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What I've Learnt - David Bromley · WHAT I'VE LEARNT

• 0:03
  SPEAKER_02: David Bromley, eclectic, adaptable, accessible art with a twist is his specialty.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_02: His artwork adorns everything from furniture, including dining tables to surfboards, clothing, crockery, and even features in huge murals and shopping malls.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_02: It's brave, often featuring the bare-breasted female paintings he's renowned for, and is sold across Australia and usually found in almost every art collector's home.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_02: Emerging as a painter in the mid-80s, in the early stages of his career, he held solo exhibitions in Sydney and Adelaide.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_02: He's represented works in state and regional galleries and has been a five times Archibald Prize finalist.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_02: Bromley infuses his colourful works of birds and beautiful butterflies with unexpected metallic backdrops in gold and silver leaf.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_02: In the portrait series, Bromley explores the female form.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_02: His paintings are predominantly provocative or demure, featuring life-size poses of models from fashion and film.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_02: The portraits are commanding and seductive, the females attractive and bare-breasted.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_02: However diverse in his subject matter, Bromley's work is enduringly figurative, reminiscent of Warhol's pop art from the 60s.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_02: This can be seen in the layering of high key colour bold brushwork paired with the use of gold and silver leaf.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_02: Bromley states that he draws inspiration from a range of artists, but the Warhol style appeals.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_02: In particular, his portraiture and figurative work.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: In the children-based work, the presence of the joy and innocence of childhood are evident.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_02: The compositions are reminiscents of bygone days, filled with imagery of toys, pets, and adventure, he says.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_02: So, David, we're so happy to have you on board to chat about your art and about your journey.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_02: Talk to me a little bit about Andy Warhol.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_02: I want to hear why he inspires you and who else you draw inspiration from.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_00: When I started being an artist, um it was with Clay.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um I'd bailed out of school in the mid-70s at about 14.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_00: We used to go walk about.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: I used to ask people for jobs because I hated school and any any any sort of constraining, any discipline.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: And uh yeah, so I went sort of walking and uh I used to love lettering.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_00: And so I did a lot of lettering and you know, got a signwriting job, was was uh too um uh averse to um you know formal structures of of work and and stuff and left that and and uh so by the time I was um in my late teens, uh I I developed um some very, very bad um uh uh you know anxiety and and sort of agrophobic um tendencies and you know it's not really worth spending more than a couple of seconds on, you know, because it's such a cliche with the creative person, but you know, the self-medication and the drugs and stuff that you know you sort of go, oh great, if I do this, I don't feel that anymore, but it chases you down and uh and and gets you so I I but I was very fortunate.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: I I I have a formidable constitution um and uh didn't die um like a lot of my friends.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I I I I so I found myself in the sort of never never land, you know, in my mid-20s, uh, where um you know I was still alive um and it was getting pretty boring um just you know doing the substances that I was doing and it just it just felt like you know a sort of a horrible groundhog day and a really um a really sad you know waste look in the mirror and just think I this is just stupid, you know, but I couldn't I couldn't part with it, but I did because I just I couldn't stand it anymore and neither could anyone else.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and so I what I did was I I I I I gave up all that all of that stuff, but I was left with I had no money, I had no nothing, I had um I had a an inkling and a leaning towards design, but but but to be a creative person when my mates were um you know we were all tradies and knockabouts, you know.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: To me, to be an artist, you know, that was like a girl sort of thinking, well, I'm you know, I'm gonna marry a prince or something.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it was so esoteric and stuff.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I I didn't come from a I didn't I didn't come from a sort of like a dumb sort of glass ceiling construct as such.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, my dad loved poetry and and loved reading you know unusual things and would do yoga every day and was interested in Eastern philosophies.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: My mum used to do crafts quite well.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, she'd take them to places and stuff, but uh to to sell and stuff.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_00: My my grandmother painted, but it was but you know, it it was in that genre of being a hobbyist, you know, whereas, you know, everyone I was around that's just like, well, you know, earn some money and get a car and blah, blah, blah.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_00: So when I started to be straight, I then realized that, well, I had one thing sorted, which was surfing.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: So I'd go surfing for half a day, and then the other half of the day, I would try and learn what it is that I who I was going to be.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: Because, you know, I was I started off school as a straight A student.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_00: I ended up failing everything because I was never there and I had a really shitty attitude.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: I was at a um um like a market near where I used to surf up in Queensland.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I'd moved up to my near my favorite surf spot in Noosa, and um I I I went to a local pottery and asked if they'd teach me how to pot messable with full, and I'm like, you don't understand.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: I I I I need to start now, you know, today.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I I you know I did because I'm a pushy bastard, and so I started doing that.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: So when I started doing that, I started to investigate, and I was a voracious reader always, and I started to investigate what this art thing was because I didn't know anything, and I certainly didn't learn anything at school because I was always looking out the window.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I'll tell you how dumb I was when I was driving to Queensland.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't know I didn't know Queensland was a state, you know.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: So I drove.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_00: So interesting.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you just kept driving.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: I thought it was a beach, you know, I thought it was a beach.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um anyway, I dropped I'm driving, I I was dumb.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_00: And uh and that's why I got in so much trouble.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: I I had I had very I had very few cognitive skills, I had no strategies, you know.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_02: I was just sort of like, yeah, let's get stoned and you know, sort of, you know, try and hang out with pretty girls and it just you were clearly lost, and but don't you think this often happens with artists who actually I mean, look at your talent, and and there's something about our system that is people are discussing now, and back then I'm sure they it was not even on the agenda that often artists or creatives are not treated with the same rigor and respect in those early school traditional environments that it's crushing.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why don't we get back to that?
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_00: Because I feel really strongly about good, so do I.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_00: So I'd love I it's imperative that we talk about.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_00: Good.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_00: Let's get back to that because that's important.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: I I I I just read everything.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_00: I just read everything.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: I was potting, I was selling my pottery at the local market and uh and going surfing, and I didn't give a damn about money.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: I I had a I had a a flat where I um I had a tin shed outside um with a kiln um in it, and I used to go surfing, I used to make pottery, then I did some work in the pottery that taught me how to make pottery and and and I used to work in there a little bit, but I wanted to work as little as possible, make art, go surfing, and that was about it.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: But then I started reading about artists and their sheer determination.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_00: I had a sheer determination to stop the noises in my head that at 60 are still well and truly there.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: I've never been able to shake them.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_00: I was living in Queensland, which, you know, at the time was all about you know blue skies and beaches and stuff like that.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_00: I wasn't in Melbourne and Sydney or Berlin, New York.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: A little bit puberty.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_02: Were you a bit puberty blues growing up?
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_02: A little bit puberty blues, yeah.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: And and so, you know, I I didn't have that, you know, that sort of hard edge, or you know, you know, I wasn't one of those artists that, you know, was portraying, you know, that I was an Enfanta Ebla, you know, that I that you know, that my work was was, you know, was full of um, you know, conceptual sort of you know, depth, you know, and and you know, I was twisting the matrix with the art, and you know, art is supposed to, you know, bend things.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's so interesting.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, like I think Nick Cave is probably one of the greatest geniuses on the planet.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_02: I would agree, I would agree with you.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_02: I would agree with you.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_00: And he's getting better and better and better and better.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: My God, he he he's a god.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, but you know, but you know, I I I had a I had a um a writer mate living around the corner, and and you know, he said it's it's actually harder to do something serious in the genre of nice, you know, or sweet.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: And I've got a lot of children and and I've seen a hell of a lot of children's films.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, only two nights ago, my seven-year-old daughter said, you know, how come I have to evade, you know, avoid the TV all the time when you're watching because it's just everyone's killing each other.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I know it's so violent.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't get it either.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm sort of like, well, you know, most that's what most entertainment is, but you know, I I I see, I think Tim Burton just did the new Dumbo.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and you know, Rango and all of those.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I can seriously watch those films 20.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, they're ingenious, they're incredible, and you know, and frozen, all of that stuff.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_00: I think I think I definitely had such a horrendous time in adolescence because because I didn't have that.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: I could have, you know, I I've got eight nice parents.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but my brain, my brain, my my brain, you know, was and still is.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, there's just so many gremlins in there, you know, like in is it is it uh chitty titty bang bang?
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's actually an Australian actor, I think, that puts those kids in the cage.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um remember that?
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I do.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's really traumatic.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know who that guy is?
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's he's an Australian actor.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it's it'll come to me.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_00: And anyway, screw it.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: I'm the I'm the I'm the I'm my brain is the bad dream sequence in Wizard of Oz, and it's like when the kids get stolen and stuff.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_00: I I I have that sort of mental illness that that means that every every time you allow it to, your brain takes you to places like, you know, you're gonna die, and this is gonna happen.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: And it's it's all of that stuff.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's just textbook anxiety, you know.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_00: You you know, you have vivid, um, you know, vivid dreams where you wake up in the morning and you're like that and stuff like that.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: I've had it since I was 14, I'm 60 now, you know, I've I've had it sort of 46 years.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_00: I certainly had, you know, some pretty weird shit going on in my head from even even younger, you know.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: And when I've when when when you know when I've been restrained in um, you know, sideboards or things like that, you know, when I come out, people say, Oh, you know, you should paint that.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: That's gonna make you seem really interesting.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm like, paint that.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: Like, no, no, I was there.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's yeah, something that I want to stand on.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_02: But you know what?
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_02: It's really interesting.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_02: A few things on that front.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_02: I was thinking as you were talking, first of all, you're not alone because the creative heart and soul can be a blessing and a curse.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: We all know that.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_02: As a creative myself, I relate to what you're saying to some degree, maybe not to the same extreme, but most of the artists that I interview, um, most have, you know, it's a double-edged sword.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_02: And the anxiety, it's a blessing and a curse.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_02: So you have the anxiety that drives the imagery.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it's it's it's it's it's a it's it's a it's a thing with a giant big stick just saying you get you cannot live a normal life.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: And each time you go to do so, you know, you get cracked on the you know, most painful part of your body, which is not your fingers and it's not your toes, it's your psyche.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that's right.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I mean, for you, you've mastered some, you've mastered some sense of all of the things you referred to.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_02: You're obviously very disciplined to do what you do.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: You couldn't possibly have to be those to beat those other things, you know.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_00: You've got to fight in fighting against them, you learn you, you know, you learn, you know, certain sort of disciplines and and stuff.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: You know, when I was a kid, we weren't allowed to have comics.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_00: Someone dropped some off at my place.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: I never I've never known who they were.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_00: But to me, you know, uh, you know, these images, these colours, you know, three different colours and black line work and stuff.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I read the things, you know, Richie Rich, Uncle Scrooge, all of those things.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_00: I read them, you know, three, four, five hundred times, um, you know, each.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_00: And the fact that the art scene hit that thing, and you know, you didn't just have to do painterly things, you know, you could do big pop heads.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you look at Arkley's work, you know, these incredibly fantastic sort of colorful suburban houses and stuff.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_00: And it's just, you know, I I just look at those paintings and and and I'm just like, yeah, you know, like, you know, turn it up, you know, turn it up.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I can just look at them and just be inspired by them.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: And it's the same as like a Liechtenstein.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, when he does one of his just those brush strokes or something, he gets down to the very, very essence of what it is that I love.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I mean, I can eat paint.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sure you could.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_02: Tell me, I want to talk to you about the okay, so you know your bare-breasted nudes and the the range that has really sold out very, you know, they're they're everywhere.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_02: People love them.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: Tell me a little bit about how they came to be.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, was that something?
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_02: Did you reference something?
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_02: Was it where where did that come from?
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: The the look, it's it's really interesting.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: And I you might be the first person to ever ask me that, I don't know.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: Which is astonishing to me because it's it's pretty obvious question.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_01: I have to, yeah.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: No, no, I think I would probably have been asked.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: Look, I I I I my father was a my this is an interesting thing.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: It's not when I talk about my wife, she was a criminal lawyer, and I just say, you know, well, you used to be a criminal lawyer.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: I thought you were set a criminal, you know, and uh and I talk about my father, and there's all these bare-rested women and stuff.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: So look, my my my my my father was was was you know was was one of the great loves of my life.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I mean he, you know, I I I I always say dad used to take us for a walk at night because he thought, you know, if you're gonna talk about what it is that you're gonna talk about, will you do that?
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_00: And so in the suburbs in Adelaide, we'd go for a walk.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, dad would do things like walk between, there is a point to this.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_00: Walk between the walk, walk between a tree and a front fence, so a spider wouldn't get us.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, what a sweet human.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_00: Handsome, like a film star, beautiful profile.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he did yoga, so he had a lovely physique, and he carried himself very well.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_00: Humble, humble, humble man, um, but a beautiful but a beautiful man.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_00: When I saw the when I saw the boy's own annuals that dad had, they just reminded me of my father.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: And my father did not seek negativity, and my father did not seek um um uh um you know, he he had such an incredibly tough upbringing that he he was he the only times we'd really ever argue in the home was when it something might come up as an argument because he had such a tough life and he was scared of it.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: He didn't, he hated confrontation and stuff, you know.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: So it was always positive, everything was positive.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: So I started painting Lee Stuartman's paintings.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_00: I had uh I had a gay art dealer in um in uh Brisbane, uh I had a gay art dealer in Sydney, I had a gay art dealer in in Adelaide.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_00: I was always that was purely accidental because you know there's a lot of gay people in the art world.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, mostly half reasonable chance that you'd end up with that.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: But I wasn't paying, I wasn't painting, you know, delicious pre-pubescent children.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: I was painting someone who could row a boat to the um to the horizon and go beyond the horizon, and the waves would be this big and you know, and they would still keep going.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: And that was like my father.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: You know, my father was one of those guys that would say, put your shoulders back, you know, you know, you should do some exercise and walk tall.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: And if you laugh, you know, the world would laugh along with you, all of those different things.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: What happened was I was somewhat pigeonholed, which I I don't give a rat's ass about being pigeonholed.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm still pigeonholed.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that I I do an incredibly diverse amount of things, you know, I make films, I I do sculpture, I you know, I I do big um, you know, architectural sort of you know, um in you know, interplays and things like that.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: And then nothing can get me away from being the sort of guy, I'm an easy target to be pigeonholed.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, I it just so happens in amongst all of this that I'm heterosexual.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it just so happens I am, and I love the female form.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I thought I would address the balance a little bit because it was leaning towards um, you know, me being considered to be a person that painted these beautiful young boys.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, there was even a time in England or something where, you know, there was something in the paper about sort of you know pedophilia or or something like that, and you know, there was a little bit of a concern about my work, and I just said, get fucked.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there do you do you mean because I've portrayed something nicely or appealing that that's I mean, that's no different than a you know, a woman's movement turning around and saying, well, you know, yeah, I'm a beautiful woman, I'm an attractive and stuff.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't mean that, you know, I I'm an object, you know.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_00: So so I thought I'd do this.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_00: Now I I'm shy as fuck.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_00: I'm really I'm not the sort of person that goes up to someone and says, Hey, can I paint you naked?
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah you know, I've been in, I've been in relationships nearly all my life.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and you know, I I I just don't want to go up to girls and say, hey, you know, can I paint you naked?
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I've always had other people ask.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: But in the first place, I I had a few people around me.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_00: One was Indira Nadu's sister, um Saraya.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: She was the first person that ever painted.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_00: Uh beautiful woman.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_00: I thought she'd make a great painting.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I had a few people around me like that.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_00: My the partner I had at the time was a model.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, she had a lot of model friends, and she would ask, or I knew them and they were mates, and I'd ask them, and or I'd ask someone else to ask them because I was too shy.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I so I started doing it.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_00: At the same time, I was getting into portraiture, and I I I I think I was painting I was painting Higo Weaving for the Archibald, and what I did is I I had all my colour form in the background, then I did my line work, and I thought, I'm not gonna colour it in.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna do the skin tones and stuff, I'm gonna have this abstract painting.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so, and that was around the same time that I was painting these girls.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, I sent uh images to my gallery to say I've been painting these nude girls, and I went, Oh, but you're the guy that paints, you know, the children and stuff, and you know, like that's what you're known for.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: And then people are gonna go, what nude women and these guys is gonna confuse them and stuff.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm sort of like, Well, confuse them, you know, like you know, it really that's That's really interesting.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, anyway, um Scott Liversy, um, who I no longer am represented by big up to him, and he loves women and loves the female form.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: He said, Let's do a show of them.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I'm like, Great, yeah, I think they're pretty good.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, it sold out.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: Every single gallery that hat was concerned about putting on the show of these because of what I used to do, found that you know they were selling well because that's what most galleries are interested in.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and the phone rang hot.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, and then everyone wanted them.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: Then my Adelaide dealer at that time, Samuel Smith, uh, he said, Well, you know, we'll do nudes on that wall and children on that wall.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_00: And no one seemed to blink an eye.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_00: No, interesting.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I think people in the art scene are so concerned by stuff that people on the street aren't.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: They go, Yeah, but what about that?
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: What about that?
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: The people on the street, they're they're not that concerned about juxtapositions of things and different stories and stuff.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_02: But also, it looked, let's I mean, if you look at Rubens and you look at the history of the arts, I mean, painting nudes is really historically not so revelatory.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, lots of there's a whole history of of that, you know.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: So don't you think though we're in sort of I mean, we're in more conservative times than the 70s.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, on the 60s.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_00: I had a time, I think it was in New Zealand, where there was some concern about them you know being on the wall.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, I said I think we live in phenomenally conservative times, which is based on fear.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_02: And also your favorite book that you'd like to recommend to our listeners.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_02: You can have two if you want two, because you're such a music man.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_02: I had to give you two.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_00: I think uh Lust for Life by Iggy Pop is just is just I just love that man so much.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_00: Uh he's got to get tabooed on me as well.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so we've got Iggy Pop.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and um, you know, I I I'm I'm an I'm an incredible romantic.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I loved Romeo and Juliet and stuff, so I'd have to say the stones, let's spend the night together.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_00: No, um yeah, it just it it it just it just drives itself.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: And a book book.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_00: Look, I'd have to say I'd I'd have to there's a whole bunch of them all into one.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: Look, I'm gonna have to sneak to Lust for Life is is just a pure joy.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I and I and I think I think the I think the biography on Ray Charles, I love the uncompromisingness, you know, when he came off Smack, he he he he apologized that it wasn't that hard for him, and I love it when people do that.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_00: You know, people are supposed to say, and that's why I didn't paint about you know the horrific you know challenges I've had with mental illness.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'll talk about it.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, when he came off Smack, he said, you know, like it wasn't that hard.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I hate to say it, I'm glad I'm off it, but it wasn't that hard.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas normally in that bit of the story, it's when, and you know, when you read about Keith Richardson's stuff, look, he's somewhat dissimilar, you know, there's an unapologetic sense about him.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I I thought Ray Charles had a, you know, a tremendous, a tremendous um lust for life, a way of going about things.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I love the way he says, you know, if I wasn't Ray Charles, the famous Ray Charles, I'd still be in the room banging away, you know, um, you know, painting.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: And I know when I first started painting and potting, I mean, I was just happy enough to get more paint, you know, and keep going.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_00: And and I know I've had, you know, certain commercial successes and and and stuff, but you know, maybe that's the way, maybe that's the way to do it.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_00: You know, just be so freaking pig headed about what it is that you do.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_00: Just, you know, no one, just letting no one derail you, you know, um, you know, and going forward and just pushing it, you know.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_00: People talk about success or how can you be successful and stuff.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think you've got to go into it thinking that there's every good chance you're gonna fail.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_02: So do you think art's changed through this COVID time?
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_02: How's it affected you?
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_02: Has it impacted you as an artist?
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_00: Look, I'm I'm I I about 11 or 12 years ago, I predominantly moved away from the commercial um gallery scene because I didn't like it.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um I I I I I'm very lucky.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_00: I've got stunning galleries in Singapore and Japan and England and um Africa and China and um, you know, America and stuff.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_00: So they don't have to put up with me, you know, they don't have to put up with me because I'm the way over here.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_00: So I can play pretty much any game I want here.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_00: You know, people say, oh yeah, but you do this, or you know, I've seen your work on eBay, and I'm like, well, I don't see myself on eBay, but other people collect my work and they put it on eBay, but you shouldn't do this and you shouldn't do that.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm just like, look, all rules are off.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, I don't I don't want to be in the commercial gallery um system.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: I'm in it a little bit because some people just know now I'm getting older, you know, they don't want the sole representation or anything like that because, you know, I'm not some kid that they want to hang hang on to and you know have all the rights to for the next 10, you know, 20 years because I'm older now and you know I've broken most rules anyway, and they either don't want me, they know that I do my own thing, I've got my own spaces, I've got my own galleries, I've got my own.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: And and why do I do that?
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_00: Is it a commercial thing?
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just a freedom junkie, you know.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_00: No, I get it, and I love it because it allows you to do when I want to do it, and also too, I think there's um I think there is a much bigger art audience outside of the standard gallery system, which tends to draw a certain amount of art literate people, whereas a lot of a lot of non-art literate people or people portrayed as non-art literate by a lot of commercial gallery situations actually are more art literate than they might they may not know the art cogniciante vocabulary.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't matter though, interesting.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_00: It speaks to them they like or you know, and and so how am I going through COVID and stuff?
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you know, I look, I I don't I I've been, you know, I I've I've been dumped by loved ones, I've I've had sell-out shows, I've had shows that haven't sold um that well.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_00: I've been deemed to be someone of a great success.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_00: I've been deemed as a failure, I've had some tremendous wins, I've had some tremendous losses, I've had times of happiness, I've had time look, I I I I I am so I am so I am so made to go through shit.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I and I'll just turn shit into clay and you know, make lemonade out of lemons and stuff.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_00: Some of the worst times in my life have been when I've been highly commercially successful.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's been some of the loneliest, um, the loneliest, meaning, most meaningless times.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_00: And then the shit goes down and everything's really tough, and you have to use every morsel, every cell to be creative and to work out well, how you're gonna get through and how you're gonna push and stuff.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: And I love getting my hands dirty.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_00: And so when it's dark and things are different, and and you know, I I I also too, I mean, I've got a partner who, you know, I'd I'd I'd live in a tent with.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_02: I was about to ask you about Yu Gi because you know, you guys live together, work together, and we'll talk about briefly fatherhood, but let's just talk about Yugi and your chemistry.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_02: You two seem to juggle really well.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_02: Family work.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_02: You both come from different worlds, but yet you found a way to share something special.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_02: So talk to me a little bit about your relationship, how that because you you're more of a monogamist, as you say.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_02: You weren't, you know, it it's really it's about having the one and only and ideally for you.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_02: So talk to me about what how that works for you.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_00: I'd had attricty, I'd had three long-term um relationships predominantly.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, I mean, as a kid, you know, I mean, I had three girlfriends in grade one.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_00: So you know, I you know, I had some girl come in the shop once and she said, You're the first person I ever kiss.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_00: She said, I was the first person that she ever kissed.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: I said, What grade was that?
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_00: He said, Oh, I think it was like the first year of high school.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I said, Well, it can't be because I kissed my next door neighbor when I was in grade one.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, when I was older, you know, three long-term relationships by the time I was 50, you know, probably in my first relationship, I was a loser.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_00: In my second relationship, I started making art, and sometimes I was a loser and sometimes I was successful.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_00: In my third relationship, I was reasonably successful.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, I couldn't put it down to, you know, well, you're the guy that sits on the couch with a bond, so you're no good and someone's gonna leave you, or you know, you show some promise.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_00: I I don't, I don't, I don't think I'm necessarily in the past.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think I'm really that good at relationships because I I am my oh it's funny, we can't walk the past now.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um you know, I I I I look, I'm an open book, I don't play games, I don't, I don't, I don't try and seduce my partner with I don't know, I I'm a I'm a pretty straight up sort of guy.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um I I I I would like to think that I put people you know who are close around me certainly on par with my art.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_00: Some people say, well, your art comes first, not for me.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not I if I've got if I've got a great career and I'm successful, you know, and I don't have someone you know who loves me and to to love well, I I just can't see the point, you know, of it.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_00: So I love to share it.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um I was before I met Yugi, which was um 10 years ago, um I I used to sit in my backyard.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um I I'm I'm on reasonable anxiety medication, uh, and I would take more of it than I should drink beer, smoke cigarettes, lie in the backyard, look at the clouds and say, I'm okay, I'm an okay sort of guy.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um I'm I'm you know, I've seen worse guys and they're in relationships.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I just it's not your time, dude.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_00: It is not your time.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and and what's gonna happen is someone's gonna be interested in you, and then they're gonna go, wow, you know, he's an artist and he's reasonably well known, and wow, he's interesting.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_00: And then two months later or something, I'm gonna get on their nerves and suddenly I'm not as interesting.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_00: Then then they'll probably start telling me what to do.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_00: Then they'll find me not exciting or not, I don't know.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_00: It just and and fuck you're alone again.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yiggi's Yiggy's uh we've tried to work it out because she's she's she's two decades and a bit more younger than me.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, uh um high academic um achiever, um, you know, super, super nerd.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_00: Super, she is the quintessential super Asian nerd, you know, backpack on her back so big, you know, she'd had a she left school when she was 16 to go into university.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_00: She was ducks of the whole school by the time she was 16.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: So as a young kid, she went to university, she did business, she did law, she did masters of law, and she was still too young to practice as a law uh as a lawyer.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_00: So super smart.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_00: But but her boyfriends would have painted fingernails and be in bands and and stuff like that.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_00: And she's got um inside her, you know, like I think a lot of smart people, you know, tremendous way of seeing things and seeing the world and stuff.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_00: And she came out of a relationship or a string of relationships.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_00: I say she's the runaway bride because she was engaged a lot of times, and I think uh she'd had a previously tough time um with her with her self-esteem and stuff, and she's met some older guy who just happened to have it.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_00: We've got everything in common.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_00: We're both obsessed with music.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think we love a counterculture.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I think we're both super nerds and love watching every documentary.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we both don't know how to go to sleep.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so we start till two or three o'clock, you know, every morning.
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_00: We both need to do three things at once.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_00: So if I'm working, I need to be watching TV and listening to the radio and reading magazines.
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_00: So we do that the same.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I think we're both hopeless romantics.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um I felt at 50 years old that I wouldn't have the chance to find, you know, the love of my life.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm as well behaved as I possibly can be.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_00: He said to me at times, if you do that, you won't hurt them, or you won't get back at them, or you won't you'll mess up my day.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm a lot more, I'm I I'm a little bit like rake.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I'll have an argument about pushing the button at the thing, and I'm just not like that as much these days.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_00: And you'll say to me, you know, Jesus, you've mellowed.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_00: Mellowed.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the German expressionists used to say, they used to say, moderation in everything but art.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I'm a big believer in pushing.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_00: When Yugi and I first met, her being a lawyer was very much like, you know, yeah, but David, have you thought about this and what the consequences may be?
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, well, no, because I want to do it.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_00: And she's there, yeah, but the consequences may this.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, I'm married to a lawyer.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_02: I am married to a lawyer, and I am telling you, it has the same discussion.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like, it's so funny to do that.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I say to her, I don't care what the devil's advocate says.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_00: I want to know what I say.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_00: I swear I say the same thing.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_00: I want to know what you think.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, same.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_00: Very interesting.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_00: And occasionally she said, Look, I'm more conservative with you.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, I've seen pictures of your boyfriends.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_00: They all look like girls, you know, they're, you know, like poor Liggy's mum when she, you know, saw a photo of me.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_00: I used to wear a lot of rings and a lot of bracelets.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_00: And and and I always had a beer in one hand and a cigarette, you know, in the in in in the other.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, she said, you know, first of all, she said, Well, how old is he?
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and she said, has he got any tattoos on his face?
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, and um, is that like a decayed front tooth?
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, no, she's like, no, it's gold, actually.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_00: And she said, why does he wear so many rings?
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, well, that's pretty good, because I've also got children and blah blah blah.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_00: Well, speaking to that, David, yeah, very quickly, in regards to our longevity, she's loyal, she will go on a process with me, and if I fuck up, she'll still back, she'll still back me.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm more likely to listen to her than someone that only digs you if you've won.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_00: She digs me whether I win or lose.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_00: She'd prefer to win because she's a determined person.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_00: But no, she's she's she's on the journey with you no matter what.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_00: I am terrified to think of what would have happened if I hadn't met her.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_02: What a beautiful tribute.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_02: Really special, a really good insight into you and Yugi and your children.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_02: Now, fatherhood.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_02: Now you've got older children and you've got younger children.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_02: So tell me a bit about that journey.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_02: And we touched on earlier in the interview about education, enculturation, artists, being creative, and what we want for our kids.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_02: Talk to me a little bit about fatherhood and how you've grown.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_00: I I had my first um I had my first um child um when I was something like 21 or something.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_00: So I think he's 39 or something like that, though, a boy.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um he's very much like I was when I was younger.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_00: So we I don't I don't I don't I don't have a lot of tolerance for the person I was when I was younger.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um and uh we have our problems um because of that, because he's that person that I hear he's he knows he is too.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um it's a it's it it's it's very it's very problematic.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_00: I don't talk about my past and my children and my exes um very much because I am 100% certain that there are in certain things is a truth.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_00: When it comes to relationship, there's no particular truth.
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_00: Two people can be wrong, you know.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm gonna write that.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_00: I had some good times, um, some very good times, some charming times, uh a lot of pain.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um and uh I'm very, very pleased that it's that it's that it's um that it's led to Yugi.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um because my because my um in my first relationship, um I, you know, I had a child that I was estranged from from a long time and then got together and then estranged from, and it's a challenging one.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_00: In the second relationship, I didn't want to go there because my heart was broken because of that particular thing.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_00: In my third relationship, um, I was probably in some ways somewhat similar, and then my brother died way too young.
• 41:37
  SPEAKER_00: And amongst a lot of things, I certainly thought that I was being, you know, a precious dickhead in regards to planning, you know, things.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_00: And people could say, but you were so reckless when you were younger.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_00: There are plenty of people who are reckless, but they're still conservative in their thinking, often quite conservative in their in their thinking.
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_00: My my my my brother was like 10 people.
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_00: My brother was just just the most amazing human.
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_00: He could do anything, and he was always going to be the last one to die.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_00: Always, because he smashed so many motorcycles, he fell off things, he had scars all over him.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_00: He was he was he was wild.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_00: I said him riding, you know, motorbikes.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I used to be on the back of them when I was younger, and he did everything like that.
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_00: You know, first time he went hand gliding, he just grabbed a hand glider and jumped off a cliff.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_00: I'm serious.
• 42:39
  SPEAKER_00: The guy was just a wild man and and loved partying and loved carrying on and always put himself in difficult situations.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_00: And anyway, one of them was the end um, you know, of him.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I cried a million tears and I missed him so much.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I was lonely because he was my only sibling.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, I felt like I had 10 brothers and sisters because he was just that full of life, you know.
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_00: He'd say to me, because I I I I hate so many constructs like Christmas and birthdays and things like that.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they just bore me, and you know, I just think every day should be like it, you know.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_00: And my brother would say, Well, I'll have it at my place.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_00: And he and his wife were good cooks.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_00: I go, Yeah, fantastic.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_00: And he said, I'm gonna greet everyone, nude with a big joint in my hand.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_00: I said, I'm still not coming, I'm still not coming.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_00: He goes, after all that, it's a bit unfair.
• 43:34
  SPEAKER_00: So I said, Yeah, okay, I'm coming.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_00: And you know the thing about my brother is he'd do it, you know.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_02: So you were close, you were super close, which shows to me.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_00: No, this is the interesting thing.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_00: I don't keep friends very well, you know.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm an argumentative person.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, but I'd say, I'd say the reason me and my brother were so fantastic is we punched each other's heads and we we loved.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: Each other, we got drunk together, we fell over together, you know, he stole my motorbike, he he smashed my car, he he, you know, I you know, I he's older than me and stronger than me, but I knew that, so I always went in hard and he's got scars on his head from punch-ups together and stuff.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_00: You know, my father, the only thing he ever wanted was just a bit of peace and harmony because he had a very tough, you know, upbringing.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_00: And at one of Dad's birthdays, Paul and I cleared the restaurant.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we were punching each other over tables and then it went out into the car park.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, everyone at dad's birthday left, and everyone in the restaurant left.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: You know, these two incredibly selfish young men, you know, like he had that happy birthday.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, Paul and I have a big punch up and disagree and and stuff like that.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_00: But that's why he was so important to me in my life.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you know, he'd he'd I'd dare him to go and climb the ladder up to the treehouse in the nude before work.
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he'd do it.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I called out to the next door neighbor, and the next door neighbor came out.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_00: So I would walk to school.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_00: We didn't really have a school uniform, you know, went to some crappy school nearby where, you know, if if something had some grey in it, it was enough.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_00: And my brother was on the veranda and he'd mixed muddy water in a bucket and he threw it all over me.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_00: So it's going, you know, and got it.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: Talk about how's this hit big holes in the back garden and fill them full of glass and put tops over them and then asked me to chase him and he'd run and jump and I'd fall in the hole and stuff.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_00: It was beautiful and magnificent, and I miss him every single day.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_00: You know, how long has he passed?
• 45:47
  SPEAKER_02: How long?
• 45:47
  SPEAKER_02: When did he pass?
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think he was 43 and he'd be 63 now, so 20 years ago.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_00: That's incredible.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I think of him every day, but but I said that I would live his life for him as well.
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_00: And he he's a wild man, so I I I I'm tired a lot and I really push, but in regards to like in regards to having children, you know, my like most things, I use the S word a lot.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, and so I already had four children when I met Yugi.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I I I have a remarkable um relationship with my with the mother of um with my last three children.
• 46:29
  SPEAKER_00: We're very close friends, and she is very close friends with Yugi, my partner now.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_00: And uh which is really great for the kids.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I and I have a daughter, Holly, who's 15, uh 17, a son, beautiful, beautiful, long-haired, handsome, interesting, gigantic boys tall as me at 14, um, hair halfway down his back, just the most beautiful boy, Willem.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_00: And then I have this sort of unique 11-year-old who's um thinks he can do anything, and he's powerful and and gentle all at the time.
• 47:07
  SPEAKER_00: And with Yugi, I have um I have uh Wen who's seven, Be who's four, and then I've got a little baby, um Juman, um, who's after Yugi's dad, who I love.
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_00: I love Yugi's dad very, very much.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_00: Juman, so you call him Zumin Sr.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_00: And Jim and Jr.
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_02: So you have five all up, five kids.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_02: Seven all up.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_02: Seven.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_02: Seven kids all up.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I'll tell you what, that in itself is just a blessing.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_02: So many elements of success, but I love your rawness, your honesty, and thank you so much for coming on the What I've Learned Podcast.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_02: You've been an absolute gem to interview, and I look forward to seeing what's next for David Bromley.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_02: Have a great day.
• 47:51
  SPEAKER_02: You too.
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks so much for listening.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_02: The What I've Learned podcast will now be coming to you weekly with new episodes released every Tuesday.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_02: I'm blessed to have so many wonderful guests coming on the show.
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_02: So check out my What I've Learned Instagram for updates.
• 48:10
  SPEAKER_02: Meanwhile, stay tuned, kind, and curious.
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_02: Love you.