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The Golden Age of Grave Robbing: Stuff You Should Know Live in London · Stuff You Should Know

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  Speaker 1: San Francisco, sy s K Tree, Yes, San Francisco, Oakland,
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  Speaker 1: the entire Bay area and dare I say all of
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  Speaker 1: So we're doing that show on January. Uh. You can
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  Speaker 1: Lots of awesome shows that weekend and for the following weeks.
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• 1:05
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  Speaker 1: I didn't hurry. I'm shut out. And since this promos
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  Speaker 1: petered out, it ends right now. Welcome to stuff you
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: should know from how stuff Works dot com. Hey, and
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. There's Charles W.
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: Chuck Bryant. Cherry's not here, but we are in beautiful London,
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: England at Union Chapel. It's not bad, It's not bad.
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: I have a good feeling about this. Guys. It was
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: the S word. For those of you at home just
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: tuning in, you have no idea what we're talking about. Boy,
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: the acoustics in this room, it's almost like they built
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: it for that reason. We should have done this from
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: up there, And now that I think about it, I
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: don't think so. Yeah, I've worked out of you say
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: what No, no, don't respond. Please come up here and
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: tell the crowd what you just said. So we're we're
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: doing a podcast. We'd like to start it out, get
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: you all laughing and then bring you down. And that's
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: what we're gonna do right now, because we're talking about
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: Grave robbing tonight. Yeah, there's a long rich history this country. Actually,
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: there really is. As you will see, you probably already
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: know this. You guys are probably taught this from like
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: third grade on or year three. Yeah, I don't know.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: We're from America and I think Germany's landlock for God's say.
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: So there's We did a lot of research on this show, um,
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  Speaker 1: and we found that actually grave robbing is this huge,
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: huge amorphous topic. Like the Egyptians were really big into
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: into burying people with these elaborate graves, and then they
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: were equally into breaking in and robbing those graves. Right, Um,
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: the field of archaeology is basically grave robbing and academia.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: There's this really really great video that I really strongly
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: want to recommend to anybody who has a dark and
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: interesting grave robbing that yes, sure, But alternately, if you
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: have a very dark sense of humor, you will love
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: grave robbing for more. It's this weird bootleg video from
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  Speaker 1: like the eighties maybe nineties, where this very disturbing young
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: man is explaining how to extort money from people by
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: robbing their family's graves, and he holds up jawbones and
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: stuff while he's doing it. It's just right. When you
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: leave here, go watch grave robbing for morons. But we realized, like,
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: this is two unweel it is like a five hour show.
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: It's not. They may they may sit there for five hours,
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: but by god, they're going to be really unhappy after
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: hour or two. So we decided we were gonna whittle
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: it down to two hours. And it was kind of
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: easy because it turns out that there has never been
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: a period in human history where a dead body has
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: had more monetary value and hence more likely to be
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: dug up from a fresh grave than in the late
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  Speaker 1: eighteenth and early nineteenth century in the Aisles and in America.
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  Speaker 1: And I like to call it the Golden Age of
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: grave row me. Josh did this research and he put
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: this together and he actually capitalized that, so I thought
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: it was really called the Golden Age of Gray Robin.
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: He fooled me and said, well, that's remarkable. Let it know.
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: You could have a Golden Age of something terrible, but
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: I'll go with it. And you said, no, I just
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: capitalized it. Well, if you capitalize it, it legitimizes it
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: for share exactly. I bought it. So we're gonna go
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: back in time, we're gonna all get in the way
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: back machine, which is the stone edifice right here, everyone filing.
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: There's plenty of room, believe me, lots of room in
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: the other dimension. This leads to, so we're gonna go
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: back to the mid sixteenth century and pretty much anything
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: before that, uh, to what. I don't know what they
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: called it back then. It wasn't called um medicine or
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: practicing medicine or being a doctor. Uh. In fact, I
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: don't even think they had the word doctor yet, did
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: they or did they? No? No, they were barbers and surgeons.
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: Surgeons stuck. Barber's did not for obvious reasons. Well barber's stuck. Yeah,
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: there's still barbers around, but just not in the way
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: that you think of. If you're barbera's cutting you open.
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  Speaker 1: He's not doing his job very well. Lists and apothecaries
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: and witches and that's who was practicing early medicine, and uh,
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: things were going pretty well for a while. They figured
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: out that the human body ran on the four humors,
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: and they were wrong because the four humors are blood,
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: as we all know. That's right. Like that was pretty
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: pretty sharp of them back then. Not too bad flim.
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: It is the thing we can all agree, uh. And
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: then the two bials yellow bile and black pile and
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  Speaker 1: that was it. That was the human body. You had
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  Speaker 1: the four humors and that's how all this stuff worked out. Well.
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: That that and they figured out that the kidneys may
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: be right, and they were like, it was actually this
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: guy named Galen. He was working in the first century CE,
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: and he figured all this out and said, job well done,
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: and this is human anatomy. And for four hundred years
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: they said, we don't need to go back and double
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: check his work. Let's just take his word for it.
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: This is how the human body works. And then finally
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: one day somebody who's like, I'm not sure this is correct. Sure,
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  Speaker 1: maybe the kidneys make pea and maybe blood is kind
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: of important, but black by don't. I don't even know
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  Speaker 1: what that is. I think we need to cut open
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  Speaker 1: more people. And they looked around and they said, who's
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: who are the people who should be doing this? Who
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: should we entrust cutting open dead bodies too? And they said,
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: Barbara Surgeons, you guys amputate people without any sort of anesthesia.
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: We should probably let you do it. Yeah, because if
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: you want to know how this works. You need to
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: open it up and see what's in there, kind of
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: like just lifting the bonnet or the boot bonnet. Well,
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: what the hell is the boot? I think the boots
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: the trunk. Yeah, we got that on our big tour announcement.
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: And remember that that's not surprising. Yeah. I've said a
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: few other words on the podcast that means something different
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: here all apologies. Yeah, trust me, I get the emails.
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: I understand these words means something different. Now, no offense.
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: Uh So they realized you needed to peek under the hood,
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: as we would say in the States, and see what's
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: going on. Let's just stick to that. It's just what
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: we know. Uh So eventually they were doing this a
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  Speaker 1: little bit, and they realized they needed more bodies if
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: they were really going to advance medicine and learn things.
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  Speaker 1: And so in fifteen forty there was a king you
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: might have heard of and read the Eighth I I
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  Speaker 1: and he said, here's what I'll do. I'm gonna grant
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  Speaker 1: the monopoly on uh cadavers on bodies to the barber's
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  Speaker 1: and surgeons. And he said, oh my gosh, it's great,
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  Speaker 1: thank you so much. How many do we get a year?
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  Speaker 1: Four four, thank you bodies a year. I don't know
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  Speaker 1: if that's gonna do it, but thinks it was a
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  Speaker 1: pretty good start, and um, but it clearly wasn't nearly enough.
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  Speaker 1: And these early dissections amounted to not much more than
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  Speaker 1: just kind of opening the body up and looking to
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  Speaker 1: see what was in there and lifting organs out and
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: showing people because they don't learn Galen. Yeah, pretty much.
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  Speaker 1: So like the dissections amounted to this, Yeah, what was that?
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: The appendix? Appendix? You call it funny? And then they
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: get to the intestines and like this is like magic
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: never and it just keeps coming. So it was it
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: was a little bit just like early surgical theater. They
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  Speaker 1: would display these organs and no one really knew how
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: how things work. Back then, it was pretty clear that
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  Speaker 1: you needed more bodies if we were going to get anywhere.
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  Speaker 1: Everyone wanted to live longer, and they knew a few
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: people knew that this was kind of the way to
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: do it. So they were like, who do we hate?
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: Who do we hate? Murderers? Everybody hates murderers. And King
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: George a third another King King George I I he said,
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: I'm going to pass this thing called the Murder Act,
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: and the Murder Act basically said if you were convicted
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: of murder, not only were you going to be hung,
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: but we're gonna hanged. Is it? Yeah? Two different meanings. Yeah,
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: I guess if you get to be hung, we're going
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: to dissect you after your day, because I'm not I'm Georgia. Third.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: Uh is that a fact? No? No, no, no no.
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: I just made that up, as I do from time
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: and time again. I said, Germany is landlocked. You know,
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: Donald Trump has small hands. Apparently so apparently has been
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: recently proven. Somebody figured out to go to Madame Tussod's
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: wax museum and measure the hands because apparently the whole
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: thing is anatomy anatomically accurate. Yeah, small, it's oh oh yeah.
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: I just realized how we got on that. So you
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: would be hanged if you were convicted of murder, and
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: then after that they would dissect you as like an
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: additional like we hate you that much, that's how, that's
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: how despicable we find you. So it really kind of
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: opened the floodgates of the bodies a little more. We're
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: talking like thirty forty more bodies. And we found out
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: actually in researching this that you could and during certain
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: periods of time, you could say, I don't want to
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: be executed, send me to America instead, when you were
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: convicted of murder and we're like, wait, wait, wait, I
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: thought Australia was a penal colony. No, apparently both were.
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: Did you guys know that? No? Okay, good, because I
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: was gonna say, they don't teach us that in America.
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: There's all sorts of like rebellion and we're not paying
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: taxes and you're crazy easy, we don't like you, you're
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: not hung king and all that stuff. That's how they
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: teach us. We're in a church, sent me to the
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: coast of California for my punishment exactly, you got any
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: suntan lotion. So eventually things were progressing a little bit medically,
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: and uh, they actually started founding medical schools. The first
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: medical schools rose out of the hospitals. They dropped the barber's.
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: The surgeon said, I think the word surgeon is going
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: to be the one that people are gonna I think
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: is legit. So barber's, you just go cut your hair
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: and maybe do a little bleeding on the side for
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: a little while, and we're going to found these medical schools,
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: and these students, um were expected to show up with bodies. UM.
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: I don't know how they do it in university over here,
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: when you start school, if you have to buy your books. Uh.
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: In the United States, you have to buy your books
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: each semester um. But back then it was b y
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: O B in medical school and you had to show
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: up with your own body. And there was a weird
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: loophole at the time, uh in English law where it
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: was not actually illegal to steal a body. Grave robbing
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: had been going on for a long long time, but
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: it wasn't for the bodies. It was for jewels or
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: any kind of valuables that the humans were buried with,
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: and which happened all the time, you know, because people
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: would like most like the treasures of the family would
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: be buried with the body a lot of times, you know,
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: other people wanted those treasures exactly, so they would steal those.
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: But now, for the first time, bodies were valuable. But
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: there was this loophole. As long as you returned the valuables,
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: you could actually steal the body. And technically, technically it
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: wasn't illegal because the body couldn't own itself. It wasn't
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: property exactly, so therefore it couldn't be stolen. So if
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: you were caught with just the body and it was
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: totally naked and it's clothes were back in the grave,
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: they kind of be like, why no law broken. Students
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: didn't quite dig this though. They were like, you know,
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: I'm one day this is gonna be a respectable profession
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: to be a surgeon, and I know there's a loophole,
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: but something about this doesn't feel quite right. It makes
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: me fainty. Fainty. Um. The problem was that all these students,
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: there are more and more students being attracted to the
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: profession of surgery and of anatomy and studying this kind
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: of stuff. So the more students that came, the more
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: bodies were needed. Because back then there was no embalming,
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: there was no refrigeration, and so after a very short
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: period of time, a body would get gamey. Right, So
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: you come in one day with your saw and you
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: go to saw it and like always in your arm
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: would just keep going and you'd say I need another body,
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: and there were no more bodies. They'd say, go dig
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: it up. And then you would say, I'm fainty and
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: they'd say, fine, who else can we get to do this? Criminals,
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: criminals would love to fulfill this. We have a black
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: market that's establishing itself before very eyes. Why not get
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: criminals to steal the bodies and we'll get the money
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: for it. And that is how this whole thing erupted
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: in the late eighteenth century and early nineteenth century, this
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: weird convergence of scientific inquiry, social morays against the idea
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: of dissection, and a lot of organized criminals that were like, sure,
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: we'll dig up your dead bodies and sell them to
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: you for money. And it all happened right here in London. Congratulations.
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: So one of the first gangs that emerge was called
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: the London Borough Gang Borrow Gang. We've been instructed how
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: to say this. Yeah, we were been saying burrow like
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: dumb Americans. And our lighting guy last night said, fell
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: let's come over here, and he said it with a
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: great accent. But I'm not gonna try and get pulled
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: Chuck's beard. He has a great beard too, So we
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: rubbed beards together and it's spelled Bara. It did. So
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: the londonburg Gang was operating right here, and there was
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: a man who started this gang named Ben Crouch and
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: he crosses in the audience. That's probably good. No, no crouches.
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: No one's gonna admitted at least. And he worked at
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: Guy's Hospital, and I was right next to that today,
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: but anywhere, No, I didn't realize that. We Emily and
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: now were just walking along and I looked up and
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: there was Guy's Hospital, and I say, I know what
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: used to happen here many years ago. You know, great things.
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: But this one dude, he was kind of a rat.
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: He uh, he worked at Guy's hospital, and he had
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: met somebody's in the Peninsular Wars fighting Napoleon, and what
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: they were really good at and on the battlefield was
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: um ravaging bodies and like pulling out gold teeth and
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: fillings and kind of just robbing these bodies. And he said,
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: I think I can take this back home, fellas, and
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: we can get a gang together and we can really
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: make good use of all this stuff. So he got
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: his buddies and they kind of found their go to
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: graveyards and he was for a grave robber, a pretty
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: underhanded dude, which is super super underhanded, believe it or not,
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: but he was good at it. He would find out
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: what graves were, Um, like, other grave robbers are robbing,
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: and he would go to them and he would desecrate
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: the graves and basically draw a lot of attention to
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: those graveyards so they wouldn't be able to operate in
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: those graves. So he was he was trying to just
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: kind of keep the cottage industry in house right exactly,
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: and he was really good at it. He actually came
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: to be known as the corpse King. And he would
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: even make his wife call him that. He'd be like,
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: don't you mean do you want shepherd's pie for dinner tonight?
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: Corpse King? And she'd be like, that's what I meant,
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: and he say so. Ben Crouch was so good at
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: what he did that was good. Uh. He was so
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: good at what he did that he actually was able
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: to retire a wealthy man from Gray Ribbing. But that
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: was not the end of the Borough Gang. He passed
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: the reins onto one Patrick Murphy. Murphy, Oh you should
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: have heard it in Dublin. There's one Murphy here. Come on.
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: He's like, no, no, yeah, they're all over Dublin. Uh.
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: So Murphy was even a bigger creep. He would do
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: things like. Uh. He had a bunch of looks like
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: underhanded things he would do. He would, let's say, sell
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: a body to a hospital and then go back in
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: and break in and steal that body from that hospital
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: that night, and then sell it to another hospital the
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: next day before it had a chance to be dissected. Underhanded.
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: He was very underhanded. Um. He also would keep surgeons
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: in line right like um. He found out that some
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: surgeon had bought like a bunch of bodies for some students,
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: and he and his gang broke into the the anatomy
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: school that night and you related the body so they
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: would be unusable. This is not cool. Uh. And then
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: there was this one anatomist who I've never gotten to
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: the bottom of. Why didn't they didn't like this guy?
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: But they didn't. They once delivered a body to the
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: guy that he had ordered, and it was delivered naked
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: in a sack, as they customarily were, because you couldn't
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: steal anything from the grave. Um. And the guy put
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: the body on the on the slab, and the anatomist
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: came over and was about to cut into him, and
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: the body sat bolt upright. It turned out it was
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: just a man that the gang had knocked unconscious and
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: delivered and sold to this guy, and apparently he ran
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: out of the house naked, scared to death down the street.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: I'm not dead yet. You will be soon feeling much better.
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: That's too money. Python references. I'm gonna go for three.
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: There was fair enough to then a mint that was
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: meaning of life, right. The big guy at the restaurant
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: maybe eats them and blows up and his rib cages left. Classic.
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: Well that's three. Let's try and work in five. Okay, five?
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: Could someone be in charged officially? Account Monty Python references. Um,
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: this was happening all over the UK, by the way,
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: and it was also happening right in our own United States,
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: And in fact, it was happening in our very home
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: state of Georgia in Augusta, at the Medical College of Georgia,
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: which is still there today. And there was there was
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: a man, well, I was about to say, working there.
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: He was a slave, uh, and he was owned by
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: the Medical College of Georgia. It's all very sad. He
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: he was a slave owned by the medical school and
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: he it was illegal to teach a slave to read
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: at the time, which is even more sad. But they
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: taught grandson Harris to read because they wanted him to
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: keep up with the obituaries because he was really good
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: at digging up graves and bringing in cadavers and keeping
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: them in good supply. This guy had a knack for it,
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: as a matter of fact. Yeah, and this um kind
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: of points out a thread that you'll see running through
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: this whole history that as long as bodies were being
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: stolen from minority graveyards and marginalized people or mentally ill
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: like mental hospitals, the white establishment didn't much care. So
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: only when things started happening in the white communities did
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: people really start to get upset. And you'll you'll see
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: that a little later, but this is definitely what was
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: going on with Grams and Harris. So everybody, if you
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: will reach under your pew, you'll find a little pad
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: of paper and a pen, because this is a part
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: where we teach you how to rob a grave. There
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: is no pad of papers. By the way, you get
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: a pet, you get a pen. Was that Oprah? It was?
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: It was a halfhearted Oprah. But yeah, well you don't
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: want to go full Oprah. It's it's embarrassing unless you're Oprah.
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: Uh So, here's how you do it. Typically this happens
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: um at night and you would think duh, of course,
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: but um, there was a member of the Borough Gang
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: named Tom Light who wasn't the sharpest knife in the drawer,
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: and he was actually arrested in broad daylight walking through
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: London with a cart full of dead bodies, and the
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: cops came up. And you know this is highly illegal.
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: Tom Lights like, oh can't you see the naked Yeah,
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: I didn't steal any jewels. So you go at night.
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: You use a wooden shovel because a metal shovel against
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: rock will make noise. Your whole job there is to
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: be really quiet, so you can get away with this.
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: So you got your wooden shovel, you're there at night.
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: And I didn't know before we researched this that I
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: just figured you just dug up the whole grave and
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: raised the casket and pulled out the body. That's a
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: lot of work. No, you want to work smarter, not harder, exactly.
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: So you would just dig that first third. You would
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: find the headstone, which ideally is where the head of
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: the body is unless your family has a weird since
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: the fume, and you would you would dig down that
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: first third only, and you would dig down, dig down
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: until you reach the casket, and you would expose the
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: casket and you would pry that up and snap the
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: lid off of that first third because all the dirt
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: is on the lower two thirds. And then there's this
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: or or this. Yeah, I don't think the eyes are
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: open if they were alive when they were buried. They were,
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: I've seen movies. You do like that, and then the
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: eyes glows unless you bury them while they're alive. So
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: the body's there, Why are the arms like this? I
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: don't know. I'm not sure how they do it. What
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: did you do? That's not bad? They were happy or something.
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: Either way, they would run a rope under the body,
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: under the arms, and they would just pull the body
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: out the upper third and then you've got your body,
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: you would. Um. I imagine they stole valuables. I mean,
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: come on, I know there was a loophole that there
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: were valuables. They probably took him. But the thing was,
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: if they were caught stealing the valuables, they would be hanged. Hanged. Um.
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: If they were caught with the body, no, they wouldn't
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: be that's right. So they would strip the body down
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: and put it in the sack, but everything back in
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: the grave, and rebury it as best of good, so
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: no one would ever know they were there. That is
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: ideally how it would go down. And our buddy Grandison
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: Harris actually was supposedly so good at this that he
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: would memorize the floral arrangements before he desecrated the grave,
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: so that when he reburied it he could remember exactly
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: what it looked like when he put it all back together.
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: Because if you were a decent resurrectionist, which is what
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: they call these guys, and now they say decent is
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: probably not the best word, if you were good at
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: what you did as a resurrectionist. Um, the whole point
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: was is that no one would ever know that you'd
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: broken into this grave. And we we're saying guys a lot.
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: We try to keep things in our show, like say
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: men and women, But let's be honest, women were always
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: way more decent. They wouldn't do something like this even
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: back been like they're doing it now. I just realized
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: when I said that, how that sounded. The most most
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: grave overcense days are women. Ever since the seventies, come
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: a long way, baby, so uh was that add Never mind? Um,
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: here's what also happened. People are stealing bodies out of graves,
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: but there's a lot of work. So some enterprising dude said,
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: here's what we'll do. Let's just forget the graveyards and
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: let's just find out when people have died. They kind
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: of live out in the sticks in rural areas, and
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: we'll just go pretend to be a family member and
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: they're really poor and they won't know, and we'll say
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: we'll take care of the body for you, and they
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: would just take the body right away from the family
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: and then that's it. They would have the body, no must,
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: no fuss, And somebody be like, who is that that
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: took the body. I don't care. They took the body.
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: I don't have to bury the body, So do you care? No,
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: I don't care. Well I don't care either. Then shut up.
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: That's how those conversations went. Yeah, we found actual texts.
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: You could you could also go into. Um, the hospitals,
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: the big hospitals, like guys in London City Hospital had
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: like their own graveyards, so indigent patients who died there
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: would just be buried. They're free of charge and I'm
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: sure the grave robbers were like, what are you doing?
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: Because they would break into these graveyards that were very
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: largely unpatrolled, and they would dig up the body and
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: then go sell the body to a different hospital. So
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: the body would be a patient one day, die, be buried,
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: be dug up, and then be sold into another hospital
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: within twenty four hours sometimes Yeah, But what that does
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: do is underscores how they revered the body, and they
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: respected the dead body, because you would think the hospital
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: would just think, no, one's claiming, this body, got a
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: cadaver on my hands, we can use this for medical research.
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: But no, they would still bury the body, which kind
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: of was the tone of what was going on. So
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: this was I know, uh Murphy's contemporary or predecessor, at
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: least retired wealthy Mr Crouch. Murphy himself at one point
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: made a hundred forty four pounds and one day, which
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: is about ten thousand dollars in today's dollars, by stealing
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: twelve corpses in one I guess overnight period, which was amazing.
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: And the London cops figured they had two hundred grave
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: robbers working in London alone, and ten of those were
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: full time grave robbers. They were able to quit their
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: other job, which was probably a big day in the household. Honey,
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: I have really big news. You're gonna be so proud.
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: I can stop robbing orphans. I can just do grave
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: robbing full time stand up guys. So, uh, this was
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: going on way back then, obviously, but evidence of this
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: we have found over the years, kind of recently, um
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: and at the Medical College of Georgia. Well, here's the thing.
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: If you go to renovate the basement of your really
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: old hospital, just get ready for what you're gonna find
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: down here. It's not just a matter of tearing up
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: the tile floors and ripping down the dry wall. You
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: start digging around in the basement of an old hospital,
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: you're gonna find some horrors going on. And they did
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: this in nine at the Medical College of Georgia and
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: found ten thousand bones just scattered in the basement of
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: who knows who and so like. At some point, the
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: idea that surgery and anatomy was based on stolen body
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: was lost to humanity, right, So when this kind of
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: thing comes out these days, everyone's like, all they're serial killers,
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: serial killers, And then somebody who's actually studied history comes
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: forward and says, no, actually, they got some weird news
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: about surgery and anatomy. They would steal the bodies, come
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: them open, and then just mass bury the bones and say,
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: oh my god, that's crazy. And then they'd sit there
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: for a second and then you forget what they just
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: heard and go back to normal. And then a few
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: years later somebody else would discover some bones somewhere else,
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: like on Craven Street, in the house where Ben Franklin
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: rented for like twenty seven years. Right, yeah, whereas Craven
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: Street is there no longer the street. We just assume
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: because you all live in the city, you know where
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: Craven Street is it not around? Is there no more
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: Craven Street? It's NICs, thank you. I thought they buried
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: Craven Street. They well, they found fifteen people, the bones
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: of fifteen people in this house on Craven Street that
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: Ben Franklin right in. And of course everyone said Franklin
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: was a serial killer. And the same guy came forwards
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: like I told you this before. Um, they used to
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: dig up bodies, cut them open basis of anatomy. I'm
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: going back here, look at the bones. Monty python reference.
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: No someone, that's four. I don't know what that one was,
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: but that was number four. That's from Holy Grail. What
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: what part when the rabbit and the cave remember, and uh,
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: he's talking about the rabbit with the huge point of
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: teeth and he goes look at the bones. No one,
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: all right. I don't know if that's a legitimate quote
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: like it may have been said in the movie, but
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: it's a quote for me, like we say, neat, that's
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: a quote. Yeah, that's true, to look at the bones.
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: That's what I thought. That was very funny line. Not
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: tonight when it's terrible, but when I saw the movie
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: back then, I thought it was great. When I saw
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: that movie nineteen times. So most recently right here in
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: London in two thousand six, uh, at London Hospital. You
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: might this might have been on the news. They discovered
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: two hundred and sixty two burials at London Hospital and
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: five hundred individuals in the yard there that we're missing
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: their skull caps and they had basically skeletons that still
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: had wires connecting themselves. It seems wrong if you're gonna
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: if you're gonna steal a body articulate the skeleton and
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: then go to the trouble of reburying it, disarticulate the skeleton.
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: At the very least, just clip the wires off. At
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: least that's a T shirt. It's not a good T shirt,
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: but that's two hundred sixty two burials and five hundred bodies.
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: You do the math. Not everyone has their own plot,
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. Yeah, I know what you're saying. Hey,
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: hey win quick nudge nudge. So if that's five, oh wow,
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: yeah we did it. But we did get out everyone
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: nice time. So uh, this was going on the States,
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: like we said, but as we implied earlier, as long
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: as these were kind of marginalized people or they were
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: slave graveyards, no one really got their hackles up. But
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: something happened in New York City in su called the
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: Doctor's Riot of New York of se I think that's
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: the full title. And there's two ways the story goes down.
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: One is is way funnier than the other one. Um.
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: The first is that these boys were playing in a
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: hospital in New York and they saw him just an arm,
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: a white arm hanging in the window guests to cure
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: or dry or whatever, and they were disturbed and went home.
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: This is this's the stupid one. It's not very good.
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: The other version is these boys were playing near a
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: hospital in New York and they looked in a window
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: and the anatomus took a white arm and waved with it.
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: He hello, young man, come here. He's my favorite anatomists.
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: And so that that's the version we like to believe.
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: And at any rate, they went home and they told
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: their parents, and and one of their fathers had just
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: recently lost his wife, and he got worried that it
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: might be her because he knew grave robbing was a thing,
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: and he went and found that her grave had in
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: fact been dug up, and was a little angry to say,
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: and he spun in a circle of rage that managed
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: to attract five thousand other people in New York at
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: the time, and they started one hell of a riot.
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: It went over for I think like two three days.
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: Twenty people died and they called it an anatomy riot.
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: And the reason it was an anatomy right, because they
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: tried to find every dead body they could in the hospital,
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: which they found a few, and they beat some doctors
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: along the way, and then afterwards they went to the
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: Medical College, and apparently word had gotten from the hospital
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: to the Medical College x NA on the Oddies Bay,
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: and they got rid of all of them, right and um.
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: So when they went and stormed the Medical college, they
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: didn't find anything, and they're like, well, our rage is
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: is not satiated, and what like a little known footnote
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: to this whole thing. When they got to the Medical College,
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: Alexander Hamilton was standing there. They all said, Alexander Hamilton,
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: what are you doing here? He said, peace brothers, peace sisters,
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: go back home. And they pushed his space out of
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: the way and stormed the building pretty much. But again
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: they didn't find anything. So they found out that all
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: the doctors and all the students were hiding out at
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: the jail, and they're like, no jail can hold us.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: We're five thousand strong. There's a guy circulating in the middle,
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: just filled with rage keeping us going. We're eating stuff
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: from time to time to keep our energy up. It
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: was a bad scene. They were literally shouting bring out
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: your doctors. On mass in New York City in seventeen
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: bring out your doctors so we can kill them. This
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: was the tone of the time, and this was not
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: an isolated incident. There were like dozens of anatomy riots
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: all over the United States back then. It's really very disturbing.
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: It was kind of a thing and you guys did
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: it too, but like we really did it, you know
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: what I mean, like Texas style or something like that.
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: All Right, So because all this was going on, um,
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: it became pretty clear that people should take action um
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: on their own. If you're going to bury a family member,
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: maybe you should take some steps to ensure that you, uh,
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: they would be late to rest for eternity. Yeah, it
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: was a very inventive time. It was a Georgian period.
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: And I don't know why I said it, like that
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: you have to the Georgian period some tea. I don't
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: have any tea, so, uh, I don't have any gent.
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: You can lie. I just covered my tooth on this mine.
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: That's your new thing. If you get your finger like
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: stuck in there, it's happened, no now, but my daughter
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: had her finger stuck. So this was a very inventive time.
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: So they thought, let's come up with some ways to
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: ensure this doesn't happen. Let's start kind of basically by
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: just staggering sticks and things as we pile the dirt
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: on the casket because again they're they're using wooden shovels. Yeah,
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: let's just make it harder to dig up the body basically,
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: which is pretty simple, pretty straightforward. Another one was the
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: mort stone, which was invented by a guy named mort Stone,
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: and it was just basically like putting a huge rock
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: on a grave and they're like, well, they'll never get
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: into that grave, and they hadn't thought it through because
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: all you have to do is dig around the stone
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: and downward at an angle and you get to the grave.
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: That's that not too bad. They actually still use more
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: stones every now and then today. Just a few years
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: ago in two thousand thirteen on Treadworth Road, Terry and whoa,
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: that's all right. We needed music for that way we
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: did now where was I still don't know music too Weirdly,
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: that was a weird ring tone, dude, I still don't
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: know how to pronounce this as you do too, You
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: do too, gluster cluster cluster bluster? Is that right? So
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: we did our first show in Manchester, which apparently you're
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: supposed to say murr because we said Gloucester. Now I
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: said it. You're being kind and like this audience had
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: been going like this all night. Suddenly we're pointing and laughing,
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: like they were townspeople in Springfield on the Simpsons and
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: somebody had just pants us. It was like that, the
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: biggest reaction anyone has ever gotten from a crowded Manchester
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: we got and it was at our expense, pointing and
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: laughing because we said gloud Chester, which is just so funny.
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: And they moved to Scotland and they said it's close
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: on flem came up. Didn't point and laugh when they
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: did it. So Treadworth wrote, cemetery and cluster, uh one,
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: Miss Betty Brazil and Henry Brazil were buried together, and
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: apparently the word had gotten around that they were They
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: were buried with a lot of valuables, so um, someone
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: tried to dig him up because the jewels down there.
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: And I don't think they actually got finished at night.
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: So the sun started to rise and they put a
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: recycling bend over the whole and said we're gonna come
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: back later tonight, and that worked for a little while,
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: but I don't think they got the body right. No,
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: they worked for like ten minutes until the sun came
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: fully upright and someone saw there was cling ben and said,
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: someone just tried to rob this grave. In two thousand,
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: still going on. So the next thing they invented was
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: called the mork House. Uh, invented by a guy named
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: no Wrong. It was more stone again. Uh. This was
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: basically just a mausoleum that you could not break into.
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: It was heavy stone, and it was a place where
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: you put your body where it was temporarily interred until
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: it could find its final resting place right for like
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: three weeks. Because that was the rule of thumb was
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: it took about three weeks for a body to become
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: unusable by an anatomist, and therefore it was out of
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: danger of being stolen by a grave robber. And if
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: you had a mort house, most people said, impenetrable. Maybe
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna guard it and be armed while I do. So.
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: A lot of people stood watching cemeteries at this time,
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: and as a result, cemeteries were places where there were
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: a lot of shootouts between families standing watch and protecting
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: graves and grave robbers who were so brazen that they
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: wouldn't run, they'd shoot back. I'd be like, no, that's
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: my body. Uh no, that's my aunt well, we're taking
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: your aunt. No you're not. And it would just go
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: like that for a while, or they would get in
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: shootouts with other family standing watch that they've mistaken for
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: grave robbers, which happened a surprising amount of time. Yeah, graveyards,
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: it wasn't a place to be back then at night. Uh,
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: if you wanted to remain safe and alive. And it's
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: still not so they had this. They had this other
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: thing called a set gun. It's been around since about
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: the fifteenth century, and a set gun is basically, or
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: in this case, a grave gun, a gun that you
• 40:44
  Speaker 1: don't need to man um. You set it up or woman. Yeah,
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: that's true. You had set it up on top of
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: the of the grave and it could spin in a circle.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: It's like in a tripod. And it had a triangulated
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: trip wire. So if you're walking along with your wooden
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: shovel and you go to steal a body, it would
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: trip it and then this gun would just start randomly
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: firing and his sorball and you would get and I
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: quote the article we're working from, a grave robber who
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: tripped the wire would get an ass full of musket ball.
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: That's what I said. An arshal, excuse me, this is
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: from the guy who capitalized the golden age of grave robbery.
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: Another version of that was, um, a shotgun inside the
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: casket so they would pride open and look inside and
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: literally get shotgunned in the face. And the best, if
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: you were like a family who knew where they were doing,
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: you put the shotgun in the in the corpse, which
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: should be that's not what you want to see. When
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: you get shot in the face of the shotgun, that's
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: your last believe we were from America and then what
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: does that mean? We got shotguns all over the past.
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: Another little enterprising idea was called the torpedo, the grave
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: torpedo and the grave torpedo. And our same friend who
• 42:06
  Speaker 1: said no, it's pronounced Bara Bara pointed this out to
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: me after the show. He came up to me after
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: the show and said, let me correct you guys on
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: a few things, which I loved. Again he grab Chuck's beard,
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: and uh, I just thought it was funny. It's called
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: a grave torpedo because what it is is a land mine.
• 42:22
  Speaker 1: You would just go walking toward the grave and you'r
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: you would be exploded, and which it makes you feel
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: like bad for a second. Then you're like, oh wait,
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: this is against grave. But he pointed out that the
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: early torpedoes were really just mines and it just kind
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: of got morphed eventually to be something that you would
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: shoot out of a submarrate. So now it's a colloquialism torpedo,
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: the grave torpedo coming soon. So one of the things
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: that somebody was inevitably going to hit on was, Yeah,
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: it's all fine and good breaking into a grave, having
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: a dig past six maybe around him more stone. I
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: could possibly get a shotgun blast of the face from
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: a shock um held by a corpse that I'm trying
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: to steal. I'm getting shot at by the family members.
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: It's an honest day's work, but is it worth it? So,
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: like I said, it's inevitable that somebody was eventually gonna
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: be like, why don't I just murer somebody and sell
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: their body. I don't have to deal with any of
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: that other stuff. I just have to kill him. I'm
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: robbing graves already, it's not a huge step to just
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: go ahead and murder somebody. And there were two guys
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: in particular who were really famous for this kind of thing,
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: for hitting upon this idea, and they were named William
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: Burke and William Hare, or the two bills as we
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: call them. Someone just wooed in the back. Yeah, you're
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: not supposed to move those guys. You could maybe woo
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: the Simon peg film, but we didn't reference that. So
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: Burke and Hair they were born in an Ulster and uh,
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: they immigrated to Edinburgh to work on the Union Canal.
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: And they met each other there and said, hey, are
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: you a disgusting creep? I am too, I could sell,
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: I could tell in your eyes. Let's pinky does be
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: pinky swear buddies, And they stabbed each other in the
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: back as forever, and uh, I think which one we're in?
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: The boarding house? Hair owned the boarding house. Burke was
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: a cobbler sometimes that right space there, that's right so
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: here he was, he's working at the boarding house, and
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: he said, I've got this guy living there named Old Donald.
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: He died, which happens to the guy's name, Old Donald's.
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: Eventually it was a weird nickname when he was four
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: years old, but now now he's living up to it.
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: Old Donald died owing four pounds, and background Asy said,
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: all right, here's what we'll do. I know, a good
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: body can fetch some money these days. Let's find some
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: other creep who's a doctor that we can sell it to.
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: And they found a surgeon named Dr Robert Knox, who
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: I don't know. You've seen the picture of this guy, right,
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: Have you guys ever heard of this guy, Dr Robert Knox.
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: He is I think the um the archetype for the
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: mad scientists, the creepy man scientists. Like there's one very
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: famous like wood engraving of him. He's wearing like black
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: leather gloves up to his elbow and those creepy sunglasses
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: from the nineteenth century. It's like, what are you wearing
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: those four? Doc? Where are you hiding? And he was
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: hiding plenty, believe me, right, So if you look at
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: a picture of this guy, you're like, that's where that
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: came from. And this guy was a real living guy
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: who gained a reputation for being a ghoul eventually. And
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: he was the man who was like, boys, I'll give
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: you seven shillings, no, seven pounds, ten shillings for old Donald,
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: and keep them coming. I don't care where they come from,
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: just keep them coming. You see these sunglasses, I don't
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: care where you get them. I just see more bodies,
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: and Birke and Harmer like that's great, We'll just go
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: back to the boarding house and wait for somebody else
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: to die. Is to set around for about like five
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: six minutes, and they're like, oh, six A six days,
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: very sick. Maybe we should just hasten six days death,
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: six days the place where the person dying was living.
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: And so they went in right. But on the other side, no, no,
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: this just starts there at six a. UM. So they
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: went in and said six A. Good to see you here,
• 46:14
  Speaker 1: some gin um. Just close your eyes while we do
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: something real quick, okay, And one of them I don't
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: know who did one. Well, all right, let's say we're
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: working here. Okay. I would be the one to lay
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: on the body to make sure it doesn't move. So
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: I would just climb. I would lumber up on the
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: body and just do this, show him, show him the tooth.
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: That is not what you want to see, is you expected,
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: and wink knowingly you're about to die. And then I
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: would come in and my job would be to close
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: the nostril in the mouth, maybe say something reassuring like
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: you sleep, now, get little jewel going and then that's
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: how these people would die, which is a terrible, terrible
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: way to go. And they became so prolific and well
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: known for this eventually that this process of murdering people
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: and actually murdering people for their body to sell it
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: for dissection became known as burking. It's not what you
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: want named after you a method of murder. Now, if
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: your last name becomes a verb for murder for anything,
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: unless it's really great, well, yeah, sure, there's plenty of
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: great things. Name one like somebody coming up to you
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: on the street and giving you like a bunch of
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: free candy, candying well, clarking that guy just Clark man, Oh,
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: I love it when I get Clarke down this street.
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: Realize you have to do that to make that happen.
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: I'm going to do you have a new life mission
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: to make your last name a burb. I need to
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: get my hands on candy. You do what do you
• 48:03
  Speaker 1: call candy? Here? Sweets? Oh that's why they joke didn't
• 48:07
  Speaker 1: go over quite as well. Now I understand, Like I
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: just clarked me, he gave me some sweets, fries or chips?
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: Chips are crisps? Candy? Is sweets. Pudding is all dessert, right,
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: and pork pies, by the way, are the greatest thing
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: you people have ever invented. You have some last higher right?
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I can't get enough. Somebody clarked me with
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: some pork pies. Please, I'm dead serious. We'll wait, We'll
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: wait while you go to the store. What's up with
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: the pork pie hat? Is it shape like a pork pie? Now?
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: I guess hopefully maybe like the pork it was? It
• 49:00
  Speaker 1: was around within it folded in on the edges, and
• 49:03
  Speaker 1: I think pork bye hat does that, so they might
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: be it. Who cares? You can't eat a pork by hat?
• 49:09
  Speaker 1: Well that's what you think. No, I'll try. I'm gonna
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: go to hab it Asher tomorrow. I'm gonna inspect this firsthand.
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: All right, there's another money pinefone red friends? Have it?
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: Really okay? I thought you would know where I was
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: going with it, and they I have no idea. I
• 49:30
  Speaker 1: just got lost. Where are we? All right? So they're
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: barking people left and right. They killed about fifteen people
• 49:35
  Speaker 1: at least in Edinburgh over a ten month period, and
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: they got their girlfriends involved. They each found some nice
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: ladies he said, are you are you creepy? Because we are.
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: And Burke hooked up with Helen and Hair hooked up
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: with Margaret, and they started including them in their little
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: game of death. And they said, here's what we'll do.
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: We'll just go out to a bar and we'll find
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: some old woman who loves Jim and loves gin and
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: we'll just say, you know, have another drink, have another drink,
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: and you know what, you know where we have lots
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: of gin is at my boarding house. So just come
• 50:08
  Speaker 1: back with me late at night. And they apply these
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: old ladies and old men with booze bringing back to
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: the boarding house. I would lay on them, She's sleep.
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: And it was. It was a cottage industry and things
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: were going along swimmling for a while until they got
• 50:26
  Speaker 1: a little greedy, as things go when there's money involved,
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: and they started to Yeah, money and murder. I've seen
• 50:33
  Speaker 1: the movie Shallow Grave. It's a bad combination. I know
• 50:35
  Speaker 1: how that goes. So, uh, you guys haven't seen the
• 50:38
  Speaker 1: movie Shallow Grave or have you know? Oh, you see it.
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: It's good. They're British people in it. So they started
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: burking people who were actually a little well known in town,
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: and Edinburgh wasn't the biggest city at the time, so
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: people kind of knew one another, and they got in
• 50:56
  Speaker 1: real trouble when they finally picked off this dude named
• 50:59
  Speaker 1: Jamie who everybody knew in the town and it was
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: bad news. Well, they didn't call him Jamie. They called
• 51:04
  Speaker 1: him daft Jamie. And today you would call him savant
• 51:07
  Speaker 1: with autism Jamie, but they weren't quite as sensitive as
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: we are today, so they called him daft Jamie. Yes,
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: we've advanced since then. And Jamie was actually he was
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: this very beloved figure in the town. Um. He would
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: just kind of hang out in the downtown old town
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: and people would say, hey, Jamie, here's a bunch of
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: matches I just threw onto the ground. Can you count
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: him real quick? And he would calculate it and they
• 51:29
  Speaker 1: would say that's amazing. Here was a port pie buddy,
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: and he'd say thanks a lot. But he wasn't a
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: bagger or anything like that. He just kind of hung
• 51:37
  Speaker 1: out downtown. It was a fixture in town. His mother
• 51:40
  Speaker 1: and his sister cared for him very well, and he
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: was just beloved. So he ended up on Dr Knox's
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: table and he was very recognizable, so much so that
• 51:48
  Speaker 1: a colleague of Dr Knox is like, that's deaf Jamie.
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: I didn't know he was sick. And Dr Knox is like,
• 51:54
  Speaker 1: first of all, it's savant with allaism Jamie. Secondly, no,
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: it's not. And he started cutting the head off right
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: then serious and like threw it out and they're like, no,
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: it is def Jamie has a club foot, and Dr
• 52:08
  Speaker 1: Knox started cutting off the club foot and then he
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: said okay, let's begin a great new year and started
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: cutting open jet def Jamie. Um. And that was not
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: the only one. There were several other people that were
• 52:21
  Speaker 1: recognized on the table. So Dr Knox kind of fell
• 52:25
  Speaker 1: under suspicion. But it wasn't that that that ultimately led
• 52:28
  Speaker 1: to their undoing. They just grew more and more careless
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: over time, and more and more suspicious of one another,
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: so much so that um, it was Burke and Helen right.
• 52:37
  Speaker 1: Burke and Helen said, Hair and Margaret, we think you're
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: killing people without cutting us in. So I'm gonna go
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: open my own boarding house so we can kill in
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: peace Burke's house and murder that's what they called it.
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: And then they were like, oh, it's terrible, and they
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: crossed out murder and wrote fun underneath, and they started
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: attracting borders after that. So Burke's House with murdering fun
• 53:00
  Speaker 1: is going on and tea and biscuits, and uh, they're
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: drawing in people and they're killing people on their own
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: as a duo, and uh, they're not very good at
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: keeping things quiet. They're good at the killing part. It's
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: the covering up afterward partly. Secondly, at one point they
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: had a body in the boarding house that they just
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: covered up with straw and hay, and one of the
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: other boarders was just kind of cruising through the house
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: and they said, I've noticed that that big pile of
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: hey has an arm coming out of it. It's a
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: little weird and I'm gonna go call the cops. And
• 53:32
  Speaker 1: they said, no, don't do that. Here's what we'll do.
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: And here's what we're doing. Let's give you a little dough.
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: We're selling these bodies. It's for medicine, and we'll we'll
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: cut you in on this deal as long as you
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: promised to not go to the police. And the lady
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: backed slowly out of the room and said, sure, that
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: sounds great. Just write a check and leave it under
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: my door and I'll be back soon. I have to
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: go and mail something because the sames dot com was
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: an inventor, right, so she went right to the costs
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: and the Lord Advocate I wish. So the Lord Advocate
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: in the charge of Hair's case said, you know what,
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna give you immunity. Here's a big offer if
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: you will turn King's witness against your pal Burke. And Uh,
• 54:21
  Speaker 1: Hair quickly accepted and I don't think the words were
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: out of his mouth. He said, Hurt, I'm on board.
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: I will testify against him. And that's what he did.
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: And to this day, of the four including girlfriends, only
• 54:34
  Speaker 1: one was actually tried and Uh hanged. Hanged, just Burke, yep.
• 54:40
  Speaker 1: And he was a very hated figure, as you can imagine.
• 54:43
  Speaker 1: I think twenty thousand people showed up for his hanging.
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: His hanging and no, it's just hanging. And um when
• 54:52
  Speaker 1: he was hanged, Uh, afterward they gave his body to
• 54:57
  Speaker 1: the University of Edinburgh for a dissection. Yeah, cruel, irony,
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: and forty people turned out to see his dissected body.
• 55:05
  Speaker 1: Actually again they just lift into the organs out everyone.
• 55:12
  Speaker 1: So here after a few years he kind of tried
• 55:14
  Speaker 1: to disappear, as you do when you're a creepy ghoul.
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: And um, he went to work at a lime quarry
• 55:20
  Speaker 1: and the dudes that he worked with found out who
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: he was, and kind of a mob justice took over
• 55:26
  Speaker 1: and they shoved him into the lime quarry. He was
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: blinded for the rest of his life. And we don't
• 55:31
  Speaker 1: we don't know if he was like blinded from the
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: line or they threw him into the corny like landed
• 55:36
  Speaker 1: on his eyes on sharp rocks, but either way he
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: was blinded. He was blinded by the line, you don't know.
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: And then he actually eventually moved to the streets of London,
• 55:47
  Speaker 1: which is what you do when you're blinded for life,
• 55:49
  Speaker 1: when you're trying to reinvent yourself. And uh, doctor Knox
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: as well, even he was ruined in Scotland and he
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: moved to the streets of London to try and pick
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: up his medical profession, which he did with pretty poor results.
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: But he did write a very well received book on fishing.
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: It's not a joke. I know it's true, it's hilarious,
• 56:11
  Speaker 1: but it's not a joke. All right, So people are
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: being killed, people are digging up bodies. There's anatomy murder.
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: Years before Birke in here, I think like a decade before,
• 56:45
  Speaker 1: there was a guy named Thomas Wakefield who was a
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: surgeon in the publisher of the Lancet, a great medical
• 56:51
  Speaker 1: journal that we use is still around today. We're coming
• 56:57
  Speaker 1: for us. So he was a publisher of the Lancet,
• 57:02
  Speaker 1: and he said, this anatomy murder is going on. This
• 57:05
  Speaker 1: is like an eight twenty. And he said everyone should
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: be afraid because there are dudes out there that will
• 57:09
  Speaker 1: kill you just to sell your body. Uh, And so
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: be be very afraid. And there are a lot of
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: surgeons too who were fairly liberal minded, who are saying,
• 57:18
  Speaker 1: we need better laws than what we have now. We
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: need more bodies because people are robbing graves, people are
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: murdering for these bodies. There's this huge demand that's being
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: fulfilled and terribly illicit ways. We have to get better laws.
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: But the problem is these surgeons, as prominent as they were,
• 57:33
  Speaker 1: were in this weird position where they look like ghoules,
• 57:36
  Speaker 1: like can we have some more bodies? Bleeds? These just
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: delivering them fresh to our door. So anytime they were
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: challenged they would back off. Very quickly because they all
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: had stolen bodies back in their in their labs right,
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: So the status quo remained the same until Burke and
• 57:53
  Speaker 1: Hair came out and you guys, actually you should be
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: very proud you had your own group of Burker's here
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: in London. They were known as the Lon and Burger Trio.
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: And they killed a bunch of people, uh what came
• 58:03
  Speaker 1: to be called anatomy murder or burking um. And the
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: one that undid them was they killed a fourteen year
• 58:10
  Speaker 1: old boy who had recently emigrated from Italy, and they
• 58:13
  Speaker 1: delivered him to I think Guy's hospital. And the porter
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: at Guy's hospital said, that's pretty weird. We don't usually
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: get warm dead bodies delivered to us. It seems a
• 58:24
  Speaker 1: little sloppy. Maybe I should follow up. So he took
• 58:27
  Speaker 1: the boy to one of the anatomists and said, what
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: do you think about this? The anatomist said, well, I
• 58:31
  Speaker 1: think this boy's neck was broken about forty five minutes ago.
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: It's probably murder. So luckily the porter knew who had
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: delivered the body, and the cops found the guys. They
• 58:42
  Speaker 1: were hanging themselves in between the Burger Trio and Burking
• 58:46
  Speaker 1: hair before them, that the public's eyes were finally totally
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: open to this. There was no avoiding this any longer.
• 58:53
  Speaker 1: Like people were being murdered to supply bodies for anatomists,
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: and they didn't know who to blame, Like there were
• 59:00
  Speaker 1: some anatomists who were convicted of dissecting cadavers. But for
• 59:04
  Speaker 1: the most part, people I think got that maybe the
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: law is a little weird right now, you know, maybe
• 59:09
  Speaker 1: we have this weird prohibition that we should rethink. Parliament
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: sort this out. And Parliament did, actually exactly who do
• 59:16
  Speaker 1: you turn to? So the House of Comment gets involved,
• 59:19
  Speaker 1: they get things done, and the whole hearings and they said,
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: here's what we'll do. Let's get some of these resurrectionists
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: and they'll trot them up. Let's give him immunity and
• 59:28
  Speaker 1: say you can if you testify, get away scott free.
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: And they're like, oh, you mean immunity. What'd I say?
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: You said immunity, okay, and uh, they trotted him out
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: and they toward the told these sort of tales of
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: digging up bodies, and it was very salacious in the
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: news and everybody was like, yeah, the public was very interested.
• 59:46
  Speaker 1: And then tell us more and then they got surgeons
• 59:49
  Speaker 1: and they said, well, let's hear from you, and they
• 59:51
  Speaker 1: talked about the need for cadavers, and it was kind
• 59:53
  Speaker 1: of a big deal because you know, everyone wants to
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: live longer, and in order to do that, we need
• 59:58
  Speaker 1: to cut people open still, so it's like a double
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 1: edged sword. It totally was. So finally Parliament said, all right,
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: here's what we'll do. We're gonna take action. Just picture
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: me in a powdered wig and and it'll allow makes sense,
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 1: which is hilarious by the way, every every couple of
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: months chuckles, just walk into the studio wearing a powdered way.
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: I'm like, it's a powdered wig day. The Parliament says,
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: here's we're gonna do. We're gonna provide some legitimate bodies
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 1: by passing the Anatomy Act of two. It's a very
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: big deal because right out of the gate, on paper,
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 1: at least, it got rid of the black market on
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 1: cadavers because it said anyone who has legal possession of
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: a dead body, um, and the body is dead. Uh,
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: the body never said while they were living that they
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 1: didn't want to be dissected, and no spouse or family
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 1: members saying you can't cut open that dead body. You
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 1: can take that body down to your local anatomists and say,
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 1: here you go, just roll them up the steps, walk away,
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: and they'll cut them upen for you. Right, And this
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: was really radical. It really flew in the face of
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 1: the sentiment at the time, because again, remember the Murder
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 1: Acts of seventeen fifty one said not only are we
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: gonna hang you for being a murderer, we're gonna dissect
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 1: you afterwards. That's how disgusting we think you are. And
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: that really took kind of an unspoken social stigma and
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: codified it. And this went a long way to undoing
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 1: the damage that the Murder Acts had done. As far
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: as the public view of dissection. The problem is is
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: if you were wealthy your middle class at the time,
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: you weren't exactly running out and saying like, yes, dissect me,
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: dissect me. And the whole problem with with the idea
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 1: of being dissected is that at the time you thought
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: that when judgment day came and you were in your
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: grave and God stood you up and you're just standing
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 1: there like, what do you think, huh, Well, it wasn't
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: so bad, right, God would look you up and down
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 1: and be like you look all right, you can come in.
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 1: But if you saw that you were missing your eyes,
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 1: maybe your guts, or you were just an articulated skelty,
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 1: but like you look terrible, laid back down. And that
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 1: was the sentiment behind not being dissected at the time.
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 1: So the the Anatomy Act kind of governmentalized this idea
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: that no dissections. Actually, okay, forget your religious beliefs, just
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 1: listen to us Parliament, and it actually kind of worked.
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 1: But at the same time, what it really did and
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: what it was criticized for, was that it put the
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: burden of supplying cadavers to science onto the poor, which
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 1: is kind of already the process, but in this sense,
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 1: it really kind of codified the whole thing. Yeah, but
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: like you said, it didn't make a difference. I think
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 1: between eighteen thirty two and nineteen thirty two more than
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 1: fifty seven thousand cadavers were legitimately donated to medical science
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: and the United Kingdom alone, So it really made a
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: big impact. And science was advancing in medicine was advancing,
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 1: so it wasn't to the close of the ninth teenth
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: century that dissection really came to be accepted by the public,
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 1: and people started to say, you know what, this is
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: actually a good thing. Donating organs, donating bodies is something
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 1: that we should kind of try and embrace a little
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: bit more, right. Uh, And to this day, sadly, it's
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 1: still kind of goes on in a weird way, right
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: it does. So Like if you go into an anatomy
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: lab or medical school in the United States and you
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 1: come across an articulated skeleton, those skeletons are mostly made
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 1: up of individual bones that were stolen from rob graves
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 1: in India, which means the U S outsourced grave robbing. Yeah,
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: and it is currently outsourcing gray rowing. So uh. To
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 1: finish up the show tonight, we and True Stuff you
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 1: should know Fashion are going to do a top five
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: robbed graves that only has four. I don't know why
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 1: we do that. One of them doesn't even count. Wow,
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 1: that's true. But we're gonna start with a dude named
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: Charlie Chaplin, very famous, born here in London, allegedly, that's right.
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: Do you guys know that. I think they did. That's good. Uh,
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 1: born in London, died on Christmas Day. Very sad because
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 1: he loved Christmas. He died in nineteen seventy seven, and
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: just a few months later, in March of ninety Charlie
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 1: Chaplin's grave was robbed, stole his body, called his wife,
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 1: Lady Una Chaplin, and said I want four hundred thousand
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 1: pounds for Charlie's body, and she said, nope, Charlie would
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 1: have thought this rather ridiculous, was her quote. And they went, Oh,
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: they went, I ever thought of that. No, don't hang up,
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 1: hang up, I'm thinking to uh, we have Charlie Chaplin's body, now,
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 1: let me call you back. Pretty much. So there were
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 1: multiple like staying operations at the cops would try to
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 1: set up to try and catch these dudes. Ever worked out,
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 1: They never showed up. They kind of chickened out, and
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 1: eventually they realized that there was one phone call that
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: they were supposed to make to the police, so they
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 1: tapped the phone of Lady Una Chaplin and m staked
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 1: out two hundred phone boots in the area and they
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 1: actually caught the guy's red handed. A couple of the mechanics,
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 1: one of them had the best name I may have
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 1: ever heard. Yeah, there were two guys, uh roman Wardists
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 1: and Gancho Ganev. I want a horse named Ganto Ganev. One.
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 1: Somebody clarked me a horse named Ganto Ganev Clark you
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 1: a horse? Oh man, I love that term. Now I'm
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 1: making it happen, baby, Why do you want a horse?
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: I love horses, but a horse named Ganto it just
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: fits like Ganto. Gonna have the horse. What's your horse's name?
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 1: Cancer Gonase? He was clarked to me in fact. So
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 1: eventually they did catch these guys and they led him
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 1: to Chaplin's remains, which were about ten miles from the
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: original graveyard, and then they reburied Charlie Chaplin. And you'll
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 1: see a thread here. When you rebury a body after
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 1: it's been stolen, you tend to cover it with like
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 1: seven or eight feet of cement on top. Pretty sensible. Yeah,
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 1: So the next one, I personally don't think this one counts,
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: but we've included anyway, Abraham Lincoln. Have you guys ever
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: heard of the president name Abraham Lincoln from where we live? He?
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: Uh again, he was a president from where we live. Anyway,
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 1: A B. Lincoln died and uh something like eleven I
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 1: think eleven years later, some robbers attempted to break into
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 1: his grave, and the robbers head a rat in their
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 1: midst and the rat had told the cops that this
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: is gonna happen. So the cops staked out the graveyard
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 1: waiting for the robbers. And apparently the cops were the
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 1: Keystone Cops because one of their guns went off and
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: alerted the robbers that they were there, and the robbers
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 1: turned and ran and the Keystone cops like ran into
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 1: each other and fell down, and it was weird, but
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 1: it happened. And um, they didn't actually steal Lincoln's body,
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 1: which is why I'm like, he shouldn't be on this list.
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 1: What's sad is I actually made this one. I didn't
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 1: think it through clearly. Well, they got away for a
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 1: little while, and after the robbery, his remains were reburied
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: in the same mausoleum, but in the basement of the mausoleum,
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 1: which which which? Do you know how rich you have
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 1: to be for your mausoleum to have its own basement?
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 1: It's like six rooms. Do you guys have basements here? Okay,
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 1: all right, well fine, you can imagine that pretty rich. Wait,
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: what do you call a basement here? A barsement, a basement,
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 1: bars do you call it a bars a basement? Actually
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 1: in New England that's what they call it too. That's
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 1: where we live. Well, it's north of where we live.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 1: Put in America, south of New England. What are you
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 1: talking about? So they reburied him in the basement, and
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 1: then eventually in nineteen one, his son, Robert Todd Lincoln said,
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 1: you know what, let's take him up from down there
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 1: and let's rebury him proper and put the steel cage
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 1: over him and bolt that to the floor. Andy safe.
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 1: And they poured the man over him, which is what
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 1: you do as customary. You see, So what do you
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 1: want to hear? It was quite sure. So Gladys Hammond
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 1: a lady, and this was recently you might have heard
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 1: of this one. This is in two thousand four. Um,
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 1: she was dug up and held for ransom, but not
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 1: for money, but to get the family to stop experimenting
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: on guinea pigs. They were raising guinea pigs and selling
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 1: them to medical science. And these animal rights activists stole
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 1: hard body and help basically held her for ransom for
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 1: this family to stop the family does and it worked
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: while it works sort of, no, well it did works.
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 1: The family, Um, the group of activists were called to
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 1: save the new church guinea pigs, who you may have
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: heard of, and have you guys heard of them? No,
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: you haven't. They just thought it was funny. It's a
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: cute name, but they were dead serious. Yeah, so they
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: still the body, hell it for ransom, and the family said, okay, fine,
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 1: we'll get out of the business. We're not gonna breed
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 1: guinea pigs for medical research anymore. We'll breed them to
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 1: be dressed up like cowboys for children's parties. Surely you
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 1: have no problem with that, the original purpose for guinea pigs.
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 1: So so they actually did get out of the business.
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 1: And the people who robbed the grave and stole the
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 1: woman's body, the family member's body, didn't give it back.
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 1: They just never got back in touch. They were like,
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: we moved on to Wales now, we don't care about
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 1: guinea pigs anymore. So it took eighteen months before they
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 1: finally caught these people and said where's the body And
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: they're like, oh, she's in some heathland. That's it. What's
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 1: a heathland country? No, no, heathland. Is it a more? Yes,
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 1: it's a more? What's a more? I think there's quicksand
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 1: on the moors. Isn't there boggy area? A field? Is
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 1: it a field? Why did we feel the need to
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 1: rename everything? Those are great? We renamed it. These kids
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 1: were here first. No, that's what I'm saying. Oh we yeah,
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 1: wells are a wonderful words. Heathland is beautiful. We don't
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: know what it is, but it sounds great. Stupid Americans. Uh.
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 1: So we're gonna finish up the list with Joseph Findon.
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 1: By the way, we we have a microphone right there
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: after this, we're gonna have about ten or fifteen minutes
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 1: left to do a little Q and A. If anyone
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 1: has any questions, you can do so. If you don't,
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 1: you can leave. If you have to pee, you can leave.
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 1: It won't hurt our feelings. We understand. We both have
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 1: the pe right now to speak to yourself. Uh. I
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 1: have to pete totally. Uh. And we're gonna finish up
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 1: with Joseph Hyden Franz Joseph Hyden, very famous Austrian classical
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 1: composer and uh he died. This was during the phrenology movement.
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 1: We've talked a little bit about phrenology on the show.
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 1: This is when you thought that you could look at
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 1: a human skull and really tell a lot about the
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 1: person and about where the smarts were and where the
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 1: genius was. Perhaps, so it was a big deal to
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 1: get your hands on the skull of someone like Hayden.
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 1: So they went to the grave digger and they said,
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 1: we'll give you some money if you cut off his
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 1: head and give it to us. And the grave digger said,
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 1: you had me at money pretty much. Uh So he
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 1: did so, and he gave him the head and they
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: macerated the skull, which means you make the rest of
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 1: the head disappear through magic until you're just left with
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 1: a skull maceration. It's not magic though, pretty much, just
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 1: so good the liquid it's really gross. Eventually everything goes
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 1: away but the skull, which is what you want. And
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 1: the dudes Joseph Rosenbaum and Johann Peter looked at the
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 1: skull and said, oh my gosh, when you look at this,
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 1: look at the musical bump on that skull. And the
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 1: other one was like, wait, wait, wait, it's you say
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 1: musical bump. He made that up just now, it didn't
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 1: I think, yeah, totally. But it's gonna stick. I think
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 1: it's probably just a deformatal pump. It's hide, and of
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 1: course he is a musical pump. So they had the skull,
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 1: and they weren't too shy about keeping it quiet. They
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 1: went one of them even for a little while, kept
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 1: it in his home. They would have dinner parties and
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 1: it was hiding skull and he kept it in a
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 1: glass case like musical notes and compositions and like an
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 1: ink and pill and ink and pill, quill and pin
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 1: and uh. It was prominently displayed. And then the cops
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 1: eventually he found out about this. Well, somebody went to
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 1: go reberry Hyden because he wanted to be moved to
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 1: the family flat. Right. Yeah, he died during wartime and
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 1: it was kind of hastily buried, and in a couple
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 1: of decades later they finally went to rebury him. And
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 1: when they did, they were like, I didn't know Hiden
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 1: didn't have a head you had last time I saw him.
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 1: So they go and they someone says, you know what,
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 1: I totally knew who has his skull Because they're not
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 1: too shy about it. It's over at the Sky's House,
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 1: over at Rosenbombs. So they go over to Roasta Balm's house.
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 1: This is really awful. His plan was to hide it
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 1: in the mattress to get his wife to lay on
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 1: the bed and tell the cops that she's menstruating, and
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 1: the cops were like blo blah blah blah, and they
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 1: like all just ran out of the house pretty much,
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 1: did you keep your skull? That's basically out went down,
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 1: and uh again, we've come a long way since then,
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 1: and the skull was eventually reunited. Well, they gave them
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 1: a fake skull at the time. Here's his skull. They
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 1: knew the jig was up, but they really really wanted
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 1: Hyden skool. Yeah, so they gave him a fake. They
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 1: reburied that with Hyden thinking it was hide and skull.
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 1: And then years later, in nineteen fifty four, in fact,
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 1: not that long ago. Uh well, sort of a long
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 1: time ago, but not on the grand scheme of things,
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 1: they eventually find Hyden's real skull and rebury it. But
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 1: they didn't know what to do with the old skull
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 1: so to this day, not even not only that, I
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 1: don't think it was that they didn't know what to do.
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 1: I think they took the Hyden's actual skull into his tomb,
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 1: set it down. I went to go shut the door
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 1: and turned around, was like, oh right, which one was?
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 1: Which one is the musical bump which? And then they said,
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 1: forget it, let's just bury both of them. Pretty much
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 1: so to this day Hyden Skull is still buried. His
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 1: grave still has two skulls buried in the same grave.
• 1:14:43
  Speaker 1: If you went and dug it up today, it's very
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 1: little known fact. So that is grave robbing. And that
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 1: is the end of our show. Yes, M you know what.
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 1: Thank you for more on this and thousands of other topics.
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 1: Is it how stuff works dot com? M