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Peter Bergman Pt. Two · The Path Went Chilly

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Welcome back to the Path Went Chile for part two of our series about the
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death of an unidentified deceed known only as Peter Bergmann. Robin, do you
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want to catch everyone up of what we talked about in our previous episode.
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Well, this case takes place in two thousand and nine in the town in
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Ireland called Sligo, and Involl was a middle aged man who showed up there
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and decided to check into a local hotel under the name Peter Bergman, but
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he did not provide any identification and it turned out that was not his real
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name. He spent three nights at the hotel and CCTV footage captured his movements
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during that time period. It appeared he would exit the hotel caring personal items,
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and then they would be gone whenever he returned, so it almost appeared
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like he was gradually disposing of all clues to his identity because he didn't want
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anyone to find out who he was. And after he checked out of the
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hotel, he traveled to a beach in a village called Ross's Point and numerous
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witnesses saw him hanging around the beach for about eight hours or so, but
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the following morning he was found dead. His body had gone into the water,
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he was wearing limited clothing, but it turned out that his exact cause
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of death was actually cardiac arrest rather than drowning, and when a medical toxicology
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report was performed, it turned out that he had prostate cancer and likely would
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have only lived for a couple more weeks if he had not died on that
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date, But it showed no trace of drugs in his system, and it
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did show that he had a history of three previous heart attacks. But some
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of the personal items of his like his clothing, were found on the beach
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to him. A lot of his items that he was shown carrying on the
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CCTV footage was never found, so there's a lot of mystery surrounding his death.
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People have speculated that he traveled to this place in Ireland because he wanted
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to end his own life on his own terms, but he didn't want anyone
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to find out what happened to him, which is why all form of identification
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was disposed of. All the people who spoke to him said that it sounded
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like he had an Austrian or German accent, and when he signed into the
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hotel, he provided the address for a place in Austria which turned out to
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not even exist. So they've spent the last fifteen years or so trying to
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figure out who he is, but they haven't had any success, even though
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there's actual CCTV footage of him and actual photographs that have been released to the
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public, but no one has ever come forward to say that they recognize him,
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and that's why this case is still unsolved to this day. So in
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October of twenty nineteen, one of the investigators on this case, Detective Inspector
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Ray Mulderigg of the Sligo Guardee, was interviewed for an article in Vice magazine.
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He expressed his belief that Peter Bergmann had chosen to travel to Sligo for
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a reason, stating quote, there seems to have been a purpose to it.
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Everything he did seem to have had a purpose, from cutting the labels
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of his clothes and all the rest of it. The question you have to
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ask is why Sligo. If you want a scenic place to die, you're
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spoilt for choice across the west coast of Ireland or even Scotland for that matter.
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Something must have brought him here. Even if we've never been able to
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say what that was end quote. Indeed, the consensus seems to be that
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Peter was definitely not a native of Ireland, unlikely hailed from Austria or possibly
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even Germany, So what made him travel the county Sligo. Another complication in
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this case is that even though Peter's actions suggests that he had planned an elaborate
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suicide, we can't even be one hundred percent certain how Peter died. I'm
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going to make a comparison to a case which we once covered on a path
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went Chile Bonus Patreon Minniesote, and that's the twenty fourteen death of Alan Jeel.
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Alan was a sixty four year old man whose nude body was found washed
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up on Parentporth Beach in England, and he was not carrying any identification.
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In fact, the only reason Alan was identified was because he had been carrying
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an old photograph of himself as a toddler, and his siblings recognized it when
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it was circulated throughout the media. It turned out that Alan lived in another
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town located twenty five miles away, and much like Peter Bergman, CCTV footage
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would tract Allan's movements in the hours prior to his death, but no one
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could figure out why he traveled to Parentport or if he died by suicide,
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homicide, or accidental drowning. And to make another comparison to Peter's case,
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Alan's clothing and a lot of his personal items he had been carrying around were
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never recovered. Alan was pretty much considered to be a loner and he may
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have planned to travel to a location which he found comforting in order to end
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his own life. You get the sense that this was the same situation with
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Peter and that for whatever reason, he decided that the beach in Ross's Point
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would be his ideal final destination. What's really intriguing about this, though,
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is that he asked the cab driver, can you take me to a beach
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nearby? Right? Can you take me over to a beach? And he
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goes to multiple locations to these beaches, so he's not super familiar with them.
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If it was me, I would think I would do exactly what you've
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said. I would go to a place that had some kind of nostalgia,
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that had some kind of dream moment for me. And even the detectives and
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investigators are saying this is not really the place I would have picked. When
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you think about all of the beautiful locations around where he could have gone,
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even from this point where he was at, why this location it doesn't seem
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to be a place that he's familiar with, It doesn't seem to be a
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comforting area unless he literally part of the plane is just I'm going to go
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on a whim in the moment when I feel right, I'm going to find
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a place in the moment that feels safe and peaceful, and it happens to
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be this random beach. But it's really interesting that there's really no tie.
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There's no way of knowing what it would have meant to him, But we
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know he wasn't familiar or he wouldn't have asked the cab driver to take him
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to this random place. And then to add on top of it that he
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died via cardiac arrest. It makes you wonder was he really going to this
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elaborate measure to complete suicide and then his body gives out right at the end
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that this cardiac arrest is what takes him and not his plan to end his
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life with dignity. It's very very interesting the cause of death and in the
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momentary plans that were leading up to being on that beach in that moment.
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Yeah, going back to the Alan Jill case, it was established that the
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town where he died parentpoor that was a place where he spent his childhood and
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had probably some of his happiest, fondest memories. So if it was a
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suicide, you could understand why he chose to travel to that location. But
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for Peter Bergman, he has no ties to Ireland that anyone could know of.
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He did not know about this particular beach beforehand, since he asked the
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cab driver to recommend a place, and he also did not seem to have
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too much familiarity with Sligo. So it's still a big mystery like why if
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he would travel to Ireland, and if he wasn't planning a suicide, would
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what would it be his reason for going here to begin with? Maybe it
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was just so simple as he had absolutely zero connections in Ireland and he thought
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the potential for his identity being discovered if his plan was to complete suicide,
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would be slim to none. And perhaps all he really required was the ocean.
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Maybe he was a big ocean lover, or he was drawn to water
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like so many of us are, and just the idea that he would be
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able to end his own life in water could have been enough for him to
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go, I've got no connections to Ireland, no one's going to find out
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who I am there. I'm going to dispose of any personal identification or things
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that could lead back to my true identity, and then I've got the beach
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here, and then that's all I require moving forward with the plan to complete
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suicide. If that was indeed what he was doing. If it was what
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he was doing, it does seem very serendipitous that before he was able to
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do that, he would be struck down by a heart attack at that exact
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moment. The timing seems just so bizarre and uncanny that it's just such an
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interesting element to this case. Yeah, it's just why this story stood out
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so much because it is just so bizarre and unique. And if that was
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his plan to travel to a place where he had no connection so that no
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one would identify him, then it technically did work, because no one has
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ever come forward who recognizes him. It's been theorized that Peter may have wanted
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to drown himself and hope that his body would be washed away in the Atlantic
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Ocean forever. But it sounds like there was just not enough salt water in
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his lungs for his cause of death to have been drowning. I really don't
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get the impression that there was any foul play involved, and the medical examiner
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seemed to believe that Peter died of an acute cardiac arrest, suffering a fatal
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heart attack at the exact same time you're planning to unlive yourself. Seems like
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one hell of a coincidence. But given how the autopsy indicated that Peter likely
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had a prior history of heart attacks, I suppose it's not impossible. On
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our last episode, we mentioned that this story was featured in a short documentary
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titled The Last Days of Peter Bergman, and if you go on YouTube you
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can find handheld footage of a Q and A with the director Kieran Cassidy following
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it screening at the Sundance Film Festival in twenty fourteen. Cassidy says that the
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coroner told him he suspected Peter may have taken a fatal dose of cyanide to
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end his life, but we have not seen this information corroborated by any other
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sources. However, even though no medication or drugs were found in Peter's system,
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I guess he could have ingested something which caused his death and it was
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never detected during the autopsy. And I think you have to step back and
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say what did the autopsy actually test for? Because there's so many levels of
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testing you can do for substances that could be so in somebody's body, and
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that's how you see these cases where someone has poisoned someone and because they weren't
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looking for that chemical, because there wasn't a test for that specific drug or
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whatever is going on, it is missed. And so if it's this idea
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that this is a person who's very clearly sick, they have cancer riddled throughout
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their body, they have other issues where you can see his heart has struggled
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and he's had multiple heart attacks, then maybe they're not looking as carefully as
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possible, saying hey, listen, are we going to run all of the
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toxicology reports? Are we simply going to do these basic tests, therefore missing
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something like cyanide I mean, I think it is a possible ability that they
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simply didn't run the test given what his body was already telling them. The
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standard panel's pretty basic, right, It's going to be testing for like alcohol,
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marijuana, cocaine, methampheta means all those types of things. So unless
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they know what to test for, it's so hard to pinpoint it. Like
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look at the case of like Alexander Livinenko, the one who was the Russian
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who was poisoned in the UK with their radioactive isotope. I can't remember exactly
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which one, and it took them so long to figure out exactly what happened,
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how it was administered, and what was causing this rapid deterioration. But
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do either of you know that in the case of the ingestion of cyanide,
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is cardiac arrest the first thing that it causes A good question. I'm going
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to look that up. It says at Wikipedia at least that early symptoms of
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cyanid poisoning include headache, dizziness, fast heart rate, shortness of breath,
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and vomited and this phase mean and this phase may then be followed by seizures,
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slow heart rate, low blood pressure, loss of consciousness, and cardiac
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arrest. So that is one of the symptoms. Yeah, it says that
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suicide attempts are the primary cause. This is from a medical journal or the
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suicide attempts with the primary cause of a cyanide intake, and the majority of
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these attempts are fatal. Cyanide induced cardiac arrest or hypotension is one of the
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most common causes of death through the ingestion of cyanide. How easy do you
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want to check? How easy it is to see the effects of cyanide,
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Like would a medical examiner upon doing an autopsy think, oh, there's something
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strange here, there's been this cascade of effects, or would it simply pass
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for a heart attack unless you specifically did a panel testing for cyanide, Like
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with something in the autopsy indicate that they should test for cyanide. Let's see,
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Like it says it can be detected in an autopsy, but it depends
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on if you're looking for it. And I am reading that detection of cyanide
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poisoning can be difficult, so it's possible that And it says that a lot
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of the effects of ingestion are similar to the effects of suffocation, so as
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possible it could be missed if they're not looking hard enough. And what I
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think here is you have to look at if you were the medical examiner and
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you found this body washed up on shore and you start to explore his body
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and you see a heart that is sick. Right he's supposedly they were able
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to tell you had multiple heart attacks. So right there, you're going,
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my gosh, this is a sick heart and it looks like it actually stopped
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and that was the cause of death based on the fact that there wasn't water
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in the lungs and things like that, and then you see that he has
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an advanced stage of prostate cancer, which means cancer could have spread to other
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parts of the body. I think it would have been one of those where
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you very quickly say, given that he was found in the water, there's
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no water in his lungs, and his heart clearly stopped, and we have
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this cardiac arrest present in his heart and a sick heart. On top of
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that, we're able to see that it has multiple histories of issues. Then
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I don't know that you would dig much further. There's no sign that drowning
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caused it. And then you see that he's very sick, and then his
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heart stopped, and I bet he may have if that is the case he
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may have bet on that. Why would they test for sinide poisoning? They're
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going to see a very sick man who's in advanced age of prostate cancer with
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a weak heart, who has a history of heart attack, So why would
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they dig any further and why would they assume anything other than he was just
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struck down by a heart attack. But then when you have the director Tacidy
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Caring Cassidy saying that there was potentially cyanide adjusted, then the serendipitous timing of
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this heart attack is called into question and you go, okay, well did
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he just attempt to ingest something that wouldn't have been tested for at a regular
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drug panel. And if we look at his behavior leading up to what could
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have been his suicide or just you know, a medical cardiac event that led
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to his death, then we have to think, like the cutting off of
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the labels and the disposing of identification or anything linked to himself, then it
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is very possible that he would have chosen a substance like sinide. But then
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the other question is what would he have been doing in what type of a
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line of work would he have been in to have had access to cyanide,
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because you can't just go out and buy it. I want to say you
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can get it on I mean the dark Way. Yeah, I was going
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to say, I feel like if I wanted it, I could get it.
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But what year was, like, uh dread Pygriate, Roberts and the
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Silk Road. What year did that start? Because before that it would have
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been a lot harder. Oh it was twenty eleven and this take took place
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in two thousand and nine, so I don't know if it would have been
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more difficult to obtain cyanide at this point. Also, think about this,
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if you knew I'm dying I wanted to, I would dig I don't want
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to be a burden on my family anymore. And he really is going to
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end his life. He buys that one way ticket. He says, take
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me to this place that's a peaceful beach, and he scopes a mound and
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he goes back the next day. If that's the case, can you imagine
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the fear of drowning to death. That seems like one of the most brutal,
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horrific moments that could ever happen. So if I knew that I wanted
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to end my life, it is a much more ideal situation that I ingest
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something that's going to cause me to die, and then I would be taken
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out to see after I knew that I was either unconscious or deceased. So
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I think that could very well have been part of his plan as at Cyanide.
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Who knows, but if there was an ingestion of something that would have
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caused cardiac arrest to a weak heart, that makes a lot of sense versus
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saying I want to drown myself. That seems like a very scary, painful
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way to end your life. And I know people who were very determined to
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end their own lives can indeed drown themselves in small amounts of water. But
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it's that survival mechanism that kicks in. And I don't necessarily think that you
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yourself, unless you've attempted it, are going to know if that's going to
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kick in and that you're going to pull yourself out or you're just you're going
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to pull yourself out of the water like not being able to complete it.
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But I think with Cyanide, there's that no turning back type of a thing,
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and it's very very quick. I mean, I'm not an expert,
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You too did just do some googling, But the amount of time from ingestion
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to death is pretty short, no, I think so. Yeah. Like
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you remember, we did another case, the William L. Toomey case.
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That was another decedits who did jest cyanide in a church in nineteen eighty two
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and he was waiting to go into the confession booth. But it sounds like
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he gest died it before he got his turn because someone else was in there
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and die before it can happen. And in that case, we still don't
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know how he obtained his cyanide. But before we talk more about Peter's death,
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let's go back to the beginning and track his movements. The first CCTV
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footage of Peter showed him at the bus depot and Dry before he made the
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one hundred and thirty five kilometer trip to Sligo. Since it seems very unlikely
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that Peter was an Irish citizen, he had to travel from somewhere else,
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possibly Austria, in order to arrive in Dry. This would have required the
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usage of a passport, but he probably got rid of it at some point,
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and since we don't know his real name, that makes it very difficult
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to track down when he originally entered the country. Now, in spite of
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all the theorizing about how Peter chose Sligo for a reason, his actions when
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he first arrived there give off the impression that he wasn't all that familiar with
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the city. The bus station was only about a fifteen minute walk from the
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Sligo City Hotel, so there was really no need for him to take a
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taxi. It seems like he didn't have much idea where to go. He
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never made a reservation anywhere and only wound up staying at the Sligo City Hotel
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because the first hotel he tried was full, and much like with the Jennifer
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fairgate case, it's very frustrating that the desk clerk did not ask Peter for
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identification when he checked in, even though it was supposedly standard policy in Ireland
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for all hotels to require ID from their guests. If Peter had been asked
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to produce ID, who knows how you would have reacted and if things might
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have turned out differently. Instead, he was allowed to provide a fake name
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and address, and there has been endless speculation about their potential significance. What's
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interesting is I do think that Peter was looking for a place that probably wouldn't
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have asked for identification. Like we mentioned in episode one, you know,
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the hospitality industry and law enforcement have protocols in place to help with things like
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human trafficking, fraud, all of these different things, drug networking, and
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so because now you are required to produce an ID, you are produced,
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you have to produce a credit card that matches the ID on file, and
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that's how you have to book your room. I think Peter we're out in
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the car and specifically said I want a cheap hotel and I don't really care
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where it is, and he goes to a place, assuming that the cheaper
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the hotel, the less likely they would stick to those protocol It's two thousand
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and nine. I'm assuming in Ireland they had the same rules, and he
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found a place that wanted the money, they didn't care what was happening in
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their rooms. And that's one of the issues that we run into. I
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don't think it matters what country you're in if there's a rule in place,
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and yet I'm the kind of establishment that just cares about the bottom line of
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my money. I don't care what age the people running my room are.
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I don't care who they are, and I don't care what they came for.
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I just want their money. Then why would they care who Peter actually
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was, because you even mentioned our last episode that, for all you know,
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Peter could have provided a fake story just saying, oh, I forgot
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my identification, I'll show it to you at a later time. And they
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just went for it. They said, well, we want your money,
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and that's why they decided to let him check in. And they probably never
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guessed that this would become the centerpiece of a huge mystery. Yeah, and
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I guarantee you had he been staying at a place like you know, Jules
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said to like if it was the Hilton, or if it was a bigger,
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a higher end hotel chain that does care about the protocol being followed.
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I remember just losing my room key and needing to get back in, and
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I was like, hey, here I am on the internet, Like here's
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my face, here's my school ID, here's these things. I just don't
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have my driver's license and credit card with me. They're in the room.
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They had to have security escort me to my room, produce the documents before
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I could be, you know, back down at the front desk and get
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a copy of the key. But it was a very serious thing. They
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said, no, no, I don't care what else you produce with your
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name on it. I don't care what pictures you show us. It has
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to be your government issued idea and it has to be the credit card that
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matches it. And I went, goodness, okay, So I mean it
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is a it's serious for them. That's something that you know a lot of
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higher end hotel chains. I don't think you're going to bend. And Peter
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won, if he was ending his life, doesn't want to pay a lot
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of money. But I think he knew that he could probably get away with
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saying this is my name, I'm Peter, and I can write down a
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fake address and it doesn't really matter. And Robin, one question for you.
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I think you'd mentioned it in episode one and I forgot to ask,
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and you'd said that they never asked him to produce ID. Do we know
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for a fact that they never asked him to produce ID or did the person
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ask him to produce ID? And he said that he wasn't able to at
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that moment, and they just let it slide. It's never been clarified.
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I don't think that they've ever asked the desk clerk to confirm it, so
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that is kind of a mystery in this case. I know that's one of
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the big controversies in the Jennifer fairgate case, because apparently the desk clerk at
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the hotel there like has given conflicting stories about why they did not ask Jennifer
22:47
for her ID and why she was allowed to check in, So who knows.
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Maybe the clerk was no longer working there by the time this became a
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mystery, and they just were never able to track them down and get their
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side of the story. I could almost understand in the Jennifer fairgate case because
23:03
it's in nineteen ninety five, but with Peter Bergmann, it's two thousand and
23:07
nine. It just seems so inconceivable that somebody wouldn't ask for identification. Now
23:14
there's been differing accounts from different sources about whether the address he provided from Vienna
23:19
led to a vacant lot or just never existed in the first place. I
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know that if you type the supposed street name in Stetterson into Google, the
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only matches you're going to get are sources related to this case, so I
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wonder if it might have been a misspelling or of some sort, and if
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Peter just made the name up. The thing with the postal code he provided
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four four seven two is that even though Vienna's four digit postal codes only begin
23:45
with one, there is another section of Upper Austria which it does use that
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particular number. But it doesn't sound like investigators ever found any significance to it.
23:56
And of course you have to wonder if there's a reason why he shows
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the name Peter Bergmann. Bergmann is spelled with two ends, not one,
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and if you type that name into Google, you'll find a Wikipedia page for
24:07
a prominent German American physicist named Peter Bergman, who work with Albert Einstein and
24:14
publish a couple of textbooks on such topics as general relativity before his death in
24:18
two thousand and two. But it's possible this connection is nothing more than a
24:22
coincidence and the name provides no clues about the man's true identity. It's interesting
24:29
that the people who have talked to Peter and who have actually interacted with him
24:33
can identify this Austrian accent. But then when he makes up this address,
24:37
there seem to be bits and pieces that'll match, but things like the postal
24:40
code doesn't match a place in Vienna. He does have a street that could
24:45
be real, but it actually traces back to more of an abandoned lot instead
24:51
of an actual home where he would live. So is Edmund to confuse people?
24:56
Is he taking bits and pieces of reality and trying to put some pieces
25:00
down or is this all just simply made up, like his name. Well,
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to make another comparison to Jennifer Fairgate, when she checked into her hotel,
25:08
she provided the name of a village in Norway, and they did check
25:12
this out, but cannot find anyone who recognized or knew who she was.
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So it seemed apparent that she might have just just chosen this place at random
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and it had no real connection to her. So, for all you know,
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maybe Peter did that. Maybe he chose a location that just didn't even
25:26
exist because it just popped into his head and said, well, if anyone
25:32
tries to track me down, they'll never find me because I'm not giving them
25:34
any information. So, unlike the aforementioned Jennifer Fairgate and Lyle Stevick cases,
25:42
Peter did not die until after he checked out of the hotel, so you
25:45
have to wonder about his reasons for staying in Sliego for three nights. In
25:51
the Last Days of Peter Bergmann documentary, the hotel manager shared a story about
25:55
an incident in which she visited Peter's room and knocked on the door but received
25:59
no anas, sir. When she decided to unlock the door and go inside,
26:03
she saw Peter standing in the doorway with a startled look on his face,
26:07
and he almost appeared like he had been caught in the middle of doing
26:10
something. But then he apparently gave off a look which almost seemed to indicate
26:14
he was relieved that it was only a member of the hotel staff who was
26:18
visiting him. So I don't know if this can be seen as a sign
26:21
that Peter traveled to Sligo to hide from someone. Of course, you can
26:25
understand why Peter might have valued his privacy, as the CCTV footage captured him
26:30
exiting the hotel no less than thirteen times while carrying a purple plastic bag,
26:34
and then returning out a later time with nothing in his hands. This is
26:38
why investigators believe that Peter spent his entire three night hotel stay, gradually disposing
26:45
of most of his personal possessions and taking steps to ensure that no one would
26:49
ever be able to figure out his true identity. We saw another example of
26:53
this when Peter was shown checking out of the hotel with three bags in his
26:56
hand, but he was only carrying two of these bags when CCTV footage captured
27:02
him arriving at the bus station less than thirty minutes later, so I'm guessing
27:06
he had some additional items in that bag he wanted to get rid of.
27:10
The authorities were unable to recover any of the possessions that Peter supposedly disposed of,
27:15
but the problem is that they really didn't have any idea what they were
27:18
looking for, and I'm not sure if these items would have had any distinctive
27:22
characteristics to prove they belonged to him. Since Peter was never shown getting rid
27:26
of any personal items on CCTV, it's been theorized that he knew the camera's
27:32
blind spots and went out of his way to avoid them. This is why
27:36
we've seen online sleuth speculate that Peter might have been in the police or the
27:40
military, or had experience as a spy because he had the necessary skills and
27:45
training to avoid security cameras. However, this seems to contradict the assertion that
27:51
Peter did not have much familiarity with Sligo, as they seemed to know so
27:55
little about the downtown area that he had to ask the taxi driver to find
27:59
him at Tell when he first drived. So how would he have known where
28:03
all the CCTV cameras were. I have a feeling that Peter not being captured
28:07
on camera disposing of any possessions was do more to luck than anything. Yeah,
28:12
I have to lean more towards it that a luck thing. He seemed
28:17
very unsure of a lot of things in this area, like, Hey,
28:19
is there a cheap hotel I can go to? Hey? Is there a
28:22
nice beach I can go? To? Take me to any of those?
28:26
Hey, I got on the wrong bus a few times. I mean,
28:29
we see him make decisions and actions that show that he's not familiar with his
28:33
surroundings. It doesn't seem like he's actually at this stage where he's planned out
28:38
so carefully that he can avoid these cameras. Yes, he's doing some careful
28:42
planning. If he's disposing of items. But is it also the fact that
28:47
I don't know about you guys, but anytime I've been with law enforcement in
28:49
like pulled security camera or you were looking for camera coverage of a certain business
28:56
or businesses, it's like it's very purposely placed on one segment of the building,
29:03
the doorway right or the front desk or things like that. Possibly not
29:07
in the areas where the receptacles are, where the trash cans are located.
29:11
Maybe they're simply not priority areas in these establishments where he's visiting, and they're
29:15
focusing on places like where the cash register is located, where the front door
29:19
is located, where other potential large gathering areas might be, but that they're
29:26
not in these smaller locations or these more corner obscure locations where someone might go
29:32
to dispose of something. And so I think it's more luck or placement of
29:36
the cameras versus saying he was able to elude them. We caught him on
29:41
CCTV. You just didn't see him disposing of the items. But they also
29:45
don't place trash cans in the middle of the room. They don't place the
29:47
trash can right in front of the front desk at the hotel, So I
29:51
think it could just be the placement of these items. I don't think he
29:55
was familiar with where he was, therefore, I don't think he was at
29:57
the point of being able to elude ude the recordings. Yeah, that's a
30:03
good point. If he was going to, say a dumpster in a back
30:06
alley to dispose of items, that's not a place where you're going to find
30:08
a security camera. So I think he probably just lucked out and just went
30:12
to locations that just didn't happen to have any cameras. Now, one thing
30:18
we do know about Peter's stay and Sligo is that he stopped by the post
30:22
office and purchased airmail stickers and ten eighty two cent stamps. Well, it's
30:27
never been officially confirmed that he mailed any letters, the fact that these stamps
30:33
and stickers were not found on him when he died would imply that he did
30:37
well. It's easy to believe that Peter was some loner who did not have
30:40
any family or friends, why would he have felt the need to mail out
30:44
any letters. But if he did have family and friends, then these actions
30:48
do make sense, especially if he knew he was going to die sometime in
30:52
the near future. However, not one person has ever come forward to say
30:56
that they received any letters from Peter, which would be all the more surprising
31:02
if he mailed them to ten separate people. At that time, the postage
31:06
to mail a letter to someone in Ireland was fifty five cents, and it
31:08
was eighty two cents to mail something outside the country. So the fact that
31:12
he purchased eighty two cent stamps obviously suggests that any letters he had sent had
31:18
an international destination, right. And also you have this idea that maybe he
31:25
was sending information for work, maybe he had to mail in time cards,
31:29
or maybe he had to mail in receipts, or maybe he was mailing in
31:33
I don't know, bills for his medical expenses, so his partner wasn't burdened
31:37
with him. I mean, we really have no idea where these were going.
31:41
I really would have assumed that they would have found them on his person,
31:45
except for the fact that it seemed like he did have a plan for
31:48
either getting rid of his things preparing for the end of his life. There
31:52
was a meticulous decision made when you see the actions of him trying to check
31:56
things off the list, right like minimizing on his person getting these postage stamps,
32:02
and then we assume subsequently mailing letters. So either it was sent to
32:07
someone like you said earlier, where he's trying to say, I'm not here
32:12
anymore. I ended my life. Please don't worry about me. I wanted
32:15
to die with dignity. I mean, it is possible people receive letters and
32:20
weren't connected to the Peter Bergmann case, but that they know that their loved
32:25
one was dying of cancer. Didn't want them to have to see him at
32:30
the end of his life where he wasn't able to have all of his faculties
32:32
about him, and he wrote the truth, I'm taking my life with dignity.
32:37
Please let me be I love you with all my heart. This is
32:39
the way I want to do it. Please honor and respect that. And
32:43
they were at peace with that, and therefore when they don't link themselves to
32:47
Peter countries away, then it's kind of the end of that story. So
32:53
I don't know. I think the fact that you didn't find the postage stamps
32:57
likely he did send them to some one, or he was doing something more
33:00
practical where you wouldn't have really had anyone paying attention, like paying a bill
33:05
or sending something to his workplace. I just don't think that we can operate
33:08
under the presupposition that everybody in his life, if he did have these close
33:14
relationships or relationships at all, that they were aware of his councer diagnosis,
33:19
because if he wanted to end his own life, he may have been dealing
33:22
with this on his own without the supportive family, because they might not have
33:27
known that they had to support him if he didn't disclose his diagnosis, which
33:31
some people don't, especially if they find out about the disease in the end
33:36
stages, and then he may say, well, I don't want to burden
33:38
people with this and watching my rapid dissent, so I'm going to take it
33:43
upon myself. But I don't want to make people sad. And so if
33:46
that is the case, we can't assume that he disclosed the truth, which
33:50
would be I'm ending my own life, I'm going to be at piece.
33:52
Well, then I would think that one of those people would have heard about
33:55
the Peter Bergman case because their antennas would have been up and somebody would have
34:00
contacted the authorities. I just think that if he did send letters, there
34:04
would have been an element of misdirection involved. One of the big complicating factors
34:09
with identifying Peter Bergmann is that, even though his story got extensive coverage in
34:14
Ireland, it's very unlikely that he was an Irish citizen, and I'm not
34:17
sure how well known his case is and other countries. If Peter hailed from
34:22
Austria or Germany and his friends and family received some letters there, they may
34:25
have had no idea that he became an unidentified John Doe in Ireland. According
34:30
to a twenty fifteen article in the French newspaper Le Mont, the Austrian authorities
34:37
claim they were never contacted by the Guardee about this case, so I don't
34:40
know how much effort has been spent attempting to match Peter with missing persons in
34:45
Austria. There is also no official interpoal notice for Peter Bergmann because their only
34:51
two categories are missing person and wanted person, and as far as anyone can
34:54
tell, no one has ever reported this guy missing. It would be the
34:59
responseb of his home country to do so, but we don't even know which
35:02
country's from. On the other side of the coin. It's also possible that
35:07
the people who received Peter's letters are well aware of his story, but he
35:10
gave specific instructions for them not to come forward and claim his body, and
35:15
they've decided to respect his wishes. But of course we still can't be one
35:19
hundred percent certain that Peter mailed any letters in the first place. That's right,
35:23
I mean, we have no idea that he You didn't take those postage
35:27
stamps in that purple bag and discard of them somewhere. You could just as
35:30
easily throw the postage stamps away as you could mail them. It. Just
35:35
because I wasn't found with his belongings doesn't mean that he actually used them.
35:40
The only other significant movement we know about from Peter Stan's lago was when he
35:45
asked a taxi driver to take him to a quiet beach and they took a
35:49
brief trip to Ross's Point. It doesn't sound like Peter was aware of this
35:53
location beforehand, but it made a strong enough impression for him to travel back
35:58
there when he decided to check out of the hotel. We know that Peter
36:01
subsequently took the bus to return to the beach the following day, and while
36:07
we don't know the exact time he died, Several eyewitnesses placed him on the
36:10
beach at various times between four and eleven fifty pm. Most of them described
36:16
Peter as introspectively pacing and walking through the water in his bare feet. But
36:22
why would he remain at that same location for eight straight hours if he was
36:27
planning suicide by drowning himself in the ocean. Perhaps he wanted to wait until
36:30
the middle of the night and then there was less chance of someone coming along
36:34
and rescuing him. But for a guy who liked to keep to himself and
36:37
was going out of his way to erase all traces of his identity, he
36:42
still managed to leave an impression on all the people who saw him. Most
36:45
of the witnesses who spotted Peter on the beach would later say they distinctly remember
36:50
him because he seemed at a place there and something about him really stood out.
36:54
While it's not uncommon for people to end their life by jumping into a
36:59
body of water, walking into the ocean to intentionally drown yourself is a lot
37:04
more complicated way to die. Even though it's been theorized that Peter hoped to
37:08
be swept out into the Atlantic Ocean and lost forever, part of me wonders
37:13
if he actually wanted his death to be as mysterious as possible so that he
37:17
would be remembered. In fact, I'm genuinely curious to know if Peter might
37:22
have been familiar with the Somerton Man case, because both men went to the
37:25
trouble of removing all the labels from their clothing, and this could also be
37:30
the reason that Peter intentionally chose a beach as his final destination. So are
37:36
the similarities between these two mysteries just a coincidence or did Peter orchestrate the whole
37:42
thing intentionally. Well, if Peter did want to be forgotten about after he
37:45
died, then it's truly ironic that his actions have led to him becoming the
37:51
subject of endless discussion in the media and on the internet. Yeah, exactly,
37:57
I mean this idea. I think it's a coincidence between the cases in
38:00
my personal opinion. But one of the things that really caught my eye when
38:05
I was listening to this is that he went to the beach so early in
38:07
the afternoon, right, it was around what two thirty or three o'clock When
38:10
he gets there at four o'clock, four o'clock and then we know for a
38:15
fact that there's people who are saying they see him well into ten eleven,
38:19
eleven thirty at night. You would think if you were going to the beach
38:22
to end your life, you would go at dusk at the you know,
38:28
as the evening's rolling in, or even later, so that there aren't other
38:30
people on the beach. But you also feel this sense that if he did
38:35
take a substance to render himself unconscious or to cause cardiac arrests before being swept
38:39
out, that's all of this is a huge decision, right, And so
38:44
I could see going and having thirty minutes an hour where you're pacing back and
38:49
forth and saying like, Okay, this is it, this is it,
38:51
this is it. That's a to me, a horrifying thought that I'm about
38:54
to dictate exactly when my life ends. So I could see the delay in
39:00
actually executing that plan. But the hours upon hours upon hours that he's there
39:06
is odd. It opened him up to being talked to by multiple people by
39:10
being identified, you know, later down the road, And in my mind,
39:15
it's like, is that part of that kind of delirium psychosis that he
39:19
could have been experiencing where he says, I'm going to go down there,
39:22
I'm going to wait till it's dark, But he's not really factoring in how
39:24
long this takes. I don't know. It's sad if he's if he's waiting
39:30
to end his life, that seems like a very sad, drawn out to
39:32
me scary circumstance that you would be there for eight hours waiting to end your
39:37
life, contemplating, though, you know, pacing back and forth thinking about
39:43
your life. Because once, if we are to believe he did take Seinid,
39:47
or even if he was just going to walk out into the ocean,
39:50
the finality of it, it could take a lot of nerve. Even if
39:53
you're sure exactly what actions you want to take and your hell bent on taking
39:59
the actions, I think getting the courage to actually take that action that will
40:06
end your own life and not knowing what awaits you on the other side is
40:10
a truly scary endeavor for anybody who's going to be in a position such as
40:15
that. So eight hours does sound extreme, but I think given the gravity
40:22
of a situation, if we're to believe that was his objective, then I
40:24
can completely understand. In addition to the unanswered questions, about how exactly Peter
40:31
died. There's also some mystery about the items he did and did not leave
40:36
behind. Various witnesses from the beach saw him with the small black bag slung
40:39
over his shoulder and the purple plastic bag in his hands, but neither of
40:44
these bags were recovered. It's one thing for him to dispose of items like
40:47
this in the middle of town, but there would have been a limited amount
40:52
of places to get rid of them on the beach unless he carried the bags
40:54
into the water and the tide took them out to see. His glasses also
40:59
disappear, though I suppose he could have lost those in the ocean as well.
41:02
And even though he was found wearing a navy T shirt, he had
41:06
been seen wearing a long sleeved pale blue shirt when he left the hotel,
41:10
and it was not on the beach either. It's also odd that Peter was
41:14
wearing underwear over top a speedo if his plan was to drown himself all along.
41:20
I wonder why he even removed any of his clothing to begin with,
41:22
because wearing all those heavy articles into the water would have made it easier for
41:27
him to sink the way the clothing was neatly folded, almost gives off the
41:30
impression that Peter was legitimately planning to go for a swim before he unexpectedly succumbed
41:37
to a fatal heart attack. That's also very possible that this was not a
41:42
place to go in his life. That maybe he had a sensory issue where
41:45
he's cutting the labels out of his clothing right where he doesn't want the tags
41:50
on his clothes, or maybe he you know, it was part of his
41:54
mental health that you know, where he's going. I don't want the name
41:57
brands on here. I don't want the label on my clothes. My daughter
42:00
can't have labels touching her body. So who knows if Peter had something like
42:04
that as well, But it is possible that he was going just for a
42:07
swim. I don't know as a man, why you would put undies over
42:13
your speedo. I mean, it feels like just two layers of an undergarment,
42:16
So that seems very odd to me. If you were going with the
42:20
intent to swim, why not just wear the speedo under your clothes. Why
42:23
put the pair of underwear on top of it. You also have a bag
42:27
with you, why not put the extra pair of underwear in your bag for
42:29
when you're done swimming, you can just change from the speedo to the underwear.
42:32
That seems a little bit odd to me. Yeah, as a man,
42:37
I can tell you that's not normal. So I can't think of anyone
42:38
who's going a sweeto with underwear or obnet while going for a swim. But
42:45
now let's explore the personal items which were left inside the pockets of Peter's clothing.
42:50
Many of them, such as the envelope containing money, were not unusual,
42:53
but the two items which seemed a bit odd were the aspirin and the
42:58
wrap bar of hotel soap. Under normal circumstances, the aspirin wouldn't be weird
43:02
at all, but the toxicology report showed no traces of any medication in his
43:07
system, including aspirin, even though Peter's cancer likely would have been causing him
43:13
great pain. I mean, if he were one of those people who didn't
43:15
believe in drugs or painkillers, that would be one thing, But then why
43:21
would he be carrying around aspron to begin with? These particular aspirin tablets were
43:25
distributed in Germany by the country's pharmaceutical company, Bayer. So I don't know
43:30
if this could be seen as a clue that Peter originally hailed from there.
43:35
The soap in Peter's pocket wouldn't be unusual if he had taken it from the
43:38
Slago City hotel, but the rapper had the words Mild Soap Hotel Care printed
43:44
on them, and this particular brand is not made or stalked by any hotels
43:47
in Ireland. So obviously Peter must have stayed at a hotel in another country
43:52
and carried the soap into Ireland with him. But after Gwen is so much
43:57
trouble to dispose of all of his personal items, why did he still have
44:00
this soap on him at the time of his death. And it's the soap
44:04
on him, it's not in his possession like in one of his bags.
44:07
Like we teased earlier. A lot of us take the free soap from the
44:10
hotel right just in case, but I never have it on my person.
44:15
I don't have it in me in my pocket when I'm discovered, right when
44:20
I've been out at the beach, I don't have it sitting in my pocket.
44:22
It was just a very odd location to have a bar of hotel soap
44:27
on you. Overall, the one thing about this case I'm fairly certain of
44:32
is that Peter was not the victim of foul play, so it's not like
44:36
we're looking for some unknown killer here. I do believe his death was either
44:39
suicide or natural causes. But even if he was a loner, you still
44:44
have to think there must be someone out there who misses this guy and is
44:46
wondering what happened to him. In a lot of the more recent cases in
44:51
which John or Jane does have been identified, it turned out they were living
44:54
a transient lifestyle and had no fixed address at the time of their death,
45:00
which is why they were never officially reported missing and it took so long to
45:02
figure out who they were. But I do not get the impression that that
45:07
Peter Bergman was a transient So if he resided in another country, did he
45:10
not have a house or an apartment under his name somewhere which suddenly went unoccupied
45:15
and left people asking questions? He was in the advanced stages of prostate cancer
45:21
and had bone tumors, so were there no medical professionals who were treating him
45:24
at that time? And why ed why he just stopped showing up for appointments
45:29
hell, Peter was missing one of his kidneys, so unless he sold it
45:31
on the black market, there have to be records somewhere of an operation where
45:36
that kidney was removed. There had to have been, and there had to
45:39
be. The teeth records are the ones that really bother me where you say
45:44
there were specific things like bridges made for his mouth, there were rude canals
45:49
performed in his mouth, Like, there had to be dental records that said,
45:52
this is so obviously this person and having those very clear health issues,
45:59
knowing he had hard issues, know any had the prostate cancer, it seems
46:02
like his body gave keys to who his identity was. Yeah, that's the
46:07
thing, Like they could use his teeth and match them to dental records if
46:12
they could figure out where he was from. But that's the issue is where
46:15
do you start, Which country do you go to, which city you go
46:17
to to start checking dental records? And I just have a feeling if they
46:22
can narrow it down a bit that even if they do not use DNA,
46:24
those distinct dental records could be used to identify them. Again, the key
46:30
to uncovering Peter's true identity is figuring out if he mailed any letters from Sligo,
46:36
and since he purchased ten stamps, there could have been as many as
46:38
ten recipients who heard from him. It's unlikely he would have referred to himself
46:44
as Peter Bergman and these letters, so you can understand why these recipients have
46:47
never put two and two together. But you also have to wonder if there's
46:52
anyone out there who recalls receiving a letter postmark from Slago, Ireland in June
46:57
two thousand and nine and never heard from the writer again. Like we mentioned
47:01
earlier, there are CCTV images of Peter Bergmann plastered all over the Internet,
47:07
and his Wikipedia pages even has an actual post mortem photograph of him. So
47:12
unless Peter's friends and family have their own reasons for not coming forward, there
47:16
may be a day where someone comes across one of these images of Peter and
47:21
recognizes him. During our episodes, we've made mention of this. Somerton Man
47:25
another case in which an unidentified John Doe died under such strange circumstances that many
47:30
people speculated that he was a spy involved in espionage, but now he's likely
47:36
been identified as Charles Carl Webb. We know that these spy theories were nothing
47:40
more than smoke and mirrors, and the decedent was an ordinary guy who lived
47:45
an unhappy life and suffered from serious mental health issues. So the same logic
47:51
might apply to Peter Bergman, as he was also probably not a spy with
47:54
a larger than life backstory, but was simply an ordinary man who traveled Slago
48:00
for his own personal reasons. That is exactly what I think happened. I
48:04
think if Peter had been some kind of larger than life entity and there had
48:08
been this huge romantic story as to how he got there, there would have
48:14
been more attention. There would have been more links to him to external places
48:19
other than just the location where he was discovered. So I for me,
48:24
the prayer would be that someone would be able to see Peter and know,
48:29
for their own sake, this is what happened. He is at rest,
48:31
They have his body, we can actually bury him with a headstone, we
48:35
can cremate him and have him back in our care, those kinds of reasons.
48:39
It's my prayer that they recognize Peter. But I don't think there is
48:43
some huge international spire espionage happening with Peter. I just don't think it's the
48:47
case here. I mentioned in our last episode that the Guardie have confirmed that
48:52
they do not use websites like ancestry dot com, as I think the rules
48:58
for using genetic genealogy and criminal investigations might be a lot different in Europe than
49:01
North America. So even though the authorities do have Peter Bergmann's DNA, I
49:07
do not believe identifying him will be as simple as submitting his DNA into a
49:12
genealogical database. But of course, if they manage to find anyone who seems
49:15
like a promising candidate to be a biological relative of Peter's, they can still
49:21
use his DNA to make a genetic comparison and positively identify him. While I've
49:25
already addressed the potential ethical issues of identifying Peter if it goes against his final
49:30
wishes, I still hate the idea of this man having loved ones out there
49:35
who are suffering because they don't know what happened to him. And that's why
49:38
I believe every investigative possibility should be explored. So if you happen to have
49:43
any information about the identity of the man known only as Peter Bergmann, please
49:47
contact the appropriate authorities. Jules Ashley, any final thoughts on this case?
49:53
This one for me, it's more about the family that there is a family
49:58
summer saying I wonder what happened to my loved one. He was sick,
50:04
And the reality is that when you have a person who makes a decision to
50:09
end their life, that is a very personal, very big decision that that
50:14
individual is struggling with. Yet they still have a family who is waiting to
50:20
understand what happened where they are and just having their body to say that this
50:23
is a closed part of our life that he passed away. He was sick.
50:29
We want to honor him and have a place where we can go and
50:30
honor him as a final resting place. There's a family that doesn't have that.
50:36
And there's still the potential that Peter did not complete suicide, that he
50:39
did go, let's say, to get away and left. He was having
50:44
a mental health crisis and just needed to get away and clear as mind,
50:47
knowing that he was not going to live much longer. This might be his
50:50
last chance to travel. Maybe he was going to go home and had that
50:53
cardiac arrest on the beach. Still again, there's a family wondering what happened
50:59
to our loved one if he had not left detailed plans of where he was
51:01
going, which he likely did not. When he's using false names and things
51:05
like that, then someone's wondering, where is my brother, where is my
51:09
uncle, where's my cousin, where's my coworker, where's my husband? So
51:15
it's just sad. And my prayer is that the authorities who say the DNA
51:20
and genetic genealogy would do nothing to help this case, that they step back
51:23
and they rethink that there's too much progression in terms of genetic genealogy. I
51:29
believe it is being practiced very heavily, and databases are being used heavily.
51:34
In Europe. This would be the prime case to say who is this John
51:38
Doe and give that family some answers. I agree. I think genetic genealogy
51:45
absolutely should be used in this case, but like we mentioned throughout, I
51:49
am completely unaware of what the laws are in Europe with regards to using it,
51:53
and Robin had said that it's only used in Canada and the US.
51:58
So I really hope moving forward, as you know, the technology continues to
52:02
improve, and there's so many different Jane and John doe cases that are solved
52:07
through genetic genealogy that countries in Europe get on board as well. But if
52:13
they are unable to do so, even something so simple as radiocarbon dating could
52:17
allow them to figure out potentially where Peter Bergman grew up, where he's lived,
52:23
you know, in the last few years of his life, and it
52:25
might narrow down this zone. And as far as what his objective was,
52:32
I mean, I personally think that there's a strong likelihood or probability that his
52:38
intention was to complete suicide. And since Kuran Cassidy, the director of that
52:44
fourteen minute short that showed at Sundance and I think won in a word at
52:47
Melbourne International Film Festival, Robin is that right, Yeah, that's correct.
52:52
Yeah, that Cassidy had said that there was a potential that cyanide was used,
52:58
and I think that for me, that makes a lot more sense than
53:01
just a random heart attack just before one could complete suicide. But I think
53:07
that I can't discount any possibility in this case. And as Ashley just mentioned,
53:13
I really really hope that moving forward they can figure out the identity because
53:17
somewhere out there there's friends and family who are missing this man, and who
53:22
wonder what happened to him, And it's just so heartbreaking that he died while
53:29
staring down this insidious disease all alone on this beach. Just it really breaks
53:34
my heart. Yeah, Like we've talked about how in recent years, identifying
53:39
John or Jane Does and giving them their names back has pretty much become a
53:44
weekly and sometimes a daily thing because there are literally hundreds of decedents who have
53:49
gotten their identity back thanks to genetic genealogy. And I remember when they started
53:52
using it in twenty eighteen. One of the first John Does who was identified
53:58
was Lyle Stevick, which was a very similar case, like we said to
54:01
Peter Bergman, where he checked into a hotel under a false name and then
54:06
took his own life, and they couldn't figure out who he was until they
54:10
submitted his DNA into a genealogical database. And it seems inevitable that the vast
54:15
majority of these cases will be solved someday in North America. But there is
54:19
kind of a gray area here where genetic genealogy does not seem to be implemented
54:24
much in Europe or in many other foreign countries or continents, and The two
54:30
prime examples of this are the Jennifer Fairgate case and the Peter Bergmann case,
54:34
about two mysterious folks who checked into a hotel under a false name and then
54:38
died under very strange circumstances. And I think if these cases had taken place
54:44
in North America, they would already be solved now because they would just enter
54:46
their DNA into a deep database and try to find some relatives. But here
54:52
things are a lot more complicated. I mean not only taking into account what
54:55
potential laws there might be in Ireland, but also potential laws in other countries,
55:00
because it seemed like Peter was from Austria or perhaps even Germany, and
55:05
that just makes the whole situation all the more complicated. I do think that
55:09
he probably traveled to Ireland with the intention of ending his own life because he
55:15
probably did not want to suffer from the cancer he was facing anymore, and
55:19
he was in so much pain that he wanted to end things before he died
55:22
of natural causes. And maybe he just picked out Sligo randomly on the Internet.
55:28
He said, this seems to be a nice place where I can die
55:30
peacefully, and then just decided to get rid of all clues to his identity
55:36
before he went out into that beach. I mean, we may never know
55:38
what was going on in his mind. Perhaps he was lucid and he chose
55:43
that place for a reason. But like we said earlier, perhaps his cancer
55:46
was just causing a lot of mental health issues or delusions and he was just
55:51
not thinking rationally. Maybe he thought people were after him. Maybe he was
55:54
just not in his sound mind. But it sounds like even if he was
56:00
planning suicide, a severe coincidence could happen and he just died of cardiac arrests
56:05
before that took place. But all that being said, I do think that
56:08
this is one of the cases we covered that has one of the best chances
56:12
of being solved sometime down the line, because even if they do not use
56:16
genic genealogy, they still have Peter's photograph and images of everywhere all over the
56:22
internet, So there is always a chance that the right person might see those
56:27
images and recognize them and come forward, and that's how they'll be able to
56:30
positively identify him. And in spite of the fact that he may have wanted
56:35
to die under these circumstances, he may not have wanted to be identified.
56:38
I still think we should figure out who he is because he probably does have
56:43
a family or friends out there who are wondering about what happened to him,
56:45
and they definitely deserve to get some answers. Robin, do you want to
56:50
tell us a little bit about the Trail Went Cold Patreon? Yes, The
56:53
Trail Cold Patreon has been around for three years now, and we offer these
56:57
standard bonus features like early ad free episodes, and I also send out stickers
57:02
and sign thank you cards to anyone who signs up with us on Patreon.
57:07
If you join our five dollars tier Tier two, we also offer monthly bonus
57:12
episodes in which I talk about cases which are not featured on the Trail Went
57:15
Cold's original feed, so they're exclusive to Patreon, and if you join our
57:20
highest tier tier three, the ten dollar tier. One of the features we
57:23
offer is a audio commentary track over classic episodes of Unsawved Mysteries, where you
57:30
can download an audio file and then boot up the original Unsolved Mysteries episode on
57:35
Amazon Prime or YouTube and play it with my audio commentary playing in the background,
57:39
where I just provide trivia and factoids about the cases featured in this episode.
57:45
And incidentally, the very first episode that I did a commentary track over
57:49
was the episode featuring this case. So if you want to download a commentary
57:52
track in which I make more smart ass remarks about Jewel Kaylor, then be
57:57
sure to join Tier three. So I want to let you know the bit
58:00
about the Jewles and Nashty patreons. So there's early ad free episodes of The
58:04
Path Went Chili. We've got our Pathwent Chili mini's, which are always over
58:07
an hour, so they're not very mini, but they're just too short to
58:10
turn into a series, and we're really enjoying doing those, so we hope
58:15
you'll check out those patreons. We'll link them in the show notes. So
58:17
I want to thank you all for listening, and any chance you have to
58:21
share us on social media with a friend or to rate and review is greatly
58:24
appreciate it. You can email us at The Pathwentchili at gmail dot com.
58:29
You can reach us on Twitter at the Pathwin. So until next time,
58:31
be sure to bundle up because cold trails and chili pass call for warm clothing.
58:37
Music by Paul Rich from the podcast Cold Callers Comedy