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The Skinnygirl vs The Princess (RHONY S10 Pt. 2) · Mention It All Again

• Blake: Welcome, welcome back. Welcome back to Mention It All, the podcast where we mention it all. My name is Blake and I'm with my co-host Casey. Hello Casey. Casey: Hi, Blake. I'm so thrilled to be back here with you to mention it all again. I missed you last week, even though we appreciated our special guest. Blake: I was just gonna ask, did you miss me? But thank you for offering that up. I have to say I had such FOMO about not being able to, I know we're about to get into like the meat and potatoes of the season, but I feel like with Roni, it's like, I wanna talk about every little nook and cranny. And I was listening to your guys' ⁓ episode. Casey: Of Blake: and there's so much to say there really is so much to say so i had such fomo but i'm really happy to be back here because we have a lot more to really say about this season Casey: a whole lot more. ⁓ And like you were saying, it's actually difficult to pick out material for these women because they really are at this stage, honestly at mostly all stages, but especially at this stage are pumping out the content. Like they will put on a show regardless of the inner and outer turmoil that's being experienced. Blake: I have to say like I mean if if you're listening, I would love to know what you what you're like favorite Franchises I just feel like Roni is one of those franchises where It just works so well Like even the filler scenes because sometimes I'm gonna do a little BTS for our listener sometimes We will skip the filler scenes because we have to watch like half a season a week for you bitches to keep you bitches entertained and it's a lot. mean obviously, you know, I wish this was our full-time job I wish we were just sitting down on the couch and getting paid to rewatch housewives and maybe eventually we'll get there, ⁓ you know, ⁓ let me do the sign of the cross. Amen. ⁓ you guys you can help us get there keep listening, but we have you know jobs and a life so we will skip the filler scenes but with Roni it's very difficult because they don't they don't need to really have that many filler scenes I feel like every scene is like even if it's not the drama it's like Bethany's on some shit Ramona's on some shit Sonya's on some shit and they're also really friends so it really the chemistry is really there so I feel like it's there's always something that's really like interesting to notice And then especially on a rewatch when you already have seen what's going on and then you're like you're noticing these little small tidbits and I feel like my notes are always so extensive and I want to shout out Casey because Casey goes through both of our notes and she calls it down to like what we both kind of have said similarly so that we can get to like the meat and bones the meat and potatoes the flesh and bones if you will of like the season. Because if you look at my notes, it's like I will be I'm like Sonya takes a shit and she's like maybe we don't have to talk about that Like maybe that's not the most interesting thing We might eat The thing is like so that's that's why I don't she will like combine our notes and I just I can't look back at what my actual original notes were it's like the combined notes that's what I'm looking at because I will talk about it all I will mention it all if you give me the opportunity Casey: But we might. We might. We probably will. Yeah We will and I This is like a little secret BTS, but I love reading Blake's notes because Blake is hilarious I adore Blake but the Little notes that all read in there that I can just imagine him sitting on his couch You know long long distance friendship if we could watch it together I mean that'd be a lot of time spent together, but if we could we probably would a little bit Maybe not every Blake: I'm down. I'm down. No, because here's the thing, like, I'm taking these notes and I'm like, I wonder what Casey's gonna think about this. And then we will talk about it. And then I realize we have the same thought. Like, we're pretty well aligned and it's not even about like the main sort of like scene of the episode. It's like she mentioned how, you know, Dale... Casey: Usually, yeah, we're pretty well aligned. Blake: Dale's hair was so good in this scene and that's what I would write and she'll be like, ⁓ my God, we both had the same thought that Dale looks incredible. it's like, that's why this works. Listener, that's why this works. That's why you're here, by the way. That's why you're here. Because Casey and I have just like a, the partnership, the partnership is so, it's so important and it's so there. And I feel like her mind is so gorgeous and you- Casey: It really is. We draw you in. ⁓ I'm I'm like blushing like this is a sweet little a sweet little intro we're having. Blake: Wait! Wait, no I know but also I just remembered, why don't you tell the listener what happened to you this weekend? Instagram Ali. Casey: Instagram this weekend not on our pod Instagram just yet, but on my Bravo Instagram at Stassi's backhand check her out ⁓ to Founding mothers I would say have joined my army Vicky Gunnvilsson and Tamara judge are now Oomphs of Instagram they are by in a way you could honestly say that they're friends of the pod Blake: Stasi nation. They're oomphs. They're oomphs. Casey: now. Blake: They are, they don't know it, but they are. You know what I mean? Casey: They are. Like, and I feel like everyone that's listening knows that. And they might be. We can't rule that out. Blake: They are. They might be. Guys, look, we started this like, it's been a month. I mean, give us some time, but with some time, I think we could really, we could leverage these Instagram follows. But it's because you posted this incredible edit of the Trace Amigas from Real Housewives of Orange County. I have to take a, I'll take a sliver of credit because in our, in our housewives group chat, I, I remember, it was a long time ago, but I said like, I think it would be so, Casey: Yes. Blake: This was when Mayhem by Gaga came out and Vanished Into You, was just such a sentimental song and I was like, Kasey, I think you need to make an edit of the Trace Amiga's friendship to Vanished Into You by Lady Gaga and you did and you made it so spectacularly and you just reposted it on your Instagram and then like literally flies to honey? What do flies fly to? Like vinegar? Casey: I did. It's flies to honey, I'm pretty sure. Blake: Okay, yes, like flies to honey both of them followed you but Shannon didn't but Shannon didn't It's it's coming or Or she just doesn't check her Instagram like I feel like Shannon Bedore is like a housewife who like isn't well-versed in social media Casey: It's coming. It's brewing. It must be. I agree. She has commented on a couple things I've posted and sent me a message or two being like, thank you for the support. But you can tell she's not on there all the time. But I do think it's really genuine though. I was like, ⁓ my god, I really did reach her there. Blake: No She'll see it in like three weeks and she'll follow you. Mark my words. Mark my words. Casey: Perhaps. But happy 20th anniversary to the OC ladies. It's been what, does that mean 20 years or 20 seasons? I guess both. ⁓ Defo seasons. Blake: Both. mean, I think it's the same thing. Okay. And then before we begin, I do think it's necessary to mention, cause that's the whole point of the podcast is that we mentioned it all, is that they have put on pause, they being Bravo has put on pause Rojas Fives of Miami. It took me a couple of days to really like, for that to hit me because There's so much going on every single day like with everything but then this happens and also I think you had actually told me like a day before like Some one of your sources told you that this might be happening that so I was like, ⁓ shit And then a day later it did happen this Miami is literally like the one of the three I think franchise that I look forward to in current day ⁓ Miami is has never missed And I really enjoy the like unique dynamic that Miami brings to the housewife sphere. And I know they're saying it's because of low ratings. I cannot fathom why nobody would watch Miami, why nobody is watching Miami. I think that's bullshit. I think there are other shows like the phony, rony reboot, reboot times two, because now they're rebooting it again. Like just let it go. Let the mouse go. Casey: Right. And people with taste would say that obviously Miami's far better and more entertaining than Beverly Hills. Like, let's just be real about it. Like, I understand that that's Bravo's like big diamond, literally, like, and because it pulls in a lot of viewers because of, I think, like nostalgia and like the lifestyle porn of it all. But. Blake: Yeah. I think, yeah. Yeah. Casey: It's not entertaining. Like everyone that watches it, even the people that like it don't think it's entertaining. Like it's just not. Blake: I think that that is their like, ⁓ that's their like, people who watch Housewives for the lifestyle of it all, watch Beverly Hills, and I personally, and I'm not even sorry to say it, I don't consider them to be like, real Housewives fans. I think that they should be watching, know, Millionaire Listing or whatever the fuck, because Housewives to me, There's one element of it that's supposed to be lifestyle, but the point is the chemistry with the women. The point is the women like going at it, having fun together, like having tough conversations. You're not watching, like realistically you're not watching Housewives just to be like, ooh, she has a nice house. That's like a fleeting thought you might have and then you move on to, like, but she's mad at, you know, this bitch for talking about her divorce. So what are they going to say at dinner? But you're not, it really doesn't matter what kind of house they have when they're sitting down at dinner fighting with each other. So they get by because that is like a legacy rich people, you know, franchise, but I, 100 % agree it is it's not been entertaining. I think this season they did a good job with adding Amanda and Rachel's ⁓ but ⁓ You know, it's it they care about the ratings even though Andy has said multiple times we don't do ratings here or he's like, you know, we do peacock and cable and They combine all of it. Whatever but clearly you're mad that Miami hasn't had the best ratings also ⁓ I'm so sorry. I'm like really on it right now, but ⁓ They strategically placed shows after other shows that they know will do well. And they did that with Rony after Beverly Hills because they wanted Phony-Rony reboot to piggyback off of the Beverly Hills viewership because they wanted it to succeed. So it kind of makes you feel like they were given the ultimatum, pick one. Do you want to invest in Rony or do you want to invest in Miami? And I feel like they went with Rony. Even though, as someone who lives in New York, we can let it die. We can let it die because you guys killed it. You already killed it. It's dead. So you can keep trying, but it's dead. Casey: Right. And like, I know that you're not a big summer house watcher, but they're doing a spin off of summer house now, like some of the OGs are older and they spend more of their time like in the city and can't really like party as much all the time. So they're doing a spin off of that. That's going to be called in the city. So like now we have Real Housewives of New York flop version in the city and summer house. That's three shows and next gen NYC. So it's like Blake: and next gen. Casey: Whoa, I think we're good here. Like, can we like mesh some of these together? Like, and we're gonna cut another show full of diverse immigrants. Like, I mean, not that every show has immigrants, but we also cut Family Karma. We just brought back Shaw's for the Valley Persian style, but they were off for a while. Summer House Martha's Vineyard, which was an all black cast, and now Miami. So people are rightfully kind of side-eyeing this. Blake: I think New York's getting its moment. Casey: Because yeah, why would you not? Blake: It's also just like, you know, we're doing a Vanderpump's Rules reboot, which I haven't watched because it looks really try hard. They give, you know, spin-offs to Heather Gay for her Mormonism, which we've heard about every season of Salt Lake City. know, Erika Jayne got a spin-off for her You Bet It On Blonde Vegas show that the tickets were $7. We're just, I feel like, you know, they can invest in what they want to see succeed and I don't think Miami was given that opportunity. So in that vein, we will be doing a Miami rewatch soon. Casey: Yes, stay tuned. Blake: ⁓ And so stay tuned for that stay tuned ⁓ With all that being said our rant being done. Let's get into part two of Rony season 10 because Lord knows there's a lot for us to talk about so So Casey take it away. I almost called you Stassi because of your I Mean gorgeous girls gorgeous girls, you know what I mean? Casey: I appreciate that. I mean, I'll take it ⁓ Exactly, divas. But yeah, I mean, how about this? Why don't we, cause I didn't do it while I was missing you, cause I know it's a favorite of yours. Do we want to talk about the taglines real quick before we dive back into the madness? Do you want to roll the tape? Blake: Right, I noticed you guys didn't play the taglines last episode. Let's roll tape. Let's roll the taglines because they're pretty good. Casey: kind of cut Luann off there at the end, the most interesting people make the best headlines. Blake: That's okay, you got the gist. That is such an iconic tagline, I'm sorry. I think that the taglines that own the storyline of that season are so cunt. knowing that she gets arrested this season and saying the most interesting people make the best headlines. And they do. And they do, Luan. And they do. And you're right. And you're right. Casey: I think that's my favorite of the group taglines for this season. I think it's phenomenal. like on the opposite side, I also do love Tinsley's because it's so stupid, but like I love the like, it's been playing in my head every time I've like ordered delivery this week. Like why would I cook when I can order room service? Blake: It is stupid. Come on why would I I I have to say like Tinsley wouldn't be a housewife that on a normal franchise like gets you know any love from me, but I think Tinsley is the perfect like foil for these women and I think for that reason like People don't understand, like, she is integral to this, like, perfect cast. Like, this season and last season, 9 and 10, which are the same cast, perfect cast for Rony. This is like their sweet spot and Tinsley needs to be there. A lot of people don't recognize how important Tinsley is to this formulation and... I will take her stupid tagline, will take her stupid storylines, I will take her feeling like she can't switch up her hair after 40 years because she's afraid it's gonna make her look fat or whatever the fuck she said. I love it all. I love it all. Casey: I really, mean, everyone already knows how funny her mom is as a character. We even already name dropped Dale earlier in this episode just as an example, but Dale, whenever she's around Tinsley, I think they are so funny as a little duo. Like, and that's one of the moments that we come back to in the beginning of, ⁓ in the beginning of the second half of the season. like mid season, Dale is in town and Tinsley and her are... playing, playing fools. Like they are going wedding dress shopping. They're calling her like fertility doctor. And it's, it's hilarious. I mean, like how much of it is like even like real or what's going on? Like, is this for the camera? I don't really know, but it's so funny. Blake: You It's so funny, are, so Tinsley is wedding dress shopping and the reason that's funny is because her whole thing is she's with Scott, she's not with Scott, like they're not really in like a continuous, strong relationship and people are questioning, nobody knows when it ends and when it starts again. So, you know, but then there are people questioning like, you know, is he giving you money because... Which I don't really understand and we'll get into it later because Sonia brings it up later, but I don't really understand this like ⁓ obsession with knowing whether Scott's giving Tinsley money because Tinsley grew up in wealth. Like she is a trust fund baby. She's never had a job. She's just a socialite. So regardless of whether Scott paid for something or whether she paid for something like she has the money. I don't really understand why anybody cares about that, but they're wedding dress shopping and it's funny because she's not anywhere near close to getting married. And then, okay, this was interesting because they're wedding dress shopping and then they're like her fertility doctor like FaceTimes her and wants to like update her on her like frozen embryos. so like he like he like flips the screen on the FaceTime and he's like, look, look, here are your eggs. I'm gonna play it. I'm gonna play it. So like, so he like, he, I, look, I know that reality TV is obviously produced, like it's not all like organic. So like obviously the producers had to be like, hey doctor, whatever the fuck, can you like exactly 15 minutes from now, can you call Tinsley and tell her about her frozen eggs? Because she's gonna start crying in the middle of the bridal dress shop and. Dale, her mother who's shopping with her, also starts crying and she's like, they're both like, those are your babies, those are my babies. Casey: It's them crying in like the exact same cadence like the Dale joins in in the like perfect tune in San Quentin's Lee and Someone I think makes the point later like that. These are unfertilized eggs Like they're not even like in the next stage of like we're not even close to that being a baby yet Like not anywhere close Blake: their embryos, like. but it's perfect because she's also she's also bridal dress shopping when she's not even close to the stage of getting married so i feel like she's i feel like she just does this like ⁓ humiliation ritual where it's like i'm going to like maybe she's manifesting i don't know but she's like i'm going to do the thing that i really want to do that i'm not quite there yet but i'm gonna do it anyway in hopes that maybe it like will complete itself very soon but it just makes it just i don't know like tinsley's like a hopeless romantic she's like a hopeless ⁓ mother antic i don't know what the other word is but she i i feel for her like i want her to have that life but but there's no Casey: Yeah, I feel like part of me thinks it might be that she wanted like to have these moments on camera, even though like the timeline wasn't exactly lining up. Maybe she was starting to think, what if this happens in a while and I don't get to be in my wedding dress on the Rony cameras? I don't know. But wedding dress shopping, I know her producer for the day was feeling like they won the lottery. Like they were like, ⁓ We're going fake wedding dress shopping. Yeah, let's get that fertility doctor on the line while she's in that dress. And let's make sure that call is picked up in the bridal dress store after she's told all the employees that she's single and not heading to the altar. Yeah, let's do that for sure. Roll it. Blake: let's get her sobbing ⁓ And we also have to mention that we also get the scene of Bethany showing up to Jill Zarin... Well, it's not Jill Zarin's funeral, but it's Bobby Zarin's funeral, which is sad because Bobby was actually a great guy. Jill sucks, but Bobby was a great guy. And this really isn't that notable, except for the fact that if you're familiar with the Rony lore, you know that... Bethany shows up, Jill and Bethany have this moment where they're like reconnecting after years, you know, they had their beef and they haven't spoken and they're reconnecting over acknowledging how great of a person Bobby was and whatever. But years after this, Jill denies knowing that they were filming at the funeral and makes it seem sort of like ⁓ they were opportunistic. I had no idea, but you know, Jill emailed them, her assistant emailed them asking them to have cameras there. So I think that is the most interesting tidbit is that you watch them, Jill and Bethany speaking and it does seem like a very genuine moment but Jill said something like I thought it was ⁓ press because you know Bobby and I were on a show. I thought it was press from like you know the city whatever. ⁓ If you watch the scene There's no way you don't realize it is like Bravo production. It's not just like a reporter and his little camera. It's like there's every angle has a camera on it. And so it's funny that she continues on ultimate girls trip. They have this drop. They have this, you know, argument like it, it, stretches years, but at the reunion, they mentioned that Jill emailed them, asking them to film and Bethany mentions Jill wanted her to be there. to film. it's just funny, like, Jill, I don't really understand Jill's era because she's such a... She just constantly is fucking up left and right. She doesn't really understand. Like she, I feel like she's so thirsty for attention. But if you can literally pinpoint an email where you said, Hey, I would love for Bravo since it was a big part of his life to be there for his funeral. Why would you walk that back? I don't understand. It makes no sense. Casey: Yeah, I don't even like want to get for too much time because she annoys me and like this whole thing annoys me because Like, obviously it's a little bit strange. You haven't even been on this show for a number of years now. Like, not even remotely connected. Like, I understand that he was on the show and, like, everyone, like, would obviously see that and think, ⁓ like, how sad. Like, he was always a good guy, like, when we saw him. But it's not something that, needed to be filmed. I don't know if I ever feel like a funeral needs to be filmed for any of these shows. ⁓ But I also, like, this all ends up... Blake: Yeah Casey: as a chip that the women try to play as like, this was Bethany, like Bethany wanted to film at the funeral. And Bethany is like, no girls, like I did not like that was Jill. Blake: They were saying she asked me to film. she didn't... Like, I actually don't feel the same way in terms of like, I don't think that filming necessarily, you know, is like wrong at a funeral. But I think when it turns into this argument about, you know, you did it for your own personal reasons or whatever, like, if she did that, it would have been shitty. But... If like, you know, my friend's husband dies and I happen to be a reality star and I'm like, you know, ⁓ he was on the show and they're like, can you bring the cameras? I think it'd be good to like, you know, let the audience know like we're mourning him, whatever. Like I personally don't think there's anything wrong with that. It's only if you're doing it for shady reasons, which she wasn't because Jill asked. So I just wanted to put that out there because that has been a controversy for years and it really is just Jill lying, which I guess she does all the time. Jill Zarin is... I don't know, she's... Yeah, moving on. Okay, this is a big part of the season that we need to talk about, or at least acknowledge at this point, is that because Carol and Bethany are not good, Bethany is kind of fighting a proxy war. I think you might have mentioned that last episode. Casey: Yeah, I'm done with her. Next. Blake: Like Bethany's fighting a proxy war with Carol, where she is ingratiating herself with Sonia. She and Sonia are besties and she's showing an interest in Sonia's life that she has made clear before she doesn't care about. You know, if you recall, I think it was last season or two seasons ago where she like the tipsy girl thing where she like eviscerated her and she said like, I want nothing to do with you. Suddenly this season, she is all chips in for Sonia. And I think it's only because she knows she can manipulate Sonya into kind of being her puppet. And I think that... I think Bethany is very strategic when it comes to the friend group. Casey: Yeah, I think there's a lot of strategic things happening here. I mean, if you had to like draw like the shakedown of the group right now, it's Bethany, Sonya, Luann versus Carol. Tinsley Dorinda, Ramona kind of plays both sides of the fence until the very end of the season where she firmly goes to the the Tinsley Carol Dorinda side of the swing mostly because of her beef with Bethany like that's really why because they become like the anti Beth squad by the reunion and It's it's smart. I mean, I think when if you're on a show like this, you probably naturally end up forming alliances and feeling like you need to kind of have some people in your corner when Blake: Yeah. Casey: When the drama is going down, I would feel like that. think people feel like that in their regular lives more than they'd want to admit to. Like, if you've ever been in a weird friend group, like, people do that in friend groups. Like, there are sides and there are clear, ⁓ I'm just gonna jump into this even though I really have no stake in this game. Blake: Yeah, definitely. I mean, loyalty is a thing when it comes to friendships. you know, obviously people would hope that they don't have to deal with this level of like, you know, chaos when it comes to their friend groups, but your natural instinct is to pick a side, unfortunately. So this is when... we get like the jab of jabs. I think this is probably the worst thing that was said all season is that Bethany in her confessional says that Carol doesn't have a career, she has no children, she's not married and that's why she thinks that Carol and Tinsley get along really well. And I think she says that to sort of say like, that's why, I think it's cope. To be honest, I think it's cope. I think that is Bethany saying, you know, That's why Carol isn't into me anymore because she and Tinsley are besties because they both are very similar in life. No career, no husband, no children. ⁓ And Bethany also loves to say jabs where she comes out on top. And so the implication is that she has a career, she has a child, she's definitely obviously divorced. for her to say Carol has no career to her is like, you know, and I do and I'm a business woman, I'm busy, I'm successful and I think that that, ⁓ I think that was low. I don't think anything that has happened up until this point has merited her taking such a low jab against Carol and you might disagree with me, I would love to hear it but I think that that was low. Casey: I think that I do. Wait, clarifying question, because I can't remember. Did Bethany say that in a confessional or did Bethany say that in a scene, like a live scene? So there is the factor that that was probably filmed after a lot of their fights had already happened. So Bethany is adding that in. Blake: Confessional, for sure confessional. Casey: post real time, which I do think makes it worse overall. Like it's like you had time to think on it and like then you made a jab. I do think it's a jab. Like I agree with you that there is a condescending tone to it, specifically about the career. cause I, I as a- Blake: Mm-hmm. It's certainly supposed to be rude. Casey: childless person. I get confused sometimes why the other childless women on the shows get so mad when it's like pointed out because like you just don't have one. Like it's just a it's just a fact. Like I like feel like there's like this weird competition of like I want to be able to comment on family matters and then a woman is like ⁓ but you don't have a kid and they're like ⁓ like how could you say that but you don't. Blake: But... Y'all. Yeah. Well, I think it hurts Carol more only because, and we get to this in the reunion, we'll talk about it later, but I think it's different when it's your choice versus like, know, Carol, I think her husband dying and feeling like, I think at that point she felt like I don't really want to rebuild my life and be married and have kids with anyone else. So I think it's, and it comes from a friend who knows that. Like I'm sure Casey: Right, yeah, it is a different situation. was your morning during, like, peak tile rearing age, i guess? that sounds like weird Blake: But Carol. But Bethany knew that. Like that's my thing. Bethany and Carol were close at one point. I'm sure Carol told her that. Like once my husband died, I didn't want to really like get married again and have kids. So the reason I think it's different, because I agree with you. I think there are housewives who try to weaponize that. Like, you don't know what it's like because you don't have kids. Different thing if you're not married yet or you chose not to have kids. But I think it feels lower to me because it's like she Casey: Right. Okay, yeah. Blake: would have had a family with her husband and I feel like she made that conscious choice and you don't know what's going through people's heads when it's like you know if I if I like maybe I maybe that was so traumatizing I'm that was my one love and I don't want to get married again I think Bethany took a low blow because I think Bethany weaponized her knowledge of what matters to Carol Casey: Yeah, that's true. Blake: And I think that's what she did. She said you have no career, you know, you don't have children and she said it in a matter of fact way. Don't get me wrong, but Bethany loves to do the like thing where it's like plausible deniability. I didn't actually mean it to be rude. I was just pointing out the facts, but no, I mean that is rude because Carol would have had a child. ⁓ And it wasn't even... Yeah, sorry. mean, I... Casey: Mm-hmm. I was just thinking that. Yeah. Okay, so I actually agree with you. I agree with you. You've convinced me now because I think of it more as like... It is like a factual statement to be like, you do not have a child. Like if someone said that to me, I'd be like, yes, correct. Like I do not. But I also am like not super invested at this moment in my life in having a child. So it's not like it's like a slight, because if you're saying that to someone that you do know has or had interests, like you're kind of then poking like, what if they can't have a kid? Like what if they're trying and like that's like, and that's where it gets like, and that's basically the case for not like for body issues, but like Carol. Blake: well that's my point. it wasn't- Yeah. Casey: couldn't or didn't have the right mix of things to have a kid because of her husband dying, because of mourning, because of a whole bunch of things. Tinsley doesn't because she's had shit boyfriends and she's worried about her biological clock ticking too, so it would obviously kind of fringe her a little bit. So yeah, I actually do get it. It's definitely a dig. Blake: I think Bethany, to understand that Bethany is a very smart woman. And when she says things, it's not, it's very intentional and it's meant to hurt people. We'll move on. We will probably have this conversation again because Bethany says a lot of shit this season. But this is also when Luanne gets arrested and she's heading back to New York and she says a very funny, Casey: It's intentional, yeah. ⁓ Yeah. Blake: Let's play it. I Casey: I love her so much. She's literally my favorite person in the whole world. Like, wow. Blake: I do love her and I love that her first call was to Dorinda. ⁓ I know we had this, we were texting about this. We, you know, I feel like you're Luanne, I'm Dorinda and I feel like we, ⁓ not like- Casey: I know, before things go south. Blake: necessarily like we embody those people but I think like I'm a Dorinda stan you're a Luan stan and I really feel like you know we are always hoping for them to be on a good page ⁓ we'll get to that later but ⁓ Luan so Dorinda meets up with Luan in the city Luan obviously is not trying to drink anymore because of Casey: No. Blake: What just happened, but it's funny because she opens her fridge while Dorinda's like at her apartment hanging out and she goes ⁓ shit, like it's like it seems like that's the first time she's opened her fridge since she got arrested She's like there's a shit ton of rosé in here I gotta like get rid of it and I I thought it was funny because I mean I don't know about you Casey, but I Definitely like, you know, partake, you know on the weekends I put there's sometimes like it's a thirsty Thursday, whatever but it's always I'm going out and buying a bottle like I don't really have just like a Casey: Yeah, absolutely. Blake: Stocked fridge or like I don't have bottles hanging around not that that's indicative of having a problem But I just think it's funny that like She got arrested came back and she was like, ⁓ my god I literally have like a shit ton of Rose in here like let me get this off my hands and and Dorinda is talking to Luanne and Again another this this is the thing. There's so many like details. I'm not trying to get into it like too deep but like Dorinda's talking to Luann and she has these like leather fingerless gloves. Why? Dorinda why? Like what what statement are you trying to make like are you are you did you just get off your motorcycle girl like you're Harley Davidson like you were in the Upper East Side there's no reason for you to be wearing those. Just needed to say that. ⁓ we we sorry. Casey: Right. But Luanne comes home, she talks to Dorinda first, and like they have a little debrief, but everything that they kind of talk about gets re-talked about when the group is all together, so we'll kind of just mesh it. Blake: Yeah. Casey: mesh it into one, but basically the group slash mostly Dorinda has an idea of like when Luanne gets home, like she could really use some time to like reset, relax, like show that we have people that are there for her. So they decide to go to this like spa in Connecticut that you stay at, you, you know, have like activities, you have treatments, all that good stuff. ⁓ And right away. we kind of get a sit down where we talk about the arrests and all that. But two things preceding the arrests that I think are interesting. One, when Luanne's mugshot is released, I'm pretty sure organized by either Carol or Tinsley, they go to this workout class that's called like con body fitness or something like that. And they take fake mugshots and do like. jail poses and they're all like haha like Luanne's in rehab no Luanne's in rehab while they're doing this like this is immediately right after she gets arrested so this is before they all meet up and for me i'm watching that and i'm like i'd be so mad like if i got home and i press play on this show and all my friends are taking fake mugshots while i'm in rehab on camera on camera all together as a storyline which i'll put a pin in that because i'll return to it but Blake: The wind's not there. Yeah. Yeah. Casey: Then I see them here in this group scene and they're all being relatively supportive and nice to Luan. They're making it lighthearted. They're able to be like, yeah, we know girl, you're back now, you seem great. It's a generally good vibe, but in my head I'm like, is this not fake? They're all very fake to Luan about this arrest. When they're talking to Luan, it is like, we are so proud of you, Lu girl, you're amazing, you're doing amazing. And then she literally leaves the room and they're like, mugged. Blake: haha Casey: shot fell in Luanne, like, let's lock her back up. Like, and I just can't deal. Blake: Also, I think we need to explain what Luanne's version of events is. Essentially, she says she went to a hotel. ⁓ She was staying with a friend, not at a hotel, with a friend, but her friend's cat was keeping her up, so she chooses to go to hotel. She says that she gets to the hotel bar. I think she was already drunk. She says she's feeling good. ⁓ She goes to the fourth floor with this potential suitor. ⁓ She gets out, she goes to the wrong room. Apparently her floor was on the fifth floor. But she doesn't know that. The maid is cleaning the room so the door is open, she goes in. ⁓ The maid kind of just leaves. I think the maid goes and calls the police because she doesn't think that Luan belongs in that room. Luan is just not hearing it. She's like, no, this is my room. She's trying to like, you know get down and dirty with the suitor then the police show up and that's when all this happens and I have to say like That sucks like To me she did nothing wrong to me. This was what happens when like you you know a night out having fun You know just you make the wrong Choices that aren't even illegal choices but you're not given the grace of like, hey, let me just escort you to your room. It's like, now we gotta get the police involved and now it's escalating for some reason. And the only reason she got the felony charges is because she was thrown into a police car and was very confused. it does make you kind of fear, obviously she was blacked the fuck out, but is that a crime? Is it a crime? I mean, why couldn't someone have just said like, Miss Ma'am? Casey: and was wanting to attack them. Blake: we're gonna escort you to your fourth floor room, which is not on this floor. Why did it have to get to a place where we were arresting you? I did feel the moment for her where I was like, this is not, it definitely would make you feel like shit, but it wouldn't really indicate like, you have a drinking problem. So I did sort of feel like. Casey: Yeah. well i- i don't think she does have a drinking problem like- ⁓ she- Blake: I don't think she ever did. Casey: She doesn't really say that ever. Like she's like, I think right now I'm using it unhealthily to cope with a lot going on and like it was totally a crutch and like totally something that I was using to like avoid my feelings. And I think that that's true. Like she was going through a lot and was drinking to deal with what she was going through like ⁓ at this time and then more things pop up with her family down the line that kind of causes a relapse situation. But. she i i think i could be wrong but today i think she indulges in a regular like manner again and she seems to be all set so godspeed like it's it's your life and like people no matter how much like Blake: No, she definitely does. She definitely does. Casey: everyone could agree that you have an issue, it has to be an internal thing, like if you feel it, you have to go solve it yourself, but anywho, they're all chatting about this, it's actually like a nice scene, even though I have the lingering back of my head, like this is giving fake a little bit, I also was struck by like, they walk into their house at this cottage, and there is so much liquor. Yeah, and there's so much liquor. Blake: ⁓ the Mayflower. Because they- so they're all going to a spa. This is when Luanne comes back. They're all going to a spa in, like, Connecticut called the Mayflower and they want Luanne to just detox. Casey: Right. Blake: Meanwhile, they walk in and there's welcome champagne. Casey: so much wine in like the front entrance way like literally you walk in Blake: Dorinda literally said like, she was like, do you mind if I have a glass? I'm like, maybe just take a weekend where you don't drink. Casey: Like, did you guys even want to think that maybe just for like the night one, night two, maybe let's not drink in support of our friend that literally is fresh out of rehab? That blows my mind. Like, that alone tells you that this group has some issues because that would be the first thing that anyone would think of if you didn't need to have alcohol on a group outing. But this is Real Housewives and they have to have it. Like, they can't not have it around each other. Dorinda needs to have it. Blake: Right. You would think. You would think. But, but... Well, Dorinda needs to have it, you know? Like, she walks in with Luanne, she's like, hey girl, ⁓ know that you just were arrested and probably aren't legally allowed to drink because you're gonna be arrested again and the court system thinks you have an alcohol problem, but mind if I have a glass of champagne? That okay with you? And Luanne says yes, and I will say Luanne handles herself so gracefully. So gracefully. Casey: So well. Blake: Bethany, Sonia, everyone they go to dinner ⁓ and, ⁓ and ⁓ Luan calls ⁓ Ramona out because apparently Ramona was trying to get an invite to ⁓ Tom Luan's that she crashed out about and went. Casey: Like fresh ex-husband, Blake: fresh like literally the reason she went to jail is because she was literally the same city that they got like engaged and everything and married. ⁓ Ramona who is not a girl's girl. Ramona is a sociopath. She tries to text Tom and say can I be a part of your New Year's Eve party which is on the boat that Tom and Luan got engaged on. Casey: which Ramona had already brought up to Luann episodes earlier being like, you know, what's so crazy? He's having a party on the same boat that he had the party for you. Like, isn't that horrible? And then after saying that to Luann, text him this. So like she's acknowledged that this is not a good thing. Luann already is known to be a little bit upset about it. And then she goes and does this. Like, what are we doing here? Blake: I genuinely do not understand. I think Luan was really kind to Ramona because if my friend tried to do that to me after I was married, divorced, and just freshly out of jail because of how deeply this affected me, she should have killed Ramona. she should have killed Ramona on camera I would have strangled her Casey: I completely agree. think that's like, there are some things that everyone just knows are wrong. Like that's obviously wrong. Like every step of the way that was wrong. It would have been wrong if you hadn't already talked about it, but it's extra wrong because you already did. Like, come on. Like you have to like have more. And then she always wants to be like, I'm so smart. I'm so educated. Like, are you? Because that's not what it's giving. Blake: No, you are not a girl's girl. You're a selfish, not even gonna go there, like Ramona, Ramona is a horrible person. Like a horrible person. And I think that probably because of the show, these women give her like third and fourth and fifth chances, but nobody would want to be friends with somebody like that. nobody, like I don't know how you can have no. Casey: Yeah. Blake: sense of care, compassion for your friend. Insane to me. Insane. Casey: And she doesn't feel bad about this, like she refuses to apologize for it. She's like, I don't understand the big issue, like, and we don't like fully like understand like the situation. Like they talk about this multiple times throughout the season, cause like more details unravel, but she even says, ⁓ go ahead. Blake: Yeah. But at this lunch... ⁓ sorry. No, I was gonna say at this lunch... No, you're fine. You're fine. At the same lunch or dinner or whatever it is. ⁓ This is also when we get the iconic scene of... ⁓ Sonja comes out with a shoe line and it's like a loafer line, something like that. Casey: ⁓ my god. ⁓ my god, I'm so sorry. ⁓ she coming out with a shoe line or does she just have one pair? I wasn't really sure about that. She's wearing like a little pair of loafers with a deer on it and someone's like, ⁓ cute, and she's like, it's my family's crest, like it's the morgue. It's like that's the deer, like that's why I have it. Blake: Was she? Yeah. That's the Morgan crest and Dorinda just is not having it. Dorinda says, you know, you're not a Morgan anymore. Like your daughter's a Morgan, you're out of the picture girl because you're Sonya Tremont, you're not Sonya Morgan anymore, you got divorced. And she's like, I would be so embarrassed if I was wearing Ralph's tartan, which tartan crest is maybe it's the same thing, but I'd be so embarrassed if I was doing that because I'm no longer part of the family. But Sonya... can't let go. She can't let go of the past. Casey: Well, and it's funny because this initial day slash initial dinner at the spa sets up conflict that we're going to hear about for the rest of the literal season. both the Ramona Luan thing, all the arrest drama, Carol Bethany of it all, the Sonya Derinda beef, which does kind of peter out. We're probably getting to the end of that because Derinda finds a new target in Luan. But I agree with Derinda. I do think that, all right, you could probably let that go. You guys are divorced. You didn't want to be with each other. So I understand saying, all right, girl, like. Let's not have this here. But at the same time, it's not like, what does it bother? Like, what does it hurt you to let her live this like delusional fantasy? Like, it is a little bit like let the mouse go like. Blake: it's true, it's true, i think- Yes, but and I'm sorry to have this because I know that like every fucking part of this show like we it's like so hard to like just move on from but but I will say Dorinda clocked Sonia because Sonia doesn't like go of it forever. Like even Ultimate Girls trip, she's still talking about how she used to be married to the bank. Like I think they were just, they were closer to her. They were able to see that like even outside of the cameras, she's not well cause she can't be Sonia Morgan. Like Sonia Morgan, she has to be Sonia Chase Bank Morgan. that's like, you're, it's, they've been married, they were divorced like nine years ago. You need to stop. But anyway, I did also think there was a moment at this spa where Bethany sees these like crystals and Dorinda comes over and she's like, ⁓ I know where you can buy those. Like, let me like put you in contact, whatever. And it just, part of me was like, Dorinda, stop. Stop trying to buy people things. Stop trying to like connect people to things. Clearly like it's not working out for you. People are not showing you like the adequate amount of like graciousness, gratitude. And you, I don't even know how you know how to get all these things. And we're going to get there because we haven't even touched upon Giovanni, but how, but you know how to get all these things. And then you're going be so mad. when people don't give you the adequate amount of like, thank you. And I was like, how do you, how do you? Casey: Yes, yes. This is exactly what I was thinking because Dorinda, to her credit, is very generous. She's always offering to help people. Like you said, she has a lot of connections. She's always being like, wait, you like that? I can help you get that. She does it with the Nutcracker. She offers it here. She does it for a bunch of other situations that we see. And then she ends up doing it with the Giovanni dresses towards the end of the season. But on the flip side of the generosity is like there's this Venom if you do not have the exact reaction that she wants you to have like no matter if it's thankful It if it might not be thankful enough like no matter how much you jump up and down She might have wanted you to jump up and down and then give her a hug and then give a speech and then post about it like who knows what the The standards are but I was thinking this while I was watching I was like dear God, I would never want a gift from Dorinda I'd be so stressed out that I would have to perform my Grateful ritual in the right way or else I'd get stabbed like it really is like whoa. Whoa like thank you. Not enough ⁓ Blake: I know. Also, this is when I think Bethany is projecting her insecurity about the Carol situation onto everyone else because she says something like, ⁓ know, Dorinda, I don't think you really like me right now. And it's just because Dorinda is expressing like, you know, her feelings about their relationship. But I feel like Bethany kind of takes that in, you know, put... pulls it all together and says like everyone hates me right now and I'm gonna play this only because it's been a big meme on Twitter and it's kind of funny out of context. It's not even like a big scene, but it's funny that Dorinda's like, hey, what's up? And she's like, I don't feel totally safe with you. Casey: I think it's such a funny phrase to say to someone like, you know what though? I wouldn't feel totally safe with Dorinda either, as I was just saying. It's like a good, it's like the least offensive way you could put girl, you're a lot sometimes in an alarming way. She's just like, I don't know. And this is post, they had the Haiti thing, they had the Nutcracker thing, so they've already had. Blake: Yeah Casey: like several dramas between the two of them. So yeah, they're not feeling safe with each other at this moment in time. Blake: And then okay we move on to Dorinda is they leave them a flower whatever that's like their little like spocation whatever Dorinda is introducing Luanne to Giovanni because I guess Dorinda has a connection with ⁓ I don't know every fucking brand ever and so she's like hey I think you'd look amazing in all these dresses and they fit Luann amazing she's like use them for your cabaret ⁓ and ⁓ then also Luann lets us know as the audience that they dropped her charges from felony to misdemeanor which makes sense I mean did we think she needed to be like locked away for 10 years for what she did. No, she didn't have criminal intent. She was just a drunk lady, like confused and scared. Um, we move on to the speed dating event. This is like actually like a really, really, I think, um, funny event. Casey: fun watching it. It's like kind of a random thing that like takes up- it's like probably like something to kind of fill an episode here, but with these women you can, like because they're entertaining. It was like kind of a goddamn key, like the women are all there, even the ones that have partners, ⁓ but the most into the event are Ramona, Bethany, and Sonia, I'd say, that are really kind of getting in the mix and flirting around. And there's this one guy who's identified immediately, who's wearing a red scarf, so that's what they're all calling him, signifying him by. And he becomes a point of contention because the matchmaker is like, Carol, he'd be good for you. Ramona's like, I like him. And then he goes and tells Bethany, I'm only here for you, actually. So there's this weird love square going on at this speed dating event that actually does even cause drama. that continues on, but it's mostly just entertaining. Ramona's on full game. Blake: It's funny only because Bethany is talking to a guy and Ramona really liked the guy and so Ramona in the middle of Bethany's speed round of talking to this guy comes over and is like, hey, you you got me a drink earlier so I thought I'd bring you a drink and it's clearly supposed to interrupt them because she sees they're having kind of a vibe and she really liked him but she's playing it off like it isn't and then Bethany's confessional is like... You brought me a drink, so I'm gonna bring you a drink. And I just, I, I... Bethany is like unmatched when it comes to confessionals. Bethany is unmatched when it comes to confessionals. I'm sorry. She's really good. but okay, so now we're going to Columbia. Now we're going to Columbia that... Casey: Hahaha Pretty good, yes. Tinsley is like, I've been a bunch of times. I want to take you girls to Cartagena. Let's get going. So they go. Tinsley has planned everything, arranged everything. They arrive at their lodgings, which is like not a hotel. It's like an actual house, ⁓ like a villa. Blake: It's a villa. It's a villa like it's like a yeah, it's it's there's multiple rooms. There's a swimming pool There's a kitchen, but it's like a big villa by the way amazing sounds amazing to me Ramona apparently like has like an injury to her ankle or something. So she's kind of like She's like a wheelchair the whole time Bethany is not really impressed The women so basically like they all you know get settled. They're all getting ready for dinner Ramona Casey: It's lovely, yeah. She said she's twisted her ankle. Blake: This is, this has happened, think like at least twice on Housewives. Ramona gets stuck in an elevator and she's like, hello, hello ladies, can you hear me? And it's funny because. Casey: Girls! Blake: And it's funny because it's like production is right there. They're filming her So it's like this weird like feigned like I'm trapped, but obviously, you know, there are people there But it's really funny because it's Ramona. So she's obviously gonna be like annoying about it Okay, then before they had to dinner Luan One of my favorite ever Luan moments. Let's play it back Casey: Filming her. you They were so gagged. All of them were like, wow! Blake: she she puts on this fucking sofia vergara wig like i hola chaquitas welcome to colombia ⁓ the same season Casey: Like, she's everything. People were posting that clip. People were posting that clip during the Super Bowl being like, like white women arriving to the halftime show. Blake: Lady Gaga during the Bad Bunny half time. Yeah, yep, yep. So they go to dinner and really nothing from this dinner is crazy except for the fact that you should know that the last time we left off with Carol and Bethany, like they hugged it out and everything seemed fine. But at this dinner, based on the speed dating situation, Like Carol's talking about how she went on a date with the red scarf guy, the guy that Ramona was really after and Bethany was really after, whatever. Bethany, like, for some reason feels like Carol's being really smug about it. And they're fine, but I think Bethany still, feels like Carol has this insidious motive deep down where she, like, doesn't like her because she's paranoid. So she basically says, like, you know, it's a consolation prize. Like, you're acting smug. You think you got something with this guy, but it's a consolation prize. And Carol's like, excuse me, Bethany, like, where is this coming from? But Bethany is like... Like she's on one. So, you know, half the table gets up and leaves Bethany stays with, you know, one group. They end up reconvening and then they literally continue to fight. They go to another bar. Everyone's like, wait, I didn't even know you guys were going to come here. Like you thought you guys were going home. You seemed upset. And then they end up fighting again. It's just a very tense trip and Casey: Yeah. Blake: I personally blame Bethany. I think that she is not comfortable in like this ⁓ uncertainty so she needs to like lash out personally is how I feel about it and Ramona the whole time is in a wheelchair mind you. Casey: I used to feel like it was very much Bethany's fault. This time around, think I see more of Bethany's side of it. So I think it's just like equally both of their faults. Ultimately, I do think that Bethany has, I mean, obviously we won't ever really know for sure. But to me, it felt like on this rewatch, Bethany does have a more genuine interest in staying friends, even if she is being toxic and shitty. I do believe that she wants to stay friends with her. And I don't think that Carol wants to stay friends with Bethany. and I think they could have saved a lot of time if Carol was just like, you are too much for me. I actually don't like you anymore. Like, and I just can't be your friend in that way. Like. Blake: I don't agree but we will talk about that at the end because I think we need all the facts. yeah, basically Bethany starts off the day with a mental breakdown. She starts off the day just kind of losing it. Like she's crying, the girls are ready to go shopping and she's just like breaking down which to be honest, if I had a quarter... Casey: Okay, well yeah, let's go to the next day in Colombia because everything kinda really takes off this day. Huge mental breakdown. Yeah. Blake: or a nickel, whatever the fuck. For every time Bethany Frankel has lost her shit and started crying, I probably have a dollar. Or two. Which is not a lot of money, but it's... Casey: ⁓ my god. The way that I thought you were saying court order when you just said quarter talking about her divorce, I thought you were saying like court order. Like if I had a court order. Blake: well, if i had a court order before she has a court order from her stalker ex-fucking-husband, but Casey: But she does have a court order. She does have a court order. Yeah, so she does have something big going on to be freaking out. And the Carol thing is really clearly freaking her out. Like she says, I think she says during this or at some point during the trip, she's like, this feels like losing a family member. Like I've never had anything like this happen. Like I'm really tweaking. And she like calls her like on and off again boyfriend at the time. Blake: Yeah. Yeah. Casey: And it's like, you gotta come and get me, you gotta come and get me, like I gotta go. And then like she talks to him and it's like, actually, it's fine. Like I'm gonna go sit back down. Like it's okay. Blake: Right, she's like, I'm good, I'm gonna just like, you know, buck up because you're on a fucking cast strip, The day they're shopping, whatever, it's awkward, like, you know, there's like the factions, like Sonja and Luanne and Bethany versus everyone else and they're chit chatting. But then, then we go to this famous iconic dinner. where this is where Casey and I are gonna probably have to have, we're gonna have to come to blows. But ⁓ this is the dinner where they sit down, it is Luanna Derinda, Tinsley Ramona Sonia, and then it's Carol and Bethany. And so we have literally three conversations happening at once. This is the same time where... Casey: So, over to Blake: Luanne says, hey, how are the margaritas? And you know, get that famous scene of Dorinda sipping her margarita. And she goes, what? And Luanne goes, she's starting. Let me play it. Darlene, what's that mean, Darlene? Darlene! Darlene! But I will say, like, it was so unnecessary for Luan to say she's turning, because she wasn't doing anything. Casey: Darlene! Darlene Mitchell of RuPaul's Drag Race! What's that mean, Darlene? ⁓ i so disagree, i think you can tell by darinda's eyes already that she is starting, and she is turning. Blake: No, but why would you say that when she wasn't saying she wasn't doing anything to be rude? Like how's the margarita? She says she goes she said what like what do you what did you say? And then Luanne's like, ⁓ she's turning. No, she's not. She's enjoying her goddamn margarita. What I will say is that she was obviously drunk, but why would you assume she's just gonna be like fuck you bitch for asking how the margaritas are? Casey: But she's going to, like you know she's going to. I don't agree. Why would you assume that? Because that's what she does every single time she gets drunk. Blake: If you give her a reason, if you give her a reason. Casey: no, that's not true, it is off of no reasons all the time, that dinner with the people, with Bethany's people Blake: Okay, but if you look at the clip that we just played, not to do the Dorinda hands, but if you look at the clip that we just played, she's sipping it, she goes, what? And then Dorinda, then Luan goes, ⁓ she's starting, she literally wasn't. I'm sorry, I'm sorry, she wasn't. Casey: She was, you can see it in her eyes that she is starting and even if that wasn't the case, Luanne saying four words total, it's turn in and she's starting should not have been enough for the reaction that we get from Dorinda next. Blake: I agree with that. I agree with that. She says, you know, you're a countess, countess no more or something. And then Dorinda drops a glass and then Luan says like, you need to like watch your drinking or something like that. And then Dorinda says, I didn't get a mugshot over it. And it gets really dark. I'm not defending Dorinda on that, but I think that Luan got her start in. I don't think she would have done that if Luan didn't kind of provoke her. Casey: I mean, isn't that a little bit blame the victim mentality a little bit? Blake: ⁓ please no because Luanne gets this she does this thing no No, Luanne does this thing Luanne does this thing. She's sober so she thinks she has on this high horse She can judge people she does it next season where she's Tinsley's like I'm just stuck up and then she goes ⁓ What and then that's when Bethany freaks out because she just she judges these people for drinking because she can't drink So she feels like she's on this high horse. I feel like it's similar Casey: It is! You can't blame someone for making someone act like that. You can't. You can't. Well, two points. One, yes, she does get on her high horse sort of about drinking when she's sober. And yes, she is newly sober. But I think because of the fact that nobody has taken into account that she is newly sober and they're not even at no point have they tried to not drink around her. I think she has the right to be like, you guys are a lot because they have never even once tried to adapt for her. Why should she adapt for them? And like the Dorinda of it all, like She has a reason to think Dorinda's gonna act like that. And I do think regardless, Dorinda's actions are her own fault. Like you can't say that this is because of what Luanne said. It's because of Dorinda having a drinking problem. Blake: No, I mean fair, Dorinda does get mean for no reason. I'm not saying that her comments were a fair game. I just, think initially, like if Luanne was like, how are the margaritas? And Dorinda said what? And she said, ⁓ how are the margaritas? Dorinda would have been like, ⁓ it's good. You know, I really don't think, but anyway, it doesn't matter because they have that fight. That's fair, that's fair. Casey: Yeah, I don't know, man. I don't agree. But they go, there's a break in the argument because Dorinda and Carole get up to go smoke six together and like you'd think that maybe they'd come back. Blake: Yeah, but Carol and Bethany are rehashing the same thing they've rehashed already about like, you know, I don't think they're not listening to each other. Carol's talking about what she was doing over the summer. Bethany's talking about like, I feel like Bethany has like this very myopic idea of what she said to Carol, text message Lee and Carol received that and said something. And I feel like nobody is really like saying the actual full truth. So we're not really getting the full truth. ⁓ But it's not. going anywhere. Like again, they are talking to each other and I feel like it comes down to like they are making the smallest things the issue rather than talking about the overall issue of why they're not friends anymore. Carol gets up and she smokes a cigarette with Dorinda. Casey: Right. and they come back and like that's kind of like they like they get a second wind for both of their fights like you think maybe they come back a little more calm and like things would no no no like it just there's a there's a mid there's an intermission and then we pick both fights right back up so and honestly like even watching this for how many times have i seen this episode so many and still i'm like Blake: Ha ha ha! Casey: I was texting Blake, I'm like overstimulated, I'm low key getting a headache. There's a lot going on right now. Everyone is talking so fast, everyone's saying horrible things. My poor little sensitive brain is getting involved in it. Blake: You literally have like three segments like Sonya, Ramona and Tinsley are living their lives. They're having a goddamn key. And then you have, you know, Luan saying like, yeah, like I'll never speak to her again or Dorinda saying I'll never speak to Luan again. And you have Bethany and Carol who are just like really trying to hash out the details of who texted who what and who was saying what and like it doesn't make any sense because obviously like there are the text messages. So like what was said, but we're not getting. So it ends with nothing, nothing good. They go back to the villa and this is where- Casey: Yeah, Luan left first, like she left ahead of the group, like she stormed off because of Dorinda and her's fight. So Luan was gone first and then the rest of the group goes home together, I believe. like, Dorinda's still very mad, Luan's very upset, she's in her room. We end up kind of getting a like, Carole is talking with Dorinda and Bethany is talking with Luan and they're kind of like juxtaposing both conversations, cause those were like... our main fights of the night. But Dorinda is clearly hammered. She's talking. Carole went for a random nighttime swim when they got home, so Carole's soaking wet. Blake: I love it. I would have done it too. If I'm drunk, if I'm drunk after dinner and we're in a foreign country and my villa has a pool, I'm getting in the pool. Casey: Yes, if you're Carol drunk, but then Carol goes to Dorinda, you should go in there. Dorinda's gonna drown in there. Like, Dorinda is not alive. Like, how can you tell Dorinda to get in that pool? Like, that's not a good idea. Blake: Hahaha she has a joker lipstick schmear all over her face she's sitting there and this is when i think we actually have the video i'm gonna play the freaking video here we go Casey: Yeah, we do. I would never shame you. After just shaming Luan. ⁓ minutes after shaming Luan so viciously, I would never shame you. Like, I would never do that. Blake: She was blitzed. Yeah, I don't care if you're the biggest heroin addict prostitute in the street. would never shame you. Meanwhile, she shames Luanne for getting a mugshot because the cop showed up to like this room that she was in doing nothing wrong. It's... Casey: But if you're a heroin ornate, she won't shame you. Luanne. Fuck off. She should have been a heroin ornate and then Dorinda would have never shamed her. She would have brought her into her house and said, what the fuck is going on? And honestly, if we're following... Good. Blake: but she- Luan should have been a heroin addict. She would have invited her into our house. And I love how Carol- Carol's just sitting there like- Like she's... Casey: But also, Carol does the same thing, because we do have to be fair. Carol does the same thing that Bethany is doing in this war they're having, is she's building up allies all the time, too. Because Carol, talking to Dorinda, who has clearly made a huge mistake tonight, who is clearly drunk, Carol's like, you're such a good friend. You're such a good friend. You are the best friend. It's like. Blake: That's true. It's true, it's true. Casey: Wait, girlie, like, I know you, I know you know what's going on here. Like, same thing with Bethany and Sonya at times. Like, maybe Sonya doesn't know what's going on. Bethany knows what's going on, you know? So it's like they're they're doing the same thing all the time. Like, it's almost like we move on to like the second layer of the proxy war in the second half because it was Beth, Sonya, Carol Tinsley. And now we're picking up Dorinda. We're picking up Luan. We're building. We're building the sides. And I think. getting ahead of myself. But I think Team Bethany would have fared a little bit better at the reunion if Luanne had been there, but she's not. So they're down an Alliance member. So it's tough for them. Yeah. Blake: for sure for sure and we'll get there we'll get there we'll get there later ⁓ but yeah no it's true carol definitely is ⁓ allowing certain things to fly and other things to not fly the next day we get to we get to breakfast ⁓ darinda darinda has like this really interesting kind of anxiety where she actually just doubles down on what she did the night before Casey: Yeah, they both are on both sides. She comes in just as hot as, like, she almost is like, where you're still drinking? Blake: Instead of being like, Luan, can I? Like she wakes up drunk, honestly, because when I wake up drunk and I'm like... You know, and obviously I've never even said half these things to my friends, but when I wake up and I've had a great night with my friends, nothing went wrong, I'm still like, did I bother them? Like, am I a horrible person? And like, if I were going to breakfast with them, I would be like, even if I said like, you know, oh, maybe I said this thing that like came across a little bit mean, I'd pull them aside and be like, are we good? Like, I love you. Like, but no, Dorinda shows up and she's like, she just rehashed, she starts going in again. She's like, she's like, no, don't you dare tell, don't you dare tell me how to be, don't you dare. Casey: Right. Right. Blake: make fun of me for drinking. You're the one who went to rehab. She just starts immediately, like cannot understand the fact that she's hurt Luanne. I will give you that. She is bad at recognizing that she's wrong. Casey: And it's frustrating, because even the night before, she's so contradictory. The night before, she says to Carole, I'm feeling really bad. I shouldn't have said that stuff. And then five seconds later, she's like, I'm not sorry at all. Luanna owes me an apology. And the next morning, she's like, same. It's like there's no break in her personality from the night before. Besides, she seems a little more composed than heroin-ordic. But it literally is the same. We pick right up where we left off, both with them. And then it's almost like Bethany and Carole. Blake: Yup. Yeah. You Yeah. And then Bethany and Carol will. Casey: If they're going at it again, we might as well pick our thing back up. So it's like, ⁓ Blake: And Bethany says, well, Carol says to Bethany, I, you know, I just don't have like 24 seven to deal with you. And I think that really sheds some light on the fact that Bethany, think, okay, this is my read of like their situation. And I will get into it more later, obviously, like at the reunion, but I, what I'm gathering, what you do tend to gather, like when you see how they're fighting is just basically like, Carol, was I think trying to set some boundaries. Carol has I think a lot of friends and Bethany like I think was expecting to take an outsized role in her life. And I think Bethany is very closed off and Bethany really only has like... two, three close friends. So when she is close friends with you, she's really clingy. And I think Carol is basically saying here, like, I just can't be that person that you lean on constantly, that you're firing off 30 texts, that you're the one who you me every single time there is an issue. I think she was basically saying like, uh... You know, I was trying to maybe like establish a little bit more of a healthy dynamic, one that made more sense for me. And Bethany took that as like, you don't care about me anymore. That's how I took it because that's what it sounds like they're saying to each other. Casey: Right. Bethany has like an anxious attachment style. Like she can feel that something's slipping away from her. And so she starts like bombing Carol with text being like, are we good? Are we good? I miss you. I love you. Like what's going on? Like, ⁓ which they get into again, it's like always like, they get into that later, which they do at the reunion. Like Carol shows how many texts she was getting from her. So I think, I actually think this was probably one of Carol's better moments of honesty, which is just like, yeah, this friendship is a little too much for me. Like I'm, that's just, that's just the reality of it. Like, and that's Blake: Yeah. Casey: and Bethany is like hurt by this, think fair enough, but at least that's real. And that's like that is an issue. Like that's something that's going on here. I think that there I do ultimately fundamentally think like the main issue is that Carol, they outgrew each other and Carol isn't into being Bethany's friend in the way that Bethany wants her to be her friend and that. Blake: Right. but i also think bethany is not able to adjust to like where carol's at in her life like it's definitely a two-way street Casey: For sure. No, I agree. can't meet in the middle when they used to sort of be seemed that they were, but they can't meet in the middle. Neither one of them is willing to adjust to the other's friendship standards. So the arguing is ultimately pointless. If they were more mature people, it would probably be like, hey, I think we've come to this point and we're not meshing, we have different ideas of friendship. Let's just go our separate ways. We can be cordial, whatever. Blake: Right. No. Casey: but they obviously don't do that because there is like love and friendship there. So the arguing to me does suggest that they both still care in some way. Because if you didn't, you could just be like, I'm done. Blake: Right. They do. I just think that neither of them have been able to actually ⁓ vocalize what actually is the issue. So that's why it becomes this thing where it's really frustrating because they are fighting about the way someone's saying something and how strongly they're saying something and it's not about the actual issue. So the viewer is the one who has to come up with what they think is the actual problem. No. Casey: Yeah. They never say, like, a real problem. It's just, like, stupid fighting. Blake: Then we go on the boat. Then we go on the boat. ⁓ They go to the island, they have fun. Dorinda cries about how she feels about Luanne, which like, you know, she said that twice, but she's still being mean to Luanne. I don't really understand why you wouldn't just... Casey: right and they make a little bit of progress though they do like luanne is like it's okay durinda like i i understand bethany comforts durinda like they have like a little bit of like a okay like let's just let it go but they're still like simmering anger on both sides like both of them are clearly not Blake: Yeah, yeah, it's sort of just like let's let's just like do this later. Like let's figure this out later It's not necessarily like the you know full on makeup then they go on the boat This is the famous like everyone thinks they're gonna die And we have that video Okay, first of all, I didn't even know you could do like minute long clips like that because that was probably the longest one we've had but Casey: I know, but I didn't know where to cut it. It's like really good footage. Blake: No, it's good. And I also like their being dramatic, I think. Like, if Tinsley's not freaking out, why are you guys freaking out? You know, you guys think Tinsley's this like little delicate little flower. Why are you freaking out? Like... Casey: I think so too. Well, they say later that like something was wrong with the boat actually internally and the captain had to fix it. But ultimately in the background, the waves don't look that big. When it zooms out on the boat, it doesn't look like they're in the Bermuda Triangle. It looks like they're just on a little bit of a choppy sea to me. Not to gaslight their boat experience, but it doesn't look that bad. Blake: They're not capsizing. Like... Right. So that's funny. They come back and this is their last breakfast in the villa and... The main thing for the listener to know about this is that everyone's shitting themselves. This is probably the first, I think, on camera Ramona shit smear we get. Like it's, and we don't have a video because we wouldn't do that to you guys, but like the camera does pan to the floor and it's like, you know, visible human feces and someone's like, Ramona, was that you? And then they're talking about how it's just coming out and they're like, who doesn't have diarrhea? And it's just like, it's, it's really fucking Casey: It does, yes. Blake: Gross. It's really disgusting. Casey: and that's how we leave cartagena is everyone besides like i think bethany and tinsley because they are like pickier eaters they are not shitting themselves but everybody else is ⁓ we go home Blake: Yeah, and then we move on to the we go home and then we move on to the women are pre-gaming Loann's Cabaret and they're pre-gaming Dorinda specifically Dorinda and Carol are pre-gaming Loann's Cabaret ⁓ at Tinsley's hotel apartment whatever and the main situation here is that because of course we can't come back and just be all good. Casey: Mm-hmm. Blake: We do have to, there has to be another wrench in the program and here the issue is that apparently Luanne invited Scott, Tinsley's boyfriend who doesn't even live in New York, to her cabaret but does not invite John, Dorinda's boyfriend of five years who nobody likes but we all have to deal with, you know what I mean? Dorinda's pissed off because Luanne was kind of like making a thing about not inviting John and Tinsley doesn't want to tell Dorinda that ⁓ shit he wasn't invited because she explicitly invited Scott so Dorinda's mad Dorinda's mad Casey: And Carole's messy ass is like, Tinsley, tell Durenda right now. Like she needs to know right now. And honestly, again, as a longtime Carole defender, this season she annoyed me more than she ever has because it's like, own that you're being messy and own that you get into the same crap that everybody else does. Like you are playing the same game that the other women play right Blake: Okay, but here's my thing. True, but here's my thing. She says, you know, my motto now is like everyone should know everything. Do you think- do you disagree with that? Casey: But that's not true. Do I disagree with that that's her motto or do I disagree with the motto in general? Blake: Both! I mean, do you think she's being honest about it, but then also, like, do you not think everyone should just know what everyone's saying? Casey: Ooh, that's difficult. Because in theory, yes, I think honesty is usually the best policy. It's just better to get things out there. knowing, I think there's timing and there's common sense. Knowing what you know. Dorinda's already mad, you know this. Dorinda's already drunk, you know this. Blake: That's true. and drunk. Hehehehehe Casey: you know, like, you know what you're doing. Like, and that that could have waited until after that could have like it. Honestly, I think it's obviously like it's a judgment call. So it's a gray area because everyone has different like lines that they think are appropriate. But to me, I don't think that's enough of ⁓ a like thing that I would feel like I need to tell my friend that immediately. It's not like she like did something horrible. Blake: I think especially because she tells her, Tinsley ends up telling Dorinda like hey Scott, because Carol's kind of like goading her into doing so and it's at the show. At Luann's, I will say it, in the crowd at Luann's like first Casey: in the crowd like moments before we're starting. Blake: cabaret show like she's sober and she's trying to like like turn a new leaf and She tells Dorinda who is drunk and crazy In the crowd, so it's like maybe not do it then maybe do it sometime else but she does do that and This is kind of fun This is what we get from it And I have to say That's I was gonna say like Tinsley doesn't realize that Dorinda's heckling her so she's like yes, like let's cheer for her Giovanni, GIOVANNI But then it's like you're part of the heckling girl Casey: It's something about Tinsley doing it. which is so- and she even says like, tinsley? sounds like- tinsley's saying like, geovani, like tinsley's not even like saying the right name no, she literally has no idea like, ⁓ my god but obviously like- and she does this like, this continues throughout like, more of her singing like, she continues to yell at her and she says Blake: no, Giovanni, she doesn't even know what's going on she just wants to be part of it ⁓ Yeah, and Luan's cabaret show is actually like pretty legit. honestly, it seemed like really star studded and like really fun and Dorinda looked... Yeah. Yeah. Casey: It's fun! I know Rachel Dratch is there. That's a big pull. Bridget Everett. Like those are really funny people. And there were more than that too that weren't even like on the footage that we get to see. But the Giovanni of it all to bring us back to Dorinda's gift giving. This is one of those moments. It's one of those moments where Dorinda was all smiles to bring Luanne to the Giovanni showroom. This looks amazing on you, Luanne. These are going to be perfect for your show. Gets to the show. Blake: Yeah. I'm You Casey: Giovanni, like it's a trap. It's literally a trap. And she says, like either in a confessional or maybe like to Bethany or one of the women, she goes, I paid for all those. Why did you, is that true? Like, why did you do that? Blake: done. Giovanni, thank you! It's a trap. I don't remember hearing that, but if she did, it's like, is that even like, is that even like, like, feel like that's a misrepresentation because it's not like, Oh, I have a connection. It's more of like a, will just give you money kind of situation. Casey: Well, and that's what I mean, like what's going on? There's this quote that I always think of, I think it was actually from Orange is the New Black, and it's like, if someone holds the door for you, and people don't really agree, but like, if you're gonna hold the door for someone, you have to accept the fact that they might not say thank you. Like, you have to do that for your own reasoning, like you can't do it for the thank you and the reciprocal action, like. Obviously it's nice, like everyone would rather have a thank you for something. But like if you're gonna pay for dresses, if you're gonna help her with the dresses, you can't hold these things over people's heads. Like you have to do it for generosity's sake. Blake: No, I agree, but I do also think that like you are doing it because you do want that person to like feel thankful for the fact that you did it. But you, but if you say thank you, if you say thank you, you cannot, it can't be something you are like, I'm, I'm able to bring this up whenever I want to like just to hold it over your head. Yeah. Yeah. Casey: Yeah, well for sure again, we all want that but if you're gonna like really hold it to a stake Whenever I get mad at you, exactly, exactly. And that's what I think happens with this stuff. It's like, I get it. I probably would want a bigger reaction too, just in my own heart. But you can't be mad about that. You can be annoyed and keep it internal, but it can't become an actual, I'm pissed at you. Because then it's like, oh, you should have just never given me that. And then we wouldn't have had an issue. Blake: No. No. Right. ⁓ so we go to the after party of Luanne's cabaret and I think like the one of the most iconic ever housewives moments happens here. ⁓ so Carol and Bethany shockingly are speaking. They're like trying to catch up and be like, how's it going? Like, you know, I feel bad about how things went, whatever Ramona comes over and, ⁓ she starts going in on Bethany about not showing up to her skin care, launch, whatever. And Bethany basically is just like, okay, noted, I understand you're upset, thank you. And she won't give her an interaction. then Bethany, remote assistant. Casey: And Bethany, like, is unfazed, like... Blake: I'm so sorry the way that Ramona is walking away from the camera like almost into the camera. She's like wow. She's like shaking her head. Wow. Wow Bethany. Wow. Casey: It's like, and it's so funny to me that Ramona chose this moment to do that because it's like, can you not see that we have bigger fights going on here? Like, Dorinda and Luan are about to start stabbing each other with knives out in the lobby and Carol and Bethany have been fighting all season long. Like, you really think your beef now is going to come in and like take precedence on the final episode? Like, no! Blake: You Bethany says like she's okay they get into this reunion okay I'll hit it later at the reunion because Casey: Wait, wait, wait, I have one more thing to say about the party. I kind of forgot what it was gonna be now. Blake: Well no, so then Dorinda is supposed to leave, but she ends up staying and that's when Luan comes out and they end up fighting. ⁓ And I mean nothing is really said that is like different than like, you know, them just expressing what their point of view is, but it is funny that Dorinda was like, I'm gonna go so I don't cause a scene and then ended up staying so she could cause a scene. Casey: No. Well, and she's like, she's talking in her like drunk Dorinda voice and she keeps repeating and she repeats it to the point that it like gets sinister because of her tone and the amount of times she said it, she goes, was an amazing show, darling. It was amazing. I'm so proud of you. And she's like staring at her like she wants to literally take her head off. So it's like threatening. It's like, ⁓ okay. Like, thanks. And Bethany. Blake: Yeah. You Casey: is kind of, you know, again, taking up for Luanne because it's convenient as they all are taking up for people right now because it's convenient. But she says, maybe, guys, which this group is not, they're not natural empaths and they're not natural deductive reasoners. Like we jump to conclusions very quickly. So Bethany is like, hey, everyone, like, and I'll give her a little bit for some level of like, maybe let's try to bring this down to earth. And she's like, What if Luanne texted Tinsley to invite Scott after Dorinda yelled at her about John because she realized, like, people are gonna get mad at me if I didn't tell them to invite their boyfriend? Huh, what a reasonable suggestion. That makes a ton of sense. Blake: Which honestly makes a lot of sense. Casey: Again, everyone at the first place was like, why would Luanne invite Scott? Why would Luanne invite Scott? Probably because Dorinda just bitched her out for not inviting John. And whether convenient or not, Luanne says, that is why I texted Scott. And obviously at this point, the group is so divided that it's just gonna be contentious on like, that she's just covering. Like she didn't really mean that. Like she, you know, that's what Dorinda says and Carol say. Blake: Right. Right. You are such a Luan. You are such a Luan, apologies. Like, you really are. Not that I disagree, but I have to say that if you invited me to Casey's Cabaret, knowing that I have a boyfriend, and you weren't like, ⁓ by the way, like, bring Charlie, like, you know, it's gonna be so fun. I wouldn't react the way that she did. Casey: But like, that is probably the most logical line of reasoning here. It just is. Blake: But I would definitely be like, is it a thing where I can bring a plus one? you know, I would probably, here's the thing, I would have asked you before. Casey: Sorry, real quick, I'm just writing down for my future cabaret notes. Invite Charlie to cabaret. Don't forget. Don't forget, gonna cause issue. Please send invite. Blake: invite charlie ⁓ so we don't have this situation Okay, let's move on into the reunion where we do have to unfortunately announce that Luan fell off the wagon Casey: Oh my god, you make it sound like she's dead. But yeah. Blake: Well, she fell off the wagon, she's in rehab, she couldn't be there. To your point, think that Bethany and Sonja would have done better having Luan there, but Bethany is pretty good at defending herself. Casey: Yeah, she's not there. Bethany does a good job. Sanya's not the strongest ally, so then they just kind of, I think just numbers game. It's 4v2. Is that right? Yeah. Carol, Dorinda, Tinsley, Ramona, because Ramona joins them at the reunion full-time. So it's 4v2, and that's tough. Andy kind of joins team Bethany like a half point, so I'd say it's 4v2 and a half. Blake: Yeah. Yeah. And it's pretty much, Andy? It's, mean, yeah. And it's basically all the women, well, cause at this point, Bethany has really pissed off all the women. know, like in different ways, Bethany has made everyone feel like they have an issue with Bethany. So it is a Bethany take down, but it's also like, can, you know why everyone is mad at Bethany cause she's, she's kind of stuck up. Like she's, she's Casey: Yeah, and she's snarky and condescending, especially in her confessionals, which causes a lot of tension at the reunion of like Carol saying like, I was going to be OK with you, but I didn't know everything you were saying off camera. Like, and I think that's fair. Like, that's naturally going to happen to these women. Like, they don't know every little thing that's being said. And, you know, this. Blake: Right. Fair. Fair. Also, I think an important thing to point out is like, so at the very end when Ramona confronts Bethany and she's like, I'm talking to Kara or whatever, she's upset because she's like, you you say you're about women empowerment. You didn't come to my event. You didn't even like send sort of any sort of like acknowledgement that it was happening. And Bethany says it's because none of your products ever last. And I thought that there was a really funny moment at the reunion. where everyone is like, well, what about your baloney? What about your chocolate? Like, what about your this? What about your that? And it's like, it's funny because like, yes, listener, Bethany did have like a Skinny Girl Lunchable. She did have Skinny Girl chocolates. Like she did have all these, like a lot of things that just never ended up on shelves and I'm not even saying that to build up any of the other women as legit business women, but I just, I do think it was funny that they all had like a list of like things they were ready to go. Like, what about your baloney, Bethany? Casey: ⁓ my God. Well, and I know it's like I am like low key on the team Bethany side, but I think that there are tons of things to go after Bethany for. I think that this takedown focuses on some of the wrong things. I think they could have had a stronger platform if they had focused less on some of the things that they do because like for one, Blake: I know you are. Casey: They're all going a little too hard for each other. I find that reunion defenses work better when you are a little bit more like, and we'll give you this, like, and I will give this, I will own up to this. Like, team Carol is very harsh on Bethany. Like, they are not giving her an inch during this reunion. Like, there is no, like, ⁓ yeah, you don't think? Blake: That's not true. They definitely said, they definitely said at one point they were like, you know, Bethany actually is really good at diagnosing like what's going on with somebody and people do feel they want to ⁓ open up to her and that she's there for them when they need it. Like I do think that they definitely not Carol individually, but I do think that the women overall acknowledge that like there are moments where they find themselves aligned with her and there are moments where they Casey: Yeah, they do say that. Blake: Recognize that she could be a good friend I think that it's the issues that they have with her are based on this season and I do think that she intentionally Made herself because she was so paranoid about the Carol thing that she just started choosing the wrong side of every issue Because I think she was sort of self-flagellating like I think she was sort of just like I'm gonna be the like, you know, I'm different you guys hate me whatever and she kind of just leaned into it and I think she ended up just isolating everybody. I think that she played a part in that. Cause I know that like, Dorinda doesn't actually have this like real issue with Bethany. I think it was just Bethany was kind of being, I think Bethany, you know, your team Bethany, but Bethany also has a huge ego. You know what I mean? Casey: Yeah. I agree. For sure. I'll alter my statement. So I guess what I think what I really mean is I think team Carol side is weakened for me because not specifically in regard to Bethany, but just in general, they're very rigid on on some of their points that I think are that like exposed that like they're just agreeing with each other instead of like being real. Like there's a moment where they're talking about the Luanne Dorinda of it all, which isn't even Bethany related, but it is because everything is so like group. like sides, so it kind of is, but they're talking about the Luan and the Dorinda fight of it all. And Dorinda is completely denying that she was drunk during that fight. She is like, I was not drunk, no. Andy even goes with kind of like a, Dorinda, you're saying you were sober when you said all those things to your friend. And she goes, yep, yep, I was, yes. Blake: That is probably the most ⁓ fascinating part of Roni, think. Well, not the most, obviously, but one of the biggest parts is Dorinda literally gets away with... She escapes every conversation about drinking problems and sobriety and whatever ⁓ because she just says no. And people are like, it is mind-blowing because we've had Leah... Casey: And this is mind-blowing. Like, anyone with two sets of eyes knows she's drunk. Blake: We've had Luanne, we've had Sonia, we've had like, you know, there's a lot of conversation about people with drinking problems on the show. And there really is never a serious converse. I guess maybe that's why Dorinda was put on pause, but I think that was all just because she was too mean. But we never have a real like, I think Andy to try at this reunion. He definitely like there was there was a good there was a good 10 minutes. Yeah, because she doesn't let up and she does say things. Casey: Yeah. Sure. And Bethany tries a little bit too, but then they backtrack by the end. Right, and even when she says this, like, I wasn't drunk at all during that whole night or whatever, Carol's like, I agree, wasn't drunk at all. She had one drink. Tinsley's like, she had one drink. Like they are like on lockdown and Bethany even goes, she goes, Ramona, that night you tried to cut Dorinda off and they play the clip of Dorinda going to the waiter. She doesn't need another drink. Don't give her another drink, absolutely not. And Dorinda's like, whoa, Ramona. She even like, she gives Ramona a couple jabs. Blake: Yeah. Yeah. Well, also you remember like two seasons, one season ago when there was that whole moment where was like, know, Sonia goes like, everybody knows you do drugs, Tarinta. Casey: ⁓ my God, yeah, I forgot about that. And everyone's like, yeah, Jordan's like, no, no. Blake: I think it's funny because she's very functional and she's also very staunch in her opinions. people just let off of it. But, know, obviously, when she said I wasn't drinking, when she said I wasn't drunk when I said those things to Luanne, she was like, I was having one margarita. I got mad at Luanne for saying you're starting. Casey: Great. Right. But this is insane. Like objectively, this is like, to me, this is where I get frustrated with them. Blake: I will absolutely, as I said before, I don't think that Luann needed to say that, but she was drunk. She did get up and she was slurring and she was like, you're a countess and I didn't get a mug shot. She was not sober saying all that shit. that's where I'm like, I guess there's only- Casey: Right. I agree. And I think if you're Luanne, you're not gonna be, you're not gonna want to apologize for your side of it until there's an acknowledgement of... like I was drunk and like I went too far. And then when you're the one who's like committed the lesser infraction, then once you have an apology, you're like, you know what? I wasn't perfect either. Like I did kind of add to it and start the catalyst, which like, you know, who knows if we never get that. Like, so who can say if we would have gotten to that. But I think if that was two reasonable people, that's probably how that would have gone. And that's like how you would have found resolution of like, yes, like, okay, yeah, we both have something to apologize for. They might not be equal, but we both do have something to say. Blake: Yeah. Casey: that we're sorry for, period. Blake: Okay, so we have to talk about, obviously there's the Carol and Bethany of the reunion. ⁓ Essentially, it all boils down to, they're getting into the weeds of it, they're getting into the text. I don't think it's necessary for us to talk about who said what because it honestly was maddening. I wanted to take an Advil. There is a moment though where Carol says, well, because they're talking about who really bashed each other on the show and Casey: Yeah. It is. Blake: They're like, you know Carol says Bethany you bashed me constantly about things like you bashed me and they do this like really maddening back and forth and then ⁓ know Andy says ⁓ You know you both bass bash each other on the show and then that's when Carol says the iconic line like ⁓ You're so full of shit Andy. You're scared of her too. ⁓ but my question for you is because I don't really want to like get really into it because it's really a lot but Casey: Yeah, it is a lot. Blake: Who do you think it was an equal bashing? Casey: Yeah, I do. Blake: I don't. I actually think that to me, Bethany was the one who was making like real jabs at Carol and I think Carol was just responding and observing what was in front of her. I don't think Carol ever really said anything that was like extremely mean. I think she was more just like... Bethany's like acting really narcissistic or like Bethany has to be in control of things or like Bethany won't let go of this like those kind of things but then Bethany was like you have no career and you need to act your age when she said you know I know you want to be 40 but like you're acting yeah like she's age shaming her I feel like she just went so low um so I don't think it was an equal bashing and I get why Carol was upset at that and told Andy to fuck off Casey: Right. 45, yeah. Yeah, I think if you want to like think of bashing in terms of like the severity of insults in terms of like the the level of digs, I think yes, Bethany, Bethany hits lower than Carol does in this season. think Carol tends, but I also think, okay, how about this? These are two very smart women objectively. I think both of these women are very intelligent. Two of the more intelligent women on Real Housewives to have verbal sparring ability, especially when you actually have a deep friendship, that's an intense war of words. ⁓ But I think Daphne is dumber here. Blake: for sure. Casey: I think Carol is playing smarter than Bethany. Maybe Carol just is smarter than Bethany, who knows? But I think Carol delivers her jabs to Bethany in more subtle ways, whether subconscious or fully conscious, like maybe she's not that like diabolical. like, Carol is playing the same. They're playing the same game the entire season. They're playing the war between the girls. They're playing the let me build my alliance, let me back this horse because it will it will negatively affect her in this way or whatever. Blake: Yeah, for sure. Casey: So I find it difficult to diagnose like either one of them as more of the problem because they're both very much in it and just because I think Carol is a little bit smarter in how she's playing it and maybe just more compassionate maybe more empathetic I think she's definitely more level-headed in moments of conflict and panic and anxiety like Bethany is a high-strung person she has a lot of anxiety so I think that level affects her where she can't play this Blake: for sure. Casey: as well or as smart as she probably should have. So Carol fights better for sure. Blake: I also think Carol didn't initiate it and to be honest I don't think Carol initially saw a problem. So I think all of this is kind of coming to her and like I said we started this episode talking about how they hugged, made up and Bethany brought it back up and Bethany started making jabs again. I do think that ⁓ Carol just is tired of something that she thinks should have been put to bed that like just Casey: Yeah, I think that's true. Blake: refuses to be put to bed. ⁓ But I think that we need to end this on one question, which I think I know your answer. ⁓ Who whose team are you on ending this season when it comes to Carolyn Bethany? Casey: You know, it's like I do truly feel like maybe neither now, like this time liking Bethany more has probably neutralized me because every other time I've watched, I've always been more Carol. So if you add up all the years, I probably end up like just neutral. But yeah, I think I'll go with Bethany and maybe it's like a personal thing because I probably also have an anxious attachment style and like I have also had friendships and or I have freaked the fuck out. has it been an appropriate reaction? Maybe, maybe. just not like you do have to honor people's space when they ask for it and that's hard if you're someone who is really anxious and like wants that connection back wants someone to say it's okay we're the same as we were like that's what I think Bethany is craving here Carol's not giving it to her and I think that's really the meat and potatoes which we've said way too many times in one episode but Blake: Yeah. Hahaha Casey: It's in my head now is that I think they are not compatible friends. It worked for a minute. It's not working now Bethany whether healthily or justifiably Probably not. Does want this friendship. Is she proceeding in the right way to keep it? Probably not. Definitely not. But I do think like the anxious little insecure girl inside of Bethany is freaking the fuck out because she doesn't have a lot of friends like you said. She doesn't care about people like this. So to have it slip away from her is such a loss of control. Which Carol clocks. She said she needs to feel in control of all of her relationships and I think that's true. And like I have worked on the same kind of thing. So I think I'm just relating to Blake: Yeah. Casey: to Shayla Bethany for the first time in my life because otherwise she annoys me. But watching this season on like a one-off, like I think I saw it in a different light than I normally would have. Blake: Shayla Bethany. I I have definitely flip-flopped, but I do disagree. do think that Carol, I think was blindsided by this. think Carol, as she said, she was trying to establish some boundaries because she can't be the one who is like Bethany's go-to constantly. And I think Bethany interpreted that as her pulling back. I don't think either of them were communicating well. I definitely think they're both at fault. But if you're telling me who I think... Like created the ending of their friendship. It's Bethany because I think Overall at the end of the season they both said I think we're gonna find our sweet spot Carol watched it back and saw that Bethany was really nasty to her and I think that that was where she was like no, this is deeper than what I thought it was ⁓ And I think you could really make the argument for both but it's just to conclude Casey: Okay, I think that's fair. Blake: really just earth-shattering ⁓ housewives relationships we've seen crumble ⁓ and really just maddening because ⁓ if you watch the season as we've just explained to listening they weren't ⁓ hearing other they weren't listening to each other it didn't make any fucking sense you to piece it together Casey: It's okay. No. Blake: based on your intuition. So, you know, that's... Casey: We've said multiple times in one episode like I think the heart of it is and we keep changing it the heart of it is not clear like it's it's really not it's like not clear like Blake: It's not clear. It's not clear, what is clear is that this cast is just phenomenal. So we're going to end it there. ⁓ Please like, subscribe, leave a comment. You know, we have Instagram, we have TikTok. Check the, you know, show description, whatever the fuck it's called. You can see all our ads are, we post like a show guide, like a viewing guide with the clips that we play. We will be posting for next week, ⁓ the next, you know, Casey: Yeah. Blake: our schedule for the next two episodes basically like what seasons we're gonna watch, what episodes we're gonna watch and just just keep on mentioning it all. How about that? Casey: Mention it all again and again and again. I know this was a bit of a super-sized episode, but we'll see ya next week. Diving on over to our sweet Georgia peaches in Atlanta. So we will see y'all then next Monday. Blake: Bye!