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A Good Walk Ruined: The History of Golf · Stuff You Should Know

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a production of iHeartRadio.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh and there's
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: Chuck and Jerry's here too. And in this episode, we'll
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: get to hear Chuck do a Scottish accent a lot. Wow.
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: I haven't really thought about that. I do love that
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: Libby helped us with this, how she titled it. Um,
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: which I think I'm titling it something like that. But
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: she titled it Golf, colon, Spoiling Good Walks Since 1457.
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: Have you ever heard that phrase?
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that was Samuel Clements.
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, how to spoil a good walk or whatever, something
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: like that.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: It's pretty funny. They get it. Golf is hard.
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: I have a question for you. Are you into golf
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: at all?
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: You're being coy. I have been playing golf since I
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: was 13, but I took, like, 25 years off uh
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: from like kind of post-college to when i moved back
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: to atlanta um played maybe once or twice a year
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: during that time but then have gotten uh really started
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: playing again in 2020 uh during covid and but still
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: very casually but then like six months ago started really
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: getting into it again and like trying to get better
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: for the first time yeah how's it going I mean,
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: it's very hard. Emily asked me why I love golf
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: so much, and that's why, because golf is really, really hard.
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah.
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: And so when you do it well, it feels like
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: you've achieved something.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: And so that's what I love about it. It's really, really, really,
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: really hard, and I like trying things sometimes that are really,
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: really hard.
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: You know what they call that? The love of the game.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah. That's right. And you were kind enough to let
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: me make this announcement now as I'm dipping my toe
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: back into the podcast world. You know, I haven't done
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: anything like that since Movie Crush went away. And friend
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: of the show and friend of ours in real life,
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: Adam Pranica of The Greatest Generation. Adam is a golfer
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: and we play golf together and we text about it
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: all the time. I was like, we should do a
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: golf podcast, like a fun and funny one. And try
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: and build like a community around it because most golf
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: podcasts are like kind of serious or instructional.
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: And I said, there's not a lot of shows out
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: there for guys like us that are like not great
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: at it. Like average golfers who just sort of the
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: absurdity of the sport. And Adam was in. And so
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: we're doing a new show.
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: That's awesome. I predict you guys will make a great pair.
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: I hope so. Yeah, it's called three putt bogey. And
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: we think that's kind of a fun and funny name that,
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: you know, that's kind of one of the worst things
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: that can happen on a golf course. That means you
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: have like on a par three, for example, you've hit
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: a great tee shot onto the green. You got a
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: shot at birdie, but you put it three times instead
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: for a bogey. So that really kind of sums up
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: where we are in our game. And I think it's
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: very relatable. And it's out now. It released on, I think,
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: episode one was Friday, September 25th. So you can go
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: out and listen to it right now wherever you get
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: your podcasts. And also follow us on socials, 3 Putt
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: Bogey Podcast on Instagram. We're going to have lots of
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: fun content on there.
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: Wow, that's a great name.
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: Thanks. Well, I mean, we hope it gets across like
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: what it is, which is, again, average guys having a
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: good time. What we're hoping to do is build a
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: community of, like, support. Because, like I said, it's a
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: hard game and, like, you know. The worst thing you
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: can do is go and play golf with people that
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: are like really want to beat you or like want
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: to gamble at golf and stuff. Like that's not my deal.
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: Adam and I are both kind of like cheerleaders when
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: we play with each other and with friends.
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: Do you dress like cheerleaders when you play?
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: Well, sometimes on Fridays.
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: That's cool. I think that's definitely the better way to
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: go is to do that rather than be like you
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: remember that one. Character on the pit who was hospitalized
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: because he did too much cocaine and drank too much
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: and blacked out and tried to kill somebody.
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the golfer. Yeah.
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: That's who I think of when you're describing the type
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: of golfer you just did. Yeah.
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: I mean, that's not me. Like, if you want to
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: go out there and play for money and really compete
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: against your friends, that's great if that's your deal. But
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: we're trying to build a show that's fun and encouraging,
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: and I hope people give it a shot.
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So maybe leave your fleece vest at the door
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: when you listen to your podcast. That's right.
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: But all this to say, we are about to start
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: an episode here in three, two, one about the history
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: of golf, because I think it's fairly interesting. It is.
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: One of the things I found quite interesting about it
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: is that it has not only some unclear origins. There's
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: a lot of people who just kind of say whatever
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: they want about the history of golf and it gets
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: spread around. It's like, yep, that's the history. And thankfully
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: we have great writers and researchers like Livia to be like, actually,
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: that's not true at all, which is one of my
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: favorite things to do. Yeah.
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: And I think some of the confusion comes in because
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: like many, many ancient places had games that involved hitting
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: a ball with a stick and Yeah. Sometimes into a hole.
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: So I think it's very easy for someone to say like, hey,
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: in ancient Rome, they had a game called Paganica. And
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: that was that was the first golf or someone might say, yeah, no.
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: In China, they had a game called Chui Wan or
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: hit ball and they had rules like golf. And so
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: it was kind of like golf. But I think we
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: can mostly agree that like golf, as we know, it started,
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: of course, in Scotland.
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and one of the stories goes that it was
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: bored Scottish shepherds who were like, let me use my
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: shepherd's hook to bat some rocks toward a hole in
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: the ground. That's probably not correct either. What they think,
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: at the very least what Livia thinks, is that— The
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: word golf, at least, if not golf itself, can actually
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: be found in Holland. And this isn't where, like, golf
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: comes from. I'm not trying to rewrite history here or
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: shake the boat. Everybody knows that, yes, like you said,
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: golf came from Scotland. But it's possible that the inspiration
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: for golf in Scotland came from there. At the very least,
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: it's almost certain that the word golf came from the Dutch.
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: That's right. Except it was C-O-L-F. That was a game
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: that at least that word was recorded in 1297 that
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: did involve hitting balls into holes. It was probably a
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: little more like cricket. But golf had other spellings throughout
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: the years. G-O-U-F-F.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: G-O-I-F-F.
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: G-O-I-F-F. G-O-W-F-F. G-O-L-P-H.
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: Golf.
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: That's right. You've seen Caddyshack, right? I know you're not
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: into golf, but have you seen that movie?
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I have. I'm more of a Happy Gilmore fan,
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: meaning it's one of my favorite movies. But Happy Gilmore 2? No, sir.
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: Oh, I didn't know there was a second one.
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: Oh, just wipe it from your memory that there is
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: a second Happy Gilmore.
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: All right. Will Ferrell has that new show too.
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: What new show? A golf show?
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah. It's called Hawk.
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: I had no idea golf was so popular.
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: It's super popular right now.
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: I'm just kidding. Okay.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: Well, I didn't know if you knew because it's kind
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: of come and gone as far as like, I think
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: it's like peak popularity.
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: Oh, really? I actually didn't know that. I didn't know
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: it had ever gone. I thought it was always generally
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: widely and wildly popular.
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, it's always been pretty popular. I mean,
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: I've got some stats for you if you want.
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, lay them on me.
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: Golf is 48 million Americans participate.
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: There's only 50. It is.
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: A.
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: Guess how much just United States annual economic effect golf
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: has in the United States.
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: I mean, obviously, I'm going to say it's in the billions,
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: but I have no guess between.
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: $ 226 billion.
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: That is not what I was going to guess.
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: Responsible for 1.65 million jobs. Wow. $ 80 billion in wages
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: in the U.S. And this is because, you know, golf
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: gets a bad rap because it's sort of an environmental
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: nightmare in a lot of ways. Yeah. So I'm trying
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: to highlight some of the good things. Sure. But golf,
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: $ 4. 6 billion annual in charitable contributions generated through golf, which
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: is more than all other pro sports combined. Oh, wow.
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: That's a great one, too. Nice work.
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: Which is pretty good. But jumping back to Caddyshack, I
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: mentioned that because there's that one great line from Ted
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: Knight when he's talking about the history of golf. He says,
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: but it was golf without the L.
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: I don't remember that one.
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: The thing I remember is, of course, the baby Ruth
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: in the bottom of the pool.
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: Right. Of course.
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: So, yeah. So we've got at least the word golf
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: from the Dutch. But golf, as we spell it today, G-O-L-F,
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: that was around the mid-1400s. And this is when people, well,
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: maybe not the mid-1400s, at least within the next hundred years,
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: People started golfing in Scotland, doing what we would recognize
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: as golf today. Like I have this stick or whatever,
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: and I have another one to do, to like drive with.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: I have one to putt with essentially. I'm hitting a
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: ball and I'm trying to get it into a hole
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: and the hole's way over there. So like what you could,
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: if as a golfer, Chuck, you could show up in
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: 16th century Scotland and be like, let's play. And you
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: guys would generally be able to work it out.
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Um, the earliest golf was sort of an urban version,
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: like where you played in the streets of the town. Uh,
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: they called that short golf. Um, but that was obviously
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: not the same as what they called long golf, which
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: was out in the pasture or a field. And we'll
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: talk about that evolution a little bit more. But, you know,
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: we know for sure golf was a thing then because
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: in 1457, there was an act of parliament in Scotland
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: signed by King James II that outlawed golf and football
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: because he said there were pointless sports and you should
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: be practicing like archery or something instead. And then there
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: were also complaints about people playing golf instead of going
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: to church. And that's where I found this kind of
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: fun little thing called Sunday sticks, which was a sneaky
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: way to get some golf in. Apparently they would flip
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: over a golf club and hold it as a cane.
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: So you're holding like the head of the golf club
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: and walk around, pretend like as if you needed a cane.
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: And then you flip that thing over and you can
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: just play a quick hole of golf with it, I guess.
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: Wow. Man, you really have to love golf to try
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: to deceive your entire town.
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and your Lord and Savior.
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: Exactly. Jesus is like, I see you for what you are.
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: That's right. And quit using my name in vain out
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: there on the course.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: Right. So that prohibition on golf from 1457, from King
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: James II, it apparently didn't take because in 1471 and 1491—
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: The Scottish Parliament said, like, stop playing golf. You're not
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: allowed to play golf. And it's probable that the golf
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: that they were referring to was short golf. Yeah. Which
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: is I don't I didn't catch how how much in
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: depth you went with short golf. Did you just mention it? Yeah.
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: Just that, you know, they played it sort of in
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: town on the streets of like the village.
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: That was a problem in and of itself because, you know,
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: you had glass windows and, you know, village people walking around.
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: So you don't want to hit them. But they were
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: probably banning short golf. Instead, if you were, say, aristocracy
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: and not like a working class person or a peasant
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: or something like that, you were like, OK, just ban
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: short golf. I'm going to play this new form called
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: long golf and I'm going to go play it in
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: the pasture lands.
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: That's right. Or a golfing ground. Or a lynx. And
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: that's where, you know, that's where that name first comes from.
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: Mainly around Scotland's east coast at the time. This is where,
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: you know, they weren't building a lot of buildings because
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: it was oceanside. It was pretty sandy. So there was,
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: you know, it was wide open land. Rabbits everywhere. Apparently
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: there's lore that rabbits may have, like rabbit holes were
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: some of the first golf holes.
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, makes sense.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: Not gophers. But. You know, some of these early terms
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: like links like had been around since the very beginning.
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: And also this idea that you go out to play
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: like nine holes in the back end on the back nine.
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: Like they were saying stuff like that. And they borrowed.
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: I never knew this. The term fairway, which if you
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: don't know anything about golf, when you tee off and
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: you hit it out there and hopefully the middle of
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: that green expanse that the middle of that green expanse
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: where the grass is the shortest is the fairway. And
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: that term is a sailing term, meaning the easiest direction
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: to go, which makes a lot of sense in terms
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: of golf.
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: For sure. So, OK, so we're in Scotland. It's the
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: 15th century. Parliament keeps trying to ban golf. The Scottish
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: people say no. And then finally, in 1502, they're like, fine,
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: we're going to lift the ban on golf. Everybody can
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: play golf. And the reason why is that not coincidentally,
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: James IV, who is the grandson of James II, who
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: was the first one to proclaim golf illegal. He went
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: to Perth in Scotland, not Australia, and he found out
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: about golf and he fell in love with it so much.
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: He came home with his own set of clubs and
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: was like, I'm into golf now. Let's all play golf
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: all the time.
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: That's right. There are also apparently receipts of the king
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: purchasing clubs in Edinburgh and St. Andrew around the same time.
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: So the royals are getting into it. So that means
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: everyone else can.
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: Well, not quite everyone, as we'll see. But Mary, Queen
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: of Scots, the granddaughter of King James IV, she ruled
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: from 1542 to 1567. Apparently she was into golf and
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: is one of the first women to just have any
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: sort of impact on the game at all, especially early on.
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: And apparently her enemies used that against her. They would
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: spread rumors that she played just a few days after
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: her second husband died. And that obviously was a violation
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: of how someone was thought to like mourn or like
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: how someone should mourn rather, but also like a bit
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: of a smear campaign that's just like it's not an
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: appropriate game for ladies at the time. And look at
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: what Mary Queen of Scots is doing.
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: Exactly. I say we come back or take a break
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: and then come back and possibly, if we're lucky, we'll
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: talk a little more about the history of golf.
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: Let's do it. Let's do it.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: Okay, Chuck. So we're back. And I think we kind
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: of have gotten across. It's really difficult to trace the
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: history of golf in any really legitimate manner and not
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: just make stuff up. That sounds cool. There are some
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: surviving documents that give us an idea of the early
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: contours of what golf was like. There's a textbook from
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: the 17th century, a diary from the 17th century, an
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: embarrassing poem from the 18th century. And a book of
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: golf instructions from the mid-19th century. And all of them
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: put together, kind of giving historians a pretty good view
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: on golf.
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. The poem I thought was pretty interesting.
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: That was in 1743 by Thomas Matheson. And it was,
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: you know, if you're writing a parody epic poem, and
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: it's called The Golf, G-O-F-F, as Ted Knight would love. And,
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: you know, there was a character, a goddess named Golfinia.
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: And it like that, that means it's pretty well in
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: the public like specter at this point.
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: Did you did you look that up? Oh, yeah. It's
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: a I mean, it is an epic poem about golf.
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: There's also that diary was by a guy named Thomas Kincaid,
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: who is a medical student at Edinburgh University, which we toured,
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: I think, at least some of their some parts of it.
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: But he was there in 1687. And he was like,
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: his diary was essentially like, I'm playing golf today and
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: this is what I'm doing. My swing's not so great.
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: I need to improve my swing. Here's how we handicap.
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: Here's what clubs are made of. Like, he was just
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: basically leaving a document for future historians that they couldn't
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: have asked for more than.
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he would have started his own podcast. Had that
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: been around at the time. But instead, he had a diary.
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: Which was very cool. And then, you know, there was
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: an instructional book called The Golfer's Manual. by a keen hand,
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: and that was 1857, and that was like the first
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: printed book of instruction from H.B. Farney. So golf is
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: definitely a thing by that point. St. Andrews is recognized,
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: the old course that is there, as the oldest surviving
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: golf course that's still around. It's been operating since at
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: least 1552. That's impressive. Which is, yeah, just incredible.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah.
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: It's still around. They'll still play the Open there every year.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: I'm not sure if it's like a set number of
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: years that they go back, but they still play it there.
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: The British Open?
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah. It's called specifically the Open.
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: Oh, okay.
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: People call it the British Open to differentiate it from
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: the U.S. Open, but I think the Scots are very
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: much like, no, it's just the Open.
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: There it is.
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: The Open.
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: Give us more, baby.
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: That's all you get.
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: Here, I've got one for you.
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: The Archbishop of St. Andrews, his name was John Hamilton,
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: back in 1552. This is how we know that it
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: was being played on at least since then. It was
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: probably being played on long before then because in 1552,
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: John Hamilton's like, fine, here's a charter. You people of St. Andrews,
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: my congregants, my people, you guys can play on the
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: links for, and here's where you do a John Hamilton
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: impression from 1552.
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: Golf, football, shooting, and all games.
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: Beautiful. That was a dead on John Hamilton.
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: I don't know why my Scottish accent sounds like I'm
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: about to choke at any second.
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: I feel like most Scottish impressions are like that. Like
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: think about groundskeeper Willie. He's like really worked up all
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: the time.
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: No, that's true. And I think I'm also just doing
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: Mike Myers from So I Married an Axe Murderer.
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Is that the if it's not Scottish, it's crap family?
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Hit.
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: Move. It was good stuff.
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it was very good stuff. That was a fun movie.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: Was it? I haven't seen it.
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it was funny.
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: I've seen all the Austin Powers movies. Does that count
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: for anything?
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, one of those is good.
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: There was Fat Bastard. He was Scottish.
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: That's right.
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: Boy, what an offensive character he was.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: So early on, these golfing grounds or links were, they
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: just used sort of what the land gave them, the
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: If there was a pond, that was a hazard. If
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: there was a big, like, hill in the middle of
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: the fairway, that was maybe not a hazard, but something
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: you had to get through.
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: Stationary tornado, hazard. That's right.
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: But they essentially created, like, the model for what a
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: golf course would be and what would look like as
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: people started to, like, construct and build golf courses. And
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: also the number of holes. I think the old course
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: was originally 22 holes, but in 1764, they did some
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: consolidating and eventually ended up with 18. And they were like,
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: that's the standard.
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the thing. That's why everybody's so into Scotland
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: as the origin or the cradle of golf, because not
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: only is that where golf really started and developed, that's
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: where like a lot of the terms are from, like
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: you said, links, A lot of the rules, a lot
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: of the standards, like the 18-hole golf course, they all
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: just kind of came from Scotland and spread from there.
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: Indisputably came from Scotland and spread from there. That's what
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: the beautiful thing is. We finally have made it out
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: of the murky past into the much clearer past for
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: the history of golf.
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: That's right. The Royal and Ancient Golf Club of St. Andrews,
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: or otherwise known as the RNA, originally was known as
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: Society of St. Andrews Golfers. That was founded in 1754.
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: By 22, quote, noblemen and gentlemen. And they, the RNA
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: is who basically runs the show. They took responsibility for
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: maintaining that old course, building the new course. So the
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: new course was 1895. That shows you how old golf is.
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: And they became the authority. I think in the late
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: 19th century, the RNA became the UK's authority for the
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: rules of the game. And they managed the Open or
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: the British Open, as we call it. And then other
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: stuff like big golf events over there.
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I saw that they are– I saw someone equate
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: them to the Augusta National Golf Club where they're just
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: an authority on the game and they are– they have
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: such authority they can actually issue rules and stuff like that.
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: Is that– that works out? I mean, it was Bleacher Report.
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: They're pretty legit.
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: I mean, that sounds about right. You're talking about where
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: they play the Masters here in Augusta, Georgia, a place
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: where I've never been.
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: I guess.
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, that's the one. I'm dying to go to
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: the Masters, but it's really, really hard to get tickets.
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: Yes, and I think you should do a call-out for
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: anyone who can get you Masters tickets to get them
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: to you.
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, if you want to host me at the Masters,
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: I mean, I can't believe I've never asked this. Please
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: and thank you.
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you'll bring the crackers for the pimento cheese.
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: I'll bring everything.
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: So....
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: You are a great guest. I remember when we were
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: in Canada, you picked up after yourself all the time.
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: You pushed each chair back into the table. Like, you
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: were a great guest.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: I appreciate that.
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: So, and I realize I'm being kind of jokey in
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: this episode. I'm not usually very jokey. But that's because
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: I have so little to offer in this episode that
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: I have to be the color commentator, I feel like.
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: That's right. You're doing great.
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: Like, you're Vern Lundquist. And I'm Dennis Miller in this one.
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: So we should talk about the 13 articles. There was
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: an event in 1744. It was a group known as
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: the Honorable Company of Edinburgh Golfers. And they created a
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: competition called the Silver Club. And in preparation for this,
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: they wrote out a document called the 13 articles. And
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: that was sort of the first official rule book of golf,
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: which is now like very much expanded today. As far
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: as the official rules of golf with like the PGA
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: and stuff like that.
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: I saw rule 11 was that you had to memorize
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: and then recite Matheson's epic poem, The Golf. Oh, wow. Yeah,
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: which is long.
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: Probably hard.
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: So golf finally showed up in England in 1603. Again,
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: it had been being played for 150 years by then.
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: But Scotland and England frequently went to war. They weren't
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: very friendly during this period. They became much friendlier when Mary,
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: Queen of Scots' son, James VI of Scotland, who was
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: the Scottish ruler at the time, he inherited the English
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: throne and he became James I of England. And so
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: Scotland and England became much cozier companions. And when James
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: I showed up, he had his crew with him, his entourage,
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: court as you call it. And among his court members
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: were a lot– or courtiers– were a lot of people
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: who were avid golf players. And just because they had
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: moved to a country that had never heard of golf before,
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: that wasn't going to stop them from continuing to play
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: anytime they could.
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it sounds like he's like, these are my boys
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: and we like to golf.
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: So go build me a course. And that's what happened.
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: They established a course in Blackheath near the Royal Palace
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: in Greenwich. And it didn't like spread far and wide though.
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: In fact, I think- It was like post-World War I
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: was when you finally got to 1,000 golf courses in
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: England and 200,000 golf enthusiasts. So in that interim time,
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: apparently a lot of doctors, like Scottish professionals living in England,
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: brought the sport over. People would go on vacation maybe
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: to Scotland, discover it, and come back and be like,
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: why aren't we playing golf in England yet? And eventually
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: they would get some momentum going. Someone would rent some land.
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: Someone would create a course, and they just started opening
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: eventually at the rate of about one golf course a
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: week by the 1890s in England.
• 25:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but then those courses would close down very quickly
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: just because it was like overbuilding malls at the time.
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: Or in my family's experience, racquetball clubs in the 80s.
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: My family was on a terrible streak in the early
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: mid-80s where we would join a racquetball club, the whole family–
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: And a month later, the place would shut down and
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: there went our money. And then we'd move on to
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: the next one. It easily happened at least three times
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: to us, if not more. Yeah.
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: It's crazy to remember when racquetball had a grip on
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: the United States in the 80s. It was fast and
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: wild and then basically went away. You never hear about
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: racquetball anymore.
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: No. I'm sure there's people who still play it quite
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: a bit.
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah. I love racquetball. I haven't played in Since
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: you and I did that commercial thing.
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: I forgot about that.
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: It's like 14 years ago.
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: That was awesome. It is great. The court sounds cool.
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: It's fun to watch.
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: It's a great workout.
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. And the bags are usually pretty awesome,
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: especially the early 80s racquetball bags. Yeah.
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: And pickleball, please. Get back to racquetball, people. That's what
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: I say.
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: Sure. Let's get back to it.
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: Maybe you and I should invest in a racquetball court.
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: Franchise?
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah.
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: We got to figure out a good name for it.
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: And it can't be some course reference to balls.
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: Right. Yeah. That's immediately what I thought.
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: No, we're going to have to workshop it further, Chuck.
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: All right.
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: Cool.
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: Speaking of workshopping, they had to workshop the number of
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: holes because, you know, 18 was the official number. But
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: most of these golf courses in England were nine hole courses.
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: And there's still plenty of nine hole courses out there.
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: But eventually they expanded to 18. And one downside to golf,
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: you know, early on in England was it drove up
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: the price of land quite a bit and also displaced
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: like cattle grazing and stuff like that and angered a
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: lot of farmers.
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: I mean, think about that, Chuck. Like England is not big,
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: but this is like 19th century England just had started
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: the Industrial Revolution and. Like there's already land that's there's
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: like a land grab going on for golf courses. It's
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: already having an effect. Like that's how golf course crazy
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: England went at the time. And yeah, some of the
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: farmers push back. I think that they would drive their
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: cattle onto the commons to graze during golf games to
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: basically send the message like take it elsewhere, guy. Yeah,
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: that's the best I could come up with. I'm a
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: terrible color commentator.
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: Well, you just can't say what you would say, which
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: is filthy. That's true.
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: You know me so well.
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. We've done pretty good over the years avoiding
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: that kind of filth and flooring.
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: For sure.
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: So a lot of these courses were created by the
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: sort of upper class and the aristocratic class, obviously. Sometimes
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: it might be a local government. But, you know, it
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: was a pretty bourgeois thing to play golf. And, you know,
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: in a lot of areas, it still is that way,
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: even though it's really been democratized in the past, like,
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: especially 20 years, I think. But the rise of the
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: industrial middle class in England was looking for stuff to
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: do for fun like this, and they played golf. It
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: was a good way to get out and enjoy nature
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: and to do something to keep your body moving.
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: The Industrial Revolution had taken hold and changed things enough
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: that the urban centers became like where people moved and lived.
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: And so golf was a really great way to get
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: out there, like you said, back to nature. People needed
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: it quite badly by then. And then the other thing
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: that happened thanks to the Industrial Revolution was the railroad
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: made it a lot easier to get further out into
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: the county, into the shires, as they call them.
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. So all of a sudden you had access.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: It gets you out into nature. That's still one of
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: the things I love about it the best is even
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: though there are frustrations, like those leave me very quickly.
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: I don't like get mad and stay mad. I get
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: mad for a second or two. And then you're out
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: there with your friends and you're walking around in this.
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: sun for four hours and not looking at your phone. And,
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: you know, it's great.
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: Not muttering to yourself.
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: I mutter a little bit, but no one likes playing
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: with someone who just gets mad. No. All the time.
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: That's just that's no fun.
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: That's a great personality trait to be able to let
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: it go. Let it go. I try. Let's take a
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: break and come back and talk about the USA.
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: All right, let's do it. All right. So we promised
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: talk of the United States. Golf in the U.S. goes
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: back a pretty long way, actually. In the 17th century,
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: when the American colonies were being populated from places like
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: Scotland and the Netherlands, which we brought up, they were like,
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: we want to play golf over here. Looks pretty good
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: to me. And people started playing in 1659. I think
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: that was verified that people were playing golf in Fort Orange,
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: New York, modern day Albany. And I guess that sort
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: of short style golf game. Right.
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: In the streets.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: That's right.
• 31:04
  Speaker 2: It's a four kid. The actually I think the Dutch
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: colonial government in what would probably be what like New
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: Amsterdam or something like that at the time. They were like,
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: you can't play the short golf stuff. Again, the windows
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: are really costly here. They're a high-end luxury. So let's
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: not break them with your golf balls anymore. Yeah.
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: So it was sort of playing out the same way
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: in the U.S. as it did in Scotland early on.
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: In 1743, there was a Scottish native that was 21
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: years old. Also, he was a slave trader. His name
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: was David Dees. And he had his gear shipped to
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: him in Charleston, South Carolina. And in 1841, the South
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: Carolina Golf Club established Harrelston Green in Charleston Park, which
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: I think is the first American golf club. And very disappointingly,
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: the caddies there were enslaved people.
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: Right. And it was I looked it up, the Harrelston
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: Golf Club or Harrelston Green, I should say. Is not
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: there anymore. But that was the first one in the
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: United States ever. Right.
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah. The oldest continuous or continually running course, I guess,
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: surviving course. A lot of ways you could say that
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: is also St. Andrews, but not in Scotland. In Yonkers,
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: New York in 1888, that was founded. Canada edges us out.
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: I think the Royal Montreal Club was founded in 1873. Yeah.
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: But I didn't know about St. Andrews and Yonkers. I'd
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: love to go play that course.
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: It became one of the founding members of the U.S.
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: Golf Association, which this story is one of my favorites
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: out of this whole thing.
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: Let's hear it.
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: Well, there's a guy named Charles Blair McDonald, and he
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: is the first person to call himself a golf architect.
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: He had Scottish roots, but he was from Chicago. But
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: he went back and studied at St. Andrews University in Scotland. So,
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: of course, he played golf a lot. And when he
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: came back to Chicago, he was like, hey, man, let's
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: get busy on turning Chicago into a world-class golf town.
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: And he started designing courses. And he became, yeah, a
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: very widely respected course architect. He was also a huge,
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: huge jerk. And because of his personality, he actually inadvertently
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: gave rise to the U.S. Golf Association. Yeah.
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: Didn't he, like, just pitch a tantrum or something?
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: He did. Two different ones. He played in two tournaments back-to-back,
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: placed second in both of them, and threw such a
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: hissy fit in both of these tournaments for placing second
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: that he called into question the legitimacy of the tournament.
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: He basically said that the players who placed first had cheated, like,
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: really was a sore loser. So much so that St.
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: Andrews and Yonkers and I think four other golf clubs
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: at the time got together and were like, we need
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: to come up with a set of rules that can't
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: be challenged or anything like that. None of this loosey-goosey
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: stuff because people like Charles Blair McDonald are out there.
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: They exist. We've seen now. So they got together to
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: formalize rules. Again, that became the USGA.
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: Oh.
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: And they did it because of Charles Blair McDonald and
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: his temper tantrums.
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: Wow. That's funny. Second is- Not bad, my friend.
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: No, no. And especially in a golf tournament?
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's weird. So by 1900, there's more than a
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: thousand golf courses in the U.S. And then just like
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: in England post-World War I, things really catch on even more.
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: A lot has changed equipment-wise in golf over the years.
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: Those early golf clubs were, you know, built by hand, obviously.
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: And they were all wood. You know, they were dense hardwoods,
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: basically like beech or holly. The shafts were made of wood.
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: The club heads early on were made of wood, maybe
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: ash or hazel for the shafts. And they had at
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: this point, you know, they were playing with a club
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: for a shot. So it wasn't just like, all right,
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: you've got two clubs. Go out there and do it.
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: Like you had, you know, there's a guy named Archibald Barry,
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: I think was the first guy to invent a standard
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: set of golf irons.
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. Yeah.
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: But they had, you know, they had different names for
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: the clubs, like the play club. was what you would
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: call a driver these days. A brassy would be equivalent
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: to a three-wood. A spoon was a five-wood. A cleek,
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: I saw a couple of things for cleek. I think
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: a cleek was like a one or two iron, which
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: is not a club that people really even use much anymore.
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: How come?
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: They're just really, really, really hard to hit.
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: It's like an iron that's just almost completely flat and
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: has no angle to it or loft.
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: No lift?
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. Okay. Uh, like I have a five iron
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: is the lowest iron I have. Some people have fours
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: and some like, you know, really good golfers might have
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: a two iron. But anyway, I think that's what a
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: cleek was, even though I saw something about a cleek putter. Uh,
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: they also had a baffy or a baffing spoon would
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: be like a seven wood and a Nick Blick would
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: be like a lofted wedge. Uh, and then all of
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: this was like, um, Like wood, wood, wood until you
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: finally started getting metal shafts. I think in the 1650s
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: were the first metal shafts, but they didn't really become
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: popular until much later on. And I think in 1930,
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: the Spalding Company started like numbering the irons. So they
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: got rid of like most of those words and just
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: use like the numbers.
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: Right. And then metal clubs weren't around really until the
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: 1980s or weren't common until the 80s. That kind of
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: surprised me.
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: Well, metal woods. Right.
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: Before then, they were like my very first driver when
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: I was 13 was a wooden driver. I mean, I
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: had a metal shaft, steel shaft, but it was a
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: wooden driver. But the face of it has like a
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: metal plate on the front of it. Sure.
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: No, I played golf. I was actually I led off
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: about the same time as that around age 13.
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I just mean for people listening, if they thought
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: like you're talking.
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: No, no, no.
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: Like when you say they had wooden heads, they had
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: wooden heads, but like a metal face plate.
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: Sure.
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: And then in the 1980s, like I remember my first
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: driver that had like an all metal head. And I
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: was just like, it felt like the future.
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: Gotcha. So one of the reasons they had to make
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: harder and harder clubs was because the balls themselves got harder,
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: I guess. Yeah. There was something called gutta perca, which
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: is from a Malaysian tree. It's a kind of latex.
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: And this completely changed the type of ball that golfers
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: were hitting before. I don't remember if we mentioned or not,
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: but it was boiled goose feathers packed tightly in a
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: leather exterior. That was a golf ball. That was like
• 38:05
  Speaker 2: the standard for a while. Now, all of a sudden,
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: you have this natural latex. It's way harder. And it's just,
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: I'm guessing, breaking your club naturally. pretty easily. So that's
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: why they advanced in the technology of clubs. And then
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: now that the clubs and the balls were working so well,
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: they had to actually go back and kind of rearrange
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: golf courses because people were hitting it way farther than
• 38:29
  Speaker 2: they had been before with the other, like the slightly
• 38:33
  Speaker 2: jankier equipment.
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. And these days, just the tech behind
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: golf clubs and golf balls is just you know, as
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: you would expect. It's like, so next level, it's kind
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: of funny, like how they manufacture these things now and
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: all like the R & D that goes into it.
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: Right. Yeah. I think that's a, I don't want to
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: say it's an issue I have with it, but there's
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: something that stands out to me, not just in golf,
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: but in life these days, everything has been optimized to
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: the maximum degree that it's just like, you know, here,
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: chase after this thing and you got enough money for this.
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: And This is going to make you a million times
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: better than you could be on your own through hard
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: work and effort or whatever. I don't know. It just
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: stands out to me.
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Golf for sure is a sport that wants to
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: sell you every new thing under the sun to make
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: you better.
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I imagine. And there's a lot of new things
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: under the sun. You said it was a 200 plus
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: billion dollar industry in just the U.S. alone. I imagine
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: that's the case.
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it is a little annoying, though. I'm with you
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: on that. OK, the term caddy was originally a term
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: for a Scottish errand boy. And one of the errands
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: was like, hey, come over here and carry my golf clubs.
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: I don't want to do that. The balls, those feathery
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: balls that you were talking about were expensive and And
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: so a lot of times you would have what's called
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: a four caddy. And this is someone who goes up
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: the course a bit to find your ball and like
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: spot where your ball went so they can retrieve it
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: for you. They still have caddies on some courses today, obviously.
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: I've had a caddy in like three or four times
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: maybe in my life because I don't usually play like
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: those super, super great courses. But it's a it's a
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: fun experience. Caddies are usually like like really nice and like,
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: you know, they work for tips.
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: So.
• 40:16
  Speaker 1: You know, they're out there to help you play your
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: best game and have a good time doing it.
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: I heard that the word caddy came from Mary Queen
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: of Scots who resided in France for a while. And
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: some of the French cadets would carry her clubs around.
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: And she lovingly referred to them as caddies. Is that
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: not true, Chuck?
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: That's not true.
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: Okay. In 19th century England, a lot of times these
• 40:44
  Speaker 1: were teenagers doing this kind of thing or maybe a
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: working class adult who couldn't go work at the factory
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: or something. You might work as a caddy. Apparently they
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: weren't treated super great back then. I did mention that
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: enslaved people were used in like early in the United
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: States as caddies. There were even reformers who were like
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: Trying to do work to get caddies to be treated better. Yeah.
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: And I love that Livia says provide them with shelter
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: on the course. She didn't use the word shack.
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: No, she didn't.
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: Just sitting there like staring at her. Yeah. It's pretty funny.
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: I wrote caddy shack.
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: Well, Livia also said, by the way, guys, I know
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: nothing about golf. So if I got anything wrong, take
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: it easy on me.
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: As far as I can tell, she did a great job.
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: No, she did a really good job.
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: And then pros, too, the idea of having a pro
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: on staff and then not just a golf pro who's
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: there to like teach you how to play, to tell
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: you what clubs you need, that kind of stuff. But
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: also basically people who maintain equipment, groundkeepers, they all started
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: to come around in England. And then if you were
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: a member of like a really good club, you probably
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: had like a famous player who was the pro. Yeah.
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: And then. if you were not a member of a
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: really great club, there was probably still a really good
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: Scottish golf player because Scottish players were like the gold standard.
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: I think if you belong to a club that had
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: like a non-Scottish pro or a non-famous pro, you probably
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: rethought where you sent your membership dues.
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. And, you know, that tradition continues today
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: with like, you know, every I don't know about every club,
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: but I think most golf clubs have a pro on
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: staff still today for various uses. I think it's a
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: good way to earn a living. I imagine most of
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: those people wanted to go out and play professionally on tour.
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: But I'm sure it's a great sort of gig to
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: fall back on.
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: For sure. So golf fever really started off in the
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: late 19th century. Like when magazines dedicated to golf started.
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: And then also one of the other indicators that golf
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: is just like this mass phenomenon is that it starts
• 42:59
  Speaker 2: showing up in other publications that had nothing to do
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: with golf. Right? Just like today. There was like mention
• 43:04
  Speaker 2: of golf. There was an article on golf or this
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: golfer or something like that. And I found probably one
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: of the most niche websites I've ever been on. It
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: dealt in antique golf magazines. cartoons from the 19th century
• 43:19
  Speaker 2: from magazines like punch. Um, did you see some of this?
• 43:23
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah. The, my favorite one was, uh, you know,
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: one of the biggest no-nos you can do when you
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: go to swing a club is to like lift your
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: head up.
• 43:32
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah. I like that one too.
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: Guaranteed bad result. Like keep your head down, keep your
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: head down. And there's been all sorts of various devices
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: over the years. Like literally a thing you hang around
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: your neck and attached to your crotch to like keep
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: you from lifting up. But there's one of those antique
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: cartoons had a guy with a, You know, a five
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: foot long beard that he was standing on to keep
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: him from lifting his head. I thought that was funny.
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: There's devices you attach to your crotch to keep your
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: head down while you swing. Does it like shock you
• 43:58
  Speaker 2: or something if you lift your head? Well, no.
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: If you lift your head up, it just pulls up,
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: you know, and I guess pulls up at your crotch. Like,
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: I don't think people use these. I remember seeing that
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: like 20 something years ago. Okay. It may have been
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: more of a novelty, but I do remember that existed.
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: It was by the company that make those hard hats
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: that hold beers and the straws come out of them?
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, probably so.
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: So one of the things that golf was long known
• 44:23
  Speaker 2: for was it was an elite white male sport or
• 44:28
  Speaker 2: recreation or pastime. And then slowly but surely over the years—
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: The gates open more and more and more to women,
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: to African-Americans in the United States. And in the meantime, though,
• 44:42
  Speaker 2: before those those gates open groups like women and like African-Americans,
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: they just were like, we like golf, too. We're going
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: to go do our own thing. So you had like
• 44:54
  Speaker 2: the LPGA that was formed in 1950. Yeah. The Chicago
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: Women's Golf Club, which was all African-American women, they formed
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: their club in 1937. And then the impression I have
• 45:07
  Speaker 2: is that the United Golfers Association, the African-American Men's Association,
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: was like the premier golf association starting back in 1925,
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: I think. Yeah, it's great.
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: I mean— You know, it's definitely a game and a
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: sport where there is still this old sort of country
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: club set that is still very white male oriented. Like
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: no one is denying that. There's a country club sort
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: of near my house and I have some friends that
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: are members that I get to play at sometimes. And
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: they're a pretty like progressive model, but they still have
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: like the men's lounge at, you know, the club that's got,
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: you know, the pool table and the darts and the
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: buffet and the bar and the cigars. And, you know,
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: the women there, they play golf, but they don't have
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: their own lounge.
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: So that kind of stuff is definitely still out there.
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: There are clubs that have just recently like allowed women
• 46:05
  Speaker 1: to be members or African-Americans or people from other ethnicities
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: to be members. So that's something that that sucks. But
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: it's changing. And I think golf is as democratized as
• 46:16
  Speaker 1: it's ever been right now. Um, especially like you go
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: out in Atlanta, uh, which is very African-American town and
• 46:22
  Speaker 1: you go out to public courses and, you know, these
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: are where I'm playing and the driving range, like right
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: near my house. And like, I'm, I'm a minority in
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: a lot of cases and it's, it's great to see.
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: I love that the game is being spread around to
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: more and more people. Uh, one of the fun segments
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: on the show I'm going to do is I got
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: these little, you know, the little microphones that you see
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: for Instagrammers and I'm going to go out to the
• 46:43
  Speaker 1: range and like talk to people and stuff. And, uh,
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: you know, that's going to be one of the segments. So.
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: That's awesome.
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: It's changed a lot over the years for the better,
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: I think. And people are I see guys with their
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: girlfriends out there a lot now, which seems something I'd
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: never used to see that it's becoming like a coupled
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: sport more than ever, which is awesome.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: I've noticed that, too.
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's cool. I love it.
• 47:04
  Speaker 2: So I think this is high time that you tell
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: everybody the name of your podcast again and when they
• 47:08
  Speaker 2: can get it and where they can get it, Chuck. Yeah.
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: Thanks, dude. In fact, I'm going to do this in
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: lieu of listener mail since we're running long. But, you know.
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: Once again, the show is with myself and Adam Pranica.
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: Adam's going to be on the cruise, by the way.
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he is.
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: He's my plus one. So we're going to have a
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: good time. The three of us are. And along with
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: Ben is coming instead of Jerry now. We should probably
• 47:31
  Speaker 1: announce that.
• 47:32
  Speaker 2: Yes, it's going to be fun.
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: I know we told everyone Jerry was coming, but she
• 47:37
  Speaker 1: can't come now.
• 47:38
  Speaker 2: You're going to meet producer Ben, who may or may
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: not actually be Jerry.
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: That's right. Yeah, once again, it's called Three Putt Bogey.
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: And it's already out. It's live, everybody. It was released
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: once again this past Friday, September 25th. So give it
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: a listen. I appreciate your support and appreciate your support, Josh,
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: for allowing me to do another solo record.
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: I don't have any say in it whatsoever.
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: Well, not allowing, being encouraging of it. Yeah, that's what
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: I mean.
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: Encouraging makes more sense. Yes, I am very encouraging. Go
• 48:12
  Speaker 2: knock them out of the park.
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: I appreciate that.
• 48:15
  Speaker 2: Is that a golf metaphor?
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: It absolutely is. A home run. And I look forward
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: to End of the World Part 2.
• 48:21
  Speaker 2: Oh, thanks, man. Someday. Someday.
• 48:23
  Speaker 1: You think so?
• 48:24
  Speaker 2: Something like it. Probably. Eventually. I'm not sure what, but
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we'll see how it goes. And I'll let you
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: know how taxing it is on me to do a
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: second show again.
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: Right. You're just going to be like, not worth it.
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: No, I'm sure it's going to be fun. And plus,
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: I mean, you'll have a great excuse to golf, golf, golf.
• 48:43
  Speaker 2: And I imagine expense it or at least write it off.
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: You know what? I can't do that. I actually checked
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: with my accountant.
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: Why can't you? That doesn't make any sense.
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: Well, it's funny because I was like, that wasn't the
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: reason I started it. But I was like, hey, man,
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: that'd be great if I could like write off stuff.
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: She actually has my accountant has a golf influencer and
• 49:03
  Speaker 1: someone else on her roster. So like she really knows
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: about this.
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: OK.
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: She was like, your dreams of writing off golf rounds
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: and equipment are not going to happen. She said, but
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: if you travel for a golf trip that is part
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: of the show, which is going to be part of
• 49:17
  Speaker 1: the show when Adam and I do our golf trips,
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: we're going to like talk about them and bring microphones
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: and stuff. She said, you can probably write off the travel.
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: Oh, that's good.
• 49:25
  Speaker 1: So like plane tickets and hotel, maybe.
• 49:27
  Speaker 2: Okay. That's something.
• 49:30
  Speaker 1: It's big stuff. I'll let everyone know how the write-offs
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: are going.
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And I'll let everyone know that you went to prison.
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: That's right.
• 49:37
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: Well, that's Chuck and Adam's podcast that's coming out. So
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: keep an ear out for it. It's going to be great.
• 49:45
  Speaker 2: And in the meantime, you can always email us here
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: at Stuff You Should Know at stuffpodcast at iheartradio.com.
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: Stuff You Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app. Apple Podcasts
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: are wherever you listen to your favorite shows.