Latest / Off The Shelf With Phil and Dave- A Movie Review Podcast / 1993's Carlito's Way

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1993's Carlito's Way · Off The Shelf With Phil and Dave- A Movie Review Podcast

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Hello and welcome to Off the Shelf with Phil and Dave, the
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movie talk show where each week one of us takes movie off our
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Shelf presents it to the other for discussion.
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This week, coming off of Phil's shelf, 1993's Carlito's Way,
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written by David, Kept and directed by.
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Brian. Depalma, Brian.
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Depalma. That's it.
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Brian with an I. One of the absolute greats.
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Yeah, this third one, yeah, Yeah, check the archive.
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It's accurate. Buddy, for some reason I thought
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he did. Draft day.
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Why did I think? I don't know, that's a real
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tough one. You were talking last week about
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the split screen camera, Maybe that through that.
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Yeah, you did. Yes, that's what I did.
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Use a split screen in draft day. So I'm not.
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Crazy poor execution. Incept these thoughts in my head
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and they. They grow, I'm more educated man
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might be able to get through it but.
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Any who Phillip? Well, why is this movie under
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shelf? Thank you for asking first and
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foremost. My pleasure always.
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I love this movie. When I first saw it as part of
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the good enough reason of the black box, early to mid 90s that
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I've mentioned a number of times.
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I was only 14 years old in this movie came out, so I wasn't
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really that familiar. I'd loved The Untouchables, so
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I'd kind of known that director that way, but not in that
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capacity. Yeah, like just not.
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This is a diploma movie. It's Pacino.
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It's a gangster, I mean. What age did you start doing
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that? You thought more about the
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director? I think we talked about this a
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little bit around probably Pee Wee's big adventure into Batman,
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Edward Scissorhands, right? I think Tim Burton was the first
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director. I was like this guy makes these.
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Moves. I knew we did touch on it.
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Thank. You, I think he would probably
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be the one that is most aligned because he has such a
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distinctive style. And now you'd look at something
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like Wes Anderson and you would say, yeah, this is a Wes
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Anderson movie. Even if I was nine years old,
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I'd be able to know the same guy made this movie.
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Is that movie as that movie? He's a pastel.
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Colour, yeah, very specific visuals, language that's
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developed over time, but but very, very obvious.
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Loves the good luck. And Depalma, at this point, I
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wouldn't know him as specifically Depalma, but some
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of the marketing around this was from the director of The
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Untouchables and Scarface comes and I hadn't seen Scarface at
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the time, but I knew Pacino through Glengarry and Godfather
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movies. So it was enough familiar
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territory for me that I was like, I want to see this.
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And I just loved it right away. Now I like the trailer, I like
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the music. I It was just a thing that was
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in my zeitgeist for a while. I had heard about the movie, OK,
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but didn't know what it was about.
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You thought it was direction, like a Waze map maybe.
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Well, I gotta head Carlito's way rather than.
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I think this movie maybe would have done a little bit better,
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adjusted the title a little bit. A workshop, too.
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OK. And one of them is not what
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you're thinking. OK.
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I think it would have fared better if it was Carlito's Way
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or the highway. I think that's a good one, but a
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little lengthy. So the other one I went with was
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Carl's Way. Ohhh interesting.
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There's a lot of people named Carl.
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Yeah, especially in 93. Eighteenth most popular name.
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OK. And that's the connective tissue
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for them to go watch the movie. I'm Carl.
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I want to see the way. Which way do I go?
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Yeah. How many people are named
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Carlito or go by Carlito in the US?
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Maybe if you look around, probably a fair.
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Amount, but I'm not going to a David's way.
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That sounds lame. I'll go to Dave's way.
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Yeah, OK. Talking about alright.
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Anyways, I've seen Dave's way over these many years and I
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wouldn't advise touché. Step up for that.
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One, that's right. But let's just continue down
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Carlito's way and see what Old Faithful has to say about this
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particular film. Yes, we have here a recently
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released convict determined to avoid making the same mistakes
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as before his drawn into a fresh web of crime and corruption.
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It's a little generic. Do you think that that's the
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movie we watched? I wasn't paying attention.
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I was wondering myself, did you have to hit more on that?
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No more. No, really.
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You got it from the first screen.
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Absolutely. Oh, that's tight though.
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It is a little snug, but I've got the the edge Yeah screens.
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Sometimes true, sometimes I like generic.
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Yeah, OK, simple, straightforward, not
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complicated. Let me.
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Fill in the. Rest well.
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I think that that's appropriate because this movie to me, for
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all that I love about it, is pretty generic.
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And the fact that it hits a lot of the tropes correct, yeah.
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And we'll get into them as the movie goes on, but just
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fundamentally, it's not very complicated.
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It's not bringing a lot new to the table necessarily.
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It's taking a fairly generic gangster.
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Plot, but is able to elevate it in certain areas.
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Yeah, and that's performance. And I wouldn't say the writing
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necessarily, but definitely the performances and definitely the
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direction for sure. We all know Cap Cap is a such a
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hidden miss guy, but he's got his name on so many great
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movies, but he's also got his name on a whole lot of shit
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movies that's only bring the good ones off the shelf, and
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maybe this is one of them. Well, you brought Lost World off
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so too late, but just interesting writer for that.
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He can sort of succeed as well as he can fail, frankly.
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And De Palma is kind of the same.
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Blowout, I think is a masterpiece, as we've talked
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about years ago. The Untouchables, I think is in
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masterpiece. This, I would say, is incredible
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for what it is. Give me a couple examples of
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some duds. I know they're on your shelf
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regardless. Mission to Mars.
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OK, I'm going to like it then. I've been wanting to watch that
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movie. I've been yearning to see it
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because I love. I like Mars, sure, I like space.
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I need space sometimes. You like Tim Roth?
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Tim Robbins? Yeah.
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Don Cheadle, Particularly Don Cheadle, Yeah.
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So that was a movie that I thought was pretty terrible back
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in 2001 or 2 when it came out. And I'm less excited now that
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you mentioned Tim Robbins. He's not an infamy, OK?
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He's fine. He's sounds like he's out for
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you alright. Frank says it out.
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I mean, I love Arlington Rd., but he's certainly didn't go to
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theatres. For Snake Eyes with Nicholas
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Cage, also pretty bad. Black Dahlia with Josh Hartnett
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kind of bad. Snake Eyes A GI Joe story.
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No. That'd be pretty cool.
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For us there is a movie GI Joe thing, but it was a Snake Eyes
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lament or something nonsensical. But the movie Snake Eyes is set
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in Vegas. What the best GI Joe?
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Because he flips the good guy, he's a bad guy.
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Yeah, Storm Shadow is boy. Yeah, yes, great stuff, the GI
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Joe. It really is.
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You know Bruce is in one of those, so you'll probably take
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it off at some. Point, I have that movie at some
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point, I don't know where it was.
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It must have Yeah it yard sale. That's going to be the.
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Enabled yard sale. It's funny, most of the Bruce
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movies I put in a yard sale, they go, yeah, they're gone,
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yeah, which hurts me because I regret that yard sale.
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I wish I had a lot of these movies.
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I go to watch them like This is why I collect these things
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because I. Can't find it?
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Nope. On the one streaming service I
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subscribe to because I refuse to be correct, $5060.00 a month in
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fees subscriptions and yeah I can't find them.
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And then when you do find them, if you can find them, they're
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expensive. Yeah, and if you can find buying
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it twice like man. Like only the cream of the crop
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gets to be bought twice. Quick side note is I have a
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movie that I bought twice. I keep forgetting to bring it.
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I'll give it to you. It's just an old Navarone.
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Yes, I mentioned it to you. Yeah.
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Do you want it or? Of course.
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There's plenty of room on this shelf buddy.
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It's 4K. I don't limit myself to your 19
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slots. No, no, but I think it's because
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it had a different sleeve. You know when they do that, This
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is why they do that. Idiots like me to buy it twice.
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I bought all that jazz 2 separate occasions because of
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basically different. I actually have bought them
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three times purpose. That's the problem.
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Yeah, I guess that's. True, that's true.
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It was by accident. Used to buy who records who CD's
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like that too. Like reissue remastered.
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Got it. Let's do it over and over again.
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Yeah, they had a cowbell, I think. 10% more.
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Cowbell. What movie are we talking about?
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Again, I think Carl's Way, Carl, Carl's Way, or the highway.
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Yeah, Yeah. You're combining the two.
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Yeah, that's what you're saying. For the Highway, right off the
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bat I can tell that this movie has a bit of an artistic touch.
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Yeah, OK. In what way?
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The first opening sequence, it's black and white.
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Sure. Slow motion almost feels not
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real dreamy. Yeah, if you will.
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Or floating a little bit. Right, yeah.
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So it wasn't grounded and they could have scene from a movie
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and assume that something the Palma does if not before he does
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it 93. Yeah, I don't think he makes the
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same type of movie every time. He's got his choices.
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I wouldn't say that I know that particular move before, but it's
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very effective as a way to open into the movie.
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I'd like a director that switches it up new things but
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isn't too showy. Yeah.
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I mean, this is a director that I think is showing all the right
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ways. Well, that's what I mean.
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It doesn't come across as showing.
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I don't see showiness. I see a film that.
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I know you like because of what the director is doing, sure.
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And I know it's happening. Yeah, I'm appreciating it.
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But it's not clicking in so. That's perfect because the
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danger is something like a Shyamalan, right?
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Which we've talked about before, where it's a camera work just
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for the sake of it, or feels obvious, or feels noteworthy.
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And here comes this twist. Yeah.
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Whereas this guy, in this particular opening, it's
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designed to put you a little off because what it is doing
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ultimately, which we find out later, of course, is revealing
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more or less the end of the movie.
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But I don't know that it fully clocks.
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So that's a better question for you because I don't remember 30
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years ago. It's too bad.
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When you watched it, did you think I'm watching the end of
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the movie here? I wasn't 100% sure.
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I come in around 72%. OK, I'm like, I think it is, but
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maybe not. I feel like he's living a life
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where he's probably been shot before and he says that I
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believe exactly the first time. So maybe this is just what
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happened before, but 72%? Lock it in and then starting the
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voice over, getting shot after midnight.
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These guys always know, don't take me to the hospital.
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Yeah, he doesn't like Chinese interns.
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Edgy. I like that.
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I love his voice. Yeah, I don't know.
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What a great accent, great tenor.
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We've joked about this in the Great Wall with Matt Damon
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peeking. Oh yeah.
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Yeah, this is 93. Yes, it's a serious question.
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Is this Pacino at his? Peak.
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This is probably, if there could be a peak, it was right around
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this time because mainstream Machino, yeah, I mean, obviously
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he's in the Godfather and Godfather 2.
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That's 7274. That puts them right in right
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away, right? And then from there he's doing
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Dog Day afternoon in 76. He's doing Serpico.
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You know, he's he's on the ascent, right?
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And then 90 he gets nominated. Sent of a woman.
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He gets nominated for Dick Tracy.
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Dick Tracy in 90 didn't even know he was in it, but I'm
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trying to remember if he was nominated, if that was the year
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of Senate woman. I've been a year or two later.
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So that is where he wins his Oscar.
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I want to say 92 ish and then 93.
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Glengarry this right? Like so he's a mirror.
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Yeah, I believe so. Some of those dates might be a
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little mixed up, but after this, I would say it does start to
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decline a little bit. OK.
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So, yeah, I mean, there's a way that says this is the sort of
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last I mean. I just want to get it.
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Right. No, that's fair.
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In two years he does heat with Deniro.
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Yeah, OK. That's probably the ultimate
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the. Peak.
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Was he in 15 minutes as well? No, that's just.
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That's just an error and Ed Burns Burns Kelsey grammar your
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boy also in that oh. Really.
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Yeah, because I have the case for it.
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There's no disk in it. I really wish there was now.
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Yeah, give me some Kelsey. I have to watch Expendables 3.
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No big deal. Get it on the back end.
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Yeah, but one of my few slides that will come off for you,
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buddy. OK.
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Yeah, wonderful. Actually, that's four of them.
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So it's. It's there Four.
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Yeah, I believe so. OK, well, there's only one of
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Carlito's Way. That's right.
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Let's get back to Carlito's Way. What's next is what Kelsey
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Grammar does really good, actually.
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Good speech. Oh, yes.
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Great voice. Yeah.
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I did not recognize Sean Penn. Me neither.
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I mean, I did this time, obviously, but when I first
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watched it, it took about halfway through the movie before
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I was like, shit, that Sean. Penn says.
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Real hair I think it is actually.
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Yeah, I think he. Just I only see him in his like
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later years. I was never a Sean Penn.
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No, I think he, like, affected it.
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Like I think he shaved it back and like, you know, he's a
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method guy. This.
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I don't think Madonna's into that look.
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No, but that was 87, Steph. Is but not.
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Stepped into it for sure. Articulates it very well.
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He's so good. He is.
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He's like, I've been cured. Yeah, right.
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Five years. Reassimilate.
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Rejuvenated. Reinvigorated.
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Yeah, he just hits those. He's perfect notes and justice
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for All is another one, I guess to make a bunch of speech in
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Norman Jewison film also in the 70s Yeah, he's great in this.
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And watching Kleinfeld pen as Kleinfeld allow for the grace,
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right. He says, you know, after five
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years exonerated, give him a chance to speak.
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And the judge is so bored and frustrated by it. 56 other cases
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to do today, but he's like, let's go, let's go.
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But this is my time, Yeah. And he just delivers it.
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It's so good. And do you think it's sincere?
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He says right outside the courtroom afterwards that he's.
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Changed. Yeah.
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And he spends the rest of the movie effectively trying to live
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up to those same standards. And he says it over and over
13:09
again. I'm out.
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That's. It at the moment I wasn't sure,
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but yeah. The movie, yeah, I mean,
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certainly heard that. And this is the trophy kind of
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part, as you've heard, criminals, you know, this is the
13:17
last job. Even if they want to get out
13:19
clean, it sucks you back. Godfather Three, he gets to say
13:23
the same line in 1990. Actually, that's what it was.
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It was Dick Tracy and it was Godfather.
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Don't ruin it for me. You gotta know that line for
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God's sake. Come on.
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Who you talking to? That's right, movie TV.
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I can quote it all day long. Buddy, Yeah, I think The
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Simpsons may have done it. Yeah.
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Kleinfeld right away is trying to throw him into a another job.
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I got an idea. Come back to the office.
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We're gonna do a thing. And Carlito, if you will, is
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right away. I'm out.
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That's it. I'm done.
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He's very excited about it, too, and Penn can't understand it.
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He's like, what are you talking about?
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You don't like this? Doesn't.
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Doesn't. Work.
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Yeah, Dave says he's got something lined up for tonight.
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Yes, that sounded more a celeb celebrity.
14:02
Celebrity celebratory. Yeah, You struggled with it for
14:05
a second there. It's tough word.
14:06
Why do I bother? Why do I try to say this stuff?
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Words. Good question.
14:10
I like. Movies.
14:12
Misa. And we get a little window into
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Dave actually, in the next scene about his past.
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Who is Dave? Who is he?
14:23
He's a lawyer that seemed a little timid at first, a little
14:26
scared. That's how Pacino describes him.
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Look at you now. You're, yeah, moving and
14:30
shaking. Yeah, he's transitioned.
14:32
Yes, and with that ends up being the crux of really the that
14:36
relationship throughout the whole.
14:37
Movie which I didn't foresee. Like I didn't get that from this
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scene. No.
14:41
This movie has, I don't necessarily want to say a ton of
14:44
replayability, but there are four or five things that we'll
14:46
touch on. That's like, OK, that makes
14:49
sense because you said that in that scene.
14:50
This is a taste, a hint of Dave's dissent.
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Yeah, exactly. He's he's peeking now.
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Maybe everybody's about to. He's tweaking and speaking.
15:00
Yeah, not working. Though no, no, no.
15:01
Not on the dance. Floor not yet.
15:04
It's interesting. It does set up that relationship
15:06
as being one, that is, that the dirtier that Kleinfeld is
15:11
getting coincides with the cleaner, as it were, that Pacino
15:16
is getting. That's getting.
15:17
I don't know if that's just you digging a little bit, but De
15:21
Palma is a big fan of the contrast and that could be part
15:26
of that world. I don't know.
15:28
We'll see. We won't see.
15:30
It is what it is. Not going to ask them, no.
15:32
This is an opinion show. That's my opinion.
15:36
That's a good one. Thank you.
15:37
I think it's it's smart. And what effectively, Carlito
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explains to him in the bar when they're dancing with each other,
15:44
basically is he just wants to be a car salesman.
15:48
Yeah, in the Bahamas. In the Bahamas.
15:50
He's got a guy he knows and he says 70 grand, 75 grand.
15:54
He can be as in the early stages of steaks, right.
15:57
He wants $75,000 to do his dream in the Bahamas.
16:01
And what is he going to do to get there?
16:02
Good, bad, indifferent. Black, white or Gray?
16:06
Gray. Yeah, that's the question.
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And this is set up in the first sort of 1520 minutes of the
16:10
movie, which I'm impressed by. Well, Phil's time to hit the
16:23
streets with Juan Guzman. Louise.
16:28
Louise Guzman. Guzman.
16:30
Guzman, Yeah. Louise Guzman, Puerto Rican.
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That's right, he's Puerto Rican, yes, which tells me Pacino is
16:37
playing a Puerto Rican in this. Yes, Carlito Brigante.
16:41
Now I know he's Italian. Sure, Pacino.
16:44
So I was thinking about it and I think he looks more like a
16:48
Puerto Rican than Samuel Jackson did in Die Hard 3 Jesus in the
16:54
back of the taxi. Do I look Puerto Rican to?
16:56
You. Yeah, Yeah.
16:58
You remember that? Yes.
16:59
Yes, of course. The best part of the movie?
17:00
It's up there in the. First, the first half hour 45,
17:05
so I'm OK with that. Yeah, I.
17:07
Think I mean. He dresses himself up well
17:10
enough, it seems, with the beard and the accent.
17:13
Yeah, but you know, what's funny is that the movie kind of calls
17:16
him out on it a little later. I'm not sure if you caught that.
17:19
Oh, right near the end. Near the end.
17:22
I thought this guy, I think he's Italian, yeah.
17:25
Everything's a choice. That's it.
17:26
That's so you're like, if you're gonna cast the Italian to be the
17:29
Puerto Rican, you can at least comment on the fact that he
17:31
looks more Italian than Puerto. Rican.
17:32
I thought that was more realistic than his cousin being
17:35
his cousin. I felt it should have been his
17:36
nephew. OK.
17:37
I don't know where you at on that.
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How do you feel? I don't have a lot of feelings
17:42
about it. I mean, cousins could be any age
17:44
because a lot of variabilities and things like that.
17:47
I don't know. I think the impact would have
17:49
been more. That have been your nephew, you
17:51
know Well, cousin or nephew, David, there's an action.
17:54
An action. It's a piece of work that's
17:57
about to happen. Here.
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Yes, yes, indeed. The cousins.
18:00
Really proud of Carlito being a side guy.
18:03
Look how impressive I am going to be able to walk in.
18:06
He's ascending, that's right, he thinks so.
18:08
And he's got 30,000 bucks in his pocket.
18:11
He's feeling real, real high. I really like this guy.
18:15
He to me delivers the promise of hope and young guy so that I
18:23
know within one second that this guy is, yeah, is not long for
18:26
the world. But he plays that optimistic,
18:29
hopeful on the up. Look at me.
18:32
I'm a big guy on campus, you know, a lot.
18:36
I think he plays it really well. I think he's nominated.
18:40
Best cousin. Best cousin?
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Exactly. This scene, however, is not a
18:46
showcase for him. It's not even a showcase for
18:48
Pacino, although there are moments this is an element of.
18:52
The Palmas excellence, yes, I wrote down showcase scene.
18:57
It really is just as a generalization of it.
19:00
And right away Phillip, I can feel suspense or the fact that I
19:05
know it's coming. It's like pre suspense leading
19:08
into suspense. Is that a thing?
19:10
No pre suspense. We talked about this a little
19:13
bit in Rear Window. It's like surprise is you don't
19:16
know the bomb is underneath the table and it blows up.
19:19
And suspense is, you always know the bomb is underneath the table
19:22
and you're waiting to see what happens.
19:23
Hmm. And Dipalma is an excellent
19:26
master. He's a huge Hitchcock fan of
19:28
that building the suspense. So it's not got you.
19:31
I wonder what's gonna happen, You know, you know, something is
19:34
gonna happen. And the camera work and the
19:36
staging of it and the style of it and the look of it and the
19:39
cuts of it and all the pieces come together to tell you
19:43
something is going to happen and stretch out that feeling for as
19:46
long as comfortable. And this is a showcasing for
19:49
that. Were you ever uncomfortable?
19:51
Always. Because you know it's going to
19:53
happen, you just don't know. And it's Carlito's eyes work in
19:57
the room. Cause he's been in these rooms
19:59
before, right? Cousin is chilling.
20:01
He's got his back to the guy. He's oblivious.
20:04
Lacks. Experience.
20:05
Sure. Exactly.
20:06
But Carlito hasn't. He sees the room, the doors
20:08
cracked open a little bit. We get to see the people
20:12
playing. I use the washroom test run.
20:14
No, no washrooms broke like Harry.
20:17
I'll come back in a week. For a week, that's it.
20:20
That's funny like that. And so we're building this thing
20:24
up. Don't go in the washroom, OK?
20:25
Carlito's brain is going. There's something up in there.
20:27
I know it. I know it.
20:28
I know it. Toilet could just been plugged.
20:30
We don't. Know well we see the doors
20:31
plugged and we see a shadow of a guy.
20:33
So yeah, I missed the shadow. OK, you're not watching the
20:36
movie. Problem.
20:37
It's like I knew something but I have issues with shadows.
20:41
What you want to hear? I am shadow blind.
20:43
Storm Shadow. So this staging in the setup of
20:46
this scene is incredible. I like the camera work to the
20:49
gun. Yep.
20:50
Not obviously not obvious. Like it's it's supposed to be
20:54
obvious. Yeah, we know that this is
20:55
happening. It's not a surprise what's
20:57
happening. It's how and when.
20:59
And then playing into the pool, getting to his reflection like
21:01
why? Why is he asking to do this?
21:03
Or you're going to see the shot and then we get to see the
21:05
reflection in the guys glasses of the attack that's happening
21:09
and Bing bang boom. Before you know it, guns are
21:11
blazing, pool tables overturned gunshots.
21:14
It's just fucking incredible. I love so much this 10 minute
21:18
sequence. It's incredible.
21:20
And in later years, De Palma makes questionable decisions.
21:23
Movies are hit and miss, this and that.
21:25
This is perfection. And it's 20 years after the guy
21:29
made his first movie, so he's still at a level to me.
21:31
It's incredible. That his peak 93.
21:34
Maybe. Maybe, yeah, I thought the scene
21:36
was fantastic. Like I'm not necessarily
21:38
noticing some little things about the shot, but I'm hyper
21:43
focused on this, so I'm captivated.
21:45
I think that would be a great word.
21:47
I feel bad for the cousin. He just wanted a beer at the
21:49
bottom of that bridge. That guy's creepy too.
21:52
That bad dude like that's. He's always playing that guy.
21:55
Godfather 3 Ghost. He's never a good guy.
21:59
But he's dead, which is good. And it's got the great line from
22:03
the trailer, which I remember hearing over and over and over
22:05
again. You think you're big time,
22:07
you're gonna die big time, which in the movie is you're gonna
22:10
fucking die big time. But.
22:11
Yeah. That's great.
22:12
And then, yeah, he escapes out the back.
22:14
The worst thing of offence of this movie to me is how poorly
22:18
he washes his fingerprints off that gun.
22:20
I think this guy busted. OK.
22:22
So, OK, maybe, yeah. Anyway, it's just fantastic.
22:25
It throws in the garbage can, walks away and also another
22:27
thing around this time 9394, I have always wanted to dress in a
22:33
trench coat. I always I go, you can love the
22:36
look of a trench coat and you do it.
22:39
I've never been able to do it because I never think I can pull
22:41
it off You can't. Him wearing this coat in this
22:45
movie. I think he looks so good in
22:46
this. I don't.
22:47
Think you can pull it off, but I can see you wanting to pull it
22:49
off. Like I can see the desire in
22:52
your eyes of the trench coat. I had one buddy in high school,
22:55
Mark. Shout out to Mark, great guy and
22:57
he did it. He did the trench coat, did the
22:59
trench coat. There's a similar physique to
23:01
you. OK, well, you're pretty
23:03
gorgeous. Yeah, that's it.
23:06
The first choice of words, but yeah.
23:08
So maybe you could pull it? Off.
23:09
Yeah. I just.
23:10
I don't want to spend the money on a coat that I can't pull off
23:12
is the problem. But I love the look of a guy in
23:14
a trench coat. You should be able to rent.
23:16
I wish. I wish.
23:17
There's a business opportunity for you.
23:21
Speaking of business opportunities, Carlito takes
23:24
some money off the shelf. Yeah, takes the 30 grand he
23:27
does, that is true. And uses that as seed money for
23:30
the disco that Disco that Seinfeld threw him in, asked him
23:35
to, you know, get a part of this club. 25 grand Rinaldo's.
23:38
He's in a little. Deep.
23:39
I know him, Sasso. That's right.
23:41
I'll never call him Ron. So we talked before, how is he
23:44
gonna get this money? This is obviously dirty money,
23:46
but he didn't really do anything to get it.
23:49
Wasn't as I'd say, right? He just happened to be right
23:52
place, wrong time, right or wrong, wrong place at the right
23:56
time. Yeah, let's do.
23:57
That so far so. Good but he uses it.
23:59
He says to Dave like don't flow me any money, this is my money I
24:02
want in and he talks to Sasso and says I want all your end
24:06
because he basically buys him out.
24:08
Yeah, he's a funny guy. Yeah, Sasso, but he's got sticky
24:12
fingers in the till. Yes, Dave drops that earlier
24:16
than Sasos. He's great and everything's fine
24:19
except, yeah, that one issue is so deep in debt.
24:21
Yeah. So what I love is the shakedown
24:24
where Pacino is basically saying like, how much you in?
24:27
6070. OK, so that's 100 and it's to
24:31
this guy. And so he just knows knows all
24:33
the angles. And this character throughout
24:35
the whole movie is established as a guy who knows all the
24:39
angles right from that opening scene we just talked about all
24:41
the way through to the very end until the angles going to catch
24:45
up to him. And he alludes to that a little
24:47
later too, which just makes that character, I think, a little
24:49
more interesting than just crime guy trying to go clean.
24:53
There's some other layers I think at play here.
24:55
Yeah, it's not a super in depth character, no, but there's
25:00
stuff. There's complexity where there
25:02
doesn't need to be. And part of that I think is the
25:04
fact that it's, you know, Pacino is incredible actor and the
25:08
writing of the book, which I remember reading that a lot of
25:11
the voice over and a lot of the other elements are taken right
25:13
from the book. It's a collection of I think 3
25:16
books actually that they've kind of amalgamated into this one.
25:18
Got you. So that character, those
25:21
character traits, I think are there, and in part they're
25:23
buoyed by the fact that we've got Pacino involved.
25:26
I do want to ask you this, Phil. Have you been to a disco?
25:28
I know it's not as prevalent. No, no, I don't dance and there
25:34
are no discos anymore, so there's dance.
25:35
Clubs, I'm sure they have disco nights.
25:37
Yes, certainly, but. They put it all into one.
25:40
Night instead of like. You know, 7 day a week so.
25:43
That's right, no more Studio 54 in the world.
25:46
Yeah, great film, by the way. Ryan Phillippe, Mike.
25:48
Myers, Mike Myers. I don't think I'd enjoy so much
25:51
the fact that we're into coke now.
25:53
Yeah, he's explaining like it's not weed.
25:55
The answer is I don't know. And then we have a new
25:57
characters. Introduce Benny Blanco.
25:59
That's right, Yes, played by John.
26:03
Like was Alamo. Thank you.
26:06
And he doesn't wanna pay? No.
26:08
I've done the dining dash once. Not proud of it.
26:11
Yeah, this guy is not even dashing.
26:12
No, he's not. Dashing.
26:13
That's true. He's just dining his dining, and
26:15
he's waiting. Until he found out who he's
26:18
dealing with. Because Carlito's been around
26:21
and Benny seems like a new boy on the block and Carlito doesn't
26:26
take him serious at all. And you think you should?
26:28
That's all I'm saying. Leave that there.
26:30
But he thinks he's a punk, more or less.
26:32
Then he sits down. This girl named Steph approaches
26:35
him. Bit of a looker, yeah, I'd say.
26:36
Yeah. And my time.
26:38
It's it's funny as he says, I don't like anybody here but you
26:41
stuff. But he's looking at this blonde
26:44
dancing correct and it's beautiful.
26:47
Yeah, it's beautiful. The things that stick out to me
26:49
in this early scene in particular is frankly more
26:52
depalma, the ability to establish this geography.
26:55
If you remember in The Untouchables we walk into
26:57
Malones apartment, we know exactly where all the nooks and
27:00
crannies. Picture it right now.
27:01
Yeah, right. And blowouts the same.
27:03
The circular looking around is editing Bay.
27:06
All of that is established here with the camera walks in.
27:10
We got a first person shooter. The first person, we got a first
27:13
person shot. The maitre-d' is like, oh, hey,
27:16
notices, recognizes. We see the camera follows up the
27:19
stairs into the office, down over the dance floor underneath.
27:23
There is never a moment in this movie where you don't know where
27:27
each character is. And the more cuts you have, you
27:31
don't know where the geography is.
27:32
You don't know where. Oh, I'll out of the blue
27:34
something happens on the left side.
27:36
So the use of the camera to establish the room helps not
27:40
only now to establish where Carlito is in relationship, but
27:44
will continue to pay off throughout the rest of the movie
27:47
because there are three other sequences, if not action
27:50
sequences, that take place in this room that we don't need to
27:53
spend any extra time on because we've already seen it
27:55
established. It's a level of detail and level
27:57
storytelling and a camera ability that I think is
28:00
unmatched in almost any other. Director I think one of the side
28:02
effects of that, even though I may not notice it like you're
28:07
talking about I'm like yeah, OK, we're doing this for doing that
28:10
but I think it helps the pacing totally of the movie because
28:13
this movie isn't short No, for some reason this movie, I've
28:17
never seen it. I vaguely knew like maybe
28:19
Pacino's end up that's maybe all I knew but I got the sense like
28:22
this is a long movie sure it's going to drag.
28:25
I don't know why I'm thinking that, but I didn't feel that at
28:29
all. And maybe it's these types of
28:31
scenes of when he takes us for the tours that he's able to cut
28:34
out other stuff that we don't need that would maybe slow
28:37
things down a bit. It could be, or it's just so God
28:39
damn entertaining. That could be it.
28:41
Right. I mean, it does the same thing
28:42
with the camera work in that previous we talked in the pool.
28:45
He just does a great establishment of where you are
28:48
at all times so that when the hell breaks loose, nothing is a
28:51
surprise. 2nd, which was a breeze.
28:53
Like I just like wow, it's incredible. 2 hours.
28:55
I mean, I wasn't paying much attention.
28:57
But you're sleeping through. Sure, and the late night.
29:01
Yes, but you did establish which was watching a blonde.
29:03
Uh huh. And we get that.
29:05
What is that? That.
29:07
Is pretty cool. Yeah.
29:09
And this is where, like, I feel like Phil for a couple minutes
29:13
and everything's a choice. And I don't know if this is like
29:16
a De Palma specialty, but the contrast of music.
29:22
He's outside, it's raining, he's watching her dance.
29:25
I'm like, Oh my God, I am so loving this moment.
29:29
I just felt myself entranced. It quiets the movie down, right.
29:33
We've seen a lot of big shift, the music that you're saying
29:36
that, the clubs, the discos, all that, the big violence.
29:38
And to me he looks so pathetic. Well, I was gonna go that.
29:42
Far in the best ways, because we watched him.
29:45
Now he plays all the angles. He's a smooth criminal.
29:47
Fuck Billy Blanco, fuck, you know?
29:50
And then he gets to Gail's dance recital.
29:53
He's got the garbage can. Yeah, yeah.
29:55
That's. Good.
29:56
And he just looks so sad and forlorn looking at this lost
30:00
love. It's really beautiful, beautiful
30:02
moment. It makes a high status character
30:05
that we've been watching now for half an hour or whatever into
30:08
what I think is an incredibly low status.
30:10
It's a great juxtaposition of what we talked about.
30:12
So you. Got it and keeps us on our toes.
30:14
Like a ballet dancer. Now they make a date to chat.
30:19
Yeah. Coffee.
30:19
Talk, coffee. Talk amongst yourselves.
30:23
Discuss. What's odd to me personally is I
30:29
love the first half hour or so. I love the low status moment of
30:32
him watching her in the rain. I would hope so.
30:34
I totally have no interest whatsoever in this conversation
30:39
that they have, in fact most of the conversation.
30:42
So I wonder what your take is on this relationship being
30:47
established at this juncture and then how it may be plays out.
30:49
Throughout, That's surprising to hear Phillip by the end of this
30:53
movie would have thought the words perfection came out, no?
30:56
So you don't like basically this relationship, correct?
30:59
What I'm hearing correct, huh? This conversation, to me, stops
31:03
the movie dead. Hmm.
31:04
I wouldn't go that far. I think we need to establish a
31:09
relationship between the two. We have to have a history.
31:11
Why? Because we got to be in.
31:13
We got to be. I think why is she here though?
31:16
Like do you see a value in having?
31:18
Her in the movie. Her I like her as an actor,
31:21
Penelope Ann Miller like I think she's fine but this character to
31:23
me is like it's maybe 1 trope too many but you you're OK with
31:28
this? Like, I am 100% OK with that,
31:30
but maybe I'm not classic podcasting folks.
31:35
Have you watched it again and just skip her scenes and see if
31:38
it still works? Yeah, I think it's just adding
31:40
another layer. It's adding a little bit of
31:43
vulnerability to the character, but I didn't find it slowed down
31:46
the movie. And I have to say, I'm a little
31:47
disappointed to hear that from. You I don't feel.
31:49
It, but it's honest now. Did you prefer the coffee date
31:53
with Dave and the inmate? I don't know if there was any
31:57
coffee there necessarily. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
32:02
I just feel like this propels the movie and the stuff with
32:04
GAIL, I don't know that it does. It further solidifies the
32:08
Carlito's goals for the end of the movie.
32:10
So like, yes, there's value there, but for the movie itself,
32:14
I don't find it really propels it moving forward at all.
32:17
This. This is setting up plot and
32:19
setting up characters, setting up things.
32:21
Bigger stakes, bigger stakes, stakes.
32:23
I like watching Kleinfeld really panic in real time.
32:28
Did you see the sweat? Sweat there totally beads.
32:31
I like that he threatens them too. 1 button even in here
32:35
you're dead. Man, he's got.
32:36
And you stole $1,000,000 and he says I know, I.
32:38
Delivered personally. Where do you land on a million?
32:40
Did he take it 100%? Oh, you knew that?
32:42
Oh yeah, 30 years ago. Yeah, OK.
32:44
Yeah, that it just. Yeah, for sure.
32:46
So slimy. And the way Pacino describes
32:48
him, you were one guy five years ago, you're this guy now,
32:51
$1,000,000 can make you that guy now.
32:53
I was thinking about 72% chance you took.
32:55
It 72 you really. Like that it's good number.
32:58
Over here, yeah, yeah. Team Canada.
33:00
Team Canada? Yep.
33:01
And we have a even shorter coffee talk.
33:04
Not really with Norwalk. Yes, the infamous.
33:09
Let me look down on my notes here.
33:10
James Raybourn. Raybourn.
33:13
So good. Love to see him.
33:14
He's the best. Well, I wouldn't go that far.
33:15
He's really good. You don't think he could handle
33:17
the weight of his own movie? But never had the chance.
33:20
That's true, no. And he pays Dave a visit in his
33:24
office shortly thereafter. But this is only like a 45
33:27
second scene. And again, looking back, yeah,
33:31
watching the second time. Oh, I get what that is, yeah.
33:35
Question is, do we need it though?
33:38
Can we just figure that out without seeing that?
33:40
I think so. It's a scene that sticks out to
33:43
me. I like it fine.
33:44
I like Ray. Bernie's great and Pen is great
33:46
in the in the moment, the cameras just holding on him and
33:49
he's twitching and he's smoking a cigarette and smirking and.
33:52
Get rid of the Coker, OK? Frowned.
33:55
Upon, but it does stick out as being like why is this here and
33:58
until later when we discover this is likely when the taps
34:01
happen. But to your point, we don't need
34:04
those taps could have happened at anytime.
34:06
We don't need to see the moment it happened.
34:07
It doesn't. Matter.
34:08
But I like that. We do.
34:09
And I don't know why. I'm like, Oh yeah, I think I
34:13
like it because I didn't get it. That's why.
34:16
And we could have because it's like, you got problems.
34:19
He's telling data. And we know Dave requested a
34:21
bodyguard about 1520 minutes. Earlier and we just got accused
34:26
of taking $1,000,000. From a Yeah.
34:27
So there are some question marks about his, let's say his tics,
34:32
maybe tactics. Tactics.
34:34
Yeah, yeah, he's going down the wrong side of the road.
34:37
Yes, yes, some may say, not unlike Laleen.
34:41
Lifeline Another beautiful example of a contrast.
34:46
Yes. Piccino's describing him.
34:48
He's a ladies man and we see it. Beautiful man, he's doing his
34:52
thing. Come on, what are we talking
34:53
about? Here Vigo is gorgeous.
34:55
Aragorn here. And then 30 seconds later.
34:59
Right after he says stand up guy, fucking describe him in one
35:02
word or two words. Stand up guy.
35:04
Now that's interesting writing. David Cope.
35:06
Cop kept cap and yeah, he's in a wheelchair, his hair greasy.
35:12
No, he's whining like a little bitch.
35:14
Yeah, you. Know you got a fucking diapers.
35:18
We will see a lot of this guy. He's an amazing movie called A
35:21
Walk on the Moon for him and Diane Lane and Anna Paquin.
35:25
He's good. Have you seen daylight?
35:27
He's in that for a minute. He is available in the archives.
35:29
I just finished Lord of the rings finally.
35:31
Return of the King. Hate those.
35:33
I never watched it. Wow.
35:34
I had the trilogy in 4K Wellington Walk.
35:36
Yes, and it's been. Came out in 2003, so I think 20.
35:40
Three. But even once I.
35:41
Bought it, it's been 10. Years, 10 years and I just never
35:45
got the return and I never watched it earlier.
35:48
I had it on DVD actually. Wow this was an upgrade.
35:50
What a let down. Sucked.
35:51
I hated all. Those movies, I almost walked
35:53
out the first one, yeah, there's hasn't aged the best, but yeah,
35:57
never know how you feel about lots of works.
35:58
We discovered that the Great Wall God damn break back to
36:01
Carlito's Way either way. The highway we're on, yeah, 30
36:07
years. He's supposed to do in the big.
36:09
House, yes, and he just beat it. That's it.
36:13
Has no good excuse for it. No, no, no.
36:15
Better answer when? Carlito asked.
36:16
So he really was not. He's not good for poorly
36:19
rehearsed. Yeah, He's not the guy you want
36:21
to wear wire. But but I love the way Carlito
36:25
kind of plays with him. I like the way that he is trying
36:29
to manipulate the situation, too.
36:30
Hmm. I got this guy.
36:32
We can do a thing, you know, whatever.
36:34
It's like I'm clean. What do you clean?
36:36
I'm gonna do the. Nobody's.
36:37
Clean and when Carlito kind of calls him out.
36:39
I love that scene too where he gives him the finger and the
36:43
knife into his throat. OHP man, you just Carlito.
36:47
Has a way. The only thing that GAIL does
36:52
for me in the movie is allow for Carlito to be lower status.
36:58
Like we talked about, he's off his game.
37:00
Let's say he is not focused on the angles, distracted, yet
37:04
focused on her. And what I love about this scene
37:07
with Laline is we see that he is still Carlito Brigante from the
37:13
Old neighbor. Yeah, it's in the blood.
37:15
Right. He can fuck with you now.
37:17
He may not kill you anymore. He might not want the heat, but
37:20
watching him and his eyes and the rage inside is fucking
37:25
great. And that's just great.
37:26
Great performance from Pacino. It's incredible.
37:28
You know, you often wonder why Pacino is like referred to as a
37:33
great actor. Heralded as one of the.
37:35
Greats heralded. That's perfect and but we've
37:37
seen movies like Recruit, which we thought he was pretty good.
37:40
Dog day. Well, I mean, yeah, we've seen
37:42
that. But you know, just in later
37:44
years, sure, sometimes you forget that man, this guy had a
37:46
lot of hits. Yeah, he's fantastic.
37:48
Really is. And Vigo, in this one moment, I
37:52
think, kind of steals the movie. His accent works.
37:54
Oh yeah, he's really good. He's so sad and pathetic and
37:58
plays that really, really well. But what he does?
38:00
Now you could pull off. That's right, Maybe not the
38:02
trench. Could do that pathetic guy?
38:03
Yes, you could do that. If not for Leilene, what he
38:07
really is there to do is obviously give the audience
38:11
little taste of Carlito's past and that they're trying to pin
38:15
them down. But really, really does is it
38:17
gives the pathway to GAIL Ohe yeah again.
38:20
Yes, and I didn't get this right away.
38:22
Oh, she's really talented. She's a dancer.
38:24
I thought Line took in a show. Yeah.
38:26
But I look at him like, you know, OK, this makes sense.
38:28
She's stripping on the. Side that's right and so Carlito
38:31
goes to meet her because they never exchanged numbers they
38:33
don't just sort of I'll see you around the neighborhood texting
38:36
happening here exactly can't remake this today.
38:40
See, now I don't understand why you don't want her in this movie
38:43
because you get a little bit of breast.
38:44
Yeah, I think she got great boobs.
38:45
They're fast, quick. Very, yeah, very nice.
38:48
Perfectly proportioned. Join us for Breast Talk.
38:52
Watch this show. Yeah, it doesn't seem angry.
38:55
No. Maybe.
38:57
Curious, confused. Another little coffee today.
38:59
Another little coffee talk. Yeah, at the table.
39:02
Now this is where I think you might have enjoyed it because
39:05
he's really judgy. For the sex work, he's not
39:08
overly judgy. He's if you are a good girl, you
39:11
wouldn't be doing this. But she has a great comeback,
39:14
yeah. Have you ever killed a?
39:15
Man, there it is. Because he has that.
39:17
Just not sure if you knew that. I did, yeah.
39:19
Just don't get to judge me. You're you.
39:21
We all make mistakes. I have a drink or two after work
39:23
or I strip or I do a couple of lines of coke, whatever.
39:27
You're this and that. But he has his sincerity about
39:29
him, like he's not angry. No.
39:31
Why would he be? How?
39:32
Could he Seems like a pretty understanding guy like I date.
39:34
Him, except for the fact later. This is light, that's right.
39:39
But I think it generally this is a good conversation, not as long
39:42
as the first one that you didn't.
39:43
Like, yeah, this one just seems to propel enough forward.
39:46
Could they have just done this one maybe?
39:48
100% I don't like the other one and I don't really like the next
39:52
one. OK, well and not much a fan of
39:55
the next one after that. So just this is the best one of
39:58
the bunch I think. She's got fans.
40:00
Get that part? Also a little odd to me.
40:03
It's the thing. I don't really been to a strip
40:04
club so I don't. Know but come on every Friday
40:06
night that's me no but they've reestablished a relationship to
40:12
the point where he invites her to his disco come with me hang
40:18
out with me and they're just chilling out having some food
40:21
this disco has a. Menu He's shoveling it down, but
40:25
you know. Is I wonder how good the food is
40:27
because even though you and I haven't maybe ventured out to a
40:31
lot of strip clubs in the last 20-30 years, you know what I
40:34
mean, Disco it's like the food may not be the priority.
40:37
I wonder how good it is. I remember hearing all the time
40:39
the buffets at the bear fax is where it's going for lunch.
40:42
Like I've never been but I don't know.
40:43
Interesting. But food is one of their drawing
40:46
elements I've heard. I think the bar is pretty low.
40:48
There could be and then this girl named Steph yes, we have
40:53
already met her. Sorry, I did mention earlier
40:55
just one still come on now. And she's sitting down with oh
40:59
wait no, she's not sitting down she's leaning against the wall
41:01
in the bathroom with Dave right. Dave was banging Steph.
41:05
That's right. Long story short, however,
41:08
Steph. Is Blancos girl?
41:11
That's what he says. I don't remember her sitting
41:13
next to him when we first meet Blanco, but you know.
41:16
Not really, but didn't make a reference.
41:17
To it, but it sure would you ever want to own a woman.
41:21
It's something you've thought about.
41:22
No, no. I think it's just for more than
41:24
like 20 minutes at a time. Depends on the cost.
41:28
That's right. I have a list of things that
41:31
could have potentially prevented the outcome and this is one of
41:37
the early. Ones this is the.
41:38
One, this is the big one. You're right.
41:40
Basically how Carlito is treating Blanco, not taking him.
41:44
Serious at all, over and over again.
41:46
Maybe. I don't remember the last time I
41:47
took a shit. Right?
41:48
Like or like you're, you're a bum.
41:51
You're a hoodlum. He's you 20 years ago.
41:53
That's it. We don't know that because we
41:54
haven't seen the prequel. That's right.
41:56
That's right. But his disinterest in Blanco to
41:59
your point, is I think the turning point for sure if this
42:02
scene goes differently, not just not just in the very end, but
42:06
like if this entire scene goes differently, we've got a much
42:10
different. Sequel movie.
42:11
That's right. Way again.
42:13
That's right, it was way back. And I think there was a way to
42:17
get the best of both worlds. He's semi retired.
42:22
I think he even says that. I've used that line too.
42:25
And he doesn't want to kill Blanco, but he knows he needs
42:28
to. That's right.
42:29
Or he should. He says if this is the right
42:31
thing to do, but I can't do it anymore.
42:33
And I think the way around it, a little Gray here, you know,
42:38
dabbled in the Gray. But of course, it's just get
42:41
Louise to do it. If he orders Louise to do it,
42:45
he's still the one that's ordering it to happen.
42:47
He was all for it, correct? He had no issues.
42:49
Let me whack. Him.
42:50
Yep. Yeah, he wanted it.
42:51
They both wanted. It well, then let him whack him
42:53
like it fixes your problem and you're not the one that pulled
42:55
the trigger and you're not telling him to do it.
42:58
You're just letting Louise be Louise, right?
43:02
He has an itch. I'm scratch it, I think that
43:05
you're right and loophole buddy, but the problem is it happens
43:09
later is the same situation and look what that does to him.
43:14
He happens to be on the boat. He's got nothing to do with it.
43:17
He didn't ask for any of it, but he's associated and so Blanco
43:20
shows up dead. The connective tissue is Carlito
43:25
had something to do with it and that causes bigger problems.
43:27
But I agree with you, Blanco needed to.
43:29
Die. Well, yeah, I guess people will
43:30
make those assumptions that because Carlito was this he,
43:34
they might not believe that he's that.
43:35
That's right. That's a good point.
43:36
But it is to your point the scene needs to go differently.
43:39
Now if he had fallen down the stairs like Ivana, none of this
43:44
is a problem because. That no questions.
43:45
Asked That was an accident, your accident.
43:55
Do you have fun at a party, Phil?
43:58
I do have fun at parties. Yeah, I don't.
44:00
I'm the guy in the corner. Yeah, Wallflower just baked and
44:05
baked. Baked.
44:07
We have a party at Dave's place. People are having fun.
44:10
He's telling. Don't have fun basically.
44:13
Yes, well, I think maybe stop fucking on the lawn.
44:17
Pokémon and the other clothes sort of on.
44:20
Like no one really cares. Like if you're at that party.
44:23
And you're watching somebody. I think fuck on a passenger.
44:26
You've signed up for that to maybe happen.
44:29
OK. Oh my God, people are doing
44:31
coke. I gotta go like.
44:33
Oh no, I don't think mine in the coke.
44:34
I think people are minding the fucking on.
44:35
The chair Have you not done coke?
44:38
But this is an interesting moment to the less avid movie
44:41
watcher. I would say this kind of slows
44:42
down the movie a little bit, but this seems pretty important.
44:45
Yeah, it's the pivot point of the whole movie.
44:46
It's the halfway point to me. Ish ballpark, hmm.
44:49
And actually exactly I looked at it exactly.
44:51
Halfway, and it it sets up the next act of the movie,
44:54
fundamentally, which is out of loyalty to his brother, to his
44:59
best friend, not by blood. I don't want any.
45:02
Confusion to commit to 1/2 baked plan from a full baked guy.
45:08
Yes, it's not going to be not a good combination.
45:11
Is the turning point for the rest of the movie, and his
45:14
committal to this puts them into the black.
45:17
Don't do it. Don't trust him exactly.
45:20
Don't believe him. But it is convincing because he
45:24
leverages. Hmm, I mean.
45:26
All that. I got you home, I got you off,
45:29
you know? Five years instead of 30, I
45:31
mean, and that's a long way. That's the world, for better,
45:34
for worse. Your favors or you're loyal to
45:37
the man. I don't know.
45:39
That's it. It's the worm factor.
45:41
Yeah, to a fault. You wonder when that debt can be
45:44
paid, and because in this moment it isn't and.
45:47
Carlito, it falls prey to it. You're I think you're right.
45:49
Dave has become the worm at this point.
45:51
You are the toxic negative. You're bad, bringing me down to
45:55
your total. And this is not going to end.
45:57
Well, that's right. And you really leads to one of
45:59
my favorite lines in the whole movie, which is when Carlito
46:03
looks at Kleinfeld and Justice says, like, what the fuck is
46:09
happening to you? That delivery and watching Penn
46:13
that we've seen him now twitching and tweaking out for
46:17
the last hour or whatever the movie and particularly in this
46:20
scene, the desperation like he's going to kill me.
46:21
And you can tell he left that meeting and he throws up on the
46:24
long walk back, right? Like this has been building up
46:27
in him. All the petty like stop fucking
46:30
on my chairs. I don't really care.
46:32
It's really just this moment that matters.
46:34
But I guess you have to frame it.
46:35
Got to frame it. We gotta break a door frame.
46:38
Actually, another frame. I wonder how this scene landed
46:44
with you. He goes to visit GAIL.
46:46
Yeah, Carlito does. Yes.
46:48
And she won't let him in. She got the old chain on the
46:51
door, which she probably had in Vancouver with all the.
46:53
Break. Yes, right.
46:54
Yeah, Didn't take. But she's being provocative.
46:57
Yeah, she's saying, well, what are you going to do, break in
47:00
and push me and kiss me and do these things?
47:03
But she's saying it like that. She's saying it away.
47:06
Much not that. Is hinting now.
47:08
I don't know if I would have got it.
47:10
I would like OK, fine, I'll come.
47:11
Back to you later 100% when she says if you don't get in, you
47:17
don't get in. Oh, yeah, it's on.
47:20
Yeah. I guess you figure that out if
47:21
you read between the lines, right?
47:23
Do you do it? Do you?
47:24
100% to it. I don't know if I even wait that
47:27
long. Shoulder, though you have had
47:30
some. Issues right Frozen.
47:32
I just think this could have been prevented because now you
47:33
got to replace that door. It's.
47:35
An apartment you pay somebody. Else I'm sure, but you've added
47:38
a lot of next day stuff. All you had to do was undo the
47:42
thing. Do you have to do that to be
47:44
passionate? Can you?
47:46
I don't. Know I don't know what you're.
47:47
Talking I'm just a 47 year old saying I don't want to deal with
47:50
the door issue tomorrow. You're not she, is she?
47:53
Is but I'll have to do it because I'm the boyfriend.
47:55
Now they have contractors. I suppose, but she has to be
47:59
home. Maybe you know, it's just adding
48:01
things to your table that maybe you'd rather not have to do when
48:04
really all you have to do is click.
48:07
I don't know you're. Really all about the simplicity.
48:09
Don't pick up the phone. The payoff don't isn't worth.
48:12
It like your passion, you think you can get the passion.
48:15
She wants to be chased around the apartment naked.
48:18
Fine, I locked the door. Start running.
48:20
I'll give you a 10 second. Head start.
48:22
A lot less fun. Let me lay the bread crumbs.
48:25
Let me do this. All the things for you.
48:27
Maybe that's what you're looking for.
48:28
I don't want to do any work. I don't want to earn it.
48:32
I like to be on bottom by the way, just so you know.
48:35
I have a nap and a sandwich. George it's good.
48:38
It's good, but the music isn't really steamy.
48:44
I felt the song out of place. I don't know what she felt.
48:47
That yeah, OK for the passion. Yeah, they didn't match.
48:51
I love that song. However, Joe Cocker's rendition
48:54
of it, I think it's incredibly beautiful.
48:55
If he opens the door the regular way, this song fits.
49:00
Sure so but running around the apartment, breaking down a door,
49:03
chasing the woman naked? Not the song.
49:04
This is not the song. I agree it's a very romantic
49:06
song and what it's supposed to be, animalistic and carnal.
49:10
Doesn't jive doesn't just the contrast of looking for out of
49:13
diploma, but he's done so well. Forgive it.
49:16
Yeah. And I don't really love the
49:18
rotating camera work and such like that as well.
49:20
They're making. Out.
49:21
Yeah, a little dizzy. If you're going to give me a sex
49:22
scene, let's go. Yeah, I'm there for the pillow.
49:24
Talk. I hate the pillow talk.
49:26
So. Well, actually, no, that's not
49:28
true. I hate the end of.
49:29
The pillow, OK, The only part I really like that stuck with me
49:31
is they talk about his experience with killing
49:35
somebody. And I think that's important.
49:36
If you're going to pursue a relationship with each other,
49:39
you don't want these out later. This is the second or third time
49:42
she's asked the question of ever killed somebody.
49:44
So I like that he gives a final answer, which is it's not like
49:47
that. It's not like you just walk into
49:48
something. Exactly.
49:49
It's a consequence of and he tells that great story.
49:51
I got no place to be pull a knife.
49:54
I'm thinking of Mr. Tough Guy and they pulled out a gun and I
49:57
thought of the untouchables bringing bringing a knife to a
49:59
gunfight. Yes.
50:01
What I don't like is her. Yeah, I guess.
50:04
And the other he says a line that something like how would
50:07
you ever had a dream? The dreams, yeah.
50:10
You talked for three scenes about a dream first and
50:13
foremost. I get a lot of Rams.
50:14
You know how I feel about that. Yeah.
50:16
Tons of dreams. So she is saying I have a dream
50:18
to be a dancer, of course. The ballet or the strip?
50:22
The Broadway she do both amalgamate the tree.
50:25
That would be something special. So they asked the question is
50:28
like, haven't you ever wanted something like, yes, of course.
50:30
So she gets to reiterate that if you weren't sure.
50:33
And then she says what I think are the worst lines in the
50:35
movie, which is I hate my dream and I'm awake now.
50:41
Hmm. Yeah, I used to have a dream,
50:43
but now I'm awake. These are two terrible David
50:46
kept nonsensical lines and I like her as an actor but
50:49
delivered I think poorly and to me it ruins whatever good that
50:53
came before it. I hate this last part of this
50:56
scene so much that it ends up negating the most of it.
51:00
I really don't like this relationship.
51:01
I don't like no the connection in there.
51:04
I didn't completely buy in on the chemistry, I bought in on
51:08
the premise of it and why it's in the film.
51:11
But yeah. I mean, you have a love
51:14
interest. I just think it's so tacked on.
51:15
It doesn't add anything to the movie except for potential
51:19
stakes, quote UN quote. But I don't think anything that
51:21
they do together is exciting or interesting or unique.
51:25
It's possible there's already enough steaks.
51:27
Yeah, you don't want too much steaks.
51:29
That's right. Back here, right?
51:31
Well, let's head back to the disco then.
51:32
You don't like pillows talking? You like dancing?
51:36
No, you're not very good at. Though But you I'll watch it
51:38
dance. Watch dance.
51:39
Of course I love Broadway shows, I love performances, ballet.
51:42
I can be moved. Artistic representations.
51:45
It's beautiful. Well, it moved.
51:48
For me watching this. This Italian guy handle Gale.
51:53
You'd like to watch. I don't even have to do the
51:56
handling. You do the lazy, lazy.
52:00
Another example. I'll be over here order you
52:04
unlock the door later on. Carly doesn't seem to have a
52:09
problem. Not at all.
52:10
He's cool, he's old, he's never shown any sort of jealousy.
52:14
Stand up guy really likes this girl but Dave.
52:18
Dave's fucked. Up David, he is.
52:20
He's all messed. Up.
52:21
He is messed up. You gonna let him touch him on
52:24
the butt? Yeah, it's clearly the waist.
52:26
And he says it's the waist and it is the waist.
52:29
However, I found it odd that Carlito provoked him a little
52:33
bit. What are you going to do?
52:35
You going to say something to him?
52:36
You're going to yell at him? He's planting the idea to make a
52:40
scene, yes. I don't know why Carlito would
52:43
want. That I think he doesn't want.
52:45
I think he's just being sarcastic.
52:46
I think he's being. But you got to know days not
52:48
going to. Get that?
52:49
Why? I think that that's the problem.
52:50
Yes. Understanding of how far gone he
52:55
shave is getting. Carlito should know by now.
52:57
Agreed. Agreed.
52:59
But he says, you know, why don't you go?
53:00
He's gonna love this. Go.
53:01
You go tell him, right? Ha, ha, ha.
53:03
And then he's like, yeah, OK, I'll go tell him.
53:05
Yeah. Ruins everything.
53:07
But what really ruins everything, yeah, is a little
53:11
ball busting OHS that Dave likes to.
53:14
Do with your girl there? Yeah, You ever do?
53:16
That absolutely. This is like sadly my 20s.
53:20
Yeah, but you do it for fun. Absolutely.
53:22
Oh yeah, it's a very different environment obviously, but I
53:26
think the messing with your buddy in and around girlfriends
53:31
and or potential dates and whatnots evening plans if you.
53:34
Will did you get that thing checked out on your?
53:36
Exactly. You get the medical records
53:38
checked yet? Oh, yeah.
53:39
Yeah. No, sorry.
53:39
That's next week. Yeah.
53:41
Oh, sorry. Hi.
53:41
Nice to meet you. Absolutely.
53:44
We used to just do that all the time.
53:46
Did you ever ask any of them if they got seasick though?
53:49
No. Why?
53:50
We didn't own any boats. Exactly.
53:53
You were on the island, you know you.
53:54
Didn't know Vancouver. Yeah, I suppose no boat access.
53:58
No, that's a shame. No money if you need money for a
54:01
boat didn't. You buddy around with Jason, the
54:05
actor, the guy that played. Jason Kirzinger, Yeah.
54:07
He didn't invite me to his boat, no.
54:10
I'm sure he had boat money from all those.
54:12
Yeah, maybe. Who knows?
54:14
And this is where Carlito's had enough of Dave at this point, he
54:19
really is. Pissed, he gets angry again.
54:21
When she walks out of him, he gives that rage that we had seen
54:23
with Eileen. Yeah.
54:24
What are you doing? Here he sees it there too.
54:27
You fucking. He's really, really angry at him
54:30
and he tries to make nice with GAIL.
54:32
Goes back to the apartment trying to smooth things over.
54:35
How much smoothing over have you done in your day?
54:37
Hmm, lot of apologies I'm sure. So smooth, it's gone.
54:41
And Carlito, who's honestly trying really hard here, yeah,
54:45
and I can certainly understand why he doesn't want his worlds
54:47
to collide. Of course not.
54:48
At the same time, she has a reason to be upset because you
54:52
know. You promised me that you were
54:55
done with that world that we're talking about moving to the
54:58
Bahamas, living this life. We're going to do this right
55:00
things and you're not out. You said you were out and not
55:03
out. But he could have got out of
55:05
this. You're just going for a boat
55:08
ride. Dave owns a boat.
55:10
I'm going to take you out for a boat ride.
55:13
It's your first time. Hope you don't get seasick.
55:16
Maybe she'll be like, well, can I come along?
55:18
That might be an issue. But you deal with that later.
55:21
Sure. So I don't think it was such a
55:23
bad thing to say. Carlito just didn't say the
55:26
right things back to diffuse again.
55:29
He's not diffusing. Dave, no.
55:30
Well, yeah, I mean, obviously Dave has got a precedent that's
55:33
been established. Here, that'd be a good name for
55:35
this movie, diffusing Dave. Right, that's the other one.
55:39
But yeah, you're right, Carlito tries to smooth things over
55:42
with. He saved my life, GAIL.
55:45
And I am who I am for, right? Or for.
55:47
Wrong. Can't change.
55:48
That, that's that character. Yeah, and that's ultimately what
55:51
hurts him and what kills him. Yeah, I think you're pretty bang
55:54
on, unfortunately. And his whole argument, which is
55:57
not unlike Joe Ohe and Mike and Rounders, which is I'm just
56:03
going on the boat. That doesn't mean I'm doing, I'm
56:07
doing that. I was in a room where poker
56:09
happened. Yes, that's good.
56:10
Doesn't mean I'm three stacks of high society in here, but it
56:14
does mean it. But it does mean it does in this
56:16
instance. He's just on the boat, but it is
56:19
adjacent to some criminal activity for sure.
56:21
I think he does explain himself well enough where this becomes a
56:25
soft. Breakup, Sure.
56:26
It's not a hard breakup, No. Soft.
56:28
And we've all had the soft breakups.
56:29
Yeah, sure had the soft makeup too.
56:33
Ohe yeah, I'm not sure what that is.
56:36
Too much whiskey? Ohe, yes, yes, yeah.
56:39
Yeah, that's good point we're making up, but.
56:42
Softly certainly wasn't breaking down any doors, that's for sure.
56:48
But we got to do the boat thing. Yeah, but an hour and a half in
56:51
and Frankie is not too impressed.
56:54
Frankie Frank. Frankie.
56:56
Yeah, he recognized. Collective correcting him no.
56:59
Burn Notice 3 episodes. Never watched Burn Notice but
57:02
good for you for detecting. I'm an honest man Phil.
57:05
I wouldn't belong in this world, but I had to look it up.
57:08
OK, newly recognized them couldn't.
57:11
Where, yeah, I couldn't place them.
57:13
I knew it was TV, of course, and it was a reoccurring role and I
57:16
knew it was something that was not easily found on the
57:20
filmography. I had to scroll a little bit
57:23
there. He was 3.
57:23
Episodes of Burn Notice. You managed to detect it.
57:26
That's pretty good. That's a detective show.
57:28
It's a great show. It's a great show, Superstation.
57:30
Check it out. Check it now.
57:33
I'm not sure what's going to happen here.
57:35
OK, I know now. So how do you feel about the
57:41
Palm's boat work? It's water work.
57:43
I think it's incredible. Right amount of fog, because we
57:46
love the fog and Great Wall, of course.
57:48
That was the highlight for you. Yeah, that was the best part of
57:50
the movie. It's ominous, you know,
57:53
something's up. And the saturated Blues a little
57:56
bit. I thought it was really good.
57:58
Pen is so out of his mind. He just rocker.
58:01
Yeah, he just doesn't. Dave, slow down, slow down.
58:04
He just barrels past now. I think it's intentional cause
58:07
he needs to back up to get the guy.
58:08
But yeah, like that I'm like, OK, just.
58:10
He's got it. Yeah, it's all good.
58:12
But much like at the beginning, I'm like, Cuz is going to die
58:15
any minute. Did you anticipate where this
58:18
was gonna go? No, but it makes sense and
58:21
that's why I like about this movie and movies in general.
58:23
It's like you don't have like, yeah, I know what's gonna
58:26
happen. You know, if you do it, it, it
58:29
just doesn't quite sink in because maybe he doesn't.
58:33
There's other ways for this movie to end.
58:35
Sure. And any movie, when you're
58:37
dealing with gangsters and stuff, you don't know who's
58:40
gonna get killed when. Yeah, it keeps you kind of
58:43
guessing. Sure it's done.
58:45
Right. Is it the connection?
58:46
Right. Like Carlito could be busted for
58:48
the fact that this gangster gets on the boat, lives, gets on the
58:51
boat and is like Carlito, who the fuck is this guy doing here?
58:54
And now he's ensnared in something with right And now
58:57
that's the next hour of the movie is trying example.
58:59
Connect that together or in this instance, whack them.
59:03
Kleinfeld just whack whack him and Frankie and Frankie too.
59:06
Man should not taking that job. That sucks.
59:08
Yeah, it seems like a damned if you do, damned if you don't
59:11
situation. If you let him live, you stole
59:13
his million bucks, Yes, maybe you can pay him back.
59:17
What did you do with that million?
59:18
Sure. Like here's I saved you, I got
59:20
you out, here's 1,000,000 bucks. Does that square us?
59:23
That's your best chance at living this, as Carlito explains
59:29
in a voiceover. These guys.
59:31
They're going to know, yeah, they're good and we're done.
59:34
We just killed a maid guy and a thing and whatever else and he
59:37
says you fucked us. He says to Dave, look, you
59:39
fucked us. You killed us even.
59:42
Well, that's when they get back. Yeah, sure.
59:44
He makes it very clear. Yes, say it very, very even.
59:48
Yeah, I quit fucking around here.
59:50
You just killed us. But he also says you're not a
59:53
lawyer anymore. Now you're a gangster.
59:55
And he says you can't start late.
59:57
That's. A great ohe, yes.
59:59
It's not a world, you just. Yeah, clearly not.
1:00:02
Yeah, you're right. You're right, Phil.
1:00:04
When you're right, you're right. 30 seconds later he gets
1:00:14
stabbed. Yeah, 30 seconds.
1:00:16
Movie time, movie. You know what I mean?
1:00:19
I don't know always time is a thing with you.
1:00:23
I want to make sure that we're establishing.
1:00:25
If you finally see the bodyguard the first time this is
1:00:27
requested, I don't know. There's a backlog, there's a
1:00:30
queue time. I'm not sure now these baddies
1:00:33
do these things in the plain sight of day.
1:00:37
I don't know. I just don't think it's a good
1:00:39
choice. Sometimes.
1:00:40
I feel like the lack of police presence sometimes in the movie
1:00:44
takes away from the reality of it.
1:00:46
Like, these guys aren't going to really get away with this sort
1:00:49
of thing or. You know, why would a policeman
1:00:51
be at a lawyers office in any given middle of the afternoon
1:00:53
on. Tuesday.
1:00:54
I don't think it's that. It's like these guys aren't
1:00:56
picked up later, like, OK, this guy, they, the witnesses, like
1:01:00
everyone saw it. What are we doing?
1:01:01
Here, Yeah. I love this song for reasons
1:01:04
that are well beyond that building.
1:01:06
The suspense. Is it kind of come from right?
1:01:07
Is it gonna come from the left? The elevators gotta come.
1:01:10
Is he gonna get into the elevator and escape?
1:01:12
And it turns out they're all yeah, all those angles are.
1:01:15
Covered. Yeah, that worked out quite
1:01:17
well. Now I saw him get stopped.
1:01:19
Yeah. I'm not a doctor, not a nurse.
1:01:22
Haven't played one on TV. OK.
1:01:24
That is right in the heart. Just below, just under.
1:01:29
Alright, yeah, pause it next time.
1:01:31
Well that's that's I think 3 times he got stabbed.
1:01:35
Yeah, yeah, like, yeah, like, yeah, he's right underneath and
1:01:39
then right beside, right above, just all around.
1:01:41
See, these guys aren't very good is what I'm saying.
1:01:43
Plain sight can't hit the heart. You're fired.
1:01:47
You're fired. I mean, I assume he died.
1:01:49
Of course, so did Sasso. Yes, Will Sasso, Ron.
1:01:56
I love the scene, I think it's really great and we all are
1:02:00
meant to assume that he's dead because it goes right to Carlito
1:02:04
and GAIL. Am I on the outs with you?
1:02:07
He says funny 70s line in his line and then she reveals that
1:02:12
she's pregnant 10 seconds after. Conception.
1:02:17
Yeah. See that?
1:02:19
I don't know. This was like yesterday.
1:02:20
I think it takes like a couple weeks.
1:02:22
I'd say that that means that there was a couple of weeks ago
1:02:25
that they had. Sex like, yeah, maybe, but they
1:02:27
didn't display that They did. They could have two weeks later
1:02:30
at the bottom. Screen right, They did the sex
1:02:32
scene, then they did the bar scene, then they did the boat
1:02:35
scene. That's two nights.
1:02:37
It's all just right after another.
1:02:38
This guy wants to get out of that prison.
1:02:40
He's like, you know, I'm fine. Give me a couple more weeks.
1:02:42
I'll hang out in prison. Now he's ready to go.
1:02:45
It's not a big deal. I just.
1:02:46
I felt like I haven't picked your movie.
1:02:48
Yeah, all movie. It is time we're.
1:02:50
Getting near to the that's right, I thought it was fine.
1:02:53
My issue is not the fact that when she's discovered she's
1:02:56
pregnant, just the fact that she's pregnant at all.
1:02:58
I so don't care about this relationship whatsoever.
1:03:01
And I don't think you need an extra layer.
1:03:02
And he gets a couple of lines throughout the rest of the
1:03:04
movie. The three of us are going to do
1:03:06
it. You know, you both are going to
1:03:07
take care of yourselves. Like fuck off.
1:03:09
I don't think the pregnancy thing is necessary whatsoever.
1:03:12
I don't like anything about it except Redburn.
1:03:17
Norwalk coming in? Yeah.
1:03:19
Sweep in to save the day. Well, yeah.
1:03:21
My boredom with this relationship.
1:03:22
He gets to change the scenery. I wasn't unexpected to have an
1:03:25
issue with that, hate it because it's just weird for you having
1:03:28
and me not having an issue with it, that's just strange, but it
1:03:31
happens. But I do like this scene.
1:03:34
They're trying to convince him to rat on or to whistle blow.
1:03:39
Yeah, that's a Gray area, like cause when you've set somebody
1:03:44
up to fall, which Dave has done to Carlito, yeah, I think that
1:03:49
nullifies anything that Carlito does.
1:03:53
He can cart blush to whatever dude like Dave is ultimately
1:03:57
sold him out, yes. It's over for him.
1:04:00
Do you still cover for a guy like who's done well?
1:04:02
He's my brother. Yeah, I owe him.
1:04:05
I owe him big time and he's basically getting me killed.
1:04:09
Yeah, what? He says that he says he saved my
1:04:11
life. Dave did.
1:04:12
Have to give him back. Do you have to pay him back with
1:04:14
that? Like your life?
1:04:16
Yes, The answer is yes, Dale. Stop asking questions.
1:04:20
I like the scene, what it does, but the audience doesn't
1:04:23
necessarily clock until a little later.
1:04:26
Is, Carlito says Later. They're not going to come for
1:04:30
me. They don't have enough.
1:04:32
If they did, they would have busted me there.
1:04:34
So I love that he his whole read from the situation has nothing
1:04:38
to do with Dave. Really, it is where am I at in
1:04:42
relationship to this? Yeah, and the answer is pretty
1:04:45
clean. It's a good move.
1:04:47
Yeah, it's good. Move.
1:04:48
So forget it. Let's go.
1:04:49
And then basically the last half hour of the movie is him trying
1:04:51
to tie up all his loose ends so that he can achieve the dream of
1:04:55
selling cars and in the Bahamas with GAIL and the baby.
1:05:02
I'm not going to go see the baby.
1:05:04
I'm going away. The Bahamas wants to go to the
1:05:06
Bahamas. What are we doing here?
1:05:07
Love the Bahamas. And then he comes in, he's like,
1:05:10
you know, in the car, wait 5 minutes.
1:05:12
He runs around, He's got tickets.
1:05:14
You and me on the train. Midnight, Grand Central.
1:05:18
Let's do it. Good plan, solid plan.
1:05:21
A couple things he wants to do. First, like you said, he wants
1:05:23
to wrap up with some loose ends. He's got to look into Dave's
1:05:25
eyes. That's right.
1:05:26
Does he? Does he have to?
1:05:28
Hmm, no, I would accept this is over.
1:05:31
However, I do like the scene. It's a great scene.
1:05:34
I didn't notice the first time him removing the bullets.
1:05:38
It's all off screen. It is magic.
1:05:40
Yeah, I watched it again. I'm like, OK, well, I don't see
1:05:43
him below the waist. Yep, works for me.
1:05:46
This is the nitpick that I have maybe is at no point in this
1:05:50
conversation doesn't look like they're not looking at one
1:05:54
another. So Dave is always talking to
1:05:56
Carlito, Carlito is always talking to Dave.
1:05:59
They're facing each other. They're just pacing around.
1:06:01
Dave sees the whole body. Dave would see the whole we
1:06:03
don't, we don't exactly. The Spielberg moments.
1:06:06
Halloween is the best example of that for me, so again, it
1:06:08
doesn't matter. It's a beautiful scene.
1:06:10
I fucking love it and I as an audience the first time, didn't
1:06:13
notice, didn't notice, wouldn't think to notice.
1:06:15
The camera is telling me what to look at.
1:06:16
I'm looking at it. Right.
1:06:18
I guess it's fine if you don't notice.
1:06:20
Have you notice? And I've talked about this
1:06:22
several times, it's an easy fix. You have the character turn
1:06:25
around briefly. We still don't know what's going
1:06:27
on, but now he doesn't know what's Dr. Moment looks out the
1:06:30
window. Whatever the case, sure.
1:06:31
People, when they're talking each other, they wander around,
1:06:34
they turn around, they do all sorts of things.
1:06:36
Doesn't matter in the end of the.
1:06:37
Day because we didn't. Notice exactly.
1:06:39
So here we go. But it is a thing.
1:06:41
But we get that, and Carlito again gets to show just how good
1:06:44
a criminal he is, basically where he says no way that face
1:06:47
matches that uniform. He's seen all the angles.
1:06:49
He knows this. He knows that.
1:06:51
Very untouchables like too, right?
1:06:52
We have bad guys in cop uniforms.
1:06:54
Right. And then he leaves.
1:06:56
You got a hell of a future. No it doesn't.
1:06:59
No, didn't. And it drops.
1:07:01
Adios, counselor. It's great.
1:07:03
Line and that's. Slow mo the bullets as he gets
1:07:05
whacked in the face, and that's just good.
1:07:07
That's great direction. That's good writing.
1:07:09
Better direction, right? You're right.
1:07:11
And then he has to tie up another loose ends, not really
1:07:13
tie up. He needs the cash.
1:07:15
To go back to get the. Cash and it's at the disco.
1:07:17
Unfortunately Ron which was established.
1:07:21
I don't know if you picked up on it earlier had a gambling.
1:07:23
Problem. The whole reason why he's
1:07:25
involved in the disco to begin. With the whole reason he had is
1:07:27
for this probably because that money needs to.
1:07:29
Disappear. Pacino's great in this scene
1:07:31
too, where he goes in and. Opens the safe and.
1:07:34
The level of shock and rage and he's upset and surprise is
1:07:39
fantastic. But you know, I think is just so
1:07:41
damn good in this movie. You really shines here because
1:07:44
the walls are coming in on him and just the way he's standing
1:07:47
and he's just completely thinking about something else.
1:07:50
And the big Italian boss is here focused enough to say go get the
1:07:55
best champagne, which is apparently not the best.
1:07:59
I think it was. Yeah.
1:08:00
Yeah, but causing distractions to get away without he's.
1:08:03
He gets roped into the conversation, then says let me
1:08:05
do what I got to do and I'll come back down.
1:08:07
Does that, then comes down, causes the disruption with the
1:08:10
champagne. Now the money is missing.
1:08:12
Oh, what the fuck? And he goes and talks to Sasso,
1:08:13
tries to get the money shaken down.
1:08:15
All the money is in the drawer. All of these elements and it's
1:08:17
all again. The direction of this movie in
1:08:19
these sequences is incredible. Tasting, the editing, everything
1:08:23
put together makes it to me just incredibly watchable.
1:08:26
Like you're saying this is the last home stretch the movie 220.
1:08:29
This is before 2 hours because we have a long scene that's.
1:08:31
Right. But it's really, I thought,
1:08:33
built to perfection and this and then the reveal that he's
1:08:37
escaped through the Hatch. I love a good hatch.
1:08:39
Trapdoor and begins the chase sequence basically ends the
1:08:42
movie. Yes, it's it, it's, it's a long
1:08:46
one. Lengthy.
1:08:47
It's very lengthy. Not unlike the Untouchables.
1:08:49
If you remember, that train sequence in Untouchables is one
1:08:52
that goes on and. On Yeah, as I type, it's
1:08:55
relatively entertaining, generally speaking, but I would
1:08:58
argue that it doesn't need to be that long.
1:08:59
There's a lot of going up the escalator, coming back down
1:09:03
stairs, doors. I say 35% of that can.
1:09:06
Go. Oh wow.
1:09:07
OK, I'm not a director obviously, but maybe the longer
1:09:11
goes on, the bigger the build up, the end hits more.
1:09:15
So I imagine there's a reason to do this.
1:09:17
It's mentally preparing us for the last two minutes.
1:09:21
Yeah, I think what I love about it, it's the misdirection.
1:09:24
There's so much attention paid to the Italians that are chasing
1:09:28
Carlito. Yes, right on the subway, in and
1:09:31
out of the Grand Central. He's running through the streets
1:09:33
of the city. He's trying to hide.
1:09:34
He's underneath, like he is doing so much to hide up and
1:09:37
down the trains. It's all building, building,
1:09:38
building. And then ultimately shoot out in
1:09:41
the station kills the Italians. He's thinking Humphries running,
1:09:44
whereas an audience like, oh, he just solved that problem that
1:09:48
we've been watching now for 15 minutes, you know, on and on and
1:09:50
on. He's home free.
1:09:51
We got the money, he got Sasso everything running smooth.
1:09:54
Yeah, he didn't watch the 1st 2 minutes of the.
1:09:56
Movie and then that's the question right.
1:09:58
Does that remind you like I I think about something like
1:10:01
fallen where I don't remember connecting the whomever shot him
1:10:06
at the beginning to whomever shot him at the end.
1:10:09
I don't think I connected that the first time I.
1:10:10
Saw I didn't connect who it's when I see Gale in front of the
1:10:15
door I'm like all right here this we're back to the beginning
1:10:17
for. Sure, but who and why?
1:10:19
I was. Really surprised I didn't figure
1:10:22
it out. Yeah.
1:10:22
And I love that in a movie because it's not really trying
1:10:25
to trick you. No.
1:10:26
Like, it's not like it's not like it's a twist and it's not
1:10:29
all obvious. Yeah.
1:10:30
And it's similar to prisoners, sort of where it ended up being
1:10:34
the Ant. And when you look back, like,
1:10:35
yeah, of course it's the Ant, duh.
1:10:39
But never had that moment. So I don't know what the trick
1:10:41
is. I think it's just keeping us
1:10:43
captivated, keeping us busy for sure with all these other things
1:10:46
going on. And Blanco's been out of the
1:10:48
movie for an hour and a half. Exactly.
1:10:51
And here he. Is it's so good, It's such a
1:10:54
great misdirection. And I think that the reason why
1:10:55
that goes on so long is to give us this sense of relief.
1:10:58
I can take a breath, and the first minute you take a first,
1:11:01
second you take a breath. Blanco, Hey, Remember Me?
1:11:04
Bam, bam, bam, and you're like son of a bitch.
1:11:07
He was that close and we as an audience were that close.
1:11:10
Frustrating. Totally, but good.
1:11:11
Filmmaking, I love it. I think it's so great.
1:11:13
And then the fact that Guzman calls him out and says like, you
1:11:16
know, got to look after your own ass and then actually you're not
1:11:19
coming with me. Bam.
1:11:21
It's that same mobbed thing of was it all worth it?
1:11:24
You just sold out your guy for what?
1:11:26
No one you. Don't trust to sell him out.
1:11:28
Who's to stop you from selling me out at some point?
1:11:30
So he's got to go. You've already done that.
1:11:32
Adding a double murder, probably not a big deal.
1:11:35
Lifetime is lifetime after. I love those sentences were like
1:11:38
2 lifetimes. Yeah, well, you're here for one.
1:11:40
I don't think I'm going into jail in hell.
1:11:42
Well, maybe you're right. But you know what?
1:11:44
You have 40 versions right outside the jail cell and you
1:11:47
got to spend another lifetime waiting, Damn it.
1:11:51
One thing I didn't like about the ending though is GAIL.
1:11:54
This is where I am anti. Gay OK she just have an anti
1:11:58
girl. You too, actually, Yeah.
1:12:01
She just whines a lot. I know she's upset, it just goes
1:12:05
on and on and on. I just don't think we need that
1:12:07
much, OK? Her crying, her sobbing.
1:12:10
Love her life can shot right in front of her, dying her eyes.
1:12:13
But I don't need to know herself, really.
1:12:16
Move on. You know what I mean?
1:12:17
You got your ticket on the train.
1:12:18
Get out of town. I agree.
1:12:21
She's just there to do this. It's just from an auditory sure
1:12:25
term. It's like, OK, you're just.
1:12:27
Annoying. Lower that in the mix Exactly.
1:12:30
And yeah, and then we have him on the stretcher.
1:12:34
Which I really get a kick out of this sort of random.
1:12:37
What is he talking about? It's so funny to talk about
1:12:39
things like that. You know, he's like, I'm not
1:12:41
gonna make it. Where are we going for
1:12:43
breakfast? Don't want to go far?
1:12:45
I've said that. I have said that to Mike.
1:12:47
I don't mind going out for breakfast, but let's just keep
1:12:49
it close. Chorus right around the corner.
1:12:51
OK, no big deal. Perkins Actually, sorry, it's
1:12:54
closer than chorus, so I'm going to.
1:12:55
Perkins I love delicious sandwiches.
1:12:58
Sourdough big Canadian flag. It is, I think, both hilarious
1:13:04
and beautiful. I really dig it.
1:13:07
When the movie ends and he's dying in the credits are rolling
1:13:09
over. You are so beautiful.
1:13:11
And we're watching GAIL, presumably.
1:13:13
This song's fine for. This is perfect in this moment
1:13:16
for sure, and it has to be in the other one I guess to connect
1:13:18
the dots. Just don't.
1:13:19
Bang down the door. We're fine.
1:13:20
That's right. But I I like the closing moments
1:13:23
of this movie now. Everything in colour but the
1:13:25
poster is alive and it's vibrant and Gale is assuming she's
1:13:28
dancing there. The movie doesn't really have
1:13:30
any right to be that sentimental at the end, let's say.
1:13:33
But I thought the music and the queue and the voice over all
1:13:36
works to actually ground that relationship in ways I didn't
1:13:38
really enjoy throughout the rest of the movie.
1:13:40
But ultimately, in its totality, I think this movie is fantastic
1:13:44
and it seems to only grow in time.
1:13:47
And I feel like when I first saw it, I really loved it.
1:13:50
And then I saw other Depalma movies, I saw other Pacino
1:13:52
movies and I kind of thought, ohhh, this, this is OK.
1:13:55
But the other stuff is really good, and the further away I am
1:13:59
from some of the other stuff, and from this one in particular
1:14:02
I haven't watched in a long time.
1:14:04
I'm really was impressed by it. I just think it's really, really
1:14:07
good. Nothing amazing hits all the
1:14:09
tropes. It's the same stories that we've
1:14:11
seen 100 times. The mob guy wants to go clean.
1:14:14
He's got a girlfriend and needs him out.
1:14:15
Right, works right so. But tropes are tropes for a
1:14:17
reason. I think this one hits all of
1:14:19
them incredibly well, and there's just something about the
1:14:22
Palmas camera work that tickles me so hard, so it's definitely
1:14:25
stay on the shelf. I got a 4K version of it.
1:14:27
I'm happy to get it. So Gail's not enough to get.
1:14:30
You out? No.
1:14:31
My question is, are you willing to give any Depalma movies that
1:14:34
you hadn't warmed up to a chance?
1:14:36
Well, I guess mission to Mars, maybe my baby.
1:14:39
I might have to. I might be picking that.
1:14:41
Up I might have. To make its way to my shelf,
1:14:43
however, it's Tim Robbins. I've seen most of them and
1:14:48
there's some that hit some that don't for sure.
1:14:49
I don't know. I'm always willing to watch a
1:14:51
diploma movie because even if the movie isn't that great, the
1:14:53
style of them I'm sure is. Worth your time?
1:14:55
Yeah, so Dave's first time viewing on this and revisiting
1:15:00
maybe a diploma in the end, where do your final thoughts and
1:15:03
maybe a little tease for next week?
1:15:04
I want to start by saying I enjoyed the movie.
1:15:07
Your film? Yep, that's right.
1:15:10
I said it for the following reasons.
1:15:13
I think Penn is amazing. Yeah, this is peak Puccino.
1:15:18
So great casting. I think we know which category
1:15:20
this kept movie writer side falls underneath.
1:15:23
Hmm. Replayability.
1:15:25
I question it beyond two or three, sure.
1:15:28
But definitely I wanna watch this again.
1:15:30
In five years or in two? Years.
1:15:32
Yeah. Believe it or not, I would
1:15:34
consider putting this on my shelf if Wellington was still
1:15:37
open and I could get a 15 dollar 4K.
1:15:42
The sound mix of certain moments, like out in the rain
1:15:45
watching her dance, I would love to hear that.
1:15:48
I think that would really be worth the 15 in that moment.
1:15:51
Yeah. However, at the end with her
1:15:53
whining for 10 minutes with that same atmost surround sound, I
1:15:57
might return it. So I don't know.
1:15:59
But that's pretty good for me to consider having it on my shelf.
1:16:03
But I would require the 4K upgrade.
1:16:06
I wasn't sure if it existed. You said it does so on your
1:16:08
shelf, maybe when you're not looking.
1:16:12
I think what also sold me is the pacing, and that's a big thing
1:16:17
for me. De Palma never claimed to be a
1:16:20
big fan. As much as I like Untouchables,
1:16:23
I don't like it in certain ways. It's not like a oh, I love
1:16:27
movies, yeah, but I love draft day.
1:16:30
That's right, his working draft days?
1:16:31
Impeccable. Yeah.
1:16:32
So I don't maybe necessarily appreciate his filmmaking to
1:16:36
your level, but I can recognize a good built film and I like
1:16:41
tropes. Yeah.
1:16:42
If they're done right, absolutely.
1:16:44
This is done right? Yeah.
1:16:45
As for next week, if Pacino is option A, I'm going with a movie
1:16:51
with option B. I'm not sure if you're going to
1:16:54
get that. I'll be curious to see if you
1:16:55
get that. If you don't, I'll explain it
1:16:57
please. Someone else who pukes in it
1:17:00
coincidentally. And also someone gets shot
1:17:04
coincidentally. Can't wait.
1:17:05
It's all happening in Paris. OK, yeah, alright, take a trip.
1:17:09
We're gonna go to France next week, folks.
1:17:11
Thanks for joining us here in New York this week.
1:17:15
We're gonna classify such. You love geography.
1:17:17
I do obviously found that out. Please rate US five stars in
1:17:20
your podcaster of choice. Subscribe to Never miss an
1:17:22
Episode and please share the podcast with any criminals,
1:17:25
hoodlums, gangsters, dancers as well that you meet along.
1:17:29
The ballet or otherwise. We're not judging.
1:17:32
You find it? Yeah, Dave is judging, don't
1:17:34
you? You have to tell them.
1:17:35
Share it anyway. Share it.
1:17:37
Goodbye.