Latest / Honey Badger Radio / The Problem with Lesbian Romance Novels! | Red Chill Cinema

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The Problem with Lesbian Romance Novels! | Red Chill Cinema · Honey Badger Radio

• 0:00
  Hi, and welcome to Honey Badgery Radio. I'll be your host, Alison,
• 0:05
  and with me today as always is Brian and we are going to be
• 0:09
  covering the problem with lesbian romance novels, which I know is a bit of
• 0:13
  a digression from our usual affair. Well is it really? I mean,
• 0:16
  because we do media quite a bit and this is a red chill cinema,
• 0:20
  so well media, there you go. It could work. Yeah, we'll
• 0:27
  do it. We'll figure it all out. So we're responding to a individual
• 0:32
  who apparently is not fond of lesbian or at least how lesbian. How it's
• 0:39
  written. One wonders how you could really write lesbian romance in a way that
• 0:45
  isn't boring as hell. But regardless, perhaps she can enlighten us. The
• 0:50
  channel is a sunny booknook. I don't know, does she seem really ideologically
• 0:55
  uh hunter postual to us? Well, she's not, like so I looked
• 1:03
  through the opus clips and you don't get the sense that she's an angry person.
• 1:10
  You know, that's like like walking around with a chip on her shoulder.
• 1:15
  But I do think that she's certainly like got the woke mind virus at
• 1:21
  least, so far as how it applies to LEB women and lesbians and women
• 1:26
  and queer theory and feminism, et cetera. So there's definitely that, But
• 1:32
  she's kind of like, I don't know, like my my ingreied on the
• 1:37
  surface is that she is an unfortunate casualty of a feminist dogma. Essentially,
• 1:45
  she learned how to be a woman from her you know, university professors,
• 1:49
  her English teachers, whatever, and she's just following through on it, and
• 1:55
  I don't know, you know, it's a little bit sad because she probably
• 1:57
  didn't have any other options. So yeah, it's, uh, well,
• 2:01
  she's doing she's doing the womanhood the way she's taught essentially, So there you
• 2:07
  go. She's she is. She is a product of the system, so
• 2:10
  exactly that's exactly right. She's a product of the system. So great.
• 2:15
  Okay, well let's let's see let's see the just sort of the put is
• 2:21
  now basically the factory standard. Yep, all right, yeah, sure,
• 2:28
  sure, yeah, sure, Okay, So if you enjoyed this actually,
• 2:31
  you know what, I haven't done that yet, so let's let's delay that
• 2:35
  for a moment. I was gonna say, if you enjoy this content,
• 2:37
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  Put you know, put a little pin in it. We'll get there.
• 2:52
  But if you want to send us a message at anytime throughout the show,
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  you can do so at feed the Badger dot com slash just the tip.
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  at least not to tip us and send us comments, So you can do
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  so on Twitter if you're watching us on Twitter at Feedbadger dot com slash just
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  the tip. All right, So I guess we just get started, eh
• 3:32
  yeah, get the party, get the party rolling, all right. Let's
• 3:38
  uh, so this is the first so we put the video through opus clip,
• 3:42
  and it like sort of like looked for highlights or what it thought were
• 3:46
  highlights. I think, And so this is the first one, which is
• 3:50
  kind of an introductory thing, or at least it sets up her conversation.
• 3:54
  So we'll play it as to why I think being romance novels specifically are not
• 4:03
  that good, why the genre doesn't really lend itself to good good writing,
• 4:11
  looking at some of the specific lesbian romances that I've read over the years,
• 4:15
  and how I think they just fall short and fail at doing the thing that
• 4:21
  romance novels are supposed to do and that I have gotten from romance novels of
• 4:26
  other sorts. Oh man, I wonder if she got total shit for this.
• 4:30
  I mean, this is this is actually like slightly controversial, you know
• 4:34
  what. She's saying that she's not totally fulfilled by romance novels that are all
• 4:41
  about the informed consent or never ending consent or like confirming consent, you know,
• 4:48
  like always taking the temperature every like thirty seconds? Right? Are you
• 4:53
  okay with this? Are you okay with this? Now? Are you okay
• 4:55
  with this now? Which also is a high pressure sales technique, is constantly
• 4:59
  asking questions to essentially erode people's ability to say no. So what you do
• 5:03
  is you just keep asking questions and then eventually you just exhaust people and then
• 5:09
  they just do whatever you want. And I'm guessing that feminists aren't intend you
• 5:14
  know what. I was about to say that feminists aren't intending to promote something
• 5:16
  that's actually occult, sort of like a little sexually abusive. But then I
• 5:21
  thought about it, and I'm like, of course they are. I'm done
• 5:28
  giving them the benefit of the doubt. Yeah, be talking about let me
• 5:33
  see here. I just wanted to make sure. So it is playing here,
• 5:40
  but the people watching on see the people watching on vertical, I want
• 5:46
  to make sure they can hear it because it is a separate set of frightens.
• 5:51
  So I'm just double check. I'm sorry, guys, No, no,
• 5:55
  no, I think it's okay. I'm just making our sound is fine.
• 6:00
  Yeah, our sound is fine. Let me just go and I want
• 6:06
  to go ahead, Okay, I apologize. I wanted to just say what
• 6:13
  romance is usually supposed to do, and with the Roman romance genre, and
• 6:17
  that includes also, for example, buddy cop films. So with romance,
• 6:23
  you're supposed to have. And I don't mean that in like a sexual way.
• 6:26
  It's it's basically two people who function as each other's biggest antagonists. And
• 6:30
  what I mean by that is they're the ones who are forcing the biggest amount
• 6:33
  of change in the other. And with with a buddy we'll use a buddy
• 6:39
  Buddy Cops for for an example. Each of the two cops changes the other
• 6:45
  in a significant way, and that is what is the central pillar of romance.
• 6:49
  And of course, a traditional romance, as acceptable to the romance writers
• 6:54
  of America, is that it has to end in a happy manner, so
• 6:57
  they have to get together in the end. So for a buddy cop romance,
• 7:00
  romance friends they become friends, they understand each other, and the idea
• 7:08
  is that it's two people who are coming together and learning to let go of
• 7:13
  an aspect of their individuality in order to put the relationship first right, in
• 7:17
  order to make room for that relationship in their life. And with the buddy
• 7:21
  cops, they have to learn to work together. With the traditional romance,
• 7:25
  the man and the woman have to let go of something in order to gain
• 7:30
  the relationship. And the first thing that all right, off the bat and
• 7:33
  I don't know if she's going to address it is with the new romance I've
• 7:38
  been seeing, they seem to have more of an emphasis on the man just
• 7:43
  changing for the woman. That's not actually traditional romance. Both are supposed to
• 7:46
  change put the relationship first. But what I've seen, and I'm there was
• 7:51
  a recent romance that I watched that it's just awful. It was it was
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  just so destroyingly awful, and the entire ten things I Hate about you know,
• 8:03
  what was it ten things about I Hate about? Yeah, yeah,
• 8:07
  it was, it was. It was. It was not that one.
• 8:09
  It was it was one that was almost completely forgettable. I'm sorry I can't
• 8:13
  remember the title, but it was something about hate and it was supposedly enemies
• 8:18
  to lovers scenario, except of course the man was always secretly you know,
• 8:24
  in love with her, and of course he's also like a you know,
• 8:28
  high powered executive type. But the premise is that he is part of a
• 8:33
  publishing empire, and he goes and works at her little book nook kind of
• 8:37
  publishing, uh, indie publisher kind of thing, and and he's he's bringing
• 8:43
  all that kind of corporate behavior, and throughout the course of the movie,
• 8:48
  she does absolutely nothing to earn him, nothing like less than nothing, and
• 8:56
  he just basically turns into a completely spineless simpy. For some reason, falls
• 9:07
  for her, for some reason, he does everything for her, He sacrifices
• 9:11
  his job for her. But but but but but he gets a better job,
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  so still got that higher or be going, you know. And she
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  does not extend herself at all, She does not change a damn whisker of
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  herself, and he just conforms to her ass like a man shaped leech.
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  And I mean, I don't mean I could probably get it. This is
• 9:37
  not romance. The essential component of romance is both characters are each other's antagonists.
• 9:43
  But I was thinking, like, in this kind of modern take on
• 9:46
  non mance, because I'm not gonna call it romance where the man just completely
• 9:52
  conforms to the woman, how do you actually how do you actually extrapolate that
• 9:58
  to lesbians? Which one's going to be the man, which one's going to
• 10:03
  be like totally debasing herself to conform to the other. I don't know.
• 10:07
  Yeah, it's it's a real question, isn't it. Yeah, I don't
• 10:11
  know what it's about. I mean, like, I mean, I don't
• 10:13
  know how and I don't know that this girl answers that question. This is
• 10:20
  the end of that clip, so it cuts off there. This is like
• 10:24
  one of the later clips. Maybe. Yeah, it's the last one on
• 10:28
  the list, but it sounds like it's early in the video. Okay,
• 10:31
  so you know what I mean. Like, it doesn't it's not putting them
• 10:35
  in chronological order when it selects the clips. It's kind of like setting up
• 10:39
  a set of I guess priorities. Yeah, the scores get higher as you
• 10:43
  go up. So all right, but anyway, do you do you want
• 10:48
  me to go to another another one? Sure? All right? Okay,
• 10:52
  so they have titles. So there's the last one is why romance not was
• 11:00
  fall short? Analyzing the genre's writing. That was the clip we just played.
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  Then there's exploring adult queerness, navigating romance and identity. Then there's escape
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  into the world of romance novels, a level of literary escapism. Yeah,
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  fascinating, diving a historical young adult female female romance. Let's go for number
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  two, number two on the list. Yeah, let's number two on the
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  list. Looks good. Let me just go to the top. Mm hmm,
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  what the what what happened? No? Nothing, it's just it's the
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  the whole screen moved over, and I don't know why I did that,
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  and I don't see how I can just yeah, all right, So this
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  is number two. Is Last Night at the Telegraph Club a compelling historical lesbian
• 11:50
  romance. Let's go for it. Yeah, sure, oh, because it
• 11:56
  is a I mean, I think the peak example that combined all of the
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  things that I'm talking about, that is it comminds all the things I'm talking
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  about in the sense of being good against all the ways that I think things
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  are not good and are part of the genres that I think like lend themselves
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  better to that aspect of female. A romance, historical A young adult is
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  fuck is last Night at the Time Technical Difficulties by Transitive Property a historical fiction
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  novel, and it's a romance novel at the heart of it, but it's
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  also like a young adult story about the coming of age of our main character,
• 12:35
  Lily, who is Chinese American, lives in San Francisco's Chinatown during the
• 12:41
  nineteen fifties, and it's like the Heighth of the Red Scare. She is
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  studying like Stem and the only other girl in her math class is this girl
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  named Catherine who's this Italian and they both as not that unlikely though. I
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  mean it's the fifties. Women were more likely to go into STEM at the
• 13:00
  time, get involved with the butchfem subculture there, and I think, like,
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  that's so beautiful and amazing, and their romance is so compelling and sweet.
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  We also talked about this book actually on the podcast, so you should
• 13:11
  check that out if you would be interested as well. That's I guess,
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  like an example of something that I found really compelling. I mean, so
• 13:20
  she's that's like an example of something that she thinks is good. Why because
• 13:24
  it checks boxes? Like what it sounds like? It checks boxes? Yes,
• 13:28
  that's what it sounds like. Do you want to listen to it again?
• 13:33
  No, I'm just like, maybe we should just go to the red
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  to the main move show video. Yeah, because it's almost sounds like there's
• 13:43
  nothing like it. There isn't like a an organized like a skeleton to this,
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  like a a spine, you know what I mean. Maybe maybe it's
• 13:54
  more in the Yeah, maybe it's more in the actual videos. All all
• 14:01
  right, Well, I mean we could go me to go to the beginning
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  of this. There are some there are no chapters, but there are there
• 14:07
  are peaks and valleys. Okay, yes, so we could try that.
• 14:11
  Okay, let's give that a go. I'm not feeling Just make sure we're
• 14:16
  not missing any chick. Yeah. The opus is like it would be good
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  if it was about hooking you in, like hooking somebody in to watch the
• 14:26
  content. But that means it's probably because most of the clips are not making
• 14:31
  a direct point, but they're hinting that there is a point. And so
• 14:35
  what what works is that people are like, oh, I want to watch
• 14:37
  the video now and find out what this is about, you know exactly anyway,
• 14:41
  So we'll just play it from the beginning here, and I'm I'm actually
• 14:46
  really concerned about the one where she says, well, this does it right?
• 14:50
  Yeah? What was the I mean, does it? Yeah? It
• 14:54
  doesn't? Like is it just checking boxes? There is the ultimate conclusion of
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  this is if it's sallacious, it's bad like last night at the Telegraph Club
• 15:03
  is what the name of it is? All right book that she was recommending.
• 15:07
  Okay, Hello, welcome to the Sonny Book Nook. My name is
• 15:11
  Sunny, and I have a problem with lesbian romances. I have a problem
• 15:18
  with I also have a problem with romance, like lesbian romance novels. If
• 15:26
  I sought them out, I might have a problem, but I I really
• 15:30
  have very little interest in it. Although I did change my video, So
• 15:33
  did I screw anything up? Nope? Well no, it looks fine.
• 15:37
  No, okay, good, Okay. I read a variety of genres.
• 15:41
  I read basically every genre. I will admit that the majority of what I
• 15:46
  read is literary fiction and a lot of speculative fiction as well. Lesbian literary
• 15:50
  fiction is often not always, but it's often pretty good in my in my
• 15:56
  opinion, Do you really read it though, like honestly literary thing? Do
• 16:00
  you read it? Or do you read like the first pack paragraph of every
• 16:03
  chapter and then tell everybody you read it, look at the cliff notes.
• 16:07
  I don't know how anybody can read literary fiction. It's a total direk well
• 16:12
  literary fiction or something modern literary fiction, modern literary Let me, let me
• 16:17
  qualify that modern literary fiction, because I actually understand the appeal of like older
• 16:22
  literary fiction, but modern literary fiction. I mean it's basically people sucking farts
• 16:30
  out of each other's butts butts buttholes. Yeah, I mean you can read
• 16:40
  literary fiction if it's What I've found is, if it's written by somebody who
• 16:44
  went through a war, it's very readable. But if it isn't, it's
• 16:48
  it's a lot of It usually amounts to a lot of fart sniffing. So
• 16:55
  went through a war or ran a homestead on the prairies. Those are the
• 17:00
  two options. Everything else is huff fart huffing. All right, Okay,
• 17:07
  yep, Okay. The thing is, I have a couple reasons as to
• 17:12
  why I think lesbian romance novels specifically are not that good, why the genre
• 17:21
  doesn't really lend itself to good good writing, looking at some of the specific
• 17:27
  lesbian romances that I've read over the years, and how I think they just
• 17:33
  fall short and fail at doing the thing that romance novels are supposed to do
• 17:38
  and that I have gotten from romance. Okay, I'm curious what she thinks
• 17:42
  romance novels are supposed to do, because I know, technically i'm talking about
• 17:49
  possibly like one percent, romance is something that's very easy to do very badly.
• 17:56
  So you know Sturgeon's law, ninety percent of shit, everything is crap.
• 18:00
  Well with romance novels. It's like ninety nine point nine percent of everything
• 18:03
  and in the genre is utter crap. But that's because there are the people
• 18:08
  who are attempting to write a romance in the traditional form, which includes things
• 18:15
  like pride and prejudice and stuff like that, which is actually pretty good reading.
• 18:18
  And then there are people who are simply making something to slick to.
• 18:23
  Yeah right, I don't know what she means by that. Yeah, so
• 18:26
  it's it's it's like because this could just be like, you know, like
• 18:32
  gooner material in the where in the Veneer of like literature. That's why she's
• 18:37
  exactly and sipping tea with makeup. But she's really so really you have to
• 18:41
  ask yourself, what is it? What is it you're saying that lesbian romance
• 18:47
  needs to do? Does it need to I don't know check boxes in your
• 18:52
  how you know how bad writing. You know how bad writing has gotten.
• 18:56
  And I know this even though I don't read. Sometimes I see ads on
• 19:03
  YouTube, Okay, sometimes they see ads on YouTube where there'll be like an
• 19:07
  ad before a video that's trying to sell a book, and they're like the
• 19:11
  worst tumblr bloggie plots ever. Like there was one of a of a.
• 19:17
  It even has animation to go along with it to sort of sell you in
• 19:19
  the book. And it was like I was the only wolf in my pack
• 19:22
  that couldn't transform and I was in heat and I had this and no one
• 19:29
  could tell it was a girl, right, And it was like it was
• 19:32
  an ad on YouTube and I was like, what is going on? And
• 19:34
  yeah it was. It was total like borderline lesbian furry smut, but disguised
• 19:44
  as literature, and it was a book. It was they were trying to
• 19:45
  sell a book. I'm yeah, it's basically pornography and there's some seriously screwed
• 19:53
  up in So what right off the bat, what are you trying to say
• 19:59
  that you're you want from this? Because most what most people want is an
• 20:07
  encouragement to you know, like just to start gooning. Yeah, like,
• 20:15
  what is it about? Well, let's see, let's I guess we'll listen
• 20:18
  to more novels of other sorts. I have read straight romance novels and male
• 20:23
  male gay romance novels. I've read historical romance novels and contemporary romance novels.
• 20:29
  I haven't read any fantasy romance novels. Really, I mean I think I
• 20:34
  read like a quatar once, like years ago, and I thought it was
• 20:37
  fine, and I read what was Court of Thorns and Roses? I read
• 20:44
  like a quatar, Sarah J. Mass Court a Court of Thorns and Roses.
• 20:51
  I actually attempted to read some of her. Right, it looks bad.
• 20:55
  It looks bad, just based on that, because technically I can say
• 20:59
  that I write fantasy romance in a technical sense. At least, my editors
• 21:08
  encouraged me to lean into the romance because the romance readers will tolerate all the
• 21:14
  weird time shenanigans to get their hit. But so I was researching romance in
• 21:22
  the fantasy genre, so I read some attempted to read some Sarah J.
• 21:26
  Mass. Let me see what this one is, Court of Thrones and Thorns
• 21:30
  and Roses. Oh yeah, this is the one that was sort of like,
• 21:33
  you know how fifty Shades of Gray is like a is a fan fic?
• 21:40
  Yeah, oh yeah yeah. Court of Thorns and Roses reminded me very
• 21:45
  strongly of the Hunger Games? Is it a super sexy Hunger Games? I
• 21:56
  didn't get to that point. It was just okay, the first chapter was
• 22:00
  really interesting, but then the protagonists martyrdom and whining got a little bit annoying,
• 22:07
  I think, is what happened. And I was just like, I'm
• 22:08
  done, I'm done, goodbye. I did read some of the Uh,
• 22:17
  I did read some of the the one star reviews. I really love that.
• 22:21
  I like going to read one star reviews from books. I'm pretty sure
• 22:26
  that ya novels are totally trash. Pretty sure. I'm not sure that the
• 22:32
  because pretty sure this has too much sexual content to be ya. Okay,
• 22:37
  well, I don't know. I mean I think that they they're moving in
• 22:41
  on that. Yeah, go ahead. Uh, well, you know,
• 22:47
  I'm done. I think we should just continue once like years ago, and
• 22:52
  I thought it was fine, and I read What's the Fairy one that everyone
• 22:55
  likes Holly Holly Black, Yeah, that one. I read the first book
• 22:59
  to that as well, and I thought it was fine as well. But
• 23:02
  I am a lesbian reader who reads lesbian books what I identify as lesbian books,
• 23:08
  and a lesbian novel. Okay, I'm just plausive for the veno.
• 23:14
  Okay, I never thought you'd be like, I'm a lesbian reader. Well,
• 23:17
  here's the book section for you. I guess I don't know a lesbian
• 23:22
  reader. Weird, it's weird. It is weird. It is weird.
• 23:25
  Latino reader, But are you though, Yeah, yes, I'm Latino and
• 23:30
  I read so, I'm a Latino reader. Yeah read dragon Mary. I'm
• 23:41
  being an asshole. Let's keep going. That's all right, all right,
• 23:44
  Well, lesbian literature, a lesbian romance novel is obviously at the center of
• 23:48
  it are two female characters who get together, or a lesbian relationship that is
• 23:53
  at the center of the novel, or lesbian dynamics and themes that are really
• 23:56
  present. That to me, is what makes a lesbian novel a lesbian novel.
• 24:03
  Of course, with romance novels FF, romance is its own thing,
• 24:07
  and like that is lesbian fiction, that is lesbian romance. That's the lesbian
• 24:11
  romance genre oftentimes. And this gets into my first point. I've noticed that
• 24:19
  I'm pausing for the banana. We'll listen to her first point. What's f
• 24:23
  F stand for f F? What do was the context that she said it?
• 24:30
  Novels. It's like a novel, type of lesbian book or something novel.
• 24:37
  I have a female female sorry female on female. Okay, it's the
• 24:42
  obvious sorry, weird, Like that's like a porn genre. F fm mmf
• 24:48
  whatever. So you're saying that, No, I know, But so what
• 24:52
  you're saying is is that what it sounds like she's saying is that lesbian novels
• 24:57
  are like there are no, oh, lesbian novels that don't become sexual because
• 25:04
  like how else? How else do they exist? You know what I'm saying,
• 25:10
  Like, yeah, yeah, it just seems it seems like these are
• 25:14
  all just smut, Like I mean, they kind of have to be on
• 25:18
  some level. Okay, anyway, wait what happened to my sources? Oh
• 25:23
  there it is. There is Okay, many ff romance novels. The two
• 25:27
  feel main characters that get together are not lesbians. That's fine, Okay,
• 25:33
  that's fine. But I just don't think it is necessarily a good representation of
• 25:38
  reality, if that makes sense. Like from what I understand, romance novels
• 25:45
  are of course a level of escapism and a way of inserting yourself into something
• 25:52
  that is appealing or experiencing. It's like all other forms of literature, right
• 25:56
  form of escapism and is immersive. Something that I find is kind of takes
• 26:02
  me out of a lot of the romance novels that I read is that most
• 26:07
  of these love interests and main characters are both bisexual or pansexual women who have
• 26:11
  male exes who sort of feature in the stories as well. Some example.
• 26:17
  Oh no, that's interesting. Mmm yeah, well, what a surprise,
• 26:22
  you're basically the genre is basically just fantasy for the main amount of readers,
• 26:30
  which are women who do have relationships with men. I mean, that's that's
• 26:37
  who it's really marketed for. It's not really marketed for lesbians, so yes,
• 26:44
  or so for lesbians who have always been lesbian, these books are not
• 26:48
  for you. But if you're a woman who has who's angry at an X
• 26:53
  or is just angry at men or whatever, then maybe this book is for
• 26:57
  you, yeah. Or if you just want to explore the scenario, yeah,
• 27:03
  or you just want to explode a scenario. Sure yet, all right,
• 27:07
  rules that I'm going to bring up are actually let me, I'm gonna
• 27:11
  look on my phone for this, because I have screenshots of like twenty five
• 27:14
  different romance novels that I've read over the last two years or three years ish
• 27:19
  that I would identify as like having some of these things that I think are
• 27:26
  some of my problems, I guess with lesbian romance, The lesbian romance Sean,
• 27:32
  I'm gonna say one thing. I will say one thing for this person.
• 27:37
  She doesn't make me hate my life like manifest though, I don't hate
• 27:44
  you. I don't feel the onset of cellular death. When I'm listening to
• 27:51
  you. I think, Yeah, you're right, she's pretty. She's just
• 27:53
  pretty much bog standard factory setting. I am what I've been taught, and
• 28:00
  uh like, I think she's a bit delulu about freaking lesbian novels because they're
• 28:07
  never going to really feature I guess, the pure lesbian It's just it's unlikely
• 28:15
  because it because the biggest part of the genre is going to be again women
• 28:22
  who do have relationships with men exploring the other side. Strangely, there's not
• 28:26
  a huge amount of that, you know for men. No, not a
• 28:33
  lot. Okay, let's keep going Temple. In the book Something to Talk
• 28:41
  About by Merril Wolsner, which follows this, it's like a fake dating Hollywood
• 28:48
  assistant and an older woman who is a really famous actress or actress who's like,
• 28:56
  you know, pretty pretty well known in the Hollywood circles, and they
• 29:00
  stint is definitely like I think she has male exes from what I remember,
• 29:04
  I read this a while ago, and Joe the Hollywood actress, she just
• 29:11
  like vaguely does not have any exes or like no one knows her sexuality,
• 29:18
  and that feels to me that's not really how lesbian romances are in real life,
• 29:26
  and I think, like that's what makes it different from male male romances.
• 29:32
  And I just, you know, felt like he was going for long.
• 29:36
  I don't know, so I think we need to get to a point
• 29:42
  like yeah, yeah, pausing for the banana. Hopefully there'll be like is
• 29:47
  that Oftentimes for those books like I haven't read any Emily Henry for example,
• 29:52
  but like for other contemporary romances that I've read that aren't lesbian, these characters
• 29:59
  are coming from positions that make sense, are realistic, and that I encounter,
• 30:03
  you know, like people who are out and proud in a way that
• 30:10
  their identities are like really central to their life. And I think that a
• 30:15
  lot of the sexualities of characters and female female romances that's not really necessarily the
• 30:21
  case I've noticed, which I think, like doesn't really doesn't make sense.
• 30:26
  Every lesbian I know is really proud to be a lesbian. And also every
• 30:30
  lesbian couple I know is usually comprised of two lesbians, not to by women.
• 30:36
  Sometimes it's one by woman and one lesbian. But to be honest,
• 30:40
  like, I just feel like it seems like a lot of these romance novels
• 30:45
  are kind of even while being lesbian. Point, she's just just waffling as
• 30:55
  pophobic in the way that it's phobic because the characters are not full on,
• 31:00
  super proud, hardcore militant butch lesbians like you. No, she likes the
• 31:10
  butcher stuff. It comes up the cliffs. There's a lot of mention of
• 31:14
  that, although she doesn't appear to be butch, but then she does have
• 31:17
  that the nose ring. I don't know, but yeah, I mean,
• 31:22
  I don't like. I guess what I'm what I'm wondering about is, uh,
• 31:27
  how do you how do you even like? How do you even write?
• 31:33
  Like when you write, let's okay, when you write a heterosexual romance
• 31:37
  and not like this the Penguin book smut stuff that the women like where it's
• 31:42
  because they're all formulaic, right, It's like the say, you could turn
• 31:45
  to a certain page in the book and that's when the sex is happening,
• 31:48
  and it's it's basically just porn for women. But if you want to write
• 31:52
  a real like a real story that has romance in it, like that has
• 31:56
  a romantic theme that runs through it, I don't know, whatever it is
• 31:59
  the boss Estonians or you know, some and some Shakespeare or some you know,
• 32:08
  I don't know, just something like like you mentioned Bride and Prejudice,
• 32:12
  Like it's not smut, it's it's you know, it involves like let's say,
• 32:17
  for the example, it involves a man and a woman. And why
• 32:22
  do those work? And can you take that template and simply apply it to
• 32:27
  either two men or two women? And I don't think that lesbian, but
• 32:30
  I think that lesbian romance novels and maybe also gay romance novels, if they
• 32:36
  exist, I'm sure they do. I think they are written explicitly to kind
• 32:43
  of not be of let's say, formulaic in a heterosexual sense. Okay,
• 32:52
  so you think that lesbian novels are not okay, First of all, one
• 32:54
  of the problems is, yes, you can apply it to men, but
• 32:57
  no, you cannot apply it to women. And the reason why is because
• 33:00
  women's characters are extremely limited in this particular orthodoxy that we exist within and the
• 33:07
  range of stories. And it's even more limited when you're talking about lesbians,
• 33:12
  because each of these characters is going to have to contend with being a lesbian
• 33:17
  and what that means in the society and smashing the patriarchy, and that is
• 33:22
  going to end up consuming their individual personalities. With the heterosexual romance, the
• 33:28
  important thing is you got two individuals who are contending with themselves and contending with
• 33:32
  the relationship. When you take away a man, or often if you have
• 33:37
  a man paired with a woman, you may end up with just one person,
• 33:42
  one individual contending with himself and contending with the relationship, and the woman
• 33:45
  is just basically a metric by which she measures his ability to Like when I
• 33:52
  was talking about that woman who was part of the I guess the small publisher
• 33:57
  and then this guy came in from a more professional publishing outlet. When I
• 34:02
  talked about that that there is two sides to that. On the one hand,
• 34:07
  he becomes entirely defined by her needs. But on the other hand,
• 34:12
  she becomes entirely defined by her needs, you know, and whether or not
• 34:17
  he is meeting them. So there's no sense of development of herself. There's
• 34:22
  no going inside herself and becoming stronger, being able to effect change in the
• 34:29
  greater world, being able to manage herself and her own bullshit. There's none
• 34:32
  of that, So there's no real development of the individual female like the individual
• 34:37
  woman now there was in past romances like Pride and Prejudice. Not only did
• 34:44
  the main female character have to overcome her prejudice towards the main male character and
• 34:49
  actually see beyond the surface level, she also had to stand up to his
• 34:52
  very class conscious aunt who did not want him marrying a squire's daw. Basically,
• 35:00
  when she was based like redescended from nobility or royal blood, it's it's
• 35:06
  it's last stuff. But but she had to develop the chops to stand up
• 35:12
  for herself. She had to develop the chops to question herself and all of
• 35:15
  that, or she wasn't going to be worthy of the relationship. You don't
• 35:19
  see that, You get see less and less and less the closer you get
• 35:21
  to the modern time of that of that recognition of women's individual moral development in
• 35:25
  romance. Now, so with with modern romance, you can have a situation
• 35:31
  where a man is the only one doing any kind of developing, and only
• 35:36
  one developing himself as an individual and the woman is basically just a blob of
• 35:40
  needs that he has to accommodate. And but but that starts to like that,
• 35:47
  the whole concept and the whole enjoyability of it starts to deteriorate. Then
• 35:53
  you have two women, Well you got two women who are blobs of needs,
• 36:00
  and who's going to attend to those needs? So even that tension is
• 36:02
  gone, right, and then it's all about the victimhood because they have to
• 36:08
  somewhere. The movement has to come. So it comes from the persecution by
• 36:13
  a horrible patriarchal society, the hatred of men towards women, whatever, that
• 36:19
  something kind of external force. It's the only place where you're going to find
• 36:22
  tension because you can't start to explore the individuality of these women and how they
• 36:27
  develop themselves because you're not really recognizing that. So a classical romance between two
• 36:34
  men is doable, although there's some horrendous crap going on there, just because
• 36:38
  you have you don't get away from recognizing the individuality. Although to be fair,
• 36:46
  women can screw that up really badly by simply a over identifying one of
• 36:51
  the men with like a thirteen year old girl, or making them both thirteen
• 36:54
  year old girls. But but you see what I'm getting at. It's like,
• 36:58
  yeah, when you have two women, the tension just drains out of
• 37:01
  everything because now it's no longer about who they are as individuals, and there's
• 37:07
  nobody actually being an individual, so there's no real tension. It's just a
• 37:12
  mess. And the other thing is that it's going to be even worse.
• 37:15
  When she's talking about, oh, I want this to be like pure lesbians,
• 37:19
  Well, you're just going to make that twenty times worse because on top
• 37:22
  of being women, they are now lesbians, which means they have no agency
• 37:27
  whatsoever, and they cannot develop individually because that would be lesbianist. I think.
• 37:36
  Okay, she said lesbophobic is actually lesbophobic phobic. You need to understand
• 37:40
  any recognition of individual moral worth is the intersectionalists have a word for it for
• 37:47
  any particular group except for men. Men can continue to be interesting individuals who
• 37:52
  develop, who deal with their own bullshit, who becomes stronger, whose stories
• 37:58
  are fascinating and compelling, and everybody wants to read, which is why male
• 38:01
  authors have a huge female viewership readership, whereas female reader authors do not have
• 38:09
  a huge male readership, you know, so we're we're going to continue to
• 38:13
  make men the best characters in fiction by constantly erasing the individuality of every other
• 38:21
  group. But you know, and ultimately, like this is this is this
• 38:28
  complaint is ridiculous because she's essentially saying, oh, because this is a genre
• 38:35
  that appeals to a subset of straight and bisexual women, and they are much
• 38:39
  larger in number than lesbians. I have a whole bunch of options that I
• 38:45
  wouldn't have if that weren't the case. Plus, you also have the classical
• 38:50
  lesbian romance, which you know, you read one of them, and you
• 38:54
  probably have read every single one of them, let's be honest. Yeah,
• 38:59
  But like, the truth is that lesbian romance as a sub genre of romance
• 39:06
  is the size that it is because of bisexual and straight women's interests. The
• 39:12
  end, if they didn't have an interest, you would probably have three options.
• 39:20
  So there you go, you don't, okay, all right? They
• 39:28
  exclude lesbian experiences and are very still centered on previous relationships that women have with
• 39:37
  men in the aftermath of those things, which that is also a true experience
• 39:42
  of many people, and many by women. And lesbians even in like my
• 39:47
  life, but I think that that a man turned them into lesbians or I
• 39:54
  just want aftermath being with a man. Yeah, especially for the female female
• 40:01
  like romance genre. I'm actually curious that it is really because you know,
• 40:07
  every time there's a shooting, there's some guy who throws himself in front of
• 40:10
  a bullet for his female partner. I notice that or or tries to take
• 40:15
  down the shooter. I'm wondering, let's be a relationship which one of you
• 40:17
  throws themselves in front of the bullet, like you do you have to?
• 40:22
  Does it? Do you toss a coin like because it seems like there's something
• 40:29
  going on? Yeah, you know, but we're and actually, honestly,
• 40:31
  that's a more interesting that's more that makes a more interesting premise for romance too.
• 40:37
  And I know I don't want to over encourage like men's sacrifice for women,
• 40:42
  but men sacrifice for women, women sacrifice for each other, and that
• 40:47
  makes that challenging a challenge, yeah, like if you well, challenging for
• 40:55
  by the standards today. But okay, let's keep going. You know what
• 41:01
  I'm just well, what I'm what I'm saying is, uh, it would
• 41:06
  be like if you if you wanted to explore lesbian romance, you could do
• 41:09
  it and involve a sacrifice, right, Yeah, So I'm just saying like
• 41:15
  you could do that. I don't know, like you like that's why I
• 41:22
  said. But in the beginning I said that, like you know, if
• 41:23
  you if you look at the way that good heterosexual romance stories are written,
• 41:30
  then look at what elements, what are the elements in them that work,
• 41:34
  and then see if you can translate will that translate over to a lesbian relationship?
• 41:39
  And I think you're right. I don't think it will as well.
• 41:44
  And it's almost like that's why maybe there they just turn out to be.
• 41:51
  It sounds like they're just kind of political to me, like they're just kind
• 41:54
  of political screeds like, oh, well, well we got nothing else,
• 41:58
  so let's make it about the patriarch. You know, well, like I
• 42:00
  said, there's no other tension. So yeah, because again, like that
• 42:07
  bechel test I suppose maybe specifically for like lesbian romances, when I feel like
• 42:15
  that's not really the case for gay romances, and for straight romances, your
• 42:20
  ex oftentimes like the ex'es and gay romances are like also men or in straight
• 42:27
  romances it's not like, obviously there's not that issue of having to contend with
• 42:30
  your identity. And I don't know, I find it a little disingenuous at
• 42:36
  a certain point, I suppose, But I can sort of sympathize with this
• 42:40
  because I can see what's probably happening. They're using a straight and maybe bisexual
• 42:46
  women are using lesbian romance as a maybe catharsis to their romantic relationships with men
• 42:55
  and their their gripes about that, and they bring that in and I can
• 43:00
  see why that would be annoying if you have a genuine interest in the romance
• 43:04
  between women that it's not a statement about men, you know what I mean.
• 43:08
  Yeah, But also she says that it's also gay men have, at
• 43:14
  least the way they're written, apparently also are like, you know, they
• 43:19
  have men in their history, and I wonder if that's not, like,
• 43:22
  if that's not basically the constant throughout is that there has to be a background
• 43:29
  where there was a man and that man hurt them or broke them or did
• 43:35
  them wrong or something, and can't do that with a woman exactly. Like
• 43:39
  That's that makes me wonder, And that's the funny thing, is that how
• 43:43
  come all of these How many of these lesbian romance books end up in a
• 43:47
  fistfight? Like, I don't know how many fight scenes there are. These
• 43:51
  lesbians are so big on the domestic violence now, But seriously, I think
• 43:54
  that that might be the reason. I think that, And it goes back
• 43:58
  to what I was saying about it possible being political, because there has to
• 44:02
  be like, Okay, we're gonna make this. Like if you create any
• 44:07
  piece of media and you're trying to include a kind of identity in the story
• 44:15
  that is superficially intersectional, like I'm gonna make this about an Asian girl,
• 44:21
  I'm gonna make this about a you know, a trans Muslim, I'm gonna
• 44:24
  make this about whatever. In nine times out of ten, that identity takes
• 44:30
  the front row seat in all of the story choices you make. Because now
• 44:35
  all of that every choice you want to make in the story, you have
• 44:38
  to consider how it impacts this political purse puppy that you've created for your story.
• 44:45
  So lesbian romance stories are going to run into that problem because I'm betting
• 44:52
  that most of the people who write them are doing it. From that,
• 44:55
  I'm gonna write a story about a lesbian woman because no one's ever done it
• 44:59
  before, and I'm gonna do it. And then they sit down and they're
• 45:02
  doing it, and they're like, well, she's she's got a history.
• 45:06
  It can't be another woman because that's not good for the sisterhood. So we're
• 45:08
  gonna put We're gonna make it like some you know guy used to beat her
• 45:13
  and he drank all the time and all of the usual Like, let's just
• 45:15
  cross off all the stereotypes, right. He was a redneck, he wore
• 45:19
  a maga hat, you know, he liked beer and watching sports and all
• 45:23
  this other stuff. And she couldn't take it anymore. And so she fled
• 45:28
  to the arms of another woman who listened to her, who you know,
• 45:31
  heard her problems. Whatever. She's like, she runs up to an animal
• 45:37
  shelter. She's got like you know, you know, all of that stuff,
• 45:42
  and I think that it is like that. I think that's her issue,
• 45:46
  but she's not gonna be able to identify it if she's concerned about the
• 45:53
  way that lesbianism is represented and not exploring the possibility that a woman who leaves
• 46:00
  another woman someone was in the wrong. There there was some problem and a
• 46:05
  good story with that kind of back story to it, like where there was
• 46:08
  an old relationship and it went sour. That can't be like something simple like
• 46:15
  well, we just didn't see eye to eye. It has to be something
• 46:17
  kind of dramatic because it adds to whatever the tensions are, right, Like
• 46:22
  if they were controlling, Let's say, and you you do like a relationship
• 46:28
  where lesbian's breakup because one of them is like really controlling and always plays the
• 46:34
  victim and uses it to control the behavior or the other and the other one's
• 46:37
  like, I gotta get out of this. This is toxic. Whatever reminds
• 46:39
  me of my mother, you know, And and they leave and then like
• 46:43
  she meets the new girl. The new girl's kind of you know, like
• 46:45
  the opposite of that whatever. She's like more I don't know, like not
• 46:51
  not as controlling, a better listener, whatever. And then the controlling woman
• 46:54
  comes back into the you know, into the picture, and then it creates
• 46:58
  all but like you need that otherwise it doesn't work or like a rival boring,
• 47:02
  Yeah, otherwise it's boring, right, So that's I'm just making that
• 47:07
  up. But I'm I'm thinking, like this is what she's she sees that
• 47:12
  there's a problem with it. But what she doesn't seem to get is it
• 47:15
  is not an accident. It is it is kind of by design because the
• 47:21
  people who write this kind of stuff, if people create this content, especially
• 47:23
  today, whether it's literature or television or film or video games or music,
• 47:29
  even they're doing it from a specific kind of identity like oriented angle and that,
• 47:37
  and there are things associated with that that take precedent, so it will
• 47:40
  affect the storytelling, but they think it's worth it. That's how you get
• 47:43
  lesbian space witches. That's how you get them. Oh, I'm gonna I'm
• 47:46
  thinking of watching that and maybe covering it. I've never watched it. I
• 47:52
  I no interest, no interest. Okay, no, Star Wars is dead,
• 48:00
  so damn. But but uh but yeah, I mean like I know
• 48:04
  about it. I know what the plot points are and stuff. So all
• 48:08
  right, let's play some more of the video. I don't know, maybe
• 48:12
  I'm wrong for that. This is just a general trend that I'm noticing,
• 48:15
  like even in lesbian literary fiction, and this is just for lesbian fiction in
• 48:20
  general. So much of what is published and what is on the market and
• 48:27
  the books that are out there feature characters who are not lesbians, but get
• 48:34
  involved in lesbian relationships. Okay, all right, how many times is she
• 48:37
  gonna say this? I don't know, you jump to one of these humps,
• 48:43
  these spikes. Sure, let's jump to a spike. And also like
• 48:49
  yeah, I think you I think you're on point there, Brian. The
• 48:52
  reason why they do that is because they don't want to have a woman ex
• 48:55
  who is a nutcase. And you can do anything with a MALEX, right.
• 49:00
  You can make it a serial killer. You can make them a stalker,
• 49:01
  you can make them a rapist, a rapist, you can make them
• 49:04
  a freaking genocide er. You, I mean, the sky is a limit
• 49:07
  With a male X, like, you can make them any shades of evil.
• 49:12
  What can the hell can you do with a female X? Well,
• 49:15
  she just she just me or you don't even have to make it evil,
• 49:20
  like you can just have like say a scenario where in a heterosexual romance where
• 49:27
  there is a girl and there's a love triangle, there are two men they're
• 49:30
  interested in the same woman and there's a rivalry. It's like you know,
• 49:34
  Team Edward or team whatever his name is, like from Twilight, Right,
• 49:38
  and that is enough to get like readers and gross because they like, start
• 49:43
  picking their favorites and then and a good writer will probably make both of them
• 49:46
  appealing right to the point where you don't know which one is good for her
• 49:50
  or whatever, as long as the woman is not a pain in the ass,
• 49:52
  because if the woman is unlikable, then you're just gonna want them to
• 49:57
  be a lot like what these guys they shouldn't be with her, she's not
• 50:00
  worth it. But if you make all of them appealing and you keep people
• 50:04
  on the edge of the seat, you can make a rivalry look good.
• 50:07
  It's another thing that they don't want to do. And I think it's because
• 50:08
  they don't want Lesbie. They don't want women in competition with women. They
• 50:13
  don't even though women are always in competition with women. Yeah, and the
• 50:16
  problem with the female ex is even if you make a female ex, if
• 50:22
  you don't make them evil, then why did they leave? Then then it's
• 50:25
  bad on the on the person, like you know, it looks bad on
• 50:29
  the on the person who did it, or it's just dull. You just
• 50:32
  say, well, we just grew apart, you know, and then that's
• 50:36
  it, right, And then why are you even including them? Like why
• 50:38
  would you include an ex unless they're the the inclusion of the X actually increases
• 50:44
  the tension. Yeah, that's really interesting, isn't it. Like a male
• 50:50
  ex can add so much to a story that a female ex just can't because
• 50:55
  they thinks so much with the characterization of a male ex and you can also
• 51:00
  have it, well, you can blame him, and you can also you
• 51:02
  don't don't have to blame the female character who left him as much, you
• 51:07
  know what I mean, Like you can you can have her leave him for
• 51:12
  superficial reasons and people will still buy her as a sympathetic character, you know,
• 51:16
  but if if she leaves another woman, she becomes less and less sympathetic,
• 51:21
  right, yeah, okay, Well one other thing too that they could
• 51:24
  do with arrival. This is what they would likely do even if they did
• 51:29
  have something like where they need to figure out, like, you know,
• 51:31
  what happened with a past female partner, is that she could have gone to
• 51:37
  a man which would make her a traitor in a way or something like that,
• 51:40
  right, or go back to her old man, her old ex boyfriend
• 51:45
  who was not good for her or whatever, and she didn't know, you
• 51:49
  know, what she was doing. I don't know, something like that.
• 51:50
  There there there are ways, there are new ways, novel ways to make
• 51:53
  men in fiction more and more unsympathetic and so all right, yeah, but
• 52:01
  that's why the male ex will always be more pervasive and always be more likely
• 52:07
  to be part of the fiction. Like I said, he can add so
• 52:09
  much more tension without sacrificing the sympathy of the female protagonists. So sorry,
• 52:17
  lady, Like, if you want to do if you want that to change,
• 52:21
  then you're gonna have to accept portrayals of women that you probably wouldn't accept
• 52:29
  dark feminine. Man, Yeah, you're gonna have to explore the dark feminine.
• 52:31
  You're gonna have to accept fiction like that other than and like I talked
• 52:36
  about how when you when you have the women, you have two women,
• 52:42
  you limit how much you can do with those women for the same reason that
• 52:46
  when you have a female ex you're limited in what they can bling to the
• 52:50
  story for exactly the same reason, because the women cease to be interesting individuals
• 52:55
  and they become ciphers for a morality. Play can't do certain things with women
• 53:00
  because otherwise it's it's sexist, right, you can't do things with women because
• 53:06
  I just I guess the the idea of women being totally evil. I mean,
• 53:10
  how's this for a lesbian romance one half or a woman who gets involved
• 53:16
  with an incredibly abusive lesbian partner who tries to suck her into a cult that
• 53:22
  kills boys, and then she has to escape that and overcome it, and
• 53:30
  then with her new FBI girlfriend she goes back and she there. That sounds
• 53:38
  like it would be actually interesting to listen. But you can't do that.
• 53:43
  Can you do that? Could you even consider publishing that something like that in
• 53:46
  today's publishing industry? Absolutely not. So you're stuck with male axes for the
• 53:52
  same reason as every time the woke writers attempt to make male characters less interesting,
• 54:00
  they make them more interesting because are the only ones who have any flaws.
• 54:05
  They're the only ones who have to strive. They're the only ones whose
• 54:07
  individual moral actions matter in a way that the others don't. And they keep
• 54:13
  doing this over and over again. They don't understand why. Oh man,
• 54:19
  we should call this the we should call this the interesting male ex theory hypothesis.
• 54:27
  Yeah, male characters are interesting for the reason why your so many romance
• 54:32
  novels have ex boyfriends, Because you can just do so much with them and
• 54:37
  add and they add so much to the story. All right, possibilities are
• 54:40
  endless. All right. Couple of like the dozens that I know that are
• 54:46
  like two bisexual women or two bisexual feminine women, which is what is seems
• 54:52
  like to be the majority of these books, like most of Alexandra Bellaflir's books.
• 54:58
  And she is a ma So I think she's saying they're not writing enough
• 55:01
  butch lesbian stories. They're all like feminine, lipstick lesbian stories. And I
• 55:07
  think it's because, again, they're not for butch lesbians. They're four like
• 55:14
  regular women. They just want to like explore the material. They like the
• 55:17
  idea of you know, it's like Yuri. Isn't that what Yuri is?
• 55:21
  I don't know. Yeah, yeah, so the girl girls in Uri are
• 55:24
  very feminine and like that, Like they're not and they're not explicitly lesbian,
• 55:30
  but lesbian things happen, I guess, I don't know. So they're hetero
• 55:36
  flexible. Yeah yeah, Well, honestly, I think she's just repeating herself.
• 55:42
  But let's let's see, I mean, does she make another point.
• 55:45
  I don't know. I don't know. I got a super I mean,
• 55:47
  a rumble rant. So I want to read that really quick. Nova Fan
• 55:52
  twenty one Thank you, NOBA Fan says for a dollar, does she not
• 55:55
  know that even when her diversity fantasy is realistic, it's triggering to others,
• 56:00
  and when it's presented as empowering that the reader base still complain because real life
• 56:06
  still sucks. M Yeah, I don't know, thank you. I probably
• 56:13
  not. I'll just say that she probably does not know that. All right,
• 56:15
  there is another peak coming. So let's see where Alexander Bellaflour is a
• 56:20
  major female female conemporary romance author, and that's basically all of all of her
• 56:25
  characters, and then with Ashley Herring Blake in the first book of her Bright
• 56:32
  Fall series, Dalilah Green doesn't care. I mean she does a similar thing
• 56:38
  again, like it's two by women who get together, I think, or
• 56:43
  it might be one lesbian and one by woman. It varies between all of
• 56:46
  her books, but it's always like two feminine women or two Yeah. See,
• 56:52
  so I knew that she was going to get into the Delilah is the
• 56:57
  woman who was sent in to destroy Samson something about like I'm gonna assume this
• 57:05
  is a feminist writer. Okay, so you can put me on a stake
• 57:07
  if it's not true. But there's something about feminist writers that they love to
• 57:15
  take the names of really evil women from like fairy tales and mythology and religion,
• 57:24
  and then take that name like they love Delilah and you know, Jezebel
• 57:30
  and Lilith and kali Ma and they love them. I don't know what it
• 57:36
  is, but feminist women they love to embrace that, like that dark feminine,
• 57:39
  and then they Medusa they celebrate it like I there was a sculpture.
• 57:45
  You guys probably remember this was like years ago that someone made a sculpture.
• 57:50
  It was like that. There was a sculpture. I think it was Perseus
• 57:53
  holding the head of Medusa. Do you remember that. It's an old classical
• 57:57
  sculpture Greek mythology. Money created a reversal of that where it was Medusa holding
• 58:02
  the head of Perseus and all the women were like, oh, get it
• 58:07
  girl, And I'm like, do you know what the do you know who
• 58:09
  Medusa is? Like? Why are you you know, putting these women on
• 58:13
  a pedestal. They're always doing that anyway. Sorry, I just had to
• 58:16
  say that, Yeah, more feminine than masculine women, I guess getting together
• 58:22
  and I think that it's it's kind of again, it's strangely, it's it's
• 58:29
  lesbophobic in some way because it feeds into this idea of like, oh,
• 58:34
  we're not like those ugly, mannish, Harry fat bull dykes. We are
• 58:39
  We're like pretty women, just like everyone else. Like that's when a lot
• 58:44
  of these covers and I'm going to put some examples on here really give off.
• 58:49
  I guess this is more of this kind of surface level criticism, like,
• 58:57
  Oh, I don't like that they're pretty. Why aren't they like you
• 59:00
  know, bull dye carry flannel, wearing short haircut, hairy legs, birkenstocks,
• 59:09
  Like, why aren't they those lesbians? It's like, I don't know,
• 59:15
  maybe it's the same reason why the men in romance stories don't have washboard
• 59:19
  abs. I mean, they do have washboard as was regular men mostly,
• 59:23
  don't you know. Yeah, yeah, it seems pretty superficial. It's finished
• 59:27
  off the peak. Okay, I don't really have anything. I don't know
• 59:31
  that doesn't sit right with me. And I think like this really encompasses the
• 59:36
  vast majority of the genre, and I think it has to do with the
• 59:39
  publishing industry itself, and it has to do with what people are writing and
• 59:43
  comfortable with writing. In the Actually Herring Blake books, I also noticed that,
• 59:50
  and actually, on my podcast Lavender Metas, where we talk a lot
• 59:52
  about lesbian media and critically examining a lot of that, one of our listeners
• 59:58
  emailed us and mentioned how and Jilah Green doesn't care. The first book in
• 1:00:00
  the series, Actually Hearing Blake never uses the word lesbian. Ever. One
• 1:00:07
  of the love interests is a bisexual woman who has I know, you have
• 1:00:12
  a banana. Are we through the peak yet? Yeah, there's another one
• 1:00:16
  right here though. Yeah, this is like the biggest one. Let's just
• 1:00:20
  teleport over here. Okay, So, like, do you watch a lot
• 1:00:23
  of like if you had a podcast and all your podcast was focused on lesbian
• 1:00:30
  fiction, how much of that is there to get out? Are you just
• 1:00:35
  looking at like fan fiction, because I know there's a lot of fan fiction
• 1:00:38
  probably covers that. Are you looking at like editorials? Like I don't,
• 1:00:44
  like, I don't know, I just feel like you're limiting yourself a little
• 1:00:46
  bit, you know, Like do you just do you just like turn your
• 1:00:51
  nose up at like regular stories talk about it. She says that she does
• 1:00:57
  read it though. I'm just really astounded because this represents an explosion in romance
• 1:01:07
  related to lesbian themes gay themes. But it's all written by women. So
• 1:01:12
  but you know, like I bet, yes, yes, which is why
• 1:01:22
  a lot of it is just awful. But twenty years ago you wouldn't see
• 1:01:25
  any of this. And you're complaining for Chuck Tingle, he's a genius.
• 1:01:30
  Yeah, you're complaining about having this much choice, because let's be frank,
• 1:01:38
  the actual representation of people who have women who have an interest in sexuality with
• 1:01:45
  other women is not right here like a gigantic blob on lesbian it's actually a
• 1:01:52
  bell curve with their straight women. There's bisexual women who are interested, and
• 1:01:57
  there are a lot more of them. So you you are upset that women
• 1:02:02
  interested who have sexual interest in women the fiction that aimed towards them reflects what
• 1:02:10
  they look like and what they want and how they are. Right, You
• 1:02:15
  cannot, you cannot. You are unbelievably entitled. Yes, you want this
• 1:02:23
  to resemble your interests, and no doubt you think you have the self righteousness
• 1:02:30
  belief that if they don't resemble your interests, that there's something wrong with them.
• 1:02:36
  Well, one you. Once you get rid of the male ax,
• 1:02:38
  you have severely restricted your plot potentials because the male ax represents such a variety
• 1:02:45
  in terms of stakes and tension and different things that he's bringing to the plot
• 1:02:52
  that a female ax just won't. And if you want to change that,
• 1:02:55
  then you have to challenge missonry and the soogyny of low expectations. But you're
• 1:03:01
  not gonna do that. So you are gonna look at this entire gigantic genre
• 1:03:10
  of romantic fiction and you're gonna say this resembles the people who are interested in
• 1:03:15
  it too much. It should resemble me. And you're gonna say that you
• 1:03:20
  are entitled to do that because why because you're a lesbian. You don't own
• 1:03:24
  sexual interest in women. That's your problem. You think you own that,
• 1:03:29
  you don't. There are straight women, women who identify as straight, who
• 1:03:34
  have a sexual interest in women. There are bisexual women who obviously have a
• 1:03:37
  sexual interest in women, and they outnumber you. So the fact that the
• 1:03:42
  the genre of women with a sexual interest in women looks like the majority of
• 1:03:47
  the women who have a sexual interest in women, get over it. Yeah,
• 1:03:54
  it's not gonna look like you. It's not an echo chamber to make
• 1:03:58
  you feel good, good Lord, And like twenty years ago, I go
• 1:04:04
  into a bookstore and there would be five books on lesbian romance or anything related
• 1:04:11
  to that, and most of the the genre of women with a sexual interest
• 1:04:18
  in women, Because it's not the lesbian genre. It is. This is
• 1:04:21
  she's trying to own something that isn't hers. It is the genre of women
• 1:04:27
  who have a sexual interest in women. It includes straight women, it includes
• 1:04:30
  bisexual women, it includes lesbian women. But if you think when you look
• 1:04:34
  at the demographics, the largest demographic of women with a sexual interest in women
• 1:04:41
  probably is straight. And that doesn't mean they don't identify as straight. I
• 1:04:45
  know that sounds weird, but they just they don't want to identify with that
• 1:04:48
  particular aspect of their sexuality. They just want to explore it. Fine,
• 1:04:51
  and then you have bisexual women, and then you have a smaller proportion which
• 1:04:56
  is lesbian. So the fact that the genre resembles the majority of the people
• 1:05:01
  in it who consume it and who write for it, that is not discrimination
• 1:05:06
  against lesbians. Your problem is you think you own the genre and you don't.
• 1:05:13
  Exactly. You are a small part of it. And if you want
• 1:05:15
  to go back to owning the genre. Then you can get rid of all
• 1:05:19
  of the bookcases full and we can all go back to twenty five years ago
• 1:05:25
  when you had five books and all of them were short stories. Right No,
• 1:05:29
  like we're compilations of short stories. Right Yeah. Otherwise, just enjoy
• 1:05:34
  the fact that you have choice. And also again, if you want to
• 1:05:39
  get rid of the male ex then that the number of the types of stories
• 1:05:43
  are gonna be slashed by ninety nine percent. They're all going to be the
• 1:05:46
  same damn coming out story of smashing the patriarchy like it's in. You won't
• 1:05:53
  even be able to put a face to the patriarchy because that's going to be
• 1:05:56
  having an X. Right, you get rid of the mailexes, you get
• 1:05:59
  rid of X everything they add to a story, tension, stakes, questions,
• 1:06:04
  other aspects. I mean, I guarantee in each one of these stories,
• 1:06:10
  the male ex is probably bringing most of everything to it, and that's
• 1:06:14
  probably why she's complaining about it. Well, you want to change that.
• 1:06:16
  Challenge, challenge miss Injry, recognize men's issues and challenge the misogyny of low
• 1:06:25
  expectations, and demand that your female characters have every bit as much moral individuality
• 1:06:30
  as men, which means that their consequences, they can be just as evil
• 1:06:34
  as men. And do not soft pedal it with bullshit about patriarchy. Okay,
• 1:06:41
  if that's what you want, but this is the consequence of living in
• 1:06:44
  the system that we do. Women's moral choices are boring, they add nothing
• 1:06:49
  to a story, and you make it worse by saying, well, it's
• 1:06:53
  the patriarchy, the patriarchy is responsible. Well, you're just blanding women out
• 1:06:58
  more. You're making them more worthless as human beings, more just just blobs
• 1:07:03
  that are posted or pushed around by the miasma of evil men's thinking and actions.
• 1:07:09
  What do you think is gonna happen that's gonna come out in storytelling?
• 1:07:13
  People are gonna add a malex because they need a bit of tention, They
• 1:07:16
  need a bit of a heavy you know. Okay, Yep, there you
• 1:07:21
  go. There's the best I can do. That's good bunge of annoyance.
• 1:07:26
  Again when like the characters are another yet another sort of representation of something that,
• 1:07:30
  like I've seen a million times before that doesn't feel realistic to like how
• 1:07:35
  people actually engage in like lesbian community. But I will say you freaking and
• 1:07:45
  I'm like, I'm like, okay, how far until we get the biphobia?
• 1:07:47
  Well, we were already well passed. I didn't say anything. It's
• 1:07:51
  just like, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna turn my freaking experience into a
• 1:07:55
  sword. But honestly, how dare you say you speak for the entire community?
• 1:08:01
  You are a part of it. You don't own it. Okay,
• 1:08:06
  you don't own it. Get off your high horse, and if you want
• 1:08:12
  to own it once again, we go back to twenty five years ago.
• 1:08:15
  Five books on a shelf, all of them short story anthologies. All right,
• 1:08:24
  shut up, enjoy the plenty. Think specifically about like adult romances here,
• 1:08:30
  because young adult romance novels I have a lot more leeway. I feel
• 1:08:36
  like they are often a better written and be much more compelling because they're dealing
• 1:08:43
  with other themes besides the core of like just romance. Like oftentimes they're dealing
• 1:08:46
  with like family and loss and growing up and being in an environment of like
• 1:08:51
  school or you know, working, Like oftentimes, that's what a lot of
• 1:08:55
  these young adult female female romance novels are doing. I think a lot of
• 1:08:59
  times they're done really compellingly and really well, but pausing for the banana.
• 1:09:05
  But I think this is almost the end of this hump, so I don't
• 1:09:08
  know if she's gonna say anything. I don't think that that is the case
• 1:09:12
  for a lot of adult contemporary female female romances, for example. I mean,
• 1:09:15
  I think young adult romances that are done really well are by Kelly Quinslan.
• 1:09:20
  And perhaps some of the things that I'm identifying as I think are like
• 1:09:26
  problematic a little or that I find concerned trend within lesbian romance might be identifiable
• 1:09:32
  in some of Kelly Quinlan's work, But I think that as a whole,
• 1:09:36
  the writing and the characters like kind of make up for it, whereas a
• 1:09:40
  lot of these other books, like there's no redemption for that in that regard,
• 1:09:44
  Like in Kelly Quinlan's books Late to the Party and Her Name in the
• 1:09:47
  Sky, and there's another one about the basketball player and the Cheerleader, like
• 1:09:54
  all of them feature characters who are even if they're not grappling with her sexualities
• 1:10:00
  within the context of these books, they are in environments that are like restrictive
• 1:10:05
  of like you're in high school. Some of these girls are like out and
• 1:10:10
  or out to certain people and trying to navigate that, and I think all
• 1:10:13
  of that is really interesting, whereas uhhhhh, I don't know if this gets
• 1:10:20
  a lot deeper. I mean, you know what, this is the end
• 1:10:25
  of this hump, by the way. You know what I think is funny
• 1:10:29
  about this. I think these are all like these are essentially queer feminists criticizing
• 1:10:41
  the work of other queer feminists, and they're just you know, because like,
• 1:10:45
  I don't know, I feel like this has nothing to do with me,
• 1:10:47
  Like this is all like, you know, it's like the people who
• 1:10:53
  were on Tumblr have become and we're writing fan fiction, are now writing books,
• 1:10:58
  and now the people who read those books that are fan fiction are criticizing
• 1:11:01
  them. And it's like a competition for who is the most inclusive and who
• 1:11:06
  is the least problematic amongst this small subset of writers that are trying to make
• 1:11:14
  you know, content that's apparently, you know, just lesbian friendly enough.
• 1:11:19
  Yeah, and uh yeah, it's like it's just becoming another competition. Mm
• 1:11:26
  hmm. Although I do appreciate I'm about to ruin this woman's whole career.
• 1:11:30
  I do appreciate the shout out to Angel Reese there. Although I don't know
• 1:11:33
  if she'd appreciate being cast as a lesbian. Oh really, well, white
• 1:11:39
  basketball player right there up in the Yeah, yeah, no, I oh,
• 1:11:44
  oh, are you referring to the basketball player? Yes, yes,
• 1:11:47
  Angel, isn't it Angel rees no talking about the really popular one right now?
• 1:11:51
  Yes, that's upsetting all the other female basketball players. Lindsay's a big
• 1:11:57
  Lindsay's a yeah. Well, actually she's not good. I can't remember her
• 1:12:00
  name now that you say it, now that you said that, it's not
• 1:12:02
  it's not what you said though, But not only no, it's not,
• 1:12:11
  it's a different I'll get the I'll get the name, get the Clark.
• 1:12:16
  Yes, that's right, Kaitlyn Clark. The thing I was gonna say about
• 1:12:19
  Caitlyn Clark is that not only is she a really great basketball player that happens
• 1:12:25
  to be white, which is woof that's a problem, but she's also very
• 1:12:29
  sportsman like. She's very like. The reason why her team kills is because
• 1:12:33
  she cooperates with the other players. She comes up with plays and like,
• 1:12:39
  you know, like they works with the team to to score. This is
• 1:12:43
  what professional you know, uh, sports teams are supposed to do. They're
• 1:12:48
  supposed to come up with a plan they're supposed to like. I think sports
• 1:12:51
  is actually more about it's actually more tactical than people think, and it's less
• 1:13:00
  athletic. I mean, athletics are important obviously, but it's less of a
• 1:13:03
  focus, you know, than like being a good part of the of the
• 1:13:09
  team. So yeah, and I think Katelyn Clark recognizes that. But yeah,
• 1:13:13
  it is it is funny that that's when I saw that cover we got
• 1:13:17
  we got a Caitlin Clark Angel Reese story. Is that what that is?
• 1:13:24
  No? No, absolutely not, absolutely do not. I know I'm taking
• 1:13:29
  the piss utterly. Okay, this is this is a bunch of wintering and
• 1:13:34
  basically an object demonstration and why stories are only interesting if men are involved.
• 1:13:39
  So let's keep going. Well, I want that to be the case,
• 1:13:43
  but it seems to be. Do you want me to jump to another hump?
• 1:13:45
  Yeah, jump to another hump? The humps day it's the same time.
• 1:13:54
  Guess what day it is? Oh, I got a super child super
• 1:13:57
  chow from Richard Pierre is five bucks and says she has yet to bring up
• 1:14:02
  whether the author is authentically lesbian enough. This stream has been sponsored by and
• 1:14:09
  The Minotaur as well. Burger King and Fries, Burger King and Fries and
• 1:14:14
  the minotaur. You know what this is? This seems this is this is
• 1:14:20
  deep lore from the discord. Incidentally, if you want to join the discord,
• 1:14:24
  you can do so at Badger Nation dot online. You can help us
• 1:14:28
  with or you can enjoy our resources and all that other stuff that we give
• 1:14:31
  and I put together. If you're interested in any of the statistics that I
• 1:14:36
  talk about on the stream, the best place to go to get them would
• 1:14:40
  be the Discord. So Badger Nation dot online and uh Badger or sorry,
• 1:14:45
  Burger King and Fries was one of the craziest posters I have ever met,
• 1:14:53
  one of the craziest, craziest people in the discord. Yes, I actually
• 1:14:58
  made a labor the center of the discord. And yeah, and the minitary
• 1:15:04
  lesbians. Yeah no, no, he he used to constantly talk about the
• 1:15:09
  lesbian You know how some people talk about certain noticers, you know, like
• 1:15:14
  particular Yeah. Uh. That kind of his conspiracy was the lesbians. The
• 1:15:19
  lesbians are at the center of it all. So he'd go on and on
• 1:15:24
  and on about it, among other things, and he'd also challenge He's just
• 1:15:28
  really obnoxious. So I constructed a special role for him that left him at
• 1:15:32
  the center of the maze, and amusingly, at one point we had I
• 1:15:38
  don't know, like I think it was Rose Wrist or Rose Wrist, that
• 1:15:43
  guy who kept wanting me to identify as an intersectional. Remember we got into
• 1:15:48
  that fight with him about him. Did he end up in the Minotaur?
• 1:15:55
  I think it was him. I think or was one other feminist who ended
• 1:15:59
  up in the actual And then he's I'm like, you gotta be careful because
• 1:16:03
  he'll release the minatar, and then they do, and then the minuitar got
• 1:16:08
  into their discord and it was hilarious because you could just see them like trying
• 1:16:13
  to crawl out of their discord, like this is your fault. I'm like,
• 1:16:15
  I warned you, I warned you. You you're the one who went
• 1:16:21
  into my discord and then crashed it and then released the minatar and then you
• 1:16:27
  had the minotaur on your ass. That was all on you. Nothing new
• 1:16:30
  with me, all right? So as well as also I recall several audio
• 1:16:35
  book apps that were advertising their app with these cookie cuttery young adult novels but
• 1:16:41
  about either the werewolf romance genre or the husband struggling at work and people propositioning
• 1:16:45
  his wife. But he's connected with a powerful mafia family, but he's trying
• 1:16:48
  to make his own way without using his connections to establish himself. It's awfully
• 1:16:54
  specific. Yeah, right, but I could see how that could become its
• 1:16:57
  own trope. Yeah, the werewolf thing, I don't know, it's just
• 1:17:01
  it's so it's cringe man, all right, So should we play some more?
• 1:17:09
  Yeah, let's see if there's any anything left of these humps. Yeah,
• 1:17:15
  I don't know that there's a there's like a little one right here,
• 1:17:19
  so I'm gonna jump here. Well, let's see romance and whatever. Like,
• 1:17:25
  I know it can get bad, but there's some things that I'm like,
• 1:17:29
  this is not how is this being published? I feel like I'm reading
• 1:17:32
  fan fiction that is better than this, you know, and me and Renaissance
• 1:17:35
  talked about this in terms of reading Mel Wilson something to talk about, and
• 1:17:40
  Merl Wilson recently came out with us, is your pornography is so bad?
• 1:17:48
  Yes, because it's porn? Like, do you not know what the genre
• 1:17:55
  is about? Okay, this is dumb? What's another hump? Is there
• 1:17:57
  any other further humps? Uh? There's like little ones over here I'm looking
• 1:18:03
  at These are some pathetic cumps. Yeah they are. They're more like a
• 1:18:10
  mild rise really into like the bo lesbian subculture. In a way, it's
• 1:18:15
  about as stimulating as the books that she is critiquing. There's no erections because
• 1:18:21
  this is all lesbian stuff. That's why there's so few that most a lot
• 1:18:28
  of lesbians and a lot of people in lesbian communities aren't necessarily but I think
• 1:18:30
  like the fact that this the huge swathes of like this genre, or just
• 1:18:35
  have no acknowledgement of even the existence of like gender non like truly gender not
• 1:18:43
  conforming women write it and gender not conforming lesbians. Okay, who is this
• 1:18:46
  person? Did she have a sunny book something sunny something booknook? Let me
• 1:18:54
  let me, let me take a look, because these people always write take
• 1:18:58
  a look. It's in a book. My name is Sonny, Sonny Lushoe.
• 1:19:03
  I mean, I'm guessing that she's got a huge following on Twitter or
• 1:19:08
  something, Sonny Shoe. I never heard of them, Uh no, I
• 1:19:16
  mean, because you know they this is book talk. Oh, incidentally,
• 1:19:19
  there's a big controversy with book talk. They're drooling over Wade Wilson not the
• 1:19:24
  Deadpool actor, the guy who murdered two women. Did you know that?
• 1:19:30
  What book talk? Book Talk. It's all the female It's a whole bunch
• 1:19:35
  of women who are fans, usually of dark romance. They're on a place
• 1:19:42
  called book talk, which is like a community on TikTok, and a lot
• 1:19:45
  of them are drooling over Wade Wilson, not the guy who plays Deadpool,
• 1:19:50
  a man who was recently condemned to death for murdering two women. Oh yeah,
• 1:20:01
  I mean not got surprised. Okay, all right, booknook. Now
• 1:20:12
  I'm trying to find literary reviews for children's books, workbooks and get okay,
• 1:20:15
  that must be her general or somebody else's. Yeah, this might be some
• 1:20:20
  This might be somebody who has absolutely nothing to do with the evils. Here
• 1:20:26
  we go, good Reads. Let's see do you actually write? Is what
• 1:20:30
  I'm trying to get at. Uh read currently reading doesn't look like she writes
• 1:20:38
  best anti capitalist fiction, because of course this is one of her list's best
• 1:20:45
  anti capitalist fiction. Yeah, it's like I said, it's political in nature.
• 1:20:49
  I knew it was from the get When she said lesbian romance, I
• 1:20:54
  was like, this is political and I knew it, like I I So,
• 1:20:57
  I'm not surprised. I'm sure that. And that's and by the way,
• 1:21:00
  that's why it sucks, you know, that's why it sucks. That's
• 1:21:05
  why like all of these, all of this like woke garbage sucks because the
• 1:21:11
  political is the precedent on which or it's the foundation of whatever the product is,
• 1:21:18
  whatever the art is, and so it undermines it because it's a weak
• 1:21:25
  foundation. Anti capitalist books. Do you pay for these books? You've already
• 1:21:30
  lost? You know, how much are these anti capitalist books? Allison?
• 1:21:38
  How much do they cost? Is it's going to make who's going to make
• 1:21:44
  the products in your anti capitalist utopia? Oh? Well, who's going to
• 1:21:47
  pay the taxes? Let's face it, Like yeah, well, And the
• 1:21:55
  the problem is that, I mean, I honestly, I think today's verse
• 1:22:00
  version of capitalism is so it's it's well, I mean it's it's not exactly
• 1:22:05
  real because it's all like the money is printed, so they're manipulating everything.
• 1:22:12
  But but I'm not against the idea the necessity of a meritocracy in society.
• 1:22:17
  People need to get what they earn. God damn, do these people ever
• 1:22:24
  bore themselves to death like they don't want any kind of strife in their life
• 1:22:30
  despite constantly creating it. No doubt that's probably why they. Yeah, but
• 1:22:36
  okay, so I got another super child from Richard Beierre. He gives us
• 1:22:40
  five bucks and says, Wade Wilson's swastika face tattoo just put those women over
• 1:22:45
  the edge and makes them absolutely irresistible to those women. To be fair,
• 1:22:50
  he didn't have the facial tattoos when he was murdering the women, but he
• 1:22:56
  did have neck tattoos. It's like, there you go, there's a big,
• 1:23:01
  big, big red flag. Yeah, like he's uh, and there's
• 1:23:09
  a lot of women drooling over him right after the man versus bear meme.
• 1:23:15
  Yep, I guess people are too boring or sorry, men are too boring.
• 1:23:19
  Okay, let's let's uh is there any because she's just back on the
• 1:23:24
  same topic there. I don't think. I don't think that this really gets
• 1:23:28
  I don't I don't think there's anything else to this. I think we've done
• 1:23:30
  it, Like I think we we squeezed everything out of this, out of
• 1:23:33
  this lemon. Yeah, we've squeezed all the things. We've got it all.
• 1:23:39
  Yeah. Oh so In short, lesbian fiction, sucks because they can
• 1:23:46
  only write men in an honest way. And so if you can't, if
• 1:23:51
  you can't write women as compelling as you can write men, then your lesbian
• 1:23:57
  fiction will always have male ex boyfriends or male antagonists or whatever the conflict is,
• 1:24:05
  because that's what I'm wondering about too, like, what is the conflict
• 1:24:08
  in a romance? In the lesbian romance, Without the conflict, then you
• 1:24:13
  got nothing. So yeah, and of course you're also limiting your potential.
• 1:24:17
  That's why what stories remain probably all look the same because there's only so many
• 1:24:24
  ways to skin a cat. So well, I think ultimately what I'm getting
• 1:24:29
  from this is she believes that the genre of women with the sexual interest of
• 1:24:33
  women, it's not lesbian fiction, that genre should resemble her, should just
• 1:24:40
  be a gigantic echo chamber determined by her interests. Well, no, and
• 1:24:46
  you don't. I mean, you have every right to say that because you
• 1:24:49
  know no censorship, but everybody has an equal right to completely ignore you and
• 1:24:57
  say, yeah, but we also exist in the space. Yes, unless
• 1:25:00
  you're gonna talk about some kind of purity or you're the pure woman who wants
• 1:25:04
  to have sex with women. Therefore you get to define the entire genre and
• 1:25:09
  everybody, even women who don't want to write what you want them to write,
• 1:25:13
  they have to write what they Well, they're not going to do it,
• 1:25:15
  right, no wonder an anti capitalist wants slavery or thinks that she's entitled
• 1:25:20
  to it to enforce norms on other people, to enforce things on us,
• 1:25:28
  or ask for things from others that they have to labor to create. Let
• 1:25:31
  me put it that way, Yeah, entitlement to others labor. Okay,
• 1:25:38
  all right, So what's gonna happen now is we're gonna move over to my
• 1:25:43
  channel, which I believe you can find at It's at gender attic on YouTube.
• 1:25:46
  I did check that out gender attic. Uh, it's erratic with two
• 1:25:53
  rs. Not too te's two rs erratic gender ratic Okay, but you might
• 1:25:59
  also be able to do it with a search on Typhoon Blue. And we
• 1:26:01
  are going to talk about more House of the Dragon, because it's almost the
• 1:26:06
  same as this, Like really it's almost the same problems as we got here,
• 1:26:13
  Like the women just cannot be characters. They just they're functionally non existent
• 1:26:17
  as moral agents. But anyway, if you want to join us for that,
• 1:26:21
  go over to my channel and if you want to send us a message
• 1:26:25
  at any time after this show is over, feed the badger dot com slash
• 1:26:28
  just the tip is the very best way to send us that message and to
• 1:26:30
  send us whatever funds you'd like to give us as a tip to tell us
• 1:26:34
  we're not screaming into the void, because it often feels like we are.
• 1:26:39
  Once again, Feed the badger dot com slash just the tip to send us
• 1:26:42
  a message in a tip and back to you. Brian. All right,
• 1:26:45
  I did get one last super child before we wrap it up from grading doors
• 1:26:49
  for five bucks and he says you will own no lesbian books and you'll be
• 1:26:53
  happy. Some old German misogynists posing seductively. All right, a right,
• 1:27:00
  Well, if you guys liked this video, please don't like subscribe if you're
• 1:27:01
  not already subscribe to the bellflonifications, leave us a comment, let us know
• 1:27:04
  what you guys think about what we discussed on the show today, and please
• 1:27:08
  please please share this video because sharing is caring. Thank you so much for
• 1:27:11
  coming on today's episode of Red Chill Cinema, and we'll talk to you all
• 1:27:15
  in the next one.