Latest / Hurdle with Emily Abbate / #HURDLEMOMENT: How To Pick A Therapist & What To Know Before You Go

Transcript

#HURDLEMOMENT: How To Pick A Therapist & What To Know Before You Go · Hurdle with Emily Abbate

0:00
Speaker 1: The better that we understand ourselves, and the better of
0:04
Speaker 1: a relationship that we have with ourselves, the more able
0:09
Speaker 1: we are going to be to engage in healthy relationships
0:12
Speaker 1: and healthy activities and fulfilling activities in the outside world.
0:31
Speaker 2: Hey everyone, Emily a body here. You are listening to
0:34
Speaker 2: another installment of Hurdle. Moment from Hurdle. I am just
0:39
Speaker 2: going to address this right off the bat.
0:41
Speaker 3: My voice it's been in better shape before it's here.
0:46
Speaker 3: It's just it's a.
0:48
Speaker 2: Little struggle city from a little extra socializing. I went
0:53
Speaker 2: down to Miami with my run club and being out
0:58
Speaker 2: and around.
0:59
Speaker 3: People for the first I'm in a long time.
1:01
Speaker 2: Clearly spending a year plus at home alone.
1:06
Speaker 3: I need to ease back into society.
1:08
Speaker 2: I think this also reminds me of I recorded with
1:11
Speaker 2: Ruth Zuckerman. She was one of the co founders of Flywheel,
1:16
Speaker 2: and I was set to record with her. I believe
1:19
Speaker 2: it was a day after my final class as a
1:23
Speaker 2: spin instructor. This is a few years ago now, and
1:27
Speaker 2: when I left that class, which was super emotional and
1:31
Speaker 2: just super special, within like an hour, my voice was
1:34
Speaker 2: just gone. And I was frightened because I was so
1:37
Speaker 2: so excited to record with Ruth, and I crowdsourced my
1:43
Speaker 2: Instagram followers for their best tips and tricks, which included
1:47
Speaker 2: elderberry gummies and sitting in a shower and chugging water
1:52
Speaker 2: and avoiding anything that could be dehydrating like alcohols or caffeine.
1:57
Speaker 3: And I didn't speak.
1:58
Speaker 2: From I want to say, noon one day through probably
2:03
Speaker 2: noon the following day, right before I was going to
2:05
Speaker 2: sit down with Ruth and I spoke and we were fine,
2:10
Speaker 2: but it was super stressful.
2:12
Speaker 3: So I always think.
2:12
Speaker 2: About that when my voice is in this current state. Anyway,
2:17
Speaker 2: let's talk about hurdle moment. Let's talk about what we're
2:19
Speaker 2: getting into here today. Today on the show, I am
2:22
Speaker 2: going to be chatting with doctor Amanda Fock. She is
2:27
Speaker 2: the chief of clinical services at the Dorm, which is
2:30
Speaker 2: a treatment community for young adults ages eighteen to thirty five.
2:35
Speaker 2: I've got virtual treatment options as well as physical locations
2:38
Speaker 2: in both New York and Washington, d C. We are
2:40
Speaker 2: going to be chatting about exactly what to look for
2:44
Speaker 2: when searching for a therapist. I know there are so
2:47
Speaker 2: many different options out there. We address what those are,
2:50
Speaker 2: We talk about what some of the letters at the
2:52
Speaker 2: end of someone's name might mean how there are different
2:55
Speaker 2: types of therapy and how to figure out which one
2:57
Speaker 2: might be the right one for you. We talk cost
3:00
Speaker 2: I mean, we really cover it all. I've had some
3:03
Speaker 2: really special and interesting conversations on the show before about
3:07
Speaker 2: therapy and what it's been like for me and opening
3:09
Speaker 2: up about that, But I don't think I've ever dove
3:12
Speaker 2: into the nitty gritty like this with someone to really
3:15
Speaker 2: help someone who may have never gone to therapy before,
3:19
Speaker 2: for someone who has done it and isn't exactly sure
3:21
Speaker 2: what other options that may be out there, differing from
3:24
Speaker 2: what they've already tested out. So here, I'm here to
3:27
Speaker 2: help you out. I'm here to give you the rundown,
3:29
Speaker 2: and I'm here to give you the resources that you
3:31
Speaker 2: need to seek out help and take care of your
3:34
Speaker 2: mental health because it is just so so important.
3:38
Speaker 3: Make sure you're following along with Hurdle.
3:39
Speaker 2: Over at Hurdle Podcast, I am over at Emily a
3:42
Speaker 2: Body and with that, let's get to it.
3:44
Speaker 3: Let's get to Hurdling.
3:53
Speaker 2: Today. I am chatting with Amanda Fall because she is
4:01
Speaker 2: a licensed clinical social worker. She's also chief of Clinical
4:05
Speaker 2: Services at the Dorm.
4:06
Speaker 3: How are you doing today.
4:07
Speaker 4: I'm doing good. Thank you? How are you?
4:09
Speaker 3: I'm so good.
4:10
Speaker 2: I'm so excited that we're sitting down because I've been
4:12
Speaker 2: having a lot of really awesome conversations about mental health,
4:17
Speaker 2: the importance of mental health, how helpful it can be
4:21
Speaker 2: to work with a therapist. But the questions that come
4:24
Speaker 2: in are surrounding this topic that we're going to be
4:28
Speaker 2: talking about today, which is what to look for when
4:31
Speaker 2: seeking mental health treatment. So before we dive into the particulars,
4:36
Speaker 2: I always love to know a little bit about the
4:39
Speaker 2: backstory of who I am sitting down with. So talk
4:42
Speaker 2: to me about how you got into this position with
4:46
Speaker 2: the dorm. What is it that made you interested in
4:50
Speaker 2: making this kind of work your work?
4:53
Speaker 1: You know, My story, I think is similar to a
4:55
Speaker 1: lot of different helping professionals or mental health professionals. We
4:59
Speaker 1: get into the field because we want to help, because
5:02
Speaker 1: we enjoy helping others. And typically we enjoy helping others
5:07
Speaker 1: because maybe we've experienced some stuff in our histories where
5:11
Speaker 1: we have needed help and there have been significant people
5:15
Speaker 1: in our lives who have helped and inspired us.
5:18
Speaker 4: Or maybe we've had.
5:19
Speaker 1: A family member who's needed help and through that process
5:23
Speaker 1: have been inspired to help others. For myself, you know,
5:26
Speaker 1: growing up being an adolescent is hard, and transitioning into
5:31
Speaker 1: young adulthood is hard, and I'm so grateful for the
5:36
Speaker 1: resources and the help that I had during that time
5:39
Speaker 1: period to navigate the roller coasters and the ups and downs.
5:43
Speaker 1: And that inspired me to work specifically with this age
5:48
Speaker 1: group of teenagers of young adults because I think it's
5:52
Speaker 1: only getting harder to be a young person these days,
5:55
Speaker 1: and it's important that they have safe and pathic, compassionate
6:01
Speaker 1: understanding helping professionals in their lives to get through the
6:06
Speaker 1: hard times.
6:07
Speaker 2: So for you, when you say that you were really
6:09
Speaker 2: grateful for the resources you had, what options did you
6:13
Speaker 2: dive into when you were growing up?
6:16
Speaker 1: Having people outside of your family system to talk to
6:20
Speaker 1: so trusted adults, having people outside of your friend groups,
6:24
Speaker 1: just objective outside opinions and people to freely talk to
6:30
Speaker 1: was so important.
6:31
Speaker 4: You didn't have to censor yourself.
6:33
Speaker 1: You didn't have to or I didn't have to censer myself.
6:36
Speaker 1: I didn't have to worry about what I said if
6:38
Speaker 1: it would hurt somebody's feelings. So having those individual therapists available,
6:44
Speaker 1: I think is important. Therapy isn't just for people who
6:49
Speaker 1: are in crisis. Therapy can be used to just help
6:53
Speaker 1: you learn more about yourself and to grow as a
6:57
Speaker 1: human being. And I think that we need to as
7:00
Speaker 1: a society get away from thinking about therapy is something
7:03
Speaker 1: that you only.
7:04
Speaker 4: Do if you're an intense crisis.
7:05
Speaker 1: Yes, of course, when you're in crisis, doing therapy is
7:09
Speaker 1: vital to your well being.
7:11
Speaker 4: But you don't have to be in crisis to just
7:13
Speaker 4: want to.
7:13
Speaker 1: Talk to somebody and to learn more about yourself and
7:17
Speaker 1: to evolve as a human being.
7:19
Speaker 2: Definitely not so when you were younger you sought out
7:23
Speaker 2: in person therapy, Yes.
7:25
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean we didn't have the world of Zoom
7:28
Speaker 1: and all of that back then, so that was the
7:30
Speaker 1: only option.
7:32
Speaker 2: And reflecting on your process, do you remember meeting with
7:36
Speaker 2: a therapist for the first time and thinking, oh, this
7:39
Speaker 2: is definitely the person that I want to sit down with.
7:41
Speaker 2: And do you remember it being awkward or good? What
7:44
Speaker 2: was that like for you?
7:45
Speaker 4: No?
7:46
Speaker 1: I actually remember it being incredibly awkward and not liking
7:49
Speaker 1: it at all. And I think that that's why it's
7:52
Speaker 1: so important to realize that the relationship that somebody has
7:55
Speaker 1: with a therapist is like any relationship in your life.
7:59
Speaker 1: Some relationships work and it's a good fit, and some
8:01
Speaker 1: relationships don't work and it's not a good fit. And
8:04
Speaker 1: the first time I sat down with a therapist, it
8:07
Speaker 1: did not feel like a good fit. And it was
8:09
Speaker 1: not that therapist's fault. It was just the way that
8:12
Speaker 1: we were together as a diad And it took a
8:15
Speaker 1: couple of tries of meeting different people before I found
8:18
Speaker 1: the person that was right for me, and that I
8:22
Speaker 1: think is a very common experience that people have. And
8:25
Speaker 1: it's important not to get frustrated in the process and
8:28
Speaker 1: know that finding the right fit is a process.
8:31
Speaker 2: Here we are today to talk about what to look
8:34
Speaker 2: for when seeking mental health treatment. Where does one even begin?
8:39
Speaker 2: Because someone says, well, you should speak with a therapist,
8:42
Speaker 2: and it's like, okay, but what do I need to
8:45
Speaker 2: look for? What letters should be next to their name,
8:48
Speaker 2: what's good, what's bad? So where do we even begin?
8:51
Speaker 1: And there are so many options right now, and I
8:53
Speaker 1: think it makes it even more overwhelming in some ways.
8:56
Speaker 1: Ten fifteen years ago, when there was less options and
9:01
Speaker 1: less technology, it probably was in some ways easier, I think.
9:06
Speaker 1: So there's a couple of different things. Of course, it
9:09
Speaker 1: is important that whoever that you're speaking to, just like
9:12
Speaker 1: if you were going to a doctor, you want to
9:13
Speaker 1: make sure that they have the proper training. That said,
9:18
Speaker 1: there's lots of different modalities that therapists are trained in,
9:22
Speaker 1: and one modality might be really really great for person
9:26
Speaker 1: A and might feel very invasive or ineffective for person B.
9:31
Speaker 1: So I think it's important for people to educate themselves
9:34
Speaker 1: about the different types of therapists, all the different letters
9:39
Speaker 1: behind names and what they mean, and then start thinking
9:43
Speaker 1: about what they think what that individual thinks might be
9:47
Speaker 1: the right fit for them. For example, if you want
9:52
Speaker 1: somebody who is going to be much more directive and
9:56
Speaker 1: more like an active coach in the process give you
10:00
Speaker 1: a lot of feedback, you might want to work with
10:03
Speaker 1: a therapist who's trained in some of the behavioral therapies
10:08
Speaker 1: like CBT or DBT. If you want somebody who is
10:14
Speaker 1: going to engage in more of talk therapy and maybe they're.
10:19
Speaker 4: Going to be doing a little bit more.
10:21
Speaker 1: Listening than talking themselves, you might want to look for
10:27
Speaker 1: somebody who's analytically trained, who's a psychotherapist. So these are
10:31
Speaker 1: the different things that I think people can a quick
10:34
Speaker 1: Google search can can help people to understand the different
10:38
Speaker 1: types of therapies and what the different letters behind people's
10:43
Speaker 1: names really mean in Layman's terms.
10:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, and there's just so much to navigate in that regard.
10:49
Speaker 2: So for someone who is looking to find a therapist,
10:54
Speaker 2: aside from a googling and checking into what their specialties
10:58
Speaker 2: may be, what's the I don't know if classic is
11:01
Speaker 2: the right word, but what's the traditional amount of schooling
11:04
Speaker 2: that someone should expect they're a therapist to have under
11:07
Speaker 2: their belt.
11:08
Speaker 1: So you need to be licensed to be a therapist,
11:12
Speaker 1: So that means that you either have had to have
11:15
Speaker 1: gone through a master's program if you're a social worker
11:18
Speaker 1: or a mental health practitioner or a marriage and family therapist.
11:23
Speaker 1: If you're a psychologist, you are doing a PhD program
11:27
Speaker 1: in order to get a license.
11:29
Speaker 4: And if you are.
11:30
Speaker 1: A psychiatrist, meaning a medical doctor, somebody who prescribes medication,
11:36
Speaker 1: a psychologist cannot prescribe medication, a licensed clinical social worker cannot,
11:41
Speaker 1: then you need to go through med school. So yeah,
11:45
Speaker 1: it's complicated. The other thing that I think overly complicates
11:50
Speaker 1: this is insurance because insurance companies might pay for one
11:56
Speaker 1: type of therapist, but not another type of therapist. So
12:00
Speaker 1: calling that number on the back of your insurance card
12:03
Speaker 1: and asking for a list of providers who are in
12:06
Speaker 1: network if you need to see somebody in network, if
12:10
Speaker 1: you don't want to pay money out of pocket. It
12:12
Speaker 1: gives you also a good starting point for who they
12:15
Speaker 1: will cover.
12:15
Speaker 2: And that's also just such I'm like sitting here shaking
12:19
Speaker 2: my head, which doesn't help someone who's listening to this,
12:21
Speaker 2: But it's so frustrating to think about the importance of
12:26
Speaker 2: mental health and mental health care and know, especially firsthand
12:31
Speaker 2: for me at least, that money can be such a
12:34
Speaker 2: barrier to entry for so many and that many insurance
12:38
Speaker 2: companies and policies don't even offer coverage for this type
12:43
Speaker 2: of personal care and important care.
12:45
Speaker 1: You know, it's criminal. Mental health needs are just as
12:50
Speaker 1: important as physical health needs. And until we can begin
12:53
Speaker 1: to look at mental illness and the same way that
12:56
Speaker 1: we look at physical illnesses and diseases, there's going to
13:00
Speaker 1: be a lot of people who are suffering in this
13:02
Speaker 1: world unnecessarily. And I think it's something that a lot
13:06
Speaker 1: of people in the mental health field are advocating for
13:09
Speaker 1: their pending litigations against various different insurance companies about their
13:15
Speaker 1: lack of coverage for people who truly, I mean they
13:19
Speaker 1: need this mental health treatment.
13:21
Speaker 4: It is for many life and death.
13:24
Speaker 2: Someone decides they want to go see a therapist, they
13:28
Speaker 2: have done the work and they know what type of
13:31
Speaker 2: therapists that they think they want to see or get
13:35
Speaker 2: to know what happens next. Where would you suggest someone
13:39
Speaker 2: to go online to even seek out a professional to
13:42
Speaker 2: start working with or is it maybe not online where
13:45
Speaker 2: they should start.
13:47
Speaker 1: I think we need to use all available resources just
13:50
Speaker 1: to get names and numbers and information. Like I said,
13:54
Speaker 1: I think calling the insurance company and finding out you know,
13:56
Speaker 1: who's in network is an important step to take, especially
14:00
Speaker 1: if finances are something that somebody needs that coverage to
14:04
Speaker 1: be in network. Also going on to different websites like
14:07
Speaker 1: Psychology Today and looking up by zip code a list
14:11
Speaker 1: of providers if they're in network with your insurance, they
14:16
Speaker 1: have bios that you can read about them as well.
14:19
Speaker 1: There's also different places online that you can look to.
14:23
Speaker 1: You know, social media is such a blessing and a curse.
14:26
Speaker 1: The positive sides of social media is that there are
14:29
Speaker 1: resources on there that you can join different groups and
14:33
Speaker 1: get recommendations from people about therapists in your neighborhood or
14:40
Speaker 1: in your community that have been you know, come highly recommended.
14:45
Speaker 1: And then personal networks, word of mouth recommendations are really wonderful.
14:49
Speaker 4: And if you.
14:51
Speaker 1: Have friends or family members who talk openly about their
14:56
Speaker 1: struggles with mental health or their therapeutic experiences, and you
15:00
Speaker 1: feel comfortable trusting them with the fact that you want
15:04
Speaker 1: to be engaging in a therapeutic relationship reaching out to
15:08
Speaker 1: those people, they can supply sometimes some of the best recommendations.
15:13
Speaker 2: And that's how I first found The first therapist that
15:16
Speaker 2: I ever worked with was putting out feelers to a
15:18
Speaker 2: bunch of women that I trusted and respected, and I felt,
15:22
Speaker 2: at least this way that I knew someone I was
15:26
Speaker 2: friendly with had had a positive experience with this person,
15:29
Speaker 2: and it made me feel a little bit more comfortable
15:31
Speaker 2: to get into something that maybe otherwise wouldn't have felt
15:34
Speaker 2: necessarily the most comfortable. Not that I mean to your
15:38
Speaker 2: point earlier talking about your first experience with therapy, Like
15:40
Speaker 2: I think, no matter how you slice or dice it, it
15:42
Speaker 2: would be a little abnormal if you walked into that
15:44
Speaker 2: room and you were like, man, this is the most
15:47
Speaker 2: This is the best I've ever felt like right off
15:49
Speaker 2: the bat.
15:49
Speaker 1: Right Yeah, also too, though, what's great about if you
15:53
Speaker 1: feel comfortable asking friends or family members, even if you
15:58
Speaker 1: don't want to see the therapist that your friend is
16:00
Speaker 1: seeing because you feel like that would be a little
16:02
Speaker 1: weird and uncomfortable, you could still call that therapist and say,
16:07
Speaker 1: who would you recommend for me to see because they
16:11
Speaker 1: might have good recommendations. Because oftentimes, and we do this
16:16
Speaker 1: all the time, if we feel like a client isn't
16:18
Speaker 1: the right fit, or if there's a conflict of interest,
16:21
Speaker 1: maybe we're treating a family member, maybe I'm treating a friend,
16:24
Speaker 1: I'll say, you know, this probably isn't right for me
16:27
Speaker 1: to take on.
16:27
Speaker 4: But call these five people.
16:30
Speaker 1: They're amazing, and that's a way to then get referrals
16:35
Speaker 1: to people who are potentially a.
16:37
Speaker 4: Good fit for you.
16:39
Speaker 2: So for someone who then goes into their first therapy session,
16:42
Speaker 2: talk to me a little bit about what they can
16:44
Speaker 2: expect there.
16:45
Speaker 1: You know, I think it's going to be a little
16:47
Speaker 1: bit different depending on on the therapist that you're seeing.
16:51
Speaker 1: Some therapists you walk into their offices in it feels
16:55
Speaker 1: comfortable and almost like a living room, setting with couches
17:00
Speaker 1: and coffee tables and very peaceful and zen, or you
17:05
Speaker 1: might be walking into more of an office space type setting,
17:10
Speaker 1: which feels a little bit more even like you would
17:13
Speaker 1: if you were walking into a medical appointment, more like
17:17
Speaker 1: an institution versus a private office.
17:21
Speaker 4: So in terms of the surroundings and what.
17:23
Speaker 1: They physically feel like, that can vary very much therapist
17:27
Speaker 1: to therapists. I think the common denominator between therapists is
17:31
Speaker 1: that I haven't met a therapist to date who doesn't
17:35
Speaker 1: genuinely want somebody to feel comfortable or to try to
17:40
Speaker 1: make them feel as comfortable as is possible on that
17:43
Speaker 1: first encounter. I think it's important to remember, though, that
17:48
Speaker 1: it is a first encounter. So anything that you do
17:50
Speaker 1: for the first time, like you were saying, feels weird.
17:54
Speaker 1: Whether that's going to your first day at school, entering
17:58
Speaker 1: a new grade, whether that's starting college and your first
18:02
Speaker 1: day at college, whether that's taking a new exercise class
18:05
Speaker 1: at your gym and walking into a studio where you've
18:08
Speaker 1: never done that exercise class before. First times are always uncomfortable,
18:13
Speaker 1: So we can expect, and somebody should expect for that
18:16
Speaker 1: to be there, and that that's okay and that that's normal.
18:19
Speaker 1: And I think when we normalize that and we're prepared
18:22
Speaker 1: for that feeling, it's less overwhelming.
18:32
Speaker 2: Taking a break from today's episode to talk to you
18:34
Speaker 2: about my sponsor at Tracksmith. Tracksmith is a Boston based
18:39
Speaker 2: performance a running brand that is dedicated to the community,
18:42
Speaker 2: style and culture of running, and their gear really does
18:47
Speaker 2: make me feel my best. Let's be honest, When you
18:50
Speaker 2: feel good, you move well. And hey, science even co
18:54
Speaker 2: signs this. Because of their dedication to community, Tracksmith has
18:58
Speaker 2: offered to donate five percent of every purchase using the
19:02
Speaker 2: code Hurdle to Girls.
19:03
Speaker 3: On the Run to help drive change.
19:05
Speaker 2: Now, if you know me, you know my personal motto
19:08
Speaker 2: is too good and that's why I feel so aligned
19:12
Speaker 2: with Tracksmith on this opportunity.
19:14
Speaker 3: Girls on the Run Let's talk about them.
19:16
Speaker 2: They're a nonprofit organization with the mission to inspire girls
19:19
Speaker 2: to be joyful, confident, and healthy using a fun, experience
19:23
Speaker 2: based curriculum which creatively integrates running. I feel so fortunate
19:28
Speaker 2: again to have this opportunity to give back to this organization,
19:31
Speaker 2: in particular because fostering that sense of identity confidence in
19:35
Speaker 2: young women, it's so so important so head on over
19:40
Speaker 2: to tracksmith dot com and make sure to use the
19:42
Speaker 2: code Hurdle at checkout to receive free shipping and support
19:45
Speaker 2: Girls on the Run. I don't go a week without
19:47
Speaker 2: wearing my Twilight Crop tank and speed prew Socks, two
19:52
Speaker 2: of my go tos. I know that you will love
19:54
Speaker 2: them as well. Again, that is tracksmith dot com slash Hurdle.
19:58
Speaker 2: Use the code Hurdle at check out to donate five
20:01
Speaker 2: percent of your purchase to Girls on the Run and
20:04
Speaker 2: get free shipping.
20:05
Speaker 3: I also want to give some love to.
20:06
Speaker 2: My sponsor at Athletic Greens. I say this whenever I travel,
20:10
Speaker 2: but whenever I am getting my act together to get
20:13
Speaker 2: on the road, the first thing that I do is
20:16
Speaker 2: pull out my travel packs of AG. And that's because
20:20
Speaker 2: taking Athleticgreens every single morning makes me feel like my
20:25
Speaker 2: best self.
20:25
Speaker 3: It helps me feel good.
20:27
Speaker 2: Athletic Greens is an all in one daily supplement. It's
20:30
Speaker 2: got seventy five whole food sourced ingredients as well as prebiotics, probiotics, adapagens,
20:36
Speaker 2: and superfoods.
20:37
Speaker 3: Until I integrated this into my routine within the last.
20:40
Speaker 2: Three years, I had such a haphazard vitamin routine. Nevertheless,
20:45
Speaker 2: all the great stuff that you get in this all
20:48
Speaker 2: in one daily scoop, I cannot recommend it enough and
20:50
Speaker 2: that's why you've got to get in on the action.
20:52
Speaker 2: Of course, they have an awesome offer for you. Head
20:55
Speaker 2: on over to Athleticgreens dot com slash hurdle and get
20:58
Speaker 2: a three year's supply of Vitamin D as well as
21:02
Speaker 2: five free travel packs with your first purchase. Again, that
21:05
Speaker 2: is Athleticgreens dot com slash hurdle to get your freebies,
21:09
Speaker 2: no code necessary. The next question I have is something
21:22
Speaker 2: in retrospect when I think about my therapy experience. My
21:26
Speaker 2: therapist told me that she used the lay on the
21:30
Speaker 2: couch method and the first time I went in to
21:34
Speaker 2: speak with her and get to know her, in that
21:36
Speaker 2: first session, we did not execute that. And the next
21:38
Speaker 2: time I showed up again, let me just like make
21:41
Speaker 2: this all about me, she said that to me, and
21:43
Speaker 2: I mean, I did it, and I proceeded to do
21:46
Speaker 2: it for the next you know, year, change that we
21:49
Speaker 2: work together. But in retrospect, like I don't know if
21:52
Speaker 2: that's something that's my style. So if that's if something
21:55
Speaker 2: like that like that example, if that happens and that's
21:58
Speaker 2: not your style. Is that something that could be a
22:01
Speaker 2: negotiable with you and your therapist, or is that something
22:04
Speaker 2: that you're like, Oh, shoot, I guess they need to
22:05
Speaker 2: find a new therapist.
22:07
Speaker 1: As a therapist, I wish that I had a crystal
22:11
Speaker 1: ball and that I could be a mind reader like
22:14
Speaker 1: I am not, and I it would make my job
22:17
Speaker 1: so much easier if I could read the mind of
22:20
Speaker 1: the person sitting.
22:20
Speaker 4: Across from me.
22:22
Speaker 1: I only know how they're feeling if they tell me
22:26
Speaker 1: how they're feeling. I can try to ask all the
22:28
Speaker 1: right questions, but I can't force somebody to tell me
22:32
Speaker 1: what is going on in their mind. And we of
22:36
Speaker 1: course want to know if you're feeling uncomfortable or if
22:39
Speaker 1: it doesn't feel.
22:40
Speaker 4: Like the right fit.
22:41
Speaker 1: And I think, of course that's a negotiable. Everything is negotiable.
22:44
Speaker 1: It's a relationship like any other relationship. Now, might there
22:48
Speaker 1: be some things that are non starters for both parties, Sure,
22:52
Speaker 1: that's a possibility, but you don't know what is and
22:56
Speaker 1: isn't unless you bring it up. So in the example
22:59
Speaker 1: that you gave my dream, if I was your therapist,
23:04
Speaker 1: would be for you to say, hey, Amanda, I don't
23:08
Speaker 1: really feel comfortable lying down on the couch. I would
23:10
Speaker 1: rather sit up like we did that first session. That
23:13
Speaker 1: feels more natural to me and less intimidating. And I
23:16
Speaker 1: think I'll be able to engage better in this process
23:19
Speaker 1: if we do it that way. And then I would say, hmm, okay,
23:23
Speaker 1: tell me more about that. What makes you feel uncomfortable
23:26
Speaker 1: about lying down? And that is right material for exploration,
23:32
Speaker 1: and we, through exploring that together could probably deepen our relationship,
23:37
Speaker 1: which would in turn lead to deeper work.
23:40
Speaker 2: I already feel like I'm sitting here and I'm in
23:42
Speaker 2: there because it's like, well, why don't you why do
23:45
Speaker 2: you want to look at me when you talk to me?
23:46
Speaker 2: Like when was the last time that you were not
23:49
Speaker 2: looking at someone and having a really important conversation?
23:53
Speaker 3: You know?
23:53
Speaker 2: But I mean this is all relative to the conversation
23:56
Speaker 2: and in the nature of the topic and finding that
23:58
Speaker 2: quote unquote goldilocks to your perfect experience, so to speak.
24:03
Speaker 2: So something we haven't covered yet that could be really helpful.
24:06
Speaker 2: So we're talking a lot about in person therapy, but
24:09
Speaker 2: as many of us have dabbled in over the last year,
24:13
Speaker 2: our options now go so much further beyond that, So
24:17
Speaker 2: let's dive into some of the things that's someone to
24:20
Speaker 2: know if they're seeking out virtual therapy, whether that be
24:24
Speaker 2: via a zoom or a video conversation, a phone conversation,
24:27
Speaker 2: or now rising in popularity, the text based options as well.
24:31
Speaker 1: Right, And again, the beauty and the curse of technology
24:36
Speaker 1: is having all of these these options and recognizing that
24:39
Speaker 1: maybe not all of them are the best options. They
24:43
Speaker 1: might feel like the easier options, or the more convenient options,
24:46
Speaker 1: or the safer options, but sometimes what's more convenient and
24:49
Speaker 1: what feels safer isn't actually going to lead you to
24:51
Speaker 1: be doing the deeper work.
24:53
Speaker 4: So we have to look at that.
24:55
Speaker 1: You know, we just went through clearly a unprecedented time
24:58
Speaker 1: where we had no choice in many instances but to
25:03
Speaker 1: engage in therapy on a virtual platform, and it was hard.
25:08
Speaker 1: It was an adjustment for many people. I think it
25:12
Speaker 1: was probably quite honestly the biggest adjustment for the therapists,
25:16
Speaker 1: because we're used to being able to base our assessments
25:20
Speaker 1: and our interventions and everything we do not just on
25:24
Speaker 1: what people are saying from here up and not just
25:26
Speaker 1: the way that their face is appearing on a screen.
25:29
Speaker 1: But there's body language, there's micro communications. There's so many
25:33
Speaker 1: things that you can't pick up online that said in
25:36
Speaker 1: person when people are wearing masks, there's also a lot
25:39
Speaker 1: that was hard for us to pick up on. So
25:41
Speaker 1: we've had to, I think as therapists challenge ourselves in
25:45
Speaker 1: a good way, because we should always be challenging ourselves
25:47
Speaker 1: and trying to grow. But for some people, they are
25:49
Speaker 1: still not comfortable coming and doing in person therapy. Maybe
25:53
Speaker 1: they're immunocompromise, maybe they can't get vaccinated, or uncomfortable for
25:58
Speaker 1: medical or religious reasons, and therapy needs to take place
26:01
Speaker 1: in a virtual world. The same principles of looking for
26:05
Speaker 1: a therapist still apply. You still want to be looking
26:08
Speaker 1: at making sure that they're licensed, making sure that they
26:12
Speaker 1: have the qualifications or the training that is congruent with
26:16
Speaker 1: what you're looking for in a therapist. And there's still
26:20
Speaker 1: that first session, and there's still that assessment period where
26:23
Speaker 1: they're not just assessing you and what your needs are,
26:26
Speaker 1: you're assessing the therapist and making sure that the therapist
26:30
Speaker 1: is somebody who you think you can actually do good
26:33
Speaker 1: work with. And we do that the same way in
26:37
Speaker 1: a virtual platform as we do in person.
26:40
Speaker 4: The texting and the snapchat.
26:42
Speaker 1: You're seeing a lot about therapy on snapchat and visb texting.
26:48
Speaker 4: I wouldn't classify that as therapy.
26:50
Speaker 1: I think that it can provide an entree and a
26:55
Speaker 1: bridge into therapy. But texting or watching a Snapchat video
27:02
Speaker 1: of a therapist is more psycho education. It's not diagnostic,
27:08
Speaker 1: it's not assessment, it's not psychotherapy.
27:13
Speaker 4: And I think we just need.
27:15
Speaker 1: To be careful of what we're using those sort of
27:20
Speaker 1: outlets for and the benefits and where the benefits sort
27:26
Speaker 1: of cap off.
27:28
Speaker 2: I think for me, I mean I recently did a
27:30
Speaker 2: trial of talk Space, and I could see where some
27:33
Speaker 2: of the benefits could be. For sure. I do think
27:37
Speaker 2: that I learned so much about myself in my first
27:42
Speaker 2: go about with therapy, which was in person and understanding
27:46
Speaker 2: the real kinds of conversations and work that gets done
27:50
Speaker 2: in that setting. It just didn't compare at all the
27:54
Speaker 2: two different experiences. That's not to say that someone else
27:59
Speaker 2: could use to talk Space and find it to be
28:02
Speaker 2: the best thing for them, but to each their own,
28:05
Speaker 2: and just like you need to do your research and
28:10
Speaker 2: perhaps try out different therapists in real life, you can
28:14
Speaker 2: also have to do that when it comes to the
28:16
Speaker 2: platform that you choose to seek out your assistance with.
28:21
Speaker 4: Absolutely.
28:21
Speaker 1: And the thing is, for some people, the thought of
28:24
Speaker 1: engaging in a conventional therapeutic relationship it's too much.
28:29
Speaker 4: It's not something.
28:30
Speaker 1: That they're ready for, especially our younger population. I've noticed,
28:34
Speaker 1: like teenagers and some young adults and snapchat or talk
28:39
Speaker 1: space or texting, whatever it is, it is a means
28:44
Speaker 1: to an end. They start there, start to get more
28:47
Speaker 1: comfortable with the idea of talking to somebody or listening
28:50
Speaker 1: to somebody, and then they think to themselves, Wow, if
28:54
Speaker 1: I can do this, maybe I maybe I can do
28:57
Speaker 1: therapy in a face to face setting or in a
29:01
Speaker 1: different environment than this. And in that way, it's wonderful
29:05
Speaker 1: because you always want to start where the client is.
29:07
Speaker 1: You can't push the client faster than they're able to go.
29:11
Speaker 1: And if that's where they're at, that's where they're that's
29:14
Speaker 1: where they're at, and that's that's okay.
29:17
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I mean not too also discredit that.
29:20
Speaker 2: I'm just talking about the conventional side of talk Space,
29:22
Speaker 2: which would be text opportunities in text communication. I know
29:26
Speaker 2: the app does offer more one on one and phone
29:29
Speaker 2: consolisations and whatnot. But I'm just talking about that app
29:32
Speaker 2: and the text only sense. So for someone now they've
29:37
Speaker 2: tried this, they ask the ever lovely question, which is
29:42
Speaker 2: how long should I be in therapy? Like and you
29:45
Speaker 2: said this so well before, you don't need to be
29:47
Speaker 2: in crisis to be in therapy. But for someone that
29:50
Speaker 2: is newer to therapy, they've been going for a little while,
29:53
Speaker 2: is there a way to know maybe, Okay, you've done this,
29:56
Speaker 2: you could be good for now.
29:58
Speaker 3: Should you move on? Should you just keep going? What's
30:01
Speaker 3: the Is there a right or a wrong way?
30:04
Speaker 4: No?
30:04
Speaker 1: And I wish that there was a clear answer to that,
30:06
Speaker 1: and there's not. And I think that's frustrating to people
30:09
Speaker 1: because when you go to the doctor and you broke
30:11
Speaker 1: your leg, they put an X ray up on the screen,
30:15
Speaker 1: they show you the break, and they say you need
30:17
Speaker 1: to wear the cast for eight weeks and then you
30:19
Speaker 1: will be better and you no longer need the cast.
30:21
Speaker 1: That is not the way that therapy works. And there's
30:25
Speaker 1: no magical number prescription for some types of therapies, like
30:30
Speaker 1: some of the behavioral therapies like DBTCBT, there's certain curriculums
30:34
Speaker 1: and there's you know modules that last a certain number
30:37
Speaker 1: of week, but even in those cases, you can continue
30:40
Speaker 1: and repeat modules. Listen, I think that generally speaking, people
30:46
Speaker 1: who are going to therapy because they are in pain,
30:50
Speaker 1: they're in emotional pain, they are in some type of crisis.
30:54
Speaker 1: You certainly don't want to end the process before you're
30:58
Speaker 1: not only feeling better, but having a period of sustained
31:02
Speaker 1: feeling better. Just because you feel better for two days,
31:05
Speaker 1: that doesn't mean that you can say, Okay, I'm done,
31:07
Speaker 1: no more therapy.
31:09
Speaker 4: You really want to see it. You want to see.
31:12
Speaker 1: Those gains maintained over a period of time, because life
31:16
Speaker 1: will always throw curve balls, and it's nice to have
31:19
Speaker 1: that support when the curve balls are being thrown at you.
31:21
Speaker 1: That said, I am a therapist. Clearly, I love therapy. Clearly,
31:26
Speaker 1: I think therapy works. That's why I do this. I
31:30
Speaker 1: think that people can benefit from and be engaged in therapy.
31:37
Speaker 1: And definitely there's nothing wrong with having somebody to talk
31:43
Speaker 1: to who is objective, who is not one of your
31:47
Speaker 1: best friends, who is not your mother or your father,
31:49
Speaker 1: your sister or your brother, who you can just in
31:52
Speaker 1: an uncensored way, be yourself and learn about yourself because
31:58
Speaker 1: life is a journey of self reflection and self awareness,
32:05
Speaker 1: and the better that we understand ourselves and the better
32:09
Speaker 1: of a relationship that we have with ourselves, the more
32:14
Speaker 1: able we are going to be to engage in healthy
32:17
Speaker 1: relationships and healthy activities and fulfilling activities in the outside world.
32:23
Speaker 1: I don't think there needs to be an end date
32:25
Speaker 1: to it. I think you do it if you're getting
32:27
Speaker 1: something out of it and you're working, and you know
32:30
Speaker 1: you can play around with different things, like maybe you
32:33
Speaker 1: do talk therapy with a therapist for a couple of
32:36
Speaker 1: years and you feel like you've sort of reached the
32:41
Speaker 1: max benefit that you can with that person, and then
32:45
Speaker 1: you want to try maybe engaging in a group like
32:47
Speaker 1: a group therapeutic process, because that's a whole different experience.
32:53
Speaker 1: But this idea that you know therapy has a start
32:56
Speaker 1: point and an endpoint is to me kind of silly
32:59
Speaker 1: because you're always looking to personally grow and be more
33:03
Speaker 1: self aware.
33:04
Speaker 2: And I like what you said about as long as
33:05
Speaker 2: you really feel like you're getting something out of it.
33:08
Speaker 2: I mean, I think that you may not realize always
33:10
Speaker 2: what you're getting out of it. However, I felt personally
33:14
Speaker 2: that I got to a point with the last therapist
33:16
Speaker 2: that I worked with that I was just showing up
33:18
Speaker 2: every week and we weren't getting anywhere.
33:20
Speaker 3: There wasn't much new. I mean it was over COVID.
33:23
Speaker 2: We were kind of just living this groundhog's day lifestyle.
33:28
Speaker 2: And I chose after trying to pursue that further from
33:32
Speaker 2: pre COVID through COVID for a few months, I was like,
33:34
Speaker 2: you know what, at this point, I'm going to hold
33:36
Speaker 2: off until I feel like it's the right time to
33:38
Speaker 2: go back to therapy. Now, when I returned to therapy,
33:42
Speaker 2: something that I'm really excited to do is seek out
33:45
Speaker 2: behavioral therapists, someone that is going to challenge me a
33:48
Speaker 2: little bit more, that's going to perhaps flex different muscles,
33:51
Speaker 2: so to speak, mental muscles that maybe I wasn't trying
33:54
Speaker 2: to flex the first time. And in this process, I'll
33:57
Speaker 2: have the opportunity just to learn more, to learn more
34:00
Speaker 2: about myself, to learn what works, and then be able
34:03
Speaker 2: to say, Okay, I've tried it. Either I want to
34:06
Speaker 2: stick with this or maybe it's time to go back
34:08
Speaker 2: to the other thing. But the best thing that I
34:11
Speaker 2: can say, and I'm sure that you would co sign
34:13
Speaker 2: this as well, is getting over that initial hurdle of
34:17
Speaker 2: just putting yourself in the room, putting yourself out there,
34:20
Speaker 2: asking questions, getting a referral, making yourself a priority, which
34:25
Speaker 2: is something that so many of us struggle with, and
34:27
Speaker 2: understanding that, just like we said at the top of
34:30
Speaker 2: this episode, mental health is just as important to learn about,
34:35
Speaker 2: to dive into to take care of as it is
34:39
Speaker 2: that annual doctor's visit.
34:41
Speaker 1: Absolutely, and also mental health and physical health are connected.
34:47
Speaker 1: So when we take care of ourselves mentally, we are
34:49
Speaker 1: going to feel better physically too, And I think that
34:51
Speaker 1: not enough people stress that, and our medical doctors don't
34:54
Speaker 1: necessarily stress that as much. One quick thing too that
34:58
Speaker 1: I have to say is that there are going to
35:01
Speaker 1: be times in the therapeutic process where things feel icky
35:05
Speaker 1: or it feels like you're maybe not progressing in the
35:09
Speaker 1: way that you want.
35:10
Speaker 4: To or that you should.
35:12
Speaker 1: That is also a natural part of the process and
35:16
Speaker 1: important to talk about with your therapist. Sometimes it's because
35:20
Speaker 1: the process has reached its natural end with that specific
35:23
Speaker 1: person and it's time to move on to something different.
35:26
Speaker 4: Sometimes it's because of something.
35:29
Speaker 1: That's going on in the dynamic that needs to be
35:31
Speaker 1: worked through and it's an opportunity to learn and to grow.
35:36
Speaker 1: Maybe it's you're repeating a pattern that happens in all
35:39
Speaker 1: your relationships. Once you get this close to a person,
35:42
Speaker 1: it's time to shut down and back off, and that's
35:45
Speaker 1: what you're doing with your therapist. But working through that
35:47
Speaker 1: with your therapist will be a corrective emotional experience for you,
35:53
Speaker 1: and then maybe you won't do it in your outside
35:54
Speaker 1: relationships anymore. So just because therapy gets hard or doesn't
35:58
Speaker 1: feel like it's working and always mean that it's time
36:01
Speaker 1: to end the process. So these are just the tricky
36:04
Speaker 1: things that you work through with the therapist.
36:07
Speaker 3: Just like any relationship, it's gonna take work.
36:11
Speaker 2: Now. Is there anything else that you think we're leaving
36:13
Speaker 2: out when it comes to diving into what to look
36:16
Speaker 2: for when you are seeking mental health treatment, I think
36:21
Speaker 2: it's just.
36:21
Speaker 1: Really important to remember that you, as somebody who is
36:28
Speaker 1: engaging in this courageous and brave journey, because it is
36:32
Speaker 1: a courageous and brave journey to look itself in that
36:36
Speaker 1: type of reflective way, can and should take the time
36:41
Speaker 1: to really have multiple consultations, meet with a couple of
36:46
Speaker 1: different therapists, get a sense of what it's like to
36:48
Speaker 1: be in the room with different people, different personalities, because
36:51
Speaker 1: that will help you to figure out who is the.
36:55
Speaker 4: Right fit for you.
36:57
Speaker 1: Now, you don't need to meet with twenty people, because
36:59
Speaker 1: that might just be avoidance and your way of avoiding
37:02
Speaker 1: actually starting the process. But meet with three or four
37:06
Speaker 1: different people and have a list of questions that you
37:09
Speaker 1: want to ask them, because it is important that you
37:14
Speaker 1: pick the person and you're starting a relationship with somebody
37:18
Speaker 1: who feels like the right fit, just like with friendships,
37:21
Speaker 1: just like with romantic interest, you don't.
37:24
Speaker 4: Just dive in.
37:25
Speaker 1: You actually ask questions and get to know them before
37:27
Speaker 1: you start the process.
37:28
Speaker 2: And I know earlier we did a double tap on
37:32
Speaker 2: looking into your insurance to see if someone is in network.
37:37
Speaker 2: But if someone is going at this out of pocket,
37:40
Speaker 2: and I'm talking about like a traditional consultation, I know
37:43
Speaker 2: this pricing can vary greatly depending on your geographic location
37:46
Speaker 2: and what you're looking for. But is there anything of
37:49
Speaker 2: any sort that we can give someone for a benchmark
37:52
Speaker 2: of what this range could be.
37:54
Speaker 1: It's such a tremendous range, especially in a place like
37:58
Speaker 1: New York City, actually in the Northeast. The good news
38:02
Speaker 1: is is that there's a lot of therapists in New
38:06
Speaker 1: York City, and there's a lot of different venues like,
38:10
Speaker 1: for instance, Postmaster's Training institutes. They have students who do
38:17
Speaker 1: their Postmaster's training. They're already licensed, they are already able
38:20
Speaker 1: to do therapy, but they're getting additional training. You can
38:24
Speaker 1: often see one of them for free, and you're basically
38:27
Speaker 1: seeing three therapists for the price of one because or
38:31
Speaker 1: for the zero price, because the student is being supervised
38:35
Speaker 1: so heavily by some of the best in the field,
38:38
Speaker 1: and that can be a really cost effective way to
38:41
Speaker 1: find treatment. But the ranges, the range is large. You
38:45
Speaker 1: can always ask about people's sliding scale fees. Oftentimes therapists
38:49
Speaker 1: will have sliding scales based on need. Don't assume that
38:54
Speaker 1: the most expensive therapist is the best therapist. And also
38:58
Speaker 1: don't assume that the person who has thirty years of
39:01
Speaker 1: experience is better than the person with five years of experience,
39:05
Speaker 1: because that's not necessarily the case. It's important to meet
39:08
Speaker 1: different people.
39:09
Speaker 2: It's important to meet different people. So many helpful takeaways
39:13
Speaker 2: in this episode. I wish that I had this episode
39:16
Speaker 2: before I started looking for therapy.
39:18
Speaker 3: Talk to us again, how do we keep up with you.
39:21
Speaker 2: How do we follow along with you and the Dorm
39:24
Speaker 2: give us all the details absolutely well.
39:26
Speaker 1: We are on social media of course, Instagram and LinkedIn,
39:31
Speaker 1: so please follow us there. We often are promoting and
39:35
Speaker 1: talking about a lot of different mental health resources for
39:38
Speaker 1: various populations, and anybody can of course always reach out
39:43
Speaker 1: or call us on our website, you can find the
39:45
Speaker 1: eight hundred number. Even if somebody doesn't necessarily need treatment
39:49
Speaker 1: at the Dorm, which is a more intensive treatment facility,
39:52
Speaker 1: we are always trying to get people connected to the
39:56
Speaker 1: right places. So just like we talked about, even if
39:59
Speaker 1: you're not necessarily going to use the therapist that you're
40:01
Speaker 1: reaching out to, if it's a therapist that was recommended
40:05
Speaker 1: to you by somebody, they can often point you in
40:09
Speaker 1: the right direction. So if anybody ever has any questions
40:12
Speaker 1: about where to go, who to reach out to, they
40:14
Speaker 1: can always call us and we can point them in
40:16
Speaker 1: the right direction.
40:17
Speaker 2: Doctor Falk, thank you so much, Really really appreciate your
40:20
Speaker 2: input and your insight, and I know it's going to
40:23
Speaker 2: help a lot of people. I'm over at Emily a
40:25
Speaker 2: Body and at Hurdle Podcast Another Hurdle Conquered.
40:29
Speaker 3: Catch you guys, next time.