Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Dangers of the dark web: Murder for hire

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Dangers of the dark web: Murder for hire · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

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Speaker 1: Nancy Grace is coming to Fox Nation. I want justice.
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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace available now only on Fox Nation.
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Speaker 1: The dark Web, what is that? Well, you're about to
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Speaker 1: find out and I'm going to give you three examples
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Speaker 1: where these so called dark web was used to hire Hitman.
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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. I Nancy Grace, this is
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Speaker 1: Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here on
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Speaker 1: Fox Nation and series x M one eleven. First of all,
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Speaker 1: let's kick it off with ABC seven News Chicago reporter
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Speaker 1: John Garcia Listen. Jones was having an affair with the
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Speaker 1: intended victim's husband, who she worked with. She used the
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Speaker 1: relative anonymic of the dark web to hire a company
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Speaker 1: called Sicilian Hitman International to kill his wife, all from
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Speaker 1: her quiet suburban displays apartment. But a network news organization
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Speaker 1: investigating the dark web stumbled down to the plot and
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Speaker 1: reported it to Woodridge Police. Without they're bringing this evidence
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Speaker 1: to law enforcement's attention, who knows how this case would
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Speaker 1: have ended up. She admitted that she had access to
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Speaker 1: Hitman website. Investigators found evidence of Bitcoin payments and communication
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Speaker 1: between Jones and the Hitman website on her laptop. Man
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Speaker 1: oh Man of chevits hiring a hitman on line on
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Speaker 1: the web, even if it is the dark web. From
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Speaker 1: any of you that don't know what the dark web is,
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Speaker 1: think of dark magic. That that's what it is. Everything
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Speaker 1: dark and distasteful is on the dark web. You know,
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Speaker 1: you want to know how to make a bomb dart web,
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Speaker 1: you want to hire a hitman dart web. But it's
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Speaker 1: just so predictable Sicilian Hitman International. Really with me an
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Speaker 1: all star panel to break it down and put it
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Speaker 1: bad together again. Kathleen Murphy, North Carolina, family lawyer at
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Speaker 1: NC Domestic Law dot com and Family Law. That's certainly
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Speaker 1: putting perfume on the pig. It's anything but family. Like
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Speaker 1: John Cardillo, host America's Talks on NEWSMACKTV, former n Y
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Speaker 1: p D. You know he's been around the block once
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Speaker 1: or twice. Professor Forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of Blood
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Speaker 1: Beneath My Feet on Amazon. Joseph Scott Morgan joining us today,
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Speaker 1: Doctor ANGELA. Arnold, renowned psychiatrists joining us from the Atlanta jurisdiction.
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Speaker 1: And to Ray Kamputo, lead news anchor for Orlando's The
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Speaker 1: Morning News w d BO. Ray Kaputo, Wow first of
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Speaker 1: all the dark Web. A lot of people won't even
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Speaker 1: know how to find the dart web. What do you do?
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Speaker 1: Go to Google and write in dart Web. It's really
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Speaker 1: like the seed back alley of the Internet. And you know,
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Speaker 1: I've accessed it as a journalist a couple of times.
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Speaker 1: Journalist in your professional capacity, right, yes, unfortunately or my
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Speaker 1: job makes me do things like that. But but yeah,
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Speaker 1: it's just an absolutely seedy place. I mean everything from
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Speaker 1: kitty porn to murder for higher plots. It's just a
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Speaker 1: place that if you have any sensibility, you don't want
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Speaker 1: to be. Uh, how do you access the so called
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Speaker 1: dark web Kiputo? Well, you have to get a special browser.
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Speaker 1: It's not really a direct thing. You just don't log
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Speaker 1: onto a website. But way I did, He's a download
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Speaker 1: a browser and then that gives you access to these
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Speaker 1: these shady sits and then you're you're kind of on
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Speaker 1: your own. It's not a straightforward thing, but it's really
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Speaker 1: not that difficult either if you're a little bit tech savvy. Nancy, Well,
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Speaker 1: you know, whenever I need to make the smart flicker work,
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Speaker 1: I call my son, who grabs it out of my hands.
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Speaker 1: At any opportunity. He grabs phones, he grabs the remote
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Speaker 1: controlled anything that has a button. He grabs it out
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Speaker 1: of my hand very rudely, I might add, he's like
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Speaker 1: a monkey, you know that just jumps down out of
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Speaker 1: a tree and grabs whatever remote is in your hand.
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Speaker 1: But tech savvy, I mean even a nine year old
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Speaker 1: can do it. So basically anybody can do it if
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Speaker 1: they said their mind to it. John Cardillo hosts America
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Speaker 1: Talks on Newsmax TV former NYPD. You've actually worked dark
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Speaker 1: web cases. Can you break it down for me? Explain
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Speaker 1: to others what is the dark web? Right? So, like
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Speaker 1: the previous guests said, you download a browser. They're given
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Speaker 1: types of browsers. The most popular one is they call
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Speaker 1: it tour tr browser, basicallyaning CRYPTI. Who whoa whoa whoa
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Speaker 1: whoa whoa Wait wait, wait a minute, because I'm pretty
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Speaker 1: sure Joseph Scott Morgan doesn't know what you're saying. When
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Speaker 1: you say download a browser. You don't have to best
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Speaker 1: Buy to get it or its I like to say
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Speaker 1: buy more. You know how to go to best Boy.
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Speaker 1: You just look it up and click and you download
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Speaker 1: the browser right there on your laptop, right on your laptop,
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Speaker 1: it's encrypted. And now the dark Web, I will say
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Speaker 1: this law enforcement Nancy has made a real dent. There
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Speaker 1: was a famous case called the Silk Road case, and
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Speaker 1: Silk Road at the time was the largest marketplace on
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Speaker 1: the Dark Web, and you could go on there. I
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Speaker 1: mean I was on there when we were looking into them.
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Speaker 1: They were actually pedaling like bricks of heroin and fully
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Speaker 1: automatic anti aircraft weapon. I mean, it was insane the
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Speaker 1: types of things you could buy from around the world.
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Speaker 1: The problem for the bad guys was that many of
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Speaker 1: them were just tech savvy enough, but not tech savvy enough.
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Speaker 1: So they would download this browser, but they wouldn't do
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Speaker 1: things like mask their IP address, the location of their computer,
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Speaker 1: the idea of their computer, and so the FBI in
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Speaker 1: any way you say they didn't mask their IP address
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Speaker 1: their internet provider. Let me give a really rudimentary example.
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Speaker 1: I remember when I was still prosecuting in Inner City Atlanta,
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Speaker 1: I got a facts from the Fulton County Jail. It
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Speaker 1: was a death threat from an inmate. Well, just like
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Speaker 1: I could look at that number, see it was the
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Speaker 1: Fulton County Jail. Just like New York numbers start with
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Speaker 1: two one two, or Atlanta area number four h four
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Speaker 1: or six seven eight. You could look and see it
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Speaker 1: was from the jail. Just like that. Cops can look
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Speaker 1: at the IP address, your Internet provider address, and track
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Speaker 1: you down like a bloodhound. Yeah they can. And so
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Speaker 1: what wound up happening was law enforcement that we started
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Speaker 1: to make it dent because of those people making silly mistakes.
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Speaker 1: So the dark web has become more of a it's
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Speaker 1: more now of an exchange place for people who want
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Speaker 1: to believe they're doing something. And there still is nefarious
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Speaker 1: CD activity, don't get me wrong, but it's nowhere near
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Speaker 1: as bad as it used to be. Well maybe you
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Speaker 1: should tell that to Tina Jones. Take a listen to
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Speaker 1: CBS to Chicago reporter Charlie Damar, November fifteenth, twenty fifteen.
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Speaker 1: Tina Jones is proposed to surrounded by family and friends,
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Speaker 1: her life seemingly going in the right direction, but the
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Speaker 1: honeymoon faded. This is her now in jail. Police say
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Speaker 1: she was having an affair with a married man accused
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Speaker 1: of paying a company on the dark web ten thousand
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Speaker 1: dollars in bitcoin currency to have that man's wife killed.
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Speaker 1: Jones lives with her spouse, and this displains apartment building
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Speaker 1: on River Road. Neighbors reacting to the arrest to me,
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Speaker 1: it's what's wrong with this lady that you know the
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Speaker 1: price of a life is on money. Last week, police
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Speaker 1: in suburban Woodridge received a tip about the murder for
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Speaker 1: higher plot from the CBS news program forty eight Hours.
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Speaker 1: That information led investigators back to Jones, revealing she allegedly
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Speaker 1: made arrangements on the dark web for the hit. Back
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Speaker 1: in January, straight out to Ray Kaputo, lead news anchor
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Speaker 1: anchor Orlando's Morning News WDBO, Okay, tell me about Tina Jones.
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Speaker 1: First of all, she was using bitcoin, which my husband
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Speaker 1: and I argue about that all the time. I don't
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Speaker 1: think it's even real. You can't. You can't go to
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Speaker 1: a bank Jackie and say, oh, give me ten thousand bitcoins. Impossible.
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Speaker 1: It's pretend, but apparently people believe it. Okay, Ray Kaputo,
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Speaker 1: explain to me what Tina Jones did. Wow, she's pretty.
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Speaker 1: She could have any guys she wanted. Why do you
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Speaker 1: have to have an affair with a married man in
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Speaker 1: your office and then go online and order a hit
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Speaker 1: for his wife? Go ahead, you're your guess is as
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Speaker 1: good as mine. You know, Tina Jones wasn't even married
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Speaker 1: very long herself before she started one of several affairs.
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Speaker 1: I believe there's like two affairs actually, and this was
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Speaker 1: the second one. So it does make you one or
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Speaker 1: why this woman was married in the first place. But
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Speaker 1: she clearly liked to go after a men who were
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Speaker 1: taken because she starts this uffair. Now, meanwhile, Nancy, this
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Speaker 1: is a nurse. This is a person who is trained
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Speaker 1: to help people, and her instinct is the opposite. She
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Speaker 1: gets this love rival out of the way by going
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Speaker 1: to this murder for Higher website and she provided a
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Speaker 1: picture and addressed And here's the thing I answ this
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Speaker 1: wasn't a crime of passion. She made installments bitcoin installments
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Speaker 1: over three months. She had a plenty of time to
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Speaker 1: revisit this plan, but she ended up making that last
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Speaker 1: Bitcoin payment, so she was serious about this crime. Stories
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Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace, Guys, we are talking about the dark
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Speaker 1: web and what goes on on the so called dark web.
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Speaker 1: And let me tell plenty right now, we're talking about
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Speaker 1: a beautiful young nurse, Tina Jones, who not long after
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Speaker 1: her wedding, that marriage was doomed. Starts in affear with
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Speaker 1: a married man and her office. How predictable? I mean,
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Speaker 1: does it always have to be the secretary or a
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Speaker 1: co worker you go into the office fridge and get
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Speaker 1: your yoga out together. I mean, surprise me. Why is
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Speaker 1: it always the office, always a married man? But that's
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Speaker 1: what happened. But that wasn't enough for her, according to prosecutors,
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Speaker 1: they say she went on the dark web to hire
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Speaker 1: a hit man from I mean, this is straight out
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Speaker 1: of Central Casting Sicilian Hitman International. I mean to you,
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Speaker 1: Kathleen Murphy, North Carolina Family Law Attorney, Family Law Attorney,
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Speaker 1: NC Domestic Law dot com, that was a little redundant
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Speaker 1: family law attorney. But okay, that's your canon worms to
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Speaker 1: deal with Kathleen Murphy. Kathleen installment plan. You remember you
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Speaker 1: used to have layaway like you'd want a sweater. You
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Speaker 1: see it at what Sears and you go pay ten
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Speaker 1: dollars until you pay the whole thing. Often you get
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Speaker 1: the sweater. An installment plan for murder, Kathleen Murphy. Not
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Speaker 1: only is that significantly cold blooded, but Nancy, she never
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Speaker 1: even met this woman. And how cold blooded can somebody
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Speaker 1: be to sit behind a computer and make installment payments
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Speaker 1: for murder of a person you've never met. And she's
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Speaker 1: thirty three years old. It's not like she's some starry
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Speaker 1: eyed teen girl and that has no idea what she's doing.
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Speaker 1: She's thirty three years old. And what does that tell
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Speaker 1: you to Doctor Angela Arnold psychiatrists joining us out of Atlanta,
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Speaker 1: That she's a newlywed but she starts an affair. Of course,
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Speaker 1: it takes two to tango, I'll use that old tire cliche.
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Speaker 1: So the man was part of this too, as far
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Speaker 1: as the affair anyway, don't know that he's connected to
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Speaker 1: the murder attempt. But she's just gotten married. Well, why
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Speaker 1: is she having an affair with a married co worker?
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Speaker 1: Doctor Angela. It's not the first time I've ever heard
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Speaker 1: about something like this. The part that disturbs me the
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Speaker 1: most is how premeditated this was on her part, and
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Speaker 1: the and the length of time that she that she
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Speaker 1: participated in this plot. But I have but I have
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Speaker 1: often seen people who are recently married start having an affair.
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Speaker 1: This is not that that was not a surprise to me.
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Speaker 1: That part of it. I wonder if it's just too
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Speaker 1: much life change and this is their way of an
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Speaker 1: out because or perhaps or perhaps they feel trapped. They
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Speaker 1: could feel trapped, and they want to know that they can,
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Speaker 1: that they can still, you know, be out there doing
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Speaker 1: whatever they were doing before. But it isn't. But it
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Speaker 1: isn't a sign of some mental instability, no matter what
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Speaker 1: it is, isn't it you know what I'm thought of,
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Speaker 1: Doctor Angela Arnold. The other night, John David had a
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Speaker 1: play date and it was to spend the night, so
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Speaker 1: Lucy and I stayed up. I'm embarrassed to say, don't
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Speaker 1: call de facts. Three am watching girl movies and one
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Speaker 1: of them was Runaway Bride, remember that which Julia robertson
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Speaker 1: Somebody Long story short? Why would you go through with
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Speaker 1: the wedding in a marriage if you're gonna feel trapped?
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Speaker 1: Don't you get an inkling of that as you're walking
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Speaker 1: down the aisle? Well? I have. I think that this
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Speaker 1: speaks to some much deeper things going on in this woman.
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Speaker 1: We have no idea what she was, what her history
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Speaker 1: was prior of getting married. You know. Another issue is
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Speaker 1: I think I know what triggered this. The married co
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Speaker 1: worker dumped her. He called it off raka photer how
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Speaker 1: could you leave out that important fact and her psyche
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Speaker 1: She gotten dumped royally and this was her response to
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Speaker 1: kill the wife. It is, it's absolutely preposterous. It's not
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Speaker 1: what most people do. Most people, you know, break ups
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Speaker 1: hurt Nancy, but you know most people have had one
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Speaker 1: that caused a little sting. And what we didn't do
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Speaker 1: is get on the dark weapon and hire somebody. So
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Speaker 1: you know again, circle God so to you. Joseph Scott Morgan,
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Speaker 1: Professor Forensics, Jackson State University, author Blood Beneath My Feet
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Speaker 1: on Amazon. J Scott, you don't just look at blood
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Speaker 1: spatter and crime stace. You look at all sorts of
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Speaker 1: forensic evidence, including a huge digital footprint. This woman's leaving behind,
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Speaker 1: going online making installment payments. Talk about premeditation if premeditation
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Speaker 1: can be formed in an instant, in an twin, just
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Speaker 1: like that when you raise the gun and pull the trigger,
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Speaker 1: that's enough under the law to form premeditation, which means
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Speaker 1: premeditateated murder. She was making installment payments like she's, you know,
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Speaker 1: buying a sweater at belt Matthew, and she went, it's
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Speaker 1: such such a scam, and it was a scam. It
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Speaker 1: wasn't even real sight Sicilian Hitman International. So how long
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Speaker 1: does it take for the cops to unravel that digital trail? Yeah,
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Speaker 1: that sounds really legit Sicilian Hitman. Yeah. Hey, listen, she's
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Speaker 1: left she's literally left electronic breadcrumbs as clues for people
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Speaker 1: to follow. And now you know, we're law enforcement has
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Speaker 1: caught up. They've they've kind of you know, they've they've
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Speaker 1: beat the curve now because their entire units that are
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Speaker 1: specifically assigned to do computer forensics. And boy, when you're
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Speaker 1: talking about making installment payments, every time there's a keystroke
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Speaker 1: relative to this engagement that she's having with these people,
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Speaker 1: that is another clue along this path. And the fact,
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Speaker 1: going to what doctor Angela said just a moment ago,
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Speaker 1: the fact that she had this much time to think
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Speaker 1: about this. This isn't like a heat of passion type
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Speaker 1: of event you talked about premeditation. Man, she'd been thinking
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Speaker 1: about this for a while. Listen to this, Joe Scott
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Speaker 1: talking about forensic evidence, and like you said, you can
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Speaker 1: look at every digital keystroke. As a matter of fact.
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Speaker 1: You know, my book coming out, Don't Be a Victim.
16:20
Speaker 1: One of the chapters about how to protect yourself and
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Speaker 1: your family deals with cybersecurity, if you really want to
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Speaker 1: see what your children are doing, other than sneaking up
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Speaker 1: behind them all the time and ambushing them like I
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Speaker 1: like to do. For the scare factor, there are many
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Speaker 1: many programs out there that you can download on somebody's
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Speaker 1: computer and it catches every keystroke and then I understand
16:45
Speaker 1: the way it works is that you type in let's
16:48
Speaker 1: just pretend you type in creepy Specter and that the
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Speaker 1: program comes up, you put in a password, and then
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Speaker 1: suddenly you see every keystroke or pictures what they're looking at.
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Speaker 1: If you really want to go deafcom for so, if
17:05
Speaker 1: we can do that, of course, the police can do it.
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Speaker 1: Experts in computer technology can do it. So here she
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Speaker 1: is and we understand. Speaking of her digital footprint, she
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Speaker 1: left specific instructions on the website as to when the
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Speaker 1: husbandwoman's husband would be at work when so the hit
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Speaker 1: the Sicilian hitman would know when she was alone not
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Speaker 1: to hurt the husband and make it look like it
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Speaker 1: was I think a robbery gone bad, it's what she wanted,
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Speaker 1: or an accident. So ray kaput. What did she tell
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Speaker 1: the Sicilian hitman International that she wont and what specifically
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Speaker 1: did she want? Well, she wanted this woman dead, and
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Speaker 1: the other thing was she didn't want the X, the
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Speaker 1: person that she was having an affair, way to hurt.
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Speaker 1: So she had very very specific instruction that you know,
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Speaker 1: when those instructions, it becomes evident what she wanted to do.
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Speaker 1: She wanted to get this woman out of the way
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Speaker 1: through this murder for higher plot so she could have
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Speaker 1: her husband all to herself until she bought you know, Miranda.
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Speaker 1: When police get a hold of her, she immediately after
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Speaker 1: ten minutes blurts out that she did it, Kathleen Murphy.
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Speaker 1: Then she wanted a lawyer, but it was too late.
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Speaker 1: She had already blurted out to cops that she did it. Nancy,
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Speaker 1: this woman is clearly delusional. She's not thinking. And nice
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Speaker 1: see people that come through our court system time and
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Speaker 1: time again who think they're smarter than the police, who
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Speaker 1: think they're smarter than the detective, who have no clue
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Speaker 1: that everything they're typing on their computers can be traced.
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Speaker 1: I have programs where I print out all these text
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Speaker 1: messages and to read these text messages, people are clueless
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Speaker 1: as to the imprint or the footprint that they're leaving.
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Speaker 1: You know, I'm looking online at some photos CBS posted,
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Speaker 1: and it's of the legitimate fiance, not the marry coworker
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Speaker 1: bending down giving her the rings, saying Tina, will you
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Speaker 1: marry me? Tina says yes, but that wasn't enough. She
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Speaker 1: had to have not only the married co worker, but
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Speaker 1: his wife's head on a platter. That's Tina Jones. She
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Speaker 1: played guilty to attempted murder. Guide about twelve years plus probation.
19:22
Speaker 1: Hi guys, Nancy Grace here, we have all worked so
19:26
Speaker 1: hard to bring to you Don't Be a Victim, Fighting
19:31
Speaker 1: back against America's crime Wave, a brand new book. After
19:36
Speaker 1: interviewing literally hundreds of crime victims and police, we put
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Speaker 1: our knowledge into Don't Be a Victim. You could pre
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Speaker 1: order now go to Crime online dot Com. Pre order
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Speaker 1: now and know that portions of our proceeds goes to
19:55
Speaker 1: the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. Crime Stories
20:04
Speaker 1: With Nancy Grace, we are switching gears here at Fox
20:11
Speaker 1: Nation and series Sex and one eleven. We're talking about
20:14
Speaker 1: the mischief and mayhem and murder, among other things that's
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Speaker 1: going down on a so called dark web. You may
20:22
Speaker 1: not have ever heard of it, but boy of I
20:24
Speaker 1: now we're talking about a young person, a young woman
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Speaker 1: named Amy l Wine and the suspect, Steven all Wine.
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Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friend chelseagona nine one one
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Speaker 1: with the adjecue emergency. I think my wife. There's blood
20:44
Speaker 1: all over shot gun. It looks like a gut wrenching
20:52
Speaker 1: scene plays out During a nine one one call, A
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Speaker 1: young boy is the first to find his mother's shot
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Speaker 1: to death inside their home. Does she still out the weapon?
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Speaker 1: I don't know. We just got shoot herself. I don't know.
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Speaker 1: I just saw her and in bloody busy trying to
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Speaker 1: console his son, Stephen Alwine has little information for the operator. Okay,
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Speaker 1: do you re see her right now? I'm with my
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Speaker 1: friend sar. Do you know if she was breathing it all?
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Speaker 1: I don't from dinner? Okay, would you like to check
21:26
Speaker 1: on her and see if she is or do you
21:28
Speaker 1: believe that she's beyond house? There for a second, they
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Speaker 1: want me to check on her. Stephen quickly returns to
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Speaker 1: the phone with the tragic news. Okay, I'm not breathing.
21:39
Speaker 1: I can't tell where she shot. Wow, our friend Michelsea
21:43
Speaker 1: gone crime watched daily. He sounds awfully calm to have
21:47
Speaker 1: just found his wife's shot dead and his son going
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Speaker 1: bizarre of course after saying, Mommy covered in blood. I'm
21:55
Speaker 1: not quite sure how the dark web is going to
21:57
Speaker 1: fit into this, but I know this much. And defense
22:00
Speaker 1: attorneys will argue with Matill, they're blue in the face.
22:03
Speaker 1: But he sounded real, Jackie. Did he sound calm to you?
22:06
Speaker 1: He sounded very calm to me, like she shot herself dead.
22:11
Speaker 1: I'm not buying that for a minute. To Kamputer Laid
22:14
Speaker 1: news anchor Orlando's morning news w d B, oh right,
22:18
Speaker 1: what happened exactly? Well, this case actually starts like six
22:22
Speaker 1: months before her murder, when the the SBI pops up
22:26
Speaker 1: on aby All wine store and they give her some
22:28
Speaker 1: shocking news answer. They say someone put a hit out
22:31
Speaker 1: for on the dark web. And they figured this out
22:33
Speaker 1: because there was a white hat, a white hat computer hackers,
22:37
Speaker 1: an ethical computer hacker out of the UK, and he
22:39
Speaker 1: broke into one of these websites and he found all
22:41
Speaker 1: this information and ends up passing it along. And that's
22:44
Speaker 1: how SBI and figure out somebody wanted Amy killed. Somebody
22:49
Speaker 1: that used the handle dog Day God paid six thous
22:53
Speaker 1: whoa the handle was wet dog day God. Okay, can
23:00
Speaker 1: to leave that to our strength to figure that one out.
23:01
Speaker 1: But that's his handle, now, you said six months before,
23:05
Speaker 1: and she stayed in the home even though the FBI,
23:09
Speaker 1: if I got my fact straight, called her and said, hey,
23:13
Speaker 1: somebody put a six thousand dollars hit on your life.
23:16
Speaker 1: And she stayed in the home with her child. Yeah,
23:18
Speaker 1: she did, with her husband or a child. I know
23:20
Speaker 1: that they had purchased a gun because they were scared,
23:23
Speaker 1: but you know, unfortunately that was the same gun that
23:27
Speaker 1: Amy alridly allegedly had used to kill herself. So yeah,
23:30
Speaker 1: they stayed in that home, Nancy. A trial kicking off
23:34
Speaker 1: for a so called church elder, a forty four year
23:39
Speaker 1: old church elder out of Minnesota accused of killing his
23:44
Speaker 1: wife and staging it to look like suicide after a
23:48
Speaker 1: failed attempt to hire a hitman on the dark web
23:52
Speaker 1: so he could quote date other women. Might be hard
23:58
Speaker 1: to date other women from behind bars on a life sentence.
24:02
Speaker 1: I don't understand that thinking, but we see it all
24:05
Speaker 1: the time. To John Cardillo, hosts America Talks on news
24:10
Speaker 1: Max TV former NYPD, it reminds me of Scott Peterson.
24:15
Speaker 1: If you want to have a relationship with Amber Fry,
24:17
Speaker 1: who's gorgeous, why not just get a divorce and let
24:22
Speaker 1: your wife's whole family hate you, because your family's gonna
24:26
Speaker 1: blame her no matter what and date. I'd be mad
24:31
Speaker 1: if you didn't get after it. Why murder? How many
24:35
Speaker 1: times have you seen that? John Cardillo, Nancy? It's always
24:38
Speaker 1: been the question, right, I mean these guys, first of all,
24:43
Speaker 1: aside from committing the murder, the heinous act taking a
24:46
Speaker 1: life instead of just losing a couple of bucks in
24:49
Speaker 1: a divorce settlement, havn't your wife's family hate you? People
24:51
Speaker 1: you were going to be out of touch with anyway
24:53
Speaker 1: when you go off with the new person you're seeing,
24:55
Speaker 1: either break up with them and see somebody new or
24:57
Speaker 1: married somebody else. You're now sitting in jail for the
24:59
Speaker 1: rest of your life. If you're in a capital murder state,
25:02
Speaker 1: sitting on death row, you'll probably spend close to a
25:04
Speaker 1: million bucks in legal fees. Your life is destroyed. A
25:08
Speaker 1: church elder, it's not going to have a million dollars.
25:10
Speaker 1: And the Methodist church that I'm a part of, the
25:13
Speaker 1: pastors man, they need to pay raise big time. Yeah, okay,
25:16
Speaker 1: but I'm talking about the normal guy who goes out there,
25:18
Speaker 1: maybe has a couple of bucks and messes around on
25:21
Speaker 1: his wife. You're right, why not just leave her. I've
25:24
Speaker 1: never understood the psychopathology of killing the person you're with.
25:28
Speaker 1: I've just never never made sense to me. People get
25:32
Speaker 1: divorced every day. There's a couple of months of hiccup,
25:34
Speaker 1: a little bit of unpleasantries, and then everybody gets over
25:37
Speaker 1: it and moves on and goes on with their life,
25:39
Speaker 1: and everybody has things doing their life. So yes, never
25:41
Speaker 1: understood it. You know. Another layer to this is that
25:48
Speaker 1: the alleged killer is not from the dark Web. It's
25:53
Speaker 1: actually the church. What do they call him? A church elder?
26:00
Speaker 1: A thank his position within the church made it impossible
26:03
Speaker 1: for him to get a divorce, so it's better to
26:05
Speaker 1: commit murder. I want you to take a Lissa now
26:08
Speaker 1: to our friends at Fox nine Minneapolis, Saint Paul reporter
26:11
Speaker 1: Tom Leiden, dog day, God goes on. This bitch has
26:16
Speaker 1: torn my family apart by sleeping with my husband, who
26:20
Speaker 1: then left me and is stealing clients from my business.
26:25
Speaker 1: There are dozens of emails over the next two months
26:28
Speaker 1: as dog Day God sends thirteen thousand dollars an anonymous
26:32
Speaker 1: bitcoin to Bessimafia, asking them to kill Amy when she
26:37
Speaker 1: makes a trip to Maline, Illinois to make it look
26:40
Speaker 1: like an accident, but that falls through. There's another plan
26:44
Speaker 1: to kill Amy at home during spring break when her
26:47
Speaker 1: husband and son are away and burn the house down,
26:51
Speaker 1: but that falls through too. It's the level of detail
26:55
Speaker 1: that stood out for detectives. This was someone who knew
26:58
Speaker 1: Amy's every move. It starts to look pretty obvious that
27:03
Speaker 1: dog Day God was somebody very close to Amy all
27:05
Speaker 1: Wine at that point for all of us, I think,
27:08
Speaker 1: and not only that, it was someone that wanted the
27:10
Speaker 1: husband and the son spared. As a matter of fact,
27:15
Speaker 1: the dog Day God person the killer was very careful
27:23
Speaker 1: in their specifications as to how they wanted this innocent mother,
27:27
Speaker 1: Amy Allwine murdered. Take a listen again to our friends
27:31
Speaker 1: at Fox NI Minneapolis, Saint Paul Web of lies that
27:35
Speaker 1: Tom Leiden. The FBI had contacted the all Wines and
27:39
Speaker 1: Cottage Grove Police. FBI agents told the all Wines they
27:43
Speaker 1: had received information that a murder for higher inquiry had
27:47
Speaker 1: been located on the dark web. A part of the
27:50
Speaker 1: Internet that is all but untraceable, with Amy all Wine
27:54
Speaker 1: as the intended target. The website was called Bessa Mafia,
28:00
Speaker 1: claim to be run by Albanian gangsters contracting with professional
28:04
Speaker 1: hitmen around the world. Someone had recently hacked the site
28:09
Speaker 1: and posted their private emails for the world to see,
28:13
Speaker 1: including an email chain from someone in Minnesota with the
28:17
Speaker 1: name dog Day God who writes, I am looking to
28:22
Speaker 1: hire you for a hit. But what is the recommended
28:25
Speaker 1: way to convert cash to bitcoin? Man? Oh Man, what
28:30
Speaker 1: a trail they're leaving behind. Hey, by the way, this
28:35
Speaker 1: is the base of mafia, Albanian gangsters. It sounds like
28:41
Speaker 1: a fifth grader writing a crime novel. The last one
28:45
Speaker 1: was Sicilian Hitman International. This is base up mafia, the
28:50
Speaker 1: Albanian gangsters, and now they're actually asking the alleged hitman
28:56
Speaker 1: to explain to them how to change my any currency
29:01
Speaker 1: into bitcoin. Crime stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, we are
29:19
Speaker 1: talking about the so called dark web. What isn't how
29:23
Speaker 1: does it work? Why are people using it? It is
29:27
Speaker 1: still functionaling? Right now we're talking about Amy all Wine.
29:32
Speaker 1: At first, police are told that it is a suicide,
29:37
Speaker 1: that she shot herself but that didn't cut it with police.
29:42
Speaker 1: Take a list to our friend, Michelle Sigona. Sergeant Randy
29:45
Speaker 1: McAllister at the Cottage Grove Police Department was the first
29:49
Speaker 1: detective on the scene. You questioned the suicide theory right
29:53
Speaker 1: off the bat. Yeah, I hadn't completely discarded it yet
29:57
Speaker 1: because when weird things can happen with physical evidence and
30:01
Speaker 1: blood splatter in physics, but it was enough for me
30:04
Speaker 1: to at least put the brakes on. What stuck out
30:07
Speaker 1: to you. She was sort of laid out with her
30:09
Speaker 1: arms out to forty five degrees. That's not a normal
30:13
Speaker 1: position for somebody who's just shot themselves in the head.
30:16
Speaker 1: Another red flag blood drops around the bedroom. There were
30:20
Speaker 1: some what we call satellite blood drops outside of the
30:24
Speaker 1: mean blood pool itself, which suggests that there was something
30:28
Speaker 1: suspended above that area in dripping blood down. Also, the
30:32
Speaker 1: position of the gun on Amy's left side. Her family,
30:37
Speaker 1: who's outside by this time, says she's right handed. So
30:40
Speaker 1: there are three red flags immediately sticking out to you.
30:43
Speaker 1: Right you're hearing our friends at Crime Watch Daily. That
30:46
Speaker 1: was Michelle Sigona to Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics, Jacksonville,
30:50
Speaker 1: State University, an author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon.
30:54
Speaker 1: I'd like you to address I mean, we can all
30:56
Speaker 1: as light people understand the guns on the wrong side
30:59
Speaker 1: of the body. Now, it possibly could have reacted and
31:05
Speaker 1: gone across her body and landed on the left side.
31:08
Speaker 1: But I want you to address the forty five degree
31:12
Speaker 1: angle at which her arms were found from her body.
31:17
Speaker 1: And as he says, satellite blood drops. Yeah, the angle
31:21
Speaker 1: or position of the arms relative to a weapon, for instance,
31:27
Speaker 1: it needs to marry up with the consistency of the
31:31
Speaker 1: weapon itself. You know, just for example, if if the
31:35
Speaker 1: if the arm, say, for instance, is in this kind
31:38
Speaker 1: of odd contorted position relative to the weapon, it would
31:42
Speaker 1: give the detective at the scene pause to think, well,
31:45
Speaker 1: this just doesn't marry up. Now. The other thing that
31:48
Speaker 1: we have to think about, Nancy, is these satellite blood droplets.
31:52
Speaker 1: So remember what the detective said. He said that these
31:55
Speaker 1: are not These are not like a real dynamic blood droplet.
31:59
Speaker 1: It's not a dynamic bloodstain like when we hear about
32:02
Speaker 1: things like cast off from beatings or stabbings, or even
32:05
Speaker 1: high velocity from a blast. This is something that's literally
32:09
Speaker 1: dripping at a very slow rate of speed, probably off
32:13
Speaker 1: of something at an elevated height, maybe off of the hand,
32:16
Speaker 1: or maybe off of the tip of a weapon, say,
32:20
Speaker 1: for instance, that's hovering above the level the surface of
32:23
Speaker 1: the floor. So it's going to give a completely different
32:26
Speaker 1: dynamic in appearance. And somebody that's trained like this detective
32:29
Speaker 1: is sure to recognize that at the scene, And of course,
32:32
Speaker 1: what's the medical examiner performs the autopsy, he or she
32:36
Speaker 1: can clearly see the trajectory path of the bullet, which
32:39
Speaker 1: would most likely show that suicide was impossible. In other words,
32:44
Speaker 1: if she was shot from the back of the head
32:46
Speaker 1: right upward to downward, clearly that's not a suicide. So
32:50
Speaker 1: let me ask you this, Ray Kaputo, what happens to
32:54
Speaker 1: the Minnesota church elder Stephen all Wine? Well, Nancy, I
32:59
Speaker 1: needed that please start taking all this evidence in. It
33:02
Speaker 1: becomes very clear that he had something to do with it.
33:06
Speaker 1: They charged him with a crime. He ends up going
33:09
Speaker 1: on trial and he's convicted of murder, and he's convicted
33:12
Speaker 1: of being dog day God. So he is going to
33:15
Speaker 1: pay for his crime. But you know, he thought he
33:17
Speaker 1: was the smartest guy in the room. Nancy, What's what's
33:21
Speaker 1: the sentence. I believe he's he's going away for life. Nancy. Yeah,
33:24
Speaker 1: you know what. Anna Blake, Minnesota has the death penalty,
33:27
Speaker 1: so I had plenty of time behind bars to think
33:30
Speaker 1: back on his foiled murder plot, and that leaves their
33:34
Speaker 1: little boy without a mother or a father. There is
33:38
Speaker 1: also the case of Alexis Stern. Take a listen to this.
33:42
Speaker 1: He was just like, I think you should sit down.
33:45
Speaker 1: Someone put a hit out on you and they want
33:47
Speaker 1: you to I was like, this is a joke, right,
33:53
Speaker 1: It was not a joke. On the dark web, someone
33:57
Speaker 1: using the alias Mastermind three five had gone to a
34:01
Speaker 1: hitman for Higher Sight and paid about five thousand dollars
34:05
Speaker 1: worth of bitcoin for Alexis to be assassinated, giving chilling
34:12
Speaker 1: details where I loomed, where I worked, from, a picture
34:15
Speaker 1: of me, a description of me, everything. FBI and Homeland
34:20
Speaker 1: Security agents soon got involved. Although many dark web sites
34:24
Speaker 1: are scams, Alexis knew someone out there wanted her debt
34:29
Speaker 1: and that terrified me. Authorities promised to investigate. Here hearing
34:34
Speaker 1: our friends at CBS forty eight hours that was Peter
34:36
Speaker 1: van zandt. Police come to this young lady and tell
34:40
Speaker 1: her there is a hit on her, that she is
34:43
Speaker 1: scheduled to die. All this goes down on the dark web,
34:48
Speaker 1: straight out to psychiatrists, how the eland of jurisdiction joining
34:52
Speaker 1: us Doctor Angela Arnold, Doctor ANGELA question. Have you noticed
34:57
Speaker 1: the code names, the handles, the user names these people use,
35:01
Speaker 1: for instance Mastermind three sixty five or dog Day God.
35:09
Speaker 1: What does that tell you? They're very grandios? Aren't they?
35:13
Speaker 1: These names are very grandios. These people seem to It
35:17
Speaker 1: seems to be a portrayal that they don't think that
35:19
Speaker 1: anyone can and get to them. They are going to
35:24
Speaker 1: go through with what they're trying to do. To John Cardillo,
35:27
Speaker 1: hosts America Talks news Max TV, former NYPD, I want
35:30
Speaker 1: you to take a listen to our friend Peter van Zant.
35:33
Speaker 1: Listen to this. We asked Alexis Stern to read the
35:37
Speaker 1: disturbing emails between the person who wanted her dead code
35:41
Speaker 1: named Mastermind three six five and Eura, the alleged murder
35:47
Speaker 1: for higher Kingpin on the dark Web. I can see
35:53
Speaker 1: on your website that the services you offer are murder, assault, arson, kidnapping.
35:58
Speaker 1: Is the job that I had in mind? Mastermind three
36:02
Speaker 1: six five sent this picture of Alexis to Ura. Then
36:07
Speaker 1: for some reason, about a week later, he upgraded his
36:11
Speaker 1: order from kidnapping too. I would just like this person dead.
36:17
Speaker 1: I would just like this person to be shot and killed. Wow.
36:21
Speaker 1: Straight out to Ray Caputo joining me, lead news anchor
36:27
Speaker 1: Orlando's Morning News WDBO. What happened? Then, after the fans
36:32
Speaker 1: go to Alexis, tell her about the plot. What happens? Well,
36:38
Speaker 1: I'll tell you what, Nancy. She gets spooked. Herners family
36:41
Speaker 1: literally get in their car and they just drive away.
36:45
Speaker 1: Because you know, if you'd think that, you know, somebody's
36:48
Speaker 1: out there, they don't know who it is. I mean,
36:49
Speaker 1: it's like completely shocked his family. So they get up
36:52
Speaker 1: and they leave. Now from that point forward, you know,
36:56
Speaker 1: Alexis starts putting two and two together, and the first
36:59
Speaker 1: person that she thinks of who could do this is
37:02
Speaker 1: an ex boyfriend that she had lives over all the
37:04
Speaker 1: way over across the pond in the UK. And then
37:07
Speaker 1: she starts putting two and two together and contacts authorities
37:10
Speaker 1: about it. Guys, we're talking about the dark Web and
37:15
Speaker 1: how the Internet is used to transfer her child pornography,
37:20
Speaker 1: stolen goods, even higher hitmen. Alexa Stern says she believes
37:28
Speaker 1: it was her ex, her boyfriend from Great Britain that
37:31
Speaker 1: wanted her dead. He absolutely refutes that to Kathleen Murphy,
37:36
Speaker 1: North Carolina family lawyer. You can find her at insee
37:39
Speaker 1: Domestic law dot com. I mean, if this is happening
37:44
Speaker 1: happening in a dating relationship, what do you think's going
37:46
Speaker 1: to happen after they get married? So, Nancy, I have
37:49
Speaker 1: one word for all of this. I mean, I listened
37:52
Speaker 1: to the entire podcast, and people really need to consider
37:55
Speaker 1: pre nuptural agreement. I think they're just trying to stay alive.
38:00
Speaker 1: I don't think they're worried about there checking account four
38:05
Speaker 1: one K. They're just trying to stay alive. But here
38:09
Speaker 1: we're understanding this is her ex so apparently. I mean,
38:13
Speaker 1: I'm guessing she broke up with him, but the reality
38:17
Speaker 1: is he swears he had nothing to do that. Take
38:19
Speaker 1: a listen one last time to CBS forty eight hours,
38:22
Speaker 1: Peter van zandt do you have any doubt in your
38:26
Speaker 1: mind who put out the contract on your life? I
38:29
Speaker 1: have no doubt in my mind that it is Adrian Fry.
38:33
Speaker 1: Adrian Fry, her ex boyfriend from England. When she saw
38:38
Speaker 1: the kill order dated July fifteenth. She says the timing
38:42
Speaker 1: suddenly made sense to her what had happened the day
38:46
Speaker 1: before July. That is when I told Adrian that I
38:52
Speaker 1: was dating someone else. And it wasn't just the timing
38:56
Speaker 1: of the hit order, she says, it was the language
39:00
Speaker 1: two sounds very British. I would just like this person dead,
39:04
Speaker 1: but if there's any more information, you would like in
39:06
Speaker 1: box me. I don't know anyone in America that uses
39:10
Speaker 1: the term in box me. Adrian, on the other hand,
39:13
Speaker 1: often would say that alexis noticed, mastermind three six five,
39:21
Speaker 1: sometimes referred to himself with a lowercase I. She says,
39:25
Speaker 1: when Adrian wrote her, he did the same thing, lowercase
39:30
Speaker 1: I in box me. The devil is in the details.
39:35
Speaker 1: We wait as justice unfalls. Nancy Grace Crime Story, signing
39:40
Speaker 1: off Goodbye friend,