Latest / Breaking OWCP with Chris & Gini / (Chats 8-6-26) The Ultimate Second Opinion Survival Guide for Federal Workers

Transcript

(Chats 8-6-26) The Ultimate Second Opinion Survival Guide for Federal Workers · Breaking OWCP with Chris & Gini

0:03
SPEAKER_00: Welcome back to the Breaking O WCP podcast.
0:08
SPEAKER_00: Join Chris and Jeannie as they bring you expert advice on Federal Workers Comp, guiding you step by step to get back to work the right way.
0:16
SPEAKER_00: Let's break down the barriers and get you the help you deserve.
0:21
SPEAKER_02: Hey everybody, welcome to Wednesday night OWCP Chats with Chris and Jeannie.
0:26
SPEAKER_02: I'm Chris.
0:27
SPEAKER_02: And I'm Jeannie.
0:29
SPEAKER_02: All right.
0:30
SPEAKER_02: A lot of you, and this is since we've been gone, a lot of you have been saying or messaging about second opinion doctors.
0:41
SPEAKER_02: The why, how, when, where, all of the stuff.
0:45
SPEAKER_02: And you guys are really getting frustrated, and it is a frustrating situation.
0:50
SPEAKER_02: So tonight, Chris is going to go over the OWCP second opinional survivor guide.
0:57
SPEAKER_02: Survival guide.
0:58
SPEAKER_02: Survival guide.
0:59
SPEAKER_02: Let me redo that.
1:00
SPEAKER_04: It is the OWCP second opinion survival guide.
1:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:04
SPEAKER_04: And it's there's no official guide.
1:06
SPEAKER_04: It is everything that I've learned and everything I've heard from other people.
1:10
SPEAKER_04: And so I'm going to give you the very best information you're ever going to get on how to get through a second opinion exam without your case getting hosed.
1:20
SPEAKER_01: Hose.
1:21
SPEAKER_04: Which is what happens most of the time.
1:22
SPEAKER_04: It's my opinion that second opinion exams are just there to hurt the case.
1:27
SPEAKER_04: And I don't like it.
1:29
SPEAKER_04: But some of those doctors are great.
1:31
SPEAKER_04: I'm thinking of one in my head right now for New Jersey that I can't wait to meet, who is fantastic.
1:36
SPEAKER_04: The Rutgers doctor.
1:37
SPEAKER_04: The Rutgers guy.
1:38
SPEAKER_04: And so it's I'm not saying that they're bad.
1:40
SPEAKER_04: The system is not good for sure, but I'm going to help you help yourself through the second opinion process.
1:48
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
1:49
SPEAKER_04: So who we got?
1:50
SPEAKER_02: Hold on.
1:51
SPEAKER_04: You Milla, hello, and Frank.
1:53
SPEAKER_04: You go ahead and say good old Frank.
1:54
SPEAKER_04: Good evening, Frank.
1:55
SPEAKER_04: How are you?
1:56
SPEAKER_02: Frank.
1:57
SPEAKER_04: Say hi to my boy Richie.
1:59
SPEAKER_04: Do us a favor and share this because I can only help people that are here to listen.
2:05
SPEAKER_04: So let people know that we're doing this.
2:07
SPEAKER_04: We do it every week on Wednesday night at 8 o'clock.
2:10
SPEAKER_04: Sometimes we don't.
2:11
SPEAKER_04: I shouldn't say every week, because sometimes we're in an airplane or our camera's broken.
2:15
SPEAKER_04: Happened for six weeks, which was ridiculous.
2:18
SPEAKER_02: But and it still didn't get fixed if you guys watched last week's.
2:22
SPEAKER_02: It didn't feel broken.
2:23
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
2:24
SPEAKER_02: But we got a new one.
2:25
SPEAKER_02: It's just gonna sit there for a little bit.
2:27
SPEAKER_02: It's gonna sit there until we figure it out.
2:29
SPEAKER_04: I'm shaming it.
2:31
SPEAKER_04: Shame.
2:32
SPEAKER_02: But oh we probably unless we are in a plane, we won't do chats.
2:37
SPEAKER_02: Norm normally we really don't fly out on Wednesdays anyway, like in or out.
2:42
SPEAKER_02: But we did a thing two days ago that we bought.
2:46
SPEAKER_02: We bought Skylink.
2:49
SPEAKER_04: Starlink.
2:50
SPEAKER_02: Starlink.
2:53
SPEAKER_04: I didn't know she's gonna talk about that, or I would have given her a script.
2:56
SPEAKER_04: We bought the Starlink satellite Wi-Fi thing, which is it comes in tomorrow.
3:01
SPEAKER_04: But we're so excited about it because we're gonna take it everywhere with us since we travel so much, and then we won't have any reason to not be able to see you when we're in a hotel.
3:11
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
3:11
SPEAKER_04: In random places.
3:12
SPEAKER_02: We normally travel with a T-Mobile travel Wi-Fi.
3:16
SPEAKER_02: But it's so bulky.
3:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
3:18
SPEAKER_04: And this thing is flat and it'll set actually with I can lay it or slide it into my backpack with my laptop.
3:26
SPEAKER_04: It's really cool.
3:26
SPEAKER_02: It's like an inch thinner than one of the new laptops.
3:30
SPEAKER_04: Linda, good evening.
3:31
SPEAKER_04: Frank said Rich is in LA.
3:33
SPEAKER_04: We just got back from there last week.
3:35
SPEAKER_02: Hold on, people.
3:36
SPEAKER_02: I'm just trying to share here.
3:38
SPEAKER_02: All right.
3:38
SPEAKER_04: While she's sharing, I'm just gonna get going.
3:40
SPEAKER_04: So look, second opinion visits are a real problem.
3:43
SPEAKER_04: And most people don't understand why second opinion visits happen, how to avoid them, if it's possible possible to avoid them, and what you should do during and after the visit to give yourself a fighting chance to not have a bad outcome.
3:59
SPEAKER_04: And that's what tonight is about.
4:01
SPEAKER_04: People think that I got sent to a second opinion, so they think I'm lying, or they're whatever.
4:09
SPEAKER_04: There's always like something negative.
4:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
4:12
SPEAKER_04: They're out to get me, essentially.
4:14
SPEAKER_04: And really, that's not what's happening.
4:16
SPEAKER_04: Usually what happens is your doctor made a mistake, or your doctor could have done something better more efficiently, right?
4:25
SPEAKER_04: And so I'm gonna help you help your doctor, basically, so we can avoid these things.
4:30
SPEAKER_04: So here's 10 common reasons that OWCP requests a second opinion.
4:35
SPEAKER_04: And there may be more of these, but these are the ones, and I took notes, okay?
4:39
SPEAKER_04: I don't always take notes, but I really wanted to make sure that I'm thorough on this because I think it's such a problem.
4:46
SPEAKER_04: So follow me on this.
4:48
SPEAKER_04: The number one reason that a second opinion doctor is requested is because causation is unclear.
4:56
SPEAKER_04: What happens is your doctor writes a narrative report, and sometimes I think narrative report in air quotes, because I've seen some really terrible ones.
5:05
SPEAKER_04: Like, really terrible.
5:06
SPEAKER_04: In fact, most of the ones that are written by people that are not in federal injury centers, like I'd be embarrassed if I were those doctors writing like that.
5:15
SPEAKER_04: It says something about you if you can't write properly and get a claim accepted.
5:20
SPEAKER_04: But when causation is unclear, then the claims examiner is gonna say, okay, we need to get a second look at this because clearly your doctor doesn't have a clue what's going on.
5:28
SPEAKER_04: And so they'll do that.
5:30
SPEAKER_04: So causation is super important, and it's the number one reason a claim is denied.
5:34
SPEAKER_04: Yes, because causation.
5:36
SPEAKER_04: They don't clearly link the injury to the diagnosis on the job.
5:42
SPEAKER_04: And so when causation is unclear, it's likely to go to a second opinion.
5:47
SPEAKER_04: The other one says the next one is treating physicians' reports are not sufficiently explained.
5:52
SPEAKER_04: So outside of causation, everything else, they just do a really bad job writing reports.
5:58
SPEAKER_04: So I always tell people when I'm training OWCP and union events that it's in your best interest to read your narrative report before the doctor sends it in.
6:07
SPEAKER_04: Because once it's sent in, it's like the ball's in the air.
6:10
SPEAKER_04: Now you're just waiting on your denial to happen.
6:12
SPEAKER_04: But if you look at it first and you've heard me talk about anything, then you have a chance to say to the doctor, hey, this doesn't look good.
6:20
SPEAKER_04: Let's do it different or better.
6:21
SPEAKER_04: And if they won't, that's not the right doctor for you.
6:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
6:25
SPEAKER_04: Because winning is everything.
6:27
SPEAKER_04: Anytime you have a legitimate injury, okay, I'm not talking about, I never see this, but let's say hypothetically somebody was lying about their injury.
6:35
SPEAKER_04: I'm not talking about that.
6:36
SPEAKER_04: And I honestly never see anybody do that, which I'm really glad.
6:40
SPEAKER_04: But as long as you have a legit injury, all claims should be accepted.
6:44
SPEAKER_02: Correct.
6:45
SPEAKER_04: They just should be, and all doctors should want that to happen.
6:48
SPEAKER_04: And for me, that's what winning looks like is getting your claim approved.
6:51
SPEAKER_04: Now, of course, winning also is getting better and getting back to work.
6:53
SPEAKER_04: Don't get me wrong.
6:55
SPEAKER_04: There's no better way to get paid than to clock in.
6:58
SPEAKER_02: I have a question.
6:59
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
7:00
SPEAKER_02: First of all, Linda, my gal.
7:04
SPEAKER_02: Hi, Amy.
7:06
SPEAKER_02: Jack, Starlink is a good idea.
7:08
SPEAKER_04: Jack knows Jack is an expert in all things technical.
7:11
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
7:12
SPEAKER_02: Camilla, I was told that I'm being sent for an a second opinion because I had one nine years ago.
7:20
SPEAKER_02: It's been a month and a half, and I've not gotten any information where to go.
7:24
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, that's good news for you.
7:26
SPEAKER_04: You don't have to go until they tell you where to go.
7:28
SPEAKER_04: You don't have to push it.
7:30
SPEAKER_04: You don't got to get a hold of your claims examiner and say, hey, you told me about this second opinion visit.
7:35
SPEAKER_04: I'm so excited, I can't wait to go.
7:36
SPEAKER_04: I wouldn't want to go.
7:38
SPEAKER_04: But you do have to go.
7:39
SPEAKER_04: As soon as they assign a doctor to you, you gotta go.
7:41
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
7:42
SPEAKER_04: If you don't, they'll just cut off your benefits until you decide to comply.
7:45
SPEAKER_04: So definitely go.
7:46
SPEAKER_04: But I wouldn't be bothered that they haven't found a second opinion doctor.
7:50
SPEAKER_04: I would just go, ah, cool.
7:51
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
7:52
SPEAKER_04: I haven't I don't have to do that yet.
7:53
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
7:54
SPEAKER_02: Frank, I just realized as you said, he's in LA.
7:57
SPEAKER_02: I forgot because I'm seeing all of his uh TikToks and all these pictures that he's posting.
8:02
SPEAKER_02: I love his pictures.
8:03
SPEAKER_02: I think I love all of them when he posts.
8:06
SPEAKER_02: It's funny that they're in Los Angeles for their national convention because APW is also going to Los Angeles.
8:13
SPEAKER_02: I know, and I know the rule carriers are going to be at the Gaylord in Dallas.
8:17
SPEAKER_02: Dallas, Texas.
8:18
SPEAKER_04: Greatvine.
8:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
8:19
SPEAKER_04: Hey, maybe I'll crash the rule carriers party in Greatvine, Texas.
8:23
SPEAKER_04: I may be there at the same time they're there.
8:25
SPEAKER_04: Maybe I can get a room, hang out in Grapevine and see a bunch of my friends.
8:30
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
8:30
SPEAKER_04: You think they'd mind very much?
8:31
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
8:32
SPEAKER_02: So Chris is going to Texas next week.
8:33
SPEAKER_04: I'm not going to crash your party.
8:34
SPEAKER_02: He's not.
8:35
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
8:35
SPEAKER_02: He's going for personal for f with friends, and I'm actually going to go work with my partner Joe in Orlando.
8:40
SPEAKER_02: So yeah.
8:41
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
8:42
SPEAKER_04: I'm going for fantasy football too.
8:44
SPEAKER_02: I don't do the football things.
8:45
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
8:45
SPEAKER_02: I'm going to go work while he goes to play.
8:49
SPEAKER_04: I'm so committed to fantasy football that I'm going to lose money just by playing because I got to get on an airplane.
8:54
SPEAKER_04: Yep.
8:55
SPEAKER_04: But whatever.
8:56
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
8:56
SPEAKER_04: So I better win.
8:58
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
8:58
SPEAKER_04: Here's the next reason, and this is a big one, why second opinion doctors are requested.
9:04
SPEAKER_04: Because recovery is slower than expected or treatment is prolonged.
9:08
SPEAKER_04: In other words, you ain't back at work.
9:11
SPEAKER_04: So if you're not going back to work, then eventually they're going to say, all right, what's going on here?
9:17
SPEAKER_04: Because the goal of workers comp is to return to work.
9:20
SPEAKER_04: That is the goal.
9:21
SPEAKER_04: And so anytime you're not making progress to get back to work, then you're going to end up seeing a second opinion doctor.
9:26
SPEAKER_04: And here's what they're going to say they're going to say, ah, you're all better now.
9:30
SPEAKER_04: It's going to happen every single time.
9:32
SPEAKER_04: So the best thing you can do is communicate with your doctor and get better.
9:37
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
9:37
SPEAKER_04: Do all the treatment the doctor tells you and get better as soon as possible.
9:41
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
9:42
SPEAKER_04: I don't know if you could hear Ellie barking over there, but she's probably saving us from another FedEx guy.
9:47
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
9:47
SPEAKER_02: Susan said to please go, please do if you go crash the party.
9:53
SPEAKER_04: The last time I did it, I got in a little bit of trouble by your president, and that wasn't my intent.
9:59
SPEAKER_02: But everybody else was so excited that he was there.
10:01
SPEAKER_04: I wasn't trying to piss the guy off.
10:03
SPEAKER_04: Actually, I had no bad intentions.
10:04
SPEAKER_04: I have a lot of friends that are roll carriers.
10:06
SPEAKER_04: I just want to see my buddies.
10:07
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we both can't be there, but one of us got to work, one of us got to go play.
10:10
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
10:11
SPEAKER_04: All right.
10:11
SPEAKER_04: Get back to work as soon as possible.
10:13
SPEAKER_04: And that will take out one reason to go to a second opinion visit.
10:17
SPEAKER_04: But again, I always say this: the surest way to get paid is to clock in.
10:20
SPEAKER_04: You don't have to jump through hoops with CA7s.
10:22
SPEAKER_04: You don't have to worry about LWAP in any way because you're back at work.
10:26
SPEAKER_04: So make an effort to get back as soon as you medically can safely, but so they don't send you to a second opinion visit.
10:32
SPEAKER_04: The next is that surgery or something else like really significant is being requested.
10:37
SPEAKER_04: And when that happens, it's it's not a guarantee that it's going to go to a second opinion, but there's a really good chance it will because it's a it's an invasive procedure.
10:49
SPEAKER_04: You're going to get cut on, you'll be under anesthesia.
10:51
SPEAKER_04: There's always risk involved in that.
10:53
SPEAKER_04: And for OWCP, it's like super expensive.
10:55
SPEAKER_04: So they're going to just make sure that's what's needed.
10:58
SPEAKER_04: And usually when you have surgery, that just means you're going to be out of work even longer because now there's post-op therapy you're going to need.
11:04
SPEAKER_04: And for those of you that are new, I'm not a doctor.
11:07
SPEAKER_04: So I don't know about post-op therapy except for I've had surgery and had post-op therapy three times.
11:11
SPEAKER_04: So I know how that works.
11:13
SPEAKER_04: So anytime surgery or a significant treatment is being requested, you may be ordered to go to a second opinion doctor.
11:20
SPEAKER_02: Oh, hold on.
11:22
SPEAKER_02: Net Neta?
11:24
SPEAKER_02: I'm sorry.
11:25
SPEAKER_02: I does it say Netta or Neti.
11:26
SPEAKER_04: It looks like Neti.
11:27
SPEAKER_02: You saw the notice, but you don't have any idea what we're talking about.
11:30
SPEAKER_02: We're talking about second opinions.
11:31
SPEAKER_02: I know we started right at like eight o'clock.
11:34
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we just started saying.
11:35
SPEAKER_02: So tonight's chats is all about second opinion doctors.
11:39
SPEAKER_02: Why you get sent to them?
11:40
SPEAKER_02: What do you do when you get sent to them?
11:42
SPEAKER_02: How sometimes you can't avoid them.
11:44
SPEAKER_02: So this is tonight's chat because everybody's been asking about second opinions.
11:47
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
11:48
SPEAKER_04: And so right now what I'm talking about is what are the most common reasons that someone would be sent to a second opinion doctor?
11:54
SPEAKER_04: In a minute, I'm going to talk to you about what you can do about it once you're there.
11:57
SPEAKER_02: We got the Puerto Rican daddy.
11:59
SPEAKER_02: Hello, Victor.
12:01
SPEAKER_02: Let me just read this from YouTube.
12:03
SPEAKER_02: My doctor puts me on MMI on my second case and I and didn't tell me anything about AROM or anything about submitting a schedule award for my shoulder.
12:13
SPEAKER_02: That's what a range of motion, something range of motion.
12:17
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, so schedule awards, a that's a long topic.
12:20
SPEAKER_04: And that is a, by the way, a reason that you may get a second opinion doctor.
12:24
SPEAKER_02: Active range of motion.
12:25
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, that's what it is.
12:26
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
12:26
SPEAKER_04: Schedule awards is a common reason for getting a second opinion visit because let's say that you get a an impairment rating that's 35%, which is a big number.
12:35
SPEAKER_04: They're gonna send it in to the second opinion doctor and it's gonna end up being like eight percent.
12:39
SPEAKER_04: I see it happen all the time.
12:41
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
12:41
SPEAKER_02: Oh, her name said it rhymes with Betty, so it's Netty.
12:46
SPEAKER_04: Cool.
12:46
SPEAKER_04: And by the way, thanks for letting us know.
12:48
SPEAKER_04: We won't forget.
12:48
SPEAKER_04: Please keep coming back, Betty.
12:50
SPEAKER_04: Glad you're here.
12:51
SPEAKER_02: That's so cute.
12:52
SPEAKER_04: Okay, conflicting medical opinions.
12:54
SPEAKER_04: That's another reason.
12:56
SPEAKER_04: So there are two doctors or more that are not agreeing with one another.
12:59
SPEAKER_04: And so they're gonna send it to a second opinion doctor and say, What do you say?
13:03
SPEAKER_04: And then if there's conflicting opinions there that the claims examiner can't figure out, they go to a referee doc until finally somebody says, Hey, here's a deal.
13:10
SPEAKER_04: So conflicting medical opinions.
13:12
SPEAKER_04: But the best way to avoid that is just make sure your doctor's writing a fantastic narrative report because when it's really thoroughly written, great detail, good diagnoses, great causation, it's hard to have conflicting opinions because other doctors are gonna look at it and go, Yeah, I'm not messing with this one.
13:27
SPEAKER_04: Because they don't want to fight each other.
13:28
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and we always hear that these doctors are in the room, we hear it all the time.
13:32
SPEAKER_02: He was with me for five minutes.
13:34
SPEAKER_02: He didn't even touch me.
13:35
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, we're gonna get to that.
13:36
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
13:37
SPEAKER_04: Questions about return to work or work restrictions.
13:40
SPEAKER_04: So in line with the other thing I said about prolonged treatment, but at some point they're gonna say, Why are you still out of work?
13:47
SPEAKER_04: And they're gonna ask about it.
13:48
SPEAKER_04: Or what about your work restrictions?
13:50
SPEAKER_04: Are you still on limited duty or can you go back full duty?
13:53
SPEAKER_04: So that'll be a reason.
13:54
SPEAKER_04: And these are, by the way, not all like disasters waiting to happen, but because some of them are just okay.
14:00
SPEAKER_04: I was reading a couple of them this week where my response to the person who sent it to me was, Hey, that's no big deal.
14:05
SPEAKER_04: This is fine.
14:06
SPEAKER_04: Go to that second opinion visit.
14:07
SPEAKER_04: It's not gonna hurt you at all.
14:09
SPEAKER_04: So they're not all negative, but for when they are, I'm gonna tell you what to do about it.
14:13
SPEAKER_02: Hold on.
14:13
SPEAKER_02: I can't believe this girl's on tonight, Tammy Newman.
14:17
SPEAKER_04: Tammy.
14:18
SPEAKER_04: She said rock stars.
14:19
SPEAKER_04: Oh, we love you, Tammy.
14:20
SPEAKER_02: We love you, Tammy.
14:22
SPEAKER_04: Very much.
14:23
SPEAKER_04: Okay, so there's a thing called a diagnosis expansion.
14:27
SPEAKER_04: And that is when you have an accepted condition, and then the doctor realizes there's something else going on, and they want to add a diagnosis to your claim.
14:36
SPEAKER_04: So let's say you have a rotator cuff, right?
14:39
SPEAKER_04: And then the doctor realizes you have some ridiculopathy, which is like nerve damage or nerve problem, and they want to add that diagnosis to the existing claim of rotator cuff, you have to do what's called a diagnosis expansion and then add the diagnosis.
14:52
SPEAKER_04: This is one of the more common reasons that a second opinion visit happens because the claims examiner is going, crap, here we go again.
15:00
SPEAKER_04: So we thought it was just a shoulder sprain and now it's a rotator cuff and neuropathy.
15:05
SPEAKER_04: What the heck is happening here?
15:07
SPEAKER_04: And the way you avoid that is don't let your doctor underdiagnose you.
15:11
SPEAKER_04: When the doctor says you just have a sprain and you know for sure that it hurts so bad and I can't use my knee and I felt this pop, that's weird.
15:19
SPEAKER_04: You need an MRI, right?
15:21
SPEAKER_04: To properly diagnose it.
15:23
SPEAKER_04: Because if it's diagnosed properly in the beginning, you don't need a diagnosis expansion later.
15:28
SPEAKER_04: And if you don't have a diagnosis expansion, that's one less thing to get sent to a second opinion for.
15:34
SPEAKER_04: So what I like to tell my doctors and federal injury centers is that look, if you think it's something more, feel free and get imaging.
15:43
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:44
SPEAKER_04: Because it's in the patient's best interest, long run or long term, to do the diagnosis properly up front.
15:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:52
SPEAKER_04: So there's a lot of moving parts there because also the doctor's got to get his got to get the medical report in within 10 days to preserve your COP.
15:59
SPEAKER_04: So a lot of this has to happen in pretty quick time.
16:02
SPEAKER_04: But diagnosis expansions are a common reasons, a reason for second opinion visits.
16:07
SPEAKER_02: Nettie said, I live in the communist Japan.
16:10
SPEAKER_02: It's 9 15 a.m.
16:11
SPEAKER_02: What are you watching us from Japan?
16:15
SPEAKER_02: Wow.
16:16
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
16:17
SPEAKER_02: Are you communist Japan?
16:18
SPEAKER_02: So I have I have Are you a federal employee over there?
16:20
SPEAKER_04: You work on a base?
16:21
SPEAKER_04: What are you doing?
16:22
SPEAKER_04: And why are you watching OWCP chats?
16:23
SPEAKER_04: And thanks for being here again.
16:24
SPEAKER_04: But what do you do?
16:25
SPEAKER_04: I'd like to know.
16:26
SPEAKER_02: I have family overseas, some cousins, and funny, you said Japan.
16:30
SPEAKER_02: Wow.
16:30
SPEAKER_04: And one of our good friends, who is a union leader, went over there and found his wife and brought her back.
16:37
SPEAKER_02: He was in the military.
16:38
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he's in the military.
16:39
SPEAKER_04: So I'm yeah, I'm really interested in what you're doing over there.
16:44
SPEAKER_02: On YouTube, my wife was rated 0% by a second opinion and what and 100%.
16:50
SPEAKER_02: My doctor went to the VA and now I will be losing Lou's rating.
16:55
SPEAKER_02: Any suggestions?
16:56
SPEAKER_02: I have several reoccurrences.
16:58
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, my suggestion would be go find a trained OWCP doctor and let them take another swing at it.
17:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
17:04
SPEAKER_02: She's not a federal employee, but she's on here.
17:07
SPEAKER_04: Hey, you're welcome here.
17:08
SPEAKER_02: That's really nice.
17:09
SPEAKER_02: Glad to have you all the way from Japan.
17:12
SPEAKER_02: That's cool.
17:12
SPEAKER_02: Victor said, question Who sends employees to a second opinion?
17:17
SPEAKER_04: The claims examiner does, and that's pretty much the only one that will.
17:20
SPEAKER_04: A lot of people say, Can I go get a second opinion?
17:23
SPEAKER_04: Sure, just go find another doctor.
17:24
SPEAKER_04: You can do whatever you want.
17:26
SPEAKER_04: But the claims examiner is the one that decides whether or not you're getting the official second opinion that you are required to attend.
17:34
SPEAKER_04: Okay, so I said diagnosis expansions.
17:37
SPEAKER_04: This one's a little vague.
17:39
SPEAKER_04: Inconsistencies in the medical evidence or history.
17:42
SPEAKER_04: So a claims examiner may look at three different places and have three different things that they're reading.
17:47
SPEAKER_04: Wow, this doesn't really add up.
17:48
SPEAKER_04: So you want to make sure everything's really consistent.
17:51
SPEAKER_04: There's unresolved medical questions.
17:54
SPEAKER_04: So the doctor's narrative essentially didn't answer all the questions.
17:57
SPEAKER_04: And so now the claims examiner is gonna say, I gotta get to the bottom of this.
18:00
SPEAKER_04: Again, if your doctor cannot write a great medical narrative, you're gonna have all kinds of problems, anyways, like all kinds of problems.
18:08
SPEAKER_04: And probably second opinions are the least of your problems at that point.
18:11
SPEAKER_02: Hold on.
18:12
SPEAKER_02: John Reverend, he said, What up, Chris and Jeannie?
18:15
SPEAKER_02: Yo, John.
18:16
SPEAKER_02: I hope you're feeling better.
18:17
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
18:18
SPEAKER_02: Because I know you were in and out of the hospital.
18:22
SPEAKER_02: So thanks for keeping everyone updated.
18:24
SPEAKER_02: Yep.
18:25
SPEAKER_02: Hope you're doing good.
18:26
SPEAKER_04: And finally, uh reason for second opinion.
18:29
SPEAKER_04: They are looking for a periodic reevaluation of long-term disability or treatment.
18:35
SPEAKER_04: So they're just like, hey, we just got to check on you.
18:38
SPEAKER_04: We're just doing a check.
18:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
18:39
SPEAKER_04: Those are not the worst thing in the world, but you better be prepared with documentation because very often the doctor could say, nah, you're all better, even if you're not.
18:50
SPEAKER_04: And that could be a problem.
18:51
SPEAKER_02: Mary said, Hello there, lovebirds.
18:54
SPEAKER_02: Good to see you again.
18:56
SPEAKER_04: Cute.
18:58
SPEAKER_04: Thanks, Mary.
18:59
SPEAKER_02: That's so cute.
19:00
SPEAKER_04: So, how do you reduce the likelihood of being sent to these things?
19:05
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
19:05
SPEAKER_04: Okay, for the most part, most of everything I said on reasons to go are because narrative reports are not good, diagnosing was improper, you're out of work for too long, or treatment's not working.
19:16
SPEAKER_04: Those that's like the most common reasons.
19:18
SPEAKER_04: I did mention schedule awards because if the schedule awards too high, they're almost always going to double check that, which makes me nuts because they use this basically a textbook, the sixth edition to permanent impairment that's put out by the American Medical Associations.
19:32
SPEAKER_04: They all use the same guidelines.
19:34
SPEAKER_04: For some reason, and it's all it's not some reason, it's no mystery, it's training or lack of.
19:38
SPEAKER_04: You can get two, three, four, eight doctors that all have different ratings.
19:43
SPEAKER_04: I don't understand how that can be if they're a trained.
19:45
SPEAKER_04: So you want to make sure your doctor is well trained in schedule awards.
19:48
SPEAKER_02: He's right.
19:49
SPEAKER_02: I had a lady this morning, she actually sent me her narrative.
19:53
SPEAKER_02: It was a paragraph long.
19:55
SPEAKER_03: It's not a narrative, folks.
19:56
SPEAKER_02: And she went to her primary care.
19:58
SPEAKER_02: This is all new to her because the she wound up submitting the little narrative and it just came back denied not sufficient medical evidence.
20:08
SPEAKER_02: And she said, What is it supposed to consist of?
20:11
SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, normally it's at least five pages.
20:13
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
20:14
SPEAKER_02: So you have to go to an O and I told her this, you have to find yourself an OWCP trained doctor.
20:20
SPEAKER_02: Whether it's not easy, whether it's us or somebody else, just Google OWCP.
20:26
SPEAKER_04: OWCP injury doctor in your city and state.
20:28
SPEAKER_02: Yep.
20:29
SPEAKER_04: Whoever wants to be found will want to help you, and they'll be easy to find.
20:33
SPEAKER_04: So I'm going to pause for a second before I tell you the ways to reduce the likelihood of a second opinion, and we're going to just roll through some of these questions.
20:40
SPEAKER_02: Deborah Jackson, how are you?
20:42
SPEAKER_04: Hey.
20:43
SPEAKER_02: I was sent home for no work and been with federal injury for more than a year, but I was just issued a second opinion.
20:51
SPEAKER_02: Not sure why.
20:52
SPEAKER_04: You've been off for over a year, that's probably why.
20:55
SPEAKER_04: And they want to just figure out can you go back to work?
20:58
SPEAKER_04: It's probably a work status thing.
21:00
SPEAKER_04: And my last section on what to do during these visits will be something you want to pay very close attention to.
21:06
SPEAKER_04: I'm going to tell you what to do while you're there.
21:08
SPEAKER_02: Victor said, How long do you have to be on OWCP to be sent for a second opinion?
21:13
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it's not a time frame thing, man.
21:15
SPEAKER_04: It's just anytime the claims examiner's got questions, that's when they do it.
21:18
SPEAKER_04: That's why I said questions about the narrative report, the diagnosis, the length of time out of work, the diagnosis expansion, those things.
21:26
SPEAKER_04: Those are the reasons.
21:27
SPEAKER_04: And they can happen just randomly.
21:28
SPEAKER_04: It's not a time frame thing.
21:29
SPEAKER_04: Literally, I have a binder that is everything about second opinions.
21:33
SPEAKER_04: It's all the laws, rules, regulations, it's everything.
21:36
SPEAKER_04: And there's nothing in there about time frames.
21:38
SPEAKER_02: All right.
21:39
SPEAKER_02: Anne had a second opinion exam case, finally accepted.
21:43
SPEAKER_02: Doctor was an ortho specialist, offered his diagnosis, treatment requirements, and restrictions.
21:49
SPEAKER_02: Now, local orthopedic specialist does not agree with the second opinion and is delaying treatment by not submitting correct info for treatment.
21:58
SPEAKER_02: Authorization from DOL.
22:00
SPEAKER_02: I can't get a hold of DOL, my DOL claims examiner.
22:03
SPEAKER_02: I'm pretty frustrated.
22:04
SPEAKER_04: Okay, so about the claims examiner, leave a voicemail.
22:07
SPEAKER_04: Don't just hang up because voicemails are transcribed into documents and documents are responded to eventually.
22:13
SPEAKER_04: And remember, I am the least patient person probably on earth.
22:18
SPEAKER_04: I have no patience.
22:19
SPEAKER_04: Do I have any?
22:20
SPEAKER_04: I have no patience.
22:21
SPEAKER_01: Zero.
22:22
SPEAKER_04: And so I have to say that to tell you to have patience because there's a few hundred of them and a few million of you.
22:28
SPEAKER_04: So they're definitely overwhelmed.
22:30
SPEAKER_04: In eComp, there is a, I think, what's it, escalate button or something like that.
22:34
SPEAKER_04: You can click that and it'll get to the supervisor.
22:37
SPEAKER_04: So you could always do that as well.
22:38
SPEAKER_04: As far as the doctor goes and the second opinion, the doctor's gonna have to write a fantastic rebuttal if he disagrees.
22:45
SPEAKER_04: Or she I don't know if it's a woman or man.
22:47
SPEAKER_04: But the doctor will have to write a rebuttal that's just rock solid with fantastic detail.
22:52
SPEAKER_04: Whatever the doctor thinks is wrong, they need to put some factual stuff in there to explain why it's wrong.
22:58
SPEAKER_04: An opinion that it's not correct isn't gonna be good enough.
23:01
SPEAKER_04: They need to have some medical evidence in there.
23:03
SPEAKER_02: Rolando, can I get back OWCP benefits instead of FERS benefits?
23:09
SPEAKER_04: Wait, what?
23:10
SPEAKER_02: Can I get back to OWCP benefits instead of FERS benefits?
23:15
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
23:16
SPEAKER_04: You just have to you have to tell Office of Personnel Management to stop paying you your FERS benefits.
23:21
SPEAKER_04: You got to cut them off because you can't get dual benefits.
23:23
SPEAKER_04: But yeah, that's how you would do that.
23:24
SPEAKER_04: You cut one off to get the other.
23:26
SPEAKER_04: Which I don't know.
23:27
SPEAKER_04: Look, for those of you that are listening, I don't have an opinion on this.
23:31
SPEAKER_04: FERS by the second year, you're making 40% of your income.
23:35
SPEAKER_04: So when you can get back on OWCP, it's clearly better because it's 67% or 75%.
23:40
SPEAKER_04: So it's the math is obvious, but you have to do medically what you have to do based on what your doctor tells you.
23:46
SPEAKER_02: Talisha, I have already been for a second opinion and I have permanent restrictions, and now they want to send me back for another second opinion.
23:54
SPEAKER_02: What's vocational rehab with OWCP?
23:59
SPEAKER_04: Was the question what is vocational rehab?
24:01
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, they're just they're gonna help you with retraining to be able to go do a job full time that fits within your permanent restrictions.
24:10
SPEAKER_04: That's what that is, and that's not that it's not the most common thing that happens, but it happens.
24:15
SPEAKER_04: It's part of the roles.
24:16
SPEAKER_02: Linda, does OWCP send you to their doctor for impairment ratings, or can you go to your own doctor that does them?
24:22
SPEAKER_04: That's both, but you can always go to your own.
24:24
SPEAKER_04: In fact, I recommend it.
24:26
SPEAKER_04: The only way I wouldn't recommend it is that you just really can't find anybody that knows how to do that six edition rating, at which point it might be in your best interest to allow the claims examiner to send you somewhere for that, but I'm not sure why the claims examiner would be motivated to do it.
24:41
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
24:41
SPEAKER_04: Because the end result of a schedule award is that OWCP is paying out money and sometimes tens of thousands of dollars.
24:48
SPEAKER_02: Victor said you only have patience with me.
24:50
SPEAKER_02: He no, he doesn't have patience with anybody.
24:54
SPEAKER_04: I am lacking in that category.
24:56
SPEAKER_04: And I want, I'm not even gonna say I'm trying to get better.
24:58
SPEAKER_04: I'm really not.
25:00
SPEAKER_04: I'm too old for that.
25:03
SPEAKER_04: Is that all for you?
25:04
SPEAKER_04: That's all for now, yeah.
25:05
SPEAKER_04: Okay, so here's what we're gonna do next.
25:06
SPEAKER_04: 10 ways to reduce the likelihood of a second opinion.
25:09
SPEAKER_04: And as I'm talking, I might come up with way 11 and 12.
25:13
SPEAKER_04: I don't know.
25:13
SPEAKER_04: Let's see where this goes.
25:14
SPEAKER_04: So, obviously, as I said earlier, get the diagnosis right the first time.
25:18
SPEAKER_04: Avoid doing a diagnosis expansion as often as you can.
25:22
SPEAKER_04: You want your doctor to be as thorough as humanly possible the first time around and don't diagnose pain.
25:29
SPEAKER_04: Make a note of that.
25:30
SPEAKER_04: Pain is not a valid diagnosis.
25:32
SPEAKER_04: The denial letter will say specifically your claim is denied because pain is not a valid diagnosis in OWCP.
25:37
SPEAKER_02: Oh, wait.
25:38
SPEAKER_02: What?
25:39
SPEAKER_02: Juan is on.
25:41
SPEAKER_02: I miss you guys.
25:42
SPEAKER_02: Keep up the great word.
25:43
SPEAKER_02: See you work, see you soon.
25:45
SPEAKER_04: What's up, Juan?
25:47
SPEAKER_04: Is that his first time ever being on?
25:48
SPEAKER_04: I think so, yeah.
25:49
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, we're so glad to have you.
25:51
SPEAKER_04: Juan's a bad man, and I love him.
25:53
SPEAKER_02: He's with federal law enforcement.
25:55
SPEAKER_02: We love him.
25:55
SPEAKER_02: John Reverend said, yes, document everything.
25:58
SPEAKER_02: We say this all the time.
25:59
SPEAKER_02: Our case managers say it all the time.
26:01
SPEAKER_02: It's to protect yourself.
26:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
26:03
SPEAKER_02: So document everything.
26:04
SPEAKER_04: And we talked about that last week as well.
26:06
SPEAKER_04: The documentation.
26:07
SPEAKER_04: Send things by email, not verbal.
26:09
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
26:10
SPEAKER_04: Text messages are second best to email, but everything you can do in writing is better.
26:15
SPEAKER_04: Definitely better because now you have a paper trail.
26:18
SPEAKER_02: I won't forget mangoes, Victor.
26:20
SPEAKER_04: How are we gonna forget?
26:21
SPEAKER_04: We're going to mangoes in Miami in the next couple of days.
26:25
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
26:26
SPEAKER_04: Ensure your physician explains the medical reasoning, not just conclusions.
26:32
SPEAKER_04: So that one paragraph thing she was talking about that she read, that thing just had conclusions that this person got hurt at work and has a left knee sprain.
26:39
SPEAKER_02: It literally had it literally had five sentences.
26:42
SPEAKER_02: And I was like, wait, where I and I asked her, is that the narrative or do did you not upload the narrative?
26:46
SPEAKER_02: She's like, no, that's what the doctor gave me.
26:48
SPEAKER_02: And I was like, it doesn't even say anything.
26:49
SPEAKER_02: It doesn't even have her vitals or anything.
26:51
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it's got to explain not just what happened, but what was the diagnosis that resulted from what happened?
26:57
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
26:58
SPEAKER_04: And what was what they call the mechanism of injury?
27:00
SPEAKER_04: Like, how did that ligament tear?
27:03
SPEAKER_04: It's crazy, but they need all this stuff, and too many doctors just won't.
27:07
SPEAKER_04: So you want your doctor to be very detailed.
27:10
SPEAKER_04: Use objective findings like MRIs and nerve testing, x-rays.
27:15
SPEAKER_04: Anytime you can use those, it's a lot more rock spot.
27:18
SPEAKER_04: Get them dumb, yeah.
27:19
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
27:20
SPEAKER_04: Make sure your history is consistent across all records.
27:24
SPEAKER_04: So your CA1 or two, your CA 17s, your CA20s, and your medical narrative all need to say the same thing and tell the same story.
27:33
SPEAKER_04: And which shouldn't be a problem because legit claims, it happened the way it happened.
27:39
SPEAKER_04: The story should not change.
27:40
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
27:40
SPEAKER_04: But you want to make sure that the doctor is really consistent in all the medical treat consistently.
27:46
SPEAKER_04: A lot of people will, I don't want to say a lot, but some people will get injured and go see the doctor, and the doctor will recommend treatment, and then they just kind of skip out and stay home.
27:57
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you can't do that.
27:58
SPEAKER_02: And then your claim, then you guys get upset that your claim gets closed.
28:01
SPEAKER_04: Yep.
28:02
SPEAKER_04: And if there are gaps in care, let's say that you have a back injury, but then you get like really sick and you're in the hospital for three weeks.
28:11
SPEAKER_04: I don't want that to happen to you.
28:12
SPEAKER_04: But let's say you do.
28:13
SPEAKER_04: You just have to explain the gap in treatment.
28:15
SPEAKER_04: That way you will avoid the second opinion visit to find out what the heck you've been doing, right?
28:20
SPEAKER_02: Talisha said, Do you have a book on when you are out on vocational rehab?
28:24
SPEAKER_02: Are there rules for guidelines if they find me a job to do?
28:29
SPEAKER_04: I don't have a book on that, but I will make a note that needs to be a topic and we'll talk about it.
28:34
SPEAKER_02: We can come on and talk about vocational rehab.
28:36
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I really appreciate when people tell me things they want to know about.
28:39
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
28:39
SPEAKER_04: Because I can always craft a Wednesday night chat for that topic.
28:43
SPEAKER_04: So I'll find out about that and get back to you.
28:45
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
28:46
SPEAKER_04: Where was I?
28:47
SPEAKER_04: Okay, we want to follow the treatment plan.
28:49
SPEAKER_04: Okay, so treat consistently, follow the treatment plan.
28:52
SPEAKER_04: Again, I'm not a doctor, but if a doctor tells me to do stuff, I usually do it.
28:56
SPEAKER_04: I'm pretty hard-headed, actually.
28:58
SPEAKER_04: But it's a good idea to do what the doctor says.
29:00
SPEAKER_02: Hold on.
29:00
SPEAKER_02: Talisha said, Will my pay stay the same with vocational rehab, or will OWCP make up for the difference?
29:10
SPEAKER_02: I don't know anything about that.
29:11
SPEAKER_02: So that's not that's not my thing.
29:13
SPEAKER_04: You will you're not required to take a pay cut because you're injured.
29:18
SPEAKER_04: So I've read this that you will get paid the difference.
29:23
SPEAKER_04: And I'm gonna give you more information on that too.
29:25
SPEAKER_04: Thanks for that question.
29:26
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's a good question.
29:27
SPEAKER_04: It's actually a really great question.
29:28
SPEAKER_04: We did not stump the chump.
29:30
SPEAKER_02: No, that's not this week.
29:32
SPEAKER_04: And I'm not the chump.
29:34
SPEAKER_04: Let's see.
29:35
SPEAKER_04: Make sure reports answer the key medical questions.
29:38
SPEAKER_04: So at the end of this report, there can no there can be no questions left.
29:42
SPEAKER_04: Right?
29:42
SPEAKER_04: It's absolutely guaranteed that everyone understands what happened and what the diagnosis is as a result.
29:47
SPEAKER_04: No questions unanswered.
29:49
SPEAKER_04: OWCP will send out development letters, they'll ask you questions, right?
29:53
SPEAKER_04: And a lot of people maybe they don't see their mail or they don't realize how important it is, or they don't understand the questions or how to answer them.
30:01
SPEAKER_04: You've got to answer development questions.
30:04
SPEAKER_04: And so when they send you a list of questions, if you're not sure what to do, then go to your doctor.
30:09
SPEAKER_04: Or maybe there are questions that your union can help with.
30:12
SPEAKER_04: And maybe there's questions that we can help with.
30:14
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
30:14
SPEAKER_04: But get help if you need it, right?
30:16
SPEAKER_04: So answer your development request.
30:18
SPEAKER_02: John Reverend said, I love the backdrop, looks awesome.
30:21
SPEAKER_04: Oh, thanks.
30:22
SPEAKER_02: Chris created that actually.
30:24
SPEAKER_04: It's not for me to say I'm awesome, that's for other people to say.
30:30
SPEAKER_04: Work with doctors who understand OWCP.
30:34
SPEAKER_04: I could have put that first.
30:36
SPEAKER_04: But we have doctors all over the country, and sometimes we have patients that get second opinion visits too.
30:42
SPEAKER_04: But we almost never have second opinion visits that result in killing a case.
30:46
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
30:46
SPEAKER_04: Because we document so thoroughly.
30:49
SPEAKER_04: So you want a doctor who really knows what's going on.
30:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
30:52
SPEAKER_04: And build your case so strong that another doctor reviews it and says, I got nothing else to add to this.
31:00
SPEAKER_04: You want every report your doctor writes to be written as if someone else is going to read it and try to dispute it.
31:06
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
31:07
SPEAKER_02: Crystal, hey, new to the group, my pro welcome.
31:11
SPEAKER_04: Welcome.
31:12
SPEAKER_02: Click the follow button so then every week you'll find out when we go live.
31:15
SPEAKER_04: Love, love new people.
31:16
SPEAKER_04: So glad you're here.
31:18
SPEAKER_02: She said, I'm having the problem I'm having is the neurologist that saw me the day I fell is diagnosing me with degenerative disc disease.
31:28
SPEAKER_02: And I've never had a problem with my back.
31:30
SPEAKER_02: This was last December.
31:32
SPEAKER_02: I'm waiting now until September 28th for a doctor for OWCP.
31:37
SPEAKER_02: I'm still not being paid and can't afford to go to physical therapy or my pain management doctor because WorkComp hasn't paid any of my medical bills.
31:46
SPEAKER_02: This whole thing is frustrating and makes you just want to quit.
31:48
SPEAKER_02: I'm a rural mail carrier.
31:50
SPEAKER_04: So I figured you were a rural carrier.
31:53
SPEAKER_02: But besides that, and I understand why he said that.
31:58
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, the reason they're not paying for everything is probably the doctor never wrote a narrative.
32:02
SPEAKER_02: Are you even seeing a DOL trained OWCP doctor?
32:06
SPEAKER_04: The bottom line is claims not approved.
32:07
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
32:08
SPEAKER_04: That's exactly why.
32:09
SPEAKER_04: They don't pay anything without an approval, approved claim.
32:11
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
32:11
SPEAKER_04: And if the diagnosis isn't proper, they're not going to pay you to be out of work.
32:15
SPEAKER_04: Like, for example, ankle sprain.
32:17
SPEAKER_04: Come on.
32:18
SPEAKER_04: I've sprained my ankle a hundred times.
32:20
SPEAKER_04: If I if it's a hundred, it's a thousand.
32:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
32:22
SPEAKER_04: And I can usually walk tomorrow, right?
32:25
SPEAKER_04: It doesn't mean I could carry the mail for sure, because I know what that means.
32:29
SPEAKER_04: But they're going to say you should have gone back to work sooner.
32:31
SPEAKER_04: But that's the key to getting paid is have your claim accepted with the proper diagnosis.
32:36
SPEAKER_02: And if you want more info and you still don't understand, which we understand the system is extremely frustrating, you can just message me after the live and I'll have a case manager give you a call.
32:47
SPEAKER_04: And how frustrating is the system?
32:48
SPEAKER_04: Let me tell you something.
32:49
SPEAKER_04: We have a good friend who happens to be a business coach, and he's been today was digging into OWCP for the very first time.
32:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
32:57
SPEAKER_04: And his name is Sean.
32:59
SPEAKER_04: And let me tell you something.
33:00
SPEAKER_04: Sean is the smartest guy I've ever met.
33:02
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
33:03
SPEAKER_04: Now listen, I know most of you will say, no, Chris, you're the smartest guy.
33:06
SPEAKER_04: That's for you to say, not me.
33:09
SPEAKER_04: But he actually is.
33:11
SPEAKER_04: I say that he can see around blind spots.
33:13
SPEAKER_04: He does.
33:14
SPEAKER_04: He can see behind him.
33:15
SPEAKER_04: He actually has eyes in the back of his head.
33:17
SPEAKER_04: And he called me today and he goes, it was just one question after another.
33:20
SPEAKER_04: I'm like, welcome to the party, Sean.
33:22
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
33:22
SPEAKER_04: Welcome to my world.
33:23
SPEAKER_04: That's exactly what I'm saying.
33:24
SPEAKER_04: It's a very complicated system.
33:25
SPEAKER_04: The smartest guy I know is what in the heck is happening in this thing.
33:28
SPEAKER_02: And you guys haven't It's not just you.
33:30
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you guys are not reading what he was reading.
33:32
SPEAKER_02: So imagine if you had to even read what he was reading.
33:35
SPEAKER_02: You guys would be like, I literally, if that was me, I wouldn't even file my claim.
33:39
SPEAKER_02: But that's not that's why you come here.
33:41
SPEAKER_04: That's right.
33:41
SPEAKER_04: And don't listen to her.
33:42
SPEAKER_04: Always file your claim.
33:44
SPEAKER_04: All right.
33:45
SPEAKER_04: So I'm pausing again before I get to what you do during the visit.
33:49
SPEAKER_04: Are there more questions?
33:50
SPEAKER_04: Let's hit them.
33:51
SPEAKER_02: Amy J.
33:52
SPEAKER_02: Yes, if you could add vocational training to your list, thinking I may end up there down the road at one point.
33:58
SPEAKER_02: We will definitely, we're gonna put this, we're gonna research it.
34:00
SPEAKER_02: Amy, I'm all over it.
34:01
SPEAKER_02: Take care of it.
34:02
SPEAKER_04: All over it.
34:03
SPEAKER_02: An do you need DOL permission to change doctors?
34:07
SPEAKER_04: So you do actually.
34:09
SPEAKER_04: You have to send them what we what's called a change of treating doctor request.
34:13
SPEAKER_04: You got to tell them why you're doing it.
34:14
SPEAKER_04: There's got to be a good reason.
34:16
SPEAKER_04: It can't be because I don't like my doctor, right?
34:18
SPEAKER_04: Or I don't agree with my doctor.
34:20
SPEAKER_04: It can't be that stuff.
34:21
SPEAKER_04: It can be my doctor went out of business, my doctor retired, my doctor died.
34:25
SPEAKER_04: I think a great reason is my doctor has made five attempts to get my claim accepted unsuccessfully.
34:30
SPEAKER_04: I'd like to try someplace else.
34:32
SPEAKER_04: But you gotta have a good reason to do it.
34:34
SPEAKER_04: But I have this thing that I say.
34:36
SPEAKER_04: I call these things criticisms.
34:37
SPEAKER_04: They're things that Chris says all the time.
34:39
SPEAKER_04: And one of those things is if you're stuck at a red light that never turns green, what do you do?
34:44
SPEAKER_02: Run it.
34:45
SPEAKER_04: Run the red light.
34:46
SPEAKER_04: Everybody will run it.
34:47
SPEAKER_04: I was talking a few months ago.
34:48
SPEAKER_04: I actually did.
34:49
SPEAKER_04: I was setting in a red light and I was trying to make a U-turn and it I never turned green.
34:56
SPEAKER_04: My light never turned green, but the other three sections turned green like three times before mine got green.
35:03
SPEAKER_04: And so finally I was like, nah, screw it.
35:06
SPEAKER_04: And I just ran the red light.
35:07
SPEAKER_04: And as I was doing it, I said, This is what I tell other people to do.
35:10
SPEAKER_04: So don't run red lights and get tickets.
35:12
SPEAKER_04: I'm saying, like, not real, figuratively, I think is what you say.
35:18
SPEAKER_04: Don't run red lights.
35:19
SPEAKER_02: You can get a ticket because there was no camera at that spot.
35:22
SPEAKER_04: What I mean, if you're stuck at a light that never turns green, you got to make a decision.
35:26
SPEAKER_04: And if your doctor can't get a claim accepted, then find a way to get to another doctor.
35:31
SPEAKER_04: You can get a referral from the existing doctor.
35:33
SPEAKER_04: You can ask your existing treating doctor to write a letter to the claims examiner requesting to be removed from your case.
35:39
SPEAKER_04: That's one of the rules.
35:41
SPEAKER_04: But a referral, all referrals are honored.
35:44
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
35:44
SPEAKER_04: So your doctor can actually refer you to somebody who knows what they're doing.
35:47
SPEAKER_04: And why would that doctor want to do that?
35:49
SPEAKER_04: Because if you if the doctor's not getting your claim accepted, guess what?
35:53
SPEAKER_04: The doctor's not getting paid.
35:54
SPEAKER_02: And the doctor can't write a five paid, a five or uh five-sentence narrative.
35:59
SPEAKER_04: But seriously, a medical is a business, whether we like it or not, and doctors like to get paid for the work they do.
36:04
SPEAKER_04: And when your claim's not accepted, the only way they get paid is if they ask you for money out of your pocket, which we do not allow.
36:10
SPEAKER_04: But I don't control all the doctors outside of federal injury centers.
36:14
SPEAKER_04: So sometimes you want to just run that red light.
36:16
SPEAKER_04: So ask the doctor for a referral.
36:18
SPEAKER_04: Once the claim gets accepted, guess what?
36:20
SPEAKER_04: The doc will get paid.
36:21
SPEAKER_04: All that stuff he didn't get paid for, he will get paid.
36:23
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
36:23
SPEAKER_04: So he should be motivated to help you find somebody that can help you.
36:26
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
36:27
SPEAKER_02: Nancy, is there a way to get DOL to expedite approval for a surgery quicker due to bones healing incorrectly if not expedited?
36:37
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, make sure the diagnosis is proper.
36:40
SPEAKER_04: This happens a lot.
36:41
SPEAKER_04: Someone will be, and this is like breaking a rule that I said in the very beginning that leads to a second opinion visit.
36:46
SPEAKER_04: Someone's diagnosis will be knee sprain.
36:50
SPEAKER_04: Just example, knee sprain.
36:51
SPEAKER_04: Why?
36:52
SPEAKER_04: Because it's easy.
36:53
SPEAKER_04: Sprains and strains are easy to get approved.
36:55
SPEAKER_04: Claims examiners look at it and go, oh, this thing's gonna be over with pretty quick.
36:59
SPEAKER_04: It's a sprain, it's gonna heal.
37:01
SPEAKER_04: Let's say that your doctor diagnosed you with a sprain because it was easy, and or the doctor was lazy, but you get an MRI later and says you have an ACL tear, which is a ligament that goes down the middle of your knee.
37:12
SPEAKER_04: Okay, that's surgical.
37:14
SPEAKER_04: Almost always.
37:15
SPEAKER_04: How would I know?
37:15
SPEAKER_04: I got two of them.
37:17
SPEAKER_04: You're never gonna get surgery on that surgical condition because your diagnosis is a sprain.
37:21
SPEAKER_04: So the first thing you got to look at is what's my accepted condition?
37:24
SPEAKER_04: What is the diagnosis they approved?
37:27
SPEAKER_04: Once you have a diagnosis that is surgical, then it's nearly automatic.
37:32
SPEAKER_04: Okay, like I said, needing surgery can result in a second opinion visit.
37:36
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
37:36
SPEAKER_04: That was one of the things on the list.
37:38
SPEAKER_04: But most surgeries are held up because of the bad diagnosis.
37:42
SPEAKER_04: I don't know your situation, but if I were gonna guess and put money on stuff, I'd put money on you have a good diagnosis that's not surgical, even though you have a condition that is.
37:52
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
37:52
SPEAKER_02: Talish, okay, when I read this, you're gonna laugh after, and I'm not gonna say you're gonna know why you're gonna laugh.
37:58
SPEAKER_02: I'm a role carry of 25 years and I love my union, but they have told me they don't handle OWCP grievances.
38:06
SPEAKER_04: I'm not gonna laugh.
38:12
SPEAKER_02: There's a story behind that.
38:13
SPEAKER_02: That's why I'm laughing.
38:14
SPEAKER_02: So now answer her question.
38:16
SPEAKER_04: What was the question?
38:17
SPEAKER_02: Oh, wait, hold on.
38:18
SPEAKER_04: You just told me a statement that I'm supposed to laugh at, and I choose not to.
38:21
SPEAKER_02: I know, Talisha.
38:22
SPEAKER_02: Like, I've had a handful of people asking if we were going to the national convention in at the Gay Lord.
38:28
SPEAKER_04: You have no idea how bad I want to go.
38:30
SPEAKER_04: I have, and to my APWU and FLIOA friends, don't take this anyway, but I have probably have more friends in the rule carrier union than anywhere else.
38:41
SPEAKER_04: And I miss everyone so much because I'm not invited to your stuff.
38:45
SPEAKER_04: I love being around all of you so much.
38:48
SPEAKER_04: I was talking to my friend Jerry the other day, and it was so nice talking to her.
38:52
SPEAKER_04: I've Tammy here, her son Scott.
38:55
SPEAKER_04: Like, I love rule carriers.
38:56
SPEAKER_04: I've made such close connections with them, but I'm not invited.
39:00
SPEAKER_04: And I'm not mad about it, okay?
39:02
SPEAKER_04: But I'm saying that's why I can't be there.
39:04
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
39:04
SPEAKER_04: I'm not mad about it, but I can't go.
39:06
SPEAKER_02: Crystal said, My primary doctor is trying to write a narrative saying this is your primary care.
39:13
SPEAKER_02: Is trying to write a narrative saying there was no other prior diagnosis to say it was or was not a previous medical condition.
39:22
SPEAKER_02: See, that's what's happening.
39:23
SPEAKER_02: Your primary doctor is not trained in OWCP.
39:26
SPEAKER_04: No, but also who cares?
39:27
SPEAKER_02: No, I know.
39:28
SPEAKER_04: Ask me why who cares?
39:29
SPEAKER_02: Well, oh, why who cares?
39:30
SPEAKER_04: Why?
39:30
SPEAKER_04: Oh, good.
39:31
SPEAKER_04: So earlier somebody said degenerative disc disease as well.
39:35
SPEAKER_04: And that whoever you are that said degenerative, this applies to you as well.
39:40
SPEAKER_04: But any condition that's pre-existing that is made worse by the job is covered by OWCP.
39:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
39:48
SPEAKER_04: So let's say that you're the person with degenerative condition in your back.
39:52
SPEAKER_04: The post office still hired you with that condition.
39:54
SPEAKER_04: And one day with your degenerative back, you're carrying the mail and you bend over and you feel a pop in your back.
40:00
SPEAKER_04: Maybe your back was weakened because of your previous condition, but it's still covered.
40:06
SPEAKER_04: If you had a previous knee injury and you went and got hired at a federal agency and your knee blew out, and they say, well, you already had a previous condition.
40:15
SPEAKER_04: The answer is, so what?
40:17
SPEAKER_04: This made it worse.
40:18
SPEAKER_04: So those previous conditions are covered by OWCP.
40:21
SPEAKER_04: Your doctor just has to know how to deal with it.
40:23
SPEAKER_02: Hold on.
40:25
SPEAKER_02: This question.
40:26
SPEAKER_02: Norax is back.
40:27
SPEAKER_04: Hey, hey, nice seeing you.
40:29
SPEAKER_02: She said, I did that.
40:30
SPEAKER_02: I wrote a grievance on my claim examiner, and he was removed also to change physicians.
40:35
SPEAKER_02: That's the first I've heard of that.
40:37
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
40:38
SPEAKER_04: That's cool.
40:39
SPEAKER_04: Look, let me just say supervisors.
40:42
SPEAKER_04: For the record, I'm not mad at claims examiners, but sometimes they don't do a great job.
40:46
SPEAKER_04: And that's good that you're able to get that solved.
40:48
SPEAKER_04: And by the way, by role, you can request a new claims examiner.
40:52
SPEAKER_04: You can request a new nurse case manager.
40:53
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, you can.
40:54
SPEAKER_04: They don't have to honor that request, but you're allowed to do so.
40:57
SPEAKER_02: So I wanted to say something to Crystal.
41:00
SPEAKER_02: Crystal, in our offices, any of the Federal Injury Center's offices that we have, what I know because somebody said this earlier.
41:10
SPEAKER_02: No, you never have to pay anything out of pocket when you go to our offices.
41:14
SPEAKER_02: OWCP pays the doctor.
41:16
SPEAKER_02: That's like the insurance for the doctor.
41:18
SPEAKER_02: They're billing OWCP.
41:20
SPEAKER_02: But our and if anyone hears that it's our doctors, they always wind up messaging me.
41:26
SPEAKER_02: So I remember you said your primary care.
41:28
SPEAKER_02: Obviously, I have to pay your primary care.
41:30
SPEAKER_04: It's one of our policies that we never take money, no matter what, ever.
41:33
SPEAKER_04: Period.
41:34
SPEAKER_04: There's no exception to that.
41:36
SPEAKER_02: All right.
41:36
SPEAKER_02: Nancy said.
41:38
SPEAKER_02: No.
41:39
SPEAKER_02: Nancy said it took two weeks to get into orthosurger for badly broken wrist, need surgery ASOP, but cannot wait until DOL approves it, unless I pay out of pocket.
41:49
SPEAKER_02: I can't afford to do that, nor do I want to fight for the reimbursement.
41:53
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, you've got to get your claim accepted with the right diagnosis, and then surgery is nearly automatic.
41:59
SPEAKER_04: I wish I had a better answer for that, but that's what has to happen.
42:03
SPEAKER_04: If your diagnosis is wrist brain, the surgery is never going to happen.
42:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
42:07
SPEAKER_04: You got to understand that.
42:08
SPEAKER_04: It's got to be a diagnosis that actually matches what happened.
42:11
SPEAKER_02: Tanisha said, does that include rheumatoid arthritis is included pre-existing that was made worse by the injury?
42:20
SPEAKER_04: Technically, yeah.
42:20
SPEAKER_04: The rule states that anything that is exacerbated or worsened in any way by the job is covered.
42:27
SPEAKER_04: With that said, I can't think of a single instance of rheumatoid arthritis that was covered.
42:34
SPEAKER_04: But I'm the guy who tries everything.
42:36
SPEAKER_04: So I'd probably attempt it.
42:38
SPEAKER_04: If it's me, I'm going to try to win.
42:39
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, he is.
42:40
SPEAKER_04: Because you're not breaking the rules by telling the truth to OWCP and letting them decide.
42:46
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
42:47
SPEAKER_04: It's not a it's not against the rules to say I had it already and my job made it worse.
42:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
42:51
SPEAKER_04: But having the doctor be able to prove how it made it worse, that's going to be the trick.
42:56
SPEAKER_02: And everybody has to stay on because I have a little surprise at the end that I told my business partner I talked to him that I was going to talk about at the very end.
43:05
SPEAKER_04: It's even going to be a surprise to me.
43:07
SPEAKER_04: I have no idea.
43:09
SPEAKER_04: Is all the questions so far?
43:10
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
43:11
SPEAKER_04: All right.
43:11
SPEAKER_04: So check it out.
43:12
SPEAKER_04: I've told you the reasons that second opinion visits are they happen.
43:16
SPEAKER_04: I've told you how to avoid them.
43:18
SPEAKER_04: And I don't believe that it's possible to fully avoid them, but I think you can take the steps necessary to try to avoid some of the cases like diagnosis expansions and surgeries.
43:28
SPEAKER_04: Well, if you have the right diagnosis, then don't need to send you to second opinion for the surgery.
43:32
SPEAKER_04: So great diagnos, great narrative reports.
43:35
SPEAKER_04: When you have thorough details, you're less likely to be sent to a second opinion.
43:40
SPEAKER_04: But what if you do?
43:41
SPEAKER_04: I hear all the time that I went in and the doctor spent five minutes with me, barely looked up, never touched me, and then made a determination, and I'm not even sure what they were thinking.
43:51
SPEAKER_04: And that to me is a problem.
43:53
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
43:53
SPEAKER_04: I work with doctors all over the country, and our doctors are very thorough.
43:57
SPEAKER_04: They're required to be thorough.
43:58
SPEAKER_04: It's the only way to offer.
44:00
SPEAKER_04: Operate inside of OWCP is thoroughness.
44:02
SPEAKER_04: But I think that the second opinion doctors get paid the same amount no matter what they do or how much time they spend.
44:08
SPEAKER_04: I think that's true.
44:09
SPEAKER_02: We heard that.
44:10
SPEAKER_04: I think so.
44:11
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
44:11
SPEAKER_04: And if that's the case, if you get paid, let's just, I'm picking a round number.
44:15
SPEAKER_04: It's not this, it's way more.
44:16
SPEAKER_04: But if you get paid$100 for 10 minutes or$100 for 100 minutes, how many minutes do you want to spend to get$100?
44:22
SPEAKER_04: So I think that's a flaw in the system.
44:24
SPEAKER_04: But again, maybe I'm wrong.
44:26
SPEAKER_04: I just doubt it.
44:27
SPEAKER_02: John Reverend said, Welcome to the world of OWCP.
44:31
SPEAKER_02: No doubt.
44:32
SPEAKER_04: No doubt.
44:32
SPEAKER_04: I always say OWCP is not spelled F-A-I-R.
44:36
SPEAKER_04: It's not.
44:37
SPEAKER_04: So what can you do to improve your chances of a good outcome when you go to a second opinion visit?
44:44
SPEAKER_04: To me, this is going to be the most valuable thing that I say to you tonight.
44:48
SPEAKER_04: So whatever you do, don't shine, don't sign off now.
44:52
SPEAKER_04: You've made it this long.
44:53
SPEAKER_04: You need this part.
44:54
SPEAKER_04: Write it down.
44:55
SPEAKER_04: After I'm done, go watch it again if you need to.
44:57
SPEAKER_04: But this is what this is really the stuff that you got to do to protect yourself.
45:01
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
45:01
SPEAKER_04: Number one, and it seems the most obvious, so I made it number one, is tell the truth.
45:06
SPEAKER_04: Don't exaggerate.
45:08
SPEAKER_04: Be just straight up.
45:10
SPEAKER_04: This is what happened.
45:11
SPEAKER_04: Try to leave your opinions out of it.
45:13
SPEAKER_04: Just tell the truth of what happened.
45:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
45:16
SPEAKER_04: Know your injury timeline.
45:17
SPEAKER_04: If a doctor has questions, you need to know look, I got injured on June 2nd, 2026.
45:23
SPEAKER_04: For three weeks, I this happened, then I did that, and it took this long.
45:26
SPEAKER_04: And know your timelines.
45:28
SPEAKER_04: That's important.
45:28
SPEAKER_04: Understand what happened to you and when it happened.
45:31
SPEAKER_02: Because if you miss timelines, you're screwed.
45:34
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
45:35
SPEAKER_04: Be consistent with prior records and statements.
45:37
SPEAKER_04: So whatever was written on the CA1, CA2, CA20, CA17, medical narratives, all that stuff, that's the stuff we're going to be dealing with here too.
45:46
SPEAKER_04: So make sure you're really consistent.
45:48
SPEAKER_04: And as long as we're always telling the truth, that part's easy.
45:51
SPEAKER_04: This one's really important.
45:53
SPEAKER_04: Stay calm and don't argue.
45:56
SPEAKER_04: If you know me, can you imagine me going to a second opinion doctor and staying calm and not arguing?
46:03
SPEAKER_02: I would have to tell him, I'll sit here and you go sit in the car.
46:05
SPEAKER_02: I don't even know what that means.
46:06
SPEAKER_04: What do you mean, don't argue?
46:07
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
46:08
SPEAKER_04: Because I'm going to fight for myself and you should too.
46:10
SPEAKER_04: But they can stop the exam and you can be forced to go to another one.
46:15
SPEAKER_04: And in between that time, to the another one, they'll cut off your benefits.
46:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
46:20
SPEAKER_04: So be nice and play nice.
46:23
SPEAKER_04: Clearly explain your injury and symptoms if you're asked to.
46:28
SPEAKER_04: Describe your specific functional limitations.
46:31
SPEAKER_04: So let them know look, I struggle lifting over my head, et cetera.
46:35
SPEAKER_04: Right.
46:35
SPEAKER_04: So let them know what you really are struggling doing because a lot of times they're in there going, can you go back to work full duty or not?
46:41
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
46:42
SPEAKER_04: So you gotta let them know what's wrong and why you don't think you can go back full duty.
46:46
SPEAKER_04: And hopefully it's supported by the CA 17 your treating doctor recently wrote.
46:51
SPEAKER_04: If you don't know something, don't try to say anything, just say, I don't know.
46:54
SPEAKER_04: It's okay to not know something, all right?
46:56
SPEAKER_04: Don't make stuff up.
46:58
SPEAKER_04: Cooperate with the exam unless something is unsafe or causes severe pain.
47:02
SPEAKER_04: I used to do in a when I was brand new into healthcare, I used to be a functional capacity evaluation tech, which meant I did FCEs.
47:12
SPEAKER_04: I was trained, I was certified, I could do an FCE asleep.
47:16
SPEAKER_04: And one of the things I would tell people is I want you to do, give it the best effort you can give, but you're not allowed to get hurt.
47:23
SPEAKER_04: Do not hurt yourself doing this.
47:25
SPEAKER_04: If you feel like you're going to get hurt, do not do what I tell you to do.
47:28
SPEAKER_04: Instead, tell me that's gonna hurt me.
47:30
SPEAKER_04: That applies here.
47:31
SPEAKER_04: Do not get hurt.
47:33
SPEAKER_04: Okay, you got to know your limits.
47:35
SPEAKER_04: Focus on facts, not your frustrations.
47:38
SPEAKER_04: This is not the second opinion doctor, is not your counselor.
47:41
SPEAKER_04: All right, you don't go in there and say my manager did this and my doctor did this and my doctor's a jerk or whatever that stuff.
47:49
SPEAKER_04: They don't want to hear that.
47:51
SPEAKER_04: I want you to be the most credible person in the room.
47:55
SPEAKER_04: Okay, this doctor needs to leave this exam going, all right, this person's legit.
47:59
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
48:00
SPEAKER_04: And that's really important.
48:02
SPEAKER_04: So don't fight with them, don't argue with them, don't make stuff up, don't exaggerate, don't lie, whatever you do.
48:07
SPEAKER_04: Be very consistent.
48:08
SPEAKER_04: But you also have to document some things, okay?
48:11
SPEAKER_04: So I want you to document, and this is really key.
48:13
SPEAKER_04: What time did you arrive?
48:16
SPEAKER_04: I arrived at 10.02 a.m.
48:19
SPEAKER_04: Be very exact.
48:20
SPEAKER_04: We all have phones with us at all times, and all of our clocks are exactly the same as everyone else's clock.
48:26
SPEAKER_04: Right now, mine says 850.
48:29
SPEAKER_04: If it said 851, I would write down 851.
48:32
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
48:32
SPEAKER_04: Okay, so be very specific about that.
48:35
SPEAKER_04: And I just lost my place.
48:36
SPEAKER_04: Document.
48:37
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
48:37
SPEAKER_04: You document when you arrived, you document when you left the building.
48:43
SPEAKER_04: I want you to document what time you were taken back by the nurse or medical assistant.
48:48
SPEAKER_04: I want you to document what time the doctor came in and what time the doctor left.
48:53
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
48:54
SPEAKER_04: So your timeline is going to be I arrived at 10.02.
48:57
SPEAKER_04: The nurse took me back at 1017.
49:00
SPEAKER_04: At 1021, the doctor came in the room.
49:03
SPEAKER_04: At 1024, the doctor left.
49:05
SPEAKER_04: And that was the end of the visit.
49:07
SPEAKER_04: And at 1025, I was in my car.
49:09
SPEAKER_02: I don't he's telling you this for a reason.
49:12
SPEAKER_02: And you should, because you're making sure you're documenting everything.
49:16
SPEAKER_02: But when you go to a doctor's office, and especially something as a second opinion, and you're so frustrated, sometimes you forget to document what he's saying.
49:24
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and all that timeline thing is really critical because let's say the doctor, after spending three minutes with you, I'm exaggerating.
49:31
SPEAKER_04: I hope doctors spend way more than three minutes, but let's say that happened.
49:34
SPEAKER_04: And then after that three minutes, you get a determination from that doctor that you can return to work full duty, that you're all better, there's no more temporary disability, and there's nothing else to see here.
49:47
SPEAKER_04: And you're like, wait, you were in the room with me for three minutes, barely looked up.
49:52
SPEAKER_04: How could you have determined that?
49:54
SPEAKER_04: And so we want to tell the claims examiner, I don't know how the doctor came to this conclusion in three minutes.
49:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
49:59
SPEAKER_04: But you document to the minute everything that happened when it happened.
50:03
SPEAKER_02: I think he has x-ray eyes.
50:06
SPEAKER_04: Who?
50:06
SPEAKER_02: The doctor that goes in there for three minutes.
50:08
SPEAKER_04: You're funny.
50:10
SPEAKER_04: Okay, name and description of everyone present.
50:13
SPEAKER_04: So in the exam was the doctor, a nurse, and here's their names.
50:17
SPEAKER_04: If someone else was there, this is their name, right?
50:20
SPEAKER_04: So try to get names of people and what their position in the office is.
50:24
SPEAKER_04: Remember the questions that the doctor asked you.
50:27
unknown: Yeah.
50:27
SPEAKER_04: That's really important.
50:28
SPEAKER_04: And if the doctor didn't ask you a single question, document they didn't ask me anything.
50:33
SPEAKER_04: If they ask you anything, write down what they ask you and what your answer was.
50:38
SPEAKER_04: What physical exam was actually performed?
50:41
SPEAKER_04: I can't tell you how many times someone told me the doctor came in and didn't even touch me.
50:45
SPEAKER_04: Listen, if they don't touch you, they did not do a physical exam.
50:49
SPEAKER_02: But we but we hear it all the time.
50:51
SPEAKER_02: They don't.
50:51
SPEAKER_02: We really do.
50:52
SPEAKER_04: But physical exams are physical.
50:54
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
50:54
SPEAKER_04: That's why they call it that.
50:55
SPEAKER_04: All right.
50:55
SPEAKER_04: If they don't touch you, they didn't do it.
50:57
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
50:58
SPEAKER_04: They could have looked at you.
50:59
SPEAKER_04: I don't know if a visual exam is even a thing.
51:01
SPEAKER_04: I don't know.
51:02
SPEAKER_02: That's what I'm saying he has x-ray eyes.
51:04
SPEAKER_04: So document that, right?
51:06
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
51:06
SPEAKER_04: I want you to document what imaging or records were discussed with the doctor.
51:11
SPEAKER_04: Did the doctor discuss any records with you?
51:13
SPEAKER_04: And if not, say so.
51:17
SPEAKER_04: Any statement that the doctor made that you clearly remember, okay, don't make anything up.
51:22
SPEAKER_04: Okay, if you're not sure, don't say it.
51:24
SPEAKER_04: It's so important to be truthful.
51:26
SPEAKER_04: But if something stands out to you, write it down.
51:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
51:30
SPEAKER_04: Any unusual factual observations about the visit?
51:34
SPEAKER_04: You're saying, this is weird.
51:36
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
51:36
SPEAKER_04: I don't know why this is happening.
51:38
SPEAKER_04: It's okay to question things.
51:40
SPEAKER_04: That's not a problem.
51:41
SPEAKER_04: We're not making accusations.
51:42
SPEAKER_04: We're just saying, I don't get this.
51:44
SPEAKER_04: This was this thing was happening.
51:46
SPEAKER_04: I didn't understand it.
51:47
SPEAKER_04: And so I'm just going to document that.
51:49
SPEAKER_04: And I don't have examples of what the thing could be that you want to understand.
51:52
SPEAKER_04: But if it happens, document it.
51:54
SPEAKER_04: Like just that was weird.
51:57
SPEAKER_04: Symptoms experienced during the physical exam maneuver.
52:01
SPEAKER_04: So let's say the doctor does put their hands on you and they say, bend forward, raise your arms up, any of that stuff, whatever they do.
52:07
SPEAKER_04: If that stuff hurts or it causes any sort of discomfort, document that.
52:16
SPEAKER_04: Be as specific as you can.
52:18
SPEAKER_04: And preserve all paperwork, receipts, and mileage and documentation.
52:23
SPEAKER_04: Preserve everything about that visit.
52:26
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
52:27
SPEAKER_04: Don't lose anything.
52:28
SPEAKER_04: Because look, you can get paid for the drive.
52:31
SPEAKER_04: You can be paid for your time off if you had to leave work to go to it.
52:34
SPEAKER_04: And your paperwork documentation from the visit could be a deal maker or deal breaker for you.
52:41
SPEAKER_04: The key to this is just document the hell out of this visit.
52:45
SPEAKER_04: Don't leave anything to chance.
52:48
SPEAKER_04: Because if a bad determination comes, you want to be able to say to the claims examiner, I don't understand how that happened.
52:53
SPEAKER_04: The doc spent three minutes with me, didn't touch me, we didn't talk about anything, didn't do any x-rays, nothing happened.
52:59
SPEAKER_04: How can the doctor know anything by not even talking to me?
53:03
SPEAKER_04: So you got to document the whole thing, but be truthful and don't exaggerate.
53:08
SPEAKER_04: No more questions?
53:09
SPEAKER_04: No.
53:09
SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah.
53:10
SPEAKER_04: We're waiting for you to I'm at the end of that.
53:12
SPEAKER_02: Deborah Jackson, I have three herniated discs and sciatica going down both legs, but don't have but not but have not been able to get the expansion since 2024.
53:24
SPEAKER_02: The hospital I attended at the time of the incident included sciatic nerve.
53:28
SPEAKER_02: What can I do?
53:30
SPEAKER_04: If you don't have a diagnosis expansion for those, and again, remember that's a reason you might get sent to a second opinion visit, but you also have to have the right thing documented on your case.
53:41
SPEAKER_04: So if you need a diagnosis expansion and the doc can't do it and the hospital won't do it, you gotta find one who will.
53:46
SPEAKER_04: That's the bottom line.
53:48
SPEAKER_04: It's got to happen.
53:49
SPEAKER_04: The doctor's got to be able to explain medically with great causation how that condition going down your leg is related to the injury that was on the job.
53:59
SPEAKER_02: But if you're going to the whole thing, if you're going to the hospital to get that done, it's not gonna happen.
54:04
SPEAKER_02: It's not gonna happen.
54:05
SPEAKER_04: Okay, is there a 5% chance?
54:07
SPEAKER_04: Sure, maybe even three.
54:09
SPEAKER_04: It can happen, but almost always it won't.
54:12
SPEAKER_02: I would have said one.
54:14
SPEAKER_02: Amber just filled my first CA7 with a CA7A, and USPS didn't fill out their portion correctly.
54:21
SPEAKER_02: USPS said they will kick it back so I didn't worry about my part.
54:26
SPEAKER_02: How can they do this?
54:27
SPEAKER_02: I filled out first day annual, three days LWAP, one on one row, then annual day on row, then LWAP, the rest of the one line was it wrong.
54:40
SPEAKER_04: I'm sure you did yours right.
54:42
SPEAKER_04: So she okay, she was explaining a CA7A, a time analysis form.
54:47
SPEAKER_01: Amber.
54:47
SPEAKER_04: Amber.
54:48
SPEAKER_04: So I understood what you were saying.
54:49
SPEAKER_04: That's a time analysis form.
54:50
SPEAKER_04: I'm sure you did it right.
54:51
SPEAKER_04: The CA7, I'm sure you did it right too.
54:53
SPEAKER_04: You only had to fill out one piece of paper there.
54:55
SPEAKER_04: And what's frustrating to me is a supervisor also only has to fill out one piece of paper.
54:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
55:00
SPEAKER_04: And it's all done electronically too, so it's not even actually paper.
55:03
SPEAKER_04: So it doesn't even look overwhelming to someone who's not that smart.
55:06
SPEAKER_04: I was talking about your supervisor, not you, of course.
55:09
SPEAKER_04: They got to do this right.
55:10
SPEAKER_04: And when it goes to the claims examiner, to actually the claims examiner's one of their jobs is to say, hey, you did this wrong.
55:16
SPEAKER_04: And they kick it back to the supervisor, but they only have five days to get that in.
55:22
SPEAKER_04: And so if they did it wrong and it gets kicked back, they got to finish it now.
55:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
55:27
SPEAKER_04: This is not a thing that can wait because your income is at stake.
55:30
SPEAKER_04: It's really frustrating to me when people do that.
55:33
SPEAKER_04: We actually have a video on our website, federal injurycenters.com, that explains box by box how to fill out the CA7.
55:40
SPEAKER_04: So if it's a question, you can go check it out.
55:42
SPEAKER_04: You can even give it to your supervisor.
55:44
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
55:44
SPEAKER_04: I'm okay with that.
55:45
SPEAKER_02: Melissa, what's with the second opinion doctor appointments only lasting 15 minutes when paperwork says to be prepared for a long appointment, also bring all imaging and reports, yet they never look at it.
55:57
SPEAKER_02: We're just saying that yes.
55:58
SPEAKER_04: 15 minutes is a long visit for second opinion for them.
56:02
SPEAKER_02: We understand, yes, for for you sitting there, it is not enough time.
56:06
SPEAKER_04: And this is why we document everything to the minute, everything that happened, when it happened, because if you get a bad determination, you want to be able to say, I don't know how the doctor made that determination after just 13 minutes.
56:18
SPEAKER_02: Like we said earlier, he has x-ray vision.
56:20
SPEAKER_02: I don't know and can tell you what's wrong with you.
56:22
SPEAKER_04: You're welcome, Amber.
56:23
SPEAKER_02: Amber said, USPS said I didn't fill out my CA7 correctly to clarify that's why they didn't worry about their part.
56:32
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
56:33
SPEAKER_04: So let's say that's true.
56:35
SPEAKER_04: Let's say that you didn't fill it out correctly.
56:37
SPEAKER_04: And so management said, but you didn't do it right, so I'm not going to do mine at all.
56:41
SPEAKER_04: I'd like to direct you to the directions page that is the last page of a CA7.
56:48
SPEAKER_04: In fact, the last page of every document is a directions, like instructions page.
56:54
SPEAKER_04: And I will assure you, although that I don't have that instructions page memorized, I assure you that it does not say management.
57:02
SPEAKER_04: If the first page isn't filled out right, you don't have to do your part.
57:07
SPEAKER_04: No.
57:07
SPEAKER_04: In fact, they have to say, hey, Amber, you did this wrong.
57:12
SPEAKER_04: Let's correct it.
57:13
SPEAKER_04: That's what they're supposed to do.
57:15
SPEAKER_04: I would get my unit involved for sure.
57:18
SPEAKER_04: Because your pay's at stake.
57:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
57:20
SPEAKER_04: And that's not okay.
57:21
SPEAKER_04: It's not okay for a supervisor to play dumb.
57:23
SPEAKER_04: It's just not.
57:25
SPEAKER_02: And we say this, Chris always says, they're either playing dumb or they don't know.
57:29
SPEAKER_02: So there's a 50-50 chance.
57:31
SPEAKER_04: Actually, I say they're either dumb or they're playing dumb.
57:34
SPEAKER_04: Rolando.
57:35
SPEAKER_04: No reason to be nice about it.
57:36
SPEAKER_02: I already told them that I don't want surgery and I'm on injections and pills for my back.
57:42
SPEAKER_02: At what point do you claim a schedule award?
57:45
SPEAKER_04: So that's an interesting question.
57:47
SPEAKER_04: You don't have to get surgery.
57:48
SPEAKER_04: It was Rolando?
57:49
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
57:49
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, Rolando.
57:50
SPEAKER_04: You don't have to get surgery.
57:51
SPEAKER_04: You have to consent to all treatment, which means you don't have to consent to any treatment.
57:56
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
57:56
SPEAKER_04: So let's be clear about that.
57:59
SPEAKER_04: Once the doctor has exhausted all things that the doctor thinks can help you get better.
58:04
SPEAKER_04: And if the doctor says surgery will help, but you say no, the doctor says then, okay, then we have exhausted everything that we think we can do to get you better.
58:14
SPEAKER_04: You're now at maximum medical improvement.
58:15
SPEAKER_04: You're as good as you're ever going to get because we've done everything we can do or that you're willing to do.
58:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
58:20
SPEAKER_04: And that's the point you can get a schedule award.
58:23
SPEAKER_04: The doctor has got to say that you're at maximum medical improvement.
58:25
SPEAKER_04: You're at MMI.
58:26
SPEAKER_04: You're the best you're ever going to get unless you do something else.
58:29
SPEAKER_04: Yep.
58:30
SPEAKER_02: Norak said, let everyone know that mileage refund could be inputted through e-comp portal now under billing.
58:37
SPEAKER_02: Boom.
58:38
SPEAKER_04: And you got to get that stuff in within one year of when you incur the expense.
58:42
SPEAKER_04: Don't wait because they don't have to pay you after a year.
58:45
SPEAKER_02: Jeremy, we haven't seen you for a while.
58:47
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
58:47
SPEAKER_02: Welcome back.
58:49
SPEAKER_02: Goody.
58:50
SPEAKER_03: Let's see.
58:52
SPEAKER_02: Amber, I have a call in to the CE, but I will call the union in the morning.
58:58
SPEAKER_02: Thank y'all.
58:59
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
59:00
SPEAKER_04: And you can always message us.
59:02
SPEAKER_04: This goes to anybody.
59:03
SPEAKER_04: If you have questions and you're still having difficulty, there's a messenger attached to Facebook.
59:08
SPEAKER_04: You're all free to send us messages.
59:10
SPEAKER_04: It doesn't mean that I'm going to necessarily answer all the questions, but I have a team of people that can help you.
59:15
SPEAKER_04: So it's okay if you send us messages.
59:16
SPEAKER_02: Along with my other roles in the company, I'm also the complaint department.
59:21
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, but I'm not talking about if you have a question.
59:23
SPEAKER_04: But do me a favor, don't send a message that says, Do you have an office located in my area?
59:27
SPEAKER_04: Just go to my website and check the locations tab.
59:29
SPEAKER_04: That'll answer your question.
59:31
SPEAKER_04: Because we're just going to tell you to check the locations tab.
59:34
unknown: Yeah.
59:35
SPEAKER_02: Are you done?
59:36
SPEAKER_04: I have one more thing.
59:37
SPEAKER_04: No, that's it.
59:38
SPEAKER_04: Okay, so I just want to talk about the takeaways.
59:40
SPEAKER_04: We're out over the hour.
59:41
SPEAKER_04: So these are the takeaways, the main points of this.
59:44
SPEAKER_04: Second opinions often occur because there are unanswered medical questions.
59:48
SPEAKER_04: So make sure your doctor is thorough.
59:50
SPEAKER_04: Strong, consistent, well-documented medical evidence is the best way to prevent a second opinion visit.
59:58
SPEAKER_04: And after the visit, document everything.
1:00:02
SPEAKER_04: Leave no stones unturned.
1:00:03
SPEAKER_04: Document it all.
1:00:04
SPEAKER_04: I arrived at this minute.
1:00:06
SPEAKER_04: The doctor took me, or the nurse took me back at this minute, the doctor arrived at this minute into the room and left at this minute.
1:00:12
SPEAKER_04: And this is when I left the building.
1:00:13
SPEAKER_04: You got to document everything.
1:00:15
SPEAKER_04: The doc said this, or this thing was weird, or this is something I remember, but just be accurate.
1:00:21
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:00:21
SPEAKER_04: Don't exaggerate.
1:00:22
SPEAKER_04: Don't make anything up.
1:00:23
SPEAKER_02: James Colbert said, so I got approved, I got an approved case and went through physical therapy and surgery, but now I'm released to work.
1:00:33
SPEAKER_02: How do I go about getting a schedule award?
1:00:36
SPEAKER_04: Schedule award's simple.
1:00:37
SPEAKER_04: It's not, but the procedure for getting it technically is it's just a few steps.
1:00:42
SPEAKER_04: One, the doctor says you're as good as you're ever going to get, MMI.
1:00:45
SPEAKER_04: Second, you get an impairment rating based on the sixth edition guide to permanent impairment by the American Medical Association.
1:00:54
SPEAKER_04: Then that impairment report is attached to a CA7 claim for compensation.
1:00:59
SPEAKER_04: You select letter D, schedule award, and that is sent by e-comp to the claims examiner.
1:01:05
SPEAKER_04: The claim examiner is then going to review it, and if it's a high percentage, send it to a second opinion doctor.
1:01:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:01:12
SPEAKER_04: That's going to happen.
1:01:13
SPEAKER_04: That's sad and it's not fair, but OWCP is not spelled F-A-I-R.
1:01:17
SPEAKER_02: Maria said, some union reps don't want to get involved in this issue.
1:01:22
SPEAKER_02: I know.
1:01:22
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I know.
1:01:23
SPEAKER_04: And look, so stewards are some of my favorite people.
1:01:27
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
1:01:28
SPEAKER_04: I'm not sucking up.
1:01:28
SPEAKER_04: It's not that, but it's true.
1:01:30
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:01:30
SPEAKER_04: Because stewards, I believe, are the power of the union.
1:01:33
SPEAKER_04: But they're not always trained.
1:01:35
SPEAKER_04: And I know that because I train stewards, and it's not their fault.
1:01:38
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
1:01:39
SPEAKER_04: Unions have so much to deal with outside of OWCP, especially now.
1:01:44
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:01:44
SPEAKER_04: With the current administration, there's a lot going on.
1:01:47
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
1:01:47
SPEAKER_04: So OWCP is not high on the list at all times.
1:01:51
SPEAKER_04: So stewards need to be trained.
1:01:52
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:01:53
SPEAKER_04: They really do, but it's not their fault.
1:01:54
SPEAKER_04: They want to be able to help you.
1:01:56
SPEAKER_04: And sometimes they are restricted from helping you, depending on the union.
1:01:59
SPEAKER_02: Anne says supervisor signing off CA7, CA7A, not occupational health.
1:02:06
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it can be occupational health, HR, supervisor.
1:02:09
SPEAKER_04: It's got to be somebody on the management level.
1:02:11
SPEAKER_04: Let's put it that way.
1:02:12
SPEAKER_02: Jeremy, so possible surgery on my left within the next couple of months.
1:02:17
SPEAKER_02: Second opinion for the right knee schedule award, how will this affect either claim?
1:02:23
SPEAKER_04: Okay, hold on.
1:02:24
SPEAKER_04: Don't move that.
1:02:24
SPEAKER_04: So a second so I'm assuming your left knee, possible surgery on your left knee in the next couple of months.
1:02:30
SPEAKER_04: Second opinion for the right knee, schedule award, how will this affect either claim?
1:02:33
SPEAKER_04: So unless they're on the same claim, it sounds like they're two different ones.
1:02:38
SPEAKER_04: One will not be affected by the other.
1:02:40
SPEAKER_04: That's the most basic answer.
1:02:42
SPEAKER_04: The two claims will be treated like you're two different people, which is interesting, actually, to think of.
1:02:47
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:02:48
SPEAKER_02: Amanda said, I've been waiting since June 15th to get paid since my COP ended.
1:02:53
SPEAKER_02: Does it usually take this long?
1:02:55
SPEAKER_04: It does when your doctor can't write narrative reports.
1:02:58
SPEAKER_04: It's going to take a lot longer until you find somebody who can write a report to get your claim accepted.
1:03:02
SPEAKER_04: Until your claims accepted, you're not eligible for any OWCP benefits, including paid time off after a COP.
1:03:10
SPEAKER_04: Which we hate.
1:03:11
SPEAKER_04: And that's why we push so hard to get claims accepted, because it ruins people's lives to not get claims accepted.
1:03:18
SPEAKER_02: Dennis Bailey, I hurt my wrist in 2023, was on work comp off and on, worked the whole entire time.
1:03:26
SPEAKER_02: They removed three bones from my wrist.
1:03:29
SPEAKER_02: No longer have a joint.
1:03:30
SPEAKER_02: However, I was hired underneath the Disabilities Act.
1:03:34
SPEAKER_02: They offered me a job using my eyesight, which I cannot do considering I'm legally blind.
1:03:39
SPEAKER_02: Then I decided to retire this year, and as of March 31st, retirement took effect.
1:03:44
SPEAKER_02: However, Workers Comp terminated my case and said I cannot get a schedule award or anything.
1:03:50
SPEAKER_02: Is this true?
1:03:52
SPEAKER_04: I can't even imagine that would be true.
1:03:54
SPEAKER_04: If you have an accepted claim and your body part that needs a schedule award is on the schedule award chart, I can't think of a reason why that would be disallowed.
1:04:06
SPEAKER_04: I just can't even imagine.
1:04:07
SPEAKER_04: Accept a claim.
1:04:10
SPEAKER_04: That's like the key.
1:04:12
SPEAKER_04: Accept a claim, MMI, you have a body part that is rateable.
1:04:16
SPEAKER_04: I don't know why that would be the case.
1:04:18
SPEAKER_04: If you have a letter, I'd be happy to read it, but you'd have to send it to us by messenger.
1:04:22
SPEAKER_02: Jeremy said, possible surgery on the left knee, next couple months, schedule award for the right knee, and impairment rating, second opinion, is set for October.
1:04:30
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, they're going to treat those two knees as separate things as long as they're separate claims.
1:04:37
SPEAKER_04: If they're on the same claim, that's a different story.
1:04:39
SPEAKER_02: Ivy said, Hi, Chris.
1:04:41
SPEAKER_04: Hi, Ma.
1:04:42
SPEAKER_02: That's my mom.
1:04:43
unknown: Tommy.
1:04:44
SPEAKER_04: She is a great ma.
1:04:45
SPEAKER_04: Everybody should have a ma like me, but you don't, and you can't have mine.
1:04:48
SPEAKER_02: Tommy Lyman, from someone who was greatly helped from your Wednesday night chat show.
1:04:54
SPEAKER_02: I'm so glad you are still out there helping.
1:04:57
SPEAKER_04: Of course.
1:04:58
SPEAKER_04: So that's it.
1:04:58
SPEAKER_04: I appreciate that, Tommy.
1:05:00
SPEAKER_04: I was talking to Ginny about this.
1:05:01
SPEAKER_04: We were having a hypothetical conversation.
1:05:03
SPEAKER_04: Listen to me, folks.
1:05:04
SPEAKER_04: It's a hypothetical conversation.
1:05:06
SPEAKER_04: What I'm about to say next.
1:05:08
SPEAKER_02: Don't freak out.
1:05:09
SPEAKER_04: Just trust me, we're just having a hypothetical conversation.
1:05:13
SPEAKER_04: And the hypothetical conversation was: what would I do if I'm no longer doing this?
1:05:20
SPEAKER_04: If I no longer have Wednesday night chats, I know or I no longer am in federal injury centers, which is my company.
1:05:26
SPEAKER_04: I'm a founder.
1:05:27
SPEAKER_04: So me not being in it is interesting.
1:05:30
SPEAKER_04: That's mine, it's hypothetical.
1:05:32
SPEAKER_04: But what if I weren't doing these things anymore?
1:05:34
SPEAKER_04: What would I do with you?
1:05:37
SPEAKER_02: I got sad and I'm like, no, they need us.
1:05:39
SPEAKER_04: And the answer is it was so hurtful.
1:05:40
SPEAKER_04: The answer is I'm gonna keep doing this.
1:05:44
SPEAKER_04: I love doing this.
1:05:44
SPEAKER_04: I love helping you.
1:05:45
SPEAKER_04: I was we're in Detroit.
1:05:47
SPEAKER_04: Detroit?
1:05:48
SPEAKER_04: We were in Detroit, right?
1:05:50
SPEAKER_04: Several months ago.
1:05:51
SPEAKER_04: And I was teaching a group of mail handlers, stewards.
1:05:54
SPEAKER_04: In fact, I love training stewards.
1:05:56
SPEAKER_04: And while I was talking, see, look, I do this all the time.
1:05:59
SPEAKER_04: I can Go on autopilot, and you don't even know that I'm zoned out thinking like who's Notre Dame gonna play next week, and I'm still talking about whatever's on the slide behind me because I've just this is just part of me.
1:06:10
SPEAKER_04: That slide is like my arm, like it's just part of my body.
1:06:13
SPEAKER_04: So I was doing this training, and like an hour into the training, I started getting tears in my eyes, and like I have these people looking at me, and there's tears in my eyes.
1:06:23
SPEAKER_04: And in that training, I said to myself, What if I couldn't do this anymore?
1:06:27
SPEAKER_04: And it made me sad.
1:06:29
SPEAKER_00: It did.
1:06:29
SPEAKER_04: And the good news is nothing can stop me from doing this.
1:06:33
SPEAKER_04: I love it.
1:06:33
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, so I'm gonna keep doing it.
1:06:35
SPEAKER_02: Ivy said, Aw, love you.
1:06:38
SPEAKER_04: Anybody ever seen Wolf of Wall Street?
1:06:39
SPEAKER_04: Remember when he's in there and he's about to quit and he's got the microphone, he hits himself in the head, he says, I'm not leaving.
1:06:45
SPEAKER_04: And he says some other words.
1:06:47
SPEAKER_04: He showed me that too.
1:06:49
SPEAKER_04: That's gonna be me.
1:06:51
SPEAKER_02: Bobby Sloan best.
1:06:53
SPEAKER_02: Oh my name.
1:06:55
SPEAKER_02: I hurt my left knee back in 2022, had to have a total knee replacement.
1:06:59
SPEAKER_02: I've had three other surgeries since then.
1:07:02
SPEAKER_02: My right knee is really bothering me lately.
1:07:04
SPEAKER_02: I've had to have two steroid shots in it.
1:07:07
SPEAKER_02: The doctor said, since I've got arthritis so bad, and he can't say that it's overcompensating, it's causing my right knee all the problems.
1:07:17
SPEAKER_02: What do you suggest?
1:07:19
SPEAKER_04: So if I heard that right, and I know I did, the doctor said, I correct me if I'm wrong, please, Bobby, but did your doctor say I can't prove that this is due to overcompensating?
1:07:31
SPEAKER_04: I'm not a doctor, okay, so it's not my place to criticize medical decisions.
1:07:36
SPEAKER_04: I'm not saying anything like that.
1:07:39
SPEAKER_04: What I am saying is procedurally, if you have a condition in the left knee and as a result of that it causes a problem in the right knee, yeah, that's called a consequential injury.
1:07:50
SPEAKER_04: And those are accepted by OWCP with a well-rationalized medical opinion and a narrative report.
1:07:57
SPEAKER_04: We get those types of things approved all the time because it's a fact of life.
1:08:01
SPEAKER_02: Bobby said yes.
1:08:02
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, okay, so cool.
1:08:04
SPEAKER_04: So when your left knee has a problem, total knee replacement qualifies, and let's say you're limping around, and maybe your right knee starts to hurt, or your hip starts to hurt, or your back starts to hurt.
1:08:16
SPEAKER_04: And the only thing that changed is your left knee was hurt.
1:08:19
SPEAKER_04: The doctor can usually explain medically why that caused a problem to the right knee.
1:08:24
SPEAKER_04: That's called a consequential injury, and those get accepted all the time as long as the doctor can write a great report.
1:08:31
SPEAKER_04: But what you said is your doctor said, I can't prove it.
1:08:34
SPEAKER_04: I can't dispute your doctor, but I know that there are more than one doctor probably in your town.
1:08:39
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:08:42
SPEAKER_04: I hope that answered your question thoroughly.
1:08:44
SPEAKER_02: Do you guys want to hear what I have to say today?
1:08:45
SPEAKER_04: Well, my real answer would have been find a new doctor because you're at a red light.
1:08:49
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:08:49
SPEAKER_04: But I don't know.
1:08:50
SPEAKER_04: I'm sure maybe your doctor is fantastic and I'm wrong and he's right, and whatever.
1:08:54
SPEAKER_04: But that's how you would do it if you disagree with your doctor.
1:08:59
SPEAKER_04: So what's the surprise?
1:09:01
SPEAKER_02: All right.
1:09:01
SPEAKER_04: I just seriously, I have no idea.
1:09:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you do once I say it.
1:09:05
SPEAKER_04: Oh, I don't know if she's gonna say whatever she's about to say.
1:09:07
SPEAKER_02: So I was talking to our business partner yesterday, and then we talked again today, and then he said to bring this up.
1:09:15
SPEAKER_02: So, sometime October, we don't know where yet, we don't know when, but starting October this year, we normally end chats in November.
1:09:25
SPEAKER_02: We'll go halfway.
1:09:26
SPEAKER_02: Probably the week before Thanksgiving will stop then because we understand, especially USPS, they want their hours.
1:09:33
SPEAKER_02: You guys don't know you're working 12, 16 hours a day.
1:09:36
SPEAKER_04: Not to mention family time.
1:09:37
SPEAKER_04: Family, yeah.
1:09:37
SPEAKER_04: And football.
1:09:38
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, oh, football.
1:09:39
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, don't forget football.
1:09:40
SPEAKER_02: And so what Chris and I are doing, we are taking a nationwide tour.
1:09:46
SPEAKER_02: And we will give you addresses where we're gonna be.
1:09:49
SPEAKER_02: So we're still next weekend.
1:09:52
SPEAKER_02: My partner and I were gonna sit down and we're gonna talk about this.
1:09:55
SPEAKER_02: But what we're gonna be doing, he doesn't really care about Chris more than me.
1:09:59
SPEAKER_02: Joe?
1:10:00
SPEAKER_02: Nobody does.
1:10:01
SPEAKER_02: So this is how it's gonna work.
1:10:03
SPEAKER_02: We are gonna be going to certain places.
1:10:06
SPEAKER_02: Again, we'll give you the addresses, and then Chris, because you guys have been asking for this, because we don't get to train at all the conventions because it's just not an there's just one of us and all of the different state trainings.
1:10:19
SPEAKER_02: We are gonna start doing two-hour OWCP trainings in certain locations.
1:10:25
SPEAKER_02: Two hours of OWCP training.
1:10:29
SPEAKER_02: This is it's a shortened version of our three hour.
1:10:33
SPEAKER_02: We're doing two hours.
1:10:34
SPEAKER_04: Wait, two is shorter than three?
1:10:36
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think so.
1:10:37
SPEAKER_02: And we're gonna cram it all in.
1:10:38
SPEAKER_02: Chris has done the training in one hour sometimes, but we're gonna do also we're gonna do two.
1:10:45
SPEAKER_02: So we're gonna put our tour on chat soon.
1:10:48
SPEAKER_04: So Jeannie's excellent adventures.
1:10:50
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:10:50
SPEAKER_02: So by October, you'll start seeing our little tour come out.
1:10:55
SPEAKER_02: And it's super exciting because those of you have been upset, have complained, miss it, whatever it is.
1:11:02
SPEAKER_02: You don't get to go to state conventions or local conventions.
1:11:07
SPEAKER_02: So when we go, it'll be in an area that you're probably familiar with.
1:11:11
SPEAKER_02: Are we gonna hit all 50 states?
1:11:13
SPEAKER_02: No, but we're gonna do our very best.
1:11:16
SPEAKER_02: Again, it's just Chris and I.
1:11:17
SPEAKER_02: So surprise.
1:11:19
SPEAKER_02: We wanted to tell you guys that because you guys really wanted this.
1:11:22
SPEAKER_02: And we do our OWCP national training normally towards October, which we're still gonna do, but this is gonna be catered to all the people that are in the local areas that can come after work and get a two-hour training.
1:11:34
SPEAKER_04: So there you go.
1:11:36
SPEAKER_04: That's actually gonna be fun.
1:11:37
SPEAKER_04: I've wanted to do that for so long.
1:11:38
SPEAKER_04: And by the way, Dennis and Matt, I'm gonna address, I see your comments, okay?
1:11:43
SPEAKER_04: So hang in there with me.
1:11:45
SPEAKER_04: But I've been wanting to do this for so long.
1:11:47
SPEAKER_04: I've always said, for some of the unions that don't invite me, again, I'm not angry.
1:11:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:11:52
SPEAKER_04: Look, my dog's laying right there and she loves it when I'm home.
1:11:55
SPEAKER_04: So it's no problem.
1:11:56
SPEAKER_04: But I love doing what I do.
1:11:58
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I'm not mad when I'm not invited, okay?
1:12:01
SPEAKER_04: Don't get that wrong.
1:12:02
SPEAKER_04: I'm okay, but I love doing it.
1:12:04
SPEAKER_04: It makes me so happy.
1:12:05
SPEAKER_04: So I've always said, what if I could go places even when I'm not invited?
1:12:09
SPEAKER_04: All right, have my own venue, and anybody from any union, any craft can show up if they want and get the information I have to give.
1:12:16
SPEAKER_04: And it's fun.
1:12:17
SPEAKER_04: We have a good time.
1:12:18
SPEAKER_04: I don't put anybody to sleep talking about work comp.
1:12:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:12:20
SPEAKER_04: So I'm really looking forward to that.
1:12:22
SPEAKER_04: Will you read those, please?
1:12:24
SPEAKER_02: So, this is what's gonna kick it off, what you see here.
1:12:28
SPEAKER_02: America's OWCP couple.
1:12:30
SPEAKER_02: That'll be our America's OWCP couple tour guide.
1:12:33
SPEAKER_02: And we're gonna list it.
1:12:34
SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna make it just like you're going to a concert.
1:12:36
SPEAKER_02: So it's gonna be fun.
1:12:37
SPEAKER_02: We're looking forward to it.
1:12:39
SPEAKER_02: Again, we're probably gonna do one or two by October, and the rest will start again next year.
1:12:45
SPEAKER_04: We're taking our audio video people with us.
1:12:46
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it's gonna be a lot of fun.
1:12:48
SPEAKER_04: A lot of fun.
1:12:49
SPEAKER_02: Melissa Tyler, I was off work on work comp for one and a half years till till second opinion doctor said not job related.
1:12:57
SPEAKER_02: Benefits stopped abruptly.
1:12:58
SPEAKER_02: I would I was returned to work within two weeks, even though the doctor didn't release me and never received, returned the paperwork from OWCP to release from the doctor, but OWCP said return to work immediately.
1:13:14
SPEAKER_02: So I had to because all of the benefits insurance stopped.
1:13:18
SPEAKER_02: Now, after appeal and reconsideration, my case is reopened and good.
1:13:22
SPEAKER_02: DOL says I shouldn't have had benefits stopped and shouldn't have returned to work.
1:13:27
SPEAKER_02: Prior decision has been vacated.
1:13:29
SPEAKER_02: I'm still working in pain.
1:13:31
SPEAKER_02: I'm still working on pain management.
1:13:34
SPEAKER_02: What's next?
1:13:34
SPEAKER_02: Will they take me back off work or is the doctor who takes me back off?
1:13:39
SPEAKER_02: I have four claims with numerous expansions.
1:13:42
SPEAKER_04: You ask a can or can't question.
1:13:44
SPEAKER_04: Yes, they can do it, but as long as your doctor is thoroughly documenting things, they're not likely to do it.
1:13:49
SPEAKER_04: That's the key.
1:13:50
SPEAKER_04: The doctor has to thoroughly document everything that's happening.
1:13:53
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:13:54
SPEAKER_04: It's I always say denials are the fault of the doctor.
1:13:57
SPEAKER_04: And I mean that.
1:13:58
SPEAKER_04: And I tell my doctors that all the time.
1:14:00
SPEAKER_04: If there's a denied claim, you did that.
1:14:02
SPEAKER_04: Do a better job.
1:14:03
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:14:03
SPEAKER_04: Write a better narrative, fix it.
1:14:05
SPEAKER_04: But that applies to all things.
1:14:07
SPEAKER_04: If a doctor doesn't do a good job documenting, these are the bad things that can happen.
1:14:12
SPEAKER_02: Bobby said, My doctor originally retired who did all my surgeries, and it was the new doctor that said that.
1:14:18
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, that new doctor instantly frustrates me.
1:14:22
SPEAKER_02: Dennis said, Is it true that the sites you guys have up are not doing schedule awards any longer?
1:14:28
SPEAKER_02: The one in Cleveland told me they will not be doing schedule awards.
1:14:32
SPEAKER_02: If I want to come up and be treated, that would be fine.
1:14:35
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, so that doesn't surprise me.
1:14:38
SPEAKER_04: My doctors are not required to do schedule awards because I'm not I'm not allowed as a non-licensed person, I don't, I'm not a doctor, to tell doctors what they can and can't do in treatment.
1:14:49
SPEAKER_04: All I'm allowed to do with my company is set rules.
1:14:51
SPEAKER_04: Like you can't charge people money out of their pocket, like stuff like that.
1:14:56
SPEAKER_04: So that's the value of the franchise, is that I'm able to set rules that other doctors don't have to follow, but mine do.
1:15:01
SPEAKER_04: But I can't tell them how to treat in a schedule award impairment rating, that's part of treatment.
1:15:06
SPEAKER_04: And it's also extremely complicated, and not everybody can do it.
1:15:10
SPEAKER_04: And it has to be medical providers doing it, and they don't like getting trained, and so it's really tricky.
1:15:16
SPEAKER_04: So I've never said that we are schedule award doctors.
1:15:19
SPEAKER_04: I've never said this is the place to go for schedule awards.
1:15:21
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it is the place to go to get a claim accepted, it's the place to go to get treated, and it's the place to go to get back to work.
1:15:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:15:27
SPEAKER_04: I want to have schedule award doctors in every place I'm at, but it's complicated.
1:15:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:15:33
SPEAKER_02: Matt, how are you?
1:15:34
SPEAKER_04: Sorry, I actually hated that answer.
1:15:36
SPEAKER_04: Just so you know.
1:15:38
SPEAKER_02: Matt says, Can you address the transitioning of doctors in and out of your practice?
1:15:43
SPEAKER_02: I have an accepted injury claim, but denied compensation due to hiring and firing of doctors.
1:15:49
SPEAKER_02: All I can seem to get is a telemed appointment.
1:15:52
SPEAKER_02: I spoken to the other owners in your FIC Richmond location.
1:15:56
SPEAKER_02: Can you get a doctor to stay there permanently?
1:15:58
SPEAKER_04: This is so I wanted that question read out loud.
1:16:01
SPEAKER_04: And some people would say, Why would you want that?
1:16:03
SPEAKER_04: Aren't you embarrassed?
1:16:04
SPEAKER_04: No.
1:16:04
SPEAKER_04: Listen, all of my franchisees, all those locations we have, like 65 of them right now, they're all individually owned and operated by the doctors who contracted with my company to be in federal injury centers.
1:16:15
SPEAKER_04: I don't run those practices.
1:16:17
SPEAKER_04: I only set rules for how they operate inside of what you need in OWCP.
1:16:23
SPEAKER_04: So with that said, they're all businesses.
1:16:25
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:16:26
SPEAKER_04: A lot of people don't see it that way.
1:16:28
SPEAKER_04: Doctors' offices are a business.
1:16:30
SPEAKER_04: That's what they do for a living.
1:16:32
SPEAKER_04: And in business, there's turnover.
1:16:35
SPEAKER_04: It happens.
1:16:36
SPEAKER_04: Do I like it?
1:16:37
SPEAKER_04: No, I hate it.
1:16:38
SPEAKER_04: And I'm not going to discuss it here because it has nothing to do with OWCP, but I believe there are three reasons that people leave a company.
1:16:46
SPEAKER_04: And it's not related to healthcare, it's all business.
1:16:49
SPEAKER_04: There's three things that are like the main three reasons anybody leaves.
1:16:53
SPEAKER_04: We try to do those three things very well, but people still leave.
1:16:58
SPEAKER_04: And it's frustrating.
1:16:59
SPEAKER_04: And I hate it.
1:17:00
SPEAKER_04: But our job or their job as a business is to continue to hire.
1:17:05
SPEAKER_04: That's what HR is for.
1:17:06
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
1:17:06
SPEAKER_04: And so we just try to keep people staffed up as much as possible.
1:17:09
SPEAKER_04: And when the new person comes on, they get trained just like the last person.
1:17:13
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:17:14
SPEAKER_04: And it's frustrating.
1:17:15
SPEAKER_04: I'm really sorry about that, but I can't control people quitting.
1:17:18
SPEAKER_04: Nobody can.
1:17:19
SPEAKER_04: You can quit your job tomorrow if you want to.
1:17:21
SPEAKER_04: These doctors can too.
1:17:22
SPEAKER_02: Talisha said, Awesome.
1:17:24
SPEAKER_02: Can we watch it live if we can't make the location?
1:17:27
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so if we have to go live, we normally don't go live in any of our trainings.
1:17:32
SPEAKER_02: One reason is we just don't.
1:17:34
SPEAKER_02: Number two, we would have to drag all of our stuff and we just take a suitcase.
1:17:39
SPEAKER_02: So we will give you way in advance notice where we're going to be.
1:17:44
SPEAKER_02: And if you do miss it, and those of you that cannot come to the locations that we give you, we do a national OWCP training for three hours.
1:17:53
SPEAKER_02: It's normally on a Saturday or Sunday.
1:17:55
SPEAKER_02: We always ask you guys which one you guys want Saturday once a year.
1:17:59
SPEAKER_02: So if you can't be at any of the live trainings that we're going to start doing, you'll be able to catch it here sometime October, November.
1:18:08
SPEAKER_02: But we do not leave that chat up.
1:18:11
SPEAKER_02: We train and then we just take it down.
1:18:13
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:18:14
SPEAKER_04: Don't ask why.
1:18:14
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:18:15
SPEAKER_04: You won't like the answer.
1:18:16
SPEAKER_02: Melissa said I switched doctors and got them all opened and accepted again.
1:18:21
SPEAKER_02: I if I need to leave work early for an appointment, do I lose my whole day of pay?
1:18:26
SPEAKER_02: Postmaster says Stub gets paid.
1:18:29
SPEAKER_04: If you're a rule carrier, an hour away is the same thing as an entire day.
1:18:33
SPEAKER_04: But if you're anybody else, you're allowed up to four hours of your work shift to go to the doctor and get paid for LWAP.
1:18:39
SPEAKER_02: All right.
1:18:40
SPEAKER_02: Last question.
1:18:41
SPEAKER_02: I didn't even realize what time it was.
1:18:43
SPEAKER_02: Rachel, can a regular OWCP doctor use notes from your regular neurologist for your injury, stroke issue due to hyperthermia in a mail truck, or do I need an OWCP neurologist?
1:18:56
SPEAKER_04: There is, thankfully, for you, no such thing as an OWCP neurologist, so that's not going to be an issue.
1:19:03
SPEAKER_04: Your treating physician can definitely use the notes from the neurologist you saw.
1:19:08
SPEAKER_04: In fact, we frequently, by we, I mean our doctors, will frequently say, doctor who is a specialist in neurology, said the following, and then we'll quote that in our narrative reports.
1:19:20
SPEAKER_04: That's actually a really great way to do it.
1:19:23
SPEAKER_04: It's okay to combine reports from two different doctors into one.
1:19:26
SPEAKER_04: It's actually really strong to do that.
1:19:28
SPEAKER_04: That was smart.
1:19:29
SPEAKER_04: I would do that.
1:19:30
SPEAKER_04: This is her other and I'm sorry you had that problem.
1:19:32
SPEAKER_02: Her other part of the question.
1:19:33
SPEAKER_02: If you have workers' comp and you're a regular RCA, you get allotted two to four hours OWCP pay for your appointment, and the sub finishes it.
1:19:41
SPEAKER_02: Melissa got approval through Postmaster HR first.
1:19:48
SPEAKER_04: There wasn't a question there.
1:19:50
SPEAKER_02: No.
1:19:50
SPEAKER_02: Victor said one more thing, and he always ends this every night.
1:19:54
SPEAKER_02: I think it's so cute because this is how he ends the show.
1:19:56
SPEAKER_02: But he's right.
1:19:56
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:19:57
SPEAKER_04: And he means it.
1:19:58
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:19:58
SPEAKER_02: Victor says, one more thing, never give up and always fight for your rights.
1:20:03
SPEAKER_04: That's right.
1:20:04
SPEAKER_04: Exactly.
1:20:05
SPEAKER_04: I say this all the time.
1:20:06
SPEAKER_04: The only way, look, when it comes to OWCP, I have never been accused of not being cocky.
1:20:13
SPEAKER_04: Ever.
1:20:14
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
1:20:15
SPEAKER_04: If you ask me who the best in the world is at OWCP, what will I say?
1:20:20
unknown: Him.
1:20:20
SPEAKER_02: He'll say me.
1:20:21
SPEAKER_02: I didn't want to say me because I think it's not.
1:20:23
SPEAKER_04: If it's not me, I want to meet that person because it's me.
1:20:26
SPEAKER_04: And I say this all the time.
1:20:28
SPEAKER_04: As long as you don't give up, I won't either.
1:20:30
SPEAKER_04: I will fight to the death to get your claim accepted as long as it's legit and as long as you don't give up.
1:20:35
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:20:36
SPEAKER_04: So never give up.
1:20:37
SPEAKER_04: Never.
1:20:38
SPEAKER_02: The last thing, if you guys are a part of AFGE, you see this book right here?
1:20:42
SPEAKER_04: You got our copy.
1:20:43
SPEAKER_02: Mr.
1:20:43
SPEAKER_02: Kelly is the national president for AFGE.
1:20:47
SPEAKER_02: He's outside of him being a national president, he's a personal friend of ours.
1:20:51
SPEAKER_02: And he wrote this book called Unbought, Unbowed, Unstoppable.
1:20:55
SPEAKER_04: And it's important that you know he didn't ask us to do this.
1:20:57
SPEAKER_04: He doesn't know we're doing it.
1:20:58
SPEAKER_04: He's just a good friend, and it's a great book.
1:21:00
SPEAKER_04: And I've already read through it and I'm like, wow, this needed to be written a long time ago.
1:21:04
SPEAKER_02: And you can get it.
1:21:05
SPEAKER_02: Where do you buy it?
1:21:05
SPEAKER_02: I got it on Amazon.
1:21:06
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so you can get this on Amazon.
1:21:07
SPEAKER_02: This is what it looks like.
1:21:09
SPEAKER_02: That's national president for AFGE.
1:21:12
SPEAKER_04: Nobody fights for federal employees stronger than he does and his unions.
1:21:16
SPEAKER_04: And that's no offense to the rest of the unions.
1:21:17
SPEAKER_02: I'm just saying he's very strong.
1:21:19
SPEAKER_04: This guy's in the mix.
1:21:20
SPEAKER_04: He's right in the middle of it all the time.
1:21:22
SPEAKER_02: So go grab his book because it says A Story of AFGE and the fight for federal workers.
1:21:26
SPEAKER_02: And he means that title right there, it he means it.
1:21:29
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, Mr.
1:21:29
SPEAKER_04: Kelly was a local president.
1:21:31
SPEAKER_04: He was a MVP, right?
1:21:34
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, that's when I met him.
1:21:35
SPEAKER_04: And then he became the national president.
1:21:37
SPEAKER_04: It's just an incredible story that he's got.
1:21:40
SPEAKER_04: And it's just it's awesome.
1:21:41
SPEAKER_04: But I'm really happy to have the book.
1:21:43
SPEAKER_04: It's worth buying.
1:21:44
SPEAKER_04: And again, he has no idea I was going to say he's he's actually in DC, probably.
1:21:48
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he is in DC.
1:21:49
SPEAKER_04: And for that one of you out here who just may be a jerk, we don't get kickbacks.
1:21:54
SPEAKER_04: I'm not gonna get a penny from that book.
1:21:57
SPEAKER_04: I just think it's great, and he's great.
1:21:59
SPEAKER_02: He's just literally a personal great friend of ours, and we love him.
1:22:03
SPEAKER_02: So that concludes tonight.
1:22:05
SPEAKER_04: We went an hour and 25 minutes.
1:22:06
SPEAKER_02: That's so funny.
1:22:07
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, this is great.
1:22:08
SPEAKER_02: This topic, you guys, so many of you have asked.
1:22:11
SPEAKER_02: Share it with your friends.
1:22:13
SPEAKER_02: It'll be on here for about 30 days.
1:22:15
SPEAKER_02: And then it when you don't see our chats anymore, Meta pushes it out.
1:22:19
SPEAKER_02: And we have our social media people that handle our social media, it goes to YouTube.
1:22:24
SPEAKER_02: So all of our videos, yeah, all of our videos from the last 10 years is on YouTube at Wednesday night OWCP chats with Chris and Jeannie.
1:22:33
SPEAKER_04: Okay, I can't.
1:22:34
SPEAKER_04: I have to answer this question.
1:22:35
SPEAKER_04: Okay, I'm not leaving with an open question.
1:22:37
SPEAKER_04: Read that out loud.
1:22:38
SPEAKER_02: She said, How does it, Susan?
1:22:41
SPEAKER_02: How does it work?
1:22:43
SPEAKER_02: How does it work?
1:22:44
SPEAKER_02: I'm in the beginning stage of finding out I had a heart attack.
1:22:48
SPEAKER_02: May have been just after my injury.
1:22:51
SPEAKER_02: How does that affect my claim?
1:22:52
SPEAKER_02: Is there an OWCP cardiologist?
1:22:54
SPEAKER_04: No, there's not.
1:22:55
SPEAKER_04: There's I've never even heard of that, but there I've heard of cardiologists, but not OWCP.
1:23:01
SPEAKER_04: So you just have to find a cardiologist that can link it to the job.
1:23:04
SPEAKER_04: And that won't be easy.
1:23:05
SPEAKER_04: I'm gonna tell you right now.
1:23:07
SPEAKER_04: I have gotten the impossible claims accepted.
1:23:10
SPEAKER_04: And I would definitely fight for yours.
1:23:12
SPEAKER_04: I'm gonna tell you yours is one of the more difficult ones that I could even imagine getting approved.
1:23:17
SPEAKER_04: But that's what you have to do.
1:23:18
SPEAKER_04: Go to a cardiologist who can connect the dots.
1:23:20
SPEAKER_02: When you're seeing, and I'm only speaking for our clinics, when you go to our offices and there's an another thing wrong with you, like like this, they will refer you out to a cardiologist that they have been networking with and told them about OWCP.
1:23:33
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
1:23:33
SPEAKER_02: So that's just with our offices.
1:23:35
SPEAKER_04: Hey, it was so good having all the interaction tonight.
1:23:37
SPEAKER_04: Thank you so much.
1:23:38
SPEAKER_04: I hope this topic was useful to you.
1:23:40
SPEAKER_04: Again, I don't normally make notes.
1:23:41
SPEAKER_04: I don't, I'm not actually comfortable reading from notes.
1:23:44
SPEAKER_01: He's not.
1:23:44
SPEAKER_04: I'm not.
1:23:44
SPEAKER_04: When I have when I'm training live and I have my I point back, I have my slide presentation.
1:23:49
SPEAKER_04: I never read my slides, I think that's boring.
1:23:51
SPEAKER_04: But tonight, this is just really important.
1:23:53
SPEAKER_04: I wanted to not miss anything.
1:23:54
SPEAKER_04: So I hope that was useful to you.
1:23:56
SPEAKER_04: For those of you that have topics you want me to discuss, please let us know.
1:24:00
SPEAKER_04: I'd love to do it.
1:24:01
SPEAKER_04: I am gonna be looking at that one topic.
1:24:04
SPEAKER_04: I'll go back and remind myself of what it was.
1:24:07
SPEAKER_04: But I know I have to do that.
1:24:08
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:24:09
SPEAKER_02: Oh, vocational rehab.
1:24:10
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, so I'm gonna know everything about that and I'm gonna bring it back to you.
1:24:14
SPEAKER_04: And if I find that it's not enough to do this, then I'm gonna create a document and post it on Wednesday Night Chat's Facebook page, and you can just go get it and it'll be all yours.
1:24:23
SPEAKER_04: I'll make sure that I answer that question, though.
1:24:25
SPEAKER_02: All right, everybody.
1:24:26
SPEAKER_02: We are let me just make sure that we are actually here next week.
1:24:31
SPEAKER_02: Yes, August 12th.
1:24:33
SPEAKER_02: We will be back on chats next week.
1:24:34
SPEAKER_04: We'll be sitting in this chair, right here.
1:24:36
SPEAKER_02: All right, not over to the same time, same place.
1:24:38
SPEAKER_02: Everybody have a good night.
1:24:40
SPEAKER_02: It was great seeing you guys.