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UCC Admission Community Conversations | Episode 5- Demystifying FA · Upper Canada College Admission Community Conversation

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, welcome back to Community Conversations.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_03: In today's episode, we're demystifying financial assistance, breaking down how families can actually afford UCC and other independent schools.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_03: I'm Sandra.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: Hi, and I'm Melody.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_02: And today we're very excited because we're really talking about a topic that we find, I think, most important in all application process, no matter which independent school you're looking at.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_02: Because often a lot of families come in, they just say, Oh, great that you all offer all of this.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_02: This will be too much for my family, and that's why I won't even apply.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_02: So today we're actually going to talk about tuition cost and financial assistance and how to help demystify some of that.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_03: Great.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, for sure, tuition numbers can certainly look daunting.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_03: But here's the reality: thousands of families across the country send their kids to independent schools without paying full tuition.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_03: This is how schools actually build vibrant and diverse communities.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_02: And here at UCC, we're so fortunate and we're in a very privileged position where we can actually offer financial assistance programs that supports a lot of our students.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_02: We're very committed to pluralism, and we believe that anybody should be able to access great education regardless of their financial background.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_02: So at UCC, we actually dedicate about$6.7 million every year to returning in new students coming to UCC.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_02: And actually, out of all of our eligible students, 20% of them actually receives financial assistance.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: And that is committed on a need anonymous basis, meaning that throughout the entire application process, we actually don't consider your financial needs.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_02: So if we feel like you'd be a great member to join UCC, then we'll try to make that work for your family.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_03: That's amazing, Melody.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_03: Can you talk a bit about who's eligible to apply for FA at UCC?
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so this is a great question.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I would encourage all families to really find that out in whichever school that you're looking into.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_02: But that at UCC, we really encourage all applicants that are applying to year five and above that are Canadian citizens to apply for financial assistance.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_02: And don't assume whether you will qualify or you won't qualify.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_02: I would encourage you to put in an application regardless, because we really do.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_02: And Sam later on is going to tell us a little bit more about this process as well.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_02: But then if your family really needs it, we'll be able to cover that for you as well.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_03: And what about the process for applying to financial assistance?
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_03: How does that work?
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and I think the best person to really answer this question is Sam, that we also have on here right now.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_02: And Sam is the managing partner at Apple Financial Services, which is the platform that we use for all financial assistance applications.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: And Sam, thank you for answering some of our questions here.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for having me, Sandra and Melody.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm really glad to be here.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's great, uh, great to talk to you both.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_03: Great.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_03: Sam, to kick things off, could you walk us through what financial assistance actually means in the context of independent schools?
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: Every school is a little bit different and everyone has their own exact guidelines.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: But at its core, it's the same uh principle.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: So financial assistance is designed to bridge the gap, but a family's financial resources don't really cover the full tuition costs.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: And if there's a demonstrated financial need, financial assistance is there to help us make assistance possible, make attendance possible.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_03: Great.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_03: What does the process look like for a family who's starting out?
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_03: Where do they begin?
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: So for the majority of uh of schools in Canada, they start by going directly to the Apple Financial Services website.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it involves three main steps.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a third, we're a third-party evaluator.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: So like UCC, most independent schools use an independent financial assessment service such as Apple Financial.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: So parents would fill out a secure application, they detail their income, their major expenses, all of the family's assets and liabilities, and then they provide tax documents to support all of these figures.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: Then Apple Financial or a similar firm calculates an estimated household contribution based on various criteria, including the standard cost of living in your region.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_00: And then finally, all of that report goes to the school and the to the school's financial assistance committee because it's the school itself that makes the final determination on an aid package to offer to any family.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_03: Sam, can you tell us a bit more about the second part there, the calculation and what the expectation is in terms of a family's contribution?
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: So firstly, the evaluation of financial need for a family is an evaluation of that particular family's financial situation and resources.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: So that means there's no predetermined level or range that's used to determine the eligibility for financial assistance.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: Secondly, most schools can expect the family to contribute as much as possible towards educational costs of the student.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_00: And that can mean potential financial sacrifices for discretionary activities like vacations, camps, or sports.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_00: And it can also mean prioritizing investing in the child's education as opposed to things like investing in growing a business or potentially into a larger home.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, definitely.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that is such an important point that families sometimes don't think about, is that we really do want to maximize our reach and impact and reach as many families as possible.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_02: So this would be a conversation that we can have with you as well in terms of what are some of the things that we could work around.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_02: A lot of times, especially for boarding parents, that remind them that when you're not feeding a teenage boy at home, that actually is quite a bit of savings too.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_02: So another big question that a lot of parents have is um they wonder if financial assistance actually would affect students' chances of being accepted.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_02: Sam, what have you seen across all the schools that you've worked with?
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: Each school is different.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_00: And it ultimately comes down to whether a school is needs blind or needs aware.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_00: So needs blind schools evaluate admissions completely separately from financial assistance requests, and needs aware schools might factor FA into their final decision when allocating limited funds.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: So my best advice is don't let it intimidate you.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: Just ask admissions up front about their policy.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_03: That sounds good.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_03: What about tuition and extras like uniforms, textbooks, laptops, field trips?
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: So a comprehensive financial assistance package takes into account the total cost of attendance.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: When you receive an award, it's worth asking if it covers extra fees.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_00: At many schools, but not all.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: The recommended award amount will take into consideration incidental costs.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_02: And a lot of families then worry, great, now I can make year one happen, but then I want my student to be able to graduate at your school.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_02: So I need to actually think about the four or five or six years that they're here with you.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_02: So um, what does what what happens after the first year, Sam?
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_00: So families do reapply annually, but as long as your financial situation stays roughly the same, your support level generally remains consistent throughout your child's uh time at the school.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, Sam, can we talk about one of the biggest misconceptions out there?
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_03: A lot of parents hear the term financial assistance and they immediately think of athletic scholarships or academic awards.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_03: Is that how independent school financial assistance works?
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_00: That's easily one of the bigger misconceptions out there.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_00: So at most independent schools, the vast majority of financial support is need-based, not merit-based.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: So some schools do offer merit scholarships, um, but most independent schools at financial assistance is primarily designed to bridge the gap between what a family can reasonably afford and the total cost of tuition.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: We evaluate the family's full financial picture to determine that need.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_02: And that's exactly what we do here at UCC too.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_02: All of our financial aid award is based on need and not based on merit.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so whatever um the family is uh determined to need to cover and make tuition happen for the family, this is what we're considering as well.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_02: Great.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, so I do, I do, I do wonder, I do wonder, Sam, what are what are some of the biggest thing that you're seeing or or the biggest question that you often hear families um ask you about when they are making the application?
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the the biggest one that we've uh that I hear, we've already covered a little bit.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of people are worried that they they might not qualify.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_00: They don't necessarily know about financial aid.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I encourage parents to make an application.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of things factor into uh into the uh the assistance calculation, including how many children that they've got, how many of them are attending schools or or in university, and those costs can add up very quickly.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_00: So some families may qualify uh even if they are they're concerned that they might not.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_02: And Sam, you do receive applications from a lot of different backgrounds.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_02: So, say, for example, a family that lives in Toronto versus a family that might be living in suburb areas of Ontario or even different countries.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_02: So, how how do you how do you that's that's must be a lot of consideration that you take into?
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_02: So, what what are how how do you make some of your decisions there?
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_00: No, it certainly is.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_00: So we always look at reasonable living uh situations for the different places where where people live.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the fact of the matter is there are different uh living standards in in Toronto and different housing costs versus in the suburbs, but those also frequently come with higher day-to-day living costs, uh, higher gas costs, uh, higher food costs, sometimes that we do account for.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: And we do take applications from all over the the world.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_00: So uh the we may have borders from uh from various countries around North America and Africa and Asia, and all those come with vastly different living expenses as well.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: So we we do make sure we look into all that.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_00: And it's uh it's very interesting having to learn tax jurisdictions for uh for 193 countries around the world so we can make sure we're all treating everyone accurately, certainly.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_01: Is that actually how many number of like countries that you get applications from?
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_01: 193?
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: That's impressive.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_00: Over over time, not every year, certainly.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: But uh, but but that's that's the number we have pinned above the door.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_03: Wow, that's interesting.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_03: That's amazing.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_03: Um, Sam, could you shed a little bit of light on how financial assistance final decisions are made?
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: So the final decision for financial assistance is made by the school.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: So it takes into account numerous factors, including family finances, school finances, access to the school affordability, enrollment goals, and the school priorities.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_00: So it uh it can look very different at at different schools, um, especially once you once you consider the the grade the child's going in, how long they would need to be there on financial assistance, and the many, many competing needs for financial aid at the school.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: So it's often a compromise between the family needs and the available funds at the school.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_00: And uh it's important to spread out those funds to aid the maximum number of students.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_03: Great.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I think we're almost ready to wrap up.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_03: I'm just wondering if either of you have a top piece of advice for parents who are feeling a little hesitant or nervous about applying for FA.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, my best piece of advice is just to be open, be thorough, and apply on time.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: So every school has their own deadlines and make sure that uh that you're talking to any schools you're interested in to make sure you're on not uh not behind the eight ball.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_02: And if I can jump in with one question as well, Sam.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_02: For a family that's currently preparing um to put in an application, I know your application portal opens on September 28th this year.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_02: Um, how should families prepare?
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_02: Um, because it does feel very overwhelming sometimes, and it is a daunting application.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: I usually tell families to think of it similarly to applying for a mortgage.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna ask for very similar pieces of information.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: So our website does have a couple of instructions that give you a leg up on preparing before your application, but basically, gather your tax documents uh is gonna be my best piece of advice.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: So get your notice of assessment, get your T4s if you have one, get a pay statement if you have if you receive employment income.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_00: All of those we're going to need during the application process anyway.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: So gathering ahead of time is just saving you time later.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_00: And it's going to make filling out the application itself much easier.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_02: Mm-hmm.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_02: Perfect.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_02: And Sam, what if a family might have a more complicated situation?
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_02: For example, a separation agreement in place or kind of different financial um setup.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: Um what should they do there?
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: So the first thing uh is that Apple Financial has been in business for 33 years.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I guarantee you, no matter how complex your situation, we have seen it all.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um separated families are very easy for us.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's bread and butter.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um don't hesitate to take a stab at the application, give it a good run through.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_00: But we're always here if you need help.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: You can call us, you can email us.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: We are happy to talk you through the application if you've got some questions, if you feel that it's more complex than uh than might uh might be easy to fit on the application.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_00: They can parents can also write us a note.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_00: So um it's always very helpful to have have some background information, especially if there's things that aren't covered on the application that might be helpful.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're if you're having to pay for a grandparent's uh elder care, or if you're having to send money back to relatives in a different country, anything like that um can always be helpful to add to give us a little bit more context for your application.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so it sounds like the more context, the more transparency, the more documents, the better to support kind of the application there, Sam.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_00: And we can tell when parents take their time and do it properly and and really make sure that they're going through it goes through the process a lot faster than if a family tries to really rush through it because they're they're racing against a deadline.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: So uh start it a little bit before the deadline, make sure that you've you've set aside enough time and really take your time.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_00: We know how important it is, and of course, parents do too.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_02: Perfect.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_02: And um, since Sam mentioned deadline, I know different there are different deadlines for different schools too.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_02: So for those that are considering UCC, our application um deadline for new families is December 31st.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_02: So the earlier you can put in an application, the more time that allows the Apple Financial team to kind of reach out if there's any missing documentation.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_02: Um, because if you apply right at the deadline, sometimes the back and forth of documentation um will take a long time too.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_02: And going back to kind of Sandra's original question, I would really encourage families not to roll out of school just because of tuition fee.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_02: Um, do look into their financial aid kind of policy and availability and put in an application anyway.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and that would really allow you to, um, when you receive an offer, you also know um what will what you'll have to work with in the remaining times of your child being at that school.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_03: Great.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_03: So it sounds like we're really here to help work you through the process.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_03: Is that yeah.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_03: Great.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much for that advice, Sam.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much so much for taking the time to break that all down for us.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: Of course.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you, Sandra.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you, Melody.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: It was my pleasure speaking with you.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_03: All right, that wraps up today's episode of Community Conversations.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_03: We encourage you to visit our website for things like open house registration to learn more about financial assistance, important dates and deadlines, and grade level specific admission process information.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_03: If you found this podcast helpful, please pass it along to another parent who might be navigating the school's learning process.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_03: And thanks for tuning in.