Latest / Most Things Kenobi - A Star Wars Podcast / Episode 97: Revenge of the Sith, Clone Wars Season 7, and Obi-Wan Kenobi - How things changed "knowing what we know now"

Transcript

Episode 97: Revenge of the Sith, Clone Wars Season 7, and Obi-Wan Kenobi - How things changed "knowing what we know now" · Most Things Kenobi - A Star Wars Podcast

• 0:00
  Hello there, it's time for most things Kenobi.
• 0:04
  I prefer all things Kenobi, but I suppose that's not the Jedi
• 0:08
  way as long as it's not all things Anakin.
• 0:24
  Hi, everyone, welcome to another episode of most.
• 0:26
  Thanks Kenobi. A podcast about Obi-Wan Kenobi,
• 0:28
  in all things Star Wars. I'm your host Leanne and I'm
• 0:32
  your host Lauren. And this week we're doing a deep
• 0:36
  dive into the overlap of Revenge of the Sith and Clone Wars
• 0:41
  season 7 with emphasis on Obi-Wan.
• 0:44
  Because now that we have a more complete picture, how does it
• 0:48
  change things? And how does it deep in the
• 0:52
  character that we already know and love Obi-Wan amongst others?
• 0:56
  Definitely adds a lot of layers there that, that you can read a
• 1:00
  lot more into it. Now, depending on how you're
• 1:02
  looking at things, I'm curious to get your opinion on some of
• 1:06
  the Snippets that we got. Granted Obi-Wan was not in it a
• 1:10
  whole lot. No, he wasn't.
• 1:13
  He was not in Clone Wars 7 but we know why, because he was off
• 1:17
  doing the things that were in Revenge of the Sith.
• 1:21
  So unfortunately, we don't have as much as we want as we would
• 1:25
  like, as is usually the case am I wrong?
• 1:31
  No. No, you're not wrong.
• 1:34
  And he looked really good in this episode or this season
• 1:37
  because he had the little Touch of Gray and I believe the first
• 1:39
  time we see Kenobi in season 7 is like The Stance.
• 1:46
  Oh my God, you know, yeah where it's like a side view and it's
• 1:50
  moving and he looks back and it's like gritted teeth and
• 1:54
  power stance, and it's really nice actually.
• 1:57
  Don't think that's the first time now that I think about it
• 1:59
  is in my it is in my brain, it isn't that was like one of the
• 2:03
  hardest things I've ever Ever seen in my life.
• 2:05
  He's, he likes rice with base prior to that, doesn't he?
• 2:08
  He does. And then there's like the little
• 2:10
  exchange with the bad batch episode, where Anakin is talking
• 2:14
  to Padme and Obi-Wan. Actually let's talk about that.
• 2:19
  Let's start with that first. So, Obi-Wan new, this is like
• 2:24
  the first, we always assumed. Yeah, this is the first time
• 2:29
  they say it, and James Arnold Taylor has said that he always
• 2:33
  played Obi-Wan as though he knew, but he felt no need to say
• 2:38
  anything. And I think maybe this was a
• 2:42
  deleted scene in Revenge of the Sith.
• 2:45
  But 0, b 1 says something to Padme.
• 2:47
  I think it was a dog yet where he said like I didn't I didn't
• 2:52
  say anything because you made him happy in a way that like
• 2:54
  nobody else could. So I just allowed that it turned
• 2:58
  a blind eye to that. I just don't know why that scene
• 3:01
  was deleted. I don't either added so much
• 3:05
  more depth to everything, everything his knowledge of
• 3:09
  Anakin how his friendship. He's a better friend than ever
• 3:15
  thought before because he kept something that could have been
• 3:18
  horribly detrimental. To everyone involved if anyone
• 3:23
  found out but like like the clip says he did it because he knew
• 3:30
  it was the only person that can make him happy.
• 3:33
  Even Kenobi, couldn't make him happy even though sometimes they
• 3:35
  laughed and fought like old married couple and, you know,
• 3:38
  had really good times together but they never quite had that
• 3:41
  depth of talk that I bet Obi-Wan really wanted with Anakin, Yeah,
• 3:47
  they both never seem to get past that exterior wall, which
• 3:52
  doesn't surprise me with 0, b 1, because it kind of seemed that
• 3:55
  way with Qui-Gon. Also that they just didn't have
• 3:58
  that, which is weird. We've talked about this before
• 4:01
  because Qui-Gon is so super affectionate with Anakin.
• 4:05
  Yeah. And, and even SRI for that
• 4:08
  matter. Well, yeah.
• 4:12
  Get it quagga. He could if he wanted It to us.
• 4:17
  Yeah, yep. I will say though, one of our
• 4:20
  patrons Adam has mentioned that maybe that's just because some
• 4:24
  people are just better with kids like little kids than they are a
• 4:27
  teenager's, sure that like that could be but still, it doesn't
• 4:33
  surprise me that Obi-Wan and Anakin Don't talk, you know,
• 4:39
  like we have said so many times, it's people would just talk and
• 4:41
  Star Wars. A lot of Bloodshed would be
• 4:43
  avoided in. The funny part is, is I'm pretty
• 4:46
  sure that Anakin wanted to have that with Obi-Wan and probably
• 4:51
  resented. No, he did resent.
• 4:53
  Obi-Wan for not being closer, but at the same time, they
• 5:00
  neither one did anything to make that closeness possible.
• 5:04
  Yes, exactly. And yet Anakin still I kept
• 5:09
  resentment about it, and I'm sure that Obi-Wan felt a little
• 5:14
  like, oh, I can't reach in, you know.
• 5:18
  Yeah, for sure. I think that that's evident in
• 5:22
  the Clone Wars episode that was never aired.
• 5:26
  The utapau Arc, where they find that giant kyber crystal.
• 5:30
  I can't remember the exact name of the arc, but it's like all
• 5:34
  animatronic or whatever. It's like an anime.
• 5:38
  Anchor. Something I think is what it's
• 5:39
  called, where they, it's like an outline, basically, they have
• 5:42
  the voice actors, but not the full animation, right?
• 5:45
  And there's that scene where Obi-Wan is trying to talk to
• 5:47
  Anakin about Ahsoka. Mhm.
• 5:50
  And it almost turns into an argument like they're pretty
• 5:54
  contentious. Only ones trying to keep it from
• 5:57
  getting into argumentative territory and Anakin is like,
• 6:00
  how would you feel? You know, if it was me and I
• 6:03
  mean true. But yeah, Anakin at this point
• 6:07
  Is taking everything way too personally.
• 6:09
  And there's a reason why palps. Yes, yeah, yeah, it's being
• 6:14
  pushed his absolute Max everywhere.
• 6:18
  Yeah. So I do kind of like, that,
• 6:23
  Obi-Wan was allowed to admit it in can inform, will, tell Padme.
• 6:30
  I said, I hope you at least told pad me, I said hello or
• 6:33
  whatever. However, he phrased it, you
• 6:35
  know, and the look of shock on everyone's face.
• 6:38
  Like we've been Rex was like yeah.
• 6:42
  Rex wanted no part of that. He did not want to be in the
• 6:44
  middle how fucking humiliating must that.
• 6:47
  If Ben's it's like being in a school yard you know you'll
• 6:52
  watch the door while I go make out with my wife.
• 6:55
  Wait. Yeah, no.
• 6:56
  Yeah, wife. That's not what you do in a
• 6:58
  school yard. But yeah, in this place yet it
• 7:02
  is because everything is fucked up in this story.
• 7:04
  Okay, true. And I also like to think and I
• 7:11
  think you and I have discussed it before then, another reason
• 7:14
  why Obi-Wan just didn't say anything is because he did the
• 7:17
  same thing with Satine. Yeah.
• 7:21
  Who is he to say anything? He knows what it's like to have
• 7:24
  the love of a woman. It's different than bro, time.
• 7:28
  So, yeah, maybe he just allowed Anakin to have that.
• 7:32
  Because honestly, what did, what else did Anna can have?
• 7:35
  Yeah, you know. Yeah.
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  And he did try to talk to him about it in that Clovis episode.
• 7:41
  Remember. Oh yeah.
• 7:41
  Just like lose his mind over at rush Clovis.
• 7:45
  That is insane that those episodes are insane.
• 7:47
  If you think about it, they really are Really extreme all of
• 7:51
  the ones with clove is even the earlier episodes with him.
• 7:54
  Are they really do? Crazy stuff with Padme are those
• 7:58
  but I mean 0 b 1 says it's not like we can't have these
• 8:03
  feelings. Of course they're natural.
• 8:05
  It's just your you've sworn to do your duty with the Jedi but
• 8:11
  of course, at this point and again is no longer really
• 8:13
  feeling like the Jedi are staying true to their Social
• 8:20
  beliefs, you know, their Central beliefs.
• 8:23
  He's feeling like the Jedi are straying and everyone else is
• 8:27
  seeing it, as Anakin is straying.
• 8:29
  So it's kind of an interesting dynamic they set up there.
• 8:32
  Well, your point one finger, you have three pointing back at you.
• 8:37
  Hate got the stuff. That's the Jedi Council right
• 8:40
  there. It's up true.
• 8:43
  Oh my God. Yeah, I had to do that.
• 8:46
  I had to mime it out to make sure that I counted amount of
• 8:49
  fingers. True.
• 8:50
  So there's three pointing back. Yes.
• 8:55
  And they're called Mace Windu ki-adi-mundi and Yoda.
• 9:00
  Yes, it is pretty cool in season seven.
• 9:08
  When Ahsoka is speaking to the council via transmission and
• 9:14
  it's Like leading up to that point when Ahsoka steps in it's
• 9:19
  the exact same scene from Revenge of the Sith.
• 9:23
  Like they had mace say the exact same line like yes something
• 9:28
  about the energy of the chancellor.
• 9:31
  Yeah. And then Ahsoka enters and it's
• 9:34
  weird if you go back and watch Revenge of the Sith and, you
• 9:36
  know, ahsoka's like in on this eventually, like it really,
• 9:42
  really does drive it home. How many things?
• 9:46
  As were at play, all within the span of a few days, which is
• 9:49
  what Revenge of the Sith is. See, that's the thing that this,
• 9:53
  like, doing this kind of, like preparing for this episode
• 9:57
  really made me realize that either revenge of the.
• 10:00
  Thus, it is much shorter time period than I thought it was, or
• 10:04
  the siege of Mandalore took a lot longer than I thought it
• 10:07
  did. Yeah, I It looks like both take
• 10:11
  forever. Yeah.
• 10:13
  But its literally only a few days, like four or five days.
• 10:16
  Right? It's it.
• 10:17
  I think. Yeah, it's insane.
• 10:19
  If you think about it, that Anakin went from handing Ahsoka,
• 10:24
  her lightsabers and being a genuinely, amicable person to
• 10:30
  fucking killing everybody. I know, like it was.
• 10:34
  Yeah. Okay.
• 10:35
  The stage was set but it was, it was right for this started, but
• 10:38
  when he was a kid, right property had been working on
• 10:42
  him. Literally the entire time.
• 10:46
  Yeah, it's pretty crazy though. Yeah, because they like split
• 10:50
  the 50 First and they send Rex with Ahsoka then Anakin is like
• 10:55
  killing Dooku within what a few hours, half a day, something
• 10:58
  like that. Yeah.
• 11:00
  Yeah, and then we won. It's interesting how they had
• 11:04
  like James Arnold Taylor as voice when Obi-Wan is in a
• 11:06
  transmission with Bogut on. Yes, and Ahsoka.
• 11:11
  There is a little bit of anger. Yeah.
• 11:14
  In his voice when he's like, well we won't have the chance to
• 11:17
  find out now because Anakin killed him and it's like we
• 11:22
  never got that before. I think it's it ties in really
• 11:27
  well with Revenge of the Sith because I feel like Obi-Wan is
• 11:32
  starting to see connections but he can do nothing about it and
• 11:36
  then he's starting to see Anakin is making decisions that kind of
• 11:39
  make him uncomfortable but there's also nothing he can do
• 11:42
  about it and that's why in that transmission.
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  Also he asks to speak to Ahsoka alone and everybody's steps away
• 11:51
  and he says he tells her about the secret mission of an Spying
• 11:55
  on the chancellor. And then he Ahsoka says, I'm not
• 12:02
  the best person to convince Anakin that this is the right
• 12:05
  thing and Obi-Wan's responses, I know the council is not always
• 12:10
  right? And that's why I'm asking for
• 12:12
  your help, right? But then they get interrupted.
• 12:16
  Yes. And that's that, that is one of
• 12:18
  the most honest things that Obi-Wan is ever said in the
• 12:21
  history of Obi-Wan. Yeah, like speaking against the
• 12:26
  council is something he Does not really do.
• 12:29
  No, he doesn't. He sits on the fucking Council.
• 12:31
  So for him to like, admit it even to one person which tells
• 12:35
  you how close he is to Ahsoka. Mmm, even after everything,
• 12:40
  didn't he sit on the trial for her?
• 12:42
  Was he not present whenever she was brought in?
• 12:45
  He was present, I think, in the, in the chamber, I don't know if
• 12:50
  he had any decision, like he had any power in the decision, but
• 12:53
  he was then there when they offered her her place back,
• 12:57
  right? It's like fuck you assholes,
• 13:00
  right? And I think that ring home rang
• 13:03
  true to Obi-Wan because he probably saw that and thought,
• 13:08
  okay, this is this, is this a shady this shade even for me.
• 13:12
  Yeah, yeah it was. I thought that was and the I
• 13:15
  loved the intonation that James Arnold Taylor uses in that
• 13:20
  moment because you here like Obi-Wan is kind of like Like,
• 13:24
  I'm just, I'm just trying to get some help from somebody.
• 13:27
  Yeah. Like like, there's all these
• 13:29
  things happening. There are so many things
• 13:31
  happening. That and they sent him they
• 13:35
  split him and Anakin up at that moment.
• 13:38
  Which Is even more apparent in this because he's got to go to
• 13:44
  you to pow and deal with Grievous.
• 13:47
  Ahsoka is nowhere near Anakin. She's on Mandalore.
• 13:51
  Like it's just strategic how nobody that he really trusted.
• 13:55
  Including Rex, we're anywhere near him.
• 13:57
  Yeah, they were all set to you Jake Lee sent except Cody except
• 14:02
  Cody but which was very, very fucking heartbreaking.
• 14:07
  Still daddy's job handle it. Yeah.
• 14:10
  I just think that like something that really hits home to me with
• 14:13
  this is how lucky Rex was honestly my God as bad as things
• 14:19
  got for him. He's really lucky that Anakin
• 14:23
  split the 50 First and promoted him and sent him with Ahsoka to
• 14:27
  Mandalore because if he hadn't, he had been with Anakin and
• 14:31
  going to the Jedi Temple and killing all the Jedi.
• 14:34
  Yeah, he wouldn't be the wrecks we know anymore.
• 14:37
  Yeah. Although they You say that the
• 14:42
  arc troopers their chips were different.
• 14:46
  The first, the first batches of Troopers their chips were
• 14:51
  slightly faulty rather than later versions.
• 14:54
  Maybe that's why he could resist it even when with Ahsoka.
• 14:58
  Yeah. So if he lets say you had the
• 15:00
  same resolved when he was with Anakin, he probably would have
• 15:03
  just been shot by his own people.
• 15:06
  That's true. Yeah, you're right.
• 15:08
  Anakin would have ordered Heard them to shoot him and they
• 15:12
  probably would have. Yeah.
• 15:14
  The the reason he survived is because Ahsoka is the one who
• 15:17
  helped him and he wouldn't have had that if he wasn't with her
• 15:20
  obviously. So yeah, it's pretty crazy.
• 15:25
  So how do we feel about Darth Maul?
• 15:29
  I mean, not in general. We already know how we feel
• 15:31
  about Drake and Josh I didn't like he expected Kenobi to be
• 15:39
  there and Was shocked when Ahsoka came.
• 15:43
  Yeah and then I'll be wouldn't suggest catching Mall because
• 15:46
  Dooku's dead, so maybe Mall will know something.
• 15:49
  It's they're always thinking about each other even when
• 15:51
  they're not hanging out together, they are penpals.
• 15:54
  Whether they want to admit it or not, I think it's Grazie.
• 16:03
  The extent ball will go to to trap up, it's nuts.
• 16:09
  There's a whole fucking Galaxy about to implode on itself and
• 16:12
  he's like Kenobi here is Cano, but he's writing that shock
• 16:17
  waves so that he can still Trip Kenobi, it's easy.
• 16:21
  Wait, this could be a chance for me to the NAB Kenobi.
• 16:26
  My God, he needs one of those. What was the thing they use used
• 16:32
  in the Mandalorian on the guy that he's his braids all that
• 16:35
  column mind. Flayer mindful are mom needs a
• 16:39
  mindful are just give a gentle one zayat.
• 16:45
  He's first of all. How badass is Ahsoka for
• 16:51
  handling mall? It's so amazing.
• 16:55
  But what would have happened? If Kenobi would have went and I
• 16:59
  me I mean, that would have been a very, very triggering place
• 17:04
  for Obi-Wan to go, I think, considering, yeah, it could have
• 17:10
  ended badly, honestly, because I was just thinking about Kenobi
• 17:17
  is use of combat earlier today, when I was watching some stuff
• 17:20
  for Revenge of the Sith and I saw a comparison of Revenge of
• 17:26
  the Sith versus the Kenobi series and how I I love this
• 17:32
  about Obi-Wan that he is a master of sorry Sue, but he is
• 17:35
  also really good at other forms. He is that I'm bad and he learns
• 17:42
  from his duels and he learned even The reason he defeats
• 17:47
  Anakin or Vader in the Kenobi series is because once again, he
• 17:52
  knows what Anakin is expecting from him and he changes it
• 17:56
  completely. So Anakin's totally caught off
• 17:59
  guard. He spent all this time learning
• 18:01
  to defend against the race do and now all of a sudden he's
• 18:03
  fighting him with some people say ataru, but it's also kind of
• 18:08
  like using Anakin's form on him. Like, reversing it back on him
• 18:12
  because form five is a mixture of Surrey.
• 18:16
  Zoo in a taro. So it's like Obi-Wan is an
• 18:18
  expert at both of those. But he does the same thing with
• 18:21
  mall, right? So he shows Mall, Qui gonn
• 18:26
  stands to malls, like I'm no, I know what's coming and then he's
• 18:30
  wrong. Yeah, and I'll be one kills him.
• 18:34
  So if he had gone to Mandalore, he wouldn't have had that time.
• 18:37
  Yes, sir his brain to calm down and learn from that experience.
• 18:43
  He was probably still. Like you said, is very
• 18:45
  triggering. Being so it maybe wouldn't have
• 18:48
  ended so well, he would have may be repeated the same mistakes.
• 18:52
  I don't know though because like we said in the Lawless is the
• 18:54
  first time he decides to not fight at all Drew.
• 18:58
  Yeah. That I don't think it would have
• 19:00
  went well either. At all.
• 19:03
  And I'm really glad Ahsoka went. She basically had no claim to
• 19:10
  anything there. Shit.
• 19:11
  Yeah. She's like emotionally invested
• 19:13
  at all. No.
• 19:15
  And she had Rex with her. So she had someone she'd fought
• 19:19
  with before, but technically all of it was a little new and it
• 19:26
  worked in her favor. I mean, she's kind of
• 19:28
  resourceful in the way that she will use her surroundings to her
• 19:31
  benefit. All the time all the time and I
• 19:35
  think any good Jedi would but she seems to have a better grasp
• 19:39
  on like using what's available not just the lightsaber so,
• 19:43
  right? I think it would have been more
• 19:45
  one-on-one combat with Mall which could have gone very ugly,
• 19:49
  very quickly if ball used the emotions against Kenobi unless
• 19:54
  you know, he was so hard and buy it at that point, but with
• 19:57
  everything we know that was going on with Anakin, it could
• 19:59
  have been just enough to weaken him even more.
• 20:02
  You know, if he's worried about his best friend and he knows
• 20:05
  something's wrong in the council, you know, something's
• 20:07
  wrong with the chancellor and he has to go back to Mandalore and
• 20:10
  deal with this. Again, I think it would have
• 20:13
  been enough of a distraction to and that's the only way you can
• 20:15
  defeat Kenobi is if you get him distracted.
• 20:19
  Yeah, I'm off his game and like really pry at the really deep
• 20:24
  emotional Parts which would have been quite good Anakin and City.
• 20:27
  And although he had kind of like control his emotions over Satine
• 20:31
  already because I think there was back when he was young,
• 20:35
  there was already that heartbreak, so he like learn to
• 20:38
  control that shit as early as possible, but with Qui-Gon and
• 20:41
  Anakin those were like, really raw nerves for him.
• 20:44
  I think so. Yeah.
• 20:45
  And with the information that mall gave us Sokka about like he
• 20:49
  suspected Anakin all along, which is crazy that they had
• 20:52
  Mall delivered that line, I know, right?
• 20:55
  Like he's like even Dooku didn't really know that.
• 20:59
  That was the ultimate plan, right?
• 21:01
  Yeah, they kept Palpatine Count Dooku, just in the dark enough.
• 21:06
  Talk about he was really used. Ya know, he was set up to be
• 21:11
  killed by Anakin from the start. He was yes, right.
• 21:15
  You're so right. Right from the beginning, that
• 21:17
  was always the plan and Dooku. Thought he was making a decision
• 21:21
  for a better future or really such a pain.
• 21:24
  He played right into it which is a shame because Dooku in all
• 21:28
  fairness. Could have stopped this because
• 21:32
  he was like this close to admitting.
• 21:34
  I mean, he admitted that the Jedi Council was off that things
• 21:38
  weren't right? But he just he had too much
• 21:41
  murder in them, you know, like he had the ingredients that
• 21:47
  Qui-Gon had but he had the murder too.
• 21:49
  So yeah, yeah, it'll tried. She tried her best.
• 21:54
  Yes, I think that's exactly what I'm referring to.
• 21:56
  I'm referring to all the things that we've been Keen to with
• 21:59
  Dooku. And then you think about all the
• 22:03
  fights that Anakin had with Dooku throughout the Clone Wars
• 22:06
  Palpatine was almost there for like three quarters of them over
• 22:10
  seeing it every single time. Hmm, and Dooku.
• 22:13
  Always stopped. It always overpowered Anakin.
• 22:16
  And then the one time that Obi-Wan's indisposed, right,
• 22:21
  isn't he just somewhere at the time?
• 22:24
  As long as unconscious take a nap.
• 22:27
  Yeah. God We talked about that in a
• 22:31
  minute, but we, we, most certainly will.
• 22:33
  Um, I just, I just want to make the point that if you're only
• 22:37
  person there to talk any sense to you, any sense into you is
• 22:41
  Palpatine, you're probably going to do a Palpatine has to say
• 22:43
  because he trusts and I can trusted Palpatine.
• 22:46
  Yep. Also bad choice.
• 22:51
  Everyone was a fucking pain from day.
• 22:53
  One that really hit home when re watching the scene when Anakin
• 22:59
  and Obi-Wan come out of the council chambers.
• 23:00
  And Anakin's really pissed that he's been put on the council,
• 23:03
  but isn't made a Jedi master and Obi ones.
• 23:07
  Like, the only reason you're on the council is because of the
• 23:11
  chancellor and and it's like he had nothing to do with it.
• 23:14
  It's like how naive are you naive to think that that person
• 23:19
  in power who hasn't whoo-hoo? Always implied that he has your
• 23:22
  best interest at heart and is always doing the little nudge.
• 23:27
  You know, he even did it during the rako.
• 23:29
  Hardeen arc, is another good example, absolutely.
• 23:33
  The council told him, you know, we're going to handle it and
• 23:36
  then Palpatine was like, there's no one better than you to handle
• 23:41
  this situation. You hold that.
• 23:43
  Whole thing was a setup for Anakin as well.
• 23:46
  Yeah, whole thing was an orchestration on Palpatine's
• 23:49
  behalf to put a mannequin in a position.
• 23:51
  Addition of Doubt of everyone around him that he trusted, and
• 23:55
  a position of power over those who were on the council and made
• 24:00
  the big decisions did all of this.
• 24:02
  Yeah, Palpatine slid underneath and was like, nah man.
• 24:05
  I want you over them, you know. Yeah.
• 24:08
  They're not handling you, right. You know, exactly, always that
• 24:12
  the little seeds of doubt and it just, it took just the right
• 24:15
  amount of time until Anakin was Peak power.
• 24:19
  Yeah. And then, uh, All those seeds
• 24:21
  came to fruition. So it was just like the perfect
• 24:25
  storm that created a really scary City Lord.
• 24:29
  Yes. Yeah, terrible honestly.
• 24:35
  Yeah, so you want to talk about Obi-Wan on the floor with left
• 24:39
  to talk about like how disappointing that?
• 24:42
  I mean it's just bad, it's just bad knowing what we know after.
• 24:46
  You just said, he's a warrior who learns from his fighting is
• 24:50
  prior battles, is duels. He's a mastermind.
• 24:52
  He's combat Savvy and multiple forums and just poop, he's down.
• 24:59
  He's thrown into a wallet. Is then out for the count?
• 25:02
  Yeah. And then I like him Dooku pulls.
• 25:05
  Like a Gantry down on top of him.
• 25:06
  Yeah. That would kill you.
• 25:09
  It would kill you. Well I mean the man was drug
• 25:12
  through fire glass so and that didn't kill him.
• 25:13
  So he's made up something different is made of something
• 25:18
  different. Yeah maybe he's a robot come.
• 25:24
  Now it would have crushed his body in half like so stupid.
• 25:29
  This is just bad filming bad writing.
• 25:33
  It could have been something. So Fucking cool.
• 25:36
  Like like, okay, you want to subdue Obi-Wan Kenobi, so it's
• 25:39
  not able to fight anymore. That could have been way.
• 25:42
  Cooler, ways of doing that. Yeah, granted at this time Clone
• 25:46
  Wars hadn't existed yet. So we don't have the whole
• 25:48
  backlog of Obi-Wan being a fucking bad ass, but I still, I
• 25:52
  found that like so deeply disappointing, and then also
• 25:56
  that it defeats Grievous with a blaster is also, yeah, that's
• 26:00
  really disappointing. After all the things that we've
• 26:04
  seen him do, with Grievous, like, all of them fighting and
• 26:07
  the I mean, you could look at it from this point of view.
• 26:14
  At the very end of all of this Grievous is taken out, not by
• 26:17
  one of his giant lightsaber collection pieces.
• 26:19
  But by a blaster How ironic right?
• 26:24
  That's the only way that I can somehow make it ok in my brain
• 26:29
  and it's still not. Okay, it's just disappointing.
• 26:33
  It is because it undermines the character, which we have talked
• 26:37
  about so many times in Star Wars where it's a repetitive.
• 26:40
  It's a repeated thing that is happening and I don't like it.
• 26:44
  Yeah, I don't and that but that is why I really felt a lot of
• 26:48
  gratitude for the Kenobi series. That Final Duel because we've
• 26:54
  seen all we want to be a badass but that was intelligent
• 26:58
  fighting as well. Not only was he really fucking
• 27:04
  powerful to not only defeat this Sith, but also his own demons in
• 27:09
  order to do it? And that's the toughest fight of
• 27:11
  all right? It's the mental side that he had
• 27:15
  to overcome. Yeah.
• 27:17
  So that was very redeeming. I thought to see him Defeat
• 27:22
  Vader. Not just because he's a badass
• 27:25
  but because he also moved through his emotional stuff as
• 27:30
  well, which is why it's very frustrating.
• 27:33
  When they make the character like Boop, he got popped in the
• 27:37
  head now. Yeah.
• 27:38
  Fight anymore. No it's like watch this.
• 27:42
  Just hit him in the wrong spot. This is a character.
• 27:45
  Is defeated multiple cysts, guess what?
• 27:48
  Yeah I just It could have been better, just could've been
• 27:53
  better, that's all. So overall, what are your
• 28:03
  thoughts overall. Overall, I think that they did a
• 28:09
  really good job of tying Clone Wars to Revenge of the Sith.
• 28:13
  Yes, part of me wonders. Now about Ahsoka and ov1.
• 28:20
  You know, people have all said, why didn't they look for each
• 28:22
  other? She probably assumed he was
• 28:24
  dead, but he knew she was alive, right?
• 28:27
  Maybe. I would have guessed that I mean
• 28:32
  maybe he was too traumatized to assume anything but a part of me
• 28:37
  wonders, if he didn't look for her because he didn't know how
• 28:42
  to face her after Anakin. Oh maybe.
• 28:46
  Yeah. Maybe there is that that would
• 28:48
  have been a heavy, heavy weight. Yeah.
• 28:51
  Because there is that Exchange. We're Ahsoka turns around and
• 28:55
  turns back to him and says, tell Anakin And Obi-Wan says he will,
• 29:01
  but it never is spoken about what that line is.
• 29:06
  What do you think she meant by that?
• 29:08
  I don't have an answer. Personally, I have a headcanon
• 29:13
  wish but I don't know what it is that she was actually going to.
• 29:18
  Maybe it is. I think she wanted tell Anakin
• 29:22
  that I support him. And that I thank him are the two
• 29:27
  things because I don't think she would have said I loved him.
• 29:30
  Obi-Wan. That you know.
• 29:34
  Yeah I don't think she would have either.
• 29:35
  But in that time where she was just given all this fucking
• 29:38
  information and she wasn't, I don't know.
• 29:42
  I just think she would wanted to tell him that she supported him
• 29:45
  or was by his side or something. I'm with you regardless, you
• 29:51
  know, filoni has ever said anything about what I've
• 29:54
  researched it. And people have plenty of ideas,
• 29:57
  but I don't think anyone's ever said, and I think that's fine.
• 30:01
  Hmm, Italy. Is it up to us?
• 30:05
  Just it's a little I mean it's funny that Obi-Wan understood
• 30:09
  but we don't. Yeah.
• 30:11
  Right I know and she gives the OB want to look kind of like
• 30:15
  annoyed that he knew what she was going to say without her
• 30:18
  saying and she kind of gives him this like Weird, like taking it
• 30:22
  back. Look before she runs out of the
• 30:24
  room. Well, maybe it's the same thing
• 30:26
  that they both want to tell him the same thing.
• 30:29
  Yeah, I don't know. It's still an animation.
• 30:34
  So we can't quite tell by the facial expression.
• 30:39
  It's true. So, like that's their last
• 30:41
  exchange basically. And then, you know, if she feels
• 30:47
  Anakin turn or whatever that she feels that moment where he kills
• 30:52
  Mace Windu, right? Yeah.
• 30:54
  Yeah, that's the moment she feels.
• 30:57
  And then if she ever saw Obi-Wan again, he'd have to either tell
• 31:00
  her that Anakin was dead and that he killed him or that he's
• 31:04
  not dead. But he turned to the dark side,
• 31:07
  which I guess. The Kenobi series implies that
• 31:09
  everyone didn't know Anakin survived until 10 years later
• 31:15
  which makes no sense that still doesn't make any sense to me.
• 31:18
  Because what did he not have a TV or a radio and hear about the
• 31:21
  Sith? Lord go around killing people.
• 31:23
  Like I don't know. Because everybody just goes
• 31:30
  their separate ways and stay so silent and removed out of
• 31:33
  safety, for whatever the reason is, you know, Luke Leia
• 31:37
  themselves. You know, I think Obi-Wan would
• 31:42
  have assumed she'd be on a on a ship with clones.
• 31:47
  It's crazy to me because there I mean, I guess it was very
• 31:51
  traumatizing, so it's not that crazy.
• 31:54
  But if you think about how close, especially Obi-Wan Anakin
• 31:58
  and Ahsoka were, And none of them looked for each other.
• 32:03
  Like, Anakin was fixated on finding Obi-Wan, but never seem
• 32:07
  to give a second thought to Ahsoka until they cross paths
• 32:10
  and Rebels. Well, he had hate towards
• 32:12
  Obi-Wan for what he did as misguided as it was, but he
• 32:16
  still didn't have that emotion with Ahsoka.
• 32:18
  He couldn't hate her so he had had a tuner out so crazy that he
• 32:23
  didn't try to find her it. Maybe he was ashamed.
• 32:26
  I don't know. He didn't seem ashamed, he
• 32:28
  seemed pretty sure of himself there.
• 32:30
  Is that moment in Rebels where he senses her when she's on the
• 32:34
  ship and they pass by or say yes, and they sense each other.
• 32:39
  That would that would be too much.
• 32:41
  That would be too much for me if I was a Soca to feel someone's
• 32:44
  like signature. That was so familiar to you but
• 32:47
  it probably felt so much darker. Yeah.
• 32:50
  And then she does face him eventually in Rebels but maybe
• 32:54
  the Ahsoka show will give us some insight into this.
• 32:58
  I don't know. That's interesting, I never
• 33:00
  thought of that. I think it would be really cool
• 33:02
  if they do fill in the blank of what happened in that duel with
• 33:06
  Vader. Yeah, the the Mater, whatever
• 33:09
  gyozas and they disappear inside, we have no idea.
• 33:12
  We obviously, they both survive, but we don't know how or why?
• 33:15
  Or like, you know, what the hell happened.
• 33:18
  I can tell you that door closed, the look behind him and said,
• 33:21
  okay, how have you been? How are things?
• 33:26
  No, just kidding. No one's looking.
• 33:30
  Oh my God, how are you black? Is your color?
• 33:33
  No, no. Sorry.
• 33:36
  It's just a 5. You know, he came across as my
• 33:38
  best friend. Had seen a while if they had a
• 33:40
  makeover I would want to, you know, it's they had a makeover.
• 33:45
  I'm sorry, didn't make over a Sith makeover, head to toe metal
• 33:49
  and black, and a voice box. It's terrible, it's actually
• 33:53
  terrible. I can't even joke Ahsoka and
• 33:56
  Annika. If I don't get some kind of
• 33:59
  force goes, which I think we're going to get in the Ahsoka show.
• 34:03
  I might I think there's gonna be flashbacks even if there's only
• 34:06
  a flash goes. Yeah, I think isn't Hayden on
• 34:10
  the cast. Yes, that's why I'm saying all
• 34:12
  this if I don't get some window. I might I mean we didn't get a
• 34:19
  clone wars window in Kenobi. So I may just be talking out my
• 34:23
  ass right now about wishful thinking.
• 34:26
  I wonder if the I mean I know the felonious doing Ahsoka, so I
• 34:30
  get it. But I wonder if of people who
• 34:32
  made Kenobi because I know you and McGregor had a big.
• 34:36
  He was the executive producer, maybe he didn't realize like how
• 34:40
  important Clone Wars is because he didn't do it.
• 34:43
  So, like he knows it's there and he appreciates it.
• 34:45
  But I really, I know people said it like, He didn't loves clone
• 34:48
  wars and you've been researching.
• 34:50
  I don't think that's really true.
• 34:52
  I think that they, probably, I think they were probably filled
• 34:55
  in the blanks, but I'm sure they didn't watch seven seasons of an
• 34:59
  animated show for children. I'm sure they did not.
• 35:02
  Let's ask Hayden when we're in London, shall we?
• 35:08
  If we bump into one will be like, excuse us?
• 35:11
  Have you been, how are things? You look a lot healthier now.
• 35:21
  But I think I think maybe maybe they had to watch Clips probably
• 35:28
  to get an understanding, but they have to be diplomats,
• 35:32
  right? They can't be like, they can't
• 35:34
  say, oh no, I didn't watch it, of course, they're not going to
• 35:37
  say that they're going to say, oh yes, and they really added a
• 35:39
  lot to the character and I really appreciate it.
• 35:42
  And then I'm gonna be like night and watch it.
• 35:46
  True. The only person that brutal is
• 35:49
  Tony Gilroy. That is true.
• 35:52
  He literally said he didn't give any Fox and that's why we love
• 35:56
  him. Yeah, he did a great job.
• 35:59
  There's there's two sides of Star Wars.
• 36:01
  They can both coexist. It really felt like they took
• 36:05
  Revenge of the Sith and expanded the next step with that.
• 36:10
  And the only Clone Wars reference.
• 36:12
  Really that we got was Quinlan Vos.
• 36:14
  Yes, they didn't even say. Ahsoka, right?
• 36:18
  Like she wasn't even mentioned and although you and I always
• 36:21
  say like do we have to have Ahsoka and everything?
• 36:23
  Could we just get a breather when it comes to Obi-Wan Anakin
• 36:28
  and Ahsoka is like the three, right?
• 36:32
  So it was surprising. They didn't even mention her
• 36:36
  like oh but wouldn't even say like, well what is so good think
• 36:39
  of you, you know, that could have been an interesting moment.
• 36:43
  So it really felt like I have just one line, right?
• 36:46
  It just one line that It would have I got goosebumps when you
• 36:49
  said that see Vader there like accepting that from Oman.
• 36:55
  Like yeah, I don't, I don't know.
• 36:59
  So it felt like a very compartmentalized story that
• 37:01
  they were telling. And I think some of the
• 37:06
  grown-ups don't realize that Clone Wars is not just a kids
• 37:10
  show, it's not. And it's not just your basic
• 37:13
  animation, either. It is A work of art.
• 37:16
  It is a beautiful work of art. Thank you, gorgeous.
• 37:26
  Join us next week. We are going to celebrate Return
• 37:30
  of the Jedi. Yes!
• 37:31
  Happy 40th. Return to the Jedi.
• 37:34
  Yeah, it's having a birthday right around the celebration
• 37:38
  time. So we are going to recap.
• 37:40
  Our favorite stuff about Return of the Jedi and specifically
• 37:44
  focus on Luke. Invader kind of the end but it
• 37:46
  just talk about it in general because we both love this movie.
• 37:51
  Yes. And there's so many good things
• 37:53
  to cover some deep. Some not so deep but we love to
• 37:56
  have the Deep stuff. So come on back and join us.
• 38:00
  Happy birthday, Return of the Jedi.
• 38:04
  Thank you so much for joining us here on the most things Kenobi
• 38:07
  podcast. We appreciate every single one
• 38:09
  of our patrons and are grateful for your support.
• 38:13
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• 38:15
  well. Head over to the most things
• 38:17
  Kenobi. Patreon, as always, you can
• 38:19
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• 38:23
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• 38:26
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• 38:30
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• 38:31
  find all of these head, over to most things Kenobi.com.
• 38:36
  So until next time, my space twin May the force be with you
• 38:41
  always.