Latest / Rusty's Garage / James Courtney | Part 1 - cut throat karting & losing a good mate

Transcript

James Courtney | Part 1 - cut throat karting & losing a good mate · Rusty's Garage

• 0:02
  A listener production.
• 0:14
  I'm automotive commentator and journalist Greg Rust and this is Rusty's Garage.
• 0:28
  I'm recording these intros in the home studio as a cyclone approaches.
• 0:32
  That's a true story.
• 0:33
  So although it's pretty well soundproofed and thankfully the cyclone has been downgraded a little, you may hear the wind outside.
• 0:40
  The interview itself I did in the lead up to the shortened towpaw supercars round last weekend.
• 0:46
  Martin Collins, who's a friend and former team boss at Team Kiwi among...
• 0:50
  Other management roles in the sport has very kindly let me use his office in race control.
• 0:55
  One piece of memorabilia in here quickly caught my guest's attention, and we'll talk about that later.
• 1:00
  A little note of thanks to my long-term friend and colleague at Listener, Mark Howard from New York.
• 1:06
  the famous Howie Games pod.
• 1:08
  James Courtney spoke with him at length back in 2017, and he opened up on living with hyperactivity, something that I didn't know about.
• 1:15
  He expands on that a bit in this latest chat with me here because he's learnt a lot in the almost decades since speaking with Howie.
• 1:24
  At times, JC might...
• 1:26
  laugh about things that he went through while learning to cope with it.
• 1:29
  Don't take that the wrong way.
• 1:30
  It's an almost self-deprecating way that he accepts it, owns it and powers on.
• 1:36
  That is a theme of both parts of this feature ep.
• 1:39
  It is a great takeaway for young racers who are listening.
• 1:42
  Don't let things like that stop you.
• 1:46
  Just look at the success that James has had.
• 1:48
  Two karting world titles.
• 1:50
  He was British Formula Ford champion, and that is a very respected, famous championship or class.
• 1:56
  And he did that at the turn of the century, breaking a record at the time for most wins in a season.
• 2:02
  He drove for Jaguar's junior F3 team and won on debut.
• 2:07
  He was test driver for the Jag F1 team and he talks in the pod here in incredible detail about a testing crash at Monza at a time when he was very much on the radar of teams in the F1 paddock.
• 2:19
  We also talk a little about his success in Japan, some other motorsport career or driving options that aren't widely known, the highs and lows of supercars, selling one of the best houses on the Gold Coast that belonged to the former czar of the sport, Tony Cochran.
• 2:36
  And thanks to the head of broadcast for the NextGenNZ Championship that I work on,
• 2:41
  a deal that nearly saw him move into TV much earlier before his stint with the Blanchard Racing Team.
• 2:48
  Thank you to David Tunnicliffe for that little bit of intel there.
• 2:50
  Thanks also to the Supercars TV crew, Nath, Bryony and more for helping us find a couple of hours in the schedule in the lead up to Topor so that we could record this chat.
• 3:01
  For regulars to the pod, after you've listened, I reckon you'll agree this is up there with some of the best eps that we've ever done.
• 3:10
  Thank you to JC for that.
• 3:11
  Hope you enjoy it.
• 3:16
  Giovanni Coutini.
• 3:18
  Buongiorno.
• 3:19
  That's exactly what my school teacher used to call me.
• 3:22
  Tell me the backstory to this.
• 3:24
  Was it someone saying that you needed a more Euro-sounding name for the karting days or when you were heading overseas?
• 3:30
  Where did this... And have I got that right?
• 3:32
  Is it Giovanni Coutini or something like that?
• 3:34
  That's exactly what they say.
• 3:35
  Because they...
• 3:35
  He said that to be a racing driver, you need a flash name, and he thought James Courtney was pretty boring.
• 3:41
  Because at the time, I was going to live in Europe initially.
• 3:44
  So he said, oh, you've got to call yourself Giovanni Courtney.
• 3:48
  Did it stick a bit?
• 3:49
  No, only with him.
• 3:50
  He was the only person, and you remembered it.
• 3:52
  I love that.
• 3:53
  I love that.
• 3:54
  We've jumped forward in the timeline.
• 3:56
  Let's come back a little step.
• 3:57
  Your dad was a chippy by trade, but the family had a carpet-lying business, didn't they?
• 4:02
  And he sort of, I think, enjoyed the notion of –
• 4:05
  tinkering, whatever it was, bikes, carts or whatever.
• 4:09
  And at about age seven or eight, maybe you go to Lithgow, where I've commentated over time.
• 4:16
  And was it like a come and try day or something?
• 4:18
  What was it?
• 4:19
  Yeah.
• 4:19
  So my dad actually raced first.
• 4:21
  Did he?
• 4:22
  Yeah.
• 4:23
  So he actually won two national championships.
• 4:25
  So he was good.
• 4:25
  I shouldn't remember that.
• 4:26
  Sorry.
• 4:27
  No, no, no.
• 4:27
  I don't tell it because I don't want anyone to know that he was good.
• 4:29
  Sorry, dad.
• 4:30
  Sorry.
• 4:32
  But no, he won two national championships in the top class, which was pretty cool.
• 4:38
  But yeah, I was that little kid annoying the crap out of him and friends and everything to have a go.
• 4:43
  And we eventually went up to Lithgow and had this – there was an old –
• 4:49
  clapped out thing.
• 4:49
  I think Winterbottom drove the thing at the same time, and Caruso.
• 4:52
  Okay.
• 4:53
  And it was like a, it was called a track up and it had adjustable pedals and whack the pedals all the way back.
• 4:58
  And, and I remember the first time, like it was, um, you're right.
• 5:02
  You're age seven or eighties.
• 5:03
  Yeah.
• 5:03
  Yeah.
• 5:04
  And my dad, I remember looking at like his little yellow open face helmet on with goggles and it was freezing because it was Lithgow.
• 5:10
  And I remember my dad running around the track beside me, me telling me what to do.
• 5:14
  So he's obviously a bit fit, a bit of it.
• 5:17
  Um, but yeah, I remember him, um,
• 5:18
  Gradually, like that first time, like yelling at me, not yelling, but running, telling me instructions what to do.
• 5:24
  So that's how it started.
• 5:26
  By the end of the day, it obviously got a little bit faster.
• 5:30
  And, you know, we're off.
• 5:32
  And I fell in love.
• 5:34
  I think I annoyed Dad that much.
• 5:37
  And, you know, then I think he won a race and won a cut.
• 5:42
  Then I got there.
• 5:42
  There was an arrow, an old little arrow.
• 5:45
  Maybe it was an arrow.
• 5:46
  Demon X8, I can't remember what, I think, I don't know if that was a brand or whatever, but I remember it having Demon X8 on it.
• 5:51
  And, um...
• 5:52
  And that was too big and then they got me a little Licata Dino Mini and then I was off, I was gone.
• 5:57
  And then dad realised, I think, that we both couldn't do it.
• 6:02
  And as dads do, as I do now for mine, you sort of sacrifice your own fun to enjoy it for your kids.
• 6:09
  So then dad and I went on this journey together.
• 6:12
  I love that.
• 6:13
  There is a little back story here.
• 6:15
  You enjoyed soccer to begin with.
• 6:18
  But you got in a little bit of trouble, didn't you, seeking the limelight?
• 6:21
  Is this true?
• 6:22
  I may have liked to have played every role in the team, so I did get asked not to play anymore.
• 6:29
  But, yeah, I was, who would have thought, a glory hunter.
• 6:31
  LAUGHTER
• 6:33
  So I'm not much of a...
• 6:34
  I mean, like, racing's a team sport, but it's very much individual as well, once you're out there.
• 6:39
  But, yeah, the soccer story was short-lived.
• 6:42
  I think the story goes something along the lines of tackling your own team in order to score the goal or something along those lines.
• 6:48
  Yeah, it was probably a home goal.
• 6:49
  I didn't care.
• 6:50
  I love it.
• 6:51
  I love it.
• 6:52
  Run around.
• 6:52
  Come forward a step.
• 6:53
  It clicks straight away in a motor racing sense for you.
• 6:56
  And I think there's a drive in order to kind of get a sign-off on your licence and...
• 7:02
  You may have either in that race or the first official race kept the trophy.
• 7:07
  You finished on the podium that day and kept the trophy.
• 7:09
  Is that right?
• 7:10
  Yeah, I still got it at home.
• 7:10
  It was like a little green sort of bit of perspex with a little emblem on it and combined districts.
• 7:18
  So yeah, that was my – I think it was at the end of that come to try day.
• 7:22
  You had like a little run and I ended up.
• 7:24
  getting a trophy.
• 7:25
  So yeah, it was pretty good from the start.
• 7:27
  I love that.
• 7:28
  You have a saying too, mate.
• 7:29
  Mark Howard and I both work for the same pod network in Listener, and I know you spoke with him back prior to the pandemic.
• 7:36
  Beautiful chat, that.
• 7:37
  And you used a line with him, and it was something along the lines of, I don't wanna be,
• 7:43
  I'm going to be.
• 7:44
  And I love that.
• 7:46
  From a very young age, you were sort of transfixed on the notion of Formula One.
• 7:50
  You loved it and Sinner, things like this, mate.
• 7:53
  And it wasn't necessarily just like a dream.
• 7:56
  It was more like, forget school, whatever.
• 7:58
  I want to pursue that.
• 7:59
  Mate, it was happening.
• 8:00
  I told myself, like even down in school when I was – I should have been doing school work, but I was designing my helmet.
• 8:08
  And I left, if you know my helmets, sort of a band on the top, which I left in the front.
• 8:13
  That was because I was going to have, which I'm not allowed to now, Marlboro, because everyone had Marlboro sponsorship, as you can see behind me.
• 8:20
  So I left space on it because I was going to be a McLaren driver, I was going to win world championships, and I was going to be sponsored by Marlboro.
• 8:28
  didn't just want to get to F1, I wanted to get there and be someone and that was my sole focus and I was so determined the whole way through.
• 8:38
  You shared with Howie, I don't know if you are comfortable talking about it again here now, school was a bit tough for you mate, wasn't it?
• 8:47
  I think you talk as though you have a level of ADHD and that there are nerves around things like
• 8:54
  reading books in front of fellow class members or classmates at school back then.
• 9:01
  That aspect kind of haunted you a bit, mate, didn't it?
• 9:03
  Yeah, massively.
• 9:04
  I've got severe ADHD.
• 9:05
  Do you?
• 9:07
  That much that...
• 9:09
  When I was going through my divorce, I ended up having to get tested and do all this sort of stuff for other reasons.
• 9:14
  Yeah.
• 9:15
  But when they tested it, they asked me to come back in after the test and there was all the other doctors in the room and they questioned me for a long period of time because they couldn't understand how I had a job before.
• 9:25
  and for a long period of time and sustained it.
• 9:28
  And I wasn't in jail because the normal medication for someone is between 30 and 40 milligrams of the medication I was on was Vyvanse.
• 9:38
  But I didn't get diagnosed until I was 38.
• 9:39
  So prior to that, but anyway, so then as you can see, I'm jumping around a bit.
• 9:43
  You're right, it's all good.
• 9:44
  It's all good.
• 9:44
  But my, so then I sat down with these people and they're going through it all, the doctors, and they're going through it all.
• 9:49
  And my dose was 115 milligrams.
• 9:53
  So then they tracked my diet and everything I did for a month to try and work out how I was sort of managing such, that's the most severe case of ADHD they'd ever seen.
• 10:06
  And they worked out that with my diet, what I was eating and my coffee intake and all that sort of stuff, I was self-medicating to balance myself out.
• 10:14
  Wow.
• 10:15
  So that was, and at school, that was horrific.
• 10:18
  I couldn't sit still.
• 10:19
  I couldn't, like, as you know, I only wanted to be,
• 10:22
  a racing driver, so anything else that wasn't going to benefit that I was not interested in or so focused on that thing.
• 10:29
  You know, at school it was really hard for me.
• 10:32
  I was okay at math with numbers, but anything, reading or writing or anything like that was horrific.
• 10:38
  So even now, like I'll sit on the telecast.
• 10:41
  I can sit and talk for hours about racing and if you give me a paragraph to read on TV, I'll just fall apart.
• 10:47
  Like anything to do with, you know, with racing,
• 10:51
  There's a form of dyslexia with that as well because whenever you have ADHD, you either have something like there's a – they come in pairs, thankfully, which is lovely.
• 10:58
  So you either have ADHD and dyspraxia, which is trouble to speak, and you sort of stutter and things like that, or dyslexia where the words get jumbled up.
• 11:08
  So when I read, I don't read – In a linear sense.
• 11:12
  No, I just look at blocks and my brain sort of makes up –
• 11:16
  Jumps it.
• 11:17
  Jumps it.
• 11:17
  Yeah, guesses what the words are as opposed to reading it properly.
• 11:21
  So that was always hard.
• 11:22
  At school, I was really skinny as well.
• 11:24
  Like I'm not massive now, but I was always the little guy.
• 11:27
  I went to – I grew up west of Sydney where I was big, tough footy players.
• 11:32
  So at school, I went to a football school.
• 11:34
  So I was always the geek that –
• 11:37
  wasn't involved in football and I'd go away and race a car on the weekend.
• 11:40
  I'd always get teased at school.
• 11:42
  So I was pretty – I'm really introverted away from racing and I just had to teach myself that I had to be an extrovert to be able to do what I wanted to do, which was racing.
• 11:55
  And part of the racing side of things, a mate of ours, Neil Crompton, was bang on to me from when I was 15.
• 12:01
  You have to be able to talk to the media.
• 12:02
  You have to be able to present yourself.
• 12:04
  You have to be able to hold conversations, all this sort of stuff.
• 12:07
  So I had to teach myself and how to be an extrovert.
• 12:09
  So a lot of people that see me away from racing are blown away with how quiet I am because the moment I'm on show or doing – this is a show for us.
• 12:18
  This is our show business.
• 12:19
  So the moment I'm in character, I'm bang, I'm life.
• 12:23
  But then of a night, I'll go and sit in the hotel room by myself, have a pizza and watch the football and not talk to anyone.
• 12:28
  A lot of people can't understand the way that all works with me, but I think it all comes back to the way it was through school, the ADHD stuff, and just being so determined to do racing and block everything else out.
• 12:42
  The thing for me here is the beauty in that.
• 12:44
  I mean, that's a very difficult thing to deal with, and you've obviously gone extensively to try and manage it the best way you can.
• 12:51
  The great example to other young carters that might be going to Lithgow for a come and try day is it hasn't stopped you, mate.
• 12:58
  It hasn't stopped you making it all the way to Formula One.
• 13:00
  It hasn't stopped you winning a Supercast Championship and so on.
• 13:04
  No, not at all.
• 13:05
  And the more I sort of think about it and you sort of get into it and you read and you talk to people about it, there's so many of us.
• 13:11
  It's not like a disease or anything.
• 13:15
  Talking with the doctors, they then realize that it's my ability to process like high stressful situations with so much information.
• 13:22
  I'm used to it because my brain's working like that the whole time.
• 13:26
  So you can process so much stuff and make decisions and get through those crazy times without too much stress.
• 13:33
  It's like you've trained yourself to deal with that stress kind of thing oddly.
• 13:36
  Yeah, but a lot of high functioning people with ADHD are in high...
• 13:42
  positions like big CEOs and things like that because they can deal with that stress.
• 13:45
  They can have six million things on their plate at once and not be overwhelmed with it all.
• 13:50
  And it's just because in my head the whole time there was that much information.
• 13:53
  Like when I had to get medicated through my divorce for a period of time, which I didn't like because all of a sudden everything was so quiet.
• 14:01
  And for me it was unnerving, like not having…
• 14:05
  my brain going 24-7.
• 14:06
  As soon as I wake up, it's like, bang, it's on.
• 14:09
  I'm thinking about what I can do or what I can't do and what's happening over there.
• 14:13
  I'm talking to you now and there's a car on the track.
• 14:15
  I wonder what times they're doing.
• 14:16
  There's all that sort of, like seriously, there's all that stuff going on.
• 14:19
  But with you...
• 14:21
  You're a normal person, so you're sitting here listening to what I'm saying and you can block all that out.
• 14:25
  So with the ADHD, you have the inability to prioritize information.
• 14:29
  You just get flooded with everything and then your brain is then trying to process and place it all and give everything the same amount of importance.
• 14:37
  With yours, it's like, hey, I've got to concentrate because James is talking to me.
• 14:40
  Whereas mine is still now trying to work out what's going on, but explain this.
• 14:44
  And do the podcast.
• 14:46
  So it is craziness in there, but that's my crazy.
• 14:50
  Yeah, but you've got a beautiful smile and you clearly have found a way, mate.
• 14:53
  You are a twin too, which not many people realize.
• 14:55
  I am a twin.
• 14:55
  Your sister was born, I think, four or five minutes difference to you.
• 14:58
  Four minutes earlier.
• 14:59
  Four minutes, there you go.
• 15:01
  She doesn't have this?
• 15:03
  She doesn't?
• 15:03
  It's not a hereditary?
• 15:04
  No, I think she does.
• 15:05
  No.
• 15:06
  Sorry, sorry, Beck.
• 15:07
  Sorry.
• 15:08
  Beck's with twins.
• 15:10
  They're very rarely the same sort of character.
• 15:12
  Beck's fuse is about a millimeter long and like I'm pretty crazy and to a point where I'll get upset.
• 15:20
  But Beck, if you look at Beck the wrong way, she's into you.
• 15:22
  So, but she's beautiful.
• 15:24
  She's, it's amazing for me, which was really tough through my childhood is because I left.
• 15:30
  So, it was my choice.
• 15:32
  I left when I was 15 and went to Europe.
• 15:33
  Yeah.
• 15:34
  Then I was by myself, so I went from mum and dad being so focused and such a tight family unit with myself, Bec, and we have an older sister as well, Melinda.
• 15:45
  We'd all travel together, do the racing and all that sort of stuff.
• 15:47
  And then I was off by myself for...
• 15:50
  whatever it was, 11 years.
• 15:51
  So you sort of miss so much of your family time with her and with my older sister and with my mum and dad through those very influential years where I was, you know, by myself in Europe.
• 16:01
  You had to grow up fast, mate, didn't you?
• 16:03
  Yeah, it was pretty wild.
• 16:04
  It was pretty wild.
• 16:05
  So mum doted on me as a kid.
• 16:07
  It's Deanna, isn't it, your mum?
• 16:08
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 16:09
  Yeah, and then dad, Jim, he was hard into me about the racing, so we were always so close.
• 16:16
  And then all of a sudden, you're just by yourself in Europe.
• 16:17
  So it was a big adjustment for me.
• 16:20
  It was like so many times I was like, this is just...
• 16:25
  So sad.
• 16:27
  Like I would sit in a hotel.
• 16:28
  Like I'd lived in an apartment and it was fine through the week when the team was there.
• 16:31
  You're talking Italy now when you're living in Italy and stuff.
• 16:33
  And sometimes you were there in winter when it's snow and can't go out.
• 16:36
  Yes, I pretty much come home at Christmas for two weeks a year.
• 16:39
  And apart from that, I was pretty much there the whole time.
• 16:41
  So I would...
• 16:43
  Through the week, you're sort of in the factory where Tony Carr was the team and you'd sort of be there with all the boys and everything would be fine.
• 16:48
  And then on the weekend, they would all go home or do their own thing.
• 16:51
  And I'd just sit in the hotel room Friday night, Saturday, Saturday night, Sunday, Sunday night, just looking out the window because I didn't know anyone.
• 16:58
  So I just sat.
• 16:58
  I couldn't understand the TV.
• 17:00
  I couldn't read anything.
• 17:01
  There was no internet.
• 17:03
  You couldn't call home because… It was a fortune.
• 17:05
  It cost a fortune.
• 17:06
  Yeah.
• 17:06
  Texts were a new thing, I think.
• 17:07
  Texts was new.
• 17:08
  There was no social media.
• 17:10
  There was nothing.
• 17:10
  So I just, this sounds really horrifying, but I would sit and look out the window.
• 17:16
  That's what I'd do for like three days or two days over the weekend.
• 17:20
  Or if there was a long weekend, the same thing.
• 17:22
  So I spent a lot of time by myself, sort of learned who you are.
• 17:27
  You learned Italian.
• 17:28
  You learned Italian.
• 17:28
  I did learn Italian in the end.
• 17:29
  You can understand it still now, I'm told.
• 17:31
  If we went to a restaurant, you could pick up bits and stitch it together.
• 17:33
  Yeah, as you sit there, you sort of comes back.
• 17:35
  But the funniest thing that I tried to do while I got so much time alone, I tried to learn to be able to move my toes individually.
• 17:41
  I've heard about this.
• 17:42
  I was going to ask you about this.
• 17:44
  So this is amazing, right?
• 17:45
  So most people, if you took your shoes off now, don't do that if you're driving, and you tried to individually move your toes, most people cannot do that.
• 17:54
  But this became a mission for you to drive.
• 17:57
  Yeah, it was a massive challenge.
• 17:59
  So I spent weeks and weeks trying to learn the neural pathway to try and be able to do it.
• 18:05
  So I started to get some movement.
• 18:06
  I didn't get full control, but I got a little bit there.
• 18:09
  I love it.
• 18:09
  Then obviously you get older and girls become in focus and you forget about that sort of stuff.
• 18:23
  During the pandemic, Rusty chatted with a good friend of James, Dario Franchitti, on how a massive IndyCar crash thwarted other racing plans.
• 18:32
  Yeah, I did.
• 18:33
  You know, you talked about Bathurst.
• 18:35
  That was what I wanted to do.
• 18:36
  Actually, I wanted to do the GT3 race at Bathurst this year.
• 18:39
  But after seeing some of the shunts, I thought, maybe not.
• 18:42
  But yeah, Bathurst was one.
• 18:45
  The 24 Hours of Le Mans, I had a lovely deal ready to go on that.
• 18:50
  Dario's brother Marino and James are thick as thieves as they say.
• 18:54
  Let's continue the convo with James now.
• 18:58
  Relatively quickly, there are national titles to your name.
• 19:03
  So, I mean, this thing takes off for you, mate, in many respects.
• 19:08
  Probably, if he doesn't mind me talking about it, your dad went through a tough period from a business point of view.
• 19:14
  That made it hard to continue the racing for a little while there.
• 19:18
  Enter Jim Morton, great person in Australia.
• 19:22
  Australian motorsport in karting circles.
• 19:24
  And there's a yarn about you.
• 19:26
  Dad says, I think at some point, can you go down and borrow some chain oil off Jim?
• 19:33
  And that leads to a good conversation, doesn't it?
• 19:36
  Yeah, yeah, it does.
• 19:37
  So it was Wollongong Street Race.
• 19:39
  I love that race.
• 19:39
  I love that.
• 19:40
  Yeah, yeah.
• 19:40
  Dad says, okay, go up to Jim Morton's tent, which was like a circus tent.
• 19:44
  It had like a big pitch thing and it's all red and white striped.
• 19:47
  Anyway, he said, go up to them and ask if you, because they were sponsored by Castrol.
• 19:51
  And he said, oh, can you ask if you can borrow some chain oil?
• 19:53
  So I roll up there and I'm, excuse me, Mr. Morton.
• 19:58
  Can we borrow some chain oil?
• 19:59
  And he said, on one thing, you have to go back and tell your daddy has to come and see me.
• 20:03
  So I'm like, oh, okay.
• 20:04
  So he gives me the chain oil.
• 20:05
  I think it was chain paste, whatever it was.
• 20:08
  So we roll down.
• 20:09
  I roll back to Dad and I'm like, hey, Dad, here's the stuff.
• 20:11
  But Jim said you have to go and see him now.
• 20:14
  And he's like, oh, okay.
• 20:16
  So I think my dad thought he was going to have to pay for it or something.
• 20:20
  So Dad walks up there.
• 20:21
  And anyway, so then Jim sort of lays down to Dad because I stopped racing because Dad had some financial dramas with work and all that sort of stuff.
• 20:29
  And that was our first race back and we're doing really well.
• 20:32
  I think we were on the front row or whatever, winning heats and all that sort of stuff.
• 20:36
  So dad rolls up there and then Jim pretty much says to dad, hey, look, I want James to be part of that at that time.
• 20:45
  He imported DAP carts.
• 20:46
  He said, I'd like James to be part of the whole Castrol setup.
• 20:50
  So that was the first big break for us, Dad and myself.
• 20:55
  And that's really what started this whole journey.
• 20:58
  So before that, it was just a hobby with Dad.
• 21:00
  And once Morto sort of...
• 21:03
  gave me the in, it just skyrocketed from there.
• 21:08
  It leads to Tony Kart, mate, naturally.
• 21:10
  And they kind of hounded you to come to Portugal for the World Championships, mate, didn't they?
• 21:16
  Yeah, so we had DAP that first year.
• 21:17
  The next year, Jim changed the Tony Kart because the DAP stuff wasn't good enough.
• 21:20
  He changed it because he imported the stuff.
• 21:22
  So they imported Tony Kart.
• 21:24
  That first race, there's an international kart race every year in Australia.
• 21:27
  It was in Raleigh near Coffs Harbour.
• 21:29
  So we roll up there.
• 21:30
  There's all Euro kids that come out the first time.
• 21:32
  So cool.
• 21:33
  Before, there was only ever the Euro seniors would come.
• 21:35
  They came to Orrin Park one year, I reckon, too.
• 21:37
  Yeah, that was the year after.
• 21:39
  I think it was maybe two years after.
• 21:42
  So anyway, so they came out, and I ended up winning the event.
• 21:45
  And, you know, there was a hotshot Euro kids that were there, and they were supposed to wipe the floor with us.
• 21:50
  And I remember we only had one engine the whole time, and Dad leased it from Peter de Bruyne.
• 21:56
  And I remember Dad having a big chat with me saying, this is very expensive, right?
• 22:01
  Don't destroy it.
• 22:02
  You've got to be so careful.
• 22:05
  Make sure you're choking it.
• 22:06
  Keep it cool.
• 22:07
  So I was so nervous.
• 22:08
  I'm driving around.
• 22:09
  Anyway, I was so nervous and I was running it that rich and choking it that hard.
• 22:13
  I actually stalled.
• 22:15
  the engine while I was racing and then we thought, I thought that it just seized.
• 22:21
  So then dad went crazy and then we were just sort of, you know, this is it, the weekend's over and we're sort of half packing up because we only had enough money for one engine.
• 22:30
  And Peter De Bruyne came over and he was like, hey, what are you guys doing?
• 22:35
  My dad's like, well, he blew the engine off so I've only got one engine so it's over.
• 22:38
  Yeah.
• 22:39
  and then he's like, no, you didn't blow it up.
• 22:41
  It's fine.
• 22:42
  He must have just choked it too hard to looking after it.
• 22:45
  So anyway, so we put it back on and continued on the weekend.
• 22:48
  We ended up winning the weekend.
• 22:50
  And then on the way home, I remember as we were packing up, Dad was over with Jim Morton and the guy who owns Tony Car called Robazzi, Roberto Robazzi.
• 22:58
  Yeah, yeah.
• 22:59
  So we were talking and I was a kid throwing rocks at someone or something.
• 23:02
  And then we get in the car on the way home and Dad said, hey, just so as you know, look –
• 23:06
  We can't afford it, but he said that we should race, that they want us to go to the world championship because he said that you were super quick and he was super impressed.
• 23:15
  But he said, look, we can't ask Jim Morton to pay for it.
• 23:17
  And he said, well, he can't afford it.
• 23:20
  So that's pretty cool that they asked us.
• 23:23
  But that's it.
• 23:24
  The feeling was that's kind of...
• 23:26
  Yeah, that's it.
• 23:27
  But then I remember two weeks before the race, then they said, hey, can you come and do the world championship?
• 23:33
  And dad explained the position.
• 23:34
  And they said, hey, look, just get over here.
• 23:36
  Roberto called, I think, didn't he?
• 23:37
  He chased Jim to get you or to get a hold of you, didn't he?
• 23:40
  Yeah, yeah.
• 23:40
  So then came through and got to us.
• 23:42
  And then I ended up.
• 23:43
  my first ever time being on a plane and I flew to Europe and I remember being there at the world championship and it was Ryan Briscoe and I were both shitting ourselves like properly like these kids are shaving, had beards, some of them already receding hair lines.
• 23:57
  To add to this there's some names that people will know too like like Tony Oliuzzi, like Fernando Alonso, these other guys in the the driver's briefing for these two little... Yeah Kimi, all those guys.
• 24:07
  Yeah they're all there.
• 24:08
  So anyway, we were at practice and I kept, after testing and going, each session I'd come out and say to Dad, I'm like, hey, how are we going fast enough?
• 24:16
  What's the thing?
• 24:17
  He goes, no, you need to work on this.
• 24:19
  Listen to your mechanic and the mechanic who was Yano Trulli's manager and he's the mechanic because he was still in the car team.
• 24:26
  And he's saying, no, you need to work on this, this, this.
• 24:28
  So anyway, I kept doing it and ended up doing all the testing for a few days.
• 24:33
  Still had no idea.
• 24:34
  Then we go into qualifying and –
• 24:37
  and got out of the qualifying.
• 24:38
  I'm like, oh, didn't embarrass us, did I?
• 24:41
  How are we going?
• 24:42
  My dad's like, no, we're first.
• 24:45
  And I was like, what?
• 24:47
  And he goes, no, no, you're fastest.
• 24:48
  Anyway, and then we went on to win every heat.
• 24:52
  We won every heat, the pre-final and the final.
• 24:54
  So it was...
• 24:55
  It's pretty crazy.
• 24:56
  You've missed a story here.
• 24:58
  In the driver's briefing, didn't Liuzzi give you a sign or something like that?
• 25:02
  Yeah, so we'd roll into the driver's briefing and Ryan and I, we're like half the size of everyone else as well.
• 25:08
  We're both skinny little Aussie blonde-haired kids.
• 25:10
  And I remember it was Liuzzi and another guy called Antonucci, Ricardo Antonucci.
• 25:16
  So they're both tall guys already shaving.
• 25:19
  And they're standing at the other end of the thing, and Ryan, Bruce goes, like, we're standing beside him.
• 25:24
  He goes, hey, those guys are looking at us.
• 25:25
  And I'm like, what, guys?
• 25:26
  And he points them out.
• 25:27
  And as we're both looking at them, they point at us, and then they just start going.
• 25:30
  They cross their throats.
• 25:32
  And Ryan and I are like, oh, God, we're in trouble here.
• 25:35
  For people that can't see that, it was like a slit throat.
• 25:37
  Like, you guys are gone.
• 25:38
  Yeah, we're going to take you down.
• 25:41
  So that was horrifying.
• 25:43
  But, yeah, we ended up winning.
• 25:46
  And then at the end of that weekend, they sort of said to...
• 25:49
  I said to mum and dad and asked, hey, you can either stay and keep racing and come to Europe and be that or we can end it here.
• 25:57
  And I was like, no, I'm going to do the karting thing.
• 26:00
  Your lovely mums are great.
• 26:01
  I mean, your family are a great family, full stop, mate.
• 26:04
  But how was she with letting you go for that?
• 26:07
  Yeah, I think it was pretty tough for them.
• 26:09
  Like being a parent now, I cannot imagine that.
• 26:12
  Oh, mate, it's wild to think I was...
• 26:15
  14, just turned 15.
• 26:16
  My son's 15 now and he's – to think that I was sort of at that same age but yet mum and dad sort of gave me the chance to go and do it.
• 26:25
  It was unbelievable and it did make me mature so much quicker and not take anything for granted.
• 26:33
  So, yeah, it was wild.
• 26:35
  Awesome.
• 26:36
  Cadell, I think too.
• 26:37
  Drew, a connection from Cadel Evans, who you liked mountain biking back in the day.
• 26:41
  Yeah.
• 26:41
  And he was a gun mountain biker before he won the Tour de France, wasn't he?
• 26:44
  Yeah, exactly.
• 26:45
  And that's where I remember watching him mountain bike back in the day and that name and thinking, Farah, that's a cool name.
• 26:50
  Cool name.
• 26:51
  And Zara, my daughter, I got from when I was racing and we went to Spain and I saw Zara shops and I'm like, oh, that's a pretty name.
• 27:00
  And that's how I got both my kids' names.
• 27:02
  Let's continue the journey.
• 27:03
  So that's the 95...
• 27:05
  Well, title, if I'm right.
• 27:08
  I tried to find it for this discussion, mate.
• 27:09
  I can't.
• 27:10
  I have it somewhere, and it would be on film, like a proper photo.
• 27:14
  I reckon either that year or at some point in 96, I can't remember, you came back.
• 27:20
  I was doing some PA commentary on the grid at Orin Park.
• 27:22
  It was that year.
• 27:24
  It was that year, and you cut a lap of the track, and everyone was just chuffed that we had this world champion, mate.
• 27:29
  I did a couple little chats with you on the grid.
• 27:32
  I vividly remember it.
• 27:33
  I vividly remember it.
• 27:34
  So you go into the next year with another shot at the World Championship again.
• 27:39
  And if memory serves, something goes wrong with the throttle and you nearly got a podium, but you had to drive it using the throttle by hand or something.
• 27:47
  What did you do?
• 27:47
  I can't remember how you got around it.
• 27:48
  Yeah, the throttle cable broke.
• 27:49
  So then, yeah, I had to...
• 27:51
  Use my hand, but your foot's still working, which is funny.
• 27:54
  But you ended up finishing fourth that time.
• 27:57
  So we definitely could have been further up the field.
• 28:01
  But we were super strong throughout it all.
• 28:03
  My teammate ended up winning, which is annoying.
• 28:05
  But, yeah, I think that's probably another one which we could have had, I reckon.
• 28:12
  But you win again in 97, right?
• 28:13
  Just rattle off for people some of the names in the field that year.
• 28:18
  Yeah, so it's all those guys, Liottsi, Raikkonen, Jensen was in Super A, there was Anthony Davison who now does the Sky stuff.
• 28:28
  Yeah, there was, I don't know.
• 28:30
  Everyone.
• 28:31
  Everyone that's sort of my age group that went through, we were all there together, so...
• 28:36
  Who would you – I mean, we'll get to the single-seater stuff in a second here.
• 28:39
  Who's one of the toughest you've come up against in that period?
• 28:42
  Alonso, Hamilton?
• 28:44
  I think – yeah, all those guys were there.
• 28:46
  I reckon the best guy I've ever raced against, which is a shame, is –
• 28:51
  Anthony Davison.
• 28:52
  Really?
• 28:52
  Yeah.
• 28:53
  He was so good.
• 28:55
  And he was my nemesis.
• 28:58
  Really?
• 28:59
  Like, we didn't have a show.
• 29:00
  We were starting to the Grand Prix and we were mucking around just the other week.
• 29:03
  Because we're both English-speaking.
• 29:05
  So, typically, when you go to the track, because we're all there together, all the English guys would sort of, speaking guys would hang together and all the Euros would go and do their thing.
• 29:13
  And it always frustrated me that he was...
• 29:17
  always challenging me.
• 29:18
  Like we were always there with each other and I nicknamed him the prawn because he had red hair and he was little and he sort of hunched over.
• 29:27
  So I called Ant the prawn.
• 29:31
  But he was super quick through karting and all the way into open wheelers and we sort of butted heads that whole way.
• 29:37
  But, yeah, he was really good.
• 29:39
  He was good.
• 29:40
  He's one guy that definitely should have had more of a shot than what he did.
• 29:46
  My teammate through all that as well, Andre Lodera, he was German, he was really, really good.
• 29:50
  Then we were at Jaguar together.
• 29:52
  But there was a lot of us that sort of were on a similar sort of level, but we just arrived at Formula 1 in the wrong time.
• 29:58
  Like we were too early or too late for that changing of the guard.
• 30:02
  And there was a period there where...
• 30:05
  There wasn't any real change in F1.
• 30:07
  They sort of let Raikkonen and Button through, and then they were like, oh, we'll hang off for a minute, and then there wasn't a lot of change through that period.
• 30:13
  Timing is everything, mate.
• 30:14
  Yeah, all of us sort of were waiting on the edge there, and it didn't really open up, and we all sort of went our separate ways.
• 30:20
  You formed some very good friendships in that period, because I think circumstance more or less forces you to... You win that second title, I think, at the end of 97 there, and then you come back...
• 30:32
  dad, I think, was perhaps talking to you about maybe a trade or maybe the family business or something along those lines.
• 30:39
  And there's a chance meeting with Neil Crompton.
• 30:42
  You go with Castrol to Bathurst or something or other.
• 30:44
  It might have been the super touring Bathurst.
• 30:46
  And it was the super touring.
• 30:49
  And he was almost – because I know what Neil's like in these moments, right?
• 30:54
  He was almost insistent that you don't give up the dream, wasn't he?
• 30:57
  Yeah.
• 30:58
  Did he –
• 30:59
  Stitcher meeting together with Alan Gow.
• 31:00
  Yeah, so Neil, I was... Because I think Brock was even racing then.
• 31:04
  He would have been, yeah, yeah.
• 31:05
  He would have been.
• 31:06
  He would have been.
• 31:07
  Because I'd just done a...
• 31:07
  It's funny.
• 31:09
  So we did a lap around the mountain and in the go-kart.
• 31:14
  Wow.
• 31:14
  And it was a shifter kart.
• 31:16
  And I remember, I don't know why, but...
• 31:18
  I was behind Brock and I reckon he was in the Volvo or something.
• 31:21
  Volvo 850.
• 31:22
  And I remember him saying, because they were getting us to do it together, I remember him saying, oh, look, I'll make sure you're there.
• 31:27
  I won't sort of take off on you.
• 31:29
  And I was like, who's this old bloke?
• 31:31
  Take off on me.
• 31:32
  Calm down, mate.
• 31:34
  Anyway, I remember like in the go-kart, you can sort of see him in the mirror and I remember him looking like, holy shit, this kid's done.
• 31:39
  So he was hooking along.
• 31:41
  Anyway, so we did that lap and as we got out, I think Neil interviewed me and we sort of did like a little interview.
• 31:48
  And then afterwards he was like, oh, what are you doing now?
• 31:50
  You know, you should think about getting into cars.
• 31:52
  And I was like, mate, the show's over.
• 31:54
  Dad said to me, you know, at this point I was 18 pretty much.
• 31:58
  You know, you can't race a go-kart forever.
• 32:00
  It's cool.
• 32:00
  You've had good fun.
• 32:01
  You've won a couple of world championships.
• 32:03
  you know, you've got to get, start getting on with life and moving on and we can't afford car racing.
• 32:08
  So yeah, I said, I'm starting work with dad.
• 32:10
  I'm going to be laying carpet.
• 32:12
  And, and Neil was like, don't do that.
• 32:16
  He said, give me a few days before, you know, you commit massively or, you know, completely give up on the dream.
• 32:24
  So I was like, oh, okay.
• 32:25
  So I drove home, said to Dad, I'm like, Dad, this Neil Crompton bloke reckons he can maybe help us.
• 32:31
  And then he called on the Tuesday and he's like, hey, can you be in Sydney at lunchtime?
• 32:35
  And I said, I couldn't drive.
• 32:37
  I didn't have a car or whatever.
• 32:38
  And I said to Dad, can you take us in?
• 32:41
  So I must have been 16, 17.
• 32:42
  I must have been 17.
• 32:44
  Anyway, so then Dad was like, yeah, I'll take you in.
• 32:46
  So then he took me in to meet Alan.
• 32:49
  because he wanted to meet both of us.
• 32:51
  And, yeah, then I sat down with Gowie and he's like wanted our story and I sort of went through our life story and all that sort of stuff.
• 32:58
  And he said to me on that day, he goes, right, sort of Neil's informed me about this, I've been looking over it all.
• 33:04
  I don't want you to answer now, but what I am going to tell you is I will pay for your first year.
• 33:11
  You can come and live with me.
• 33:14
  I'll pay for your first year in Formula Ford.
• 33:17
  Only ever pay for one year.
• 33:19
  If you're good enough, then we'll find other people that will pay and manufacturers and stuff that will carry you through.
• 33:24
  If not, we had a good crack and you'll just owe me that money for the rest of your life and you'll slowly work it off.
• 33:31
  Here's a – I'll get a 10-year contract drawn up for you.
• 33:35
  Don't answer me now.
• 33:36
  Go away and think about it because at the moment you're emotional and you're going to say yes, but you need to have a think about it because this is going to be a huge life-changing decision for you and it's not all going to be –
• 33:45
  roses.
• 33:46
  So go away, have a chat with your dad and get back to me.
• 33:48
  So on the way home, dad and I are talking.
• 33:50
  Properly good guy to have in your corner.
• 33:52
  I mean, owner of the British Touring Car Championship had worked significantly with Brock over time.
• 33:57
  All those guys, Brad Jones, Krompo, they all know Gao very closely and how well connected he is.
• 34:03
  I'm probably talking a little bit out of school here, mate, but I think it was, you know, in the order of £120,000 back then, so probably quarter of a million dollars that was...
• 34:12
  committed for you to go and do the formula forward British formula forward which is held in high regard and typically that's a two-year campaign mate isn't it like you get in and then hopefully you can have a shot at it the next year with the factory team or whatever it might be yeah so yeah two parts of that so yes Gowie's a god in the he's also high up in the in the FIA I think he was
• 34:34
  I don't know who, I can never remember the guy's name who runs the FIA now, but back then, Sean Todd.
• 34:40
  Sean Todd, so he was second in charge.
• 34:42
  So Gowie had anything that had a roof on it, he was sort of in charge of.
• 34:46
  So...
• 34:48
  So he's, yeah, massively influential.
• 34:51
  And then I can't remember.
• 34:53
  What was the second part?
• 34:53
  Well, it's just about where this is going to take you.
• 34:55
  So he makes this commitment to you?
• 34:58
  Yeah, yeah.
• 34:59
  So then – and with Formula Ford, yes, because typically you're coming out of cars and you've got to learn – you've got to learn how to change gears, down change, braking, the weight of the cars and everything.
• 35:07
  So typically it is a two-year program.
• 35:10
  So, yeah, so we did the first year.
• 35:12
  tore up a lot of stuff like we i remember and i was so scared my first ever test so i get to donington and prior to this i was at the indy car race on the gold coast and i met dario frankity and paul tracy so then i was hanging out with those guys all week so they knew me through karting um then dario's like hey my brother's racing formal voxel junior next year and you're doing the british touring cars oh
• 35:37
  British Formula 4, it's the same weekend, you guys should hang out.
• 35:40
  So anyway, so the first test, I'm at the test, and this Scottish kid comes up to me and it's Marina.
• 35:45
  So Marina's like, hey.
• 35:47
  And I'm like, hey.
• 35:47
  And he's like, my brother said we should hang out.
• 35:49
  And I'm like, okay, cool.
• 35:50
  What are you doing after this?
• 35:52
  And Marina's like, oh, nothing.
• 35:53
  And he goes, do you want to go get pizza?
• 35:54
  So I'm like, all right.
• 35:55
  So then we drive and he goes, where do you live?
• 35:57
  And I'm like, oh, I live with this guy, this old guy.
• 36:00
  And he's like, oh, who is it?
• 36:01
  And I said, oh, it's Alan Gown.
• 36:02
  He goes, no.
• 36:03
  I'm not going to his house.
• 36:04
  And I'm like, what?
• 36:05
  What do you mean?
• 36:06
  He goes, I'm not going there.
• 36:07
  That guy's out like crazy.
• 36:08
  I'm not going to his.
• 36:09
  He's scary.
• 36:10
  And I'm like, what?
• 36:11
  Gally?
• 36:11
  And he's like, yeah.
• 36:12
  And I'm like, no.
• 36:14
  Anyway, so then we go back there and, yeah, and then Alan obviously meets Marino.
• 36:18
  Marino becomes Alan's third son.
• 36:21
  I'm Alan's second son or fourth son now.
• 36:23
  But, yeah, so we're all sort of –
• 36:26
  become like all super close mates.
• 36:27
  Marino is a lifelong friend mate, isn't he?
• 36:29
  Yeah, still now.
• 36:30
  Super, super close.
• 36:31
  Both him and Big D. But no, so Gowie was super scary and super influential.
• 36:37
  And everyone, it's funny, like we'd go to the races and it was kind of like he would hate me to a...
• 36:45
  to liken him to Tony Cochran, but he had that sort of aura about him at the track.
• 36:50
  Like everyone was frightened of him, would, you know, cautiously approach him and everything.
• 36:53
  And then there was, but he got shit done, mate.
• 36:55
  He organized, he, I mean, yes, he paid for that whole first year.
• 36:58
  And, um, anyway, so then, yeah, Gary and I, and we, we,
• 37:04
  I can't remember where we finished that first year in Formula 4, but we ended up getting the works Formula 4 drive the next year.
• 37:09
  So then we were free from then on.
• 37:12
  Somewhere, I reckon Lee Diffie is in the UK in this period, early days of World Superbikes, and he was doing a few little video projects, and I reckon I would have the VHS.
• 37:24
  I've still got it.
• 37:24
  Did you?
• 37:24
  You've still got it.
• 37:25
  He made this great video about you and your campaign and what you were doing.
• 37:28
  Aussies abroad, I think you called it.
• 37:30
  Well played, well played, well done, well done.
• 37:31
  I couldn't remember.
• 37:32
  There's only ever one.
• 37:33
  It was me.
• 37:34
  He never made a – I think you're so scared after the first one.
• 37:37
  Two copies.
• 37:38
  We've got them.
• 37:39
  Now, can I talk about, if you don't mind, somewhere here, I don't know whether it's with the factory drive or that first year,
• 37:46
  you get a kind of pretty tough wake-up call around the dangers of racing with a teammate, an Irish teammate, who is killed tragically at Alton Park.
• 37:59
  If you can share a bit of that and what that was like.
• 38:03
  Yeah, it was horrifying.
• 38:04
  He was a great character too, mate.
• 38:05
  Yeah, Neil Shanahan.
• 38:08
  Yeah, he was a great prankster, wasn't he, and things like that.
• 38:10
  Yeah, Neil...
• 38:12
  Red-headed Irishman, super jokester, just really nice guy, Neil.
• 38:17
  And we're both young guys trying to be the head guy on the team and all that sort of stuff and playing pranks on each other.
• 38:23
  And Neil had a – with another mate of ours, Craig Murray, who was a Scottish guy, Neil had a – Craig was passing him.
• 38:32
  They touched.
• 38:34
  Neil ended up in the wall and died at Alton Park when we were racing there.
• 38:40
  So that was –
• 38:42
  probably my first ever sort of big loss in racing with someone that I was really quite close to.
• 38:51
  And I remember, because this is my teammate and everything, the red flag comes out and you drive along and I saw it was his car.
• 38:56
  So you sort of look to see how much the damage is to be able to tell the team if they can fix it and all that sort of stuff.
• 39:01
  So I slowed down.
• 39:02
  As I slowed down, you could see the drawer of the helmet was broken off.
• 39:08
  So you knew it was pretty bad.
• 39:10
  But, yeah, that was...
• 39:14
  That was hard.
• 39:15
  That was really, really hard.
• 39:16
  It still knocks you around now, maybe just recounting that.
• 39:17
  I can tell.
• 39:18
  Yeah.
• 39:19
  We were – the crazy thing is like five minutes earlier, we were all mucking around having a great time and then obviously – then doing something we both love so much, then for him to lose his life was – and it sort of brought home that we sort of – everyone forgets how dangerous it can be.
• 39:38
  If something – like the wheel –
• 39:41
  as he hit, the wheel stayed connected, or the upright wheel stayed connected.
• 39:45
  It was early days of tethers, mate, wasn't it, and stuff?
• 39:46
  Yeah, and the wheel came up and hit him, and that's what ultimately killed him.
• 39:50
  But...
• 39:52
  Yeah, I remember that afternoon they, you know, chopped him out and all that sort of stuff.
• 39:55
  And I remember Alan, who was, like, had no emotion.
• 39:59
  Like, he was, like, blue steel and just, like, scary at the track.
• 40:04
  Him coming in, and he knew how tight myself, Marino, and Neil were.
• 40:11
  And I remember Alan calling us up to go in, and Marino and I...
• 40:16
  you know never ever like we knew it was bad but we never thought it would be this and um i remember alan sitting us down and alan crying because he knew how it would affect us yes and um one it showed that he was human galley but um he broke it to you he told you before to become public i think yes he told me no and i straight away which was um i was there closed down the race meeting all that sort of stuff so and he just said to us he said um
• 40:42
  He gave us, I think it was 1,000 pounds or something, and just said, this is going to be just go to Scotland for a week or a couple of weeks.
• 40:49
  You guys just don't leave each other alone.
• 40:52
  Just stay together and get through it all.
• 40:54
  Get through this.
• 40:56
  Dario loaned you the keys to his place.
• 40:58
  Yeah, so he stayed at his place.
• 41:01
  But, yeah, that was a super tough time.
• 41:04
  And it was probably harder for my parents as well because something like that happened.
• 41:08
  Yeah, me coping with it alone, but then also...
• 41:11
  them remembering how dangerous it can be.
• 41:13
  So it sort of, I think it sort of affected them a lot as well.
• 41:18
  But yeah, it was a pretty tough time.
• 41:21
  Just to underscore the great zest for life he had, the energy that he had, I think you two, maybe you and Marino, had put like, what was it?
• 41:31
  All these wheel weights in his rental car, his road car, on the way to the track that day and he had to stop and jack it up.
• 41:36
  What was going on?
• 41:38
  He couldn't do more than 30K an hour.
• 41:40
  He'd always do shit to me, like prank.
• 41:43
  Like, I hate bananas.
• 41:43
  So he'd put them in my race boots and just screw with me the whole time just doing stuff.
• 41:49
  You have a banana phobia?
• 41:51
  Yeah.
• 41:51
  So anyway, do all this stuff.
• 41:52
  So I was like, right, I'm going to get this bastard back.
• 41:54
  So we got, I went to Dunlop on, this is like the Thursday you get to the track and I went to the Dunlop guy.
• 42:00
  I'm like, give me all the wheelways you can.
• 42:01
  So we got two handfuls.
• 42:03
  And we went out to Neil's car and at the hotel that night, we put them all like one on the front left corner, like all in one spot.
• 42:11
  And then on the right rear corner, just as it wasn't, excuse me, hitting the brake duct.
• 42:14
  So there probably was like a couple of hundred grams like on each wheel.
• 42:18
  Like there was a lot.
• 42:19
  That would feel horrible.
• 42:21
  I remember Neil was like, all right, I'm going to go leave at whatever, seven o'clock to go to the track.
• 42:25
  And I said to me, we'll wait a little bit and then we'll go.
• 42:27
  So then...
• 42:28
  We go past him, we see him jacked up, like he's stopped on the side of the road with his car jacked up, like looking around underneath and everything.
• 42:36
  And we just toot the horn and keep going and laugh.
• 42:39
  And then he gets to the track like 20 minutes later and we're like, what are you doing, mate?
• 42:42
  And he's like, I don't know, there's this massive vibration in my car and I can't work out what it is.
• 42:48
  But yeah, so yeah, I got the last laugh, Neil.
• 42:53
  Love it.
• 42:54
  Dario came on the pod during COVID when we were all struggling for things to do.
• 42:59
  I had a great chat with him, and he told me a fun story about you and Marino, and I don't know if it happened during this period.
• 43:06
  There's many of them.
• 43:06
  Do not try this at home, kids, right?
• 43:09
  But he tells me, I think he was in America at the time, and you two might have had Honda.
• 43:15
  It was like full Dukes of Hazzard, was it not?
• 43:21
  So we go to Scotland.
• 43:22
  Whenever we're there, we get to borrow it.
• 43:23
  We drive all of Dario's cars except the 355 and the F40.
• 43:28
  Like everything else was helpful.
• 43:30
  You boys do what you want.
• 43:32
  So it was right when Honda just released that Type R Accord.
• 43:35
  So we go out and Marino and I are hooking around.
• 43:38
  We go, I can't remember, we end out to lunch or something.
• 43:40
  Anyway, just do a manis in this thing.
• 43:43
  Marino, it's like the variable valve timing, so it sounded like it was turbo and all sorts of stuff.
• 43:47
  So we're coming home.
• 43:48
  Marino goes, hey, on the way home,
• 43:50
  We'll go past – there's this, like, super special stage from my school to the house.
• 43:56
  He goes, I know the road back to front.
• 43:57
  He goes, there's a humpback bridge.
• 43:59
  We'll do a little jump.
• 44:00
  It'll be awesome.
• 44:01
  So I'm like, righto.
• 44:03
  So we go out.
• 44:03
  We're like, what?
• 44:04
  We're coming up.
• 44:05
  And he's like, oh, it's up here.
• 44:06
  And driving along, and I can see it.
• 44:07
  And Marino's pulling gears.
• 44:08
  And we're going fast, like, real quick.
• 44:09
  And, like, we're going fast.
• 44:11
  And we come up and we're coming up to the humpback bridge and I'm thinking, we're going way too fast here.
• 44:15
  We're going to end up on the moon here.
• 44:17
  So as we're going up and Marino's like, I'm like, mate, we're going fast.
• 44:20
  He goes, no, no, it's all good.
• 44:21
  I do it every day on the way I have in the school.
• 44:23
  I'm like, righto.
• 44:24
  So I'm holding on.
• 44:25
  And right as we get to the crest, Marino realises we are going too fast.
• 44:29
  So he just backs off.
• 44:30
  So then it goes through the air and it then goes nose down.
• 44:34
  And we're going through the air and we're both yelling at each other.
• 44:36
  It's like slow motion.
• 44:37
  I'm like, whoa.
• 44:39
  Like look at each other.
• 44:40
  And it lands like on the front bar.
• 44:43
  Like it nearly does a front summit, but it lands on the front bar.
• 44:46
  And we're sliding along the road on the front bar.
• 44:49
  And then it bounces and we end up like off the road.
• 44:52
  And we're like, holy shit.
• 44:54
  And then we jump out of the car and I'm like, you all right?
• 44:56
  And he's like, yeah.
• 44:57
  So we run around to the front and there's no front bar on the car.
• 45:00
  And we're like, what the hell in the front?
• 45:02
  Lots of gravel rash on them.
• 45:04
  That's how far up it was.
• 45:06
  And the chassis rails are just full of like tarmac because it's just pushed all up into the chassis rails and the radiator is all like jammed back and all the ducting on the front screwed.
• 45:16
  And then we look down the road and you can just see the front bar and I'm like, oh, we better go get it.
• 45:21
  We go down and the front bar just has like two little marks on it.
• 45:24
  It must have just hit it in the perfect spot to break the clips and pop it off.
• 45:29
  So then we're like, oh, what are we going to do?
• 45:30
  How are we going to explain this?
• 45:31
  And I'm like, we can't tell him that we jumped the thing.
• 45:34
  So we end up zip tying the bar back on and we go, we come up with this story to Darrow that we're driving up to Knock Hill because to look at the track and the cyclists on the road and they're coming the other way.
• 45:45
  So we had to get off the road.
• 45:46
  No, there's a guy on a Renault 5 because they were always out of control.
• 45:50
  We said, go on a Renault 5, come around out of control.
• 45:53
  A cyclist was another crash we had.
• 45:55
  We didn't actually, it wasn't a real cyclist.
• 45:57
  But anyway, so then we said the Renault 5, so we went off the road and it hit him and plucked the bar off.
• 46:01
  So Dario believed this the whole time until it was at his wedding when Marino and I, I got drunk and then told Dario the real story.
• 46:08
  Don't worry.
• 46:08
  And he reckons that he knew it the whole time.
• 46:10
  Did he?
• 46:10
  He was waiting for us to tell it because someone saw us parked up.
• 46:19
  That's the end of part one of this Ripper feature episode with James Courtney.
• 46:23
  Hope you're enjoying it as much as I am.
• 46:24
  Part two is all loaded up and ready for you to enjoy right now.
• 46:29
  Jump back to the library when you're ready and fire it up.
• 46:32
  A little-known IndyCar option.
• 46:34
  as well as some reflections on the supercars chapter of his career, including a very vivid memory of the day that he won the title amidst the backdrop of serious financial challenges for the team at the time, his move into broadcasting, and how it very nearly happened a few years earlier, plus what looks like the perfect bookend to his supercars driving career, and much more.
• 46:59
  It's all ahead here on Rusty's Garage.