Latest / The Parent Tap / Single Parent Alert: Trauma, Grief & Generational Trap

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Single Parent Alert: Trauma, Grief & Generational Trap · The Parent Tap

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: I did not know another widow.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't know anybody that I really didn't even know any single parents, right?
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_00: I knew some divorced couples, but even that isn't the same thing as being a single parent.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_01: On this show, we treat parenting like an operational challenge.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: We build standard operating procedures for screen time.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: We reverse engineer toddler meltdowns and we try to create systems that keep our households running efficiently.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_01: But today we are talking about the one thing that shatters every system you have in place: profound loss.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_01: My guest today is Rachel or Snyder.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: Long before social media, Rachel was building million-dollar teams and a massive career through the sheer power of authentic human connection.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_01: She is a powerhouse in the entrepreneurial space, having trained alongside the creators of the Chicken Soup for the Souls series and leadership experts like Michael Hyatt.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_01: But beyond the business success, Rachel is the founder of Spirited Prosperity, where she dedicates her work to helping women and mothers overcome massive life challenges by tapping into a deeper spiritual resilience.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: I can't imagine because this morning, just getting the kids out the door, it was like me putting on the shoes of my toddler, one-year-old, and then we have to change his diaper, and then my four-year-old, but like she forgot her water on the counter.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: So mom has to go run back and grab it.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just like it's this constant push and pull of what we have to do.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: And doing it by yourself is I'm always much more thankful when my wife gets home, like if she's out getting her hair appointment or nails done or something like that.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'm always like, wow, I appreciate you 10 times more because I realize that oh my gosh, that is so hard to do.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_00: Ryan, you make a great point.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: And you said you have a toddler that's four and another one that's one.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_00: Is that correct?
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so my question to you is it's a huge jump to go from one to two children, isn't it?
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_00: Did you find that to be the case?
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's a ginormous step.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't realize it.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_01: We thought got a little overcompetent, to be honest with you.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: I will tell you, everybody does because that's the reason why we go and do the second one because we're like, I could do this, I got this.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: We figured it out.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: Child's alive, we're alive, we're still sane.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: How hard could it be?
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_01: That's famous last words, and then we the second one just it seemed like we had five more at once.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: Our life really got chaotic, and we had this, we had an old dog too, and it was just the dynamic of an old dog with uh a newborn, and he's always licking the kids or always stepping over them.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_01: So it seemed like we had three kids at once at the same time.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_01: We just lost our dog, unfortunately.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_01: It's it it feels like it's a little bit more manageable now, just the two kids to focus on, and sad as that makes me.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's like once you have your kids, your focus is solely on your kids, right?
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure I see your book there behind the right.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, that is an I few have a newfound, total profound respect for single parents.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: And my children were older, and it it is a huge responsibility.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_00: And the great thing about having a family with both parents there is that you're expressing you can divide and conquer.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: One of you can tackle one child, the other can handle the other one or the other two.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: You can divide and conquer if something happens with the dog, plus you've got that additional adult moral support.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: You guys could just look at each other across the room and go, okay, I know exactly what you're thinking.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: I know you're about to pull your hair out, and I know you need to get out the door, but you understand that you're at the mercy of these two little people, and you're trying to do whatever you can to help each other out.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: And there's something that's so fortifying and comforting about that because you guys know that you're in the same boat, and you guys both went into the boat willingly, right?
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: You both signed up for this cruise.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's the thing is that for when they're so little, the physical needs, your responsibility is so much more physically engaging, right?
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: You have to have hands.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I can remember for myself, I always thought I am really gonna enjoy it when these kids can talk and reason, and we can just sit and have conversations, and it's gonna be a lot easier.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: So I can get through all of this.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: And what I found for me, because I have two boys, and I don't know, are your children boys, girls, one of each?
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: I have one of each, yes.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_00: And the girl come first, okay.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_00: And her name is Riley.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_00: Riley, and your son is Reese.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, Riley and Reese.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: My name is Ryan, and my wife's name is Randy, so it's all ours.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: I I love that, and I guess I'm I'm gonna step out on a limb here and say that perhaps Riley and Reese have very different personalities.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, and uh who's the more spirited child?
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_01: My firstborn, Riley.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_01: She is a firecracker.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_01: She is her way or the highway, and she knows how to manipulate us and get mom to go to Target and get dad to let her sleep in bed with us at night, and she's very she's very witty.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's interesting because I've got two grandchildren, and they are five and three, about to be six and four.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_00: And Grayson came first, and Autumn came second.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I not raising girls myself, I was never really manipulative.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: They know what they're doing, but they're so cute about it, aren't they?
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_00: And so you just you're like, okay, it's worth it.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm seeing it now firsthand.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: I will tell you, raising two boys, you didn't have quite that.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_00: I never saw it, it didn't come out.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: Boys are very different in the way that they present, and you can see that too with Reese, I'm sure.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_00: He's probably just got a whole different air about him, and he'll learn from his sister what works and what doesn't, but he probably won't be quite that assertive about it all.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: He he just may be a little bit more laid back, and it's very interesting.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: What was so interesting for me with this journey with my boys is that they're raised the same way, we're in the same household.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: Our values, our morals, our belief system, our routines, everything was the same.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: And yet they both handled the loss of their dad very, very differently.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: And and you had mentioned the loss of your dog, and that your children may have handled even that differently.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_00: One is may have been a little more connected to your pet than the other.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I just think it's one of those things of human nature that there have been tons of psychological studies done about that.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think for me, and I was an older parent.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: I was an older parent in that I had my first child at 34 and my second one at 38.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_00: So I think one of the other dynamics for me, play groups, I'd be in play groups, and I wasn't as upset or concerned about some of the things that these other young moms were were dealing with.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_00: And maybe part of that was just where I was in my life's journey.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_00: Children will watch the way that we handle things and will take our take their cues from us.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_00: And I I do you have your families or are their grandparents close by?
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just curious.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_01: We just moved um closer to family last year.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, that was a whole whole deal itself.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_01: We moved from a different town.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, are you closer to your wife's family or your family?
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um, my my family, my parents are older.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, just in background.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_01: I had kids around your age too, so 35 and 38.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_01: I'm almost 40 now.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, my parents are in their 70s, or I think my dad's in their 70s, my mom's about to be.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so they're older, and and her family, uh her parents are mostly in their 50s, like they just they're in their mid-50s.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_01: So I was thinking, like, you know, let's uh let's give my parents a chance, you know what I mean?
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: Before um their parents have a chance.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_01: I guess that's kind of how I viewed it.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but her mom's 45 minutes away.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: And then the rest of her family lives in Vegas.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_01: So it's, you know, we're most of our family's in Phoenix.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_01: So we are, you know, the it the kids have more support here, they have more things to do versus our old town.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_01: Although I do still miss our old town quite a bit.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um it was, you know, a town of 40,000, and the the weather was really pleasant all the time, and you had seasons and Phoenix, like we're already 100 degrees, and no seasons really.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's we have summer and we have a mild summer.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: That's hot and not so hot.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of a bummer.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's almost like seasonal depression, I get when spring hits because it's like already 100 degrees.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's not like the slow progression of four different seasons.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_00: And Ryan, I've never thought about that.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: Seasonal disorder from not enough sunlight, and we always think about winter and bleak and dreary, but you make a really good point that I never thought about is that when it gets that hot for that long without any break, that can mess with you.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it really can affect the way that you though, especially when you've been exposed to something else, I should say.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: If you haven't been, then you don't know what you're missing.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_00: But you make a really good point because I'm in Dallas and we're not as hot as you.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: We'll be hot for a while, and it'll get there and stay there.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: But we have a little bit more of the distinction of going into we will have a fall, we will have a little winter.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_00: Kudos to you for recognizing the connection and and for honoring the relationship with the with the grandparents on on all sides, because I didn't have that when I was growing up.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: And my boys still have all four grandparents are all still alive.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: My parents happen to live in Australia, though, that's very far away, and they have a grandpa that's turning 93 today, and they have a grandma who is tur who is already 88.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: So that's really an enigma in and of itself.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: I would like to say that they were all.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_00: Well, my parents moved in the last six months of John's illness, so they were there.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: So my boys were 10 and 14 when they lost their father, and so they were kind of at those ages where Oma and Opa were kind of more pain in the butt, right?
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: But they were there, and I think there's something to be said for that.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I think even now they are helping me.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: The boys are helping me with the second book, which is called The Boys, The Battle in the Bible.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it's been 14 years now since their dad died.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: So they have been able now, even though they can't recall a lot, Ryan, they're still able to kind of go back to that place.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: And it's interesting how both of them have just said so much of what was going on during that time was a blur.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so it really is interesting to see what our kids remember about things that go on in there.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: Of course, they remember their father and they remember his illness, but they don't there are other things that that don't stick with them quite so much.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: So I think you're doing a great thing, and and your sacrifice will be honored.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_00: Know that it will be.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: Appreciate that.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_01: I love it, and I felt like I didn't do such a great job with the first one at times.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_01: I struggled as a as a new parent, and so the second one is my new chance to kind of wipe the slate clean and try again and be a better father, hopefully.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that this podcast, the whole idea behind it, is so I can learn from others and so I can share.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like it's a very isolating being a dad in the 40s.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_01: I work remotely, my wife works remotely.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_01: We're in a new, somewhat new town from a year ago.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know many people, I don't have many friends.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: So this is a way to connect, but also learn and systems that you use in your household or you've established and kind of bring it back into my household and kick your brain on your expertise.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_01: And so I've I've really enjoyed hearing your story and just gaining that experience from you.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: They have such a great outlook on life and sunny disposition.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_01: And so sometimes it's hard to maintain that, I find, when when every day feels mundane and you do the same thing over and over, and without saying the days are long but the years are short.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: I really, I really live that every day, it seems like.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_01: So this is this is a great connection.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_00: And and given the fact that you and your wife both work remotely, our culture has changed so much in that there's there's so much more flexibility and freedom, but our opportunity for connection, you you are being intentional.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: So good for you for recognizing that you have to be intentional about making connections.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: As your kids get older, you're gonna be swamped with school things, and there's gonna be class parties, and there's gonna be all those things that I have forgotten about.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_00: But now that I'm a ya-ya, flashbacking to all of the things that the boys were involved in.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I will tell you that for me, after I lost my husband, and I mean we knew he was going to die, fatal terminal disease, you're still never ready.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_00: You're you're never, whether you lose somebody suddenly or gradually, you're never ready.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: But because those boys were in school, John had just started high school.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_00: Jake was still fifth grade.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: So the school, that community, that routine, those relationships were critical for it kept the routine going.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: And then when they're out of their routine, they get all wonky and tired and cranky and nobody's happy.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: And yet I found that the routine for these boys getting up, breakfast, school, sports, homework, that all of that was one of the things that both it kept us, kept us thinking that we were somewhat normal in the middle of a situation that wasn't normal.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_00: It may have also insulated us a little bit, Ryan, from actually doing a lot of the grieving that we needed to do.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_00: I found that for me, I didn't know how to, I didn't know how to deal.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: I'd never helped anybody die.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: I'd never gone through this kind of a loss myself.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_00: And and so I kind of just thought that since things were going along normally, right?
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: As I was saying that routine, that okay, I mean, I knew something major, of course, had happened and their dad was gone.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_00: But but you just somehow seem to think too that if you're going through all the motions, right, that the routine might save you, or it might in some ways, like I said, it did, but in others it didn't.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: And actually, you're kind of the first person that I've actually even shared that with because I don't think I've really taken the time to really examine it like that.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: That was that community, which which you will soon be a part of because you're gonna be hitting preschool or kindergarten and all that stuff very, very soon.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: You'll find that to be to be a place where you can build from and and as well as your platform here.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my goodness, that was powerful just hearing about how people uplifted you and kind of got you through the obviously a really trying time.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_01: And that that's also just very uplifting.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_01: So, with that being said, how did you process earth shattering grief when you still have to wake up at a certain time, make the pancakes, be the mom for the kids who rely on you?
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_00: Well, Ryan, thank you for having me today.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm thrilled to be here.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: And I guess the best way to kind of explain that is it's kind of like when you go through a wedding or birth of a child or a funeral, there's all that activity, right?
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_00: And in the first two instances, you're celebrating.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: And then at some point, life goes back to you and your person, your family, right?
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: And for us, we had all of this.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: My husband had been ill for three years, everybody knew he wasn't going to be cured of this disease, and he passes, and then we have this flurry of activity, right?
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_00: Everybody comes in, everybody's together, and there's a there's an element of it being somewhat surreal, right?
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: This person is gone, my kids know their dad is gone, and yet we're doing these services, we're having all the people are in town, and then I think it's when everybody leaves, and it's just three of us, when it used to be four, that it kind of hits we're really have to, we're gonna have to figure this out.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I think one of the hardest things for me was the fact I didn't know, so I how did I keep going?
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: I think part of it was just because my boys they were still in school, they couldn't not go to school.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: That was one of the saving graces, I think.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: And and for them, being with being with friends there was so important.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I think for me, I just I was just kind of in this in this fog of just, I just need to keep doing what we need to keep doing.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_00: I just thought, well, these boys, I just have to keep going.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: I have to keep going for them.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: And that's and that's what I did.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_00: I think for me, it was in, I don't think I really the shock and the trauma of it all came later, much later.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_01: And and judging by your book titled, a little bit of of faith that came into it.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_00: No, there was a lot, there was a lot of faith.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_00: I think for me, there was a lot of faith that kind of changed.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: I had core beliefs and I grew up in a very faith-filled household.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_00: My parents were from two very different faith backgrounds, so I got exposed to a lot of things.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: But for me, at this point in my life, the structure of Sunday was we were in church in the morning, we were in church at night, we were at church on Wednesdays, we were in church a lot.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: My parents might have had very different ideas about what happened in those services.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_00: However, they were very good about sharing the stories of the Bible.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_00: We knew who Jesus was, we knew about the miracles, all of those things.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: But for me, relationship is more important than religion.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_00: Religion gives us the guardrails, it gives us the structure.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: But it's the relationship that Jesus wants with us that is so important.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_00: And for me, he got so real because I got to the end of my rope.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: When somebody says there's nothing we can do for your loved one, there's not a thing we can do.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: Get your affairs in order and just watch this happen.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_00: When you get to the end of the rope, you just say, Okay, Lord, I don't, I have not a clue.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_00: So I have to rely on you.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: Amen.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_01: I have a very similar background with church services and religious family, and that that was a huge strength of comfort for me going through.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_01: Obviously, it pales in comparison to your loss, but we mentioned my loss with my dog of 14 years.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_01: And so I've I've had a lot of time with God recently where it's like, okay, I I need you to kind of get me out of business and get me get me past this sticking point because I feel like it really was tough to get through and it pales in comparison to your story, but it's a little bit of my own experience.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_01: Lost stinks, it comes back, it comes back at weird weird random times, and sometimes I'm fine, and then sometimes I'm crying in front of my kids, and I'm like, I don't, I don't know how to handle this.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_01: And so I I just commend you for your your strength during all this with your kids and and keeping their worlds spinning when I know it's probably extremely tough to do, being that main provider for your kids and going through that.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_01: With that being said, we throw the word resilience around a lot in parenting.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: We want our kids to be resilient when they they fail, right?
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like they strike out a t-ball or they fail a test.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_01: But how do we model resilience for them when dealing with real trauma?
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_01: Was there a difference between being strong for the kids and accidentally teaching them to suppress their negative emotions?
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: And that's a great point that you bring up.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that what you just said about letting your kids see you cry, letting them see you sad, letting them see you pray, letting them see you question, letting them see you be angry within normal limits.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_00: This is this is what is so important.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: And we are all going to live with disappointment.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_00: We are all going to live with loss.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_00: We are all going to have things come into our life that we're not ready for, prepared for, or weren't expecting.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_00: My boys watched me and they helped me take care of their father.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: They watched, they watched us have conversations, they watched us.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: Tell them we don't have an answer.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_00: We don't have an answer.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: But we are going to say our prayers.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_00: We're going to talk to God about this.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I know that when they're young, this concept of God, this concept of death, they are big concepts.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: And we feel like, okay, as the parent, we're supposed to be able to explain all this.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: Well, Ryan, sometimes there just isn't an explanation.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that when they can see us hurting and not knowing the answer, at least it makes it palatable.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: It gives some kind of a reference point.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_00: Because I don't think it serves any of us well to be so stoic to pretend that none of this is affecting us.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_00: When they see us dealing with the hard things and then also dealing with the good things, they are going to, they are going to learn so much from that.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_01: And the vulnerability of it, of letting them see your real emotions and and not hiding it because you want to, at least I feel this, but I want to hide it from my kids sometimes.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like I don't want them to see bad of emotions.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_01: We talked with a psychologist on the show last time, and she said that's actually what you don't want to do.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_01: You you want your kids to actually have emotions, and especially boys when they grow up, society expects boys to just kind of take things on the chin and keep moving and and not have those emotions.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: So I think we're kind of doing them a disservice if we don't do that.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_01: Grief, as as we talked about, grief doesn't hit two people the exact same way.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_01: So if you and your kids were navigating the lost with different phases, how did you navigate through that?
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_01: If one of you are maybe in the numb phase and one of you are in the anger phase, how did you give you such another grace for that?
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_00: No, you're so right.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_00: Because the oldest was 14 and he had just started high school.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: I will tell you, his teachers showed him a lot of grace.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: He probably should have failed that year.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: But what I found was a lot of them had not dealt with this either.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_00: And because the pain was so bad for John, he turned to drugs.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_00: John's the one that that went down the road of addiction.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what the subject of the second book is about.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_00: Jake got addicted to sports.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_00: If that had a ball or a bat or something, that was where he was.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_00: That's where he was.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_00: So they both handled this same event very differently.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_00: And I didn't have any exposure, just like I didn't know much about it.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't know anything about drugs.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: I thought, okay.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_00: When John started acting out, I thought, okay, it's a combination, right?
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's adolescence, it's grief, high school, this is all normal stuff, right?
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_00: I had no idea that he was buying them and selling them and using them and stealing.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_00: So I had to start a whole new journey.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: How do you do addiction with a 14-year-old?
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_00: And this went through several years, and we did the whole thing, ending up with an intervention and rehab all before he turned 18.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_00: So that we were all on different pages, right?
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_00: At this point, I'm just trying to keep the two of them.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: I'm trying to keep the older one really alive and keep from killing himself.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_00: And Jake, I've had both of these boys, they're contributing to this second book.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_00: And and Jake was just still at that point, what 10?
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_00: He was just still somewhat innocent about all of this.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_00: I could still, he could still crawl into bed with his mom when he got scared of a thunderstorm.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: That's still where he was.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_00: So this whole rebellion, everything that was going on with John, he he compensated by becoming the child that would never give his mom any trouble at all.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: And he carried that with him, carried that with him until he became a young man.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, that's quite the different paths that they took.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_01: And I could see how the cascade effect of the loss kind of triggered of your children a little bit differently and kind of changed the trajectory of everything, it seems like that's the powerful story, and that's great that that your youngest was able to be there.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it sounds like almost like a support system.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_00: Somebody will really call it a trauma bond that you become bonded to this person because of the trauma that you guys have experienced together.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and that's kind of my daughter right now, which is funny because our dog would always sleep on the floor.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_01: She has a Spider-Man bed.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, it's not her real bed, but she keeps it in our bedroom.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: And she was been going in there almost every night now that her dog's been gone.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_01: And it's in a way, it's super comforting.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: There's something here, and there's noises going on.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_01: Because I think that the quietness for me is deafening when there's nothing in the house happening, it's just like so.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's almost like that that white noise of okay, everything's okay, my family's still here, everything's good.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_01: That can relate to that.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_01: The rapid fire.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_01: What is the absolute worst thing a well-meaning person can say to a parent who is grieving?
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I think the worst thing anybody can say is I know how you feel.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I appreciate that, but I don't really think that you do.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you didn't have you didn't have the quite the same relationship, you don't have the same dynamic.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot in that.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, hopefully I didn't say that earlier.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_01: No, but you didn't.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_01: I just think that's just one of those common well-meaning states, but if they haven't walked in your sheet, is it?
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, what is the most helpful practical thing a friend or neighbor can do to support a family going through loss?
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_00: Be available and let them know it.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_00: Let them know, and just remind them.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_00: It may be a simple text every day that says I'm available for whatever, and that's it.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_00: You may get a reply, you may not, but just that availability is huge.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_01: Lastly, if a parent listening to this right now is in the absolute trenches of grief and they're feel like they're failing their kids today, what is the circuit breaker?
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: So one action they can do right now to reset.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_00: Acknowledge that you are not a superhero, cut yourself some slack because you probably are failing them, because you cannot do it all, be it all, have it all at the same time.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: You just can't.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_00: So, in order to reset, for me, it's taking a look at what is working.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_00: And and if you've got more than one child, try to deal with them individually, right?
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: Set the time.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe it's going to get ice cream with the one of them, maybe it's going for a walk with the other.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: They need to know that they are individual and that they're not all clumped into this collective of all of the kids.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: But if you can deal with your children individually, take them away for a date per se, I think that you'll find that that could be one of the most helpful things that you can do for yourself and for your children.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: Practical advice.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: And if and if you have failed them or something hasn't gone the way you wanted it to, acknowledge that too and just say, I didn't handle that well.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sorry this happened.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_00: And and and if they need to talk about it, great.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_00: And if they don't, at least they know that you are aware.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_01: Rachel, I cannot thank you enough for holding space for this conversation today.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_01: For the parents listening who are in the thick of it right now, where is the best place for them to find your resources and connect with your work?
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, well, you can find the book on Amazon.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_00: And it's also recorded on Audible.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: This is a memoir trilogy.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: So there are three parts to it: the story of the loss of their dad, the boys, the Bible, and the battles will come out on Father's Day.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_00: And then the third one will be God, the guy, and the girls, which will tell how I met a widower and we dated long distance for 10 years, and he had four girls.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_00: So, and how all of that has come about and what my life looks like now.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: My community is called Spirited Prosperity.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_00: That's the name of my company and my website.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: I'm available on Facebook, LinkedIn, Instagram, and YouTube.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_01: Well, thank you so much.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna I'm gonna link everything in the description of this video.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_01: So everyone go there.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for your time and everyone listening.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_01: Hug your kids, trust your system, and we'll see you on the next episode.