Latest / QUESTION EVERYTHING / Bobbi Brown: The Key to Confidence + Why it's a GOOD Thing To Be a Bit Naive With The Business & Beauty Icon

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Bobbi Brown: The Key to Confidence + Why it's a GOOD Thing To Be a Bit Naive With The Business & Beauty Icon · QUESTION EVERYTHING

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: The following podcast is a Dear Media production.
• 0:03
  Speaker 2: Hi.
• 0:04
  Speaker 3: I'm Caroline Stanbury and I am Divorced Not Dead. Fresh
• 0:07
  Speaker 3: off the back of my divorce. I'm bringing real stories,
• 0:10
  Speaker 3: real life, real talk on all things that aren't said.
• 0:13
  Speaker 3: Why do we put so much pressure on ourselves for
• 0:16
  Speaker 3: the happily ever after? Does our love story really have
• 0:18
  Speaker 3: to be one great, lengthy novel or can we be
• 0:21
  Speaker 3: happy with a book of short but exciting love stories.
• 0:24
  Speaker 3: I guess we'll find out on Divorce Not Dead and
• 0:27
  Speaker 3: Lucky me, you'll be joining me for the journey, So
• 0:29
  Speaker 3: buckle up.
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: Big things happen when you're pretty, pretty bold, pretty clever,
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: pretty strong. I'm Danielle Robe, and each week my guests
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: and I have conversations that put a new spin on pretty.
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: This is pretty smart. When you think of a billion
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: dollar makeup line, you think glamour. But Bobby Brown has
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: always taken a different approach. It may not seem revolutionary today,
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: but back in the eighties, when she started to mash
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: off the shelf cosmetics together to create colors that weren't
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: even on the market, she was trying something totally different.
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: She was trying to convince millions of women that makeup
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  Speaker 2: could almost be invisible. Bobby Brown completely disrupted the makeup industry,
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: and she's doing it again with her new clean makeup line,
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: Jones Road. So, Bobby, your story was so fascinating to
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: me as I researched, I learned so many of the
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: different steps that took you to where you are right now.
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: But before we dive into the big, beautiful life that
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: you've built, both professionally and personally, I feel like we
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: can't fully understand you without really going back to where
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: you grew up in Chicago. I'm curious to know what
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: your house was like, what were your parents like.
• 2:04
  Speaker 4: Well, when I first was born, I apparently lived with
• 2:07
  Speaker 4: my grandparents in the city, and my dad and my
• 2:10
  Speaker 4: mom moved to the suburbs and Well Met to a
• 2:15
  Speaker 4: very you know, like typical small house, three bedrooms, and
• 2:22
  Speaker 4: I believe.
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  Speaker 1: We didn't move there until my brother was born.
• 2:27
  Speaker 4: So growing up, my my house and well Met, which
• 2:30
  Speaker 4: was on the corner, and it was just this normal,
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: like now I look at it, it was so teeny,
• 2:36
  Speaker 4: you know. I lived there with my mother, my father,
• 2:39
  Speaker 4: my two siblings, and our dog, and it was just
• 2:43
  Speaker 4: like your typical Chicago suburb The only thing not typical
• 2:48
  Speaker 4: was down the block was a family that was the
• 2:52
  Speaker 4: children of Hugh Hefner.
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: So Hugh Hefner would.
• 2:56
  Speaker 4: Come visit his you know, his his family or his
• 2:59
  Speaker 4: ex family times.
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  Speaker 1: But that was the only thing like not normal and typical.
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  Speaker 2: You had a mini bunny ranch down the block.
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: How did you get the name Bobby? Were you named
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: after somebody?
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  Speaker 1: You know?
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  Speaker 4: I was named after my great grandmother, Berta, who I
• 3:15
  Speaker 4: never met, because, as you know, in the Jewish tradition,
• 3:18
  Speaker 4: you take the same initial, but it can't be the
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: same name. So they were going to name me Roberta,
• 3:22
  Speaker 4: and my grandmother said, no, it has to be the
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  Speaker 4: same initial.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: And so my mother my.
• 3:27
  Speaker 4: Father said well, let's just call her Bobby because then
• 3:29
  Speaker 4: people will remember her.
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: I wonder if you would have sold as many lipsticks
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  Speaker 2: with Roberta Brown or Berta Brown.
• 3:37
  Speaker 4: I know people think Bobby Brown is a made up name.
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: It is not.
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  Speaker 4: But I have once almost missed my opportunity on Oprah.
• 3:46
  Speaker 4: I had a live segment on Oprah and the car
• 3:49
  Speaker 4: service couldn't find me. He was looking for the other
• 3:52
  Speaker 4: Bobby Brown. So every time I'd like wave my hand
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  Speaker 4: on here. He shushed me away, and I'm like, where's
• 3:58
  Speaker 4: my car?
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  Speaker 1: And anyways, it was that guy.
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: That's funny. So you wrote a letter to your younger
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  Speaker 2: self and you said, the secret to beauty is simple,
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: be who you are. I think so many people would
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: be shocked to hear a renowned makeup artists say just
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: be who you are. How did that become your beauty philosophy?
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  Speaker 1: I learned the hard way. In middle school.
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  Speaker 4: I was the kid that always was, you know, feeling
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  Speaker 4: insecure and thinking my friends were you know, blonder and
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  Speaker 4: taller and more athletic and.
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  Speaker 1: Smarter, and I always had, you know, some kind of.
• 4:32
  Speaker 4: Self esteem issues, probably based on the fact that I'm teeny,
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  Speaker 4: I'm five foot tall, and I'm not an athlete, I
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  Speaker 4: can't sing, and I wasn't necessarily the brainiest person in
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  Speaker 4: the class. And what does a person like that do.
• 4:45
  Speaker 4: I moved to New York and start working with supermodels
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  Speaker 4: with one names, and I'm at you know, Linda and
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  Speaker 4: Cindy and Christy and you know, onward, and I realized
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  Speaker 4: that I cannot compare myself to someone else because.
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: I will lose most of the time. And you know,
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: what does it really matter.
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  Speaker 4: So I just started realizing that, you know, once I'm
• 5:06
  Speaker 4: myself and I figure out what clothes work for me,
• 5:10
  Speaker 4: what hair works for me, my style, then I could
• 5:13
  Speaker 4: just be myself and being comfortable in your skin is
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: what makes you confident. And it was such a like,
• 5:20
  Speaker 4: oh my god, it's so simple.
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  Speaker 2: It happened when you moved to New York.
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  Speaker 4: It happened over time after I moved to New York.
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  Speaker 4: You know, when I first moved here, I was, you know,
• 5:29
  Speaker 4: twenty three to twenty four years old and just trying
• 5:33
  Speaker 4: to figure myself out. And then you know, eventually I
• 5:37
  Speaker 4: got into the fashion industry, and that's when I realized,
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  Speaker 4: just because these models are born this way and are
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  Speaker 4: so absolutely stunning and gorgeous, I'm not going to feel
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  Speaker 4: bad because I don't look like that.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, there's also so many different things that we value, right,
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  Speaker 2: And it's so hard in America because for women, we
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: value beauty often over everything else when it shouldn't be
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: the case.
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: But honestly, I do think everyone is beautiful.
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  Speaker 4: Like just because you are, you know, an actress or
• 6:07
  Speaker 4: a model is not the only you know, description of beauty.
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: There's you know, there's to me.
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  Speaker 4: I love you know, people that are interesting, that have
• 6:16
  Speaker 4: a strong nose, have freckles, have a gap in their teeth, have.
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: Really curly hair. I mean, one of my models in
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: my new company has a shaved head and freckles, a
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: woman of color, and I just think she's so cool looking.
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: So I'd like to appreciate the differences.
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: So you went to Emerson and created your own major
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: because you didn't want to go to beauty school. Why
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: didn't you want to go to beauty school?
• 6:40
  Speaker 4: I knew that I did not want to be a hairdresser.
• 6:43
  Speaker 4: I knew I didn't want to be pigeonholed into just
• 6:48
  Speaker 4: doing makeup in a salon. I didn't want to, you know,
• 6:51
  Speaker 4: be working in a department store for the rest of
• 6:54
  Speaker 4: my life. I wanted to do movies and film. I
• 6:56
  Speaker 4: never even thought about fashion, and that's that's what my
• 7:00
  Speaker 4: mom encouraged me to do.
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  Speaker 2: And then I loved this part. You were in your
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: senior year and wrote a letter to a makeup artist
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: whose name you found in a magazine. Yes, and she
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: didn't answer.
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: She didn't answer, and then I was like, Okay.
• 7:15
  Speaker 4: When I moved to New York, I looked her up
• 7:17
  Speaker 4: and I got her number and I called her. She
• 7:20
  Speaker 4: never called me back, but on the answering machine it
• 7:23
  Speaker 4: said call my agent with his name and number, and
• 7:26
  Speaker 4: I did, and he said, come on in, come talk
• 7:29
  Speaker 4: to me. And I said to him, will you represent me?
• 7:32
  Speaker 4: He said, I can't represent you. You don't have a
• 7:35
  Speaker 4: book of work. And I said, how am I going
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  Speaker 4: to get a book of work unless I have someone
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  Speaker 4: represent me.
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  Speaker 1: But he started helping me.
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  Speaker 4: And he started just you know, someone needed an assistant,
• 7:45
  Speaker 4: or a young photographer needed a makeup artist. Then I
• 7:49
  Speaker 4: he would call me. So he Brian Bantry, started my
• 7:52
  Speaker 4: freelance career.
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  Speaker 2: Would you say he's your gatekeeper.
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  Speaker 4: I mean he was there at the moment, He was
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  Speaker 4: not my gatekeeper, but he definitely you know, threw me
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  Speaker 4: the keys. Yeah, And honestly, I learned it's what you
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  Speaker 4: put into something is what you get out of it.
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  Speaker 1: You know.
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  Speaker 4: I had to keep being in touch with him. He
• 8:10
  Speaker 4: did eventually represent me at one point in my life,
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  Speaker 4: really many many years later, and I ended up leaving
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  Speaker 4: him because he had so many people I didn't have
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  Speaker 4: the right attention.
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  Speaker 1: So I went to a different agency.
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  Speaker 2: Cool full circle moment, nonetheless, so I mean, you mentioned
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: a few of the supermodels you worked with, but you're
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: doing makeup for Naomi Campbell, Cindy Crawford, even Anna Wintour,
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  Speaker 2: and Keith Richards. At one point. You're a well known
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: makeup artist in New York. And you said you were
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: mixing all of these different colors because the eighties style
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: was like a lot of bright makeup and you didn't
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: like that. You wanted a much more natural look. You're
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: mixing all these colors. You wanted a natural, barely their look.
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: And you met a chemist at Keels. Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: Yes, I was a young makeup artist. I was actually
• 9:01
  Speaker 4: just pregnant with my first child. I was living in
• 9:05
  Speaker 4: the suburbs of New Jersey with my new husband. I
• 9:08
  Speaker 4: got pregnant a year after we got married, and I
• 9:13
  Speaker 4: started talking to the chemist because I said to him,
• 9:16
  Speaker 4: I really hate, you know, makeup on the market. I'm
• 9:19
  Speaker 4: always mixing and blending. He said, oh, I make these
• 9:21
  Speaker 4: lipsticks in the side, and he showed them to me
• 9:24
  Speaker 4: and I'm like, wow, those are really different and nice,
• 9:27
  Speaker 4: and he said I could make one for you. Tell
• 9:28
  Speaker 4: me what you want, and I described, you know, in
• 9:31
  Speaker 4: my layman's terms, how I wanted it to look how
• 9:34
  Speaker 4: I wanted it to feel, how I wanted to smell,
• 9:37
  Speaker 4: and the colors, and he made it for me, and
• 9:40
  Speaker 4: I thought, oh my gosh, everyone's going to want these.
• 9:43
  Speaker 4: And then I realized not everyone has the same color lips.
• 9:46
  Speaker 4: And then I realized not everyone likes a natural lip.
• 9:50
  Speaker 4: So I started to think and create in my head
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  Speaker 4: and on paper all these different tones based on the
• 9:57
  Speaker 4: different models.
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: I knew the name of my you know, my son's friends.
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  Speaker 4: I just started thinking about people from all over the globe,
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  Speaker 4: and I created ten colors that I started selling out
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  Speaker 4: of my house.
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  Speaker 2: How did they start selling from your house to Burgdorfs?
• 10:16
  Speaker 4: Well, our deal was the chemist and I. He would
• 10:20
  Speaker 4: make them and he would send them to me, and
• 10:22
  Speaker 4: I would have to deal with everything else. I would
• 10:25
  Speaker 4: have to you know, market them, pr them. I would
• 10:28
  Speaker 4: have to mail them. So, you know, I got the lipsticks.
• 10:32
  Speaker 4: So I took the lipsticks. I put them in a
• 10:34
  Speaker 4: you know, Manila envelope with a little piece of paper
• 10:37
  Speaker 4: with the ingredients, and I would label them and my
• 10:40
  Speaker 4: husband and then eventually my sister in law would bring
• 10:43
  Speaker 4: them to the post office and my sister in law
• 10:45
  Speaker 4: would do the books. The accounting. I was still a
• 10:48
  Speaker 4: working makeup artist. And you know, during that time, my
• 10:52
  Speaker 4: husband and I were invited to New York to a
• 10:55
  Speaker 4: party in the Upper East Side, very fancy, and I
• 10:59
  Speaker 4: think the lady who invited me it was a mutual
• 11:03
  Speaker 4: friend and she, you know, I said to her, what
• 11:05
  Speaker 4: do you do? And she said, oh, I'm a buyer,
• 11:08
  Speaker 4: a Burgdorf goodman, I said, in makeup. And I said, oh,
• 11:11
  Speaker 4: I have a new I'm a makeup artist and I
• 11:13
  Speaker 4: have a new line of lipsticks. And she said, oh
• 11:17
  Speaker 4: my God, tell me about them. And I pitched her
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: and she said, let me get back to you. And
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: she called me the next week and said, we'll take them.
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: And that's how I launched Burgdorf. I was not a
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: Burgdorf shopper.
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: Let me tell you.
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: It's interesting because a lot of people will say, like, oh,
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: I want to meet Oprah, I want to meet Phil
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: knight Er, I want to meet these sort of iconic people.
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: But if you were to meet them, what would you
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: actually say?
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: Hi?
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: Right? And it's like, but you had your pitch ready.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: Well I didn't have a pitch.
• 11:46
  Speaker 4: It was just I've always been very good at realizing
• 11:50
  Speaker 4: what is going on around me?
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: And you know, well why not?
• 11:54
  Speaker 4: Like I'm I don't think about trying to do these things.
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  Speaker 1: They just happened.
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  Speaker 4: I was once in an eleve and I said to
• 12:02
  Speaker 4: the girl in the elevator high and she said hi,
• 12:05
  Speaker 4: and I said something.
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  Speaker 1: You know, I'm Bobby.
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  Speaker 4: I live at whatever the thing was, and she said,
• 12:09
  Speaker 4: I'm sharing I'm at whatever, and you know, we were
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: at a high floor. So I said, what do you do?
• 12:14
  Speaker 4: She said, oh, I worked for a cosmetics lab in
• 12:16
  Speaker 4: New York. And I said, do you have a card?
• 12:19
  Speaker 4: And that's where I ended up. After the chemist, you know,
• 12:23
  Speaker 4: couldn't fulfill the next order. I called this girl Sharon,
• 12:27
  Speaker 4: and she brought me to the lab, the same lab
• 12:29
  Speaker 4: that I've worked with a million times since then. But
• 12:32
  Speaker 4: I met her in the elevator only because I said Hi.
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: I don't want to jump around timeline wise, but you
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: have this other chance meeting. I feel like we have
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: to talk about also. So one of the integral parts
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: of your story is that you were a Today's Show
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: beauty expert for fifteen years, and can you tell us
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: how you met Jeff Zucker?
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: Sure?
• 12:50
  Speaker 4: So I wrote my first book and I had to
• 12:53
  Speaker 4: go on book tour. And by the way, I only
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: wrote the book because on a beach in Nantucket I
• 12:58
  Speaker 4: met someone with her little kid who was a book agent. Okay,
• 13:01
  Speaker 4: that's the true story. And so I was on a
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: book tour and I was in Nieman Marcus, like the encircle,
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: which are all kind of the fancy, wealthy ladies, and
• 13:10
  Speaker 4: no one was paying attention to me.
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: It was like so noisy while I was talking. But
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: I said, any questions, and.
• 13:16
  Speaker 4: This cute, little redheaded, you know, older woman said I
• 13:20
  Speaker 4: have a question. I went over and I love older people,
• 13:24
  Speaker 4: and I answered her makeup question and she said, I
• 13:28
  Speaker 4: loved watching you on the Today Show. I had been
• 13:30
  Speaker 4: on once and I said thank you. She says, you've
• 13:32
  Speaker 4: done so much. What else would you want to do?
• 13:34
  Speaker 4: I said, I want to be a regular on the
• 13:37
  Speaker 4: Today Show. I never had that thought before. She said, honey,
• 13:40
  Speaker 4: Jeff Zucker, who was the executive producer, is my grandson.
• 13:44
  Speaker 4: And she called Jeff. I was on the show on Monday.
• 13:48
  Speaker 4: Jeff came down and he always called me Barbara. I
• 13:51
  Speaker 4: think that was her name, but I'm not sure. And
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: he said, Barbara, I'm glad you're on the show. He said,
• 13:57
  Speaker 4: you know, what do you want? And I said, I
• 14:00
  Speaker 4: don't know. Can I be a regular? He's like, all right,
• 14:02
  Speaker 4: you're a regular, come back tomorrow. I was on the
• 14:05
  Speaker 4: show the next day. He came down and he said,
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: all right, Barbara, now what do you want? I said,
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: can I be the beauty editor of the Today I
• 14:11
  Speaker 4: just made that up. I never heard of it. And
• 14:13
  Speaker 4: he said, okay. He never came the third day, so
• 14:17
  Speaker 4: I forgot to ask him for money. I was on
• 14:20
  Speaker 4: fourteen years, and I mean, it's funny. I'm still friends
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: with him and his ex wife and it's been a
• 14:25
  Speaker 4: long history.
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: And you said you never made a dime on the
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: Today Show. But it was still valuable.
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: Oh my god, it was the most valuable, you know,
• 14:32
  Speaker 4: if you think about it.
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: Back then, there was no social media. There was no Internet.
• 14:36
  Speaker 4: I don't even think you know, I had a computer.
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: So how do you get the word out about what
• 14:42
  Speaker 4: you're doing?
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: Well? TV? Hello?
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: You know how many homes did I reach? And by
• 14:48
  Speaker 4: the way, I never promoted my business. I never did
• 14:52
  Speaker 4: anything except became a trusted, you know, teacher to teach
• 14:56
  Speaker 4: people how to put makeup on. And this was not
• 14:59
  Speaker 4: planned but all of my products were always named by
• 15:02
  Speaker 4: the color they were. So when I'd say, get a
• 15:04
  Speaker 4: tawny blush, get a you know, a beige eyeshadow, I
• 15:07
  Speaker 4: had the colors.
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: I love that because it's also goes back to your
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: simplicity through line. You know, you just call it like
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: it is. So most makeup artists at that time are
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: putting on blue eyeshadow and red lipstick, and I'm sure
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: they see this line. And at this point also no
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: makeup artists had their own line. So they're all telling
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: you you're never going to be able to sell this stuff.
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: If you can describe the voice in your head that's
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: telling you, no, I'm going to sell this stuff. What
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: is that voice, what's it saying to you?
• 15:40
  Speaker 4: Well, it was, you know, makeup artists were always telling
• 15:43
  Speaker 4: me that my style of makeup wasn't popular and people
• 15:47
  Speaker 4: wouldn't hire me. So I proved that wrong slowly. I
• 15:50
  Speaker 4: couldn't do makeup that looked ugly, I mean, and it
• 15:54
  Speaker 4: looked ugly to me.
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: So I started doing it my way.
• 15:56
  Speaker 4: And I started, you know, building a community of people
• 15:59
  Speaker 4: that hire me for what I did. And then when
• 16:02
  Speaker 4: I did my own products, and you know, I wasn't
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: trying to impress beauty editors or annaintour or anyone fabulous.
• 16:10
  Speaker 4: I really was trying to help women find makeup that
• 16:14
  Speaker 4: look good on them. So I only cared about the
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: women so they could do their own makeup.
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: Where it was always like, well, you want.
• 16:21
  Speaker 4: To learn makeup, go meet a makeup artist and they
• 16:24
  Speaker 4: can draw you a drawing, and it's very complicated. So
• 16:27
  Speaker 4: in the beginning it was about the women that I would,
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: you know, meet and I would make it really simple
• 16:34
  Speaker 4: for them. Eventually, my audience were makeup artists because they
• 16:38
  Speaker 4: wanted to hone their skill and do better makeup.
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: I read this quote, it's really beautiful, you said when
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: things don't go right and get really tough, find a
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: way to power through, find a window of a door closes,
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: make up your own rules, and follow your gut. Finally,
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: don't lose your naivete It is a trait that will
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: make you most successful. I've never anybody credit their naivetate.
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: Why is that? And do you think you still have it?
• 17:05
  Speaker 4: I definitely still have it. I am someone that you know.
• 17:09
  Speaker 4: I don't do things because they make sense. I don't
• 17:12
  Speaker 4: do things because I know it's going to be a success.
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: I'm not afraid of doing something. And if someone says
• 17:19
  Speaker 4: it's not going to work, well, I'll find someone else,
• 17:23
  Speaker 4: you know, to tell them about it, or I'll do
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: it differently. But I think being naive, you know, I
• 17:29
  Speaker 4: just I don't think about, oh my god, what would
• 17:31
  Speaker 4: happen if like, I'm not fearful that way, And what's
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: the worst that happens. You know, what's the worst that happens.
• 17:39
  Speaker 4: It doesn't work out, I lose money. You know, I'll
• 17:42
  Speaker 4: figure out how to make more money.
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: That's all it is.
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: Do you think it's a trust in yourself too?
• 17:48
  Speaker 4: I think it's, you know, a combination. I mean, a
• 17:51
  Speaker 4: trust in myself. Yes, I'm I'm there's not a cocky
• 17:55
  Speaker 4: bone in me. There's not a Oh I think I'm better.
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: As a matter of fact, people always tell me that,
• 18:00
  Speaker 4: you know, I kind of self deprecate myself. You know,
• 18:03
  Speaker 4: I'm not the smartest person. I know I'm not, but
• 18:06
  Speaker 4: I'm different smart and you know that's taken me a
• 18:09
  Speaker 4: while to kind of figure out. But I just think that,
• 18:12
  Speaker 4: you know, I see so many interesting things that I
• 18:16
  Speaker 4: want to touch and be part of, and I you know,
• 18:19
  Speaker 4: I just I truly love people and love their stories.
• 18:21
  Speaker 4: And when you kind of put it all together, I mean,
• 18:25
  Speaker 4: I once pitched, now this is crazy. I had this
• 18:28
  Speaker 4: crazy idea that I wanted people to buy an eyeshadow
• 18:32
  Speaker 4: palette at Starbucks. I thought, people go in there in
• 18:36
  Speaker 4: the morning for coffee, let a grab and go, you know,
• 18:39
  Speaker 4: whatever it is. I had this crazy idea, and a
• 18:42
  Speaker 4: friend of mine, who's a guy named Mickey Drexler, gave
• 18:45
  Speaker 4: me Howard Schultz, then CEO and founder of Starbucks his email.
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: So I emailed him and I had someone on my
• 18:54
  Speaker 4: team draw up all these things, and I thought, I
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: already make eyeshadows coffee express, so cappuccino cafe. So I
• 19:03
  Speaker 4: pitched it to him and it was, I think a
• 19:05
  Speaker 4: brilliant idea. He said, I don't see it doesn't make
• 19:09
  Speaker 4: any sense. And I said, do me a favor. Just
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: go ask the girls on your team, the marketing team, whatever.
• 19:15
  Speaker 4: And he came back, you know, and said, I'm really sorry.
• 19:17
  Speaker 4: No one really understood it. This was a long time ago,
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: but you know what, so what, it didn't happen. But
• 19:23
  Speaker 4: I still think it was a great idea. Would you
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: not have gotten a cappuccino and a wake up your
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: eyes palette.
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: Of course for sure would have. So four years after launch,
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: in nineteen ninety five, you have a call with Este
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: Lauder and they want to buy one hundred percent of
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: your company. I read different numbers. Was it about one
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: hundred million dollars they bought it for? Yes? About that
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: sort of money is obviously life changing. And also this
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: company is your namesake and it's your baby. How did
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: you go about making that decision?
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: Well, at the time, I had two young sons. I
• 20:01
  Speaker 4: was about thirty three years old, maybe thirty four, living
• 20:05
  Speaker 4: in the suburbs.
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: You know, my kids in public.
• 20:08
  Speaker 4: School, lived in a house that I loved that my husband,
• 20:13
  Speaker 4: you know, developed, had a nice car. I think we
• 20:16
  Speaker 4: probably drove Volvo by then. You know when we sold
• 20:20
  Speaker 4: the company, well it wasn't for sale. But when Leonard
• 20:23
  Speaker 4: Latter called, he was the most charming, amazing man, and
• 20:27
  Speaker 4: he said to me, what if I told you that
• 20:30
  Speaker 4: I could help grow your company while you did what
• 20:33
  Speaker 4: you love, which is the creative part and the makeup
• 20:36
  Speaker 4: and being a mom to your kids. But we could,
• 20:39
  Speaker 4: you know, grow it like exponentially, And I we really
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: weren't for sale. But at the time, my husband and
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: I had business partners that we were not getting along with,
• 20:49
  Speaker 4: and it was really stressful, like really stressful, and it
• 20:55
  Speaker 4: was a great way for us to get out of
• 20:58
  Speaker 4: that situation. And you know, and Leonard was a trusted,
• 21:03
  Speaker 4: amazing guy and we did it. And you know, I
• 21:08
  Speaker 4: the only you know, I don't I don't think I
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: would have done it differently. I did sign a twenty
• 21:14
  Speaker 4: five year non compete, which at the time was like
• 21:17
  Speaker 4: twenty five years, I'm not going to want to work
• 21:19
  Speaker 4: in my sixties, and I did so I had to
• 21:23
  Speaker 4: wait for my non compete for my new gig.
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: There's this Japanese word ika guy, and it means purpose
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: and they say part of the reason Japanese people live
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: so long is because they may stop working, but they
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: never lose their ikea guy, their sense of purpose. And
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: I kept thinking about that word with you. You just
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: you keep I don't know if achievements the right word
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: because it's personal also, but you like you have a
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: forever want to expand.
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm not done. And by the way, my it's
• 21:52
  Speaker 4: not about it's not about how big and how much money.
• 21:56
  Speaker 4: I mean, I you know, I was part of a
• 21:58
  Speaker 4: billion dollar brand. So I did that and now I'm
• 22:02
  Speaker 4: doing my passion what I love. And of course I'm
• 22:05
  Speaker 4: very competitive. I wanted to be super successful, but I'm
• 22:09
  Speaker 4: also smart enough to know I also want my life
• 22:13
  Speaker 4: to be calm and happy. I love doing things I
• 22:17
  Speaker 4: don't know how to do. Like I have this, you know,
• 22:20
  Speaker 4: insatiable curiosity. I always think something could be better, you know.
• 22:24
  Speaker 4: I always kind of see what's wrong with certain things,
• 22:27
  Speaker 4: but also believe how I could do it better.
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: I love that you say, see how you could do
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: it better, because I kept reading about how, like you said,
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: I'm not the follow the leader kind of person. I
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: am the leader. I can't help it. And if I
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: see things not working where it makes sense to me,
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: I don't like it and I do it differently. You
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: have this obsession with efficiency that I also have, and
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: so I felt so connected to you. Is that just
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: like an innate quality? Is that something that you recognize
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: that your mom or dad had?
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: Like?
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: What is that?
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: You know?
• 22:59
  Speaker 4: I think it is from me being so overloaded and overwhelmed.
• 23:04
  Speaker 4: I get overwhelmed really easily. And when I saw the
• 23:09
  Speaker 4: beauty industry being over you know, being just overwhelming me.
• 23:12
  Speaker 4: I said, I've got to do things simple, which is
• 23:14
  Speaker 4: when I launched Bobby Brown, I called it Bobby Brown Essentials,
• 23:18
  Speaker 4: just to make it really simple. So I don't like
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: being overloaded. And I just I have such simple common
• 23:25
  Speaker 4: sense that I know if we had just had this
• 23:28
  Speaker 4: conversation and done it this way, we could have just
• 23:31
  Speaker 4: done this and not how to do thirty six meetings
• 23:34
  Speaker 4: and you know, bring in all these you know, waste
• 23:37
  Speaker 4: of money consultants. So I do have a little bit
• 23:40
  Speaker 4: of a obsession with order. I am a self diagnosed
• 23:45
  Speaker 4: OCD and add so you know, it's a creative thing.
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: But I'm learning.
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: How to balance my cortisol learning. I said, not there yet.
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: It's a forever as I think. Okay, so you mentioned
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: Bobby Brown Cosmetics turns into a billion dollar global brand. You,
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: I'm guessing, travel the world, live out major adventures. You
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: build a really happy family and happy home. I love
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: seeing that on your Instagram. If you can take me
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: behind the curtain. What was the hardest year since nineteen
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: ninety five? What do you gloss over in interviews?
• 24:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah, well, the hardest year by far was the last
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: year I was with the company.
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: There was, you know, hopefully I'll remember all of.
• 24:30
  Speaker 4: The details when I'm writing, you know, a biography or autobiography,
• 24:35
  Speaker 4: but or a business book. But there was so many
• 24:39
  Speaker 4: things that were just not right, you know, and it
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: got so big and there's a you know, you're owned
• 24:46
  Speaker 4: by a big corporation. I couldn't just snap my fingers
• 24:49
  Speaker 4: and fix things, and so it was really difficult for me,
• 24:54
  Speaker 4: really difficult, you know, on the workfront. On the personal front,
• 24:58
  Speaker 4: the hardest things were when my kids were young and
• 25:02
  Speaker 4: I would have to get on a plane and go
• 25:03
  Speaker 4: to Europe and one of my kids got chicken pox
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: and was really sick, and just the thought of me
• 25:09
  Speaker 4: leaving this child because I'm a natural born, you know, nurturer.
• 25:15
  Speaker 4: And I remember I said, okay, well I will stay
• 25:18
  Speaker 4: one more day.
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: I had to go to the UK.
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: And do a live TV show, and I would usually
• 25:23
  Speaker 4: get there a day before, so I can you know,
• 25:25
  Speaker 4: catch my sleep for a day, and I didn't. I
• 25:28
  Speaker 4: stayed a day until my son's you know, he's now
• 25:31
  Speaker 4: thirty one and getting married.
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: But when he you know, had.
• 25:34
  Speaker 4: A fever, and I flew got off the plane and
• 25:38
  Speaker 4: I went right to this live TV show.
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: It was so difficult. I was so exhausted. But the
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: only good news is I slept really well that night.
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: In hindsight, do you feel like you made the right
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: decisions in those trade offs or would you have put
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: more emphasis on one or the other.
• 25:57
  Speaker 4: I made the right decision because I could fulfill my
• 26:00
  Speaker 4: work obligation and I could, you know, nurture my child.
• 26:03
  Speaker 4: The only one that missed out was me because I
• 26:06
  Speaker 4: was exhausted.
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: But I was in my thirties.
• 26:08
  Speaker 4: I was young enough to take a hit where now
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: I would not work so well in my sixties.
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: You feel the difference in your energy, you know.
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: What, not in my energy, more in my recovery. You know.
• 26:20
  Speaker 4: The one thing that I have learned, and it's funny,
• 26:22
  Speaker 4: I just shared this with you know, people on my
• 26:25
  Speaker 4: team because we were at a you know, a lunch
• 26:28
  Speaker 4: is I learned early on that the things that aren't
• 26:31
  Speaker 4: working for me I got to stop doing. So you know,
• 26:35
  Speaker 4: how do you not eat cookies and cake when they're
• 26:37
  Speaker 4: in front of you? Because I realized if I eat them,
• 26:40
  Speaker 4: I'm going to feel a crap. You know, I'm not
• 26:42
  Speaker 4: going to eat a pizza for lunch, gluten free or not,
• 26:45
  Speaker 4: because I'm going to feel like crap. I stopped doing it.
• 26:48
  Speaker 4: So I always tell people if something that you're doing
• 26:51
  Speaker 4: is not working, stop doing it.
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: I was so interested to learn that you became a
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: certified health coach. Was this in between launching Jones Row
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: and your time at Bobby Brown?
• 27:01
  Speaker 4: Well, I never even imagined that I would, you know,
• 27:05
  Speaker 4: have the time to do it. When I was at Bobby,
• 27:07
  Speaker 4: my schedule was six months ahead of time completely, like
• 27:12
  Speaker 4: it was really really tough. You know, my kids vacations,
• 27:16
  Speaker 4: sometimes things got messed up. But it was the hardest
• 27:19
  Speaker 4: part was my calendar. When I left the brand, all
• 27:22
  Speaker 4: of a sudden, I had nothing on my calendar and
• 27:24
  Speaker 4: it was the most bizarre feeling for someone that was
• 27:28
  Speaker 4: so overscheduled. And that's when I was like, well, what
• 27:31
  Speaker 4: do I want to do? And I somehow I had
• 27:34
  Speaker 4: a book to promote, my ninth book, by the way,
• 27:37
  Speaker 4: I don't know how to type, but I've written nine books,
• 27:40
  Speaker 4: Beauty from the Inside Out, which is really about my
• 27:43
  Speaker 4: passion of healthy eating and lifestyle. So I promoted it
• 27:48
  Speaker 4: and then I, you know, somehow, my sister graduated from
• 27:53
  Speaker 4: which is the Institute of Integrate of Nutrition, and I
• 27:57
  Speaker 4: signed on and I went back to school.
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: And I loved every minute of it.
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: I have a health coach degree, not that I have
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: any paying customers, but do give people advice.
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: I can't help it.
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: Well, it seems like it played a role in the
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: launch of Jones Road.
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: Well, everything I do kind of goes into each other.
• 28:17
  Speaker 4: I mean, even my husband, I own a hotel in Montclair, Well,
• 28:21
  Speaker 4: how does that fit in? Well, lifestyle is everything to
• 28:24
  Speaker 4: me and people's experience. So when we developed this thirty
• 28:28
  Speaker 4: two room hotel, I really I had no experience how
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: to build a hotel. We had no budgets, we had
• 28:34
  Speaker 4: no timelines. I basically with my husband. He did the
• 28:37
  Speaker 4: construction the things he's brilliant on, and I thought about
• 28:41
  Speaker 4: people's experience. What sheets would they sleep on, what would
• 28:45
  Speaker 4: they eat in the morning, what coffee would they drink?
• 28:47
  Speaker 4: What is the robe like? So That's what I'm good at.
• 28:51
  Speaker 4: So I think of all of those things. And with
• 28:54
  Speaker 4: Jones Road, I wanted to create a makeup brand that
• 28:58
  Speaker 4: made women look better.
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: It was easy to use. Yes, I wanted to clean
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: because why would I not? Why would I?
• 29:06
  Speaker 4: You know, I didn't realize that one of my favorite
• 29:09
  Speaker 4: products at the old brand, the second ingredient is petroleum. Well,
• 29:13
  Speaker 4: you know, we're not putting petroleum on our faces anymore so,
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: and that was something that couldn't be changed when you're
• 29:19
  Speaker 4: part of a big company. But you know, I got
• 29:22
  Speaker 4: to do over. I got to do everything over.
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: I heard that you're about to celebrate the one year
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: anniversary of Jones Road, which is a huge milestone. You
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: obviously had so many learnings that you took from your
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: previous brand. What would you say is one of the
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: monumental learnings that you implemented in Jones Road something you
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: wanted to do differently this time?
• 29:44
  Speaker 4: Well, certainly I wanted to have, you know, an atmosphere
• 29:49
  Speaker 4: of light and relaxed because you know, sitting in a
• 29:54
  Speaker 4: corporate office is not fun. And you know, I'm looking
• 29:57
  Speaker 4: out now. There's three dogs today, sometime there's more, and
• 30:01
  Speaker 4: you know, there's one girl wearing shorts. There's a couple people.
• 30:05
  Speaker 4: You know, one has to go upstairs to pump. I mean,
• 30:08
  Speaker 4: it's a full on, you know, community of people that
• 30:12
  Speaker 4: have lifestyles and I like to be the most supportive
• 30:16
  Speaker 4: boss ever. But I just mostly learned being having you know,
• 30:21
  Speaker 4: thirty years of experience, what not to do, you know,
• 30:25
  Speaker 4: how not to have so many layers and not to
• 30:27
  Speaker 4: have so many meetings and not expect people to do
• 30:31
  Speaker 4: things that I wouldn't do. And so, you know, I
• 30:34
  Speaker 4: know it's going to be challenging as the brand gets bigger,
• 30:37
  Speaker 4: and it's pretty much exploded way beyond my expectations.
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: So we hit a nerve.
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: You know, we keep coming back to that simple things
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: make you happy, and it feels like you'd rather be
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: at home in New Jersey with your family and your
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: dog versus on set with Kendall Jenner at Vogue. How
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: do you explain that the two worlds like you occupy
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: both spaces and it's so rare.
• 31:05
  Speaker 4: Well, you know, look, I've never met Kendall Jenner. I've
• 31:08
  Speaker 4: never been on set with her, you know, never done
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: her for Vogue. But what my happy place is my
• 31:14
  Speaker 4: own shoots with the photographer that shoots everything for me,
• 31:18
  Speaker 4: the hairdresser that does everything, my team, because then I
• 31:22
  Speaker 4: get to do the shoots, the creativity, but it's done
• 31:26
  Speaker 4: my way, it's done chill, and it's and I guess
• 31:30
  Speaker 4: I got really tired of being in situations where I
• 31:34
  Speaker 4: was so nervous and anxious and trying to be something
• 31:38
  Speaker 4: other than I was, you know, I mean, look, I
• 31:41
  Speaker 4: mean the met Ball was just recently. I've gone twice.
• 31:43
  Speaker 4: It is the most terrifying evening of my life. You know,
• 31:47
  Speaker 4: the weeks and months that you know, figure out what
• 31:50
  Speaker 4: you're wearing, what you're not wearing. It's it's a lot.
• 31:53
  Speaker 4: And you know, going by yourself, it's fun, it's amazing,
• 31:57
  Speaker 4: but it's it's terrifying. I kind of all that stuff
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: and now I don't want to do that stuff anymore.
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: If I can't wear, you know, a pair of sneakers
• 32:05
  Speaker 4: and jeans, I'm probably not gonna say.
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: Yes, you always have your red nails though, right?
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: I do? I always have my red nails. And do
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: you know why? Tell us?
• 32:15
  Speaker 4: Once I was in my office and this very beautiful
• 32:18
  Speaker 4: model from London, Yasmine Labon, married to you know, a
• 32:23
  Speaker 4: rock star. She called and said could she come in
• 32:25
  Speaker 4: and say hi? And I said sure, she comes in
• 32:28
  Speaker 4: my office. The woman is stunning and she just has
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: the most incredible skin. She comes in this office, she's tall,
• 32:34
  Speaker 4: she's beautiful, long black hair, not a stitch of makeup on,
• 32:38
  Speaker 4: wearing a white Haynes T shirt. A pair of jeans
• 32:41
  Speaker 4: and short red nails. And I'm telling you, the next day,
• 32:44
  Speaker 4: every single girl in that office was wearing a white
• 32:47
  Speaker 4: T shirt and short red nails, and she just looks
• 32:50
  Speaker 4: so amazing. And that's my kind of beauty. I don't
• 32:53
  Speaker 4: like overdone.
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 32:55
  Speaker 4: I'd much rather see someone's freckles than see a foundation
• 32:58
  Speaker 4: on their skin.
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: I love seeing that in your branding for Jones Road.
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: You really see people's faces. It's not caked on YouTube making.
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: But okay, So, as a serial entrepreneur, do you believe
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: you can create and sell anything? Do you have any limitations?
• 33:15
  Speaker 4: Well, I certainly couldn't sell any tech because I don't
• 33:18
  Speaker 4: know anything about it. I think I could sell anything
• 33:22
  Speaker 4: that I believe in is better than anything on the market.
• 33:26
  Speaker 4: You know, I always say I didn't invent makeup, I
• 33:28
  Speaker 4: reinvented it, And you know that's what I believe in.
• 33:32
  Speaker 4: I literally believe in what I'm doing and I stand
• 33:36
  Speaker 4: behind everything my name is on.
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: So it's easy to sell something you believe in.
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: I really love that I didn't invent makeup. I reinvented it.
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: You really did.
• 33:46
  Speaker 4: And I do think if I really was bored I
• 33:48
  Speaker 4: could probably make a better bra. I could certainly make
• 33:52
  Speaker 4: you know, better high heel shoes. You know, there's no
• 33:56
  Speaker 4: question I don't want to be in either of those businesses.
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: Though I was going to say, can you please make
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: a better bra? I would use that? Okay, So I
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: do a few rapid fire questions at the end. You
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: just celebrated your thirty third wedding anniversary with your husband,
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: which is a huge milestone. What was it about him
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: that felt like he was the right partner thirty three
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: years ago? And how do you think of your relationship now?
• 34:22
  Speaker 4: Well, A little bit of the backstory is I dated
• 34:24
  Speaker 4: someone not him, from eighteen to thirty, twelve years right,
• 34:29
  Speaker 4: So you know, eighteen to thirty and we broke up
• 34:33
  Speaker 4: and I met my husband through a friend and I
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: literally went out to dinner and I don't remember what
• 34:40
  Speaker 4: I was wearing, with wet hair and a ponytail, no makeup.
• 34:43
  Speaker 4: On the second I looked at him, I was like,
• 34:46
  Speaker 4: oh my god, I fell.
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: I knew I was going to marry him.
• 34:49
  Speaker 4: I came home that night I said to my dad,
• 34:52
  Speaker 4: I just met the man I'm going to marry, And
• 34:53
  Speaker 4: he said, what's his name?
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: Stephen? What's his last time? I don't know. Is he Jewish?
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: I don't know. What does he do for a living?
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 35:00
  Speaker 4: So the next day I found out through my friend that,
• 35:03
  Speaker 4: you know, he's an amazing guy. He graduated from Harvard,
• 35:07
  Speaker 4: he was Jewish. The only problem his last name was Plofker.
• 35:11
  Speaker 4: But I married him.
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: Anyways, and it worked out. You got to keep brown exactly. Yeah,
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: that's funny. And do you still have that gut instinct
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: with things? Like you know pretty much right away if
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: it's a yes or a no.
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: I can't say I'm always right.
• 35:27
  Speaker 4: Sometimes I hire people on gut and I am wrong
• 35:30
  Speaker 4: and other people and other times I don't want to
• 35:32
  Speaker 4: hire someone and I was wrong.
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: So yeah, my husband, I was right.
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: It's a good one to be right on as is
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: actually a good transition. You said, you're really good at
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: hiring people who are good at what they do. What
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: do you look for? How can you tell?
• 35:49
  Speaker 4: Well, I think I know what I'm good at what
• 35:51
  Speaker 4: I'm not good at, So I usually make sure that
• 35:54
  Speaker 4: there's someone around me who could do the things I'm
• 35:56
  Speaker 4: not capable of doing. So, you know, I always had
• 35:59
  Speaker 4: an assistant and that would literally type up my papers
• 36:02
  Speaker 4: every morning and help me, you know, get organized. And
• 36:06
  Speaker 4: I've written all my books that way, so I'm pretty
• 36:09
  Speaker 4: good at that. And I just need the right people
• 36:11
  Speaker 4: around me to support me on these different endeavors. And
• 36:15
  Speaker 4: you can imagine now, you know, at my age, I'm
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: social media is. It's a big job, you know, and
• 36:21
  Speaker 4: I love it. It's my knitting.
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: I would.
• 36:24
  Speaker 4: I could sit on Instagram, you know, and then when
• 36:26
  Speaker 4: I'm bored, I can go to LinkedIn, and you know,
• 36:29
  Speaker 4: I can go down a rabbit hole on Pinterest.
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 36:32
  Speaker 4: I don't know how to do all the things, so
• 36:34
  Speaker 4: I sometimes need someone to help me put it up.
• 36:36
  Speaker 4: And you know, as this young brand is growing, we
• 36:39
  Speaker 4: are looking for more producers and content people. And I
• 36:44
  Speaker 4: think it's really fun. So I make sure I have
• 36:47
  Speaker 4: people around me who are good at things I'm not.
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: We do a pretty smart question. I made a card
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: deck of fifty two questions for deeper conversation, so I
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: pick one at random. Okay, what have you changed changed
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: your mind about recently?
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: That is a really good question. I've changed my mind.
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: Let me think.
• 37:08
  Speaker 4: I mean, right now, I'm really in the middle of,
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: you know, building and rebuilding my team. So I have
• 37:15
  Speaker 4: changed my mind that I want to make sure that
• 37:18
  Speaker 4: people around me are all calm and capable. Where I
• 37:23
  Speaker 4: used to kind of look for, you know, different things,
• 37:27
  Speaker 4: I am so changing my mind on, you know, the people.
• 37:32
  Speaker 4: I want to surround myself with.
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: What should be required reading for every human being. Is
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: there a book that changed your life? You know?
• 37:39
  Speaker 4: The one I keep going back to is by Liz Murray,
• 37:42
  Speaker 4: who wrote a book called Breaking Night. It's her story
• 37:46
  Speaker 4: from homelessness to Harvard. And if you read her book,
• 37:50
  Speaker 4: I don't think you could even complain about anything in
• 37:53
  Speaker 4: your life.
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: Is gratitude something that you've practiced with your life, coach,
• 37:59
  Speaker 2: or does that come toatu really to you?
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: I don't have to practice it.
• 38:02
  Speaker 4: I am very grateful, and I make a habit of
• 38:05
  Speaker 4: telling people that mean something to me that I appreciate it,
• 38:09
  Speaker 4: and I'm grateful, and I know I have to do,
• 38:12
  Speaker 4: you know, a better job when I'm busy, you know,
• 38:14
  Speaker 4: certainly with my staff and certainly with my kids and
• 38:17
  Speaker 4: my housekeeper and anyone who's around me. Because when we
• 38:21
  Speaker 4: get busy and there's so much going on, it's very
• 38:25
  Speaker 4: stressful and you're just sometimes you're not present and I think,
• 38:29
  Speaker 4: you know, the pandemic and being home made me realize
• 38:33
  Speaker 4: a lot of different.
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: Things, Bobby. This last Friday, I missed my one of
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: my really good friends rehearsal dinners because I just was
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: like I had too much on my plate. So I
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: know exactly what you mean. And it's terrible because I
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: value friendship and human connection more than anything.
• 38:50
  Speaker 4: So what, but you made a choice. By the way,
• 38:53
  Speaker 4: you made a choice to miss it. It wasn't an accident,
• 38:56
  Speaker 4: you did, you know? You made a choice. I once
• 38:59
  Speaker 4: got offered to do Nicole Kidman's and Tom Cruise makeup
• 39:03
  Speaker 4: on a Saturday Night Live, and I was tortured because
• 39:08
  Speaker 4: I had committed to my girlfriend to go to her
• 39:12
  Speaker 4: husband's surprise party. Is forty the surprise party, and I
• 39:15
  Speaker 4: was tortured.
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: What do I do? What should I do? Stephen? What
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: should I do? I'm my god, my agent? What should
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: I do?
• 39:20
  Speaker 4: I went to the birthday party and Gino Goldberg is
• 39:24
  Speaker 4: still my dear friend. And I actually met Nicole Kidman
• 39:27
  Speaker 4: this couple years ago in the Bahamas, and I told
• 39:30
  Speaker 4: her the story.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: And she's like, my bad.
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: Next time I'm on Sarah Night Live, I'll call you,
• 39:35
  Speaker 4: but you know, you make those decisions so hopefully it's
• 39:39
  Speaker 4: not your best friend.
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: No it's not, but it was the wrong It was
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: the wrong decision, you know. I think you always have
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: to choose life. Yes, so I'm sure that you have
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: a lot of women and consumers come up to you
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: and talk about how your cosmetic lines have impacted them,
• 39:56
  Speaker 2: maybe even changed their life. Is there a story that
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: really sticks out to you.
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: I mean there's so many.
• 40:01
  Speaker 4: I mean from you know, women with bad skin that
• 40:04
  Speaker 4: have found something to cover them. But really, my most
• 40:08
  Speaker 4: amazing story is when I was asked to go speak
• 40:12
  Speaker 4: to the widows of the World Trade a year after
• 40:15
  Speaker 4: nine to eleven. And you know, I walked into this
• 40:18
  Speaker 4: room where there was hundreds of women holding babies by
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: the way, and I just like burst out in tears.
• 40:25
  Speaker 4: And you know, as I was about to speak, and
• 40:27
  Speaker 4: they came and gave me a tissue and I just said, guys,
• 40:30
  Speaker 4: I'm really sorry, but this is like it's makeup like
• 40:33
  Speaker 4: and someone said, you know, this is part of our
• 40:37
  Speaker 4: healing and this is really important and we really appreciate it.
• 40:40
  Speaker 4: And I you know, I've just remembered that, you know, yes,
• 40:44
  Speaker 4: we're in this fluff business. But what I do particularly
• 40:48
  Speaker 4: is I just help people feel better about themselves.
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: And you know, not done through glamour.
• 40:53
  Speaker 4: By the way, there's not a glamorous bone in my
• 40:55
  Speaker 4: body except my red nails.
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: That gave me chills because you're right there. For I
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: think women, especially or female identifying people, there's something about
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: putting makeup on that really can change how you feel.
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: Right, And our hashtag on Jones Road is how not
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: to look like shit?
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: Is that really?
• 41:16
  Speaker 4: Yes, I'm probably the only one that puts things up,
• 41:18
  Speaker 4: but that's why I wear makeup.
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: Like you know, I did so much research and I
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: did not come across that. That's amazing.
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: Well, we'll have to get our marketing team, which we
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: don't have yet on it.
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: That's so good. Okay, last question, what is the smartest
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: decision you've ever made.
• 41:33
  Speaker 4: The smartest decision I ever made personally was marrying my
• 41:37
  Speaker 4: husband and have my third son, because I had two boys.
• 41:41
  Speaker 4: I was forty years old and I just decided to
• 41:44
  Speaker 4: have a third. So I don't know what I would
• 41:47
  Speaker 4: do without my baby, who right now lives in California.
• 41:50
  Speaker 4: But you know, he's the cherry on my Sunday but
• 41:54
  Speaker 4: certainly marrying my husband beautiful.
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much, oh my pleasure. Sure all right,
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: today is a good day to have a good day.
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: I'll see you next h