Latest / Unshakeable with Human Design - A Human Design For Business Podcast / 280 - Elevate Your Brand Through Podcasting with 4/1 Emotional Projector Jessica Burgio

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280 - Elevate Your Brand Through Podcasting with 4/1 Emotional Projector Jessica Burgio · Unshakeable with Human Design - A Human Design For Business Podcast

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Welcome to Unshakeable with Human Design, the show dedicated to
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helping entrepreneurs use human design to shift from hustle to
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flow without sacrificing results.
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Come here to become an unshakeable human and build an unshakeable business
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according to your human design.
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I'm your host, Nicole Laino.
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Hello and welcome to Unshakeable with Human Design, everybody.
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I'm your host, Nicole Laino, and I am so happy to be here, not by myself today,
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but with my good friend, Jess Burgio.
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Jess is, I'm honestly, I'm going to deviate from the traditional
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bio, and I'm going to talk about what I know about Jess.
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Jess is one of those people that I creeped for a long time on Instagram.
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I watched her, I saw her, the way that she engaged with people, the way that
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she showed up, and I was drawn to her.
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I think that she's a great example of what being magnetic is, where it's
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not so much that you're necessarily investing thousands of dollars
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with people off of one post, but it was just like, I want to know her.
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I want to get to know her.
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And then I had a ticket for something, and I offered it to Jess because it was an
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event in her town and we got to meet for the first time right there at that event.
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And now here we are, I've been on her show.
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She has an amazing podcast called Unscripted, which is incredible.
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She has the most amazing guests, and she's one of the best interviewers
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that I've heard in a really long time.
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I love, love, love her show and I love her energy.
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She's a community builder.
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She's a former stylist and salon owner.
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She has this wealth of experience and I think is just this amazing example
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of what someone does when they're just determined to succeed and they're willing
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to put in the work to see how every step unfolds along the way, and just
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remaining dedicated and really driven.
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So Jess, welcome to the show.
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Oh my gosh.
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Thank you.
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What a beautiful introduction.
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I love that so much.
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Could you write all that down?
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And that will be my new intro.
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Well, tell everybody what I didn't tell them.
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Introduce yourself, let listeners know a little bit
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about you that I left out there.
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Well, I am a self proclaimed high energy hype girl.
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Like she said, there's something that I naturally am gifted with, which
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is bringing people into my world.
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Sometimes it doesn't always bring people in, and hopefully I'm learning now that
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sometimes it pushes the people away that aren't meant to be in your world.
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So I just love a good vibe.
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I love creating a good vibe.
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It's why I loved and thrived in the salon industry for many, many years.
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I think.
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And once I met Nicole, I got to learn a little bit more about why that
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was possible through human design.
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And it's one of the things I know we're going to dive into, but I'm a mom.
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I have a almost 13 year old who's in sixth grade.
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That's been interesting to navigate and has thrown my life
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for a curve ball, for sure.
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I now do have a podcast.
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Yeah, it's called Unscripted.
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I've been doing the podcast for almost four years now.
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We just hit our 300th episode.
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And I've learned so much just about myself and about commitment and
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consistency through the podcast, which I tell people that I think I found
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my voice through podcasting and the ability to connect with so many people
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at such a high level in a very focused way, has literally changed my life.
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And so that will be the next book, it's my first announcement.
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I was talking to Jake about, I want to write a book around how
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a podcast can change your life.
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But I get the honor of coaching other women in the entrepreneurial space
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who are usually at some sort of a pivot in their life or career where
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they're looking to make a change.
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So I have a lot of people moving from corporate into the coaching
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space, people who maybe have tried entrepreneurship in the past, but
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didn't have a clear strategy or plan.
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Didn't really know how their skill sets or soft skills fit into
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potentially what they wanted to do.
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And so I get to play in that world of helping people figure
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things out and take action.
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So that's what we've been up to over here.
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I love that.
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And I love the way that you approach things.
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There is such an open hearted perspective and way that you
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approach life and approach business.
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And I do want to say, because this is a human design show, Jess is actually
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a really rare human design type.
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She's a 4/1 emotional projector, which projectors are already 20%.
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Then we cut that in half by making you emotional.
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And then we go and add the 4/1, which the 4/1 profile is the most rare of profiles.
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Means that you have a fixed fate.
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And this is one of the things, when I see people living their design, even
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without knowing that they're doing it.
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That feeling like you're on a track, you may not know where it's going, but you
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trust the track and you trust yourself.
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That is everything about a 4/1.
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You can't be pulled on somebody else's journey.
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It's your journey.
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And that journey is you discovering yourself, trusting yourself,
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and it can be interesting.
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And then you have an open G Center, which through the different environments
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that you're in, through the people that you meet, you're picking
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up, do I belong here or don't I?
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Is this my place?
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Is this not, are these my people?
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Are they not?
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And the more you're in community with the people that are right for
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you, the more your path unfolds.
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That's where your direction comes from.
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So, it's so interesting.
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I love to call out whatever my guests are on the show.
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I'm like, let everybody know what your design is.
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Yeah.
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And I always take extra notes when you are talking about me, because I always
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hear something that I didn't hear the last time, or that I'd forgotten.
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And so it's these, this is literally one of the most powerful things.
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Obviously, if you're listening to this podcast, you're
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interested in human design.
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I would imagine.
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But there's so much depth to what you can continue to learn about yourself.
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In different seasons of your life, different things will land differently.
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And so every single time I talk to Nicole, I learned something different,
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or I'm reminded of something, or something makes more sense in my
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life that didn't make sense before.
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So I'm a huge fan of your work and how you approach things.
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And for always bringing it back to the things about us that
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make us uniquely different.
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Because a lot of people are searching for that.
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And so this is such a beautiful way to find that in you.
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Thank you.
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And I think there's a common misconception with human design that you need to
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be lost to go and to have to find your path, but it's the little clues.
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It's the things that tell you I know where I'm going, but if I just had this
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little bit of information, that one little thing can make so much click
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that could help you figure out if that decision, that thing that's been on
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your heart, that maybe you've been denying and you feel the pull toward.
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That one thing, like hearing that your conscious sun is gate 37 and it has to do
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with community, and that your fixed fate is going to have to do with community,
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and friendship, and family, that might help you deny or accept an offer, an
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invitation, a piece of recognition that comes to you and helps you either
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take a step or walk away from it.
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So I appreciate you saying that, and I'm happy that you get that experience
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when I talk about human design.
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It's always my hope.
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But I want to talk to you about podcasting.
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And when I have friends on particularly, I think that there's a great benefit
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to people hearing a conversation that we would have even if we didn't
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have microphones in front of us.
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And I think that you and I both have grown our business, I think
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we have that in common where the podcast changed everything.
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The podcast, for me, gave me focus.
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It gave me a little playground for me to test and workshop.
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Like a gym.
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I got to work out my message.
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I got to work out my brand.
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I can get on stage now and not even think twice.
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If I really were like blocked and was like, I don't know what I'm going to say.
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If someone went to go pull me up out of an audience and say, do you have 10 minutes?
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We need you to fill.
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If I was totally blocked, I could go back and just look at podcast episodes.
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And I could say, I've carefully thought through 280 ideas
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that I have to choose from.
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I have this bank of material that is so valuable in so many ways.
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Can you talk about your experience with podcasting and what
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it's done for your business?
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Hmm.
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There's so much there.
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I agree with you on now having a arsenal of conversations
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that I can bring to the table.
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And that's, what's always so fun and interesting when people have
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me on their show of like, what do you want to deep dive into?
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I'm like, listen, I've had just about every conversation you could
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possibly think of between the 300 plus episodes I've done for my own
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show, probably another hundred.
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I've been a guest on someone else's show.
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And then 20 plus years of having all varieties of clients in my chairs at
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the salon, you know how it is when you sit down with somebody to get your hair
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done, you tend to share or overshare.
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And so, that is true for me as well.
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I feel so much more rooted in my message.
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I'm able to convey a message from start to finish much more concisely than
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I ever was before I had a podcast.
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I've refined how I approach conversations, I've studied my own tape, if you will,
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and many other interviewers that I love of how do I become better at what I'm doing?
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And everything's a rep.
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And like you said, it's a playground to discover, what do I love talking about?
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What gets me excited to sit down in front of the microphone?
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Who do I want to have these conversations with and being
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able to steer the ship, right?
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Knowing that I'm a projector.
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There's just things that we know, and we have these intuitive nudges
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that like, I don't know how I know this, but I know this and I
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know energy and I can read people.
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And so when I vibe with somebody, we have really great episodes and
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it took me about two years before I actually got the guts up to start the
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podcast because I was like, everybody else, am I going to be consistent?
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Am I going to be able to do this?
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Every week for forever.
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Cause there's really no end date.
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It's not like a six week gym challenge.
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But you can, there are actually no rules.
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So if you are someone who's thinking about starting a podcast and think,
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Oh, well, there's no end date I could never, you can end it whenever you want.
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You can take a break whenever you want.
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You can put out one episode a year if you want.
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You can use the platform, however you see fit.
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Obviously quantity is just as important as quality these days,
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but the quantity will help you get the reps in to develop your style.
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Do you love doing solo episodes?
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Do you love being funny?
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Do you want to be educational?
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Do you want to be known for a specific topic?
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And so that's what you can play with.
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And I had an agency for a while where this is exactly what we did.
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We helped other people start and launch their podcasts.
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And I got to see myself come through in their shoes many times with the
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fear of will I have enough content?
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Will I have enough to say?
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And if you're living your life, you will have plenty to say.
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And you at times just have to be brave enough to share what you're
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going through and document it in real time, instead of perhaps waiting
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until you figured something out.
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That's why social media is so popular is because the people who
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are willing to document the process of something is far more exciting
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than watching someone's after story.
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We want to be taken along on the ride, and you can do that with a podcast.
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And aside from that, I've made so many connections with friends because if you
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think about how much time you get with one person on a podcast, It's probably a lot
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more than you're getting with a variety of people that you love in your life.
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You might not get one hour of undivided attention with your best friend.
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And here I'm getting one hour of undivided attention from a guest
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that I probably couldn't even afford to do a coaching program with if
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really we put that on the table.
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So when I realized it was going to give me access to people I might
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not otherwise ever have a chance to say even hello to, I was all in.
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Because as someone who is just naturally curious, I call myself a nosy bitch,
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but somebody very nicely said, no, you're just a very curious person.
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I said, I like that better.
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That sounds more professional.
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I thought that's what makes me such a good interviewer is because I'm
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not afraid to ask the hard questions.
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I'm constantly thinking of questions to ask people.
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I'm my mom now, I'm the person that says hello to people in the elevator.
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I annoyingly will compliment somebody in the grocery store line, or if
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someone seems like they're in a bad mood, I'll try to make them laugh.
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And so all of those soft skills that you might be someone listening, thinking, I do
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that, that would make me a good podcaster?
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Those are the little things that can help you be just a little bit different
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than anybody else who might have a show.
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And that's another thing that's kind of the problem is, there's
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this new era of, everybody's doing that now, there's no room for me.
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Or those people only blew up on Instagram or podcasting because
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they've been doing it for 10 years.
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Well, I was a hairdresser.
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How many hairdressers are there in the world?
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And nobody, when I went to beauty school said, you shouldn't go to beauty school.
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There's already enough hairdressers in the world.
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Nobody was talking like that back then.
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Nobody says you shouldn't go be a doctor.
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There's too many doctors in the world.
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And so it's interesting how in the online space.
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We feel like everything's oversaturated because we're inundated with so much
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shit, but at the end of the day, like I said earlier, you can be for
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somebody or you cannot be for somebody.
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And so when you choose a platform like podcasting, you really can go
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all in on who you are and develop a brand as you create conversation.
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And so, I started off actually with a podcast called the
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beauty inspires beauty podcast.
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Where during COVID and my salon was closed, I started interviewing
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my friends in the beauty industry, asking them how they were doing.
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Are you okay?
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What's happening in your world?
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How are you coping with all of this?
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And then the conversation kind of ended there and we moved into, and
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by the way, you're super successful.
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How did that happen?
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How did you get into the industry?
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What are you doing now to diversify your income?
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What would you have done differently when you started?
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And that's where I was like, wait a second.
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I'm really good at this.
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I actually really like this.
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And now I want to talk to more than just hairdressers.
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Oh, shoot.
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Have I pigeonholed myself into the podcast being called beauty inspires beauty.
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Now I could have taken it one way and stayed talking only to beauty
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professionals, which are entrepreneurs.
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Or what I wanted to do was expand my reach, still include the beauty
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industry, but talk to more early stage entrepreneurs about how they could
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develop a personal brand, whether it be through podcasting or just starting to put
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themselves out there in a different way.
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Because in my background, 25 years ago, we didn't have social media.
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We barely knew how to use the internet for promotion.
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I did guerrilla marketing.
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I used to get all dolled up, go to Nordstrom's, pass out my cards.
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That's how I built my business was from referrals and guerrilla
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marketing, not from social media.
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And so when people are coming into the space now, they're
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like, how do I do all of this?
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There's a lot of overwhelming stuff when it comes to podcasting, but it's
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actually more simple than you think.
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And I have a resource.
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I know Nicole can help people with podcasting too, but there's a lot
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of great resources that can help you get out of overwhelm and into action.
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But, all that to say, yeah, podcasting has changed the trajectory of how I'm able to
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show up and how I'm able to reach people.
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Because with a brick and mortar space, with a one to one in a location, I
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couldn't speak to a lot of people.
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I could impact the small group of people that I got to see in the
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daily and those around me, but I didn't have a big enough reach.
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And I knew that where I was at in my life and business, I wanted to
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create more impact in a bigger way.
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And the podcast is giving me that opportunity.
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Yeah.
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And I think one of the things that people really discount is, of course there's
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that question, will I have enough content?
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Will I have something to say for weeks and weeks and weeks on end?
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Because I have people who come to me for human design and
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they're like, I'm a reflector.
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Can I have a podcast?
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Am I going to have the energy for it all the time?
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And I'm like, it's all in the way that you structure it.
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I had a manifestor who is interested in starting a podcast, but she's like, I
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hate everything that I do eventually.
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And I'm like, well, you're a manifestor.
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That's just normal for you.
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You're going to say, this makes me sick.
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I don't want to do this anymore.
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But I was like, what about the concept of seasons?
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Recognize where you're putting up a blocker.
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Do you want it or not?
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Cause if you don't want it, that's a different story, but if you want it and
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you're afraid, it's really the fear that I think puts up the blockers where your
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brain starts to say, that sounds scary.
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That sounds confronting.
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I'm afraid of the judgment.
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I'm afraid of the, who does she think she is kind of thing,
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and all of the excuses come up.
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What if we run out of content?
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What if it doesn't grow?
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What if it just takes up a lot of our time?
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What if I hate it after six months?
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What if I hate it after six weeks?
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Most podcasts don't make it past 20 episodes, which is a staggering statistic.
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So here's the thing that a lot of people don't understand, I don't think,
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is that if you hang out in the game, And you have a good quality podcast.
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I'm not talking like crazy production or anything like that.
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If you do that and you hang for a while, you will already be
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toward the front of the pack.
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You just end up there because everybody else falls off the race.
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So if you're just willing to put in the work, which that was another thing
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that I wanted to talk to you about that I think could benefit everybody
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here, particularly the people who are at that early middle stage of their
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business, the value of the long game.
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If you're looking for a podcast, or your offer, or your launches, or whatever
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to pay off in four to six weeks, you're probably going to be disappointed.
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And I know you haven't had this, like you've had a lot of different
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businesses, you've tried a lot of different things, but what is
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your perspective on the long game?
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Because I think it's also interesting from a projector's standpoint where I
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think there's a common misconception that projectors don't have energy.
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I should say that Jess has three motor centers defined, so you
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are a highly energetic projector.
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But from this projector's perspective where you don't have sustainable
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energy is really the thing.
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You need to take those breaks.
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What is your perspective on playing the long game and allowing things to build?
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Because you've done that, I think, with relationships.
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You've seen things and said, that's an opportunity.
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And then it doesn't seem like you've expected instant results,
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and you've stayed with them.
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Do I have that right as far as your experience with that?
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Oh yeah.
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And nobody told me, just like maybe no one's told you until this very
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moment that nothing happens overnight.
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And I think, fortunately and unfortunately my hair business
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did kind of happen overnight.
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And so I did have a warped sense of things being able to be easier than
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they were, but if I look back over my career, it was a long game, yes, but
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it was a long game of being consistent and being available and doing the work.
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And I didn't get into the beauty industry to think, if this doesn't
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work out in a couple of weeks, I'm not going to do it anymore.
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If this fails, then I'm not going to keep doing this.
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I never thought that once, but for some reason, now we have this perceived notion
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that things shouldn't take very long.
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And if I don't have sold out launches, or if I don't have a lot of people
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downloading my podcast, what's the point?
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And again, I coach people that have podcasts through that sticky situation,
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because even if you can get past 20 episodes, you're going to be comparing
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yourself to other people's downloads and how many DMs they get, or how many
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re shares they're getting on their podcast, or how many reviews someone
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else has that you don't have yet.
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And I say to people, did you get into podcasting for the short game?
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You have to be in it for the long game.
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You will not go viral with a podcast.
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If you want things to be quick and overnight, you better get good at
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making TikTok reels and good at really solid hooks with calls to action.
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And there are platforms where things can happen overnight, but will you be
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ready for it is always my question.
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What are you setting yourself up for?
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And so I think it takes some time to figure out where you fit in,
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in the podcast space, but also in maybe your entrepreneurial journey.
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Because if at the end of the day, you're just trying to make some money,
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we can make money doing anything.
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We can make money doing anything.
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And right now there's a whole lot less work involved in going to just get a job.
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A lot of these companies pay decently 20, 30 bucks an hour.
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You've got benefits, you've got all sorts of support and structure and
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you're told where to be and how to do it.
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And there's nothing you got to figure out.
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You just got to check that box and you get that paycheck.
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And I want to just remind people of that because it is a gift
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to choose entrepreneurship.
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No, one's making you do this.
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And so I see a lot of people that sit in that, Oh, this is so hard.
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I said, well, choose a different hard then.
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It might be hard to tell everybody you work at Chick fil A at 35 years old.
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I don't know, is that too hard for you?
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What would be harder?
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What would make you feel aligned in your life and your business,
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putting everything you have into it or just toe dipping into something?
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I can tell when someone's fully invested in something and when they're not.
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They get results or they don't.
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They're happy with the little bit of results or they're not.
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People that always find something wrong, or things don't happen fast enough are
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the ones that are actually not probably putting enough effort into something.
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Because if you put your whole heart into something, if you worked as hard as you
19:36
possibly know, you could, if you did all the things that a coach told you to
19:39
do, or a framework of something, and it doesn't work, that type of person is going
19:44
to be like, I did everything possible.
19:45
Let me tweak this, take whatever little data I got from this
19:48
experience and make it better.
19:50
And they keep going because they have a vision and a why for what they're doing.
19:54
And I think with a podcast, having a vision and a why
19:56
for me was really important.
19:58
And I actually recorded over 25 episodes in person with video before
20:03
I even launched my show, because I wanted to prove to myself that I
20:05
could do this podcast before I put it out into the world, because I'm
20:08
not somebody who likes to say, I'm going to do something and not do it.
20:11
I do care what people think, and my reputation is my brand.
20:15
And I think a lot of people forget that.
20:17
And it's not to say that you can't say you're going to
20:18
do something and not do it.
20:20
We can all change our mind and that's fine.
20:22
And I learned that the hard way when I chose to step away from the beauty
20:25
industry, because I had over a book of 200 clients and I owned a salon.
20:30
So I had employees and people that worked for me and looked
20:32
up to me and that I mentored.
20:33
And do you think that all 220 of those people were happy about my decision
20:38
to step into a different field?
20:39
Absolutely not.
20:41
So talk about not even getting the support that you wanted.
20:44
It came in the form of, oh, that's so exciting, but who's going to do my hair?
20:47
What about me?
20:49
So when I started asking myself, what about me?
20:52
What do you want?
20:53
That's when things started to become a little bit easier.
20:55
And that's when I got to dig my feet in and be like, yeah, what about you?
20:58
When are you going to put your wants, needs, desires first and create
21:03
something that feels aligned for you?
21:05
I didn't know how podcasting was going to feel.
21:07
I didn't know how it was going to affect my life.
21:09
I had hopes that it would create opportunity, but that was the only
21:13
thing I really had an expectation on is I'm going to try this podcast
21:17
and see if I can't create some sort of opportunities out of it.
21:20
And It's opened up so many doors because I've put myself in rooms to learn
21:25
from a variety of different people who do different things in business.
21:27
While the first 20 years, I stayed around all hairdressers only learning
21:31
from one particular industry.
21:33
So I didn't get to learn all of those things.
21:35
And again, back to your question of, what are my thoughts on the long game?
21:39
In this day and age, if you are not committed to something fully, with the
21:42
intention of playing the long game, choose an easier route, choose something
21:47
that doesn't require as much commitment.
21:49
Because the results will speak from the fact that you're just not as
21:51
committed as you might think you are.
21:53
And you said earlier about fear being a factor of why people don't start.
21:56
I do think it's fear of what people think, but I also think it's a fear of overwhelm,
22:03
of how much work it's going to take.
22:06
Because it is a lot of work.
22:07
Podcasting is a lot of mental energy.
22:09
It's a lot of forethought into creating valuable content that's going
22:13
to land with your potential client.
22:14
If that's what you're using your podcast for, like a
22:16
marketing piece of your business.
22:18
But that's the fun part is you get to discover those things along the
22:21
way by putting yourself out there.
22:23
So for the longest time, I still did hair while I funded my side hustle
22:26
business, which was the podcast.
22:28
Well, then when the podcast started creating an awareness that I even
22:31
existed, creative visibility for me.
22:33
I was able to then tease out offers of what would you guys want from me?
22:37
A retreat?
22:37
Would you like one to one coaching?
22:39
So I launched my first group coaching program for hairdressers.
22:43
It was the six figure stylist course.
22:45
And because I chose a path, I chose a launch.
22:48
I was able to bring a couple people into my world.
22:51
Three to be exact.
22:52
And then I had three or four other people come around the back door because
22:56
they saw I had put myself out there.
22:57
And say things to me like, I already make six figures, Jess, would you
23:02
be able to coach me on X, Y, or Z?
23:04
And that's when I started to really realize the mindset around my industry
23:08
of what does six figures mean?
23:10
And I was like, what does six figures mean to you?
23:12
Is it literally 100, 000?
23:14
Or do you make 999, 000?
23:18
And I started to see people shift and think differently, cause in
23:20
their head, six figures meant I hit 100, 000 in my business.
23:24
And so it was fun to dig into that mindset around the glass
23:27
ceiling for us in this industry.
23:28
You could make more, you could do more, you could have more.
23:31
What do you want?
23:32
Who are you?
23:32
And it just led me into this curiosity, because for the longest
23:35
time I was in that box, I thought I had hit the glass ceiling.
23:38
I've proven to everybody that I could be a successful hairdresser.
23:41
Because let me tell you, when I was 19 years old, deciding to go
23:43
to beauty school, everybody was like, that's not a real career.
23:45
You need to get a real job.
23:47
But 20 years later, I quote unquote, prove them all wrong, but realize as I sat
23:51
making just shy of 200, 000, is this it?
23:54
Is this as good as it can be?
23:55
Am I just going to sit here and for the next 20 years be okay with A, only
23:59
making this amount of money, B, never having tried to do anything else and
24:03
put myself out there in a different way, and C, the amount that I was
24:06
working, I was so much away from my son.
24:09
I wanted to explore creating opportunities for myself that would
24:12
allow for me to have flexibility that was different than a brick and mortar.
24:16
And so to say that I was super invested in playing the long game was full, because
24:19
my why was to be home and available during the times of day that my son needed me.
24:24
And I really couldn't do that even with my owning a salon.
24:27
So there's a lot of levels to that, but I think ultimately the question
24:31
is, what legacy do you want to try to create while you're still here
24:35
so that you can actually enjoy it?
24:36
I had a conversation yesterday with a woman who's in her fifties.
24:38
She's got a multimillion dollar business.
24:40
They make spray tanning products, and all the devices that go
24:43
with it, and the machinery.
24:44
And she doesn't need a podcast, but she loves getting into rooms.
24:48
She loves networking.
24:49
She loves building community.
24:51
And she wants to expand the business even more.
24:53
And she's recently moved from LA to Phoenix.
24:55
And that's how I met her at one of the Laurie Harder's
24:57
girlfriends and business events.
24:59
And we connected the other day cause she saw me post something about podcasting.
25:02
And so she said, hey, I'm talking to a few other producers about starting my show.
25:06
I would love to pick your brain.
25:07
I said, sure, no problem.
25:08
So we get on a call yesterday.
25:09
We talked for about an hour and there was all those things we just talked
25:12
about, that fear of I'm not really sure exactly what I want to talk about.
25:15
I do think it's focused on the beauty industry, And then I started asking
25:18
her questions and she's like, I know so much about this industry and
25:21
I've built this and I've done that.
25:22
And so, long story long, I said, here's your homework.
25:25
I want you to make a list of all of the things that you've accomplished
25:27
in your life, big or small, all the hardships you've pushed through, all
25:30
the things that you've managed to figure out that haven't taken you
25:32
down or taken your business under.
25:34
And then I want you to create a list of all of the fun guests
25:37
you'd want to have on your show.
25:39
Who would you want to bring in from the industry that could provide value?
25:42
And at the end of it, we discovered she did really want
25:44
to talk about the industry.
25:45
She wanted to be connected to more beauty professionals.
25:48
The irony is, what is my background?
25:50
20 years in the beauty industry.
25:52
So then the conversation led to her needing a VP of marketing,
25:55
her needing help for this.
25:57
She kept going, well, you'd be really good at this.
25:59
You could help me with this.
26:00
You could do this with me and my business.
26:02
And fun fact too, is I'm a two on the Enneagram, which is a supportive helper.
26:06
So I love this role of helping people figure things out while also being.
26:10
Of use.
26:11
So it was just an interesting conversation that whatever comes from it, I don't know,
26:15
but we were able to give her some clarity that yes, a podcast would be really fun
26:18
for her because like I said earlier, we either have done something that we
26:22
can then share with the world to sell our products or services or knowledge.
26:25
You've either created something by doing it, or like me, you want to
26:30
do something while you're creating, which is the podcast and it's
26:33
become what I'm now known for.
26:34
So it was just a cool conversation to get to have with her.
26:37
And then I woke up to a text this morning saying, thank you so much for sharing
26:40
your time with me and giving some insight and shifting my perspective on this.
26:43
I definitely do want to start a podcast.
26:45
And I definitely know I need some support and help.
26:47
Let's talk some more.
26:48
So it was cool.
26:49
And if I hadn't been chatting about it on Instagram, if I hadn't been sharing
26:52
it, if I hadn't put myself in that room, I would have never met this woman.
26:56
So it's crazy the long game that can come from building the relationships,
27:00
from continuously talking about something that lights you up and from just inviting
27:03
people in to have a conversation with you.
27:06
I want to call one thing out there, by the way, those were invitations, you're
27:10
a projector, she was inviting you.
27:11
She was recognizing you.
27:12
That's what happens with projectors.
27:14
You don't have to be selling yourself to be recognized.
27:17
You don't have to be like, hey, I do this.
27:19
And then someone recognizes you and invites you.
27:22
Usually it's you being who you are and people are like, I
27:26
think you can help me with this.
27:28
I think you're really good at that.
27:29
That's just how it works.
27:30
So for all the projectors listening, that's what it looks like.
27:33
It doesn't always look like someone calling you and being like, I
27:36
want to invite you to this thing.
27:38
It's you being recognized for being special in your way and your
27:43
unique perspective, wisdom that you have to offer, your experience.
27:48
Now, you get to decide whether those invitations are right for you.
27:51
And especially as a 4/1, you're going to say, that's
27:54
not my path or that is my path.
27:55
That's how the game works.
27:57
So I just wanted to call that out since that was there staring me in the face
28:01
and I can't ignore those type of things, but with all of that said about the long
28:06
game for podcasting, I want to call out that the long game doesn't have to be
28:11
this horrible uphill sludge of doing tech work and slaving over things.
28:18
It seems like you have picked your pieces that you want to grow, that
28:22
you want to play the long game with.
28:24
And this is something that I want listeners to take away.
28:27
They think they need to do everything.
28:29
And people are doing a lot of things not very well.
28:32
They're playing a short game with a lot of things, except like Instagram.
28:36
So they'll show up on Instagram and they'll do their thing.
28:39
They're not doing all the other pieces around it that are helping to drive people
28:44
to it and building real relationship.
28:46
And I wanted to call out that you have played the long game
28:49
with key pieces of your business.
28:52
I think, similarly to me in that way, where there are things that
28:56
we said, these are my avenues.
28:58
This is how I want to grow my business.
28:59
And for you, you've been diligent and dedicated to relationship building and
29:05
building real strong connections with people, getting into the right rooms,
29:10
making connections with strategic partners and friends, and really building community
29:16
within this entrepreneurial space.
29:20
That's the top of the funnel.
29:21
I want to call this out to people because they miss this stuff.
29:24
They're like, okay, I'm going to build my podcast.
29:26
And it's like, okay, now that you've built it and you get that running
29:29
and this is becoming muscle memory and it's something that you do.
29:33
Now, how are we going to drive people to it?
29:36
What's your drug of choice as far as your top of funnel?
29:39
Do you want to buy ads?
29:41
Do you want to get into rooms?
29:43
You can choose several, but you have to do them.
29:48
People think that people are just going to magically find everything that we do.
29:51
And there are ways that you can tune it so you can use SEO and things where
29:54
people can find you, but you do have to be doing something on the other end.
29:58
And I think you've done that incredibly well with that long game.
30:01
Cause I know you network with very high level people, but I know
30:04
you also network at all levels.
30:07
Have you seen the people who get into the room and we do the ask and give,
30:12
you have an ask and then a give.
30:14
And the ask is like referrals, clients, that's what they're asking for.
30:19
I need clients.
30:20
And they think that like people who just met them, who have no idea what they
30:25
do are going to just start referring.
30:28
And that's not building relationships.
30:32
Have you had that experience in your networking past?
30:36
I suppose I've been witness to it.
30:39
What's interesting about that question is, I definitely have an
30:42
air of like, don't mess with me.
30:44
I don't know where it comes from.
30:46
I've always had it.
30:47
I used to get the whole, I thought you were a bitch until I got to know you vibe.
30:50
I just feel compelled to share that because energy matches energy.
30:54
I wouldn't dare ask somebody that, it doesn't happen to me that often.
30:57
I think if a room has been set up properly, the asks
31:01
come in a different way.
31:03
And so specifically that question, no, but generally when people
31:07
are talking about what they need, it is, they need more clients.
31:09
They need more visibility.
31:10
And so to that, I'll say you need to get yourself on more podcasts.
31:14
You need to be promoting yourself just as much as you need to be asking for things.
31:18
As far as projectors, if we have any of those listening, it is about getting an
31:21
invitation, but you can't be invited to things unless people know that you exist.
31:25
And so, when I first put my first course out, nobody knew I existed.
31:28
They knew I was a hairdresser, but there was nobody to know me.
31:31
I didn't have a social media following.
31:32
I didn't have any sort of platform whatsoever.
31:35
And after I sat and thought, I'm like, how can you create
31:37
visibility while also adding value?
31:39
How can you ask for something if you haven't given anything yet?
31:41
And so that's where the skin in the game came for me was the time
31:44
investment, the money investment using what network I did have to parlay
31:47
that into another growth in network.
31:49
Like, hey, thanks for coming on the show.
31:50
Who else do you know that would make a good guest on the show?
31:52
And just really doubling down on all of that and always asking
31:55
people, how can I serve or help you?
31:57
And generally, the clients will come from that.
31:59
And again, I came from a referral based business.
32:01
So I learned early on to ask for the business from people
32:05
that I was already working with, or who already invested in me.
32:08
And so if you want people to invest in you, if you want people to refer you
32:11
business, what are you doing for them?
32:13
So my question to you is, do you follow them?
32:15
Do you re share their stuff?
32:17
Are you doing things without being asked with no real intention behind
32:20
it, other than to support people?
32:22
If you are that type of human, I promise you that long game plan
32:26
will pay you back huge in dividends.
32:28
People will think of you because you are always constantly commenting on
32:31
their stories, or posting stuff about them without asking them for anything.
32:34
This doesn't mean you have to go buy their courses or programs or spend
32:37
10, 000 to be in their mastermind.
32:38
Whilst that does help to get you noticed.
32:42
You want to be sharing people's stuff without being asked
32:46
long before you have an ask.
32:48
So that's building the runway with relationship capital.
32:51
And I think it was something I didn't know I already did, but working with
32:54
people like Jeff Fenster, Lori Harder, Chris Harder, I learned that you
32:58
have to put some skin in the game.
33:00
And a lot of those things don't take any money.
33:02
They just take forethought and time.
33:05
And that's why I stay around a lot of my mentors because I see them
33:07
commenting on other people's stuff.
33:09
I see that's how they get into their worlds.
33:11
And luckily, I've had some really great mentors that have shared
33:14
how long it actually has taken them to accomplish X, Y, or Z.
33:18
And so for me, that gives me hope that it's not taking me any
33:21
longer than it's supposed to.
33:23
That my journey is not going to look like anybody else's.
33:25
And anytime I try to quit on anything, I know who to go to talk to, who's
33:29
going to encourage me to not, looking for the proof to keep me in the game.
33:32
But, as far as running a room and asking for something, my favorite
33:36
recent quote that I've heard is, try to be as interested as
33:39
possible versus being interesting.
33:42
Yeah.
33:43
Being curious about people is the key.
33:45
To really be able to look and see the people who are in front of you and
33:49
get curious about, what do you do?
33:52
And I feel like you're built this way.
33:54
I mean, you're a four line.
33:55
So typically four lines just know how to interact with people.
34:00
And you have the channel of community.
34:01
I mean, you were a hairdresser, you were a stylist.
34:03
So people have probably fueled your life for a long time.
34:08
I have zero four lines in my design.
34:11
None of them.
34:12
I did not naturally know how to make lasting connections with people, because
34:18
the five has a weird relationship with connection and how people see us, which
34:25
I didn't know until later in life.
34:27
It helped me not take it so personally.
34:28
Yeah, we've talked about this.
34:29
That was interesting when you share that with me.
34:32
But one thing that really helped me was, I would always feel like
34:35
I hadn't done enough for people, which that's a five thing, guilt.
34:38
Five line guilt.
34:39
I haven't done enough.
34:40
I haven't fixed enough for you.
34:42
But then just opening it up to people to say, how can I support you as well?
34:45
What can I do to support you?
34:47
I see you're doing this.
34:47
What can I do to support you?
34:49
And that's just a question that I've put in my mind.
34:52
It's not the natural thing.
34:53
I'm very head down working a lot.
34:55
But when I connect with people, it's like, let me make intentional connections.
35:00
And the podcast has helped so much with this too, because it's given
35:04
me this avenue to focus on people.
35:07
Like, let me showcase you.
35:09
Yeah.
35:10
And let me get super curious about you, and let me ask you great questions
35:14
and expose you to my audience.
35:15
And I think that's an underrated piece that a lot of people don't think of
35:19
when they're thinking about going into podcasting is it establishes you as
35:24
an authority, but it's also a really beautiful gift that you can give the
35:29
people that you want to showcase.
35:32
In the beginning, it can sometimes feel like I'm not in
35:35
a place to lift somebody up.
35:37
I'm not big enough.
35:38
And I definitely fell into that trap.
35:40
I don't have a big enough show to ask them to be on it.
35:44
And then I had to get over that quick.
35:46
So it trains you to get over your stuff quickly if you really
35:50
are committed to the show.
35:51
Yeah.
35:52
But I got over that quick and then I realized, what a gift it is.
35:56
Like, I had people that were way more established than me that were very
36:01
excited when I invited them on my show.
36:03
Or they asked to be on my show.
36:06
And I was shocked.
36:07
And it made me feel really good about myself.
36:10
Yeah.
36:10
And it made me feel like I was more established than maybe I
36:13
was giving myself credit for.
36:15
And then people would say I was a great interviewer and I asked
36:17
great questions and it was like, oh, maybe I am good at this.
36:21
The confidence that I got through this journey.
36:25
Cause when you're building a podcast, if you're building a good one, I
36:28
think you're building a message.
36:30
And you may not know exactly what that message is on day one, the full thing.
36:34
You should have an idea so that it's actually producing something
36:38
for you, but the act of showing up does so many things for you.
36:44
If you're showing up and you are putting out a podcast episode every
36:48
week, I've been doing this for three and a half years now, and we do
36:52
two episodes a week at this point.
36:54
We've been doing that for eight months, I think we've been at the two episodes.
36:59
It's a lot.
37:00
I'm not going to lie to you.
37:01
There's a lot of work that goes into the show.
37:03
A lot of thought, a lot of energy, but also at the end of the day,
37:06
I'm very proud of this show.
37:09
And I CTA this with some serious confidence when I'm
37:13
like, listen to my show.
37:15
And it is the greatest lead magnet.
37:17
Little soldiers out there working for me every day.
37:19
Cause people are listening to episode 100 after they listen to episode 280.
37:26
They're finding all of these old things.
37:28
I don't have to create new content every day.
37:31
When I feel like I need to have some downtime, I can take it off
37:35
knowing that the podcast is going.
37:38
I'm not completely absent.
37:39
And I've built a loyal following on the podcast where my people come back
37:44
and new people find me every week.
37:47
I'm curious if you've ever had this thought, but I always say that
37:51
when you're doing things in the physical world, it helps you believe
37:55
that your dreams are possible.
37:57
So if I have a vision for I make money in my sleep, which is something that
38:01
we see quotes on Instagram about, we have that vision, we have that thing,
38:06
but if you don't actually have a way for people to pay you while you're
38:09
sleeping, then there's a part of you in your brain that's saying bullshit.
38:13
You can't do that.
38:15
I know that when I go to sleep, people are listening to my show because I
38:19
see downloads change from the night before to when I wake up the next day.
38:23
While I'm in the shower in the morning, people are listening to my message.
38:27
They are deciding whether I am the person for them or not.
38:32
And I'm sure you have people like this who've listened to your show for a while
38:35
and you don't even know they exist, and then they come into your world and they
38:39
say, I know I have to work with you.
38:41
Or, I know you're my person.
38:43
And that comes from you being dedicated enough to show up and give them
38:48
something to binge, and to listen to and go deep enough with you.
38:52
Cause they're not gonna know that from a 15 second reel with a great hook.
38:58
Unless you're selling a course on how to do Instagram reels and grow
39:01
to 200, 000 followers in a minute, unless you have that course and that's
39:07
your business, that's not going to drive people to send you thousands of
39:12
dollars, but a podcast will, because they can actually go deep with you.
39:17
Cause you're going deep.
39:18
Yeah.
39:19
I think one of the girls in my mastermind specifically said, I've
39:22
been listening to your show for over eight months, and that's what
39:25
got her to join the mastermind.
39:26
When I started talking about that, inviting people to check that out.
39:29
And yeah, it was the consistency of her listening to me in her ear
39:33
for eight months before she reached out and wanted to work with me.
39:37
And she's actually the only one in my mastermind right now,
39:40
currently there's seven women, that is in the beauty industry.
39:42
So it's crazy because I know for a fact, had I not had so much
39:47
skin in the game with my podcast, I don't think any of these women
39:50
would have joined my mastermind.
39:52
Four of them have started podcasts.
39:54
Two of them worked with me individually before joining the mastermind.
39:57
And then two of them went through my podcast course and started their podcasts.
40:02
And then the first one who was a one on one client, we held her off for a while
40:06
cause she wasn't clear on her message yet.
40:07
And we worked through that before she started the show.
40:09
Cause she wanted to be very, very intentional.
40:11
Her topics are a little bit more sensitive and specific.
40:14
And so with the right guidance, these four women have moved from corporate
40:19
environments into the entrepreneurship space, but because they also wanted
40:23
to have a podcast, that was the secret sauce of the extra layer that got them
40:27
to work with me versus maybe another entrepreneurship coach or someone who
40:30
could help them with their career.
40:32
So I know it to be true.
40:33
And the other two, I think the credibility came from the podcast as well, because
40:37
not only does the podcast speak for itself, like you say, with the downloads,
40:40
but is it gives me more than enough content to speak about throughout the
40:43
week to share the two episodes that I'm also doing throughout the week.
40:46
So on any given day, I don't have to think about what I want to share on the show.
40:50
I at least have those two juicy episodes that I can
40:53
promote, re promote, talk about.
40:55
So I listen to all my episodes now.
40:56
I thoroughly enjoy listening to them.
40:58
I get a lot out of them, especially if there's a guest interview,
41:00
because there's always something I missed, or maybe I batch recorded
41:03
it and it was a few weeks prior.
41:04
So I always listened to the show and then reshare the topics
41:08
on the show on social media.
41:10
I do little clips out of it over on Tik Tok and we've started to
41:13
push stuff on Pinterest right now.
41:15
Just driving traffic back over to the podcast, which has seemed to be working,
41:19
but nothing moves traffic like you showing your face on social media and talking
41:23
about stuff, or getting into the rooms and telling people about the podcast
41:26
and getting them to connect with you.
41:28
But I'll tell you, it's really easy to get excited about sharing
41:30
your episodes when you're creating stuff that you're proud of.
41:33
So I'm excited to show up sometimes with no makeup on in the morning to talk about
41:37
the latest Friday episode, or to talk about the Tuesday episode with a guest.
41:40
So it has become a lot more fun.
41:42
And I think that part is something you need to experience by starting it.
41:46
Because at first it doesn't seem like fun.
41:47
It seems maybe overwhelming and like a lot of work.
41:50
And oh my gosh, I'd never used tech stuff before.
41:52
I have no idea how to do all of this.
41:54
But trust me, there are people to help you.
41:56
There are strategy coaches can help map out content ideas.
41:59
And then there are plenty of people who are producing shows now at a
42:01
very affordable price that you could probably figure out how to pay them.
42:05
And or you could figure it out yourself.
42:07
With YouTube university and Google, there are plenty of tutorials that
42:11
you could watch and figure it out.
42:12
You don't have to have a full blown production.
42:14
You don't have to have it up on a YouTube channel yet.
42:16
You don't even have to show your face if you don't want.
42:18
Most people listen to podcasts through audio, but if you can, go out of your
42:22
way to hit the zoom record button, and or put your face on the camera.
42:25
It's even more content you can pull from, from social media.
42:28
And then little short clips that you can put on YouTube.
42:30
If you don't want to put the full episodes up there.
42:33
A thousand percent.
42:34
And I think one thing I want to add to that whole thought is that there
42:37
are so many strategies out there.
42:38
You should be on Pinterest.
42:39
You should be on YouTube.
42:40
You should be on this.
42:40
You should be on that.
42:42
But what do you put on there?
42:44
The podcast becomes this easy thing that as long as it's tied to your core message,
42:50
which is tied to your offers, which is tied to what you do, then the worst thing
42:54
that's going to happen is it's not going to drive as much traffic as you want.
42:58
But if it gets one person who believes deeply in what you do,
43:02
that can be a paying person.
43:04
One anecdote is that my latest launch that we did in April.
43:11
I think everybody that joined our program, we had 10 people join.
43:16
Every single one of them, I believe, was a podcast listener.
43:19
And we had some people that joined in there that have only been in our world
43:24
for like two months, but they binged hard.
43:28
And I have an $8,000 program.
43:30
They didn't buy a $22 guide from me.
43:33
They jumped in and said, I want to spend a year with you.
43:36
And it's because of a strong connection that was built on this show.
43:41
So you're such an example of that.
43:44
And I know that is what you do.
43:46
So tell everybody, where can they learn more about what you do?
43:50
How can they stay in touch with you?
43:51
How can they find out about the podcast services that you offer?
43:54
Tell them where they can get all the things.
43:56
Yes.
43:56
Well, as you heard, I'm on Instagram predominantly every day.
43:58
@JessicaBurgio is my Instagram handle and Unscripted is the name of the podcast.
44:02
You have to type my name in with it because there are many
44:04
other people that have that too.
44:05
show title, which is another reason to not hold yourself back, whether
44:08
it's with the title or with anything, something's already been done.
44:11
So don't even worry about it.
44:12
You can fit into the game, but yeah, Instagram and the podcast.
44:15
And then we do have retreats that we run, which are called unscripted
44:18
live retreats where they're fully holistic style mastermind retreats
44:22
where we come together, we drop into our feminine energy in the morning.
44:25
Then we also do some masculine strategy business stuff in the evenings.
44:29
They're pretty transformational, I think.
44:31
I am an in person person.
44:33
So if you were someone who's hiding behind the idea that you're not an
44:36
in person person, I will convert you.
44:38
I think I'm all about the inclusion.
44:40
I love bringing people to the table.
44:41
And I was once told, if I didn't feel like I was getting the right invitations
44:45
that I had to build my own table.
44:46
So perhaps you're someone who has to build your own table too,
44:49
but if you want to learn how to build the table, it's over here.
44:51
And yeah, I do love doing one on one strategy coaching for podcasters.
44:55
It's become a big passion of mine and it's the thing I get asked most about.
44:58
So I wanted to create some resources there.
45:01
I do have a resource that you guys can grab if you're interested.
45:04
Oh, maybe I should start a podcast.
45:05
I don't want to ask the girls any more questions.
45:07
I just got to figure this out.
45:08
Well, it's called three reasons to start.
45:10
And one reason not to, and I think you got the underlying theme.
45:13
I'll give it away.
45:14
The one reason you shouldn't is if you can't commit to being
45:16
consistent, which anybody can build their consistency muscle.
45:19
I promise you.
45:20
Nicole and I are very busy.
45:21
We're both moms.
45:22
We're both second careers in our lives.
45:24
We're not 20 with no responsibility.
45:26
And we've figured out how to have a podcast and make shit happen.
45:29
So if you are trying to build a business, and create credibility, and position
45:32
yourself as an expert in any form, a podcast can be a really fun way to do it.
45:36
And you've got two great resources here, me and her.
45:39
We'd love to help you if there's anything we can do, but yeah,
45:41
come say hi on Instagram.
45:42
Yes.
45:43
She's @JessicaBurgio on Instagram.
45:45
We'll link all of it up in the show notes.
45:47
So we've got you covered there.
45:48
Don't worry.
45:49
You can find all of the things that Jess just called out there.
45:52
And I highly recommend her in all ways.
45:55
She's just an amazing human.
45:56
At the very least go connect with her and then jump in and grab those guides and
46:00
the other things that she mentioned there.
46:02
Jess, thanks for being here.
46:03
I'm so excited we finally got to do this.
46:05
I know me too.
46:06
It's wonderful.
46:07
I appreciate you, listener, for making it all the way to the
46:09
end of this episode with us.
46:11
We appreciate you.
46:12
Thank you for being here with us.
46:13
Thank you for sharing the show.
46:15
Please share it on Instagram.
46:16
Tag us if you got value from this episode, if you loved what we shared.
46:20
If you're thinking about starting your own podcast, tell us all
46:22
about it because we are champions and cheerleaders in that way.
46:26
Everybody, I think, should have a podcast.
46:28
Because that's where your message can be worked out.
46:30
So thank you so much for making it to the end with us.
46:33
We appreciate you.
46:34
And remember in order to have an unshakeable business, you must
46:37
first become an unshakeable human.
46:39
So thanks for letting us help you become unshakeable with human design, everybody.
46:42
We'll see you next time.
46:44
If you love this episode and you're a fan of the show, please show
46:47
us the love on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever you're listening to
46:49
the show and leave us a review.
46:51
And if you'd like to connect with other entrepreneurs on their human
46:53
design journey, join our free Facebook community, Human Design for Entrepreneurs.
46:58
Go to nicolelaino.
46:59
me forward slash podcast links to join the group, book a human
47:03
design reading with me, or access our free human design resources.
47:07
We'll see you there.