Latest / Sidewalk Talks / Brian Pruitt is Dreaming Again: Purpose, Partnership, Parenting
Transcript
- Phil: [00:00:00] Have you ever done a podcast before? Brian: Uh, yes. Just uh, I would say one. Phil: Which one? Brian: This one is in Canada. Phil: Oh, you did a Canadian podcast. Yeah. Before you did an This is your American debut. Brian: This is my first American debut podcast. Phil: That surprises me 'cause you're such a stud. Brian: Yeah. Yeah. I have not done, I have not done, I can't say I've done any podcasts. Brian: Uh, I've done a lot of video, but yeah. Um, but the first podcast was with a Canadian company. Yeah. Phil: Yeah. Podcasts are cool 'cause. You can just, this is a part of the work that I really, really love. Ah, because you can get into the weeds and you can flesh things out, and you can go down every little nook and cranny. Brian: Yep. Phil: Obviously the writing of the stories is really important 'cause it gets it out to more people. But per personally, like I look, our first conversation, I just loved our first conversation. Oh Brian: man. We had a good time, didn't Phil: we? We did have a good time. Oh gosh. And you were so kind. You said some [00:01:00] really important things that I'll never forget, um, to me. Phil: And I was just like, yeah, this is this. It's a reminder why I do this work. Brian: Oh boy. It was, that was a great conversation. I've been watching you since then too. Phil: Have you? Brian: Yeah. You, you're knocking it out, man. Phil: Stalking me from afar. Brian: I, I watch you because I, because I love what you do. Phil: Thank you. Brian: And you've been consistent. Phil: Thank you. Brian: You've been consistent and that's how you change a community. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Yeah. Phil: You, I'm, I, I, I wanna riff on that for a second. 'cause I think you're absolutely right. I think, um, with looking at all the communities that I've had the privilege of working with, yeah. Like, like everybody has really great ideas. Phil: Yeah. Everybody knows what the problems are, right? Everybody knows what the answers to those problems are, but where things really start to break down is keeping at those solutions for long enough. For them to work. Brian: That's right. Phil: You know, like we all get really fired up about a thing and we dive into that thing and then at the first challenge, or just, you know, we're six [00:02:00] months in and we thought this was gonna take a week. Phil: Yep. Uh, things start to fall apart. And then what, what always happens is three years, four years later, that same issue rises to the surface and people are like, oh, here's the answer that we tried four years ago. We should have just stuck at it. So I think you just gotta be consistent. Brian: Yep. Consistency. Phil: Yeah. Phil: Um. We, uh, we chatted a little bit on the phone talking about like, what do you wanna talk about? And you, you came up with four things. Yeah. Life, family, fatherhood, and leadership. Yes. And you're like, I wanna talk about these four things and let's just let it rip. Brian: Okay. Phil: Um, I let, let's talk a little bit about your life. Phil: 'cause I, I, I really love your story and for the folks that might be watching this or listening to this that don't know, I think it's important to kind of give you, give them a little bit of context first. Um, tell me. Just gimme like a 1 0 1. Who is Brian Pruitt and what does he do? Brian: Um, Brian Pruitt is a father of four. Brian: Uh, the [00:03:00] husband of Dr. Deisha Pruitt. Mm-hmm. For 30 years. The Phil: brains Brian: behind the operation. Yes. The brains behind the operations. Uh, for 30 years we've been married, I've got four awesome kids, uh, three daughters and, uh, uh, and a son. Uh, I have traveled as a motivational speaker for the last 28 years. Phil: Whoa. Brian: Uh, so my life, the way I've made my living has been on the road traveling. Brian: Keynote speeches for corporate corporations, uh, uh, churches, schools, colleges, and men's conferences. And family conferences as well. Uh, I'm also a leadership trainer, and so, uh, that has been, uh, those things. That's how I've made my living. The way I make my giving is in my community is through a organization called Power of Dad that we started, uh, over 20 years ago. Brian: And we work with men and fatherless boys. Phil: Um, I wanna, I just want to tell you, before this work started, and it was just kind of an idea, um, you were, you were like one of the first people [00:04:00] that somebody told me I should talk to. Awesome. So like, oh, should talk to Brian Pruitt, power of dad. He came and spoke. Phil: You spoke at something he was at, okay. And he was like, oh, you gotta really connect with Brian Pruitt and look, here we are. Brian: Well, I'm glad we did, man. I'm glad we did. Phil: Yeah, me too. I'm so impressed by that. Like 28 years of. Being a public speaker. 'cause I, I've done it for a, a couple years and it's a grind. Brian: It is, man, it, it, it, it is a grind. And what you, what you know is you really gotta be called to it, you know? Mm-hmm. That's the thing. It's, is it your calling? Is it your purpose in life? And, um, and that's, that's what's kept me in the game. Phil: Yeah. Yeah. You're so good at it. Brian: Thank you. I appreciate Phil: that. Yeah. Phil: You're so good at it. Um, talk to me about how you ended up here. How did, how did Brian Pruitt, the motivational speaker, the men's conference, or the man end up here today? Brian: Yeah. Um, a lot of consistency. We talked a little bit about that. Mm-hmm. Today, a lot of consistency. Um, [00:05:00] I've had many opportunities to go in different directions. Brian: Uh, but purpose matters to me. Phil: Mm. Brian: Purpose matters to me. And so, uh, I am a stickler for purpose. I believe that. Um, I was born for a reason. Phil: Mm. And originally that reason was to play football. Brian: Yeah, Phil: right? Brian: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Originally that was football. Yeah. And I, I had two dreams as a kid, uh, Philis. And one was, I was a kid who in the backyard pretended to score the last, uh, second touchdown to win the game. Brian: Okay. You know, we all did that. Oh my God. He scores. Mm-hmm. He won the game. Mm-hmm. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Um, I did that a million times in my backyard to, I could do it for real, uh, on, on physical football fields. And the other dream I had as a kid, which was a little bit strange and a little bit different that I'm sure not a lot of kids played. Brian: Um, I closed my door and I would begin to write speeches. Hmm. And I would, [00:06:00] I would write speeches. I would get my cassette recorder, push those two buttons on the cassette recorder, man. And, and I would let my imagination run, run. Well, Phil: really, Brian: I spoke in my bedroom. I spoke around the world. I spoke to everybody. Brian: I spoke to millions of people in my, my bedroom, Phil: the old, my people. Brian: That's right. That's right. But, but, but here's what I discovered at 53. What I can look back now and see is sometimes we think we're playing, but the truth is, is you're actually practicing. Phil: Mm. Brian: I was practicing. Phil: Mm. Brian: And I didn't know it. Phil: I, I, I love that because, I mean, even if you're thinking about in, in the public speaking world Brian: Yeah. Phil: Like, sometimes, sometimes folks get into it because they think that they should, and this is right. You know, this source of income for them. Yeah. Or this is the next step professionally, but they don't necessarily have. The experience of it. Yeah. Or the practice of it. And so the learning curve ends up being really, [00:07:00] really steep. Phil: And like, like you can speak to from experience like, like the public speaker you are a year ago, even 28 years in is not the public speaker that you are. Like, it just takes time. And here you are as a kid, like already putting in the reps right in your room. Brian: Right. Phil: Um, practicing. Brian: Right. So I was, I was practicing and didn't even know it. Brian: And so that's how I, how I came to be. Phil: Oh, wow. Brian: Yeah. Phil: So, le let's talk a little bit more about your life. So here you are having these two dreams. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Wait, where, where does it go from there? Where does life. Take you from there. Brian: Um, I end up, uh, chasing after that dream for football. Um, and, and I do rather well at it. Phil: Yeah, you do. Brian: Uh, a lot of that has to do. Um, I'm grateful for the people I got a chance to play with and the coaches I played for, uh, who put me in a great situation. So I ended up going to Central Michigan playing football there. Played with a great group of guys, became an all central Michigan's first all American AP for ap first [00:08:00] team, all American. Brian: Uh, I'm battling out my senior year in college for the nation's leading rusher with the Heisman Trophy candidate that at that time who was mm-hmm. Um, Rashan Solan, you know, got rest his soul. He's passed now. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Um, and um. My life changed drastically within 24 hours. Phil: Tell me about that. Brian: Um, I'm, I'm one of the nation's top running backs. Brian: I'm expected on the NFL draft night to be drafted highly. Um, and, um, my life's about to change. My childhood dream is about to become true. I've been to the NFL combines. I've done everything that you're supposed to do, right? Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Um, and they discover at the NFL combine that I had an issue with my spinal cord. Brian: And literally, overnight my life began to change. Phil: What was the issue with your breast spinal Brian: cord? Uh, spinal stenosis. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Which is, at this point in time in history, not so much of a big deal, but at that time in history, they were [00:09:00] weeding it out of the NFL because many guys with that particular symptom or issue where they were breaking their necks. Phil: Yep. Brian: And I was a part of the first group of guys that they said, you know what? Oh really? Nobody's bigger than the shield. Phil: Mm. Brian: Um, in their mind there'll be another big, fast, strong running back that'll come along, and they are right. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Um, and so I was the first group of people who were weeded out for that particular, um, for that particular issue. Phil: Did you get like a, a letter? Did they call you on the phone? Like, like how did they break that news to you? That, Brian: uh, I got a call, it was actually NFL draft night. Phil: Oh. Brian: I'm sitting in my, my, my, uh, my uncle Terry Pruitt's house. Uh, we're all there together. Me, my family, my mom, uh, the Saginaw News. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Everybody's there. Yeah. Uh, they're expecting, uh, I'm, I'm expecting a, you know, I'm getting drafted tonight. Um, phone finally rings as my agent and he tells me, [00:10:00] poor, we got a problem. I said, well, are you, what's the problem? He says, why are you at the NFL combines? Here's what they found. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Now I knew they were leery about something on that day. Brian: Because you go through all type of physical exams and, uh, and they start pulling me aside and sending me into more x-rays and those things like that. Um, and so it, it just, everything just changed. Uh, within 24 hours. I went from, wow. I went from, um, A NFL per prospect to, this ain't happening in 24 hours. Phil: What was that like? So you hang up the phone with your agent and then what happens next? Brian: Um, I turn, I tell my family the, the news, the Saginaw news literally take pictures of the moment. Phil: Oh really? Brian: There is a picture in the paper of the moment when this happens. Phil: Wow. Brian: Yes. And I'm sitting there. I I, I met recently. Brian: I've seen this picture recently. Phil: Wow. Brian: You know, you're going through old stuff. [00:11:00] Yeah. And I see this and I go. Oh, that's that picture, that's that moment. Right. Wow. Brian: And, uh, you know, it, it's an interesting look to see what it looks like in a young man's eye when his dream dies. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: That's an interesting look to be captured in time. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Um, but I would say what's more powerful is the look that a young man gets in his eyes when he learns to dream again. Phil: Mm-hmm. Tell me about that. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Because you get this news, this devastating news. I mean, like, football has been your life. Yeah. And it's going to be your life and your future. Yeah. Phil: Yeah. And like everybody, like you're the best. You're one of the greatest. You're the best. This is your future. And then it goes away. What happens after that? And how do you dream again? Brian: Yes. Yes. So I, I keep trying to go back into the NFL for a number of years, three years, probably after that moment as a free agent, I keep getting shut down and then I begin to realize, uh, Brian, it might be time to move on. Brian: And here was a turning point. You're asking about the [00:12:00] turning point. Yeah. I'm living in Detroit at the time. My wife comes home, she's in medical school, and she says, we need to talk. Any man knows. That means, yeah. Any man knows. That means your next statement is, what did I do? Yes. Right. What, what did I do? Brian: I'm in trouble. That's why I'm in trouble. Yeah. And I'm thinking, oh boy. Right. And, and she said something that, that really changed my life. And it was one of those moments, Phil, where you realize, oh my God, I married the right woman. Mm. She said to me, she comes home from school, medical school, and she looks, she, we sit down and she says, we need to talk. Brian: And I says, okay. She says, I need my husband back. Phil: Mm. Brian: And I said, what are you talking about? I'm sitting right here. Mm-hmm. And she says, no. She says, the man I married was joyful. He was passionate about life. He believed in purpose, and he didn't lay down for anybody. And she said, you were all [00:13:00] American for everybody else. Brian: I need you to be one for me now I need you to get up. 'cause she knew I was dying. I was alive, but I was dying. I was somewhat of a walking zombie. Um, and, um, just looking for purpose again. Phil: Yeah. Brian: And when she said that to me, it was like, uh, the scene in Rocky where the music plays. Phil: Mm. Brian: Mm-hmm. Right. Um, that was the moment I realized, A, I married the right woman, and BI had made a decision. Brian: Brian, you're 20 something years old. You got the rest of your life to live. Phil: Mm. Brian: What do you want to do now? You, you are great at that. You gotta get up and be great again at something else. And this is why I live by one of the motto I live by is, go be great, GBG. And it comes from that era of my life. So, um, Phil, I remembered my second dream at that moment. Brian: My second dream was I [00:14:00] wanted to be a speaker. Phil: Hmm. Brian: And then I got some courage to go run after it. Phil: Hmm. I, one, one, your wife is incredible. Brian: Thank you. Phil: I, and I like, I also wanna give her credit too, because you, you mentioned that you, you get this devastating news, but then you, you still keep trying and you're trying for three years. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Yeah. Phil: And, and like, I, I, I want to give her so much credit because it would've been. I think it would've been easy for her to kind of swoop in right after that devastating news and say like, okay, like put that dream away. You, we've like, we've gotta move on. Right. You know, little Brian, it's, it's time to Yeah. Phil: We, we grow up now. But, but it sounds like she didn't say that she gave you space and she gave you time Yeah. To fight it out and to keep trying and keep fighting. And then after that three years and she started to see what was happening to you. Brian: Yes. Phil: That's the timing of it is it sounds like it, the timing was also right. Brian: Yes. Phil: For her to step in and say like, I need you to be an All [00:15:00] American for me now. Brian: Yep. Phil: And for us now. Brian: Yep. And, and I would, you know what? It, it made me love her even more. You know, when, uh, you know, you married a good woman when she's willing to pick you up and say, okay, let's go dream again. Phil: Yeah. Brian: And, uh, and so forever, you know, um, and just forever and, you know, grateful for Decia and the, the role she played in helping me to get back up during that time. Phil: I, I have a list of quotes that I, that I love from our first conversation together. Oh, Brian: okay. Phil: And, and one of them that, that I really love speaks to this. Okay. And it speaks to like. To men. You, you, you start off this, this topic, encouraging men to find someone in their life to connect with somebody in their life that can speak to them, that can help them Yes. Phil: That can motivate them. That can fire them up. Whether it's a wife or a partner or friend, or, like, you need, you need somebody that is there to support you. That's Brian: right. Phil: And you, and you said, um, then I think of my wife and when she tells me something like, honey, you got [00:16:00] this. You can do this. When she says something like that, the world better watch out. Phil: Yeah. Because at that moment, I'm not just doing it for myself. I'm doing it for my baby to those surrounding a father. Never devalue the voice that you have in a man's life. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Men love to fight for somebody. We love to be the hero of the story. Brian: Yeah. Phil: When you tell them that you love them or that you're proud of them, watch how their chest sticks out. Phil: Watch how they go to work. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Watch how hard they dive in and lead into the things of this world inside of him. Every man is a little boy who still needs to hear those words from the people who love him. And when he hears it, I promise you that little boy inside him will stick out his chest a little bit more. Phil: Lean into the world and go to work. Brian: Oh yeah. Oh yeah. And it's true. Um, there's a boy inside of every man. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: And, and not only can his parents speak into that, to that little boy, but his wife has the ability to speak to that person, that king, that little boy [00:17:00] inside of that man. And when you do and you connect with him, watch what he'll do. Brian: Mm-hmm. Watch how he'll spread his wings and fly. And the opposite is when we don't. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: When we don't, here's what happens. I have seen it time and time and again in my travels and speaking to men, what happens is there's a quiet quit. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: They don't even have to leave to quit sometimes. Sometimes being there and giving up and going silent, it's worse than actually physically leaving. Phil: Mm. Brian: And I minister and speak to many of men who are still present, but gone. Phil: Mm. Brian: Silent, quiet, quiet, quit. Phil: Mm. It also speaks, I think, like culturally right now of one of the. Broad general [00:18:00] topics is, uh, like male loneliness Brian: Yeah. Phil: And social isolation and things like that. And, and you're, you're seeing like an increase of depression. Phil: Yeah. Yeah. And like depression is also a cycle that continues to isolate you from other people. And I, I think what you're saying. Just has so much value to the cultural moment that we're living in is like one Yes. Like men, we absolutely have to do our Yeah. Work. That's that's right. And we have to make good decisions. Phil: Like you could have listened to your wife trying to motivate you and been like, like, you don't understand me. Right. Like, this is my dream and you don't get to tell me what my dream is. Yeah, yeah. You know, you, you, you could have made the wrong decision in that moment. Yep. So, like men, we are absolutely responsible for our own wellbeing. Phil: Yeah. But I think what you're saying here in this moment is we also have a responsibility to other people, the men in our life. Brian: That's Phil: right. The people in our life. Yeah. To speak life into them and say like, you, like I, I love you. Yeah. And this is why I am telling you [00:19:00] this, and you can do so much more. And like we, like we have that responsibility to other people. Brian: Yeah. And we need to be open to that. Mm-hmm. From the people that we know, uh, that love us as men, if you know they love you, they should have a voice to encourage you to challenge you. Phil: Mm. Brian: Okay. And, uh, who else is going to tell you Phil: Yeah. That was, I, I'm gonna be transparent. When I got married here, I am like a fiercely independent person and I know what I'm doing and I know where I wanna go and what we need to do and all, you know, check, check, check, check cha. Phil: And then here comes this wife of mine, you know, telling me that I'm doing something wrong, right? Or maybe you should do this. They were like all like, how dare you. That's right. And like, to be honest, like that was part of the acclimation to getting married is like, I had to realize like there's a reason why she's here. Phil: And sometimes the reason is. To tell me I'm doing something wrong. Right. Or I need to change course, or you're not showing up for me or [00:20:00] for us and our family in the ways that you should. Yeah. Um, and you, you gotta learn how to hear that. Brian: That's right. Yeah. And be open to it. There's a, um, when you get married, there is, I think you hear the statement, you are, you when two become one, right? Brian: Mm-hmm. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: What I've learned after 30 years of marriage is that day, when you say, I do, it's not that you necessarily become one. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: It's, you start becoming one. You start, the process has started. 'cause the truth is, is after 30 years of marriage, what I know now is we're still becoming Phil: That's so good. Brian: We're, we're still becoming one. Right. But what I've learned to Phil after 30 years of marriage is, man, I'm learning to enjoy the becoming. Mm. To enjoy the becoming. There's some hard parts. There's some great, some easy parts. There's some ups, there's some downs. There's some good times, there's some tough times, [00:21:00] but I'm not going anywhere. Brian: Mm. And she's not going anywhere. We're becoming, Phil: mm. That's the beauty of like the commitment part, right? 'cause the commit, like if you don't, if you don't make that commitment, you miss out on the becoming being, because as soon as, 'cause like husband to husband, we're talking about like, things can get really, really tough and intense, right? Phil: Yes. And then that independent person inside of you bubbles up and you're like, ah. Like, but you gotta chill out. Yeah. And you gotta fall back on that commitment. And then you got I the, the becoming. Brian: Yeah. Phil: I think is, is so good because you, the culture. The impression that you get that everybody gets is that you fall madly in love. Phil: Right. And you, you say, I do. Yeah. And then they say, you know what? Sometimes it's gonna be hard, but it's gonna be great 'cause you love each other. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Yeah. And that, that does such an injustice to like the reality of it. Brian: That's Yeah. Yeah. Phil: Because it, it, it very much sends this message that you are now [00:22:00] married and every once in a while you're gonna have a little disagreement, but mostly things are gonna be amazing. Phil: Right. When it is so, so much a process of just, it's becoming married and becoming a, a deeper, stronger relationship. It's just I love Brian: that. It is there. There's seasons of seasons. Phil: Mm Brian: mm And there's seasons where you go, boy, Phil: yeah. Brian: Did, did we do the right thing here? Right. And then there's seasons where you go. Brian: Boy, I wouldn't want to do this with anybody else. Phil: Uh, there there's a great, uh, uh, a therapist Terry real uhhuh. He speaks specifically to relationships and men and male depression and, and, and things like that. Yeah. And he, he said something once, and I'm gonna misquote him, but he said something like, the day that you wake up next to your spouse and think, this isn't the person that I married is the first day. Phil: Of marriage. Brian: Wow. That's good. Phil: And, and I, and [00:23:00] I love that. Yeah. Because it really embraces this idea of like, becoming Right. One is like, like it's everything's great when we're playing pretend, and every, everybody's perfect and you're exactly the person I want you to be. Yeah. And then as soon as the reality that that doesn't really exist in the real world, he's like, welcome to marriage. Phil: Yeah. Like, this is the first day of the rest of your marriage. Yeah. Brian: There you go. The first day of the Phil: rest of your Brian: life now. Phil: Yeah. Right. So, so your wife has this really kind of momentous confrontation Yes. With you saying like, I need you to be Brian: Yeah. Phil: More, um, what, what do, what do you do? Like, how do you go on from there? Brian: Um, first thing is I did is, uh, uh, for me, I went back into just, just, you know, prayer. Doing what I knew to do. Okay, what's my passion? What else do I love doing? And I remembered at that time, the other thing that I loved doing was speaking. Phil: Mm. Brian: And I was already doing some of it, but I [00:24:00] wasn't vested, I wasn't totally vested in, you know, one foot in, one foot out, uh, had not taken the risk to do it for a living. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Um, and so at that point. I start taking some risk, um, making business cards when people would say, Hey, Brian, what do you do? I would have the courage to say, Hey, I speak. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: And I, and, and they would go, really? About what? And sometimes I had a good answer and sometimes I did. Phil: I, I love that too. Phil: Just because like sometimes people ask you, what did you do for work? And you feel ashamed and Right. You just start kicking rocks. Well, we're trying to do stuff That's right. That know it's doing a big deal. But, so it does take practice to say, it does, I do this for a living. It does. And Brian: I'm Phil: proud of Brian: it. Brian: Yep. And to look 'em straight in the eye. Right. So I would, I would tell him, sometimes I go. I'd give an answer and go, why did I say that? I tell you the most terrified thing Phil was Yeah. When somebody go, when they liked it, and they go, oh, really? Do you have a card, Uhhuh? And you'd be like, oh, no, you, you, you want a [00:25:00] card. Brian: So you reach in your pockets, you hand them a card, you hand shaking, right? Uhhuh, and you go, you walk away, you go, oh my gosh, what if they call? Phil: Yeah. What if that's true? That's true. Brian: Yeah. Phil: You can't just pretend anymore. Brian: Right? That's right. Right. And and and the truth is, is people start calling. Right? Yeah. Brian: And um, and when they would call, you know, one of the things that my mom taught me was be prepared. Phil: Yeah. Brian: One of the things, my mentors, I had some great mentors be prepared. One of the things sports taught me, be prepared for the game. Right. And I think what would happen is I would show up. People thought they were gonna get an athlete, and they found out I had something to say. Brian: They found out that I was authentic. That I actually cared. I meant what I said. I just wasn't a talking puppet. Um, there was a connection that I could make with a crowd, and that came out of genuinely caring about who I was talking to. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: The [00:26:00] fear when I would walk on stages subsided because it wasn't, what I have found out was when I was terrified, it was more about me. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: If I could just focus on the fact that I genuinely care about people. My fear would leave. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: And then I could go out and actually help people. Phil: Mm-hmm. Interesting that you say that. 'cause that's, uh, something that Simon Sinek talks about Yeah. In public speaking. Yeah. He said like, the, the question is, what, what can I give to these people? Phil: And, and that's his, that's his, this is how you deal with stage fright. Yeah. It's like when you take the focus off you Yep. And I'm trying to speak really well and I wi like, I'm trying to persuade everybody and be very impressive and witty, and I'm gonna make them his standing ovation at the end. Like, you're gonna freak out. Brian: Yeah. Phil: But if you say like, I need to give these people something that I feel is very important. Yep. Takes that focus and says, this is about you now. Yep. And I'm here to serve you as opposed to impress you. Brian: That's right. So I, I started doing that and I was doing it quite often in schools, you [00:27:00] know, uh, high schools, junior high schools, and then it just grew from there. Brian: Mm-hmm. You know, it grew from there and, um, you know, so I was able to live my second dream and I'm still doing that at this point in time. Phil: Wow. That's so wonderful. Yeah. I just love this, I love this for you because it says like, let, let's dive into this, this rabbit hole and talk about this. So that moment that your life had been leading up to the N-F-L-N-F-L draft. Phil: Yeah. This isn't like you a month from now, six months from now, I'm gonna be in the draft and I get this like the night of. Brian: Yeah. Oh yeah. Phil: Um, and you get the call. Um, many, many people, honestly, like myself included, Uhhuh, would would've. Said like, this is, this is the ultimate failure of my life. Uhhuh. Like, this is, this is the end of everything. Phil: Mm-hmm. This is like, like, I'm just gonna go, you know, work [00:28:00] someplace else. Like I, I'm giving up on everything because like, this was my one shot Right. And I lost it. And honestly, like bitter Yeah. As well. Yeah. Because like, I did everything right? Like I'm one of the best. Right. And there's this pesky little spine thing, right. Phil: That's disqualifying me. Um, like this is over. So in your experience, uh. Like what, how do you, how do you navigate failure? Yeah. How? Because like we, we all fail every day. Yeah. And it's really not so much like what you can do, it's how you navigate failure. So how, like, how do you navigate that? Brian: Yeah. Yeah. Uh, what everything you're saying about that moment was true. Brian: I wanted to hide under a rock. Phil: Mm-hmm. Okay. Yeah. Brian: Just couldn't find 'em big enough. One, Phil: yeah. You'd need a pretty big Brian: rock to hide under. I, I, I obviously live in the wrong part of the country. I needed Arizona or something. They got boulders out there. Yeah. Phil: Cliff or Brian: something. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, everything within me wanted to hide under a rock. Brian: Um, the, the, the hard part [00:29:00] about being, uh, a athlete at that height was everything I did was visible. Phil: Yeah, true. Brian: And so the failure of it was visible. Phil: Yeah. Brian: It was on front cover, a newspaper. It was, you know, uh, I, I ended up going back to my campus at CMU to finish my degree. My last year when I walked on my campus, it was, Phil: and then you, I'm sure you have like people reminding of you Oh, you of it constantly. Phil: I, I think in our first conversation you mentioned like you ended up working at a bank. Brian: I ended up, Phil: yeah. And, and people would come in like, you, you're Brian Pruitt. Yes. Like, yeah. I'm Brian Pruitt, like the CMU guy. Like the one, one of the all time leading rushers. Right. Like, yeah. That's me. You, Brian: it was hilarious because I, you know, I'm, I'm getting up right in life. Brian: I'm getting back up right now. Yeah. But there's stages to getting up, you know, you don't just start speaking and doing it for a living right away. Yeah. You, you get a job, you speak on the side, you build your speaking business until you can leave your job. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Um, and, [00:30:00] and I was working at a bank and yeah, I was a teller, you know, and, and a loan processor. Brian: People would come in and, you know, they would go and I, this was down in, uh, Detroit, Ann Arbor area and they would go, boy, you look familiar. Phil: Yeah. Brian: And I would be thinking, I'd be thinking, nah, you don't know me. Yeah. There we go. Wait a minute. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Aren't you Brian Brown? Phil: Yeah. That's like, Brian: uh, weren't you in all the, they were like, weren't you just in the draft? Brian: Yeah. Whatcha whatcha doing here? Yeah. You know, and, and in those moments, it's not that those are bad jobs, it's just that nobody expected to see me at that place. It's Phil: true. Brian: Then I was working with the youth ministry down there, youth group and, uh, underprivileged kids who were, you know, in trouble. So we would go and work the University of Michigan football games to, or to raise money for, to, you know, to get the kids to go on missions trips. Brian: And, uh, I would be out, we'd be out serving popcorn and stuff like that and, you know, somebody would stop me in the middle of the game and go. Brian Pruitt. What, what are you doing? Serving popcorn? Phil: Yeah. [00:31:00] Yep. Yeah. So here you are experiencing not only failure Brian: Yeah. Phil: But very public failure. Oh, Brian: yeah. Phil: And then you're also being reminded of this constant failure. Brian: Constant. Phil: So how did, like what, looking back on it, what are the keys? How do Brian: they navigate? Phil: Yeah. Brian: Yeah. And number one, let me give honor to my mother. Mm. Number one, my, my mother. You must, oh, my mother, Joyce Pruitt, man. Um, this one makes me emotional. She, um, she built a man. Phil: Mm, Brian: she built a man. My mama taught me. Brian: I've watched my mom go through some things and I watched her get up. And you never know how much what you're modeling to your kids mean until they need it. And I knew what it looked like to get up. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Um, I modeled work ethic after my mom. I modeled persistence after my mom, um, getting up for me, uh, at that time and navigating was, I had a lot of people coming to me asking questions, but most of [00:32:00] all, it was making sure I had the right people around me, asking me the right questions. Brian: Questions are gonna come. I begin to, I, I pull close to my mentors. Okay. I made my world real small. Mm-hmm. Outside of me leaving, outside of me leaving my house to do what I needed to do. I made my world real small, not outta depression and not out, not out of isolation, but out of protection for what was to come next out of me. Brian: I felt like I was incubating my, my baby, so that I could give birth to something again in my life. Phil: Mm. Brian: And everybody couldn't have the say so when it came to that, um, so what I began to do, I stayed close to my mentors. I stayed close to my childhood buddies, people that I came up with who wasn't going to let me stay down no way. Brian: Mm-hmm. Um, my, I made my world small, but I made my world matter. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: The people who were in my inner circle are the people who were not gonna let me stay where I was at. And I [00:33:00] knew it, and they would help me get up. And those were the only voices I was really listening to at the, I had learned, I had learned to block other voices out and they meant well. Brian: I never responded angry to 'em or in a rude way. They meant well, they just had questions. You mattered to them. You were their favorite or they were rooting for you, right? Mm-hmm. Um, and so, um, but at that time, I had to make my world small so that the voices that were coming into my head and my heart were helping me get to where I needed to go because I could have easily stayed down. Brian: But you're in your twenties. Yeah. You're in your thirties. You got the rest of your life to live. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: If, if what happened at 21, 20 22 is the best thing that has ever happened to you in your life, and you live to be 80. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: That's a tough life, right? No. The truth of the matter is you are going to live to be great again. Brian: You just gotta find what [00:34:00] you love again. Phil: Mm-hmm. The making. You are essentially like community of people. Small. Brian: Yeah. Phil: I think is such great advice because like thinking of my own, you know, personal challenges or struggles, like you're going through it and you are in your head all day long. Oh yeah, yeah. Phil: The stress of it, the trying to figure it out like the, the, the options and the decisions and then navigating the risk of it. And then you throw in like family and other obligations and they depend on you too. And it's just like you're in your head all day long and if you're surrounding yourself with. Phil: Like you said, good people, well-meaning people. Right. But too many people now you have 25 different voices in your head. Yeah. And you know, mom and dad are going like, well, we always thought that we'd see you like this. That's right. And then, you know, somebody else is like, well, you shouldn't do that. You should do this. Phil: Yeah. And they, everybody means, well, but there's just, there's too much chatter going on. Yep. And so I love this idea [00:35:00] of contracting that community mm-hmm. And saying like, almost creating like a personal cabinet of people Right. To be like, you are my, you are my six most trusted people. Right. Because I, I, you, I know that you love me. Phil: I know that you give qualified advice that you'll check me when I'm doing something wrong. Yeah. Give me a valuable perspective and this is who I'm gonna listen to until I figure that out. That's brilliant. Brian: Yeah. That, that, that's what I did. I went from, it takes, I went from it takes a village to raise a child, to honoring the village, saying Thank you village. Brian: Mm-hmm. But I can't listen to all the voices coming out the village. Phil: Mm. Brian: It, it took a thank you village for raising the child to, it takes, it takes a small room of people to help the man who I am right now. Phil: Mm. Mm-hmm. Um, speaking of villages and raising children, we're both twin dads. Brian: Yes. Phil: Wild. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Isn't it wild, isn't it? Phil: Such a wild trip? Brian: Yeah. Yeah. And you are a twin? Phil: And I am a [00:36:00] twin, Brian: and my wife is a twin. Phil: Is she really? Brian: Yes. Phil: Oh. Wow, you're the first like back to back generational twin parents that I've met. Really? Because usually it's like, oh, it's scoop a generation, or go and look at us. Brian: Yeah. Like Phil: winning the genetic lottery is what this Brian: is that it was meant to be, man. Phil: Yeah. Tell me, tell me about your kids. Brian: Uh, my, my oldest child is Brianna Brianna's 22. She just graduated from Central Michigan. She's going to school to be a veteran, a veterinarian next. Um, my second oldest is Destiny. Destiny is 18. She attends Central Michigan. She's in her second year. And then I had this wonderful idea. Brian: I told my wife, let's have more babies. And my wife said, we ain't having no more babies. And I told her, I said, don't make me pray Deisha. And she said, I don't care who you pray to. Okay. We ain't having no more babies. And, and I prayed and my wife had a set of twins. And, and now in our [00:37:00] fifties, 53 now I go, every now and then I threaten her. Brian: I go, don't make me pray. Phil: That's so funny. 'cause we, we originally, we, we wanted multiple kids. Brian: Yeah. Phil: And we're like, Hey, wouldn't this be great if the first time around we had twins and then we were just kind of done. Yeah. You get, you get a little two for one deal. And then we had our, our 7-year-old Evelyn Uhhuh, and eventually we decided that Evelyn really, she, we of course, wanted. Phil: More kids. Brian: Yeah. Phil: But we also really wanted more kids for Evelyn. Right. Because she like, she needs people. Yes. Like she's social. She, she's friendly. She wants to talk to everybody. Yeah. And like you could tell like desperately one of the greatest gifts we could give to her Yeah. Was yeah. Having siblings. Phil: And, uh, lo and behold, uh, I got my, we, we found out we were pregnant. My wife goes to the first OB I met. Um, I'm at a photo shoot at McLaren Bay Region. Yeah. And I'm riding up the elevator surrounded by all these [00:38:00] doctors that I'm taking photos of and the phone rings and it's my wife. And I was like, guys, I gotta, I gotta take this. Phil: Yeah. She's at the, the ob and so I pick up the phone and I go, Hey, how's it going? And she says, Phil, I am not joking with you, Uhhuh, I, this is not a prank in any way. I'm not bullshitting you. Like this is absolutely the truth, but there are two. Brian: That's Phil: Wow. And she said, as soon as they put the, the ultrasound thing on her, she saw baby A and baby B, and there's Nora and Penelope. Brian: She started the conversation off that way. Phil: Oh yeah. Brian: Let me just say, I'm not joking Phil: with you. I'm not lying to you. Straight up. So one of, one of the other quotes that, that. I really loved from our first conversation what was in regards to the fatherhood. Yeah. And you, you said, I think back to what type of father I wanted to be before I actually had kids. Phil: Mm-hmm. And I had this image of being Superman. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Now that I have kids, I realize that very rarely do my kids need [00:39:00] Superman. True. Most of the time they just need Clark Kent. Brian: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Phil: Tell me what you mean by that. Brian: Um, in particularly growing up without a dad. Okay. I, I grew up without a father. Um, and for the period that my dad was around, very violent person. Brian: Mm. I was not a good situation. Phil: Mm. Brian: Um, so you, you grow up wanting to, um, to set a new standard to create this different legacy. And in my mind, what that looked like was everything my dad was not. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: That picture was a picture of superman And, and so you go, I went into fatherhood thinking my kids needed me to be that at all times. Brian: Um, and the truth of the matter was that they just didn't need Superman that often. Phil: Mm. Brian: They just needed to know that when they needed me to be Superman, I could be that most often they needed Clark [00:40:00] Kent tossing a football in the backyard, dancing in the back room with them to songs, uh, watching them as they spin around in a circle in the dress and say, daddy, look, how do I look? Brian: Do I look pretty? I say, sweetheart, you look absolutely beautiful. Or me grabbing them by their hands, my daughters, and they're standing on my shoes, right? Mm-hmm. And we're dancing, you know, and they got on their dresses and that's what they needed. They needed Clark Kent so much more than they ever needed Superman. Brian: And even now, my oldest had 22, Brianna, you know, Brianna Destiny, and Brian and Diamond. But even, you know, Brianna, even at 22, so often, man, I can't tell you that that Cape doesn't get nearly as much use as I would like to have used. I'm like, come on guys. Gimme a reason to go pull out my Batman suit. Phil: Yeah, yeah. Phil: You know, I wanna show you what I'm made Brian: of. Yeah. I wanna show you what I'm made of. Yeah. And, and, and they just look at you like, we'll, we'll let you know when we need them. Yeah. We'll let you know. And, and I'll tell you this though, I have had to [00:41:00] learn to get more comfortable with Clark. Phil: Mm. Brian: I have had. Brian: Tell Phil: me that. Tell me more about that. Brian: I'm more, I am. I think you grow up as a little boy always. You got the superhero complex. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I could see it in my own son. Phil: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Especially if you, if you grow up talented. Yeah. And like you have the, the entire world saying like, you're the next big one. Phil: Right. You're the next big one. You're doing so good. Right. Like people wearing your jersey. Yeah. You know, like, like you are the superhero. Brian: Right. Right. Don't need it. They don't need it. And, and I've had to learn to put, to take that cape off because what happens is, and I've learned this the hard way, Phil, what happens is, is I was, I was trying to be what they didn't need and it comes off as overbearing. Brian: So you're, you're right. And it, and, and it's, it's more because the situation isn't appropriate. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Okay. I don't need, where's Clark? [00:42:00] Phil: Yeah. Brian: I just need you to show up to my game. I just need, you know, and when you show up to the game, I don't need you in that Superman outfit. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Uh, I just need Clark and his Ty. Phil: Yeah. You know? Yeah. You don't have to be the loudest person in the crowd. Nope. You don't have to be screaming your face off, like, Brian: Nope. Phil: You don't have to be up there making sure that everybody in the gym sees Brian: just be there. Phil: Yeah. Brian: And, and I can say this, and this is a, this has been a, it's fatherhood has been a be we talk about the becoming. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Oh, wow. It has been a beautiful becoming. It has. It's grown me up. It has, it has humbled me. It has humbled me. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: And it's grown me up. It's matured me. Um, I tell you, the, the, just, just being there, being present is what they need more than anything. Right? Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: And so I say to people, man, I, I know I'm raising kids. Brian: I'm just not sure sometimes if my kids realize that they have also raised a father. Phil: Mm-hmm. [00:43:00] Brian: And that, that, that sounds a little crazy. It sounds a little unbalanced, but the truth is, is as men, we are becoming for, we we're still even as a dad. Mm-hmm. When my daughter turns 23, I've never fathered a 23-year-old before. Phil: Hmm. Brian: That'll take some becoming Phil: It's true. Brian: Right? Um, Phil: as soon as you learn the playbook, Brian: it changes. Phil: The game changes. Brian: The game is always changing. And so, um, you are always calling audibles. Okay? You are always Idaho. Idaho. Wyoming. Wyoming. You are always calling some type of an audible and, and you learn. Brian: That's okay. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Every, at some point you're gonna have to throw most of these plays out. Phil: Yeah. Yeah. Um, it. What you say, what you're saying, I think is perfect. Brian: Yeah, Phil: because [00:44:00] like I I, I was just talking to a friend, a friend about this, like when, when we had Evelyn Brian: mm-hmm. Phil: Um, it was, it was obviously life changes. Phil: Yeah. Like, like you have your, yeah. You have a child and your life is different. Right. But there was just one of 'em. And to a certain extent, like I still had both hands on the wheel of whatever life it was I thought I was living at the time. Yeah. Only it was like my life. Plus now I had a kid. Right. And so like, welcome to my life child, you know? Phil: Yep. You know, and like obvi, you, you know, that that's really what I was thinking, looking back on it. Yep. And then when we had the twins, that was really the torpedo that God said mm-hmm. Through the water and said like, whatever you thought before, like, I'm gonna show you Yes. That you're wrong. Yes. And it just like blew everything apart. Phil: Yeah. And even, and I still didn't get it [00:45:00] right in that moment. 'cause I remember also kind of feeling similarly, like, okay, this is gonna be a little bit more complicated now. Yeah. But we'll be able to manage and I'll just be able to travel for work as much as I did and do all these other things and none of that is true. Phil: Mm-hmm. Like, none of that was true. Like, it was like, I, I was. Heading into a completely different life than what I thought I was. Right. And, and I tell people that becoming a father has been the greatest gift to my own self-development that I could have asked for. Brian: Right. Phil: Because it was like so much, and I think we're we're similar. Phil: Like you're, you're, you're, you're trying to think deep thoughts and you're trying to grow as a person and you're trying to read books and you're trying to, you know, you talk, listening to the gurus and all, you know, every, everybody, like you're just trying to be a better human. And that is important, but it can also really make you self-centered. Brian: Yes. Phil: And everything like [00:46:00] revolves around you. And it's really, it's really self, it can become selfishness. Yes. Yep. And what kids do is it, it is. Forces you to not be selfish anymore. That's right. That's right. You have a decision, like, is it, is it about you Right. Or is it about us? Yeah. And every day you're confronted with making that decision. Phil: Like you go home after a long day of work and it's, it can be really easy to just say like, guys, I can't hang out with you right now. Like, I gotta go lay down. I gotta go doom. Scroll on my phone for two and a half hours. That's, or whatever it is we like, make excuses for. But having those kids show up at that door every day, it, it confronts you with a choice. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Like, is it about you or is it about us? Brian: That's right. Phil: And it, it has been the best thing. And like I think about the person that I would've been not. Becoming a father. And like I, things could have gone better than what I assume, but I don't know if I would like that person. Right. Like they just, like it would all, all up in my head, all [00:47:00] about me all the time. Phil: And now I've really been given this gift of having to care for these beautiful little girls and Brian: Right. Phil: Become a, become a father. Brian: You're, you're in the becoming, and I, and I'll say this, some of the greatest teachers in my life is my family. Phil: Yeah. Yep. Brian: They, they are ref, they are. I have, I live with, uh, five mirrors. Phil: Yeah. Yep. Brian: I live with five mirrors. Phil: Yep. Brian: And which I can see my reflection and which I can see my blind spots. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: And if I'm a, if I'm, if I'm sincere and if I'm wise, whatever I see in those mirrors. I'm gonna see some things I like about Brian Pruitt. Phil: Yeah. Brian: I'm gonna see some things I don't like about Brian Pruitt. Phil: Yeah. Brian: And I'm gonna see some things that need to change about Brian Pruitt and I can only see those in the five mirrors that I [00:48:00] live with in my house. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: And um, and, and I believe, I believe God does it that way. He gives you a few mirrors so you can see your blind spots and become. A better person. Phil: Yeah. I think that speaks to folks who, who might be listening to this, that, that are similarly minded. They're, they're trying to be better people and they're reading all the books and trying to get better habits and all of those things. And all of those things are, are important and I still do them. Brian: Yes. Phil: Um, but how you really grow as a person is on an individual basis. That's right. And so you need the people immediately in your life saying like, Hey, hey bro. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Um, my daughter. Just a couple weeks ago, she was, she like we were drawing something or she, she was describing, like drawing her dad at school or, I mean, she's like, yeah, and I drew, I drew you with a beard and bloodshot eyes. Phil: And I was like, and bloodshot like, right. That's how you see, like, that's how you see me. Uhhuh is like as [00:49:00] tired. Yes. And that really checked me because it was honest. Brian: Yes. Phil: Like there was no, like, she didn't mean anything bad. No. Nope. She's not trying to manipulate me or anything. Like she just said like, this is what I see. Phil: Yep. And that, that moment sticks out. Um, one time when she was younger, she said something like, like, why? Like, do you love your phone more than me? Uhhuh. Brian: Yeah. Yeah. Phil: And I was like, Brian: yep. Phil: I mean, I unfortunately, I probably tried to rationalize my like, well I'm working on, I'm doing something important, Brian: right? Brian: Dad's buying you something. Phil: Yeah. I'm buying you a gift on Amazon. You know, or whatever. Um, but I knew like she cut right to the truth. Brian: Well, kids do that, right? Yeah, they do. And, and I could, you know, and I, I don't know of a dad or a mom who hasn't had those experiences, including myself, right? Yeah. Where your kid says something to you that is so sobering that you go, I don't know if I could even receive that from anybody else but my kid. Phil: Yep. Brian: And if I'm wise, I'll listen. [00:50:00] Yep. Right now, you know, and not blow that off. But I tell you what, what, what an opportunity to grow. Phil: Yep. Brian: What an opportunity to grow. It is. And it's not always fun to grow. Mm-hmm. But, but what an opportunity to grow as a person. Phil: Yeah. I mean, like talking about the phone thing. Phil: Um, on average, uh, we spend six and a half hours a day on our phones. Right. Brian: Easily Phil: every single day. Brian: Yeah. Yeah. Phil: And. Like you are what you do. Brian: Yes. Phil: And so if you extrapolate that to the rest of your life Yeah. Like what are, what are your deathbed memories? Yes. Anymore? Yes. Like because you spent most of your waking life. Phil: Scrolling through your phone. Yeah. And so in, in essence, like your kid saying something like, like, do you love your phone more than me? Mm-hmm. Because you're on it all the time. Right. Like, it is essentially saving your life. Brian: Right. Phil: Saying like, Hey, you have a, you have a, right now, you have to make a decision if this is gonna be your life. Phil: Yeah. Or like, we're gonna be your life. [00:51:00] That's right. And you, you gotta listen. You, you have to do yourself a favor and listen to that. Even though it hurts and it stings and like you feel shame and embarrassment, or you want to fight against that and rationalize it or whatever. Like, you just, you just gotta take it. Brian: That's true. Phil: Yeah. Brian: That is true. Phil: I know. Like to, I. Another quote that you had in our first conversation, and this kind of ties, these, these two ideas of failure. Feeling like a failure. Yeah. And fatherhood, you said to fathers, I'll say that The life you're living today Brian: Yeah. Phil: Is the legacy that you're leaving for tomorrow. Phil: Mm-hmm. What you do today matters. How you treat your kid today matters. Yeah. We can't be perfect fathers, but we can be persistent fathers. Brian: Yeah. Yeah. You get up and you fight for it every day. You, you're not going to be a perfect father, but it should never be said that you are not a persistent one. Phil: Mm. Brian: My kids don't live with a perfect father. Brian: If they were sitting right here, they'd tell you that. Phil: Yeah. They'd be like, dad, dad, you don't do any of this. [00:52:00] See, Brian: it's like you, what? You're doing a podcast. Phil: You're teaching them about what? Brian: Right. Right. But, but what they would say is, yeah, we know. In the morning, he's gonna be there and we gonna get up and we're going to try, we gonna try this again? Phil: Yeah. Brian: He's, he ain't going nowhere. Phil: Mm. Brian: He's, he's persistent. And, and that's what I want them to be able to say. Phil: Mm. Brian: Um, you don't live with a perfect man. You live with a persistent man. Phil: Mm. Brian: I'm gonna be here tomorrow. I'm gonna love you tomorrow. I'm gonna show you who you should marry tomorrow. I'm gonna show you the type of man you need to grow up to be. Brian: Tomorrow we'll be, we'll do this all over again tomorrow. Mm-hmm. Because I'm persistent, right. And I'm not going anywhere. And so that, that's what matters. Um, and, and I know that now working, you know, I, I've seen both sides of this thing, um, growing up without a dad working with young men, without fathers, um, dealing with men who have, who had no [00:53:00] dads, who are now dads. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Um, and so that whole model of the life you're living today is the legacy you are leaving for tomorrow. It is such a powerful statement because it makes us responsible for the moment. It makes us responsible for today. Um, God forbid, if I walk out of this room today and something happens to me, the life I've lived is the legacy I've left. Phil: Mm. Brian: I don't, I don't get to change that. Phil: Mm. Brian: So today matters, even if today means I gotta look at my kid and go, Hey. That needs to apologize to you for the way I responded or the way I did something. Um, that's okay too. 'cause I taught my kids something in that moment as well. Phil: Mm-hmm. That persistence, I think, ties to what we were talking about at the beginning with, in regards to communities, consistency changes communities. Phil: Right. And I think persistence within a relationship really determines the quality of that relationship. [00:54:00] Like, I'm thinking about times where like a, like a, let's say it's an uncle that you don't really have, have a good relationship with. Yeah. Or you don't talk very often, but then like on your birthday you get a phone call and it's like, Hey, I'm gonna send you a gift and how have you been and you know, all this other stuff. Phil: It almost, it almost wells up in you as like resentment, right? Like, like and, and like Superman. Yeah. Yeah. Like you don't have to overdo it right now because you weren't Brian: overcompensating. Phil: Yeah. Like you are overcompensating. Like if you were just. Consistent. Right. Like, things would be good and like we'd have a relationship and that would feel good. Brian: Yes. Phil: But jumping in and saying like, well, once a year I'm gonna try really hard. Yeah. Or once a month I'm gonna try really hard. Like, like kids pick up on that. They may not be able to verbalize that. Right. They're not gonna say, well, you know, 17 outta the last 30 days you showed up for me. No. They're just gonna get a feeling like, can I [00:55:00] depend on you as a human being? Phil: Mm-hmm. And that just takes showing up. It doesn't mean being perfect. It's right. It doesn't mean like, like, wow. Like you win outta the year. It just means being, like you said, being persistent. Yeah. Every day you show up and you try better, and you try better and you try better and you become a father. Brian: That's right. You, you just keep becoming, you don't give up. You don't quit. You stay in the fight and, and you, you win what I call the away games. Phil: Oh yeah. Brian: The, the home games are the great days and anybody can, you know, it's, it's like there are some days where you go, man, today was a home game. This was a great day. Phil: Yeah. Uhhuh, you like walking out of the house like, yeah, I did it. Look, that's the year. Brian: That's right. Phil: Baby had the best weekend ever. Yeah. Brian: And then there are those moments where you go, Hmm, today wasn't awake game. Phil: Yeah. Brian: It wasn't away game. But yeah, that was my Sunday away game. Sunday. But, but I tell you what, Phil, what I'm, what I've, what I'm, I've learned and, and I'm still [00:56:00] learning even from the analogy of football, the importance of being able to. Brian: Either win the away games or bounce back from them quickly. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: When you don't. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Right. Phil: Because they can kind of fester and repeat. Brian: Yep. Phil: Too, what I, what I noticed too, like, like I just mentioned, like Sunday was my away game. Like every, everybody has been sick in the house for days and days and days, and we're all cooped up and we're having some really good days. Phil: And then Sunday I was just, I was just kind of over it. Yeah. Yeah. And like, I don't want to get another juice box for you that's like, you know, whatever it is. And so, but then I was also thinking about it like, if, if you don't, if you're not self-aware enough to, to admit that that happened and you did not do this. Phil: Right. Right. And when you feel that way, next time you gotta do better. Yes. Like next Sunday could be the same situation. That's right. That's right. Like, you just, you dwell on that frustration or whatever emotion it is, and then it just comes to the surface and then you look like you just lost another one. Brian: Yeah. You know? Yeah. Yeah. And, and those are the moments, man, I tell you. [00:57:00] It's, it's up, it's down, it's up, it's down. But you know what I challenged again, challenged us to do, hey. Persistent. Mm. Keep going. Get back up, keep going. There's still time on the clock. You can run, run another play. Phil: Mm. Brian: As long as there's, as long as there's time on that clock, run another play. Brian: Run another play until, until life shows up and says it's time for you to get in your victory formation. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Just keep running plays, man. Phil: Just keep running plays. Um, one of the, one of the plays that you have kept running Yeah. For 30 years Yeah. Is the marriage to your wife. Brian: Yes. Phil: And, uh, so you're three decades into Yeah. Phil: Yeah. Your, your marriage. Like, what, what do you, I mean, you, you kind of mentioned this idea of like becoming Brian: Yeah. Phil: Like. Are there other keys to like, looking back on three decades? Oh yeah. Brian: And saying like, oh yeah. Phil: Like this is why we made it. Yeah. And this is why we love each [00:58:00] other. Still. Brian: Certainly. Phil: Talk to me about that. Brian: Certainly number one, nu number one. She would say it if she was here too. Forgiveness. Phil: Mm. Brian: For, for you, you married to somebody for 30 years, you're gonna say the wrong thing. Phil: Yeah. Yeah. Brian: You're gonna say the wrong thing. Yeah. Or you're going to say it in the wrong, the right thing in the wrong tone. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Um, you're going to, you're going to do some things that, uh, that brings that person joy. Brian: You are going to do some things that at times, whether intentional or unintentionally, that hurts that person. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: And the same will happen to you. That's the risk you take when you look at somebody and say, and to death, does this part I love you. I do. You, you, you are saying, you are the person that I choose to be open to. Brian: These things happening to me. Okay? Because they're again, mm-hmm. They're not perfect. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: They're persistent. And so, uh, these things are [00:59:00] going to happen anytime you say you love anybody. 'cause that requires trust. That requires opening up your heart. And, and the deeper you open up your heart and the deeper you trust, the more beautiful the relationship is, but also it also leaves you more susceptible to being hurt, right? Brian: Mm-hmm. So, um, Deisha and I both would say, uh, forgiveness. It's the number one thing that we have used to get to this point. And uh, and that doesn't mean we walk around all day, you know, with a marriage, you know, and marriage shanking one another, but, you know, but, but it does mean we live in the same house. Phil: Yeah. Brian: We, we, we are human beings. Things get said, things get done, people get hurt at times. Um, and people have great moments at times as well too, in our house, right? Mm-hmm. The right things are said. But it's, it's not those part, those times that end up ruining relationships. It's the times when you can't forgive Phil: mm-hmm. Brian: And you can't forget. And all of a sudden [01:00:00] you, you, you find yourself. That is, there's so many unforgiveness issues that the person you once loved has become your roommate. Phil: Mm. Brian: And that's all you are. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Your roommates. And if children are involved, all you're doing is raising kids. Phil: Mm. Brian: At some point you're staying together for the kids. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Right. And I, and what I can say is this, every marriage will come and have those crossroads, every marriage will have those options. And you will have those options many of times in your marriage. And so what you have to do is settle in your heart. I am going to, I'm going to give you the grace that I am probably going to need tomorrow. Phil: Mm mm Brian: I'm gonna forgive you today because I know me. Phil: Mm-hmm. And Brian: I'm probably gonna need forgiveness tomorrow. Phil: Yeah. Yeah. You like you talked, I think you used the word humility Yeah. Earlier. And I think like such an [01:01:00] important part of forgiveness is, is humility. Yes. Is this understanding like. Like, I'm gonna screw up. Phil: Right. And I have screwed up and I will continue to screw up. Right. And so who am I? Yeah. To withhold forgiveness from somebody else. Right. Like, it just Right. Yeah. Doesn't make any sense. Brian: Think about that. Phil: Right. So something that, something that you said, um, like, it just made my brain explode about like, like the, when you, you're talking about vows and you said something like, um, like you are the person that I am willing to be hurt by. Brian: Right. Phil: And I just, I love that so much. Yeah. 'cause we, we get either intentionally or unintentionally really infatuated with. Uh, like the pos the positive side of love. Yeah. It makes me feel good. It makes us feel good. Yeah. And you know, there's gonna be bumps along the road, but we'll get through 'em. Yeah. Phil: Because we love each other. Gosh, dang it. You know, like that kind of th that kind of thing. But like, that is such an act of love. It is. [01:02:00] And saying to another person, like, I choose you Brian: Yes. Phil: And you are the person that I'm willing to be hurt by. Right. Brian: Right. Phil: And I think that that is such an incredible way of like, really stating the realness of like a deep relationship with another person. Phil: Yeah. 'cause it's not, it's not self-centered. Like, well, you make me the best version of me. Right. Which it can be great. Yeah. And that's very true. Brian: Yes. Phil: Um, but it also really acknowledges that this, this gesture of vulnerability. Yeah. Where like, like I am, I'm willing to be hurt by you. Yeah. And I know I will be. Phil: Yeah. And I'm okay with that. Brian: Right. Phil: Because I love you. Like man. Brian: Yes. Phil: It doesn't get any deeper than that. Brian: It, it's a different level and it's not. Because you've come to a place where you trust that that's not their intent. Phil: Yes, yes. Brian: You, you've, you've come to the place in most marriages there. What happens is you, you begin to not trust the intent of the person. Brian: Mm-hmm. Well, I know you, you tried to say that you, that's what you always do. You, [01:03:00] you, when we, when we come to a place where we begin to realize that person loves me, they do not intend to hurt me. They want what's best for me. I don't even intend to hurt them. I want what's best for them. But if and when it happens. Brian: We gonna be okay. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Because I know that's not your intent. Mm-hmm. You love me and I love you. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Okay. And, and this is again, the becoming, if you're gonna tell somebody you love them, you're gonna go through this process with somebody. Phil: Yeah. Brian: It's true. So, so choose who that's gonna be. Phil: It's true. And even like, outside of like romantic relationships, like if you're talking about, like, again, the cultural conversation is friends and the importance of friendships and deep friendships and like male to male friendships and, uh, like, like. Phil: Men. Like, we have to be willing to like, go through these phases with our friends. That's right. As well. That's right. Like, because like sometimes you guys are gonna be vibing and things are [01:04:00] really good, and then they're gonna say something, they're like, Hmm. And it's gonna be really easy to not text them back for the next two and a half years. Phil: Right. That's right. You know, because like you're separated by the phones and you can just cut that person off and you can't do that. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Like, you, you, you cannot do that. You gotta run two, two important relationships and not away from them. Brian: Yes. Yeah. Phil: Um, I wanna talk about one more thing. Yes. The, the leadership part of all of this. Phil: Yeah. Like, like we're talking about being better husbands and being better fathers Yeah. And community members and human beings. Like, how do all of those things relate to this idea of, of leadership? Yeah. When you think about leaders and leadership, like. What are the important ideas to you? What makes a good leader? Phil: What is good leadership? Brian: Yeah. Um, when I talk of leadership, when I'm in a corporate situation, I'm speaking leadership. Um, what I know is this, I know they're human beings out there. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Regardless of their titles, some of them [01:05:00] would serve divorce papers the night before. Some of them don't even know, haven't seen their child. Brian: They don't know they, they, they don't know where their, you know, their kid has been the last three days. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Some of them have gotten a call from the doctor to tell them that their life just changed their humans with titles. And what happens is, is we make the mistake in corporate America of thinking that people's home life don't affect their work life. Brian: And I don't care what anybody says it does. Right. And then the idea of, I don't go into workplaces to teach leadership principles that can only be used at work. Phil: Oh yeah. Brian: I walk into organizations to teach leadership principles that you can take to work and then you can take home, it'll work in your relationship with your significant other. Brian: It'll work in your relationship with your children. It's, it's, it's a deeper thought because I can use this in my entire mm-hmm. [01:06:00] The big picture of my life. So not only do you need me to be a leader in this workplace, the truth of the matter is I'm not taking a leadership hat off when I go home. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: My family needs me to be a leader. Okay. My, my, your wife needs you to be a leader. Your husband needs you to be a leader. Your kids need you to be the leader. You walk outta your front door and you got a community that's in need, and you are one of the people that serve that community. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Your community needs you to be a leader. Brian: So we teach principals leadership principles that you can take home with you and they'll work in the workplace and at home. Phil: That, that to me is so brilliant because you go, you go to these keynotes or you go to these ha, you know, half day workshops, leadership focused, and it, it, it never, it never makes sense to me because like, here we are, like you said, like we're divorcing the fact that [01:07:00] these are human beings in the room. Phil: Right. And we're treating them like, well, you're a C-Suite executive and you are the, and like this is how you should interact. And I'm thinking. Well, isn't this how people should interact? Right. Like shouldn't we be talking about that? Yes. Yeah. Because then that's gonna resonate with everybody. But we're, we're talking to people like their little pawns on a chess board. Phil: Right. And it doesn't make any sense, but principles, if they're true, are true regardless of context. That's right. And so, like you said, like if, if, if there are leadership principles in a multi-billion dollar corporation, yes, there are principles in how you enter your house at the end of the day. That is true. Phil: Or the board that you're on, or the volunteer group that you're, you're like, the principles are true regardless of context. So I love what you're talking, and I love what you're talking about in regards to like the people side of it. Yeah. Like, we are not, we are all human beings with emotions and with relationships and lives. Phil: And you can't, you can't say, well, we're talking like business people today. 'cause like they're [01:08:00] human beings. Brian: That's what they are. They, they are human beings who are going to go home and take off this title. Okay. And, but there's still gonna be a requirement to be a leader, right? Phil: Yeah. Brian: And, and, uh, and there's nothing wrong with that. Brian: You just gotta teach stuff that they, they can use in the full circle of their life. And then within the corporate setting, what I try to teach is this, um, everybody's a leader. Now you can talk about C-Suite, you can talk about all these things, right? Everybody's a leader. Everybody you have leadership is influence. Brian: If you have influence, you are a leader. And you want everybody in your organization to operate as a leader. It, I call it a leadership train. You may be on different parts of the train. Different seats on the train. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: But everybody on that train, believe me, is valuable. Phil: Mm-hmm. I just pulled up another simonon quote that I love. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Uh, he says there's [01:09:00] a difference between having a position of leadership and being a leader. Brian: Mm. Phil: I know many people in very senior positions, but they aren't leaders. Right. They have authority, but they are not leaders. Yep. I know many people in no position of rank or authority, but they've made a choice to look after the people to the left of them. Phil: Yeah. And to the right of them. And we would trust and follow them anywhere. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Leadership is not a rank, it's a choice. Brian: That's right. That's right. And that's a, that right there, that's a mic drop statement, what Simon says there. It's true. I, I tell people, listen, if you at the front of the train. You would be unwise to ignore the people in the middle and in the back of that train. Phil: Yep. Brian: Because they have a view from the seat they're in that you cannot see. Phil: Yeah. And if they go off the rails, that whole train goes off the rails. Like you don't keep chugging along. Like that entire thing is going into the river. Or if you lose the caboose, Brian: most of the people in your organization is in sitting in the middle of that train. Phil: Yeah. Yeah. Brian: And, and if you, [01:10:00] if you don't hear what they're saying to you as they're speaking to you about what they can see from their perspective on that train, you train may get to its destination. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: But I'm gonna tell you what, the cargo will be damaged and the people will be damaged. Yeah. And you have to ask yourself as a leader, was that journey worth it? Phil: Mm. Brian: And I hope the answer is no. Phil: Yeah. Oh, that's so good. Brian: Or you can listen to the people all the way through the train. They'll also realize that you have a view that they don't have and a perspective that they don't have because of your seat on the train. Phil: Mm. Brian: And everybody's respecting the view, the blind spots that they have because of where they're at on the train. Brian: You make it to your destination, the people are whole and the car goes intact. Phil: So, te tell me what you think about this, because like, I, I love that you, what you're saying about the, the. As a leader, [01:11:00] you have to embrace the perspective of the people in the middle. Brian: Yeah. Phil: And then also the people in the middle. Phil: Mm-hmm. Have to respect the perspective of the leader. Yeah. And what I, what I think makes that possible, that acceptance and that respect and that mutual trust is relationship. Brian: Oh yeah. Phil: If. The relationship doesn't, or that the, the ability, the potential of that is determined by the quality of the relationship between the people. Phil: And then that goes to your idea of these are human beings with human needs. Yes. And so like, we, we need to meet each other as human beings and develop that relationship. Brian: Yes. Phil: Because then the world is our oyster. Now we can have conversations that would make people quit their jobs in other places. Yeah. Phil: Because we understand that there's a human being sitting across from me who has my best interest in mind. Yeah. And they're saying things that I don't agree with or that are coming from me specifically, but I understand that. Right. [01:12:00] We have a relationship here first. Yes. And I think about that all the time in communities. Phil: Mm-hmm. Like we have, we have community groups and government and, you know, political leaders and grassroots leaders and all of these, the people that are, I think, mean well and are likely right. Brian: Yes. Phil: But we jump into like the politics of things, right? Or the outcomes of things, or the consequences of things, or the policy side of things before we try to develop a relationship first, right? Phil: Right. And then it's just like you said, like we have 25 people all trying, like barking at everybody, trying like, well, you should do this, you should do this. And then nothing ever gets done. And we're all very frustrated and the good things end up being mediocre things or bad things are not done. And I think we would just be better if we said we, we have to. Phil: Approach this relationship human first right. Then to like start dictating things. Yes. I, I, I just, I think the relationship comes first. Brian: You gotta build relationship. I like to think of it, I, I'm not [01:13:00] responsible for this quote, but I've heard it, um, that, that we have to remember that these are human beings, not human doings. Brian: You know, it's like we just want them to do, do, do, do, do. But they're, they're human beings, right? And they're, they have things happening in their lives. And, and again, you cannot tell me, I don't care what anybody says if home ain't right. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: I am not my best at work. Phil: It's true. Brian: I am not, I I don't care who you are. Brian: You, you're not, you know, you're not gonna walk in here and give me your a plus best. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: If, if, if last night was hell on earth at the house. Phil: Yep. Yeah. Brian: That's hard to do. Phil: Even, even like, and you take that a step further into the workplace. If the, the emotional environment of the workplace Yes. Is not right Brian: culture. Phil: You are not getting what you could get out of your team because now every, like, now your team is [01:14:00] scared because you're the mean one. But you think like I'm the straight shooter. Yeah. Like we don't have time to beat around the bush. Right. I tell people, I'm being honest. And your entire team is afraid of you. Phil: Yes. 'cause they've not motivated by empowerment or by accomplishment or like whatever it is. They're motivated by fear. Brian: Yes. They work for a bully at that point. Phil: Yeah. Brian: Um, and, and you don't wanna mo 'cause what do you do when they're no longer? Phil: Oh yeah. Brian: And then the next thing is, is, uh, people don't work in cultures like that for long. Brian: They start looking. It's true. They start looking for a way to get out. What, what happens is you, you, you know, you, you are having anxiety attacks Phil: mm-hmm. Brian: On Friday night. You don't even have to go back to work until Monday. Phil: Yes. Brian: Right. By, by, by, by Sunday night. You know, you just, you, you can't even sleep. Brian: Right? Mm-hmm. Because you know what, you're about to walk into that. That's what you call culture. And when you build a poor culture, you're gonna have low retention. Phil: [01:15:00] Yep. Brian: Okay. People, you're gonna see people coming and people going because they don't wanna stay in that environment for long periods of time. Brian: Um, it's just hard to work in those type of Phil: Yeah. Or they, they insulate themselves. Yes. Or like the quiet quitting. Yeah. Like, like, why I can't quit my work, but I'm mentally checking out to protect myself and I'm gonna be there for the next two or three years. But you're not Yeah. The best employee that you can be. Phil: Right. Whoever it is. Brian: Right. I, I say this, Phil, that if you capture my heart, you can always have my hands. Phil: Oh, yeah. Brian: I, I will go to work for you. I will, I will. What you say? Work starts at eight 30. Okay. I'll be here at eight. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Oh, you say work gets out at five 30. Okay. You know what? I know it's five 30, but, but I'm want to finish this up. Brian: Are you okay if I finish this up? Matter of fact, I'm done. Does the other team need a, Hey, you guys need my help with anything? Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Because you've captured my heart. You can have my hands, but if you just ignore my heart and demand my hands Phil: mm-hmm. Brian: My mentality now [01:16:00] becomes What time is work? Yeah. Eight 30 Phil: Uhhuh. Brian: I'll be here at eight 30. What time do we end? Five 30. I may be shutting down at five 15. Okay. Mm-hmm. So, so what happens is. We're making demands for hands. Mm-hmm. Instead of understanding the power of the heart, if I captured their heart relationship Phil: mm-hmm. Brian: Relation, if I captured their heart, these people will, will, they will, they will work hard as a team. Brian: They will love the culture. They will want to be here. It's very much like sports. You get a coach who understands culture. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: Those kids will run through a wall for them. Phil: It's true. Brian: Yeah. Phil: It's true. I didn't play, I didn't play football in high school my first two years. Mm-hmm. And, uh, my sophomore year, uh, varsity football coach comes into the weight room and I was working out and he said my, my twin brother did play and he was, he was very good. Phil: And he, he came up to me, he's like, um. Have you thought about joining the team? Brian: Mm-hmm. Phil: And I, [01:17:00] like, I didn't like the story that I had told myself was I was, I was not a good athlete. Mm-hmm. I didn't play from grade school. Yeah. Like my brother, you know, whatever. That was his thing. You know, this is my thing. Phil: And I said no. And he said, well, like, I want, I want you to, and even like. Even if you're not good at football mm-hmm. I think we would benefit as a team from who you are as a person. Wow. Brian: That's cool. Phil: And I'm gonna tell you, like, I joined the team the very next season and I played my heart out junior and senior year. Phil: Wow. Like, I, I was, I was not good. Yeah. I wasn't bad, but I, like, I sacrificed myself on that field because of that moment that Professor Gillespie said, like, because of who you are as a person. That's cool. 'cause he, he spoke right to that, what you're talking about. Like, it wasn't like, well, I, I see potential in you as an offensive lineman. Phil: Yeah. Because I could've like, like what potential? Like I know you're jerk in my chain. Yeah. Yeah. But he spoke right to me as a person. And like you said, like I would've ran through a brick wall for that guy. Yeah. 'cause [01:18:00] he, he spoke to me as a human being first and as a potential football player. Seconds. Brian: Yeah. And, and people do the same thing in corporate. Phil: Yep. Brian: If you'll, if you'll treat 'em with dignity, respect, if you'll build relationships along the way that if, if, if, uh, if you'll do those things, man, you'd be amazed on, on what, what they'll show up to do for you work hands wise. Right? Mm-hmm. Um, but it's gotta be driven from their heart and you gotta capture their hearts first. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: The heart does matter. Phil: Well, Brian Pruitt, I wanna say that you have captured my heart again. Well, Brian: thank you, Phil. Appreciate it, man. I love having conversations with you. I do too. We always have a great time, don't we? Phil: Yeah, we do. We do. If, if people are watching this or listening to this and they wanna know more about you or reach out to you or, and so like, how, how would they do that? Brian: Pruit motivational.com or pro pruitt motivational.org, they can reach out to us. Phil: Okay. Brian: And, uh, or power dad.org. Phil: Yeah. Brian: You know, and, uh, either one of those [01:19:00] ways through our website, they can reach out to us. Pruitt Motivat. Dot com or power dad.org. Phil: Do it people. Brian Pruitt, he's one of the best. Brian Pruitt, you're one of the best. Phil: I wanna thank you so much for this conversation. Brian: Thank you, my dude. Thank you my friend. You keep doing what you're doing. I appreciate what you're doing in our community, and as stated, you are consistent and you're building bridges. I appreciate that. Thank you my friend. Thank you. Yes, Phil: thank you. I appreciate you. Brian: Yep. Phil: You're awesome. Brian: Thank you, Phil. Phil: You're awesome. I love, I love this Brian: conversation. This Yeah. I love talking with you, man. You just, you, you are good at this stuff because you, you would know this. It's not so much always who's on the other side of the mic or camera. It's sometimes it's who's on that side of it. Phil: Yeah. Brian: That makes somebody so comfortable. Phil: Yeah. Brian: That they can just be themself and talk. Phil: I think I look at conversations like. Like a spiritual practice. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Because there is so much of that. Mm-hmm. And [01:20:00] like, it's, it's cyclical because like you, you say things that like, make something bubble up inside of me, Brian: Uhhuh Phil: that I never would've thought about. Phil: Like, like this, this, uh, what you said about like, I'm choosing you. Brian: Mm-hmm. Phil: And because I like, I'm ready to be hurt by you. Yeah. Brian: Yeah. Phil: Like, I'm willing to be hurt by you. Like, oh my goodness. Yeah. Like that is so right. And then like, then that cycles back into this conversation and I just, I feel like. Phil: Face-to-face conversations like these Brian: Yeah. Phil: Are the, like these, this is what changes the world. Brian: Oh yeah. I agree. I Phil: agree. Like we spend so much time on this mm-hmm. And on social media and like, that's an important part of our lives. And I like, I don't want to just like, relentlessly hate on it. Brian: Yeah. Phil: But like, this is where the magic happens. Phil: Like neurons in your brain light up Yeah. In a completely different way. Yeah. And it's just like, now you are a human and we are both humans here. That's right. And it's just like, like it's, [01:21:00] if there is a chance to change the world, this, Brian: this is it. Yeah. It's conversations man. And it's having conversations sitting down and talking and, uh, yeah, you're absolutely right. Brian: You, you do a great job at, and, and that's a gift. Um, you can walk into a room, there can be cameras, you could be the greatest. You could be Denzel Washington and the other person on the other side of that camera makes you feel uncomfortable. Phil: It's true. Brian: Denzel's, not Denzel. It's true. It's, it's a gift to be able to make somebody feel comfortable enough in that moment where they can have those type of conversations. Brian: Right. Gale King does it too. Phil: Mm-hmm. Brian: You know where you go? Oprah does it. Phil: Yeah. Brian: We got Phil. Yeah, we got, we got Phil here. We Phil: got front truck. Brian: We got Phil: Phil, man. Awesome. Brian: I Phil: appreciate.