Latest / Making The Impact - A Dance Competition Podcast / The Transition From Competitive Dancer to Professional Dancer

Transcript

The Transition From Competitive Dancer to Professional Dancer · Making The Impact - A Dance Competition Podcast

0:07
SPEAKER_05: Have you ever wondered what goes on behind the table at a dance competition?
0:10
SPEAKER_05: Exactly what are the judges looking for anyway?
0:13
SPEAKER_05: This is Making the Impact, a dance competition podcast.
0:15
SPEAKER_05: Each week we'll cover a different topic related to the world of competitive dance from the perspective of the judges behind the table.
0:26
SPEAKER_05: The leap from competitive dancer to professional dancer can seem huge and scary, but it doesn't have to be.
0:31
SPEAKER_05: With the right tools, dancers looking to pursue where the dance world can flourish.
0:36
SPEAKER_05: Here today to share just a few pieces of advice are Menina Fortunato, dance mentor and industry professional and sister strain, professional dancer and multi-hyphenate in the dance industry.
0:48
SPEAKER_00: Hello, dance world.
0:50
SPEAKER_00: Welcome to this week's episode of Making the Impact.
0:53
SPEAKER_00: I'm your host, Courtney Ortiz, and I'm here, like always, with my co-host, Leslie Maylor.
0:58
SPEAKER_00: Courtney, how long has it been since we've done a podcast?
1:02
SPEAKER_05: In real life.
1:03
SPEAKER_00: I know.
1:04
SPEAKER_00: I mean, in real life, uh, physically next to each other a very long time, or maybe that was the the live event at Capesio was the last time I've sat next to you to do a podcast.
1:14
SPEAKER_00: Correct.
1:15
SPEAKER_00: But we haven't recorded an episode on our end in a long time because we've just been so busy.
1:20
SPEAKER_05: We've been so busy.
1:21
SPEAKER_05: And so, listeners, you hear us week to week, but it has been a minute.
1:24
SPEAKER_05: So we are excited to be back recording this episode for you.
1:28
SPEAKER_05: Uh, we have some amazing guests that we are super stoked to bring you some really awesome new connections and new voices on the podcast.
1:36
SPEAKER_05: So we can't wait to get to it.
1:38
SPEAKER_05: But we have a few Making the Impact Award winners from this season that we want to share.
1:42
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
1:42
SPEAKER_00: And as everyone knows, we are giving out our Making the Impact Award at all IDA affiliated competitions that have at least one IDA judge on the panel.
1:51
SPEAKER_00: They want to recognize that one dance that they just cannot stop thinking about and they felt made an impact in the weekend.
1:57
SPEAKER_00: So we have some recent award winners to share.
2:00
SPEAKER_00: The first award winner is coming to us from Gems Dance Competition event in Peoria, Illinois.
2:06
SPEAKER_00: Congrats to Ignite Dance Center from Burlington, Iowa for their small group Crocodile Rock.
2:12
SPEAKER_05: From Starbound's event in Youngstown, Ohio.
2:15
SPEAKER_05: Congrats to Lucky Star Dance Company from State College, Pennsylvania for their small group, Not All Wounds Are Visible.
2:21
SPEAKER_00: From Dive Dance Competitions event in Spartanburg, South Carolina.
2:25
SPEAKER_00: Congrats to Artistic Edge Dance Center from Greenville, South Carolina for their small group look.
2:30
SPEAKER_05: And from World Class Talent Experiences event in Sturbridge, Massachusetts.
2:34
SPEAKER_05: Congrats to Connecticut Dance Academy from Canton, Connecticut for their production, Knocking on Heaven's Door.
2:39
SPEAKER_00: Congrats to all of our recent Making the Impact Award winners, and stay tuned to hear more throughout the rest of season five.
2:45
SPEAKER_00: And before we jump into this week's episode, let's hear from our sponsors.
2:49
SPEAKER_00: We all know the struggle is real when it comes to getting stage ready for competition, especially when it's time to apply your eyelashes.
2:57
SPEAKER_00: We've all been there, myself included.
2:59
SPEAKER_00: But guess what?
3:00
SPEAKER_00: I've got the ultimate hack just for you.
3:03
SPEAKER_00: Lily lashes to the rescue.
3:05
SPEAKER_00: They offer a variety of styles that suit every dancer's needs.
3:08
SPEAKER_00: Lily lashes are top quality, conform to the shape of your eye, and they are available with sheer transparent lash line bands or black lash line bands to resemble eyeliner.
3:18
SPEAKER_00: They have half lashes called butterflies that are a great accent lash and are ideal for smaller eyes with no trimming required.
3:26
SPEAKER_00: Perfect for young dancers.
3:27
SPEAKER_00: Every lily lash is multidimensional, which gives an elevated look under stage lights and shows up beautifully in pictures.
3:34
SPEAKER_00: They truly are so much better than those drugstore lashes.
3:38
SPEAKER_00: Oh, and did I mention they're reusable?
3:40
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
3:41
SPEAKER_00: You can simply tuck them back into their box until your next performance and reuse them again and again.
3:46
SPEAKER_00: I've been wearing my Lily lashes while teaching at convention and absolutely love the way they make my eyes pop on stage.
3:52
SPEAKER_00: With so many styles and options, check out Lily Lashes now to enhance your stage makeup for your next performance.
3:58
SPEAKER_00: And we're happy to share with you an exclusive podcast promo code to try them out with a discount.
4:03
SPEAKER_00: Use the coupon code Impact20 in all caps at checkout to receive 20% off your order.
4:09
SPEAKER_00: That's Impact20 in All Caps at Checkout on lilylashes.com.
4:15
SPEAKER_05: Hey dance friends and fam, let's talk about feet.
4:18
SPEAKER_05: Just like teaching the proper foundational movements, you've got to have the proper footwear to be your best.
4:22
SPEAKER_05: I switched to Apollo Shocks Dance socks and I'm never going back.
4:25
SPEAKER_05: Want to experience this foot utopia for yourself?
4:28
SPEAKER_05: Use our podcast promo code Impact10INALLCaps in the promo box at checkout and receive 10% off your order.
4:34
SPEAKER_05: Oh, and something else that I love, they have a satisfaction guarantee with free returns and exchanges.
4:40
SPEAKER_05: Head to their website to order your new pair of dance compression socks at ApolapErformance.com.
4:45
SPEAKER_05: That's APOLA Performance.com.
4:48
SPEAKER_00: Our season 5 premiere sponsor, Francisco Gela Danceworks, offers some exceptional training opportunities for dancers throughout the year.
4:55
SPEAKER_00: If you're seeking an intensive to attend over Labor Day weekend before you head back to your dance season, then check out Franciscogella Dance Works Pre-Professional Dancer Institute.
5:04
SPEAKER_00: This intensive provides knowledge to dancers to better aid them in the transition after high school graduation.
5:09
SPEAKER_00: This is especially recommended for dancers considering college or secondary training programs.
5:14
SPEAKER_00: Throughout the five-day intensive, dancers will learn all about different programs for post-graduation, how to build a resume, create audition submissions, apply for scholarships, and so much more.
5:24
SPEAKER_00: And of course, there will be lots of dancing involved, with classes that are curated towards a typical college dance curriculum to allow dancers to understand what will be expected of them in a college dance program.
5:35
SPEAKER_00: Parents are also welcome to observe select classes and workshops throughout the event to better help their dancers' journey on the best path for their future.
5:42
SPEAKER_00: This intensive is open to advanced dancers ages 13 through 18.
5:46
SPEAKER_00: Mark your calendars and join Francisco Gela and faculty at this wonderful summer dance workshop.
5:51
SPEAKER_00: Learn more about the program and what is offered by visiting their website at PreproDancerInstitute.com.
5:58
SPEAKER_00: Thank you to Francisco Gella Danceworks for being our season 5 premiere sponsor.
6:03
SPEAKER_00: Alright, dance world.
6:05
SPEAKER_00: I'm real excited for this episode.
6:07
SPEAKER_00: Because today we are talking about the next generation of dancers who are now breaking in to the professional dance world.
6:14
SPEAKER_00: There are a lot of listeners out there who are competitive dancers who have dreams of becoming a pro one day.
6:19
SPEAKER_00: Whether that's in New York City or Los Angeles, Chicago, Atlanta.
6:23
SPEAKER_00: There's so many places that you can become a professional dancer.
6:26
SPEAKER_00: But today we're going to be covering the two major coasts, the New York City side and the Los Angeles side, and give you some tips and tricks on what you need to know to break into the industry, coming from a competitive dancer and now a newly professional dancer.
6:42
SPEAKER_00: We have two brand new guests who are joining us on Making the Impact.
6:45
SPEAKER_00: I'm so happy that our schedules all align to make this episode possible because I know they have so much to contribute to this chat.
6:53
SPEAKER_00: The very first guest that I'm excited to welcome is someone who I met at Commercial Dance Intensive, which is an amazing intensive and organization that y'all should get to know and get into out there if you want to have a commercial dance career in LA or New York.
7:09
SPEAKER_00: And I've had the pleasure of teaching alongside her and meeting her there.
7:12
SPEAKER_00: It was such a blast.
7:13
SPEAKER_00: We even recorded a podcast episode at Commercial Dance Intensive during our time there, which you can listen on Platinum Premium if you're a member.
7:21
SPEAKER_00: I'm excited to welcome Sissa Strain to the podcast.
7:24
SPEAKER_00: Welcome, Sissa.
7:25
SPEAKER_04: Hi, thank you so much for having me.
7:27
SPEAKER_04: I love this podcast.
7:29
SPEAKER_04: I love what you do for our dance industry, especially what you provide to the pre-professional dancers as well as those who support them.
7:37
SPEAKER_04: A little bit about me.
7:38
SPEAKER_04: I am originally from a small town in southern Louisiana.
7:43
SPEAKER_04: I am a professional dancer in New York City.
7:46
SPEAKER_04: I'm also a competition director and adjudicator.
7:51
SPEAKER_04: I'm on faculty at Broadway Dance Center.
7:54
SPEAKER_04: I teach heels, technique, and foundations.
7:57
SPEAKER_04: I also teach Accro at Broadway Dance Center.
8:01
SPEAKER_04: And I'm also the director of operations for the one and only commercial dance intensive, where I learned many of the things that I'm going to talk about today with you because that program had a very large impact on my career.
8:15
SPEAKER_04: And I'm so excited to get into it.
8:18
SPEAKER_04: I would say in New York City, I've been given the title of the mayor of auditions.
8:24
SPEAKER_04: So really I love it.
8:26
SPEAKER_04: I feel like a professional auditioner in the New York City market.
8:30
SPEAKER_04: So I'm really excited to talk about it because the more you know, the more you can prepare for the things that you can control.
8:37
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
8:39
SPEAKER_00: It's so, it's so real.
8:40
SPEAKER_00: It's so true.
8:41
SPEAKER_00: The audition, hustle and grind, professional auditioner.
8:44
SPEAKER_00: I call myself that as well.
8:45
SPEAKER_00: It is real, y'all.
8:47
SPEAKER_04: Honestly, auditioning is the job.
8:49
SPEAKER_04: When you book the job, that's the payoff.
8:52
SPEAKER_04: That's something that one of our faculty at commercial dance intensive said, and I have never let go of it.
8:56
SPEAKER_04: I'm like, you're right.
8:57
SPEAKER_04: This part's the job.
8:58
SPEAKER_04: And then when you get the job, that's your payoff.
9:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
9:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
9:02
SPEAKER_00: That is so real.
9:03
SPEAKER_00: I love it.
9:04
SPEAKER_00: Well, I know you have so much to share.
9:06
SPEAKER_00: So thank you for all of your contribution as well to the Pro Dance World because I love following your journey on Instagram and all of your like equity chorus call recap videos that you do.
9:15
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I wish that that existed when I was breaking into what it what even is an equity audition.
9:22
SPEAKER_04: A hundred percent.
9:23
SPEAKER_04: And I feel I often get feedback that it's helpful.
9:26
SPEAKER_04: Uh, it kind of like shows you what's happening behind the curtain because it can be intimidating to go into a room where you've never been before.
9:34
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, totally.
9:36
SPEAKER_00: Amazing.
9:36
SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you, Sissa, for being here and joining us.
9:38
SPEAKER_00: Thank you for having me.
9:39
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
9:40
SPEAKER_00: All right, and our next special guest is someone who I've been admiring from a distance.
9:45
SPEAKER_00: I love everything that she's offering to the next generation of dancers because she has created a mentoring platform to help guide young dancers or dancers who are aspiring to GoPro and help lead them into that commercial dance career that they are looking to have.
10:01
SPEAKER_00: And she's going to be covering the Los Angeles side and the commercial dance side of the industry.
10:06
SPEAKER_00: She's had an amazing career.
10:08
SPEAKER_00: She's worked with so many artists.
10:09
SPEAKER_00: She's going to tell you all about her.
10:11
SPEAKER_00: She also has a podcast that you need to check out.
10:13
SPEAKER_00: I'm excited to welcome Manina Fortuano to the podcast.
10:16
SPEAKER_00: Welcome, Manina.
10:18
SPEAKER_07: Thank you so much for having me in that lovely intro.
10:21
SPEAKER_07: I did not know that.
10:22
SPEAKER_07: So uh thank you.
10:23
SPEAKER_07: All right, my backstory.
10:24
SPEAKER_07: I'll try to keep this concise.
10:25
SPEAKER_07: I'm originally from the Vancouver area.
10:27
SPEAKER_07: I'm Canadian, um, now also American.
10:29
SPEAKER_07: I'm dual, but I started my career in dance in Vancouver, where I had my uh my start, my father's dance studio.
10:36
SPEAKER_07: He was my dance teacher.
10:37
SPEAKER_07: My mother owned a dance competition called 5678 Showtime when she when I was 13.
10:42
SPEAKER_07: So I grew up in a dance family.
10:44
SPEAKER_07: So we had two dance studios and a dance competition throughout my teen years.
10:47
SPEAKER_07: And then I was that competition kid that graduated to the LA scene.
10:52
SPEAKER_07: So the very dancer that probably listened to this or the dance parent, I was once in your shoes, uh, a very long time ago.
10:58
SPEAKER_07: And um, I moved to Los Angeles when I was 20, which was also a long time ago in 2001.
11:05
SPEAKER_07: And um I've worked with some incredible people.
11:08
SPEAKER_07: Within that first month, I was working with Paul Abdul and then Britney Spears.
11:11
SPEAKER_07: I did the Pepsi commercials on the Super Bowl.
11:13
SPEAKER_07: I've worked with uh Beyonce, Earth When in Fire, Z Top, Carmen Electra, Paul Abdul, MC Hammer, Luke Bryan, Victoria Justice, uh, to name a few.
11:22
SPEAKER_07: Um, I've also been on uh Star Trek Enterprise, Mad TV, alias, uh Guys' Choice Awards, Latin American Music Awards.
11:29
SPEAKER_07: I have also shifted onto the other side of the table, working on the creative team of the X Factor in America's Got Talent.
11:36
SPEAKER_07: I was a guest judge on the TV show Dance Moms at the season with uh Jojo Siwa, Maddie Ziegler, and that whole little crew.
11:42
SPEAKER_07: I've also been an adjudicator for many years because I got to start with my parents' dance competition and then I've also worked with many others over the years.
11:51
SPEAKER_07: Um, so that has been a long profession of mine.
11:54
SPEAKER_07: So I'm still active in the dance competition space, but on the judging side.
11:58
SPEAKER_07: But I also helped my mom in the teen years on the producing side.
12:01
SPEAKER_07: So I've worn every single hat from competition dancer, teacher, judge, uh competition director, uh host, MC, backstage manager for Supervision.
12:11
SPEAKER_07: I've worn all those hats.
12:13
SPEAKER_07: But today, fast forward, uh, I would say that to sum it all up, being a dance educator mentor is my main focus now.
12:21
SPEAKER_07: 2020 happened.
12:22
SPEAKER_07: Um, but prior to that, I should say I founded the Hollywood Summer Tour.
12:26
SPEAKER_07: You guys talk about commercial dance.
12:28
SPEAKER_07: I started that in 2006, where um we give dancers an opportunity to experience the commercial dance industry in Los Angeles.
12:35
SPEAKER_07: That's a one to two week program where we take them through classes at all the major studios.
12:39
SPEAKER_07: They do agency showcases with the major agents.
12:41
SPEAKER_07: We take them to TV show taping, they shoot a music video.
12:44
SPEAKER_07: We shot at Paramount Studios, Universal Studios.
12:47
SPEAKER_07: They also we also do seminars.
12:48
SPEAKER_07: So it's a bit of dance education, Hollywood glam, and then I'll also vacation.
12:52
SPEAKER_07: We do Disneyland and the Beach and Hollywood Highland and all those things to really immerse dancers into the professional world.
12:58
SPEAKER_07: But then fast forward, 2020 happened and that came to a halt.
13:02
SPEAKER_07: And everything just came crashing down.
13:05
SPEAKER_07: And my business came crashing down, the career that I once had came crashing down.
13:09
SPEAKER_07: Everything that I once could do, I no longer could do.
13:12
SPEAKER_07: Had baby number three in April of 2020.
13:14
SPEAKER_07: So during the lockdown, I thought I was like, oh yeah, two weeks at home, no problem.
13:18
SPEAKER_07: Great, I can have my baby, everyone's home.
13:20
SPEAKER_07: And then I thought it was like, okay, two months, I can do that.
13:23
SPEAKER_07: And then it turned into two years.
13:24
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god.
13:25
SPEAKER_07: My back was against the wall.
13:27
SPEAKER_07: I could barely scrape pennies, I couldn't do events, I couldn't adjudicate, I couldn't run a it was a very, very frustrating time.
13:33
SPEAKER_07: But it also forced me to pivot and it forced me to pivot and birth what we call the business of dance, which is an online mentorship program where I now help educate and prepare and mentor dancers so that they can too can create their dream dance career.
13:48
SPEAKER_07: And now I serve dancers from all over the world, uh Canadian Americans primarily, but also some UK and some European, some South uh America and even um Asia.
13:58
SPEAKER_07: And I get to do what I love, which is still dance while being a wife, a mom of three kids.
14:04
SPEAKER_07: And I'm literally, as you say, tuning in from Hawaii, even though my business is based in LA.
14:08
SPEAKER_07: And I actually live in Vancouver as well.
14:11
SPEAKER_07: So I am always on the go.
14:13
SPEAKER_07: I went back to to Vancouver in 2016 after having baby number one.
14:18
SPEAKER_07: Um, but I still work very much in LA and and everywhere else as well.
14:21
SPEAKER_07: And I'm uh literally working from Hawaii this week, while my oldest gets to go to a volleyball uh tournament.
14:28
SPEAKER_07: So I get to be volleyball mom this week.
14:30
SPEAKER_07: I was dance mom and gymnastics mom last week.
14:33
SPEAKER_07: So yeah, I've also I'm also a dance mom too.
14:35
SPEAKER_07: Wow.
14:36
SPEAKER_07: But so I've I've worn I've been in everyone's shoes in the dance competition space as well as in the professional side.
14:44
SPEAKER_07: So um hopefully I can bring some value to all your listeners here today.
14:48
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
14:49
SPEAKER_00: Yes, I'm pretty certain you will.
14:52
SPEAKER_00: I think so.
14:53
SPEAKER_00: And like I mentioned, you're gonna be bringing that LA side of it because the rest of us, Leslie and Sissa and myself, have all dabbled in the New York side of the biz.
15:03
SPEAKER_00: So I'm excited because there are a lot of dancers these days that have dreams of saying, I'm going to Los Angeles.
15:08
SPEAKER_00: So we're gonna help share an in that insight for them on this episode.
15:14
SPEAKER_00: So thank you both Sissa and Manina for joining us.
15:17
SPEAKER_00: Let's jump in.
15:17
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
15:18
SPEAKER_05: Let's do it.
15:19
SPEAKER_05: Yes, awesome.
15:20
SPEAKER_05: So yeah, we have literally among the three of us just every single hat.
15:25
SPEAKER_05: We say all the time, like we we wait to do some of these episodes that people are like clamoring for because we need the right guests.
15:31
SPEAKER_05: And so we have landed upon the right guests.
15:33
SPEAKER_05: We have so many things to cover today.
15:35
SPEAKER_05: For my first question, it's like so broad and so large, but like one of you can start.
15:39
SPEAKER_05: So why don't we start with you?
15:40
SPEAKER_05: What do you think, hardest things about breaking into the industry as a new professional, either coming from high school directly into the pro world or even having four years of college or a program like commercial dance intensive under your belt?
15:53
SPEAKER_04: So, in my opinion, one of the hardest things about breaking in as a new professional dancer into a new market is that you don't know what you don't know.
16:02
SPEAKER_04: There's a lot of unspoken rules, unspoken practices.
16:06
SPEAKER_04: Sometimes when you get to a new place, A, you don't know a lot of people and it can feel like an in-group, outgroup situation, but B, you don't know where everyone's getting their information from.
16:16
SPEAKER_04: And sometimes there are things you learn the hard way through trial and error.
16:22
SPEAKER_04: And one of the things I'm so excited, Manina, that to be on here with you, because I think that seeking out mentorship is a huge way to navigate that process of finding out, you know, what are the unspoken rules?
16:36
SPEAKER_04: Like, how do I show up for Radio City versus how do I show up for Broadway versus how do I show up for a music video versus a tour?
16:43
SPEAKER_04: There's a lot of things that you show up and you make bold choices, and you're like, maybe next time I'll wear something different, maybe next time I will bring these shoes, or when they ask for this, they really mean this.
16:56
SPEAKER_04: But we learn those things the hard way, and unless you are fortunate to have a mentor or a friend who's actively in the industry take you under their wing and say, No, no, there's a loose leaf piece of paper take up to the outside of the building.
17:07
SPEAKER_04: You should know about that.
17:09
SPEAKER_04: Because how are you supposed to know, right?
17:11
unknown: Yeah.
17:11
SPEAKER_00: That's true.
17:12
SPEAKER_00: That's a great point.
17:13
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
17:14
SPEAKER_00: Anything to add, Manina?
17:16
SPEAKER_07: Yes.
17:16
SPEAKER_07: I think the hardest thing for dancers in the LA market, but I think it I think it would relate to New York as well, is connections.
17:23
SPEAKER_07: So having the right industry connections because this business is all about who you know and who knows you.
17:30
SPEAKER_07: You can be uber talented and be a competition dancer that wins every title and all those things, but if nobody knows who you are and you don't know anybody, that talent will only get you so far.
17:40
SPEAKER_07: So you can move into the LA market, be uber talented, realize very quickly that you're not just the only talented dancer that's beautiful and has all the tools at their toolkit and all the things and you're not booking and wondering why.
17:52
SPEAKER_07: Well, a lot of that reason, that reason why is usually tied to relationships.
17:58
SPEAKER_07: Who do you know in that room?
17:59
SPEAKER_07: Do you know that choreographer?
18:01
SPEAKER_07: Do you have an agent?
18:02
SPEAKER_07: Do you know how to get an agent?
18:03
SPEAKER_07: You know, do you have the connections to get an agent?
18:05
SPEAKER_07: Like all of those things play a role.
18:08
SPEAKER_07: So if you're moving to the LA market without any connections, you're in for a very rude awakening, no matter how talented you are.
18:16
SPEAKER_07: And even though I did have some beginner's luck a little bit in the beginning, I will say I did have relationships before I came.
18:22
SPEAKER_07: I went to LA for four summers before I did the move.
18:25
SPEAKER_07: I had an agent before I did the move.
18:27
SPEAKER_07: I had a work visa because I'm Canadian before I did the move.
18:30
SPEAKER_07: I had savings before I did the move.
18:32
SPEAKER_07: So the transition for me was a little bit easier per se than a lot of people that um moved to LA.
18:40
SPEAKER_07: So um I but I think the number one thing that is missing that a lot of dancers don't realize is relationships, those connections.
18:48
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
18:48
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
18:49
SPEAKER_00: But I I think that's that's extremely valid.
18:52
SPEAKER_00: It's super true.
18:53
SPEAKER_00: I mean, even my experience personally, I didn't really know that many people in New York, but I knew some friends that grew up at my home studio that ended up going to college in New York.
19:03
SPEAKER_00: So like I could talk to them and just talk about New York things, but I couldn't even talk to them when it came to audition things because they weren't in the audition scene, they were at college.
19:13
SPEAKER_00: So and I there weren't, I mean, there were dancers ahead of me that had gone on to pursue careers, but like not many in New York City.
19:21
SPEAKER_00: And I did have my two teachers who taught me everything I know, Melissa Wolf Rosebro and Shelly Hutchinson, who were active teachers in New York City, that kind of could mentor me a little bit, who had done the the scene and were, you know, older than me, wiser than me.
19:36
SPEAKER_00: But it is really uh tough to figure things out on your own if you don't have that mentor to go to fall back on, or the right connections, like you said.
19:45
SPEAKER_00: And like in my my situation, I was lucky enough to have a connection to get an agent easily.
19:52
SPEAKER_00: That was something that helped me.
19:53
SPEAKER_00: And in New York, you don't necessarily need an agent right away.
19:57
SPEAKER_00: You don't ever really need an agent to be completely honest, because you can find out about a lot of jobs on the internet in New York versus I feel like Los Angeles, you kind of need one.
20:05
SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of private auditions, agency auditions, commercial auditions that, you know, in that sense.
20:11
SPEAKER_00: But like again, it's really depends on if you have some connections to kick things off.
20:16
SPEAKER_00: That that networking in your like junior and senior year, I mean, even all of high school, like if you know you want to go on and pursue this, you should be networking like crazy leading up to your professional transition.
20:28
SPEAKER_07: Absolutely.
20:29
SPEAKER_07: Well, in the dance competition convention world, you're taking classes from all these great teachers and choreographers that a lot of them are sometimes hiring.
20:36
SPEAKER_07: So if you're able to establish those relationships, even in your competition convention days, uh, it can also help.
20:42
SPEAKER_07: And it's not just those choreographers, but sometimes it's the other dancers in the room.
20:47
SPEAKER_07: You never know who next to you might be the next big choreographer or casting director or agent that can help you later in your life.
20:55
SPEAKER_07: There's so many dancers from my competition life that I work with today, yeah, decades later.
21:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
21:02
SPEAKER_07: And um, those valuable relations at the time, you're just a kid, you don't think of them.
21:06
SPEAKER_07: I mean, even today, being in Hawaii right now is so nostalgic for me because 30 years ago, I was here for a dance competition.
21:13
SPEAKER_07: I was 13 years old and I um met a dancer who we used to see each other uh a lot other competitions, but I remember we really connected in Hawaii.
21:22
SPEAKER_07: And ironically, she's my client success manager inside the business of dance 30 years later.
21:27
SPEAKER_07: And that's the beauty of relationships when they're authentic and real, you know.
21:33
SPEAKER_07: But I know a lot of people say network, network, but network is not about schmoozing and like just like I want to be friends with this person because I think they're gonna do something for me.
21:41
SPEAKER_07: It's actually having a real connection and a real relationship with the person, but because naturally we want to work with the people that we like.
21:49
SPEAKER_07: We want to know that if you're gonna get if I'm gonna hire you for something, right?
21:53
SPEAKER_07: That I know that I'm gonna enjoy my time with you and your talent at the end of the day, you're a dime a dozen.
21:58
SPEAKER_07: There's so many talented people.
22:00
SPEAKER_07: But we want when we're in a work environment, we want to know that we're gonna have a great time working together.
22:06
SPEAKER_07: And if you can bring that great energy, and it's it can start in the dance competition world.
22:11
SPEAKER_07: It can start in the dance studio with the convention.
22:14
SPEAKER_07: Uh and for me, it was a Hawaii convention uh competition.
22:16
SPEAKER_07: So you just never know when those relationships can be of value to you.
22:20
SPEAKER_07: And it's not always right away.
22:22
SPEAKER_07: Sometimes you plant those seeds and sometimes it may not blossom until years later.
22:26
SPEAKER_03: Great advice.
22:27
SPEAKER_05: And I think that's that's so important to just talk like the shared connections of your youth.
22:32
SPEAKER_05: I had a like very similar experience, Manina.
22:35
SPEAKER_05: I pulled up from a competition I went to in high school recently.
22:38
SPEAKER_05: I just looked in it and was like, oh, da-da-da.
22:40
SPEAKER_05: Oh, wait, I know that person.
22:41
SPEAKER_05: Wait, that person owns a studio.
22:43
SPEAKER_05: All these people that just show up in your life years later that you had associations with, and now you have a shared experience of that's a key point that y'all both brought up is that, you know, the connections that you make.
22:53
SPEAKER_05: And Sissa, like you said, you don't know what you don't know.
22:56
SPEAKER_05: And to have that older person mentorship role come into your life and take you under the wing and say, actually, the sign-up sheets around the corner.
23:04
SPEAKER_05: They're not gonna tell you that, but I'm gonna tell you that.
23:06
SPEAKER_05: Not gatekeep the information.
23:08
SPEAKER_05: I think that's something important.
23:09
SPEAKER_05: No, no good comes gatekeeping information.
23:12
SPEAKER_05: We want this industry to be better and bigger and more successful for everyone.
23:16
SPEAKER_05: So when you know something, share that information.
23:20
SPEAKER_00: Well, absolutely.
23:21
SPEAKER_00: I mean a thousand percent.
23:22
SPEAKER_00: There's like people who are mentors who won't gatekeep the information because they know that you aren't, they've been there, done that, and they don't mind sharing that.
23:32
SPEAKER_00: But if there might be someone who's in the biz with you who s sees you as their direct competitor, and they're gonna gatekeep that information because they don't want to give it to you and potentially you book the job over them.
23:43
SPEAKER_00: There are very selfish people in this industry that are looking out for only them and not the community.
23:49
SPEAKER_00: And that's another thing that's really tough to navigate because you might fall for that gullible trap at the beginning, and like you will really learn like who's your friend and who's your foe in this dance world.
24:01
SPEAKER_00: Unfortunately, that's the sad truth about it.
24:03
SPEAKER_04: It brings me to the mindset of scarcity versus abundance.
24:07
SPEAKER_04: Sometimes when you're entering the industry, you can feel like, oh, there's just this one audition, or like I need to book this one job.
24:15
SPEAKER_04: And like you're talking about the competitiveness sometimes, you know, like when you're at a dance competition and you're like, oh, I really want to place top 10 because this is my senior solo dance competition, and it feels like it's the last opportunity, right?
24:29
SPEAKER_04: One of my mentors loves to say that auditions are like buses and boyfriends.
24:33
SPEAKER_04: If one passes along, the next one's right around the corner.
24:36
SPEAKER_04: So that's gonna be the one for you, you know?
24:39
SPEAKER_04: So I love it.
24:41
SPEAKER_04: It's that kind of I'm not afraid of sharing information because what is meant for me will not pass me by.
24:47
SPEAKER_04: And I'm gonna be hired because I'm the right person for that job.
24:51
SPEAKER_04: And there are so many jobs out there.
24:54
SPEAKER_04: That's another thing, too, is researching the abundance of what you can do as a professional dancer.
25:00
SPEAKER_04: Because sometimes when we're younger, like you see a tall dancer and they're like, You're gonna be a rocket, and that's the thing that they focus on.
25:09
SPEAKER_04: And then they may not realize, oh, well, I could also be in circus, I could also be in Vegas, I could also be on Broadway or you know, dancing on tour.
25:19
SPEAKER_04: There's so many things out there, and sometimes I feel like young dancers hold on to something really early on because it's been uh inspired by a mentor or positive feedback in some way.
25:30
SPEAKER_04: And I think that there's just so much out there.
25:32
SPEAKER_04: Like, do you know how much money you can make dancing like in an Amazon commercial?
25:36
SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
25:37
SPEAKER_00: No one even knows that exists because it's not like the thing you see as like the ultimate dance career, but we've talked about it previously on the podcast where it's like I've made the most amount of money doing one commercial in my entire career.
25:51
SPEAKER_00: Not that six-month gig that I did.
25:53
SPEAKER_00: Nope, not that one.
25:55
SPEAKER_00: It was that one commercial that I did.
25:57
SPEAKER_00: And that may not look like I'm not performing on a stage and it may it's like a one and done type of thing, short and sweet contract.
26:04
SPEAKER_00: Were you a robot?
26:06
SPEAKER_00: Yes, I was a robot in a commercial.
26:08
SPEAKER_00: Like it wasn't even a glamorous thing, absolutely not glamorous at all, but I made a trillion million dollars.
26:12
SPEAKER_00: There were no flatties.
26:14
SPEAKER_00: I didn't even dance, I just ran around.
26:16
SPEAKER_00: Like, I didn't even, you know, it was just that like as dancers, we are hireable because we take direction well and we know how to like stand like where we're supposed to stand.
26:25
SPEAKER_00: And take, you know what I mean?
26:27
SPEAKER_00: Like we're eat, we're moldable, we're eat, we follow directions.
26:30
SPEAKER_00: People like hiring dancers.
26:31
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't always have to be for dance, but sometimes we dancers forget that oh, I could do something like that.
26:38
SPEAKER_00: Oh, I could be that person in a commercial or that person on doing this job.
26:42
SPEAKER_00: Like, there's a lot more opportunities than you think out there.
26:46
SPEAKER_07: I can totally relate to that whole commercial thing.
26:48
SPEAKER_07: I did a Pepsi commercial with Britney Spears, and my money shot was just me holding a Pepsi and doing a little shimmy and uh I got a bump upgrade to principal, made$10,000 more than all the other dancers because I did a shimmy holding a Pepsi, and all that intricate choreography that we learned before barely got shot, barely got seen.
27:09
SPEAKER_07: And the money shot was just doing a little shimmy.
27:12
SPEAKER_07: And and then, yeah, talk about money.
27:14
SPEAKER_07: Uh, I made 35 grand on that commercial for 10 days of work.
27:17
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
27:17
SPEAKER_07: You know, and I was just a fresh, you know, kid off the boat, just moved to LA.
27:21
SPEAKER_07: It was my rent was$375.
27:23
SPEAKER_07: So that was a lot of money for me back then.
27:26
SPEAKER_06: I know that doesn't even get you a closet anymore, but nope.
27:31
SPEAKER_04: I'm gonna go rethink my life choices now.
27:33
unknown: Right.
27:36
SPEAKER_07: Trust me, that's like one trip to the grocery store now for me.
27:39
SPEAKER_07: Right, exactly.
27:40
SPEAKER_07: Exactly.
27:40
SPEAKER_07: Because I have a family of five to feed, so yeah.
27:43
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, and uh so perspective wise, from that time in my life, it was it was a significant amount of money.
27:49
SPEAKER_07: And yeah, some of the best taste best paying jobs are like those step touch uh uh, you know, gigs and the the most intricate choreography are the free gigs, the free ones.
27:58
SPEAKER_00: So right.
27:59
SPEAKER_00: So something I want to dive into is, and it's actually interesting with my next question, and I have something to like add to it, but to kind of give a realistic idea to a lot of these dancers who have dreams and think they're moving, not think, they are.
28:16
SPEAKER_00: They are moving to Los Angeles or New York City and they're gonna hit the ground running.
28:22
SPEAKER_00: How long does it take before they might even get a job?
28:26
SPEAKER_00: You know, there are some dancers that move and boom, they get a job, and there's some that it takes a little bit longer.
28:32
SPEAKER_00: And like, I'm gonna just throw this in there before y'all can chime in.
28:36
SPEAKER_00: I was just at CLI Conservatory and we had Teddy Forrens on the podcast last season, talked about CLI.
28:41
SPEAKER_00: It's a really great, like, gap year, bridging the gap from you know, studio dancer to pro dancer program that exists.
28:48
SPEAKER_00: It's a 10-month program.
28:50
SPEAKER_00: Really awesome look into it to our listeners.
28:52
SPEAKER_00: And I was sharing my story with them, and I told them, like, moved to New York when I was 19, after I did my cruise ship with Leslie, saved all my money.
29:00
SPEAKER_00: That's how I moved to New York.
29:02
SPEAKER_00: Took me about three years, four years until I booked my first big job, what I consider my first big job, which was Westside Story International Tour.
29:10
SPEAKER_00: Like that felt like the job of all jobs, but it took me four years of auditioning, and they all gasped when I said that.
29:18
SPEAKER_00: They were like shocked that it it took that long.
29:20
SPEAKER_00: And I was just like, wait, what?
29:22
SPEAKER_00: Like, do you do you've did I I'm not shocked?
29:25
SPEAKER_00: I wasn't ready.
29:26
SPEAKER_00: I'm not shocked.
29:27
SPEAKER_00: I wasn't ready when I first auditioned, you know?
29:29
SPEAKER_00: Like it took me that long to actually figure it out.
29:32
SPEAKER_00: And like they weren't gonna take a risk on me, this young, green, fresh, like little baby dancer, Courtney, who has no life experience, who has never worked a professional job in their life.
29:43
SPEAKER_00: There are companies are like, I'm not taking a risk on you.
29:46
SPEAKER_00: You need to get some more under your belt first before we'll give you that big boy job.
29:50
SPEAKER_07: So well, at least you're still standing in dance, because I will say the vast majority of dancers that come to LA turn right back around.
29:57
SPEAKER_07: Right.
29:58
SPEAKER_07: And they move back home.
29:59
SPEAKER_03: Right.
29:59
SPEAKER_07: That I can I can tell you so during my audition years, there was so much rotation of new faces every six months that would come in and out.
30:07
SPEAKER_07: I'm like, whatever happened to that dancer?
30:09
SPEAKER_07: And I find out they turned back home, they usually run out of money, and um, mom and dad gets in their head and they say they need to go get a real job.
30:15
SPEAKER_03: Right.
30:16
SPEAKER_07: That is unfortunately the reality.
30:17
SPEAKER_07: And that was why I was so motivated to create a program like the Business of Dance to fast track the success of these dancers and to prepare them realistically so that they actually have the tools before they actually make the big move.
30:30
SPEAKER_07: Because uh I know a lot, I mean, I know a lot of dancers that go on a whim with like$25 in their pocket, their clothes on their back, and nothing, and they make it.
30:36
SPEAKER_07: And I there are those diamonds, a dozen.
30:38
SPEAKER_07: I mean that those exceptions to the rule.
30:40
SPEAKER_07: Yes, we've heard those stories, and however, the vast majority they go there, they don't make it, they get they can't deal with rejection.
30:48
SPEAKER_07: Yeah, because in competition lands, they're getting gold, silver, platinum, ruby, diamond, and all these crazy awards that nobody cares about in the professional world.
30:54
SPEAKER_07: Let me be just to be realistic about that as well.
30:57
SPEAKER_07: Thanks for that.
30:58
SPEAKER_07: And they they don't, I'm sorry, even though I come from that world.
31:02
SPEAKER_07: And yeah, and then they their dreams are shattered.
31:06
SPEAKER_07: So the preparation is key.
31:08
SPEAKER_07: And I think, you know, it as for you it took four it took four years.
31:12
SPEAKER_07: Now it took me four years of visiting LA every summer.
31:15
SPEAKER_07: I was 16 the first time I went, and then I went longer the next summer, and then the next summer, and I was preparing work visas, that took me a year, and then I got an agent, and that took me another year.
31:24
SPEAKER_07: So I was doing the legwork before actually getting there, and then I was teaching dance and judging and all of that, and I remember I had$5,000 saved, which I thought was a big deal back then because I could live off of that for almost uh half a year with$365 or$75 rent.
31:39
SPEAKER_07: So, with that, having that money saved, having those connections ahead of time, having an agent ideally if you're moving to the LA market, because you do need an agent in LA, it's very different than New York.
31:49
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
31:50
SPEAKER_07: And then having the cash flow to be able to sustain yourself, because the reality is you may not book that job right away.
31:57
SPEAKER_07: I did book a job, thankfully, within that first month with Paula Dool, the next one with Britney Spears, and it happened to be an amazing job.
32:03
SPEAKER_07: But I also had money saved, so I was prepared not to work for a few months.
32:07
SPEAKER_07: And my I never had a nine to five job, but I'm my crutch was teaching and judging.
32:11
SPEAKER_07: So I would do that on the weekends.
32:13
SPEAKER_07: That's what paid my bills.
32:14
SPEAKER_07: And then during the week, I would go audition and I would take class and whatever job I ended up booking.
32:19
SPEAKER_07: And it's sometimes feast and famine.
32:20
SPEAKER_07: But I was thankful that I had the teaching and the judging to supplement my gigs.
32:25
SPEAKER_07: And then if I booked a tour, then I was like hands-off of everything.
32:27
SPEAKER_07: I was just focusing on the tour.
32:28
SPEAKER_00: Right.
32:29
SPEAKER_07: But the reality is uh preparation is key.
32:33
SPEAKER_07: Having those again, those go back to the connections is key as well because knowing the right person can get you that job as well.
32:39
SPEAKER_07: But if you don't know anybody, you're brand, you're brand new, you don't know anything, you don't know anybody, you're making connections, you're building your portfolio, you don't even have a professional headshot, resume, demo wheel, website, social media presence, all these things are important now.
32:50
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
32:51
SPEAKER_07: You know, back then in my time, we didn't have all of that.
32:53
SPEAKER_07: A headshot and resume was sufficient, but now you need so much more.
32:57
SPEAKER_07: So there's a lot of preliminary legwork that if you want an easier transition, I'm not gonna say easy, but easier transition to the LA market, being a smarter dancer, having a clear understanding of who's who and what, what are the dream jobs, doing your uh homework and find out what choreographers are actually doing your dream jobs, taking class from those people, going to their workshops, following them on social media, engaging with them, attending events, uh, listening to podcasts, doing as much as you can to educate yourself and prepare yourself before you dive into the deep waters, before you get eaten alive by a shark.
33:34
SPEAKER_07: Because that is the reality for a lot of people.
33:37
SPEAKER_07: That's the reality for many dancers.
33:39
SPEAKER_07: And I also always say 20, you know, your talent is only a small, small part of your success.
33:44
SPEAKER_07: There's like I say 20% talent, 80% everything else.
33:48
SPEAKER_07: And everything else is the connections, it's mindset, it's preparation, it's having a good understanding of the business side of dance, it's um having your marketing tools, having nutrition, your finances in order.
33:59
SPEAKER_07: You do have to have other parts of your at life in order, otherwise you're gonna be a hot mess.
34:04
SPEAKER_07: And other and you don't want to go into that audition with I need this job, I need this job, because people feel that energy and that doesn't get you booked.
34:11
SPEAKER_07: You go in with feeling that confidence, your bills are paid, you feel like you've got your toolkit, uh, you know, maybe you know people in the room.
34:20
SPEAKER_07: You walk into that room with a whole different air of confidence, and your level of success will be affected by that if you have the right preparation before you walk in.
34:32
SPEAKER_00: Francisco Gala Danceworks has created a summer dance intensive that helps bridge the gap between high school graduation and a dancer's future.
34:40
SPEAKER_00: Introducing Pre Professional Dancer Institute.
34:44
SPEAKER_00: Pre-Professional Dancer Institute brings students in contact with dancers and artistic staff from the collegiate and professional dance world.
34:51
SPEAKER_00: This allows emerging dancers with professional aspirations to engage in open conversations about their career options and offers them the best avenues and strategies for pursuing their goals.
35:01
SPEAKER_00: Throughout the five-day intensive, dancers will receive training and exposure in a variety of different career paths they could choose as a professional, like concert dance, company work, live performance, broadway, commercial dance, and more.
35:14
SPEAKER_00: The Pre-Professional Dancer Institute intensive is taking place this August 29th through September 2nd, 2024, in Santa Fe, New Mexico, and it's open to advanced level dancers ages 13 through 18 who have a desire to continue their dance career post-graduation.
35:29
SPEAKER_00: This selective program is only open to 100 dancers and is by audition only.
35:34
SPEAKER_00: Learn more about Francisco Bella Dance Works Pre Professional Dancer Institute by visiting their website at PreProdancerInstitute.com.
35:42
SPEAKER_00: And don't forget to use our podcast promo code at checkout to receive$75 off your registration.
35:49
SPEAKER_00: Use the code MAKINGTHEIMPACT in all caps at checkout.
35:53
SPEAKER_00: Don't miss out on this exciting opportunity to grow as an artist and prepare for your dance future with Francisco Fella Dance Works, our season five premiere sponsor.
36:09
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, that's exactly what you were saying, Cecil, with the of abundance and not scarcity.
36:14
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
36:15
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, absolutely.
36:16
SPEAKER_04: And I love everything that we are talking about here.
36:19
SPEAKER_04: I feel so passionate about sharing this information.
36:22
SPEAKER_04: I think it's so great.
36:23
SPEAKER_04: I too, Courtney, it took me five years before I booked my first job from a cold audition.
36:29
SPEAKER_04: Cold meaning you walk in, you don't know anybody in the room.
36:31
SPEAKER_04: It's uh I was a non-union dancer at the time, and I was attending an ECC, which means it's a dance audition that prioritizes people who are in the union.
36:42
SPEAKER_04: So it's technically called crashing the call when you go as a non-union human.
36:46
SPEAKER_04: But that was my first big musical theater booking, and that took me five years to do that.
36:52
SPEAKER_04: And all of that while I was attending every single audition I could find out about.
36:57
SPEAKER_04: I was taking classes, seeking out the mentorship, the choreographers, the directors who I was interested in, and also infusing myself into my community by being involved in benefit concerts and pre-production and skeleton crew and things like that.
37:11
SPEAKER_04: And I think it's all about planting the seeds and you don't know when it's gonna grow.
37:16
SPEAKER_04: What you have to do is like take care of and foster all of the interests that you have and all of the goals and dreams that you have and plant the seeds, tend to them and stay ready so you never have to get ready when the opportunity presents itself.
37:30
SPEAKER_04: Because you can be in charge of what you bring to the table, but you can't be in charge of when dinner starts.
37:36
SPEAKER_04: But I will I will also say that after those five years, once that first job was booked, it really has been like ever since because it's like that opening of the door.
37:48
SPEAKER_04: When you first move to a new market, no one knows that you exist.
37:52
SPEAKER_04: And then people start to know that you exist, and then they're like, Oh, the talent can back it up.
37:57
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
37:58
SPEAKER_04: And then once you get that first job and they're like, Oh, you're a rock star to work with, I'm gonna call you when I need somebody.
38:04
SPEAKER_04: I would say that like 90% of my resume is from phone calls, and that's because my reputation precedes me outside of going to a cold audition.
38:14
SPEAKER_04: But I do go to the cold auditions and I have booked from those, but I would say the majority of my career is really just relationship based and coming in clutch when someone needs you.
38:24
SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
38:24
SPEAKER_05: The majority of my career is the immediate replacement because they can count on Leslie, but she can do the choreography, she can pick it up, she can, she can make this happen, she can be there tomorrow, she can send you a video of whatever she needs to do.
38:35
SPEAKER_05: And that's that's how I booked most of my jobs.
38:38
SPEAKER_05: But I am a little different.
38:39
SPEAKER_05: It only took me a one year.
38:41
SPEAKER_05: However, after that, it it was continually a slog.
38:45
SPEAKER_05: It wasn't like a door opened and oh my gosh, Leslie.
38:48
SPEAKER_05: It was just a constant, you're so close, you're so close, then no.
38:52
SPEAKER_05: But actually, can you come and do the replacement contract?
38:55
SPEAKER_05: Which, you know, it's there's no shame in that game of being the person who can come save the day because was I the one with the paycheck?
39:02
SPEAKER_05: I wish I could have, you know, stuck it out for longer, but that gets to you as well.
39:06
unknown: Right.
39:07
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, in terms of advice for dancers moving to new markets, I would say be really, really heavy into it for at least a year.
39:16
SPEAKER_04: Like, don't give yourself less than a year.
39:18
SPEAKER_04: And then if you feel like it's consistently not working, maybe take a step back, ask for information from someone you trust in the industry.
39:27
SPEAKER_04: Like, how does your headshot and resume look?
39:30
SPEAKER_04: Does it reflect who you are when you walk into the room?
39:32
SPEAKER_04: How does your online presence look?
39:34
SPEAKER_04: Does your social media match what you would bring to the table?
39:38
SPEAKER_04: Or does it match the jobs you're interested in too?
39:40
SPEAKER_04: Because I can tell you for a fact that people hire quickly through social media.
39:46
SPEAKER_04: They're like, oh, we need someone tomorrow.
39:48
SPEAKER_04: I need them to do X, Y, and Z.
39:49
SPEAKER_04: And the associate or the assistant to the choreographer is like, I know three people.
39:52
SPEAKER_04: And they're like, send me their Instagrams.
39:54
SPEAKER_04: I need their headshot, I need their dance reel and their contact.
39:56
SPEAKER_04: And then and they're like, Great, yes, yes, no.
39:59
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
39:59
SPEAKER_07: Yep.
40:00
SPEAKER_07: Instagram has become the new casting profile.
40:02
SPEAKER_07: And that's the reality.
40:03
SPEAKER_07: I every casting director and agent that I talk to, they say they quickly just they start, they don't even Google a name, they search a name on your better.
40:10
SPEAKER_07: That's how I think your Instagram handle better match your name that they're looking for.
40:14
SPEAKER_07: That's another important tip tip.
40:15
SPEAKER_00: Great tip.
40:16
SPEAKER_07: Uh, because you could be missing out on a job if it's doesn't match.
40:19
SPEAKER_07: If you have Susie QL5678, whatever, it's gonna be hard to find you.
40:24
SPEAKER_07: So if you can have your name.
40:25
SPEAKER_07: But yeah, having those pinned posts is really helpful.
40:28
SPEAKER_07: If your demo reel hopefully is one of those pinned posts, and then if you have, you're allowed one link on your Instagram.
40:34
SPEAKER_07: So if you have a website, I personally use a hype link, which is like a web link, like Link Tree, and then you can have that link to your website, to your YouTube, to your whatever else that you have content so that it's very easily accessible when somebody's considering you for a job that they know right away who you are, what you do, what you can do, and they don't have to go searching for it.
40:54
SPEAKER_07: You know, casting directors, they gotta make decisions quickly, you don't have time.
40:58
SPEAKER_07: They just want to go boom, boom, boom, look at this.
41:00
SPEAKER_07: Okay, great.
41:00
SPEAKER_07: Lover, let's go.
41:01
SPEAKER_07: Boop.
41:02
SPEAKER_07: Right.
41:03
SPEAKER_04: Nice.
41:03
SPEAKER_04: Something I like to share with new dancers is control the things that you can control.
41:08
SPEAKER_04: And social media is one of those things, right?
41:10
SPEAKER_04: Um, I personally on my Instagram, I use my highlights to show like skill set sort of like little demo reels and things like that.
41:17
SPEAKER_04: But the first one is everything that you would find on my website is clickable in that first highlight and it says resume, you know.
41:25
SPEAKER_04: So when you click on it, you can be like, oh, they've done this, that, and the other.
41:28
SPEAKER_04: Here's four contrasting headshots and like links to Vimeo and website and all those things.
41:35
SPEAKER_04: And also, I think that it's so we're so lucky that we can control everything that's on that page.
41:42
SPEAKER_04: And if something says I'm interested in doing an aerial track in a show and I'm going in for it, I can pin my aerial reel to the top for that week of audition.
41:52
SPEAKER_04: And then the following week, when I'm going in for like classic musical theater, let me get my theater reel and pull that up to the top.
41:58
SPEAKER_04: Like I like to adjust and fine-tune things for what I'm interested in at the time.
42:04
SPEAKER_07: Susan Selgado, a huge casting director, uh, who she lives in Vegas now, but she used to be in in LA.
42:11
SPEAKER_07: She literally gave the exact same tips to my mentees.
42:14
SPEAKER_07: She's like, when you're auditioning that week for whatever job you're auditioning for, pin the appropriate video reel, whatever it is that showcases your talent so that me, the casting director, can actually go quickly look because I'm gonna look at those pinned posts right away.
42:29
SPEAKER_07: Like you said, if it's a musical theater job, if it's a ballet job, if it's a hip-hop job, whatever the job is, then it's like, oh, okay, they can do that.
42:35
SPEAKER_07: They don't have time to scroll through your feed.
42:37
SPEAKER_07: It's too much.
42:38
SPEAKER_00: Or even watch your long demo reel that like that that that chunk of what you need is like a minute in.
42:45
SPEAKER_00: They might have already been like, I'm I don't even feel like watching this dancer anymore.
42:48
SPEAKER_00: 30 seconds.
42:49
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
42:49
SPEAKER_07: That first 30 seconds, every casting director I talk to, you're lucky if they get through 30 seconds of your reel.
42:54
SPEAKER_07: I mean, even my mentees, I tell them do no more than a minute and a half.
42:57
SPEAKER_07: Uh, I know more professional higher level professional dancers have longer reels, but minute and a half, 90 seconds is plenty.
43:03
SPEAKER_07: You're lucky people watch you the first 30 seconds.
43:05
SPEAKER_07: That's that's how quickly they can make a decision.
43:07
SPEAKER_04: The professionals who have the longer reels, they're not getting booked off their reels.
43:11
SPEAKER_04: They're getting booked off their relationships, and like the reel is just like shiny on top.
43:16
SPEAKER_04: You know what I mean?
43:17
SPEAKER_04: Like when you get to a certain point, like no one is asking Misty Copeland for her dance reel.
43:22
SPEAKER_07: Right, right.
43:23
SPEAKER_07: Of course.
43:24
SPEAKER_07: That that is more like if they want to present her, you know, prov present her with an award and they want to get clips from something, they want to montage, then that's when the reel can come in handy.
43:33
SPEAKER_07: Here's some highlights of my career.
43:35
SPEAKER_07: It becomes like a body of work of your career.
43:38
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
43:38
SPEAKER_07: And those usually a two, three minutes long.
43:41
SPEAKER_07: But um, if you're starting out no more than 90 seconds.
43:43
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, at commercial dance intensive, we often tell our dancers it can be challenging, especially when you're first starting out, to tailor your dance reel to the things that not only you can do, but the things that you wanna do, right?
43:55
SPEAKER_04: So say you're say you went to college for dance and you did like a very Contemporary modern program, but you're moving into like a commercial realm and all of your footage is of like one style.
44:07
SPEAKER_04: You want to think ahead, not only the material you have and the training you have, but you want to tailor it to the jobs that you want.
44:14
SPEAKER_04: You want to make it make sense.
44:15
SPEAKER_04: You want to take the guesswork out of it for the casting directors, the choreographers and things like that.
44:20
SPEAKER_04: And the one piece of advice that really helped me is don't be too precious about what you're cutting and taking out and things like that, because you can be like, oh, I had a beautiful memory of doing this duet.
44:30
SPEAKER_04: And it doesn't matter.
44:31
SPEAKER_04: It doesn't matter.
44:32
SPEAKER_04: You're not watching it, your grandmother's not watching it.
44:35
SPEAKER_04: Someone who doesn't know you needs to know that you're a sure thing by watching the first 30 seconds, which I love you said that, Manina.
44:43
SPEAKER_04: Like the first 30 seconds really are the Yeah.
44:45
SPEAKER_05: Well, that's what we always say too, even in competition.
44:47
SPEAKER_05: I don't really want to see your three-minute dance.
44:50
SPEAKER_06: Yeah, oh my goodness.
44:54
SPEAKER_07: Uh little pro tip for dance uh teachers and soloists.
44:59
SPEAKER_07: Please short solos short solos as adjudicators.
45:03
SPEAKER_07: We love short, sweet.
45:04
SPEAKER_07: Show us what you can do and get off stage.
45:06
SPEAKER_07: Because quite frankly, it hurts you sometimes when the solo is too long because you're making more mistakes, then you get tired.
45:12
SPEAKER_07: And then I change my mind.
45:13
SPEAKER_07: In the beginning, the first 30 seconds, I'm like, oh, I like you.
45:15
SPEAKER_07: And then suddenly I'm like, uh, maybe not as much.
45:18
SPEAKER_07: And then your points will actually go downwards.
45:20
SPEAKER_07: So short and sweet, please.
45:23
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
45:24
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
45:25
SPEAKER_00: And even just like how we're talking about this, and it it just really is important.
45:30
SPEAKER_00: If you, if all of our listeners out there, if you haven't caught on, it it is so crucial to understand how to brand yourself in this industry.
45:37
SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's really all of these things we're talking about is branding you as a business.
45:42
SPEAKER_00: Like, I am Courtney Ortiz, the professional dancer, the teaching artist, the dance educator, whatever it is.
45:49
SPEAKER_00: You have to market yourself like that.
45:51
SPEAKER_00: And you have to, you have to hustle like freaking crazy to do it.
45:55
SPEAKER_00: Like at any time you get a new credit, your resume better be updated.
45:58
SPEAKER_00: Your website better be updated.
46:00
SPEAKER_00: Like, even the this new addition of pinning posts to your Instagram, like that's something I never had to deal with before when I was breaking in because Instagram wasn't a thing.
46:09
SPEAKER_00: So no one was checking my follower account, no one was checking my social media.
46:12
SPEAKER_00: Like you said, Manina, it was literally you better have a good-looking headshot that looks like you and doesn't look super airbrushed.
46:19
SPEAKER_00: And you better have a resume in a proper format that has your contact details on it.
46:23
SPEAKER_00: And we've done a headshot resume episode.
46:25
SPEAKER_00: So, like, if y'all need advice on that, go listen to it.
46:28
SPEAKER_00: But those are the bare minimums.
46:29
SPEAKER_00: After that, you now, like you said, now you have to know how to brand yourself because there's dancers who are doing it better than you, and they might get the job because you didn't know how to brand yourself properly, or you don't have a social media presence, or I think so, whatever.
46:43
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and also I've encountered this with some of my friends and contemporaries.
46:48
SPEAKER_04: They're so humble.
46:50
SPEAKER_04: Like a lot of dancers are really like happy to be here.
46:53
SPEAKER_04: I'm so humble.
46:55
SPEAKER_04: Thank you so much.
46:55
SPEAKER_04: And they're like, Oh, I really didn't need to post that I did this workshop or this work or this thing.
47:01
SPEAKER_04: But the truth is that if a tree falls in the woods and no one's there, did it make a sound?
47:06
SPEAKER_04: We don't know.
47:06
SPEAKER_04: So the world needs to know when you're making moves, or else they're not gonna have that information.
47:13
SPEAKER_04: They're gonna not realize that you're capable, like swinging in for something.
47:17
SPEAKER_04: You know, you like it it can feel gratuitous sometimes, and we don't want to be egotistical.
47:23
SPEAKER_04: But the fact of the matter is that if you do the work, you should share it so that other people know that you're capable of doing more work like it.
47:31
SPEAKER_07: Absolutely.
47:32
SPEAKER_07: And I think dancer dancers need to understand that they are a product, they are a brand.
47:38
SPEAKER_07: You are a business.
47:39
SPEAKER_07: And just like the box of Kellogg's cornflakes has their branding, doesn't mean they're a great product, because I don't think they are, but they know how to market themselves.
47:49
SPEAKER_07: They know how to market their product, and you have to understand that you are a product.
47:52
SPEAKER_07: So a product that's sitting on the back shelf that doesn't have any advertisement, no one's gonna know about it.
47:57
SPEAKER_07: Doesn't matter how excellent a product it is, it will not sell.
48:01
SPEAKER_07: And you have to understand that you are selling yourself the moment you walk into that audition room.
48:05
SPEAKER_07: The you are selling yourself online, you are constantly selling yourself.
48:08
SPEAKER_07: So you have to really see yourself as a business, as a brand, as a product and a service that people are looking to buy.
48:15
SPEAKER_07: Because at the end of the day, somebody's going to pay you money one day so that you can do what it is that you do best, which is dance.
48:21
SPEAKER_07: Um, and you're no good to yourself if you keep it a secret and you don't share it.
48:26
SPEAKER_07: Oh, it's true.
48:27
SPEAKER_04: I also think it's important, especially for the pre-professional dancer, to do inner work on finding out who they are, what they want, and what they have to offer.
48:37
SPEAKER_04: Uh, because sometimes we can be uh sort of like directed by our peers, what what they want to do, or our teachers, what do they expect of us, or our parents?
48:48
SPEAKER_04: What does it mean to be successful in dance and this, that, and the other?
48:52
SPEAKER_04: And oftentimes we'll we'll take on those expectations and do ourselves a disservice.
49:00
SPEAKER_04: So I encourage the next generation that's about to move or about to start deciding what it is they want to do in the professional dance industry, figure out what you actually want.
49:10
SPEAKER_04: What will light your fire?
49:12
SPEAKER_04: What will light your fire?
49:13
SPEAKER_04: What will inspire you to go to auditions or show up to events and classes and opportunities on a daily basis?
49:22
SPEAKER_04: And it may not be what you studied, it may not be what you expected when you first moved there, but there's so much available to you.
49:29
SPEAKER_04: Doing the uh research on who you are and what you want will serve you in the long run because it'll allow you to have that longevity and play the long game because that's that's really what it is.
49:40
SPEAKER_04: It's about a numbers game.
49:42
SPEAKER_04: How many auditions are you gonna go to until you get that yes?
49:44
SPEAKER_04: How are you gonna survive those days?
49:46
SPEAKER_04: How are you gonna survive the no's?
49:48
SPEAKER_07: Great advice.
49:49
SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
49:49
SPEAKER_07: There's no other you on the planet.
49:52
SPEAKER_07: That's a really cool reality to understand that if you are your true authentic self at the end of the day, that will draw people to you more than trying to be the dancer that you think you're supposed to be.
50:05
SPEAKER_07: Yes.
50:06
SPEAKER_07: And a lot of times we look we idolize other dancers and think, oh, I have to be like them.
50:10
SPEAKER_07: No, you don't have to be like them.
50:11
SPEAKER_07: You need to be the best version of you because there's no other you on the planet.
50:16
SPEAKER_07: And when you really step into your authenticity like that, people will be drawn to you and want to have you and hire you and all of those things.
50:23
SPEAKER_07: And and then the whole rejection thing that you're talking about, that is having the mental toughness is a reality check for dancers.
50:30
SPEAKER_07: And I one of the things that I will say that our dance competition industry is failing our next generation is everybody is walking away a winner.
50:39
SPEAKER_07: And the reality is in the professional world, you're not gonna feel that all the time.
50:43
SPEAKER_07: You're not gonna walk away with uh a double platinum or movie platinum, whatever the awards are, and I can't even keep up.
50:49
SPEAKER_07: You're not gonna walk away with that certificate for our participation for our trophy for just coming to this audition today.
50:55
SPEAKER_07: You will get a no thank you, or we'll call you, don't call us, and you're lucky if you get that call.
51:00
SPEAKER_07: And you're gonna deal with that rejection.
51:02
SPEAKER_07: And that mental toughness is so critical.
51:06
SPEAKER_07: It's survival of the fittest.
51:07
SPEAKER_07: And I don't mean fittest dancer as and who has the highest kick, I mean mental toughness because you're gonna have it's an endure, it's a marathon.
51:14
SPEAKER_07: This is not a sprint, you're not gonna just get that big break and everything's just gonna explode and you're gonna be a superstar.
51:19
SPEAKER_07: It doesn't work that way.
51:20
SPEAKER_07: You know, you're gonna if there's gonna be feasts, there's gonna be famine, you're gonna be told yes, you're gonna be told no, you're too short, you're too tall, you're too skinny, you're too fat, you're too this, you do that.
51:27
SPEAKER_07: You're gonna hear all those things.
51:29
SPEAKER_07: But the right jobs will be there for you in the right time, and you have to be patient with yourself in the process.
51:36
SPEAKER_04: A hundred percent.
51:37
SPEAKER_04: I think too um to add on to that, Manina, is that in a competition world, which is also where I grew up, it's a clear merit-based reward system, right?
51:49
SPEAKER_04: It's it's meant to be structured that way so it makes sense to the audience, to the adjudicators, and to the dancers, right?
51:57
SPEAKER_04: You can't always expect to like win all the time and things like that or know who's going to get the title, this, that, and the other, but it's merit-based, right?
52:04
SPEAKER_04: When you're in the professional world, it is rarely merit-based because when you move to these markets, if you've got the gumption to move there, you've probably got the talent.
52:14
SPEAKER_04: You've probably got what it takes to do the job.
52:17
SPEAKER_04: Getting the job is a different story.
52:20
SPEAKER_04: It's all about the tenacity, it's all about showing up, knowing who you are and your branding and things like that.
52:24
SPEAKER_04: But it's not gonna be the best dancer in the room that books the job.
52:27
SPEAKER_04: And I'm sure people have heard that all the time.
52:30
SPEAKER_06: 100%.
52:31
SPEAKER_06: 100%.
52:32
SPEAKER_04: It's not something that you can figure out either.
52:36
SPEAKER_04: Like no one's gonna tell you why you didn't book it unless you have someone on the inside.
52:41
SPEAKER_04: You know, they're gonna be like, oh, the costume doesn't fit you.
52:44
SPEAKER_04: Okay, like, you know, that's one of the things that you talk about.
52:47
SPEAKER_05: Yeah, we love it.
52:48
SPEAKER_05: You're so great, you're so talented.
52:49
SPEAKER_05: We don't know what to do with you.
52:51
SPEAKER_05: That happens so many times, too.
52:53
SPEAKER_05: You know, there's just the pure I we don't know what to do with you.
52:56
SPEAKER_05: Right.
52:56
SPEAKER_05: You're so great and we don't know what to do with you.
52:59
SPEAKER_05: And that happens, and you would never know, like you said, unless you know somebody in the inside, and you can't fix that either.
53:05
SPEAKER_05: You know, it's not I need to be better.
53:07
SPEAKER_05: It's just not today.
53:09
SPEAKER_04: I'd also love to add one more thing for um some of your listeners who may not be the winner at competitions.
53:16
SPEAKER_04: I grew up and wasn't the titleist.
53:20
SPEAKER_04: I never got the top 10.
53:21
SPEAKER_04: I never really had those awards and things like that.
53:26
SPEAKER_04: And I was just happy to be there, cheering on, you know, my friends and studio teammates would like win and succeed in all these things.
53:34
SPEAKER_04: But in the long run, it served me because I personally feel like I I wasn't winning.
53:41
SPEAKER_04: And and I just got to New York and I was like, it's not happening, that's okay.
53:45
SPEAKER_04: We're gonna keep going, we're gonna keep doing it, we're gonna keep working, we're gonna keep pushing and keep showing up because I know that I'm worth worth working with.
53:53
SPEAKER_04: And when you know that and you are secure in that, just like Manina was talking about, when you walk into a room and you are secure in your worth, regardless of booking the job or not, that shows a lot of confidence and it shows security.
54:07
SPEAKER_04: And I feel sometimes we forget to consider the casting director, choreographer, and artistic team.
54:13
SPEAKER_04: They want people who are secure in what they have to offer because it helps them put a steady product forward.
54:21
SPEAKER_04: They want to work with someone who's a sure thing, which is oftentimes why they hire people they know.
54:31
SPEAKER_00: I have four important words for you.
54:34
SPEAKER_00: No more lash glue.
54:37
SPEAKER_00: Lily Lashes is the leading prestige lash brand, and they just launched a new type of eyelash that I feel will be making an impact in the industry.
54:46
SPEAKER_00: Introducing their new 3D foaming reusable self-intensive lash that has a sticky band and stays put by using your own body heat for over 12 hours.
54:57
SPEAKER_00: You'll never have to wait for that lash glue to dry ever again.
55:01
SPEAKER_00: These are the easiest lashes to apply and can be repositioned during application until you get them just right.
55:07
SPEAKER_00: Lily lashes come in a variety of shapes, styles, and sizes, so you can find that perfect lash that works best for you.
55:14
SPEAKER_00: I've loved wearing the self-adhesive lashes, and my favorite style is called the trendsetter.
55:20
SPEAKER_00: With just a little bit of trimming required to fit my eye shape, they were quick and easy to put on before I hit the stage and stayed put all day.
55:28
SPEAKER_00: Head to their website to view all of their eyelash options at lilylashes.com.
55:33
SPEAKER_00: And there's a special discount code just for our podcast listeners.
55:36
SPEAKER_00: Use the code IMPACT20 in all caps at checkout to receive 20% off your order of your new Lily Lashes.
55:44
SPEAKER_00: Get stage ready and make your eyes pop with Lily Lashes.
56:03
SPEAKER_07: I was happy if I placed top three.
56:05
SPEAKER_07: Okay, I got a couple high score there and maybe a scholarship here.
56:09
SPEAKER_07: But I was not, if anybody knows my competition dance life, they will know I was not the strongest technically.
56:16
SPEAKER_07: I was not the kid that had the beautiful debloppee and the tilt and the 10 pirouettes and all the flips.
56:21
SPEAKER_07: I was not that kid.
56:22
SPEAKER_07: So I learned how to deal with failure and loss over and over and over again.
56:28
SPEAKER_07: And that mental toughness that I developed throughout those competition years, because I came from a generation before you guys, there was no gold, silver plum.
56:35
SPEAKER_07: It was like first, second, and third, you didn't place.
56:37
SPEAKER_07: There was 30 in a category, you walked over with nothing.
56:39
SPEAKER_07: Good luck, better luck next time.
56:40
SPEAKER_07: That's how I was raised.
56:42
SPEAKER_07: So that that mental toughness was actually prepared on.
56:45
SPEAKER_07: I learned that in a very early age, but this generation doesn't experience that loss.
56:50
SPEAKER_07: So even those that are not even strong dancers feel like winners.
56:54
SPEAKER_07: Then they walk away like, I got first to whatever I got platinum, I got this.
56:58
SPEAKER_07: But then the reality hits you hard in the face if you're not ready to handle that rejection.
57:04
SPEAKER_07: But that mental toughness is so important.
57:06
SPEAKER_00: It's it's very true.
57:08
SPEAKER_00: And all of those things that you both said, I mean, it that was uh one of the hard wrap my head around when I was just starting out in New York City because I kept looking around dancing circles around everybody in the audition room.
57:23
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I'm literally the best dancer.
57:25
SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, me full of myself, like young, 19, like, you know, I'm gonna book everything.
57:30
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I'm like kicking higher than these people.
57:33
SPEAKER_00: I'm doing like quadruple pirouettes, I'm doing all the things that I've trained my whole life for.
57:38
SPEAKER_00: I'm picking up the choreography fast.
57:40
SPEAKER_00: I have a smile on my face.
57:41
SPEAKER_00: Like, I think I'm checking off all the boxes of like what they want in the audition, and I would still get cut.
57:46
SPEAKER_00: And I wouldn't really understand.
57:48
SPEAKER_00: I think that was like one of the hardest things.
57:49
SPEAKER_00: And it wasn't that I couldn't handle the rejection, it was just that I didn't understand the casting process.
57:54
SPEAKER_00: I didn't understand that, no, you're too short, or no, you won't fit the costume.
58:00
SPEAKER_00: And honestly, sometimes that's what it comes down to.
58:03
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't sometimes have to do with the talent that we've talked about.
58:06
SPEAKER_00: It really has to come down to the more logistics of are you going to blend in with this ensemble?
58:11
SPEAKER_00: Are you going to be that puzzle piece that fits into whatever our needs are?
58:15
SPEAKER_00: Do you, you know, we already have this dancer lined up, so this is what we're looking for.
58:19
SPEAKER_00: And if you're not that, you're not that, and you can't help that.
58:22
SPEAKER_00: But your talent might have been great.
58:24
SPEAKER_00: And another thing I always tell young dancers is that you're be grateful in every moment when you get feedback while you're still a training dancer.
58:33
SPEAKER_00: Because once you've become pro, you never get feedback.
58:36
SPEAKER_00: You never know what I could do better?
58:38
SPEAKER_00: Why didn't I get this job?
58:39
SPEAKER_00: What should I be doing instead?
58:41
SPEAKER_00: Like you said, unless you have an inside, like someone on the inside, you're not getting feedback after every audition on why you didn't get the job.
58:48
SPEAKER_00: Like, I think in my entire career, I've probably gotten feedback five times from jobs that I've done when I've made it to the final, final, final, final round of callbacks.
58:59
SPEAKER_00: And it was out, it was down to like me and two other dancers.
59:02
SPEAKER_00: And that's when your agent can actually reach out and be like, so can we get some feedback on why she didn't book this job today?
59:09
SPEAKER_00: And they'll and they'll actually tell you because you made it that close.
59:13
SPEAKER_00: But if you're still in like, you know, two, you got cut two times before that, and you were there were still like 75 dancers left, they're not going to go around and give individualized feedback to 75 dancers.
59:24
SPEAKER_00: No one has time for that.
59:25
SPEAKER_00: So I always tell dancers, like, take advantage of these opportunities.
59:28
SPEAKER_00: Like, if you don't like what a judge says at competition, you need to grow some thick skin and you need to accept that feedback because you're lucky that you're getting it right now.
59:36
SPEAKER_00: You might not ever get this feedback again.
59:38
SPEAKER_07: So if you are a dancer and you get constructive feedback from an adjudicator or a teacher, be thankful for it.
59:45
SPEAKER_07: Invite it.
59:46
SPEAKER_07: Just know that they're doing it because they see your potential.
59:49
SPEAKER_07: They see you and they want you to do better.
59:52
SPEAKER_07: I've been, I've been criticized for singling out dancers at a dance competition, but it's only because I actually saw their potential and because I saw them as a diamond in a rough that I felt that this dancer, just with a little bit of tweaking, could have made something good into great.
1:00:09
SPEAKER_07: So while you're young, I totally agree with you what you were saying earlier, Courtney, about invite that feedback because when you're older, you're not going to get that feedback.
1:00:16
SPEAKER_07: And if you're getting the feedback, it's because somebody actually sees you and they care enough about you to say something so that they can help you improve.
1:00:23
SPEAKER_05: Great.
1:00:23
SPEAKER_05: You should be more concerned if you're in class or anywhere and somebody's not saying something to you.
1:00:29
SPEAKER_05: That was always a big fear of mine and call it.
1:00:32
SPEAKER_05: I want you to notice me, good, bad, or otherwise.
1:00:35
SPEAKER_05: Because I want to either know I'm doing well or know what I can do better.
1:00:39
SPEAKER_05: And if you don't, if you if you don't get any of that, that's when you should be worried because that probably means that just something's not going well and they they maybe don't even see a reason to say something.
1:00:51
SPEAKER_04: I also agree, Leslie.
1:00:53
SPEAKER_04: And the other thing that we want to think about too is that at the end of the day, that art is opinion-based.
1:00:59
SPEAKER_04: And that also goes into casting.
1:01:02
SPEAKER_04: So I've often, you know, over the years of adjudicating, you know, you get feedback sometimes that maybe you were too honest, or maybe they didn't prefer that you had a critique about the choreography or the direction or something like that.
1:01:16
SPEAKER_04: And at the end of the day, it's one person's opinion, or it's three people's opinion on your panel.
1:01:22
SPEAKER_04: And that's how the real world is as well.
1:01:25
SPEAKER_04: Because you could be the most capable, amazing dancer, you fit the costume, you're the right height, you've worked with them before, da da da.
1:01:32
SPEAKER_04: And they may have a new choreographer, and maybe you're just not the cup of tea.
1:01:36
SPEAKER_04: And it's their opinion, and that's all.
1:01:39
SPEAKER_04: And the fact is that you can't say that someone else is in charge of your success, even though the keys to the castle feel like it's in the casting director's hands, feels like it's in the choreographer's hands, etc.
1:01:52
SPEAKER_04: You have the keys to your trajectory, and it's about finding what's going to serve you in the long term.
1:02:00
SPEAKER_04: And if you keep going in for the same team and they're just not about you, go in for another team.
1:02:05
SPEAKER_04: Go if New York's not working for you, go to LA.
1:02:07
SPEAKER_04: If LA's not working for you, go to Atlanta.
1:02:09
SPEAKER_04: If Atlanta's not working for you, go to New Orleans.
1:02:12
SPEAKER_04: You know, there's so many markets out there that it's not just I'm not getting this, it's over.
1:02:19
SPEAKER_04: It's where do I need to shift?
1:02:22
SPEAKER_04: How do I hone in on what I'm right for and what's gonna make me happy, you know?
1:02:27
SPEAKER_04: But again, it's opinion.
1:02:29
SPEAKER_04: And I also want to say one thing too that I think is worth is worth mentioning to the younger dancers is that I know this is very common in New York, and you can speak to this menina about LA, but there are auditions that happen all the time where they are simply not looking, that they are not hiring at all at the audition.
1:02:46
SPEAKER_04: There's this scenario in uh New York City that's called required calls.
1:02:50
SPEAKER_04: I don't know if that's like a a technical phrase for it, but in equity shows that are long running, they are required to hold auditions every six months.
1:03:00
SPEAKER_04: So you could be going in and they've got a file, you know, a whole cabinet of dancers who are ready to go in for track number six who covers the lead.
1:03:08
SPEAKER_04: And you're right for that, but they they have an entire filing cabinet.
1:03:12
SPEAKER_04: And this audition is an opportunity, A, for you to learn the choreography because it repeats year after year.
1:03:18
SPEAKER_04: That's true.
1:03:19
SPEAKER_04: To be more comfortable in that audition room, C, get in front of a team that could be casting and working on something else actively, and D, for you to get to know your community in the holding room, in the room where you wait before you go into the audition.
1:03:33
SPEAKER_04: There's so many reasons to still go to those.
1:03:35
SPEAKER_04: I wouldn't say like disregard the uh required calls and things like that.
1:03:39
SPEAKER_04: But just know if you're getting cut from an audition, it could be because the casting team is going through the motions because they are required to.
1:03:47
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:03:47
SPEAKER_04: And it has nothing to do with anyone's talent and no one's getting hired that day.
1:03:51
SPEAKER_07: That's so interesting because LA doesn't have that.
1:03:54
SPEAKER_07: Like they don't have an audition unless there's a purpose.
1:03:57
SPEAKER_04: Right.
1:03:58
SPEAKER_07: But I have attended, I remember Tina Landon's audition once where she was just having an audition because she hadn't seen a lot of she had any new new talent in a while because she'd been direct booking.
1:04:09
SPEAKER_07: So she just wanted to have an audition for upcoming projects.
1:04:13
SPEAKER_07: It was left very vague.
1:04:14
SPEAKER_07: Now I made it to the final cut.
1:04:15
SPEAKER_07: I didn't end up booking anything for from that audition.
1:04:18
SPEAKER_07: However, sometimes there are choreographers that are just so busy that they don't have time to do an audition for every project that's coming up.
1:04:25
SPEAKER_07: So they'll just hold that kind of open call.
1:04:27
SPEAKER_07: I just want to see new faces, get some people on my in my filing cabinet, you know, my uh, so that I can pull from when my regular dancers that I always book are not available or something like that.
1:04:37
SPEAKER_07: Can that can sometimes happen?
1:04:39
SPEAKER_07: Or I've also seen jobs where you audition for a particular job and the job just doesn't end up happening.
1:04:44
SPEAKER_07: It just falls apart, you know.
1:04:46
SPEAKER_07: And you find out later when you're like, you know, I made it to the end.
1:04:49
SPEAKER_07: Why don't I hear anything?
1:04:50
SPEAKER_07: Like, actually, the job still hasn't happened or it hasn't happened at all, or they so sometimes there's auditions, but I will also say this I agree with going to the audition for many reasons because you never know who might see you at that audition.
1:05:02
SPEAKER_07: I'll never forget I went to this one audition.
1:05:04
SPEAKER_07: This audition I don't remember what I was auditioning for.
1:05:06
SPEAKER_07: I didn't book the job or at all, but another dancer who was at the audition who I knew was she saw me at that audition and she was choreographing Luke Bryan's upcoming music video.
1:05:16
SPEAKER_07: And uh she was like, Are you available on this whatever day or whatever for this country artist?
1:05:20
SPEAKER_07: I didn't even know who Luke Bryan was at the time.
1:05:22
SPEAKER_07: It was a shake it for me girl, whatever's a music video.
1:05:25
SPEAKER_07: Uh, he was kind of a newer artist at the time.
1:05:27
SPEAKER_07: And uh it was a direct booking.
1:05:28
SPEAKER_07: Literally, she just saw me at an audition, was like, Are you available next week?
1:05:31
SPEAKER_07: Blah, blah, blah, blah, this is the rate, da-da-da-da.
1:05:33
SPEAKER_07: I was like, Yeah, okay, cool.
1:05:34
SPEAKER_07: So I didn't actually, I went for an audition for one job and I ended up walking away with another.
1:05:38
SPEAKER_07: And that sometimes can happen as well.
1:05:40
SPEAKER_07: Yes.
1:05:41
SPEAKER_07: Happens all the time.
1:05:42
SPEAKER_04: When you look at the finances of it all, it's so much more cost effective to direct book, to make phone calls instead of hold auditions, which is pretty much in my understanding why equity says we have to have auditions.
1:05:58
SPEAKER_04: You know, the required calls have.
1:06:00
SPEAKER_04: To exist because otherwise we would just like keep recycling in the same dancers, which is not a crime, but it also doesn't give opportunities for new talent, you know.
1:06:08
SPEAKER_07: Well, L LA is feeling a bit of a shift in the open call space since 2020.
1:06:13
SPEAKER_07: We're seeing less and less of the open calls.
1:06:15
SPEAKER_07: Like in my time of auditioning, there was tons of open calls, and even if there was a closed call, people would crash it anyways.
1:06:22
SPEAKER_07: But now, um, you know, speaking to the agents now, there's a lot of direct bookings that are happening, and they're looking at Instagrams or looking at casting profiles, and sometimes it's just a direct booking because self-tape auditions is happening.
1:06:35
SPEAKER_07: So those big cattle call auditions that I remember being a part of aren't as common anymore because because of 2020, casting and agents and everybody involved realize very quickly, oh, we actually don't have to rent studio space and be at that, you know, studio for three days and doing all the audition because it costs money and it takes time.
1:06:55
SPEAKER_07: So we're just gonna have somebody, we're gonna record a piece of choreography, we're gonna send a video to all the agents.
1:07:01
SPEAKER_07: They blast it out to all of their clients, and then all these dancers are submitting these self-tape auditions that happens, or there's none of that at all.
1:07:08
SPEAKER_07: And it's just like show me your roster.
1:07:09
SPEAKER_07: Oh, yeah, boom, I want to book this person, that person, that person.
1:07:12
SPEAKER_07: Sometimes there's agencies that have booking in-house.
1:07:15
SPEAKER_07: There was many times in my younger days where it was like the choreography department asked the dance department, who do you have that matches this profile?
1:07:21
SPEAKER_07: Boom, submit, and then it was a direct booking, there was no audition of any kind or no opportunity for anybody even outside the agency.
1:07:28
SPEAKER_07: You know, that's also another thing that happens a lot in the LA market.
1:07:31
SPEAKER_04: And that's something as well to think about when you maybe going into a room and you'll see, you know, maybe one person was like the clear like person that would be getting the job in the room and they're not the one that gets it.
1:07:44
SPEAKER_04: This is something to be spoken about that not everyone's path is on the same timeline.
1:07:49
SPEAKER_04: So that person that eventually gets the job over here may have been auditioning for it for five years, seven years.
1:07:57
SPEAKER_04: And because you're new to the market, you don't know that they were in final round callback last year for that same role.
1:08:03
SPEAKER_04: So it's about like ensure that you stay in your lane and you're inspired by what's around you, but you're focused on what your trajectory is, and you're not comparing yourself to someone else's timeline journey path because your path is your own.
1:08:18
SPEAKER_04: Not to say that you can't mirror things that are successful for other people.
1:08:23
SPEAKER_04: That's one thing I love to say, like exist in the circles and spaces that you want to be a part of, you know, go to the events, like be involved in the classes, the programs, and the benefit and like all of these opportunities to be surrounded by the people who are doing the things that you want to do because you will learn by osmosis.
1:08:42
SPEAKER_04: Like you will hear tidbits and conversation.
1:08:44
SPEAKER_04: Like, if you want to be a dancer in TV and film, go dip your toe in some background work, listen to what's being said on set, see who are the movers and shakers out there, you know.
1:08:56
SPEAKER_04: And then eventually you'll be a heavy hitter when it comes to your time to be on set because you have experience in that realm.
1:09:03
SPEAKER_04: You've existed in that realm.
1:09:04
SPEAKER_04: You know what the call times look like.
1:09:06
SPEAKER_04: You understand how to read a call sheet, you know what they mean when they say, ah, we're gonna shoot this in a 50-50 because you in your side hustle job, you were like, Oh, I'm gonna be back on barista number two, you know?
1:09:16
SPEAKER_05: All right, so I think one of my one of my biggest questions is because I think we do have a lot of dancers who are interested in starting their career straight away.
1:09:24
SPEAKER_05: No college, no program, no nothing.
1:09:26
SPEAKER_05: They're just they're ready to go.
1:09:27
SPEAKER_05: What are some of the main differences that y'all have noticed over the years between the competitive dance world, which is where a lot of our listeners come from, and the professional dance world?
1:09:36
SPEAKER_05: Because, like you mentioned earlier, Sissa, like there's a few things that you don't know until you know.
1:09:41
SPEAKER_05: And what are some like little helpful hacks and tips that like in the competition world we do this, but in the real world, you don't really do this.
1:09:47
SPEAKER_05: And you're gonna look green and amateur if you do this.
1:09:50
SPEAKER_05: I would love to just hear a few thoughts.
1:09:52
SPEAKER_04: I love this question.
1:09:53
SPEAKER_04: There's a couple of hot topics that we've kind of like mentioned on.
1:09:57
SPEAKER_04: One large thing that I feel really passionate about is freestyle because you'll be asked to do it at the beginning of an audition and at the end sometimes or in a professional dance class when there's a videographer.
1:10:09
SPEAKER_04: And the expectation, even though I'm a special skill lover, I love acro, I love heels, I love all the special skills and things like that.
1:10:17
SPEAKER_04: But when someone is asking for freestyle, nine times out of ten, they want to see style over skills because the skills are already probably woven into the choreography.
1:10:28
SPEAKER_04: Not saying you can't throw something fancy in there, but we're not checking boxes.
1:10:33
SPEAKER_04: Like sometimes at competition, it can feel you know, you have to have these skills and those skills.
1:10:39
SPEAKER_04: And if you're competing in this division, you need to have X, Y, and Z in an audition setting.
1:10:44
SPEAKER_04: They're trying to see you that hasn't had an opportunity to shine through the choreography they've given you.
1:10:52
SPEAKER_04: So what has been left unsaid is what you want to explore in your freestyle.
1:10:58
SPEAKER_04: And another thing that we spoke about uh is that a dancer who's been in the audition process for a long time will not go up and ask for feedback after an audition has after they've been cut.
1:11:13
SPEAKER_04: It is not a crime.
1:11:14
SPEAKER_04: There's like not a hard and fast rule about it.
1:11:17
SPEAKER_04: I would just say that it shows that you're new to the game because your veteran auditiones are going to show up, get cut, go get their croissant with their girlfriend, and then go take a dance class.
1:11:29
SPEAKER_04: They're not gonna go up and say, What what did I do wrong?
1:11:31
SPEAKER_04: What can I do better?
1:11:33
SPEAKER_04: Because they know nine times out of ten, it's not about what you did in the room.
1:11:36
SPEAKER_04: It's just you weren't right that day.
1:11:38
SPEAKER_04: And that can be tough to handle because as dancers, we are often high achievers and are happy to do the most, uh including what has been asked of us, right?
1:11:50
SPEAKER_04: So we we always want to do better because in dance there is no perfection, and we're taught that from a very young age.
1:11:57
SPEAKER_04: So I I just encourage dancers to be secure in what they have to offer, even when they've been cut.
1:12:04
SPEAKER_04: And if it's a really long process, like Courtney talked about before, of course, you can inquire about feedback long term.
1:12:10
SPEAKER_04: But I I personally wouldn't recommend approaching the table or the panel because then you'll look really new to the to the scene.
1:12:17
SPEAKER_07: Great advice.
1:12:18
SPEAKER_07: So I have uh another take on that.
1:12:20
SPEAKER_07: Uh the dance competition world, especially this generation, is very heavy on tricks, very heavy on the tilts and the fuites and the Alice Cohn turns and all of those things that in the professional world, especially specifically the LA market, none of that really is ever used.
1:12:38
SPEAKER_07: So that is another reality check.
1:12:40
SPEAKER_07: So having performance quality and style, being able to mimic the choreographer exactly how they do it, because if you're part of a group cast, they want to know that everybody can work together.
1:12:51
SPEAKER_07: If you're the odd one that's doing things completely different, that's probably not going to serve you for that particular job.
1:12:57
SPEAKER_07: So, competition world, there's a heavy, heavy high in the tricks in the professional world in the LA market.
1:13:02
SPEAKER_07: It's not as heavily used.
1:13:04
SPEAKER_07: Now, you might want to whip out, you know, an aerial or a suicide or any kind of cool tricks in the freestyle just to give that little wow factor.
1:13:13
SPEAKER_07: Um, that's okay.
1:13:15
SPEAKER_07: Or that little moment before or after if they ask you to freestyle, that's fine.
1:13:19
SPEAKER_07: But uh generally speaking, you're lucky if you get to do a pirouette in an audition.
1:13:25
SPEAKER_07: So style and performance usually supersedes uh the classical technique in the commercial market of LA.
1:13:32
SPEAKER_07: And that's another harsh reality for a lot of those competition kids that train so hard to get that tilt and train so hard to get those, you know, million pirouettes when then they get there and it's not even really used.
1:13:43
SPEAKER_07: The other thing that is very different is in the competition world we have costumes.
1:13:48
SPEAKER_07: And you might, if you audition even in a convention, you're in dance wear.
1:13:52
SPEAKER_07: But in the LA market, generally speaking, you're not wearing costumes and you're not wearing dance wear either.
1:13:59
SPEAKER_07: A lot of times you're wearing pedestrian clothes and it's street clothes, it's sneakers, it's heels.
1:14:06
SPEAKER_07: It's not coming to an audition in the one stock look, you know, that we see sometimes in competition.
1:14:13
SPEAKER_07: Um, so how you present yourself is also very different when you get to the professional world.
1:14:19
SPEAKER_07: It's not sequins and rhinestones.
1:14:22
SPEAKER_07: It's, you know, it might be flashy, but in a different way.
1:14:25
SPEAKER_07: It might be edgy depending if you're going for a tour audition.
1:14:28
SPEAKER_07: You might people see with mohawks and tattoos and piercings and sparkly tops, and you might see a bit of that, but it depends on what you're going for.
1:14:36
SPEAKER_07: If you're going for like a gap commercial, it might be clean cut and girl next door, boy next door kind of look.
1:14:41
SPEAKER_07: So you also have to know how to dress the part because your look plays a big role in the commercial world.
1:14:47
SPEAKER_07: And like we've talked about earlier, sometimes it's a height thing, sometimes it's an ethnicity thing, sometimes it's a gender thing.
1:14:53
SPEAKER_07: Like they're looking for specific types a lot of times.
1:14:56
SPEAKER_07: And very rare does it have to really necessarily do with your abilities.
1:15:00
SPEAKER_07: So that goes back to Courtney, what you were talking about.
1:15:02
SPEAKER_07: You're like, but I'm the best dancer in the room.
1:15:04
SPEAKER_07: Why am I not booking?
1:15:05
SPEAKER_07: Well, it's because it's really not about your talents.
1:15:08
SPEAKER_07: It's kind of they're trying to fit a mold, they're trying to fit a look, they're trying to fit a type that they're actually looking for.
1:15:13
SPEAKER_07: And that's a thing too.
1:15:14
SPEAKER_07: In the competition world, we're supposed to be judging you just on your skill set and yes, performance as well.
1:15:19
SPEAKER_07: But in the audition environment of the LA market, um, your talent is really little to do.
1:15:25
SPEAKER_07: I mean, it has a plays a role, but it's not the end all be all, is my point.
1:15:29
SPEAKER_07: There's a lot of other components that they're looking for.
1:15:31
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:15:32
SPEAKER_04: I love that you talked about that as well.
1:15:34
SPEAKER_04: In the New York market, you want to show up with a look, but it's not as pedestrian as the LA market.
1:15:41
SPEAKER_07: Totally different.
1:15:42
SPEAKER_04: You'll really, you'll really see, especially when it's like a technique-based show or like a classical musical theater show, you'll see a lot of like Lululemon and a lot of like sets and things like that.
1:15:53
SPEAKER_04: Uh, but I will say it does stand out when you choose a look that reflects the show as a whole.
1:15:59
SPEAKER_04: So if you approach it from an actor standpoint in musical theater and give a little like a nod, a little nod to it.
1:16:06
SPEAKER_04: You allude to it.
1:16:07
SPEAKER_04: Like if you're going in for a 1960s show, maybe like have your hair in a ponytail with a headband.
1:16:11
SPEAKER_04: You know, like you just add in like some accessory or something like that.
1:16:15
SPEAKER_04: You don't show up in costume, except when you're auditioning for Chicago on Broadway and very specific.
1:16:20
SPEAKER_00: And like Moulin Rouge, I feel like, is like costume.
1:16:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and it and it I think like that's one of the hardest things for young dancers to figure out is like right.
1:16:28
SPEAKER_00: When do I actually show up?
1:16:30
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like this.
1:16:31
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:16:31
SPEAKER_00: What do I wear in an audition?
1:16:33
SPEAKER_00: And like you have like your few like go-to audition looks.
1:16:36
SPEAKER_00: You should also learn like what color looks really great on you.
1:16:38
SPEAKER_00: That should that should be what cut exactly, something that actually like shows off your body in a great way that makes you feel confident and also looks flattering on you because there's honestly, there's many times where I'm like, what in the world are they wearing?
1:16:52
SPEAKER_00: Like, this does not flatter them at all.
1:16:54
SPEAKER_00: Like when I'm sitting behind the casting table, I'm like, I see the potential here, but that was not the outfit.
1:16:59
SPEAKER_00: And that outfit got you cut.
1:17:00
SPEAKER_00: Your dancing's great, but that outfit, I just can't get out of my head in like a bad way.
1:17:05
SPEAKER_00: Like, unfortunately, and again, you're not gonna hear that feedback.
1:17:08
SPEAKER_00: You have no idea if that you're gonna wear that outfit again next week and they might think the same thing.
1:17:13
SPEAKER_00: You just don't know.
1:17:14
SPEAKER_00: So you have to learn what works for you, what doesn't.
1:17:16
SPEAKER_00: Should I wear my hair up?
1:17:18
SPEAKER_00: Should I wear my head down?
1:17:19
SPEAKER_00: Is it in my face?
1:17:20
SPEAKER_00: Also, do not come to an audition in turners or pirouetters because that's a big thing in the competition world.
1:17:26
SPEAKER_00: And I'm telling you, I judge you immediately the moment you step foot.
1:17:29
SPEAKER_00: If I ask for flats, ballet shoes or jazz shoes or bare feet, I unless it's contemporary dance, I probably don't want to see a sock.
1:17:37
SPEAKER_00: And I definitely don't want to see turners because it makes you look amateur.
1:17:41
SPEAKER_00: It makes you look like you're still a training dancer and not I'm a professional now.
1:17:46
SPEAKER_00: So no matter how great you are, like it just makes me think something different about you.
1:17:50
SPEAKER_00: And that's a first impression.
1:17:52
SPEAKER_00: It's it's the same thing at competition.
1:17:53
SPEAKER_00: We talk about it all the time, but like it's important to know how to transition properly, and that's what this whole conversation is about is just learning the ropes on what works, what doesn't.
1:18:07
SPEAKER_00: Hey listeners, you may remember hearing about Apollo Shocks earlier, and I'm here to tell you that they are an essential in my dance bag.
1:18:16
SPEAKER_00: Apollo shocks have revolutionized dancer footwear by providing the benefit of a shoe with the comfort of a sock in one durable and high-quality footwear.
1:18:25
SPEAKER_00: Apollo has a style of sock for every genre of dance.
1:18:28
SPEAKER_00: You can wear them in class, on stage of competition, and even on those long convention weekends.
1:18:34
SPEAKER_00: They can easily replace your dance shoes or can be worn with your dance shoes to offer additional support and post-cost recovery.
1:18:41
SPEAKER_00: I love wearing my Apollo shocks, and I know you will too.
1:18:45
SPEAKER_00: Try them out risk-free as they offer free returns and free exchanges.
1:18:49
SPEAKER_00: And don't forget to use our exclusive promo code IMPACT10 in AUCAP for 10% off your order at Apollaperformance.com.
1:18:58
SPEAKER_00: That's APOLA Performance.com.
1:19:02
SPEAKER_00: Dance longer, dance stronger with Apollo Performance.
1:19:13
SPEAKER_04: Absolutely.
1:19:14
SPEAKER_04: And like when people are talking about, we had this conversation earlier, right?
1:19:18
SPEAKER_04: Like, how do you know yourself and what you have to offer and all of those things?
1:19:22
SPEAKER_04: The other side of the coin is know your audience, right?
1:19:26
SPEAKER_04: What generation is casting right now?
1:19:29
SPEAKER_04: What generation is behind the table, right?
1:19:32
SPEAKER_04: So you kind of have to suspend your reality in regards to what their expectations are of how a professional dancer would show up.
1:19:43
SPEAKER_04: What is the status quo for them, you know?
1:19:45
SPEAKER_04: And that could change from job to job.
1:19:47
SPEAKER_04: Like the type of dancer that a cruise line is looking for is gonna be different than the type of dancer that a national tour is looking for.
1:19:56
SPEAKER_04: So that's something to take into account as well, right?
1:19:58
SPEAKER_04: So like we're of a certain generation and we're gonna say that the half shoe is not acceptable, one shoe is not acceptable.
1:20:06
SPEAKER_04: We don't know what it's gonna be in 10, 15 years from now.
1:20:09
SPEAKER_04: But like the important thing is that we have intelligence, right?
1:20:14
SPEAKER_04: So we can think about like what are we going for?
1:20:17
SPEAKER_04: Who are these people and what what's gonna be flattering to them?
1:20:20
SPEAKER_04: We want to take all the guesswork out of their process and we wanna make it look so I what I like to say about dancers, like control the things you can control, but also the other side of the coin is that your headshot and resume and social media, even if you haven't worked a day in your life, it should look like you're already working.
1:20:39
SPEAKER_04: It should reflect the working dancer's materials, right?
1:20:43
SPEAKER_04: And the way that you do that is by research, right?
1:20:45
SPEAKER_04: You walk into an audition like you've been there 10 times before.
1:20:48
SPEAKER_04: You walk into a holding room like you know what you're doing, even if you're shaking in your boots, you walk in, you sit next to somebody you feel like knows what's up, and then you just listen and you stay really nice and kind and positive in the holding room.
1:21:02
SPEAKER_04: But you just stay calm and take it all in, right?
1:21:05
SPEAKER_04: But you need to walk in like you're already working because someone is going to find that attractive.
1:21:10
SPEAKER_04: And they want to work with somebody who's a sure thing.
1:21:13
SPEAKER_04: That's true, right?
1:21:13
SPEAKER_04: Just makes it easier for them.
1:21:15
SPEAKER_05: I love that's that is that's like a soundbite right there that I feel like you didn't have to restate yourself.
1:21:21
SPEAKER_05: That is perfect the way it is.
1:21:23
SPEAKER_00: All right, dance world.
1:21:24
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
1:21:24
SPEAKER_00: Oh my God.
1:21:25
SPEAKER_00: I I I mean, this resource right here for this past hour and change is something that I wish existed and could only have dreamed of existing in my time when I was breaking in as a new professional dancer.
1:21:39
SPEAKER_00: And I will say we barely touched, like we've barely scraped the surface of this.
1:21:44
SPEAKER_00: We have so much more that we could continue to talk about.
1:21:46
SPEAKER_00: And one of the resources that you could continue to go listen to is Manina's podcast, The Business of Dance, because she covers all of these topics over there on her podcast.
1:21:55
SPEAKER_00: So absolutely make sure you give a listen and check out her mentoring platform.
1:21:59
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, everyone go check out commercial dance intensive because that's where Sissa is going to be.
1:22:04
SPEAKER_00: And they're running an intensive.
1:22:06
SPEAKER_00: When's the intensive this summer, Sissa?
1:22:08
SPEAKER_04: Our intensive is July 14th through the 27th in Nashville, Tennessee.
1:22:14
SPEAKER_00: Oh, and it's an amazing program where you just get thrown in and learn everything, mock auditions, how to do your resume, how to prep your reel, tons of different classes, guidance from all different sides of the industry and not just the commercial side.
1:22:28
SPEAKER_00: Broadway is commercial now.
1:22:29
SPEAKER_00: Broadway is definitely considered commercial now.
1:22:31
SPEAKER_00: So don't think it's just for Los Angeles.
1:22:33
SPEAKER_00: You can be a New York City dancer going to commercial dance intensive and learning all the things.
1:22:38
SPEAKER_00: So, so many resources available for our dance world, and we're happy to bring more of that here to you on making the impact.
1:22:43
SPEAKER_00: So I have to give a huge shout out to Manina and Sissa for sharing all of the wealth of knowledge that you've learned from your time in the industry.
1:22:50
SPEAKER_00: It's just amazing.
1:22:51
SPEAKER_07: Thank you so much for having us.
1:22:53
SPEAKER_07: What a great conversation.
1:22:54
SPEAKER_07: So colorful, so many different perspectives.
1:22:57
SPEAKER_07: And so much harsh truth.
1:22:59
SPEAKER_07: I'm glad that we're able to speak that to the younger generations and their parents as well listening.
1:23:05
SPEAKER_05: We only speak the truth here on Making the Impact.
1:23:08
SPEAKER_05: Yep.
1:23:08
SPEAKER_04: Absolutely.
1:23:09
SPEAKER_04: I feel so honored to be here with you.
1:23:12
SPEAKER_04: And I think that knowledge is power.
1:23:14
SPEAKER_04: And I'm so grateful for what everyone here has shared and the inspiration that these conversations spark because we are in charge of the direction our industry goes in.
1:23:25
SPEAKER_04: And I just really appreciate how forthcoming everyone is.
1:23:28
SPEAKER_04: Manina, it's so nice to meet you.
1:23:30
SPEAKER_06: Good to meet all of you.
1:23:31
SPEAKER_06: It's uh great.
1:23:32
SPEAKER_06: I feel like we can chat all day, but we've got to be respectful of everyone's time listening.
1:23:37
unknown: We could.
1:23:38
SPEAKER_06: Very true.
1:23:38
SPEAKER_06: We might need a part two to this or something.
1:23:40
SPEAKER_06: Honestly.
1:23:41
SPEAKER_06: There's so much to cover.
1:23:44
SPEAKER_06: I know.
1:23:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there's we barely touched on our questions, but everything we said was what it was needed to be like people are gonna love it.
1:23:50
SPEAKER_00: So, listeners, hope you love it.
1:23:52
SPEAKER_00: Be sure to share it.
1:23:53
SPEAKER_00: Sit down with your dancers who want to make this a reality.
1:23:56
SPEAKER_00: If they want to go pro, they have to listen to this.
1:23:58
SPEAKER_00: It's a requirement.
1:23:59
SPEAKER_00: You have to listen to this episode.
1:24:01
SPEAKER_00: And um, for our guests, how we always have our guests on making the impact lead us out is with one final thought on the topic today.
1:24:08
SPEAKER_00: So if there's anything that you didn't cover today that you want to share, any advice for dancers who are breaking in to either coast, maybe to the parents, any of the studios out there, you can truly talk to anyone with just one final wrap-up thought on transitioning from competitive dancer to professional dancer.
1:24:26
SPEAKER_07: One thing I'd like to share is even though we've talked about some harsh realities that a dancer might face, I also want you to know that it's possible.
1:24:35
SPEAKER_07: It's still possible.
1:24:36
SPEAKER_07: We're all living proof that it's possible.
1:24:38
SPEAKER_07: We've been able to stain careers within the dance space.
1:24:41
SPEAKER_07: Speaking for myself, I have only been in dance my entire life.
1:24:45
SPEAKER_07: I'm a wife, I'm a mom, I have three children, that I've evolved in different chapters of my life.
1:24:50
SPEAKER_07: And I hope that inspires you one day to be able to pursue your goals, your dreams, and be able to fulfill what you want to do.
1:24:57
SPEAKER_07: And I want you to know that dance can and will be a fruitful and can be a sustainable career for life.
1:25:05
SPEAKER_07: I want to just uh dispel the myth of the starving artist.
1:25:10
SPEAKER_07: I think we have got this misconception that it's a short-lived career and that dancing and performing is the only thing that you can do in dance, when in reality that could just be just the beginning and the springboard to something even better and greater for you.
1:25:21
SPEAKER_07: There's so many areas within the dance space that you can carve out for yourself, whether you become a professional dancer in LA or New York, whether you want to open a dance business to own a dance studio, a dance convention, be an agent, be a producer, be a casting director, bridge, branch over into singing and back into acting.
1:25:37
SPEAKER_07: Circus arts, there's so many avenues that dance can take you and just know that it is possible.
1:25:44
SPEAKER_07: And uh I think we're all living proof of it, and we're not just the exception to the rule.
1:25:48
SPEAKER_07: There are many others out there that are doing amazing things and creating an impact, doing what they love uh for a lifetime.
1:25:54
SPEAKER_07: So that's my message to young dancers and parents.
1:25:58
SPEAKER_07: You can do it too.
1:25:59
SPEAKER_04: One thing that I would love to end with, and I love that you asked this question, but it's that people want to hire nice people and your reputation will precede you both inside of the dance world and outside of it.
1:26:15
SPEAKER_04: And I think it's so important to be mindful of the way you carry yourself, be polite at all times, be early, make people feel valued when you're talking to them, make other people who share space with you feel included.
1:26:31
SPEAKER_04: If you're in a stressful situation, how you manage what's happening is almost more important than anything else, because someone who's good in a crisis is gonna be someone who's hired again.
1:26:44
SPEAKER_04: Someone with a bad attitude won't get the same opportunity the next time the job comes around.
1:26:49
SPEAKER_04: And because so much of our lifestyle is big to moment, to contract, to opportunity, to this, that, the other, how you work and who you are is going to keep you working.
1:27:03
SPEAKER_04: Once you get that foot in the door, which is what we've talked about for a lot of this episode, once you get there, it's really about your work ethic and are you good to be around?
1:27:13
SPEAKER_04: And I always love this quote from one of my mentors.
1:27:17
SPEAKER_04: He says, 10 minutes or 10 blocks.
1:27:20
SPEAKER_04: If you have something that's not glamorous to share, whether it's from an audition or a show or an experience, in the space where it happened, you don't need to be sharing that information.
1:27:30
SPEAKER_04: Flowing reviews only.
1:27:32
SPEAKER_04: Go home, call your mom, talk to your non-dance friend about it, right?
1:27:38
SPEAKER_04: Because gossip spreads like wildfire, and you never know the person sitting next to you hearing you talk about a negative experience in the audition you just had.
1:27:47
SPEAKER_04: They might be running the room you're in in the afternoon.
1:27:50
SPEAKER_04: You don't know who they are, right?
1:27:52
SPEAKER_04: And it's just you wanna be graceful and gracious with your energy because that is a huge part of what we do.
1:28:00
SPEAKER_04: We in creative spaces rely on positive energy.
1:28:04
SPEAKER_04: And I think that is so important and something to remember, especially when you're diving in and you might be in a stressful situation where you're unfamiliar.
1:28:12
SPEAKER_04: Carry yourself professionally and be mindful of how your energy could affect other people because they will remember.
1:28:23
SPEAKER_00: We hope you enjoyed our latest episode all about transitioning from competitive dancer to professional dancer.
1:28:29
SPEAKER_00: Special shout out to our guests, Manina and Sissa, for joining us on this episode.
1:28:33
SPEAKER_00: Don't forget to follow them on Instagram.
1:28:36
SPEAKER_00: You can find Manina at ManinaFortunano and Sissa at Sissa.strain.
1:28:41
SPEAKER_00: Also, if you're ever in New York City, head on over to Broadway Dance Center to take class from Sissa.
1:28:46
SPEAKER_00: And if you're looking for more mentorship and guidance, look into Manina's online mentoring platform, The Business of Dance, and tune into our podcast on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.
1:28:58
SPEAKER_05: Don't forget to follow Making the Impact on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Podcast, and pretty much everywhere you listen to podcasts.
1:29:05
SPEAKER_05: And if you want more exclusive episodes, support our podcast by joining our Platinum Premium membership for only$5 a month.
1:29:11
SPEAKER_05: Subscribers receive free Making the Impact stickers, shout-outs live on the air, ad-free listening, and exclusive access to our QA episodes for members only.
1:29:20
SPEAKER_05: Join now at Impact Danceeducators.com/slash Platinum Premium or click the link in our show notes.
1:29:26
SPEAKER_00: Looking for some outside expertise to fine-tune your dance before hitting the competition stage this season?
1:29:32
SPEAKER_00: Then check out IDA's Online Judges Critiques.
1:29:35
SPEAKER_00: Our seasoned judges will provide you with the video critique of your routine, just like you'd receive at competition.
1:29:41
SPEAKER_00: But with IDA's online judges critiques, we take it one step further with our post-critique additional feedback.
1:29:47
SPEAKER_00: Your judge will go through your routine again, pausing the video to give you even more detailed and personalized feedback.
1:29:54
SPEAKER_00: You can even request a judge that specializes in your styled dance.
1:29:58
SPEAKER_00: This game-changing service has helped countless dancers prepare for the competitive stage, and it's available year-round.
1:30:04
SPEAKER_00: With critiques starting at only$35, what are you waiting for?
1:30:08
SPEAKER_00: Click the link in our show notes or visit our website at Impact DanceAdjudicators.com/slash online critiques to learn more and submit your dance today.
1:30:17
SPEAKER_05: Season five is coming to a close, but stay tuned for our last few episodes, including our final studio Spotlight, in house versus guest choreography, and a chat with current college dance majors.
1:30:28
SPEAKER_00: We'll see you next week.
1:30:29
SPEAKER_00: Until then, keep dancing.