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History's Weirdest National Anthems · Ridiculous History

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Speaker 1: Ridiculous Histories, a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to the show,
0:27
Speaker 1: fellow Ridiculous Historians. Oh say, can you see in your
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Speaker 1: podcast feed our one and only super producer, mister Max Williams.
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Speaker 2: Oh say, can you see in your podcast feed? Are
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Speaker 2: we there?
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Speaker 3: We are?
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Speaker 1: That's mister Noel Brown. They call me Ben Bullen. In
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Speaker 1: this neck of the woods, that would be the United States.
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Speaker 1: We have been fascinated for a long time about how
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Speaker 1: countries always pick space things to coside, right, Like, countries
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Speaker 1: have an official animal and official flag, and they also
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Speaker 1: have official songs.
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Speaker 2: They do called national anthems. And that's that's they're talking
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Speaker 2: about today. The the the world's most ridiculous national anthems.
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Speaker 2: I love the word anthem, though again it's one of
1:25
Speaker 2: those chicken or the egg things. Something being anthemic, you know,
1:30
Speaker 2: means it's kind of epic, and I guess an anthem,
1:33
Speaker 2: a national anthem, is meant to be epic. And it
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Speaker 2: also goes back to you know, they call certain big
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Speaker 2: church pieces anthems, you know, as part of a church service.
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Speaker 1: And one of my favorite, one of my favorite British
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Speaker 1: insults that I've ever heard, just off the cuff, because
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Speaker 1: we know the British cousins are way better than Americans
2:00
Speaker 1: at insults. I was walking around our old office in
2:06
Speaker 1: Pont City Market here in the fair metropolis of Atlanta, Georgia,
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Speaker 1: and someone was telling a kind of I'll say the
2:16
Speaker 1: guy was being kind of a dick about how there
2:18
Speaker 1: was a line for one of the restaurants, and a
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Speaker 1: person working at the restaurant started telling them, you know, okay,
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Speaker 1: the weight's going to be about twenty five thirty minutes
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Speaker 1: something like that, and this British guy that I've never
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Speaker 1: seen before or since, he said, oh, spare me your anthem.
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Speaker 2: I don't know that one, Ben, that's good. I'm sure
2:41
Speaker 2: he brought it off. Yeah, yeah, maybe he might have
2:44
Speaker 2: coined it that very minute, but yeah, I guess an
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Speaker 2: anthem is also kind of in that context, sort of
2:49
Speaker 2: a something that's a little bit like a saga, you know,
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Speaker 2: like a wordy perhaps.
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Speaker 1: Propaganda the oh good point. The Reeks have a national
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Speaker 1: anthem that is so long they don't speak or they
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Speaker 1: don't sing most of it. It's got like one hundred
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Speaker 1: and fifty eight verses.
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Speaker 2: That's another thing about those church anthems that you know,
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Speaker 2: you have the hymnal, I guess they've got the hymn,
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Speaker 2: but then there's the anthem, which is like the big
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Speaker 2: kind of show piece, the centerpiece of the servant.
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Speaker 1: So many verses, so many verses, so many churches, so
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Speaker 1: many verses. Let me stop freestyling and acknowledge our research
3:27
Speaker 1: associate for this episode, Max the Madman Williams or Max
3:33
Speaker 1: Foster Key Williams, and we get to go into it,
3:38
Speaker 1: you know, with clear eyes and open minds. If you
3:42
Speaker 1: are listening to this podcast and you're not from the US,
3:46
Speaker 1: first off, thank you. Secondly, we know our national anthem
3:52
Speaker 1: is not the best.
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Speaker 4: Song and did jump in real quick, just as the
3:56
Speaker 4: research associated on this. I want to come out and
3:58
Speaker 4: say this that even though these are ridiculous, because especially
4:01
Speaker 4: the backstories and some of these, yeah, none of these
4:03
Speaker 4: anthems are bad. Actually, these anthems are pretty awesome in
4:06
Speaker 4: my opinion, especially the third one. The second one is
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Speaker 4: kind of weird.
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Speaker 1: They're still all better to sing than the US anthem.
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Speaker 1: And I don't want to sound unpatriotic, but I'm just
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Speaker 1: thinking of like, no, you're my music guy, so what
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Speaker 1: do you think about the national anthem? I find it
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Speaker 1: off putting. I mean, I'm curious about that. Ben, I
4:32
Speaker 1: don't mind it. I think we maybe get a little
4:34
Speaker 1: overexposed to it. Maybe it's sort of like a hotel
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Speaker 1: California or something. You know, maybe I never need to
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Speaker 1: hear it again, but it's sort of foisted upon us,
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Speaker 1: especially if you find yourself attending a sports game. One
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Speaker 1: thing I do love about the national anthem is really bad,
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Speaker 1: historically bad Rose Ambar. There was one recently that was
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Speaker 1: like Fergie I think historically did a really bad one.
5:01
Speaker 1: And then there was some singer recently that did one
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Speaker 1: that was so bad. I think she was really drunk
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Speaker 1: or something, but now I can't remember the details about.
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Speaker 2: You cheat, Yeah house drunk National Anthem rehab. Country singer
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Speaker 2: Ingrid and Dress checked into a rehab facility after a
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Speaker 2: widely criticized intoxicated performance of the national anthem at the
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Speaker 2: Major League Baseball home run Derby. She admitted to being
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Speaker 2: a little tipsy and aangized to fans.
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Speaker 1: Okay, well, I haven't heard of her, but wish her
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Speaker 1: well on her journey.
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Speaker 2: We all do.
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Speaker 1: But also we we have to confess to your point
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Speaker 1: about overexposure.
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Speaker 2: There Noel.
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Speaker 1: The national anthem of the United States is almost always
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Speaker 1: hung at the beginning of a sports game, right, U
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Speaker 1: and everybody, if you're respectful, you stand up. You might
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Speaker 1: take your hat off, you might put your one of
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Speaker 1: your hands over your heart, and then you have to
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Speaker 1: just stand there while you hear the rockets, red glare,
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Speaker 1: or whatever the current current public consumption version of it is.
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Speaker 2: It is called the star spangled banner, if I'm not mistaken.
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Speaker 2: I had to search for I had to dig deep
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Speaker 2: for that one, because people usually just call it the
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Speaker 2: national anthem, which is funny. I do love the idea
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Speaker 2: of something being spangled. Nobody uses that word enough.
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Speaker 1: I know, why didn't that British guy who was mad
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Speaker 1: about waiting in line, why didn't he say spare me
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Speaker 1: or spangled anthem?
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Speaker 2: Here you go?
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Speaker 1: That would have been cooler. But what we found here
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Speaker 1: thanks to Max, is that national anthems are very much
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Speaker 1: a thing. Some of them are written by terrible people.
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Speaker 1: They're often going to be a product of their ridiculous time.
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Speaker 1: Some are written by lawyers, some are written by musicians.
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Speaker 1: To be fair, and a lot of times people are
7:02
Speaker 1: cribbing notes and songs from one another and putting their
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Speaker 1: own spin on it for sure.
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Speaker 2: Well, why don't we just jump right in to this
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Speaker 2: is sort of alistical episode. Max is fond of those,
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Speaker 2: and we're fond of them as well. So we're going
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Speaker 2: to start off. First entry in today's episode of ridiculous
7:20
Speaker 2: national anthems that are also good is the Czech Republic
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Speaker 2: and Slovakia. Who go in have these on a national anthem.
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Speaker 2: You will probably still hear people refer to this part
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Speaker 2: of the world as Checklesslovakia. That's because before Slovakia the
7:37
Speaker 2: Czech Republic split were they were the same country. It's
7:43
Speaker 2: pretty recent split, actually, about thirty three years ago. And
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Speaker 2: it's funny though, because if I'm not mistaken, then oftentimes
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Speaker 2: a shorthand for people from this region is just Slavs
7:57
Speaker 2: or checks dang it, don't know which. Which are the
8:00
Speaker 2: ones that squad in tracksuits? All of them men, all
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Speaker 2: of them do. Do check out squatting Slavs in tracksuits.
8:07
Speaker 2: If you want a fun Instagram.
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Speaker 1: Follow absolutely because they'll get there. If we go to
8:13
Speaker 1: our friends at Britannica, we'll see that Czecholeislovakia was a
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Speaker 1: former country in Central Europe and it took in the
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Speaker 1: land of other previous countries or regions Bohemia, Moravia, Slovakia.
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Speaker 1: I'm falling into Dracula voice flat Tepe.
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Speaker 2: You got the hands and the voice, you know.
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Speaker 1: So the Empire of Austria Hungary collapses in nineteen eighteen
8:40
Speaker 1: at the close of World War One, Czechleislovakia gets formed.
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Speaker 1: Out of all of this, the political union of the
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Speaker 1: Czechs and the Slovaks after World War One. It worked
8:54
Speaker 1: out kind of at least in the bigger picture, because
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Speaker 1: these are two different ethnic groups, but they have a
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Speaker 1: lot of similarities in religion, culture and language. And for
9:06
Speaker 1: a while, between World War One and World War Two,
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Speaker 1: this was, no kidding, the most politically stable state in
9:15
Speaker 1: Eastern Europe. Again, the bar is very low.
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Speaker 2: Well yeah, I mean they often hear this part of
9:19
Speaker 2: the world referred to as a powder keg, and I
9:22
Speaker 2: think it's not too hot of a take to say
9:23
Speaker 2: the history of this part of the world is a
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Speaker 2: little fraud, a little complex. Hence, things like Austro Hungary
9:30
Speaker 2: and and you know Czechoslovakia, which now is of course
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Speaker 2: the Czech Republican Slovakia strange bedfellows. And I think it's
9:38
Speaker 2: because of the border. They're all so close, they're all
9:40
Speaker 2: packed in together, and yet they all have distinctly unique
9:44
Speaker 2: national identities and cultures. And sometimes, what do they say,
9:49
Speaker 2: been good fences make good neighbors, and maybe the fences
9:52
Speaker 2: aren't high enough. But these borders are so close, you know,
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Speaker 2: it's like living in one of those like a condo situation,
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Speaker 2: where everything is packed right next to each other, and
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Speaker 2: it can sometimes cause beef.
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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, And I love the point you're making about
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Speaker 1: the combination of these various unique ethnic groups into a
10:12
Speaker 1: larger nation. One thing that's always fascinated me and probably
10:17
Speaker 1: all of us is the existence of countries that are
10:21
Speaker 1: named two countries like Ostia and Herzegovina.
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Speaker 2: That's right, that's another one. So is Slovakia the same
10:28
Speaker 2: as there's also Yugoslavia. Yes, there was also Yugoslavia, but
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Speaker 2: it's in the region.
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Speaker 3: It's in the region. It's not a thing anymore.
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Speaker 2: Nineties that fell apart.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, So if we look at the nineteen thirties,
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Speaker 1: as you said, the powder keg begins to you know,
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Speaker 1: begins to get a little sparky. There's this guy that
10:53
Speaker 1: hot take I think is kind of a drip, kind
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Speaker 1: of a pill and a fink. His name is Adolf Hitler.
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Speaker 1: He is rising to power in Germany in nineteen thirty
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Speaker 1: three and the people of western Czechoslovakia start to buy
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Speaker 1: into his pitch of national socialism.
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Speaker 2: M YEP national socialism aka the Nazis, and with the
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Speaker 2: acquiescence of Britain and France, Hitler did a bit of
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Speaker 2: a power move, a lot of a power move, and
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Speaker 2: annexed the German speaking part of Zudutan which means southern
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Speaker 2: areas of Czechoslovakia in nineteen thirty eight. By thirty nine,
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Speaker 2: Germany had occupied Bohemia and Moravia further and turned the
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Speaker 2: two regions into a protectorate of Germany right, which means
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Speaker 2: in this context these people were under the leadership of
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Speaker 2: Nazi Germany, but they did not have the same rights
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Speaker 2: as German people. Slovakia, it gets autotomy on paper, but
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Speaker 2: still Germany and German corporations are running the game. In
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Speaker 2: nineteen forty five, and we'll get to the anthem here,
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Speaker 2: Czechlislovakia is quote unquote liberated by the Soviet Union, but
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Speaker 2: they're not really liberated.
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Speaker 1: They just have new masters. Because the Soviet Union takes
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Speaker 1: this land into the USSR and they rule there in
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Speaker 1: all but name from nineteen forty eight to nineteen eighty nine.
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Speaker 1: We're talking puppet government's vassal state stuff for sure.
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Speaker 2: By the Soviets. You know, iron fisted grasp did eventually weaken,
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Speaker 2: and when that dominance broke, the Czechs and the Slovaks
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Speaker 2: began to kind of realize that they didn't particularly care
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Speaker 2: for one another.
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Speaker 1: They might not be the best roommates, or they might
12:56
Speaker 1: need to Fleetwood max style go their own way. So
13:01
Speaker 1: just Hollywood Mac did, just like Fleetwood back did. Yeah,
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Speaker 1: And so when the Communist rule ends due to the
13:10
Speaker 1: Velvet Revolution, that sounds nice. It does sound nice. It
13:13
Speaker 1: sounds like an album from the seventies.
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Speaker 2: Well, there's that band, Velvet Revolver that that's like the
13:18
Speaker 2: supergroup from the Guns and Roses and what was it?
13:23
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, Tommy Lee was in and I want to say,
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Speaker 2: and I think the singer was the dude from Stone
13:27
Speaker 2: Temple Pilots.
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Speaker 3: I'm thinking of Velvet Underground.
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Speaker 2: Vell Underground much much superior group to Velvet Revolver. But
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Speaker 2: we're talking about the Velvet Revolution, which sorry, it just
13:37
Speaker 2: sounds really soft. They had some serious disagreements and that escalate.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, the Slovak part of the population is saying, you
13:50
Speaker 1: guys got to stop privatizing everything, you dirty checks. And
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Speaker 1: they have these parliamentary elections in June of nineteen ninety
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Speaker 1: two that really put a spotlight on these stark political differences. Eventually,
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Speaker 1: because of these disagreements, the leaders of the Czech and
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Speaker 1: Slovak factions decide to peacefully dissolve the idea of Czechoslovakia.
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Speaker 1: And so as part of this we see something called
14:24
Speaker 1: the Velvet Divorce and two.
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Speaker 2: New Yeah sounds nice, dude the follow up.
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Speaker 1: Album, and two new countries are created, the Czech Republic
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Speaker 1: or Czechia and Slovakia. This occurs on New Year's Day
14:38
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety three. This is where our national anthem comes in.
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Speaker 2: That's right, because even the you know, most amicable of
14:48
Speaker 2: divorces still involve breaking up your stuff, and sometimes that
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Speaker 2: can include a song. So when Czechoslovakia split in nine
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Speaker 2: Zine eighty three, Eben Discan writes for Matador Network the
15:02
Speaker 2: following more than just land was divided between the two countries.
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Speaker 2: Czechoslovakia's anthem where my Home Is was originally written in
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Speaker 2: nineteen eighteen. By combining verses from a Czech opera and
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Speaker 2: a Slovak folk song, makes sense, gives a little taste
15:17
Speaker 2: of both the national identities in that national anthem. When
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Speaker 2: the country split in two, so did the anthem hull.
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Speaker 2: The Czech Republic adopted the first verse as its new anthem,
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Speaker 2: also called where My Home Is, and Slovakia adopted the
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Speaker 2: second verse as its new anthem, now called Lightning over
15:34
Speaker 2: the Tatras, which is clearly a more badass name than
15:38
Speaker 2: where My Home Is. And then they add an additional
15:40
Speaker 2: verse because you know, they only had one verse, so
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Speaker 2: they had extended a little bit.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, there we go, so amicable breakup and everybody wants
15:51
Speaker 1: to keep at least a piece of the song. And
15:54
Speaker 1: so that's why those that's why that anthem is going
15:59
Speaker 1: to be so similar here. Don't worry, folks, it gets
16:09
Speaker 1: weirder if we go over to Chuka. Juannazia, writing for
16:14
Speaker 1: Dutch Review, will see the story of the vill Helmos,
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Speaker 1: which is regarded by the Guinness Book of World Records
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Speaker 1: as the oldest national anthem in the world.
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Speaker 2: That's right, and the Dutch Review piece goes on to
16:28
Speaker 2: say that the Wilhelmas only became the official anthem of
16:31
Speaker 2: the Netherlands in nineteen thirty two. However, as the writer
16:35
Speaker 2: points out, things are a little bit off kilter with
16:38
Speaker 2: this anthem. While reciting the anthem, you start to ask
16:42
Speaker 2: yourself a few questions. What inspired someone to write this hymn?
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Speaker 2: There we go with him again, who wrote it? And
16:48
Speaker 2: what is the hidden meaning behind the lyrics. I just
16:52
Speaker 2: want to take a pause real quick because that word
16:54
Speaker 2: him came up. There is a certain in a reverence
16:58
Speaker 2: that needs to be conveyed a national anthem. It really
17:01
Speaker 2: is kind of like you mean, even like what the
17:03
Speaker 2: battle Hymn of the Republic is another big you could
17:06
Speaker 2: say that's an anthem. It's not a national anthem, but
17:08
Speaker 2: that's sort of the idea. It does have this sort
17:10
Speaker 2: of biblical epic quality to it.
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Speaker 1: So we we see something really interesting here. As Juanasea explains,
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Speaker 1: the vill Helmas or Willhelmos I'm going to go with
17:24
Speaker 1: vill Helmas was written about a guy named Villain von
17:29
Speaker 1: Orange or.
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Speaker 2: O r A in j E.
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Speaker 1: We are not native speakers. This guy led a fight
17:38
Speaker 1: against the Spanish for independence during the eighty years war.
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Speaker 2: That's right, and some scholars believe that the author of
17:48
Speaker 2: this piece of music may actually be a history mystery.
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Speaker 2: On the other hand, this is again from a Nuan
17:57
Speaker 2: Nausea's piece. Some Dutch citizens, you know, and students of
18:03
Speaker 2: history of their country, have always believed that the hymn
18:06
Speaker 2: was written by Philip of Marnix of st Aldigonda. Of course,
18:12
Speaker 2: he's got a couple of things, who is a very
18:14
Speaker 2: important advisor to the aforementioned villem van Orange.
18:20
Speaker 1: And a lot of people will still propose different authors here,
18:26
Speaker 1: names of poets that were contemporarius to the rebellion, and
18:31
Speaker 1: of course names of advisors. The issue is for people
18:37
Speaker 1: like Dick Kornhert and I see you there, Max or
18:40
Speaker 1: Phillips of Martix. Neither of these guys claimed to have
18:45
Speaker 1: written this anthem, even though it was very popular during
18:49
Speaker 1: their days.
18:50
Speaker 2: So you'd think if if they, if credit was to
18:52
Speaker 2: be claimed, they certainly would have done it right exactly now.
18:56
Speaker 1: I realize, of course that often throughout history and anthem
19:00
Speaker 1: will be propaganda that has new lyrics added to an
19:06
Speaker 1: existing song.
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Speaker 2: So there was traditional traditional him if. Yeah, a lot
19:14
Speaker 2: of these things are kind of interchangeable irrespective of genre.
19:18
Speaker 2: Perhaps might be some of the differentiating features. But much
19:23
Speaker 2: like the oral tradition, you know, and the songs of
19:26
Speaker 2: old like you know, think about tales of nights and
19:30
Speaker 2: the songs that bards might sing, the original author of
19:33
Speaker 2: those things can often be lost to history because they
19:36
Speaker 2: just get repeated and tweaked and that historical game of
19:40
Speaker 2: telephone that you're always talking about, Ben, So it does
19:42
Speaker 2: make sense that a lot of these things could date
19:45
Speaker 2: back to much more regional traditional tunes with lyrics that
19:51
Speaker 2: are then kind of tweaked a little bit. So it
19:53
Speaker 2: makes it a little bit hard to nail down a
19:55
Speaker 2: single author.
19:57
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, well said, we know. A lot of the
20:01
Speaker 1: village bangers eventually, like the breakout singles of your favorite uh,
20:06
Speaker 1: your favorite fair Carnival, they later informed national anthems. In
20:11
Speaker 1: the case of this one, it seems that the music
20:15
Speaker 1: itself can be traced back to a popular Roman Catholic
20:19
Speaker 1: French song called Hanson de la ville de.
20:27
Speaker 2: Well, certainly, we've got to put that into a little translator.
20:30
Speaker 2: What the heck does that mean? Casey Pegron would be
20:33
Speaker 2: able to help us with that. Let's see it appears
20:37
Speaker 2: hold on to translate to well, it's so French that
20:44
Speaker 2: the only results I'm getting are in French. Ben, Wow,
20:49
Speaker 2: I bet I could tackle a little bit. I bet
20:51
Speaker 2: you could. I here we are at the Dutch review,
20:55
Speaker 2: which I think is the piece, the piece in question
20:58
Speaker 2: here then, but it does not offer us the translation.
21:02
Speaker 2: That is a bonker's long title for a piece of music. God,
21:07
Speaker 2: if only casey we're here.
21:08
Speaker 1: I believe it translates to outside the Chanson of the
21:12
Speaker 1: sheltras via sailed by the Prince of Conde.
21:15
Speaker 2: Okay, all right, well done, well done, Ben, I knew,
21:19
Speaker 2: I knew you could do it.
21:20
Speaker 1: Let's not stop there. Let's figure out what a chanson is.
21:25
Speaker 1: A chanson is a musical genre spanning from medieval courtly music.
21:31
Speaker 1: So this is outside of the song.
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Speaker 3: Very confusing, that's very.
21:36
Speaker 2: Confus confusing, chass all, I have to imagine that it's pronounced.
21:39
Speaker 2: But this was actually a pretty controversial pick for a
21:43
Speaker 2: national anthem at the time because it was considered a
21:49
Speaker 2: little too kind of of the upper class and a
21:53
Speaker 2: national anthem supposed to be for everybody. So at the
21:57
Speaker 2: beginning of the nineteenth century, this piece of music, the
21:59
Speaker 2: Wilmus was considered unworthy of being the national anthem of
22:03
Speaker 2: the Netherlands. That was because it was regarded as a
22:05
Speaker 2: song specifically for the Orange Royalists, who many folks were
22:11
Speaker 2: not a big fan of.
22:12
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, a lot of people were not a huge
22:15
Speaker 1: fan of the royal family at the time, so they
22:18
Speaker 1: didn't want to have anything to do with this. Until
22:22
Speaker 1: the Nazi occupation of World War two. That's when you
22:26
Speaker 1: see cities like Rotterdam completely get their bells rung. And
22:31
Speaker 1: that's when you see absolute innocent civilians getting sent wholesale
22:37
Speaker 1: into the horrors of concentration camps.
22:40
Speaker 2: Because of their religious faith. And there you know, obviously,
22:43
Speaker 2: and everybody knows about this stuff, and it's every time
22:45
Speaker 2: you read about it. It just really that happened. It
22:49
Speaker 2: wasn't that long ago.
22:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, let us not forget the Jewish people. Let us
22:55
Speaker 1: not forget the Roma people, the people of same sex orientation.
23:01
Speaker 1: Folks are getting rounded up and they're sent to death
23:03
Speaker 1: in hellish ways. And the Dutch are trying as a
23:08
Speaker 1: culture to find national pride, right to identify in some
23:15
Speaker 1: way that has passed this slavery and horror occurring in
23:20
Speaker 1: their homelands. So they look to their old symbols and
23:24
Speaker 1: they say, ah, right, the vill helmets is maybe not
23:28
Speaker 1: that bad?
23:29
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, apparently. Can I say, Ben, I got a
23:33
Speaker 2: call back to a thing that you said off Mike
23:35
Speaker 2: when we were looking up something a little peak behind
23:38
Speaker 2: the curtain. The idea of ball with Taba by Kid
23:43
Speaker 2: Rock kind of becoming a new de facto national anthem
23:47
Speaker 2: for us here in the United States, I non consensually
23:52
Speaker 2: I would argue, and in that context, boy Ol Boyd,
23:55
Speaker 2: is that star spangled banner look pretty just.
23:57
Speaker 3: Like a banger? Yeah?
23:59
Speaker 1: Absolutely sorry, it gave you a hard time history.
24:03
Speaker 2: So where is Kid?
24:05
Speaker 3: Where is job rule?
24:06
Speaker 2: As well? You've seen that video of Kid rocking the
24:09
Speaker 2: RFK gets. I don't love it.
24:13
Speaker 1: It's still it's a little uncomfortable for me.
24:15
Speaker 2: It's a lot uncomfortable. They thought it was cool. It
24:20
Speaker 2: is still right?
24:21
Speaker 1: Is it not still unusual for us to realize that
24:24
Speaker 1: a hymn can be a national anthem? Japan, the nation thereof,
24:30
Speaker 1: has a bone to pick about the idea of oldest
24:34
Speaker 1: national anthem, because Japan has used a poem which is
24:38
Speaker 1: quite short but also older for its anthem, The melody
24:44
Speaker 1: just wasn't recorded or wasn't documented until the eighteen hundreds.
24:50
Speaker 1: So it depends upon how we define an anthem. Is
24:54
Speaker 1: it the poem first, the music first, or is the
24:58
Speaker 1: time the lyrics and the music come together. I think
25:01
Speaker 1: it's the third one.
25:02
Speaker 2: I would agree with you, Ben. Moving over to South
25:12
Speaker 2: Africa and what Max described as probably the most creative
25:17
Speaker 2: and definitely the hardest national anthem to learn, because it's
25:21
Speaker 2: got those cliquies, it's got those those yeah, those little sounds,
25:25
Speaker 2: which are not particularly easy. God Bless Africa, writes Jackie
25:30
Speaker 2: Bischoff for q Z. The title and first lines of
25:34
Speaker 2: Enoch Son Tonga's hymn Nkosi Sikeli e Africa may appear
25:40
Speaker 2: simple to some, but one hundred and twenty years after
25:42
Speaker 2: it was written, it has become one of the most
25:44
Speaker 2: powerful tunes in Africa's history, a symbol to the post
25:47
Speaker 2: colonial liberation movement used in the past and present post
25:51
Speaker 2: independence national anthems of South Africa, Tanzania, Zambia, Zimbabwe and Namibia.
25:58
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is a fascinating and inspiring story because Sintaga
26:03
Speaker 1: initially wrote this hymn this zilk to him for his
26:07
Speaker 1: school choir in eighteen ninety seven. And I want to
26:10
Speaker 1: pause there, because, as we have pointed out earlier, it
26:13
Speaker 1: is quite difficult for us to pronounce this language. If
26:17
Speaker 1: you want to look it up, you're going to look
26:19
Speaker 1: for a language spelled Xhosa.
26:22
Speaker 3: Anyway.
26:23
Speaker 1: So he writes this him for a school choir eighteen
26:26
Speaker 1: ninety seven. It's inspired, probably in part by the work
26:31
Speaker 1: of a poet named Joseph Perry from Wales. This hymn
26:36
Speaker 1: becomes popular, other choirs start performing it. Fast forward nineteen twelve,
26:42
Speaker 1: it is sung at a meeting of the South African
26:45
Speaker 1: Native National Congress, which we now call the African National
26:49
Speaker 1: Congress or a n C.
26:52
Speaker 2: That's right. The A and C adopted the Him as
26:54
Speaker 2: an official song in nineteen twenty five as an act
26:59
Speaker 2: of defiants to the South African government's racist policies towards
27:06
Speaker 2: Black Africans, apartheid. This is what we call that.
27:11
Speaker 1: Yeah, and now it becomes a unifying liberation anthem, right,
27:17
Speaker 1: a hymn to an anthem again, and a lot of
27:20
Speaker 1: communities that might not have otherwise unified, they agree on
27:26
Speaker 1: this song and they we see the streisand effect the
27:31
Speaker 1: apartheid government tries to ban anybody from singing this anthem,
27:36
Speaker 1: so naturally everybody wants to sing it. Fast forward nineteen
27:41
Speaker 1: ninety four, then President Nelson Mandela says, hey, can we
27:45
Speaker 1: get a modified version of Sontonga's original hymn and can
27:52
Speaker 1: we combine it with the old afrikanor hymn the Call
27:57
Speaker 1: of South Africa or dies Steve Vans Africa.
28:01
Speaker 2: So interesting Afrikaan language, so much in common with German.
28:05
Speaker 1: Yeah, very much so. And they say, Okay, We're going
28:09
Speaker 1: to use these two sources to make a unifying thing,
28:14
Speaker 1: a unified national anthem. If you go to the boffins
28:19
Speaker 1: over Michigan State, like David Copeland and Benetta Jules Rossette,
28:23
Speaker 1: you'll see that they describe it as being composed in
28:27
Speaker 1: the form of a blessing offering a message of unity
28:31
Speaker 1: and uplift to act morally and spiritually on behalf of
28:35
Speaker 1: the entire African continent.
28:37
Speaker 2: So it's a beautiful idea, right it is. It really is.
28:41
Speaker 2: But it does add a level of complexity to it
28:45
Speaker 2: that you don't find in most national anthems because of
28:48
Speaker 2: the absolute just cornucopia of languages that are spoken in
28:55
Speaker 2: this part of the world.
28:55
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh.
28:56
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we as knuckleheaded United Staters or Americans as
29:02
Speaker 1: we're sometimes called, we have a hard time learning our
29:05
Speaker 1: own national hymn that is just in one language. This
29:09
Speaker 1: anthem has five different languages. English is one, but then
29:15
Speaker 1: you have Jotsa, you have Zulu, you have Setoto, you
29:18
Speaker 1: have Africaullans. If you're singing the full anthem, you're supposed
29:21
Speaker 1: to sing all five languages because it is about unification.
29:27
Speaker 1: Let's get your country singer pal to do that.
29:30
Speaker 3: One.
29:31
Speaker 2: Gosh, that sounds that sounds a little painful.
29:34
Speaker 3: That's a tall milkshake.
29:35
Speaker 2: I think, no Pal of mine. She's doing well.
29:39
Speaker 3: Yeah, I hope.
29:40
Speaker 1: So we've got a couple other things we wanted to
29:43
Speaker 1: get to England's national anthem. We're not necessarily fans. There
29:48
Speaker 1: are four nations who cut past vocals.
29:51
Speaker 3: In general.
29:52
Speaker 1: Four nations have national anthems with no words. They are
29:58
Speaker 1: San Marino, Coase of our guests from earlier in the episode,
30:02
Speaker 1: Bostnia and herzel Viavina, and then of course Spain. I
30:06
Speaker 1: don't know why I said of course Spain. I had
30:08
Speaker 1: no idea.
30:09
Speaker 3: I don't know.
30:09
Speaker 2: I mean, it's it's it's definitely a classy move It's like,
30:14
Speaker 2: we don't need lyrics. We can communicate this national pride
30:17
Speaker 2: with melody alone.
30:19
Speaker 1: Just hear the chord progressions and you'll get what we're about.
30:23
Speaker 2: I mean, it's funny, like a lot of really great
30:25
Speaker 2: classical music is meant to paint a picture, you know,
30:30
Speaker 2: without words. Like there's this piece called Themes from the
30:33
Speaker 2: Maldao that is meant to be the you know. It
30:37
Speaker 2: starts off with these happy sailors, you know, preparing to
30:40
Speaker 2: go on a voyage, and then the next movement of
30:42
Speaker 2: the seas begin to royal and get a little more intense,
30:45
Speaker 2: and then the next movement it's an outright storm and
30:48
Speaker 2: you can really feel all that stuff, even if you
30:51
Speaker 2: don't really know that's what it's supposed to be about.
30:53
Speaker 2: Pretty cool. I love that.
30:54
Speaker 1: I love when bands do that as well, bands that
30:57
Speaker 1: will ordinarily, you know, have vocals or have a lead vocalist,
31:01
Speaker 1: but then there's one track on the album that is
31:04
Speaker 1: purely instrumental. I think that's powerful. I'm thinking of, you know,
31:08
Speaker 1: I'm thinking of the bands Beirute.
31:11
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love I love fully instrumental bands. Explosions in
31:15
Speaker 2: the Sky, Yeah, tortoise is one of my favorites. And yeah, no,
31:20
Speaker 2: I think it's a cool it's a cool idea.
31:22
Speaker 1: Well, with this, I do have a question to pose
31:25
Speaker 1: to you, No, and to pose to you Max before
31:28
Speaker 1: we wrap today's episode.
31:30
Speaker 2: Are you prepared? I am right, right, okay?
31:37
Speaker 1: Could the US change its national anthem? And should it
31:41
Speaker 1: to Toba? I jumped the gut. I don't think that's
31:46
Speaker 1: with the forties and the chicks with beepers. That doesn't
31:48
Speaker 1: resonate you think with the common man. Is it possible
31:52
Speaker 1: that we are in a situation I'm I'm going to
31:56
Speaker 1: be very political here. Is it possible that we are
31:59
Speaker 1: in a situation wah from where a president with a
32:03
Speaker 1: predilection for naming stuff after himself would ask for a
32:08
Speaker 1: new national anthem featuring him.
32:11
Speaker 2: Let's just say, let's just change it to God Save
32:13
Speaker 2: the King. Oh no, No. To answer your question, Benet,
32:17
Speaker 2: it is certainly not outside the realm of possibility.
32:21
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, I Francis Scott Keys is kind of
32:23
Speaker 4: a pill, so I would not be against getting rid
32:26
Speaker 4: of stuff.
32:27
Speaker 2: Just like as a dude.
32:28
Speaker 4: Yeah, he's like not a was not a good person.
32:30
Speaker 4: But I mean, in this scenario, it sounds like it
32:33
Speaker 4: would be a downgrade.
32:34
Speaker 1: It is also true that forty eight of the fifty
32:39
Speaker 1: states in the US Union have state songs, and some
32:44
Speaker 1: of them have more than one state song. Can we
32:47
Speaker 1: guess the state song of Georgia? It is a Devil
32:51
Speaker 1: went down to Georgia by the Charlie Daniels band.
32:53
Speaker 3: It better be Unfortunately, it's Georgia on.
32:56
Speaker 2: My mind, you know, Okay, look, excellent song. Heard it
33:01
Speaker 2: too many times?
33:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, because it's like the state song. I can't wait
33:07
Speaker 1: to hear more about anthems. I know we are all
33:10
Speaker 1: fans of seeing big public performances. Super producer, Max, thank
33:15
Speaker 1: you so much for being our research associate on this one.
33:19
Speaker 1: And thank you, of course to Alex Williams who composed
33:22
Speaker 1: the anthem of ridiculous history, which is instrumental and I's
33:27
Speaker 1: just instrumental because we rule.
33:31
Speaker 2: Thanks to Chris Frosciotis and the needs Jeff Codes here
33:33
Speaker 2: at spirits U and man Ben you know, let's just
33:36
Speaker 2: kut it sure. Thanks to you and with you as well.
33:40
Speaker 2: We'll see you next time, folks. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio,
33:50
Speaker 2: visit the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen
33:53
Speaker 2: to your favorite shows.