Latest / Alive & Kicking: Stories of Waking Up with Kay Eck / Interview with Elizabeth Rago | Awakening and Living Well

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Interview with Elizabeth Rago | Awakening and Living Well · Alive & Kicking: Stories of Waking Up with Kay Eck

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to the Alive and Kicking Podcast.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_01: I'm your host, Kay Eck.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: I'm talking to ordinary people about their extraordinary lives.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome back to the podcast, everybody.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: I'm delighted to have with me today the beautiful Elizabeth Brago.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome, Elizabeth.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so excited to be here and chat with you today.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so excited to be here with you because as I was um kind of looking at some of your, you do a lot of stuff, so I want to get into that.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: But as I was kind of browsing through some of the things that I know you do, I I think like we have so many commonalities.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm excited to explore some of those.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_01: One of them is that we love what I what I refer to as the domestic arts.
• 0:58
  unknown: Yes.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_01: Truly.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_01: It's so much fun.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I am a Taurus, and so I'm yeah, that makes sense.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: So creating a comfy nest is like, you know, high on my list of priorities.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: So we'll we'll get into that in a little bit.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_01: But I wonder if we could start out today by talking a little bit about all of the things that you are up to.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_01: I know you're a writer, and uh let's just I'm just gonna hand it over to you and let's talk a little bit about what you're up to.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: Well, uh, you are correct.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: I do lots of things.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, well, currently um I am a freelance writer, and I am also in a master's program to become a secondary education teacher with an emphasis on humanities.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um that stemmed from just all the happenings of 2020.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_00: Me really reassessing how I wanted to take the next stage of my writing life, where I wanted to take it, um, and really just seeing so much positive energy and passion from young people.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I wanted to be part of that.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, not that I've given up hope on adults.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we all have something that we're working on and we will continue uh to do that.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: But the the 2020 was so intense, and it just made me sit back and reflect, okay, where do I want to put my energy?
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so what I'm doing is now I'm shifting from exclusively freelance writing as you know, a full-time job to pay the bills, to um getting my master's degree and my teaching certification.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then parallel to that, um working with Modern Domestic Woman, my online platform for women.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: So um Modern Domestic Woman is really a passion project.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's an online community for women to support them in whatever capacity they need.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, there are specific resources that I talk about on my website.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's almost like a guide for the local area that I live in, um for therapists and um any kind of like professional help that they might need, um, legal services if you're getting a divorce, food pantries, uh, domestic violence centers.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: So it's it's very localized to my area.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, long-term, big time takeover.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: I would love to make that a worldwide um space for people to come, for women to come and find like a local place of support that you can't normally find just in a random Google search.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: You know, because there's so many amazing practitioners and people who are out there who are helping people that don't necessarily come up, you know, in an SEO algorithm.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: You know, Google is kind of it's limited.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: So I just wanted to be a safe space for women to come to if they're in a hard time of their life and they need some support and guidance.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I've got my modern domestic woman passion project, getting my master's degree, freelance writing to buy groceries.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I've got three kiddos um and a husband and, you know, a house to manage, like every other domestic woman out there.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I had hit the pause button on a couple other projects because of just burnout.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I really started listening to my body and saying yes and no and establishing boundaries.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: And that was like one of the most magical things I could have done for myself is establish some good healthy boundaries.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_00: So currently that's all I'm doing.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_01: Well, the thing that I love about modern domestic woman is it it is very much a place of support, but it's also a celebration.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: I there's there's you have such a wide range of voices that you bring to the table, and and all of the things that would be of interest to women that are both supporting and also just like it's really expansive.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_01: So there's not like one sort of way of thinking about support.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_01: There's many different voices that contribute to it.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's not just you and what you can put together.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_01: It's I I love that about it.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: And it's also like really fun.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's not it's not a serious no.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we taught the the contributors that I have and the um elements that I highlight, definitely we get into more dicier topics that are more serious, but it's not, I mean, it's a place where I don't take myself too seriously.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: I share funny things and make fun of myself quite often.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_00: It really is an extension of me as an individual.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_00: So when I meet someone or someone's in my life, if they're having a rough time, and and really that's what's how it how it was created was women that I knew were coming to me with, I trust you.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: Where can I get a recommendation for A, B, C, and D?
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: You know, my my child was newly diagnosed on the autism spectrum.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: I have no idea what to do.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm scared to ask, yeah, you know, my group, I I trust you.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: Can you help me lead me in the right direction?
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: And so really it's just an extension of me.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_01: So let's uh wind the clock back a bit and talk a little bit about your childhood.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm curious, um who you knew yourself to be as a child and how life changed that.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_00: That is a really good question.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_00: Let's see.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_00: In my childhood, I was very, I grew up in a very safe home.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: I'm very, very blessed and fortunate to have that because not a lot of people can say that.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I felt very loved and supported, um, always encouraged to be creative.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: So I always had very big dreams.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: And it wasn't, you know, I'm gonna ride a horse one day.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: It's I'm gonna have a horse farm.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: This was literally one of my dreams.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I'm gonna have this giant horse farm and the people are gonna come and we're it was always very big, big, big picture.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, my parents never stifled me.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sure at the time they were like, sure, you can be an astronaut and have a giant horse farm at the same time.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they they didn't shoot me down, basically.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: So as a child, I always had like big dreams.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_00: I was always thinking about the world around me.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the schools that I went to were very um women-centric, um, which back, you know, in the 80s, I don't, I don't know if we were, you know, things were were ramping up to really start supporting women.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: But when you're a little girl, I just I was put in the path of adults that were women and and men who really supported me.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um now, of course, there were some stinkers peppered in, you know, that weren't as encouraging, but I felt that I had a really good um support system rooted from a young age.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_00: So in my childhood, I felt like there was no stopping me.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, maybe a little scattered, maybe a little too imaginative and like living in my own head, but that was okay.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody ever put me down for that.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_00: So my my my childhood was pretty nice.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then life happened, and then I went out into the world.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, I still think that that little girl lives in me today, and I and now in my 40s, I'm like searching to get her back, um, but with a newfound wisdom of age and and things happening to me.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: So um after I got out of high school, you know, I went into college, I was away from home, um, had the usual college experiences, um went out and played with different um different different experiences with different groups of people.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I I think I was at first a little afraid to venture out into the world because I lived in a bubble as a child.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it was very safe.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I was very curious to get to know people who weren't like me.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_00: So that was that was fun.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um and just very eye-opening because I was able to see into the world and um start making my own opinion about how how to connect with people who were so different than me.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: And that could be anything, that could be, you know, their background, it could be their belief system.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so it was just it was, it was, it was an interesting time for me.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I got married after I left college.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_00: And about five years after that, I start we started having children, and that was a game changer.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, they always say, you know, whoever they is, that children change everything, and they they really do.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think because of the bubble, the childhood bubble, um, I was teetering on a judgmental me and a very compassionate, sensitive me.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: So in my 20s, as I went from being in college, still kind of in a bubble, um, and then going into the working world and starting, I worked in corporate for a while, um, in sales, I worked in education.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I was almost wrestling with myself to find my true self.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: So on one hand, I was kind of mean to female coworkers.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I I'm not proud to say that at all, but I've always been very open with that.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_00: So in my in my 20s, it's there was almost like voice, not voices in my head, but you know, you've got that inner prompting of, oh, you know, that girl or that woman is doing better than I am.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: And then a tinge of jealousy would come out, and then I would with humor um bring back the attention to me, and in in that way, um, maybe embarrass the person that was doing better than me.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_00: It and it was really petty, really horrible.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: And in fact, I've apologized to some of the people that I've done that to so much.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I've changed so much.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_00: But then at the same time, there was this voice saying, that's not really you.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_00: This just isn't you.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I was wrestling with that.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: Then, you know, in my in my 20s, I was, you know, you're young, you're full of hope, you're bebopping around town, and you've got like decent income.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_00: And then the children came and I got to see a life and care for a life that wasn't my own.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_00: And the thought of someone doing the things and just being petty and mean, like I had been to some of my like co-workers or friends, that really bothered me.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I thought, I can't be that way anymore.
• 13:42
  unknown: Wow.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I really, I mean, it takes time because when you start having a habit, you know, you have to kind of do the replacement principle, like replace it with something else.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: So I really started exploring like a spiritual side of myself and like a higher power.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and really it was because this I was caring for this little human being and I wanted to probably put him in the same bubble my parents put me in, you know, and at least give him a foundation of self-worth, happiness, um, safety.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so that I feel like that's really when things started to change for me.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I really started to tap into my own true self.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I I started to ditch the drama.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_00: I couldn't do it anymore.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_00: My life was so dramatic under my own home, you know, under my own roof, that I couldn't bring any more of it into my own life.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_00: Now, that's not to say that things didn't go wrong, but you know, it was intense.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so fast forward a couple of years.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, my kids are now, I have three children.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: They're um starting to be in school, they're independent, they're going out into the world.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and we went through some about five years of family trauma.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: And that was in the form of financial trauma.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we had to file bankruptcy.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, not going into a long story, but we had a lot of financial problems.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: My husband was in a car accident, which resulted in lots of medical bills, you know.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: So there was this sense of urgency for us to start living the way we wanted to like truly live.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so we went through this financial trauma.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: My husband was in a car accident.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, then he got in another car accident, like back to back.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_00: So his back, his back literally is um in a bad place.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but that put such stress on our family.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we moved three times in like five years, you know, we had to do a short sale on our house.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like all those things are in the top stressors of life.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then just when we started to find some relief, both my husband and I were like gainfully employed, we were doing really well.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, my my son really started struggling and um he was hospitalized.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: He was 10.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_00: So a little guy.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um it it turned out that he was on the autism spectrum.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: He was a late diagnosis because he was super high functioning.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_00: He was super social, he was all the things that your typical autistic kid was was not, which is a misconception because a lot of people in the spectrum are super social.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but he always got good grades, got along with kids pretty well.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_00: But then our whole life just kind of came crashing down around us when he was in the hospital.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: So that too was a huge turning point.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um just for me as an individual, as a parent, as a woman.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_00: I got to see at that hospital people who were hurting so badly.
• 17:20
  unknown: Yeah.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_00: The parents who were there supporting their kids, who were going through horrible stresses and you know, self-mutilation.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I was talking to these people who were so hurt, and all they wanted to do was be safe and be heard.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I that that's uh that's a lot.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it knocked me off my feet.
• 17:48
  unknown: Yeah.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I'm an empath, so I take on a lot of things.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I after all that time, that five years of this chronic stress coming at us as a family unit, um, I really just realized like every single person is working on something.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I cannot, no matter what I might think I know, I cannot judge.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_00: Now that's not to say I'm not a human being and I don't have like nasty thoughts sometimes, but when you really start getting into like the muck and the mire of people's lives, like that that dark underbelly, and through Modern Domestic Woman, I started interviewing people who had these stories.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: And there were people in my community, and people would reach out to me and say, like, I want to tell you my story, it it made me walk around my little world in a different way with like new eyes.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I when you talked about um like kind of like being the mean girl back um when you were first starting your career, I you know, it it I feel like it at that age, it takes a lot of self-reflection and under a very mature sense of understanding that why you were behaving in that way and the consequences that it was having.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm wondering, you know, since you were in this, you were raised in a nice bubble, where you got that that the ability to self-reflect like that, whether that was part of your upbringing, or if there were if that if those situations were creating just so much discomfort that you had to look at it?
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's a combination.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_00: I think um my mother and I are very similar.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, she tends to attract people who have a story who might be more like rough and ready, and you know, somebody who's who might not be accepted straight away in terms of looks or how they act or whatever.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: So she, I always watched her um, as I was growing up, be assigned like the problem children at school when she would um volunteer.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: And she was like, it's fine, he's a good kid.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_00: You know, she would talk about these undesirable people that she was always linked up with because she had this compassionate heart, and I think that that was part of it was I was brought up to be kind.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's that's it, it's really that simple.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: On the flip side of it, there there was a judgmental aspect to my upbringing.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I think um I think that was just like maybe fear of the unknown, um, to be more scared to venture out.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so there was definitely like support, but there was also this, okay, let's just protect ourselves.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: So in that it became, I think naturally, if you are fearful, you I think I fell into this judgmental, um I don't know what even what it was.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: It was this, well, if you're not like me, then it's like I can't even pinpoint it.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: But it was this self reflection of I just don't like the words that are coming out of my mouth.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and and at the same time, as I started to like tap into that higher power and really question, you know, our existence just as human beings on the earth.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the higher power I choose is all about love, and I couldn't I couldn't justify the things that were coming out of my mouth, my actions, if I was truly going to be following this idea of love.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, does that make sense?
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_01: Totally, and I I just want to acknowledge that how much courage it takes to talk about a prior self that you might not be proud of.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: I I really relate to that, and and and I just like it, that's amazing.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: And it is it heartens me so much to create like that together, you know, we're creating the acceptance for people to say like to be honest about who they've been, because that's really what sets you free, you know, keeping it hidden is uh what torments you from inside, and you might not even realize it, but to set it free in the world is to set it free from within your heart.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_01: So it's I I love that you can talk about that like that.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_01: So, and it also is kind of amazing to me that you and I had the completely opposite upbringings and experiences as children.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_01: And yet it it's almost as if no particular childhood can shield you from the life lessons that are heading your way.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's like it almost so as a parent, you know, be encouraged that you could be a perfect parent and your children are still going to experience the lessons they came to learn.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you can't shelter human beings from the world.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_00: Eventually they're gonna have to venture out, and all you can do is just provide them with, you know, a well-rounded thought thought process of how to deal with stress and to be compassionate with others, um, which actually takes a lot of the pressure off parenting.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not to say I don't have like mom guilt 24-7, but a lot of times I'm like, you know what?
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: If my child is happy in what they're doing in their life, if they're surrounded by people who love them, and if they bring something positive to the world, then we're in a good place.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_01: So you went through really cataclysmic trauma and sustained trauma over sounds like quite a few years.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_01: How were you able to cope with that as you were going through it?
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_01: And have you felt that there's there needed to be a period of recovery from it?
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_00: So that's an amazing question.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: I'm currently in recovery from it.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_00: So we came out of the trauma about a year and a half or two years ago.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um, no, probably like a year and a half.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like we we gained financial stability.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we got the right help we needed for my son.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I was actually going through a lot of physical ailments because of the trauma that we had gone through.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but now is my recovery time, like right now.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I I really we encourage people and especially women, well, we encourage everyone to just like pull up your big girl panties and um press on and work through it and like toughen up.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I don't think that that's the right answer.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I'm all about being driven and saying, you know what, this is a hard situation, but I'm gonna push through it.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_00: But I pushed through so many things consecutively that my body and um biologically and my spirit and my mind were in a state of fight or flight 24-7 for years.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_00: Because I thought, what's gonna happen next?
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because things kept happening, like small, well, it's not small thing, but like our identity was stolen.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: And then my husband got in a car accident, and then our identity was stolen again.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, my my child was in the hospital, and then I had like paralysis of the face because of the stress that was going on, and I was working three jobs, you know, and I was pressing for it and pressing for it and pressing forward and being like strong, but then that's not sustainable, and you crash and burn, and that's exactly what I did.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I the way I got through was from writing.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_00: I did a lot of writing that helped me was almost like journaling.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I started modern domestic woman like during that time.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_00: Almost.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_00: Well, in my morning, what's what's funny is you had talked about how um modern domestic woman is like a celebration of women and you know, domestic goodness and stuff.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_00: And every morning I post something called the morning pretty.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_00: And it's just a beautiful image.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_00: It could be anything, it could be a flower, it could be a person, it could be a house, it could be, you know, a cute nook.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_00: And literally that came from the fact that I just wanted something nice to look at when I woke up in the morning because I was so filled with fear and dread of what the day was going to bring that I needed something nice to start my day.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: And I started the morning pretty for myself.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 28:06
  unknown: Wow.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I have goosebumps all over me.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: It it, I mean, when I think about the beginnings of how Modern Domestic Woman started, that was really a lot of therapy for me.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so my writing, the things that I posted, I was really talking and counseling myself, searching for resources and thinking someone else out there has to be feeling the same way that I am.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like I can't be this crazy, you know, by myself.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_00: And once I started putting it out there little by little, I would get responses.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_00: Now, and that wasn't in the form of thousands of followers and um, you know, being interviewed.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: It was private messages from women saying, I'm too scared to say this out loud.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_00: I can't share this with my family.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going through something similar, or what you said really touched my heart.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: I just want you to know that I really appreciate that, even though I don't even comment on your stuff.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: So that's what kept it going.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: So at the same time, um, I, you know, was seeing therapists.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not ashamed to say that I still am on um medication, and that that's fine.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know, sometimes people choose to take medication to help out that that biology, that gap, whatever they're missing or they're needing more of.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I, you know, I believe in a higher power, and there's a lot of disagreements of whether or not you should take medication in my in my religion.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm a Christian, um, and I do get a lot of slack from other Christians about taking um medication that I just need to pray.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_00: The good thing is I pray all day.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: But my in my belief system, I believe that God, this higher power, created every human being with a unique talent.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I find therapists and clinicians to be so talented to unravel someone's mind and give them suggestions and give them coping skills and encourage and listen to the like the deep dark things.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: That is a talent.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_00: So I've had some amazing therapists along the way.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, during this time of recovery, I actually discovered a trauma therapist and she's she specifically um, and I didn't know I had trauma, I just thought I was living life.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because my trauma was little.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I was I wanted to speak to that because while you were talking about these various traumas, like you're you know, they're not little, obviously, they're huge.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_01: You were minimizing them probably.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, but also I really I had a teacher who once said that trauma is any time the world ended up being different than you thought it was gonna be.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_01: And that is like, wow, yes, that's a traumatic experience when something happens that was outside of your of what you expected.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, you could uh you know, you could name a thousand encounters that that fall under that category, and the significance is that they change you, yes, they change you in some way that isn't always easy to cope with.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_01: So I I love that you talk about you know all of the things as being traumas, not just like hard knocks or like you know, life happened, right?
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_01: This is deeply traumatic to who you were, truly.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I think as women, we minimize it.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's a oh well, someone else has it worse, right?
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_00: Or at least I wasn't raped as a child, you know, and then you you minimize it and minimize it and minimize it, and you're like, well, I'm just gonna toughen up and push through.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_00: And again, that's not sustainable for your body, for your mind, for your spirit.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's just not.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_00: So I am a huge supporter of seeing trauma specialists because they're so it's so interesting.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_00: I find mental health so interesting because your body responds so differently to different stressors, whether it be, you know, someone cuts you off on the street or your heart is completely devastated and broken, or your child is hurt, or you have a death, you experience loss.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, our bodies respond to that trauma in a certain way.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_00: But the great thing is, and this is what my this is where my recovery is coming in, is you can make different neuropathways.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: So if forever I I'll give you an example of my own.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I have anxiety.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I I've had, I've really noticed it affecting my life since I was in college.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so when we were in this great time of financial stress, every single time I would go to the grocery store, I would have an anxiety attack because I was like, I have this amount of money to spend.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_00: I cannot go over this amount.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_00: I would want to buy a certain brand, but I couldn't because it was too expensive.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_00: So I'd have to put stuff back.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so my trips to the grocery store just to buy regular essentials became a huge stressor for me.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so just the other day, now we've been at a place where we can now I still look for good prices, but I'm not like spending tons of money, but um, I can go to the grocery store now and buy what I need um and not freak out.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like I'm talking like I had to go find a bench and talk myself down because I couldn't breathe while I was doing my grocery shopping, because I had set this narrow pathway of this is how you respond when you go to the grocery store.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_00: So I was so excited because over Christmas, I went to the grocery store and I'm like, I don't have to have an anxiety attack today.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_00: And that's huge.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_00: Just that pause of listening to your body and saying, you know what, I have a choice here.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_00: I'm in a safe place mentally.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_00: I have money in my checking account to buy these groceries, and I don't have to feel bad about it because then there's guilt, you know, guilt comes in.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: And just pausing that that simple pause paved a new narrow pathway.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: So now when I go to the grocery store, I don't have to panic.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, it was so many similar things like that.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like every time the phone would ring, and this is where we where I would always say it's a small trauma, a baby trauma.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_00: Every time the phone would ring, some would be calling to tell us we're being sent to collections, or you know, that my child was sent to the hospital, that something bad happened at school.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so those little things, like just the simple phone ringing, and that happens all day.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that would send me into a panic.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_00: So now I don't panic anymore because I've paved a new habit.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like I'm responding to that stress and trauma differently.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think it's it's worth saying that when you experience a trauma, it lives in your body, it lives in your cells.
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_01: And you may be out of danger, but the reaction is still occurring in the body, whether the situation warrants it or not.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_01: So that I think that's what trauma therapists train you to do is to recognize that you're no longer in the danger that caused the reaction, and you can you can shift your reaction by becoming aware, right?
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of it is just pausing and acknowledging how you're feeling right now.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I um I experience something similar in that my children are all in their 20s, and it's a a period of time when they are out living their lives and they don't report into me regularly.
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_01: And so um when any of them call me, I just naturally assume some disaster has happened.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_01: And even though, you know, for the last 100 times that they've called me, there's not been a disaster at all.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_01: But you know, the the that experience of worrying about your children lives in your body, right?
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I can feel it in my shoulders right now, just talking about it.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_01: So, what are some of the things that your recovery includes in addition to the um some of the things that you're doing, like therapy and medication?
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_00: What what are some of the other things that you I would say one of the number one things is setting firm boundaries, not only with other people, but with myself.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I'm a yes person.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_00: I love saying yes to things super duper quick before I can just pause, decide whether or not it's you know, I can do it.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so really setting boundaries with myself and saying you don't have to answer yes straight away.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um, establishing boundaries with other people that has been part of the recovery.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_00: And once you start to establish healthy boundaries, it's actually kind of fun.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_00: Because then if someone asks you to do something and you're like, no, I don't think I'm gonna do that, it's very empowering.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_00: Very embarrassing, like developing mastery and yes, and the problem is that you do get pushback once you start setting boundaries because you're gonna have to start saying no to people or things.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so you just have to I had to assure myself that it was okay to say no.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_00: So that's been a huge part of my recovery.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um I do, I do yoga just in my home.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I watch like somebody on YouTube.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I try to be as active as I can because on on days when I'm feeling all the extras of life and I can't physically move.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_00: I just always feel like those days that I feel extra great or just a teensy bit energized, I need to like try and work out.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_00: And um, we do something in our family called laps.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_00: We do a lap, and that is where we just do a lap around the block.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and we can do that alone.
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's if we're stressed out or if we want to talk, like I want to talk to my husband about something.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_00: We say, You want to do a lap.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, my son has a lot of sensory overload stuff.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_00: So to get him grounded, um, he says, you know, can we do a lap just so I can step away from my computer?
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_00: Because we've had a lot of, you know, it's a lot of screen heavy living right now.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so they often need a lap.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_00: So that's just something silly we call it.
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_00: We're just taking a lap.
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um I love that because that's like that is the pause.
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_01: That's timeout, you know, like a good timeout, not like a negative timeout.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_00: Or like just anything that's grounding, more green, less green was our month, is has been our mantra.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and uh the 54321 technique where um if I feel like my chest tightening or I feel like I can't get away and do a lap, I can observe, you know, five things that I can see.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then I usually I don't really say it out loud, but if you say it out loud, it's even better because it then interrupts the thoughts that are going on in your head, like the negative thoughts.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_00: So, like five things you can see, four things you can hear, three things you can touch, taste, and smell.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_00: And just taking, and it doesn't take five minutes, but um, just taking that couple minutes to identify your senses is so helpful in like getting grounded and just interrupting that train of thought or you know, slipping into some kind of an anxiety attack.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_00: It just kind of puts it at pause.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_01: So is that meant to take you out of your mind and into your body, into your the present moment experience of your body?
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_01: Very much so.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_01: It's about that's genius.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_01: I hadn't I had not heard of that technique before, but that's genius.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_00: I hadn't either, and it's amazing.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_00: Because it literally just interrupts whatever is happening, and even if you do it angry or you know, you're feeling so overwhelmed, you're like, no, I'm just gonna do it.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna tap into my senses just for this minute, it just gives you that little bit of time for your the practicalness of your mind to catch up with that emotional side that's getting sucked into stress and trauma and drama or whatever it might be.
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you uh on modern domestic woman, which is um, I know it's on Instagram.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know whether it's on Facebook because I follow you on Insta.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_01: So um we can talk about that too.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_01: But um, one of the things that I love about you is that you're so open with what you're dealing with in the moment, and you speak very openly about your anxiety and also your love of coffee.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_01: I do love coffee, which probably doesn't help anxiety.
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um and I'm wondering kind of what that does for you and what that has done for other people.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_00: I think when I share, I and I some people call it oversharing.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_00: I think that if I overshared, nobody would talk to me ever again.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, it it the reason why I share about my anxiety and things that I'm going through like in the moment, um has been because I've seen so many people in pain who have kept it in.
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_00: People that, you know, you think have it all together.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_00: They look fine, you know, they're perfectly quaffed, you're um successful, you got your ducks in a row, but on the inside, it's sheer terror or anxiety.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_00: And I just want to put a face, a regular human face, and an honest voice to someone who has an.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: Anxiety because when I meet people, they're like, you don't look like there's anything wrong with you.
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_00: And that that's the stigma.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we can look like we have it all together, but there's so much going on up here and in here.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I think it helps me in the moment just to work through it.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_00: And then on the flip side of that, I at least every time I share, and this is what has kept me going for the past seven years doing Modern Domestic Woman is someone will always message me, no matter what it is.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes it's someone I've never ever heard of before.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it's a friend or a friend of a friend, but there's always someone who says, thank you for sharing.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_00: This made me feel like I'm not alone.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_00: This made me think I'm not crazy.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_00: This helped me realize that everybody's got something that they're working on, you know.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_00: So those tiny moments, you know, it's not in the form of like 10,000 likes on Instagram or 500 people sharing a post.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's one person.
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel like if I can help one person a day in just that tiny little way, even just to comfort them, then it's worth it.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_01: I almost feel like these small communities are so much more effective because they're not dehumanizing, you know.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_01: They're you go on to, you know, there's these giant platforms that people have, and it's great information, but you just feel like a drop in the ocean of like madness, and it's not it's not quite as relatable.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_01: So I love the small intimate network that you've created.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_01: I it's very and and also I think that the in a global existence that we live in the the local, bringing it back to something local, it's so it's grounding and it's like home.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it kind of like brings the the frequency of home into into the sharing.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I I really love that.
• 46:22
  SPEAKER_01: So what's the future look like for modern domestic women since you're you know about to get real busy?
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know, I took um September through December off.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_00: I was really burnt out, I think, on the world, you know, um, just the social climate of everything that was going on.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_00: I was very disheartened around August of last year.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_00: And I thought, you know what, I have to put a pause on this because I'm not having fun.
• 47:00
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so frustrated and I feel so disheartened that I need to just pause this.
• 47:07
  SPEAKER_00: And by this, I meant like writing articles, um, interviewing people, um, posting on social.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_00: I just wanted to hunker down and just heal on my own.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_00: So I did.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_00: I just deleted all my apps, um, and I wrote a letter to people who were kind of were always with me reading and said, Hey, I'm just hitting the pause button.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's this isn't going anywhere, but I have to like stop.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_00: I need to regroup.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_00: I need to spend some time with my family and my plants, and I'll be back.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_00: But I I have to stop for a little bit.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_00: And it was uh it was good.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_00: It was sometimes you have, I mean, I think we all need to take purposeful time to unplug every day, not just when we're so burnt out on it that we hate, you know, going online.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so 2020 and then 2019 was me trying to figure out my place in terms of where the modern domestic woman fit in.
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_00: Because I was having people asking me if I wanted to do like sponsorships for you know products.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I'm not a lifestyle brand, you know, because I lead with mental health, um, it's a little dicier.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_00: So people don't, whether people like organizations or brands, they don't know how to approach me.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_00: Because I talk about the dark and ugly sometimes.
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I talk about spirituality and a higher power.
• 48:57
  SPEAKER_00: So I took that time, my pause to figure out what do I want to put out into the world?
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_00: Where do I want MDW to be in the future?
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_00: Because I never really felt like I um I resonated with being like, you know, a lifestyle brand.
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I and really I made some boundaries for myself.
• 49:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I said, okay, I'm not gonna do um garden walks, even though I did them all through the summer on Facebook, and I would do a tour of my garden, and it was silly and it was fun and people loved it, but it was it didn't feel right.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_00: So I said, okay, I listed all the different things that I did with MDW and all the things I put out into the world, and I said, what is right?
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_00: And then I crossed off the stuff that didn't and stuck with the stuff that did, and that's kind of where I'm at today is interviewing people who have a story to tell, sharing the stories of women in any capacity, highlighting the talents of practitioners, of counselors, therapists, um, doctors.
• 50:18
  SPEAKER_00: So really focusing on that, sharing other people's wisdom, and then at the same time still staying true to that extension of me, which is in that morning pretty, um, you know, memes that make fun of ourselves or are just silly.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then anything that's gonna help bring awareness, you know, it's it's really just a helping site.
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_00: I just want it to be a safe place for people to come and like have take refuge in it, knowing that when they pass anything in the blog on a social feed, that it's gonna either like bring a smile to their day or laugh or a head nod, um just dig a little deeper.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_00: So and where where that'll take me in the future, um, I'm not sure, but I'm just kind of I'm willing and open to just keep doing what I'm doing, and then whatever comes my way, I'll just assess it then and decide if it's a good fit.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 51:29
  SPEAKER_01: I think about those memes, you know, they on the one level you can think they're excuse me, just like little silly things.
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but they also this is just occurring to me, it has the same effect of disrupting the thought pattern.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like if you have a negative voice in your head, like so many of us do, so negative and so constant that we don't even necessarily recognize it, but a happy meme that things differently or you know causes you to like laugh at yourself or to laugh at something, it's like that disruption.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_00: It is, and it's nice.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_00: So I want to be like a happy disruption in people's lives.
• 52:16
  SPEAKER_01: That's true.
• 52:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, oh my gosh.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_01: Well, oh, there's so much that we could talk about, but limited, obviously.
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_01: So I wonder if we could switch over to our lightning round.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, let's do it.
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_01: So some of these I think you um have already talked a lot about a little bit, but the first question I have for you is what gets you through the tough times?
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_01: What's your top five?
• 52:45
  SPEAKER_00: Top five, I would say um tea, um, yoga, CBD oil, um, my my family, like my little crew, and uh my higher power god.
• 53:04
  SPEAKER_00: That's beautiful.
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 53:07
  SPEAKER_00: How do you like to celebrate?
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I love food.
• 53:13
  SPEAKER_00: I love food to celebrate, definitely.
• 53:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, if there's not food involved, um, celebrating by just having like calm and quiet time to me is really refreshing because every day is so loud and busy and we're moving and stuff.
• 53:32
  SPEAKER_00: So to celebrate sometimes is really nice just to have like a quiet night in.
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 53:39
  unknown: Yeah.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_00: Or eat, just lots of eating.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I feel for for I'm still in um a period of prolonged quiet after 25 years of raising kids, of raising four kids.
• 53:56
  SPEAKER_01: It it's taken me a while to like really recover from that experience.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_01: It's a lot, it's just allowed existence.
• 54:06
  SPEAKER_01: It is, and it's so active, and you're so drawn out of yourself by attending to the needs of others, which is a non-stop job, right?
• 54:18
  SPEAKER_01: And so to like curve everything back in, it's just like I've been there for like I don't know, four years, four or five years.
• 54:25
  SPEAKER_01: It's like recovery.
• 54:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's gonna be ongoing, you know, it's gonna be yeah, other forms of recovery.
• 54:33
  SPEAKER_01: That's so funny.
• 54:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, okay, what role does curiosity play in your life?
• 54:39
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it plays almost too much of a role because I'm too, I am so curious about everything.
• 54:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that could be anything from like nature to different jobs to people.
• 54:53
  SPEAKER_00: I mean everything.
• 54:54
  SPEAKER_00: I am curious about everything.
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes my partner, Peter, he's like, just slow it down.
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_00: I think last year I said, you know what, I'm gonna run for president because I think I can do it.
• 55:07
  SPEAKER_00: And he was like, please don't, because he knows that I'm so curious to try something out that I'll do it.
• 55:20
  SPEAKER_00: So he had to like reel me back in.
• 55:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but yeah, I you know, I sometimes I think it gets me in trouble or it distracts me from what I should be doing because I am so curious.
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_00: But I would never take that away from I would never ever take that away.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, that's a beautiful thing.
• 55:40
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I love that.
• 55:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um, what's your favorite scent?
• 55:45
  SPEAKER_00: Oh currently I have this little essential oil that has um lavender and chamomile and evening primrose oil.
• 56:03
  SPEAKER_00: And that's just very soft and soothing to me.
• 56:07
  SPEAKER_00: However, I do love a good um lemon smell, like if you're cleaning your house, not with like chemicals, but like lemon um scents or the outdoors, just fresh air, even if it's cold or hot, just any kind of fresh air, I love.
• 56:24
  SPEAKER_00: Love that.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_00: Me too.
• 56:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um, okay, so then our my final question today is what role does music play in your life?
• 56:34
  SPEAKER_00: I love music.
• 56:36
  SPEAKER_00: So music plays a role in a couple different capacities in my life.
• 56:40
  SPEAKER_00: So when I write, um, because of all the trauma that I've been through, um, in order to help me stay focused and like keep my brain in check, I listen to classical music.
• 56:53
  SPEAKER_00: It tends to just kind of organize my brain and my thought process to stay focused.
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_00: So that is one area where music comes into play.
• 57:03
  SPEAKER_00: We're always singing in my house.
• 57:06
  SPEAKER_00: I love musicals, I love all types of music.
• 57:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we dance, we have like dance parties all the time, um, singing in the car.
• 57:17
  SPEAKER_00: I just I I do love music.
• 57:19
  SPEAKER_00: It immediately, and again, it's another way for you to cut that negative thought process that's going on in your head.
• 57:28
  SPEAKER_00: And singing is actually supposed to lower stress because you're like breathing intentionally and breathing deep when you're singing.
• 57:36
  SPEAKER_00: So, yes, music.
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_00: I love music, all types.
• 57:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 57:41
  SPEAKER_01: I also have found with classical music, I just came to this realization because you and I are have lived in the same area for a while.
• 57:49
  SPEAKER_01: So I bet we're listening to the same radio station.
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_01: But I've noticed, like from back at the time when I started listening to public radio when I was in college, I would they had like a mixed NPR classical station.
• 58:02
  SPEAKER_01: And um I noticed that sometimes classical music can be quite jarring.
• 58:09
  SPEAKER_01: Though, and the reason that I was listening to classical music was because of the announcers, their voices are so calming.
• 58:19
  SPEAKER_00: They are, they are.
• 58:21
  SPEAKER_00: I love listening to NPR announcers, yeah.
• 58:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's or you may uh the announcers on the classical music station.
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, there's that one gentleman, I can't remember what his name is.
• 58:33
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's on the same station that we've we listened to.
• 58:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, just so calm.
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, I wish they would talk more.
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_01: I know I want to listen to like their voice, like all the time.
• 58:46
  SPEAKER_01: But classical music, some of it's you know, relaxing, and some of it's like you know, can be quite, you know, just depends on the composer.
• 58:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so did you bring a question for me today?
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_01: I did.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_00: So my question for you is if you could, so no restrictions, doesn't matter how much it costs, it doesn't matter how far or the social climate or the political climate of the country, where would you live if you could live anywhere in the world and why?
• 59:21
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh.
• 59:22
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I thought you were gonna ask me where I would visit, what's like next on my list?
• 59:27
  SPEAKER_01: No, okay.
• 59:29
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like I'm a little bit um hampered by the fact that I'm limited to the places I've been and experienced.
• 59:38
  SPEAKER_01: You know, so given that I would have to say maybe you haven't been there before.
• 59:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's possible that I haven't been there, but I I would have to say it right now, I would say Iceland.
• 59:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because I've been there four times and I have often thought of extend of spending extended amounts of time there.
• 1:00:07
  SPEAKER_01: And it m the drive to to be there is a little bit less than it used to be.
• 1:00:13
  SPEAKER_01: But um one of the most profound things I experienced in Iceland is the profound quiet.
• 1:00:24
  SPEAKER_01: It is so profound it hits you like it hits you like a hot wind in the face.
• 1:00:30
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 1:00:31
  SPEAKER_01: Because uh because it's so rare that we actually experience quiet.
• 1:00:36
  SPEAKER_01: We don't even realize how noisy our existence is.
• 1:00:40
  SPEAKER_01: And they um even like like a really natural place can have lots of natural sounds to it.
• 1:00:47
  SPEAKER_01: But in Iceland, there's no there's very little wildlife because there's so few trees, and um, the you know, the interior of the country is all volcanic, so there's not a lot of vegetation, so there's just not a lot of life there, right?
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_01: And you get out into some of those places and it's so so profoundly quiet.
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_01: And for some people that's very unsettling, but to me, it's like mana from heaven.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_01: I just I just drink it up, I love it so much, and um also they live a life that is like 24-7 nature immersion.
• 1:01:28
  SPEAKER_01: It it's that it's just you're outside all the time, and there's you know, like very little to do outside of Reykjavik that doesn't involve just going being outside, you know.
• 1:01:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um so I I guess I would have to say Iceland right now.
• 1:01:47
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I love so many places.
• 1:01:49
  SPEAKER_00: I know, I know, and and the reason well, one of the reasons why I said political climate is because I've I love exotic places, but of course, the exotic places that I love, like they hate women.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_00: So I would love to go and live in Egypt.
• 1:02:07
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, just I love history, so any place that's historic, I would love.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_00: So if if they didn't hate women there, you know, in the political uh climate wasn't so horrible, I would live in Egypt.
• 1:02:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but right now I would I'd love to live in in a small tiny village in England.
• 1:02:32
  SPEAKER_00: Just quiet, again, quiet, historic, lots of land, lots of place to wander.
• 1:02:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um I love the I it's just a good vibe.
• 1:02:46
  SPEAKER_00: I just get a good vibe there.
• 1:02:48
  SPEAKER_00: So that's where I want to live today.
• 1:02:51
  SPEAKER_02: Beautiful.
• 1:02:53
  SPEAKER_01: Well, um, I want to thank you so much for being with us here today, being with me and sharing your beautiful story.
• 1:03:02
  SPEAKER_01: I it takes a lot of courage to do that, and it's so so deeply nourishing to us all to hear about real life and how you got through it and how you are getting through it and how you're not sometimes.
• 1:03:20
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you so much.
• 1:03:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I I um, you know, when we publish this episode, we'll put all of the information about how to reach you and how to find a modern domestic woman and some of your other outlets uh in the notes so everybody can find you.
• 1:03:36
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you again so much for being with me.
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_00: It's always a breath of fresh air to talk to you or seeing you on social and what you put out, it's always a joy.
• 1:03:48
  SPEAKER_00: I always leave feeling a little bit more full than like depleted.
• 1:03:55
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, thank you so so much.
• 1:03:57
  SPEAKER_01: That's means so much to meet.