Latest / The You Project / #1612 Olympic Review (Kind Of) - David Gillespie

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#1612 Olympic Review (Kind Of) - David Gillespie · The You Project

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: I got a welcome to another installment in the show.
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: Of course, it is the Project Tiffany, and Cook is
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: not here. She's in the hammock, she's in the jacuzzi,
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: she's anywhere but the virtual studio.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: But I tell you who has rocked up driven straight.
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: To the virtual studio in his ten year old Volvo
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: station Wagon, which I said I wouldn't talk about on air,
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: but fuck it.
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: David James, Kevin Patrick Gillespie.
• 0:22
  Speaker 3: Good I mate.
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: I did ask you randomly off air what kind of
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: car and you were You.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: Were amused by that, and I was just thinking, just
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: because you're a kind of a practical functional dude with
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: a practical functional.
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: Car, so I wasn't surprised at the answer.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: You've never been a You've never been an ausy bogan
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: concern with zero to one hundred and the horsepower and
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: Newton meters and all that shit.
• 0:46
  Speaker 3: No, No, as long as it gets me from A
• 0:48
  Speaker 3: to B, then job done.
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Have you been having a squiz at the Olympics.
• 0:54
  Speaker 3: I have. I have, indeed, because of my involvement with handball,
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: which I think we find course once or twice. You know,
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: it's good having a two week long handball competition that
• 1:05
  Speaker 3: you can just tune in and watch for free on
• 1:07
  Speaker 3: Telly and with an English commentary no less, oh.
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: Really of course? And who's I mean who did well?
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: Like I didn't see one minute of handball.
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: So it's.
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: So Denmark won the men and Norway won the women,
• 1:22
  Speaker 3: which and neither of those were particularly unexpected results. But
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: a lot of them are full of people who've been
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: there for a good decade or so, so it's going
• 1:30
  Speaker 3: to be a changing of the.
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: Guard, okay.
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: And who how many countries in the world, Like if
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: we look at you know, like for example, I worked
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: with the Melbourne Dixens and Melbourne Phoenix and some of
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: the Australian netballers and Collingwood in the National Netball League.
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: But if we look at.
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: Netball as an example as a sport globally, you know,
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: it is an international sport, but there's probably about four
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: or five countries that are really good at it, four
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: or five that are pretty good, five that are emerging,
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: and then no one else in the world gives a shit.
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: What's the equivalent with handball, Like how many countries really
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: play it and really are good at it?
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: There's well, all of Europe play it, which is what
• 2:15
  Speaker 3: it tends to be called European handball. It's the I
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: think it's the third biggest participation sport in Europe behind
• 2:23
  Speaker 3: soccer or football as people like to call it, and
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: I think the other one there is basketball is a
• 2:28
  Speaker 3: big one, but so handball's behind that. The professional leagues
• 2:33
  Speaker 3: there are absolutely huge. A lot of the players that
• 2:36
  Speaker 3: were running around at the Olympics of you know, earning
• 2:39
  Speaker 3: tens of millions of dollars a year playing handball. There's
• 2:43
  Speaker 3: three million people in Europe play it. It's huge in
• 2:46
  Speaker 3: South America as well, probably the European influence there. North
• 2:51
  Speaker 3: America is pretty much like Australia, which is what's regarded
• 2:54
  Speaker 3: as a developing nation where you know, I guess, I
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: guess what Zimbabwe is to netball is what we are
• 3:02
  Speaker 3: to handle. Yeah, but it's massively bigger than netball. Netball's
• 3:09
  Speaker 3: wildest dreams couldn't be that big. I mean the gold
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: medal match, so the final four matches in the women's
• 3:17
  Speaker 3: and men's comp at the Olympics were at a capacity
• 3:20
  Speaker 3: stadium with thirty thousand people, so you know, each each
• 3:25
  Speaker 3: match thirty thousand people, so it's a big sport.
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's crazy, I am. I'm just trying to find
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: something now. I put up a post the other day
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: about about the relative kind of per capita medals. Like
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: a few people have put up a few things, but
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: at the time that I wrote it, which was I
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: think Friday night, nine pm or something, New.
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: Zealand with a population of five million, they were doing
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: very well.
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and they finished with nine gold medals, like five million.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: You know, there's more than five million people where I live,
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: like in Melbourne, right.
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: It's yea.
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: And I'm thinking, then I extrapolated that out and I'm thinking, well,
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: China has when I looked to give or take one
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: point four and a bit billion, you know, And I
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: was thinking, wow, if they had a similar kind of
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: per head ratio, they'd be up to fourteen hundred gold medals, right,
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: and like if it was if Obviously it doesn't work
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: that way and there's a lot of variables around it.
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: But I'm thinking, while I'm very proud of Australia and
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: all that, clearly I did no fucking work, neither did you.
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: I find that a funny thing. How oh, how well
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: are we doing?
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: Well?
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: I'm not doing anything. I'm just the people.
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's funny how we take ownership.
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: But anyway, and in my case, I'm not even watching Australians.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: Well that's exactly right, but you know there's a reason
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: for that.
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: But yeah, they ended up with nine gold medals in
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: a country of you know, five million people. When you
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: think there's something like forty million people that live in
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: California or something.
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: It's you know, it's fucking amazing.
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: But you always punches above their weight. I mean you
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: just look at them in the rugby for starters. Yeah,
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: you know, they're always they are a sports mad nation.
• 5:18
  Speaker 3: They they're the sports crazy state of Australia. They don't
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: like being referred to that way, but that's pretty much
• 5:25
  Speaker 3: how I think of them.
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: It's hilarious.
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: And hey, what did you make of the Big Girl controversy?
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: Oh do you know what?
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: Okay, everyone, so we're talking about the breakdown, to which
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: in the Olympic call it breaking.
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: I don't want to get in trouble.
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: I just gone have an opinion.
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: Harp, No, well my opinion, you know, like so part
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: of me is like, well done.
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: You had to go when I first saw it, Honestly,
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: and this is just I didn't know if it was
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: a parent or if it was.
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know. Look, I think good
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: on her for having.
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: A go, but and people like I saw people coming
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: out going, oh stop stop putting women down and that, Like,
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: for me, it's got nothing to do with gender. It's
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: got everything to do with skill and ability. And yeah,
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: I want to sit on the fence because I don't
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: want to get in trouble. But yeah, well clearly, clearly
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: she wasn't at the same level as the other competitors.
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: I don't know, I don't know.
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: It's just isn't that Isn't that the equivalent of saying,
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: you know, qualifying for one hundred meters knowing that your
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: best time in one hundred meters is twenty seconds, and
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: you're going to be racing against people who do ten
• 6:44
  Speaker 3: seconds and then and then rather than running against them
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: and doing your twenty seconds, you decide, you know what,
• 6:51
  Speaker 3: I'm going to skip. Yeah, you know, I don't know
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: if that's what happened.
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean obviously, well, you know, we're we
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: think about the Olympics. I'm generalizing, we think about the
• 7:02
  Speaker 1: best athletes on the planet. With the best fitness, best strength, power,
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: speed skill like the elite of the elite, and.
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: I don't know like good on a like.
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: I think good on a for having a go, and
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: I think if she's happy and people enjoyed it, then
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: I think it's good.
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: Well, I worry. I mean, I don't know breakdancing from
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: anything else. I know zero about breakdancing. I don't know
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: how good, bad her and different her performance was. All
• 7:30
  Speaker 3: I'm talking about is a controversy about it. And the
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: thing that concerns me coming from I guess a sports
• 7:38
  Speaker 3: administration perspective, you know, being involved in handball is who
• 7:43
  Speaker 3: missed out on that place? Is the question that occurs
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: to me. You know, I struggle to believe that there
• 7:52
  Speaker 3: are very you know, I suspect there's a lot of
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: dance schools around Australia with lots of people who do breakdancing.
• 7:59
  Speaker 3: I presume I don't know anything about it, but I
• 8:01
  Speaker 3: presume there must be where there are no other people
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: to choose from. I don't know.
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, I think the answer to that is again,
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: so anyone listening to these two are white middle aged men.
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: We both will acknowledge it. We both acknowledge. We do
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: not know anything about this, No.
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: But what I think I do know is that I
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: think there was like essentially trials, and she was she won.
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: I think she was the best, and then she deserved
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: to be there, didn't she exactly exactly?
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: So if that was the process and she came out
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: and she was the best of the people who tried
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: to qualify for the team and she won that well,
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: got through that process being number one, then han't absent.
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: She deserves to be there.
• 8:45
  Speaker 3: Then really the only critique critique people can give her is, well,
• 8:49
  Speaker 3: you know, if you came through a fair trial process,
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: just like everybody else, and you and you were the
• 8:54
  Speaker 3: one selected, then you have just as much right to
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: be there as anybody else. And and and then what
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: you're really doing is critiquing the artistry of what she did.
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: And given that this is a dance thing, not not
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: I mean, I might inflame people by saying this, but
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: it's dance, not sport in my view, then artistry is
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: part of the deal. So what you're really saying is
• 9:16
  Speaker 3: I don't like the routine she chose.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I think also, you know, the artistry slash
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: creative expression, like you think about like I've literally tried.
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: I've trained a bunch of Olympic athletes and one of
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: the girls that I trained was in I can't of
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: remember which games, but anyway, she was a synchronized swimmer.
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: Her name is Bethany Walsh. And honestly, when I her
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: dad approached me and went, would you work with my daughter?
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: She's an Olympian? And I went, what sport? And he
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: told me and I went, not a sport, though, is it?
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: You know?
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: I didn't really I didn't really think that.
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: I just my idea and then I I was completely wrong.
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: By the way, before anyone sends me an email, I
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: went and watched them, tray, I went and.
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: Watched what these girls have to do and how fucking
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: strong and fit and talented, and I mean, it is
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: a demanding sport. But then there are other things, like
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: you know, I think, like we have these like contrasting
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: events like the Wimmens one hundred meters you know, or
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: blokes hundred meters where it's just power speed like which
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: you know is like a completely athletic it seems to
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: be event.
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: And then other things like you know, the rhythmic gymnastics, which.
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: Is still very strong, very fit, but a much more
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: kind of creative subjective.
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: There's no clear subjective elements, don't but it has objective
• 10:52
  Speaker 3: elements to it because it's part of the gymnastics stuff.
• 10:54
  Speaker 3: But it's also got some artistic subjective elements to it,
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: doesn't it. Well.
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and then there's the sports like you know, weightlifting
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: and rowing and basketball.
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: And sprinting and just watch.
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there's someone's whoever's got the best or the right number,
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: the lowest time, or the heaviest weight or the most
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: points on the.
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: Board that they just win as long as they work
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: within the rules.
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: But then there's this other thing where we go and
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: even diving, Like I look at the diving and I go, oh,
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: that was fucking incredible, and then they're like scored lower
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: what do I know?
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: And someone else who I think, yeah, that was You.
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: Can tell that there's a lot of subjectivity in something
• 11:33
  Speaker 3: like diving because you see them even the way they score.
• 11:36
  Speaker 3: You know, I don't know how many judges they have,
• 11:38
  Speaker 3: but it's like seven or eight judges, and then they
• 11:39
  Speaker 3: knock out the highest and lower scores, which tells you
• 11:42
  Speaker 3: that even the people who are professionals are judging this
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: get it wrong from their perspective, and that's why they
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: take out the highest and lower scores. Yeah.
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: Well, also even in the boxing, I watched fair bit
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: of boxing, and there was numerous times where of the
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: five judges, three awarded it to the blue corner and
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: two awarded it to the red corner. And they just
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: watched the same thing. And I'm like, sixty percent of
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: the judges said Brian one and forty said fucking Dave one,
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: and they just watched this. Yes, do you know what
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: I mean? So it ends up in a split decision.
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't think you and I intended to
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: bang on about the Olympics, but.
• 12:25
  Speaker 3: There we already didn't know. I thought it was interesting.
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: Look what it is is, it's a phenomenon that you know,
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: a few people have spoken about, let's just keep going
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: with a few people have spoken about the reality that
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: it generates billions of dollars, but the athletes don't get
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: any of that. And then then you look at the
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: even within countries, like if you win a gold medal
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: in Australia, I've seen two different reported numbers, but it's
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: either fifteen or twenty thousand bucks, which to me seems
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: fuck all for an Olympic gold medal, but especially when
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: you if you're a first round loser at Wimbledon, I
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: think you get seventy or eighty grand if.
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: You're to get to winner. Pardon the trick is to
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: get to Wimbledon, I guess.
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, but there's still like yeah, but still
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: you know it's you're losing a match of tennis and
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: you're getting one hundred or whatever. I guess so, But
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: but then you're winning an Olympic gold medal for Australia
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: and you get fifteen or twenty grand. Live in Singapore,
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: you get seven hundred and fifty grand.
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, although if you are at least an individual who
• 13:35
  Speaker 3: wins a gold medal at an Olympics, yes, you're probably
• 13:39
  Speaker 3: going to be able to turn that into some money
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: through sponsorships, endorsement, speaking career, et cetera, et cetera.
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, of course, Like I think the technically all gold
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: medals are Olympic gold medals, they're all equal, but financially,
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: commercially they're definitely not all equal, are they in terms
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: of you know, like a a friend of mine is
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: an Olympic gold medalist, Lauren who won the Lauren Burns
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: who won the Taekwondo Olympic gold for US Australia in
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: the two thousand Olympics. And you know, she's a great athlete.
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: She deserved a gold medal. She's amazing. She's also got
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: a PhD. She's also a corporate speaker. But you know,
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: she will tell you she earns about nine dollars thirty
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: a year through that gold medal. You know, it certainly
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: doesn't hurt, but you know she has to work, she
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: has to study, she has to grind.
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: Oh, I'd heard of her, so it's worth something.
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: Oh have you heard of her?
• 14:43
  Speaker 3: When you said her name, it rung a bell with me.
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, well I think yeah she was. Who's
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: her dad? Was it Ronnie Burns? I think the Australian anyway,
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: So let's just quickly talk about what we were going
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: to talk about.
• 14:59
  Speaker 3: We're actually going to all is. Yeah.
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well you mentioned to me the just about chatting
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: about the what seems to be the increasing prevalence of
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: you know, people being people pulling knives on police and
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: the subsequent you know, goings on of people with mental.
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: Health issues, who are you know.
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: Either being tasered or shot or and it seems like
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: is it disproportionate in Queensland or we just get more
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: exposure to it.
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: I don't know. I haven't done any sort of comprehensive
• 15:34
  Speaker 3: analysis of it. But what prompted me to raise this
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: with you is it's been on the news a bit
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: here in Queensland on the weekend because there's been a
• 15:41
  Speaker 3: police shooting of a fellow who pulled a knife on
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: police in a hospital and I think he survived it,
• 15:50
  Speaker 3: but there's been a lot of reporting about it because
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: they are saying this is the sort of third time
• 15:58
  Speaker 3: it's happened recently, and I think the Queensland Police Union
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: are saying there needs to be there needs to be
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: an inquiry in relation to mental health in Australia that
• 16:12
  Speaker 3: most of what police are dealing with when they go
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: out on calls now is dealing with people with mental
• 16:16
  Speaker 3: health issues. Now, he didn't cite any statistics for that,
• 16:20
  Speaker 3: so I don't know, but just going on his word,
• 16:23
  Speaker 3: and I guess head of the Police union probably knows
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: something about it, it does seem logical that a lot
• 16:31
  Speaker 3: of what police spend their time doing is dealing with
• 16:35
  Speaker 3: people with mental health issues. In the community. And so
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: what I did do is going to have a look
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: at the statistics on this and have the rates of
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: reported mental health issues in the community increase. So when
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: you talk about mental health issues in the community and
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: you start looking at the health statistics on it, they
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: divide him into sort of three groups, which is anxiety, depression,
• 17:00
  Speaker 3: what they call effective disorders, and drug abuse related disorders.
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: So mental health is a kind of a vague word
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: to use, and the media uses it a lot, but
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: it really only means those things. Right. There's people who
• 17:15
  Speaker 3: are schizophrenic slash psychotic and people who aren't. And this
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: is all seen as a spectrum. So anxiety is at
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: the light end of that spectrum. It progresses towards schizophrenia
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: and are sorry to psychosis, which is an isolator or
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: a single event of extreme paranoia, through to schizophrenia, which
• 17:39
  Speaker 3: is recurring events of extreme paranoia. Now those are all paranoia.
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: Is another way of saying anxiety about the intentions of
• 17:47
  Speaker 3: other humans. Right, So if you think about what anxiety is,
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: anxiety is an overestimation of risk. So you look at
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: the environment, and you all of us do this all
• 18:00
  Speaker 3: the time. We look at the environment and we estimate
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: a potential danger to us in that environment. And people
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: who don't have mental health issues, I guess you want
• 18:12
  Speaker 3: to call them normal if you want estimate, to say
• 18:14
  Speaker 3: the environmental risk. You might be looking around you now
• 18:16
  Speaker 3: and thinking about the environmental risk and see nothing that's
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: particularly threatening to you, and nothing that's putting you in
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: fear of your life or any sort of danger to you.
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: But a person who is suffering from anxiety is overestimating
• 18:33
  Speaker 3: that same risk set in your environment. So I don't
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: know what's in your environment. There might be some electronics
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: to do with this podcast, for example, and a person
• 18:43
  Speaker 3: with extreme anxiety might be looking at those electronics and
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: be worried about being electrocuted. Even though you might say,
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: you know, I'm assessing the risk here as load and
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: non existent. What anxiety does is change the risk assessment
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: materior in your brain. And we've talked about before how
• 19:02
  Speaker 3: that happens. So that's because too many hits of dopamine
• 19:06
  Speaker 3: caused by either a too stressful environment or addiction raises
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: are tolerance level, which adjusts the input values for your
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: brain in terms of assessing risk. So the higher that
• 19:20
  Speaker 3: threshold goes, that is the more stress you are under,
• 19:24
  Speaker 3: or the more addiction you are exposed to, the worse
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: you become at assessing assessing environmental risk. So the more
• 19:33
  Speaker 3: addicted you are, the more stressed you are, the more
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: likely you are to significantly overestimate the risk in your environment.
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: And we call that anxiety, which is stress about risk
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: overestimating the danger to you. Now, what happens is that
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: if you allow that to go for too long, that
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: then transfers into an overestimator of the overestimation of the
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: dane of other humans. So you start to worry about
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: the intentions of others. So you might be in an
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: environment where there's nothing there other than another person, but
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: you are overestimating the risk of that person. You start
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: thinking that they are there to do you harm, even
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: though there's nothing to a normal person sitting in the room,
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: there's nothing about them that suggests that they might do
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: you harm, you know them or whatever. As this risk
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: assessment gets pushed out of whack by addictional stress, you
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: start to have fears about the intention of others, and
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: when that becomes extreme it gets called a psychotic event, right,
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: which is that you are so upset or in fear
• 20:46
  Speaker 3: of your life because of the intention of another person
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: that you are forced to act against them. So you
• 20:52
  Speaker 3: are in a place where you've got to stop them
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: before they hurt you, even though there's nothing that would
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: suggest they are going to, you know, in a normal assessment,
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: that's their view of things, and often when police called
• 21:05
  Speaker 3: out that's what they're encountering. They're encountering someone who's in
• 21:10
  Speaker 3: that state. So a person who sees the police as
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: an imminent threat, and obviously they are. But to a
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: normal person, it's all I've got to do is stop
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: behaving weirdly and the police will stop being an imminent threat.
• 21:24
  Speaker 3: But that calculation is not possible when your brain's risk
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: assessment capability is out of whack. So the question is
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: has there been an actual increase in the things that
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: are being measured here, And the answer is very definitely yes.
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: So if we look at the last time it was
• 21:44
  Speaker 3: surveyed in two thousand and nine, estimated that there was
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: about eleven percent of the population, we're suffering depression, anxiety,
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: or other serious mental illness, so usually drug related about
• 22:00
  Speaker 3: eleven percent in two thousand and nine at any given
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: moment in time, right, So well, it's actually reportab within
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: the last twelve months. So in twenty twenty one, when
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: they did the same survey again, it was nineteen percent.
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: Wow, that is so acid.
• 22:15
  Speaker 3: So that's almost doubling in a ten year period. So
• 22:21
  Speaker 3: that's significant. You've gone from one in ten people to
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: one in five people in ten years. And if that's
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: what's going on in the environment, it's little wonder that
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: police are finding themselves increasingly facing people who have no
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: control over the fact that their brain is telling them
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: that these people are an imminent threat to me, not
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: just the police, but everybody around them, and to me,
• 22:54
  Speaker 3: that's a concern. It's a concern that this is a
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: surprise to anyone. It's a concern that it isn't headline
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: news every day of the week. And it's a concern
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: that the best anyone can ask for is a Royal
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: Commission into mental health. We don't need a Royal Commission
• 23:09
  Speaker 3: into mental health, which is what the police union fellow
• 23:12
  Speaker 3: was asking for. I could look at those stats. I don't.
• 23:16
  Speaker 3: I'm not a Royal commissioner. I just looked up the
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: stats on the Australian Institute of Health and Welfare's website.
• 23:23
  Speaker 3: It tells the story immediately, which is something is going
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: on here. Now. You and I have talked in the
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: past about why would that be, Why would suddenly the
• 23:34
  Speaker 3: incidents of this stuff have doubled, And we know the answer.
• 23:40
  Speaker 3: We flooded the population with the very things we know
• 23:44
  Speaker 3: are just that threshold measure of risk. We know that
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: when you make someone an addict, which is why, by
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: the way, drug related psychosis is lumped in with these
• 23:56
  Speaker 3: mental illnesses, when you make someone an addict, you are
• 24:00
  Speaker 3: just that threshold determinant of risk. Now, before two thousand
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: and nine, that was relatively rare. It only affected one
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: in ten people. Since two thousand and nine, it's gone
• 24:13
  Speaker 3: off like a rocket. What have we done that has
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: introduced massive amounts of addiction into the population since two
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: thousand and nine. Any clues?
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: Oh, yes, I would think tech technology, scraps.
• 24:30
  Speaker 3: We've importantly, we've put access to software designed to addict
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: the human brain in the hands of every teenager in
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: the country, which is the point in life where this occurs,
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: that is where all addictions start. We've put devices in
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: their hands that are the equivalent of a dopamine button
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: that gives repeated, continuous hits of dopamine, the thing we
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: know are just risk tolerance, and then we are surprised
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: when that is exactly what occurs.
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I wonder, I mean, like when I listen to
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: you break this down, which I've listened to similar things
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: with you before, and it makes complete sense. Is there
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: anyone else sharing this gospel or sharing this this line
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: of thinking? Like is anyone else drawing these putting these
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: jigsaw pieces together like you do?
• 25:33
  Speaker 3: Like because yeah, you know you go on, you know,
• 25:37
  Speaker 3: you finished and finish.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: I was also this is like an adjacent conversation. But
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: the other thing that occurs to me with all of this,
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: and so andswer which one you want first, is that
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: like on top of the people with elevated anxiety and
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: paranoia and situational whatever that the cops go into, then
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: there's the cops themselves that have been anxious and traumatized
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: and potentially elevated. Like I work with police, and that
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: there aren't too many cops who don't have their own trauma.
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: Who are you dealing with something because of they need
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: to be perpetually hyper vigilant.
• 26:17
  Speaker 3: I mean, well, remember the other way to induce this
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: state is of stress. So they're going the other pathway,
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: which is if you're constantly exposed to stress, then you'll
• 26:29
  Speaker 3: have the same thing. Now that's by design, by the way,
• 26:33
  Speaker 3: because you want to be hyper vigilant and hyper alert
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: if you are in an environment where you are constantly
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: in very real danger. So that is a pro evolutionary thing.
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: It's not good for your mental health, you know, which
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: is why.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: It's it's good for in the moment survival, but it's
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: a nervous system all for anything over the long time, no.
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: Because it leaves that risk. The risk assessment doesn't change
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: as soon as you are in a non threatening environment.
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: So it's it's the same thing as happens with addiction,
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: which is that you are left with that risk assessment
• 27:06
  Speaker 3: set too high. And so the other interesting thing is
• 27:11
  Speaker 3: that there's massive crossover then between someone who's in that
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: state and addiction. So a person exposed to chronic stress
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: is most likely to be addicted to something. Someone who
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: is addicted to something is most likely to be in
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: a situation of chronic stress. So there's massive overlap between
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: those two things.
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: Well, obviously there's no quick solution, but and this is
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: very left field, but do do police in Coinsland carry tasers.
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: They do, yes, right, and and the use of those
• 27:46
  Speaker 3: has increased. I think I saw in the story about
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: this that the use of those has increased massively in
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: the last year or so.
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well, I mean it's a you know,
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: I'm sure no one wants to be tasered, but I'd
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: rather be tasered than shot with a bullet.
• 28:04
  Speaker 3: Well, I mean, the guidelines for use of a taser
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: is a policeman is only supposed to draw it when
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: they feel under imminent threat. Yes, so under personal threat.
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: So it's so the fact that it's being used more
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: frequently tells you that there's more threat. It's a more
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: threatening environment. Yeah. So, you know, the problem we've got
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: here is that we now have, you know, in the
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: space of a decade, double the number of people in
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: the population who are likely to be a threat, and
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: we are doing nothing about that. We are you know,
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: we've done it using a device designed to create exactly
• 28:48
  Speaker 3: this issue, and we are doing exactly nothing about it.
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: So don't expect solutions to appear soon, no matter how
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: many Royal commissions are held.
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: And also, you know, the use of tech is not
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: going to go down, No, no, people are not going
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: to be using these things less.
• 29:09
  Speaker 3: I mean, well, because because it's addictive.
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's what I'm saying. So what's the answer then,
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: or what's part of the answer.
• 29:23
  Speaker 3: The part of the answer is exactly the same answer
• 29:25
  Speaker 3: as if we were having this conversation I don't know
• 29:28
  Speaker 3: fifteen years ago when I first wrote about sugar, the
• 29:30
  Speaker 3: answer would be exactly the same. Stop using it. Understand
• 29:35
  Speaker 3: And people say, well, you know, how do I do that? Well,
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: you have to understand where it is and how you're ingesting.
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: You know, if you talk to a smoker, for example,
• 29:44
  Speaker 3: no one accidentally shoves a cigarette in their mouth and
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: lights it. They understand exactly what they're doing. And when
• 29:51
  Speaker 3: we have this conversation with people, like I said fifteen
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: years ago about sugar, you know, it's the accidental ingestion.
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: It's not understanding what you're doing that's the problem. And
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: once you know what you're doing, people are smart enough
• 30:06
  Speaker 3: to stop it. You know, people are smart enough to
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: stand back from an addiction once they understand that it
• 30:12
  Speaker 3: is an addiction and do something about it. Most people
• 30:15
  Speaker 3: will People are not self destructive. Most people will say
• 30:19
  Speaker 3: I actually don't want to do this. I don't want
• 30:22
  Speaker 3: my brain messed with. I want to step back from it.
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: But at the moment, the prevailing narrative is not only
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: is this safe, this is necessary, and we have to
• 30:31
  Speaker 3: give our kids these devices to use in schools. We
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: have to be able to step back from that and
• 30:38
  Speaker 3: realistically say no, oops, sorry, made a bit of a mistake,
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: accidentally distributed highly addictive stuff to school children. But it's okay,
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: we're on it. We'll stop doing that now.
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: But I guess the difference between you know, in the
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: cigarette analogy, the difference is that you know, technology is
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: integrated into every like literally every component of our existence now.
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: But a person who smokes a cigarette today knows exactly
• 31:08
  Speaker 3: what they are doing and they don't care. Okay, they
• 31:12
  Speaker 3: know what they're doing, they know the potential damage. They
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: know it's addictive, which is why there's only about thirteen
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: percent of people who still do it. But and there'll
• 31:21
  Speaker 3: be a component of that no matter what you're talking about,
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: people who will say, you know what, I know it's addictive.
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: I don't care. I enjoy it. It's a pleasurable thing
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: for me. I need it. I'm doing it anyway. I
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: don't care. But the vast majority of people who indulge
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: in addictive behavior don't want to be doing it, and
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: once they know that that's what they're doing, they will
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: take steps to stop doing it.
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: I feel like with and this is just a feeling,
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: not a bloody fact, but I feel like with technology,
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: you know, people will be listening to this, nodding along,
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: going yeah, people should do something about that.
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: But it's not. Well, there's an asset test, isn't there,
• 32:00
  Speaker 3: you know, And this is the one I put out
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: to people when I speak to groups, which is people
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: will often say, I'll say, you know what all you've
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: got to do is stop doing it, you know, stop
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: using Instagram. People not their heads and say yeah, yeah,
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: I can stop doing that, no worries at all, And
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: I say, oh, excellent, all right, so just delete the
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: app from your phone. I'll go, yeah, yeah, I can
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: do that, and you'll say, oh, that's good. But you know,
• 32:22
  Speaker 3: I know you're thinking in the back of mind, I
• 32:23
  Speaker 3: can just reinstall later if I get desperate. So now
• 32:27
  Speaker 3: delete your account then, and people start having a roll.
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah that's different, isn't it. That's different.
• 32:37
  Speaker 3: That's permanent.
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, So so I know we're going to wind up,
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: but pursuant to this, your honor, have you been and
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: I know your kids are mostly older now, but have
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: you consciously kind of created framework or rules or you know,
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: standards in your house with your kids around all this stuff?
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: Oh? Absolutely, absolutely so. One of the books I wrote
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: about this, teen Brain, which was the first one I wrote,
• 33:09
  Speaker 3: I think, came out twenty sixteen something like that. It
• 33:14
  Speaker 3: actually described what we do in our household, and we unfortunately,
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: they attended a school where devices were mandatory, so hipads
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: were mandatory. So it took every gram of willpower and
• 33:35
  Speaker 3: sticking to the cause approach to things to regulate their
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: use of those, because they come home with the device right,
• 33:42
  Speaker 3: and then they're off to their bedroom or whatever. And
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: unless you're prepared to ride them like a pony on
• 33:48
  Speaker 3: this stuff right and get that device back and put
• 33:51
  Speaker 3: it in a public place and make sure it is
• 33:53
  Speaker 3: not touched again and keep monitoring it, then they're just
• 33:58
  Speaker 3: too quick and it's too easy and too portable unless
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: you are. So. One of my kids, the eldest, who
• 34:05
  Speaker 3: were sort of pre this area, created a little stand
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: he made out of wood, which which they could all
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: sit on to be charged, and it was just made
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: it really really easy to keep an eye on, you know,
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: you just had to be able to count. Then right, Okay,
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: there's four kids and there's four devices. That's it. They're
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: all in that in one place. I know it. If
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: one's missing, you know, you've got to go hunting. But
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: that's just what the device the school required them to do.
• 34:27
  Speaker 3: With phones, we ban them entirely, not in I mean,
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: they had phones, but they were the twenty dollars cheapies
• 34:33
  Speaker 3: you get from came up. But all they can do
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: is make and receive phone calls. They didn't have the
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: kind you know, they didn't have smartphones, and which was
• 34:42
  Speaker 3: fortunate because when the only thing a phone does is
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: make and receive phone calls, it gets lost a lot. Yeah,
• 34:48
  Speaker 3: so it was good that they were cheap, yes, yes.
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: And now that now that there will some of them
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: are how old is your youngest?
• 34:55
  Speaker 3: My youngest now are twenty. Well they're turning twenty one
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: this year.
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: Okay, so all your are adults, and do they ever
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: talk to you about growing up in that environment and
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: their pleasure or displeasure or at that, you know, is
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: it like I'm glad you did that, dad, or you
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: were a fucking tyrant dad.
• 35:14
  Speaker 3: I don't ever expect to be thanked for stuff like
• 35:16
  Speaker 3: this by your kids. I they now because they're adults.
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: You know, they have their own phones, they use them,
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: and they probably spend way too much time on them.
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: But I think I can detect that they're not addicted
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: to them. And that's because a critical thing to remember
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: about this is it is growth stage dependent. All addictions
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: start between the onset of puberty and about eight to
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: nine years later. So that's because that's the particular part
• 35:49
  Speaker 3: of the growth of the human brain when something that
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: protects us against addiction is turned off, and that is
• 35:57
  Speaker 3: turned off to allow puberty to happen and to allow
• 36:00
  Speaker 3: a certain part of the brain to grow. This has
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: been known long before we had devices that all addictions
• 36:08
  Speaker 3: start in the teens. Alcoholics became alcoholics in their teens.
• 36:14
  Speaker 3: All smokers became smokers in their teens. It's not just
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: you know, anecdotes, that's what the evidence says. So it
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: is singularly the worst possible time to expose anybody to
• 36:28
  Speaker 3: anything potentially addictive, and yet that's exactly what we are doing.
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's when the door's open widest last one before
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: we go. With all of these what seems to be
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: an upsurge in knife attacks if we're correlating it to,
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: you know, in some way, and the increase in mental
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: health anxiety, depression, drug related mental health to doubling in
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: ten years, blah blah blah, and one of the byproducts
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: of that might be these knife attacks. But at the
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: same time, or it's just interesting to note that the
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: vast majority of the knife attack ers men. So yeah, like, well,
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: maybe that's not true, but like I rarely, you know,
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: all of the stuff that we see on.
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: The news is invariably it's men with knives.
• 37:17
  Speaker 3: Well, I don't know if you've noticed, Craig, but there's
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: a difference between men and women, and it's.
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: A lot when you're sarcastic, it's a good thing that
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: you're in another state.
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: You on the nose.
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: There's a there's a key difference. It's a really really
• 37:32
  Speaker 3: important difference. It's a little hormone called testosterone, and testosterone
• 37:40
  Speaker 3: has a significant effect on impulse control. So when you're
• 37:44
  Speaker 3: loaded to the eyeballs with testosterone, as any male, particularly
• 37:48
  Speaker 3: a male between the start of puberty and sort of
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: their early thirties. Is they have significantly less impulse control
• 37:58
  Speaker 3: than a female of the same and I'm talking massively less,
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: which is which is why violent crimes tend to be
• 38:07
  Speaker 3: committed by people who fit that age and gender. And
• 38:12
  Speaker 3: it's it's that when you wire someone to consider the
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: world more dangerous than the average person would regard it,
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: and then you dial their impulse control down to zero,
• 38:28
  Speaker 3: predictable things happen.
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: M So I mean, yeah, so it's that combination really,
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: because we're not even though women are subjected to the
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: same stressors and I would think anxiety depression and you know,
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: is as high or higher in some instances, but they're
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: not running around with knives. So another significant factor is
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: that is that is testosterone?
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: Well absolutely, and you see it come through in suicide statistics,
• 38:57
  Speaker 3: so yes, you see. I mean I really don't like
• 39:02
  Speaker 3: referring to it as success, but success suicides are more
• 39:07
  Speaker 3: often performed by males.
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: And such a crazy term that that isn't it. It's like, yeah,
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: but that is the term, So don't send us an
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: email because that is the term that is used everyone.
• 39:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So it's it's the same thing at play, which
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: is less impulse control, more testosterone, more ability to complete
• 39:29
  Speaker 3: the act. And you see that in the methodology of suicide.
• 39:33
  Speaker 3: It's chosen as well. So females frequently will choose a
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: you know, like an overdose or something that doesn't involve
• 39:43
  Speaker 3: a violent, you know, attack on themselves, whereas a male
• 39:48
  Speaker 3: will will have no concerns about it being a train whatever.
• 39:53
  Speaker 3: I don't want to talk about this in detail, but
• 39:55
  Speaker 3: it's but there are very obvious differences to that. There's
• 39:59
  Speaker 3: a lot of research on why, and it does come
• 40:03
  Speaker 3: back to that difference in testosterone loading and impulse control.
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, amazing, amazing.
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: Well we started on a high and finished kind of
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: on a low. But it's all interesting. It's all interesting,
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: and just quickly back to something momentarily more positive.
• 40:21
  Speaker 2: Thirty seconds. So, how did the Australian handballers go?
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: There were no Australian handballs Australia for an Olympics in
• 40:31
  Speaker 3: a pink fit honestly, Oh really, So there's I think
• 40:36
  Speaker 3: there's sixteen countries make it qualify to the Olympics, and
• 40:40
  Speaker 3: the qualification pathways very long and through various pathways. Australia
• 40:47
  Speaker 3: would have almost zero hope of it we were there
• 40:50
  Speaker 3: in two thousand because we're the host country, and we'll
• 40:52
  Speaker 3: be there in twenty thirty two because we'll be the
• 40:54
  Speaker 3: host country. But that'll be baud it. I'd say, all right,
• 40:57
  Speaker 3: might appreciate you as year later.