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The Shōta Imanaga experience · North Side Territory: A Chicago Cubs Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: That that's his name plate.
• 0:01
  Speaker 2: Now it's Mike Imanaga, and apparently when he goes to
• 0:04
  Speaker 2: the coffee shops, that's the name he gives. Welcome into
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: north Side Territory, your Cubs podcast on the Foul Territory Network.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: I'm Sahadev Sharma. That's Patrick Mooney. We're both Cubs beat
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: writers over over at the Athletic Uh. Patrick.
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: Uh. First of all, I have to say, like, every
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: single time I start this show, I worry that I'm
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: gonna say north Shore Territory for some reason. And after
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: we had after we had John Greenberg on and then
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: like the Chris gets Jed Hoyer story. Yeah, yeah, I
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: feel like north Shore is like on my mind constantly.
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: I live on the North Shore as well, so so
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: it's every single time I do it, I'm like, wait,
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: did I say it right?
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: Did I say north Side? Uh?
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: But that you are tough.
• 0:56
  Speaker 4: I've been thinking of Kenny Williams line of like we
• 0:59
  Speaker 4: got guys Chicago tough or that's what they look for
• 1:01
  Speaker 4: in free agency, like nor Short tough.
• 1:04
  Speaker 3: It would certainly be a good label for.
• 1:08
  Speaker 4: That series that was, you know, thrilling towards the end,
• 1:12
  Speaker 4: but not exactly like, you know, a game you'd put
• 1:16
  Speaker 4: in a time capsule by.
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: Any means, No, it wasn't.
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: Neither of these wins were the prettiest wins they got.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: They got the job done right.
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: They had to win this series, they had to sweep
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: this series to feel good about where things are headed.
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: I did not come away from those games saying, hey,
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: they looked impressive. I'll start with some of the I
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: mean just in general, like yesterday's game, which is Wednesday's game,
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: was not you know, nothing stood out to me where
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: I was like, yeah, that was really good. They're doing
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: this really well right now. But you know, after the game,
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: a lot of the players were talking about how they
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: just did the little things well right. The relievers, for
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: the most part, were solid, got the job done outside
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: of one bad pitch for Mayden Wassnsky that got launched,
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: a good job by the bullpen.
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: Good like there was.
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: They made plays when they needed to, They scored in
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: different ways without needing really a big hit, which can
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: sometimes be valuable.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: But this team doesn't get the big hit.
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: So I like, for me, I want to see them
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: getting the big hit more and more often rather than
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: just like getting one or two runs in a basis
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: loaded situation, right, you want to see them put up
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: the four spot more often things like that, and you
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: know what, here's here's a good thing that stood out
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: to me. They got two bad starts against a terrible
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: offense and still won the game like that is if
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: as long as that's not a sign of things to
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: come with the starting pitching, that's nice to see. You
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: gotta win games in different ways at the the team. Like,
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: things don't line up perfectly all the time, right, so
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: sometimes you gotta win games when one unit isn't at
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: its best. So, yes, it's the White Sox. They did
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: what they were supposed to do. It didn't look pretty.
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: I'm not sure if fans that really pay attention or
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: brimming with confidence right now, but they did what they
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: were supposed to do.
• 3:22
  Speaker 4: You kind of read my mind in that this episode
• 3:25
  Speaker 4: will largely be about showda Imanaga kind of a wider
• 3:29
  Speaker 4: angle look at how he got here and where the
• 3:32
  Speaker 4: Cubs go from here.
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: But I think you nailed it because you know, the Cubs.
• 3:37
  Speaker 4: Were struggling while he was performing on just another level,
• 3:42
  Speaker 4: and so like as he comes back down to earth here,
• 3:45
  Speaker 4: which I think we see happening.
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: I don't think it's totally alarming, but you do need.
• 3:53
  Speaker 4: Guys to get big hits, and Mike Taukman certainly has
• 3:56
  Speaker 4: a feel and a sense for the moment.
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: And then they're gonna have to tighten.
• 4:03
  Speaker 4: Up the defense and we can get into Christopher Morel
• 4:06
  Speaker 4: now of like you know, Shoda was cruising there the
• 4:11
  Speaker 4: first time through the lineup and then an error.
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: That just opens the floodgates.
• 4:16
  Speaker 4: And I think Morell stands out just because, like the
• 4:20
  Speaker 4: defense has been bad overall as a team, and it's like,
• 4:25
  Speaker 4: where are you gonna fix this?
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: And Craig Council acknowledge.
• 4:29
  Speaker 4: That, you know, they're evaluating everything and that you know
• 4:34
  Speaker 4: he is.
• 4:34
  Speaker 3: Morel's not out of the woods on this.
• 4:37
  Speaker 4: Council totally believes in the offensive profile and his expected
• 4:43
  Speaker 4: statistics and that he anticipates a huge balance offensively. So
• 4:47
  Speaker 4: Morel's in the lineup, but I think they're going to
• 4:51
  Speaker 4: start mixing him matching more I think Matt Shaw is
• 4:54
  Speaker 4: not out of the question later to this summer, and
• 4:57
  Speaker 4: I don't know. Ja mccandelaria was pretty good last year.
• 4:59
  Speaker 3: He was a big pick up.
• 5:00
  Speaker 4: He got hurt unfortunately, so his impact was muted somewhat
• 5:05
  Speaker 4: towards the end, but I think that's an area that
• 5:09
  Speaker 4: we're going to be circling here as it gets closer
• 5:12
  Speaker 4: towards July thirtieth.
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's I can't remember the exact wording Council used,
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: but even before he said it, I was thinking, it's
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: kind of like two steps forward, one step back with
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: morell uh and it you know, just I think before
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: that game, I was talking to someone in the press
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: box about, you know, like I feel like he's he's
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: making progress, like it was a disaster of the first
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: two weeks, but and it's not like it's been since.
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: But you know, you see signs that he can he
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: can do this. And I said, but I also, it's
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: not like there's a ton of confidence. Every ball that
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: goes in that direction. You're kind of like, is he
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: gonna is he gonna screw it up in some way? Right,
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: there's just a little bit of hesitation. Uh So, I
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: don't know, I don't think. I think when he made
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: that mistake, and it was you know, it's costing them runs,
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: potentially costing them games, which it has in the past,
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: whether it's an error or not. Just not making certain plays,
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: not making the right throw and it gets called a single.
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: Those those things add up, and those you know, eventually,
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: I think they're going to have to make a decision.
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: Does that mean you rule out Christopher Morele as a
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: third baseman? Ever, it's really hard to do this in season.
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: It just is.
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: And I'm not sure how how he gets there if
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: it's not this year, if there's a way they can
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: do work with him in the off season and just
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: dedicate a full off season to him. You know, they
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: didn't really have like a full plan in place with council,
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: and they're like the front office that they have now
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: ready to go last winter. So they try and look
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: at it as like, Okay, we're gonna have to mix
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: and match going forward. They like, look, they have David
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: Bodie up right now. I don't think you can start
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: him a ton right No? No, So so this is
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: this is absolutely an area where we need to start
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: looking at and thinking about how do you address this?
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: Is it as simple as finding someone that you know
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: that that can handle the position at an average or
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: slightly above average level and give you some offense and
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: and you and that's your new bench bat right you
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: know what I mean, like finding that person on the
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: trade market, it's gonna be hard to find, like a
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: star starter, right, like a guy that you're just like,
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: this is our no crap third baseman. Uh, this guy's
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: gonna be there every day. But there's there's ways to
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: to alleviate the defensive issues. I think without putting Christopher
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: Merrell to the side. I I mean I get the
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: the doubt in like you want to see results offensively, right,
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: and I get doubting expected stats. I just think when
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: I watch him and I combine it with the expected stats,
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: I just haven't seen someone like this. And I've said
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: this already on the podcast. I haven't seen this type
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: of bad luck for such an extended period of time.
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: My concern always was the mental aspect. I'm not seeing
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: him get out of his approach. And now a couple
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: balls have fallen, so some have fallen in the seats.
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: He's getting a little bit of a like if he
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: can continue that as long as he doesn't change his approach.
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: I agree with Counsel like this is going to turn
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: for him and he's going to be a big part
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: of the offense. If not, like the team's just not
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: gonna be good enough because he has to be a
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: big part of the offense, like he's he's kind of
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: key to there, to their power as well, you know,
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: like he's probably the most consistent power bat that they have.
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: You know that there's always thunder in that bat, like
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: whatever the city suation is, whoever he's against, Like you're like,
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: there's a chance for a home run here. But he
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: also puts up good at bats now, doesn't strike out
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: as much, doesn't chase.
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: Like it's just it's a good offensive profile Now.
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: Before it was just like this is all power and
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: it was and you just took it, took the bad
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: with the good. I think the offensive profile is really
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: impressive now and how it's all come together. But yes,
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: absolutely defense has now become a big focus there. And
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: I think when when you have the manager say what
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: he said, I think it'd be foolish to ignore.
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: It, no doubt.
• 9:33
  Speaker 4: I mean, I think we don't hear any whispers about
• 9:37
  Speaker 4: Christoper Morrel's attitude or work ethic, like just off the
• 9:40
  Speaker 4: charts positivity, like the tools are loud. You know, you
• 9:46
  Speaker 4: don't need to go to Scout school to see like,
• 9:48
  Speaker 4: oh wow, this guy's different and athletic and energizing and entertaining.
• 9:56
  Speaker 4: But part of this experiment was like there weren't many
• 9:59
  Speaker 4: other great options, and they still aren't a ton of alternatives.
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: But once the manager acknowledges that and it's introduced into
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: kind of the public sphere, you know, they've been thinking
• 10:13
  Speaker 4: about it for a long time and discussing.
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: It pretty extensively, and so.
• 10:21
  Speaker 4: We have a lot of moving pieces here to how day.
• 10:23
  Speaker 4: But I'm curious, like, I don't know you no pitching?
• 10:29
  Speaker 4: What's your panic level? Was showed in Minaugua. Right now,
• 10:32
  Speaker 4: we you and I Ken Rosenthaler colleague at the Athletic
• 10:35
  Speaker 4: and Felterer. I wrote a big story on him. We're
• 10:39
  Speaker 4: kind of, you know, under the gun there to get
• 10:42
  Speaker 4: it out. While he was on the work start, we
• 10:44
  Speaker 4: knew he was gonna regress a little bit, but you know,
• 10:51
  Speaker 4: maybe earlier in the year he pitches around that Marillra,
• 10:53
  Speaker 4: you know, like he's at a moment now or I
• 10:56
  Speaker 4: think it's gonna be really interesting to see kind of
• 10:59
  Speaker 4: how he continues to make adjustments here.
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, he got hit hard after a while there,
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: right it It just it took a little while there
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: there was some bad there were there was bad defense
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: and then and then they started getting to.
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: Him and uh it.
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: He suddenly started missing bats. It was I don't know
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: where my panic Clem was. I like, I want to see,
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: you know, Milwaukee. For me, that's a flush it. Yes,
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: there's concern after the White Sox hit him, right, he
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: probably shouldn't have been hit that badly. You gotta gotta
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: make plays behind the guy, but he also needs to
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: make up.
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: For it, right.
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: Uh So, yeah, I'd say that, I'm I'm watching the fastball,
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: I'm watching the pitch usage.
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: Is he going to go to his other pitches? More?
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: Like I just quickly picked pulled up his his numbers
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: from the last game, the last start against the White Sox,
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: and he went to his sweeper twice and his curveball once,
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: and then it was like pretty much four seamen splitter
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: other than that out of his sixty six pitches. So
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: he's just not going to his other pitches right now.
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: Much like I think what we wrote was combined ten
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: percent between the sweeper, curveball, and sinker, Like that's that's
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: just barely using your other pitches. I was told the sweeper.
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: I think we were both We've both been told that
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: the sweeper is pretty impressive. Right, they liked the sweeper, Yeah, they.
• 12:35
  Speaker 5: Kind of put him more firmly on their radar, this
• 12:39
  Speaker 5: idea of like between twenty two and twenty three he
• 12:44
  Speaker 5: was getting better already and that that, you know, could
• 12:48
  Speaker 5: be a separator pitch with him in addition to.
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: Getting into work higher in the zone and then kind
• 12:55
  Speaker 3: of hammering the splitter down.
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: So I mean, like, I think Tuesday was mostly about
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: just like he location right, Like the location wasn't great,
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: It wasn't like.
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: One thing that we heard.
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: Was watch the rise on the fastball right the vertical break.
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: As the weather changes, it could he could lose some
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: of that rise, and that's going to make that pitch
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: more hittable because you know it's coming in around ninety
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: two ninety three miles per hour, not ninety seven ninety eight.
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: That leaves more less margin for error. And when the
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: rise isn't as good, isn't as effective, that's going to
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: get hit hard. That that wasn't that's not what happened.
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: So we don't need to worry about that yet. The
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: Cubs fans don't need to be too concerned about that.
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: Yet at some point it becomes it becomes a question. Right,
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: But right now, that doesn't seem to be an issue.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: I yeah, like he's This is why I I wouldn't
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: worry if I were a Cubs fan, Like he is
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: a veteran. I don't think everybody fully appreciates that.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: But he is. He's not.
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: He's not someone that he's going to need to adjust, right.
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: I'd like to see him start to use that sweeper more.
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: I don't think he needs to panic and completely abandon
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: pitches or or completely changes arsenal, but you start maybe
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: there's a moment now, I guess I don't know if
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: he's going to did he face the Reds already? Like
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: is he finally going to face the team for the
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: second time? I can look that up real quickly, But
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: that that would be like, let's see, does he use
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: the sweeper more this weekend because he's already.
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: Faced the Reds.
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: Let's see has he faced the Reds since he so again,
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: he's not he's not going to face a team for
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: the second time yet, so Cincinnati is the first time
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: he'll face them, So maybe we'll continue to see four
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: seam splitter. But I that's that's something that we need
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: to watch second time through the league team seeing him again,
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: I think he knows that. He's not like he's been
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: preparing for what's happening right now. Uh, he knows he's
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: going to need to make adjustments. He's not shell shocked.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: He's not sitting there like, oh no, what what do
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: I do?
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: He's very confident in himself. He's very calm in these situations.
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: Those are huge things that we can't really measure. But
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: I don't think like some people may not appreciate it
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: as much and just focus more on numbers. But and
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: I was one of those people a decade ago, But
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: now the more I'm around baseball players, the more I'm
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: around the game, this stuff is so huge. And that's
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: he's not going to be rattled and overcome overwhelmed by
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: the moment.
• 15:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah, the genesis of that story was in one one part,
• 15:53
  Speaker 4: we had our editor who's just saw how people are
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: responding to Showda I mean, the shirtless dudes in the
• 16:03
  Speaker 4: bleachers spelling out Shoda, just some of the funny uh
• 16:09
  Speaker 4: interviews and comments he's had. So like there's the that's
• 16:13
  Speaker 4: your personality feature? Right, and then Ken Rosenthal. Our colleague
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: is like, what do you guys got on showdough, Like,
• 16:18
  Speaker 4: didn't the you know, the industry miss on this guy.
• 16:20
  Speaker 4: And we were kind of thinking it of like two
• 16:23
  Speaker 4: separate stories, not trying to like jam everything into one long,
• 16:27
  Speaker 4: kind of unwieldy piece. But the more we reported it out,
• 16:30
  Speaker 4: it's impossible to separate those things. Of like, yes, he
• 16:34
  Speaker 4: was sort of undersold or undervalued in the marketplace, I mean, clearly,
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: but there are a lot of reasons for that, and
• 16:46
  Speaker 4: I think there are These are some of the things
• 16:47
  Speaker 4: to keep in the back of your head of like,
• 16:49
  Speaker 4: you know, he's roughly five ten, or at least he's
• 16:53
  Speaker 4: not six five two thirty. He is thirty years old,
• 16:56
  Speaker 4: which brings a lot of experience and benefits, but the
• 17:01
  Speaker 4: like upside you plug into your computer program. He had
• 17:06
  Speaker 4: never thrown a major league pitch before, and so then
• 17:09
  Speaker 4: you even have the Cubs sort of they were on Showa,
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: but they weren't like overwhelming him or putting the full
• 17:18
  Speaker 4: court press on. It was very much a let's see
• 17:21
  Speaker 4: where this goes. Okay, there could be a fit. And
• 17:27
  Speaker 4: meanwhile the dudes just posted up out in Schomberg. I
• 17:31
  Speaker 4: mean out in like you know, going to the Woodfield
• 17:33
  Speaker 4: mall or whatever it is out there, you know, like
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: waiting for you know, the Cubs to kind of reel
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: him in. And so I think this is where the
• 17:45
  Speaker 4: personality sat talking about factors in the intelligence, the curiosity,
• 17:50
  Speaker 4: the composure of like you know, kind of being able
• 17:55
  Speaker 4: to handle a lot of this stuff because there was
• 17:59
  Speaker 4: some trap about what this could look like for a
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: fly ball pitcher trying to figure this stuff out. And
• 18:05
  Speaker 4: so another layer to this is just like as much
• 18:10
  Speaker 4: as I was just kind of bagging on the Cubs
• 18:12
  Speaker 4: for not like going out and signing him immediately, they
• 18:15
  Speaker 4: deserve a ton of credit for being in position and
• 18:18
  Speaker 4: having a plan in place to draw some of this
• 18:22
  Speaker 4: stuff out. Like obviously Eric Fetti's done a nice job
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: with the White Sox, but like, I don't know if
• 18:27
  Speaker 4: showed us on the White Sox, does this happen if
• 18:29
  Speaker 4: showed us in a different city, Like U Darbys said
• 18:33
  Speaker 4: to himself, like, the Cubs are good at individualizing the
• 18:36
  Speaker 4: stuff and accentuating a pitcher strength and not just taking
• 18:40
  Speaker 4: this cookie cutter approach. And so this is going to
• 18:44
  Speaker 4: be a big test. I don't think either one of
• 18:47
  Speaker 4: us expect like the bottom fallout, but you know, show
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: to carry this team, not to like new hikes.
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: We just kind of kept them afloat. And now I
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: think it's kind of on the.
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: Rest of the Cubs to play better defense, to have
• 18:58
  Speaker 4: the bullpen lock some stuff down and really create a
• 19:02
  Speaker 4: sense of momendum. So it's not just like, oh, like
• 19:05
  Speaker 4: as show to go, as the Cubs go, Like, it's
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: gonna have to be just a total team effort here.
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: Right he can't.
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: He can't win one nothing games over and over again,
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: right like that that can't be the recipe to success.
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: I just I hadn't fully looked at like his pitch
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: chart from Tuesday and like what was hit Like the
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: like these are just like there's a couple of splitters
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: like center cut, you know things like that, like four
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: steamers that aren't at the top.
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: Of the zone, that are in the middle of the
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: zone or down.
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: Those are those are pitches that are supposed to be hit, Like,
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: those are pitches that that's command. That's not him losing stuff, right,
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: And he's not someone that is known to have.
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: If he command. So it was a bad it was
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: a bad day.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: It was a bad team right, it looks it looks
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: scarier when when it comes against bad team. I think
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: because you almost what what I'm what I looked at
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: just there. I wanted to make sure it was what
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: I was remembering from the game.
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: It was.
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: It was a bad team that actually didn't miss the
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: pitches that they're supposed to hit.
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: Uh Like the probably.
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: My guess is, if I like fully look at all
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: his pitches, they they probably did miss some. Right, he
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: probably just was like really off and and they missed
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: more pitches. But he was so off that he gave
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: them multiple chances and they took advantage of it. Right,
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: he was he was just off with his command. This
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: isn't going I'd be surprised if that continues, because this
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: isn't a guy that's ever had command issues. That's what
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: he's known for, So you could I think. I think
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: there's reason for belief there and and trust for so
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: many reasons, including the tangi intangible ones that we've mentioned.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: Uh I just like uh. I like his personality.
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: I like uh you know this, like the willingness to
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: joke about things, the willingness to talk about the inside
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: jokes with us and and explained them like like the
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: Mic and Immenaga thing if if you haven't read the piece.
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: He was that that's his name plate.
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: Now it's Mike Imanaga, and apparently when he goes to
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: the coffee shops, that's the name he gives.
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: Not to Duncan.
• 21:26
  Speaker 4: He said, he doesn't give his name at Duncan. But
• 21:29
  Speaker 4: it was more of an in general, there are scenarios
• 21:32
  Speaker 4: where you have to give your name and he kind
• 21:35
  Speaker 4: of sense it's gonna be mispronounced or misunderstood.
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: He went with Mike.
• 21:40
  Speaker 4: Uh, did not fully get to the bottom of that one.
• 21:43
  Speaker 4: He did not particularly want to like outline everything.
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: But what we wrote was accurate.
• 21:51
  Speaker 4: Uh, just a ton of just really good and you know,
• 21:56
  Speaker 4: we'll probably reserve some of this. But James and Tyn
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: had told like, you know, his before showed his first
• 22:05
  Speaker 4: cactus leak outing.
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: He went up to him. He's like, hey, man, like
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: today is your day? Like today's show today, and like
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: showed to just love this.
• 22:14
  Speaker 4: And so now whenever he sees him supposedly and he's starting,
• 22:19
  Speaker 4: he'll go up to time and be like today show today,
• 22:22
  Speaker 4: and then ty On will do it, you know, the
• 22:25
  Speaker 4: same thing to him, just like a funny little like
• 22:28
  Speaker 4: for I'm using air quotes, rookie and for a guy
• 22:32
  Speaker 4: who's in a foreign country.
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: He's been extremely.
• 22:36
  Speaker 4: Intentional about how he's gone about this.
• 22:40
  Speaker 3: He's not.
• 22:43
  Speaker 4: Attached to the hip of his interpreter, Edwin, who does
• 22:46
  Speaker 4: a very good job. Got to give him a shout
• 22:48
  Speaker 4: out that he is really just diligent and available and
• 22:52
  Speaker 4: he really gets the game. And then just the the
• 22:58
  Speaker 4: other one was like, you know, he's facing the braves,
• 23:02
  Speaker 4: doesn't have great stuff. He's kind of battling, you know,
• 23:06
  Speaker 4: a bunch of walks and hits, and in between innings,
• 23:10
  Speaker 4: teammates are cracking up. He's drinking a Tobo Chico sparkling
• 23:14
  Speaker 4: water while he's ropes and winds up throwing five scoreless
• 23:18
  Speaker 4: at what at the time was probably his his toughest
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: task or biggest challenge. Just that sense of cool and
• 23:27
  Speaker 4: also an ability, like one of the coaches had told us,
• 23:30
  Speaker 4: like when it's time to work, like he is totally
• 23:33
  Speaker 4: locked in, Like he very much, like he's not showing up,
• 23:37
  Speaker 4: kind of wondering like what I should be doing, Like
• 23:40
  Speaker 4: he has a plan, and once it's time to go
• 23:44
  Speaker 4: to work, he is extremely I don't know if ridge
• 23:48
  Speaker 4: is the right word, but just very focused on what
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: he has to do. And so I think all of
• 23:55
  Speaker 4: those things the intangibles you mentioned sat of are are
• 23:58
  Speaker 4: really good bay from which you can build a strong season.
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: And like why the Cubs, you know they're.
• 24:05
  Speaker 4: Gonna be cautiously optimistic and working an extra rest or
• 24:09
  Speaker 4: being aware of that. I think Council said about one
• 24:12
  Speaker 4: hundred and seventy innings is kind of what he's been
• 24:15
  Speaker 4: on track for, and there'll be a lot, but I
• 24:18
  Speaker 4: don't think it's inconceivable or you know, too big for Showa.
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think how he does the rest
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: of the way is a big storyline. Right He's he's
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: in the cy Young conversation right now. I haven't paid
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: enough attention to the rest of the league to know
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: for sure if he'd be like the front runner, but.
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: I would assume he's top three or five. The Phillies
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: probably have three in the top five, right yeah.
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And speaking of the Phillies, like I'll just transition
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: here to to kind of wrapping this up and kind
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: of putting things in perspective. The Phillies just swept the Brewers.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: The Cubs are five back at the Brewers. The Cubs
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: have the second wild card spot. They have been bad. Okay,
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: they've not played well for a month now, and they
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: had a good month, they had a bad month, and
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: somehow they're right there. They're lucky that the NL is
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: pretty mediocre. I as I said at the start, I
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: don't think this. These last two games inspired confidence that
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: they're turning a corner performance wise. But it can turn
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: at any moment. I really do. I know that from
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: watching baseball my entire life. I'm not saying that the
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: Cubs will turn. I'm just saying come back, got it? Yeah,
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: I'm just so used to seeing stuff. I mean, it
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: happened last year where how many times a we where
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: we were like, oh are they back? Oh oh are
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: they going to turn it on? And then finally both
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: you and I were just like, okay, we need to
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: stop like they're sellers. What are we doing constantly talking
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: about them getting back to being you know, showing like this,
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: being consistent and winning, and then they rattle off that
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: insane run right and nearly make the playoffs. So there's
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: even when you think it they're done, you have to
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: just like pay attention and make sure, like are they
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: really dead. Uh and and as you wrote, as you wrote,
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: they're not selling right, They're just not.
• 26:24
  Speaker 3: No, it's hard to see.
• 26:27
  Speaker 4: I think our stronger went a little our headline went
• 26:30
  Speaker 4: a little stronger of like Cubs ruling it out. But
• 26:33
  Speaker 4: you know, there's just no scenario that's realistic on the horizon,
• 26:38
  Speaker 4: like to for something like that to happen. It's almost
• 26:42
  Speaker 4: impossible to imagine what that would look at or look like,
• 26:46
  Speaker 4: or what it would take. I mean, just the way
• 26:48
  Speaker 4: the roster is set up, how invested the franchise is
• 26:52
  Speaker 4: this year in winning, the pressure on the front office
• 26:56
  Speaker 4: and the manager, the coaching staff, you know, the lack
• 27:02
  Speaker 4: of pieces to move the you know, obviously you always
• 27:05
  Speaker 4: need prospects down the line, but the last thing that this
• 27:08
  Speaker 4: organization needs is like another like you know, Toolsy Class
• 27:12
  Speaker 4: a player who's like four years away from the big leagues.
• 27:15
  Speaker 4: Like and I think what we're talking about here is
• 27:18
  Speaker 4: like if you have an ace, you know, coass and
• 27:21
  Speaker 4: showda Justin Steele, Javi Asad's kind of creeping. You know,
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: maybe they're not exactly traditional aces, but all really strong
• 27:31
  Speaker 4: starting pitchers. And you have some depth with Tyne and
• 27:36
  Speaker 4: interesting younger pitchers and Ben Brown and Hayden Wizneski and the.
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: Bullpens kind of getting into order now.
• 27:44
  Speaker 4: And you have a lot of like you know, solid
• 27:48
  Speaker 4: two way players, if not you know, superstars in your
• 27:51
  Speaker 4: lineup like to I think you'll have something come on
• 27:54
  Speaker 4: athletics soon. Like if you upgrade a catcher, you keep
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: your mind open at the base. Jed Hoyer short sounded
• 28:04
  Speaker 4: interested in adding a slugger, whether or not that's Pete
• 28:08
  Speaker 4: Alonzo or someone else of that.
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: That's these things are.
• 28:13
  Speaker 4: Not going to take that much in the grand scheme
• 28:17
  Speaker 4: of things to acquire. And if you make those three
• 28:22
  Speaker 4: maybe moves to shore up some of these areas, I
• 28:28
  Speaker 4: don't think it's gonna like cost as much as maybe
• 28:33
  Speaker 4: you'd think. And I think the value in the aggregate
• 28:37
  Speaker 4: of combining all those things could be huge because the
• 28:41
  Speaker 4: National League, outside of a couple of teams, is just
• 28:44
  Speaker 4: extremely mediocre, and the Cubs are, you know, better positioned
• 28:50
  Speaker 4: than most of the mediocre teams to go six months here.
• 28:55
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• 28:59
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• 29:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and you mentioned Pete Alonzo. It's a also worth mentioning.
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: Like Toronto has talent, Houston has talent, Alex Blad Guerrero.
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: I mean those would lad probably cost is a half
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: deep price because I think separate, but but still like
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: they have it, Like, there's no doubt the Cubs have
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: the talent as much.
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: As anyone in the game.
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: Maybe uh not Houston, maybe Baltimore. Uh there's one other
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: team that has a ton of prospects. But but the
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: Cubs have what it takes to go out and get
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: pretty much anyone they want. If they you know, if
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: they choose to be aggressive, and I think their their
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: names like Bregman and Glad, that could really make sense
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: and really impact the team. I mean, Alex Bregman changes
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: kind of the the way everything looks, right if if
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: that's a if that's a possibility. I just don't know
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: if Houston will end up being aggressive sellers. Well, we'll see.
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: We'll see how they choose to. They kind of do
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: need to replenish their sis them.
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: It just depends. I don't know who's running things there.
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 31:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, right, Wilson Contrez was supposed to get
• 31:06
  Speaker 4: traded there right right right, Like the mess just to
• 31:10
  Speaker 4: me seem like.
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: Very clear sellers.
• 31:16
  Speaker 4: And that Alonso being this close to free agency, and
• 31:20
  Speaker 4: I know he's a big homegrown guy.
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: He just seems like like.
• 31:25
  Speaker 4: That dude just showing up at Wrigley and hitting bombs
• 31:29
  Speaker 4: like would like be Nick Cassiano's times a million, you know,
• 31:35
  Speaker 4: like you have no doubt of like, oh, is he
• 31:37
  Speaker 4: gonna be you know, kind of cautious or scared or
• 31:40
  Speaker 4: like no, like that guy won't necessarily fix the defense,
• 31:45
  Speaker 4: but if he can hit you know, like fifteen homers,
• 31:49
  Speaker 4: you know, from.
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: August first on, Like, yes, and there's.
• 31:55
  Speaker 4: A handful of untouchables, But I don't think you even
• 31:59
  Speaker 4: have to really likensider that, like the cost of sluggers
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: in recent years, guys in their walk ears should not
• 32:07
  Speaker 4: be prohibitive. And even if it is, like who cares,
• 32:10
  Speaker 4: this team's got the right playoffs Like this is a
• 32:12
  Speaker 4: playoffs or bust kind of year.
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: And they're starting to have players that it's just like
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: where like you don't want to like that, where do they?
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: Like you don't always want to think like that, but
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: you kind of do have to at a certain point.
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: It's like what do like these guys are some of
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: the like Kevin ol Contres on the forty man, He's
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: proving to be a pretty damn good center fielder. It's like,
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: what's going to happen with him? You know, like you
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: have to make a decision about how you use this guy.
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: Eventually he's gonna be out of options.
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: You know, he's not that.
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: Far away from that. He's been on the forty man
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: for a couple of years now. So these are just
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: like things that you have to consider. But yeah, they're
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: going to be aggressive. You would think two nice wins
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: come back when energetic wins, even if they weren't the
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: prettiest of baseball can can somehow spark something four in
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: Cincinnati and my yeah, four in Cincinnati, day off, three
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: in Tampa. This is this is winnable. Like we said,
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: like I've said, keep repeating it. But we're in a
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: stretch where the Cubs need to make up some ground,
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: build some confidence, figure some things out. They don't have
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: to play perfect baseball, but they need to get to
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: a point where they're looking better on the field.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: So, if you can win games here against the lesser competition,
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: it don't don't like either you end up being considered
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: the lesser competition or you start to stand out a
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: little bit and full away from the pack, right Uh.
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: And I think that's what we're headed here. In the
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: next few weeks. We're going to see where this team
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: is what they're what they're heading for, and really like
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: how aggressive Jed needs to be.
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: In a month and a half or two months whatever.
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: I don't know what data is June sixth or whatever it.
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: Is, so uh, yeah, Patrick, will we'll be back at
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: it on the off day.
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: I believe we'll have a podcast for you guys.
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: Uh, and you know, we'll see if we're talking about
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: a tough series in Cincinnati or what. But it's every
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: everything feels big right now as we look to see
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: if the Cubs can really fully turn the tide. Thanks
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: so much for listening. Uh, make sure you subscribe, rate,
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: and review the podcast. This is Northside Territory read Patrick
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: and my work at the Athletic.
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: And yeah, thanks so much for being here. Take care,