Latest / After Maghrib 🌙 / Obsession with SHIA Celebrities (Ft. Maryam Hilli)

Transcript

Obsession with SHIA Celebrities (Ft. Maryam Hilli) · After Maghrib 🌙

• 0:00
  So that way they can welcome back to the after Margaret
• 0:03
  podcast, hope everyone. I'm is doing well, I just want
• 0:05
  to say a massive. Thank you so far.
• 0:07
  For all of the love you've been showing us all of the support
• 0:10
  subscriptions, the feedback, you've been giving us and
• 0:13
  remember that we can only grow this podcast with your support
• 0:16
  runs sister so like subscribe. Follow if you're watching on
• 0:19
  YouTube or listening on any other any other app, this is how
• 0:22
  inshallah we will grow. And today we are talking about
• 0:26
  something, which I find very interesting.
• 0:28
  But before we do that, That allow me to introduce my two
• 0:32
  partners for this discussion. First as always my wonderful,
• 0:43
  the vivacious, the irrepressible my co-host and all you do is I
• 0:47
  wanna come say it but they come as Salam o.
• 0:49
  Muhammad Allah for a second. I thought you said your partner
• 0:51
  in crime, I wasn't sure what you wanted to.
• 0:54
  This is an amazing to be beside you again on the likewise.
• 0:57
  Another amazing podcast in shop happened a lot hamdulillah.
• 0:59
  And of course Sister Miriam Haley.
• 1:01
  Salaam alaikum. Thank you so much.
• 1:04
  Welcome back to another day. A TV.
• 1:07
  Interesting. Actually, and I thought, by the
• 1:09
  way guys, thank you. Thank you, thank you.
• 1:12
  So, what we're talking about this age, today is an
• 1:14
  interesting topic because I think it's a topic, I wouldn't
• 1:17
  say that's Brewing, but I would say is on people's minds, you
• 1:20
  know, especially with the rise of Islamic media and the rise of
• 1:25
  the mouth people using social media platforms.
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  It's an interesting topic, and I'm not going to mention the
• 1:29
  name yet, and just before I go into the topic itself, I just
• 1:32
  want to ask how's your week been.
• 1:33
  It's not mine. Quickly, actually.
• 1:35
  Now I'm thinking about all the others.
• 1:36
  I've done quite a bit this week, but, yeah.
• 1:38
  Handle a very good though, right?
• 1:39
  Yeah, it's busy. It's been hot.
• 1:41
  The weather has been, what has been up and down spins in a bit?
• 1:44
  Moody is raining one day sunny, but generally, it's been.
• 1:48
  Alright, British weather pretty well.
• 1:50
  It is a nice change. Yeah, hotter than you like
• 1:54
  muscle down, then you like to thank God for the rain and then
• 1:57
  he, like last week we had the first episode, we recorded it
• 2:00
  was 30 what four degrees in London during the day.
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  And I think about time we were recordings about. 98 Degrees.
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  And I was writing, I was good. It's good.
• 2:12
  The topic we're going to talk about.
• 2:13
  Do you wanna leave it wrong? Yeah.
• 2:16
  It's a, it's an interesting one. So as you said, say there's a
• 2:20
  lot of talk generally, but the main thing is and the idea came
• 2:23
  to us, when you open your phone and you scroll on social media,
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  what's the first thing you see, you see faces to people that we
• 2:31
  look up two faces of people. We look up to.
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  In other words, Celebrity. So we're talking about the rise
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  or maybe even if there is an existence of a sheer celebrity
• 2:41
  culture and maybe just exploring that interesting.
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  So I'm guessing you've invited me on this podcast because I'm
• 2:48
  surrounded by people that you're talking about, right?
• 2:50
  Yeah. Yeah.
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  I mean, any of obviously done a lot of work and behind the
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  scenes on the Forefront as well with with famous people within
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  the community. And of course I think we've all
• 3:00
  had some form of interaction or involvement of it or with it.
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  But I just want to kind of put out their first.
• 3:07
  This does it even exist? Is there a sheer celebrity
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  culture? It's a good question over,
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  really? Yeah because when you say she a
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  celebrity culture you sort of think of want to mention their
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  names buses like the Kardashians or something like this is what
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  people think of when it comes to celebrities.
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  I wouldn't really like to relate to when it comes to like she a
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  public Figures. It's a bit.
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  It's a bit of a dangerous game or saying to call them.
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  She are celebrities. I would like to say Role Models.
• 3:38
  I don't know what you guys will see as I would not use them.
• 3:41
  Liberty. I will use roll word Role Models
• 3:43
  at all because for me the word Role Models comes with a lot of
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  responsibility and it would mean that the person who were all
• 3:51
  people we're talking about are held in such high esteem and
• 3:55
  most of the time for me they're not like they might bring value
• 3:59
  to our community in one way or another, but they don't, they're
• 4:02
  not necessarily Role Models. I get what you're saying about
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  the celebrity weather but this is another way of maybe looking
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  at the word celebrity because Anyone who you recognize or
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  anyone who, you know, has got a familiar face?
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  Yeah, no way. They are a bit of a celebrity.
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  No. Not in the than the sense of the
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  word that you probably understood it in a wider.
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  So an extent. Yeah.
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  But to an extent. Yeah, but the what the word
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  celebrity in my opinion, there's a fine line between being a
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  celebrity, not being one and obviously the word celebrity has
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  connotations of Like, Show Business and Hollywood and all
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  that stuff. So you think flashing lights and
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  tuxedos are red carpets and so on, it doesn't always have to be
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  like that. So a lot of the time we think of
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  maybe call it icons perhaps, or Florence's of like whatever you
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  want to use as the word. But the word celebrity, maybe
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  has connotations of famous and big, and maybe powerful or rich,
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  or has a sway in or influence in the community.
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  I think there are celebrities in the community or at least for
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  our community. We have people who we do look up
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  to and some of them are great role models and some of the,
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  maybe not some people. But, you know, this was actually
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  a conversation which was kind of triggered by a Vector file
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  addict because you really sustain us on Facebook and on
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  Twitter, which is really cool and this exploring it from kind
• 5:19
  of like a physicist philosophical perspective and
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  whether it does exist or not can you quote it you know, the your
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  I can get it, I can get it. Yeah, because it was is a long.
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  Yeah, I haven't read it. So I know I've heard of it but I
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  did not get what you think. There's a lot of things to what
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  you said, so I think it's important for people to Define
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  what celebrity is what it means to them because you mentioned
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  money for example that you Crossed my mind.
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  But I don't even think that what we're talking about celebrities,
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  that might be someone who has a lot of money because sometimes,
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  you might know someone who's quite popular but you wouldn't
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  listen, you know, associate them with having a they might go hand
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  in hand. So, for example, obviously the
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  slip-ups although the driving Factor, we'd hope for our
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  community is not money. We're not monetarily driven when
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  we do head mama, that's the concept but by gaining celebrity
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  rank or status. It will naturally come with it.
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  You'd imagine you're invited to speak or to recycle to perform
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  or appear in a certain place so it comes as part of the package,
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  so For the general public whose doesn't have an Insight or
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  access, maybe into that lifestyle, may assume that these
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  people are paid, big bucks. And that's obviously a thing
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  that we can explore a person. I don't, I don't think it
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  matters so I don't think money plays any role in that
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  conversation but I think for the general public, maybe it does
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  that's quite interesting. You say money doesn't play a
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  role, I think it plays a big role when it comes to this
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  conversation. In fact contain a names.
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  However, we do know of many outscored them role Yeah, where
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  they actually say this is my rates and this is how much I
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  want and this is dangerous to get away with mother.
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  So I'll just say, are they right to ask for this?
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  Because they look so of a celebrity.
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  I have no idea. This is dangerous.
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  Are you also mentioned that you know, celebrities like
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  associated with, like, red carpets and tuxedos?
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  We do see this as well. Yeah, we do especially recently,
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  you know, there's been many, many events in the community
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  where, you know, there's Good, The Bad and The Ugly.
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  Everywhere, you know doesn't mean we are against any events
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  that any events or organizations that hold throughout Compass.
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  That's why people call them. I'm not calling them.
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  Don't misquote me by the way. So people do call them Red
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  Carpet Events and I don't think that's giving these public
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  figures, the name of being a celebrity.
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  I think is the people viewing these events are celebrities
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  doesn't make sense. Yeah.
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  But like I don't pick on the point of tuxedos have people not
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  be wearing that for time. I think it's more like
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  symbolically In a symbolic sense, know when it comes to
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  like she events. It's like very rare, very rare.
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  Come on, we do. We've had garlic.
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  Yeah. But I think this is, is more
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  symbolic thing in the sense that you think when you think
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  celebrities in the Western World.
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  So this was actually mentioned, I mentioned the the status by
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  Chef melodic but the the comparison he uses is the
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  Beckham family. So and set in the set in the
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  sense of a family, which is perform an exceedingly, well in
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  a certain thing and then obviously it branches out and
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  does different things and appears.
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  Different parts of the world and so on.
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  And obviously, there are comparable figures within our
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  community and not saying that. There's a guy who's reminds me
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  of David Beckham? No, no.
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  But in the sense that obviously, people have done exceedingly
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  well in the one form and because of their Charisma, or their
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  passion, or whatever, or perhaps, even just their pure
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  talent, they've got to such a stage where they command some
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  form of influence or, or kind of presence Over The Wider
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  community of, they make sense makes sense to an extent its
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  Center. Because I just want to backtrack
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  a little bit. Yeah, you know, the people that
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  we see as wearing tuxedos or XYZ wherever they are, I'm not
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  saying they are celebrities. Why?
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  Why men earlier on by, we see them as celebrities or the
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  viewers watching these events seeing them as celebrities is
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  that we look up to them so much that were solved idolizing them.
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  They're not then we idolize they're not saying I'm a
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  celebrity they're not saying hey look at me I am XYZ is we are
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  giving them the opportunity to feel this.
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  What do you think that they are idolized?
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  That. Yeah, I think, you know, I
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  think, I think that we're quite close.
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  It's quite close to home for us because we work with a lot of
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  these people. So, we might not see it in the
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  same way that, perhaps, someone, who lives quite far away, and
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  there's has seen some of these people that were talking about
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  are like, on TV and stuff, so, yeah, for them, their
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  non-accessible. So there might be this element
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  of, I don't know, like there's some sort of they they see them
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  as celebrities, perhaps, if that's the word that we're going
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  with. But for us because we know them,
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  and we've worked with them, we don't see in the same light.
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  I don't know if you I think that's such an important point.
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  That was my point, was there. Not saying we are celebrities,
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  is that the people look up to them?
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  They're seeing them as a sort of celebrity.
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  This is what I was going to say because when you said that maybe
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  we don't have too many celebrities, the thing is I
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  think we should look at it from the perspective of the one who's
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  the general person. The community young people
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  particularly are very impressionable.
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  What does that mean? It means that when they see an
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  icon, or someone leading in a certain industry within our
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  community that impressionable nurse, We'll make them follow
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  them and and their, the way they do things and in some sense,
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  idolize them, obviously that comes back to many discussions.
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  We have about Shook and and, and the concept of Idols in our
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  community in even in a symbolic sense and we can fall victim to
• 10:27
  that easily. And obviously the rise of social
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  media, I think in this age has meant that we see more of it.
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  So we see high quality production on social media.
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  We see Instagram and Tick-Tock influences and someone's which
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  boosts and amplifies a T status, or an influence, someone has.
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  And the other thing I was gonna say is, I don't just think
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  celebrities are on the March and recite has, I'm going to be
• 10:49
  really blunt. Okay, we're talking about
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  influences. So like someone who's doing a
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  daily Islamic blog or like an infant Islamic, you know,
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  fashion fashion fashionistas, their call them, right?
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  So sisters who are doing things and promoting Islamic fashion to
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  a Muslim audience and my opinion.
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  That's they could get to a stage of sure celebrity nose or even
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  Islamic celebrity nose. If they make sense, make a big
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  science by with and say there they represent shh I mean if
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  they all share their sheer but whether they whether their
• 11:20
  actions portray is a different question.
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  So you trying to say that anyone who has a successful business
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  because we have we know a lot of people within the community who
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  have built successful businesses online.
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  So through social media, they've got massive following Abdullah
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  but that's purely for their business.
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  Are they then considered influencers, in your opinion?
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  If you go out of your way? Yeah, to portray.
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  Self as a celebrity that will come to you.
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  So this is this is this is where it comes out.
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  That's not a follower. Yeah, and I'm just going about
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  my life. What you doing?
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  What you do. Yeah, but this is the thing.
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  So for example, influencing anyone that I'm hoping my life
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  there, right? Said?
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  Yes I am. I going out of my way to
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  influence people or am I just being me and people are
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  following? I mean, I don't know because
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  this is really important because there are a lot of people who
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  are being themselves, but won't have that.
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  But we have the talent that He has a reciter to Warrant being
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  or become. Being a celebrity but there are
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  Loki reciter and they stay close to home for as an example and
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  they don't push to promote their work, which I don't think is
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  anything wrong with that if I'm being entirely honest.
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  But of course, there are people who will push that and whether
• 12:24
  that's a good thing, or bad thing is not for us to judge,
• 12:27
  you know, I mean. But yeah, I think, and I believe
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  in the concept of there being icons and I think forever and
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  not just now. But, for since the beginning of
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  the religion, we have always looked up to people and look
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  Icons, it's human nature. So either lies if that's the
• 12:44
  right word, maybe not. But to look up or to exemplify
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  someone, if that makes sense. It's not a bad thing.
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  Recently. Someone asked me a question.
• 12:52
  Someone was like to me do you have any role models?
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  And I had to think about that and I was like I actually don't
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  I don't have any role models if we're talking about Role Models
• 13:00
  like you know, from a religious perspective.
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  And yeah, I can name religious figures and be like, yeah,
• 13:04
  they're my role models, but from in this day and age, do I have
• 13:07
  any role models? I really don't.
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  So I don't know about that point.
• 13:10
  That you just Made to be honest, I don't know.
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  Do you have a role model? Can you name someone?
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  Um, we we say this is my role model said I'll is warmer.
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  This is how do you define what I think
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  about it? Is there a because for me a role
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  model would have to be someone who's from the same gender as
• 13:39
  me. That's just be honest.
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  Okay? That's almost no.
• 13:42
  I think that right. I don't think that I do because
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  I say the father was a Heritage role model and of and she's a
• 13:48
  lot of attention. No, she was talking.
• 13:50
  I think living now. Okay.
• 13:52
  So I'd have to think the role model has to be someone from the
• 13:54
  same gender as me. Can I think of someone?
• 13:57
  No, I can't. There are loads of females who I
• 13:58
  respect. I think you're doing amazing.
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  Fantastic things out there. Are they my role models know
• 14:03
  because we're going to differ on so many different things will
• 14:06
  differ on like our opinion or theological opinions are, you
• 14:09
  know, our like political opinions will do Over there for.
• 14:11
  I don't have someone who I feel like can represent the views
• 14:15
  that align with me. Therefore, I don't think I have
• 14:18
  a role model. That's why I'm asking you guys.
• 14:19
  Do you have any? Because that's quite important
• 14:21
  because if we're talking about celebrity culture, but we can't
• 14:24
  think of anyone who's a role model than, why are we thinking
• 14:26
  of which is good? That means we don't see them as
• 14:28
  celebrities which is something amazing.
• 14:30
  Well, I do I definitely don't but that's not me speaking for
• 14:33
  the whole entire stuff. That's the thing because whether
• 14:35
  we do or we don't I think even if it's 10% of people do.
• 14:39
  But the last 10 years that temper Become 25%, which talked
• 14:43
  about the rise of it and the prevalence and the existence of
• 14:45
  it, whether there is the existence because even if the
• 14:47
  majority doesn't believe that culture exists.
• 14:50
  Yeah, I think it does exist and I think it's growing and I don't
• 14:53
  think it's a bad thing. Like I said I think that there's
• 14:56
  a lot of questions to have with this conversation the role of a
• 14:59
  celebrity or an icon. I don't really want to use World
• 15:03
  role model because I feel like that's an adjective you give to
• 15:05
  someone who's earned that Merit. You know I'm saying it's like
• 15:09
  you and being a role model. But you can be a celebrity
• 15:12
  without being a role model unfortunately.
• 15:14
  So whether or whether or not we have that in our community, I
• 15:16
  don't know, but we do try to extend him.
• 15:18
  I don't like I don't really like mentioning this my limits and
• 15:21
  anyways, but just to take me as an example.
• 15:23
  I'm not calling myself a celebrity or old or anything
• 15:26
  like that. I just say I'm someone who has a
• 15:28
  lot of followers in comparison to like the average person in
• 15:31
  our community, right? But there have been times when
• 15:33
  people have approached me like, you know, in public and you
• 15:36
  know, they've recognizing and they said to me, like, oh, we
• 15:39
  follow you on Instagram or, you know, I know, You are like, you
• 15:42
  know, I've seen I've watched you on this show and that show and
• 15:44
  the fact that they recognize me, I'm not cool because like it's
• 15:46
  not other back of your head, you don't you go about your day
• 15:49
  normally you don't think, oh my God, you're not like I'm someone
• 15:51
  so because I've been on it, you know, Channel like this for
• 15:54
  example, you don't you really don't.
• 15:56
  So when someone comes up to you and they recognize your, you are
• 15:58
  taken aback a little bit. And you're like, oh wait.
• 16:00
  Hold on. Like people actually know who I
• 16:02
  am and it happened to me at a Gala dinner, just a couple of
• 16:05
  days ago. Actually warmer climates Mission
• 16:07
  by seen you and I was like I don't know, where have you seen
• 16:09
  me? And she's like oh so she And a
• 16:11
  couple of places and I was like, no, no Stephanie.
• 16:13
  Then I was like, maybe it's on TV show.
• 16:14
  Oh yeah. You're on that shirt.
• 16:16
  They do recognize you so whether or not that that recognition
• 16:21
  entitles you to become seen as a celebrity.
• 16:24
  I don't know. Hmm.
• 16:26
  No, I don't think that makes you a celebrity because I don't feel
• 16:30
  that it must be a little more grandest that like a thing,
• 16:34
  right? Because the majority of, I think
• 16:36
  the lecturers the recite has or you call them influences in the
• 16:41
  T the the fact that recognizable doesn't mean the celebrity
• 16:44
  simple. Yeah, so that point it says it's
• 16:47
  because the we are trying I think to recognize the work they
• 16:50
  do the service that it I think it's more from that perspective,
• 16:53
  that's why I don't know, Role Models the right word but we
• 16:56
  look up to them to a certain extent where we just want to say
• 16:58
  thank you for saying the thing is, there's a lot of people who
• 17:01
  would disagree with that on the basis that, for example, you
• 17:03
  have as an example, a young teenager from Nairobi or from
• 17:08
  Michigan, or from anywhere else in the world will listen.
• 17:11
  Into English recited Surah, bakra Sciences or whatever, and
• 17:15
  idolized, what they do. The minute they become a
• 17:18
  celebrity is when someone for example, will sway themselves on
• 17:22
  a personal level to somewhat emulate them.
• 17:25
  So for example, if I idolized or I emulate someone who's doing
• 17:30
  really well in the field of head mama whether the recitals call
• 17:33
  or whatever, if they have an opinion on the way to dress or
• 17:36
  something they say and I feel like my opinion slightly
• 17:39
  shifting or swaying. Just The basis that that person
• 17:42
  is doing it, we have then a discussion about celebrity
• 17:45
  culture. If I feel that there's saying
• 17:47
  something and making a valid argument and they're having an
• 17:49
  impact on, my belief system is a different discussion but just
• 17:52
  where I'm coming from. You have a lot of recitals or
• 17:55
  speakers or mental health, professionals, or whatever you
• 17:58
  want to say, people within the community are doing incredible
• 18:00
  work, but we'll do something in a certain way and that will have
• 18:04
  an effect on the way, someone else thinks.
• 18:07
  So that there's a huge responsibility that comes with
• 18:09
  that whether we call. Some celebrities or not.
• 18:12
  Maybe that's like, you know, that's not important.
• 18:14
  The moment. Yeah, but the existence of that
• 18:15
  culture is there I don't disagree because I still
• 18:19
  believe, although I would like to call them celebrities or Role
• 18:22
  Models. Again, I'm keep mentioning this
• 18:23
  word best we still do look up to them.
• 18:26
  So you mentioned the point of the way they dress.
• 18:28
  Yeah, they like that. Yeah, I think that's very
• 18:30
  important. I think they have influence.
• 18:32
  Let's let's let's use that word. I think they have some sort of
• 18:35
  influence in our lives and if I see someone I look up to, you
• 18:39
  know, speaking, a certain way. Dressing a certain way or eating
• 18:43
  food. A certain place.
• 18:45
  I would want to do that. Yeah, because it makes it fine
• 18:47
  like, you know, if I see say let's do this, I want to do this
• 18:52
  because for me, it's normal. But do you, can I ask you?
• 18:55
  Do you feel like you fall within that category?
• 18:58
  Not that much? No.
• 18:59
  What do you mean by not that much?
• 19:01
  I don't think I have any influence on anyone's life best
• 19:04
  I in terms of like when it comes to recognition that exists.
• 19:08
  Yeah. So the people recognized with
• 19:10
  people's emotions I saved you, people, you have hamdulillah.
• 19:13
  I've been performing and and serving the community for a long
• 19:16
  time. You serve in multiple languages,
• 19:20
  you've release albums and videos.
• 19:22
  You've got handle, incredible social media page and you got
• 19:25
  pages in your in basically in your honor and that makes sense.
• 19:28
  So in a positive way you did incredible work and people look
• 19:32
  up to you, do you feel that you like being that being in the
• 19:36
  role? You are does that add pressure
• 19:38
  to you? Oh my personal life.
• 19:41
  Yes, hmm because I don't know if he's going off topic, there's
• 19:45
  sometimes you can't go to certain places.
• 19:48
  Sometimes you can't sit with certain crowds.
• 19:51
  Sometimes you can't dress as comfortable as you want to be
• 19:54
  because it has some sort of I wouldn't say will affect your
• 19:58
  reputation. That's people start saying you
• 20:00
  know this guy comes up on the member I think it's a
• 20:02
  responsibility. Yes I think that's the one you
• 20:04
  had. I do feel for you actually and I
• 20:06
  do think about that because I feel like because of what you're
• 20:09
  doing Whatever you do is like we say in about the am I saw, but
• 20:14
  I'll act like. I like they're counting like his
• 20:17
  his actions or whatever you want to say, do your things like
• 20:20
  Paparazzi? Are you making someone a
• 20:21
  celebrity? She's so I'm coming from it.
• 20:24
  Swivels the form of Gossip or bitches, you know why?
• 20:26
  Because someone sees him as someone who is serving the share
• 20:29
  our faith and bringing like an element of our teachings,
• 20:32
  whatever. I like to the Forefront.
• 20:34
  Now if he the same person who is delivering our shared values to
• 20:38
  the public then goes and does Thing that goes against this
• 20:41
  year, I'm not saying that you do obviously cuz I'm pretty
• 20:43
  confident, but if you were to step out of line or do something
• 20:47
  that, you know, people would criticize then that's where
• 20:50
  people will say, but you've got responsibilities in the same way
• 20:53
  that when we see a speaker after speaker, says something or
• 20:55
  behaves in a certain way that we don't agree with.
• 20:58
  We're like, but you sit on the member and you're delivering a
• 21:00
  lecture. But then you're going and doing
• 21:01
  this like, automatically, we think?
• 21:03
  Oh, you're a hypocrite where were very quick to label people
• 21:06
  as Hypocrites. By the way, because we really
• 21:08
  high. Hold them in such high regard.
• 21:09
  Especially People who are on the lab because we expect so much of
• 21:13
  them that the minute they slip up in any way in our opinion, by
• 21:17
  the way. They might not be doing anything
• 21:18
  harm but they might be doing something we don't like a flirty
• 21:21
  wise. Well, I call know like, you
• 21:22
  know, why is he doing that for? Yeah, I and I don't think this
• 21:25
  is something that we're going to use the word.
• 21:28
  We choose to do. Yeah.
• 21:29
  It's I think it's I think it's the people's fault because they
• 21:33
  they so I think they they find something fun or for you.
• 21:40
  That's what it is. That's an expectation, but they
• 21:42
  find something to speak about the community.
• 21:44
  For example, always saw rather we go there.
• 21:46
  Although we do this, or we did that, people speak about the
• 21:51
  everyone in anything yet. And, you know, just toss them
• 21:54
  back on the point. Just the question you just asked
• 21:55
  me out the person that suffers with this most is my wife
• 21:59
  because sometimes I can't do what I want to do comfortably.
• 22:03
  Everything's legit way, but because you have this
• 22:05
  responsibility, you have some sort of limitations of what you
• 22:09
  do in your day-to-day life. And I feel sorry for the people
• 22:12
  who are more, recognized me, interesting.
• 22:16
  See, the thing is I think there's the, it's not wrong for
• 22:19
  people to have that expectation. Yeah, I know my wife wants to go
• 22:22
  and one. Yeah, so from our kick up, I
• 22:24
  think is really why we need a sponge if you're if you're down
• 22:28
  with I have a hard time in Kingsbury
• 22:41
  and I'm not, I'm not Rocky and I could imagine for you guys.
• 22:45
  So does that additional example? I gave no, just the sort of like
• 22:48
  celebrity kind of thing you're speaking about.
• 22:51
  I mean, so it's interesting because I still think that
• 22:54
  exists and I think as a community were shifting towards
• 22:57
  becoming more sensationalist. So we are more flashing lights
• 23:01
  and colorful things and very sensation is.
• 23:02
  So we will do things. And in some ways after microbe
• 23:05
  is similar to that, we will make things look slick.
• 23:10
  For the interest of the viewers because people's attention spans
• 23:13
  are gonna cost. Ya big up aftermarket know, but
• 23:17
  the people's attention spans are low in this day and age.
• 23:19
  So to catch and to grab their attention, you need something,
• 23:23
  which is relatable to wider society.
• 23:25
  And wider Society, we see this, we see celebrities, we see
• 23:30
  people who are seem in some ways unattainable.
• 23:33
  Okay. And then people aspire to be
• 23:35
  like them, it's a huge issue we have and it comes with a
• 23:37
  discussion of the removal of a job.
• 23:39
  It comes. The discussion of men who are
• 23:42
  looking at the opposite gender. And there's so many other
• 23:44
  discussions which are result of the wider society and the
• 23:48
  celebrity culture. And in some ways I feel that
• 23:50
  it's infiltrating our community. I don't think it's a bad thing
• 23:53
  for us to give status to people who deserve it because I'm done
• 23:57
  that we have so many hadam within our community and of
• 24:00
  course there are many who don't have a celebrity status but are
• 24:03
  still serving and will always serve.
• 24:05
  Everyone has someone in their family and know someone who no
• 24:09
  one knows like a. A public sphere, but who has
• 24:12
  served the mosque for like decades?
• 24:13
  Yeah. Well who has sat on a member for
• 24:15
  a long time, but it's not got a social media page or it doesn't
• 24:18
  have like a you know people flying them out for event and
• 24:21
  that's beautiful that they're recognizable without a presence.
• 24:25
  Yeah. Just the service gives them
• 24:27
  that, you know, status and it's an interesting thing.
• 24:29
  You mentioned, say that about the expectations people have, in
• 24:33
  my opinion, I think expectations should be there because I I will
• 24:37
  trust my kids to listen to your lecture.
• 24:41
  Why should I not trust? Why should I why should I trust
• 24:44
  you to be a role model to my child?
• 24:46
  If, for example you come to a modulus and you don't speak to
• 24:49
  people after lecture, or for example, you'll give a response
• 24:51
  to someone or, for example, your post, something, which.
• 24:54
  And I'm not saying that they have to do things my way,
• 24:57
  definitely not, but I think there's an adoption are Clark,
• 25:00
  which needs to be adhered to especially from people who have
• 25:03
  a sway in English because we established that that exists.
• 25:06
  And for those who have a sway in can control, but control can
• 25:09
  sway people's opinions. Ins, they have more
• 25:10
  responsibility, that is true. But do you think that sometimes
• 25:13
  we're very, very harsh to criticize and I've seen that
• 25:17
  because they've been like really popular people from our
• 25:20
  community and I'm not going to mention names, but who I haven't
• 25:23
  met? I've just heard so much about
• 25:25
  that. I've like got all these like
• 25:28
  presumptions about them then when I meet them, I'm like,
• 25:30
  disperses really humbled. Yeah, helpful reading.
• 25:34
  But that, you know, the way they've been spoken about by
• 25:37
  other people, the way that they've been portrayed by other
• 25:39
  people You know, you automatically write them off and
• 25:42
  I think sometimes we don't give people the benefit of the doubt,
• 25:45
  sometimes you could be having an off day, you're gonna speak
• 25:47
  someone after imagine is because you're thinking about you're
• 25:49
  ill, grandmother, for example, or you know, you're going
• 25:52
  through something personal. So you're not in the mood.
• 25:55
  So you're like, you know, really within yourself and you've
• 25:58
  you've just finished it electron.
• 25:59
  For example, you've calmed down, and you're really thinking about
• 26:01
  what it is that you're going through and people take that as
• 26:03
  you being arrogant, not speaking to them.
• 26:05
  That's true. Like we never give people the
• 26:07
  vanished. But the reality is people will
• 26:11
  have that expectation but whether it's right or not.
• 26:13
  But what if they do that every single measures in the last 10
• 26:15
  years Do we always give them the benefit of the doubt?
• 26:19
  But sometimes, okay, look, sometimes I think some people
• 26:23
  have social anxiety, even though they are quote, unquote
• 26:27
  celebrities. I've actually met people like
• 26:29
  that. They're very confident on the
• 26:30
  camera. Very, very confident, but in
• 26:32
  person, they're quite shy and you're like, but hold on, you're
• 26:34
  not that same person who presents all the same person who
• 26:36
  like, you know, delivers lecture.
• 26:38
  But in person, they're actually quite socially awkward.
• 26:41
  So sometimes, you know, you might have that like, you know,
• 26:44
  you know, as an example. So many You've met me say to me,
• 26:48
  oh, we thought you were really arrogant or if I saw you and I'm
• 26:50
  like why that I owe? You know, you don't make eye
• 26:52
  contact. You you barely make you barely
• 26:54
  speak to people, but when they have a conversation with me that
• 26:57
  actually, you're not so bad after all, now I'm just nobody.
• 27:00
  Now, imagine somebody who is like, really well known and who
• 27:03
  does deliver speeches or whatever it is that they, they
• 27:06
  do to serve the community if they've got social anxiety or
• 27:09
  face off of suffer from mental health, or whatever it is that
• 27:11
  they're going through and we just label them as something
• 27:13
  just because we haven't actually asked them by the way, are you
• 27:15
  okay? Like there's something wrong
• 27:17
  Wrong. For example, can I just throw a
• 27:18
  spanner in the works? Yeah, there are so many people
• 27:21
  and I'm going to name names. We haven't even thought of
• 27:24
  because they are way bigger than the average.
• 27:26
  I would say the average, but the sort of celebrities we have in
• 27:29
  our community. Malabar, some kind of Life
• 27:31
  Lesson, do it. Mellow blessing, rewarding King
• 27:33
  of the peas? The yeah.
• 27:35
  Like, and the fact that we look up to him, and the fact that he
• 27:38
  has such a pull-on people from different cultures, around the
• 27:41
  world, in some way, makes him a celebrity, you know, Nadeem.
• 27:44
  So our Allah bless him, Mirror Has a mirror.
• 27:47
  Him with all my heart and there's so many more.
• 27:49
  But these are people who have an incredible amount of pull for
• 27:52
  their incredible talent and their hard work, but those
• 27:55
  people we won't, we won't meet like that.
• 27:57
  I just ask you, have you met them because we have and
• 28:02
  actually, it's a really good example because when you meet
• 28:04
  them in like, if they're not, they don't come across as like
• 28:07
  confident or arrogant or big-headed, all right?
• 28:10
  Humble actually and you're like, oh okay.
• 28:12
  But really big cloud like I'm so excited to meet you but I'll
• 28:15
  give it a when I first met me rehearsal.
• 28:17
  Mirror. Yeah, I took a selfie with him
• 28:19
  and then our I recorded all of the problem.
• 28:21
  Yeah, but I was I took a selfie with him so I recited I took a
• 28:30
  selfie video, reciting, his consider with him in Urdu for
• 28:35
  me, it was like a big deal. So, mashallah, I've been
• 28:37
  reciting this very Kalam this, these very words, my whole life,
• 28:41
  and I would love to recite this with you.
• 28:43
  And I recited a verse with him and it was like a huge deal.
• 28:45
  Like imagine if you met him on the bus.
• 28:47
  And he says he has met him. Yeah.
• 28:49
  Okay. Father.
• 28:50
  And you had the opportunity, even as someone who mashallah
• 28:52
  you've got, Anna following you release your own content, yeah,
• 28:55
  he had the opportunity to recite with him, the amusing, blow your
• 29:00
  mind, you guys are because surely it proves that there is
• 29:05
  there is the concept of it. Obviously, we're now talking
• 29:07
  about different level because millibars him is, you know, he's
• 29:12
  you know, speaking of Malabar some.
• 29:13
  If I can just interject you there you know, bison makes like
• 29:17
  Pretty much I think, I don't know.
• 29:18
  But outside of the Iraqi world with Arabic world.
• 29:20
  There's he's always making people cry.
• 29:22
  Yeah, pop it. That's when you meet him outside
• 29:24
  of the pulpit, he's always making you laugh.
• 29:27
  You know, there's always a smile.
• 29:28
  There's always like a nice conversation.
• 29:30
  There's always like, this, this feeling of, you know, true
• 29:33
  service. You know, people forget the
• 29:35
  reason why I wanna mention this is because bossom the way that
• 29:37
  people come to our might be part of the problem actually is well
• 29:40
  growing up. I bought some wasn't my ass
• 29:42
  24/7. Now, we start MP3 players was
• 29:45
  always like Malabar someone about something else.
• 29:47
  Other when you see my person, I am at the first time I met him
• 29:49
  in person. It was in Kuwait once well,
• 29:53
  yeah, my father was given lectures in Kuwait and Boston
• 29:57
  was also reciting afterwards. So that was when I met him.
• 30:00
  I was like, I think my heart was pounding honestly.
• 30:02
  I mean I'm being serious here was like, you know, you moment
• 30:05
  you see you see the guy's face, you hear his voice and you how
• 30:08
  much people phrase in the Tokyo and I mean you just don't know
• 30:11
  what to say. You actually start sweating.
• 30:12
  I think you're very hot. So best of the minbar, these
• 30:16
  people are amazing. Yani.
• 30:18
  They are just like you and me. They have their own problems,
• 30:20
  they have their own families, they have full-time work like
• 30:22
  they, they're not about the celebrity life, how much better
• 30:26
  I think is the people that turned them out to be a such
• 30:30
  Yanni right now. I'll speaking of want some
• 30:32
  fucking go again, the other day, a few weeks ago, there was he
• 30:36
  came to karbala and the shrine of Imam Hussain he was giving a
• 30:41
  eulogy and then you had like the front first, I think ten rows
• 30:45
  everyone's wearing when the Boston.
• 30:47
  Asia's doing local. I was confused.
• 30:50
  I'm gonna say more. There's to me that was confusing
• 30:53
  anything, you know, Bassam is that if that's not, if you don't
• 30:57
  know whether it's right or wrong, if that's not Celebrity
• 30:59
  Status, what is when you have a brand, you've got much Dice and
• 31:03
  see who uses merchandise. I'm not going to give.
• 31:05
  Anyone sure they can speak for themselves beside from I know
• 31:09
  he's just as much as ice to its contribute towards all the work
• 31:12
  that he does because he of course everything that he does
• 31:14
  he does so much more good than we would not is like Of this
• 31:17
  Walt best to see boss him on the minbar and people wearing.
• 31:20
  Boston do not want to boss him. I was confusing.
• 31:23
  So I don't know if that is what celebrities becoming these days.
• 31:28
  I'm not going to say more on this topic on this matter, with
• 31:31
  bus, I think you bought much, man and we are, we are living in
• 31:35
  a day and age, where merchandise does play a massive role in
• 31:39
  Celebrity culture influences Etc because Especially within the
• 31:43
  younger lot. I think like, for me I'm all
• 31:46
  about like I'm not interested in buying much, but when I look at
• 31:49
  my daughter's generation, they really aren't interested in
• 31:51
  buying merchandise. Was it kind of reinforces their
• 31:54
  identity because 100% do. I mean, like wrap shot to send
• 31:59
  most of our hosseini who has a match by Pioneer in the shear
• 32:03
  modulus industry? Because it's basically saying I
• 32:06
  endorse this this person or this organization or whatever it is,
• 32:10
  that the match is representing. So It's a very big part of
• 32:13
  identity, definitely. As you know, you know, actually
• 32:16
  I'm gonna I'm actually going to do is I'm going to speak about
• 32:19
  this. I'm going to talk about it.
• 32:20
  I think is going to make this amazing to have.
• 32:23
  For example, my kids grow up looking up to these people
• 32:27
  rather than looking at other know, Justin Bieber on these
• 32:29
  people. And it's now I'm thinking about
• 32:31
  just now on the spot I'm not gonna say it's a bad thing to
• 32:34
  have much of these recitals and whatnot but rather than listen
• 32:38
  and look up to these people than the cops who people outside of,
• 32:41
  this is a A point. Huge Point mention and I
• 32:44
  actually don't know so far we've been talking about like, you
• 32:49
  know, people in our community for girls that such a web you
• 32:51
  want to call them. They've always been males, which
• 32:54
  is why, when you think of females, the she might not be a
• 32:58
  reciter should not be. It might be someone big, any
• 33:00
  female who puts herself forward automatically becomes a bit of a
• 33:03
  celebrity. Why?
• 33:04
  Because there is hardly any female Representatives.
• 33:07
  Why I said, you have Instagram influencers and you've got
• 33:10
  people who, for example, like Mental Health, Was of loggers or
• 33:13
  whatever is yeah and majority of those are sisters.
• 33:16
  And I feel like the sisters make those sisters celebrities in
• 33:21
  some way. Like, for example, a young
• 33:24
  sister who for example is like working on her.
• 33:27
  Her job will look up to an older sister who's doing really well
• 33:30
  and Scott huge Instagram following.
• 33:32
  They have the whole aesthetic which is a big deal like an
• 33:35
  Instagram aesthetic, their grid is the same color and has a
• 33:37
  theme and they have like they type a certain way and they
• 33:40
  captions are all very similar and so on.
• 33:42
  And so Fourth, Brandi with the sisters and I think with that
• 33:53
  kind of celebrity stays within the community, obviously, with
• 33:56
  the brothers, like you said, there's there's recitals and
• 33:59
  there's poets and there's professionals and different
• 34:01
  things, and maybe it's a bit different.
• 34:04
  But the comparison, I want to make is even for me, if I like
• 34:07
  I've met, for example, say the word Yahweh Elohim.
• 34:12
  He's A house. When you meet someone like that
• 34:14
  in person, even me as a female that I'm not looking up to him
• 34:17
  as a role model because like I said before I for me a role
• 34:19
  model, be someone from the same gender when I look at something
• 34:22
  like that oh my God. I'm in the presence because
• 34:25
  Eminence almost yes. Yeah, because we've been taught
• 34:27
  to like you know, respect someone who you know, is of that
• 34:30
  kind of status. But when you meet a woman who is
• 34:33
  an influence or someone popular, it's not the same feeling.
• 34:36
  You don't think like, oh wow, I'm sitting with this dentist or
• 34:39
  this doctor or this, you know what?
• 34:42
  Ever profession. They had, it's not the same.
• 34:44
  It's just like, oh hi, you're really successful.
• 34:46
  Well done. Like it's amazing.
• 34:47
  I'm so happy for you and I really wish that my daughter and
• 34:50
  you know the younger generation can reach the same level of
• 34:53
  success as you. It's not the same, it's not the
• 34:54
  same level. Yeah, that may be obviously
• 34:56
  there's a question of her job and socially job and because you
• 35:00
  won't see a sister got up on the member or something the modulus.
• 35:03
  So obviously, it's hard as it may be for something.
• 35:05
  You mean in front of males in front of me and there are some
• 35:10
  women who are public figures As of course, you know, who our
• 35:14
  presenters prominent presenters or who have given lectures on TV
• 35:19
  and stuff like that, there's not that many of them.
• 35:21
  This is why I'm saying so much, the next thing I wanted to
• 35:24
  mention this, or saying, before we wrap up I think there's like
• 35:27
  a huge discussion is the runner-up of a donor.
• 35:30
  I hop don't roll of Muslim media.
• 35:32
  Yeah because whether it's to credit or to blame I think other
• 35:36
  debates he has a part to play in it.
• 35:38
  Hmm. Yeah obviously up from my
• 35:40
  opinion I think there's more far away moron.
• 35:42
  The credit side. But I will be a TV and many
• 35:45
  other channels, and many other organizations have promoted and
• 35:48
  even established. And even giving people some
• 35:50
  platforms to become who they are, since I'll you started work
• 35:54
  here in 2013, was it? 2014 14.
• 36:05
  And obviously this is around the time you were developing a new
• 36:09
  work, right? Yes yes yeah I need to be
• 36:11
  honest. When I started working here, I
• 36:14
  don't think I was really reciting and it was more of, you
• 36:18
  know, someone's house or you know it's like out of respect
• 36:22
  for my late father was being a lecturer or like you know,
• 36:25
  you're his son, let's put him on.
• 36:27
  Yeah it was it was that sort of You know, the community given
• 36:30
  support towards me Bess. I think starting English was a
• 36:37
  bit different and Elevate TV being English.
• 36:40
  This was sort of interesting for both of us.
• 36:42
  Yeah, because English was a very new thing.
• 36:45
  And he even till now still new to a lot of is 100.
• 36:48
  Our communities are bit different, these days.
• 36:49
  It's more acceptable. Best Elevate TV that helped push
• 36:53
  English, 100 % E. I don't know if they pushed all
• 36:55
  the languages, not quite sure, but when it comes to like the
• 36:58
  English Shhhh. The English World. 100% a
• 37:01
  debate. That's why I say that.
• 37:02
  There's a contribution. Yeah, but I don't think they
• 37:06
  pushed to get people out there. They push that English voice.
• 37:09
  I think that's what they tried to push.
• 37:11
  And we go one of the lucky ones. I think, I think they've been a
• 37:16
  several platforms, which have a shed light on people in the
• 37:22
  community who have some sort of talent or the other, whether
• 37:25
  it's a talent in reciting, or speaking, or presenting or
• 37:28
  whatever Is but we've seen platforms, push people to the
• 37:33
  Forefront and it's been an amazing opportunity for those
• 37:36
  individuals, young or old be recognized by the community for
• 37:40
  their talents so they can be booked up in places like
• 37:44
  mosques. Sometimes you kind of don't want
• 37:47
  to use the words. I don't say we're sick of
• 37:49
  hearing the same voices but sometimes you want to hear from
• 37:52
  someone new. You want a fresh voice.
• 37:54
  People are sick of the same voices way.
• 37:56
  The way this is. I don't think that's a lie.
• 37:57
  By the way we can say Like there's a need.
• 38:00
  There is a need for more for more, not celebrities.
• 38:03
  Because that's obviously, it sounds a bit bad, but there's a
• 38:06
  need for more icons and there's a need for more info leaders and
• 38:08
  there's so many resides, I'm gonna call them servants, we
• 38:11
  need Servants, of course, publicly publicly performing and
• 38:14
  publicly out their Servants of the elevators and your minds at
• 38:17
  the very nice point in when she was, like, they're giving them a
• 38:19
  platform. Yeah, I knew there was recent
• 38:22
  anime, an amazing, you know, initiative initiative by a
• 38:26
  different TV channel. And I came across So much
• 38:30
  amazing she oughtn't. I was like, how have we not
• 38:33
  heard of these people go and we shot so many as well.
• 38:37
  Yeah, I know it's crazy. That no one has given them.
• 38:41
  This opportunity and Islamic me to elevate TV, all the other TV
• 38:44
  station themselves. It's very important that we
• 38:47
  support these. I think that's what recited his
• 38:50
  future lecturers future, whether it's right or wrong or there.
• 38:54
  Of course people, I'm sure who even watching, who will hold the
• 38:57
  opinion that it's I wrong for a Muslim media channel to indoors
• 39:02
  and to promote, and to publicize a sheet a voice and that voice,
• 39:07
  being a shy person who becomes a, some sort of an icon or a
• 39:10
  figure do you see what I'm saying?
• 39:12
  Yeah, and that personality is then given that they go on their
• 39:16
  own Journey outside of the channel or outside of any
• 39:18
  organization and then they grow in their status.
• 39:21
  It's doesn't make the fault of the channel or anything.
• 39:24
  In my opinion. I think the channel was looking
• 39:25
  or a Channel or is looking like you said, for Servants who were
• 39:30
  performing ahead. Matt.
• 39:31
  And in doing any English language, especially for this
• 39:33
  Channel and will endorse it, you know, there's a need for it, but
• 39:38
  is there, for example, a risk that we gets too far.
• 39:41
  Yeah. Do you see what I'm saying?
• 39:42
  Because, as well as be really blunt about it.
• 39:46
  We are edging kind of more and more and more towards the
• 39:49
  Hollywood style, I don't think so.
• 39:52
  Come on, a surreal, adoration. Okay from it.
• 39:55
  We don't even have the budget for a, let's be honest.
• 39:57
  That's outside the question. If you had the budget, would you
• 40:00
  do it? That's the question.
• 40:01
  They will. Because there's a certain remit.
• 40:05
  And it depends on again, like when you say, Hollywood Etc,
• 40:08
  Lola, what are you talking about?
• 40:09
  Show biz lights and stuff like that.
• 40:10
  Like what's wrong with light snow on lights and lights in the
• 40:12
  shrines? Like I think was true.
• 40:14
  I think what happened when you went?
• 40:16
  And I'm not going to disagree. Maybe I can agree with you fully
• 40:18
  on this point. Is that Productions?
• 40:21
  Yeah, so I'm not gonna bother red carpets and Showbiz lies and
• 40:24
  whatnot. I'm talking about high-end
• 40:25
  Productions. Where even I've sometimes I look
• 40:28
  at video, From certain recitals of like, it's a bit like
• 40:32
  Bollywood, you know, it's like, there's a huge resemblance
• 40:35
  between, you know, the guy singing about falling in love
• 40:39
  with some God knows who, and the guy singing about reciting about
• 40:45
  the mob of karbala. And when you watching the
• 40:46
  production, there is absolutely no difference.
• 40:49
  Is that bad though. Yes.
• 40:51
  But if you want your, if you're trying to find a way to engage
• 40:54
  your audience, I'm not taking you through everything.
• 40:57
  I think if you're trying to find a way to Engage your audience
• 40:59
  and we're in a world where attention span is so small.
• 41:04
  Right now, very, very small. Like, you know we scroll through
• 41:07
  for through our social media. We don't even have the patience
• 41:09
  or tolerance that even like like pun like not not Ponder.
• 41:12
  Not exactly the words like literally like so you're that
• 41:18
  that trying to pull out all the stops they can to get people
• 41:21
  engaged in especially when you're trying to engage them in
• 41:23
  something that's religiously even harder but doesn't that
• 41:26
  defeat the purpose of serving but it Because what happens I
• 41:31
  said, is received as I live, look at the word I use is, I
• 41:34
  think I might be the wrong word is worse, and when it get worse,
• 41:37
  I do I say words? Yes, you did.
• 41:39
  I don't think it's right. What I think I meant will it
• 41:41
  get? Will it get deeper in the sense
• 41:42
  that we think it will evolve evolved?
• 41:45
  Yeah. Perhaps it will keep evolving
• 41:46
  depending on the times. So that that will be you know
• 41:50
  like subject to like the way things look aesthetically all
• 41:53
  the speed or even the length, all of that will vary depending
• 41:56
  on the time's, right? Okay, fine.
• 41:58
  But The same time with, with the increase of the, I'm going to go
• 42:02
  back to the Instagram concert because I don't know, any other
• 42:05
  kind of programming. Yeah, I don't know, any other
• 42:07
  platforms, for example, there's the concept of like we talked
• 42:16
  about these Instagram influences and all of that year, when new
• 42:20
  platforms are introduced, a new methods are introduced, they
• 42:23
  becomes new risks that are introduced at the same time.
• 42:25
  So what I mean is that you are you are always He's in danger of
• 42:30
  going into another danger zone or another gray area with Halal
• 42:34
  and Haram and wasn't microwatts mobile and all of these
• 42:37
  different things when you start doing new things.
• 42:40
  So for example sisters who are applying makeup bomber wearing
• 42:44
  her job and talking about a cause of social justice, is that
• 42:48
  there's a Darkness on social media.
• 42:51
  There's a there's a really really really kind of sensitive
• 42:53
  conversation to be had there and that person will obviously have
• 42:56
  a huge following and have a huge impact on other people's lives.
• 42:59
  Lives. Now, whether or whether or not,
• 43:00
  that's the right thing to do again, we don't know, we're not
• 43:04
  qualified in that experts. We don't represent a channel.
• 43:06
  Anyone else? I don't have to put it out
• 43:07
  there. But what I mean to say is, as we
• 43:10
  do evolve and it will evolve, there will be new methods that
• 43:13
  which are introduced. Like I'm saying with our new
• 43:14
  stops that we try to put forward but those new stops always
• 43:17
  present new challenges at the same time as what it gives a
• 43:20
  gives out and I'm not something to worry about, right?
• 43:22
  And the question I was new laws and like, tell us at what's
• 43:25
  right and what's wrong? That's that's for them to figure
• 43:27
  out and the concept of Allah most high tech And for us to the
• 43:29
  question of the concept of other mob, being celebrities is a
• 43:35
  whole thing. We but I mean, a lot of our
• 43:38
  maharajah mellow length in their lives and giving protection.
• 43:42
  Don't have that sort of presence on social media, so on.
• 43:45
  But of course, we Revere them. We respect them for everything,
• 43:47
  they do and give the same time, you've got local community
• 43:50
  Scholars, who? Maybe I've got an incredible
• 43:53
  presence on social media and in obviously, in day-to-day life,
• 43:56
  who may have more of an impact on your life and in your manager
• 43:58
  has on your life, Life. Do you see what I'm saying?
• 44:01
  It's an important thing to think Jody is the same though, because
• 44:05
  Mirage it holds such a high, like, like, status within
• 44:09
  communities whereby when they say, like, get up and fight for
• 44:14
  your religion, or for your country, you're going to do it.
• 44:17
  Whereas, if someone in local more said, oh you know I'm Ed
• 44:20
  you know you should you don't get involved in the political
• 44:23
  you're not going to listen, it's the same.
• 44:25
  When the merger says you have to do this, everyone will get up
• 44:28
  and do it. That's Active influence.
• 44:30
  If you're going to call it influence.
• 44:32
  Yes. Yes, I think about that.
• 44:35
  And the problem is sometimes with Maharaja people hero
• 44:40
  worship them to an extent where they become like the sword with
• 44:46
  which people fight each other with unfortunately together.
• 44:49
  So they become like everything. They do becomes in the name of
• 44:55
  that merger at that they follow. Yeah.
• 44:58
  Maybe this is like a big black hole.
• 45:00
  We're wandering into completely. She's open.
• 45:02
  The kind of love. Yeah.
• 45:03
  And my God. Oh my God, I leave in another
• 45:07
  episode. I'm just gonna have people to
• 45:09
  actually speak non-celebrity idolize these Malaysia.
• 45:13
  It's not their fault and he hits the followers, you know?
• 45:15
  I don't know. May Allah bless all of them.
• 45:18
  Yeah I'm sure they do have the wrong intentions but they really
• 45:22
  do idolize them. You know you want time someone
• 45:24
  came to my house a few years ago like some say it was the picture
• 45:28
  of your Marcia. I like it go through the
• 45:32
  questions, right? May I follow him.
• 45:34
  I love them on the copter, everything.
• 45:35
  So I'm gonna have his photo, it's enough, I got to the
• 45:39
  center. See his picture.
• 45:41
  I got his website for rulings as his pitches are not me.
• 45:43
  I don't have my photo, but there's people who take
• 45:45
  idolizing to a next next level, I think the, and, you know, so
• 45:50
  there are people that unfortunately, idolized our
• 45:54
  Scholars. I would just come on Archie and,
• 45:56
  and it's something that is interesting to see any because,
• 46:02
  you know, we I don't see them idolizing the a debate as much
• 46:07
  but to some extent maybe I don't think that's how to draw to you.
• 46:09
  It's not the majority that's, you know, living in the
• 46:13
  communities that we live in and coming from a very specialized,
• 46:17
  say the computer icon from is he is very open the way the way
• 46:22
  people idolize these jurists. That's I'm not here to cause any
• 46:27
  Fitness. I just want to go back to a
• 46:29
  different point that you were touching on about briefly.
• 46:32
  And I mentioned Hollywood. The reason why I disagreed with
• 46:37
  for example these taking the production of level up a level
• 46:40
  to work on the comparisons now Hollywood and Bollywood because
• 46:43
  it creates competition the irony being a reciter.
• 46:48
  I'm like very lucky to sit amongst other recitals and being
• 46:54
  different groups and yeah what's a groups as well.
• 46:56
  I can you can see the gossip and the talk that's happening.
• 47:00
  This got a heater this, I wanted to be like that or you know,
• 47:03
  less I make it better than that. Like, what's going on?
• 47:07
  Yeah, because I have used, I see now is defeating the, the
• 47:16
  service you are doing and you can add the end of the day.
• 47:19
  We're trying to serve a particular cause, yeah.
• 47:21
  And, and there's people that when they see this hiring
• 47:24
  Productions, the like, the more interested in the production,
• 47:27
  then the service, I don't know. It's my opinion, then I think it
• 47:30
  comes down to the person themselves.
• 47:32
  There are some people who are And with just service and there
• 47:35
  are people who are looking for something beyond that and
• 47:38
  they're looking for to grow their name.
• 47:41
  And I'm not mentioning that I don't have anyone particular in
• 47:43
  Mind by the way. And I'm not talking about
• 47:45
  recited by the way I'm still like anyone in any field, there
• 47:48
  are some people who want to grow their following or they want to
• 47:50
  grow their their fanbase. Let's say so they'll always want
• 47:53
  to take up another find people who are just content anywhere
• 47:56
  that's that's fine. Like I said you will have
• 47:58
  someone we know family or extended Circle that will be
• 48:00
  like that. Yeah but I don't think going
• 48:03
  there's such Thing, when it comes to our College of going
• 48:06
  Beyond service, you might have, you might, you might want to
• 48:08
  promote your work and say, I want to give back to the
• 48:11
  community, that gave it to me. Yeah, like says, I leave my, you
• 48:14
  know, he will, he will acknowledge the fact that he was
• 48:16
  given opportunities, and he was taught, and he learned, and he
• 48:18
  traveled, and he was, and he wants to do the same and he
• 48:21
  recites an English language, and, and he's promoting the
• 48:24
  message of the alphabet and a Muslim in this day and age to
• 48:27
  this Society, I commend that, but when it comes to the point
• 48:30
  of, I want to grow my following and I want to Grow my name as a
• 48:34
  primary thing that's my that's completely wrong.
• 48:38
  What if my for you know my name is my business.
• 48:40
  What if what if the way that I earn a living?
• 48:43
  Yes through this fine. I do you trust tawakkal Allah
• 48:46
  like you have if you when you get to that stage maybe maybe
• 48:49
  it's an expectation that's unrealistic but you will trust I
• 48:52
  lost 12 Allah will reward you and accept you and Andrew you
• 48:55
  know bless you. Regardless of whether you have a
• 48:58
  name and whether you've got 20,000 followers, or 20
• 49:00
  followers, do you know what I mean?
• 49:02
  Are you won't be worried about your He should have bees I know
• 49:04
  it's easier said than done. Is it is part and parcel of what
• 49:08
  they do. Yeah.
• 49:09
  Like if your primary job is for example, reciting, if that's
• 49:13
  your line idea, agree, this? Yeah, then you will always be
• 49:17
  looking for an excuse to grow your.
• 49:19
  We were talking about the competition element, right?
• 49:21
  So in terms of competition before, you know it, you'll have
• 49:23
  this guy says, all this guy had. Yeah, that's one thing that he
• 49:26
  has on the person. He had extras in his video.
• 49:28
  I want CGI in my video for example.
• 49:30
  You know I mean like they all come to a Next Level 3 are.
• 49:33
  That's gr like you have, for example, Harem albums, being
• 49:37
  released in VR headsets or something.
• 49:38
  And that exists of your cartilage is incredible dish to
• 49:41
  have to give a shout out. But but in terms of promotion of
• 49:45
  the self-worth, I think that's wrong as we brought up on the
• 49:49
  concept of creating my giving all with no hope or return.
• 49:53
  I have to disagree with you though.
• 49:54
  Like I have to disagree with you.
• 49:56
  Why? Because I've seen so many people
• 49:57
  being rinsed under the name of Kendama and they serve and
• 50:01
  Servants of the community so much and get nothing in return
• 50:03
  for. We're talking about rewarding
• 50:07
  them and they deserve to get paid and they deserved in my
• 50:10
  opinion to that charging. Right.
• 50:11
  But who who decides on what they deserve?
• 50:16
  Because if for example I was some like, you know it's a
• 50:19
  reciter. In my opinion I felt like I
• 50:21
  deserved a certain amount, but then you felt like it was too
• 50:23
  much, for example. How do we then come to that?
• 50:26
  Yeah, exactly. Where do we draw the line?
• 50:27
  It's a very, very tricky. There you go.
• 50:30
  On that note. I think it's time to To wrap up
• 50:34
  but it's been obviously, I think we could talk for like another
• 50:36
  week. Three hours.
• 50:37
  So there's so much more than asthma talking.
• 50:39
  Whether there's so many different like come things like
• 50:41
  custom level is so much things. I want to mention about this,
• 50:44
  it's not suitable here. Yeah, don't make this point
• 50:47
  after the show a cup of tea after Maghrib, but there was
• 50:53
  this one point, I like I was really gagging to put it in.
• 50:56
  Its, I know you said we're ending.
• 50:59
  Yeah, I'm gonna have extra minute here when it comes to
• 51:01
  competition. Mmm.
• 51:04
  I did say like I've seen it firsthand because I'm in this
• 51:06
  sort of group the scary bit is is that people are now creating
• 51:10
  self-promoting platforms, okay? Where it's it's a big discussion
• 51:18
  best. It's reached a stage now, where
• 51:20
  you have people creating their own lashes to push their own
• 51:23
  work. Now, I'm not saying what I'm
• 51:24
  doing is wrong, or the intention is wrong.
• 51:27
  Best the idea of what services has changed completely because
• 51:30
  of these self-promoting platforms.
• 51:33
  I don't I agree. I don't like being the ancient
• 51:36
  person on that this panel, they have existed actually for a
• 51:39
  while, then I've seen it but in an old-fashioned way.
• 51:42
  But now, they have been around, there's always going to be
• 51:44
  people who are going to self-promote and try and push to
• 51:47
  the next level. And they'll always be people who
• 51:50
  truly, truly have the intention of serving the Elevate and only
• 51:53
  doing head man, but that that that's the self Maalox at the
• 51:57
  road service, the Charlotte. I think I think Sake.
• 52:03
  I don't think I was going to say there will always be.
• 52:10
  People will push that like you said, yeah.
• 52:12
  And we apply to other elements of our life.
• 52:14
  You know, we apply to business. I believe my business works, and
• 52:17
  I believe my product will sell. So I will invest in, in are
• 52:19
  pushing on promote it, but when it comes to the discussion of
• 52:22
  religion, and we are born and brought up with the concept and
• 52:26
  the notion of give without hope of return since, you know, like
• 52:30
  there's a, you know, which we told to treat this in a
• 52:32
  different. In a Different Light anyway.
• 52:34
  Child, I think we have this discussion of it because Charles
• 52:36
  the concept of all of this stuff is fascinating in sha.
• 52:40
  Allah, we are really excited to hear what you have to say.
• 52:43
  Well this is in the comments were hope we haven't been boring
• 52:47
  you to death, but inshallah we know first, we ask forgiveness
• 52:50
  of we've offended anyone. And of course, our primary goal
• 52:53
  is to engage in conversation to grow and to benefit ourselves
• 52:58
  and our shoulder to whatever benefit.
• 53:00
  We can give maybe two people at home.
• 53:02
  But most importantly, bonuses. Is if you are new to
• 53:05
  aftermarket, if we need you to follow to like subscribe, share,
• 53:08
  get involved with the discussion with a late-night buzz.
• 53:11
  If you have topic suggestions, if you have guests suggestions,
• 53:15
  if you want to hear more of something on the podcast, please
• 53:17
  get in touch. You can reach us by email or
• 53:20
  social media, of course on YouTube or any of the social
• 53:23
  media platforms are also on Tick-Tock so give us a follow
• 53:26
  there. Any last words say that I just
• 53:28
  want to say it's been an interesting conversation has and
• 53:32
  thank you especially to the system own As well.
• 53:34
  Yes, thanks you for for Mario, for being on this podcast today.
• 53:39
  I should believe you added value to a different perspective.
• 53:44
  You know, me being like as a recite, I haven't seen it from
• 53:47
  our side of your from your perspective.
• 53:50
  So it's been interesting and I think everyone watching and
• 53:51
  listening to this podcast has inshallah benefited from this
• 53:54
  conversation. And as I said, I hope I haven't
• 53:58
  offended. Anyone please forgive me if I
• 54:00
  have sent, thank you Frances for tuning in and we'll see you
• 54:03
  next. Next time slime.
• 54:04
  I like home. Don't like you but I can't
• 54:05
  afford it.