Latest / The Heart-Led Business Show / Pucks to Prayers: The Journey of Dr. Dave Jones

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Pucks to Prayers: The Journey of Dr. Dave Jones · The Heart-Led Business Show

• 0:01
  Speaker: Welcome to The Heart-Led Business Show, where compassion meets commerce and leaders lead with love.
• 0:09
  Speaker: Join your host, Tom Jackobs, as he delves into the insightful conversations with visionary business leaders who defy the status quo, putting humanity first and profit second.
• 0:20
  Speaker: From heartfelt strategies to inspiring stories, this podcast is your compass in the world of conscious capitalism.
• 0:29
  Speaker: So buckle up and let your heart guide your business journey.
• 0:36
  Tom Jackobs: Well, welcome back to the Heart-Led Business Show.
• 0:38
  Tom Jackobs: Today we are thrilled to have the dynamic Dr.
• 0:42
  Tom Jackobs: Dave Jones in the house.
• 0:44
  Tom Jackobs: From taking slap shots in Europe's hockey arenas to founding M is Good.
• 0:49
  Tom Jackobs: A Christian advertising agency that has blessed over 1,000 ministries.
• 0:53
  Tom Jackobs: Dave's journey is as compelling as a championship game with his knack for uniting excellence in the marketplace and a heart as big as his hockey dreams.
• 1:02
  Tom Jackobs: He's here to share insights on leading with love in business.
• 1:06
  Tom Jackobs: Buckle up for a heartwarming discussion.
• 1:09
  Tom Jackobs: Dr.
• 1:09
  Tom Jackobs: Dave, welcome to the show.
• 1:11
  Dr Dave Jones: Thank you for having me, Tom, I'm so excited to be here.
• 1:15
  Tom Jackobs: That's awesome.
• 1:16
  Tom Jackobs: And I am super excited as well to dive into your story because I think it's just fascinating just how you've been able to wrap everything together and create a business.
• 1:24
  Tom Jackobs: But before we do that, of course, I always like to ask the first question, which is, what's your definition of a heart-led business?
• 1:32
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah, such a great question.
• 1:33
  Dr Dave Jones: And I think in the last 10 years I've tried to lead this way.
• 1:37
  Dr Dave Jones: And it's really, to me, it's leading with intimacy and transparency.
• 1:41
  Dr Dave Jones: And leading with your heart means being open, right?
• 1:44
  Dr Dave Jones: And being transparent for me.
• 1:46
  Dr Dave Jones: And I think God has blessed that we all go through struggles.
• 1:50
  Dr Dave Jones: And my point of view, or the way I look at life isn't awesome all the time for anybody.
• 1:58
  Dr Dave Jones: There's peaks and valleys, mentally, emotionally, physically, spiritually.
• 2:01
  Dr Dave Jones: And we have to recognize those times where we're in the valley and we're in a peak.
• 2:05
  Dr Dave Jones: And I think more people are willing to jump on and help you if you just open up to them, whether it's business or personal.
• 2:14
  Dr Dave Jones: Yes, we have to deliver a certain deliverable at, at the end of the day.
• 2:18
  Dr Dave Jones: But just being transparent about where you're at and sharing your life with people is important.
• 2:22
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah, absolutely.
• 2:24
  Tom Jackobs: So what would a or how would you describe somebody leading with intimacy and transparency?
• 2:29
  Tom Jackobs: What might that look like in the workplace?
• 2:31
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah.
• 2:32
  Dr Dave Jones: I think for us it's, it's radically different.
• 2:35
  Dr Dave Jones: I've had I would say I dipped my toe in corporate America that I don't want to be part of it.
• 2:40
  Dr Dave Jones: And so I, I think it's pretty easy to see, like when somebody's leading with fear and somebody's leading with anger and pride, and I used to be that person, so I recognize it, when you put somebody down, I used to think that I could get ahead in life if I put everybody else down that I would be the last man standing and I would be tall.
• 3:01
  Dr Dave Jones: And so, it doesn't work that way.
• 3:05
  Dr Dave Jones: And so, um, I had to learn the hard way on that.
• 3:08
  Dr Dave Jones: And so I think it's fairly easy for me to see when somebody's leading that way'cause that was me at one time.
• 3:14
  Dr Dave Jones: I think your fear, your loss, your anger and your pride lead you.
• 3:17
  Dr Dave Jones: Vision doesn't lead you, your emotions lead you.
• 3:20
  Dr Dave Jones: Years ago I wrote this article on emotional intelligence and, I've defined high EI and low EI.
• 3:27
  Dr Dave Jones: So when you're high EI you lead with vision.
• 3:29
  Dr Dave Jones: You're very much growth, have a growth mindset.
• 3:32
  Dr Dave Jones: When you're low EI you lead with emotions.
• 3:34
  Dr Dave Jones: You're very emotional person.
• 3:36
  Dr Dave Jones: People are exhausted when they're around you.
• 3:38
  Dr Dave Jones: That's some tips.
• 3:39
  Dr Dave Jones: I can't remember'em all, but one of them is, I can't sleep at night when I'm low EI If, I don't know, I'm low EI, but at the end of the day, I can't sleep because I'm thinking about what I said to somebody, you're low EI.
• 3:48
  Dr Dave Jones: You know, so when you lead with emotions and you just don't feel good about who you are in your own skin, this is what I would defined as low EI and leading in a non-effective way.
• 3:59
  Tom Jackobs: So what does the opposite look like then in terms of somebody that's leading with transparency and open and honest with everybody.
• 4:06
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah, it's great.
• 4:07
  Dr Dave Jones: It's great question.
• 4:08
  Dr Dave Jones: There's four major areas here that I think not all, it's not an inclusive list, a complete list.
• 4:15
  Dr Dave Jones: But these are the big ones.
• 4:17
  Dr Dave Jones: Fear.
• 4:18
  Dr Dave Jones: I'm leading with fear.
• 4:19
  Dr Dave Jones: The opposite would be I'm leading in faith.
• 4:22
  Dr Dave Jones: And so there's very distinct uh, behaviors with fear and faith.
• 4:26
  Dr Dave Jones: I could talk about those, just one or two bullet points on each.
• 4:29
  Dr Dave Jones: Fear is, you know, I'm holding on to things.
• 4:32
  Dr Dave Jones: I don't trust anybody.
• 4:33
  Dr Dave Jones: I want to control everything.
• 4:35
  Tom Jackobs: Guilty at some point in my life.
• 4:40
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah, that'd be pretty easy to see.
• 4:43
  Dr Dave Jones: And then faith's opposite of that faith is very much, it's intimate.
• 4:46
  Dr Dave Jones: I don't know where we're going.
• 4:47
  Dr Dave Jones: Here's the roadmap.
• 4:48
  Dr Dave Jones: I need your help gals.
• 4:49
  Dr Dave Jones: I need your help.
• 4:50
  Dr Dave Jones: This is where we're going.
• 4:51
  Dr Dave Jones: I don't know the next step, but if we do it together, we'll succeed or failure, but we're gonna do it together.
• 4:57
  Dr Dave Jones: Let's venture out.
• 4:58
  Dr Dave Jones: So faith is just the opposite of fear.
• 5:00
  Dr Dave Jones: So when we talk about fear, lust, you know, most people see lust as something that's sexual.
• 5:06
  Dr Dave Jones: It can be where you're addicted to that side of things.
• 5:09
  Dr Dave Jones: That was never me.
• 5:10
  Dr Dave Jones: I was very fortunate in that.
• 5:11
  Dr Dave Jones: I think lust can be things that like, like things that you want, that you, you lust for, whether it's a house, a car more money, it's something that you wanna possess.
• 5:21
  Dr Dave Jones: That's ineffective.
• 5:23
  Dr Dave Jones: I, I'm not saying that you, you don't want a bigger house or a nicer car.
• 5:26
  Dr Dave Jones: I think those things are awesome, honestly.
• 5:28
  Dr Dave Jones: But it's how you get about'em.
• 5:30
  Dr Dave Jones: If I'm working hard, I'm growing and changing, those things just come about.
• 5:32
  Dr Dave Jones: But if I'm really lusting for'em.
• 5:35
  Dr Dave Jones: And it's, it is different.
• 5:37
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah, because you're putting a lot of emphasis on getting that material thing and you're almost obsessing about it to a point where it's not really healthy.
• 5:47
  Tom Jackobs: That's at least how I see that lustfulness.
• 5:50
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah.
• 5:51
  Dr Dave Jones: So it's like, I'm gonna get those and those things are gonna define me.
• 5:54
  Dr Dave Jones: So people, power and possessions will define me when I get there.
• 5:59
  Dr Dave Jones: That, That lens is left with a lot of heartbreak, a lot of depression and anxiety and stress.
• 6:04
  Dr Dave Jones: So the opposite of that would be love.
• 6:07
  Dr Dave Jones: So I love to give, I'm grateful.
• 6:10
  Dr Dave Jones: Love breaks the back of lust, it's better to give than it is to receive, that's the opposite.
• 6:16
  Dr Dave Jones: Whereas lust says, I'm gonna take and hold on and hold on.
• 6:19
  Dr Dave Jones: It's about me.
• 6:20
  Tom Jackobs: Great examples there as well.
• 6:22
  Tom Jackobs: So, tell us a little bit about your backstory and what led you up to what you're doing today.
• 6:29
  Dr Dave Jones: The reason I can talk about this stuff so freely is'cause those all those things just define me.
• 6:34
  Dr Dave Jones: So I grew up in a hockey rink.
• 6:35
  Dr Dave Jones: I looked at thing I looked at attention differently.
• 6:39
  Dr Dave Jones: I realized that if I scored a bunch of goals, I could get lots of attention.
• 6:43
  Dr Dave Jones: So I just figured out how to score more goals.
• 6:45
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 6:46
  Dr Dave Jones: And so I got pretty good at scoring goals and I became a pretty good hockey player.
• 6:50
  Dr Dave Jones: And so I just grew up in a rink until I was about 25.
• 6:54
  Dr Dave Jones: But when I was playing for Cleveland, think I was 21 or 22, I was in Kalamazoo K-Wing Stadium, and I got a slap shot in the face.
• 7:02
  Dr Dave Jones: That broke my nose in three different directions,
• 7:05
  Tom Jackobs: oh
• 7:05
  Dr Dave Jones: cut the nerves, my teeth and my mouth and I had a deviated septum.
• 7:10
  Tom Jackobs: Oh wow.
• 7:11
  Dr Dave Jones: And those your listeners out there know a hockey rink.
• 7:13
  Dr Dave Jones: I fell to my knees at the right around the blue line and I went all the way into the goal line, and blood was just pumping outta my nose.
• 7:20
  Dr Dave Jones: And the trainer came over with a white towel.
• 7:22
  Dr Dave Jones: And put it on my face.
• 7:23
  Dr Dave Jones: And by the time we got back to the bench, that white towel was red.
• 7:26
  Tom Jackobs: oh,
• 7:27
  Dr Dave Jones: and if you can see like you can, like my nose is just still today it's lopsided.
• 7:31
  Tom Jackobs: That's pretty incredible too.
• 7:33
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah.
• 7:34
  Dr Dave Jones: So that began a change for me of, what the heck am I doing?
• 7:39
  Dr Dave Jones: So I ended up taking some time off and then I ended up going over to Europe and playing and chasing a pro career from there.
• 7:46
  Dr Dave Jones: I got a couple more concussions there.
• 7:48
  Dr Dave Jones: I ended up with seven concussions.
• 7:50
  Dr Dave Jones: Um, The last one I had was back in 2013 and I still, maybe it's a culmination of all the other concussions, but I got a slap shot and it hit my temple and cracked my skull with internal bleeding.
• 8:03
  Dr Dave Jones: And to this day I still manage that.
• 8:05
  Dr Dave Jones: It's something about fatigue.
• 8:07
  Dr Dave Jones: Like I have to sleep, I have to get a certain amount of hours of sleep.
• 8:09
  Dr Dave Jones: I have to protect my sleep.
• 8:11
  Dr Dave Jones: And I take nootropics like an over the counter supplement to help me with brain fog.
• 8:16
  Tom Jackobs: That's crazy.
• 8:17
  Tom Jackobs: You just looking at brain scans too, have you had your brain scan to see what might be going on in there and.
• 8:24
  Dr Dave Jones: I haven't had one in the last couple years, but now that you said it, I probably should go get another one.
• 8:29
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah.
• 8:30
  Dr Dave Jones: Just to check it out.
• 8:31
  Tom Jackobs: I mean there's some pretty amazing stuff.
• 8:33
  Tom Jackobs: I work with a lot of functional medicine docs and there's stuff that they're working on with brain health that's non-invasive and can help with helping reprogram, especially around concussions and some of the issues that come up with that as well.
• 8:46
  Dr Dave Jones: I definitely need to, I need to schedule that.
• 8:48
  Dr Dave Jones: Thank you for that.
• 8:49
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah, no worries.
• 8:51
  Tom Jackobs: So you're in Europe and you're getting slapped around quite a bit then what happens?
• 8:55
  Dr Dave Jones: And I basically ended my career there.
• 8:57
  Dr Dave Jones: Moved to Colorado.
• 8:59
  Dr Dave Jones: I was 25, 26 years old at that time.
• 9:02
  Dr Dave Jones: I met my wife in Germany.
• 9:04
  Dr Dave Jones: So fiance, we got engaged.
• 9:06
  Dr Dave Jones: I'm still married to her today.
• 9:08
  Dr Dave Jones: It's been 25 years.
• 9:09
  Dr Dave Jones: She was actually from Pennsylvania who just going over there to visit friends and we ended up meeting, which is crazy.
• 9:16
  Tom Jackobs: That's crazy.
• 9:17
  Dr Dave Jones: It's a totally God thing.
• 9:19
  Dr Dave Jones: And so moved to Denver, Colorado and then eventually moved to Greenville, North Carolina.
• 9:25
  Dr Dave Jones: I started the company from Greenville, North Carolina.
• 9:28
  Dr Dave Jones: Now I live in Raleigh, North Carolina.
• 9:30
  Tom Jackobs: And the company the advertising agency or the?
• 9:33
  Dr Dave Jones: Yep.
• 9:33
  Dr Dave Jones: So M is Good.
• 9:34
  Dr Dave Jones: It was originally called Marketing Ministries.
• 9:36
  Dr Dave Jones: And so the technical name is Marketing Ministry is doing business as M is Good today, so it's our 25th year.
• 9:42
  Tom Jackobs: That's amazing.
• 9:43
  Tom Jackobs: So how do you balance then, just talking more on the business side of being a heart-led business.
• 9:48
  Tom Jackobs: How do you balance making a profit and still being heart-led and everything that comes along with that?
• 9:56
  Dr Dave Jones: I don't know the right answer here.
• 9:57
  Dr Dave Jones: I knew this question was coming.
• 9:59
  Dr Dave Jones: Because like Tom, I'm like, this is what happened to me, and so this is how I balance.
• 10:04
  Dr Dave Jones: It's a great question.
• 10:05
  Dr Dave Jones: I don't think I have the right answer.
• 10:06
  Dr Dave Jones: I felt that when I wasn't leading with profitability, I was being used, I was being run over and so I had to say.
• 10:16
  Dr Dave Jones: I had to put down a boundary here.
• 10:18
  Dr Dave Jones: In order for me to get respect, I had to lay a boundary down.
• 10:21
  Dr Dave Jones: And so this is the cost and here's how much time I'm gonna spend, and if you need me to spend more time, then we need to look at the cost.
• 10:29
  Dr Dave Jones: Like we had to balance that.
• 10:30
  Dr Dave Jones: So I just got really abused by it, honestly, and I wish it was a different story, but it was being abused by pastors.
• 10:40
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah, that we just say
• 10:41
  Tom Jackobs: So you kinda swung the, all the way over to the one side.
• 10:44
  Tom Jackobs: Totally heart-led and not looking at the profit and just giving, giving, giving without getting anything in return.
• 10:50
  Dr Dave Jones: That's right.
• 10:51
  Dr Dave Jones: It was just a wake up call and I'm thankful.
• 10:53
  Dr Dave Jones: I am really thankful.
• 10:55
  Dr Dave Jones: I won't say the pastor's name, but I said, Hey, we were producing his television show for years.
• 11:01
  Dr Dave Jones: Like I was a friend.
• 11:02
  Dr Dave Jones: And I said, Hey it's, I don't remember the numbers exactly, but it was like, Hey, we spent a hundred hours, doing your program here and here's what we charged, but we only billed you for 70 and it took us a hundred.
• 11:13
  Dr Dave Jones: And he just looked me in the eye look at me in the eye.
• 11:14
  Dr Dave Jones: It was like just an everyday conversation.
• 11:16
  Dr Dave Jones: Said, Hey Dave, I didn't write the proposal.
• 11:18
  Dr Dave Jones: You did, you spent 30 more hours.
• 11:21
  Dr Dave Jones: That's your fault.
• 11:22
  Dr Dave Jones: He's I'm not paying$30, 30, 30 hours more.
• 11:25
  Dr Dave Jones: You didn't manage your time rate.
• 11:26
  Dr Dave Jones: Why is that my problem?
• 11:28
  Dr Dave Jones: And I was like he's right.
• 11:29
  Dr Dave Jones: And you know what's cool about that?
• 11:30
  Dr Dave Jones: I, looking back on it, the next year I wrote it for a hundred hours and he couldn't afford it.
• 11:35
  Dr Dave Jones: And so I lost the business.
• 11:37
  Dr Dave Jones: So then I just said, you know what, from now on, I'm just gonna make sure I build in the profitability and the scope creep is what we call it.
• 11:44
  Dr Dave Jones: So then that began this transformation of, all right we either need bigger clients or we just got to, find clients that can pay what we're worth.
• 11:51
  Dr Dave Jones: And so it's just been a series of that and finding clients.
• 11:54
  Dr Dave Jones: And now I look at it as I've taken care of the border, the boundary that I laid.
• 12:00
  Dr Dave Jones: Now, the profitability is something that I can be a blessing to other people.
• 12:04
  Dr Dave Jones: Like doing this podcast on a nice podcast set because I could afford the technology to be able to do it is a blessing to me to be able to give back, and so I look at it that way.
• 12:14
  Dr Dave Jones: It's can you really be a blessing without profitability?
• 12:17
  Dr Dave Jones: You can, it's just harder.
• 12:20
  Tom Jackobs: It's so interesting, like when I speak to a lot of heart-led business owners and they talk about not having the profitability and just the struggles that they're having, and then making the suggestion why don't you raise your rate?
• 12:31
  Tom Jackobs: Oh, I could never raise my rates.
• 12:32
  Tom Jackobs: That's all.
• 12:33
  Tom Jackobs: But I, so it is like this double edged sword.
• 12:36
  Tom Jackobs: But then when you say what would you do with that extra money that you have?
• 12:40
  Tom Jackobs: And then you just see their eyes light up and think about what they could do in terms of the giving and the impact that they could have if they have the financial resources to be able to do that.
• 12:51
  Tom Jackobs: And I think that's a huge difference between profit led versus heart-led folks, whereas profit LED is just looking to accumulate more profit
• 13:00
  Dr Dave Jones: Mm-hmm.
• 13:01
  Tom Jackobs: and for profit's sake versus heart-led wants to add that profit so that they can do more and better things with the extra profit as well.
• 13:11
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah, I really got intimate with myself and really kinda looked at what was the underlying issue, like what was truly the issue.
• 13:20
  Dr Dave Jones: I boiled down to one thing, it was my self image.
• 13:23
  Dr Dave Jones: How I saw myself in terms of value what I bring and when my self image increased, my rates did.
• 13:30
  Dr Dave Jones: I looked at two like, I can't increase my rates.
• 13:33
  Dr Dave Jones: Why can't you?
• 13:34
  Dr Dave Jones: Because there's somebody in the same field as you, hundreds of them, maybe thousands of them that charge way more than you.
• 13:41
  Dr Dave Jones: Why is that?
• 13:42
  Tom Jackobs: Okay.
• 13:42
  Dr Dave Jones: When charging less and you're not profitable and you're stressed out, who are you good to in this case?
• 13:48
  Dr Dave Jones: So it came down to what is my worth?
• 13:51
  Dr Dave Jones: What do I see myself as my worth?
• 13:53
  Dr Dave Jones: So I went from like we have this one product maybe talk about today's R7.
• 13:58
  Dr Dave Jones: I went, R7 was free at one point, and then it went from free to$500.
• 14:02
  Dr Dave Jones: And I'm spending 10 sessions, almost 20 hours with clients.
• 14:05
  Dr Dave Jones: It went from free to 500 to 1,500 to 2,500 to 5,000 today it's 10,000.
• 14:12
  Dr Dave Jones: And I'm like, what changed?
• 14:13
  Dr Dave Jones: What changed Dave's perception of his identity and what that consultation is gonna do for the client and the deliverables is what changed?
• 14:22
  Tom Jackobs: And then you can do so much more with that additional profit versus spending all that time for free.
• 14:29
  Tom Jackobs: Now you become resentful and then you're then you don't provide the best for your clients, your family, your friends, it just, it's a downward spiral versus when you have enough profit in there, you're more relaxed, you make better decisions, and you generally a happier person as well, because you're not as, as stressed out and not, kicking the dog when you come into the house at night.
• 14:51
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah.
• 14:52
  Dr Dave Jones: I also think too, like you're spot on, I think, in terms of, but I think goes a little further into that, I can hire better people.
• 14:58
  Dr Dave Jones: We could put on a better product, we can be more accountable.
• 15:01
  Dr Dave Jones: And for me, we're in the Christian space.
• 15:04
  Dr Dave Jones: I want to glorify the Lord with my talents and my abilities at the end of the day, I want to hear the words well done, good and faithful servant at the end of the road.
• 15:11
  Dr Dave Jones: I want the time to be able to think this through.
• 15:14
  Dr Dave Jones: This isn't about me having something bigger and better, whether it's a house or a boat or a car.
• 15:19
  Dr Dave Jones: This is about having the profitability to bring on quality people to deliver a quality product.
• 15:26
  Dr Dave Jones: That's the way I look at profitability.
• 15:28
  Tom Jackobs: Absolutely.
• 15:28
  Tom Jackobs: And if you don't have both of those things, then you're not gonna have be in business for very long.
• 15:33
  Dr Dave Jones: That's right.
• 15:34
  Tom Jackobs: For sure.
• 15:34
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 15:34
  Dr Dave Jones: That's it.
• 15:35
  Tom Jackobs: Cool.
• 15:35
  Tom Jackobs: How do you work with employees to make sure that they're following the same heart-led approach that you have?
• 15:42
  Dr Dave Jones: Not well.
• 15:47
  Tom Jackobs: I like your transparency and honesty.
• 15:49
  Dr Dave Jones: I have a small staff and I really like my staff right now.
• 15:52
  Dr Dave Jones: This is probably the best staff I've ever had.
• 15:54
  Dr Dave Jones: We have a standard and we try to hit that standard every day.
• 15:58
  Dr Dave Jones: And I try to give everybody the opportunity to become the best version of themself.
• 16:03
  Dr Dave Jones: I love to find what people are good at my staff and just put him in that position to win.
• 16:09
  Dr Dave Jones: I think there does come a line where they're not delivering, they're not happy.
• 16:15
  Dr Dave Jones: And I can see that.
• 16:17
  Dr Dave Jones: And I feel like our vision and our mission at M is Good, is pretty strong in what we're doing.
• 16:22
  Dr Dave Jones: So they just weed themselves out, honestly.
• 16:24
  Dr Dave Jones: It's my 25th year and I've had, I don't wanna say lots of turnover, but I have turnover.
• 16:29
  Dr Dave Jones: And every single situation happens where it's like they just leave because they're just not in their space.
• 16:35
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 16:35
  Dr Dave Jones: You know, something happens where it's like they just, they identify themselves.
• 16:40
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah, that's good on, on that side.
• 16:41
  Tom Jackobs: And then even better when you can see them really flourish in a job and go beyond whatever your expectations are.
• 16:49
  Tom Jackobs: I have, I have a staff member right now that's like that, and I'm just like, every time that I see stuff from them, it's, I'm like, wow, this is really amazing and I'm so happy that, they're on the team.
• 17:01
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah.
• 17:01
  Tom Jackobs: it makes life so much easier.
• 17:03
  Tom Jackobs: Everything is running.
• 17:04
  Tom Jackobs: What type of interview process or hiring process do you have to make sure you're getting the right people?
• 17:10
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah, I just try to be open and transparent in what we do.
• 17:15
  Dr Dave Jones: I think that, by just the name, M is Good and we're a Christian ad agency, that sort of, allows people to know that we're a Christian ad agency and these are the beliefs and we have Christian clients and employees that are coming in, they understand that now it's not my place to judge them where they're on, in terms of their walk with the Lord.
• 17:34
  Dr Dave Jones: I don't get in the middle of that ever'cause I don't want to be their judge, I don't want any of that.
• 17:39
  Dr Dave Jones: So we've been, so that's built in and I think the trick is really when you're trying to find somebody's passion in the marketing, the messaging, the design, the building stuff, whether it's a website, a landing page, client facing, non-client, like finding that skill development in them is something that takes time and you just have to be patient with where they're gonna land.
• 18:02
  Dr Dave Jones: And I think I've done a pretty good job of that.
• 18:05
  Dr Dave Jones: I too have a similar person like you were describing on your staff who came in as a graphic designer.
• 18:10
  Dr Dave Jones: Now he's the VP of the company
• 18:12
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 18:12
  Dr Dave Jones: I recognize his skill and talent every single day.
• 18:15
  Dr Dave Jones: Absolutely love him and everything he does for the business and our clients.
• 18:19
  Dr Dave Jones: It's unreal.
• 18:21
  Dr Dave Jones: Like I just feel so blessed to have him on staff.
• 18:23
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah, it just make, makes life so much easier
• 18:25
  Dr Dave Jones: Oh my gosh.
• 18:26
  Tom Jackobs: you know, that are I like what you said, get them into the position where they can win.
• 18:31
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah.
• 18:31
  Tom Jackobs: love that, that philosophy.
• 18:33
  Tom Jackobs: That's great.
• 18:34
  Tom Jackobs: So Dave, how can people find more about, or find out more about M is Good and potentially work with you?
• 18:40
  Dr Dave Jones: One of the things that we've done really well over the years is we've really owned the keyword Christian marketing.
• 18:46
  Dr Dave Jones: So you can Google Christian marketing, M is Good comes up, or you can go to misgood.com and find us there, and if you wanna talk to me specifically, there's plenty of opportunities on the, let's chat, let's chats everywhere on the website.
• 18:59
  Dr Dave Jones: I see all the leads that come through and everybody that comes through and yeah.
• 19:02
  Dr Dave Jones: So that's how you can get ahold of us.
• 19:03
  Tom Jackobs: Nice.
• 19:04
  Tom Jackobs: And, And what type of businesses do you like to work with or what's kinda your ideal client?
• 19:08
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah, I I would say obviously you know, they're glorifying the Lord with some level, whether it's they're Christian business owner, or they have the Christian business owner with a secular business or just they have a ministry.
• 19:21
  Dr Dave Jones: I think we do well with Christian organizations that are 5 to 10 years into it, two to 3 million in some type of revenue.
• 19:30
  Dr Dave Jones: We do okay with startups.
• 19:32
  Dr Dave Jones: The reason I'm saying that is we do really well with conversion.
• 19:35
  Dr Dave Jones: We do messaging and KPI management really well.
• 19:38
  Dr Dave Jones: It just takes time for customer acquisition.
• 19:42
  Dr Dave Jones: And when you're talking about time, you're talking about money.
• 19:44
  Tom Jackobs: Yep.
• 19:44
  Dr Dave Jones: so there's gotta be a certain level of a budget to be able to ride that conversion timeframe.
• 19:50
  Tom Jackobs: Yep.
• 19:51
  Dr Dave Jones: If the budget's not there, then it just doesn't work.
• 19:54
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah.
• 19:54
  Tom Jackobs: I'm finding that out the hard way over the last couple of years.
• 19:57
  Tom Jackobs: So, um, yeah, it's fascinating just as I dig a little bit deeper into the marketing aspects it's just fascinating.
• 20:04
  Tom Jackobs: I love just learning all that stuff.
• 20:07
  Dr Dave Jones: Yeah.
• 20:07
  Tom Jackobs: Yeah, what a great service too that you're offering.
• 20:11
  Dr Dave Jones: Thank you.
• 20:11
  Tom Jackobs: Very awesome.
• 20:13
  Tom Jackobs: So, Dave, thank you again for being on the show today and just sharing your stories, your wisdom, kind of the advice for other heart-led businesses, and just being a great example of being a heart-led business owner.
• 20:23
  Tom Jackobs: So thank you.
• 20:24
  Tom Jackobs: Thank you very much.
• 20:24
  Dr Dave Jones: I appreciate your time and I'm thankful for being on your podcast today, Tom.
• 20:28
  Dr Dave Jones: Thank you.
• 20:28
  Tom Jackobs: You're very welcome and thank you listeners for tuning in today and listening to the Heart-Led Business Show.
• 20:34
  Tom Jackobs: Make sure you're checking everything out that Dr.
• 20:36
  Tom Jackobs: Dave has, and we're gonna put all that down into the show notes, so you can just click on the link there to get to his website and find out more about M is Good.
• 20:45
  Tom Jackobs: And while you're down there, if you could do me a favor and give the show a rating and review.
• 20:49
  Tom Jackobs: That definitely helps spread the word about Heart-Led Business Show, and as we highlight more businesses that are heart-led in the world.
• 20:57
  Tom Jackobs: So until next time, lead with your heart.
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: You've been listening to The Heart-Led Business Show, hosted by Tom Jackobs.
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: Join us next time for another inspiring journey into the heart of business.