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Mark Wright: How The Apprentice Winner Turned Struggle Into Success · The BEYOND Podcast

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  Unknown: I'm Alexandra King and I'm the host of Beyond the Boardroom podcast. In this episode,
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  I'm interviewing winner of the BBC Apprentice, Mark Wright,
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  who went on to sell his business for millions. We're going to cover just how
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  he did it. What tactics did he use? How did he get by all the snakes in the boardroom?
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  Make sure you tune in. And you'll find out.
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  So 2014, you won BBC, The Apprentice. And I would say against all odds watching
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  that series. So I'm going to jump right in there. Like, how did you actually win? How?
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  That's a very good question. I would,
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  I would challenge the fact against all odds. I think I, I want it almost easily. Um, but, uh,
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  I would say getting onto the apprentice is the hard part, not, uh, winning it once you're on.
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  You've just got to impress Alan Sugar. And I was in series 10, which had 20 contestants,
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  not normally the 14 or 16 that that this format normally has. So I had, I was one of 20 that was
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  better than one of 75, 000. That's trying out. If you're one of 75, 000, you're a needle in a
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  haystack. Once you're in front of Alan Sugar in the boardroom, you can impress your personality.
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  You can impress your acumen. He can see you. Debating and getting challenged,
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  challenging other people. And what I noticed really quickly when I got into the boardroom
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  is Alan Sugar was looking to see who the other contestants look to for information when he does
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  this really clever thing where he, instead of directing a question to one individual,
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  he asks the group and it's really, it is psychologically genius.
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  And then the group looks to the leader because human beings are all by nature.
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  We, we follow the leader. We were like sheep. We, we, we, we, we can, you know,
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  when you're in the presence of a strong person, let's say, you know, when the boss is here and,
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  uh, it, you, you can go into it, a house or an environment called the apprentice and.
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  The leaders start emerging amongst the pack just over time. It's just human nature. It's,
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  it's, it's how all things are since the dormant dawn of time. And they know this,
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  the apprentice production team know this. So they asked the group questions and the
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  group looks to individuals. To say, no, we did do good.
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  We could have done that better. And he's going, that's the one in that team. That's
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  the one in that one. That one's pretty good. And out of 20 in my group, there was three that were
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  really sharp. Uh, a girl called Roisin, a lady called Bianca, uh, and myself. And, uh, I mean,
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  we were, I want to say 15 fold, uh, at an acumen above the rest of the group in terms of business.
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  Uh, ability, and they were the only other two I was worried about that
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  were seriously competitive from a, from a business acumen perspective.
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  Okay. So you feel that you want it because you felt this inner
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  confidence of sort of placing yourself, you know,
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  in the top three already. You kind of felt instinctively that actually I'm, I'm quite good.
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  And then you felt like a leader and you were receptive to the fact that
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  others saw you as a leader. So this was just sort of happening
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  before you even went anywhere near winning the process. Is that right?
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  I could feel that, uh, the other contestants were starting to see me as a, as a threat. Uh,
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  they would, they would be in the threat category.
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  And I felt I was at, there was one moment, a pivotal moment in about week two or three
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  in the boardroom. And there was a lady in our, in the other team. And we went
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  in and she said to Lord sugar, I'm really struggling, uh, in this process. You know,
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  I'm a swimming coach. I'm a swimming teacher. This is a bit too difficult.
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  Basically. I'm struggling being away from home yard. And I said to her.
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  That is absolutely ridiculous. You've taken someone's spot here and you can't
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  hack it. And I looked over and Alan Sugar was smiling and I realized the way to his heart,
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  the way to impress yourself on him, the more vicious you are, the more you got on the others,
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  the more he was thinking, this is a person I can do business with.
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  This is a person that can handle being in business.
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  We'll get on to that. We're going to get onto that topic. Um,
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  I don't even know where to start with answering that one, but let's, let's,
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  let's go back to, to what the viewers observed in, in that 2014 series. Because
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  there were moments throughout that you, you might've felt confident and whatever,
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  I obviously believe that you were felt confident, but you did come across as nervous sometimes.
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  Do you think that's fair?
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  Yeah, I think that's very fair. And there was times I was nervous, particularly in, in week one,
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  in the first task, because everything's new. The people are new being on TV. I'd never been on TV
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  before the production, having to walk through a door seven times. is all stuff that's just, I'd
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  not experienced having a microphone all the time, having cameras, uh, and the chance of being fired.
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  My biggest fear was being fired first, being the first person to go. Cause that sort of is like,
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  I've quit my job. I've given up my flat. Uh, I've put my whole life on the line
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  here. And then I'm out the door after a day, it feels really not so great. So that was a
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  big fear. And then in about week 10, I had an incident where I, uh, I got like stage fright,
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  I was doing a speech at Tesco's and I opened my mouth and no words came out and I'd, I got myself
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  into the situation by saying to the project manager, you know, I'm the best salesman.
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  You don't leave your prize pony in the stable. You know, when you go to the races,
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  let me do the pitch. So they let me do the pitch and I butchered it. I absolutely made a meal
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  of it and I thought I was going to get fired. And, and that, that I was pretty nervous then.
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  What did you learn from that?
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  I learned that when you're vulnerable and when you're, uh, honest, uh, good things still happen.
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  I always thought as a young man, you had to be number one. You had to win at all costs.
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  You always had to be first. You always had to be the strongest. And that moment at Tesco's really
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  exposed me. I'd never got stage fright before. Not only did we lose, I lost us the task. And
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  then we went into the boardroom and I had an option where I could say, do you know what?
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  It wasn't my fault in the pitch. The product was really bad and I could push the blame
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  onto our sub team. And instead I said, I messed this up. I, I took the pitch on,
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  I messed the pitch up and I cost us this task. And that is the point where I gave
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  him the opportunity to fire me. I put all of the blame for the whole situation on myself.
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  So everyone that could have been edited up so nice as this. This guy's done it.
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  I've taken all of the blame. See you later. But I think in that moment,
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  being a hundred percent honest, you know, taking all the responsibility showed him
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  here is a business person that is tough. That is a good sales person, but is also honest.
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  And can take responsibility. So it showed maybe I was the, a more complete picture.
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  That's definitely a really strong side that you showed. I mean, it's, it's horrible to
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  work with people just to be around people in general, that can't take accountability,
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  that can't see their own fault ever. They're so stubborn that they, there's no room for growth.
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  If you can't acknowledge your weaknesses and work with those
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  and it's, um, it makes a better person all around.
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  Taking responsibility for your actions is fundamental to being successful. I
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  think in any area of life. And I think if you talk to somebody that's overweight,
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  that can't see that they, they're still not ready for that journey.
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  Same with someone who's on that level of success on that journey for success. If they feel like,
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  Oh, I got made redundant because you know, this, this happened in the business. You're
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  not ready to be successful yet. They're not. Everyone that I know that is quote unquote,
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  super successful. They take huge accountability all the time of their own actions.
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  And they take responsibility for things that
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  they've got nothing to do with. They're just huge on ownership.
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  Yeah. Ownership driven to, to see that change and hungry for that change. Definitely. Right.
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  Okay. So let's go back a little bit now. What was little Mark like growing up?
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  He was a pretty interesting, um, young man.
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  He was dynamic, I would say, because, uh, from a young age, I didn't realize I was
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  dyslexic and I didn't realize. My parent, my mama is staying with me at the moment at my
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  house in the Gold Coast. And she, um, did, we didn't realize that I had poor vision. I was
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  incredibly short sighted and it took until I was about 12 for this to be picked up.
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  Obviously I didn't know. I couldn't see. Well, the teachers at school didn't pick it up. So I
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  was dyslexic and short sighted. So my learning was incredibly hindered at school. But what this
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  meant was because I couldn't read and write well, and I was, That's a bit more challenged
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  than the kids at school. I had to rely on what came out of my mouth, my communication skills.
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  And I was always at junior school. One of the cool kids in senior school,
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  very much not one of the cool kids, but I was always a great communicator. I was always really
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  good at getting myself into trouble and getting myself. Out trouble. Uh, but young Mark was,
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  loves his sport, wanted to play soccer, football as it's called, ob obviously in the uk.
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  That's all he wanted to do was talk about, uh, girls and, and soccer. That was my,
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  that was my, uh, my thing and, and I just love to chat. Talk to anyone.
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  Okay. So you were a chatty, happy, cool kid, loved sports. And then just before apprentice you,
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  I mean, just before you decided to apply for the apprentice, were you making like money?
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  Were you, how were you doing? Well, were you not doing well?
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  No, I wouldn't say I was doing well at all. Actually. I, I left. school and I thought
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  I was gonna be a rock star. Like I thought I'm gonna take the world by storm. I'm gonna
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  be this big super success in whatever I do. And I was just ready because I hated school.
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  School was not a good environment for me. I failed terribly at school. I don't like
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  sitting in a class being told what to do. And it just it showed through my grades. I didn't
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  apply myself and there's no excuse for it. I just didn't do well. But I couldn't get out of
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  there quick enough. And then I went And I got a football contract and I thought this is it.
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  And I lost that contract from not applying myself, you know, not training hard enough,
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  going out drinking, doing all the wrong things. And I lost the contract. And then
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  I realized life is a pretty vicious place. If you're not doing well, if you're down,
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  it can keep kicking you to a pretty low place. I ran completely out of money.
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  I was sleeping on the floor on a mattress in Brisbane, trying to get my football career
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  going and I just could not get off the ground. And I completely ran out of money. I completely
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  ran out of hope. And I was, I was down and out, uh, physically, mentally, financially. Uh, and
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  that's what made me move to the UK because things were not going great for me here in Australia.
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  And, um, and I decided to go traveling to see if I
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  could broaden my horizons for what I wanted to do with my life, you know,
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  career wise. And I thought traveling would broaden my mind. It would help me meet new
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  people and maybe find a different industry or, or some opportunity out there. And, and it did.
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  Okay. So what made you, what possessed you, shall I say,
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  to fill out that, uh, apprentice application form?
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  Well, um, I was working at a digital marketing company in the UK. Um,
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  and it was, it was a terrible company. They, uh, they were really, the way they
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  treated their staff was awful. The way they treated their customers was awful.
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  But I was really good at digital marketing. So it was the first time in my career. I was
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  good at it. I enjoyed it. I was plugged in. I was starting to make some money and
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  I didn't feel like I was working up until that point. Till I found digital marketing,
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  every job I did, every time I was at work, I hated it.
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  I felt like I was at work. I was watching the clock and all of that stuff. And digital
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  marketing was the first time I loved what I did. And, um, so a friend of mine who sat at the desk
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  next to me called Blake. He said, Hey bro, I'm going to try out for the apprentice. And I said,
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  what's the apprentice. He said, it's a TV show where an old man yells at you.
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  And I said, I've never, I've never heard. So he's like,
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  come down to the tryouts with me. So he sent me the application and I filled it
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  out and off. I went to the tryouts in Tottenham court road in London, and I didn't realize the
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  scale of The Apprentice. I'd never heard of Alan Sugar. I hadn't heard of the show.
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  Um, and I just kept getting through one week after the next one layer of the auditions
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  after the next, and I got through thousands and thousands of people. And, um, It, I don't know. I,
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  it, it, from the moment I got in the line to pass the, my documents at the tryouts, this is going to
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  sound mental. This is going to sound like I knew I was going to win and I just, I've never felt.
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  Like, like, I don't know. It was like, I knew it was for me. I knew it was my opportunity.
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  I knew this was it. I don't know. I've had opportunities where I've done stuff in the
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  past where I've tried things and I've, it hasn't felt right. And it's always been a bit clunky
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  and whatever, from the moment I went to the triads, to the moment I won.
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  It felt fantastic. It just, it felt like I was in the right place at the right time.
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  And when I handed the lady at, um, Boundless, the production company,
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  my CV and my business plan to try out, I said, hi, my name's Mark Wright and I'm
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  the winner of the 2014 Apprentice. And she was like, she just laughed anyway,
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  on the night that I won the show, the lady from the reception came in to the, your hired show.
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  And she said, do you remember me? I'm the lady from reception. And you said,
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  your name's Mark Wright and you're going to win the show. And you won it. And I was like, I mean,
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  it was so amazing. I get goosebumps just talking about that story now,
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  because I'm not really like that, that felt right.
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  But you know, if the way that you program your mind is so important and it does set
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  sail in that direction, you know, if you had those thoughts right at the beginning and you programmed
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  yourself, I'm going to win and you really felt it and you can't explain why that definitely.
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  Put you on that path to winning that show. I I'm firm believer in that
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  because I went through the audition process as well for The Apprentice.
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  Obviously I loved it. I found that really easy, easy. And I, like you, I knew 100%,
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  I knew I'm definitely getting in. Like there is no question. This is easy peasy. I love sales.
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  I can do that any day, any day of the year. But I never had the thing in my head going,
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  I'm going to win. I had a thing in my head going, I can win if I want to. I can do what I want to.
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  We'll see. We'll see. I'm not sure if I want to win. Not sure if I want it, but I'm definitely
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  100 percent sure that I can easily nail this interview and I'm going to do that challenge.
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  Different approach to you, right? Different outcome,
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  different outcome, but I never thought I'm definitely winning. Like you did
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  that without that. I mean, Napoleon Hill says,
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  whatever the mind can believe and conceive, it can achieve. And, you know, that's why
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  setting goals is so important. And this all stuff started in this manifestation where.
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  I wanted to win. I got the opportunity to be in that process and then I just made it happen. And
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  obviously there was a lot in between all of the believing it and wanting it and all of that stuff.
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  But I probably haven't had that same feeling about, you know,
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  a business or Or, you know, something like the apprentice in my life where I've gone,
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  yeah, this is I'm just going to absolutely smash this out of the park.
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  So, you know, Warren Buffett says you get three trips to the,
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  to the pie counter in your, in your life. And you've got to know which,
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  when each trip is. And I think that was my first or second time there.
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  Yeah. I mean, I, I, I've had this once before in a running race,
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  cause I'm, I'm big on athletics and I started running from a young kid.
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  And I had that once where I. And I just knew I was this, this race, I've got it. I'm,
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  I'm going to win and I'm going to win by such a long way. And it's going to
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  be incredible. And that's exactly what happened. Like it's this visualization,
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  but it doesn't always come. You're right. There's like, there's moments, you know,
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  and you've got to, Oh, when it, when you get that feeling, it's like, you know, when you know, you
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  know, When you know, have you ever read the book, the alchemist?
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  Um, my husband has read that book and told me about it many times. Yes,
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  it is. It's, I mean, it's a game changing book, but they always talk about omens and
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  listening to your body and feeling for like you with the running race,
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  me with the apprentice, whatever is sometimes you just get this. They call it, you know,
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  your gut instinct and you just think this feels right to me.
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  And, uh, you know, I think, you know, not to get too mystical with all this stuff,
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  but I think it's an important element to all the other stuff that goes into business.
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  Okay. So you then got into the apprentice, you're in that house,
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  which I found it I found being in the house really stressful. Like I didn't like the
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  idea of being trapped because I don't, I want to be able to go where I want to go.
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  I don't like someone else controlling my schedule. I can't sleep with people
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  snoring. Like I just, I find it really hard. Like even my husband, it's like,
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  it's like a dinosaur and the house is moving and it's like, I can't, and I've got to run
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  away and block my ears. And I really struggle, you know, without sleep and all of that.
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  So I found the apprentice, even though I was in boarding school,
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  that was fine. And it was. Different, but there's something about the apprentice
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  candidates. Cause they all such high intensity and it's just,
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  it's so much and you can't leave, like, how did you find it stuck in the house for them?
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  Uh, well, I think if I was to do it again, now I would really struggle.
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  I'm a 34 year old man. I have a family. I live in a lovely house and I'm really
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  lucky in my life. At the time I was 24 and I'd been backpacking for two
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  years living in dorms with 12 people snoring and doing all sorts of things.
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  So the apprentice house was just like another dorm room for me at the time.
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  It wasn't, wasn't too far from my tenure of traveling. So I sort of coped with it really well,
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  but I would really struggle now. So I think it came to me at a right time. Um, I was,
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  I was a single man, I was a young man and I,
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  I was sort of on it. The other thing that I did when I was in there is I wasn't really
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  friendly with the other contestants, uh, and that was a conscious decision.
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  Um, I, I don't know if, uh, what year were you on the show? 2016. 2016. So, um, there was a,
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  as they, the show years went on in my, in my time, 2014, they were really strict about,
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  we weren't allowed social media, um, outside of the house and all of this
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  sort of stuff. Um, and inside of the house, there was like lots of rules.
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  We had these chaperones. To make sure that we wouldn't do task talk and all
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  of this sort of stuff. Um, and, uh, uh, I knew I kind of gauged quite quickly. I
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  think these chaperones are reporting back to the production. Who's a good
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  and bad contestants in here. So what I'm going to do. is just be on all the time.
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  So I'm going to be the first in bed. I'm going to be the first
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  up. I'm going to not drink because if that's getting fed back to Alan Sugar,
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  surely that's another tick in my box. So I was using the, I was playing the whole game. I was,
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  I was playing the whole game when the cameras were on and even more so when the cameras were off.
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  Yeah. And, and, and the main thing is, is that you wanted to play the game. You were in the
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  right time phase of your life. You were hungry for that investment. You were in a position
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  that made you really need it as well. It's like, you know, you were trying to make it. So you were
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  incentivized. It was like, there was a motivation and you were in the right place at the right time.
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  And like you're saying, it wouldn't have worked necessarily now, or maybe as well,
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  it probably would have worked, but it may be in a different way because like,
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  for me, I was 34. I had three little children under the age of 10. We were
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  moving house from North London. It was the worst timing on the whole planet.
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  So my, my mindset, my motivation
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  was like, why am I, why am I here when my kids aren't in school? How is my husband coping?
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  And then of course, you can't communicate with him and you're worried. So you're distracted.
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  It's not the same, even though obviously there's this pull. Cause you think actually I can do it.
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  I'm doing well and all the tasks I'm selling. I can nail this if I want to, but then it also,
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  because you're 34, you're not handling maybe the sleeping right. And you're maybe not handling the
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  food. Like if you're not getting food, right. And there's all of that, you know? So when you
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  said in the beginning, Mark, when you said in the beginning there that like you said to that woman,
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  Oh, you know, you can just there, you know, just get on with it, carry on, you know, you're fine.
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  You know, proper business people will do that. Yes. Like, of course, you know,
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  Proper business people. We're professional. We can do it. We can put in the graph, but it's like,
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  you've also got to be in the right frame of mind for that thing wanted, you know,
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  in the right way. And, and maybe, yeah, there's so much to this that.
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  I mean, uh, I've, uh, recently had a child. And, um, it will, it has made me 10 times better boss,
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  10 times better manager. Uh, because it's given me a different perspective
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  and you can only see perspectives from where you are in your journey. And,
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  uh, at that time I was a young, hungry, broke 24 year old. I had no girlfriend.
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  I had no obligations outside of that house. And I used to give my phone call to the
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  other people in the house that had kids because I had no one to call really. So,
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  um, I was at a great time in my life. And, and, you know, now,
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  if I think about where I am in my life now, the apprentice is a terrible opportunity for me.
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  I wouldn't give away 50 percent equity in any of my companies.
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  I don't need 250 grand and I don't want to sleep in a house with. No, you know,
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  stinky people trying to be famous on Sky Sports. So
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  yeah, thank you for entering my world that I was in when I did that, that, that change. And
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  I did that because my daughter had a dream and was like, Oh, you want the apprentice?
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  And I thought, Oh, okay, that's a sign. Let me go and apply to the apprentice. I mean,
• 24:09
  seriously. Um, I was going to ask you, you know, you've got like a, a nice sort of,
• 24:14
  um, Relaxed attitude about yourself. Calm. I mean, not, maybe not on the show so much,
• 24:20
  but like outside of that, when you're doing business, you've got, you're quite a chill person.
• 24:25
  Was that fair to say?
• 24:27
  I think it's very fair to say, uh, my mom always said I'm happy
• 24:33
  go lucky. Don't really understand what that means, but she's always,
• 24:36
  uh, said I was always happy go lucky and I always wear my heart on my sleeve. Um, however,
• 24:43
  um, That's all true. And I'm very relaxed. That might be some of the Australian in me.
• 24:49
  Um, the other side is, uh, I'm fanatical about getting everything just right. Uh,
• 24:56
  getting everything perfect. Everything needs to be done perfect all the time
• 25:00
  in the stuff that I do and the stuff that my employees do and the stuff that happens in my
• 25:04
  companies. So although I'm. I'm a stickler for detail and I'm a stickler for quality.
• 25:11
  And, um, I think it serves me well because the way I communicate is relaxed. And,
• 25:17
  um, and yeah, so I think. Yeah, I don't know. I am a relaxed person.
• 25:24
  Yeah. So even though you're a relaxed person, then, um, what, what scares
• 25:29
  you? What are you afraid of in life? As you navigate life? Are you running from anything?
• 25:40
  Gosh, that's a deep, that is a deep, that is a deep question. You're all scared of
• 25:44
  something deep inside, I find.
• 25:46
  I think my biggest, I'm, I'm scared of myself. I think I'm my own biggest, uh, uh,
• 25:53
  supporter and my own biggest. Uh, enemy, uh, I mean, because I hold myself to a,
• 26:01
  a bar that is on, on believably high that I, that I'm unable to, to meet and after all the
• 26:08
  amazing things that I've achieved in business or whatever, uh, I still, I never think about it.
• 26:13
  You know, I never look back. I never take time to reflect on, um, you know,
• 26:18
  the things that I've done. I'm always thinking about what am I going to do tomorrow? And I
• 26:22
  think in a way that. Is great because it's, I mean, I'm pushing myself all the time,
• 26:28
  but at the other time, at some point, when do you stop? And what, when is enough?
• 26:33
  And, um, so, you know, it's just getting enjoyment out of life and slowing down. Obviously, I, I,
• 26:40
  I don't want my parents to die. I mean, that's a fear. I think everybody holds. I
• 26:44
  always think about that. But, um, since being, becoming a father,
• 26:49
  my world has completely changed. Yeah. It is, you know, the only thing that if someone put
• 26:53
  a gun in front of my son today, I'd just take the bullet without a second thought.
• 26:58
  There, there's no, nothing comes in. There's nothing more
• 27:01
  important on the entire planet is that there's nothing.
• 27:09
  That sounds really horrible to say, but I have seen it in people where
• 27:12
  they like the sort of the being miserable because they get attention from it. In my
• 27:17
  experience, poor people are always poor and rich people always rich. Because it's in here,
• 27:23
  it's
• 27:23
  nothing to do with what's in your bank account. It's a way of thinking.
• 27:27
  You talk about the fact that you have never met a business person,
• 27:34
  a good business person that isn't ruthless. That triggers some, uh, emotion in me.