Latest / Rosters to Rings Podcast / Sports Gambling Scandal, World Series Preview and NBA Season Outlook

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Sports Gambling Scandal, World Series Preview and NBA Season Outlook · Rosters to Rings Podcast

0:05
Speaker 1: Welcome back to rosters, to rings everyone. I am Ryan mcdonod,
0:08
Speaker 1: joined as always by fad Levigne.
0:11
Speaker 2: Thad.
0:11
Speaker 1: This is a busy time of year across sports. We
0:14
Speaker 1: now know the World Series matchup. The LA Dodgers will
0:17
Speaker 1: be playing the Toronto Blue Jays in the World Series
0:20
Speaker 1: that starts on Friday night. It is opening week in
0:23
Speaker 1: the NBA, NFL, and college football are in full swing
0:27
Speaker 1: approaching the middle of their respective seasonstad But where I
0:30
Speaker 1: want to start this show with you is a listener question,
0:33
Speaker 1: and this is from DJ and Sacramento, California, and that
0:37
Speaker 1: he's looking at the San Francisco Giants and their situation
0:40
Speaker 1: out there. Buster Posey is running the front office now.
0:43
Speaker 1: And his question that is, it looks like the San
0:46
Speaker 1: Diego San Francisco Giants may hire Tennessee manager Tony Vittello
0:50
Speaker 1: as their manager.
0:51
Speaker 2: How unusual would.
0:52
Speaker 1: It be for a Major League Baseball team to hire
0:54
Speaker 1: a college manager to run their club? And have there
0:57
Speaker 1: been any other untraditional hires in Major League Baseball that
1:01
Speaker 1: would be comparable to the Giants potentially Hiringvtello.
1:04
Speaker 3: Hey, Ryan, before we get into that, I think we
1:06
Speaker 3: have to give credit where it's due. I believe there
1:09
Speaker 3: was somebody on the show who, when the Toronto Blue
1:11
Speaker 3: Jays were down to nothing, called that they were going
1:14
Speaker 3: to win this series. Do you recall that at all?
1:17
Speaker 2: I do. That was me.
1:19
Speaker 1: I lead off every dinner conversation with my wife and
1:21
Speaker 1: kids referencing that they have no idea what I'm talking about.
1:24
Speaker 1: But yeah, I said at the time, you could probably
1:26
Speaker 1: make a lot of money if you bet that when
1:28
Speaker 1: the Blue Jays were down two to Seattle. Unfortunately I
1:31
Speaker 1: did not bet that. But what a game George Springer's
1:34
Speaker 1: three run home run. Really happy for the people in Toronto,
1:37
Speaker 1: the Blue Jays fans, and really devastated. But for the
1:40
Speaker 1: fans in Seattle. I know you've talked about They've been
1:42
Speaker 1: waiting for this a long time. This is closer than
1:44
Speaker 1: they've ever been to the World Series and they were
1:47
Speaker 1: right on the precipice on Monday night. They just couldn't
1:49
Speaker 1: get over the hump and seal the deal.
1:51
Speaker 3: What a tremendous season for both teams. The stars shined
1:54
Speaker 3: in this series. Who was something tremendous for the fans.
1:57
Speaker 3: Hopefully this is a precursor of what we'll see in
1:59
Speaker 3: the world. He's starting on Friday. But to get back
2:02
Speaker 3: to DJ from Sacramento's question, so little homework on Tony Vtello.
2:07
Speaker 3: You know, he has been the head coach of the
2:10
Speaker 3: Tennessee Volunteers since twenty seventeen. He joined. The first season
2:15
Speaker 3: was twenty eighteen, and he's really transformed that program from
2:19
Speaker 3: what had been a doormat of the SEC to being
2:22
Speaker 3: one of the prominent programs across all of the NCAA.
2:26
Speaker 3: In his tenure, the team has won seventy two percent
2:28
Speaker 3: of their games, which is truly remarkable playing in what
2:31
Speaker 3: is the best conference in the nation. They've appeared in
2:35
Speaker 3: three College World Series, winning in twenty twenty four. He's
2:39
Speaker 3: won the National Coach of the Year multiple times.
2:42
Speaker 2: You know.
2:43
Speaker 3: When I talked to Jase Tangler, the bench coach of
2:45
Speaker 3: the Minnesota Twins, also a former teammate of Tony's at
2:49
Speaker 3: University of Missouri, he said he's known for being exceptionally competitive, energetic, positive,
2:54
Speaker 3: hard worker, and an excellent communicator. Scouts like Sean Johnson,
3:00
Speaker 3: of the assistant GM and scouting director for the Minnesota
3:02
Speaker 3: Twins say he's regarded as the best recruiter and motivator
3:06
Speaker 3: almost across all college coaches. His father's a Hall of
3:10
Speaker 3: Fame high school coach both in baseball and soccer in Missouri,
3:15
Speaker 3: and something of note. You know, djted it up that
3:19
Speaker 3: this would be the first time somebody ever goes straight
3:21
Speaker 3: from college to the pros. But one thing to note
3:24
Speaker 3: is since twenty twenty, forty five players have been selected
3:28
Speaker 3: out of the University of Tennessee to play in Minor
3:31
Speaker 3: League Baseball and ultimately Major League Baseball. That's the most
3:34
Speaker 3: in the country. So you could argue he's been coaching
3:37
Speaker 3: pro players for quite some time and it won't be
3:39
Speaker 3: that big of a transition for him. But other things
3:42
Speaker 3: that the listeners should know about him is since they
3:45
Speaker 3: won the World Series in twenty twenty four, Tony signed
3:48
Speaker 3: an extension through twenty twenty nine that pays him approximately
3:51
Speaker 3: three million dollars per season, making him the second highest
3:55
Speaker 3: paid coach in Division One, and as we've discussed in
3:58
Speaker 3: previous shows, that actually would put him towards the top
4:00
Speaker 3: tier of major league managers. In addition to that, the
4:04
Speaker 3: Giants would have to deal with something that no pro
4:06
Speaker 3: team in Major League Baseball has had to deal with,
4:08
Speaker 3: which is that he also has a three million dollar biot,
4:11
Speaker 3: which presumably would have to be paid by the San
4:13
Speaker 3: Francisco Giants. Layer that on top of the fact that
4:16
Speaker 3: the Giants are also paying former manager Bob Melvin at
4:20
Speaker 3: least four million dollars for next year as well. So
4:23
Speaker 3: that's kind of the level set of the opportunity that
4:26
Speaker 3: could be presented to Tony and also some of the
4:29
Speaker 3: background that goes into the decision that Giants have to make.
4:31
Speaker 1: And one of the interesting aspects of this that I'd
4:34
Speaker 1: love to get your take on is the man making
4:36
Speaker 1: the decision, Buster Posey, in conjunction with the San Francisco
4:40
Speaker 1: Giants ownership group. Buster Posey was a untraditional hire. We
4:44
Speaker 1: know his background as a player, one of the great
4:47
Speaker 1: catchers in recent Major League Baseball history. Looks like he's
4:50
Speaker 1: headed to the Hall of Fame someday. I believe he's
4:52
Speaker 1: also a part owner. I think he has a small
4:53
Speaker 1: equity stake in the San Francisco Giants. So he was
4:57
Speaker 1: an unusual higher thad to run a front office. I
4:59
Speaker 1: believe he was promote voted from within and now he's
5:02
Speaker 1: a big part of this decision, maybe the key decision
5:04
Speaker 1: maker in this thad. What aspects of that do you
5:07
Speaker 1: think are a little bit unusual and unique? And its
5:09
Speaker 1: POSI one of the you guys in Major League Baseball
5:11
Speaker 1: who may have the confidence to pull off what you
5:13
Speaker 1: just said, going after a college manager, which historically hasn't
5:17
Speaker 1: been done, and encouraging his ownership group to pay a
5:19
Speaker 1: buyout to the University of Tennessee.
5:22
Speaker 3: Well, Ran, I think he nailed it. I think all
5:23
Speaker 3: those facts are central to this decision that ultimately Buster
5:27
Speaker 3: will have to make. And let's later on. Something else
5:29
Speaker 3: that we learned from Jeff Barry in our episode with
5:31
Speaker 3: him longtime agent and friend and now advisor to Buster Posey,
5:35
Speaker 3: is that he says Buster is really viewing winning and
5:38
Speaker 3: entertaining his fans as its northstar, and his action since
5:41
Speaker 3: he's been hired has certainly supported that. So about two
5:45
Speaker 3: months into his hire, he ended up signing Willie Domas
5:48
Speaker 3: to a seven year, one hundred and eighty two million
5:50
Speaker 3: dollars deal. Those were franchise records for the San Francisco Giants. Furthermore,
5:54
Speaker 3: than the middle of the season, he acquires Raphael Devers
5:58
Speaker 3: and what proved to be the biggest trade of this
6:00
Speaker 3: season in Major League Baseball, he acquired not only an
6:02
Speaker 3: All Star player, but his two hundred and fifty million
6:04
Speaker 3: dollars left on his contract. So but I would still
6:08
Speaker 3: say if he hires Tony Vittello, this would be the
6:11
Speaker 3: first thing he's done, which is a first, which is
6:13
Speaker 3: bringing a guy straight from the college ranks to the
6:16
Speaker 3: major league ranks. And you really illuminated it there, Ryan, like,
6:20
Speaker 3: why would he be willing to act so boldly? Well,
6:22
Speaker 3: I mean, he's not only the president of the team,
6:24
Speaker 3: but he's a three time World Series champion for the
6:27
Speaker 3: San Francisco Giants. He's undoubtedly going to be a first
6:30
Speaker 3: ballot Hall of Famer in twenty twenty seven when he's
6:32
Speaker 3: eligible to go into the Hall of Fame. And as
6:34
Speaker 3: you reference, he's a part owner of the Giants. I
6:37
Speaker 3: would think all those things combined to say he's willing
6:39
Speaker 3: to take on a little bit more risk, be a
6:42
Speaker 3: little bit more of a pioneer than maybe the rest
6:44
Speaker 3: of us would who don't have quite the same level
6:46
Speaker 3: of security that Buster Posey does.
6:48
Speaker 1: That's a great point that we've talked about it before
6:50
Speaker 1: on the show. The balance of doing what's best for
6:52
Speaker 1: the franchise and taking care of your family, staying and employed,
6:56
Speaker 1: keeping the paychecks coming. Buster Posey does not have to
6:59
Speaker 1: worry about that. That's how well he's done as a
7:01
Speaker 1: player and financially, as evidence by not only his career earnings,
7:05
Speaker 1: but the ownership equity has in the San Francisco Giants
7:08
Speaker 1: as well. So that are there any other examples, putting
7:11
Speaker 1: maybe the Giants aside, and Vitello and Posey aside, what
7:14
Speaker 1: are some of the other untraditional hires that Major League
7:17
Speaker 1: Baseball teams have made over the past couple decades and
7:20
Speaker 1: how do you think those hires have ended up working
7:22
Speaker 1: out well?
7:23
Speaker 2: Right?
7:24
Speaker 3: The first one I'd like to bring up, we'ved into
7:26
Speaker 3: a past episode we had with aj Hinch in two
7:29
Speaker 3: thousand and nine. Josh Burns was the general manager of
7:31
Speaker 3: the Arizona Diamondbacks and he paved the way by hiring
7:34
Speaker 3: aj Hinch as the first manager with no managerial experience
7:37
Speaker 3: at all. But now, hiring managers with no managerial experience
7:40
Speaker 3: is kind of a blueprint for success. Think of Rocobal
7:44
Speaker 3: Deli and Minnesota, and Kevin Cash in Tampa Bay Kit
7:47
Speaker 3: and Steven Vote in Cleveland, just to name a few.
7:49
Speaker 3: And then the headlines this offseason have been riddled with
7:52
Speaker 3: the thought that Albert Poohols and Tory Hunter are both
7:56
Speaker 3: interviewing from multiple open managerial positions and very well may
7:59
Speaker 3: get hired as former players who never have managed as
8:02
Speaker 3: well some kind of wild ones. In two thousand and one,
8:06
Speaker 3: the Arizona Diamondbacks hired Bob Brenley to be their manager. Well.
8:10
Speaker 3: He came straight out of Fox's broadcast booth to the
8:12
Speaker 3: managerial seat at that time and actually did quite well
8:16
Speaker 3: in the role. In twenty eighteen, when I was with
8:18
Speaker 3: the Minnesota Twins, we hired Wes Johnson to be our
8:21
Speaker 3: major league pitching coach. He came straight from the University
8:24
Speaker 3: of Arkansas. He was one of, if not the first
8:27
Speaker 3: major league coach to make the leap from the collegiate
8:31
Speaker 3: ranks directly to the major leagues, and he went on
8:33
Speaker 3: to have a lot of success with the Twins and
8:35
Speaker 3: now he's the head coach of the University of Georgia.
8:38
Speaker 3: Tampa Bay blazed a trail by hiring Andrew Friedman and
8:41
Speaker 3: to a certain extent, Matt Silverman as well. Andrew Friedman
8:45
Speaker 3: was hired by them in two thousand and four straight
8:47
Speaker 3: out of Wall Street. His background was Bear Stearn's mid
8:50
Speaker 3: Mark Capitol and then everyone knows how much success he's
8:53
Speaker 3: had as the general manager of the Tampa Bay Rays
8:55
Speaker 3: and now the Los Angeles Dodgers. A few more just
8:59
Speaker 3: to throw your way tooenty eighteen, the New York Mets
9:02
Speaker 3: hired Brody van Wagen and the first guy to come
9:04
Speaker 3: straight from being an agent to being a president of
9:07
Speaker 3: baseball operations. He joined the Mets straight out of CIA,
9:11
Speaker 3: which is one of the most prodigious sports agencies that
9:13
Speaker 3: there is, where he was a partner and then lastly
9:16
Speaker 3: kind of a fun one. In twenty twenty one, the
9:19
Speaker 3: Anaheim Angels hired Perry Manesian to be their general manager. Well,
9:22
Speaker 3: Perry's had an illustrious career, but where he got to
9:24
Speaker 3: start was he was a batboy for the Texas Rangers,
9:27
Speaker 3: ultimately working in their clubhouse with his father, Zach Manesian.
9:31
Speaker 3: He climbed the ranks there, went on to be a
9:34
Speaker 3: very successful executive in both Toronto and Atlanta before becoming
9:38
Speaker 3: a general manager. Ryan, how about you on the NBA side,
9:41
Speaker 3: what were some of the more out of the box
9:43
Speaker 3: hires that you've experienced a witness?
9:46
Speaker 1: Yeah, decent amount of similarities to Major League Baseball. I
9:49
Speaker 1: would say the thing that's been done more certainly in
9:51
Speaker 1: the NBA going back decades now, that is hiring head
9:54
Speaker 1: coaches out of college. We could go back to Lon Krueger,
9:57
Speaker 1: Leonard Hamilton, Rick Patino, John Klapari. You know, I could
10:01
Speaker 1: go on, but that's been done in the NBA with
10:03
Speaker 1: mixed results for a number of decades now, but more recently,
10:07
Speaker 1: I'll give you a couple in the last handful of years.
10:09
Speaker 1: You mentioned guys coming out of the broadcast booth in
10:12
Speaker 1: the NBA. That's been Steve Nash as head coach of
10:15
Speaker 1: the Brooklyn Nets, Jj Reddick most recently as head coach
10:18
Speaker 1: of the LA Lakers. Reddick nor Nash neither one of
10:21
Speaker 1: them had any coaching experience at all, that at lower
10:24
Speaker 1: levels as an assistant coach. This is their first coaching experience. Obviously,
10:28
Speaker 1: both guys have a ton of NBA experience. They grew
10:30
Speaker 1: up around the games and had long and illustrious careers,
10:33
Speaker 1: in Nash's case, a Hall of Fame career, but they
10:35
Speaker 1: didn't have any coaching experience, so that was a leap
10:38
Speaker 1: of faith in the front office. There are a couple
10:40
Speaker 1: of different examples David Kahn. He was a former writer.
10:43
Speaker 1: I believe he owned some minor league baseball teams as well.
10:46
Speaker 1: He was hired to run the Minnesota Timberwolves. He gets
10:49
Speaker 1: blamed fairly or not for drafting Ricky Rubio and Johnny
10:53
Speaker 1: Flynn over steph Curry in. A guy that I worked
10:57
Speaker 1: with in Boston way back now, going back a couple
10:59
Speaker 1: decades that who's done pretty well is Daryl Morey running
11:02
Speaker 1: the Houston Rockets now the Philadelphia seventy six ers. He
11:06
Speaker 1: worked in the Celtics business offices. When I worked for
11:08
Speaker 1: the Boston Celtics, there were two different offices. The business
11:11
Speaker 1: offices were in downtown Boston right by the TV Garden,
11:14
Speaker 1: and the basketball offices where the team was was out
11:16
Speaker 1: in the western suburbs and the town Waltham. Well, Daryl
11:19
Speaker 1: worked in the business offices. So talking about hiring a
11:22
Speaker 1: guy who's not around the team, he did his status model,
11:25
Speaker 1: and that's got him some recognition. He was a pioneer
11:27
Speaker 1: in that regard. But it wasn't a traditional hire, certainly
11:30
Speaker 1: when Les Alexander, the owner of the Rockets at the time,
11:33
Speaker 1: hired him as kind of a GM and waiting and
11:35
Speaker 1: then promoted him a year later. A few other example STAD,
11:38
Speaker 1: the Dallas Mavericks hired Bob Valgarris, who was a sports
11:43
Speaker 1: Better an expert sports Better reportedly made a lot of
11:45
Speaker 1: money betting on games. They hired him in twenty eighteen
11:48
Speaker 1: as their director of Research and Quantitative Development. Sticking with
11:52
Speaker 1: the Mavericks, Nico Harrison, the much malign Nico Harrison who
11:55
Speaker 1: had his team in the finals about a year and
11:57
Speaker 1: a half ago in the NBA and then was vilified
11:59
Speaker 1: last year for the Luka Dansis trade. He was a
12:01
Speaker 1: longtime Nike executive who was hired by Mark Cuban to
12:05
Speaker 1: be the MAVs GM. And then the group that's probably
12:07
Speaker 1: had the most success STAD you referenced relative to Major
12:10
Speaker 1: League Baseball, the former player agents. Bob Myers won four
12:13
Speaker 1: championships with the Golden State Warriors, Rob Polenka won one
12:17
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty in the Orlando Bubble with the LA Lakers,
12:20
Speaker 1: and Leon Rose has the Knicks right there in the
12:22
Speaker 1: Eastern Conference finals. Those three guys had a lot of success,
12:26
Speaker 1: had big time clients and made a lot of money
12:28
Speaker 1: as agents. And then a few across sports STAD that
12:32
Speaker 1: I thought we're interested in one touches your world as well.
12:34
Speaker 1: In Major League Baseball. Sashi Brown former Cleveland Browns executive.
12:39
Speaker 1: He became one of the top execs for the Washington
12:41
Speaker 1: Wizards in twenty nineteen when they had a bit of
12:43
Speaker 1: an unusual front office structure. And then that guy, I imagine,
12:46
Speaker 1: you know, Paul the Dee Podesta, longtime Major League Baseball executive,
12:51
Speaker 1: got a lot of attention and accolades at a young
12:53
Speaker 1: age for what he did in MLB and money bit
12:56
Speaker 1: ball and all that. Now he's the chief strategy officer
12:59
Speaker 1: for the Cleveland Browns.
13:00
Speaker 3: Yeah, I just have to make a few comments about
13:02
Speaker 3: the guys you referenced, right. I don't know if this
13:04
Speaker 3: is right or wrong, but Darryl Morey has given a
13:07
Speaker 3: lot of credit for revolutionizing analytics and baseball as well.
13:11
Speaker 3: I know he accomplished so much. But one of the
13:13
Speaker 3: things that is central to all of our draft models
13:15
Speaker 3: now is the concept that we're more aware of the
13:18
Speaker 3: older college kid and how they perform. And I think
13:21
Speaker 3: that was something that Darryl claims to have uncovered when
13:23
Speaker 3: he was building championship teams. And then with regards to Paul,
13:27
Speaker 3: Paul and I grew up in the same neighborhood, a
13:29
Speaker 3: really good friend, exceptionally dynamic person. But also he was
13:34
Speaker 3: a guy who we played high school baseball against each other,
13:36
Speaker 3: and he happened to intentionally walk the three hole hitter
13:39
Speaker 3: ahead of me, and I may or may not have
13:41
Speaker 3: hit a grand slam off at some point. We may
13:44
Speaker 3: have him on to defend that point, but that's my
13:46
Speaker 3: recollection of the event.
13:48
Speaker 1: Well, there's probably no film right unless we go back
13:50
Speaker 1: and get grainy VHS tapes, maybe eight tracks.
13:52
Speaker 2: I don't know if that.
13:53
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to date you at all, but that
13:55
Speaker 1: was ancient history at this point. With that, we had
13:57
Speaker 1: planned on in segment two doing a World Series preview
14:01
Speaker 1: and in NBA season preview. We are still going to
14:04
Speaker 1: do both of those things after the break, but stick
14:08
Speaker 1: with us because coming back, we have breaking news that
14:11
Speaker 1: is dominating the sports landscape on Thursday morning. It impacts
14:15
Speaker 1: the NBA, it impacts players, coaches, some of the biggest
14:18
Speaker 1: names in basketball. There are crossovers to Major League Baseball
14:22
Speaker 1: as well. After the break, we're going to get into
14:24
Speaker 1: all of that and more right here on Rosters the Ring.
14:37
Speaker 3: Welcome back to Rosters to rings as always alongside Ryan McDonough.
14:41
Speaker 3: I am Thad Levine. Ryan, you said it. The World
14:43
Speaker 3: Series is on the docket, so too is the NBA season.
14:47
Speaker 3: But there's breaking news. What can you tell us about
14:50
Speaker 3: the arrests of Terry Rogier and Chauncey Billups.
14:54
Speaker 1: Surprising news in the NBA fad breaking early Thursday morning.
14:58
Speaker 1: Keep in mind that the NBA ri season just tipped
15:01
Speaker 1: off with two games on Tuesday night, and then just
15:03
Speaker 1: about everybody else in the league who did not play
15:05
Speaker 1: Tuesday played Wednesday night. And then that we wake up
15:08
Speaker 1: the news early Thursday morning that current and former NBA
15:12
Speaker 1: players and coaches Chauncey Billups, who is the current head
15:15
Speaker 1: coach of the Portland Trailblazers, a Hall of Famer. You
15:19
Speaker 1: remember him as a player from the Detroit Pistons and
15:21
Speaker 1: other NBA clubs. Terry Rozier, a current player on the
15:24
Speaker 1: Miami Heat. Damon Jones, a former player and assistant coach,
15:28
Speaker 1: a longtime teammate of Lebron James. All three of those
15:31
Speaker 1: guys have been arrested. That this was tied into an
15:34
Speaker 1: illegal gambling and sports rigging operation that allegedly spanned a
15:38
Speaker 1: number of years across eleven states, and it's serious. The
15:42
Speaker 1: FBI is involved. In total, thirty individuals have been arrested,
15:47
Speaker 1: and the FBI is said that thirteen of those individuals
15:51
Speaker 1: are members of the mafia. So this is now getting
15:54
Speaker 1: beyond sports. They're alleging that the case involves La Coosa Nostra,
15:59
Speaker 1: which is the Italian and charges are being brought including
16:03
Speaker 1: illegal gambling, wire fraud, and extortion. So it's complicated that
16:08
Speaker 1: and this is breaking news. It's just continuing to break
16:11
Speaker 1: as we come on air. The most recent development as
16:14
Speaker 1: we record this midday on the East Coast on Thursday,
16:18
Speaker 1: is that the two individuals currently associated with NBA teams,
16:22
Speaker 1: Chauncey Billups, the head coach of the Portland Trailblazers and
16:25
Speaker 1: Terry Rozier, the guard for the Miami Heat, longtime NBA player.
16:28
Speaker 1: That both of those guys have been suspended immediately or
16:31
Speaker 1: placed on leave is the way the NBA put it,
16:34
Speaker 1: but that this is a huge story. We're just learning
16:37
Speaker 1: more about it as we go. But this is something
16:40
Speaker 1: that you and I have talked about off air that
16:42
Speaker 1: transcends sports, and frankly, this is what the league was
16:45
Speaker 1: scared of. I think when they opened up Pandora's box
16:48
Speaker 1: in these sports leagues and brought in fan duel and
16:51
Speaker 1: DraftKings and all these sports betting partners, which are a
16:54
Speaker 1: significant revenue stream and enjoyable hobby for a lot of
16:57
Speaker 1: folks who follow these things closely. The concern was, well,
17:01
Speaker 1: what if it impacts play on the field or the court.
17:04
Speaker 1: And unfortunately that this isn't US, you know, making allegations
17:07
Speaker 1: or accusations. This is the FBI who usually when they come,
17:10
Speaker 1: they come with heart evidence. They're saying, yeah, this involves
17:14
Speaker 1: multiple current and former NBA players and coaches, and that
17:18
Speaker 1: I think with this news breaking on Thursday, we're just
17:20
Speaker 1: starting to see the tip of the iceberg, you.
17:23
Speaker 3: Know, Ryan and I I think the listener may benefit
17:25
Speaker 3: from hearing from us as to as general managers. How
17:28
Speaker 3: would we handle this news if we were working currently
17:31
Speaker 3: for the Miami Heat or Portland Trailer Blazers. And I
17:34
Speaker 3: would just say from our perspective, we always basically would
17:37
Speaker 3: comply with all the league officials they're conducting. They usually
17:41
Speaker 3: are conducting an investigation and coordination within this case the FBI,
17:46
Speaker 3: we kind of step back, We provide all the information
17:49
Speaker 3: we possibly can, we try to aid as best we can,
17:52
Speaker 3: but mostly we're getting out of the way. There's no
17:53
Speaker 3: judgment that we are levying in the short term. We're
17:56
Speaker 3: working alongside the league until all the facts are ascertained.
18:00
Speaker 3: Once they're ascertained, usually you work in coordination with the
18:02
Speaker 3: league to understand what the discipline, if any, is going
18:05
Speaker 3: to be, and then what the team wants to do
18:07
Speaker 3: on top of that. But do you what was your
18:09
Speaker 3: experience if any was something like this? And then the
18:11
Speaker 3: other question I'd ask you as an NBA executive is
18:15
Speaker 3: one other player who's kind of embroiled in this, but
18:17
Speaker 3: kind of more tangentially is Malik Beasley. He's still a
18:20
Speaker 3: free agent. So not only how would you handle this
18:22
Speaker 3: as the GM of the Portland Trail Blazers or the
18:25
Speaker 3: Miami Heat, but as a perspective GM who may be
18:29
Speaker 3: looking at Malik Beasley and saying he could really help
18:31
Speaker 3: our team, but there's some transgressions that maybe heat or
18:35
Speaker 3: overhanging his head right now there yet to be resolved.
18:37
Speaker 3: How do you handle those two situations?
18:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, great question, Thad, because it's a very complicated and
18:43
Speaker 1: nuanced situation, and I think it's important for our listeners
18:46
Speaker 1: to realize they're going to be two different investigations. One
18:49
Speaker 1: that the NBA or Major League Baseball or whatever league
18:53
Speaker 1: conducts in this case the NBA, but there's also the
18:56
Speaker 1: federal one led by the FBI or whomever, that is
18:59
Speaker 1: obviously a lot more intensive, a lot more rigorous. They
19:02
Speaker 1: have a lot of time and resources, and this is
19:05
Speaker 1: what they do, right, this is their wheelhouse, whether it's
19:09
Speaker 1: you know, stock rigging, insider trading, things like that, they're
19:12
Speaker 1: they're well equipped to handle all of this. I would
19:15
Speaker 1: say the league's Frankly thad less so right that the
19:17
Speaker 1: NBA in Major League Baseball, they want to preserve the
19:20
Speaker 1: integrity of the game and they do everything with in
19:23
Speaker 1: their power to make sure that happens. But there are
19:25
Speaker 1: limits to what they can and can't do in terms
19:27
Speaker 1: of time, resources, and kind of the wherewithal to be
19:30
Speaker 1: able to do it. So I bring that up relative
19:33
Speaker 1: to you know, Malik Beasley and Terry Rozier, the two
19:36
Speaker 1: players current players who have been involved in some of
19:39
Speaker 1: the sports betting scandal, either today or over the last
19:41
Speaker 1: few months. And the Beasilely case is interesting that because
19:45
Speaker 1: one of the things the thirty NBA teams have been
19:46
Speaker 1: trying to figure out is okay, the league has said,
19:50
Speaker 1: you know, we're not doing anything that would prevent you
19:52
Speaker 1: from signing him, but the government is putting out there,
19:55
Speaker 1: if not publicly, then at least privately from people I've
19:58
Speaker 1: talked to. Well, we haven't fully cleared him yet. He's
20:01
Speaker 1: not exonerated yet, and so the question becomes on the
20:04
Speaker 1: team side, do we want to be the one of
20:06
Speaker 1: thirty teams to take the risk and hope that it
20:08
Speaker 1: works out? Okay, hope that whatever allegations are made against
20:12
Speaker 1: Malik Beasley, who had a terrific year shooting the ball
20:15
Speaker 1: for the Detroit Pistons last season. He was a big
20:18
Speaker 1: part of their success. And that's where, frankly, that the
20:21
Speaker 1: timing for the individual in that case, Malik Beasley couldn't
20:23
Speaker 1: have been worse because he was approaching unrestricted free agency
20:27
Speaker 1: about to get paid a lot of money. And if
20:29
Speaker 1: I remember correctly, it was just days before free agency started.
20:31
Speaker 1: This all broke, and now we're sitting here in late October,
20:35
Speaker 1: the NBA seasons underway, and he's still unsign I mean,
20:37
Speaker 1: he would have signed for tens of millions of dollars guaranteed.
20:41
Speaker 1: Now he's sitting on his couch waiting for a team
20:42
Speaker 1: to call. So that's how it impacts individual players. But
20:47
Speaker 1: the bigger question here is the integrity of the game,
20:51
Speaker 1: you know, and are there people and this is a
20:54
Speaker 1: scary thing to meet that I'd love to get your
20:55
Speaker 1: take on it as well. But I think even the
20:58
Speaker 1: more frightening thing beyond did somebody say get you know,
21:02
Speaker 1: caught up with a sports betting site and owe too
21:05
Speaker 1: much money and get themselves in a hole? Well, the
21:08
Speaker 1: bigger concern I have this morning seeing the FBI saying
21:11
Speaker 1: the Italian mafia is involved, is are there you know,
21:15
Speaker 1: mob bosses and people with influence and power exerting control
21:20
Speaker 1: and putting pressure on people playing in these games to
21:23
Speaker 1: make sure a certain thing happens, either you know, prop
21:26
Speaker 1: bet is hit or even a result you know, and
21:29
Speaker 1: that leads into question the integrity of the game. That
21:32
Speaker 1: and and that's the thing that I think these leagues
21:33
Speaker 1: are most concerned about the integrity of the game. And
21:36
Speaker 1: I don't think it got as much attention that they
21:39
Speaker 1: certainly not as this scandal. But there was, you know,
21:42
Speaker 1: an issue in Major League Baseball. I believe it involved
21:45
Speaker 1: the Cleveland Indians. If you could bring us and our
21:47
Speaker 1: listeners up to speed on Cleveland what happened with the
21:50
Speaker 1: Indians and how that went in the middle of Major
21:52
Speaker 1: League Baseball season.
21:54
Speaker 3: Absolutely, and Ryan, I think it's it stems directly from
21:57
Speaker 3: what you just said. The integrity of the game was
21:59
Speaker 3: in questions. So as you mentioned earlier, sports books are
22:03
Speaker 3: becoming such embroiled with professional sports teams. They're sponsors. You know,
22:07
Speaker 3: two sponsors of the Cleveland Guardians right now is bet
22:10
Speaker 3: three sixty five and Fanatic sports book. And to the
22:13
Speaker 3: two pitchers in question that you reference to Manuel class
22:16
Speaker 3: they're exceptionally gifted closer Luis Ortiz, a middle reliever. Believe
22:20
Speaker 3: it or not, we're accused of singular pitches in the
22:24
Speaker 3: course of games in which there was quote unusual betting
22:28
Speaker 3: behavior around those specific pitches. Happened in July for both
22:32
Speaker 3: players or teas get suspended in July. Third Manuel Class
22:36
Speaker 3: A on July twenty eighth, and they're still on non
22:39
Speaker 3: disciplinary paid leave as the league has start continuing to
22:43
Speaker 3: do an investigation. But in sports right now, there's entities
22:47
Speaker 3: out there in baseball. One of them is called the
22:49
Speaker 3: Integrity Firm IC three sixty. That is singularly looking at
22:53
Speaker 3: all of these bets and trying to understand when there's
22:56
Speaker 3: unusual amounts of bets placed on very unique things. So
22:59
Speaker 3: in these guys cases, there was a specific pitch in
23:02
Speaker 3: a specific inning in which there was an unusual amount
23:05
Speaker 3: of bets that it would be a ball or that
23:07
Speaker 3: it would be a slider in the ball, and the
23:10
Speaker 3: pitchers in each of those cases delivered against those and
23:13
Speaker 3: a lot of money changed hands. So that's a significant
23:16
Speaker 3: issue there that I think will have to be resolved.
23:18
Speaker 3: And keep in mind, from twenty twenty two to twenty
23:20
Speaker 3: twenty four, Emmanuel class A was by and large the
23:23
Speaker 3: best reliever in Major League Baseball. He had thirty more
23:26
Speaker 3: saves than the next highest guy, which is almost a
23:28
Speaker 3: full seasons worth of saves. He led the major leagues
23:31
Speaker 3: in war accumulated by relievers, and now he has suspended
23:35
Speaker 3: potentially indefinitely. That's going to be very harmful for the
23:38
Speaker 3: Cleveland Guardians. The other thing I just want to add
23:41
Speaker 3: to this conversation is the integrity of the sport is
23:43
Speaker 3: certainly at hand, but what we're hearing in baseball now
23:47
Speaker 3: is that individuals are starting to receive death threats based
23:50
Speaker 3: upon a poor performance. And you know, we know how
23:53
Speaker 3: big fantasy sports are and betting on sports are. You know,
23:57
Speaker 3: the concern I have is, in addition to the entire
24:00
Speaker 3: this sport being held accountable here, it's also the fact
24:03
Speaker 3: that fans, individual fans now feel that it's okay to
24:06
Speaker 3: reach out to professional athletes through social media or otherwise
24:10
Speaker 3: and actually levy death threats against them or bodily harm
24:13
Speaker 3: or concerned about their children based upon the fact that
24:17
Speaker 3: they didn't throw an extra pass in a game, or
24:19
Speaker 3: make an extra shot, or hit an extra base hit
24:23
Speaker 3: in a game. That to me is pretty frightening and
24:25
Speaker 3: it's something that I'm sure these leagues are massively concerned about.
24:30
Speaker 2: It is that, and it should be.
24:32
Speaker 1: And I'll give you one example of this goes back
24:35
Speaker 1: about twenty years now. But when I was a young
24:37
Speaker 1: guy in the Celtics front office, we brought in Chris Duhan,
24:40
Speaker 1: a guard from Duke, for a workout. And I think
24:44
Speaker 1: if anybody remembers from a couple of decades ago, but
24:47
Speaker 1: I believe it was in the final fourth that it
24:48
Speaker 1: was definitely in the NCAA tournament. I think it was
24:50
Speaker 1: the final four. Duke was losing a game they were
24:53
Speaker 1: going to lose. The final seconds were ticking down. I
24:56
Speaker 1: think they were down four and Chris Duhan threw up
24:58
Speaker 1: a half court shot. So instead of losing by four,
25:01
Speaker 1: I think Duke lost by one if I remember correctly.
25:04
Speaker 1: But either way, it flipped the line from one direction right,
25:08
Speaker 1: it flipped. It didn't had no material impact on who
25:11
Speaker 1: won the game, but it flipped the line in the
25:13
Speaker 1: other direction. And dou Hans said he heard from all
25:15
Speaker 1: kinds of people. You know, guys, what are you doing?
25:17
Speaker 1: Why didn't you dribble out the clock? And you know,
25:19
Speaker 1: didn't you know? He said, well, no, of course not.
25:21
Speaker 1: I had no idea. I was hoping, if if my
25:24
Speaker 1: memory is correct, we were down four and maybe somebody
25:26
Speaker 1: follows me and I tie the game if the three
25:27
Speaker 1: pointer goes in, or you know, just playing sports growing up,
25:30
Speaker 1: you do everything you can till the final buzzer goes
25:32
Speaker 1: off to give your team a chance to win. So
25:35
Speaker 1: that's going back twenty years now. What the league is
25:38
Speaker 1: concerned about now that and this is why today's announcement
25:41
Speaker 1: was a real eye opener. I think for a lot
25:43
Speaker 1: of people with the league always thought and I always
25:46
Speaker 1: thought the folks who were most susceptible to this were
25:48
Speaker 1: the people on the fringes the periphery of the NBA.
25:51
Speaker 1: A couple of years ago, John Tay Porter, who's best
25:54
Speaker 1: known as Michael Porter Junior's younger brother, he was, you know,
25:59
Speaker 1: in indicted or threatened to participate in a sports gambling
26:04
Speaker 1: scheme because of his gambling debts, and the way he
26:07
Speaker 1: did that that was making sure he hit the unders
26:10
Speaker 1: on his prop bets. You know, these sports books have
26:12
Speaker 1: bets for points, rebounds, assists in the NBA, maybe a
26:15
Speaker 1: few other categories as well. And so what players were doing,
26:18
Speaker 1: and this is what the FBI on a bigger scale
26:21
Speaker 1: is accusing Terry Rozier of doing in a game on
26:24
Speaker 1: March twenty third, twenty twenty three, is making sure the
26:27
Speaker 1: unders hit and the books flag these things and track
26:31
Speaker 1: these things that and so I think that's something that
26:33
Speaker 1: I wish the athletes were more aware of. Frankly, I
26:36
Speaker 1: hate to say it that way, but you know, there's
26:38
Speaker 1: sophisticate that the betting companies in particular have sophisticated technology
26:42
Speaker 1: that monitor all the action and if anything comes unusual,
26:45
Speaker 1: it sets off flags and alarms and then they go
26:47
Speaker 1: investigate and look at it further, especially if the sports
26:49
Speaker 1: book is liable, you know, to pay out a big
26:52
Speaker 1: handle on one side or the other because actions flooded.
26:55
Speaker 1: So why in the world, you think of it logically that,
26:58
Speaker 1: why in the world would so many people loading up
27:00
Speaker 1: the under on a two way player on the Toronto
27:03
Speaker 1: Raptors named John day Porter. You know, however, many multiples
27:08
Speaker 1: above what is usually bet on John day Porter's over run,
27:11
Speaker 1: you know, so that sets off an alarm and then
27:13
Speaker 1: they go investigate.
27:14
Speaker 2: And that's what.
27:15
Speaker 1: Terry Rozier is being accused of as well, and that
27:18
Speaker 1: I want to get your take on it, but it's
27:20
Speaker 1: scary to me because to me, those are pretty different things,
27:22
Speaker 1: even though we're talking about players in the same league.
27:25
Speaker 1: I always thought that it was likely that a player
27:27
Speaker 1: like John day Porter who's not made a lot of
27:29
Speaker 1: money is probably not going to make a lot of
27:31
Speaker 1: money playing basketball. You would get in, you know, debt
27:35
Speaker 1: to the wrong people, or fall on hard times and
27:36
Speaker 1: do something drastic, and frankly, it wasn't you know, as
27:39
Speaker 1: big as yes, in the NBA was a big story,
27:41
Speaker 1: but I don't think nationally it was as big of
27:43
Speaker 1: a story.
27:44
Speaker 2: Outside the NBA.
27:46
Speaker 1: Today's news is different because you're talking about two guys
27:49
Speaker 1: in Chauncey Billips, who is the current head coach or
27:51
Speaker 1: the Portland Trailblazers, who made around one hundred million dollars
27:55
Speaker 1: in his NBA career and recently get put in the
27:57
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame as a player. And then Terry Rozier,
28:01
Speaker 1: who has not played as well in Miami, but played
28:03
Speaker 1: very well to start his career with the Boston Celtics
28:06
Speaker 1: and then the Charlotte Hornets. The Miami Heat gave up
28:08
Speaker 1: a first round pick to get him of that He's
28:10
Speaker 1: made around one hundred million dollars as well.
28:12
Speaker 2: So if those guys, the guys.
28:13
Speaker 1: Making nine figures guaranteed and NBA career contracts are susceptible
28:18
Speaker 1: to falling in you know, the traps of sports betters
28:21
Speaker 1: and mafia members, it's really concerning for the NBA Thad
28:25
Speaker 1: And that brings us back to what you said earlier.
28:27
Speaker 1: I think there's a lot of angs right now, not
28:28
Speaker 1: only at the league office in the NBA, but across
28:30
Speaker 1: Major League Baseball, the NFL, and the other sports as well.
28:34
Speaker 3: And you know, Ryan, as we transition into talking about
28:36
Speaker 3: the World Series and the opening of the NBA season,
28:40
Speaker 3: the leagues are having to deal with this right now.
28:42
Speaker 3: So this is still a story in Major League Baseball
28:44
Speaker 3: about Emmanuel class A because the Cleveland Guardians just dedined
28:47
Speaker 3: him permission to go pitch in Venezuela this summer. I
28:51
Speaker 3: mean this winner. So this is the story again on
28:53
Speaker 3: the eve of the World Series starting. The NBA is
28:56
Speaker 3: starting what should be a prolific season for them, and
28:59
Speaker 3: this is this story day two of the season opening.
29:03
Speaker 3: This is disastrous for these leagues. They do not want
29:05
Speaker 3: to be having to address these things integrity, player safety,
29:09
Speaker 3: but also just the popularity of these sports is kind
29:11
Speaker 3: of in the balance as these stories unfold.
29:15
Speaker 1: And it's a distraction for the league. Obviously for the teams.
29:18
Speaker 1: The league has a huge headache right now going on
29:20
Speaker 1: with the LA Clippers and the allegations with Steve Balmer
29:24
Speaker 1: and Kawhi Leonard. In aspiration, now two more teams get
29:27
Speaker 1: brought into the mix. That actually more than two more
29:29
Speaker 1: teams because Terry Rozier, the behavior he's accused of happened
29:34
Speaker 1: when he did not play for the Miami Heat who
29:35
Speaker 1: recurreent to the place for I believe it goes back
29:37
Speaker 1: to when he was a member of the Charlotte Hornets.
29:40
Speaker 1: So it's really a you know, a distraction, which is
29:43
Speaker 1: unfortunate because a lot of great stuff has happened in
29:46
Speaker 1: the NBA just over the first two nights. We'll talk
29:47
Speaker 1: about that here later in this segment, but this is
29:51
Speaker 1: going to dominate the conversation, and that one of the
29:54
Speaker 1: things that I think the NBA will have to take
29:56
Speaker 1: a long look at is, you know, what is the
29:58
Speaker 1: right amount of pushback they give to the sports betting
30:02
Speaker 1: providers who you know, make them a lot of money
30:04
Speaker 1: and pay not only the league a lot of money,
30:06
Speaker 1: but the team's a lot of money, the broadcast partners
30:09
Speaker 1: a lot of money. But you know, Adam Silver has
30:11
Speaker 1: said recently, even before this scandal broke over the last
30:14
Speaker 1: couple hours, that he would like to see prop bets
30:17
Speaker 1: go away.
30:18
Speaker 2: You know, just okay, e can beut.
30:19
Speaker 1: On which team wins the game, but individual player prop bets,
30:23
Speaker 1: which are the most rifer manipulation, he'd like to see
30:26
Speaker 1: those removed. I don't know if the NBA can kind
30:28
Speaker 1: of unwind that at this point. But is there a
30:30
Speaker 1: way to do that that to take individual player stance
30:33
Speaker 1: off the table, make it more of a team performance
30:36
Speaker 1: based thing. Obviously that's a lot harder to manipulate. I
30:39
Speaker 1: don't know the answer to that, But that will have
30:41
Speaker 1: more on rosters to rings. Certainly, as this story develops,
30:44
Speaker 1: because this is just the beginning, more information will come
30:47
Speaker 1: out and there's a lot yet that we don't know.
30:49
Speaker 3: Yeah, And the last thing I just would say is
30:51
Speaker 3: there is a lot that we don't know yet. But
30:54
Speaker 3: one thing I just want the listeners to understand is
30:56
Speaker 3: most of the players, coaches, officials that are boiled in
30:59
Speaker 3: this are not miminal masterminds. The people who are the
31:02
Speaker 3: criminal masterminds are on the other side of the ledger.
31:04
Speaker 3: They're the ones who are manipulating people to the point
31:07
Speaker 3: where they probably in some regards, have almost no idea
31:10
Speaker 3: that they're involved in something that's nefarious or it's dismissed
31:13
Speaker 3: as something that is so minimal that it will never
31:16
Speaker 3: impact the outcome of games. So they're not guilt free
31:20
Speaker 3: in these situations. But it's not likely that the players, coaches,
31:25
Speaker 3: people of whom we're discussing now approach to the criminal
31:29
Speaker 3: elements and said, let's hatch this plan. And they were
31:32
Speaker 3: the people who were the architects of this. They were
31:35
Speaker 3: pawns in this and guilty, yes if if the facts
31:40
Speaker 3: are display that they were indeed guilty, But they probably
31:43
Speaker 3: aren't criminal masterminds here who are hatching these plans.
31:47
Speaker 2: Yeah.
31:47
Speaker 1: And one final point I need to make that is
31:50
Speaker 1: that what Terry Rozier and Jontay Porter in the past,
31:53
Speaker 1: and Malie Beasley have been accused of is different than
31:56
Speaker 1: what Chauncey Billups is being accused of. Right, Chauncey Billups
31:59
Speaker 1: the head coach of the Portland Blazers. He is not
32:02
Speaker 1: accused of manipulating games or player props. His involvement, allegedly,
32:06
Speaker 1: according to the FBI, is in rigged poker games the
32:09
Speaker 1: chance to play alongside professional athletes. I guess the games,
32:13
Speaker 1: you know we're rigged or allegedly rigged that. You know,
32:16
Speaker 1: they had card counting machines and things like that that
32:18
Speaker 1: would basically stack the deck in favor of the house,
32:22
Speaker 1: you know, La Cosa Nos or whoever the bad operators were,
32:25
Speaker 1: so that we could spend all show, multiple shows on this,
32:28
Speaker 1: and I'm sure we'll circle back to this probably frequently
32:31
Speaker 1: here over the next few weeks and months. But let's
32:33
Speaker 1: get into the World Series because that's about to start
32:35
Speaker 1: on Friday night in Toronto. And one of the things
32:38
Speaker 1: that I thought was so interesting that that I'd love
32:40
Speaker 1: to get your take on off the top is for
32:42
Speaker 1: all the talk of parody, isn't it great what Milwaukee's
32:46
Speaker 1: done with the best regular season record. Isn't it fantastic
32:49
Speaker 1: what Seattle has done? And I think both our hearts
32:51
Speaker 1: break for the Mariners fans who are closer than they've
32:53
Speaker 1: ever been to the World Series. But that as we
32:56
Speaker 1: sit here on the eve of the World Series once again,
32:58
Speaker 1: it's the La Dodgers going for their third title in
33:01
Speaker 1: six years, and the Toronto Blue Jays who haven't been
33:03
Speaker 1: there in a.
33:04
Speaker 2: While but have a top five payroll.
33:06
Speaker 1: And that your stats are really fascinating along these lines,
33:09
Speaker 1: because at the end of the day, it seems like
33:11
Speaker 1: to win at the very highest levels, to win your league,
33:13
Speaker 1: and especially to win the World Series. The teams that
33:16
Speaker 1: have those top payrolls keep showing up in the final
33:19
Speaker 1: grouping time and time again.
33:21
Speaker 3: Well, we had a breath taking ALCS and NLCS because
33:25
Speaker 3: we had two teams that were fifteenth or lower in
33:28
Speaker 3: the payroll. Seattle was hovering around fifteenth or sixteenth. Milwaukee
33:32
Speaker 3: is around the twenty first or twenty second highest payroll,
33:34
Speaker 3: depending on which metric.
33:35
Speaker 2: You look at.
33:36
Speaker 3: And so this is the ying and the yang of
33:40
Speaker 3: professional sports, which is Major League Baseball, and all the
33:42
Speaker 3: sponsors loved last year it was the Dodgers versus the Yankees,
33:46
Speaker 3: two of the biggest markets in the game. This year
33:48
Speaker 3: we now get Toronto against the Dodgers, which is a
33:51
Speaker 3: tremendous marketing opportunity showcase for the sport. So I think
33:55
Speaker 3: there's elements of the revenue generators that really love this outcome.
33:59
Speaker 3: The notion of having Seattle or Milwaukee supplant the Dodgers
34:02
Speaker 3: or Toronto is actually a really bad outcome for them.
34:05
Speaker 3: But yet again, we're going to have another season where
34:07
Speaker 3: a team outside the top fifteen payroll will not get
34:11
Speaker 3: a chance to hoist the World Series trophy. And I
34:14
Speaker 3: think that's a real issue. As we face and go
34:16
Speaker 3: into twenty twenty six collective bargaining agreement expires, I think
34:20
Speaker 3: the owners the union will be focused on this issue
34:23
Speaker 3: of the perceived parody in Major League Baseball, which juxtaposed
34:27
Speaker 3: against the NBA that we'll talk about in a little bit.
34:29
Speaker 3: There's just no equivalent of an Oklahoma city market getting
34:33
Speaker 3: a chance to win a championship in baseball right now,
34:35
Speaker 3: or at least it hasn't played out that way since
34:37
Speaker 3: two thousand and three when Miami won, which by and
34:40
Speaker 3: large is still a major media market within the United States,
34:43
Speaker 3: just isn't as.
34:44
Speaker 2: Prolific in the game of baseball.
34:46
Speaker 3: But as I'm looking at the World Series, it is
34:48
Speaker 3: a fascinating matchup. I think on the surface, everyone just
34:51
Speaker 3: assumes the Dodgers are going to go and win this thing,
34:53
Speaker 3: and they very well might, and maybe at the end
34:55
Speaker 3: of the segment you and I will pick our champions.
34:58
Speaker 3: But the reality is, over the course of the season,
35:00
Speaker 3: the dog the Toronto Blue Jays are second overall in
35:05
Speaker 3: offense in the major leagues with a war of thirty
35:07
Speaker 3: two point six. The Dodgers were fifth at twenty eight
35:10
Speaker 3: point nine. The separation really occurred on the pitching side.
35:14
Speaker 3: The Dodgers were ranked second, the Blue Jays, believer or not,
35:16
Speaker 3: were ranked twenty first overall in pitching. Total War favors
35:20
Speaker 3: the Dodgers forty nine to forty four. But as we've
35:24
Speaker 3: talked about on this show, that's what they did to
35:26
Speaker 3: get to the playoffs. It's now in the playoffs, and
35:28
Speaker 3: so guys that really didn't factor in for Toronto. Max
35:31
Speaker 3: Schurz are a long time ace in a you know
35:34
Speaker 3: is going to be a luck Hall of Famer, has
35:36
Speaker 3: now joined their starting rotation. Back from injury. Treya Sevitch,
35:40
Speaker 3: who was one of the best pitching prospects in the game,
35:42
Speaker 3: came up at the end of the season. Has availed
35:44
Speaker 3: himself as the number two starter for the Toronto Blue
35:47
Speaker 3: Jays and has had a really great run in the
35:48
Speaker 3: playoffs here and then similarly for the Dodgers, Otani the
35:53
Speaker 3: incredible O'tani now is in part of their starting rotation.
35:57
Speaker 3: Tyler glasnow comes back off the il so as good
35:59
Speaker 3: as the pitching once throughout the course of the year,
36:02
Speaker 3: they really didn't have those two guys. So let's take
36:04
Speaker 3: a quick spin around the diamond and see where the
36:07
Speaker 3: advantages lie. Both teams have great catchers. The Dodgers have
36:11
Speaker 3: Will Smith, one of the best offensive catchers in the game.
36:14
Speaker 3: We just saw cal Rally who was the best catcher
36:16
Speaker 3: in the offensive catcher in the game lose to the
36:19
Speaker 3: Toronto Blue Jays. Well, Will Smith has a chance as
36:23
Speaker 3: the next best offensive catcher, and he's up against Alejandro Kirk,
36:26
Speaker 3: who's one of the best defensive catchers in the game.
36:29
Speaker 3: I think overall you'd have to give a slight edge
36:31
Speaker 3: to the Dodgers there. First base, you have a battle
36:34
Speaker 3: of two behemos. Vladimir Guerrero and Freddie Freeman are two
36:37
Speaker 3: of the three or four best first basemen in the game.
36:40
Speaker 3: Point War separated those two guys over the course of
36:43
Speaker 3: the season. It's a toss up at first base. Second
36:46
Speaker 3: base will be an interesting matchup because with Bobashek coming
36:49
Speaker 3: back at shortstop, it may either push andres him Andez
36:53
Speaker 3: to second base, who is one of the best defensive
36:56
Speaker 3: second basemen in the game, who oh, by the way,
36:58
Speaker 3: had a tremendous offensive ALCS, or we may see more
37:02
Speaker 3: of Ernie Clement there, a guy who's kind of been
37:04
Speaker 3: an unsung hero for the Toronto Blue Jays as an
37:07
Speaker 3: offensive player. They're both up against Tommy edmund All he
37:10
Speaker 3: was was the MVP of the World Series last year.
37:13
Speaker 3: Probably a toss up at second base shortstop. You got
37:16
Speaker 3: to go to Mookie Betts. What a tremendous story for him.
37:20
Speaker 3: You know, we talked so much earlier in the show
37:22
Speaker 3: about Raphael Devers and is not he wasn't willing to
37:25
Speaker 3: move position, to move from third base to first base
37:28
Speaker 3: for the Red Sox, so he gets traded. Well, Mookie
37:30
Speaker 3: Betts moved from being a Gold Glove right fielder to shortstop,
37:34
Speaker 3: a position he never played in the big leagues, just
37:36
Speaker 3: because the team needed him to do it, and boy
37:39
Speaker 3: has he done exceptionally well. They're Bobaschet's coming off of injury,
37:42
Speaker 3: so I think the jury still owed as to how
37:45
Speaker 3: he'll perform. Maybe, you know, we talked about rust versus rest, like,
37:48
Speaker 3: let's see how rusty Bobaschett is. Third base is gonna
37:52
Speaker 3: you know, you're going to go to the veteran Max
37:54
Speaker 3: Munsey from the Los Angeles Dodgers, Addison Barger and Ernie
37:58
Speaker 3: Clement will probably platoon over there to young guys. Those
38:01
Speaker 3: guys are up and coming. Munths he's a little bit
38:03
Speaker 3: more established. It's probably close to a wash, but you
38:05
Speaker 3: got to give a little bit of a nod over
38:07
Speaker 3: there to the Dodgers the outfield impossible to bet against
38:10
Speaker 3: Key k Hernandez. This is a guy who somehow just
38:13
Speaker 3: gets better as the season goes on, elite performer in
38:16
Speaker 3: the postseason. This is his fifth postseason run with the Dodgers.
38:21
Speaker 3: And then Dalton Varshow in centerfield is just an elite
38:24
Speaker 3: center fielder. For the Toronto Blue Jays, I think the
38:27
Speaker 3: advantage goes to them. They're Taoska, Hernandez and right field,
38:30
Speaker 3: so the overall advantage is going to go certainly to
38:33
Speaker 3: the Dodgers.
38:34
Speaker 2: There.
38:35
Speaker 3: I have one word for you to break down the
38:37
Speaker 3: DHS and that is Otani, you know. But where I
38:40
Speaker 3: think the real separation is for me is on the
38:42
Speaker 3: pitching side. With the health of the Dodgers. With Otani
38:46
Speaker 3: pitching now, in Glasnow pitching to go with Blake, Snow
38:49
Speaker 3: and Yamamoto, I honestly would say that their four starters
38:53
Speaker 3: are better than any starter on the Toronto Blue Jays.
38:56
Speaker 3: And that's not a slight to the Toronto Blue Jays.
38:59
Speaker 3: The Dodgers will genuinely be running out four aces at
39:03
Speaker 3: the top of their rotation. If somehow Toronto can battle
39:06
Speaker 3: against those guys, they've got a puncher's chance here. Another
39:10
Speaker 3: thing which I think is a wild card in this
39:11
Speaker 3: series is just simply the home field advantage for the
39:14
Speaker 3: Toronto Blue Jays is significant for fans who've never seen
39:18
Speaker 3: a game up there. It is absolutely hostile. It's a
39:21
Speaker 3: bunch of hockey fans watching baseball. They are very boisterous.
39:26
Speaker 3: Toronto's going to need to take advantage of that. I
39:28
Speaker 3: think to level the playing field. They do have a
39:30
Speaker 3: home field advantager. They'll get to play four games at home.
39:33
Speaker 3: They're going to need to hold home a home field here,
39:36
Speaker 3: win at least one of the first two games. If
39:38
Speaker 3: they do, they then need to go to Toronto and
39:41
Speaker 3: figure out, like they did in Seattle, a way to
39:43
Speaker 3: get home, even if they're down three to two, with
39:46
Speaker 3: a chance to win it out at the end. Yeah.
39:49
Speaker 1: I Vlad Guerrero is on a tear right now of
39:51
Speaker 1: Lad Junior having one of the best postseason runs we've
39:54
Speaker 1: seen in recent history. I think over the course of
39:57
Speaker 1: the postseason he's probably played better overall than Show hey Otani,
40:01
Speaker 1: that who got off to a slow start. But what
40:03
Speaker 1: showey Otani did to close out the league championship series
40:06
Speaker 1: in the National League three home runs ten RBI. We've
40:10
Speaker 1: never seen a player do that before. We may never
40:12
Speaker 1: seen a player see a player do that again. So said,
40:15
Speaker 1: I'll go first here prediction time in the World Series,
40:18
Speaker 1: I'm going the Dodgers win in six games. I love
40:21
Speaker 1: the Blue Jays, love what they've done. I'll take a
40:24
Speaker 1: break to pat myself on the back because I did
40:26
Speaker 1: call them coming back when they were down two and
40:28
Speaker 1: look like they were down against the Seattle Mariners in
40:31
Speaker 1: the ALCS. But as I look at the Dodgers with
40:35
Speaker 1: a fraction of your knowledge about Major League Baseball, I
40:37
Speaker 1: see everything you saw, a star studied rotation and around
40:41
Speaker 1: the diamond, very few weaknesses. If I'm on the other side,
40:43
Speaker 1: I don't really know where you attack or take advantage
40:46
Speaker 1: of a team like that. I just think they're too
40:48
Speaker 1: talented the top and too solid throughout. So I'm going
40:51
Speaker 1: to go the Dodgers four to two to win the
40:53
Speaker 1: World Series. And if that happens, that'll be LA's third
40:56
Speaker 1: championship in six years, which I don't know if that
40:59
Speaker 1: in the modern era, would that make the LA Dodgers
41:02
Speaker 1: a dynasty because there are a lot of the same
41:04
Speaker 1: players you know been on those teams from twenty twenty
41:07
Speaker 1: through this year, we're potentially looking at their third title.
41:11
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think unequivocally they'd be a dynasty. You
41:13
Speaker 3: also add in the number of times they've won the
41:16
Speaker 3: n West. It's been an exceptional run for that franchise.
41:20
Speaker 2: You know.
41:20
Speaker 3: I think you actually shed light on something very interesting here, Ryan,
41:23
Speaker 3: which is the scary thing for the Toronto Blue Jays
41:26
Speaker 3: is so far, the Dodgers have lost a grand total
41:29
Speaker 3: of one game, and they had to beat the Cincinnati Reds,
41:33
Speaker 3: and then they beat the Philadelphia Phillies and they beat
41:36
Speaker 3: the Milwaukee Brewers to do this, and they've been on
41:38
Speaker 3: the road for two of those three series and so
41:41
Speaker 3: they didn't have home field advantage, so that is significant.
41:43
Speaker 3: They knocked off the number one and number two seeds
41:46
Speaker 3: in the National League, and the offense really hasn't started
41:49
Speaker 3: clicking yet. So you still have the potential that Otani Freeman,
41:53
Speaker 3: Will Smith, Mookie Betts, these guys have yet to reach
41:57
Speaker 3: their peak. On the other side of the Ledger to
42:00
Speaker 3: the stars have shined so far. George Springer of Vladimir Guerrero,
42:04
Speaker 3: who referenced they literally could not have shown up bigger
42:06
Speaker 3: in big moments, and then their complimentary players have been
42:09
Speaker 3: excellent guys like Lukes and Barger and him Andez and Clement.
42:15
Speaker 3: These guys have performed exceptionally well for them. So you
42:18
Speaker 3: could argue Toronto needed seven games to get past Seattle,
42:22
Speaker 3: and they were playing about as well as they could
42:24
Speaker 3: play offensively. The Dodgers have only lost one game so
42:27
Speaker 3: far and their offense is yet to really dominate like
42:30
Speaker 3: they can. So I'm going to take I was going
42:32
Speaker 3: to take the Dodgers and six, but just to change
42:34
Speaker 3: it up a little bit, I'm going to take the
42:35
Speaker 3: Dodgers in five. I'm hopeful that it gets closer than that.
42:39
Speaker 3: I hope that we get to a game six or
42:41
Speaker 3: seven back in the Rogers Center in Toronto, because if
42:44
Speaker 3: we do that, I think it will be absolutely electric baseball,
42:47
Speaker 3: great theater. I think the Dodgers going to win at home,
42:51
Speaker 3: and I think they'll end up winning that third championship
42:54
Speaker 3: and just cement themselves as one of the pre eminent
42:57
Speaker 3: dynasties in recent memory in Major League Baseball.
43:00
Speaker 1: Say that, and I think the the Dodgers are going
43:02
Speaker 1: to take it. We'll see what happens here in a
43:03
Speaker 1: few weeks. I like you, as a fan of the sport,
43:05
Speaker 1: I'd like to see it go at least six or
43:07
Speaker 1: seven games, right, I think that's that's good for the sport.
43:10
Speaker 1: And one team thad that, you know one in seven
43:13
Speaker 1: games last year after a dominant regular season, was the
43:16
Speaker 1: OKC Thunder. They had a terrific opener the other night,
43:20
Speaker 1: one of the best games of the year. I think
43:21
Speaker 1: it's hard to say that about game one of over
43:23
Speaker 1: one thousand, but that's that's what happened between the OKAC
43:27
Speaker 1: Thunder and the Houston Rockets. The Thunder prevailed in double
43:30
Speaker 1: overtime with Shay Guilders Alexander getting fouled by Kevin Durant.
43:35
Speaker 1: Katie rarely falls out of the game, s g a.
43:37
Speaker 1: I got him up in the air, drew a foul,
43:39
Speaker 1: and hit two game winning free throws in double overtime
43:42
Speaker 1: for the Thunder. So that I'm gonna you know, I
43:45
Speaker 1: know it's not maybe your wheelhouse necessarily, but I'm going
43:47
Speaker 1: to put you on the spot here. It'll stick along
43:49
Speaker 1: the prediction theme. You know, what do you think of
43:51
Speaker 1: the thunders chances to repeat? Because this is a very
43:54
Speaker 1: unique team. They're the second youngest team to ever win
43:57
Speaker 1: an NBA championship. They return everybody from last year. They're
44:00
Speaker 1: the rere team that brings everybody back. As you know
44:03
Speaker 1: in sports, usually if you win a title, you have
44:05
Speaker 1: free agents. The other teams tend to pay or some
44:08
Speaker 1: would say overpay those guys to get them off your squad.
44:10
Speaker 1: That is not the case for OKSEA. They return turned
44:13
Speaker 1: the core of the team that dominated in the regular season,
44:15
Speaker 1: and then I wouldn't say there was dominant in the playoffs.
44:18
Speaker 1: So the Denver Nuggets pushed them to seven games in
44:21
Speaker 1: the Western Conference playoffs, as did the Indiana Pacers in
44:24
Speaker 1: the finals. And the question that will never have an
44:27
Speaker 1: answer to is how would Game seven have gone had
44:29
Speaker 1: Tyrese Haliburton not blown his achilles after he knocked down
44:32
Speaker 1: those early three pointers and it looked like the best
44:35
Speaker 1: player on the court on the game's biggest stage. So
44:38
Speaker 1: that I'm going to throw the ball back in your
44:39
Speaker 1: court the OKC thunder. What do you think as a fan?
44:43
Speaker 1: Did they repeat which which would be a little bit
44:45
Speaker 1: unusual In the recent NBA We've had seven different champions
44:49
Speaker 1: in the past seven years for the first time in
44:52
Speaker 1: NBA history. That is does OKC repeat or is there
44:55
Speaker 1: a new team that comes in and it makes it
44:57
Speaker 1: eight out of eight, which would extend the the NBA's
45:00
Speaker 1: record as far as having different champions over an eight
45:03
Speaker 1: year period, Ryan.
45:05
Speaker 3: It's the opposite of Major League Baseball, right that you
45:07
Speaker 3: guys had the Indiana Pacers in Oklahoma City Thunder in
45:10
Speaker 3: the finals last year.
45:12
Speaker 2: Two.
45:12
Speaker 3: You know, really small market teams that are exceptionally well run,
45:16
Speaker 3: and I think that's wonderful for the sport. So I mean,
45:19
Speaker 3: if you're asking me if I would take the field
45:20
Speaker 3: over Oka, See, I would take the field. But I
45:22
Speaker 3: do think they're an exceptional team. You know better than
45:25
Speaker 3: I do. But living in Minnesota, the Western Conference just
45:29
Speaker 3: seems like a gauntlet, and what we saw in an
45:31
Speaker 3: opening night just seems to be a taste of what
45:34
Speaker 3: is going to be in store for all these Western
45:36
Speaker 3: Conference teams. You know, even the Timberwolves open last night
45:40
Speaker 3: with Portland, which I don't think is necessarily regarded as
45:43
Speaker 3: at the top of the conference, but it's an up
45:45
Speaker 3: and coming team that one almost went to two overtime.
45:47
Speaker 3: It just seems like there's going to be such attrition
45:50
Speaker 3: over the course of the season. Relative to these guys
45:54
Speaker 3: just beating each other up over the long haul. So
45:57
Speaker 3: the fact that they're young probably helps them stay a
45:59
Speaker 3: little bit heier. I think they have arguably one of
46:02
Speaker 3: the best general managers in all of professional sports running
46:05
Speaker 3: their team in Sam Presty. They're head coach you know
46:08
Speaker 3: better than I do, but seems to have managed that
46:10
Speaker 3: roster exceptionally well last year. I think it's going to
46:13
Speaker 3: take all that and then some because even as good
46:15
Speaker 3: as they were, you reference, they had two Game sevens
46:18
Speaker 3: last year and maybe needed the injury to Tyrese Haliburton
46:22
Speaker 3: to shifty the momentum back to them in that Game seven.
46:26
Speaker 3: They may be one injury away from some major concerns happening,
46:29
Speaker 3: and I just think it's going to be tough for
46:30
Speaker 3: them to come out of the Western Conference again unscathed,
46:34
Speaker 3: whether it be in the regular season or the postseason.
46:37
Speaker 3: So I'm going to take the field against them, but
46:40
Speaker 3: tons of respect for how they're doing it, and I
46:43
Speaker 3: think they're set up for tremendous success over the long haul.
46:46
Speaker 1: They are they're set up as well as any NBA
46:48
Speaker 1: team in recent history, maybe in NBA history, given their age,
46:52
Speaker 1: their salary, flexibility. The draft picks they still have coming
46:56
Speaker 1: so they can get top players in the draft. Those
46:58
Speaker 1: picks are not Okay C's picks, which would be you know,
47:01
Speaker 1: at the end of the first round. There are other
47:02
Speaker 1: teams picks that could be in the lottery or mid
47:04
Speaker 1: first round or can be traded to facilitate basically any
47:08
Speaker 1: deal if they want to add salary, move off of salary.
47:11
Speaker 1: They have the ultimate flexibility. That's what Sam Presty, Rob
47:14
Speaker 1: Hennegan and company in the thunderfront office have created. They've
47:17
Speaker 1: really done a masterful job. There another theme sad that
47:20
Speaker 1: then I'm really keeping my eye this year in the
47:22
Speaker 1: NBA are the injuries to star players. You know, you
47:25
Speaker 1: mentioned the one to Tyre's Halliburton, which was devastating. I
47:28
Speaker 1: was watching Game seven of the NBA Finals from my
47:31
Speaker 1: six year old son Jack. He became a huge Pacers fan,
47:34
Speaker 1: and he literally started to cry. You know, he was
47:36
Speaker 1: so upset that he was, you know, on the Pacers bandwagon.
47:39
Speaker 1: They're the closest team to us here. We went to
47:41
Speaker 1: Game one of the NBA Playoffs last year and they
47:43
Speaker 1: played Milwaukee. But in addition to Haliburton, who's likely out
47:46
Speaker 1: for the year. Damian Lillard, who keep in mind, was
47:49
Speaker 1: waived and stretched by the Milwaukee Bucks and now returned
47:51
Speaker 1: to the Portland Trailblazers. He's going to rehab and almost
47:55
Speaker 1: certainly missed the entire season. But a big, big one
47:57
Speaker 1: that the biggest one in the Eastern Conference is probably
48:00
Speaker 1: Jayson Tatum in Boston also blew hiss achilles tendon. Unfortunately,
48:04
Speaker 1: there's a rash of achilles injuries to Eastern Conference star
48:08
Speaker 1: backcourt players. It was kind of surprising how quickly that
48:11
Speaker 1: happened to three of the best in the game, and Tatum,
48:13
Speaker 1: Halliburton and Lillard. So the Celtics, the twenty twenty four champions,
48:17
Speaker 1: who were the odds on favor to defend last year.
48:19
Speaker 1: And I think that's an interesting tie in ad with
48:21
Speaker 1: OKC because every year it's easy to say, well, how
48:25
Speaker 1: are you going to beat those guys? They look unbeatable,
48:27
Speaker 1: and Boston was in twenty twenty four, and they looked
48:29
Speaker 1: like they were going to be again in twenty twenty five.
48:32
Speaker 1: But as you know, everything changes in sports. Nothing is fluid,
48:36
Speaker 1: even to start the year for the sorry, everything's fluid,
48:40
Speaker 1: and so even to start the year in the NBA.
48:43
Speaker 1: The OKAC Thunder, the defending champions, have Jalen Williams, arguably
48:47
Speaker 1: their second best player. He is not healthy. He did
48:49
Speaker 1: not play in the opener. It seems like he'll get
48:51
Speaker 1: back in the lineup soon. But that as I look
48:54
Speaker 1: at the Eastern Conference, two teams in particular I want
48:56
Speaker 1: to get your take on because of the injuries to
48:59
Speaker 1: Jason Tatum, Tyres Aliburton and the departure of Damian Lillard.
49:02
Speaker 1: I think there's a real opportunity in the Eastern Conference
49:04
Speaker 1: and the two teams that seemingly have a significant chance
49:08
Speaker 1: to go farther than than they've been in decades is
49:12
Speaker 1: are the Cleveland Cavaliers and the New York Knicks. That
49:15
Speaker 1: one of those teams stand out to you? Or is
49:17
Speaker 1: there somebody else you like in the Eastern Conference? Maybe
49:19
Speaker 1: as nutset with the conference as wide open as it's
49:22
Speaker 1: ever been.
49:24
Speaker 3: Well, there's no better way to answer question is by
49:26
Speaker 3: asking a question. So I'm going to I'm going to
49:28
Speaker 3: shoot something back to you because I need a little
49:29
Speaker 3: information before I answer that. What is on the calves
49:33
Speaker 3: the Calves of Memory Service was that they were for
49:36
Speaker 3: a long time the number one seed in the Eastern
49:39
Speaker 3: Conference last year, and then they had some injuries late, right,
49:41
Speaker 3: so they were a team that was regarded as a
49:45
Speaker 3: prohibitive favorite and somebody who's going to contend with the
49:48
Speaker 3: Celtics and Knicks and Pacers, and then they just kind
49:52
Speaker 3: of ran out of steam when they got hurt. How
49:54
Speaker 3: healthy are they now? I know Darius Garland is still hurt.
49:57
Speaker 3: I don't know how long he's going to be out,
49:58
Speaker 3: but by and large, so.
50:00
Speaker 1: They lost Ty Jerome, the backup point guard. He was
50:03
Speaker 1: signed by Memphis. Had a great regular season. He was
50:06
Speaker 1: a contender for a six Man of the Year. You know,
50:09
Speaker 1: he struggled some in the playoffs. They also made a trade,
50:12
Speaker 1: an interesting trade with Chicago Bulls. Did the Cleveland Cavaliers.
50:16
Speaker 1: They sent Isaac Ocorro, who was a wing they lottery
50:20
Speaker 1: pick a few years ago. Didn't pan out the way
50:22
Speaker 1: they had hoped in Cleveland. They traded him to the
50:26
Speaker 1: Chicago Bulls for a name that I think a lot
50:28
Speaker 1: of our listeners probably have forgotten about much hyped as
50:31
Speaker 1: a youngster out of UCLA and with the Lakers, and
50:33
Speaker 1: that is Lonzo Ball, who was the starting point guard
50:36
Speaker 1: in Chicago. Had a number of significant injuries over a
50:40
Speaker 1: multi year period. Now in that time period, the Chicago
50:44
Speaker 1: Bulls made a trade with the OKC thunder to bringing
50:48
Speaker 1: the young point guard Josh Giddy, the Australian who had
50:51
Speaker 1: fallen out of the rotation for OKC, and Giddy played
50:53
Speaker 1: extremely well in a Bull's uniform. The Bulls just extended him,
50:56
Speaker 1: so that limited the opportunity for Lonzo Ball. Those are
51:00
Speaker 1: the main changes for Cleveland. Ty Jerome is out. You're right,
51:03
Speaker 1: Darius Garland is injured, you know, likely to return or
51:06
Speaker 1: is going to return sometime in the season. This is
51:08
Speaker 1: not you know, Tatum Haliburton Lillard situation where he could
51:12
Speaker 1: miss the entire year. And then the other core three
51:14
Speaker 1: guys to call him the core four in Cleveland, the
51:17
Speaker 1: other core three beyond Darius Garland, Donovan Mitchell, Evan Mobley
51:22
Speaker 1: and Jared Allen are all back and your memory is accurate.
51:26
Speaker 1: They won sixty four games last year. They were the
51:29
Speaker 1: number one seed in the Eastern Conference by a pretty
51:31
Speaker 1: significant margin. They just did had some injuries and that
51:35
Speaker 1: they ran into a buzzsaw in the second round in
51:37
Speaker 1: the Indiana Pacers team that after a slow start, was
51:40
Speaker 1: playing as well as anybody. So I think, you know,
51:42
Speaker 1: this is the years. You know, in pro sports, sometimes
51:45
Speaker 1: you have windows that can be opened for a while,
51:48
Speaker 1: sometimes they open and shut quickly. I'd say for Cleveland,
51:51
Speaker 1: maybe for the New York Knicks as well, that this
51:53
Speaker 1: is the year to take advantage of it, because you
51:55
Speaker 1: have to assume the year from now, Tatum's back healthy,
51:58
Speaker 1: Haliburton's back healthy, maybe some of these other teams reload.
52:02
Speaker 1: And the Knicks and Calves, who respectively were in the
52:04
Speaker 1: Eastern Conference finals and had the best record in the
52:07
Speaker 1: conference last year, I think really see this as an
52:09
Speaker 1: opportunity to break through, to represent the East in the finals.
52:12
Speaker 1: And as you know, if you represent your conference in
52:14
Speaker 1: the finals, anything can happen, even if you're playing okay,
52:17
Speaker 1: So you're one of the loaded Western Conference teams.
52:19
Speaker 2: When you get to that level.
52:21
Speaker 3: Well, it just seems to me like looking at the
52:23
Speaker 3: Calves in the Knicks, they have stars. They have stars
52:25
Speaker 3: in those teams, and those seem to separate in the postseason.
52:28
Speaker 3: And Donovan Mitchell as you mentioned, and Evan Mowgley, and
52:32
Speaker 3: then you certainly have Karl Anthony Towns and Jalen Brunson,
52:35
Speaker 3: who's availed himself as one of the biggest, you know,
52:37
Speaker 3: big game players and leaders. I'd be curious, Ran, what
52:41
Speaker 3: do you think the impact will be Your longtime friend
52:44
Speaker 3: and professional colleague, Tom Thibodeau gets relieved of his duties.
52:47
Speaker 3: Now Mike Brown is heading up the Knicks. It seems
52:50
Speaker 3: as if that was the most material change they made
52:52
Speaker 3: this offseason. How do you think that that impacts that team?
52:55
Speaker 3: And the other thing I would say, observationally watching them play,
52:58
Speaker 3: you know better than I do, seem to be an
53:00
Speaker 3: incredible chemistry on that next team. So they seem to
53:03
Speaker 3: be playing above their individual talents, and that is always
53:06
Speaker 3: something I'm in tune with. You know, you can conglomerate
53:10
Speaker 3: as much talent as you can, but do they play
53:12
Speaker 3: better as a unit or do they play less well
53:15
Speaker 3: as a unit? And they seem to be a team
53:16
Speaker 3: that really started gelling in the playoffs and put their
53:20
Speaker 3: foot down and saying, hey, we're going to be here
53:21
Speaker 3: and be here for a long time to count.
53:23
Speaker 1: Yeah, as you know, if that in pro sports, fair
53:26
Speaker 1: really has a whole lot to do with anything. You know,
53:29
Speaker 1: maybe biased because of my friendship relationship with Tom Thibodeaux,
53:32
Speaker 1: but I thought what happened to Tom was pretty unfair.
53:35
Speaker 1: I mean, you get a team to the conference finals
53:37
Speaker 1: for the first time in about twenty five years, you
53:40
Speaker 1: beat the mighty Boston Celtics at defending champions and you know, people,
53:44
Speaker 1: it's easy to say, in hindsight, well that's because Tatum
53:46
Speaker 1: got injured. Well, the Knicks were leading the series and
53:49
Speaker 1: controlling the series before Tatum got injured. Even with a
53:51
Speaker 1: healthy Tatum, hypothetically it looked like the Knicks were going
53:54
Speaker 1: to win that series. So, you know, I would say
53:58
Speaker 1: that there's as much pressure on Mike Brown as any
54:01
Speaker 1: first year head coach. I can remember that because of
54:04
Speaker 1: what we just discussed with the injuries to the teams
54:06
Speaker 1: in the Eastern Conference, because the Knicks were in the
54:09
Speaker 1: conference finals for the first time in twenty five years
54:12
Speaker 1: last year, and I think, you know, Tom Thibodeau's firing
54:15
Speaker 1: is hard for guys like us who have made our
54:18
Speaker 1: lives and careers in pro sports. You look at it
54:21
Speaker 1: objectively say well, if that's not good enough, what is
54:23
Speaker 1: good enough?
54:24
Speaker 2: Right?
54:24
Speaker 1: What is the standard? The Knicks were not the most
54:26
Speaker 1: talented team last year. They weren't certainly weren't in the League.
54:30
Speaker 1: OKC was and you can make an argument they weren't
54:32
Speaker 1: even in the Eastern Conference when you look at the
54:34
Speaker 1: roster on Cleveland. We just discussed with the Celtics had
54:38
Speaker 1: Indiana the way that we're playing at the time.
54:40
Speaker 2: Okay, they were the hot team. So what is the standard?
54:44
Speaker 2: What are the expectations for here?
54:46
Speaker 1: Is Mike Brown going to get fired after one year
54:47
Speaker 1: if the Knicks don't make the NBA Finals or win
54:50
Speaker 1: the NBA Championship. I don't know, but you know so,
54:54
Speaker 1: I think it's a great opportunity for Brown and the
54:56
Speaker 1: Knicks players. As I mentioned, the East is wide open,
55:00
Speaker 1: but there's a lot of pressure too. It's not like,
55:01
Speaker 1: all right, well, if we don't do it this year,
55:04
Speaker 1: we'll kind of bring the same group back again and
55:06
Speaker 1: try it again next year. That is not necessarily the case, Dad,
55:09
Speaker 1: because now, especially with these high spending teams, you get
55:12
Speaker 1: into that luxury tax second aprin era and you have
55:15
Speaker 1: to make some pretty quick decisions about shedding payroll to
55:18
Speaker 1: have anything sustainable. The Boston Celtics were a great example
55:21
Speaker 1: of that this year, what they had to do, and
55:23
Speaker 1: I think those are some of the questions the next
55:25
Speaker 1: are going to have to answer win or lose, but
55:27
Speaker 1: especially if they don't win win the Eastern Conference or
55:30
Speaker 1: the championship this season, They're going to have some tough
55:32
Speaker 1: decisions to make, and those decisions are going to come
55:34
Speaker 1: quicker than most people think.
55:36
Speaker 3: So I'm going to circle back and actually answer your
55:38
Speaker 3: question now, which is to say, Ryan, I'm going out
55:41
Speaker 3: on a limbit. I'm going to pick the Knicks to
55:42
Speaker 3: be in the NBA Finals this year. I think they'll
55:44
Speaker 3: be late surges by some of the other teams in
55:46
Speaker 3: the Eastern Conference, but I'm going to say that Knicks
55:48
Speaker 3: will be the strongest team entering the postseason and they're
55:52
Speaker 3: going to come out on top this year and get
55:53
Speaker 3: a chance to play for a championship. I living in Minnesota,
55:57
Speaker 3: I I would love for the Timberwolves to get the opportunity.
56:00
Speaker 3: I think Anthony Edwards is one of the rising stars
56:03
Speaker 3: in the game. Put the team on his back last night.
56:05
Speaker 3: I actually think he has a very good supporting cast there.
56:07
Speaker 3: There's some depth there. I think they may be one
56:10
Speaker 3: year away from also getting opportunities to play for those
56:13
Speaker 3: I just think that Western Conference winning multiple series and
56:16
Speaker 3: getting to the conference championship and ultimately to the NBA
56:20
Speaker 3: Finals is so difficult right now, and any of those
56:22
Speaker 3: teams can trip you up along the way. Literally, probably
56:25
Speaker 3: the one through eight seats all will have a claim
56:28
Speaker 3: to a path to the NBA Championship.
56:30
Speaker 1: Just to be different from you, Thad, I'll go with
56:32
Speaker 1: the Houston Rockets and the Cleveland Cavaliers. Houston, after trading
56:36
Speaker 1: for Kevin Durant, look pretty impressive despite the loss. On
56:39
Speaker 1: Opening Night, they started the tallest lineup, longest lineup in
56:43
Speaker 1: NBA history, Amen Thompson, who's one of the leagues emerging
56:47
Speaker 1: young stars six to seven.
56:48
Speaker 2: He played the point guard. Thad.
56:50
Speaker 1: They did have a significant injury in the offseason, Fred
56:52
Speaker 1: Van Vliet, the point guard in Houston, got injured. He's
56:55
Speaker 1: out for the year. But I think the Rockets have
56:57
Speaker 1: enough talent to overcome that. We know what Kevin Durant
57:00
Speaker 1: can do, especially late in close games. Even at thirty
57:03
Speaker 1: seven years old, he's still that guy FAD who can
57:05
Speaker 1: close out a game and get a shot off at
57:07
Speaker 1: any time against good defenses. So I like Houston and Cleveland.
57:11
Speaker 1: I think, you know, it's two teams ahead of the
57:14
Speaker 1: pack in the East, at least perception wise, I think
57:16
Speaker 1: if Darius Garland comes back healthy for the Cavs, they'll
57:19
Speaker 1: build on what they did last year. There won't be
57:21
Speaker 1: the pressure to chase, you know, sixty four wins and
57:23
Speaker 1: the best regular season record and all that. They'll be
57:25
Speaker 1: able to settle into a groove and hopefully be peaking
57:28
Speaker 1: at playoff time. One last question I had for you
57:31
Speaker 1: before we wrapped the show is, you know, the World
57:34
Speaker 1: Series is getting a lot of the attention now in
57:36
Speaker 1: Major League Baseball, but I thought the Anaheim Angels did
57:39
Speaker 1: something very interesting that's probably a polite way to put
57:42
Speaker 1: it a little bit unusual, and that is after a long,
57:46
Speaker 1: drawn out, heavily publicized managerial search stat that involves some
57:51
Speaker 1: household names in Major League Baseball. Albert Kouhols, a Tory
57:55
Speaker 1: hunter who I think probably spent most of his interview
57:57
Speaker 1: talking about his appearance on Rosters to rings that they
58:01
Speaker 1: hire somebody who was you know, maybe a little bit
58:03
Speaker 1: surprising that. But what really surprised me was the contract
58:07
Speaker 1: that this side. So why why don't you take our
58:08
Speaker 1: listeners inside within this is you know, breaking in the
58:11
Speaker 1: last couple of days. What the Anaheim Angels just did
58:14
Speaker 1: this week well, I.
58:15
Speaker 3: Think Ryan, you went, you did the verbal equivalent of
58:18
Speaker 3: the triple jump to get from the initial word to
58:21
Speaker 3: the source, helping you get to interesting and describing what's
58:24
Speaker 3: going on in Anaheim. So, just as a quick reminder,
58:28
Speaker 3: from two thousand to twenty eighteen, Mike Sosho was the
58:31
Speaker 3: manager for the Anaheim Angels. That's a nineteen season run
58:34
Speaker 3: for him. Since twenty nineteen to this year, they've had
58:38
Speaker 3: this will be their sixth manager in eight seasons, which
58:41
Speaker 3: is a remarkable, in staggering figure of just you know,
58:45
Speaker 3: categoric you know, insecurity and instability for a franchise. So
58:50
Speaker 3: are we all collectively shocked that he signs a one
58:52
Speaker 3: year deal? Probably not. This maybe the only the only
58:55
Speaker 3: actual franchise that would propose that to a manager and
58:58
Speaker 3: have them accept it. Just as a point of reference,
59:00
Speaker 3: I think the average manager is signing somewhere between a
59:02
Speaker 3: three and four year deal. That is average, The most
59:06
Speaker 3: recent of which was Skip Schumacher in Texas. He just
59:09
Speaker 3: joined the franchise as their manager, assigned a four year deal.
59:12
Speaker 3: I think that's very common. But some things that we'd
59:15
Speaker 3: seen in the paper recently was that Albert Poolhols had
59:18
Speaker 3: kind of in a huff, rejected the notion of working
59:21
Speaker 3: for the Anaheim Angels as their manager. He clearly seemed
59:24
Speaker 3: to be their first choice. They got to the negotiating table,
59:27
Speaker 3: he walked away. Tory Hunter, whether he was offered the
59:30
Speaker 3: job or not, he preemptively also pulled himself out. Well,
59:33
Speaker 3: now I think we know why neither of those guys
59:36
Speaker 3: was willing to work on a one year term. Now,
59:38
Speaker 3: keep in mind, Kurt Suzuki, I think, has earned close
59:40
Speaker 3: to forty two million dollars in his career, So if
59:42
Speaker 3: anyone can work under this level of insecurity, it's probably
59:46
Speaker 3: somebody with that level of career earnings. But it doesn't
59:49
Speaker 3: speak well to the future stability of the franchise. Now.
59:52
Speaker 3: In the press conference, general manager Perry Manasian made a
59:55
Speaker 3: big point of saying, I am also under a contract
59:59
Speaker 3: that only spans one more seasons, So they are linked together,
1:00:02
Speaker 3: but I think in common terminology and sports, they're linked
1:00:05
Speaker 3: together as lane ducks, where they're both going into a
1:00:08
Speaker 3: season in which clearly the owner is saying, if the
1:00:11
Speaker 3: performance isn't at a certain level, most likely both of
1:00:14
Speaker 3: you will be gone again, and that would then lead
1:00:17
Speaker 3: to the seventh manager and potentially nine seasons for this team.
1:00:21
Speaker 3: It's a fascinating to follow. It seems as if we're
1:00:25
Speaker 3: all looking at at Eclipse because I'm not sure that team,
1:00:28
Speaker 3: from a roster standpoint, is really poised to strike or
1:00:31
Speaker 3: win in what is now a very formidable Ale West.
1:00:35
Speaker 3: They feel like they're being set up to fail. I
1:00:37
Speaker 3: don't know what the criteria looks like for success for
1:00:39
Speaker 3: these two gentlemen entering this season, but the fact that
1:00:42
Speaker 3: both on the last year of their deal seems very
1:00:44
Speaker 3: precarious to.
1:00:45
Speaker 1: Me, no question about it that. I think those of
1:00:48
Speaker 1: us who work in pro sports, all we can realistically
1:00:51
Speaker 1: ask for is a chance to be successful. I don't
1:00:53
Speaker 1: know Kurt Suzuki at all, but it seems to me
1:00:55
Speaker 1: he is set up to fail. I hope I'm wrong,
1:00:57
Speaker 1: and I will I admit I'm wrong. If I come
1:00:59
Speaker 1: back and the Angels have a great year next year,
1:01:01
Speaker 1: but on a one year contract, I've never seen that
1:01:03
Speaker 1: in not only Major League Baseball but across sports. You know,
1:01:06
Speaker 1: I have some concerns about how that's gonna go. In
1:01:09
Speaker 1: Anaheim really enjoyed the show today. He is Dad Levine.
1:01:12
Speaker 1: I am Ryan McDonough join us here next week. In
1:01:15
Speaker 1: every Week on rosters to rings,