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Redefining Excellence for Disaffected Children · Mental Health Matters

• 0:03
  SPEAKER_04: Hello and welcome to Mental Health Matters with me, Dr.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_04: Audrey Tang.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_04: And me, Judith Crozier.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_04: This is the show where we talk about all things mental health and well-being, but we bring in the experts.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_04: We don't have the quick fixes or the hot takes.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_04: We talk about real life work that's going on right now and real life examples, but also everything is rooted in theory.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_04: And today we're talking about young people with a diagnosis.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_04: Now, this is happening a lot more often.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_04: A lot of people are being diagnosed.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_04: Whether that's a good thing or not is debatable.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_04: What are your thoughts?
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_06: Um a diagnosis of could be anything.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_04: Autism, ADHD, or any other diagnosis that young people are getting, but those two are the most common ones.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_06: So yeah, they are the most common ones.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_06: So it's I think it's a double-edged sword, isn't it?
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_06: Um it's a really difficult one, and whichever way you look at it is right.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_06: Um I mean, I've got a family member who's recently diagnosed with ADHD, and for her it was it w she I thought she'd get the get the diagnosis and be extremely relieved and I think she was like, No, I already knew I was, I just want the medication, thanks.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_06: So now I can um live my life properly.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_06: And manage it, yeah.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_06: So for that reason it's it's a really good thing.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_06: Um she didn't go private, so she knows that it takes forever.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_06: It it yeah, it takes forever.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_06: Anyway, it did take forever, but she's she's got that now.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_06: And there are so many young people with autism and ADHD, and you've got to think, why wasn't it diagnosed before?
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_06: Why didn't we know about it before?
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_04: Or is it being over-diagnosed now?
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_06: Or exactly, and that's the other question, or is it being overdiagnosed now?
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_06: So yeah.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_06: There's issues with tests.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_04: Um because I think one of the issues with over-diagnosis is then everyone almost gets your bog standard one size fits all treatment as well, which doesn't work either, because everyone is on a different part of that spectrum, and what works for one isn't necessarily going to work for the other.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_04: And that's what today is going to be about.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_04: Um we're we're meeting with the founder of Redefining Excellence, and he will be talking about how he works with young people when they have a diagnosis, what it means for them, and how they can use that diagnosis to manage and to navigate life better.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_04: A diagnosis, and this is something I do get on a bit of a soapbox about therapy, diagnoses, none of that was ever there to tell you that you couldn't do something.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_04: It was to give an explanation as to why those things may be more difficult for you, but it's not there to say you can't.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_04: Therapy is there in actual fact to say that you can and this is how, and maybe it's going to be harder to navigate.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_04: And so, my concern with diagnoses, as always, is if you're using it as a reason to say no to life, that's that's a problem.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_04: So we'll get into that conversation when Rex comes.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_06: Welcome, Rex, it's brilliant to have you with us.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_04: Thank you, it's a pleasure to be here today.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_06: Oh, I'm looking forward to this.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and and you notice straight away the vibe.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, you are just so you've got lovely energy.
• 3:21
  unknown: You really have.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: When you work with kids, then you can't afford not to have the energy.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_02: That is you've got to bring your game on from the very second you engage them.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_02: And it's a big thing about life.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it is true.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_04: It is true.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_04: Although it's like teachers at the start of the year are like, yes, yes, yeah, and by the end of the year, we're not just done.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think I think everyone feels that whole pain.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um, teaching is almost like working in within the NHS.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, and you've done both.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_06: That is true.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_02: Have you?
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, you've done both.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_02: Very chaotic, yeah, uh, very systematic, but incredibly rewarding.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, yes.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_02: That is how I could uh explain that.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um, because when you go into because very often you find people say, Oh, the system is fractured, the system doesn't work.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_02: Of course it works.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_02: Um we as adults and as professionals, we make um a decision of what we're gonna do in life, what that pathway would look like, and then we engage it.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_02: We then get engaged in that pathway, and then sometimes we're not as prepared for the chaotic manner of the job, which means you work harder on yourself than the job in itself, which prepares you for the overall job in itself.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_02: That's true, actually.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_04: That is what we want to get into.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_06: Yes, looking forward to it.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_06: So, can you tell us a little about redefining excellence and the work that you do then?
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, redefining excellence.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_02: So, redefining excellence was uh branded by the parents and the child.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_02: So um obviously it's redefining as an R and then the EX excellence in itself, and over the over the years in itself, I decided I've got three children by the way, um, all young adults now.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_02: Um 29 young girl, um 23 boy, and then the last one who is second year, finished completed second year university, um, he's 20 years old.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_02: And that is how this pathway started, i.e., the fact that I had kids who did not enjoy education.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, yeah.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and as an born British, hackney, eastern boy in itself, raised in Africa, went through the education system in Africa, Nigeria specifically.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_02: Shout out to my Nigerians, uh came back to the UK, um, started this whole pathway in life, and then having children, and it was always very, very tough.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I'm also a black belting karate uh martial arts.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so within that sphere in itself is all about cooperation, discipline, and respect, correct?
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_02: So, over that time in itself, I get to meet a lot of people, and during that time they'll say, You do great in schools, you do an amazing job at in schools.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_02: And then one day, which was prior to COVID, um, a very dear friend of mine says, Do it, and at that point I did.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_05: Wow.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_02: So I went originally as a cover supervisor, and okay, as you would all know, yeah, cover supervisors, um, the very minute they come in, you could almost say, and and this is not me just hating on cover supervisors, but you could almost say they sit down there doing nothing.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_02: So for parents in itself, when you often um you come home, you ask your child, what did you do?
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_02: How did this go?
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_02: What do they say?
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_05: Nothing.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't do anything, didn't do anything, and then oh, we had a cover supervisor.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_02: Now, no parent understands the whole rigmarole of schooling until you're within the heart of it.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_02: So almost again, and I make that parallel with the NHS.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_02: You have no clue how this works, this whole system of education works, until you're within the crux of it.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, very true.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm in this school for the very first time, ushered in, and a script is giving um uh a page is given to me, these are the classes you're covering, etc.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_02: etc.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: It was incredibly chaotic.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_02: And the disrespect amongst pupils and kids and what they exhibit, right?
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_02: You can't make this up.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_02: My first day was my first reality into saying how do I fix this?
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_02: Because every time I engaged these kids, I saw my children.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_02: And within that, I would usually go home and then question my kids and say, Do you do this?
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_02: Do you do that?
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_02: Do you do this?
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_02: And that was when I got the reality check.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_02: And my son telling me the real reasons and how he behaved.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_05: My heart sunk.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_02: So, to that fact in itself, COVID came about.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_02: A kid coughed in my face, then told me he had given me uh COVID.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_02: And if you can imagine that, exactly what they did.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_02: He did, he coughed in my face, um, told me he had given me COVID, and that was it.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_02: From a very, very fit, strong, tall man who's practiced martial arts and never understood what headaches feel like.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_02: Oh no.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_02: To now having migraines and everything else, and uh what do they call it?
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_02: Post-COVID and long COVID, um, to then making a decision on taking cold baths and breathing exercise.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_02: Wim Hof, shout out to Wim Hof, um, to then reversing all of that, um, and then making a decision.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna look for a solution to engage young kids in schools.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_04: Wow.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_02: So I went from that to eventually then um making this um big turnaround where I was celebrated in schools like a celebrity, getting head teachers, senior leadership team members coming into the classrooms and asking, is there an exam in the class?
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_02: To me, going, no, no, no, they're just doing their work.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_02: So I changed and redefined what excellent means in a cover supervisor, to then coming up with a model that would work because what we do have today, after COVID, it exposed parenting skills like no other.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, not only that in itself, it challenged the school system much more.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_02: So school refusal is on a high, um, truancy within schools is on a high, and then uh diagnosis within ADHD, ASD is on a high.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_02: Um, for the sake of just this being a basic interview or uh um meeting, um we've now got disruption within schools and in classes like we've ever had before.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_02: And my big shout out to LSAs, like they're the crux of schools, like you can't speak more highly of LSAs.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_02: Now, to redefine excellence, and this is how this came about, a parent um over time literally, and this is me doing my ADHD scattered brain, go back and forth.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_02: So please forgive me.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_02: Um, a parent um said they were in a meeting and then they were complaining about kids and they had no solution.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_02: So, being that I had worked with her son um at age five and changed everything about what he did.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_02: She then asked the question to this body of local authority, how about Rex?
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_02: And then they said, Who is Rex?
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then she went, It's this crazy amazing guy that does crazy amazing stuff, and then at that point in itself, welcomed me in for a meeting, to which we then can talk about uh a case study of a one kid who literally was at risk of permanent exclusion, um, never went to school, year eight, and was suspended for the most year in itself.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_02: And when they brought me in, they often said, Well, Rex, you're gonna meet the kid today, and we're gonna try and see what you could do about this kid.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_02: But every time I was meant to meet this kid, at the gate he got suspended again, so I never got to see him, right?
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_02: So at this point, I then thought, right, what do we do differently, right?
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_02: Because when people are locked within this whole rot of doing policy and doing policy that does not work with the child, right?
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_02: And then saying that the blame is on the parent.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_02: And shout out to you parents who do a crazy amazing work, it's not your fault, right?
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and then back and forth.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_02: I decided that I'll do something quite different.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_02: So um, out of the cough, I bought a huge birthday cake.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_02: It was lovely.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_02: I knew it was tasty too.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_02: So every time the parent and the child will come to school, right, they knew what the expectations were.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_02: Is that they will come, they get confronted, they get labeled, they get stereotyped, and then they fed into that and they would walk all the way back again.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, right?
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_02: So I stopped that bleed, and the way I did it, I came with balloons, I came with a cake, and I presented it to them.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_02: So as they walked in with this young boy, knowing fully well that he was gonna go back home, he was greeted with celebration.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_02: And to that degree in itself, he said, It's not my birthday.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_02: I said, No, it's not, but we're here to celebrate you back into school.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_02: He then asked the big question, can I have my friends eat this cake with me?
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_02: I said, Absolutely.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: For a kid who had permanently gotten suspended on a regular basis, how long do you think?
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_02: Let's guess.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_02: How long do you think he stayed in school for?
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_06: From that day.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: From that day, yes.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_02: Well, quite possibly to the end of the term.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_06: Well, exactly, yeah.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_02: And guess what time it took for him to not be there?
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_02: When I was not available.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_06: Oh so he would only come in when you were there?
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_06: No.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_02: No, no, as soon as I left, yeah, he was suspended.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_06: That's yes what I mean.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_02: So this is what I'm now gonna say.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_02: To that degree in itself, what I do is simple.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_02: And to senior leadership team members, to schools, um, to organizations, I would say if there's anything you get to remember about what I'm gonna say, this would be it.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_02: One forgive, forgive fast.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: Two, be a dealer of hope.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_02: Three, don't take the job too seriously.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_02: I know these children will present something that is very complex, and there are many variables that make for those complexities in itself.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_02: So if you can imagine, at this point in itself, this was a child who had complex needs, which is social economic needs, right?
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_02: And based on these, present different challenges, i.e., dad is not available or not around, um, mom is a uh single uh parent having to do a tedious job.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_02: Listen, again, shout out to moms, you're amazing.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_02: And then misinformation between senior leadership team members, frustrations of that, and then how they can work collaboratively uh collaboratively together to making sure that the child is placed within the center of each provision.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_02: And that is what I do generally.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry, have I have I have I gone into a No, no, no, no.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_04: I think that's that's a really actually elegant solution to a very complex problem, and it would be lovely to see more schools working with what you do in order to address some of the habits that I think schools have got into because I think it's very easy to get there.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_04: But we will keep you, Rex.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_04: We're gonna come back um after a clip from one of our previous guest experts.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes what looks like a lack of discipline is actually a coping strategy.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: Late-life snacking, emotional eating, cravings uh that feel out of control.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's easy to label these as bad habits, but often they're your nervous system trying to regulate something.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: Stress, loneliness, boredom, even old emotional wounds.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: Because food doesn't just give us energy, it gives us comfort, familiarity, relief.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: So instead of asking, what's wrong with me, try asking, what am I needing right now?
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_00: That question changes everything because when you meet the need behind the behavior, you no longer have to fight the behavior itself.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_00: So the takeaway is this: be curious before you're critical.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: Because sometimes the habit you're trying to break is actually trying to help you.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_06: Um, and we're thinking about young people's involvement with with gangs, which obviously is something that's happening more and more.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_06: Um, what do you think might be behind this and what can adults do um to intervene without pushing the child away?
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_02: This is a tough one because again, most of the challenges that arise here um are complex in two phases.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: One, the parent, two, the child, and dare I say, three, the professional.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_02: Um I usually say um within the school system in itself, we often say that kids do not like school.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and there's so much to enjoy about school because within the school environment in itself, there's a whole populace of kids that just interact together, etc.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_02: Then you've got the parent, right?
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_02: And then you've got the adult or the professional.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_02: So I would speak on diagnosis and on diagnosis.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_02: So you it's clear to see a kid that is diagnosed with ADHD or ASD.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_02: Social demographics doesn't help because their trigger and their response, impulse control, is to always look for the excitable kid around them.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_02: But they're equally vulnerable, aren't they?
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_02: Because they're vulnerable too and susceptible to uh poor uh triggers of what people tend to present, and they'll go, I like this, I enjoy this because dopamine levels like I need more, I need more, I need more.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_02: Then it's easy to point at them, but then you equally have the parent who's often I undiagnosed with conditions too.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_03: That is also true.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_02: So we're now looking at absolutely uh parenting skills and how they were parented when they were young.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_02: Tough hand, tough love, and they're like, I didn't enjoy the feeling of that.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_02: So the reason they've never enjoyed that feeling is because there's this thing called uh masking and uh rejection sensitivity.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_02: So they say I will treat my child differently and not be as strict by not allowing them to be strict, yeah.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_02: Um, then the child becomes comfortable, and maybe, dare I say, apologies entitled.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_02: They want everything, and social media has not worked and not helped whatsoever, has it?
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_02: Um, to that degree, um you then have also again them going into an environment, let's say schooling environment, with teachers, professionals who are undiagnosed, ADHD, ASD, dyslexia, you name it, dyskerculia, but now we then have to put everything under an umbrella, and I call it masking.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, the professionals mask, the parent mask, the child in the middle expresses a feeling.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_02: So, where you then have social demographics whereby social media has now suggested to everybody what is possible and what is available the games, the scooters, um, the kind of music, the highlights.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't want to mention this guy's name, so I won't mention his name, but there's a gentleman who literally came up, and everybody hated him because he just brought in this whole energy.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_02: He did help to a degree a certain level of people by making them wealthy, but it was the wrong tone.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_02: And when we're redefining what excellence looks like, what good looks like, he was not good whatsoever.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_02: But where professionals and parents had let each other's down is that they did not have the influence to be able to influence children and say, This is what good looks like.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_02: So children then looked outwardly, and this is where the gang culture comes into play.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_02: So they looked outwardly and said, Well, I don't like you.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_02: You go to work, you work so hard, you don't put, you're you're not, you don't care about us, and we all know what love looks like is when you're present and when when you've got time for children.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_02: And these were the these are the challenges, especially after COVID.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because kids then got into this thing called social media, um, and social media became weaponized against schools.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if you remember, after COVID in itself, there were kids, uh, schools that were rioting because they wanted their phones back.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, you're right.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_02: And it went from school to school to school to school.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_02: In this day um age, where you've now got kids who's saying we can have everything and anything without going um uh considering education, not getting your math, not getting your English, not getting your sciences and itself.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_02: I could become a bricklayer, and then parents who've not got a philosophy of education, this is where the gang culture comes in because they become predators to children who now become at risk of exploitation based on their condition.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_02: So learning difficulties, an inability um um ASD, um where they seek friendships keenly, yeah, they they lack social skills, so that's Become our biggest problem.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I've got great solutions because my solutions tend to be touch wood, 99.9% success.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_06: Okay.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_02: Which is hard to say or tough for people to hear.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_02: And the reason I give that 0.1% is for the lack of cooperation.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_06: Okay.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_06: By schools and parents or by professionals.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_06: Okay.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_02: Because I'm not a teacher.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not a teacher.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: I've not got the experiences in schools to which they say I do not understand what schooling or teaching is all about.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_06: Well, you don't need a qualification to have the experience then.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_02: However, I feel their pain.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_02: Because if somebody as an outlier comes into their environment and is able to get a child, and I'm not saying this to boast, a child for a whole year.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, let me give this one.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_02: A kid was introduced to me.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_02: Refusal, school refusal, um, truancy within school, breaking stuff, running around, you name it, right?
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_02: Would not engage in academics from year from kindergarten, to be honest with you, up to year five.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: I get in, I look at him the first day, and remove all social media.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_02: Here's a nice book, uh, The Next Generation.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_02: I can't remember the title of the name, but I'll get it up, give it to you so you could have a post that.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and it talks about the influence of social media in children.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_02: Took away his social media, worked strongly with parents, taught them skills on how to deal with removal of all these devices, Fortnite.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_02: Um, there's another one, I can't quite remember it now.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_02: Um, where they swear a lot, curse a lot, and everything else.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_02: All removed.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_02: He was meant to be pushed into an alternative provision or a specialist provision based on his behavior.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_02: His behavior on a scale of one to ten was a 20.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_02: In one week, got him engaged back into school, took him off a part-time table.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_02: Within the first month, he was in school full-time.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_02: And within year six, going into year seven, he's now in a almost grammar school.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_02: Let's use the let's call the school Cooper's.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_04: What did you do?
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_04: How did you get rid of that social media?
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_04: Because that's the question people are asking.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's almost like when someone is hooked on um drugs, right?
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_02: And the withdrawal symptoms.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_02: It takes a lot of painstaking collaboration with parents.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, the key does not lie with the schools, and this is what I often do with schools.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_02: I say to you, if you cooperate with policies, right, because that is easily triggered.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_02: You could take a child and say, Hey, he's broken this policy, we're gonna suspend.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_02: Well, he wants to be suspended, right?
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: He wants to stay at home.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_02: You're giving him the candy he needs, right?
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_02: So if we could just take that ownership away from you for a minute, give that back to the parents, work with the parents, support the parents, not just trigger.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_02: I understand disclosure and everything else.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_02: But if you work intelligently with the parent and not threaten them with social services, which often is the case, because when you do that, parents say, I'm not gonna do anything now, right?
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just gonna allow the child to do whatever they need to do.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_02: So that way I don't get into trouble.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_02: So, what I do is basically empower the parent, empower the school to empower the parent, put ownership of consequences on the parent because they're brilliant at it.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I keep saying it, parents are crazy amazing at doing it.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_04: So, actually, a lot of your work is with the parents, correct, and actually where you need the schools to buy into that is where they can recognize that it needs to be the collaboration with the parents.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_04: So, in in a modern-day example, you've got the government coming in saying we will ban social media in schools.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_04: Correct.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_04: Actually, all that's needed is a school and parents working together, openly, not masking, not trying to fall within the system, and seeing what can be done to stop that child going on social media.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_02: So, so this is it.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_02: You've got the so-called code of practice, right?
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_02: That says every child deserves an education and the right corrective one in itself, right, with the right provision, etc.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_02: Then you've got the Family Act 1400, right?
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_02: That suggests that all parties, including per or inclusive of parents, should be given the right of voice to which the right provision can be applied, right?
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_02: So the process is simple.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry, I'm waffling, right?
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_02: But let me just just bear with me a minute.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_02: So, what you do have is simply this.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_02: We see a child who is who's presenting a certain behavior, it's uncommonly, and we need to fix it, right?
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_02: So teachers do this crazy amazing job of saying we've got concerns, an assessment is made, right?
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_02: And then um maybe a psychological evaluation is had, and then we say, Yep, he's got dyskusculea, uh dyspraxia, uh ADHD, ASD.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_02: During this whole big document of a psychological evaluation, maybe that assessment is gone through and say, Yep, he's got an EHCP, right?
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_02: Once you've gotten that EHCP, that is the beginning.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_02: That EHCP, section F, B and F.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_02: So B explains, F says this is what we need to do to fix it.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_02: Simple as that.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_02: So this is a law document.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_02: So basically, it's law abiding.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_02: The school has to do this.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_02: What I normally push for is the voice of the child.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's in section A2, which often needs to be updated on a regular basis.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_02: That is where the problem begins.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_02: Because it needs to be broken down into child-friendly approaches, which usually each school has, pending on the school, um, will have a one-page profile.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_02: The one-page profile explains what the child is about, what they like, etc.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_02: etc.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_02: And then in between that one-page profile, then you have a dysregulation plan.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_02: By the way, parents, you should be given a copy of all of these, right?
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_02: So you're aware of it.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_02: I remember a parent receiving one having been instructed by myself, like, have they got it?
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_02: Have you shared it with them?
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_02: And when they saw it, the first thing the parent says, Oh my god, they're making my son look like a really bad child.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_02: Right now, when you read EHCPs, it's whether you're talking about an appreciative uh inquiry in psychology, whereby we're trying to think the best of a child.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_02: You do know that if I start saying something negative about you or something positive in front in front of you, and then saying something negative behind your back, how would you feel?
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, yeah, affronted.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so some of the changes I love to make within organizations is don't be nice, be kind.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_02: And there's not enough of kindness, and there's not enough of forgiveness.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_04: I think actually, though, what I'm picking up on is there's not enough of people dealing with reality.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, they're dealing with systems which they've been taught to deal with.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_04: Everything you're saying, we understand we're teachers, we're ex-teachers, and we have been where you are, and we've had your energy, and we've spoken to so many people.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_04: I've stopped a child getting excluded because I taught drama and I was able to do it.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_04: However, what you get in return from the school is oh, that can't be done.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_04: Is that you can't do that?
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_04: Up against a brick wall.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_04: I really appreciate the advocacy that you're doing, and I think that is where your strength is in in voicing all of this and giving people, or parents in particular, an alternative route to do it.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_04: I think where you start by saying, Well, schools aren't going to listen to you, I'm afraid they're not gonna listen to you because they're not gonna want to.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_04: They didn't listen to teachers and we weren't there.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_04: So, what you're doing is maybe if you can empower parents to listen, to understand, and use your cases which have worked.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_04: It's worked, I thought that is where the parent can go into the school, and schools are scared of parents, we know that, yeah, and say, right, we want it done this way because I know legally I need to see the EHCP.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_04: Legally, I need to be able to have some say in this, and legally, my child has said this because I've explained it to him in child-friendly language, and this is his voice.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_05: Correct.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_04: And I think that's where your strength is going to be is empowering the parent rather than the school, because the school is too entrenched in its system to start with.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_04: Yes.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_04: So, on that, if you've got a parent listening to this now and they have all of that diagnosis, they have all of these things, and they are they are struggling because they are saying, I've got a child who has been given a diagnosis, and now he goes to school, and everyone just says, Oh, he's the ASD child, you know, who's that one.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_04: Um, what can you say to them to encourage them to voice that their child isn't the label?
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_04: What would you tell the parent?
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_02: Firstly, as always, I'll say to the parent, you're crazy amazing.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_02: Like you're literally crazy amazing.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_02: And and I and I say that um not because um I just want to say words to flatter you.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_02: I don't do that.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um, geez, don't make me cry.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_02: What's on earth?
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, it's ridiculous.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_02: No, I think it's I think you're not gonna be a few.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_02: Stop it, stop it, stop it, Rex.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_02: Stop it.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's not gonna happen.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_06: No, it's fine.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_02: It's not gonna happen.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_06: It's not being a parent.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_06: It's not being a parent.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_02: The problem the the problem is not you.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that is a fact.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, no.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_06: It's fine.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_01: Oh gosh.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_01: That is a trigger.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, right.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_02: So let me explain.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_02: Let me explain.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_02: Many, many years ago, when my kids, one specifically, who felt bullied.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_02: Oh no.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_01: Oh gosh.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_01: Oh no!
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_04: I actually think this is part of your power.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_04: Oh boy, this is the hand, yeah.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_04: And I bet you parents are going, oh my, yeah.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_04: Being told it's not their fault.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, right.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: Don't forget, I'm a black belt karate, right?
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_01: So this is not me.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_01: Somebody else took over this body.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_01: Oh no! Oh right.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_02: So I lacked representation then for my children.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_02: And nobody was able to represent them intelligently.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_04: Yes.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_02: So what the parent brings to the table is irrational theatrical expressions.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_02: That's what they say.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_06: From the viewpoint of the school.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_06: Of the school.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_06: Exactly.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_02: So I then get them to sit back because my job is to hear their voice.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_02: And to represent everything that the parent does.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_02: The local authorities are crazy amazing.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_02: And they can only do so much.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_02: That is a fact, right?
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_02: They put all this information together and the school in again, like, big out to the schools.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_02: I know you're overwhelmed, and there's a lack of resources, etc.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_02: etc.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_02: But what I do say is the fact that unless we all agree and admit that we're all vulnerable, mom, parents, dads, and shout out to the fathers.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_02: Like there are a few.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_02: I come on.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_02: And there are some single parents and single fathers that do such an incredible job, right?
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_02: Especially with complex kids in itself.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_02: And complex kids do crazy stuff, but they're crazy amazing until they get to understand that ADHD, ASD, dyspraxia, dyscarculia, um all these conditions, trauma-based, become superpowers when they take ownership, and it does not have to be disruptive.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_02: So, what I do say to you is don't be disheartened.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_02: This the process is simple.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_02: There's a Senko coordinator within schools.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_02: Um speak with empathy, and I do appreciate that sometimes when you do, um you often will not feel heard.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_02: Be patient with the process, be polite with the process, like when you go into the NHS, they do warn us about aggressive behavior.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_02: And when this child is your own and you see what this child presents at home in a safe environment, it's often not what they present in schools.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_02: That's the truth, right?
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_05: Absolutely.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_02: So work alongside the school, work alongside the local authorities, and look for somebody who becomes a trusted adult and an advocate.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_02: That's what I would suggest.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_02: And that could be a crazy amazing person like me, it could be a crazy amazing parent like that.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it needs to be and and and and and a school called me last week, having given me the toughest time ever, but then asking the question, How is that young boy doing?
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_02: and I said, Yeah, he's doing incredibly well.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_02: He's now in this grammar school kind of stuff, and he's thriving.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_02: And and what people tend to forget, the likes of Richard Branson, uh Bill Gates, who are autistic, ADHD, and comorbidities of other uh things have been incredibly successful.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, um, so why it's just about us changing, and when we change, the child changes.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_02: I think there's a book about that too again, right?
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_04: You know you need to write, you need to write it.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_04: You do, yeah.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_04: I genuinely, and we're gonna go to a break now, but um really genuinely what you're doing is you are talking to people as people.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_02: Correct, humanity.
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_04: Uh you when you talk about the system, and I I so I'm gonna go back to when you said the system is broken.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_04: Actually, the system as it stands is broken because, like you described, you've got all these masking people feeding into the system.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_04: Correct.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_04: And then going, oh, but it's the system.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_04: And that's it.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_04: What you what you are reminding us, and you did it so passionately when you talked about not having representation, not having your own voice at the time when you needed it, is you are reminding us that we make the system.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_04: And we can change the system just as easily if we just sit down and talk about it honestly and realistically.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_04: Correct.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_04: And we are keeping you, um, and we'll be back just after a click from one of our resident experts.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_00: Just because you're quiet doesn't mean you're at peace.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_00: Many people have learned to suppress emotions instead of expressing them.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_00: To avoid conflict, to keep others comfortable, to be strong.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_00: But unexpressed emotions don't disappear, they accumulate and they often show up in other ways.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_00: Stress, anxiety, overeating, irritability.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: So here's a gentle reminder You are allowed to feel, you're allowed to express, and you're allowed to take up space because true peace isn't about silence, it's about honesty.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_04: On this week's Test of Trend, let's think about the assumptions we make when we label someone.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_04: So this is where you might have a diagnosis, or you might be treated as a label instead, and that's the problematic bit.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_04: So let's think about the diagnoses: autism, ADHD, anxious, challenging behavior, OCD, naughty, any of those which can become labels.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_04: Say that word out loud.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_04: Anything that you've been called.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_04: So if you were called naughty, you know, you say that out loud.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_04: Tell me or think about the first three words that come to mind.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_04: I'll give you an example.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_04: A friend of mine was told in jest um he was an ugly person in a handsome person's body.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_04: But for him, the word ugly conjures up much more unpleasant sort of meanness, nastiness rather than not handsome.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_04: So really think about what words come up with that particular label.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_04: Where did those associations come from for that particular word?
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_04: What are they based on?
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_04: What you've seen in the media, knowledge and actual reading, actual theory or assumption.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_04: So you've got the label, the associations, where did those associations come from?
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_04: And based on those thoughts that you have about that particular label, I'd like you to now think how that might affect someone if you're unconsciously projecting some of those thoughts onto them when you hear that label.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_04: Because at the very least, when somebody has a diagnosis of autism, it will still mean something different to them compared to somebody else.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_04: So we need to be very aware of what we think about each of those terms and make sure we don't unconsciously place those biases or those projections onto someone else.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_04: Rex, you are mind-blowing on this because I think what you've you've made me really think about how much we're feeding into a into a system that doesn't necessarily work because we've all been lying to ourselves as we feed into this system.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_04: And and you've really just in your point of saying you had no representation and now you're being the voice that you needed at the time.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_04: But the voice that you're bringing out is one that that is still unusual in the system there.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_04: You talk about reality and you talk about what individuals, especially the child, needs to be able to voice themselves.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_04: So on that, um where and how can parents advocate for their child knowing resources are stretched, knowing they may not be listened to, and knowing that they have to do, you've done a degree's worth of work to understand how social services work, how schools work, how the um Senko system works.
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_02: Correct.
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_04: But they don't have the time to do that.
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_04: So how how where can they start?
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_02: So where they start first, I find I've found that the best advocates are parents.
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_04: Yes.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and they do most of the heavy lifting, most of the work.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um most local authorities have got um an organization that becomes the advocate that is um voluntary to supporting children.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_02: You've just got to find who they are.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_02: But the processes are very simple, as I'll always say it.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_02: They're not complex at all.
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_02: The admin is tedious, yeah, and that within schools.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_02: Shout out to Senko leaders, I know it is.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and there aren't enough qualified Senko leaders with a lot of experience.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_02: And let me say it.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_02: There are Senko people that should not be doing the job.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_03: There are many people in all walks of life that should not be doing the job.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_03: Please do not worry.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_03: We say that.
• 43:09
  unknown: Yeah.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_02: Um to which in itself, there's a great book called uh The Lucifer Effect.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_02: It it touches a lot on stuff like that.
• 43:17
  SPEAKER_02: It's a prison system in America and how they rejuvenated it, and people going into job roles for the wrong reasons, etc.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_02: Um, that is a good book.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_02: There's another great book, if I may suggest, to parents.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_04: Sorry, yeah, no, no, no, I don't see where to start.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_02: So um there's a book called Um Um Working with Children with Intense Emotional Needs, and I'll give you the author later.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but it's as simple as you taking ownership of that advocacy.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but secondly, please, if your child is diagnosed with ADHD, ASD, then it's either you have ADHD or your husband or partner has got ADHD or ASD.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_02: Once you've realized what you have and you've taken ownership for it, you then parent differently.
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that is where things sometimes uh become challenging because the school system sees that the parent hasn't taken ownership and that the parent is expecting the school to do all the heavy lifting.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_02: And if we agree today, there are schools who are literally teaching kids how to do the basic things, go to toilet, and what do they do when they teach a child to wipe themselves and everything else?
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_02: Those things are now placed upon schools.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: They are right, and they are challenging.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_02: So I suppose ownership is important.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_02: Once you've taken on ownership, look for um a support group within your community because they all have them, all local authorities have these support groups in itself.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_02: Engage them and then go through the basics.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_02: Psychological um uh evaluation.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_02: Um, after that, um, a paediatrician may be required, medicated, and medication is something we never talked about today.
• 45:07
  SPEAKER_02: But by God, five years or ten years ago, I would say no today, it's day and night, like um a child on medication and then the next day not medicated, the difference is just wide.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_06: It just makes the whole world more manageable, doesn't it?
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_06: Exactly.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_06: And I do but medication is like the starting point, isn't it?
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_04: You've got to then do the work once you've been regulated, and that's what goes wrong, yes.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_02: Correct, and also take away the myth that the fact that they've got ADHD ASD that they have to behave badly, yeah, right, they just communicate differently and they do not have um um an intelligent way of communicating their distresses.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_02: So, to that in itself, I always say, what does anxiety look like?
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_02: Anxiety looks like simply this for a neurotypical person, they would wake up in the morning, they'll have a plan, and as that plan gets to noonday, right, they become anxious and anxious, and then by evening they're like, I've had enough.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_02: Mothers will appreciate this more than us men.
• 46:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, I said it, right?
• 46:24
  SPEAKER_02: Because a mother wakes up in the morning, and what is in their thought?
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_02: I've got to do this, I've got to do that, I've got to do this.
• 46:29
  SPEAKER_06: A million things.
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_02: A million things.
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_02: So anxiety starts by the time they put their head to the bed, wake up, and now they're anxious.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_02: The child is no different.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_02: The child at the point of going to bed, they're already worried about the next day.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_02: When they wake up, now it's school refusal because they're so overwhelmed.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_02: So a lot of work needs to go into on picking behavior and managing anxiety.
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_02: And one of the greatest things you could remove is pretty much social media, yes, the phone, the phone is a bad idea.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_02: I know certain communities, and I'm not going to name this so that we're not labeling or stereotyping, but there are certain communities that would not allow their child to have a phone even at age 12, 13, 14.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_02: And once they've gotten to their GCSEC, you've got the right of passage to have that.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and to that in itself, if we do all the basic things, then gangs will not have a foothold in our children.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_04: It's about making real life better, isn't it?
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_04: We've said that a lot.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_04: I'm gonna interrupt and and steal your penultimate question because I want to just change it a little bit and then we'll find out a little bit more about where we can get hold of you.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_04: But um, in terms of language that parents are going to have to use to speak to authority, can you give parents some top tips as to what sort of language they need to be using to be heard?
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_02: My son, my daughter, is presenting complex behaviors.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_02: They mask at school and unmask at home, which makes me feel really distressed.
• 48:16
  SPEAKER_02: Please can you help?
• 48:18
  SPEAKER_06: But you know what?
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_06: That shivers down my spine as well because a parent said exactly that to me when I was a teacher, and I had no idea that her child she had ASD.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_06: And it's exactly that.
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_06: That's that's stu it's so clear and so simple.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, there's this saying, uh a gentleman, uh Jim Rohn, he says, nobody cares how much you know until they know how much you care.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_02: And caring is key.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah right?
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_02: So oh Jesus, don't do this.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_04: Oh no, it comes out and that's important.
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_06: It and and it shows that you care.
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_06: And that's like you say, it's thank you, it's fundamental to everything that you do.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_06: Where can we find you?
• 49:03
  SPEAKER_06: Where can we, you know, where can we go to find out more about you and what you do?
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so I am terrible with social media.
• 49:14
  SPEAKER_03: Sadly, you do need to be on there, don't you?
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_02: You know, that's the worst plan.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_02: Terrible.
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_02: I've set up um I've set oh jeez.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I've set up um an Instagram page and I've done nothing about it.
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_02: Don't think you need to.
• 49:27
  SPEAKER_06: I was gonna say Instagram will call it me the last one.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_02: LinkedIn, okay.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_02: I've gotten LinkedIn and I've done nothing about it.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_02: I've done a website and I hardly look at it.
• 49:37
  SPEAKER_02: My day is 24-7.
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_02: Like as at yesterday, I got home 9.30.
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_02: I was um I took a kid to a police station for the start, and and they again back to gangs.
• 49:50
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so this kid is a part of a brotherhood or whatever that literally is within this messed up situationship, and there's hope for this one child.
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_02: And whilst there is hope within this one child, the rest of them don't like it.
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so you know that saying when they say, Do unto others as you wish others do unto you.
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_02: You can't you can't think like that because the truth is there are people who smoke, who drink, and then they're the ones saying, Well, but I'm a good person, yeah, right?
• 50:19
  SPEAKER_02: But they will still introduce those people because we look, we we see by sight and we embrace what we see and adopt those things, which is why I then say to our statement, which says, Um, we've almost lied to ourselves.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_02: So I say lies, lies, lies.
• 50:37
  SPEAKER_02: The lies we tell ourselves, the lies we tell others, yeah, and the lies we expect others to collaborate with us, right?
• 50:42
  SPEAKER_04: And there's our system, yes.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_02: And that's as exactly.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_02: So I unpick the lies that people tell themselves, then I tell unpick the lies that people tell others, and then I unpick the lies that people want others to agree with.
• 50:58
  SPEAKER_04: Yes, and that is how you redefine excellence, yeah.
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_04: So um, Rex, we'll find you on LinkedIn.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you can find me on LinkedIn, yes.
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then um I could give you my website details afterwards.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_01: Amazing opportunity.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_01: And then you can make uh contact with me.
• 51:16
  SPEAKER_04: Amazing.
• 51:17
  SPEAKER_04: Honestly, we need we need more of you because you need a team.
• 51:20
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, you will change this system and it will be changed in the right way.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_04: Uh, from all of us here at Mental Health Matters, have a healthy week.