Latest / The Body Pod / RE-RUN - Vaginal Health, Sexual Pleasure, and Wellness Beyond Your 40s with Dr. Kelly Casperson

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RE-RUN - Vaginal Health, Sexual Pleasure, and Wellness Beyond Your 40s with Dr. Kelly Casperson · The Body Pod

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Speaker 1: Today on the Body Pod, we are rerunning doctor Kelly
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Speaker 1: Casperson's episode which is all about vaginal health and pleasure. Now,
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Speaker 1: Kelly is not only an incredible physician, but she is
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Speaker 1: also one of my favorite menopausal specialists in the space.
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Speaker 1: She is funny, she is vibrant, and this episode will
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Speaker 1: not only educate you, but keep you in stitches most
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Speaker 1: of the time. Enjoy this episode with doctor Kelly Casperson. Hi. Everyone,
0:32
Speaker 1: my name is Haley and this is Laura and welcome
0:35
Speaker 1: to the body Pod. Today on the Body Pod, we
0:45
Speaker 1: have a super special treat interviewing urologist doctor Kelly Casperson.
0:52
Speaker 1: If you are not familiar with her, you need to be.
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Speaker 1: She is the ted X speaker for why we need
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Speaker 1: adult sex education. It is fabulous, it is short, and
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Speaker 1: it packs a punch, so you will want to watch
1:08
Speaker 1: that if you haven't. She's also the podcaster for You
1:13
Speaker 1: Are Not Broken, as well as the author of a
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Speaker 1: book that's launching this fall that is the redo of
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Speaker 1: her original book, You Are Not Broken. You can now
1:25
Speaker 1: pre sell that on Amazon. This podcast is spicy and
1:31
Speaker 1: it will tap into every emotion that you have. Let's
1:35
Speaker 1: get into the show, all right, Welcome back to the
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Speaker 1: Body Pod. Everyone. We are so excited we have doctor
1:47
Speaker 1: Kelly Casperson here. We've already done her intro, so we
1:51
Speaker 1: are so excited to just get into all of these
1:54
Speaker 1: questions that we have and any questions that you have
1:56
Speaker 1: sent in for us. So welcome doctor Casperson.
1:59
Speaker 2: Thanks for having having me.
2:01
Speaker 1: Okay, first of all, we were just saying this offline,
2:03
Speaker 1: but you are so funny. And I when I was
2:06
Speaker 1: watching your Ted Talk, I'm like, this person. I need
2:08
Speaker 1: to live next door to Kelly because.
2:09
Speaker 3: The same we're like, why is she not our best friend?
2:12
Speaker 1: Yes?
2:13
Speaker 2: Thank you? Where do you guys live? Maybe we're close,
2:16
Speaker 2: maybe we don't even know what older.
2:17
Speaker 3: I'm in Park City.
2:20
Speaker 2: I lived in Denver for six years. See missed opportunity.
2:23
Speaker 1: Well where are you now? You're in Washington.
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Speaker 2: I'm in Washington State now. Oh yeah, yeah, Well that's
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Speaker 2: great to Denver for the first time last spring and
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Speaker 2: I was like, you, guys, hasn't always been this brown?
2:34
Speaker 2: And they're like yeah, and I'm like, I forgot I
2:37
Speaker 2: forgot right.
2:38
Speaker 1: And it's funny because every time I drive out of
2:41
Speaker 1: state and you're just like you're leaving colorful Colorado. I'm like, no,
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Speaker 1: the fuck who came up with that tagline? They needed
2:51
Speaker 1: they need to do.
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Speaker 2: So my first date with my husband was in Boulder.
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Speaker 1: Oh I love that.
3:00
Speaker 2: So it's special. There's two kids because of Boulder, Colorado.
3:04
Speaker 2: I'll have you no, yeah, I love it.
3:09
Speaker 1: Well, okay, so Doctor Casperson, here we go. Let's talk
3:16
Speaker 1: about Well, first of all, your Ted Talk, because I
3:20
Speaker 1: just was blown away. I've watched it multiple times.
3:24
Speaker 2: And I'm always like, nobody ever talks about the Ted Talk.
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Speaker 3: Oh my gosh. That was the first thing we wanted
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Speaker 3: to talk about.
3:30
Speaker 1: Yeah, talking about that Ted Talk. Why we need adult
3:33
Speaker 1: sex ed I mean, we just had a sex therapist
3:36
Speaker 1: on and she was like, adults need to be you know,
3:40
Speaker 1: they need to be teaching their kids about sex ed better.
3:42
Speaker 1: And then I'm like, we don't even know if we're.
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Speaker 2: Talking about teach them what what Hollywood taught you? Like
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Speaker 2: it's a disaster.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, so can we talk about that? For anyone who hasn't, well,
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Speaker 1: first of all, you need to go watch it right now.
3:55
Speaker 1: But if you haven't, I.
3:57
Speaker 2: Watched the Ted Talk. If you type in Ted ex
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Speaker 2: Caspersus and it'll on Google or it'll pop up or
4:02
Speaker 2: on YouTube, it'll anyways it pops up. Yeah.
4:06
Speaker 1: I love that.
4:07
Speaker 2: It's by like twelve minute. Baby. You know, you spend
4:09
Speaker 2: like a half a year working on a TED Talk,
4:12
Speaker 2: so I'm super glad I did it. The Ted Talk
4:15
Speaker 2: started out so I like, I really started out diving
4:18
Speaker 2: into female sexual health. And so the TED Talk started
4:22
Speaker 2: out with female It was like going to be female education.
4:25
Speaker 2: And because women have way less orgasms than men do,
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Speaker 2: and it's not because their body can't do it. Lesbians
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Speaker 2: have same amount of orgasms as men do. You literally
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Speaker 2: put a penis in the room and a woman's orgasms
4:38
Speaker 2: go down. They did an amazing bisexuality study looking at that,
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Speaker 2: which is just like sweet research. But so it started
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Speaker 2: out female sex ed and then I was like, yeah, no,
4:48
Speaker 2: well the other fifty percent aren't any better on this, right,
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Speaker 2: So the TED Talk really did open up to all
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Speaker 2: adults and being like, you won't think you're so broken
4:58
Speaker 2: if you just get some basic information. Yeah.
5:02
Speaker 3: Yeah, OK.
5:03
Speaker 4: I love when you say in the podcast, when you
5:06
Speaker 4: ask the question are you completely confident in the bedroom
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Speaker 4: and do you talk to your partner about it? I
5:13
Speaker 4: just thought that was such a profound question. Because I
5:17
Speaker 4: all of a sudden, I found myself asking myself like,
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Speaker 4: well am I I feel like I am, but then
5:23
Speaker 4: it's like, well am I too? And I think it's
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Speaker 4: such a good question.
5:28
Speaker 2: Right, And then if you're not, be like, oh my god,
5:30
Speaker 2: I've probably lived my whole life this way, yeah, or
5:32
Speaker 2: what got me? What got me? Not what happened right,
5:36
Speaker 2: like if I was, which I would say is the
5:38
Speaker 2: more unique one. I think. I think we fumble around
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Speaker 2: in secrecy as teenagers learn something good, bad, neutral from
5:45
Speaker 2: that first experience, and then we just take that forward.
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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, well I have to tell you I
5:52
Speaker 1: this is these are the exact words that I've spoken forever.
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Speaker 1: Was like, I don't know, maybe I'm just broken exact words.
6:00
Speaker 1: I'm just like I don't know what to say. And
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Speaker 1: so this was really enlightening.
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Speaker 2: But that's what makes so easy to name my podcast,
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Speaker 2: because like when I started talking to women about sex,
6:10
Speaker 2: like that's what they just kept saying. I'm broken, I'm broken,
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Speaker 2: I'm broken, I'm broken, and I'm like, well, actually, most
6:15
Speaker 2: women don't have an orgasm from putting something in their vagina,
6:18
Speaker 2: Like you're not broken, you just don't know that fact right,
6:22
Speaker 2: and then like another woman if she had never had
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Speaker 2: an orgasm, and I'm like, well, ten percent of women
6:26
Speaker 2: have never had an orgasm, so it's not, as I am,
6:30
Speaker 2: isn't it wild? And like the sex researchers say, it's
6:32
Speaker 2: not because it's it's rare, that it's actually because it's
6:36
Speaker 2: a body problem. It's really And then you know, going
6:40
Speaker 2: back to the ted talk of like sex is biopsychosocial.
6:43
Speaker 2: It's not just our bodies, it's not just our hormones.
6:47
Speaker 2: It is you know, the religion and beliefs your parents
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Speaker 2: gave you and your first experience and dude, the power
6:53
Speaker 2: differentials and heterosexual relationships. I'm telling you, nobody talks about
6:58
Speaker 2: this and it profoundly affects people sex lives.
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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. Okay, let's dig into that a little bit,
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Speaker 1: the biopsychosocial because I'd love that. And I'm sure a
7:09
Speaker 1: lot of women are like, Okay, that sounds cool, but
7:11
Speaker 1: let's let's dig into it.
7:13
Speaker 2: Probably like this sounds really complicated, because that's how I thought, like,
7:16
Speaker 2: I'm like, that is a long word. So and I
7:19
Speaker 2: actually like I hated that word because I'm like, I
7:21
Speaker 2: think it sounds super clinical. It sounds like somebody knows
7:24
Speaker 2: something that you don't know, Like do you have to
7:26
Speaker 2: go to a to like grad school to figure out
7:28
Speaker 2: what biopsychosocial means? And as I was writing the Ted talk,
7:32
Speaker 2: Ted talks, you know, they're kind of formulaic, like three
7:34
Speaker 2: important points blah blah blah, right for a Ted talk,
7:37
Speaker 2: And I was like, oh crap, bio psycho social. It
7:42
Speaker 2: makes sense, and it lends itself to a nice Ted
7:45
Speaker 2: talk because then you can break down all the pieces.
7:47
Speaker 2: But basically the word just means that, like everything's affected
7:52
Speaker 2: by what's around you and how you were raised and
7:55
Speaker 2: your body, right, which you could also say like are
7:58
Speaker 2: eating styles and choices are biopsychosocial? You know, it's like
8:03
Speaker 2: what does your body tolerate? What foods did you grow
8:06
Speaker 2: up with? What does society tell you about the foods?
8:09
Speaker 1: Right?
8:09
Speaker 2: Like seeing is biopsychosocial. So once you kind of break
8:14
Speaker 2: it down and be like, oh, right, yeah, that's just
8:16
Speaker 2: like humans don't exist in a bubble. Your sexuality doesn't
8:20
Speaker 2: exist in a bubble. It's influenced, whether it's probably not
8:23
Speaker 2: consciously influenced, but you have been watching Hollywood movies. Your
8:28
Speaker 2: whole life. You have been influenced about sex roles, gender roles,
8:32
Speaker 2: who initiates how fast people orgasm? You know that the
8:37
Speaker 2: glitterist is non existent? Right, Like you have been influenced
8:41
Speaker 2: by that, because like what other good sex and do
8:45
Speaker 2: we have in the United States? The data says our
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Speaker 2: sex and now is worse than it was in the nineties.
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Speaker 1: Oh come on, I know.
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Speaker 4: Why though, because of everything that's online that got political.
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Speaker 2: It kind of got political. So like, but to me,
9:01
Speaker 2: I'm like, you know, I'm a I'm a victim of
9:04
Speaker 2: the ninety sex education. But I'm like, dude, you know
9:07
Speaker 2: when I think of the female body parts that I
9:09
Speaker 2: was taught, like, well, I think of like what was
9:10
Speaker 2: on the screen, it was uterous and ovaries. That's the female.
9:14
Speaker 2: That's like, although important body parts, not responsible for pleasure.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, oh so what Okay, this is going off topic
9:27
Speaker 1: of where I was gonna go, But how do you
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Speaker 1: think the kids growing up now with the porn industry,
9:34
Speaker 1: let alone Hollywood but that are just like coming into
9:38
Speaker 1: this and they're just like, oh, this is going to
9:39
Speaker 1: be the sexual experience. This is amazing. Yeah, and then
9:43
Speaker 1: they're like, uh no.
9:45
Speaker 2: So there's a profound disappointment between reality, their reality and
9:51
Speaker 2: what they've been watching. So, I mean poor used to
9:54
Speaker 2: be like so rare. You had to like go over
9:57
Speaker 2: to your friend's house, sneak into their dad's claw find
10:00
Speaker 2: the magazines that were in the brown paper bag, like legit,
10:03
Speaker 2: because that was like my first experience with like male
10:07
Speaker 2: gay porn in seventh grade at my friend's house. So
10:11
Speaker 2: like it was like very hard to access. Now it's
10:14
Speaker 2: I mean, it's in your it's in your pocket all
10:16
Speaker 2: the time, right, So, like porn has profoundly influenced people's
10:20
Speaker 2: perception of not only what women want, but how men
10:25
Speaker 2: are supposed to perform. And so now that you know,
10:29
Speaker 2: talking to my friends who do the sex set in
10:31
Speaker 2: colleges and stuff and the health just the health centers,
10:34
Speaker 2: guys coming in thinking their bodies are perfund profoundly broken
10:37
Speaker 2: because they don't last two hours, or they think they
10:40
Speaker 2: you know, ejaculated too soon, or and then they're coming
10:42
Speaker 2: in super confused because they're like, I don't think the
10:45
Speaker 2: women are liking what we're what we're doing because what
10:48
Speaker 2: we're watching, right, So it's a profound disconnect. And part
10:52
Speaker 2: of sex education is that a lot of audio visual
10:56
Speaker 2: is performative. And this is a movie. I love the analogy.
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Speaker 2: This is not mine, but it's like learning to drive
11:02
Speaker 2: by watching the Fast and the Furious franchise. Yes, that's
11:06
Speaker 2: such a good end, like not reality, but we know
11:09
Speaker 2: that right. We don't know that with sex egg because
11:12
Speaker 2: we never got a good sex head to be like, oh,
11:14
Speaker 2: these people are faking it.
11:16
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh so true. So do you see more male
11:21
Speaker 1: or female clients or is it just pretty much a mix?
11:25
Speaker 2: I see you about seventy percent female, but I mean
11:27
Speaker 2: I still see a lot of guys. Well, it's been
11:29
Speaker 2: very interesting because I really deep dove into caring about
11:33
Speaker 2: the female now in the like the last five years.
11:36
Speaker 2: Is when a guy comes in for a rectile dysfunction
11:39
Speaker 2: and you know, viaguer prescription whatever, you know, we talk
11:41
Speaker 2: about their health because again, penises are biopsychosocial. Like if
11:46
Speaker 2: the heart health that you have is not good, the
11:48
Speaker 2: penis doesn't function, right, we'd never talk about a rectile dysfunction.
11:51
Speaker 2: But so they're coming in for that, we're talking about
11:53
Speaker 2: their heart, like you know all these things, and I'm like,
11:56
Speaker 2: what's your plan with this? I thought these guys would
12:00
Speaker 2: have a plan, like profoundly interesting that like nine out
12:06
Speaker 2: of ten are like, I don't know. I was just gonna,
12:09
Speaker 2: you know, go home and maybe have sex with my wife.
12:12
Speaker 2: And I'm like, okay, so you haven't had sex in
12:14
Speaker 2: five years? Does she know you're here? Does she consent
12:19
Speaker 2: to you coming home with a super dick?
12:21
Speaker 4: Like?
12:22
Speaker 2: Have you had this conversation? And they're like, ten times
12:26
Speaker 2: out of ten they're like, no, haven't had this conversation,
12:29
Speaker 2: which is which is enlightening. I'm like, dude, people don't
12:33
Speaker 2: talk about their sex lives. They've lived together for decades
12:36
Speaker 2: and do not talk about their sex life. I gotta
12:39
Speaker 2: tell you, things get so much better when you start
12:41
Speaker 2: talking about it. And nobody's died so far. I've never
12:44
Speaker 2: read a report of somebody dying from talking to their
12:46
Speaker 2: partner about sex.
12:47
Speaker 4: That's so true. It's the lack of communication. But speaking
12:52
Speaker 4: of the ED, that was a statistic that you shared
12:57
Speaker 4: I think on Instagram that forty percent of me. Yeah,
13:01
Speaker 4: those a lot of were Oh was that on the
13:04
Speaker 4: TED talk forty percent of men? Oh yeah, forty percent
13:08
Speaker 4: of men by the age of forty have a rectile dysfunction.
13:12
Speaker 3: Is that correct?
13:13
Speaker 2: Yeah? At least a little bit.
13:14
Speaker 4: Which that's what But to me, I'm like, if I
13:19
Speaker 4: was a man, I would want to know that because
13:22
Speaker 4: I love how you talk about the shaming and the shoulting,
13:26
Speaker 4: because I think I would feel that as a man,
13:29
Speaker 4: because obviously we have as women our own set of
13:33
Speaker 4: shame and shooting.
13:34
Speaker 3: But that's a pretty powerful piece of information.
13:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think it really normalizes that our
13:41
Speaker 2: bodies age. I think it normalizes that, like what you
13:45
Speaker 2: choose to do with your health, whether it be drinking smoking,
13:49
Speaker 2: by the way, drinkings horrific for erections, but yeah, exercise,
13:54
Speaker 2: but like that is profound. Like, you know, I've got
13:57
Speaker 2: guys in their eighties who have perfectly fine erections. It
13:59
Speaker 2: does not I mean, everybody's going to have problems, but
14:02
Speaker 2: I think it's you know, when women enter perimenopause menopause
14:05
Speaker 2: and we start needing lubrication, by the way, we should
14:08
Speaker 2: just start lubrication at like age eighteen. But lubrication, vaginal estrogen,
14:13
Speaker 2: all the things is like normalizing it of like, dude,
14:15
Speaker 2: guys have changes in their bodies too, right, Like none
14:19
Speaker 2: of us are immune from the powers of aging, and
14:22
Speaker 2: it's okay to do something about it and get it treated.
14:25
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm so happy because I always feel like we
14:29
Speaker 1: get the shit the babies, menopause, men can go after
14:34
Speaker 1: like younger girl, like we're aging up every I mean,
14:37
Speaker 1: it's literally like I didn't even think that that many
14:42
Speaker 1: men had to struggle with it, and of course they're
14:44
Speaker 1: not as comfortable talking about it. No.
14:49
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just read this one study about like the
14:50
Speaker 2: actual amount of a rectile dysfunction compared to like how
14:55
Speaker 2: many people actually go to the doctor about it, right,
14:57
Speaker 2: And Viger's over the counter in a lot of kundry,
15:00
Speaker 2: so like in a lot of countries, guys don't have
15:02
Speaker 2: to go And now we have all these online pharmacies,
15:04
Speaker 2: so we're really opening access to people, kind of reducing
15:08
Speaker 2: the challenge that it is to go see a doctor.
15:12
Speaker 2: But it's super common for them. And you know, the
15:16
Speaker 2: directions guys really tie erections to the definition of manlihood,
15:21
Speaker 2: the definition of a man that you're fully capable, that
15:25
Speaker 2: you can you know. But again, going back to the
15:28
Speaker 2: sex ed, like good sex ed will tell you it's
15:32
Speaker 2: okay to lose an erection in the middle of sexual activity.
15:35
Speaker 2: It's normal and it happens, and it doesn't mean you're broken,
15:38
Speaker 2: but guys don't know that. And then they watch the
15:41
Speaker 2: movies and these guys are like obviously enhanced many times
15:46
Speaker 2: and taking perform performance enhancing medications, right, so they don't
15:50
Speaker 2: know that. And just like, erections are not reliable, but
15:55
Speaker 2: good sex ed will will teach you that, and people
15:57
Speaker 2: don't know that, so they just feel profoundly broke can
16:00
Speaker 2: ashamed less like a man. Uh, you know. And the
16:04
Speaker 2: more anxious and stressed you are about your erection, the
16:07
Speaker 2: more you're gonna not sustain an erection because when the
16:10
Speaker 2: body's stressed, erections are like now's not the time he's stressed, right,
16:14
Speaker 2: so it actually can compound and make it worse.
16:17
Speaker 3: Oh, that performance anxiety, I'm sure totally.
16:21
Speaker 2: Yeah.
16:23
Speaker 1: I have to say the the vaginal dryness, which you
16:28
Speaker 1: had the best podcast on that, the menopause symptom no
16:32
Speaker 1: one talks about. I mean, come on, so let's move
16:37
Speaker 1: on to the vaginal dryness and calling it the When
16:40
Speaker 1: you said the volva vaginal atrophy, I'm like, nobody wants that.
16:45
Speaker 2: No, it gets worse, my friend, in the eighties it
16:49
Speaker 2: was called the senile vagina. Stop it stop right, Well,
16:55
Speaker 2: so it keeps at least it keeps kind of getting better.
16:58
Speaker 2: I don't know, but yeah, because you're really nobody likes
17:00
Speaker 2: vaginal atrophy, so we call it GSM or genital urinary
17:04
Speaker 2: syndrome of menopause, right, which is a mouthful, but it's
17:07
Speaker 2: a better term. And I'm like, well, nobody liked Bobbo
17:10
Speaker 2: vaginal atrophy. That was an improvement just from senile vagina.
17:15
Speaker 1: So bad terrible.
17:17
Speaker 2: I was actually I was pulling The reason I know
17:19
Speaker 2: this is I was pulling up that my guy at
17:21
Speaker 2: the medical library was helping me. I was pulling up
17:23
Speaker 2: an old study. Actually had to like take it off
17:25
Speaker 2: of a shelf and xerox it for me, and it
17:27
Speaker 2: was the study from which the user er lose it
17:31
Speaker 2: myth comes from, because I'm like, where does this come from?
17:35
Speaker 2: Let's go back and dig and find the thing that
17:38
Speaker 2: like everybody kind of cites and in it they talk
17:41
Speaker 2: about senile vaginas and I was like, whoa, that was
17:44
Speaker 2: a gem I hadn't planned on discovering.
17:47
Speaker 1: God.
17:49
Speaker 2: Yeah, but getting back to like it, people don't know,
17:53
Speaker 2: like you got it. It goes back to education again, like
17:55
Speaker 2: people think menopause is a hot flesh menopause is not
17:59
Speaker 2: a hot flesh and menopauseist is when you can no
18:02
Speaker 2: longer get pregnant, But it's not that's not what it is.
18:06
Speaker 2: Those are just like signs and consequences of what it is.
18:10
Speaker 2: And what it is is a profound hormone change another
18:13
Speaker 2: way of saying that is a profound enrochronology change, right,
18:17
Speaker 2: Like you are outliving your ovaries, which is a whole
18:22
Speaker 2: nother podcast of Like if you outlive your eyes, you
18:24
Speaker 2: get glasses, If you outlive your hips, you get a
18:26
Speaker 2: hip replacement. If you outlive your teeth, you get teeth.
18:29
Speaker 2: Why are we so afraid of replacing what our ovaries are?
18:32
Speaker 2: We're outliving, right, But so with that, your hormones go down,
18:35
Speaker 2: including testosterone, and the pelvis is profoundly active and lovely
18:42
Speaker 2: and healthy because of your hormones. So when your hormones
18:45
Speaker 2: go down, your labia can disappear. Inner labia disappears. Nobody
18:50
Speaker 2: knows that you can get more recurrent urinary tract infections,
18:54
Speaker 2: pain with sex, more yeast infections, more burning when you
18:57
Speaker 2: pee getting up at nightmare to pee frequency urgency. All
19:01
Speaker 2: of those things are under the umbrella of genital urinary
19:04
Speaker 2: syndrome of menopause or GSM, and explains that both the
19:08
Speaker 2: genitals and the urinary system change because of menopause. Now
19:12
Speaker 2: two more things and then I'll stop talking. This can
19:15
Speaker 2: happen before your periods are done, because your hormones start
19:17
Speaker 2: fluctuating before your peers. So people are like, my doctor
19:20
Speaker 2: said I was too young because I was forty two. Like, no,
19:24
Speaker 2: your estrogen can go low. Certainly, your testosterone is low
19:27
Speaker 2: often by that age, and you can I saw a
19:30
Speaker 2: woman shoes in her mid forties profound vaginal atrophy. And
19:34
Speaker 2: what this means is you can't penetrate. Tampons are painful,
19:38
Speaker 2: it burns when you pee. This is not just sex.
19:40
Speaker 2: For the people who think sex is extra, I would
19:43
Speaker 2: say it's an important quality of life piece. But can
19:46
Speaker 2: happen certainly before menopause, and for a lot of people,
19:49
Speaker 2: it happens eight years after menopause. So they come into
19:52
Speaker 2: my office and they're like, but menopause was years ago,
19:55
Speaker 2: and I'm like, well, yeah, but you still have low
19:57
Speaker 2: hormones and now it's caught up to you and that departarment.
20:00
Speaker 2: But because we don't have any education about what menopause
20:04
Speaker 2: is people disconnect that what's going on in their pelvis
20:08
Speaker 2: is because of a change in hormones.
20:10
Speaker 4: So is the best way to correct that or help
20:15
Speaker 4: is through hormones.
20:19
Speaker 2: One hundred percent. Now, the medical the medical literature will
20:24
Speaker 2: say try non hormonal treatments first. What that means is
20:28
Speaker 2: lubricants and moisturizers. Lubricants and moisturizers are band aids. They
20:33
Speaker 2: make skin feel better, but it doesn't actually like you
20:36
Speaker 2: could you can put on glasses or you can just
20:38
Speaker 2: print everything in twenty point font Right, you're like, well,
20:42
Speaker 2: glasses actually like just make it all all better?
20:45
Speaker 3: Right.
20:48
Speaker 2: I think this is my opinion after being being into
20:52
Speaker 2: this for a while, is I think vaginal estrogen what
20:55
Speaker 2: other people call it local estrogen or pelvic estrogen. If
20:58
Speaker 2: you're on Instagram, you don't want to save a jack
21:00
Speaker 2: too much because they'll kick you off, and it's true,
21:05
Speaker 2: So I call it pelvic or local estrogen. Okay, that's
21:07
Speaker 2: just like skincare. It's skincare for down there. And I
21:11
Speaker 2: think at a certain age women should just because what
21:14
Speaker 2: do you want to do? Do you want to come
21:16
Speaker 2: in to see me once your labia are gone? You
21:19
Speaker 2: don't want to have sex anymore, and you're on your
21:21
Speaker 2: fourth urinary traction fection. Perfectly reasonable if you want to
21:24
Speaker 2: wait for that. Or you could be like, how can
21:28
Speaker 2: I just like have good skincare so I don't have
21:31
Speaker 2: that happen.
21:32
Speaker 3: Oh, it's like, gosh, do you.
21:33
Speaker 2: Want to come in once your face is skin down sinscreen?
21:38
Speaker 2: I am it.
21:39
Speaker 1: I'm up skincare for the badge. I'm usided, dude.
21:42
Speaker 2: Skincare is like a twenty six billion dollar industry. Like
21:45
Speaker 2: women care profoundly about their skincare, and this is just
21:49
Speaker 2: vulvar vaginal bladder. It's generally urinary skincare very safe, incredibly safe,
21:57
Speaker 2: so safe, it's over the counter in multiple cut, so
22:01
Speaker 2: safe that breast cancer survivors can take it, so safe
22:06
Speaker 2: that breast cancer patients who are currently treating their breast
22:09
Speaker 2: cancer can take it. Vaginal estrogen just is in the pelvis.
22:15
Speaker 2: It won't prevent your bones, right, it won't prevent usteoporosis,
22:18
Speaker 2: It won't protect your brain, it won't protect your heart,
22:20
Speaker 2: like all the amazing things that systemic estrogen will do. Right,
22:24
Speaker 2: all it does is help GSM. And my argument is
22:28
Speaker 2: it should be a preventative medicine, like H fifty five,
22:31
Speaker 2: pick a number, like, here's your mammogram, here's your colonoscopy,
22:34
Speaker 2: here's your vaginal estrogen.
22:37
Speaker 1: Okay, you need to be everyone's dog.
22:39
Speaker 3: Found.
22:44
Speaker 2: Don't ask me about anybody's ear problems.
22:46
Speaker 1: I cannot help. Yeah, well, okay, so I'm gonna I
22:50
Speaker 1: always like throw myself under the bus on every podcast.
22:52
Speaker 1: I'm like, well, here's my problem.
22:54
Speaker 3: I know both of us are like dragging our.
22:57
Speaker 2: Our podcast just created for the for the host, like
23:00
Speaker 2: help themselves. I mean, come on, that's what we're all doing.
23:04
Speaker 1: So okay, the overactive bladder, I did not know that
23:09
Speaker 1: was a symptom of perimenopause. And let me tell you,
23:12
Speaker 1: I've gone to the urologist and I he had me
23:15
Speaker 1: on the anti what are the called the anticol energics.
23:20
Speaker 2: Those are nasty drugs. Yes, by the way, I'm so annoyed.
23:24
Speaker 1: I was on it for like three years, and then
23:27
Speaker 1: my new urrolis because this guy like bounced. He was like,
23:30
Speaker 1: oh no, you can't be on that, like you don't
23:32
Speaker 1: go on that long term. And I had no idea.
23:35
Speaker 1: So now I'm like, well, why am I peeing all
23:37
Speaker 1: the time?
23:37
Speaker 2: Freaking vaginal estrogen. What's wrong with your urologists. I'm allowed
23:40
Speaker 2: to say that because I'm a urologist, Yes, exactly. And
23:44
Speaker 2: I'm also allowed to say that because I was literally
23:46
Speaker 2: in Denver, Colorado last spring, looking at how brown it was,
23:50
Speaker 2: telling the Rocky Mountain Neurologic Society that vaginal estrogen is
23:53
Speaker 2: equivalent to anti cool energics. Like, we literally have that
23:56
Speaker 2: published data. The problem with that data is it's hiding
23:59
Speaker 2: in the menopause drone and urologists besides me don't read that.
24:02
Speaker 2: But I was literally in Denver last year telling the
24:05
Speaker 2: Colorado urologists that vaginal estrogen is equivalent to the nasty
24:09
Speaker 2: medications they put you on.
24:11
Speaker 1: My he's fired, he's he is.
24:14
Speaker 2: I have an amazing urologist, and you're boulder. Who's a
24:16
Speaker 2: female that you can go see. Her name is doctor
24:19
Speaker 2: Carolyn Phronsia. Go see her. She's amazing.
24:22
Speaker 1: Oh I'm seeing her as soon as I get off
24:24
Speaker 1: this call. This is.
24:28
Speaker 2: Help me, help you.
24:29
Speaker 4: So overactive bladder and incontinent incontinence.
24:36
Speaker 2: Means bladder leakage.
24:37
Speaker 3: Okay, that's what I wanted to know the difference.
24:39
Speaker 4: So so many women always complain about if they sneeze,
24:43
Speaker 4: if they jog, they're running, they're you know anything that
24:49
Speaker 4: your he just comes out. What.
24:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's talk about that because that's super important and
24:54
Speaker 2: very common. So leaking, when you cough, sneeze, laugh, trampoline,
24:59
Speaker 2: double under exercise. Right, it's called stress in continence. People
25:03
Speaker 2: think that means it's because you're stressed. It's not because
25:05
Speaker 2: you're stressed. Stress means a force. So it's a force
25:08
Speaker 2: on the bladder, force on the pelvis. Right, So running, jumping, coughing, sneezing,
25:13
Speaker 2: all of that will push urine out of the pelvis.
25:17
Speaker 2: Happens with aging, decrease, collagen decrease, hormones decrease, muscle strength. Also,
25:23
Speaker 2: putting any sort of baby through a vagina once or
25:27
Speaker 2: multiple times can increase. So there's many reasons that it happens.
25:33
Speaker 2: Baginal estrogen may or may not help. Doesn't help everybody
25:37
Speaker 2: with that. I've seen some women on systemic testosterone get
25:41
Speaker 2: helped with that. I'm not saying that's why we should
25:42
Speaker 2: use systemic tstosterone. It's another podcast episode, but sometimes systemic
25:46
Speaker 2: hormones do help. Pelvic floor physical therapy can help greatly.
25:51
Speaker 2: They're awesome and the traditional surgery was a sling. It's
25:56
Speaker 2: called a midirethral sling. It's been around for twenty years,
26:00
Speaker 2: done plenty of them. It's a great surgery, but I'm
26:02
Speaker 2: giving you a three percent risk of mesh complications for
26:05
Speaker 2: your life because I'm putting a permanent piece of mesh
26:07
Speaker 2: in there. I will now offer you the best new
26:11
Speaker 2: things in slice bread, which I went in very skeptical
26:15
Speaker 2: and cynical because I'm not the youngest urologist anymore. It's
26:18
Speaker 2: called bulkamid b U l K M I D. You
26:22
Speaker 2: know how women get fillers for their face, yes, to
26:25
Speaker 2: make their cheeks and their lips more full. It's filler
26:29
Speaker 2: for your urethra.
26:31
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh.
26:32
Speaker 2: And it decreases strength and continents by like fifty to
26:35
Speaker 2: eighty percent. It's a three minute procedure. There's no downtime.
26:40
Speaker 2: I'm like a walking billboard. It's like you can exercise
26:44
Speaker 2: the next day, you can have sex the next If
26:45
Speaker 2: you have a sling, you can't have put anything in
26:47
Speaker 2: your vagina for six weeks and you can't exercise Like
26:49
Speaker 2: Downtime's a big deal for busy women. Bulkamid no downtime,
26:54
Speaker 2: just the day you're having the procedure, I have you
26:56
Speaker 2: pee before you leave my surgery center because I want
26:59
Speaker 2: to make sure you're not haven't blocked, and it's not
27:03
Speaker 2: permanent like a meshling is. But the benefit is you
27:05
Speaker 2: don't have any risks of things being permanent in your body.
27:08
Speaker 2: And so you just call me and you just tell
27:09
Speaker 2: me when it wears off, and we give you more
27:12
Speaker 2: insurance covers it. This is no brainer it's a no brainer.
27:18
Speaker 2: Nobody knows about Bulkaman yet. It's been in Europe for
27:21
Speaker 2: over seven years. It's been in America for about two
27:25
Speaker 2: to three years. I went, I'm telling you, believe me.
27:28
Speaker 2: I went in cynical and like, slings are pretty awesome.
27:30
Speaker 2: Why am I gonna do something that's not maybe doesn't
27:34
Speaker 2: let like I went in fit with a scientist mind.
27:37
Speaker 2: I'm like, I don't know about this. If women tell
27:39
Speaker 2: me they don't like it, I'm not gonna do it.
27:42
Speaker 2: Like that's how I went in, And now I'm like,
27:45
Speaker 2: these are the happiest freakin' women. They like bring me
27:47
Speaker 2: house plants as thank you gifts. One woman came in
27:50
Speaker 2: with no underwear on to just to show me she
27:53
Speaker 2: can wear no underwear elk. She has like a love it,
27:56
Speaker 2: like these are happy women because it's like it's hardly
28:01
Speaker 2: a surgery. I give you a little ivy a aesesia
28:04
Speaker 2: because if you're going to put a needle in myurethra,
28:06
Speaker 2: I'd like a little ivan asesia, like no breathing tube,
28:10
Speaker 2: no incisions, no stitches, like this is filler for your urethra,
28:16
Speaker 2: for stress and contents and insurance covers it.
28:19
Speaker 3: I can't take it.
28:20
Speaker 4: And I feel like women don't care about going and
28:23
Speaker 4: getting something done again because they're used to getting the
28:26
Speaker 4: botox or getting you know, you go and get your
28:29
Speaker 4: teeth cleaned.
28:30
Speaker 3: How often? I don't know. I just feel like that's
28:34
Speaker 3: I agree.
28:35
Speaker 2: When I was starting to do this procedure, I had
28:37
Speaker 2: a woman come back at a year. She's like, yeah,
28:39
Speaker 2: more off, And I'm like, let listen, let me ask you.
28:42
Speaker 2: Would you rather come back and see me once a
28:44
Speaker 2: year for this or would you rather me give you
28:46
Speaker 2: a sling?
28:47
Speaker 1: Right yeah?
28:49
Speaker 2: And she's like this once a year, hands down, keep
28:52
Speaker 2: the mesh out of my body. And I'm like, the
28:55
Speaker 2: women are speaking, man, they know what they want. We've
28:58
Speaker 2: got options, they know they want the bulkamen. It's like
29:02
Speaker 2: very rare that I see a woman and do a sling. Now,
29:05
Speaker 2: it's usually like do a balkamid if it's what if
29:09
Speaker 2: it didn't meet your expectations, let's do it again. So
29:11
Speaker 2: you get two bulkamids before you've bought yourself a sling.
29:14
Speaker 2: And I've probably done two hundred to two hundred and
29:17
Speaker 2: fifty bulcamed in the last like two and a half years,
29:19
Speaker 2: and I've put slings in four of those people.
29:23
Speaker 3: It's a great, oh.
29:24
Speaker 1: Come, this is amazing. And so it doesn't always come
29:28
Speaker 1: down to like not having a strong pelvic floor.
29:32
Speaker 2: Not always. No, the the control of urine is actually
29:37
Speaker 2: quite complicated, right, So it's like the integrity of your urethra,
29:42
Speaker 2: how you integrity of the urethra, collagen and hormones. Right,
29:46
Speaker 2: Estrogen really helps the mucosa, the collagen, the blood blood
29:50
Speaker 2: just keeps things plump. So it does an atrophy. So
29:55
Speaker 2: estrogen hormones also the descent of the urethra where it
29:57
Speaker 2: rides underneath your pubic bone. It can get pushed down
30:00
Speaker 2: a little bit by having a baby age all that stuff,
30:03
Speaker 2: and then the muscles of the pelvic floor. So it's
30:06
Speaker 2: not just you know, I agree with the pelvic floor.
30:08
Speaker 2: Physical therapists try it. It's not invasive, they can help.
30:12
Speaker 2: It makes a world a difference.
30:14
Speaker 1: But if it.
30:15
Speaker 2: Helped everybody, I would be out of a job in
30:17
Speaker 2: that department. And I'm telling you, I'm not Yeah.
30:21
Speaker 4: Do you do vaginal reconstruction surgery Yeah, for prolabse yeah, yeah,
30:28
Speaker 4: or just anything woman I don't do.
30:31
Speaker 2: I cringe. I get very I'm very I'm a protective person.
30:35
Speaker 2: I get very protective of my women, and I get
30:37
Speaker 2: very cringy anytime people are like tightening rejuvenation, Like those
30:42
Speaker 2: words mean nothing, and you're playing on the insecurities of
30:45
Speaker 2: women because they don't know if their vulva and vagina's normal.
30:49
Speaker 2: And like, I think there's a huge market for preying
30:52
Speaker 2: on women's insecurities about their genitals. So I do nothing
30:56
Speaker 2: like that.
30:56
Speaker 4: Yeah.
30:57
Speaker 2: For me, it's like, dude, I had a baby, I
30:59
Speaker 2: haven't bet on my hormones, the tennis balls falling out,
31:02
Speaker 2: and I can't exercise. I'm like, fix it if you
31:05
Speaker 2: want to fix it. Absolutely, So I do a lot
31:07
Speaker 2: of pelvic surgeries, a lot of vaginal surgeries. But anybody
31:10
Speaker 2: who's got a website about rejuvenation and tightening. What the
31:14
Speaker 2: fuck is tightening? Okay, well we so we To me,
31:18
Speaker 2: I'm like you people come to see me because sex
31:21
Speaker 2: is painful, because it's too tight because they don't have estrogen.
31:25
Speaker 2: So to me, I'm like anybody who's branding vaginal tightening
31:28
Speaker 2: is I don't know a predator.
31:31
Speaker 4: Okay, well we read how you said there are three
31:36
Speaker 4: things that you should never do, and I have done
31:40
Speaker 4: two of them.
31:43
Speaker 1: R the vaginal kitness and the overactive bladder, which I've
31:47
Speaker 1: done that. So I guess that.
31:51
Speaker 2: Anticke a energics for overactive bad.
31:52
Speaker 1: Yeah.
31:53
Speaker 4: So between Haley and I we have covered them all,
31:56
Speaker 4: but her and I both have done pr P in
31:59
Speaker 4: the dress.
32:00
Speaker 3: You please tell us why we shouldn't do either of them.
32:04
Speaker 2: Listen, if women want to spend their women can spend
32:07
Speaker 2: their money however they want to spend their money, Like,
32:10
Speaker 2: I'm not here to tell people not to. They can
32:12
Speaker 2: dazzle their armpits for as much as I care. But
32:17
Speaker 2: where I have a problem is when women are sold something,
32:23
Speaker 2: yes for something for something that doesn't either solve their problem,
32:28
Speaker 2: right yep. That's my big issue of like, you know,
32:32
Speaker 2: take sexual desire. For example, sexual desire is quite complicated.
32:36
Speaker 2: It's biopsychosocial. There's a great TED talk on it. But
32:41
Speaker 2: it's like desires complex, right, Like it's your relationship, it's
32:46
Speaker 2: how you view your body image, it's your hormones, it's
32:49
Speaker 2: how good the sex is to begin with, Like, desires
32:52
Speaker 2: really complex. And when a woman is sold like come
32:56
Speaker 2: get these proprietary injections to improve disease desire. I know
33:01
Speaker 2: that's bullshit because it will not affect everybody's desire because
33:06
Speaker 2: desires complex. Yeah right, and by the way, it's thousands
33:10
Speaker 2: of dollars. Insurance doesn't cover it, and you have to
33:13
Speaker 2: keep doing it if it does work.
33:15
Speaker 3: Yeah, so believe it.
33:16
Speaker 2: For a woman who's like it were great, it's like, okay,
33:18
Speaker 2: well just wait for it, Like it's just have you
33:21
Speaker 2: budgeted for this plan?
33:23
Speaker 1: Right?
33:23
Speaker 2: Like totally. I always joke like women shouldn't have to
33:26
Speaker 2: re mortgage their house to take care of their health.
33:29
Speaker 1: No.
33:29
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's such a good point though about the desire.
33:33
Speaker 4: It is like we're missing that point. And in your
33:37
Speaker 4: TED talk, I feel like one of the most important
33:39
Speaker 4: things you said too is your biggest sex organ is
33:42
Speaker 4: your brain and it's isn't that what you said?
33:46
Speaker 3: Did? I? I want to repeat it correctly, and I
33:49
Speaker 3: just think, how you're exactly right.
33:54
Speaker 2: Totally. I mean if I think if I think my
33:56
Speaker 2: body's a disaster, it's failed me. I'm worried about leaking.
34:00
Speaker 2: I'm checking in on my thighs all the time. Like,
34:03
Speaker 2: my experience of my sexual life is going to be
34:06
Speaker 2: very different than if I came in being like this
34:09
Speaker 2: is what I'm showing up with today and let's try
34:11
Speaker 2: to have a good time, which is even different than fuck, yeah,
34:15
Speaker 2: look at me. Yeah, this is awesome. I am hot, okay, right,
34:20
Speaker 2: because I think we're always trying to get to neutral. Yeah,
34:23
Speaker 2: And it's like, what if we were profoundly radical and
34:25
Speaker 2: tried to get to freakin' awesome. There's a book on
34:28
Speaker 2: that there, book called.
34:32
Speaker 1: This is our best podcast already.
34:36
Speaker 2: There's for people who are interested in at work to
34:38
Speaker 2: get like, there's this book called The Body is Not
34:41
Speaker 2: an Apology. I think Sonya Renee Taylor, if I'm getting
34:44
Speaker 2: it right, it's like over on my bookshelf. But she's like,
34:47
Speaker 2: why the hell are we striving for neutral?
34:51
Speaker 3: So good?
34:51
Speaker 2: And it's like as soon as she says, You're like,
34:54
Speaker 2: oh right, we've put the bar real low.
34:56
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, well, okay, this is like since I'm sharing everything,
35:03
Speaker 1: Like when I see these things advertised, You're right, Like
35:07
Speaker 1: I go down and book and I'm like, I don't
35:09
Speaker 1: know if if I'm normal, Like how do you know?
35:13
Speaker 2: Because your body parts have been banned on the internet,
35:16
Speaker 2: Like the only body parts we see are photoshopped or
35:23
Speaker 2: video shopped or surgically augmented. It's very hard for people
35:29
Speaker 2: to go and to see if they if like how
35:31
Speaker 2: does my chin compare? Like you can go see a
35:34
Speaker 2: whole bunch of different chints, right, yeah, but like it's
35:37
Speaker 2: profoundly important to know that people sit within the Bell
35:41
Speaker 2: curve and if they don't that, you know, we can
35:43
Speaker 2: do something about it. And even if you don't sit
35:45
Speaker 2: within the Bell curve, you can have an amazing sex
35:47
Speaker 2: life anyways, if it's not, you know, a broken thing.
35:50
Speaker 2: I saw this woman, older woman. She came in with
35:54
Speaker 2: her I think he was her husband. We're doing a
35:57
Speaker 2: pelvic exam for like I don't even remember what it
35:59
Speaker 2: was for. And she was like, I'm so sorry, I'm
36:02
Speaker 2: so sorry, I'm so ashamed, and I'm like, oh, you know,
36:05
Speaker 2: tell me about that. And she's like my earlier husband,
36:09
Speaker 2: like before, the before husband had told her that she
36:12
Speaker 2: had a profoundly abnormal labia in volva, and I think
36:18
Speaker 2: it was a little more derogatory of a term. I
36:20
Speaker 2: made it medical, but like derogatory term about how horrific
36:23
Speaker 2: her external genitalia were. And I was like, listen, I'm
36:27
Speaker 2: gonna do you a favor. I look at like fifteen
36:29
Speaker 2: volvas a day. I have a lot of volva knowledge
36:32
Speaker 2: in my brain. I'm just gonna tell you where you
36:34
Speaker 2: are on the bell curve.
36:36
Speaker 1: Yeah.
36:37
Speaker 2: She's like okay, Like I wanted to keep it like
36:39
Speaker 2: super neutral. I'm like, I'm just going to tell you
36:40
Speaker 2: how average you are. It did her exam and I'm like,
36:43
Speaker 2: you're like so average, you're unforgettable. Like I can't actually
36:46
Speaker 2: remember her vulva now right, I'm like, you're just like average,
36:51
Speaker 2: normal bell curve, nothing remarkable. And her husband looked at
36:55
Speaker 2: her and he's like, see, honey, I told you. And
36:59
Speaker 2: I'm like, you get to release this asshole from your
37:03
Speaker 2: brain now. But again, going back to sex ed, like
37:07
Speaker 2: she took that one guy's advice. He wasn't he how
37:10
Speaker 2: many involvements. Had that guy looked at right and taken
37:13
Speaker 2: him as what her body was.
37:18
Speaker 3: That is so sad.
37:19
Speaker 2: Anyways, I don't remember the point of that story, but
37:22
Speaker 2: like women are hiding in shame because they don't know
37:26
Speaker 2: if they're normal or not. That's yes, that's the point.
37:31
Speaker 4: Well, all of you know, we're at this age where
37:36
Speaker 4: when we are with our friends we're talking, we end
37:38
Speaker 4: up talking about all of these different things. And a
37:42
Speaker 4: lot of my friends have said that they feel like
37:45
Speaker 4: their vagina has aged, like it's not looking the same
37:48
Speaker 4: and they and sometimes functioning the same, and they do
37:53
Speaker 4: want it to function like it did, but also look young.
38:00
Speaker 4: And I never even thought about that until I started
38:04
Speaker 4: having conversations about it, and I'm at an older age.
38:08
Speaker 4: But what do you think is the best advice for
38:11
Speaker 4: people that feel that way?
38:13
Speaker 2: Yeah? So, I mean again, this whole thing is biopsychosocial, right, Yeah,
38:19
Speaker 2: it's like, why do you want to change your body part? Oh?
38:21
Speaker 2: Because society told you youngers better? Okay, interesting, so there
38:24
Speaker 2: might not actually be anything wrong with the body part
38:27
Speaker 2: you're just coming to And by the way, we wear clothes,
38:31
Speaker 2: like ninety nine percent of the time, like Society's literally
38:36
Speaker 2: not like I understand the face so much more because
38:38
Speaker 2: it's your billboard, right, But it's like, dude, literally, maybe
38:42
Speaker 2: a couple of people are looking at your volva and
38:44
Speaker 2: ideally they're having a hell of a good time with
38:46
Speaker 2: it and not trying to judge your like your anatomical
38:51
Speaker 2: age by it.
38:52
Speaker 1: Yeah.
38:53
Speaker 2: Right, But that's why I love these conversations, because like
38:56
Speaker 2: you just take somebody's concern and you just freaking blow
38:59
Speaker 2: it out of the water by being like, is anybody
39:02
Speaker 2: asking how old you are? And you're like, hold on,
39:03
Speaker 2: let me check my volva.
39:05
Speaker 4: Yeah, And what's funny is all, yeah, we'll save Well
39:08
Speaker 4: did your husband seeming like are there any complaints? It's
39:11
Speaker 4: like no, he'd be all over it every day. Yeah.
39:16
Speaker 2: So I'm like, okay, this is my advice. Number One,
39:20
Speaker 2: nothing prevents us from aging except for death. Yeah, so true,
39:26
Speaker 2: you like nothing is stopping the clock. And do you
39:29
Speaker 2: spend spend your whole life wishing you were a different
39:31
Speaker 2: age or your body look different at the on your deathbed,
39:34
Speaker 2: you kind of wish you didn't do that, Like, enjoy
39:36
Speaker 2: the time you had, right. Number two, save your money,
39:41
Speaker 2: go get yourself some phenomenal good hormone healthcare because our
39:47
Speaker 2: I would agree, our volvas do change with age. We
39:51
Speaker 2: lose volume, we lose elasticity, and a twenty dollars bottle
39:55
Speaker 2: of vaginal estrogen does a world of difference, and we
39:59
Speaker 2: should be putting it on our clitterists. We should put
40:01
Speaker 2: putting it on our labia minora. And that six o'clock
40:04
Speaker 2: entrance to the vagina is nasty. It gets tight, and
40:09
Speaker 2: that's the first part that starts hurting when people start
40:12
Speaker 2: complaining of dryness or pain with sex. So when I
40:14
Speaker 2: see people being like get tighter, I'm like, dude, just
40:17
Speaker 2: give it. Give yourself five years with no hormones and
40:19
Speaker 2: you'll be tight to the point that you hate sex.
40:21
Speaker 2: So like, I don't think that tightness should be a
40:24
Speaker 2: branding thing at all. It makes no sense to me.
40:27
Speaker 2: If you want to work on tightness, like get a
40:28
Speaker 2: good pelvic floor physical therapist, get your muscles toned right. Yeah,
40:32
Speaker 2: so pelvic floor physical therapy and then vaginal estrogen. But
40:36
Speaker 2: don't remortgage the house or brain, like go out to
40:39
Speaker 2: dinner or go on vacation. With the amount of money
40:42
Speaker 2: that people are taking from women praying on their insecurity
40:45
Speaker 2: that their vulva doesn't look twenty like your partner doesn't care.
40:49
Speaker 2: They probably just want more sex. Yeah, what are we try?
40:54
Speaker 2: But when all you see online is like the plastic
40:58
Speaker 2: surgery images of this is how I can change a volva,
41:02
Speaker 2: you start thinking that's necessary. It is completely not necessary
41:05
Speaker 2: to a great sex life. So true, Well spend your
41:08
Speaker 2: money on.
41:08
Speaker 1: Good vibrators, for sure. That's what I thought you were
41:12
Speaker 1: going to say. When you said hormut it on hormone.
41:15
Speaker 2: I was like, we're having the vibrate vibrary conversation. Wow,
41:20
Speaker 2: we invest in some good vibrators, Like a twenty dollars
41:22
Speaker 2: vibrator is kind of a piece of crap.
41:25
Speaker 1: Yeah, in my opinion, this is this is the best. Okay,
41:30
Speaker 1: the pelvic floor physical therapist. I went because I had
41:35
Speaker 1: a lot of issues with my my last my third
41:37
Speaker 1: child birth. I didn't know that entelled and when I
41:41
Speaker 1: went in there, I was like, well.
41:43
Speaker 2: That was spir is personal and for people, I want
41:48
Speaker 2: to address that right because I see a lot of
41:50
Speaker 2: women say I don't want to go because I'm worried
41:52
Speaker 2: about an internal exam stuff like that, and I'm like,
41:56
Speaker 2: you need to communicate that to them. You need to
41:59
Speaker 2: tell them you're boues, whether you've had a history of trauma.
42:02
Speaker 2: You don't have to tell the details. But I fully
42:04
Speaker 2: respect if a woman is not ready to get naked
42:06
Speaker 2: and have some fingers in her for, you know, checking
42:09
Speaker 2: out her hip joint on the first date, I get it.
42:12
Speaker 1: Yeah.
42:13
Speaker 2: And physical therapists can do a lot without going inside
42:18
Speaker 2: of you. They're very talented people. They're better than doctors
42:23
Speaker 2: are at assessing pelvic floor muscles and inside the vagina
42:27
Speaker 2: is the way to do that. But they can do
42:29
Speaker 2: a lot without doing that, and you can also get
42:32
Speaker 2: to know them. Is this a good fit? Are we
42:34
Speaker 2: aligned in what the plan is? Do I feel good
42:37
Speaker 2: showing up here right? Like you don't have to rush
42:40
Speaker 2: into the internal exam, but you got to communicate it.
42:43
Speaker 2: You can't be like, well here I go and then
42:45
Speaker 2: be like I wish I didn't I wish we didn't
42:47
Speaker 2: do that. Like address that, bring that up on the
42:49
Speaker 2: front end, is would be my advice.
42:51
Speaker 3: That's good advice.
42:52
Speaker 1: Oh, I just didn't know what I was getting into.
42:53
Speaker 1: I mean, like, the lady was amazing, but I was
42:56
Speaker 1: just like she's like, okay, so this is what's happening.
42:59
Speaker 1: I was like, ah, well, I thought I was coming
43:03
Speaker 1: in here for a hamstring something. Where are we going
43:08
Speaker 1: with this?
43:09
Speaker 2: You learned a lot. But with I mean, they're incredibly talented.
43:13
Speaker 2: There is like not a pelvic floor physical therapist that
43:15
Speaker 2: I haven't liked yet. They're invaluable people. I mean, it's
43:19
Speaker 2: so silly our healthcare system, right, Like I'm a surgeon.
43:23
Speaker 2: People come to me first of all not wanting surgery,
43:26
Speaker 2: and then I'm like, you know, I'm a surgeon and
43:27
Speaker 2: They're like no, I didn't know that. And I'm like, okay,
43:30
Speaker 2: well Google. But but I'm like, you can go to
43:34
Speaker 2: physical therapy first. The surgeon doesn't have to be your
43:36
Speaker 2: first stop, right, And so many good pelvic floor physical
43:39
Speaker 2: therapists will tell you though. They'll be like, go see
43:41
Speaker 2: a doctor, get on vaginal estrogen, like they know the
43:44
Speaker 2: importance of hormones in pelvic health. So we're all it's
43:48
Speaker 2: all just kind of like a mutual love fest that
43:50
Speaker 2: like we love them, they love us because we all
43:54
Speaker 2: do a different part to help help a woman.
43:58
Speaker 4: So besides the estrogen, what is another essential hormone that
44:06
Speaker 4: you feel like is really helpful for women?
44:10
Speaker 3: Testosterone and progosta.
44:12
Speaker 2: Yeah, so there's three. I mean, there's three hormones that
44:16
Speaker 2: we can buy, right, like that, we have pharmacies that
44:19
Speaker 2: we've created our bodies. Well, I mean besides the other
44:23
Speaker 2: hormones of like insulin, thyroid, you know all tho sick.
44:25
Speaker 2: But we're talking like perimenopause menopause hormones. And to call
44:30
Speaker 2: these sex hormones is a complete misnomer, Like, yes, our
44:34
Speaker 2: gonads make most of them, but like they work in
44:37
Speaker 2: your brain, they work in your heart, they help with
44:40
Speaker 2: insulin resistance. Like the fact that we've labeled them sex
44:43
Speaker 2: hormones is actually like a dismissal of their importance. They're
44:47
Speaker 2: vitally important for our entire body. But again we didn't
44:51
Speaker 2: get taught that. But so there we have many hormones
44:54
Speaker 2: within the like there's many types of estrogen. There's several
44:57
Speaker 2: types of androgens, like all of these different things. But
45:00
Speaker 2: we have three that like money can buy, money can
45:04
Speaker 2: buy testosterone, progesterone, estrogen. Our ovaries make testosterone which then
45:13
Speaker 2: gets converted into estrogen. So it's actually wrong to say
45:18
Speaker 2: ovaries make estrogen because you're missing out. You're missing out
45:22
Speaker 2: the fact that like we actually have more testosterone in
45:24
Speaker 2: our bodies than estrogen because we make testosterone to make
45:27
Speaker 2: some estrogen, which is I didn't even get taught that
45:31
Speaker 2: in medical school. Like it's insulting how little we know
45:34
Speaker 2: about our bodies. But so to me, in perimenopause and menopause,
45:39
Speaker 2: those are the three options on the table, and I
45:42
Speaker 2: think they're all important and they all do different things.
45:45
Speaker 2: And if you see somebody for hormones and they don't
45:48
Speaker 2: talk about all three of those things, then I wouldn't
45:51
Speaker 2: say they're comprehensive if they're only would. I like put
45:55
Speaker 2: this on Instagram the other day and like, if your
45:57
Speaker 2: only option for a woman is a pellet of one type,
46:01
Speaker 2: you're a one trick pony. You're not actually a hormone expert.
46:05
Speaker 3: I loved when you said that.
46:07
Speaker 1: Oh, I loved when you said the pharmacists or assholes quote.
46:13
Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, so let's talk about that. The
46:16
Speaker 1: testosterone and the lack of you know how hard it
46:21
Speaker 1: is to get from it.
46:23
Speaker 2: It's embarrassing. And the reason why it's embarrassing is because
46:27
Speaker 2: I know, I trust and I believe that in the
46:30
Speaker 2: future it's going to be better. Like I know that
46:33
Speaker 2: I know there is a world where we have good
46:36
Speaker 2: access to this, and so I'm like, oh my god,
46:38
Speaker 2: I'm part of the generation where it's embarrassing, but like
46:44
Speaker 2: we have to help get it there. Right. So ovaries
46:49
Speaker 2: make testosterone. All people have testosterone. Men just have more
46:55
Speaker 2: of it, right, Like people need to know that because
46:58
Speaker 2: otherwise I come in looking like this crazy person who's
47:01
Speaker 2: like testosterone for women, and they're like what right, So
47:04
Speaker 2: you got to like go back to the education first.
47:07
Speaker 2: But the FDA has about twenty different products for testosterone
47:12
Speaker 2: for men. We have zero for women. The FDA has
47:15
Speaker 2: said we want five more years of safety data for
47:18
Speaker 2: testosterone for women, more safety data than we have for men.
47:23
Speaker 2: The additional problem, because of the Olympic doping scandals of
47:28
Speaker 2: the seventies and eighties, our legislature got a little pissed
47:34
Speaker 2: that people were doping, so they put in the FED
47:37
Speaker 2: a federal act that all of these synthetic androgens are
47:40
Speaker 2: now banned substances, and on that list was one naturally
47:44
Speaker 2: occurring hormone called testosterone. People do not overdose testosterone like
47:49
Speaker 2: they do not do it. They might become they might
47:51
Speaker 2: have gros some more hair and get angry, like there's
47:54
Speaker 2: side effects, but like too much disosterone doesn't kill a person.
47:57
Speaker 2: But it's on this list of banned subst stances, including
48:01
Speaker 2: fentanyl and oxycodone. What that does is it prevents access
48:05
Speaker 2: because now we've labeled it as unsafe instead of something
48:08
Speaker 2: your body naturally makes. Right, So we've got two problems.
48:11
Speaker 2: We do not have a female dosed product approved by
48:14
Speaker 2: the FDA. That means insurance won't cover it, and you
48:18
Speaker 2: have to dose it appropriately and it's actually difficult to do.
48:22
Speaker 2: The other problem is now it's on the DEA list.
48:24
Speaker 2: Your name goes on a register of being somebody who
48:28
Speaker 2: has a controlled substance it legit. Yeah, California has its
48:33
Speaker 2: own list because they wanted today want to know everybody
48:36
Speaker 2: who's taken oxycodone and fentanyl and ope tiestosterones on that list,
48:39
Speaker 2: and you have to see a doctor every six months
48:41
Speaker 2: for your prescription instead of every year because it's on
48:44
Speaker 2: that list. And it also carries the stigma of doctors
48:48
Speaker 2: being like that's unsafe. That's a steroid. Of like, course
48:52
Speaker 2: it's a steroid, so but so it's cholesterol, like something
48:55
Speaker 2: being a steroid means nothing. So yeah, we've got a lot,
49:00
Speaker 2: a lot of barriers to testosterone. But let me tell you,
49:03
Speaker 2: there is nothing like testosterone appropriately dosed in a woman
49:09
Speaker 2: made midlife where she comes back to see me and
49:12
Speaker 2: she says, I'm back.
49:15
Speaker 3: Oh, I just got the chills.
49:18
Speaker 2: I feel more like myself. And I'm like, at the
49:21
Speaker 2: end of the day, if my job as a doctor
49:23
Speaker 2: isn't to make you feel more like yourself, what are
49:27
Speaker 2: we doing? You know? Like, there is something profoundly better
49:32
Speaker 2: about women when they are on testosterone. They come back
49:35
Speaker 2: and they're like, I can think faster, I'm quicker, I
49:39
Speaker 2: have more energy, I can recover better from the gym more.
49:42
Speaker 2: I just had a woman She's like, I'm more interested
49:44
Speaker 2: in the world. Again, You're never going to get an
49:47
Speaker 2: FDA approval for something that makes you more interested in
49:49
Speaker 2: the world, right, Like, it's these these stories that come back.
49:53
Speaker 2: The other bullshit about testosterone for women is that the
49:58
Speaker 2: main global consensus it is for low desire. Why is
50:04
Speaker 2: the only legitimate reason for you to be on a
50:06
Speaker 2: hormone for you to sleep with somebody else?
50:09
Speaker 1: Good point, Well, messed up.
50:12
Speaker 2: It's so messed up. I didn't even think about that.
50:14
Speaker 2: Like my male brother pointed that out to me. He's like, Kelly,
50:16
Speaker 2: isn't it kind of weird that, like the only reason
50:18
Speaker 2: for women to take testosterone is to like sleep with dudes?
50:22
Speaker 2: And I'm like, yes, bro, Yes, yes, bro, thanks for
50:26
Speaker 2: putting that out to me.
50:28
Speaker 1: Gosh, and I don't want to be on any anyone's list,
50:32
Speaker 1: any government.
50:34
Speaker 2: Get as you are if you take testosterone.
50:37
Speaker 1: Or like America's most wanted.
50:39
Speaker 2: It makes it sound like you're doing something dangerous. And
50:41
Speaker 2: so in a woman's body, the testosterone she has in
50:45
Speaker 2: her twenties is about forty to fifty percent higher than
50:48
Speaker 2: the testosterone she has in her forties. Wow, testosterone starts
50:52
Speaker 2: going down much early. We kind of think of menopause
50:56
Speaker 2: as like and on Tuesday, the ovaries stopped and then
50:59
Speaker 2: everything fell off a cliff. Right, That's not how it
51:02
Speaker 2: works for testosterone. It's a very much slower decline, but
51:06
Speaker 2: it starts earlier. But you're still gonna make some testosterone
51:09
Speaker 2: even after the periods are done. Right, So testosterone is
51:12
Speaker 2: kind of like slow but early, but can you can
51:14
Speaker 2: keep getting making some estrogen is like in perimenopause, it's
51:19
Speaker 2: like up down up down, super up, way down up
51:22
Speaker 2: down here's the period. Now you're not going to have
51:23
Speaker 2: one for a while. So estrogen is like spastic, right,
51:27
Speaker 2: and then progesterone can kind of it's kind of doing
51:30
Speaker 2: its own thing. Nobody's really paid it. It's like the
51:32
Speaker 2: it's like the step brother that like doesn't doesn't come
51:35
Speaker 2: out of its room. Much like, we haven't really looked
51:37
Speaker 2: at progesterone very much. So, but progesteron is profoundly important
51:42
Speaker 2: for mood and sleep. We just we just I think
51:45
Speaker 2: we need more research, especially in perimenopause. But so to
51:48
Speaker 2: say for a woman who's still she's perimenopause, she still
51:52
Speaker 2: has her periods, maybe her energy is low, maybe her
51:55
Speaker 2: sexual desire is low. To me, I'm like, I'm checking
51:57
Speaker 2: that woman's testosterone way before I'm telling her to go
52:01
Speaker 2: get PRP and her clitterists or lasers or you know
52:05
Speaker 2: anything else. Is like, there's things happening in your body,
52:09
Speaker 2: let's optimize them. And by the way, it's predamn cheap.
52:12
Speaker 2: So but mean it all comes back to education. The
52:16
Speaker 2: more we know, the less we're gonna fall victim to
52:18
Speaker 2: people who just want to make money off of us.
52:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, so with testosterone, when it's low for certain women.
52:28
Speaker 1: I just had a conversation about this this week. That
52:32
Speaker 1: can affect your ability to grow muscle. Yes, so I
52:37
Speaker 1: have some clients. I mean I only work with people
52:39
Speaker 1: forty plus and most of them are in their fifties
52:42
Speaker 1: and their post metapuzzle and when they again, different conversation.
52:46
Speaker 1: But when they come and they're like, well, I don't
52:48
Speaker 1: want to get bulky, and I'm like, do you know
52:49
Speaker 1: how you are? Like try? I'm like, do you know
52:53
Speaker 1: how many women that like, we'll talk to them when
52:56
Speaker 1: they're passed out on the floor just because they're trying
52:59
Speaker 1: to main pin their muscle that they have.
53:03
Speaker 2: Dude, And the role of muscle and longevity, the role
53:06
Speaker 2: of muscle and insulin resistance, the role of muscle in
53:09
Speaker 2: bone health, the role of muscle in preventing falls. Like
53:13
Speaker 2: I'm telling you, if you want to do anything to
53:15
Speaker 2: help out your seventy two year old future self, lift
53:19
Speaker 2: the weights. Please preaching to the choir, but it's like, dude,
53:23
Speaker 2: muscles are so important.
53:25
Speaker 1: Yeah.
53:25
Speaker 2: I just saw a lady, she's sixty, she just came
53:29
Speaker 2: back four months. So sometimes taking disasterone, especially when it's
53:32
Speaker 2: appropriately dosed, and we can go into that, but she's
53:36
Speaker 2: about four months in. She's like, I'm noticing now my
53:40
Speaker 2: lean body mass, right, but in appropriately does hormones like
53:43
Speaker 2: it's gonna get you there slowly, not like four months
53:46
Speaker 2: is slow? Right, she spent she spent ten years without
53:49
Speaker 2: the damn stuff. Yeah, but you know, to be like, yeah,
53:52
Speaker 2: I think all tastostone's important and wound healing. Right, Orthopedic
53:57
Speaker 2: is looking like the orthopedic world is looking. They did
54:00
Speaker 2: a study where they gave dudes super high to stosterone,
54:05
Speaker 2: like way more than standard replacement before hip replacements, and
54:09
Speaker 2: they actually did better. No way, it's a little unorthodox,
54:13
Speaker 2: but like people are, you know, I think we are
54:18
Speaker 2: under because of the stigma and all the other things
54:21
Speaker 2: that we're calling these things sex hormones. We're under researching
54:24
Speaker 2: the role of hormones in healing and lean body mass.
54:27
Speaker 2: Certainly we know how important it is for bone protection
54:31
Speaker 2: and in women, your bone loss starts before your period's end.
54:35
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, that happens after your periods end.
54:37
Speaker 2: It's like no, no, no, this starts before because remember,
54:40
Speaker 2: the hormones are already doing their thing before the period stop.
54:45
Speaker 2: It's profoundly important.
54:49
Speaker 4: I am I am, I'm getting blood work done, oversation,
54:53
Speaker 4: I'm giving you a standing ovation.
54:57
Speaker 1: I don't want it to end. I'm super sensitive in
54:59
Speaker 1: your time, in our hours. But holy like my brain
55:04
Speaker 1: is just running with all of these conversations that I mean,
55:09
Speaker 1: I love what you're doing, Kelly. I love how I
55:12
Speaker 1: love your personality number one. I mean that alone outside
55:17
Speaker 1: of all of the education and knowledge that you're sharing,
55:20
Speaker 1: but like it's just on the opposite side to wrap up, like,
55:24
Speaker 1: I see women all the time that are just like
55:28
Speaker 1: shamed about weight or the fact that they don't have
55:32
Speaker 1: as much lean body mass and all of these things,
55:34
Speaker 1: and I'm just like, why are we making our lives
55:38
Speaker 1: miserable when it's just hard? I mean, and a lot
55:42
Speaker 1: of that comes from biopsychosocial and it's just it makes
55:48
Speaker 1: me so sad when women are just like kind of
55:53
Speaker 1: told that after midlife, like well, why do you care
55:56
Speaker 1: that much about your body or about your sex or
55:58
Speaker 1: about you know anything. It's just it's very disheartening.
56:04
Speaker 2: And you know, I thought about this. These are things
56:06
Speaker 2: I think about a lot, so you know, we're like, oh,
56:09
Speaker 2: society tells women all these things. Ah, and it's like
56:12
Speaker 2: we just lay down and fucking accept that. And it's like, no, no,
56:17
Speaker 2: you get to decide. You control the narrative. You tell
56:20
Speaker 2: people how to treat you, You tell people what women
56:22
Speaker 2: are like at this age. Like there's I'm so sick
56:26
Speaker 2: of this, like laying down and taking it attitude of
56:29
Speaker 2: like do you not realize your power? We have immense power,
56:36
Speaker 2: freaking use it.
56:38
Speaker 3: Yes, aimen to that. And I think the older we get,
56:43
Speaker 3: the better we get. I don't think it's oh.
56:46
Speaker 2: My god, yeah, I mean just look, you know, I'm
56:49
Speaker 2: so inspired by the thing of like, you know, Martha Stewart.
56:53
Speaker 2: Stewart didn't make her first million, and I'm making this
56:55
Speaker 2: up because I haven't looked recently, but like women kick
56:57
Speaker 2: it in the gear in mid life.
57:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, for any woman to be like, oh.
57:03
Speaker 2: They told me that this is just blah blah blah,
57:05
Speaker 2: it's like, no, no, no, this is when you can kick
57:07
Speaker 2: it into gear. If that's what you want to do.
57:09
Speaker 2: You don't have to do that, right. But it's like,
57:12
Speaker 2: you write the narrative because we have the immense privilege
57:17
Speaker 2: of living long and we've never lived this long before
57:21
Speaker 2: on a global scale, we are literally making it up.
57:24
Speaker 2: What aging looks like, all this is just a big
57:28
Speaker 2: grand experiment for the next generation, right, We're trying to
57:31
Speaker 2: help help out our kids.
57:33
Speaker 1: So what you are doing, I think it's like an amazing.
57:36
Speaker 2: Moment right now in mid life for women. And I'm
57:39
Speaker 2: like so happy to be part of the conversation.
57:43
Speaker 1: Yes, that is the perfect way to end really quick.
57:47
Speaker 1: Can people see you online? Do you do telehealth or
57:50
Speaker 1: are you ful?
57:51
Speaker 2: It's a good question. So I practice in Washington State.
57:55
Speaker 2: I currently only have a Washington state license. So what
57:58
Speaker 2: that means is you must be the bullshit of the world, right, Like,
58:03
Speaker 2: do you think healthcare is any different in North Carolina
58:05
Speaker 2: than Washington State. No, But state regulations don't blame the
58:09
Speaker 2: doctors for this, is what I'm saying. State regulations say
58:13
Speaker 2: that the person has to be in the state where
58:15
Speaker 2: the doctor is licensed, which makes again arcane state rules.
58:21
Speaker 2: But I'm already booked out for months and months and
58:23
Speaker 2: months taking care of Washingtonians. So I'm like, I have
58:26
Speaker 2: no incentive to get other state licenses because I'm like,
58:31
Speaker 2: I had I got nine million people in this state,
58:33
Speaker 2: fifty percent of them are female. Right, But so the
58:37
Speaker 2: point is I take care of Washington state people or
58:39
Speaker 2: people who fly in right now. I have no problem
58:42
Speaker 2: with you flying in, but.
58:44
Speaker 1: Oh I'm flying in. I'm gonna get on.
58:45
Speaker 2: Your note to me. I'm like, I like, you're in Boulder,
58:48
Speaker 2: you have resources. I will get you the people.
58:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, doctor Krollen phronsiac.
58:54
Speaker 2: You will say, you know me, I will help with her,
58:57
Speaker 2: take taking care of you. We will get all the women,
58:59
Speaker 2: all the balkamed in Boulder in Colorado, and it'll.
59:04
Speaker 1: Be will help other people done. I'm done, all right.
59:07
Speaker 1: So your Instagram is that the best place for people
59:11
Speaker 1: to get a hold of you or follow you? So
59:13
Speaker 1: either in Instagram because I love it, but it gets
59:15
Speaker 1: a little busy on there, you know, so you can
59:17
Speaker 1: always send me an email info at Kellycasperson MD dot com.
59:21
Speaker 1: That's through my website, which is Kellycasperson MD dot com.
59:25
Speaker 1: My baby of babies is the podcast.
59:27
Speaker 2: You Are Not Broken. I love it. That's the long form,
59:30
Speaker 2: right because like you have to hear these things a
59:32
Speaker 2: couple of times to like understand hormones and like the
59:37
Speaker 2: pelvis and how it works. So I love a lot,
59:39
Speaker 2: Like podcasting is my favorite thing. So You're Not Broken?
59:42
Speaker 2: And then the book is being re released September tenth,
59:47
Speaker 2: so it's for pre sale on Amazon right now. If
59:50
Speaker 2: you didn't get the book before, it's now taken down
59:53
Speaker 2: and re releasing September tenth, which is you are not broken,
59:57
Speaker 2: stop shooting all over your sex life.
1:00:00
Speaker 1: Okay, we're we're coming back on in September when you're
1:00:03
Speaker 1: slammed exactly nine million. Everyone has like nine million Instagram lives. Oh,
1:00:09
Speaker 1: I'm already pre booking, so we want to pre book
1:00:12
Speaker 1: you now because this is amazing and we're making everyone
1:00:15
Speaker 1: by the book. I'm going to pre buy the pre
1:00:18
Speaker 1: sell right now on Amazon because I just think you're
1:00:21
Speaker 1: fabulous and we are so grateful for your time and
1:00:25
Speaker 1: for everything that you're doing to serve women. So thank
1:00:29
Speaker 1: you so much for that, and we look forward to
1:00:32
Speaker 1: your book launch.
1:00:34
Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you, thank you.
1:00:36
Speaker 2: Thank you guys so much for having me.
1:00:38
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening everyone.
1:00:40
Speaker 4: If you enjoyed this episode, please consider giving us a
1:00:43
Speaker 4: five star rating and sharing the body Pod with your friends.
1:00:47
Speaker 1: Until next time, Beetles, Beetles, beetles,