Latest / QUESTION EVERYTHING / Transform Your Relationships: The Art of Listening with Julie Rice of Peoplehood & SoulCycle

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Transform Your Relationships: The Art of Listening with Julie Rice of Peoplehood & SoulCycle · QUESTION EVERYTHING

0:04
Speaker 1: Big things happen when you're pretty, pretty bold, pretty clever,
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Speaker 1: pretty strong. I'm Danielle Robe and each week a chat
0:12
Speaker 1: with a trailblazer who puts.
0:13
Speaker 2: A new spin on pretty.
0:16
Speaker 1: We talk passion, purpose, and how good life looks when
0:20
Speaker 1: looks aren't your life. These are their stories, but this
0:25
Speaker 1: space is for you, the dreamers, doers and beautiful minds.
0:31
Speaker 2: Welcome to Pretty Smart. I love this one.
0:36
Speaker 1: So when was the last time you felt really, really heard.
0:42
Speaker 1: I want to kick off this episode with an anecdote
0:44
Speaker 1: from Oprah Winfrey, who has talked about a through line
0:48
Speaker 1: that she's found in her career. She said in her
0:50
Speaker 1: twenty five years of her talk show, what she learned
0:54
Speaker 1: was whether she was interviewing anybody, from Beyonce to President Obama,
1:00
Speaker 1: they had one thing in common.
1:02
Speaker 3: At the end of the day, whether you are interviewing
1:07
Speaker 3: me or I get to interview you, whatever your profession is,
1:12
Speaker 3: wherever you are in your life, in your relationships, every
1:16
Speaker 3: person that you encounter, every experience, the person wants to
1:20
Speaker 3: know was that okay?
1:23
Speaker 2: Was that okay?
1:24
Speaker 3: And what I started to hear was that what people
1:27
Speaker 3: are really saying is did you hear me? Did you
1:30
Speaker 3: hear me and did what I say mean anything to you?
1:35
Speaker 1: We're all just looking to feel seen and heard, and
1:39
Speaker 1: that fact is so important that I'd argue it dictates
1:42
Speaker 1: the quality of our relationships and therefore the quality of
1:45
Speaker 1: our lives.
1:47
Speaker 2: Our guest today, Julie Rice, agrees.
1:53
Speaker 1: Julie is the co founder of the massively popular cycling
1:56
Speaker 1: fitness company soul Cycle. I know you've heard of it,
2:00
Speaker 1: and together with her business partner Elizabeth Cutler, the two
2:04
Speaker 1: revolutionized the workout industry in a way that allowed people
2:08
Speaker 1: to connect with themselves and their surroundings on a deeper level.
2:13
Speaker 2: It was more than just a workout.
2:15
Speaker 1: So it should come as no surprise that after Julie
2:18
Speaker 1: and Elizabeth sold their company, now they're looking to revamp
2:23
Speaker 1: a new concept our relationships. So together they launched Peoplehood,
2:29
Speaker 1: a guided conversation practice that teaches the power of social health,
2:34
Speaker 1: which Julia's betting is the next new frontier in the
2:38
Speaker 1: wellness space.
2:40
Speaker 4: Thankfully, we're really becoming aware of our mental health, and
2:43
Speaker 4: I do think social health is right behind that. If
2:46
Speaker 4: you look at what our Surgeon General is interested in,
2:49
Speaker 4: if you look at any of the headlines, I think
2:52
Speaker 4: that we are just beginning to come into a time
2:56
Speaker 4: where we really begin to consider how our relationships with
3:00
Speaker 4: other people are really affecting our physical health.
3:04
Speaker 1: Research reveals that millennials feel increasingly isolated. And I'm focusing
3:09
Speaker 1: on millennials, but honestly, the research says that all people are.
3:13
Speaker 2: Feeling more and more isolated and lonely.
3:16
Speaker 1: There's ay goof study showing about thirty percent of people
3:20
Speaker 1: say they always feel lonely, twenty percent say they have
3:24
Speaker 1: no friends, and twenty seven percent have no close friends,
3:29
Speaker 1: thirty percent have no best friend, and the disconnection is
3:33
Speaker 1: hurting our mental health and our physical health. I know
3:37
Speaker 1: you've heard me state this before, but the Surgeon General
3:42
Speaker 1: said that loneliness can be like smoking fifteen cigarettes to day,
3:47
Speaker 1: an entire pack. That's how damaging it is on our
3:50
Speaker 1: physical health. Relationships are our lifeline. And while it's tempting
3:55
Speaker 1: to point the finger at the pandemic or economic upheaval,
3:59
Speaker 1: there's one underling factor that has been eroding the quality
4:02
Speaker 1: of our relationships for years. So as we communicate more
4:06
Speaker 1: through technology, the caliber of our conversations is suffering.
4:11
Speaker 2: Our country is suffering.
4:14
Speaker 1: We are not listening to one another, and if you're
4:18
Speaker 1: listening to this thinking well, I do have a best friend,
4:21
Speaker 1: or I do listen to people. My question is are
4:26
Speaker 1: you really listening to them? Because maybe the answer is yes,
4:30
Speaker 1: but maybe you could be listening in a deeper way,
4:34
Speaker 1: in a way that would unlock something new for them,
4:38
Speaker 1: for you, or for your relationship. I actually took a
4:43
Speaker 1: peoplehood class in person in New York in June. So
4:46
Speaker 1: I want to set the stage for you. You walk
4:49
Speaker 1: in to this beautiful room. It's calming, it's clean, it
4:55
Speaker 1: smells so good. It's a guided group experience. There were
5:00
Speaker 1: about eight of us in that class, guided by an instructor,
5:04
Speaker 1: and the goal is to learn the art of higher listening.
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Speaker 1: That's what Julie calls it higher listening. So we did
5:11
Speaker 1: a few different exercises to help learn the concept and
5:14
Speaker 1: strengthen our higher listening muscle. And let me tell you,
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Speaker 1: the class does what it promises, which is spark self awareness,
5:22
Speaker 1: change perspectives, and lead to transcendent AHA moments. Because not
5:27
Speaker 1: only did I have an AHA moment, but I learned
5:31
Speaker 1: that while I thought I was listening to people, to
5:34
Speaker 1: my friend's family, even my podcast guests, here, I could
5:38
Speaker 1: be listening in a more active and deeper way. The
5:43
Speaker 1: idea of higher listening is something that Julie will expand
5:46
Speaker 1: on in the conversation, but I want to share a
5:49
Speaker 1: teeny bit about it now. There's a difference between listening
5:53
Speaker 1: to understand and listening to respond. Listening to understand means
5:58
Speaker 1: fully engaging with the speaker, absorbing their words, emotions, intentions.
6:05
Speaker 1: It involves empathy, patience, and open mind, not interrupting and
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Speaker 1: not responding, not giving advice. When you listen to understand,
6:16
Speaker 1: you are not just waiting for your turn to speak.
6:19
Speaker 1: You're immersing yourself in the other person's experience and perspective.
6:24
Speaker 1: It's honestly wild what you'll pick up on. It creates
6:28
Speaker 1: the safe space where people feel valued and respected, and honestly,
6:33
Speaker 1: that's what I came to taking this class. Listening is
6:37
Speaker 1: a form of respect. So today Julie is sharing what
6:40
Speaker 1: she's learned about the power of listening in both her
6:43
Speaker 1: professional relationships and her personal ones, and how deepening your
6:48
Speaker 1: connection with those around you can truly change the quality
6:52
Speaker 1: of your life. So Julie, at any peoplehood at group
7:02
Speaker 1: share sessions, you typically call for everyone to answer this
7:05
Speaker 1: brief question. So I want to start out by asking
7:08
Speaker 1: the question that you usually ask people, which is what
7:11
Speaker 1: feels true for you today?
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Speaker 4: Okay, one thing that is true for me today is
7:15
Speaker 4: I am slightly overwhelmed. My big daughter is home from college,
7:20
Speaker 4: which has created a new dynamic in the house, having
7:23
Speaker 4: two kids back again, and my husband had a bit
7:26
Speaker 4: of a health scare over the weekend, and so just
7:28
Speaker 4: trying to process it all. And that is what is
7:31
Speaker 4: true for me today.
7:33
Speaker 1: Thank you for your honesty. I'm sorry that you're overwhelmed.
7:37
Speaker 1: That's a lot to carry into a Monday.
7:39
Speaker 4: But I am here and I'm happy to be talking
7:41
Speaker 4: to you. What is one thing that's true for you today, Danielle.
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Speaker 1: I love that you're doing it all with a smile.
7:47
Speaker 1: What's true for me today is that, quite honestly, I
7:50
Speaker 1: was really looking forward to this conversation. I've felt tired
7:54
Speaker 1: and uninspired lately, which is rare for me, and your
7:59
Speaker 1: etho with peoplehood is very connected to the work I
8:04
Speaker 1: do around questions and connection. And what is true is
8:08
Speaker 1: I was hoping to gain a little inspiration from you.
8:11
Speaker 4: Great same same, We'll we'll inspire each other on on
8:15
Speaker 4: almost rainy Monday.
8:17
Speaker 2: I love that.
8:19
Speaker 1: So before we get into peoplehood, I think for people
8:22
Speaker 1: to understand your journey, we have to start even before
8:25
Speaker 1: soul cycle, which is when you were a talent manager
8:28
Speaker 1: in Hollywood. I did not know that part of your journey.
8:32
Speaker 1: How did that background prepare you for your entrepreneurial journey.
8:37
Speaker 4: You know, I loved my career as a talent manager.
8:39
Speaker 4: I was you know, I was a real theater kid.
8:42
Speaker 4: I was never that talented. But I loved productions, and
8:46
Speaker 4: I loved collaboration, and I love costumes, and mostly I
8:50
Speaker 4: loved musicals. And so for me, my first career was
8:53
Speaker 4: also actually a dream. And what I can say is,
8:58
Speaker 4: you know, for every for every seat and for every
9:00
Speaker 4: terrible job that there is in the entertainment business, there
9:03
Speaker 4: are you know, tens of thousands of people that want
9:06
Speaker 4: that seat. And so it was, you know, sort of
9:09
Speaker 4: a war of attrition to get there, And it was
9:12
Speaker 4: a war of attrition to climb the ladder in the
9:15
Speaker 4: entertainment business. And so look, I learned a couple of
9:18
Speaker 4: very valuable things from my time in the entertainment business.
9:21
Speaker 4: The first thing that I learned was that no is
9:24
Speaker 4: never the answer. There is always a yes, and finding
9:27
Speaker 4: that yes is just about, you know, if you're going
9:30
Speaker 4: to make it to live another day or not, and
9:33
Speaker 4: so you figure out a way. There's no nobody is
9:37
Speaker 4: showing up in the meeting to tell their boss that they,
9:40
Speaker 4: you know, couldn't find the answer, couldn't get the actor
9:43
Speaker 4: to the set on time, couldn't get the copies of
9:46
Speaker 4: the script where they needed to go. There's only yes,
9:49
Speaker 4: that is it. Nobody is looking for you for no.
9:52
Speaker 4: There's a certain grit that comes with that. I mean, granted,
9:55
Speaker 4: I grew up in a different time in that business,
9:57
Speaker 4: but at the time, you know, we didn't use words
9:59
Speaker 4: like self care or about happiness at work. We only
10:03
Speaker 4: figured out how to make it happen. We worked long
10:06
Speaker 4: days and long nights, and I will tell you that
10:09
Speaker 4: all of that for me as an entrepreneur was absolutely
10:12
Speaker 4: what paid off. You know. It was the nights that
10:16
Speaker 4: I stayed up all night. It was the times that
10:18
Speaker 4: I felt I couldn't give up. It was the million
10:21
Speaker 4: times that people said no that I just kept going
10:24
Speaker 4: through it. And I think that those were things that
10:26
Speaker 4: I absolutely learned in the movie business. It gave me
10:28
Speaker 4: a very thick skin and a very big work ethic.
10:32
Speaker 4: And then the last thing that I'll say is, you
10:34
Speaker 4: know I was I was a manager. I represented actors,
10:37
Speaker 4: and I really had to use my imagination to figure
10:41
Speaker 4: out how to turn them into brands. You know, would
10:44
Speaker 4: this person be, what would they stand for? And I
10:48
Speaker 4: think that ultimately, as I was creating Soul Cycle, I
10:51
Speaker 4: really pictured her in the same way that I pictured
10:54
Speaker 4: a lot of the talent that I represented. I could
10:57
Speaker 4: absolutely hear her voice in my head. I knew what
11:00
Speaker 4: she would wear, I knew what she would smell like,
11:02
Speaker 4: I knew what she would feel like for other people.
11:05
Speaker 4: And I think all of those years of thinking about
11:08
Speaker 4: people as brand really helped me when I went into
11:10
Speaker 4: creating Soul Cycle.
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Speaker 1: I really love that you use the word grit. I
11:14
Speaker 1: just shared this with you offline. But the first podcast
11:17
Speaker 1: that I ever listened to. Now I live in the
11:19
Speaker 1: podcast space, but the first podcast I ever listened to
11:22
Speaker 1: was an interview that you did. My mom sent it
11:25
Speaker 1: to me and she wrote me a note that said
11:27
Speaker 1: she did it with grit and with heart, and you
11:29
Speaker 1: can do it too. So it's so funny that other
11:32
Speaker 1: people garner that from your journey. So evidently when you
11:37
Speaker 1: were a kid, Were you that same girl that's that
11:40
Speaker 1: person with confidence and grit? Or did that build over time?
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Speaker 4: Well, first of all, let me just say that for me,
11:46
Speaker 4: confidence and grit are two totally separate things. I would
11:50
Speaker 4: absolutely describe myself as having the maximum amount of grit,
11:54
Speaker 4: but I don't know if I would describe myself as
11:56
Speaker 4: having the maximum amount of confidence. In fact, I will
11:59
Speaker 4: say that I have been so lucky to have an
12:02
Speaker 4: unbelievable business partner along the way, and I really do
12:06
Speaker 4: feel like she is a very confident person who trusts
12:09
Speaker 4: her gut, and she has absolutely helped me with my confidence,
12:13
Speaker 4: which has been a wonderful, wonderful thing. And I think
12:15
Speaker 4: a huge part of our success is that, well we're
12:18
Speaker 4: both hard workers, but she's also extremely confident, and I
12:22
Speaker 4: think that has helped me along the way. Yeah. I
12:25
Speaker 4: think I was that way as a kid. You know,
12:27
Speaker 4: I was never the smartest kid in my class, but
12:29
Speaker 4: I always figured out a way to get myself through.
12:32
Speaker 4: I like to say, you know, I was never the
12:34
Speaker 4: biggest athlete, but I was still always captain of the team.
12:37
Speaker 4: And I think that that was just sort of always
12:39
Speaker 4: the way I've been. I'm a really enthusiastic participant. I
12:44
Speaker 4: love to work also for me, you know, and I'm
12:47
Speaker 4: sure that we'll talk about this in our conversation as well,
12:50
Speaker 4: But for me, being part of a team, whether that's
12:53
Speaker 4: an office team, or an athletic team or a theatrical
12:57
Speaker 4: production team, I love being part of a team, and
13:00
Speaker 4: for me, there's so much joy and sort of maximum
13:04
Speaker 4: effort together.
13:05
Speaker 1: So in twenty fifteen, you and your co founder sold
13:09
Speaker 1: soul Cycle to Equinox for a really significant amount of money.
13:13
Speaker 1: The report said that you each walked away with ninety
13:16
Speaker 1: million dollars. Is that a correct.
13:17
Speaker 4: Stat give or take? Yes?
13:20
Speaker 1: Giver take? Okay, So you could have done anything next
13:23
Speaker 1: that's life changing, and you decided to build peoplehood. Did
13:27
Speaker 1: you take a vacation? Like why did you want to
13:30
Speaker 1: build something instead of just kind of enjoy your time?
13:34
Speaker 4: My god, my vacation was I went to we Work
13:37
Speaker 4: and became their chief brand officer for two years.
13:40
Speaker 1: Oh my god.
13:41
Speaker 4: That was some kind of vacation, let me tell you.
13:44
Speaker 4: But also, by the way, another incredible experience. You know.
13:47
Speaker 4: I went to we Work at a very interesting time.
13:50
Speaker 4: I will say I worked with some of the smartest
13:51
Speaker 4: people that I've ever worked with. It was once in
13:54
Speaker 4: a generation type of rocket ship. We had just you know,
13:57
Speaker 4: we had just been really funded, and we were scaling,
14:01
Speaker 4: you know, internationally, at an incredible rate. I worked with very,
14:06
Speaker 4: very gifted people from all different industries, and I will
14:09
Speaker 4: say for me, going to was sort of actually relaxing,
14:11
Speaker 4: even though I worked very hard, because I was working
14:14
Speaker 4: for somebody else's vision, which was different. And I think
14:18
Speaker 4: scaling internationally, which was not something I had done with
14:21
Speaker 4: Soul Cycle, really helped me. I like to say it
14:23
Speaker 4: gave me peripheral vision. Creating something in New York and
14:27
Speaker 4: thinking about how people would respond to it in China
14:29
Speaker 4: was not something I'd ever done before, and I really
14:31
Speaker 4: appreciated that experience. I love to work, and I also
14:35
Speaker 4: loved to learn, and so for me it was a
14:37
Speaker 4: learning experience. I was a grown up. I had a
14:40
Speaker 4: thick skin, and so the craziness of we work and
14:43
Speaker 4: that time didn't really get me down, and so it
14:46
Speaker 4: was actually okay. And then I took not too long
14:49
Speaker 4: before Elizabeth and I started Peoplehood, which was always in
14:53
Speaker 4: the back of my head even as I'd left Soul Cycle,
14:56
Speaker 4: but I was waiting for Elizabeth who took a brief break,
15:00
Speaker 4: she had some family stuff to deal with. And again,
15:04
Speaker 4: I think, like we were talking about, I think for me,
15:07
Speaker 4: there's so much joy in collaborating and creating. Elizabeth and
15:11
Speaker 4: I tend to create things that we need in the world.
15:14
Speaker 4: We are absolutely the users of what we create. And
15:19
Speaker 4: what we learned during our time at Soul Cycle was
15:22
Speaker 4: really that people thought they were coming for the exercise,
15:27
Speaker 4: They thought they were coming to lose a little weight
15:29
Speaker 4: or get into better cardiovascular shape. But what they were
15:32
Speaker 4: really coming back for was each other, for the way
15:35
Speaker 4: that they felt supported in those rooms, for the communities
15:39
Speaker 4: that they built, for the connections that they were fostering.
15:43
Speaker 4: And I think that we really began to understand that
15:45
Speaker 4: in a post COVID digital overuse era, those skills, those communities,
15:51
Speaker 4: those opportunities are really being stripped out of our society
15:56
Speaker 4: and for us, they really are the foundation of everything
16:00
Speaker 4: that we do. And so kind of using the things
16:03
Speaker 4: that we've learned along the way to build a product
16:08
Speaker 4: or an experience that can help people practice to exercise
16:12
Speaker 4: those muscles, those muscles of community, those muscles of listening,
16:16
Speaker 4: those muscles of connection. How do we build social wealth
16:19
Speaker 4: is really what we're talking about. And so for us
16:22
Speaker 4: it's been you know, it's been a labor of love
16:25
Speaker 4: and still is. I mean, it's a really new concept
16:28
Speaker 4: for people. Once again, we are trying to build a category,
16:31
Speaker 4: which is you know, it's layered. It's not just building
16:35
Speaker 4: a great product. When you have to build a whole
16:37
Speaker 4: category to then put your product into, it's a whole
16:40
Speaker 4: other ballgame. But we're doing it and we're loving it,
16:44
Speaker 4: and it's been really interesting so far.
16:47
Speaker 1: It's also philosophical rather than like an you're presenting a
16:53
Speaker 1: whole new idea to people, which is really difficult and exciting.
16:57
Speaker 4: Both, yes, both. I think that it's thank goodness. When
17:03
Speaker 4: we started soul Cycle almost twenty years ago now right,
17:07
Speaker 4: people were just beginning to understand that you could really
17:12
Speaker 4: exercise to improve your physical health. I mean exercise as lifestyle.
17:17
Speaker 4: I like to say, I take you back to a
17:18
Speaker 4: time when soul Cycle was starting and there was no Instagram,
17:22
Speaker 4: there were no Lulu Lemons stores in New York, and
17:25
Speaker 4: so exercise was really something that you did on your
17:29
Speaker 4: to do list. You burned your calories, your doctor said
17:32
Speaker 4: you were doing good, and then you moved on. There
17:34
Speaker 4: was no joy from it. There was no community, there
17:38
Speaker 4: was no style, there was no street cred. There was
17:41
Speaker 4: just like a thing on your to do list that
17:44
Speaker 4: was pretty miserable. So kind of introducing this whole idea
17:46
Speaker 4: of exercises lifestyle was very new. Thankfully, in the past
17:51
Speaker 4: two decades we've really seen kind of as a result
17:55
Speaker 4: of building that whole category wellness come up as lifestyle.
17:59
Speaker 4: Right now, we're aware of our sleep, we're aware of
18:03
Speaker 4: our nutrition. Thankfully, we're really becoming aware of our mental health.
18:07
Speaker 4: And I do think social health is right behind that.
18:11
Speaker 4: If you look at what our Surgeon General is interested in,
18:14
Speaker 4: if you look at any of the headlines, I think
18:17
Speaker 4: that we are just beginning to come into a time
18:20
Speaker 4: where we really begin to consider how our relationships with
18:24
Speaker 4: other people are really affecting our physical health.
18:28
Speaker 1: I'm right there with you. I think the Surgeon General
18:31
Speaker 1: says that loneliness is like smoking fifteen cigarettes a day.
18:35
Speaker 4: One hundred percent. And ironically, when you look at any
18:41
Speaker 4: medical report you know you listen to, whether you're listening
18:44
Speaker 4: to Peter Attia or you know you're listening to our
18:47
Speaker 4: Surgeon General, everybody tells you that The number one predictor
18:52
Speaker 4: of a healthy life is the relationships that you're in.
18:57
Speaker 4: Who you love, who loves you, if you feel like
19:00
Speaker 4: you matter, if somebody checks on you every day. And
19:03
Speaker 4: yet our habitual practices are falling very short of that.
19:08
Speaker 4: We know that we need it in the same way
19:11
Speaker 4: that we know we need green vegetables, but we'd rather
19:13
Speaker 4: eat French fries. You know, we know we need to
19:16
Speaker 4: speak to other people. We know we need to practice
19:18
Speaker 4: being in relationships. We know we need to reach out
19:20
Speaker 4: to other human beings, and yet we are still not
19:23
Speaker 4: making the time to do that. But I do think
19:26
Speaker 4: there's going to be a shift in that because I
19:27
Speaker 4: don't really think that we can go on this way.
19:30
Speaker 4: I think that people are actually getting bored of their phones.
19:34
Speaker 4: You know, I think we're reaching the end of the
19:35
Speaker 4: scroll at this point. You know, I like that, you know,
19:39
Speaker 4: I know for me, there's just a certain point where
19:41
Speaker 4: I just can't look at it anymore. And so it's interesting,
19:45
Speaker 4: you know, when my thirteen year old comes in and
19:47
Speaker 4: tells me, like, I'm bored of my phone, you know
19:51
Speaker 4: that we are going to get to a place pretty
19:52
Speaker 4: soon where we're going to have to go back to
19:54
Speaker 4: looking at each other.
19:55
Speaker 1: So I read that people who came out of a
19:57
Speaker 1: mistake of yours, which I thought was sort of interesting
20:01
Speaker 1: that you called it a mistake. Can you share that story?
20:04
Speaker 4: Definitely. It's no secret that I could be a real workaholic.
20:10
Speaker 4: I always say that I've been super lucky because there are,
20:15
Speaker 4: you know, three people in my life that have forced
20:17
Speaker 4: me to not work all day and night, and that
20:20
Speaker 4: is my husband and my two daughters. I think when
20:22
Speaker 4: you become accountable to a family, it's a force mechanism
20:25
Speaker 4: for a workaholics. So it's actually really great. But I
20:28
Speaker 4: will tell you that look Soul cycle was a real joy.
20:33
Speaker 4: I mean, we, Elizabeth and I loved going to work
20:36
Speaker 4: every day. That community was our family, our fun, our
20:42
Speaker 4: social life, our work life, it was all of it.
20:44
Speaker 4: And so as the business was starting to succeed, we
20:49
Speaker 4: just worked more and more and more. And there were
20:52
Speaker 4: a couple of things that happened during that time. First
20:55
Speaker 4: of all, I had a brand new baby, I had
20:57
Speaker 4: a fairly new marriage, and I think, I you know,
21:00
Speaker 4: my thought was, like everybody's thought, is that you know,
21:05
Speaker 4: at work, you have to dedicate time and discipline to
21:08
Speaker 4: learning things but at home everything will just work out.
21:12
Speaker 4: And I think that's a really funny, you know, the
21:14
Speaker 4: funny you know, juxtaposition of the way you look at
21:18
Speaker 4: things when actually your home life and your emotional life
21:22
Speaker 4: and the people that you love are sort of the
21:23
Speaker 4: most important thing, and yet you actually spend the least
21:27
Speaker 4: amount of time working on those relationships, dedicating time to
21:32
Speaker 4: that when at work. Think about it. You'll take a
21:35
Speaker 4: meeting with almost anybody that emails you and asks for
21:38
Speaker 4: your time. You may never see them again, know them again.
21:41
Speaker 4: They have actually no impact on your even your business life,
21:44
Speaker 4: and yet you will focus on them for an hour.
21:47
Speaker 4: And so my husband, who is extremely evolved, was seeing
21:51
Speaker 4: a therapist at the time, and he came to me
21:54
Speaker 4: one day and said, you know, my therapist recommended this
21:57
Speaker 4: book for us, and she said that if you like it,
21:59
Speaker 4: we should go and maybe take the workshop. And it
22:01
Speaker 4: was a book by Harvill Hendrix and Helen Hunt, and
22:04
Speaker 4: it was called Getting the Love You Want and it
22:07
Speaker 4: was all about the practice of amago therapy. And I
22:10
Speaker 4: read it and I thought, wow, this makes a lot
22:12
Speaker 4: of sense. Really. What that practice is all about is
22:17
Speaker 4: learning to listen to each other. Different is now a
22:21
Speaker 4: good time for me to have a conversation with you
22:23
Speaker 4: about and that means I get your full attention, and
22:27
Speaker 4: I tell you what I'm thinking, When you work all day,
22:30
Speaker 4: it makes me feel like I'm less important than what's
22:34
Speaker 4: going on in your office. And then I just repeat
22:36
Speaker 4: back to you. So what I'm hearing you say is
22:38
Speaker 4: when I work all day, it makes you feel less important.
22:40
Speaker 4: Did I get all of that? And then you go
22:42
Speaker 4: back and forth until finally you get to the point
22:45
Speaker 4: where somebody says to you, yeah, because I really enjoy
22:48
Speaker 4: my time with you, and when you don't spend time
22:51
Speaker 4: with me, you know, it really makes me feel not loved, right,
22:55
Speaker 4: or whatever the answer is. But you sort of go
22:57
Speaker 4: down this rabbit hole and you learn to communicate until
23:00
Speaker 4: you get to a place of empathy rather than conflict.
23:04
Speaker 4: And think about it, especially with the people we love,
23:08
Speaker 4: we want to understand them. We want to reach empathy.
23:11
Speaker 4: And so my husband and I went to those seminars
23:13
Speaker 4: and we went over and over again, and we went
23:15
Speaker 4: for many many years, and we still practice that very much,
23:19
Speaker 4: and I will tell you it's changed the entire way
23:22
Speaker 4: that we are married. We don't react to each other anymore.
23:26
Speaker 4: Nobody snaps when somebody says, well, I'm doing more of this,
23:29
Speaker 4: or how come you loaded the dishwasher wrong? You know
23:32
Speaker 4: the reaction now, and if somebody does, we can almost
23:35
Speaker 4: make a joke of it, because it's like we understand
23:38
Speaker 4: the bad behavior. I loaded the dishwasher wrong, got it.
23:41
Speaker 4: So what I'm hearing you say is that when I
23:42
Speaker 4: load the dishwasher like that, it makes you feel frustrated,
23:46
Speaker 4: not what I loaded the dishwasher wrong. Well, you know what,
23:49
Speaker 4: I ordered all the groceries and picked up the rest
23:51
Speaker 4: of the house, so it's okay, you can reput the
23:53
Speaker 4: plates in, right, I mean, that would normally be the reaction. Right,
23:56
Speaker 4: I'll tell you what I did, because you're telling me
23:59
Speaker 4: what you don't like. So that was the first one.
24:01
Speaker 4: Spencer and I really began to communicate in an entirely
24:04
Speaker 4: different language, and I think that, you know, to this day,
24:07
Speaker 4: it's something that we've really practiced. And then Elizabeth and
24:09
Speaker 4: I also found an amazing corporate coach because we learned
24:13
Speaker 4: pretty early on that a partnership is not easy to navigate.
24:16
Speaker 4: You know, two people that want a successful business that
24:19
Speaker 4: are also living separate lives and have different financial, emotional,
24:23
Speaker 4: time needs. So we found a coach, and we also
24:27
Speaker 4: learned how to listen to each other differently. Elizabeth and
24:30
Speaker 4: I have meetings in two parts when we have a
24:33
Speaker 4: big decision to make. First we go into a meeting
24:35
Speaker 4: and I present my side and she presents her side,
24:38
Speaker 4: and you can help. We all want different things and
24:40
Speaker 4: it's very heated. And then we go home and then
24:44
Speaker 4: we have another meeting two days later, and that's when
24:46
Speaker 4: we make an actual decision, and normally we've actually switched
24:51
Speaker 4: sides when we come back right.
24:54
Speaker 1: Love this technique because I've.
24:56
Speaker 4: Seen it your way and you've seen it my way,
24:58
Speaker 4: and I've had time for my ego go to go
25:00
Speaker 4: away and I've had to process. And you know what, actually,
25:03
Speaker 4: I think more than keeping our partnership healthy, I actually
25:06
Speaker 4: think it is what has made our business. Our business
25:09
Speaker 4: is very successful because you go into things with such
25:14
Speaker 4: an ego and winning is so important because down deep inside,
25:19
Speaker 4: like I told you, none of us are so confident.
25:21
Speaker 4: We're all insecure. We all want to win, we all
25:23
Speaker 4: want to be right, when the truth is that's not
25:25
Speaker 4: always the best decision. And so learning these techniques, learning
25:29
Speaker 4: how to listen. Learning how to go from ego to
25:32
Speaker 4: empathy has really changed the entire trajectory of my life.
25:36
Speaker 4: And I will say that it is something that has
25:39
Speaker 4: taken me a long time to learn, but something that
25:42
Speaker 4: I would really say probably the most valuable skill of
25:45
Speaker 4: my life.
25:46
Speaker 1: So many great things break down because of a lack
25:49
Speaker 1: of communication. I see that i'm in production, I see
25:53
Speaker 1: that on shows all the time, and there's such easy fixes,
25:57
Speaker 1: which is why one of the reasons your company is
26:00
Speaker 1: I think it's actually revolutionary. I'm so excited to see
26:04
Speaker 1: the impact that you make with this. I think everyone
26:07
Speaker 1: thinks they're a good listener, and they're not. And that's
26:11
Speaker 1: one of the funny things. Most of us are walking
26:14
Speaker 1: around not feeling heard, and we have this frustration all
26:17
Speaker 1: day and then we come home and we eat, or
26:19
Speaker 1: we just let it out on something that's it's not
26:22
Speaker 1: the right place to let it out. I like the
26:24
Speaker 1: idea of breaking these bad habits. Are there some that
26:28
Speaker 1: come up for you that are sort of flags that
26:31
Speaker 1: can help us notice that we're not listening.
26:33
Speaker 4: Definitely, Look, the number one that we are all guilty
26:38
Speaker 4: of is being on our phone while we're talking to
26:40
Speaker 4: other people. No. I mean, there's nobody walking around this
26:45
Speaker 4: planet that has a phone that is not guilty of that.
26:48
Speaker 4: And if that does not say to somebody, I don't
26:52
Speaker 4: really care about you, I don't know what does. And
26:55
Speaker 4: I do it all the time. I mean, we all
26:56
Speaker 4: do it all the time. You know, my kid is
26:58
Speaker 4: telling me about their day and I'm also you know,
27:01
Speaker 4: making the next doctor's appointment or doing whatever else. It's
27:04
Speaker 4: it's terrible. I mean, it's actually a terrible lack of
27:07
Speaker 4: respect for another human being. And I will say that's
27:10
Speaker 4: that is the number one thing that I can say.
27:13
Speaker 4: The next thing is, you know, we're listening, but we're
27:16
Speaker 4: already forming our answer in our head. Right so I'm
27:20
Speaker 4: not really listening to you. I'm going to tell you
27:22
Speaker 4: about my experience. I'm going to give you my opinion.
27:26
Speaker 4: I'm going to give you my advice, or I'm gonna
27:28
Speaker 4: give you judgment on that. I mean, that is not listening,
27:31
Speaker 4: you know. So at Peoplehood, it's so interesting, right, So people,
27:35
Speaker 4: it's a one hour experience. We either do it on
27:38
Speaker 4: a screen we do have a digital platform, or we
27:40
Speaker 4: all come into a room. It's fifteen to twenty people
27:43
Speaker 4: in the room, it's in a circle on the screen
27:45
Speaker 4: that's in boxes. But the truth is that we are
27:49
Speaker 4: all sitting there. We do some group sharing, we do
27:53
Speaker 4: some breath work, and then we go into one on
27:55
Speaker 4: one breakout groups. And what do we do in the groups?
27:57
Speaker 4: I mean, you talk for three minutes and I listen.
28:01
Speaker 4: I talk for three minutes and you listen. And people
28:05
Speaker 4: sort of look at me the first time they do it,
28:06
Speaker 4: and they go, we're just gonna listen. I say, yeah,
28:09
Speaker 4: we're just gonna listen. That's all we're gonna do. It's
28:12
Speaker 4: literally like saying to somebody, we're just gonna walk. Yeah,
28:15
Speaker 4: we're just gonna run. You know what, once you get
28:19
Speaker 4: to running for over a mile, you feel pretty tired
28:22
Speaker 4: or it feels pretty challenging. Maybe it feels that way
28:24
Speaker 4: after two blocks. Guess what, after you listen for fifteen
28:27
Speaker 4: seconds with a clear mind, it's pretty hard and you
28:32
Speaker 4: begin to realize, oh gosh, I really don't listen. I'm
28:36
Speaker 4: doing a laundry list. I'm gonna tell this person a story.
28:39
Speaker 4: And it's so simple. It's like any other muscle if
28:43
Speaker 4: we just practice. It's funny. This morning and my in
28:46
Speaker 4: my gym, I was doing a plank right, and I
28:49
Speaker 4: got to whatever seconds forty seconds, and I thought, ough,
28:52
Speaker 4: you know, if I could just p like anything, you're
28:54
Speaker 4: just building your stamina. If I can do it for
28:55
Speaker 4: fifty seconds next time, a minute the time after, And
28:58
Speaker 4: it's the same thing with listening, and it is honestly,
29:02
Speaker 4: use the word revolutionary. It is revolutionary. You know. I
29:07
Speaker 4: now at my dinner table with my kid, they will
29:11
Speaker 4: start to tell me about their day rather than immediately
29:14
Speaker 4: dive in and say, well, why didn't you do well
29:16
Speaker 4: on that test? Didn't you have three days to prepare?
29:18
Speaker 4: I just listen. I listened to them tell the whole
29:21
Speaker 4: story about why the test was unfair, why even though
29:24
Speaker 4: they had the notes three days in advance, they weren't
29:26
Speaker 4: prepared for it. And you know what happens. Usually that
29:30
Speaker 4: person solves their own issue, or they get to a
29:33
Speaker 4: place where they have a self realization about what they
29:36
Speaker 4: could have done differently, or they find their way to
29:40
Speaker 4: some sort of discovery. And they got there on their own,
29:44
Speaker 4: and it was more valuable than if I told them
29:46
Speaker 4: what to do, and they felt like I supported them
29:50
Speaker 4: in the decision. And micro change is like that. If
29:53
Speaker 4: I do that every night, at a dinner table. What
29:56
Speaker 4: does my relationship with my kid look like just one
29:59
Speaker 4: week later? If if I did that five times in
30:01
Speaker 4: a row, if I did that in an office meeting,
30:04
Speaker 4: just listened to a coworker's idea with that saying, you
30:06
Speaker 4: know what, we're not going to do it that way.
30:07
Speaker 4: Here's my way. If I just listened to the whole idea.
30:11
Speaker 4: What happens after I listened to that idea five times?
30:15
Speaker 4: I am in a new position with a human being.
30:17
Speaker 4: And that is wild.
30:19
Speaker 1: After every interview that Oprah did, she said, no matter
30:22
Speaker 1: who it was, with Beyonce Obama, they would go to
30:26
Speaker 1: commercial break and they would look at her and they
30:28
Speaker 1: would say, was that okay? Like everybody just wants to
30:32
Speaker 1: know that they're okay, that they were heard, that they
30:35
Speaker 1: were seen. And she was like, that was the through
30:37
Speaker 1: line of my work because everyone just wanted to be
30:39
Speaker 1: heard and seen, which is exactly what you're doing. It's
30:43
Speaker 1: so interesting to me that we don't learn how to
30:45
Speaker 1: do this. I had to learn through my work, right, and.
30:49
Speaker 4: It seems so simple. And that's also why I really
30:52
Speaker 4: do think this is a very new category because people
30:55
Speaker 4: think we just know how Yeah, and I don't think
30:59
Speaker 4: we do, and I actually think we're unlearning every day,
31:03
Speaker 4: especially with the amount of technology that we're using and
31:05
Speaker 4: with you know, I don't know how you feel about it,
31:08
Speaker 4: but I can tell you my behavior is really different
31:10
Speaker 4: post COVID ink say more, no, my you know, my
31:14
Speaker 4: social tolerance for being out five nights in a row
31:19
Speaker 4: doesn't happen anymore. You know, I've got one, I've got
31:21
Speaker 4: one or two nights a week in me to really
31:24
Speaker 4: be at my social best, and then I just need to,
31:29
Speaker 4: you know, bring it down. I just don't have that
31:31
Speaker 4: kind of social stamina that I used to have.
31:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, I understand that I have always been a person
31:37
Speaker 1: that needs to recharge alone. So I feel like it
31:40
Speaker 1: got worse with COVID. But it's part of Actually you
31:44
Speaker 1: talk about this concept of hire listening, which I want
31:47
Speaker 1: to chat with you about because I think that's actually
31:49
Speaker 1: part of my stamina is I really feel like I'm listening,
31:53
Speaker 1: and so I don't want to be places and talk
31:56
Speaker 1: if I can't have that. Can you share high about
31:59
Speaker 1: how you're listening?
32:01
Speaker 4: Sure, so a peoplehood, we just define hire listening as
32:04
Speaker 4: listening without giving advice. Adding your own opinion judgment or
32:11
Speaker 4: tacking on your own story, and oh my gosh, me too. Right,
32:16
Speaker 4: So is simply listening with your full body, with your
32:20
Speaker 4: full attention, with an empty, clear mind, listening just to
32:24
Speaker 4: really hear and understand somebody else's point of view. So
32:30
Speaker 4: if I'm listening to your story, and let's say, you know,
32:32
Speaker 4: last round of the playoffs, you were a seventy six
32:35
Speaker 4: Ers fan, which I know you aren't because I like
32:37
Speaker 4: you are ready, But let's say you and I right,
32:40
Speaker 4: I'm listening to you talk about why you love the
32:42
Speaker 4: team from Philadelphia, without my own judgment, without my own opinion.
32:46
Speaker 4: I'm really just listening to you say. You know, when
32:49
Speaker 4: I grew up in Philadelphia, this team really mattered to me.
32:52
Speaker 4: This is what they meant, right, And my mind is
32:54
Speaker 4: just clear. I am just absorbing your point of view.
32:58
Speaker 4: I am putting myself in your shouse, because when I
33:01
Speaker 4: put myself in your shoes and we're both just human beings,
33:05
Speaker 4: I find a place of empathy and understanding for you,
33:09
Speaker 4: we connect in a different way.
33:11
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think so too, Julie. You know, there's so
33:14
Speaker 1: many studies. We spoke briefly about the Surgeon General, but
33:19
Speaker 1: there's this overall concern for our social and interpersonal health.
33:26
Speaker 1: Have you found certain tactics to improve or create new
33:31
Speaker 1: relational habits?
33:33
Speaker 4: Do so? For me, believe it or not. The number
33:38
Speaker 4: one thing that has improved my relational habits actually in
33:42
Speaker 4: the last decade and a half, believe it or not,
33:44
Speaker 4: has been having Shabbat on Friday night with my family. Really, yes,
33:51
Speaker 4: and I will tell you why. And it does not
33:53
Speaker 4: have to be a religious thing. For anybody that's that's listening,
33:56
Speaker 4: you can dedicate any night of the week, one night
33:59
Speaker 4: of the week to doing something like this. But about
34:04
Speaker 4: ten or maybe more years ago, I was actually out
34:07
Speaker 4: to lunch with another female CEO and she got up
34:10
Speaker 4: sort of as we were paying our check and said
34:12
Speaker 4: she had to rush out of there because she goes
34:14
Speaker 4: home early on Fridays to set up Shabbat. And I thought, wow,
34:18
Speaker 4: she's so much more important than me, Like, if she
34:20
Speaker 4: can make this happen, I can definitely put this on
34:23
Speaker 4: on Friday night. And you know, in my house, I
34:26
Speaker 4: require very little of my children. We don't always have
34:29
Speaker 4: dinner together, busy working mom, two New York City kids.
34:33
Speaker 4: But I decided that the one thing I was going
34:35
Speaker 4: to require for my kids was we all show up
34:37
Speaker 4: at the table at six thirty on Friday night. They
34:39
Speaker 4: can bring any friends, you know not. We never have
34:44
Speaker 4: a table that's completely Jewish. It's Jewish people and non
34:46
Speaker 4: Jewish people, anybody. Their job is to put away their phones.
34:50
Speaker 4: They can choose whatever they want to eat for dinner.
34:52
Speaker 4: There's always tons of dessert to bribe every ready to
34:54
Speaker 4: say at the table longer. But there is something about
34:57
Speaker 4: lighting the candles at six thirty, sitting there for a
35:01
Speaker 4: long dinner until the candles are done that absolutely changes,
35:07
Speaker 4: Like it's a totally different expectation that we all come
35:10
Speaker 4: to the table with a lot of times, all the
35:13
Speaker 4: grandparents are there, there's always lots of people, an interesting conversation,
35:18
Speaker 4: and there's just this expectation that we're going to be
35:20
Speaker 4: at the table for three, three and a half four
35:23
Speaker 4: hours just talking and eating. And it has set a
35:27
Speaker 4: tone for our weekend and the end of our weeks
35:30
Speaker 4: and changes the dynamic of our family every single week
35:34
Speaker 4: in a way that I have to say, has has
35:37
Speaker 4: really changed the foundation of our family's interaction. Just that
35:41
Speaker 4: one night a week of putting our phones away and
35:44
Speaker 4: putting this expectation out there that we're just going to linger.
35:48
Speaker 4: And yeah, I would say that practice has been really
35:50
Speaker 4: big for us. I wish I did more, but that's
35:52
Speaker 4: just about that's just about what we can manage.
35:54
Speaker 1: Well, I think you're actually talking about your own version
35:59
Speaker 1: of people that you're You're creating a container and a
36:02
Speaker 1: moment that people can rely on where they know what's
36:07
Speaker 1: going to happen. It's about connection, you know.
36:09
Speaker 4: And I will also say that the people that I've
36:12
Speaker 4: invited to my table over the years, Yeah, they've really
36:16
Speaker 4: grown with me like I can. Those are the conversations
36:19
Speaker 4: over the last ten years with friends, with my parents,
36:23
Speaker 4: with colleagues that I actually feel like have made us
36:27
Speaker 4: closer and we've connected in a different way and have
36:30
Speaker 4: really put sort of a lot of money in the
36:32
Speaker 4: bank as we've grown over the years. That slow time
36:37
Speaker 4: with people around these tables, I would say has really
36:41
Speaker 4: been fuel for growing a lot of these relationships.
36:44
Speaker 1: I love that. I've never heard anyone say slow time.
36:47
Speaker 1: I love that.
36:48
Speaker 4: Yeah, it really is.
36:49
Speaker 1: Yeah. You know, you guys have tapped so many different leaders.
36:54
Speaker 1: You've tapped scientists, researchers, therapists, rabbis, authors, How have having
36:59
Speaker 1: all of those those voices shaped this space uniquely.
37:04
Speaker 4: Well. I think it's so interesting, right because everybody needs
37:06
Speaker 4: to understand this in a different way. So when you
37:10
Speaker 4: look at scientists, right, they're going to explain to you
37:13
Speaker 4: kind of how, you know, how you are affecting the brain.
37:17
Speaker 4: You know, how you are slowing down your mind, how
37:20
Speaker 4: you're reducing cortisol production, how you're releasing oxytocin when you
37:25
Speaker 4: connect with another person, how it's a real dopamine hit
37:29
Speaker 4: for your brain. And then of course there's the aspect
37:31
Speaker 4: of dealing with a rabbi or a spiritual leader and
37:34
Speaker 4: what is what is really any religion about, right? It's
37:37
Speaker 4: about being a part of something that's bigger than yourself.
37:41
Speaker 4: And when we connect with just one other human being
37:43
Speaker 4: or we feel part of a community, there is that
37:46
Speaker 4: feeling of wow, I belong to something bigger. And when
37:51
Speaker 4: we are able to step out of our own concerns,
37:54
Speaker 4: our own worries, our own small sort of you know,
37:57
Speaker 4: one perspective on life. I think that also it connects
38:01
Speaker 4: us to something really different as well. Amazing authors and
38:05
Speaker 4: experts that we've worked with that have really helped direct
38:07
Speaker 4: us toward what different types of connection. Different techniques look
38:12
Speaker 4: like with a child as opposed to a colleague, as
38:14
Speaker 4: opposed to a spouse. I feel like what we've tried
38:17
Speaker 4: to do with the one hour peoplehood experience is take
38:20
Speaker 4: like the greatest hits of all of these things. I mean,
38:22
Speaker 4: we've worked with AA leaders and that's also fascinating. I
38:26
Speaker 4: mean when we talk about rooms of people that are
38:28
Speaker 4: only rooting for each other, no judgment, people just hoping
38:32
Speaker 4: as hard for the person next to them as for
38:34
Speaker 4: themselves that they get to tomorrow. Right. That is such
38:37
Speaker 4: a profound and beautiful thing to just hope that the
38:40
Speaker 4: person next to you wakes up tomorrow morning. Right. That
38:44
Speaker 4: is wild. And so when we think about putting all
38:47
Speaker 4: of these things together and it's the greatest hits of humanity,
38:51
Speaker 4: I mean, what an awesome thing to think about. And
38:54
Speaker 4: how can we do that in a way that we
38:56
Speaker 4: can make it accessible for people? Right? I keep saying,
38:58
Speaker 4: it's soul cycle, your relational health, right pop in, you
39:03
Speaker 4: connect to other people, you practice listening, you buy a sweatshirt,
39:06
Speaker 4: you grab a Lotte, and you're out right, it's fun,
39:09
Speaker 4: it's easy, And so we've really tried to also make
39:12
Speaker 4: it that way music charismatic leaders. You know, how can
39:16
Speaker 4: we make this easy for people? I mean, we're competing
39:18
Speaker 4: with Netflix, right, people are lazy, We're all competing for
39:21
Speaker 4: people's time. So how do I make this as fun
39:24
Speaker 4: as possible so that you leave feeling high and you
39:27
Speaker 4: want to keep working on this.
39:28
Speaker 1: You keep using the word practice, which I really love
39:33
Speaker 1: because I've noticed that with questions, people are nervous to
39:37
Speaker 1: ask questions. It can be awkward or uncomfortable. But the
39:40
Speaker 1: more practiced you are, even if you ask yourself questions
39:43
Speaker 1: or you practice with the people closest to you, like
39:45
Speaker 1: your mom, where you feel comfortable, the better you get
39:48
Speaker 1: at asking questions, and I think it totally changes the
39:51
Speaker 1: quality of our conversation. So the idea that you can
39:54
Speaker 1: practice being a listener is fascinating.
39:58
Speaker 4: Well, that's the truth. I like to say that if
40:01
Speaker 4: you come to peoplehood one time, you're going to have
40:03
Speaker 4: an Aha moment. You're going to get it because it's simple.
40:07
Speaker 4: The first time that you bite your tongue and really
40:10
Speaker 4: understand listening differently, listening really becomes three dimensional. You can't
40:14
Speaker 4: believe it, but very quickly you can feel it everywhere
40:17
Speaker 4: and you go oh, this is not something I've ever
40:19
Speaker 4: done before, So you'll have an AHA moment that will happen.
40:22
Speaker 4: I can guarantee that money back. If it doesn't, I'm happy.
40:25
Speaker 4: I'm right here. You can email me if you come
40:27
Speaker 4: to Peoplehood and you don't get tingles, but you will,
40:29
Speaker 4: you'll feel a real AHA moment. That is very nice.
40:32
Speaker 4: But as we all know, you know, one carrot is
40:36
Speaker 4: not going to change our diet. One therapy session is
40:39
Speaker 4: not going to help us understand ourselves in the way
40:41
Speaker 4: that we need to move forward. You know, one pre
40:44
Speaker 4: med course is not going to make us a surgeon.
40:47
Speaker 4: All of those things right, and so like anything else,
40:50
Speaker 4: listening is a practice. Being in a relationship is a
40:54
Speaker 4: practice all of those things. And when we begin to
40:57
Speaker 4: frame it that way, when we begin to understand that
41:00
Speaker 4: we are exercising specific muscles in the same way we
41:03
Speaker 4: do to achieve anything else in our lives, we can
41:06
Speaker 4: integrate this into our lives in a way that we
41:09
Speaker 4: can really begin to create lasting change.
41:12
Speaker 1: In the spirit of your promise of AHA moments, Is
41:16
Speaker 1: there a conversation that you've had or a moment where
41:20
Speaker 1: you've really listened in a attentive way, that you think
41:25
Speaker 1: has sort of shifted your life. I know you mentioned
41:28
Speaker 1: something with your marriage and also your business partner, but
41:31
Speaker 1: if there's even like one conversation or moment you can
41:34
Speaker 1: point to, I'd love to hear it.
41:36
Speaker 4: That's interesting. I have one daughter who is you know,
41:42
Speaker 4: she is Mi Mini me. You know, I would like
41:44
Speaker 4: to say, you know, we walk down the street and
41:45
Speaker 4: people will say, like, I can't believe the two of
41:47
Speaker 4: you can look so much alike or be so much
41:49
Speaker 4: like or whatever. But I think also because we are
41:52
Speaker 4: so much alike, because we sort of mind read each other,
41:55
Speaker 4: and I would say nine out of ten times we're
41:57
Speaker 4: thinking the same thing, eating the same thing, doing the
42:00
Speaker 4: same thing. I think sometimes in our long relationship, I've
42:04
Speaker 4: overestimated that I just understand how she feels, and so
42:09
Speaker 4: probably a lot of times don't listen to her very
42:12
Speaker 4: well because actually very interesting. A lot of times there's
42:15
Speaker 4: therapists that say we actually listen the worst to the
42:18
Speaker 4: people that we know the best because we assume that
42:22
Speaker 4: we know what they're going to say. Yeah, And I
42:25
Speaker 4: remember having one very specific conversation with her where she
42:29
Speaker 4: said to me, you know, you don't know what I'm
42:34
Speaker 4: thinking you don't understand the way that I'm feeling a
42:38
Speaker 4: lot of the time, and I'm not remembering exactly what
42:42
Speaker 4: it was around at that moment would trigger that conversation,
42:44
Speaker 4: But I remember really stepping back and thinking, gosh, like, yeah,
42:49
Speaker 4: I need to give this child her own identity because
42:53
Speaker 4: I think in my own sort of ego or love
42:58
Speaker 4: for the fact that I have produced this person that's
43:00
Speaker 4: so much like me, and that I have this sort
43:02
Speaker 4: of you know, sidekick and whatever, I think I was
43:05
Speaker 4: not giving her the space that I needed for her
43:08
Speaker 4: to be able to express her own feelings with me.
43:12
Speaker 4: And how could I really be the type of mother
43:15
Speaker 4: friend person that she needs if I'm just assuming that
43:20
Speaker 4: same same me too, same same right, That's not the
43:23
Speaker 4: way she wanted to be in a relationship with me.
43:25
Speaker 4: And I think that conversation really gave me great pause
43:29
Speaker 4: and I have to work even harder actually to step
43:32
Speaker 4: back with her. I would say, she's the person that
43:34
Speaker 4: most in my life. I think I know what she's
43:37
Speaker 4: going to say, and I have to really bite my
43:40
Speaker 4: own tongue and take a step back before I engage
43:44
Speaker 4: in the answer or the comeback with her.
43:47
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for sharing that. I think everyone
43:50
Speaker 1: can identify with a person in their life that whether
43:53
Speaker 1: it's you, said you're similar to her. I immediately thought
43:56
Speaker 1: about my own mom. We are actual like, we're opposite,
44:00
Speaker 1: and so she triggers me a lot, and I have
44:03
Speaker 1: to really work to listen and to get over that frustration,
44:06
Speaker 1: which is my first instinct, and so I appreciate that reminder.
44:10
Speaker 4: I have a daughter like that too.
44:14
Speaker 1: Is she like your husband very much?
44:17
Speaker 4: Very much?
44:18
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, Okay, I'm gonna do a little rapid fire
44:20
Speaker 1: with you, Julie. Who is the best conversationalist that you know?
44:24
Speaker 4: My husband?
44:26
Speaker 1: Who's the best listener.
44:27
Speaker 3: That you know?
44:29
Speaker 4: My husband?
44:30
Speaker 1: Did you fall in love with him because he was
44:32
Speaker 1: a great conversationalist?
44:33
Speaker 4: I fell in love with his sense of humor? To
44:35
Speaker 4: be honest with.
44:36
Speaker 1: You, Yeah, what's your go to comfort movie?
44:39
Speaker 4: Devil Wor's Praduct.
44:42
Speaker 1: What is a fear that you have yet to conquer?
44:46
Speaker 4: Well? Here we go. Have you not read all the
44:48
Speaker 4: crazy things about me that I do not take elevators? No,
44:53
Speaker 4: I am a wild faustrophobic. I don't take elevators at all.
44:58
Speaker 4: I will climb to the top of rock seventy one
45:01
Speaker 4: flights if I need to get up there for a
45:03
Speaker 4: fancy occasion, but I don't take an elevator, and I
45:05
Speaker 4: have not conquered it yet.
45:08
Speaker 1: That is why you are in such good shape. It's
45:10
Speaker 1: not terrible.
45:12
Speaker 4: It's sort of embarrassing, but okay, no.
45:14
Speaker 1: I don't feel that way at all. I'm sorry you
45:16
Speaker 1: feel that way. You've made it work for you.
45:20
Speaker 4: Ish.
45:20
Speaker 1: What is a business decision that you wish you could
45:23
Speaker 1: do all over again?
45:25
Speaker 4: M Meet Elizabeth Cutler? Why? Because she is the best
45:29
Speaker 4: business decision I've ever made. That partnership is the legacy
45:34
Speaker 4: of my life. Being her business partner has been the
45:37
Speaker 4: joy of my work career.
45:39
Speaker 1: That is so rare that you hear that from somebody.
45:41
Speaker 1: That's really cool. When is the last time that you cried?
45:45
Speaker 4: M rewatching the Intern?
45:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's such a good movie. What is a book
45:51
Speaker 1: that changed your life? Something you think everybody should read?
45:55
Speaker 1: Maybe The Alchemist for on my shelf and I have
45:58
Speaker 1: yet to read it.
45:59
Speaker 4: Oh, it's it's so good. I'm such a control freak
46:01
Speaker 4: and it just makes you realize that you know, it's
46:04
Speaker 4: all the way it's supposed to be. You know, you
46:06
Speaker 4: can try to control everything, but it all starts and
46:09
Speaker 4: ends where it's supposed to.
46:11
Speaker 1: I have a card game of fifty two questions for
46:14
Speaker 1: deeper conversation, so I ask one every week. So, because
46:18
Speaker 1: we're virtual, please tell me when to.
46:19
Speaker 4: Stop stop now?
46:22
Speaker 1: Ooh A lyric poem or mantra that you hold on
46:25
Speaker 1: too tightly?
46:26
Speaker 4: Well, I have a mantra on my computer. It's on
46:29
Speaker 4: every computer. I put a post it note, and I
46:32
Speaker 4: always say high road long view. And I think in
46:36
Speaker 4: business sometimes whether it's with competition or a bad negotiation,
46:41
Speaker 4: or an employee that is, you know, unhappy, or whatever
46:46
Speaker 4: the situation is, I think sometimes our tendency is to
46:50
Speaker 4: you know, sync down to the level, measure ourselves against
46:53
Speaker 4: the competition, act out, or do things that are not
46:56
Speaker 4: the most graceful. And I really I have been in
47:01
Speaker 4: challenging business situations and somebody once said to me, you know,
47:05
Speaker 4: high road long view. So in other words, you know,
47:08
Speaker 4: you take the high road, you do, you be the
47:11
Speaker 4: best version of yourself and can be, and in the
47:13
Speaker 4: end you'll get where you're supposed to go in a
47:16
Speaker 4: much more graceful way. And I really think about that
47:19
Speaker 4: in life and in business and all of the things.
47:21
Speaker 4: High road long.
47:22
Speaker 1: View, when those moments come up for you, do you
47:26
Speaker 1: have something that you go to, like do you breathe,
47:30
Speaker 1: do you see a therapist? What's your mode of like refresh?
47:35
Speaker 4: Yeah. Well, first of all, let me say that I've
47:38
Speaker 4: gotten a bit older, and I just also think with time,
47:41
Speaker 4: you really begin to get a bit more perspective. I
47:44
Speaker 4: think that, you know, it's very hard to tell somebody who,
47:47
Speaker 4: you know, the thirty five year old version of me
47:49
Speaker 4: that was in killer startup mode, it was a lot
47:52
Speaker 4: or or even by the way, the twenty five year
47:54
Speaker 4: old version of me that was negotiating actors contracts with
47:57
Speaker 4: somebody that I didn't feel was treating these fairly. I
48:01
Speaker 4: can really think back about times when I spoke to
48:03
Speaker 4: people or acted in a way that I can almost
48:06
Speaker 4: make myself cringe thinking about how I'm not proud of that.
48:09
Speaker 4: And so as you get older, I think, you know,
48:12
Speaker 4: you begin to understand legacy a bit more. You begin
48:15
Speaker 4: to understand that the way that you walk around in
48:18
Speaker 4: the world is more important than winning or losing right now.
48:21
Speaker 4: And so for me, I try to back away from something.
48:24
Speaker 4: I try to take a walk, I try to you know,
48:27
Speaker 4: my mom used to say to me as a little girl.
48:29
Speaker 4: Don't make decisions late in the day or at night.
48:32
Speaker 4: It's not your best thinking. Wait until the morning. And
48:35
Speaker 4: sometimes I just try to have a sleep on it.
48:36
Speaker 4: I try. I really try to bite my tongue, which
48:39
Speaker 4: is very hard. It's not my bestm I'm the kind
48:41
Speaker 4: of person that if I buy your birthday gift too early,
48:43
Speaker 4: I give it to you then and then I have
48:44
Speaker 4: to buy something else for your birthday. I'm bad at surprises,
48:47
Speaker 4: I'm bad at waiting, I'm bad at taking a pause.
48:50
Speaker 4: But I do try. I really try to take a pause.
48:53
Speaker 1: And what's the smartest decision you've ever made?
48:56
Speaker 4: One percent? To marry my husband.
48:59
Speaker 1: Where'd you guys meet?
49:00
Speaker 4: We met in Los Angeles in the movie business.
49:03
Speaker 1: Oh my god. Okay, my fingers are crossed. It can happen.
49:06
Speaker 4: Oh, it can definitely happen when you're very least expecting,
49:09
Speaker 4: a very least expecting.
49:12
Speaker 1: Julie, thank you for your time. I know you have
49:15
Speaker 1: a lot of people pulling at you. This meant a
49:17
Speaker 1: lot to me.
49:18
Speaker 4: It was great. That was great.
49:24
Speaker 1: Okay, you know what time it is. Today's a good day.
49:27
Speaker 1: To have a good day. I'll see you next week,