Latest / The Mookse and the Gripes Podcast / Episode 80: Facing the Void

Transcript

Episode 80: Facing the Void · The Mookse and the Gripes Podcast

0:12
SPEAKER_01: This is the Mooks and the Gripes podcast.
0:15
SPEAKER_01: Hello, everybody.
0:16
SPEAKER_01: This is Trevor Shiley Paul.
0:20
SPEAKER_00: Paul, welcome today.
0:22
SPEAKER_00: How are you doing?
0:23
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
0:23
SPEAKER_00: Yes, I am not actually feeling very shy because I just am coming off of... I talk about this every year.
0:30
SPEAKER_00: The big work thing that I have, like there's one big conference we do every year.
0:34
SPEAKER_00: So if I was shy there, I would be in major trouble because...
0:38
SPEAKER_00: up on stage in front of hundreds of people, you know, that kind of thing.
0:40
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, no, I'm out.
0:43
SPEAKER_00: I'm happy and loud and ready to be here.
0:46
SPEAKER_01: Well, let me ask you this.
0:48
SPEAKER_01: Are you
0:50
SPEAKER_01: feeling too bashful to tell our listeners what you've been up to on Fridays and Saturdays,
0:55
SPEAKER_01: you know,
0:55
SPEAKER_01: kind of alternating over the last month or so.
0:58
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I'm not too shy about that.
1:00
SPEAKER_00: I,
1:00
SPEAKER_00: we kind of hinted at it a couple of shows ago and I don't think people were
1:03
SPEAKER_00: probably all that,
1:04
SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:05
SPEAKER_00: waiting with bated breath,
1:06
SPEAKER_00: but no,
1:07
SPEAKER_00: it's pretty cool.
1:07
SPEAKER_00: A friend of mine started a little bookstore here in the Denver area and she knows how much I love
1:14
SPEAKER_00: books.
1:15
SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, it was just her and a friend had started it.
1:17
SPEAKER_00: And I think they were, you know, working basically every day between the two of them.
1:20
SPEAKER_00: So she's like, would you ever want to just pick up an occasional shift, you know, a few times a month?
1:26
SPEAKER_00: And of course, I jumped at the chance.
1:28
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I've been able to dip my toe into the world of
1:31
SPEAKER_00: book selling.
1:31
SPEAKER_00: It's been absolutely wonderful.
1:33
SPEAKER_00: I'm doing my best to try to push as much translated fiction and independent
1:39
SPEAKER_00: publishers as I possibly can with mixed results so far,
1:43
SPEAKER_00: but I'm working on my selling game.
1:45
SPEAKER_00: I'll have to talk to some of our bookseller friends out there and get some tips.
1:49
SPEAKER_01: Well, I understand you've had at least a few successes.
1:53
SPEAKER_01: You've got some books that are like your goal is to sell them or put them in the hands of somebody.
2:00
SPEAKER_01: If I remember right, one of them did get sold, maybe not by you, but still by your influence.
2:06
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
2:07
SPEAKER_00: So one of our all-time favorites, The Peregrine.
2:09
SPEAKER_00: was sold.
2:10
SPEAKER_00: Um, we got to each pick, you know, a few like staff recommendations.
2:14
SPEAKER_00: And of course that was one of the ones that I put up there along with flights by Olga to Karczyk.
2:19
SPEAKER_00: Um, and yeah, I didn't hand sell that one, but it did sell while I was gone.
2:22
SPEAKER_00: And then I've been able to hand sell a few fun ones.
2:26
SPEAKER_00: Like,
2:26
SPEAKER_00: um,
2:26
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
2:27
SPEAKER_00: not fun,
2:27
SPEAKER_00: actually,
2:27
SPEAKER_00: this is not a very fun book at all,
2:29
SPEAKER_00: but,
2:29
SPEAKER_00: um,
2:30
SPEAKER_00: a little life by,
2:30
SPEAKER_00: uh,
2:31
SPEAKER_00: Hanya Yanagihara.
2:33
SPEAKER_00: I sold that one.
2:34
SPEAKER_00: And, you know, we, we sell a lot of copies of lonesome dove, which makes me very happy actually.
2:38
SPEAKER_00: So,
2:39
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's been a lot of fun so far.
2:42
SPEAKER_01: That is really cool.
2:43
SPEAKER_01: I'm so excited that you have this chance.
2:46
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
2:46
SPEAKER_01: and it sounds like maybe it's the ideal situation,
2:50
SPEAKER_01: like you get to go in and sell and be part of that,
2:55
SPEAKER_01: but maybe you're not.
2:56
SPEAKER_01: Maybe you are, I don't know, but...
3:02
SPEAKER_01: part of the management having to stress about all of that.
3:05
SPEAKER_00: No,
3:06
SPEAKER_00: so far it's been exactly what you described and,
3:08
SPEAKER_00: you know,
3:08
SPEAKER_00: who knows,
3:09
SPEAKER_00: maybe someday,
3:10
SPEAKER_00: you know,
3:10
SPEAKER_00: I don't want to assume anything we've,
3:12
SPEAKER_00: but you know,
3:12
SPEAKER_00: who knows where it could go,
3:14
SPEAKER_00: but at the very least for now,
3:15
SPEAKER_00: this is kind of what I'd always,
3:17
SPEAKER_00: you know,
3:17
SPEAKER_00: dreamed about doing is just kind of,
3:20
SPEAKER_00: picking up a shift here or there in a bookstore.
3:22
SPEAKER_00: And I would have been happy if it was Barnes & Noble,
3:24
SPEAKER_00: but I'm even more happy that it's a friend's bookstore.
3:28
SPEAKER_00: And it's just a cool little independent store.
3:31
SPEAKER_00: And it's in this little downtown area.
3:33
SPEAKER_00: So a lot of the people that come in, they only open back in the middle of December.
3:36
SPEAKER_00: So people are very excited.
3:38
SPEAKER_00: It's cool to see how excited people get about the fact that there's a new
3:42
SPEAKER_00: independent bookstore and just see that there are still those people out there who
3:45
SPEAKER_00: are looking for those kinds of things.
3:49
SPEAKER_00: Very cool.
3:50
SPEAKER_01: Well,
3:50
SPEAKER_01: I always look forward to hearing your stories over like Marco Polo or text or
3:55
SPEAKER_01: something like that when you tell me what's going on on that day.
3:59
SPEAKER_01: I could use some, you know, I could use that.
4:01
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
4:02
SPEAKER_00: I'll report back with all kinds of stories and especially if I can, you know.
4:07
SPEAKER_00: Butcher's Crossing.
4:08
SPEAKER_00: I sold it.
4:10
SPEAKER_01: I'm still waiting.
4:11
SPEAKER_01: I know this might not even be in there yet,
4:13
SPEAKER_01: but Miss Macintosh,
4:15
SPEAKER_01: my darling,
4:16
SPEAKER_01: the day that you hand sell that one to a willing consumer,
4:22
SPEAKER_01: that would be fun.
4:23
SPEAKER_00: That would be amazing.
4:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
4:24
SPEAKER_00: So far, I haven't been able to talk them into stocking it, which would be the first step.
4:29
SPEAKER_00: So far, I know that big books don't necessarily sell super well at this store, but I don't know.
4:36
SPEAKER_00: We'll see.
4:36
SPEAKER_00: I think part of it is just it's in the early days of the store.
4:39
SPEAKER_00: So a lot of people are just discovering it for the first time.
4:42
SPEAKER_00: And we're starting to build up some regular customers more and more that come back specifically,
4:47
SPEAKER_00: you know,
4:47
SPEAKER_00: for our tastes and things like that.
4:49
SPEAKER_00: So I could see some of that stuff building over time.
4:52
SPEAKER_01: Well,
4:53
SPEAKER_01: and on the note of Miss McIntosh,
4:55
SPEAKER_01: my darling,
4:55
SPEAKER_01: and a potential selling point is that two of our friends are involved in a project.
5:01
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
5:01
SPEAKER_01: We're reading it.
5:02
SPEAKER_01: Anthony Garrett,
5:03
SPEAKER_01: who was on recently with our poetry episode,
5:06
SPEAKER_01: and Laurie Feathers,
5:07
SPEAKER_01: who was on our book prizes episode a while back now,
5:12
SPEAKER_01: but that you got to work with on the Republic of Consciousness Prize for the U.S.,
5:17
SPEAKER_01: They are doing a Substack read-along, like a correspondence.
5:21
SPEAKER_01: So cool.
5:22
SPEAKER_01: Critical correspondence.
5:24
SPEAKER_01: I can't remember exactly how they put it, but I'm very excited about that project.
5:28
SPEAKER_01: And it does seem like something that will help...
5:33
SPEAKER_01: people continue to have the enthusiasm to read such a, such a big, uh, rich, you know, rich book.
5:43
SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you've started it yet, but you know how you can't just eat like the whole chocolate cake.
5:48
SPEAKER_01: It's super duper, duper delicious.
5:50
SPEAKER_01: I feel like that's kind of how this is.
5:52
SPEAKER_01: It's so much richness in the language and it's just delightful.
5:57
SPEAKER_01: Um, but it is, it is hard for me to read more than five, 10 pages of,
6:03
SPEAKER_01: in a sit down.
6:04
SPEAKER_01: Um, not because it's become unpleasant, but because I, I don't know if there's so much.
6:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I could see that.
6:13
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
6:13
SPEAKER_00: I remember like when I was reading Ulysses,
6:15
SPEAKER_00: it was similar where you're almost just bathed in the goodness of it all and your
6:19
SPEAKER_00: brain is working over time.
6:20
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, so I think I can
6:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
6:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
6:42
SPEAKER_01: i thought you wanted me yeah exactly and you're like i do i do trust me i just
6:48
SPEAKER_00: don't want to read you yet yeah that's right well there is something to be said for
6:52
SPEAKER_00: savoring i will say that and there's definitely a little bit of that too but yeah i
6:56
SPEAKER_00: will definitely talk about some of that later because you know there's different
7:01
SPEAKER_00: things that go into it that i think are kind of interesting with some of these
7:04
SPEAKER_00: books so how far along are you i mean not page number but i mean are you making
7:07
SPEAKER_00: decent progress through
7:09
SPEAKER_01: The last couple of weeks, I've had some other reading projects that have kind of gotten into the way.
7:14
SPEAKER_01: So I've maybe overall read 20 pages over the last couple of weeks.
7:18
SPEAKER_01: It still feels good.
7:19
SPEAKER_01: I try to make sure that I'm reading at least a page a day,
7:22
SPEAKER_01: which is very strange on a book that's over 1,200 pages long.
7:28
SPEAKER_00: Right.
7:29
SPEAKER_01: You'll finish it in four to five years at that rate.
7:31
SPEAKER_01: But it doesn't feel wrong either.
7:33
SPEAKER_01: This is not your typical...
7:39
SPEAKER_01: I do feel like I'm following the thread and this is a good way to do it.
7:43
SPEAKER_01: And there are times when I can read more and times when I can't, but I remember seeing that.
7:48
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
7:49
SPEAKER_00: Some books are just that way.
7:50
SPEAKER_00: And I remember seeing a quote from Henry James.
7:52
SPEAKER_00: I think it was about the ambassadors, his book, the ambassadors.
7:55
SPEAKER_00: And he actually said that he basically,
7:59
SPEAKER_00: the way he wrote it was so that people would read no more than like a page or two a day.
8:04
SPEAKER_00: So there are definitely those books where, you know,
8:07
SPEAKER_00: there's no, no shame by any means in it.
8:09
SPEAKER_00: And actually in some ways it might even work better.
8:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
8:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
8:13
SPEAKER_01: Well, all right.
8:14
SPEAKER_01: So listeners check out Anthony Garrett and Lori feathers for that.
8:17
SPEAKER_01: It hasn't started yet.
8:18
SPEAKER_01: They do have the sub stack up with like it's introductory post,
8:22
SPEAKER_01: uh,
8:22
SPEAKER_01: but it's coming up to,
8:24
SPEAKER_01: you know,
8:24
SPEAKER_01: the,
8:25
SPEAKER_01: the official start date.
8:26
SPEAKER_01: The nice thing about sub stack is that doesn't have to be your official start date.
8:31
SPEAKER_01: It'll be there.
8:32
SPEAKER_01: No, it doesn't, it doesn't drift away like hashtags on Twitter.
8:36
SPEAKER_01: Eventually, uh,
8:37
SPEAKER_01: tend to be difficult to find.
8:41
SPEAKER_00: Now I'm so excited for that partnership.
8:43
SPEAKER_00: What a perfect pairing and what an interesting pair of minds to talk about that.
8:46
SPEAKER_00: I can't wait to see what they have to say.
8:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
8:50
SPEAKER_01: All right.
8:50
SPEAKER_01: And just I have been delighted after our last episode on Rediscovered Gems with Jackie,
8:58
SPEAKER_01: where we each picked publishers to talk about and some of their books.
9:02
SPEAKER_01: It's been really fun to see how many people just are excited to see Archipelago McNally.
9:08
SPEAKER_01: Faber editions and I think for a lot of people this was maybe their introduction to
9:13
SPEAKER_01: Faber editions and maybe even some to McNally though it does feel like most of our
9:18
SPEAKER_01: listeners were on to them but Faber editions there were quite a few people writing
9:23
SPEAKER_01: back about how delighted they were to find that list and several of them I saw
9:28
SPEAKER_01: their their shipments of their their big uh
9:32
SPEAKER_01: The full set of 11 or 12 books that they have right now that we talked about where
9:37
SPEAKER_01: it's less than 100 pounds to get all of the books that they've released so far.
9:42
SPEAKER_01: That's been really fun to see those pictures or people saying that they made that order.
9:47
SPEAKER_00: That's amazing.
9:48
SPEAKER_01: As well as many people saying,
9:50
SPEAKER_01: I can't wait to finally someday make this order,
9:52
SPEAKER_01: maybe for a holiday or a birthday or something like that.
9:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
9:56
SPEAKER_00: Now they'll have quite a treat because like we said,
9:58
SPEAKER_00: not only are the books themselves,
9:59
SPEAKER_00: you know,
10:00
SPEAKER_00: seemingly great from what Jackie described in the couple that we've both read,
10:04
SPEAKER_00: but just as objects,
10:06
SPEAKER_00: like we said,
10:06
SPEAKER_00: the covers of those are just gorgeous too.
10:09
SPEAKER_01: And we do have a recent Patreon supporter.
10:12
SPEAKER_01: This one just came in a day or two ago, Jordan Horvath.
10:16
SPEAKER_01: Jordan, welcome to the ship.
10:19
SPEAKER_01: You get the bonus episodes and the early release of episodes.
10:24
SPEAKER_01: We appreciate the support so much.
10:26
SPEAKER_01: It really does go a long way.
10:28
SPEAKER_01: We're about to introduce something here in a few minutes that we want to do a
10:35
SPEAKER_01: little giveaway for it and also make sure that we're
10:39
SPEAKER_01: Um,
10:40
SPEAKER_01: prepared and the support goes a long way to,
10:43
SPEAKER_01: uh,
10:45
SPEAKER_01: helping us to do that as,
10:47
SPEAKER_01: as well as,
10:48
SPEAKER_01: uh,
10:49
SPEAKER_01: keep the,
10:50
SPEAKER_01: keep the show running with the various,
10:52
SPEAKER_01: uh,
10:53
SPEAKER_01: hosting fees or,
10:54
SPEAKER_01: you know,
10:55
SPEAKER_01: recording fees,
10:55
SPEAKER_01: things like that,
10:56
SPEAKER_01: that,
10:56
SPEAKER_01: that we have.
10:58
SPEAKER_01: And so it really is invaluable, not to mention just heartening.
11:01
SPEAKER_01: We very much appreciate it,
11:03
SPEAKER_01: the sport and the love that we get in its multiple iterations,
11:08
SPEAKER_01: whether financial or otherwise,
11:10
SPEAKER_01: we really do.
11:10
SPEAKER_01: I think we have amazing listeners.
11:15
SPEAKER_01: It's a fun community.
11:17
SPEAKER_00: It is.
11:17
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I know.
11:18
SPEAKER_00: Like you said,
11:18
SPEAKER_00: of course,
11:19
SPEAKER_00: the financial part of it is wonderful,
11:20
SPEAKER_00: but just the boost that I get whenever somebody comments or talks about
11:26
SPEAKER_00: They took us along on a walk that they took on Saturday morning and it was so nice
11:29
SPEAKER_00: to have us there or whatever.
11:30
SPEAKER_00: Like that stuff, just, I love it.
11:32
SPEAKER_00: It's so much fun.
11:33
SPEAKER_01: So I was just about to tell you,
11:35
SPEAKER_01: you know,
11:35
SPEAKER_01: I don't think we've ever been trolled or,
11:37
SPEAKER_01: you know,
11:38
SPEAKER_01: all that except,
11:40
SPEAKER_01: would you consider this a troll?
11:42
SPEAKER_01: You know how in the last episode we talked about, we're reaching that age.
11:45
SPEAKER_01: I didn't say old age.
11:46
SPEAKER_01: I don't think in the episode about, you know, caring about the weather and the birds and,
11:52
SPEAKER_01: And I loved the tweet.
11:53
SPEAKER_01: This is all fun.
11:56
SPEAKER_01: But one of our guests, Nora, did get on and say that it was a delight to take us on a walk.
12:02
SPEAKER_01: And then she posted a few emojis.
12:05
SPEAKER_01: Yes, she did.
12:05
SPEAKER_00: Very targeted emojis, I would say.
12:08
SPEAKER_01: I think there was a storm cloud or some rain or something like that to represent the weather.
12:12
SPEAKER_01: And then a bird, which I loved.
12:14
SPEAKER_01: And then the old man emoji.
12:19
SPEAKER_01: That's the kind of trolling that I can take.
12:21
SPEAKER_01: I love it.
12:21
SPEAKER_00: Me too.
12:21
SPEAKER_00: That was so funny.
12:23
SPEAKER_00: Well played, Nora.
12:24
SPEAKER_00: I liked it a lot.
12:25
SPEAKER_01: Very much.
12:26
SPEAKER_01: I loved it too.
12:28
SPEAKER_01: All right,
12:28
SPEAKER_01: Paul,
12:28
SPEAKER_01: I do have a little bit more preliminary before we get to our actual topic,
12:32
SPEAKER_01: but I would like to stop for a moment and ask you,
12:36
SPEAKER_01: what have you been reading first?
12:37
SPEAKER_00: Sure, absolutely.
12:39
SPEAKER_00: So I've raved many times on here about Kate Zambrino,
12:42
SPEAKER_00: and I know that you read some of her stuff and really liked it too.
12:46
SPEAKER_00: So I was thrilled recently to hear about the new book that she has that just came
12:50
SPEAKER_00: out called Tone,
12:52
SPEAKER_00: which was co-written with Sophia Samatar.
12:55
SPEAKER_00: So many of our friends online have been talking it up for a while now,
12:58
SPEAKER_00: and I was finally able to grab a copy recently,
13:00
SPEAKER_00: and I read it over the last couple of days.
13:02
SPEAKER_00: And
13:02
SPEAKER_00: It's really good.
13:03
SPEAKER_00: It's a fascinating study, kind of focusing on literary tone, as you might guess from the title.
13:09
SPEAKER_00: And it's really weird, not weird.
13:10
SPEAKER_00: I mean, the two authors have written in this kind of collective voice.
13:14
SPEAKER_00: So they call themselves the Committee to Investigate the Atmosphere.
13:19
SPEAKER_00: So it's kind of fun and playful.
13:21
SPEAKER_00: And before I go any further, I also wanted to show you Trevor.
13:24
SPEAKER_00: It's maybe has one of the most beautiful covers I think I've ever seen.
13:28
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I've been attracted to that book for many reasons, but when I did look it up, I thought, Oh wow.
13:36
SPEAKER_01: That's yeah.
13:37
SPEAKER_00: So anybody listening along, if you haven't seen it, you should check it out.
13:40
SPEAKER_00: Tone by Sophia Samatar and Kate Zambrino.
13:42
SPEAKER_00: It's just these beautiful blue hues with all these like little, uh,
13:47
SPEAKER_00: icons and statuettes and beads.
13:49
SPEAKER_00: And I don't know, it's just really striking.
13:51
SPEAKER_00: But anyway,
13:52
SPEAKER_00: when you get within that beautiful cover,
13:55
SPEAKER_00: not only is it a great piece of literary analysis and just the way that they go
13:59
SPEAKER_00: about it is so fascinating.
14:01
SPEAKER_00: But as you would expect,
14:02
SPEAKER_00: it also sends you off as a reader on about a hundred different rabbit trails based
14:05
SPEAKER_00: on all the different works that they're analyzing.
14:07
SPEAKER_00: So they talk about all kinds of different works and authors,
14:10
SPEAKER_00: including Nello Larson,
14:12
SPEAKER_00: Kafka,
14:12
SPEAKER_00: Virginia Woolf,
14:13
SPEAKER_00: Borges,
14:14
SPEAKER_00: Bolaño.
14:14
SPEAKER_00: I mean, lots of good stuff.
14:17
SPEAKER_00: but it kind of leads directly into what I'm currently reading, which was inspired by this book.
14:22
SPEAKER_00: And so I'm going to read it real fast, just the section of tone.
14:26
SPEAKER_00: It's just a short section that led into my current reading.
14:28
SPEAKER_00: So it says,
14:30
SPEAKER_00: surely translated literature offers a rich field for the study of tone,
14:34
SPEAKER_00: even if that field is slippery,
14:36
SPEAKER_00: riddled with sinkholes,
14:37
SPEAKER_00: and in some places nearly impassable.
14:40
SPEAKER_00: We recall reading that W.G.,
14:43
SPEAKER_00: Sebald's work revives the romantic traditions of the long walk,
14:46
SPEAKER_00: but they restore it as something ghostly and broken,
14:49
SPEAKER_00: a practice tainted forever by the Holocaust.
14:52
SPEAKER_00: And undoubtedly,
14:53
SPEAKER_00: we find Sebald's diction subtly archaic,
14:55
SPEAKER_00: almost courtly,
14:56
SPEAKER_00: reserved,
14:57
SPEAKER_00: and suggestive of hidden grief.
15:00
SPEAKER_00: Quote,
15:00
SPEAKER_00: in August 1992,
15:02
SPEAKER_00: he opens rings,
15:03
SPEAKER_00: when the dog days were drawing to an end,
15:05
SPEAKER_00: I set off to walk the county of Suffolk in the hope of dispelling the emptiness
15:09
SPEAKER_00: that takes hold of me whenever I have completed a long stint of work.
15:14
SPEAKER_00: Then they say the simple rustic quality of when the dog days were drawing to an end,
15:18
SPEAKER_00: the formality of in the hope of dispelling.
15:21
SPEAKER_00: These are intimations of the reserved old world melancholy tone of Sebald.
15:26
SPEAKER_00: But of course, that is not only Sebald.
15:28
SPEAKER_00: It is also his translator, Michael Hulse, with whom we have read, Sebald had many battles.
15:34
SPEAKER_00: Windows collaged over one another,
15:35
SPEAKER_00: writer and translator struggling,
15:38
SPEAKER_00: sometimes acrimoniously,
15:39
SPEAKER_00: toward the collective mood.
15:42
SPEAKER_00: So that's just a little sample of not only their brilliant analysis that I really just, it draws me in.
15:48
SPEAKER_00: And like I said, it sent me on.
15:50
SPEAKER_00: I was tabbing and reserving and putting on my wishlist all kinds of books.
15:55
SPEAKER_00: But just the way they write about it is so intelligent and curious and fascinating.
15:59
SPEAKER_00: But yes,
16:00
SPEAKER_00: that did lead me to finally pick up a book that I've owned it for years,
16:04
SPEAKER_00: but I've never read,
16:05
SPEAKER_00: which is,
16:06
SPEAKER_00: yeah,
16:06
SPEAKER_00: The Rings of Saturn.
16:08
SPEAKER_00: which I'm absolutely loving so far.
16:10
SPEAKER_00: I read Austerlitz years ago,
16:12
SPEAKER_00: and for some reason,
16:13
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
16:13
SPEAKER_00: I've had all of his books,
16:14
SPEAKER_00: but just have never yet picked up another one.
16:16
SPEAKER_00: Like we said, kind of that savoring thing, I think, is the main part of it.
16:20
SPEAKER_00: But probably a lot of people have read his works.
16:24
SPEAKER_00: But yeah,
16:26
SPEAKER_00: I guess I was thinking about reading more of it,
16:27
SPEAKER_00: but they already touch on kind of the tone of it.
16:30
SPEAKER_00: Maybe I'll skip that, but he's just such a wonderful writer and just the cool little
16:36
SPEAKER_00: photos that he inserts into the pages it's such a brilliant and strange mind to
16:40
SPEAKER_00: spend some time with and in particular the idea of the walks and that whole
16:45
SPEAKER_00: structure of kind of walks leading you to these different topics reminds me of some
16:49
SPEAKER_00: of the other books that i've read and loved in recent years so yeah so that's kind
16:54
SPEAKER_00: of the the experience of what i've had over the last week or so
16:58
SPEAKER_01: Is Anatomy of Melancholy going to come up later on in the conversation today?
17:05
SPEAKER_00: It might in passing, but you're welcome to bring it up now.
17:09
SPEAKER_00: That's what you're currently reading, right?
17:11
SPEAKER_01: No, no.
17:12
SPEAKER_01: But definitely,
17:13
SPEAKER_01: Sebald's Rings of Saturn made me want to read more of Burton and the particular
17:20
SPEAKER_01: Anatomy of Melancholy.
17:22
SPEAKER_01: And I wondered if that was going to be a...
17:28
SPEAKER_01: a topic that you were,
17:29
SPEAKER_01: you know,
17:29
SPEAKER_01: the tone got you to read Rings of Saturn,
17:33
SPEAKER_01: got you to read,
17:35
SPEAKER_01: but not just Earned Burial,
17:36
SPEAKER_01: but,
17:37
SPEAKER_01: you know,
17:38
SPEAKER_01: Anatomy of Melancholy.
17:39
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's another one.
17:40
SPEAKER_00: I mean, ever since, I don't even remember how long I've wanted to read that book.
17:44
SPEAKER_00: And I think I've talked about it before,
17:46
SPEAKER_00: but there was an episode of Backlisted where they had Philip Pullman on and they
17:49
SPEAKER_00: were talking about it.
17:50
SPEAKER_00: And
17:51
SPEAKER_00: Oh, it does sound absolutely lovely.
17:53
SPEAKER_00: And the people who've actually made it through always talk about how it was one of
17:56
SPEAKER_00: those reading experiences of a lifetime.
17:58
SPEAKER_00: So it could come up tangentially later in the episode based on something that I'll be talking about.
18:06
SPEAKER_01: Cool.
18:08
SPEAKER_00: Well,
18:09
SPEAKER_01: speaking of melancholy,
18:12
SPEAKER_01: Mark Haber,
18:13
SPEAKER_01: you know,
18:15
SPEAKER_01: who in Reinhardt's Garden so beautifully talks about the ecstasy of melancholy,
18:23
SPEAKER_01: the beauty,
18:24
SPEAKER_01: the divinity of melancholy.
18:28
SPEAKER_01: I love that book so much.
18:29
SPEAKER_01: Uh, he was in conversation with Jonathan Golding on Instagram live last night.
18:34
SPEAKER_01: If you go to Jonathan Golding's, uh, uh, I don't know what it is.
18:39
SPEAKER_01: Page profile page profile.
18:42
SPEAKER_01: Um,
18:43
SPEAKER_01: you can find that I'll link to it as well in the show notes and I'll link to the
18:47
SPEAKER_01: sub stack that,
18:48
SPEAKER_01: uh,
18:48
SPEAKER_01: on Ms.
18:48
SPEAKER_01: McIntosh, my darling with Anthony and Lori, what they're doing.
18:53
SPEAKER_01: but it was a fun conversation.
18:56
SPEAKER_01: Mark and Jonathan talking about Mark's books and kind of looking ahead to lesser ruins coming out.
19:02
SPEAKER_01: And anyway,
19:03
SPEAKER_01: when you,
19:03
SPEAKER_01: when we're talking about melancholy and where I was just listening to that last night,
19:07
SPEAKER_01: I thought I'd bring that up too.
19:09
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
19:09
SPEAKER_01: Nice segue.
19:10
SPEAKER_01: I like that.
19:10
SPEAKER_01: Oh, there's too much to talk about.
19:12
SPEAKER_00: Isn't there too many cool things happening.
19:15
SPEAKER_01: Well, what have I been reading?
19:16
SPEAKER_01: I've actually been reading a lot of different books, and it's been a lot of fun.
19:22
SPEAKER_01: Probably my two main read-along projects.
19:26
SPEAKER_01: One is George Eliot's Mill on the Floss, which I'll be wrapping up here in another...
19:32
SPEAKER_01: I don't know, week or so.
19:33
SPEAKER_01: I'll have that one done.
19:34
SPEAKER_01: And then we go on to Silas Marner in June.
19:38
SPEAKER_01: That's been fun.
19:39
SPEAKER_01: I've started the Eustace Diamonds by Anthony Trollope.
19:44
SPEAKER_01: But for our library adult book club, we are reading O Pioneers by Willa Cather.
19:51
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
19:52
SPEAKER_01: Have you ever read O Pioneers?
19:53
SPEAKER_00: You know, I haven't.
19:54
SPEAKER_00: I've read a lot of her books now, or at least a good number, but not that one yet.
19:58
SPEAKER_01: So this was the first one that I read.
20:00
SPEAKER_01: I read it back in college, one of my very first English literature classes.
20:06
SPEAKER_01: You know, one of those classes that you just this you're like, this is what life is all about.
20:11
SPEAKER_01: You know, I love I love coming to this class.
20:14
SPEAKER_01: And we read O Pioneers and I remember really enjoying it.
20:17
SPEAKER_01: And I remember little bits, you know, I remember that it it is not Little House on the Prairie.
20:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:23
SPEAKER_01: It is.
20:24
SPEAKER_01: There is.
20:24
SPEAKER_01: I remember thinking that at the time,
20:26
SPEAKER_01: like,
20:26
SPEAKER_01: oh,
20:27
SPEAKER_01: OK,
20:27
SPEAKER_01: we're reading O Pioneers,
20:29
SPEAKER_01: probably some saccharine,
20:30
SPEAKER_01: you know,
20:30
SPEAKER_01: sappy.
20:31
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's O Pioneers and the title has an exclamation point.
20:36
SPEAKER_01: That's what I was going to say.
20:36
SPEAKER_00: One of those rare titles that has an exclamation point.
20:40
SPEAKER_01: But it's not really like that.
20:44
SPEAKER_01: It's a really lovely story that my wife running the book club has been looking up some quotes on it.
20:52
SPEAKER_01: And Willa Cather herself talking about how she wanted to read books like this about
20:59
SPEAKER_01: the land,
20:59
SPEAKER_01: about all of this stuff going on where she had grown up.
21:05
SPEAKER_01: but they weren't there.
21:06
SPEAKER_01: So she wrote one.
21:07
SPEAKER_01: And of course,
21:09
SPEAKER_01: these are some of her more famous books on this particular land in Nebraska,
21:14
SPEAKER_01: these immigrant stories.
21:16
SPEAKER_01: And it's just a lovely story with complicated human relationships and all of that
21:24
SPEAKER_01: going on,
21:24
SPEAKER_01: but always,
21:26
SPEAKER_01: always,
21:26
SPEAKER_01: always,
21:26
SPEAKER_01: always stuff about the land.
21:28
SPEAKER_01: And I'm trying to figure out, do I read one of my favorite passages or do I read
21:32
SPEAKER_01: the opening lines, which are also quite lovely and will put you in the mood.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: And I think I'll just go with this one that's a little bit later on in the book.
21:41
SPEAKER_01: This is after kind of a short introductory section of a few chapters where you meet
21:48
SPEAKER_01: these characters when they're younger.
21:49
SPEAKER_01: In particular, the woman Alexandra.
21:54
SPEAKER_01: She's maybe in her...
21:57
SPEAKER_01: early to mid twenties when the book starts.
22:01
SPEAKER_01: And then this skips ahead 15,
22:02
SPEAKER_01: 16 years,
22:03
SPEAKER_01: um,
22:05
SPEAKER_01: after they've already kind of started to conquer and tame this land that was so rugged.
22:10
SPEAKER_01: And it says the divide is now thickly populated.
22:13
SPEAKER_01: The rich soil yields heavy harvests,
22:16
SPEAKER_01: the dry bracing climate and the smoothness of the land make labor easy for men and beasts.
22:22
SPEAKER_01: And that's in stark contrast to what we were getting in the beginning, you know, um,
22:27
SPEAKER_01: There are few scenes more gratifying than a spring plowing in that country,
22:31
SPEAKER_01: where the furrows of a single field often lie a mile in length,
22:34
SPEAKER_01: and the brown earth,
22:35
SPEAKER_01: with such a strong,
22:36
SPEAKER_01: clean smell and such a power of growth and fertility in it,
22:40
SPEAKER_01: yields itself eagerly to the plow,
22:43
SPEAKER_01: rolls away from the sheer,
22:45
SPEAKER_01: not even dimming the brightness of the metal,
22:48
SPEAKER_01: with a soft,
22:49
SPEAKER_01: deep sigh of happiness."
22:51
SPEAKER_01: The wheat cutting sometimes goes on all night as well as all day,
22:54
SPEAKER_01: and in good seasons there are scarcely men and horses enough to do the harvesting.
22:59
SPEAKER_01: The grain is so heavy that it bends toward the blade and cuts like velvet.
23:04
SPEAKER_01: There is something frank and joyous and young in the open face of the country.
23:10
SPEAKER_01: It gives itself ungrudgingly to the moods of the season, holding nothing back.
23:15
SPEAKER_01: Like the plains of Lombardy, it seems to rise a little to meet the sun.
23:21
SPEAKER_01: The air and the earth are curiously mated and intermingled as if the one were the breath of the other.
23:28
SPEAKER_01: You feel in the atmosphere the same tonic puissant quality that is in the tilth,
23:33
SPEAKER_01: the same strength and resoluteness.
23:37
SPEAKER_01: I just love that intermingling of the land and the air.
23:43
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
23:44
SPEAKER_01: It's a lovely passage of this young country,
23:50
SPEAKER_01: that is quite different now,
23:51
SPEAKER_01: you know,
23:51
SPEAKER_01: and was quite different even when Cather was,
23:53
SPEAKER_01: was writing this book.
23:56
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I, I do really, really enjoy O Pioneers.
24:01
SPEAKER_01: I'm about done with it as well.
24:02
SPEAKER_01: So we'll,
24:02
SPEAKER_01: we'll have our conversation on it on Wednesday night,
24:06
SPEAKER_01: I guess right before this episode comes out.
24:08
SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
24:09
SPEAKER_00: No, that's, yeah.
24:12
SPEAKER_00: It, as always so many books that I want to read, like Cather is, is one of those.
24:16
SPEAKER_00: Every time I read one of her works, I'm just like, why do I not read her?
24:19
SPEAKER_00: way more often than I do.
24:21
SPEAKER_00: But yeah, she's amazing.
24:23
SPEAKER_00: And I think among many other things,
24:24
SPEAKER_00: one of the things that's fascinating about her is her ability to write like that,
24:29
SPEAKER_00: beautiful landscapes and nature in areas that aren't always like,
24:33
SPEAKER_00: you know,
24:34
SPEAKER_00: the Rocky Mountains or the Sierra Nevadas.
24:35
SPEAKER_00: It's not that it's easy to write about those types of landscapes,
24:38
SPEAKER_00: but some of those landscapes lend themselves to dramatic writing or things like that.
24:43
SPEAKER_00: But her ability to
24:44
SPEAKER_00: take some of these,
24:46
SPEAKER_00: you know,
24:46
SPEAKER_00: the Great Plains or something like that and create the beauty there has always been
24:50
SPEAKER_00: something I've really admired.
24:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
24:53
SPEAKER_01: there's actually,
24:53
SPEAKER_01: it's almost a throwaway little passage in the early part of the book about a young
24:59
SPEAKER_01: woman who had never gone very far from this part of the land.
25:05
SPEAKER_01: And they're like,
25:06
SPEAKER_01: oh,
25:06
SPEAKER_01: you know,
25:07
SPEAKER_01: when she tried to commit suicide twice,
25:10
SPEAKER_01: her parents sent her away,
25:11
SPEAKER_01: you know,
25:12
SPEAKER_01: worried about her.
25:12
SPEAKER_01: And when she came back,
25:14
SPEAKER_01: recognizing all the beauty and is doing much better.
25:18
SPEAKER_01: It's just, like I say, it's an interesting thing.
25:20
SPEAKER_01: I think that Cather also realizes that you may have to
25:25
SPEAKER_01: be taught how to see the beauty in many places.
25:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:29
SPEAKER_01: Um, but in, in that area as well.
25:30
SPEAKER_01: And she does a great job with that.
25:32
SPEAKER_01: Cause again, you can, you can see this, you know, it's almost like golden hour.
25:36
SPEAKER_01: It's like watching days of heaven or something like that.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: Like,
25:38
SPEAKER_01: you know,
25:39
SPEAKER_01: it,
25:40
SPEAKER_01: it,
25:40
SPEAKER_01: it really is a fun,
25:41
SPEAKER_01: uh,
25:42
SPEAKER_01: a fun,
25:43
SPEAKER_01: well funds,
25:44
SPEAKER_01: maybe not the right word again,
25:45
SPEAKER_01: uh,
25:45
SPEAKER_01: with this book.
25:46
SPEAKER_01: It is, it's a great, a great little novel and it's short, Paul, you could, you could get through it.
25:50
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:51
SPEAKER_01: In the quick time.
25:52
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
25:53
SPEAKER_00: It's a good idea.
25:53
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
25:53
SPEAKER_00: Look at you, too, reading three classics simultaneously.
25:57
SPEAKER_00: Was it a couple of years ago where you said you felt like you almost never read classics anymore?
26:02
SPEAKER_00: And now a big chunk of reading seems to be even Miss Macintosh, you know, is a classic.
26:08
SPEAKER_00: So that's pretty cool.
26:09
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's been that's been a big thing.
26:15
SPEAKER_01: and one that I'm very happy with.
26:17
SPEAKER_01: We'll probably get into more of that.
26:19
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I was going to say, I think we will.
26:22
SPEAKER_01: Before we get to our topic,
26:23
SPEAKER_01: which we keep on saying,
26:24
SPEAKER_01: we'll get to it here in a minute,
26:27
SPEAKER_01: we do have an announcement.
26:28
SPEAKER_01: It is almost summer, and we have the Summer Book Club, our third year.
26:36
SPEAKER_01: I'm very excited.
26:37
SPEAKER_01: Our first year did have Willa Cather.
26:39
SPEAKER_01: That was a lot of fun.
26:40
SPEAKER_01: That was a lot of fun.
26:42
SPEAKER_01: And we are...
26:44
SPEAKER_01: every year,
26:45
SPEAKER_01: and we've talked about this already,
26:47
SPEAKER_01: we have a William Trevor book on the list that doesn't win.
26:52
SPEAKER_00: No.
26:53
SPEAKER_01: And I feel like we're always a little bit disappointed that it doesn't win,
26:56
SPEAKER_01: even though I've loved the books that we've had.
26:58
SPEAKER_01: We never pick three books we really don't want to read, but one William Trevor.
27:04
SPEAKER_01: So it's not that the other ones are bad,
27:05
SPEAKER_01: but I do always feel like,
27:07
SPEAKER_01: oh,
27:07
SPEAKER_01: we really would like to have an excuse to read some more William Trevor and make it
27:13
SPEAKER_01: a book club pick.
27:14
SPEAKER_01: So this year's book club is the William Trevor edition.
27:18
SPEAKER_01: That's right.
27:19
SPEAKER_01: We've loaded the ballot.
27:20
SPEAKER_01: He's not going to lose this year.
27:22
SPEAKER_01: No.
27:23
SPEAKER_01: In fact, we have it set.
27:26
SPEAKER_01: So there are going to be four choices.
27:28
SPEAKER_01: And there's one from each of his more active decades.
27:33
SPEAKER_01: You know, he started writing and publishing in the 60s and went on through
27:37
SPEAKER_01: You know, his last book of short stories came out shortly.
27:41
SPEAKER_01: Well, actually, was it after he died?
27:42
SPEAKER_01: I think it was.
27:45
SPEAKER_01: So we don't have the beginning or the end decade, but we have from the 1970s, Children of Dinmouth.
27:52
SPEAKER_01: From the 1980s, Fools of Fortune.
27:56
SPEAKER_01: From the 1990s, Felicia's Journey.
27:59
SPEAKER_01: And from the, you know, 2000s, The Story of Lucy Gault.
28:05
SPEAKER_01: Those are going to be the four choices.
28:08
SPEAKER_01: We're going to have voting open up on Twitter or X on May 21st and run through the 25th if I can.
28:17
SPEAKER_01: I think that those dates are the right dates.
28:22
SPEAKER_01: I think that is something that's allowable.
28:25
SPEAKER_01: And so that's the goal.
28:26
SPEAKER_01: I'll be, of course, posting on it.
28:28
SPEAKER_01: But what that means is
28:31
SPEAKER_01: is that this is the last episode that will come out before the voting happens.
28:38
SPEAKER_01: So this episode comes out on Thursday,
28:40
SPEAKER_01: May 16th,
28:42
SPEAKER_01: and voting will open on Tuesday,
28:44
SPEAKER_01: May 21st,
28:45
SPEAKER_01: and then close on Saturday,
28:48
SPEAKER_01: May 25th.
28:49
SPEAKER_01: And the reason why it has to close then is we're going to be recording our next
28:53
SPEAKER_01: episode on May 25th,
28:55
SPEAKER_01: and we want to be able to announce what won
28:58
SPEAKER_01: So that it's clear when that episode is released on May 30th what the winner is.
29:05
SPEAKER_01: Not that people won't know.
29:06
SPEAKER_01: I think you can see it when the voting is over.
29:09
SPEAKER_00: Right.
29:09
SPEAKER_00: And hopefully we'll be spreading the word and I'm sure others will because last
29:12
SPEAKER_00: year it got pretty fun with people trying to drum up support for their favorites
29:17
SPEAKER_00: and stuff.
29:18
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it was a lot of fun.
29:20
SPEAKER_01: And it actually means, so we'll be recording our episode probably earlier in the day on May 25th.
29:25
SPEAKER_01: So it doesn't,
29:26
SPEAKER_01: if you're thinking,
29:26
SPEAKER_01: oh,
29:27
SPEAKER_01: I'll wait until the very last moment on May 25th,
29:29
SPEAKER_01: you'll probably miss out because we've got to close voting before we record.
29:33
SPEAKER_01: And we record Saturday morning.
29:36
SPEAKER_01: People in the UK will have most of Saturday to vote, Saturday, May 25th.
29:41
SPEAKER_01: But people on the East Coast, you better vote on the 24th.
29:45
SPEAKER_01: And on the West Coast, for sure.
29:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
29:49
SPEAKER_00: That's fun.
29:50
SPEAKER_00: It's going to be really cool to see whether some of the ones that I might consider
29:54
SPEAKER_00: to be the more well-known favorites,
29:56
SPEAKER_00: whether one of those will take the lead or if people are going to try to use this
30:00
SPEAKER_00: as a good opportunity to read one that maybe was not on their radar as much.
30:05
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, it's always fascinating.
30:06
SPEAKER_00: I love to see the way these things play out.
30:09
SPEAKER_00: And I feel like as always with those four books, no matter which one wins, you and I will be very happy.
30:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
30:16
SPEAKER_01: I don't...
30:18
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
30:18
SPEAKER_01: I might not want to tip the scales anyway,
30:20
SPEAKER_01: but if you were to ask me,
30:21
SPEAKER_01: what are you going to vote for?
30:22
SPEAKER_01: I don't know yet.
30:24
SPEAKER_01: I am going to vote.
30:25
SPEAKER_01: I think I can vote when I set it up.
30:27
SPEAKER_01: Maybe I can't even vote.
30:28
SPEAKER_01: I can't remember.
30:31
SPEAKER_01: But I know you can vote because you won't be the one who's... It's on your Twitter account.
30:35
SPEAKER_00: Well, I was very surprised to hear, despite being a huge William Trevor fan, that you have a fairly...
30:43
SPEAKER_00: limited number of novels that you've read of his.
30:46
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I've read his short stories and that's always been where I, that's where I got to know him.
30:51
SPEAKER_01: Those are the things that I fell in love with.
30:53
SPEAKER_01: And I have read a couple of his novels and they've been really good.
30:57
SPEAKER_01: I've really enjoyed them.
30:58
SPEAKER_01: But even they almost feel like
31:01
SPEAKER_01: short stories to an extent, even the longer ones.
31:05
SPEAKER_01: Um,
31:06
SPEAKER_01: and so it isn't,
31:08
SPEAKER_01: it isn't necessarily an unwillingness so much as I just haven't opened that door,
31:11
SPEAKER_01: uh,
31:12
SPEAKER_01: too much.
31:13
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
31:14
SPEAKER_00: No, I've only read a couple of myself, so it's going to be really fun to expand that a little bit.
31:19
SPEAKER_01: Um, we are planning to release an episode in early August, August 8th.
31:23
SPEAKER_01: It will be episode 86 about the summer book club.
31:27
SPEAKER_01: Um, I'll actually be out, um,
31:30
SPEAKER_01: During that week, I'm going to be in Alaska, Paul.
31:34
SPEAKER_01: I know.
31:35
SPEAKER_01: I heard that.
31:35
SPEAKER_01: That's amazing.
31:37
SPEAKER_01: And so we'll have to record that a little bit earlier than August, the early part of August.
31:43
SPEAKER_01: But that will be when that episode is released,
31:45
SPEAKER_01: just so people can have that on what they're looking forward to.
31:49
SPEAKER_01: So pretty much we will have June and July to acquire books,
31:54
SPEAKER_01: read them,
31:54
SPEAKER_01: maybe do a little giveaway to get someone a book.
31:57
SPEAKER_01: that they might not otherwise have.
32:00
SPEAKER_01: And so that's our summer book club 2024.
32:03
SPEAKER_01: William Trevor.
32:04
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
32:05
SPEAKER_01: Can't wait.
32:05
SPEAKER_01: It's exciting.
32:06
SPEAKER_01: We've known we're going to do this all year.
32:11
SPEAKER_01: When do we start planning 2025?
32:12
SPEAKER_01: And what are we going to do on that?
32:14
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
32:15
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
32:16
SPEAKER_01: I don't know either.
32:16
SPEAKER_00: We'll have to see.
32:18
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
32:19
SPEAKER_00: But like you said, it's been a
32:21
SPEAKER_00: a year-long process of planning this.
32:24
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, we'll have to start pretty soon, I think.
32:29
SPEAKER_01: We'll probably next May be like, what are we going to do?
32:32
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
32:35
SPEAKER_00: You're pulling back the curtain.
32:36
SPEAKER_00: I thought I'd bluffed pretty well there.
32:39
SPEAKER_01: Well,
32:39
SPEAKER_01: the truth of the matter is it may be next May before we know what we're going to do,
32:43
SPEAKER_01: but I feel like we enjoy this enough that we are going back and forth and thinking
32:48
SPEAKER_01: about it all.
32:48
SPEAKER_01: Like that's part of the fun of doing this podcast is just thinking about reading
32:52
SPEAKER_01: and possibilities,
32:54
SPEAKER_01: even the ones that aren't possible.
32:56
SPEAKER_00: No, for sure.
32:57
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
32:57
SPEAKER_00: We talk about this stuff all the time and some of it never even sees the light of
33:00
SPEAKER_00: day or at least hasn't yet.
33:02
SPEAKER_00: And then other stuff does.
33:03
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
33:03
SPEAKER_00: Like you said, that's a lot of the fun of it right there.
33:08
SPEAKER_01: All right, Paul, you ready to get into our topic that we keep on putting off?
33:12
SPEAKER_00: I'm ready.
33:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, let's do it.
33:14
SPEAKER_01: So both of us recently finished kind of big book projects.
33:19
SPEAKER_01: I finished War and Peace, which I had started reading with the Brothers Karamazov.
33:23
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, in a way that was a big, even a little bit bigger.
33:28
SPEAKER_01: Um, you finished black, what is it?
33:31
SPEAKER_00: Black lamb and gray Falcon, black lamb and gray Falcon.
33:34
SPEAKER_00: I was listening to one of our episodes and I actually got those mixed up.
33:36
SPEAKER_00: So don't feel bad.
33:37
SPEAKER_00: I was like, Oh man, we needed an edit there, but yeah, no.
33:41
SPEAKER_01: That's okay.
33:41
SPEAKER_01: I mean, we all know what it is.
33:43
SPEAKER_01: So Black Lamb and Gray Falcon by Rebecca West,
33:46
SPEAKER_01: you know,
33:46
SPEAKER_01: these big multi-part volume,
33:50
SPEAKER_01: big books that are over a thousand pages.
33:53
SPEAKER_01: And I remember kind of asking you,
33:56
SPEAKER_01: well,
33:57
SPEAKER_01: aside from that sense of possibility,
33:59
SPEAKER_01: you know,
34:00
SPEAKER_01: the open horizon and you can read a lot of different things.
34:04
SPEAKER_01: What do you do when you have that void all of a sudden in front of you?
34:09
SPEAKER_01: of I don't have that thing that's been occupying my reading time.
34:13
SPEAKER_01: Maybe not exclusively.
34:14
SPEAKER_01: I certainly don't treat that exclusively.
34:17
SPEAKER_01: I didn't just read War and Peace over that whole time.
34:21
SPEAKER_01: And I think you were reading other books as well.
34:25
SPEAKER_01: But when you finish a big project like that, there's a bit of a void there.
34:31
SPEAKER_01: It's been months.
34:33
SPEAKER_01: And so we thought it might be fun to have an episode on filling that void.
34:36
SPEAKER_01: What to read after finishing War
34:40
SPEAKER_01: great book or a big book or something that's maybe occupied your reading project,
34:46
SPEAKER_01: even your planning,
34:47
SPEAKER_01: you know,
34:47
SPEAKER_01: your reading plans for some time.
34:50
SPEAKER_01: This isn't something that every day you're reading by whim.
34:54
SPEAKER_01: It's by design that you've set up a long-term project.
35:00
SPEAKER_01: And so that's what we want to talk about today.
35:03
SPEAKER_01: It's not the same as a reading slump.
35:05
SPEAKER_01: It's not that you're done and you don't know what to read or you don't want to read
35:09
SPEAKER_01: or you just can't find the right book.
35:11
SPEAKER_01: You're maybe even on the opposite end of that.
35:13
SPEAKER_00: That's what I was going to say.
35:14
SPEAKER_01: I think sometimes it is the opposite of that.
35:17
SPEAKER_01: You're on a reading high,
35:18
SPEAKER_01: but the thing that has been maybe providing that and finishing it gives you a sense
35:22
SPEAKER_01: of accomplishment that you want to continue on.
35:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
35:28
SPEAKER_01: When you've been very engaged with a book and then it's done, how do you move on?
35:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
35:33
SPEAKER_00: Now, I've actually had a few, like you mentioned, Black Lamb and Grey Falcon.
35:38
SPEAKER_00: I mean, over the last couple of years, I was looking back and thinking about it and I've participated in
35:43
SPEAKER_00: quite a few group reads and things that have kind of structured my reading more.
35:48
SPEAKER_00: You mentioned the Republic of Consciousness judging process.
35:51
SPEAKER_00: That wasn't one big book, but it was a set group of books that you were needing to read.
35:57
SPEAKER_00: And then, of course, we have the wonderful NYRB Women, which provides some wonderful structure.
36:01
SPEAKER_00: And then a couple, whenever that was, about a year ago, Joseph and His Brothers.
36:07
SPEAKER_00: And then we have The Savage Detective.
36:08
SPEAKER_00: So there's been
36:09
SPEAKER_00: A steady stream of these,
36:11
SPEAKER_00: not all of them big,
36:12
SPEAKER_00: but many of them big books and more just the idea of you have this kind of laid out
36:16
SPEAKER_00: before you.
36:17
SPEAKER_00: And so, yeah, I definitely have been experiencing that where suddenly it kind of opens up right now.
36:24
SPEAKER_00: And I mean, I can jump into a little bit of my thought process now about it if you want me to.
36:30
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's fine.
36:32
SPEAKER_01: I just want to note, when we decided to do the Savage Detectives read-along, I'm so glad we did it.
36:38
SPEAKER_01: That was a success.
36:39
SPEAKER_01: It was never something that I regretted.
36:41
SPEAKER_01: I actually didn't know that was such a big book.
36:44
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't look that big on the shelf.
36:46
SPEAKER_01: It's sitting there next to 2666.
36:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it looks like a little novella.
36:50
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but that's like 650 pages of savage detectiving.
36:58
SPEAKER_00: Right.
36:59
SPEAKER_01: That's a lot of detectiving.
37:00
SPEAKER_01: It was unanticipated.
37:02
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, that was a big book project and a big void when it was done.
37:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
37:07
SPEAKER_00: Anyway.
37:08
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
37:08
SPEAKER_01: I'd love to hear your thought process.
37:09
SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean, I was thinking about that.
37:11
SPEAKER_00: And so I hadn't really thought about it in that way before,
37:14
SPEAKER_00: but I mean,
37:14
SPEAKER_00: that's,
37:15
SPEAKER_00: you know,
37:15
SPEAKER_00: the last two or three years,
37:16
SPEAKER_00: that means a big chunk of my reading has been dedicated to these group reads and
37:21
SPEAKER_00: these projects.
37:23
SPEAKER_00: And I want to start off by saying, I mean, I think that's been amazing.
37:27
SPEAKER_00: Those have really been like defining moments in my reading life over the last
37:32
SPEAKER_00: couple of years and really valuable.
37:34
SPEAKER_00: I've really enjoyed them.
37:36
SPEAKER_00: And, you know, it's, it's,
37:37
SPEAKER_00: amazing how enriching it is to be involved in projects like that and,
37:40
SPEAKER_00: and to be dedicated to like really digging into something like that.
37:44
SPEAKER_00: But I've also talked about, there are times where I, um,
37:48
SPEAKER_00: can be a little protective of my reading you know sometimes like if I hear a lot of
37:53
SPEAKER_00: people say this they get pulled into it not a book club like the ones we're
37:56
SPEAKER_00: involved in because luckily you know we hang out with such cool kids that most of
38:00
SPEAKER_00: the book clubs that we would be involved in I would be all for but you know I know
38:03
SPEAKER_00: that people like with the best of intentions join a book club and then they end up
38:06
SPEAKER_00: reading all these books where they're just like oh boy this is the one they picked
38:09
SPEAKER_00: this month is not me yeah and so you know I do have that that feeling sometimes of
38:14
SPEAKER_00: like
38:14
SPEAKER_00: all these books on my shelf that I want to read.
38:16
SPEAKER_00: And so anyway,
38:16
SPEAKER_00: all I was going to say is,
38:18
SPEAKER_00: as this is opening up right now,
38:19
SPEAKER_00: what I'm really enjoying is kind of stepping back a little bit from the idea of
38:24
SPEAKER_00: structured reading.
38:25
SPEAKER_00: And this may not last more than a couple of weeks,
38:27
SPEAKER_00: who knows,
38:27
SPEAKER_00: but what I mentioned in the,
38:29
SPEAKER_00: what have I been reading section,
38:31
SPEAKER_00: just the serendipitousness of something like that Kate Zambrino book.
38:35
SPEAKER_00: And then I read about Zeybald and
38:38
SPEAKER_00: instantly pick it up and just dive into that like i really do enjoy sometimes when
38:42
SPEAKER_00: you can kind of step back a little bit and have a little bit of that freedom and i
38:47
SPEAKER_01: can talk more about this but yeah go ahead i'm seeing an image of you up on a cliff
38:52
SPEAKER_01: the void in front of you and you're laughing at it lightning going on around it's
38:57
SPEAKER_01: dark but you're just cackling because it doesn't scare you it doesn't scare me at
39:01
SPEAKER_00: all no no it really is a i don't know um
39:07
SPEAKER_00: I posted something about big books recently on social media.
39:11
SPEAKER_00: I pulled together a bunch of the big books that are on my TBR and it was quite a pile.
39:17
SPEAKER_00: And I think it was actually Nora again,
39:19
SPEAKER_00: who said something like it basically gave her heart palpitations just looking at
39:23
SPEAKER_00: that and
39:24
SPEAKER_00: She was just joking, but it's funny because I just... I hope so.
39:27
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I hope so too.
39:29
SPEAKER_00: It is funny because I get it.
39:30
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I do understand the idea of all these books out there and especially those big books.
39:36
SPEAKER_00: It can be intimidating, but when I stare into the void and look at all these...
39:40
SPEAKER_00: these big books or just all these books that are unread.
39:43
SPEAKER_00: I do just get a total thrill out of it.
39:45
SPEAKER_00: I, it's just a feeling of like possibility and excitement, which I really do enjoy.
39:52
SPEAKER_00: So yeah,
39:52
SPEAKER_00: that's kind of my initial thoughts is right now I'm kind of basking in just the
39:57
SPEAKER_00: idea of I can,
39:59
SPEAKER_00: I can read whatever I want whenever I want.
40:00
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
40:01
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
40:03
SPEAKER_01: So I definitely knew that that would be part of our conversation because there is
40:08
SPEAKER_01: that openness all of a sudden,
40:10
SPEAKER_01: a sense of being released from that obligation.
40:14
SPEAKER_01: even as enjoyable as it might be.
40:17
SPEAKER_01: Um,
40:18
SPEAKER_01: I just remember a few years ago,
40:19
SPEAKER_01: uh,
40:20
SPEAKER_01: well,
40:20
SPEAKER_01: it's,
40:20
SPEAKER_01: it's been a lot longer now than a few years,
40:22
SPEAKER_01: but David Blakeslee and I doing our eclipse viewer podcast with the criterion collections,
40:28
SPEAKER_01: eclipse sets.
40:29
SPEAKER_01: Uh, we interviewed, uh, Michael Koresky at the time he was working for criterion.
40:34
SPEAKER_01: He was, he was one of their writers.
40:36
SPEAKER_01: He, he did the liner notes of the eclipse sets.
40:39
SPEAKER_01: And to us, it was like, well, you have the perfect job.
40:44
SPEAKER_01: And he admitted that, yeah, I kind of do, but it is still a job.
40:47
SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, it's not always what I want, you know, because it's something that you're set up.
40:53
SPEAKER_01: That's a daily thing.
40:54
SPEAKER_01: It isn't always your whim.
40:55
SPEAKER_01: Like today I want to write about this movie or that thing, or today I want to read this book.
41:00
SPEAKER_01: It's no, I do want to read that, but I actually already set myself up to read this one.
41:05
SPEAKER_01: So there is that sense of release that happens too when you finish a big project.
41:12
SPEAKER_01: Whether that project be a big book or...
41:15
SPEAKER_01: You know,
41:16
SPEAKER_01: a a series of books,
41:20
SPEAKER_01: you know,
41:21
SPEAKER_01: like maybe reading a book series,
41:23
SPEAKER_01: even if it's a fantasy book series or or just an author's oeuvre like I'm doing
41:28
SPEAKER_01: with George Eliot over the next year and those books.
41:34
SPEAKER_01: you know,
41:34
SPEAKER_01: of course,
41:34
SPEAKER_01: Elliot wrote big books in that,
41:36
SPEAKER_01: but maybe they're not an author that's known for all their big books,
41:38
SPEAKER_01: but you want to read all of their work.
41:42
SPEAKER_01: Those projects can be so delightful.
41:44
SPEAKER_01: But yeah,
41:45
SPEAKER_01: there is the risk that they turn into work and that I always try very,
41:51
SPEAKER_01: very,
41:52
SPEAKER_01: very hard to avoid.
41:54
SPEAKER_01: If it starts to feel that way,
41:56
SPEAKER_01: then I need to stop and rethink it because that's certainly not the purpose.
42:00
SPEAKER_01: The purpose isn't just to get them done.
42:02
SPEAKER_01: The purpose is to enjoy the journey.
42:06
SPEAKER_01: And,
42:07
SPEAKER_01: and fortunately I've,
42:08
SPEAKER_01: I've just been,
42:10
SPEAKER_01: that has been the case for many of these that I,
42:13
SPEAKER_01: that I've been involved in.
42:15
SPEAKER_01: You know, NYRB women, for example, is maybe multiple short books, but it's, it's just been,
42:22
SPEAKER_01: it's been fun because it's always been doable and hasn't really felt like it's
42:25
SPEAKER_01: gotten in the way of other things.
42:28
SPEAKER_01: For example,
42:30
SPEAKER_01: at the same time,
42:31
SPEAKER_01: I am very curious because part of that sense of possibility is knowing that you can
42:38
SPEAKER_01: start another project,
42:40
SPEAKER_01: Paul.
42:40
SPEAKER_01: It isn't, it isn't just that you can read whatever you want.
42:42
SPEAKER_01: It's that that can include another project or another,
42:47
SPEAKER_00: you know,
42:48
SPEAKER_01: thing that you've had your eyes on,
42:49
SPEAKER_01: whether it's rereading something that you once read,
42:51
SPEAKER_01: you know,
42:52
SPEAKER_01: like,
42:52
SPEAKER_01: I want to reread Moby Dick finally,
42:55
SPEAKER_01: or,
42:57
SPEAKER_01: or maybe an author's work like I'm doing with Trollope and Elliot and,
43:02
SPEAKER_01: and Wolf,
43:02
SPEAKER_01: for example.
43:04
SPEAKER_01: Are you,
43:06
SPEAKER_01: are,
43:07
SPEAKER_01: when you finish a project,
43:09
SPEAKER_01: do you ever go there or do you,
43:11
SPEAKER_01: do you tend to give yourself a little bit of this time where you have a,
43:16
SPEAKER_01: you,
43:16
SPEAKER_01: you let the void go?
43:18
SPEAKER_01: be the void yeah you let you're not avoiding the void you're you're you're allowing
43:23
SPEAKER_01: it to to be what it is and then maybe later on you'll start to fill it up with
43:27
SPEAKER_01: another project or do you do you even while you're finishing up a project start to
43:31
SPEAKER_00: think about the next one oh i definitely am always thinking about the next one and
43:36
SPEAKER_00: it may or may not actually come to fruition but it's it is one of the things i love
43:39
SPEAKER_00: doing like even as i'm in the middle of reading just you know your eyes drift over
43:44
SPEAKER_00: to the bookshelf and you're thinking about what could come next
43:47
SPEAKER_00: I would say that typically, I don't know, it varies.
43:51
SPEAKER_00: This is honestly,
43:51
SPEAKER_00: I don't know that I've ever had this sustained amount of time like I've had over
43:57
SPEAKER_00: the last couple of years where I've had projects or group reads.
44:02
SPEAKER_00: And so this is kind of,
44:03
SPEAKER_00: I don't know if it's unprecedented,
44:04
SPEAKER_00: but I think it is for me where I've absolutely loved it,
44:09
SPEAKER_00: but I am kind of feeling right now the freedom of not necessarily committing to anything.
44:15
SPEAKER_00: But that said,
44:16
SPEAKER_00: I already am starting to have like,
44:18
SPEAKER_00: I've taken a little bit of a step back from NYRB Women,
44:20
SPEAKER_00: not because I wasn't loving it,
44:22
SPEAKER_00: but only because,
44:23
SPEAKER_00: you know,
44:23
SPEAKER_00: I was just feeling like what you just described.
44:25
SPEAKER_00: I didn't want it to turn into something where it even had any glimpses or risks of
44:30
SPEAKER_00: turning into like an assignment.
44:32
SPEAKER_00: And so I've talked to Kim a little bit about it.
44:34
SPEAKER_00: And that's one of the things I was going to say that I love about,
44:37
SPEAKER_00: you know,
44:38
SPEAKER_00: being friends with you and Kim and so many of the other people is like just the
44:42
SPEAKER_00: lack of pressure.
44:43
SPEAKER_00: that everybody gets that we're doing this out of the love of these books.
44:47
SPEAKER_00: And so I've never felt even an ounce of anybody being like, Oh, really, you're gonna take a break.
44:51
SPEAKER_00: That's too bad or anything like that.
44:53
SPEAKER_00: It's just like, Oh, yeah, yeah, go for it.
44:55
SPEAKER_00: And that's one of the things I appreciate it.
44:56
SPEAKER_00: And it makes it so much fun.
44:58
SPEAKER_00: But to answer your question,
45:00
SPEAKER_00: yes,
45:01
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
45:01
SPEAKER_00: I think right now,
45:02
SPEAKER_00: at least I'm kind of just enjoying the drifting.
45:05
SPEAKER_00: And I don't know how long that'll last.
45:06
SPEAKER_00: Like,
45:07
SPEAKER_00: a book like tone alone kind of,
45:10
SPEAKER_00: I guess is like a mini project because like I said,
45:12
SPEAKER_00: it took me to Zabal and then another author that they talk a lot about is Borges,
45:17
SPEAKER_00: which I mentioned like a year or two ago.
45:20
SPEAKER_00: I cannot believe it, but I've never read him.
45:22
SPEAKER_00: And so that's,
45:24
SPEAKER_00: you know,
45:24
SPEAKER_00: if I'm planning ahead,
45:25
SPEAKER_00: even to the end of rings of Saturn,
45:27
SPEAKER_00: that one's already off my shelf.
45:28
SPEAKER_00: Like that's my plan right now is to, to finally delve into that huge hole in my,
45:35
SPEAKER_00: reading so I think right now I'm really enjoying drifting but I will say I mean
45:38
SPEAKER_00: there are already some stuff I can talk about you know yeah you and I have talked
45:44
SPEAKER_00: about them like the big books it's funny because I say that I am enjoying the
45:49
SPEAKER_00: freedom and then a lot of the books that are calling out to me are the monsters on
45:53
SPEAKER_01: my shelves but I think that's lovely too and you know we talk about these group
45:59
SPEAKER_01: reads and they are delightful for multiple reasons and I feel like I've
46:05
SPEAKER_01: been involved in them in ways that I wasn't able to engage in years past for whatever reason.
46:13
SPEAKER_01: And I've been able to use what I've learned there to set up my own individual projects,
46:19
SPEAKER_01: to get through some things that I want to,
46:20
SPEAKER_01: you know,
46:21
SPEAKER_01: what ways are working for me?
46:22
SPEAKER_01: Well, it turns out, and I didn't really know this until I started NYRB women a year and a half ago.
46:28
SPEAKER_01: Now I like reading a little bit a day in a book.
46:33
SPEAKER_01: And not feeling like I have to read it exclusively or,
46:37
SPEAKER_01: you know,
46:38
SPEAKER_01: I've talked about this plenty because of how revolutionary that was for me.
46:43
SPEAKER_01: But that's how I got through Postovsky's Story of a Life.
46:47
SPEAKER_01: I wouldn't have been able to finish that book if I had been trying to read it like I used to.
46:53
SPEAKER_01: Well, maybe I'll read a few other things in the meantime, but I got to make sure that that's my focus.
46:58
SPEAKER_01: I would have eventually, the other things would have taken up the time and it would have drifted away.
47:03
SPEAKER_01: realizing this is gonna take me months that's okay yeah really really affected my
47:10
SPEAKER_01: ability to do that and i didn't know that until i started some of these group reads
47:13
SPEAKER_01: where i know kim didn't mean this but i remember one of them she's i think it was
47:18
SPEAKER_01: the um uh the grand hotel where she stopped the reading once right in the middle of
47:27
SPEAKER_01: a like a major tense moment of the book
47:31
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, oh, Kim, what a great, you know, horrible place to stop the reading today.
47:36
SPEAKER_01: Can we just keep going?
47:37
SPEAKER_01: And she goes, no, you have to wait.
47:39
SPEAKER_01: You know, I think she was having, well, of course she was having fun.
47:43
SPEAKER_01: She certainly wasn't like Trevor's doing it wrong.
47:45
SPEAKER_01: I was going to say, we all know how mean Kim is.
47:47
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
47:48
SPEAKER_01: But it was a fun, a fun thing.
47:52
SPEAKER_01: And that just kind of opened my eyes to getting through these that way.
47:59
SPEAKER_01: Also just,
48:00
SPEAKER_01: Realizing there are these authors that I want to read their work,
48:04
SPEAKER_01: their,
48:04
SPEAKER_01: their works saying,
48:06
SPEAKER_01: I'm going to spend the year doing that.
48:09
SPEAKER_01: Another thing that I've learned with these reading projects is the,
48:14
SPEAKER_01: my libraries,
48:16
SPEAKER_01: you know,
48:16
SPEAKER_01: or my wife's bookmark that she put together last year where it was a bunch of
48:21
SPEAKER_01: reading categories.
48:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:23
SPEAKER_01: And also this year.
48:25
SPEAKER_01: uh that has helped me keep up the variety and always feel a sense of of possibility
48:31
SPEAKER_01: of branching out and not feeling like i'm just pigeonholing myself into a certain
48:35
SPEAKER_01: type of book because i have to i have to stop when i finish one of those and say
48:41
SPEAKER_01: okay what what books do i have or what don't i have that i'm gonna have to go and
48:45
SPEAKER_01: find something for you know a retelling of a fairy tale
48:49
SPEAKER_01: It's not always something that I would just go looking for.
48:52
SPEAKER_01: But there are usually books that fit in those categories that I've been interested in that maybe apply.
48:58
SPEAKER_01: I mean, even NYRB Classics books, some of those are retellings of fairy tales.
49:03
SPEAKER_01: And it's just so fun to go and find them.
49:05
SPEAKER_01: But that has kept up.
49:06
SPEAKER_01: That's been a great project this year.
49:09
SPEAKER_01: I'm almost done, Paul.
49:11
SPEAKER_01: I've read a lot of books this year, but 39 of them have been applicable to the bookmark.
49:18
SPEAKER_01: So it's 42 books is the goal for 2024.
49:24
SPEAKER_01: And I've got 39 of them done.
49:26
SPEAKER_01: So I'm almost done with the bookmark.
49:28
SPEAKER_01: And to be honest, I'm a little bit worried about the void after that because I have very much enjoyed...
49:34
SPEAKER_01: trying to think outside the box.
49:37
SPEAKER_01: And,
49:38
SPEAKER_01: you know,
49:39
SPEAKER_01: we've talked about this,
49:40
SPEAKER_01: your bookshelves,
49:41
SPEAKER_01: the books that you've had on there for so long,
49:43
SPEAKER_01: you don't remember you have them.
49:45
SPEAKER_01: Even though you've always wanted to read them,
49:47
SPEAKER_01: you always intended to read them,
49:49
SPEAKER_01: but they're just kind of sitting there.
49:50
SPEAKER_01: This has been something that's forced me to do it.
49:52
SPEAKER_01: And it's been wonderful.
49:53
SPEAKER_01: And I'm a little bit,
49:55
SPEAKER_01: I'm honestly a little bit nervous about finishing it and having that void in front
50:00
SPEAKER_01: of me of now,
50:01
SPEAKER_01: how do I keep that going?
50:03
SPEAKER_00: At the rate you're going,
50:04
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
50:05
SPEAKER_00: if you could literally finish before you're halfway through the year,
50:07
SPEAKER_00: I don't know if it would be the same experience,
50:10
SPEAKER_00: but you could almost just do a second one.
50:12
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
50:12
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
50:13
SPEAKER_00: it would be the same categories,
50:14
SPEAKER_00: but...
50:16
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
50:16
SPEAKER_01: I have thought about that,
50:17
SPEAKER_01: but it makes me just go,
50:19
SPEAKER_01: I'm going to look at...
50:23
SPEAKER_01: A variety.
50:24
SPEAKER_01: I want that as well.
50:26
SPEAKER_01: That's been a really fun way to have that serendipity of an unexpected thing while
50:33
SPEAKER_01: I'm still trying to do these other projects.
50:35
SPEAKER_01: And of course,
50:36
SPEAKER_01: you have books,
50:36
SPEAKER_01: new releases that are coming out that you want to read and that are very exciting.
50:43
SPEAKER_01: I've really enjoyed having plans and I didn't used to read this way.
50:47
SPEAKER_01: It's you and these book groups that have really kind of helped me
50:52
SPEAKER_01: I would say keep that void at a healthy level.
50:56
SPEAKER_01: It's there and I like it,
50:59
SPEAKER_01: but I also like filling it and maybe not over planning,
51:02
SPEAKER_01: you know,
51:02
SPEAKER_01: and coming just to,
51:06
SPEAKER_01: you know.
51:08
SPEAKER_01: engulfed in it where it's just a void and nothing's going on.
51:11
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, it's been good.
51:15
SPEAKER_00: Good.
51:15
SPEAKER_00: Was it Books on the Nightstand, that old podcast?
51:19
SPEAKER_00: I think they used to do like a book bingo kind of a thing that was very similar to what that bookmark.
51:24
SPEAKER_00: I'm sure there are other ones out there.
51:26
SPEAKER_00: You could also just kind of do one for your own sake of just in the background, just kind of
51:32
SPEAKER_00: to keep that going for the second part of the year, because I really do like what you're saying.
51:35
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I agree with you, it's easy to get, it's not even a rut in a bad way.
51:39
SPEAKER_00: But it's easy to just get drawn to certain types of books,
51:41
SPEAKER_00: because this is the kind of books that I like and be very successful that way.
51:46
SPEAKER_00: But it is sometimes nice to just have one of those that comes out of left field and
51:50
SPEAKER_00: really surprises you,
51:51
SPEAKER_00: because it's just so different than what you'd really normally read.
51:54
SPEAKER_00: But
51:55
SPEAKER_00: It's,
51:56
SPEAKER_00: you know,
51:56
SPEAKER_00: that's one thing I think I do with my audio books is that's where I tend to do some
52:01
SPEAKER_00: of these things where it's like,
52:02
SPEAKER_00: oh,
52:03
SPEAKER_00: I have no idea if I would like this or not.
52:04
SPEAKER_00: But, you know, it's kind of like a low commitment.
52:07
SPEAKER_00: Usually I get them through Audible or not Audible, through Libby on YouTube.
52:11
SPEAKER_00: you know, the library.
52:11
SPEAKER_00: So it's free and it's a chance to just try a new author, try a new genre.
52:16
SPEAKER_00: So it is good to keep that.
52:17
SPEAKER_00: And that's the thing.
52:18
SPEAKER_00: You're previewing our next episode.
52:20
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's true.
52:21
SPEAKER_00: Sorry.
52:22
SPEAKER_00: No, you're okay.
52:23
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
52:24
SPEAKER_00: No, but it's part of it.
52:25
SPEAKER_00: That's kind of, I mean, it's so interesting because you said that, you know,
52:29
SPEAKER_00: I was one of the people who kind of influenced you to plan and then it's kind of
52:33
SPEAKER_00: funny because now I'm the one that's like saying how,
52:35
SPEAKER_00: but it is for me it's just a matter of not defining it completely I think and this
52:40
SPEAKER_00: comes up a lot for us is just giving yourself that freedom but what you were saying
52:44
SPEAKER_00: about reading one book versus multiple books,
52:47
SPEAKER_00: like for the past couple years I've been reading multiple books at the same time.
52:51
SPEAKER_00: between all the different projects we've talked about and other things.
52:54
SPEAKER_00: And again,
52:55
SPEAKER_00: with the caveat that I always have an audio book going right now,
52:58
SPEAKER_00: I'm feeling more attracted to the idea of reading one book or maybe two at a time
53:06
SPEAKER_00: and kind of getting back into that a little bit more of digging in.
53:09
SPEAKER_00: So it's almost kind of the opposite of what you were just describing.
53:12
SPEAKER_00: But again,
53:12
SPEAKER_00: this is only like,
53:13
SPEAKER_00: this could just be like a little temporary phase,
53:15
SPEAKER_00: but it's just so interesting how that works in your mind.
53:19
SPEAKER_01: what you're telling me is you have room for a big book that you spend, you read five pages a day on.
53:25
SPEAKER_00: Right.
53:26
SPEAKER_00: And that's exactly what I was thinking is like,
53:29
SPEAKER_00: as you were saying that I was like,
53:30
SPEAKER_00: that is the kind of thing where even if I was reading Borges,
53:34
SPEAKER_00: like that's where it,
53:35
SPEAKER_00: like,
53:35
SPEAKER_00: even when I say these things,
53:36
SPEAKER_00: like I instantly start,
53:38
SPEAKER_00: because a lot of times if you're reading short stories,
53:40
SPEAKER_00: for example,
53:40
SPEAKER_00: like,
53:42
SPEAKER_00: it's very rare that I would just sit there and I mean,
53:44
SPEAKER_00: I do it sometimes,
53:45
SPEAKER_00: but often you'll mix those in with,
53:47
SPEAKER_00: with a novel or something.
53:48
SPEAKER_00: So again, it's, it's, I don't know.
53:50
SPEAKER_00: It's, it's funny, but yeah, Ms.
53:51
SPEAKER_00: McIntosh is definitely something where I can't see any conceivable way that I would
53:56
SPEAKER_00: sit there and exclusively read that for the next,
53:59
SPEAKER_00: you know,
54:00
SPEAKER_00: it was three to six months of my life.
54:02
SPEAKER_00: And that's what, I mean, I was going to bring that up with the whole,
54:06
SPEAKER_00: the post that I did,
54:07
SPEAKER_00: which got a lot of interesting comments from people talking about the big books is
54:11
SPEAKER_00: that is where it gets tricky because again,
54:14
SPEAKER_00: I am drawn towards those big books and I would really like to spend the next few
54:18
SPEAKER_00: years starting to read some of these books that have been calling to me.
54:22
SPEAKER_00: But that's the tricky part is I don't know that I necessarily want to only read
54:26
SPEAKER_00: like one or two books a year,
54:29
SPEAKER_00: which might be what it would take to get through some of these.
54:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I don't know.
54:33
SPEAKER_00: It's a very adrifty at the moment.
54:35
SPEAKER_00: I'm still kind of, you've caught me in a moment where I'm still kind of planning it out, but it's fun.
54:40
SPEAKER_01: That's why we did this, right?
54:41
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
54:41
SPEAKER_01: is that you were in this phase and we were talking a little bit about it and
54:46
SPEAKER_01: thought this might be a fun way to do it.
54:49
SPEAKER_01: And the other thing that I'm thinking about now is that sense of possibility is trying to maintain that.
54:56
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
54:57
SPEAKER_01: because that's maybe that's why I do read a lot of different books and kind of on
55:02
SPEAKER_01: various schedules and types is because it does help me always be about,
55:08
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
55:09
SPEAKER_01: I've read a lot of books this year.
55:10
SPEAKER_01: It's,
55:10
SPEAKER_01: it's made it so that I'm finishing books quite often,
55:14
SPEAKER_01: not because I'm reading a book a day,
55:17
SPEAKER_01: like from cover to cover.
55:19
SPEAKER_01: It's because I'm reading several and it may take me a month to read a book, but,
55:28
SPEAKER_01: The one I started a few days later is also going to take me a month.
55:31
SPEAKER_01: And so it does kind of have that perpetual sense of I just finished something.
55:37
SPEAKER_01: I am reading other things and sometimes that's done.
55:40
SPEAKER_01: I'm done with that reading.
55:43
SPEAKER_01: But it kind of helps maintain that sense of.
55:46
SPEAKER_01: of what's next and striking when that sense is hot.
55:52
SPEAKER_01: Like when I, when I did decide to do war and peace, it wasn't, it was almost, it was a bit of a whim.
55:57
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
55:57
SPEAKER_01: My wife had bought it for me in the translation that I wanted and brothers,
56:02
SPEAKER_01: Carter Mazzo showed up on the same day.
56:04
SPEAKER_01: And I thought, well,
56:05
SPEAKER_01: I can either let these sit here for a while, which we've talked about.
56:08
SPEAKER_01: And I certainly do.
56:09
SPEAKER_01: You talked about it earlier today,
56:11
SPEAKER_01: you know,
56:12
SPEAKER_01: with smash and touch my darling,
56:13
SPEAKER_01: you know,
56:14
SPEAKER_01: arrives and,
56:15
SPEAKER_01: and there's that sense of,
56:16
SPEAKER_01: yeah,
56:16
SPEAKER_01: it's here.
56:17
SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, I've had so many books where I'm excited to read them, but I'll start it tomorrow.
56:23
SPEAKER_01: I'm not quite ready to start it today, but tomorrow I will.
56:25
SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, it just doesn't happen.
56:28
SPEAKER_01: And I remember sitting there and thinking, I'm just going to do it.
56:32
SPEAKER_01: Why?
56:33
SPEAKER_01: You know, I want to read both of them.
56:35
SPEAKER_01: Today, this is something I'm excited about.
56:40
SPEAKER_01: War and Peace that's been off of my bucket list for a long time.
56:45
SPEAKER_01: I don't even need to put it back on.
56:46
SPEAKER_01: I'm starting it today.
56:47
SPEAKER_01: And I also have this new translation of the Brothers Karamazov.
56:51
SPEAKER_01: You had read it recently.
56:52
SPEAKER_01: I'd wanted to reread it.
56:53
SPEAKER_01: And I thought...
56:55
SPEAKER_01: whatever, just, just do it.
56:56
SPEAKER_01: It might be stupid, but just do it.
56:58
SPEAKER_01: And it turned out to be something wonderful,
57:01
SPEAKER_01: but it was,
57:01
SPEAKER_01: a lot of it was striking while that iron was hot and not making it something overwhelming.
57:08
SPEAKER_01: And I tried really hard over that time to always make sure that I was excited to
57:13
SPEAKER_01: read those the next day.
57:15
SPEAKER_01: Because I wouldn't get tired of them by reading too much of it or making it get in
57:21
SPEAKER_01: the way of other things.
57:22
SPEAKER_01: And it just really worked to keep that sense of openness.
57:28
SPEAKER_01: And I think maybe that's where I'm ending on this episode.
57:32
SPEAKER_01: This is not part of my notes.
57:36
SPEAKER_01: But I kind of like having that sense of the void is right there.
57:41
SPEAKER_01: It's the wrong word, probably.
57:44
SPEAKER_01: The void that suggests something empty.
57:47
SPEAKER_01: And I guess what I mean is that tug of open,
57:51
SPEAKER_01: you know,
57:51
SPEAKER_01: something in front of you that's a little bit unknown.
57:53
SPEAKER_01: But you right now have the ability to put something in it.
57:59
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
58:00
SPEAKER_01: And trying to keep that going...
58:04
SPEAKER_01: And some of these book projects,
58:06
SPEAKER_01: the bookmark,
58:07
SPEAKER_01: the library bookmark,
58:08
SPEAKER_01: the library book clubs,
58:10
SPEAKER_01: the variety,
58:12
SPEAKER_01: making sure I'm very selective of which ones I join.
58:16
SPEAKER_01: Using audiobooks has been great because it does allow me to test some things like you were talking about.
58:22
SPEAKER_01: And we'll talk about that more next episode.
58:25
SPEAKER_01: All of these things have helped me grow.
58:28
SPEAKER_01: continually keep that mood going and it isn't about quantity like I didn't I don't
58:34
SPEAKER_01: care how many books I'm reading or how many books I read in a year if I'm just you
58:39
SPEAKER_01: know ripping through them that's not what I'm going for but it is about richness
58:45
SPEAKER_01: yeah and it's it really has been working for me this year I know things can change
58:51
SPEAKER_01: we'll probably here in a few months have to do an episode on reading slumps maybe
58:56
SPEAKER_01: we'll both be in one or I will be
58:58
SPEAKER_01: Um,
58:58
SPEAKER_01: but right now I just,
58:59
SPEAKER_01: there's,
59:00
SPEAKER_01: I'm feeling,
59:00
SPEAKER_01: I feel like a book can show up that I'm excited about and I can read it.
59:06
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
59:06
SPEAKER_01: Versus I have to figure out how to get this in when's the right time.
59:09
SPEAKER_01: Right.
59:10
SPEAKER_01: Um, and a lot of it's through these things.
59:12
SPEAKER_01: We, we talked about this recently on a different episode.
59:14
SPEAKER_01: You know, how do you, what do you, how do you read?
59:17
SPEAKER_01: How do you keep things going?
59:19
SPEAKER_01: And that's just really, really affected me and helped me keeping that sense of
59:24
SPEAKER_01: of the, what do you read after finishing a great book?
59:27
SPEAKER_01: Well, today's the day you get to do that.
59:30
SPEAKER_01: Regardless of where you're at in your reading, you can do that.
59:33
SPEAKER_01: You can still have that sense.
59:35
SPEAKER_01: So anyway.
59:36
SPEAKER_00: No, I love that.
59:37
SPEAKER_00: I think what I'm taking out of this is, in some ways, the details almost don't matter.
59:43
SPEAKER_00: It's about that mentality and the way to keep that going.
59:48
SPEAKER_00: And that can shift.
59:49
SPEAKER_00: I mean, like right now, like I said, I made this big statement that I'm kind of
59:53
SPEAKER_00: you know, taking a little bit of a break from the group reads and the bigger projects.
59:57
SPEAKER_00: But I mean,
59:57
SPEAKER_00: I don't know how true that will turn out to be,
1:00:00
SPEAKER_00: but it's more of just the idea like in your own head,
1:00:03
SPEAKER_00: maybe I was starting to feel a little bit like,
1:00:05
SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:00:05
SPEAKER_00: I have this,
1:00:06
SPEAKER_00: I need to read this,
1:00:07
SPEAKER_00: this,
1:00:07
SPEAKER_00: this,
1:00:08
SPEAKER_00: and this today.
1:00:08
SPEAKER_00: And so like it started to have a glimmer of an assignment feel to it.
1:00:13
SPEAKER_00: And so even if it's just mentally taking a break and just saying like, no, this is fun.
1:00:18
SPEAKER_00: I don't have to do any of this.
1:00:19
SPEAKER_00: I still could, I could jump back in tomorrow.
1:00:21
SPEAKER_00: I mean, the mountain lions coming up on NYRB women in that I would love to join back into that.
1:00:26
SPEAKER_00: So, but it's just, I think some of it is just for each person in each part of their life.
1:00:31
SPEAKER_00: There's just those moments where it's like,
1:00:34
SPEAKER_00: all that matters is how you feel about it.
1:00:36
SPEAKER_00: And so whatever it takes in your own mind to,
1:00:38
SPEAKER_00: in that moment to feel that sense of excitement and peace,
1:00:41
SPEAKER_00: that's,
1:00:41
SPEAKER_00: that's really all it is.
1:00:42
SPEAKER_00: It's just maintaining that.
1:00:45
SPEAKER_00: This is a little bit of a tangent,
1:00:46
SPEAKER_00: but I mean,
1:00:46
SPEAKER_00: I was thinking even something like,
1:00:48
SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:00:49
SPEAKER_00: you were talking about a book shows up and you just get excited and want to read it.
1:00:53
SPEAKER_00: The new directions, their new classics series.
1:00:56
SPEAKER_00: My wife subscribed me to that,
1:00:58
SPEAKER_00: like I think for Christmas last year and little things like that are just so much
1:01:03
SPEAKER_00: fun because it's,
1:01:04
SPEAKER_00: You know, the one that just showed up was It Lasts Forever and Then It's Over by Ian DeMarkin.
1:01:10
SPEAKER_00: And I posted something about that.
1:01:12
SPEAKER_00: And people are just like, oh, you got to read it right away.
1:01:14
SPEAKER_00: It's so good.
1:01:15
SPEAKER_00: And just I love that.
1:01:17
SPEAKER_00: Like,
1:01:17
SPEAKER_00: I think I probably will pick that one up very soon because it's just in the moment
1:01:21
SPEAKER_00: it strikes and it seems right.
1:01:23
SPEAKER_00: Just leaving that freedom and excitement, I think, is the key to all of this.
1:01:27
SPEAKER_01: That one would apply to me as well.
1:01:30
SPEAKER_01: It was, you know, I got an early copy of it.
1:01:33
SPEAKER_01: And I remember one night, it was like 1030.
1:01:35
SPEAKER_01: I think my wife was tired.
1:01:37
SPEAKER_01: She was going to bed.
1:01:37
SPEAKER_01: And I thought, I don't know anything about this.
1:01:40
SPEAKER_01: I like the cover.
1:01:41
SPEAKER_01: I didn't even, I don't even think I read the back of the book.
1:01:44
SPEAKER_01: I just sat down and started reading it.
1:01:46
SPEAKER_01: And man, it was,
1:01:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:01:49
SPEAKER_01: It was so, it's such a good one.
1:01:51
SPEAKER_01: It's so, so, so good.
1:01:53
SPEAKER_01: I've been sharing that one with other people too.
1:01:56
SPEAKER_01: Um,
1:01:57
SPEAKER_01: so yeah,
1:01:58
SPEAKER_01: it,
1:01:59
SPEAKER_01: that serendipity was still a part of it,
1:02:02
SPEAKER_01: you know,
1:02:02
SPEAKER_01: even though I think at the time I was probably still in the middle of war and peace
1:02:06
SPEAKER_01: and all of that,
1:02:06
SPEAKER_01: but I,
1:02:08
SPEAKER_01: I was able to break away and,
1:02:10
SPEAKER_01: and allow that,
1:02:11
SPEAKER_01: that serendipity to,
1:02:13
SPEAKER_01: to pop in and yeah,
1:02:14
SPEAKER_01: little,
1:02:15
SPEAKER_01: these book clubs that,
1:02:16
SPEAKER_01: that sends you stuff,
1:02:17
um,
1:02:18
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's so fun.
1:02:19
SPEAKER_00: Well,
1:02:20
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
1:02:20
SPEAKER_00: this maybe is a little bit opposite of serendipity,
1:02:22
SPEAKER_00: but I was also just thinking,
1:02:24
SPEAKER_00: even when I'm taking these times where I'm feeling this freedom and this possibility,
1:02:31
SPEAKER_00: I still am always thinking about what I can do to fill that in.
1:02:35
SPEAKER_00: And so I was just, I don't know if this is a tangent that you wanted to go down, but I just thought,
1:02:39
SPEAKER_00: You know, I could touch on some of the things that I kind of have like that I'm thinking about doing.
1:02:43
SPEAKER_00: No tangents, Paul.
1:02:45
SPEAKER_00: No tangents.
1:02:45
SPEAKER_00: I forgot what podcast we're on.
1:02:48
SPEAKER_01: No, please.
1:02:50
SPEAKER_01: This is part of it too, right?
1:02:51
SPEAKER_01: I mean, in a way, this podcast matches that tone of where do we want to go next?
1:02:56
SPEAKER_01: We don't have a strong regimented thing.
1:03:00
SPEAKER_01: We always want it to be.
1:03:02
SPEAKER_00: new and exciting for us right i mean you and i have been chatting about one book
1:03:06
SPEAKER_00: that popped up on my list of big books and that we've both talked about before
1:03:11
SPEAKER_00: which is the peasants and that one you know it's not like i can probably
1:03:15
SPEAKER_00: realistically read miss mcintosh and the peasants at the same time although i mean
1:03:18
SPEAKER_00: anything's possible of course i could you read
1:03:21
SPEAKER_00: Those two, you read War and Peace and The Brothers Karamazov at the same time.
1:03:24
SPEAKER_01: I think if you just do them differently, you could.
1:03:28
SPEAKER_01: Miss Macintosh is a different thing.
1:03:31
SPEAKER_01: It's like, can you read a magazine article on the peasants?
1:03:34
SPEAKER_01: Of course you can.
1:03:35
SPEAKER_01: They are both big books, but they're very different.
1:03:40
SPEAKER_01: By the way, are you...
1:03:44
SPEAKER_01: Are you not going to say the name of the author because it's too intimidating?
1:03:49
SPEAKER_00: Well, I didn't have it in front of me, so I figured I would just let you take over that one.
1:03:53
SPEAKER_01: I'll try.
1:03:54
SPEAKER_01: Vladislav Raymond?
1:03:56
SPEAKER_01: I don't know if I'm saying either of those right.
1:03:58
SPEAKER_01: No, that sounds... But it'll be in the show notes, The Peasants.
1:04:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and that's that book.
1:04:03
SPEAKER_00: I know that Stuart,
1:04:06
SPEAKER_00: at our end of the year episode,
1:04:08
SPEAKER_00: was partway through and he was saying it already had a good possibility of being
1:04:11
SPEAKER_00: one of his...
1:04:12
SPEAKER_00: books of the year I don't know how he's doing on it I've checked in with him a
1:04:15
SPEAKER_00: couple times and I know that you know he was still making his way through it but
1:04:20
SPEAKER_00: Stephen Sparks as we've talked about
1:04:23
SPEAKER_00: the great bookseller at Point Reyes was the one who got that one into both of our hands.
1:04:28
SPEAKER_00: So that's one that, but I was also just thinking like, it's just fun for me at least to plot ahead.
1:04:32
SPEAKER_00: So,
1:04:33
SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:04:33
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
1:04:33
SPEAKER_00: Javier Marias,
1:04:34
SPEAKER_00: I'm still enjoying kind of chipping away for our future episode on his works.
1:04:39
SPEAKER_00: I've been reading him pretty regularly over the last year or so.
1:04:43
SPEAKER_00: But again,
1:04:43
SPEAKER_00: like we talked about McNally editions in our last episode and I was looking at
1:04:48
SPEAKER_00: those on my shelves and I'm like,
1:04:50
SPEAKER_00: I have this big,
1:04:51
SPEAKER_00: beautiful stack that,
1:04:53
SPEAKER_00: it's just,
1:04:54
SPEAKER_00: it's fun to think about,
1:04:55
SPEAKER_00: like,
1:04:55
SPEAKER_00: I wouldn't mind just kind of doing some,
1:04:57
SPEAKER_00: some publisher deep dives too.
1:05:00
SPEAKER_00: So it's not that I like when I have these moments of serendipity,
1:05:03
SPEAKER_00: it's not that I'm like completely on whims,
1:05:06
SPEAKER_00: just jumping to books.
1:05:06
SPEAKER_00: I'm already still thinking ahead of things,
1:05:08
SPEAKER_00: but it's more of like the excitement of like,
1:05:10
SPEAKER_00: what if I just want to like have a charcoal press fall or,
1:05:13
SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:05:13
SPEAKER_00: things like that,
1:05:14
SPEAKER_00: like that,
1:05:14
SPEAKER_00: that would just be fun to do.
1:05:15
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:05:17
SPEAKER_01: That's a good idea.
1:05:18
SPEAKER_00: So, yeah.
1:05:19
SPEAKER_00: And then classics, you know, you're,
1:05:21
SPEAKER_00: you're a perfect example of, of somebody who's actually just doing what I'm talking about doing.
1:05:27
SPEAKER_00: But, you know, to be fair, I did just finish Rebecca West, which I think that counts as like 10 classes.
1:05:32
SPEAKER_00: No, but I would really like to jump back into Trollope.
1:05:35
SPEAKER_00: You know, Virginia Wolf has really been calling to me lately.
1:05:38
SPEAKER_00: Dickens has always been,
1:05:40
SPEAKER_00: you know, on my, I want to read shelf.
1:05:44
SPEAKER_00: And then parade's end is another one that I've really wanted to get to our old
1:05:48
SPEAKER_00: friend calling born from way,
1:05:50
SPEAKER_00: way,
1:05:50
SPEAKER_00: way back.
1:05:51
SPEAKER_00: She's been recommending that to me for probably the better part of two decades now.
1:05:54
SPEAKER_00: So that's the thing is like,
1:05:55
SPEAKER_00: even as I'm saying,
1:05:56
SPEAKER_00: like,
1:05:57
SPEAKER_00: it's kind of that fun,
1:05:59
SPEAKER_00: like there's a million things I want to read right now.
1:06:01
SPEAKER_00: And they're all just competing in a fun way in my head.
1:06:04
SPEAKER_00: And I just like, I like that feeling.
1:06:06
SPEAKER_01: It's hard to know how to turn these things that are calling to you into the thing you can do right now.
1:06:13
SPEAKER_01: Maybe that's why the image of the void resonated a little bit with me,
1:06:19
SPEAKER_01: at least when we were talking about it.
1:06:21
SPEAKER_01: There's this sense of, like I say, maybe standing in front of a hole and you hear the echoes.
1:06:27
SPEAKER_01: How do you get what's right?
1:06:30
SPEAKER_01: How do you turn those echoes that are calling to you
1:06:34
SPEAKER_01: into reality.
1:06:35
SPEAKER_01: I don't want to turn this into a corporate speech.
1:06:38
SPEAKER_01: Turn that potential into action.
1:06:41
SPEAKER_01: But at the same time, when a book is calling to you, how do you make it so that
1:06:50
SPEAKER_01: you feel like hey this is the right thing right now this is what my my my you know
1:06:57
SPEAKER_01: my soul wants is is this is this particular book this time not to plan for it you
1:07:05
SPEAKER_01: know but at the same time
1:07:10
SPEAKER_01: Part of what I also wanted to talk about in this episode is giving yourself plans
1:07:15
SPEAKER_01: that are in the future enough that you can...
1:07:21
SPEAKER_01: you do have that, cause that has been a big change for me.
1:07:24
SPEAKER_01: Like I know I'm going to be reading a book by Trollope this month.
1:07:31
SPEAKER_01: I'm not going to read the next one until next month,
1:07:34
SPEAKER_01: you know,
1:07:34
SPEAKER_01: kind of thing,
1:07:35
SPEAKER_01: regardless of how excited I am for it.
1:07:37
SPEAKER_01: It keeps that sense of, of the journey alive.
1:07:41
SPEAKER_01: You know, how do you, how do you keep that journey going in the right pace?
1:07:43
SPEAKER_01: And I think that maybe that's what I mean by there.
1:07:45
SPEAKER_01: There's just a variety of different books that,
1:07:48
SPEAKER_01: And ways to approach them kind of keeps that going.
1:07:51
SPEAKER_01: That's what's been working for me.
1:07:52
SPEAKER_01: I don't want to prescribe that to anybody else.
1:07:54
SPEAKER_00: No, no, I agree.
1:07:56
SPEAKER_00: I really like that approach.
1:07:58
SPEAKER_00: And like you said, how to know which ones are right.
1:08:01
SPEAKER_00: That's what's so fascinating to me about this whole process is like.
1:08:06
SPEAKER_00: There still feels like there's some magic to it,
1:08:08
SPEAKER_00: where,
1:08:09
SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:08:09
SPEAKER_00: I don't know,
1:08:10
SPEAKER_00: Zabal,
1:08:11
SPEAKER_00: I've been like,
1:08:12
SPEAKER_00: for,
1:08:12
SPEAKER_00: I probably talked about it on this episode multiple times,
1:08:14
SPEAKER_00: like,
1:08:14
SPEAKER_00: I need to read more,
1:08:15
SPEAKER_00: I need to read more.
1:08:16
SPEAKER_00: But then, all of a sudden, I'm reading Tone.
1:08:19
SPEAKER_00: And it's like,
1:08:20
SPEAKER_00: Oh no, not right now.
1:08:21
SPEAKER_00: This is the time.
1:08:22
SPEAKER_00: And I pull it down and it's perfect.
1:08:24
SPEAKER_01: And how cool that you did that and didn't think I'll do this soon then,
1:08:29
SPEAKER_01: but you just went and pulled it down off your shelf and started it.
1:08:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:08:32
SPEAKER_00: And that's, that's the part that's just so fascinating about all this is like,
1:08:37
SPEAKER_00: there is some art and some science and it's perfect blend.
1:08:41
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't have to be like, sometimes it's a little more of one.
1:08:44
SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it's a little more of the other, but I really like that.
1:08:47
SPEAKER_00: I think it's just giving yourself, at least for me, the flexibility to not, to just go with it.
1:08:52
SPEAKER_00: Like whatever's working and just what you're doing,
1:08:54
SPEAKER_00: like over the last year or so,
1:08:56
SPEAKER_00: you've discovered this new way of reading.
1:08:58
SPEAKER_00: That's just completely opened up the way that you're doing things.
1:09:02
SPEAKER_00: And maybe it'll last forever.
1:09:03
SPEAKER_00: I mean, or maybe it won't, but I just, I love that.
1:09:06
SPEAKER_00: It's just that idea of like, this is working.
1:09:08
SPEAKER_00: It's perfect.
1:09:09
SPEAKER_00: I'm really excited every day.
1:09:10
SPEAKER_00: It's fun.
1:09:10
SPEAKER_00: And I don't know,
1:09:12
SPEAKER_00: that's kind of what I'm feeling right now is just,
1:09:15
SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:09:15
SPEAKER_00: you don't have to necessarily define it and just kind of go with the flow.
1:09:18
SPEAKER_00: But if you get into one of those spots, just whatever's working for you, go for it.
1:09:23
SPEAKER_01: So at the risk of destroying the magic.
1:09:27
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no.
1:09:28
SPEAKER_01: I think both of us have talked a little bit about our reading horizons and what
1:09:34
SPEAKER_01: might be ways that we're looking at this,
1:09:37
SPEAKER_01: whether in the short or the long term.
1:09:39
SPEAKER_01: You know, I like that you brought up Borges.
1:09:42
SPEAKER_01: I just bought that really nice Penguin Deluxe Fictiones, like all of his fiction books.
1:09:49
SPEAKER_01: But I haven't started it yet.
1:09:50
SPEAKER_01: That was one of our Summer Book Club 2022 selections that didn't win out.
1:09:58
SPEAKER_01: And
1:10:02
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, that's something that I have on my on my book stand as well.
1:10:08
SPEAKER_01: You talked about the peasants and whether or not to jump into that.
1:10:13
SPEAKER_01: Are there other things that you're like, maybe I'm not going to start this now or maybe I am.
1:10:17
SPEAKER_01: Maybe this is my short term, you know, filling it up that you are kind of looking at.
1:10:23
SPEAKER_01: um, specifically, not just like, you know, your, your big books post on Twitter.
1:10:29
SPEAKER_01: Right.
1:10:29
SPEAKER_01: Um, where there's, you know, uh, enough for a lifetime there.
1:10:35
SPEAKER_01: Uh, are there any specifics that you're, you're thinking might be the next place to go for that?
1:10:41
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:10:41
SPEAKER_00: Like I said, I mean, definitely Borges after Zeybald is definitely my plan.
1:10:45
SPEAKER_00: I, I,
1:10:47
SPEAKER_00: Clarice Lispector has really been calling to me.
1:10:51
SPEAKER_00: I read, of course, I'm spacing on the name of it, but the star, the name.
1:10:56
SPEAKER_01: The Hour of the Star?
1:10:57
SPEAKER_00: The Hour of the Star.
1:10:58
SPEAKER_00: Oh, I just loved that one.
1:11:00
SPEAKER_00: And so I have her complete stories.
1:11:03
SPEAKER_00: And then I also just picked up her Too Much of Life,
1:11:06
SPEAKER_00: which is her kind of nonfiction,
1:11:08
SPEAKER_00: like newspaper excerpts.
1:11:10
SPEAKER_00: Chronicles or something like that?
1:11:12
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
1:11:12
SPEAKER_00: I couldn't think of the word.
1:11:13
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
1:11:14
SPEAKER_00: Both of those have been calling to me.
1:11:15
SPEAKER_00: And again,
1:11:15
SPEAKER_00: this is kind of antithetical to what I've been saying,
1:11:18
SPEAKER_00: because those would be ones that I would mix in.
1:11:20
SPEAKER_00: with other things, but both of those have really been calling to me.
1:11:23
SPEAKER_00: And I mentioned the publishers earlier.
1:11:25
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
1:11:25
SPEAKER_00: I was going to ask you,
1:11:27
SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:11:29
SPEAKER_00: for your opinion,
1:11:30
SPEAKER_00: because McNally editions,
1:11:32
SPEAKER_00: I would really like to dive back in.
1:11:33
SPEAKER_00: And so the ones that I had pulled off were The Murderer,
1:11:38
SPEAKER_00: The Oppermans,
1:11:39
SPEAKER_00: A Green Equinox,
1:11:41
SPEAKER_00: Twice Lost,
1:11:42
SPEAKER_00: and Betrayed by Rita Hayworth.
1:11:44
SPEAKER_00: I'm not asking you to necessarily,
1:11:46
SPEAKER_00: I don't know if you've read any of those,
1:11:47
SPEAKER_00: but the operaments is the one that's kind of calling to me out of that list right now.
1:11:51
SPEAKER_00: And so I'm thinking I might set that one aside.
1:11:55
SPEAKER_00: Um, and then with charcoal press, I have a big box coming from them that I'm really excited about.
1:12:01
SPEAKER_00: They're one,
1:12:02
SPEAKER_00: a publisher that I've actually read a fair number of their books,
1:12:04
SPEAKER_00: but,
1:12:06
SPEAKER_00: um,
1:12:06
SPEAKER_00: there's a couple of theirs that are,
1:12:08
SPEAKER_00: they're really calling to me to,
1:12:10
SPEAKER_00: um,
1:12:11
SPEAKER_00: because as much as I loved Elena Knows, I really wanna read.
1:12:16
SPEAKER_00: My brain is not working very well today.
1:12:18
SPEAKER_00: A Little Luck?
1:12:20
SPEAKER_00: A Little Luck, exactly.
1:12:21
SPEAKER_00: That's the one right now that's really calling to me.
1:12:24
SPEAKER_00: So,
1:12:25
SPEAKER_00: again,
1:12:26
SPEAKER_00: those are a few,
1:12:27
SPEAKER_00: but I was also just kind of thinking,
1:12:31
SPEAKER_00: you look at all these publishers that we talk about,
1:12:36
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
1:12:37
SPEAKER_00: This is what I'm talking about.
1:12:39
SPEAKER_00: This whole conversation has been very nebulous,
1:12:41
SPEAKER_00: but I was almost thinking it would be fun to kind of rotate through different
1:12:45
SPEAKER_00: publishers and just pick whichever one calls to you from Archipelago.
1:12:49
SPEAKER_00: Read that.
1:12:50
SPEAKER_00: Pick whichever one calls to you from Dalky.
1:12:52
SPEAKER_00: Read that.
1:12:53
SPEAKER_00: It might be kind of fun to almost do a round-robin where...
1:12:57
SPEAKER_01: I like that a lot.
1:12:58
SPEAKER_00: So I don't know.
1:12:58
SPEAKER_00: Again,
1:12:59
SPEAKER_00: like I said,
1:12:59
SPEAKER_00: I know that this is a little bit unstructured,
1:13:01
SPEAKER_00: but it's very indicative of what's going on in my head right now.
1:13:04
SPEAKER_00: And it's all about the possibility.
1:13:06
SPEAKER_00: It's not a stress thing.
1:13:07
SPEAKER_00: It's almost just like an overload of excitement.
1:13:10
SPEAKER_01: Cool.
1:13:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I like that.
1:13:12
SPEAKER_00: How about you, though?
1:13:13
SPEAKER_00: What are some of the other ones?
1:13:13
SPEAKER_00: I mean, you've talked about some.
1:13:15
SPEAKER_00: Are there any other ones that you've got on your kind of medium term list or something like that?
1:13:21
SPEAKER_01: Well,
1:13:22
SPEAKER_01: Lies and Sorcery by Elsa Marante,
1:13:25
SPEAKER_01: translated by Jenny McPhee,
1:13:26
SPEAKER_01: that came out last year from NYRB and it arrived and it's a big one.
1:13:30
SPEAKER_01: I don't know, is it 900 pages?
1:13:32
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:13:33
SPEAKER_01: It's 800 pages.
1:13:35
SPEAKER_00: Can I share a piece of news that might influence?
1:13:38
SPEAKER_00: You may already know this, but I was talking to Kim and I don't want this.
1:13:42
SPEAKER_00: I don't know this.
1:13:44
SPEAKER_00: She may still be planning,
1:13:45
SPEAKER_00: so don't quote me,
1:13:45
SPEAKER_00: but she told me that she was thinking that that might be the first one for NYRB
1:13:50
SPEAKER_00: Women 25 and it might be like the first couple months of the year.
1:13:54
SPEAKER_00: I like that.
1:13:56
SPEAKER_00: So just keep that in mind as you're plotting.
1:13:59
SPEAKER_01: No, that's helpful.
1:14:00
SPEAKER_01: That is helpful because I figure I might as well do it that way if that's coming.
1:14:05
SPEAKER_01: I'm not going to reread it in January of 2025 if I read it this year.
1:14:12
SPEAKER_01: I don't think.
1:14:12
SPEAKER_01: Maybe I would, but I don't think so.
1:14:15
SPEAKER_00: It's crazy, but only seven months away or something.
1:14:18
SPEAKER_00: So maybe it's worth holding off on that.
1:14:20
SPEAKER_01: Well, that changes everything, Paul.
1:14:22
SPEAKER_01: That was the one I was going to do today.
1:14:24
SPEAKER_01: No, just kidding.
1:14:27
SPEAKER_01: But that was one of the other big ones that I was looking at besides the peasants.
1:14:32
SPEAKER_01: But knowing that, again, what's kind of happened is it opened up.
1:14:37
SPEAKER_01: the door to say, well, okay, if that one's going to be a little bit later, what is next then?
1:14:41
SPEAKER_01: What else is calling to me?
1:14:43
SPEAKER_01: And so I'll have to go and look at that.
1:14:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's fun.
1:14:48
SPEAKER_00: Well,
1:14:49
SPEAKER_00: like I said,
1:14:49
SPEAKER_00: I keep mentioning that post,
1:14:50
SPEAKER_00: but so many people,
1:14:51
SPEAKER_00: when they were weighing in on the big books,
1:14:52
SPEAKER_00: like the enthusiasm of people who've read some of these,
1:14:55
SPEAKER_00: because like Anthony Powell...
1:14:58
SPEAKER_00: I think it's Anthony Pohl, actually.
1:14:59
SPEAKER_00: I always want to say Pohl.
1:15:01
SPEAKER_00: People talked about like how just different strategies to read that,
1:15:06
SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:15:06
SPEAKER_00: kind of like anniversaries where you read it.
1:15:08
SPEAKER_00: And so somebody had sent over an idea of reading like
1:15:12
SPEAKER_00: one section per month.
1:15:14
SPEAKER_00: And they said that it worked perfectly for them.
1:15:15
SPEAKER_00: So that's one of the things that I love is just,
1:15:18
SPEAKER_00: you know,
1:15:18
SPEAKER_00: you throw these kind of fishing lines out there and then you just never know what
1:15:21
SPEAKER_00: you're going to hear.
1:15:22
SPEAKER_00: And it gets me all excited to try these different things.
1:15:25
SPEAKER_00: So I don't know.
1:15:27
SPEAKER_01: As the person who puts together the show notes, I'll just say Dance the Music of Time by Anthony Paul.
1:15:34
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
1:15:34
SPEAKER_01: Sorry, I'm bad at that.
1:15:35
SPEAKER_01: And Adversaries by Uwe Johnson.
1:15:37
SPEAKER_01: The reason I do that is so that
1:15:40
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
1:15:40
SPEAKER_01: it cues it to me because sometimes I feel like if we just mention a book title in passing,
1:15:44
SPEAKER_01: it's,
1:15:44
SPEAKER_01: I'm not going to put it on the show notes,
1:15:46
SPEAKER_01: but then I realized that might be exactly the type of book that people want in the
1:15:50
SPEAKER_01: show notes because it was just in passing.
1:15:52
SPEAKER_01: So that's why I appreciate it.
1:15:53
SPEAKER_00: And honestly, I never do it on purpose.
1:15:55
SPEAKER_00: Most of the time it's because our conversations are so wide ranging.
1:15:58
SPEAKER_00: I get so excited.
1:15:59
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I remember the title or the author, but I don't remember both.
1:16:02
SPEAKER_00: And I don't have my notes in front of me.
1:16:03
SPEAKER_00: So I'm just
1:16:05
SPEAKER_01: I do expect many people know what we're talking about and recognize that we are,
1:16:09
SPEAKER_01: you know,
1:16:09
SPEAKER_01: as we've often said,
1:16:10
SPEAKER_01: we like to treat this as us just getting together and having a nice book gab for a
1:16:15
SPEAKER_01: while like that.
1:16:16
SPEAKER_01: So much fun.
1:16:18
SPEAKER_01: So definitely don't don't change or worry about it by any means.
1:16:24
SPEAKER_01: Here's maybe the final question for you then, Paul.
1:16:27
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
1:16:28
SPEAKER_01: We have a weekend now in front of us.
1:16:30
SPEAKER_01: It's Saturday.
1:16:32
SPEAKER_01: I'm not 100% sure,
1:16:34
SPEAKER_01: but I think I'll be spending some of it at the library helping my wife with some
1:16:38
SPEAKER_01: stuff that she's doing.
1:16:39
SPEAKER_01: But I think I might have some dead time.
1:16:41
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:16:43
SPEAKER_01: There's an open space in front of me.
1:16:44
SPEAKER_01: You might call it a void.
1:16:46
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
1:16:47
SPEAKER_01: That I want to make sure isn't just empty on the other side of it.
1:16:54
SPEAKER_01: I want to fill it with stuff.
1:16:56
SPEAKER_01: You know,
1:16:56
SPEAKER_01: we often,
1:16:57
SPEAKER_01: after we finish these episodes,
1:16:58
SPEAKER_01: I think have this open sense of possibility and excitement for certain books and things.
1:17:03
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
1:17:04
SPEAKER_01: And I know you're reading Rings of Saturn, so maybe that's you're going to continue on with that.
1:17:09
SPEAKER_01: Is there anything else that's calling your name this weekend that you think you
1:17:11
SPEAKER_01: might jump into right now?
1:17:13
SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
1:17:14
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
1:17:14
SPEAKER_00: I think it'll definitely be Zabal only because I was like I was saying,
1:17:17
SPEAKER_00: I'm kind of leaning into that right now.
1:17:18
SPEAKER_00: But the audio book that I just started is also really calling to me and I'm
1:17:22
SPEAKER_00: enjoying it very much,
1:17:23
SPEAKER_00: which is The Extinction of Irina Ray by the wonderful translator Jennifer Croft.
1:17:28
SPEAKER_00: which has been getting a lot of buzz.
1:17:29
SPEAKER_00: And so that was one where it was a perfect example of what we were talking about.
1:17:33
SPEAKER_00: It's not that it's outside of anything I would normally read.
1:17:35
SPEAKER_00: I definitely would.
1:17:36
SPEAKER_00: But just with the sheer volume of books coming in,
1:17:40
SPEAKER_00: it's not one that I own,
1:17:41
SPEAKER_00: but it's one that really called to me.
1:17:43
SPEAKER_00: And so I was lucky enough to get it on Libby and have been really enjoying that one so far.
1:17:48
SPEAKER_00: So it's going to be a blend of Sebald,
1:17:50
SPEAKER_00: And Jennifer Croft, at least for today.
1:17:52
SPEAKER_00: And the way I'm feeling right now, I mean, I don't know.
1:17:54
SPEAKER_00: I would like to buzz through and not in a bad way.
1:17:57
SPEAKER_00: Just I could see myself like finishing one or both.
1:18:01
SPEAKER_00: this weekend and then just jumping straight into Borges too.
1:18:04
SPEAKER_00: So that's my plan now.
1:18:06
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:18:06
SPEAKER_00: How about you?
1:18:06
SPEAKER_00: You're going to be doing some library time, but what else?
1:18:09
SPEAKER_01: I'll definitely be,
1:18:10
SPEAKER_01: you know,
1:18:11
SPEAKER_01: getting through the mill on the floss and no pioneers,
1:18:14
SPEAKER_01: like I mentioned at the beginning.
1:18:15
SPEAKER_01: Um,
1:18:16
SPEAKER_01: but I've also just got,
1:18:18
SPEAKER_01: uh,
1:18:18
SPEAKER_01: Daphne du Maurier's the house on the strand because it's a time travel novel.
1:18:23
SPEAKER_01: And that's one of my categories on my, the book.
1:18:26
SPEAKER_01: Oh, cool.
1:18:26
SPEAKER_01: Bookmark.
1:18:27
SPEAKER_01: Um,
1:18:29
SPEAKER_01: This is not a book I would not have read otherwise,
1:18:31
SPEAKER_01: but I didn't know it existed in terms of it being a time travel novel.
1:18:36
SPEAKER_01: It was just a title to me.
1:18:39
SPEAKER_01: And so when I went on Twitter to ask folks for time travel recommendations, I got a bunch.
1:18:45
SPEAKER_01: But that's the one that I got.
1:18:47
SPEAKER_01: My wife has already listened to it.
1:18:49
SPEAKER_01: She listened to it.
1:18:50
SPEAKER_01: I bought the book to read.
1:18:53
SPEAKER_01: And so that's where I'm also going to spend some of my time.
1:18:57
SPEAKER_01: I want to get through that over the next little bit as well.
1:19:00
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
1:19:01
SPEAKER_00: No, that's amazing.
1:19:02
SPEAKER_00: I didn't know that either.
1:19:02
SPEAKER_00: Well,
1:19:04
SPEAKER_00: just to continue on our theme of serendipity,
1:19:05
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
1:19:06
SPEAKER_00: we talk about our community so much,
1:19:08
SPEAKER_00: but I can't overstate that.
1:19:10
SPEAKER_00: how much fun I have talking to everybody.
1:19:12
SPEAKER_00: And usually when I do send out pictures of books I bought or books I'm wanting to read,
1:19:17
SPEAKER_00: it is fun to just share those.
1:19:19
SPEAKER_00: But a lot of the reason I love to do it is because you never know what you're going to hear.
1:19:24
SPEAKER_00: And just that sense of excitement and all of a sudden it'll bump up one of the
1:19:28
SPEAKER_00: books that was on the bottom of my list to the very top because somebody just
1:19:31
SPEAKER_00: starts raving about it.
1:19:31
SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's so much fun.
1:19:32
SPEAKER_00: So what you just said about somebody introducing you to that is a
1:19:36
SPEAKER_00: through the lens of a time travel book like that.
1:19:38
SPEAKER_00: It's just so fascinating.
1:19:39
SPEAKER_00: All the,
1:19:40
SPEAKER_00: the minds and the smart readers out there,
1:19:43
SPEAKER_00: which is another thing that just keeps me going and helps fill the void of,
1:19:48
SPEAKER_00: with just all these possibilities of excitement,
1:19:51
SPEAKER_01: you know,
1:19:52
SPEAKER_01: it kind of,
1:19:52
SPEAKER_01: maybe we need to rerecord this episode.
1:19:54
SPEAKER_01: Cause I just thought maybe the void is never quite felt right, even though it does.
1:19:58
SPEAKER_01: Um,
1:19:59
SPEAKER_01: but maybe as you're talking about friends coming to,
1:20:04
SPEAKER_01: to stand there with you and looking out and just excited about where you're going,
1:20:09
SPEAKER_01: you know,
1:20:09
SPEAKER_01: we've used because of the readers podcast,
1:20:12
SPEAKER_01: uh,
1:20:12
SPEAKER_01: reading horizons,
1:20:13
SPEAKER_01: but I really like the introduction to miss McIntosh,
1:20:16
SPEAKER_01: my darling,
1:20:17
SPEAKER_01: uh,
1:20:18
SPEAKER_01: that Megan O.
1:20:20
SPEAKER_01: Giblin put together where at the end of it she kind of views it as you standing in
1:20:27
SPEAKER_01: front of a vast sea and you don't know what swells and depths and the things
1:20:32
SPEAKER_01: underneath and overhead you don't know what storms and sunny days might be in front
1:20:36
SPEAKER_01: of you
1:20:38
SPEAKER_01: and she's excited for your journey um maybe that's it you know you're in front of a
1:20:43
SPEAKER_01: big c you don't know exactly what's coming how do you start to plot a course and
1:20:46
SPEAKER_01: just get put set sail and i like the idea of of people standing there with you who
1:20:53
SPEAKER_01: have sailed that sea
1:20:55
SPEAKER_01: just clapping you on the back and looking excited for you.
1:20:59
SPEAKER_00: I love that.
1:21:00
SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
1:21:00
SPEAKER_00: no,
1:21:01
SPEAKER_00: I think that's a great way to think about it because like you said,
1:21:03
SPEAKER_00: there's multiple ways to get where you want to go and it's constantly changing.
1:21:07
SPEAKER_00: So I think the C is a great way to look at it.
1:21:11
SPEAKER_01: All right.
1:21:11
SPEAKER_01: Let's rerecord now.
1:21:12
SPEAKER_01: Three, two, one.
1:21:14
SPEAKER_01: This is the mooks in the ground.
1:21:15
SPEAKER_01: No, we, we, we better not do that.
1:21:19
SPEAKER_01: You've got work to go to here in just a few minutes.
1:21:21
SPEAKER_01: You've got books to sell.
1:21:23
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
1:21:23
SPEAKER_01: I do have books to sell.
1:21:26
SPEAKER_01: You're the, you're the friendly guy on the dock, you know, with, with the readers today.
1:21:30
SPEAKER_01: Hopefully that that's a fun way to look at it and, uh,
1:21:34
SPEAKER_01: You know, you can push, push people out there.
1:21:36
SPEAKER_00: Well,
1:21:36
SPEAKER_00: the one thing you talked about,
1:21:37
SPEAKER_00: whether they're willing or not,
1:21:38
SPEAKER_00: whether I'm in that water,
1:21:40
SPEAKER_00: I will know the thing you talked about with kind of branching out and learning new
1:21:45
SPEAKER_00: types of books.
1:21:45
SPEAKER_00: That's definitely something that has been eye opening to me as much time as we spend talking about books.
1:21:51
SPEAKER_00: There are all kinds of genres and areas out there that I have no idea about,
1:21:55
SPEAKER_00: which has been kind of fun to see the excitement that people have.
1:21:59
SPEAKER_00: And to be honest, a lot of them do not appeal to me at all.
1:22:02
SPEAKER_00: But it's always been for me the infectiousness of just finding the right book for
1:22:07
SPEAKER_00: the right person at the right time,
1:22:09
SPEAKER_00: even if it's a book that couldn't appeal to me less.
1:22:12
SPEAKER_00: Just seeing their eyes light up or having them come back in and talk about it.
1:22:15
SPEAKER_00: I think that's the joy of all this is just all of us going on these journeys together and
1:22:20
SPEAKER_00: Sometimes they cross paths and sometimes we're in very different places,
1:22:24
SPEAKER_00: but just having that happiness for each other and that excitement about something
1:22:28
SPEAKER_00: that we all love,
1:22:29
SPEAKER_00: that's really the key to it,
1:22:31
SPEAKER_00: I think.
1:22:32
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
1:22:32
SPEAKER_01: We talked earlier about the listener feedback and never getting trolled.
1:22:39
SPEAKER_01: It's quite the opposite.
1:22:41
SPEAKER_01: It's just encouragement and good feelings and good jabs like the old man emoji.
1:22:48
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
1:22:50
SPEAKER_01: I don't know if I've told you or not.
1:22:52
SPEAKER_01: This is where I'll end.
1:22:54
SPEAKER_01: I must be like the grandpa, even though I'm not a grandpa.
1:22:57
SPEAKER_01: In my George Eliot read along, like I'll tell him, oh, I last read this book 20 years ago.
1:23:03
SPEAKER_01: And people are like, that's so long ago.
1:23:05
SPEAKER_01: Like with genuine sense of gravity and like amazement at the passage of time,
1:23:12
SPEAKER_01: I sense in their little line of text that I see.
1:23:17
SPEAKER_00: That's so funny.
1:23:17
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:23:18
SPEAKER_00: The wizened elder.
1:23:22
SPEAKER_00: That's so funny.
1:23:23
SPEAKER_01: I wasn't even born yet when you read this book last.
1:23:27
SPEAKER_01: It wasn't really that long ago, guys.
1:23:29
SPEAKER_00: It was only 20 years.
1:23:30
SPEAKER_00: One of the ladies I work with,
1:23:32
SPEAKER_00: she's a pretty recent college graduate and she always calls me her work dad.
1:23:35
SPEAKER_00: So I think, you know, we'll just lean into it.
1:23:38
SPEAKER_01: I guess so.
1:23:39
SPEAKER_01: We need to embrace it and enjoy it.
1:23:43
SPEAKER_01: All right.
1:23:44
SPEAKER_01: Well, thank you, Paul.
1:23:45
SPEAKER_01: Like I said before, have a great time selling books.
1:23:48
SPEAKER_01: Make sure you give me any updates that you can.
1:23:51
SPEAKER_01: I'd love to hear about it.
1:23:52
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
1:23:52
SPEAKER_01: You're going to be at the library.
1:23:55
SPEAKER_00: What a great way.
1:23:56
SPEAKER_00: We're both just continuing our bookish journeys.
1:23:59
SPEAKER_01: Should be fun.
1:24:00
SPEAKER_01: Next episode, as we've already alluded to, we'll be talking about audiobooks.
1:24:04
SPEAKER_01: then that's how we'll leave it.
1:24:05
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
1:24:05
SPEAKER_01: sure,
1:24:06
SPEAKER_01: we'll have some different angles to approach them,
1:24:08
SPEAKER_01: but if you,
1:24:08
SPEAKER_01: listener,
1:24:09
SPEAKER_01: have any insights or thoughts on audiobooks,
1:24:12
SPEAKER_01: I'd love to hear about it.
1:24:14
SPEAKER_01: We might be able to share some of those if we get some in the episode itself rather
1:24:19
SPEAKER_01: than just in retrospect.
1:24:21
SPEAKER_01: So, love to hear about your experience with audiobooks, positive, negative, what you think about them.
1:24:26
SPEAKER_01: I'm excited to talk about them.
1:24:28
SPEAKER_01: For me, it's been a positive thing in my life, so...
1:24:31
SPEAKER_01: But maybe if you're someone who feels differently, this is your chance to troll us.
1:24:37
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
1:24:38
SPEAKER_01: Let us know why we're wrong.
1:24:40
SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
1:24:41
SPEAKER_01: All right.
1:24:42
SPEAKER_01: Thanks, everyone.
1:24:43
SPEAKER_01: Bye-bye.
1:24:43
SPEAKER_01: Bye.
1:24:44
SPEAKER_01: Thanks.
1:24:50
SPEAKER_01: Bye.
1:24:50
SPEAKER_01: Bye.
1:24:50
SPEAKER_01: Bye.
1:25:09
SPEAKER_01: If you'd like to donate to the show,
1:25:11
SPEAKER_01: anything and everything,
1:25:12
SPEAKER_01: even a dollar a month helps and is deeply appreciated.
1:25:16
SPEAKER_01: You can become a Patreon at patreon.com slash mooks.
1:25:20
SPEAKER_01: Until next time.