Latest / Solving the World's Greatest Problems / Episode 5 - Don't Leave Your Kids Money. Leave Them This Instead. | Alan Barnhart

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Episode 5 - Don't Leave Your Kids Money. Leave Them This Instead. | Alan Barnhart · Solving the World's Greatest Problems

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_04: I have no idea what God is calling you to.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_04: Ask the owner.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_04: God is the owner.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_04: You are the steward.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_04: Ask him what he wants you to do.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_04: As you're trying to figure out his answer to that, you use scripture, use your brain.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_04: You're not going to probably get an audible.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_04: You are not entitled to anything.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_04: If you go into Deuteronomy 8, it says, remember, I'm the one who gave you the ability to earn money.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_04: Please remember that.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_04: Don't forget that.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_04: He says over and over again.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_04: We're not built to be satisfied with stuff.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_04: There's no stuff that will satisfy it.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_04: And so I think that's the trap that people fall into.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_04: And so I think to ask the owner what he wants you to do, hold everything with an open hand.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: Solving the world's greatest problems is an audacious proposal.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_00: And yet, no generation has more talent, capital, or tools than ours.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: The time has come for entrepreneurs, investors, givers, ministry leaders to reclaim the church's aim to call it.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: The scale of brokenness is too big for us to do this entire under its power, for its glory together.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Solving the World's Greatest Problems podcast.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: Most business owners spend their whole lives trying to make a fortune.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: But with Alan Barnhart, it's different.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_00: He built a business and then gave 99% of it away.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: In 1986, Alan and his brother made a decision that would change everything.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: So before they even took over the family business, they decided they would put a cap on their lifestyle.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: If God prospered the business, they wouldn't ramp up their salaries.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: About a year after the pivotal conversation, they gave away 99% of their company.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: By 2008, they transferred the stock of company worth hundreds of millions of dollars into a ministry.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: Alan Barnhart is a perfect role model for those of us who want to give.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_03: So we love to start off the podcast with just like some of the things behind the scenes.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_03: Like who is Alan Barnhart?
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_03: So if I were to say Alan's favorite hobby, what would Alan's favorite hobby be in the free time?
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_03: If people are picturing Alan at home on a weekend, I love going backpacking.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_03: Going backpacking.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_03: And cutting firewood.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_03: Just cutting it or like like the campfire that brings it together or you can't.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_04: But backpacking is my probably my biggest hobby.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_04: What's your favorite path?
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_04: You had a favorite route trip that you do?
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I did the Appalachian Trail.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_04: I took four months off to the sabbatical and did that.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_04: Um and then I do um I do stuff over in Arkansas.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_04: I'm about to go do a hike in Kentucky.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_04: I'm about to go hike.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_04: Um this is more of a niche thing.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_04: I did the Grand Canyon, the rim to rim, and I did about to do Kilimajaro.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_04: So those are some.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think we call that backpacking.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_03: I think we call it those those are not backpacking, really.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_03: But you know, the AT was backpacking.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_03: To be fair, in the Olympic sports season that we're in, that's a different category, I think, that you've just entered when you say Kilimajak.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_04: Well Kilomajaro is just a climb.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_04: It's just a walk-up.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_04: It's but it's uh and it's bougie with you know the it's got the Sherpas or whatever doing the carrying and and you know, but the but something like when you do when you go for months at a time, it's um and you're carrying 15, 18 pounds worth of stuff plus your food, and that's you know, so you you're living on it's amazing what you can get by without.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_04: It's uh so I I really enjoy this the and the camaraderie of uh a really wild demographic of people that are doing it.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_04: I met all kinds of people and and uh I'd read the book um Unoffendable right before I went, which basically says, you know, we as believers we shouldn't be offended by the outward expressions of people.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_04: We don't know their story, we don't you know, and we don't need to put give take take wrath out on them.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_04: God will take care of whatever wrath needs to be taken out, but just love them.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_04: And and so I so I read that right before I went and and just had that spirit of just loving everybody I was with and met all kinds of I met some trans people and some lesbians and some you know uh very diverse group.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_03: A whole bunch of people, yeah.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so on an average uh average Friday night, what's date night look like for Alan and Catherine?
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_04: We like sitting around the fire, um sometimes playing Scrabble, sometimes uh watching a movie, um eating popcorn.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_04: Okay.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_04: It's uh I have a very limited uh culinary uh repertoire, but popcorn is one of my things.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_04: And none of this microwave stuff, man.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: We're talking the real authentic the real authentic campfire that you've split the wood for.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_04: Well, no, I don't cook it over the fire, but it uh but uh just in a pot with oil and and um uh so just enjoying yeah that that's a a fairly common scene for us.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_04: Okay.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_03: So when I picture like I try and think of like what was Alan like as a kid, I picture that the only question in my mind is were you playing with like a a 20-wheel truck or was it a 200-wheel truck that you were playing with when in your younger days?
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_04: Well, you know, I I grew up in the business.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_04: And so my dad started the company.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_04: My mom and dad started it when I was nine years old.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_04: And so I basically just grew up in it.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_04: And the international corporate headquarters was two bedrooms of our home.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_04: The whole time I was growing up, mom wrote every paycheck.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_04: It was that kind of a business.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_04: And so we were out, we were learning how to drive trucks and run cranes before we had our driver's license.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_04: You know, it was and my brother and I were um he was two years older, and so we would just I got my first paycheck, I think, when I was maybe 12 years old.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_04: And it was super have you compared, did you beat Mark Green?
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_03: I think Mart has you a couple of years with like making frames at the end.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_03: Oh yeah, he was making frames.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_03: But you're you're close.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_03: Similar.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, so it was uh so it was that kind of a life of uh we did Boy Scouts.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_04: So my dad was my dad worked hard, but he also we we did Boy Scouts and we had a lot of we did a lot of fun trips, did a lot of family camping.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_04: Um, and uh did and then we got into sailing and did a lot of sailing as a family.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_04: We sailed, took a took the boat down to the coast of Florida and up the coast of Maine.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_04: And um, so did this was just a boat week of trailer, and yeah, so just had a big time with that.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_04: So I was growing up.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_03: You know, one of the things we've been talking about recently is we've been welcoming people to our team, and maybe somebody comes from a video production background or a design background or something like that, and they're they're not as versed or familiar with maybe like, I don't know, the faith and work intersection over the years.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_03: And so one of the things we did was just kind of like type up like just, hey, what are some of these conversations that have stacked on each other?
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_03: And saying, like, you know, in the 70s and 80s, whether it's Ron Blue or Larry Briquette and others, like there's this conversation of like the seeds of financial stewardship.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_03: And then somewhere in the 90s, maybe Bob Buford and Halftime and a bunch of other things kind of comes up with this idea of like, man, it's not just your finances, yeah, but it's your time and it's your talent.
• 7:32
  unknown: Yeah.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_03: And, you know, we could keep going to like business as mission and work as worship and some of these other conversations, but just take us into like when you and Catherine were getting involved in the family business, when you're processing through this kind of crossroads moment, what were some of the conversations that were normal just kind of in pulling at you either way?
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_04: Let me go back a little further, a little earlier than that.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_04: You know, when I was in college, I started sponsoring a kid, or maybe even in high school with World Vision.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_04: They had you could sponsor a kid in Zimbabwe and for 15 bucks a month or whatever.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_04: And so I started doing that.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_04: That was just a a little minor point.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_04: Um while I was in college, there was famines in Ethiopia, people were starving to death.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_04: And I remember my roommate and I talking about you know, how can we live like we're living when people are starving to death?
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_04: Brothers and sisters are starving to death.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_04: And we uh we decided to, it's probably the only sacrificial gift I've ever made in my life.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_04: We decided to not go on our ski trip we were planning to do.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_04: And instead, we we took that 350 bucks each and sent it to Ethiopia.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_04: And uh I don't think that changed all that much about Ethiopia, but it it changed us.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_04: You know, it was so I think there were some times when I God spoke to me or or impressed on me the needs of the poor and the and the the uh opportunity to be generous, um, I think that started shaping me.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_04: Um I started listening to guys like Larry Burquette and and Ron Ballou and reading those books and the the cassette tapes of you know we're gonna have to show a diagram on screen right now to explain to our some of our viewers what a cassette tape is.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_04: But yeah, we'll go there.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_04: And uh listen to those over and over again about business by the book and how to, you know, how to um because I I'd come back to start working in the family business.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_04: My parents weren't believers.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_04: And so it was uh um uh it wasn't a Christian, I didn't grow up in a Christian home and it wasn't a Christian environment, but but I went by the time I got out of college, I was fired up for Jesus and wanting, I'd say, I'll go wherever you want me to go.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_04: And and some people were saying you ought to go to seminary, go on, go to um on young life staff or do you know do something full-time ministry.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_04: And I came to the conclusion that all of us who are followers of Jesus are in full-time ministry.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_04: We just got to figure out where.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_04: And that most of us aren't gonna get our paycheck from a charity or a church.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_04: And and so I uh as I prayed about that, I thought I think felt God had gifted me more in the area of business and engineering, and so came back to do that.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_04: Um decided to read through the Bible to see what it said about money, spent a couple years doing that, cataloging all these verses, there were thousands of them.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_04: Um, came away with two primary takeaways.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_04: One was the concept of stewardship, that everything has come from God, belongs to God.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_04: I'm not my own.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_04: I've been bought with a process.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_03: And that was kind of like resurgent language.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_03: That that wasn't maybe normal language years and years and years ago, but that it felt like maybe during that time.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_04: People were starting to talk that way a little bit.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and and I was I was seeing it in scripture.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_04: Most of the stuff really I didn't get until after that I started listening to other guys.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_04: Um I did read some I read a book on RG Laterno and what he had done and Stanley Tam.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_04: I think that was actually a little bit after afterwards, but got motivated by those guys some.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_03: Um were there other people, like a mentor or somebody like coming to this conclusion that like work can be worship, that business could be ministry, that like that that's not a normal conclusion in that moment.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_03: Were there are there voices in there?
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_04: Well I think it star it really started with scripture and it's this because this first thing was stewardship.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_04: The second thing was fear of of wealth.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_04: Fear that I mean Jesus warned graphically about the dangers of wealth.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_04: He warned about wealth ten times more than anything else and and said wild things like it's hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven, you can't serve God in money.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_04: And he told these stories of the guy that built the bigger barns, successful guy, you're a fool.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_04: You know, and and rich man and Lazarus and all these stories that were scary.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, they weren't the PG versions.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't want, I didn't want my life to get derailed by money.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_04: And so so so I I think you know, Catherine and I were talking about that and trying to figure out um how to how to process that because I'm a competitive guy, I want to win, and you know, in business, part of winning is making money, and that's part of the scoreboard.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_04: And uh so um we decided that we needed to be careful, you know, particularly when we started talking about starting our own company with my brother, becoming partners.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_04: We we were so thankful that God gave us those verses prior to that, because it set about a conversation to say how can we protect ourselves?
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_04: How can we A, be good stewards, B, protect ourselves?
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_04: And and so we we prayed with our wives and said, this is God's business.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_04: We are not owners with rights, we are stewards with responsibilities.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_04: God, this is yours.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_04: And technically we each owned half the company.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_04: But and then the second thing is we said we're gonna to protect ourselves against wealth, we're gonna put a cap on our lifestyle, we're gonna live a simple life the rest of our lives.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_04: And if God chooses to prosper the business, we're not gonna see that as a called it ramp up lifestyle.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_04: Instead, we're gonna see it as an opportunity to to take those funds and use them for kingdom purposes.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_04: And so made those decisions before we got started.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_04: And I think it was a lot easier to do it right there.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_04: We didn't know if we'd even survive the first year.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, this was a mom and pop business.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_03: International headquarters and two bedrooms, mom and pop, and they left.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, they they left the and went sailing and sailed around the world and were gone for most of the next seven.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_03: But technically you had international headquarters at the headquarters moved.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_04: And uh and I mean, I was working a hundred hours a week.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_04: My mom was harder to replace than my dad.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_04: You know, it uh and so it was uh um very you know I was enjoying it, it was an intense time.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, but um it it uh we had made those decisions that to you know together with our wives, and I think it it's s you know my brother and I and have been partners for 40 years, and God's done a wild thing in our company, you know, and and not once have we ever argued about money, which is a miracle.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_04: It is it's a miracle.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_04: We're deaf, we're very different people.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_04: And if we had not put those those uh commitments in, those constraints in, I think our life would have been well, I think God wouldn't have done what he did.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_04: I think you know, I don't know why God did what he did.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it's way there's it's way beyond any kind of explanation of skill of ours or you know, or hard work of ours.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_04: God just did something, attracted a bunch of people, brought, brought this thing together, and the company just grew like crazy.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_04: Um I appreciate the humility of that, but let me push on that for a little bit.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_03: All right.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_03: What do you think God was doing?
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_03: What was he doing?
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_04: I guess I'm still not sure because I mean there are people that are much more godly than me, smarter than me, harder working than me, and they have different results.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_04: And I and I don't I don't think God is impressed with the commas and the zeros.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_04: I don't think those are kind of up to him.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_04: And I mean, the number one Hall of Fame giving story, you know, it's the widow's might.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_04: It's not, you know, he was watching a bunch of guys put a bunch of money in, making no comment, and then he said, Wow, that's really giving.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_04: So I don't think that I don't think God's impressed with the magnitude.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_04: People, people can be.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_04: And when they say you gave$55 million last year and they're gonna give 70 million this year, they think, wow, that's incredible.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_04: Well, we've never given away a nickel that God didn't give us.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it's God's money, He's He's grown this business, and we don't own it.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_04: We didn't, you know, it was it's his thing, and we're just trying to be good stewards of it, trying to be a good conduit of of what God has brought in.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_04: We want to distribute out, and that's that's been our story for the last almost 40 years.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_03: But it's you know, for me, again, I'm I'm 45.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_03: I first heard your story.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I think it was a generous giving conference.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_03: Um, it may have been sent to me on a cassette tape, it may have been sent on VHS tape.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_03: It was a while back.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_03: But like when I saw it, the thing that struck me for the first time is is like there's people that have intentionally given what hit their bank account first, maybe.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_03: But it was the first time that I saw a business kind of at that level saying, okay, how does the business itself kind of become more of the conduit?
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_03: Versus like hitting the bank account, leaving up to the family in the ways that like the principles of some of the things at the Grove and some of the things of what you guys were doing, and candidly just the way that you guys went public with it.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_03: I have to imagine that was also a little bit of the accountability to it, because once you stand up in front of people and say that, you're you're kind of locked in.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_03: You're kind of boxed in.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and it wasn't a big company, it was 10 guys in '86.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_04: It was a million and a half dollars.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_03: But nonetheless, people with 10 people don't do that today, as normally as we probably should, yeah, to box yourself in that that way.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_04: No, no.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_04: And we did it for self-preservation, not not because we're overly spiritual people.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_04: We saw all these warnings, and I didn't want those warnings to be my story.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_04: I didn't want the money to wreck, I didn't want it to wreck me, I didn't want it to wreck my brother and our families.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_04: And so I I thought, I don't know why more people don't do this because Jesus is just waving this, you know, just over and over again talking about money.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_04: And when it comes to stewardship, a lot of people want to move into time, talent, treasures, etc.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_04: And I I'm good, I mean, I do believe that we're we have stewardship of all of those things.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_04: Stewardship is more than money, but it's not less than money.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_04: Jesus talked about money over and over again.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_04: There's something about opening your hands and letting your money out that's hard and that is it's hard and it's therapeutic and it breaks the power of greed, and it he all of his warnings, all of his requirements that God gives are all for our benefit.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_04: He doesn't he doesn't need our money.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, he doesn't want our money, he wants us.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_04: And and but he knows, he knows how our heart works, and he knows that money can capture our heart very easily.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_04: Greed is an insidious thing.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_04: And and being generous breaks the power of greed.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_04: And so it was more self-preservation, I think.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_04: And I think we have been the beneficiaries of this, not the um not the givers.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_04: We've been the beneficiaries.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_03: I think a lot of people miss that.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_03: And I think it's interesting hearing you say that, like, hey, we wanted to protect our family.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_03: You know, Henry talks about it, like, man, I want to experience the joy, like whether it's protection or joy.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_03: Some people on the outside, it's both.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_03: And people sometimes, I don't know why.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe it's maybe it's something of um from my upbringing or whatever church is like, like, well, wait a second, this can't be about you.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_03: This can't be about personal, but it was like, no, no, no, wait a second.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_03: Like, God designs us, he wants us to experience joy.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_03: He wants to he wants your family to flourish.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_03: And he wants to give you kind of that that cheat code to dethrone this attack that's kind of being made.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_03: I think we've missed that.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_03: It's like just like the personal wellness flourishing benefit that comes with that.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, he doesn't want our enemy to get a hold on us.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_04: And money is one of those uh choice tools of our enemy to do that.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: Trafficking, structural hunger, a billion people without the Bible in their language.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_00: These aren't unsolvable.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_00: They're just uncoordinated.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_00: At solving the world's greatest problems, we're a community of givers taking on the root causes of the world's deepest suffering, and we're taking them on together.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: We've identified more than 30 of the world's greatest problems, and the list keeps growing.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: We work alongside the entrepreneurs, investors, and ministry leaders already in the fight, and we fund the breakthroughs happening right now.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: Here's where it starts.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: Choose your problem and start your journey with one of our foundation courses.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: You won't just hear about the work, you'll see the breakthroughs, and give directly towards them.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_00: Come on your own, bring a few friends, or host a room and set the table.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_00: Come join the fight and find your people.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: Learn more at solving.org.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: Under his power for his glory, together.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_03: So when somebody's listening to this, like ever since the first time you spoke at a conference that we did with right now media, like everybody comes up to me like that's great talk, amazing talk.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_03: What's the number?
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_03: What's the number?
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_03: What's the number?
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_03: Where should you stop?
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_03: And it and and I remember, I don't know, in our twenties or thirties, even our our community group and life group, we had a couple I I would just watch the two people just go at this conversation of like, it's this number, no, it's this number, it's this number, it's this.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_03: And when you see that, because it happened.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, sure.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_03: I gotta imagine that's probably one of the top questions you're asked.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_03: Always.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_03: When people ask that, what do you think is happening behind that, or how do you receive that question when you hear it today?
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it's a little bit like who when they ask Jesus, who's my neighbor, and he tells them the Good Samaritan.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_04: I think my answer is always, I have no idea what God is calling you to.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_04: Um, ask the owner.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_04: You know, God is the owner, you are the steward, but ask him what he wants you to do.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_04: And and as you're trying to figure out his answer to that, you use scripture, use um your brain, um, you're not gonna probably get An audible number, you're not going to get a number written down, probably.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_04: But you can have concepts of you're part of the body of Christ.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_04: You are not entitled to anything.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_04: The fact that you the fact that you earned it, if you go into Deuteronomy 8, it says, remember, I'm the one who gave you the ability to earn money.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_04: Please remember that.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_04: Don't forget that.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_04: He says over and over again.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_04: And so to process it through with the owner as to what is appropriate for you.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_04: And I we use the term tools and toys.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_04: But there's also a bunch of toys that I think can be a pitfall, things that you fall in love with, things that you or that you uh are proud of, or that you that that kind of feed you, uh, you know, create an identity for you because you have things.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_04: You know, we're not built to be satisfied with stuff.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_04: There's no stuff that will satisfy us.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_04: And so I think that's the trap that people fall into.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_04: And so I think to ask the owner what he wants you to do, hold everything with an open hand and say, God, what do you want?
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_04: And uh, I'm gonna try to listen and I'm gonna, you know, to to think I'm part of the body of Christ, which is a global thing, and there are brothers and sisters all over the world that are really in a lot different situation than we are.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_04: And if we can ratchet back our lifestyle 10%, we can quadruple the benefit of their their ministry, you know, to sometimes buying a person a bicycle or double their ministry.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_04: And and uh, you know, so we could there's so many things that we can do, given that we live in this wildly affluent society, um, to be good parts, good parts of the body of Christ.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_04: And uh as soon as we have to get to the point of saying, none of this is mine, yeah, it's all God's.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_03: What's been the hardest conversation?
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, uh raising a family, kids, yeah, what has been that moment where like if an entrepreneur is listening to this and they're saying, like, man, I'm I'm all right, let's go, let's go time, let's let's step into this.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_03: What are the points that you should say, be prepared to be stretched here?
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_03: Like, you know, I mean, anybody, like when we started having kids, people are like, hey, when when you get outnumbered and you have three kiddos against two parents, like that's a point where something changes.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_03: What's the point in that conversation when it got stretched?
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it depends on what where you are in the pro if it's if it's early on.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_04: The reason I like talking to college kids is because they don't have the disease yet.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_04: You know, and to get the vaccine before you get the disease, I think can really be helpful.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_04: It was what that's when God changed my life, and I think it was so, I'm so thankful that He did.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_04: So I don't know what to say to the person, particularly if husband and wife are not aligned, um, then I would say, go to jogs, get around generous people, expose yourself more and more.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_04: You're in danger, recognize you're in danger, and and start trying to dig yourself out of this danger.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_04: Um by being around, by by reading scripture together, by uh considering things.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_04: You know, you you've got to get aligned with your wife, or things are gonna, it's gonna Satan will use that.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_04: You know, it's he can use your giving to mess up your yeah, your marriage or your life, your family.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_04: Um, so um expectation management is huge.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_04: So for your kids to know, um, I mean I'm a big proponent of not leaving a bunch of money to your kids.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_04: I think it's dangerous.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_04: I think money's dangerous, and I think doing that is really dangerous, and there's lots of data that would show that being generally not a good thing to do.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_04: And and the times when it's there are people that inherit money and it becomes a very positive thing.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_04: My supposition is they'd be fine either way.
• 26:23
  unknown: Yeah.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_04: It's not like if they had not gotten that money, they'd have still been fine.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_04: Um, their head was screwed on right.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_04: Um, so why why take the risk?
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_04: And you really don't know.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_04: But you know, some people get ruined by money, and some people just get demotivated or or you know, it kind of blunts their their production.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um Is that hard for your kids?
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_03: I I remember the the video that you guys did with generous giving.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_03: There was a glimmer from your son that was like, I'm thankful for this.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_03: But you can tell like there's a processing that that you've gone they've gone through with you.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_03: Like what is that journey like?
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, we're all human beings.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, there's all you know in this world is bombarding us with stuff.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_04: And they all were, they all had friends that were getting fancier stuff.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_04: And yeah, so that means they they were they all neat wanted stuff.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_04: And uh, and we did things, and we we had the theology of like special treats.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_04: You know, in scripture there's like these feasts that they had.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, yeah.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_04: They were just many days, big feasts.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_04: Kill a whole bunch of cows, and I mean, really, we're gonna live it up.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_04: And and so there are times when we'd go to the beach and you know, we'd go out and get ice cream and you know, special treats.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_04: Um and and but the fact that we weren't doing that every day made those things special.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_04: And so my kids kind of grew up in a um uh a relatively simple lifestyle with special treats.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_04: And and uh, but we we we didn't consider the company ours, and so they didn't ever consider it theirs.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_04: And so, you know, in in 08 we transferred the stock of the company into a ministry, so we don't own it anymore.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_04: And and some people think, weren't your kids hacked off?
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_04: You know, the thing was worth hundreds of millions of dollars, and you just and you just sent it out, you know, you gave away their inheritance.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_04: And and I said, I didn't give away their inheritance.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_04: They have a rich inheritance, an inheritance of faith, of work ethic, of education, of you know, the tools to function in our society, and and that's the that's the inheritance we want to give them.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_04: And and uh giving them a bunch of money, I think, would be counterproductive to them being productive people in the in general.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_04: So so my kids were not hacked off.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_04: They they we didn't see it as ours, they never saw it as theirs, but I think expectation management's huge.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_04: And if so, if you're further down the line and you have particularly grown kids who are banking on your millions of dollars coming to them in the future, uh you got to take there's got to be a process to bring them along and to um you know communicate that, and it won't necessarily end well for all of them.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, do you think that um there's been so much intentionality about generosity conversations, so much incredible work, generous giving, generosity path, and other things.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_03: And yet the the volume of the world when it comes to greed has gotten seemingly louder and louder.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_03: Do you think today we're more greedy than we were 20, 30, 40 years ago?
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_03: Do you think that we're making progress to it?
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_04: Is it what what how would you I think it was a really, really big deal 2,000 years ago?
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_04: I really do.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, and you think what their standard of living was 2,000 years ago?
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_03: It's not a Jesus juke, that was just a Jesus juke that you went you went back 2,000 years ago.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_04: It was a big deal 2,000 years ago.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_04: I think it was a big deal a hundred years ago.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_04: It's not a mat it's it's the heart that Jesus is after, and and this money pollutes that.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_04: And so I think, yes, I mean, I think I think the excuses I is God more put off with us about how wildly affluent we are and how we still want more and more and more.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_04: Um I don't think he's surprised by it.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_04: He said, you know, godliness with contentment is great gain.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_04: And then he goes on to talk about the 1 Timothy 6, where the you know, people who want to get rich plunge themselves into ruin and destruction.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_04: And you know, there's that those terrible warnings, but he starts off with godliness with contentment is great gain.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_04: You just don't get contentment by getting what you want.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_04: There's no thing that you're gonna ever get that's gonna make you content.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_04: You get contentment by enjoying what you have and being thankful for it.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_04: And yeah, and that that's not like um that's that's that's a good life.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_04: That's not like a sacrifice life.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, my whole life has not been a sacrifice of, you know, I've oh, I've been so spiritual, I've been willing.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_04: If it had been hard, I don't think I'd have made it.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_04: God has been just, it's been a joy.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_04: And that's why, you know, what we still we didn't tell our story for the first 15 years that we were doing this.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_04: You know, we don't let the left hand know what the right hand's doing.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_04: It was we decided to start telling our story because we saw it as, you know, people encouraged us to.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_04: They said, this is really something God's done, and you need to be willing to give him the credit.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_04: You know, that that don't let the left hand know what the right hand's doing.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_04: A couple of verses earlier it says, let your light shine before men in such a way they see your good works.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_04: Um my goal or my prayer is that it sets people free.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_04: Not that we extract money from them.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_04: You know, we don't, we don't, God doesn't need their money, he wants them.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_04: So my prayer is that there's freedom in this area, to which I think right now there there was predictably 2,000 years ago, there was lots of bondage in this area.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_04: A hundred years ago there was, today there is.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I'd say we have less excuse today than than people.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_04: I like that.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_03: I like that idea.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_03: Like there's less excuse.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_03: And I think in part of that, I mean, just thanking you and Catherine for sharing this story.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_03: And I mean, I'm reminded of, you know, the first time I was telling Mart this earlier this morning, it's like 15 years ago, showed up in David's office in Oklahoma City.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, David, like, here I am, this college student.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_03: I go to a school that, you know, has a lot of faith communities to it with Baylor.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm thinking, like, how is it that I did go to a business school in a place like Baylor, and I haven't seen or heard examples or stories of like this of entrepreneurs intentionally integrating their faith?
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_03: I was like, man, something's got to change.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_03: And I, you know, you could feel and sense this like tussling of just like wrestling of like, man, and I I think it's kind of probably like what you talked about with money.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_03: There's like this fear of like, man, if if I tell this story, too much could be made of me versus made of God.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_03: And I think it was like this moment for me that I'd say, like, the the best stories are the stories that kind of don't want to be told.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_03: But there's this moment, and I mean, having this conversation with somebody else right now is like, there's this moment where I'm like, people need to know.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_03: Twenty years ago, they need to know what it looked like to do that as an entrepreneur.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_03: Today, people need to know what this looks like in generational conversations and how you have these conversations with kids.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_03: And and and I would say, you know, again, just as a word of encouragement and affirmation, that you guys telling your story, the greens and others telling your story, I think set loose the creative imagination of people to now say years later, oh, I can think of this story and that story and this story and that story, and hundreds of stories.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_03: Not just the one random, you know, sounds like a fish tail story.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_03: One person.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_03: But like the we have to do it, but it's the posture in which we tell that story that we always have to be reminded, God makes the ways.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_03: And it all this is coming from Him.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_03: But all that to say, I'm so grateful that you guys stepped into the moment to share that story because I I don't probably feel called to do the things or what I feel called to step into in this moment.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_03: And I know thousands of others of entrepreneurs would say the same thing.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_03: If we hadn't seen the faithfulness of the way that you guys led through that.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_03: So thank you for that.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_04: No, and and I do think each of us has a stewardship of our story.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_04: And we need to process our motivations for telling it and who to talk to about it.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_04: But but I think each of us has a story that that and stories can change people.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_04: Um more so than theory.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_04: And and so I think people we can encourage each other um you know to to encourage each other along in our faith by telling our stories.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_04: And the Bible's full of stories that are encouraging and warning.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_04: And I think we need to be telling each other and reminding each other of these stories and and being willing.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_04: You know, I think there's a lot of people that um have God has shown them some pretty important things, and and I think it I would encourage them to take seriously the stewardship of their story.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I want to step in as we kind of the next kind of part of the conversation, we kind of come to a close with this.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_03: I I'd love to unpack some of this thoughts of just like you've done um you've done intentional giving and collaboration.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_03: And that started with really inside the walls of the business.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_03: But I think that that's marked you guys as a couple and as a team and as a foundation.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_03: Like, just talk about that joy and the challenge of getting people in alignment on where to give, what that looks like.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_03: What did you guys start learning at the Grove?
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_03: And what have you guys learned since of like what collaborative giving can do?
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_03: It's a great question.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_04: Because I I we kind of quit using the term giving away, but investing kingdom dollars in ministry is um it's not easy.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_04: It's uh it's and we want to be as strategic in doing that as we are in making of money.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_04: Um we uh we learned the great benefit of doing it together, to not having uh unilateral decisions by anybody.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_04: And so um all of the stuff goes through a process, and there's a board of 10 of us, and there's 60 of us within the companies that are um coming up with the recommendations and the portfolios that we invest in.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_04: Um I think doing it on purpose rather than being responsive, being proactive, uh, I think to understand that all of us are gonna ignore 99.99% of the need in the world, we have to.
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_04: We're either gonna ignore it by not learning about it or by saying no to an opportunity.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_04: But just because an opportunity is presented doesn't mean that God is asking us to step into it.
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_04: And so just because there's an emotional appeal or if we we can we can really start um and and we When did that shift for you?
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_03: When did it shift from when did it shift from the emotional meets, you know, I like how our Mart says it, I want to be data informed, but I want to be spirit-led.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_04: Yes, yes.
• 37:18
  SPEAKER_03: Like when did it become kind of that combination of both and not just the emotional side?
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_04: You know, in the in the maybe 87, 88, we connected with the McClellan Foundation.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_04: At that point, we were just writing checks to focus on the family because we listened on the radio to them and you know what whatever.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_04: Um and they they invited us in, they've been doing it for years, you know, a hundred years or something, and they said, here's our portfolio, here's our strategy, here's our here's our grant uh book, and they showed it, they just talked to us about strategy.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm a business guy, and it strategy makes perfect sense.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_04: And so we were like, Yeah, why didn't we think of that?
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_04: And so uh we did we and we just started connecting with other givers and hearing what they were doing, people that were way ahead of us on the uh in the process, and uh and started focusing on indigenous folk, you know, ministries in hard places.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_04: Um and and then that kind of gave us a more of a narrow focus, which has really been helpful.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_04: So now we only we only fund things in four areas of the world.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_04: Um we do things in the U.S., wherever we have branches, we do relatively small things, but 95% of the funds go to go to the four four hard areas of the world, um, and then some to Bible translation and some to leadership development.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_04: Those are the six things that we do, and um we basically say no to everything else and we don't feel bad about it.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_04: You know, it's like God bless you, what you're doing sounds wonderful.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it's just not what what we're doing.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_04: And I think um to focus on one or two or three things, I think is uh really helpful.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_04: The other thing that I think can be careful we have to be careful with.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_04: People say, what are you passionate about?
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_04: Um or maybe even more uh how would you rephrase the question?
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_03: What do you mean?
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_04: I'll put it back in to make it even more sinister and say, what are you what gets you really excited or what makes you really feel good?
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_04: Um what gives you warm and fuzzies?
• 39:22
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, those are to me that's dangerous stuff.
• 39:24
  SPEAKER_03: It's given you know what does God want me to be involved in, and how do I process that through, not in light of what it's gonna do for me, yeah, but in light of being a good steward and well coming back to the earlier point, uh experiencing joy from that is a good thing, but there's a head part to the heart, there's a data part to the spirit, you know, led and data informed.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: It's not mostly joy, it's work.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_03: It's hard, it's it's you know, um to do it intentionally with rigor is hard.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, giving away money and just writing a check, yeah, you can do that, but to do it intentionally, that's work.
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, like being a parent is work.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, there's a joy in being a parent and it's work.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_04: And mean being a grandparent maybe is a little bit more on the fun side.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_04: But but I think in this case, we're parents of the, you know, we're the we're the we're the stewards of this money, and we need to figure out how to do that well.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_04: And and and you know, it's it's subjective, and it's but it but I think if people only are attracted to things that make them feel good, yeah, I think that's a it may work out okay, but it's a dangerous.
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_04: I think there's a something to be avoided.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_04: Spoken like a true engineer.
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_03: Spoken like a true engineer, maybe background.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_03: But I I resonate with that, and I think I'd wrap that with just kind of like what Mart said is is like, yeah, how do we be spirit-led but data informed?
• 40:51
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that that's a moment that we're here in.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_03: How hard is it to then, you know, you talk about just incredible, incredible history, experience, and lineage of McClellan.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, yeah.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_03: And yet there's also the kind of this moment, and and maybe I'm asking this just from the question of the other entrepreneur that's listening to this, that's saying, like, hey, I'm used to having a big vote in my family, a big vote in my business.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_03: You wait a second, you want me to partner with other strong-willed, hard-charging entrepreneurs and to maybe do something collaboratively?
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_03: Like, what is that like as an entrepreneur to kind of then sit at the table with other very passionate, talented experiences and say, okay, how do how do we figure this out together?
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it to me, it just is almost a necessity if you want to go to hard places and do hard things.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_04: It's to try to do that by yourself, to me, it would be a blunder.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_04: And people that can be very successful in business and make a lot of money sometimes are under the illusion that they can do anything.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_04: And that they can they can come up with an idea and they can start an organization, and and they actually can if they have enough money.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_04: And you can go into another country and you can hire away a bunch of staff from existing organizations that are really doing good things because you're gonna pay them twice as much, and you can start a thing that's got a great video, and and it's likely that it's gonna be counterproductive to the overall kingdom impact, even though your thing looks pretty good.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_04: So I I think um I think that working in collaboration is the only way we would feel really comfortable.
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_04: The Middle East is it's really tricky, you know, and how the how the heck do you go figure that out?
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_04: And and most people don't have the energy to go figure it out.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_04: We certainly don't.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah so to join with 40 or 50 other donors who are pooling a bunch of money and now can get good research done and good study done just made sense to us.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_04: And yeah, you know, if you're giving away a hundred dollars, it's no big deal either way.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_04: But if you're trying to give away a million dollars or five million dollars, yeah, you know, it's it's you can do more harm than good.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_04: You know, and I think to study stuff like the good when uh when helping hurts and toxic charity and those things will just kind of scare you a little bit.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_04: But I think it'll also push you toward let's let's try to be more careful and do it together.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_04: Um and um you know, the some of those collaborations will let you be as involved as you want to be.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah um, but and and you can put your whole brain into it and yeah, you know, one of our guys probably spends 30, 40 percent of his time on SRG, even though he has a full time job with us um and has had a huge impact on it.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_04: Other people give to SRG and write a check once a year, and yeah, you know, it's it's not they don't have any and I think it that's what that's what's that's where collaborations are really helpful.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_04: And that's why we're trying to invest some of our, not just our money, but also Some of our um thinking and and people in trying to start more collaborations because we think they're they're powerful.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_04: So we're looking at one in West Africa now and Southeast Asia and um but not doing it ourselves, doing it with a bunch of other folks that have been been working in that area for years, funding work in that area for years, and we're trying to pull things together.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_03: It's a beautiful partnership when you think about that, when you can have people that you know have the intentionality, the diligence, the rigor, they rolled up their sleeves and committed deeply to it.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_03: And yet the person that's, you know, I don't know if I would put an age to it, but let's call it the 35-year-old entrepreneur that's building, they're ascending, they got the kids, and they're just trying to make things happen.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_03: They're like, man, I'd I'd love to give intentionally, but I don't have the time to do that.
• 44:47
  SPEAKER_04: I don't have the time.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_04: And and I don't want to set up a McClellan foundation with 30 staff to to do this.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_04: But you can have the access to that 30 staff in collaborations and and or in corner with cornerstone staff and and with the Grove staff.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_04: And you you can have uh you can get the benefits of those collaborations and and uh um feels like it's a fun moment if our if we're kind of coming into some final thoughts.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_03: Like when you think about the 80s, there was that seeds of stewardship kind of mindset.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_03: You talk about the 90s again, it's like, all right, the platform, the business, like like whatever you've been entrusted to, your time, talent for using cliche words, like we can use that too.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_03: Early 2000s, maybe it was the language of business as mission that was kind of like the first thing where people like, wait, the business itself can be a vehicle.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_03: And it was that darn, you know, S at the end, business as missions that had that context of, oh, but it had to be over there.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_04: Over there, yeah, yeah.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_03: But then the pendulum swung back, and whether it was work as worship or faith at work or whatever it was, it has kind of brought this mindset of like anywhere and everywhere.
• 45:56
  unknown: Yes.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that now there's this moment where entrepreneurs have said, yes, how we lead, how we build, what we do inside the walls, how we care for our team, all of that matters.
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_03: But also, like, what if we turn on this other engine of what if we be just as intentional with the capital that we've been entrusted and that we steward from that business?
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_03: And it feels like it's this beautiful moment that's been kind of like 30, 40, 50 years in the making, where it's like entrepreneurs not just the ATM machine of the church, yeah, but it's like, no, it's the platform, the business, and the fruit that comes from it.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_03: How do we really put all of those kind of forward?
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_04: Amen.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it's I think that's exactly right.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_04: And I think going back to the stewardship of the money, I mean, giving an art in the U.S.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_04: has such massive tax benefits.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_04: Uncle Sam is subsidizing that gift to the tune of somewhere between 30 and 40 percent.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, um, depending on what state you live in or whatever, it's huge.
• 46:57
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_04: And and to save it up until you die and give it away, you get no tax deduction then.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_04: You know, and you just you've just blown 30 or 40 percent of God's money.
• 47:07
  SPEAKER_03: Not to mention the compounding impact.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_04: The compact that you've invested in people all this time.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_04: And as you've invested in people, that's got a multiplying impact.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_04: So that's why I'd so encourage people, you know, some people want to uh save it up and let their kids give it away.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_04: I said, your kids don't want to give this away.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_04: They don't want to do that.
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_04: You know, and why would you why would you not sh just you do it and show them if you think it's that easy for that your kids can do it, why don't you do it?
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_04: It uh so it I think it's that people don't because it's hard.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_04: And it it is stinking hard.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_04: And that's why I think collaborations are a good answer to that is join with some other folks that are doing it.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_04: Don't don't feel like you gotta figure this out on your own.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_04: It's not easy, but do it.
• 47:51
  SPEAKER_04: But but I think definitely do your giving now.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_04: And um, yeah, I think I think people that are wealthy in the US should be giving away 60% of their income every year because to not do so, you're gonna pay the tax on it.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_04: And it's it's all God's money.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_04: Why are you deploying that much of God's money?
• 48:09
  SPEAKER_04: You know, as long as you've got what you need to live.
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, uh, you know, I'm not talking about people that are making$50,000 a year need to do that, but if you're making a lot of money, why why would you yeah, why would you keep storing it up?
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and you're only getting to store up 60% of it.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_04: You know, it's it's uh it's all God's stuff.
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_04: Deploy it, you know, deploy it sooner.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_03: Amen.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_03: Good word to land on.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_03: Grateful for you guys.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_03: The example, the encouragement that you've been to so many people.
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_03: Very, very grateful.
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_04: Well, thank you.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_04: You know, our people, I think they vlogged like 20,000 hours on um the uh Right Now Media.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_02: Right now Media.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_02: That's fun.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_02: That is fun too.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_04: Thank you for cranking that thing out.
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's fun to do that with Brian and the team.
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's fun to do that.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_04: I hate to think, I mean, it's got to be zillions of hours of of use now across the It's really it's been encouraging.
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, you can be on trips and things uh all on the other sides of the world and and you hear those stories and see those stories and hear people say an encouraging word.
• 49:03
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's been fun.
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_03: Well done.
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_03: Well, friends, uh, we like to end each podcast with this idea of like an action.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_03: We don't want to leave you short with just some hype and some pep rally.
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_03: So maybe I'll just finish it with where we landed there.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_03: Um, just this idea of sometimes stories can put good handles on it.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_03: And we didn't even show you guys 200 wheel trucks and 300 wheel trucks or however many wheel trucks it is.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_03: But there's an incredible story that our friends at Generous Giving uh produced about Alan and Catherine's story that I just encourage you, just watch it, but watch it through the lens of not just as a consumer, not as somebody just watching it, but saying, what are you gonna do?
• 49:37
  SPEAKER_03: What's that step that you're gonna take today?
• 49:39
  SPEAKER_03: And so sometimes that's that step at home that you're united on what's the plan, what's our why?
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_03: What's the ways that we're gonna protect our family from some of these dangers as our business grows?
• 49:49
  SPEAKER_03: And so take that step, maybe take that step with a friend, uh, maybe with another peer or somebody that you can just kind of have that conversation out loud with to really make that something that somebody's gonna ask you about a few months later and say, hey, have you have you done something about it?
• 50:04
  SPEAKER_03: So watch that, dive into it, dive into ways that you can be in community with other people, that you might be able to give together and experience the joy of that part of the journey.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_03: It's always great being with you, and we look forward to seeing you guys on the next episode.
• 50:18
  SPEAKER_00: So, what are your next steps?
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_00: Give together.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_00: Meet friends and discover how you can go further.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_00: Join us on the call, and we'll give you a 30-minute overview of giving funds and how they work.
• 50:29
  SPEAKER_00: Visit solving.org to join the call today.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_00: Pick a fund and step into the story.
• 50:36
  SPEAKER_00: Breakthroughs are happening right now.
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_00: God is already at work, and you're invited to join him.
• 50:41
  SPEAKER_00: To learn more, visit solving.org.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_00: That's solving.org.
• 50:47
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• 50:50
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for listening, and we hope that you join us in solving the world's greatest problems.