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Bodies Bodies Bodies with Korama Danquah · The Bechdel Cast

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: On the Bechdel cast the questions asked if movies have
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: women in them are all their discussions just boyfriends and
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: husbands or do they have individualism the patriarchy's effing vast
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: start changing it with the Bechdel.
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: Cast Caitlin yeah Jamie do you really not listen to
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: my podcast no I.
• 0:22
  Speaker 3: I do, and I like it. I'm not hate-listening to
• 0:25
  Speaker 3: it like the other people are saying.
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: What we do is we bring on one of our
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: funniest friends and we have a chat. Sounds awesome. Sounds awesome. Okay,
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: podcasters down. Podcasters down in this one. Maybe one of
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: the first, but certainly not the last, of horror movies
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: that are trying to get us to hate ourselves, but
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: it won't work because here we are. Welcome to the
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: Bechdel cast. Whether you like it or not, my name
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: is Jamie Loftus.
• 0:54
  Speaker 3: My name is Caitlin Durante. This is our show where
• 0:56
  Speaker 3: we examine movies through an intersectional feminist lens using the
• 1:00
  Speaker 3: Bechdel test as a jumping off point. So it's a
• 1:04
  Speaker 3: lot more than just hanging out with your smartest and
• 1:07
  Speaker 3: funniest friend. Although we do that too, such as today.
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: It's true. It's true. But Caitlin, what is the Bechdel test,
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: for crying out loud?
• 1:16
  Speaker 3: It is a mediometric test. created by friend of the
• 1:19
  Speaker 3: show alice and bechdel there are many different versions of
• 1:23
  Speaker 3: it the one that we use is do two characters
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: of a marginalized gender have names do they speak to
• 1:30
  Speaker 3: each other and is their conversation about something other than
• 1:33
  Speaker 3: a man and we also like it when it's narratively
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: relevant dialogue and not just like throw away nothing dialogue it's.
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: True And today we are covering a movie that is
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: one that we've been getting requests for since kind of
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: the moment it came out. And we've shown restraint. And
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: I'm glad we did because this movie is aging in
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: a very interesting way, I think. Even though it's but
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: four years old. We are covering Bodies, Bodies, Bodies 2022.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: And we have, as we've been doing a lot this year,
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: bringing back our all-time favorite guest for, is this her birthday?
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: The fifth?
• 2:09
  Speaker 4: Is it the fifth?
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: Wow, a lot of people hit, and this is where
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: we always promise you a jacket, and then it just
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: never happens to come in the mail. Never materializes. Someday,
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: you know, there will come a day. But oh my gosh,
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: coming on for her fifth appearance. Let's get our hilarious
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: friend that we podcast with into the mix. Our funniest
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: and smartest friend.
• 2:30
  Speaker 4: Yeah, there it is.
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: She's a writer and actor, and you know her from
• 2:35
  Speaker 3: our episodes on us. Get Out, Cheetah Girls, and Holes.
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: It's Karama Dankwa.
• 2:42
  Speaker 5: Hi. Welcome back.
• 2:43
  Speaker 4: Welcome back.
• 2:44
  Speaker 5: I can't believe I'm your funniest and smartest friend.
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 2:48
  Speaker 4: It's true. It's true.
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: I love hearing guests' past appearances because it either really
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: coheres to a theme or it's truly all over the map.
• 2:57
  Speaker 4: It's thrilling.
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: For your past movies, it's three horror movies, two of
• 3:03
  Speaker 3: them directed by the same director.
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. And then two movies for children.
• 3:08
  Speaker 5: I love children's films and I love scary movies. I
• 3:11
  Speaker 5: think being a child is scary. So, you know, it's true.
• 3:14
  Speaker 5: It's a world that's not built for children. They are
• 3:16
  Speaker 5: honestly one of the most marginalized groups in society right now,
• 3:20
  Speaker 5: but people don't want to talk about that. But anyway,
• 3:22
  Speaker 5: it's true.
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: Well, I was like, I guess that today is not,
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: this isn't quite the movie to talk about it, but
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: it is worth talking about. And especially every time we're
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: talking about child stars, which we've been doing a lot
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: this year, just, um, we have to protect the children.
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: And we also have to.
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: Protect the Gen Z influencers. So let's talk about that.
• 3:41
  Speaker 5: We must. They're very fragile. They're very breakable.
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: A protected class. This movie is so interesting.
• 3:49
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: Karama, we're so excited to have you back to sort
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: of unpack this one. And I guess, yeah, because it's
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: been a little bit of time now, what is your
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: history with Bodies, Bodies, Bodies?
• 4:03
  Speaker 5: So I saw Bodies, Bodies, Bodies in theaters when it
• 4:06
  Speaker 5: came out in 2022 at AMC Burbank 16. Got lost
• 4:10
  Speaker 5: in the parking lot afterwards. Usually when I get lost
• 4:13
  Speaker 5: in the parking lot after a horror film, I'm scared
• 4:15
  Speaker 5: that the killer is going to come after me. For
• 4:17
  Speaker 5: reasons we'll get into later, wasn't scared this time. I
• 4:22
  Speaker 5: didn't care for it. I left kind of disappointed. And
• 4:26
  Speaker 5: that's the only time I had seen it prior to
• 4:29
  Speaker 5: watching it again to discuss with you two. And I
• 4:32
  Speaker 5: actually liked it a lot more this time. So I
• 4:34
  Speaker 5: think it is fine whining for me personally. It's still
• 4:38
  Speaker 5: not a movie that I'm like, I want to watch
• 4:39
  Speaker 5: this once a year, but I have a lot more
• 4:42
  Speaker 5: appreciation for it, particularly from a writing standpoint. I think
• 4:46
  Speaker 5: that it has a lot of load bearing dialogue, especially
• 4:49
  Speaker 5: early on. And I think that it's well crafted. I
• 4:53
  Speaker 5: don't know that it's my taste.
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: Mm hmm.
• 4:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: I hear you.
• 4:57
  Speaker 5: What about you two?
• 4:58
  Speaker 3: I also saw it in theaters, probably also at the
• 5:02
  Speaker 3: AMC Burbank 16.
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 5:04
  Speaker 3: Because that's where I see 90% of the movies I
• 5:07
  Speaker 3: see in LA. And I had a similar initial reaction
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: as far as I'm not sure this is for me.
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: I thought bits of it were funny. I think that
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: it handled tension and suspense well enough. but it got
• 5:25
  Speaker 3: to a point for me where I was having trouble
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: suspending my disbelief. I think as soon as the gun
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: shows up, I'm like, I don't know about this. And
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: I found most, if not all of the characters pretty unlikable,
• 5:40
  Speaker 3: which I think is probably the point, but that makes
• 5:42
  Speaker 3: it difficult for me to then enjoy the movie. So yeah, I,
• 5:49
  Speaker 3: I didn't love it. And then upon this rewatch, um,
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: I don't know. I think I like need the conversation
• 5:55
  Speaker 3: we are about to have.
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: I feel the same way.
• 5:58
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 5:58
  Speaker 3: Really unpack how I feel about it now. But yeah,
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: that's where I'm at right now.
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: What about you, Jamie? Well, it's, it's so important to
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: have different experiences in the discussion because I actually saw
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: this at city walk when it came out. Oh my gosh, Jamie.
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: So yes.
• 6:16
  Speaker 4: So I thought I knew you.
• 6:19
  Speaker 5: At least it's the Valley. At least it's the Valley.
• 6:21
  Speaker 4: I am generally a Burbank 16 girly.
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: I've since, but I, this, I remember this movie came
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: out during a heat wave and my friend, friend of
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: the pod, Julia Claire was visiting and we simply needed
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: to be in air conditioning. And so that was how
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: I came to Bodies, Bodies, Bodies. Full disclosure as I
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: do it, which like at this point, it's like so
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: many people in comedy came up with Rachel Senate or
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: Iowa debris that it like it bears saying. And that's
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: like sort of why I'm like, we can wait a
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: couple of years to cover this. I think that the
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: performances in this movie are really good. I think I've
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: sort of had like or I don't know. I want
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: to have the conversation because I could definitely be swung.
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: But I was like kind of indifferent to this movie
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: when it came out.
• 7:06
  Speaker 4: That was fun.
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: There was definitely air conditioning. I think that was my
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: priority at the time. It's a fun summer thrillery kind
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: of movie. I didn't really think about it very much
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: after that. But now that we've actually covered this director's
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: next movie, Helena Rijn, who is, I believe, Dutch. We've
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: covered Baby Girl on the pod. A movie I like
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: much better that I think has a lot more to say.
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: And yeah, I don't know. Revisiting this, I'm like, I
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: think I like it a little less than when I
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: first watched it. But I also.
• 7:38
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: This is a tricky kind of movie for me where
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: I understand where it's coming from. I get that the
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: whole cast is supposed to be unlikable to different degrees,
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: but this feels like kind of, I'm trying to think
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: of what the millennial version of this movie would be,
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: but I do feel like every generation, there's a couple
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: of years of comedy movies that are trying to comment
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: on a generation and not quite getting it right. And
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: that is like a lot of what kind of was
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: bumping me with this movie. You know, this isn't a
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: Gen Z chat. However, I do feel like this movie
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: has a very low opinion of all young people and
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: trying to make it about class at the last minute.
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: So that was kind of what I was struggling with
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: was it just, it felt like this was a movie
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: that is like written and directed by women who are
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: elder millennials to Gen X. And it does feel a
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: little bit wave a fist in a cloud to me
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: in moments, but I'm willing to be swung. I like
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: literally all of the performances. Lee Pace is a delight. 2022,
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: it's so historically recent, but you're also like, oh yeah,
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: Maria Bakalova totally forgot about that moment. Feminist Borat, what
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: was happening? I know, I was like, what do I
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: know her from? Oh, the Borat sequel?
• 9:05
  Speaker 5: But Borat, what's it called? Subsequent movie film?
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: Yes, we did nominate Feminist Borat for an Oscar, and
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: we have to sit with that, and that was in
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: the recent past.
• 9:16
  Speaker 4: Anyways, I just think this.
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: Movie, I don't know, it feels like a stepping stone
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: that has led to, or maybe just Much better Gen
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: Z comedies that are made by people who have like
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: a little more insight into being like internet natives and stuff.
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: It was also, the story is by the writer who
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: wrote Cat Person.
• 9:37
  Speaker 4: So there's just like a lot going on here.
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: There's a lot going on.
• 9:40
  Speaker 5: Well, she wrote a whole script and I read it actually.
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: Stuff.
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: Okay, prepared. I'm so excited to talk about it.
• 9:48
  Speaker 5: I wanted you guys to give me an A in
• 9:50
  Speaker 5: podcast guest.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: Always.
• 9:53
  Speaker 3: I mean, again, you are our smartest and funniest friend.
• 9:57
  Speaker 5: What I found interesting, because before, i read the script
• 10:00
  Speaker 5: i saw oh this is written by kristen rupenian who
• 10:03
  Speaker 5: wrote cat person that's weird um i and i read
• 10:06
  Speaker 5: that there was a killer in the original script and
• 10:10
  Speaker 5: i was like oh i have to see this this
• 10:12
  Speaker 5: is curious i'm i'm very interested in and how this
• 10:16
  Speaker 5: is different. And we can talk about that a little
• 10:18
  Speaker 5: bit later. I have a lot to say.
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: I'm on the edge of my, because I also read
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: there was originally a killer. And, you know, I don't,
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: I guess I need more information. I do.
• 10:29
  Speaker 4: The ending of this movie is interesting.
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: I remember when I first saw it, it's like, it's
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: kind of a funny reveal. And it also kind of
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: feels like the movie's saying, fuck you.
• 10:40
  Speaker 5: Yeah. I felt like I was in Europe because I
• 10:43
  Speaker 5: was whelmed. Like, I just, you know?
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're like, okay, it's like, I'm not, it doesn't
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: feel bad to watch Pete Davidson, like, literally die by
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: his own sword. But, but yeah, I don't know. I'm
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: excited to talk about it.
• 10:59
  Speaker 5: I will say this is my favorite Pete Davidson horror movie.
• 11:02
  Speaker 5: It's not the only one that exists, and it's not
• 11:04
  Speaker 5: the only one that I've seen.
• 11:05
  Speaker 4: Wait, what are the others?
• 11:08
  Speaker 5: Oh, there's like a movie where he works in an
• 11:10
  Speaker 5: old folks home and there's a bunch of like weird
• 11:13
  Speaker 5: stuff happening and people are dying. It's called Home, I think.
• 11:18
  Speaker 5: I saw it in a Scream Unseen.
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: Now that's Burbank 16 behavior. Oh, my God.
• 11:27
  Speaker 4: I never heard of this.
• 11:29
  Speaker 5: It wasn't. Well received by many people, including me.
• 11:34
  Speaker 4: He's in a movie.
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: He's in an upcoming movie just called Bitcoin.
• 11:38
  Speaker 4: Don't know if it's pro or con.
• 11:41
  Speaker 3: Related, he's also in a movie called Dumb Money.
• 11:45
  Speaker 5: Oh, yes.
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: And what is Bitcoin but dumb money?
• 11:47
  Speaker 5: Oh, is that about GameStop?
• 11:49
  Speaker 4: Yes, that's the game. Yeah, the GameStop.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: I think that the I, Tonya guy directed that, right?
• 11:53
  Speaker 5: Oh, okay.
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: I think so. I saw that in theaters, not at
• 11:56
  Speaker 3: the AMC Burbank 16, but rather the AMC Glendale Americana.
• 12:01
  Speaker 5: Wow.
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: So, yeah.
• 12:03
  Speaker 5: Did you park at the Glendale Galleria and then cross
• 12:05
  Speaker 5: the street?
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: You bet your ass I did.
• 12:07
  Speaker 5: Frugal.
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: We like it. I'm not paying for parking. Everyone listening
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: to the show is like, Shut up. But that's why
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: we are. That's why I'm like, are there sections of Bodies, Bodies,
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: Bodies that I'm saying come on to because I am
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: the target of it?
• 12:23
  Speaker 5: Unclear.
• 12:24
  Speaker 4: Let's discuss.
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: But also, I don't know. The reveal that everyone is mean, shallow, vapid,
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: and has no brain cells to rub together. It just,
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: it's nihilistic in a way that I understand what they're
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: going for, but I didn't love it.
• 12:42
  Speaker 3: I know because it's like, is this a takedown of
• 12:45
  Speaker 3: young rich people? Just like wealth and the products of wealth.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: Is it a takedown of Gen Z? Is it a
• 12:55
  Speaker 3: little bit of both?
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: Because I'm like, if you want to comment on class
• 13:02
  Speaker 3: and the spoiled nature of most rich kids, fine. But
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: it feels like they're specifically targeting Gen Z kids. in
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: an unfair way.
• 13:13
  Speaker 5: Right like there are rich kids that are now rich
• 13:15
  Speaker 5: adults who are a major part of the problem right
• 13:19
  Speaker 5: and there's probably more to say about them than people
• 13:22
  Speaker 5: in their house you know what I mean just like
• 13:25
  Speaker 5: for a storm party right like institutionally but anyway.
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah there's stuff I felt yeah there's definitely stuff there's
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: there towards the end it just felt like it was
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: like really stuffing in the message in the last like
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: 15 minutes or so In a way that I was like,
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: I don't know if this is necessarily what I was
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: getting from this movie up till now. I also just
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: find the game confusing. The mechanics of bodies, bodies, bodies.
• 13:51
  Speaker 5: I do not understand the rules.
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: What is the game?
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: No, it's a bad game. Do you remember the made-up
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: game from New Girl called True American?
• 13:59
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: It's like that, where the rules make no sense.
• 14:03
  Speaker 5: My friends and I played that once. Wait, what is it?
• 14:05
  Speaker 5: The thing is, you don't care about the rules after
• 14:07
  Speaker 5: the first round because you're drunk.
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: So wait what what is i didn't watch i didn't
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: watch new girl.
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: It's truly a nonsensical game i couldn't i don't remember
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: really anything about it the.
• 14:19
  Speaker 5: Floor is lava at a certain point.
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: And okay yeah you.
• 14:22
  Speaker 5: Also have to make like a tower of beers and
• 14:25
  Speaker 5: you have to say fdr jfk like there's very little
• 14:28
  Speaker 5: about it that is structurally rules based.
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: Right. Interesting.
• 14:33
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 14:33
  Speaker 5: Much like with bodies, bodies, bodies, where, why are they
• 14:36
  Speaker 5: slapping each other?
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: So is that part of the game or is that
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: a separate game?
• 14:40
  Speaker 4: And is that about class?
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: Cause I don't think it was like, it's just like, okay.
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: I think I've already, I'm like, I think this is
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: movie is like fun, but ultimately all over the place.
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: There's also a movie that unfortunately written and directed by
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: a man. I'm so sorry, but a movie that like,
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: When there's a game happening like this, one of my
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: favorite parts of the movie is learning the rules of
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: the game. That's always one of the most fun sequences.
• 15:05
  Speaker 4: That's the whole Saw franchise.
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: Wow, Jamie loves rules. No, I love to play a game.
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: I love to play a game. No, no, no. I'm kidding.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: I'm the exact same way.
• 15:15
  Speaker 5: I love rules.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: I'm coming into my little tricycle and I'm saying, what
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: are the rules? I want to play a game.
• 15:21
  Speaker 4: What are the rules billy i want to.
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: Oh i chopped my own head off got it got
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: it got it because i'm poor right got it shrug
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: i the movie i was thinking of and i'm very
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: biased towards this movie because my friend is in it
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: but um it's what's inside did either of you see that.
• 15:40
  Speaker 5: No the only one inside i know is from waitress
• 15:42
  Speaker 5: the musical because i'm a nerd in a.
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: Different way and you're right to say it um It's
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: a movie that came out a couple of years ago
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: that has a similar setup where it's like old friends
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: coming together in a nice house. Class is a big component.
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: They haven't seen each other in a long time. But
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: it becomes a body swap horror comedy. which, so it
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: goes in a different place. I would highly recommend it. Oh,
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: I have seen that.
• 16:10
  Speaker 4: Yeah, David is the lead of it.
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. But one of the best parts is
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: learning how the game works because then for the rest
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: of the movie, you as the audience always know what's
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: going on and you're always kind of two steps ahead
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: of of you're waiting for the characters to get to
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: where you are and it's exciting and it's easier to
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: be like, don't go in there. Whereas with Bodies, Bodies, Bodies,
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: I guess I was sort of like, I guess you
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: can go in there. I have no idea what's in
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: there and I don't feel dread because I don't.
• 16:39
  Speaker 4: Know how this game works.
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: So I just feel like I was just like watching
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: influencers crawl around in the dark and I was just like,
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: why the hell not i don't know i just like
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: i didn't feel attachment to the characters because they were
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: intentionally unlikable but also it wasn't even like fun to
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: watch them die because i didn't understand how the game
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: worked and there didn't feel like an actual threat well
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: because they stopped.
• 17:04
  Speaker 3: Playing the game almost immediately and then i mean i
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: think that the basic premise of a slasher movie where
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: a bunch of people are killed and you have to
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: figure out who the killer is. And the twist is
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: there is no killer is like pretty fun as just
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: a general premise.
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: But I feel like.
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: Maybe the execution here, I don't know. I think they
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: should have given the script to me for some notes.
• 17:33
  Speaker 5: I actually, I was talking to my friends about this
• 17:35
  Speaker 5: movie last night after we went and saw the re-release
• 17:37
  Speaker 5: of Pan's Labyrinth. And one of my friends said, likened
• 17:42
  Speaker 5: it to the odyssey he was like oh it's the
• 17:43
  Speaker 5: odyssey which we thought was a joke because i had
• 17:46
  Speaker 5: just talked about how i realized that one of my
• 17:48
  Speaker 5: favorite childhood films was an adaptation of the odyssey the
• 17:51
  Speaker 5: pebble and the penguin nobody's ever heard of it it's
• 17:53
  Speaker 5: a musical martin short's in it it's great it's animated
• 17:56
  Speaker 5: if you ever want to watch it and talk about
• 17:59
  Speaker 5: it here would love would.
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: Love um listeners do you want.
• 18:03
  Speaker 5: That please jump in if you want it say it
• 18:07
  Speaker 5: in the comments um But I was like, oh, yeah,
• 18:10
  Speaker 5: it's the Odyssey. And my friend was like, oh, you know, Bodies, Bodies,
• 18:13
  Speaker 5: Bodies is kind of the Odyssey because it's like the
• 18:15
  Speaker 5: sea people. Everybody keeps talking about the sea people. But
• 18:18
  Speaker 5: then we are the sea people because there's no killer.
• 18:21
  Speaker 5: They are the killers.
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: Oh, right.
• 18:23
  Speaker 5: We thought he was joking. We're like, oh, you actually
• 18:25
  Speaker 5: made a very salient point. You're so smart.
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: Oh, my gosh.
• 18:27
  Speaker 4: God, man, you hate to see it. You hate to
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: see it.
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: You need to see a man making a good point.
• 18:33
  Speaker 5: It was his birthday, so we'll let him have it. Okay.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: Pam's Labyrinth is such a clutch birthday outing.
• 18:40
  Speaker 5: Right?
• 18:40
  Speaker 4: A thinker for your birthday. That does totally make sense.
• 18:44
  Speaker 5: Right? Yeah.
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: Okay. See, now I'm back.
• 18:48
  Speaker 4: This is tricky.
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: Let's take a quick.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: Break and we'll figure out what actually happens in the movie.
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: And I think I'm going to learn something. So we'll
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: be right back. And we're back. And we're back.
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: Okay, here is the recap of Bodies, Bodies, Bodies. We
• 19:19
  Speaker 3: meet a group of friends who are staying at a
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: big rich people house for a hurricane party because a
• 19:27
  Speaker 3: big storm is about to hit.
• 19:30
  Speaker 4: I like this conceptually.
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: I've never heard of this, but I like the idea.
• 19:36
  Speaker 5: I've fundamentally done something similar to this, but it wasn't
• 19:39
  Speaker 5: like on purpose. It was just that I was in
• 19:41
  Speaker 5: college when Hurricane Sandy happened. And I lived in a
• 19:44
  Speaker 5: frat house. and we were all like, let's just hang
• 19:45
  Speaker 5: out at the house and watch Purple Rain. So, kind of.
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: That sounds so wholesome.
• 19:52
  Speaker 5: I know.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: My version of that was when the whole city of
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: Boston was locked down because they were looking for the
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: marathon bomber, and everyone had to stay inside for a weekend.
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: I was there too.
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we were all there.
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: We were all.
• 20:09
  Speaker 4: drinking and refreshing Reddit.
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: What a time to be alive. What a time to
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: be alive.
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: Truly.
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: So yeah, they're gathering for a hurricane party. The friends
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: are Sophie, played by Amandla Stenberg, and her new girlfriend, Bea,
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: played by Maria Bakalova.
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: Amandla Stenberg, I feel like it is an interesting Rorschach
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: test of where you know them best from. Are you
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: thinking Amandla Stenberg of The Hunger Games? Are you thinking
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: of Amandla Stenberg of The Hate U Give? Or are
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: you thinking, as I was, Amandla Stenberg of Dear Evan Hansen?
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: Because let's not forget they were in Evan Hansen. We've
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: got to cover Evan Hansen on the pod. It's on
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: the docket.
• 20:54
  Speaker 5: I forgot they were in that. And they do stay
• 20:56
  Speaker 5: in casting.
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: I think they want you to forget.
• 20:58
  Speaker 5: They stay involved in casting controversy in a way that
• 21:01
  Speaker 5: I find fascinating. And I think there was some controversy,
• 21:04
  Speaker 5: not in the casting with this one, but there was
• 21:06
  Speaker 5: a review that was controversial about Bodies, Bodies, Bodies.
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: I remember that, yeah.
• 21:11
  Speaker 5: But I feel like they're always kind of in a
• 21:12
  Speaker 5: storm with everything that they're in. And right now it's
• 21:16
  Speaker 5: the Children of Blood and Bone casting, I think, that
• 21:19
  Speaker 5: they're in trouble for. Again? Yeah.
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: God.
• 21:26
  Speaker 5: Always, every day.
• 21:27
  Speaker 4: Leave them alone.
• 21:28
  Speaker 3: I remember all the horrible racist comments regarding their casting
• 21:34
  Speaker 3: in Hunger Games.
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: The Hunger Games, yeah. That's the big thing I remember.
• 21:37
  Speaker 5: And then the issue with The Hate U Give is
• 21:39
  Speaker 5: people were concerned that they were too light-skinned versus the
• 21:44
  Speaker 5: person on the cover of the book, which actually I
• 21:47
  Speaker 5: found out because on my long-deceased podcast, Popcorn Book Club,
• 21:51
  Speaker 5: We actually spoke to Angie Thomas, who wrote The Hate
• 21:54
  Speaker 5: U Give, and she told us that Amanda was cast
• 21:58
  Speaker 5: before they did the cover.
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: Oh, okay.
• 22:00
  Speaker 5: So I think that's really interesting.
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: And regardless, it's like bullying a teenager over a casting director.
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: It's like, leave them out of it. God, no. I
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: didn't realize that there was, I haven't been following Children
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: of Blood and Bone because fantasy franchises stress me out.
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: But I do remember now that you're saying this, the
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: review and the discourse that the Bodies, Bodies, Bodies review inspired.
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: Just let Amanda Stenberg live their life. My God. Leave
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: them alone.
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: Okay. So Sophie and Bea. arrive at the house, and
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: Sophie introduces Bea to her friends for the first time,
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: because it's Sophie's group of friends. The other friends are Jordan,
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: played by Myhala. I'm not sure if I said that right. Alice,
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: played by Rachel Sennett, and the much older guy that
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: she recently started dating, Greg, played by Lee Pace. There's
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: David and Emma, who are a couple... played by Pete
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: Davidson and Chase Swee Wonders. And the house they're in
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: belongs to David's dad, which is like this, again, huge mansion.
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: All of these people come from wealthy families. Several of
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: the friends seem not very thrilled to see Sophie because
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: she apparently didn't let them know she was coming. She
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: had sort of fallen off the face of the earth
• 23:34
  Speaker 3: and no one had heard from her in a while.
• 23:35
  Speaker 5: So.
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: There's some tension around that. There's also Bea seeming very
• 23:42
  Speaker 3: out of place and this friend group not really warming
• 23:45
  Speaker 3: up to her. Then it starts raining. The hurricane begins.
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: So they head inside. And as the night wears on,
• 23:54
  Speaker 3: they're dancing, drinking, they're doing drugs. We get a sense
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: of various dynamics between members of this friend group where David,
• 24:03
  Speaker 3: for example, is threatened by Greg and how handsome he is.
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: And he's jealous of the cool party trick that Greg
• 24:10
  Speaker 3: can do where he pops off the cork of a
• 24:13
  Speaker 3: champagne bottle with a sword that belongs to David's dad.
• 24:16
  Speaker 4: Which is pretty cool to see.
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: Which is pretty cool.
• 24:20
  Speaker 5: It is.
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: It's honestly a good trick.
• 24:22
  Speaker 5: That's a nice thing to impress somebody at a party.
• 24:24
  Speaker 5: I would be impressed.
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: That is really impressive.
• 24:27
  Speaker 5: I'd go home with them.
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: You know, I'm like, you know, maybe Pete Davidson, you know,
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: say what you will about his character, but you know,
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: maybe I would crash out in that scenario as well.
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: Because you just start putting a position where you simply there's,
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: there's no coming back from that.
• 24:42
  Speaker 5: I also love that Greg says, I just found this
• 24:45
  Speaker 5: on the wall. And I'm like, it was on the wall.
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: That's a good joke.
• 24:50
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: Oh, I feel, Greg, Lee Pace really is so delightful
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: in this movie.
• 24:57
  Speaker 5: A joy.
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: I feel like he uniquely knows what movie he's in.
• 25:01
  Speaker 3: So yeah, David is jealous of Greg. Meanwhile, Jordan and
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: Bea are sort of vibing right in front of Sophie.
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: So Sophie's like, what the fuck? Then Sophie suggests they
• 25:13
  Speaker 3: all play a game called Bodies, Bodies, Bodies.
• 25:16
  Speaker 4: And we're all like.
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: That's the name of the movie.
• 25:18
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: The game that we love to play.
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: That we know the rules to.
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: Maybe I'm realizing I'm obsessed with rules, but I love
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: a good, this is how you play the game sequence.
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: And they spent like 15 seconds on it. And then
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: they start slapping each other. I was like, I don't
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: know this game.
• 25:36
  Speaker 3: So the way they describe it, it seems similar to
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: games like Werewolf or Mafia, but Bodies, Bodies, Bodies makes
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: less sense. There are fewer moving parts and the moving
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: parts that are there don't track. So you're just like, huh?
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: But basically, as they describe it, they all have to
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: draw a scrap of paper. Whoever draws the paper with
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: an X on it is assigned to be the murderer,
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: but only they know that they are the murderer. Then
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: they turn off all the lights. The murderer has to
• 26:12
  Speaker 3: sneak around and touch someone to signify that they have
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: quote unquote killed that person who then has to lie
• 26:20
  Speaker 3: down and pretend to be dead. When this quote unquote
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: dead body is discovered, you call out bodies, bodies, bodies.
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: And then everyone else comes running and they have to
• 26:29
  Speaker 3: figure out who among them is the quote unquote murderer.
• 26:33
  Speaker 4: Is this a Dutch thing? Is this a Dutch thing?
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: Is Helena Ryan like everyone's going to know what this is?
• 26:39
  Speaker 5: Well, Kristen Rupenian came up with it.
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: Oh, right. Okay, so we don't even have Dutch plausible deniability.
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: I don't know why this drove me up a wall
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: on this viewing. I think you know what it is.
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: I just started watching The Traitors. And so I'm very
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: into like every rule of this game is so crucial.
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: And I love to watch the game be played.
• 27:05
  Speaker 5: Have you seen the movie The Blackening?
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 27:08
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 27:08
  Speaker 5: Yeah. I feel like you'd like that. It's all gameplay.
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: I know. Well, it's like that there, they, they have
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: a great gameplay sequence and you know what the rules are.
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: And so you're just locked in and the characters are
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: mostly likable.
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: And, and shout out to our blackening episode. We covered
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: it a year or two ago.
• 27:28
  Speaker 5: Wonderful. Wonderful.
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: So yeah, those are the rules of the game. the
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: quote unquote dead body ends up being Greg and everyone
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: else convenes to discuss who they think the killer is.
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: Things get pretty tense right off the bat. So Greg
• 27:47
  Speaker 3: goes to bed. He's like, I don't want to be
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: a part of this. And everyone is accusing David of
• 27:54
  Speaker 3: being the murderer. And he gets really aggro and defensive
• 27:58
  Speaker 3: about it and then storms off. Then the power goes out.
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: Maybe it was the storm. Maybe it was David turning
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: off the power. They don't know, but they disperse to
• 28:09
  Speaker 3: look for the breaker box. And B finds David outside,
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: his throat having just been slit. And it seems like
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: someone actually killed him for realsies. And so everyone is
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: freaking out. And no one has service to call 911.
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: They try to leave in Sophie's car. But the car
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: won't start because of Chekhov's. Bea accidentally left the light
• 28:38
  Speaker 3: on the mirror earlier and it killed the battery.
• 28:40
  Speaker 2: Sure.
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: And there are for some reason no other cars there
• 28:45
  Speaker 3: because their friend Max... brought them in his car and
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: then left the night before. And he was supposed to
• 28:53
  Speaker 3: come back, but he hasn't shown up yet. So no
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: one knows where Max is.
• 28:57
  Speaker 5: Also, he punched David prior to leaving. So there was conflict.
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 29:01
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: So they head back to the house and Jordan finds
• 29:05
  Speaker 3: the sword from earlier covered in blood. Then that seems
• 29:09
  Speaker 3: to be the murder weapon. So they start being like, well,
• 29:13
  Speaker 3: who killed David? Um, Was it the elusive Max? Was
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: it Greg? Because Alice reveals that she has only known
• 29:23
  Speaker 3: Greg for two weeks. So he's a wild card, more
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: or less. So they go looking for him. They find
• 29:31
  Speaker 3: some weird shit in his luggage. And then they discover
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: Greg in the like, home gym slash basketball court that's
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: just in this enormous house.
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: This scene is kind of a mess, but it is
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: my favorite scene in the movie. It's pretty fun.
• 29:47
  Speaker 4: Lee Pace in the middle. What is it?
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: The, like... light therapy mask.
• 29:53
  Speaker 5: Yeah. Right.
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: You're like, yeah, that is chilling.
• 29:55
  Speaker 4: That is a chilling thing to see.
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: He's like a foot and a half taller than everyone.
• 30:00
  Speaker 4: He's so, he's, he's far too big.
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: Like, right. Cause it's like these like five young women
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: trying to, so basically what happens is they come at
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: him with a butcher knife and a meat cleaver. And
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: at first he thinks that they're still playing the game
• 30:17
  Speaker 3: and that they're fucking with him, but things escalate. And
• 30:21
  Speaker 3: he moves like he's about to attack one of them.
• 30:26
  Speaker 3: He's got his knife pointed at Sophie, I think. And
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: so Bea strikes and kills him with a kettlebell. And
• 30:34
  Speaker 3: so now they have another body, body, body to deal with.
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: Fun that we do start by knocking off the two
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: men in the house.
• 30:42
  Speaker 4: It's like subversive. I'm listening.
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: I like it.
• 30:46
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: So then Sophie and Emma get into a huge argument,
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: but then they apologize shortly after and Sophie gives Emma
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: some drugs. I have no idea what those drugs are
• 30:58
  Speaker 3: because I'm too much of a square, but it's something
• 31:01
  Speaker 3: to take the edge off, I think.
• 31:03
  Speaker 5: Xanax? I don't know.
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: Shrug.
• 31:06
  Speaker 5: Are we supposed to know? Are we supposed to be
• 31:08
  Speaker 5: able to recognize drugs?
• 31:10
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: Sometimes I'm just like, wow, I was not invited to
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: enough parties in high school to understand what's going on.
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: Big parties that happened between ages 15 and 25, I'm like,
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: I'll have to.
• 31:25
  Speaker 4: Take your word for it.
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: Wasn't there.
• 31:27
  Speaker 5: Was not there.
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: So yeah, there's some kind of drug that Emma takes
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: And a short time later, Alice finds Emma's body, body, body.
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: It seems like she either fell down or maybe was
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: pushed down the stairs and she died. but they have
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: no idea what happened. They question who the killer was
• 31:51
  Speaker 3: in the game and if there's any correlation between what
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: happened in the game and what's happening in real life.
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: Rachel Sennett's character is really going on about this, but
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: it makes absolutely no sense because she's like, yeah, it's
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: following the same pattern. And it's like, no, it's not.
• 32:09
  Speaker 5: You stop playing the game before a pattern could be established. Right.
• 32:13
  Speaker 4: I wish they.
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: Again, I just wish they'd kept playing the damn game.
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: I know that they have no reason to, but it
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: is like we learn about the titular bodies, bodies, bodies,
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: and then 15 minutes later, they're just kind of flailing
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: around for the next hour. Yeah.
• 32:30
  Speaker 3: If we have one note, it's more rules.
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: I just want more bodies, bodies, bodies for crying out loud.
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: The game, not like dead bodies.
• 32:39
  Speaker 4: And why not both? Why not both? Por que no
• 32:41
  Speaker 4: los dos?
• 32:41
  Speaker 5: But.
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: Okay, so they're trying to figure out who the killer
• 32:46
  Speaker 3: might be. They start pointing fingers at Bea since they
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: don't really know her either. And Sophie has only known
• 32:53
  Speaker 3: her for six weeks. And they discover that she lied
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: about where she went to college. So she is not trustworthy.
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: And so Alice and Jordan kick Bea out of the
• 33:04
  Speaker 3: house and into the hurricane that's raging outside. So Bea
• 33:10
  Speaker 3: takes shelter in the car. where she finds a pair
• 33:14
  Speaker 3: of underwear that do not belong to her or Sophie.
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: So that's weird.
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: And we do get a sniff test. She does sniff
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: the underwear.
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 33:25
  Speaker 5: Yes. And also it matches a bra that she saw earlier. Yep.
• 33:30
  Speaker 4: Check out this bra.
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: I missed that.
• 33:33
  Speaker 5: Yeah. So Jordan, when they were looking for what's his face, Greg,
• 33:37
  Speaker 5: she was like, he's not in my bra. And it's
• 33:40
  Speaker 5: like a yellow bra that matches.
• 33:42
  Speaker 3: Okay, here is my other, here's another problem for me
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: with this movie is that most of it takes place
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: in the dark. There's only like flashlights lighting everything. So
• 33:53
  Speaker 3: I didn't know what was happening over half the time.
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: I could not see.
• 33:57
  Speaker 3: I was like, who's doing what? Anyway, so Bea sneaks
• 34:03
  Speaker 3: back into the house through a doggy door. And while
• 34:08
  Speaker 3: she's doing that, she sees Jordan with a gun. So
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: B comes in and accuses Jordan of being the killer
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: of killing David and Emma. At first, Jordan denies having
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: a gun, but then she starts waving it around. And
• 34:23
  Speaker 3: then she reveals that she and Sophie had sex in
• 34:28
  Speaker 3: Sophie's car like.
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: A few days ago.
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: Hence the mysterious underwear that B found. But Sophie denies this.
• 34:36
  Speaker 3: And then they're all like arguing and screaming about how
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: they all secretly hate each other. Alice says something that
• 34:43
  Speaker 3: really sets Jordan off. So Jordan shoots Alice in the leg.
• 34:48
  Speaker 3: They all start scuffling and then Alice gets shot again.
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: It kills her.
• 34:53
  Speaker 3: So now there's Alice's body, body, body. And then another
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: one when B throws Jordan from the balcony while Jordan
• 35:02
  Speaker 3: and Sophie are kind of like struggling and wrestling with
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: each other. And in her dying breath, Jordan tells Bea
• 35:10
  Speaker 3: to check Sophie's texts for proof that Sophie cheated on
• 35:14
  Speaker 3: Bea with Jordan. So Bea is like, hey, Sophie, did
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: you have sex with Jordan? And Sophie continues to deny it.
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: So Bea like just runs away. She like hides in
• 35:29
  Speaker 3: the house until the sun comes up. Sophie finds her again.
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: and admits that she might have been responsible for Emma's
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: death because she gave Emma those drugs and Emma probably
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: was super high and tripped and fell down the stairs.
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: And B is like, yeah, that's fine and everything, but
• 35:47
  Speaker 3: did you cheat on me? And she wants to see
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: Sophie's phone. So they start scuffling. They like fall in
• 35:54
  Speaker 3: the pool and stuff and then like scramble back out.
• 35:57
  Speaker 3: B grabs a phone, but wait a minute, it's David's phone.
• 36:02
  Speaker 3: And on it, they see a video of him trying
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: to do the champagne bottle opening trick that Greg did
• 36:10
  Speaker 3: at the beginning of the movie. And David accidentally slices
• 36:14
  Speaker 3: his own throat. So all of these people died slash
• 36:18
  Speaker 3: killed each other because of a murder that never actually
• 36:21
  Speaker 3: took place.
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: Because, yes, fragile masculinity was the killer part. all along
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: which is an idea I like in theory maybe not
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: as much in execution although I do I will say
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: that the video itself the Pete Davidson the Peter Davidson
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: performance of killing himself with a sword by mistake is
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: fun is fun I agree yeah.
• 36:45
  Speaker 5: I do I will third that I think that it's
• 36:48
  Speaker 5: very fun.
• 36:50
  Speaker 3: And then the movie ends with the elusive Max finally
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: showing up Seeing the chaos and all the bodies, bodies, bodies,
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: and being like, what happened?
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: And as with every movie of the 2020s so far,
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: it is inexplicably Connor O'Malley coming in for one scene
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: at the very end of the movie. I still don't
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: have a sense of who he is.
• 37:11
  Speaker 5: I don't know this man. Sorry to this man.
• 37:15
  Speaker 4: I like Connor a lot.
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: I think he's great.
• 37:17
  Speaker 4: And if you have... I don't know.
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: It's like if you date a certain kind of guy,
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: you will be hearing about him.
• 37:26
  Speaker 4: If you know, you know. And if you don't, that's fine.
• 37:28
  Speaker 4: If you don't, you're free.
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: Well, that's the movie.
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: So let's take a quick break and we'll come back
• 37:34
  Speaker 3: to discuss.
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: And we're back. And we're back.
• 37:48
  Speaker 3: Karama, is there anywhere you'd like to start?
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 37:54
  Speaker 5: Greg isn't wet. Greg isn't wet when they come and
• 37:57
  Speaker 5: confront him. And there's no way he could have killed
• 38:00
  Speaker 5: David without getting wet. I don't understand why nobody thinks
• 38:04
  Speaker 5: about that. His hair is dry. He is bone dry.
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 38:10
  Speaker 5: And I just feel like that's a key component. And
• 38:13
  Speaker 5: they're just so quick. To jump on the outsiders. First
• 38:17
  Speaker 5: Greg and then when Greg is dead, then Bea. And
• 38:18
  Speaker 5: they're like, well, we know you've killed somebody. She's like,
• 38:21
  Speaker 5: I killed somebody to protect you. What are you talking about?
• 38:24
  Speaker 4: That is very women's wrongs.
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: Women's wrongs abound in this one.
• 38:31
  Speaker 5: And I just, I find it interesting that the like
• 38:34
  Speaker 5: insiders are the first people to die. And the most
• 38:39
  Speaker 5: insider person is David as it's his house. He's rich.
• 38:43
  Speaker 5: He's white. He's cisgender. He's heterosexual. He's able-bodied. He's American.
• 38:48
  Speaker 5: He's a man. He is the majority. Like truly every
• 38:51
  Speaker 5: majority you can be.
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: The epitome of privilege.
• 38:54
  Speaker 5: Yes. And he's the first person that dies. And I
• 38:58
  Speaker 5: think that it's interesting that also when Emma dies and she's,
• 39:02
  Speaker 5: you know, this pretty actress, I don't think that she
• 39:05
  Speaker 5: is fully white, but she could, I think in some
• 39:08
  Speaker 5: instances present as more white. She's high as a kite.
• 39:14
  Speaker 5: people have been seeing her doing stuff all night, even
• 39:16
  Speaker 5: if they didn't see the stuff that Sophie gave her.
• 39:19
  Speaker 5: And she's at the bottom of stairs that are covered
• 39:21
  Speaker 5: in blood. But the immediate question is, who is responsible
• 39:24
  Speaker 5: for this? And I was like, is it possible? Is
• 39:27
  Speaker 5: it possible that she fell? I just, i think it's
• 39:30
  Speaker 5: interesting the the idea of when people like her and
• 39:35
  Speaker 5: david die somebody must be responsible and there's no investigation
• 39:39
  Speaker 5: beyond just like which of us did it meanwhile there's
• 39:42
  Speaker 5: a storm out what is the probability that somebody is
• 39:45
  Speaker 5: hiding in the storm coming to kill you guys for funsies.
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: That is a really good, I guess maybe this kind
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: of gets at, like, I feel like, I don't know,
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: we'll figure out in real time, like, what it, like,
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: isn't quite feeling right about this story. I do think
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: that there is, like, to your point, Karama, there are
• 40:03
  Speaker 2: the insiders and the outsiders, and they are treated differently,
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: but there is still this, like, mob mentality that seems
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: to form that I think in certain moments, like, just
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: doesn't really make.
• 40:19
  Speaker 4: Where it's just, I don't know.
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: I mean, the Lee Pace not being, not being wet,
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: I think is a very funny, like for, for a
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: movie that does seem to want to subvert horror tropes,
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: there are some like fairly like clear things to subvert or,
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: or like point out even in like a kind of
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: scream kind of way that it's, doesn't really happen i
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: feel like there's not always sort of the character having
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: that like wait can we take a second which i
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: think normally in these like in these setups you see
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: that i don't know.
• 40:55
  Speaker 3: I know and i feel like well i don't i
• 40:57
  Speaker 3: guess i don't really know what the intention of this
• 41:00
  Speaker 3: movie is if it wants us to think there is
• 41:03
  Speaker 3: a mysterious killer on the loose for most of it.
• 41:08
  Speaker 3: And we're wondering who it might be. Is it one
• 41:10
  Speaker 3: of the people that we have already gotten to know?
• 41:13
  Speaker 3: Is it a mysterious outside person who we don't know yet?
• 41:18
  Speaker 3: Is it this Max person who we haven't seen? Because
• 41:21
  Speaker 3: it seems like the movie wants you to suspect certain
• 41:25
  Speaker 3: people at certain times. If that's the case, I feel
• 41:29
  Speaker 3: like there needs to be There need to be more
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: red herrings.
• 41:33
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: More characters that we introduce that could be potential culprits.
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: The suspect, yeah, maybe that's like the reason that various
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: people become suspects never quite scans to me, I guess.
• 41:47
  Speaker 3: And to be clear, this is not like a feminism
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: critique necessarily. This is more of just like a screenwriting.
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: It's a structural.
• 41:56
  Speaker 5: It is trying to exist in a genre without actually
• 41:59
  Speaker 5: taking in the conventions of that genre i mean right
• 42:02
  Speaker 5: if it's a slasher film somebody needs a body needs
• 42:05
  Speaker 5: to drop in the.
• 42:05
  Speaker 3: First couple of minutes like a body body body a.
• 42:08
  Speaker 5: Body body body and we don't get any body bodies
• 42:11
  Speaker 5: bodies bodies until fairly far into the film.
• 42:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah about 25 30 minutes yeah.
• 42:17
  Speaker 5: Which you know end of first act okay fair i
• 42:20
  Speaker 5: will say in the kristen rupenian script it was like
• 42:23
  Speaker 5: page 46 of 91 when I finally get a body, body, body.
• 42:28
  Speaker 4: Tell us more about this. Tell us more about this script.
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: I'm so curious. Yeah.
• 42:33
  Speaker 5: So it is freely available online. If anybody is interested
• 42:36
  Speaker 5: in checking it out, I just like Googled Kristen Rupinian bodies, bodies, bodies. Um,
• 42:40
  Speaker 5: and I hope that I'm saying her name right, but, um,
• 42:44
  Speaker 5: it is at a cabin instead of a mansion, which
• 42:47
  Speaker 5: I think is interesting. Um, But it's a cabin with
• 42:50
  Speaker 5: a basement. So it's still very like rich people cabin.
• 42:53
  Speaker 5: But it's a snowstorm that's happening. And they have an
• 42:57
  Speaker 5: annual trip that they take for skiing. And it's this
• 43:00
  Speaker 5: friend group. A lot of the names are different. B
• 43:03
  Speaker 5: is still the same for some reason. And B is
• 43:06
  Speaker 5: Korean in the script. And there is one person who
• 43:10
  Speaker 5: nobody knows. Or not nobody knows. But he's the new
• 43:13
  Speaker 5: friend in the group. And they establish at one point
• 43:16
  Speaker 5: that they always have a new person that they bring.
• 43:18
  Speaker 5: They call them the wild card. And they are playing
• 43:22
  Speaker 5: Never Have I Ever in a hot tub. And they're like,
• 43:26
  Speaker 5: never have I ever been arrested. And then they find
• 43:28
  Speaker 5: out that David's been arrested before. And, uh, at the
• 43:32
  Speaker 5: end of the game, the new guy whose name is
• 43:34
  Speaker 5: either Scott or Matt, I can't remember because they're just
• 43:37
  Speaker 5: two double T names. And I was like, I'm not
• 43:39
  Speaker 5: going to know who's who. I can't see them.
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: Is that like theoretically who the, who becomes the Lee
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: Pace character?
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 43:46
  Speaker 5: Yeah. That is, I would say the Lee Pace sort
• 43:48
  Speaker 5: of analog. Um, so he puts his finger down at
• 43:51
  Speaker 5: some point during Never Have I Ever, but everybody's like, wait,
• 43:53
  Speaker 5: when did you put your finger down? And he's like, oh,
• 43:56
  Speaker 5: wouldn't you like to know or whatever? Okay. And so
• 43:59
  Speaker 5: then they decide to play Body Swappings. They play King's
• 44:01
  Speaker 5: Cup first. There's a lot of game in this, Jamie.
• 44:03
  Speaker 5: You might love it.
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: They want to play a game.
• 44:06
  Speaker 5: But they don't explain.
• 44:07
  Speaker 3: Damn.
• 44:07
  Speaker 5: They don't explain King's Cup at all.
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 44:10
  Speaker 5: Another.
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: You have to. And you have to explain the game.
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: I really am like begging you both to just watch
• 44:16
  Speaker 2: the introduction to the body swapping game and it's what's inside.
• 44:20
  Speaker 4: It's so satisfying. There's all these fun shots.
• 44:22
  Speaker 5: I'm going to watch the movie. I'm excited. I'm excited
• 44:24
  Speaker 5: about the game.
• 44:25
  Speaker 2: I love the game.
• 44:25
  Speaker 5: Yeah. So they play King's Cup and then they play Bodies, Bodies, Bodies.
• 44:29
  Speaker 5: They explain the game. They show somebody getting bored at
• 44:32
  Speaker 5: the rules being explained.
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 44:34
  Speaker 2: That was hilarious.
• 44:36
  Speaker 4: Wouldn't be me, but.
• 44:37
  Speaker 5: They're smoking weed and explaining the game. And then they
• 44:39
  Speaker 5: start playing the game. They actually play the game. Two
• 44:42
  Speaker 5: people die in game before we get into like craziness.
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: So they fake get killed.
• 44:49
  Speaker 5: Yes, they get fake killed. In the context of the game.
• 44:51
  Speaker 5: And they get into the mechanics and the like politics
• 44:53
  Speaker 5: of who is the killer and And they're like accusing people.
• 44:58
  Speaker 5: And there's a lot of logistics. And I was like, Kristen,
• 44:59
  Speaker 5: we can cut some of this.
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: I'm so sorry.
• 45:03
  Speaker 5: But it's like, if you were upstairs and you heard
• 45:05
  Speaker 5: so-and-so and da-da-da-da-da, then it has to be David and whatever.
• 45:09
  Speaker 5: So then the main character whose name, I truly cannot
• 45:13
  Speaker 5: remember anybody's name, Ashley. I think her name's Ashley. She
• 45:17
  Speaker 5: goes downstairs and she is like, wait, where did everybody go?
• 45:21
  Speaker 5: Because that's where all the dead people are supposed to be.
• 45:23
  Speaker 5: Nobody's there. The door to outside is wide open. They're
• 45:27
  Speaker 5: scared now. Maybe a drifter has come in. What's going on?
• 45:31
  Speaker 5: And then she's like, why is nobody coming when I'm
• 45:34
  Speaker 5: calling bodies, bodies, bodies? Cause I found a body, body, body, uh,
• 45:37
  Speaker 5: earlier and the lights are all out. So they have
• 45:40
  Speaker 5: flashlights and then they find their first dead body, but
• 45:44
  Speaker 5: they find all the bodies in quick succession and And
• 45:46
  Speaker 5: I will say, I read it this morning and like
• 45:48
  Speaker 5: I emailed you guys, I thought we were meeting an
• 45:50
  Speaker 5: hour earlier than we actually were. So I was skimming
• 45:53
  Speaker 5: a lot near the end because I was like, oh
• 45:55
  Speaker 5: my God, this is taking forever. But they find the
• 45:59
  Speaker 5: bodies like back to back to back and they're stuffed
• 46:02
  Speaker 5: in a closet. Most of them are stuffed in a closet.
• 46:05
  Speaker 5: And that's when they get freaked out. And then Matt
• 46:08
  Speaker 5: or Scott, one of them, one of them's dead, one
• 46:11
  Speaker 5: of them's new. comes down the stairs they're like where
• 46:14
  Speaker 5: have you been he was like oh sorry I passed
• 46:16
  Speaker 5: out I couldn't hear anything because he has been drinking
• 46:18
  Speaker 5: and doing drugs all night and so he was like
• 46:21
  Speaker 5: I fell asleep and they're like you fell asleep and
• 46:23
  Speaker 5: he said okay I passed out I was really high
• 46:26
  Speaker 5: sorry and they're suspicious of him he has the other
• 46:29
  Speaker 5: guy's keys and they're like why do you have his
• 46:31
  Speaker 5: keys you must have killed him and he says no
• 46:34
  Speaker 5: he gave me his keys earlier to go on a
• 46:36
  Speaker 5: beer run you saw it happen don't you remember but
• 46:40
  Speaker 5: they get really scared and then they kill him Um,
• 46:43
  Speaker 5: one of them kills him. I think it is Casey.
• 46:46
  Speaker 5: Casey kills him. Then there's just the three women left.
• 46:50
  Speaker 5: Like in the version we get, we kill all the
• 46:52
  Speaker 5: men first. Uh, and one woman, Liz dies. Also, I
• 46:56
  Speaker 5: I'm just throwing names at you, but, uh, we now
• 47:00
  Speaker 5: have B Casey and Ashley left. These are our final girls.
• 47:04
  Speaker 2: Sure.
• 47:06
  Speaker 5: And one of them realizes, Oh, we have to turn
• 47:11
  Speaker 5: the lights back on. It's not the storm. Somebody cut
• 47:13
  Speaker 5: a wire in the closet. If we just reattach the wires,
• 47:16
  Speaker 5: we'll be able to get service and we can call
• 47:18
  Speaker 5: on the landline to call 911. So Ashley goes in,
• 47:22
  Speaker 5: leaves B outside to do that. And Casey and Ashley
• 47:27
  Speaker 5: are inside and they start screaming while she's on the
• 47:29
  Speaker 5: line with 911. So B runs back in with the
• 47:32
  Speaker 5: phone and sees that Ashley has been stabbed by Casey. No, sorry.
• 47:38
  Speaker 5: Casey has been stabbed by Ashley. And each one of
• 47:41
  Speaker 5: them is accusing the other one. They're like, there is
• 47:42
  Speaker 5: nobody else in the house because they got blocked in
• 47:45
  Speaker 5: at one point also. So they're like, oh, somebody else
• 47:46
  Speaker 5: is in the house. It's not just us. There isn't
• 47:48
  Speaker 5: somebody else in the house. Each of them is accusing
• 47:50
  Speaker 5: the other one. And Ashley and Bea are dating. And
• 47:54
  Speaker 5: she finds out that Ashley has been cheating on her
• 47:57
  Speaker 5: with Liz, who is now deceased. And so she's like,
• 48:00
  Speaker 5: I don't know if I can trust you. And so
• 48:03
  Speaker 5: they decide we're just going to throw the the knife
• 48:06
  Speaker 5: under the couch and I'll just wait for the police
• 48:08
  Speaker 5: because she's called 911. And as they are waiting, B
• 48:12
  Speaker 5: gets up really quickly or like turns around for a second.
• 48:16
  Speaker 5: And then she sees that Casey has stabbed Ashley. And
• 48:18
  Speaker 5: she's like, Casey, why are you doing this? And she's like,
• 48:20
  Speaker 5: you guys have all been hanging out with my ex-boyfriend
• 48:22
  Speaker 5: behind my back because our ex-boyfriend cheated on her and
• 48:24
  Speaker 5: then was stalking her. So it's not like an unreasonable
• 48:28
  Speaker 5: thing to be upset about.
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: Sure.
• 48:29
  Speaker 5: Not this level of upset. And she said that, her
• 48:33
  Speaker 5: boyfriend knew she would be there because it's an annual
• 48:35
  Speaker 5: trip and they've cut him out of the friend group
• 48:38
  Speaker 5: in front of her. So they didn't invite him. They
• 48:40
  Speaker 5: invited her and they've been pretending to choose her. According
• 48:43
  Speaker 5: to the ex, she killed her ex, stuffed him under the, um,
• 48:48
  Speaker 5: under the porch, which he's like, I was going to
• 48:49
  Speaker 5: blame it all on him, but it's been so long
• 48:50
  Speaker 5: that he's probably frozen. So now I'm just gonna have
• 48:52
  Speaker 5: to blame it on you. And, uh, she stabs B
• 48:55
  Speaker 5: as the police are coming and she's, and she, she
• 48:58
  Speaker 5: pretends that she's in trouble, kind of like in Get Out,
• 49:01
  Speaker 5: where the girlfriend is on the phone. And she's like,
• 49:04
  Speaker 5: oh no, I'm so scared, help me. And she says
• 49:07
  Speaker 5: that as the cops are outside the door. She's like, B, no,
• 49:09
  Speaker 5: don't hurt me. And then like stabs B and slices
• 49:12
  Speaker 5: her throat. And she's like, I'm a white girl, they're
• 49:15
  Speaker 5: gonna believe me. And then the cops come in and
• 49:19
  Speaker 5: they get dispatched and they're like oh we hear that
• 49:21
  Speaker 5: the 911 dispatcher is still on the line and apparently
• 49:24
  Speaker 5: somebody's lying so then that's how they realize that Casey
• 49:27
  Speaker 5: is the real murderer and B with her final breath
• 49:31
  Speaker 5: calls Casey a liar and that's the end of the
• 49:33
  Speaker 5: movie okay I think that this is, I think that
• 49:38
  Speaker 5: the version we saw is stronger in a lot of ways.
• 49:42
  Speaker 4: I agree.
• 49:43
  Speaker 5: I agree.
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: I mean, I I'm curious, first of all, thank you for,
• 49:46
  Speaker 2: for reading that whole script. Of course.
• 49:49
  Speaker 4: It definitely does sound like, I don't know.
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: There there's elements that at least sound like address some
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: of the things that I found like a little bit
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: more frustrating about this movie, but also it also kind
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: of sounds like a mess.
• 50:01
  Speaker 5: And you know, that's why there are multiple drafts of things. I, yeah.
• 50:06
  Speaker 5: I'm fascinated that A24 bought this, though. And this was
• 50:09
  Speaker 5: A24' s first spec script that they purchased. Because usually A24
• 50:14
  Speaker 5: was just distributing films that had already been made prior
• 50:18
  Speaker 5: to 2022, I believe. And they were not producing their
• 50:20
  Speaker 5: own stuff. They were a distribution company. But this is
• 50:25
  Speaker 5: the first one that they ever bought. And I'm like, that? That?
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: Her i'm so curious if it was just truly like
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: one of those situations and oh you know whatever all
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: due respect to kristen ripanian i honestly the cat person
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: drama kind of entered and left me i don't have
• 50:45
  Speaker 2: a great recall on exactly where.
• 50:47
  Speaker 4: We landed as a culture on cat person but i.
• 50:50
  Speaker 6: Think we were cat person neutral by the end of
• 50:52
  Speaker 6: it i yeah i'm just like i just sort of
• 50:54
  Speaker 6: want it to be over but so that short story
• 50:57
  Speaker 6: came out in 2017 and they bought the script in
• 50:59
  Speaker 6: 2018 so i'm guessing it's just like oh this is
• 51:02
  Speaker 6: the writer of the moment let's see what she's got
• 51:04
  Speaker 6: and it.
• 51:05
  Speaker 5: It happened to be bodies bodies bodies and you know
• 51:07
  Speaker 5: good for her good for her good for.
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: Her because it is it is a good concept and
• 51:11
  Speaker 2: it's like a really hard concept to execute in a
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: way that's Fun and tense. I think that the reason...
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: I don't mind... I guess what I'll say is I
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: don't mind that the characters in this movie are not likable.
• 51:24
  Speaker 4: I get that that is the point.
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: But I think that if we are making all of
• 51:28
  Speaker 2: the characters so unlikable, I need a little more to
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: grasp onto in terms of who are they to each other.
• 51:35
  Speaker 4: We get so.
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: Because I'm thinking another, you know, a movie with a
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: different premise, but that also involves as a lot of
• 51:43
  Speaker 2: people's like first kind of lower budget or like first
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: break into a new country movie is, is we're in
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: one location and it's a group of friends coming back
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: together after a long time. This is a premise we
• 51:54
  Speaker 2: see all the time. But I was thinking of Companion,
• 51:58
  Speaker 2: which for all of its faults, you do at least
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: have enough of an idea of what the relationship of
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: the couple going into the house is before you get there.
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: And I feel like one of the big issues I
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: have with this movie is that, that Sophie and B,
• 52:14
  Speaker 2: I don't think we have enough of what their relationship
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: is before we throw B into the soup. And so
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: that was like, just from like a writing standpoint, I
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: found it a little tricky because I was like, what
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: is the problem in this relationship?
• 52:31
  Speaker 5: Like, I think what the difference, the core difference for
• 52:35
  Speaker 5: me in those two, and I do agree that Companion
• 52:37
  Speaker 5: is better at it, is that this is not the
• 52:40
  Speaker 5: first time they've met the friend group and Companion. So
• 52:44
  Speaker 5: she's like, I'm nervous because I already think they hate
• 52:47
  Speaker 5: me versus we don't really understand why Bea is nervous.
• 52:52
  Speaker 5: We get Sophie saying, oh, Jordan's going to be obsessed
• 52:54
  Speaker 5: with you. I don't know who Jordan is or why
• 52:56
  Speaker 5: she'd be obsessed with Bea. I don't know anything about
• 52:58
  Speaker 5: Bea except that she texts her mom. And allegedly works
• 53:01
  Speaker 5: at Game Hut.
• 53:04
  Speaker 2: And because they're... I mean, it's interesting to know that
• 53:06
  Speaker 2: B's character was originally Korean because it makes this whole
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: friend group seem anti-Bulgarian, question mark. And I was like,
• 53:17
  Speaker 2: does this happen? Are we... Like, so I just... There
• 53:22
  Speaker 2: are a few things that just, I don't know. Yeah.
• 53:24
  Speaker 2: That's a great point. It's like there, there's just like
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: the shared history was a little bit confusing to me,
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: both with the couple going in and with the friend
• 53:34
  Speaker 2: group once you get there. So I just feel like
• 53:37
  Speaker 2: I didn't have a lot to hold on to in
• 53:39
  Speaker 2: terms of like, I'm not rooting for the couple really,
• 53:45
  Speaker 2: because it seems like they seem like fine people. people
• 53:49
  Speaker 2: but like you know clearly maybe don't belong together but
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: like you're i don't know i just like i couldn't
• 53:54
  Speaker 2: find a character to be like yay except except honestly
• 53:58
  Speaker 2: because it's like it's so you're kind of going performance
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: to performance um we're like i don't know like i
• 54:05
  Speaker 2: just like the performances are good but the characters weren't
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: like written to like cohere in a way that made
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: sense to me it.
• 54:12
  Speaker 3: Seems like we are meant to be primarily empathizing with
• 54:19
  Speaker 3: b because we are seeing most of the story unfold
• 54:23
  Speaker 3: through her point of view there are some like omniscient
• 54:27
  Speaker 3: scenes but a lot of it we are with b
• 54:31
  Speaker 3: experiencing things through her point of view and compared to
• 54:35
  Speaker 3: the other characters she to me at least is definitely
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: the most likable because everyone else is so yeah vapid.
• 54:44
  Speaker 2: I like alice I was going to say, Rachel is
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: so fun to watch. For sure.
• 54:51
  Speaker 5: I don't want to hang out with Alice, but from
• 54:53
  Speaker 5: the perspective of watching it, I'm like, yeah, she's fun
• 54:56
  Speaker 5: for a night.
• 54:57
  Speaker 4: From one podcaster to another. Like a party.
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: A fellow podcaster.
• 55:02
  Speaker 3: And as Alice points out. A podcast takes a lot
• 55:05
  Speaker 3: of work. You have to organize the guest. You have
• 55:08
  Speaker 3: to do a Google calendar. You have to build a following.
• 55:11
  Speaker 3: It takes a long fucking time and we've been working
• 55:13
  Speaker 3: at it for a while.
• 55:14
  Speaker 4: And that's so true.
• 55:15
  Speaker 5: I'm proud of her.
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: We're proud of her.
• 55:19
  Speaker 3: And her podcast about hanging out with your funniest and
• 55:22
  Speaker 3: smartest friend.
• 55:23
  Speaker 4: Look, that's like 90% of podcasts.
• 55:27
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 55:28
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 55:29
  Speaker 3: So anyway, we're experiencing things through Bea's point of view,
• 55:34
  Speaker 3: which is fine. But I think then we also, yeah,
• 55:39
  Speaker 3: we don't get enough insight into the rest of the
• 55:43
  Speaker 3: character's Or even her. Because I almost feel like, so
• 55:49
  Speaker 3: attention is called to the fact that she is talking
• 55:52
  Speaker 3: to her, like texting with her mom a lot. I
• 55:55
  Speaker 3: almost thought that that was going to be revealed to
• 55:57
  Speaker 3: be a lie and that she was actually talking to
• 56:00
  Speaker 3: someone else and who's the big mystery of who she's
• 56:03
  Speaker 3: actually talking to. But then all of that just, to
• 56:07
  Speaker 3: quote A Star is Born, falls by the wayside. So
• 56:11
  Speaker 3: I'm like, well, then why did you even set that up? Right.
• 56:14
  Speaker 3: It feels like there are a lot of threads that
• 56:16
  Speaker 3: just kind of go nowhere. Because there's also the thing with,
• 56:21
  Speaker 3: it's implied that the reason Sophie shows up to this
• 56:25
  Speaker 3: gathering that she was invited to, but never confirmed that
• 56:28
  Speaker 3: she was coming to, never let anyone know that she
• 56:30
  Speaker 3: was bringing her new girlfriend, is that Sophie wants to
• 56:36
  Speaker 3: convince David to talk to her parents about, To get
• 56:42
  Speaker 3: her trust back because we learned that Sophie has dealt
• 56:47
  Speaker 3: with addiction issues and went to rehab and apparently got
• 56:51
  Speaker 3: cut off by her parents. And she's trying to get
• 56:53
  Speaker 3: cut on.
• 56:54
  Speaker 2: And that issue is both like very relevant to the story,
• 57:01
  Speaker 2: but also brought up. in a way that felt kind
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: of selective to like when the plot needed addiction to
• 57:07
  Speaker 2: be a plot point, if it came one.
• 57:09
  Speaker 5: It felt poorly handled. And I feel also just on
• 57:13
  Speaker 5: this thread, I feel like race was also poorly handled
• 57:16
  Speaker 5: in this quite because the only time that anybody ever
• 57:21
  Speaker 5: mentions race is when she's like, Oh, so when the
• 57:23
  Speaker 5: black girl does cocaine, it's a problem. But when the
• 57:26
  Speaker 5: white people do cocaine, it's fine. And I'm like, I
• 57:29
  Speaker 5: do think they all have a problem to be fair.
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: Sure.
• 57:32
  Speaker 5: And also there, but like, there's also a difference between
• 57:35
  Speaker 5: addiction and people who are doing cocaine and they shouldn't
• 57:38
  Speaker 5: be necessarily doing cocaine all the time. But like addiction
• 57:43
  Speaker 5: is a very specific thing. And it seems like she
• 57:45
  Speaker 5: had a problem. They describe her as like peeing on
• 57:48
  Speaker 5: the New York subway. Right. Which is not behavior that
• 57:51
  Speaker 5: we're seeing from anybody else in this. So I think
• 57:54
  Speaker 5: that like, there's this idea of her playing a black
• 57:56
  Speaker 5: card and these, these like identity politics. And she also
• 58:00
  Speaker 5: says feelings are facts, which is I think the most
• 58:04
  Speaker 5: insane line I've ever heard. And it just kind of,
• 58:07
  Speaker 5: that scene for me was the core of what my
• 58:10
  Speaker 5: issue with this movie is. It seems like a farce
• 58:12
  Speaker 5: about Gen Z as opposed to having real Gen Z
• 58:15
  Speaker 5: characters who have full interior lives. Like they definitely feel
• 58:18
  Speaker 5: like cardboard cutout Gen Z, which is fine. if that's
• 58:22
  Speaker 5: the thing that you're trying to say, but I don't
• 58:24
  Speaker 5: think that it says that well either.
• 58:26
  Speaker 2: No, it's like ultimately you have this movie from what
• 58:31
  Speaker 2: I mean, it was, it was written and directed by
• 58:35
  Speaker 2: white women in their forties. And I feel like you can,
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: and we love when women are making movies. However, this
• 58:43
  Speaker 2: movie is trying to bite off a lot and comment
• 58:45
  Speaker 2: on a lot in a very like satirical way that
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: I feel like maybe the team they assembled was not really,
• 58:52
  Speaker 2: Like speaking to your point, Caramba, like everything is acknowledged,
• 58:55
  Speaker 2: but like the way that it's brought up feels kind
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: of unnatural.
• 59:01
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I would be curious like what the actors make
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: of that too. Obviously they can't really say it when
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: they're promoting the movie, but I'd be curious to like
• 59:09
  Speaker 2: hear the recommendations. on this because it does feel in
• 59:12
  Speaker 2: a way that's like hard to quantify but it feels
• 59:16
  Speaker 2: like someone writing young people instead of something that feels
• 59:20
  Speaker 2: authentic which can be which can work anyways and can
• 59:24
  Speaker 2: be like campy and fun and I think in some
• 59:27
  Speaker 2: it's like when this movie is trying to be serious,
• 59:30
  Speaker 2: I'm kind of like, well, that's not the movie you
• 59:34
  Speaker 2: set up for me. And I don't really buy it
• 59:37
  Speaker 2: starting to be serious now. There's a lot of stuff
• 59:40
  Speaker 2: in that sequence. We get talk about that Bea is
• 59:46
  Speaker 2: taking care of her mother, who they specifically state has borderline,
• 59:50
  Speaker 2: which is, I thought, kind of out of pocket. Out
• 59:53
  Speaker 2: of pocket and very unspecific in a way that I
• 59:57
  Speaker 2: don't think really helps with the representation of borderline and
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 2: doesn't really seem to have much of an understanding of like, well,
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 2: what do you mean by that? You know, race is
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 2: brought up one time.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 2: There's like certain moments where we are supposed to be
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 2: taking these issues seriously. And then there's certain moments where
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 2: it's brought up as like, oh, these girls are too
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: woke for their own good. And it kind of will
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 2: oscillate between those ideas within the same scene. Totally.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I was struggling with that as well. Because, I mean,
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 3: so much of the dialogue is characters talking about or
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 3: saying phrases.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 4: They're like weaponizing therapy talk.
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 2: It's like, you're gaslighting me. You're toxic.
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 3: You trigger me. You're silencing me. And depending on the context...
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 3: like you said, Jamie, like those are serious issues. If
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 3: someone is being gaslit, if someone is triggering someone else
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 3: needlessly or deliberately or whatever, but a lot of times
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 3: in the movie, when characters say those things, it's the
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 3: punchline of the joke or it's almost presented as like
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 3: a satirical takedown of like Gen Z speak.
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 5: Again, the cardboard cutout of it all is interesting. Yeah.
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 5: And I do also, just again on race, I was
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 5: fascinated by the fact that the only black people in
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 5: this movie were both biracial. And also Chase Sweet Wonders,
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 5: I believe, is biracial. Yeah. And I think that there's
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 5: something interesting to be commented on there in terms of
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 5: privilege and people of color in spaces of privilege. And like,
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 5: who is invited to these spaces and proximity to whiteness
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 5: in these spaces that maybe is not for this movie,
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 5: but is something that I was thinking about. I don't
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 5: think that the movie would have handled it well based
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 5: on what we've got if they did try to tackle it.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 5: But that was just something I was extremely conscious of.
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 5: And I do think it's interesting that the actresses, Uh,
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 5: the actors, I literally earlier was talking about how I
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 5: don't like the word actress and then I just said it.
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 2: It's top of mind. It's top of mind.
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 5: Uh, the actors who play these two characters, one of
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 5: them is a biracial person with a white mom and
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 5: a black dad. The other person is a biracial actor
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 5: with a, which one did I just say? They, they
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 5: have different configurations of parentage. One has a white dad,
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 5: one has a white mom. And there's a lot of
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 5: discourse in terms of, like, black spaces about, like, quote-unquote
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 5: white mom biracials and how their proximity to whiteness and
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 5: the way that they behave is different because child rearing
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 5: is primarily a task taken on by the mother. So
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 5: I think that that could have been an interesting thing
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 5: to tackle. But I also, again, I don't know that
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 5: these are the people to do it.
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 4: But this movie. The writer-director.
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 2: Probably not.
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 5: I mean.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 2: it feels like there is like a lot with regard
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 2: to race that is like, that it would have been
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 2: possible to talk about in this movie that, I.
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 5: Mean, thinking somebody has a gun and then it being
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 5: a cell phone in her pocket. Right.
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 2: But then it's like, Oh, well, but it makes sense
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 2: to be, it's like, well, like, I don't think B
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 2: maybe gets, gets enough smoke for that. I, it's interesting.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 4: Like, I don't know.
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 2: And, and like you're saying Karama, like, I don't think
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 2: that this, this creative team would have been the team to,
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 2: to get somewhere, but it felt interesting where it's like,
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: everything is on the table, but race specifically felt like
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: the issue that everyone was like, it felt very like
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 2: post-racial the way that everyone was talking to each other,
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 2: but it wasn't like that on any other issue.
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 5: Like, well, it's, it's very not intersectional in the fact
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 5: that like, it kind of paints them all as everybody's rich. Right.
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 5: And that means that the race stuff doesn't matter because
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 5: they're all rich and, and, there's the famous scene where
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 5: Jordan's being told by Alice, your parents, like you're obsessed
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 5: with your rags to riches narrative, but your parents are
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 5: upper middle class.
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 5: And Jordan is like, they're not. And she's very attached
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 5: to this idea of being sort of below the rest
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 5: of them in a way, because I think that it
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 5: allows her not to examine the ways that she's complicit
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 5: or I don't know, in the trappings of wealth. but
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 5: you know and she's the one that understands because um
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 5: what's her face Sophie is like oh no David David's
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 5: dad wouldn't have a gun his politics check out and
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 5: then Jordan's like his dad is rich rich people have
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 5: guns and she's the one that understands wealth in that
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 5: way so I think she wants to distance herself from
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 5: it but you know she's kind of like picking at
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 5: things saying well yeah my parents are university professors but
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 5: it's public so that's different right.
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 3: This movie felt to me like an example of a
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 3: movie that is written and directed by white people that
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 3: acknowledges that their cast should be diverse. So the casting is.
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 3: is diverse, but then they didn't go back to the
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 3: script and make adjustments that they might've needed to make
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 3: based on the actors who they cast to play whichever character.
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 3: And that's why it feels to me like race is
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 3: for the most part ignored.
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 5: B being Korean in the other script also is never
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 5: acknowledged beyond a descriptor. I don't think they ever say
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 5: anything like no microaggressions, no macroaggressions, just like, they mentioned
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 5: she's Korean and then I don't think it ever.
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 2: Comes up again. But it's like, we're also told that
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 2: this group, I mean, and also this like team's conception
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 2: of how they're satirizing Gen Z in general would be
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 2: hyper aware of these things. And almost like it's made,
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 2: there's one joke about it with Alice's character where she
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 2: sort of does the, you know, the like flailing white
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 2: girl thing that, you know, every white.
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 4: Girl has done. of like, no, I'm an ally.
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 2: I totally get it. I understand. But again, it's like,
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 2: it's sort of just that one time. It just feels
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 2: like checking a box of acknowledging that this is something
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 2: that happens versus having it meaningfully work into the story.
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 4: And all of that, I.
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 2: Mean, everything we just talked about sort of is isolated
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: to one scene.
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 2: Toward the end. This all comes up in one scene
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 2: towards the end. And I didn't have time to watch
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: this twice to prepare today, but, like, I think for
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 2: a lot of the stuff that pays off at the end,
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 2: I think, like, sort of with the exception of, we
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 2: know that, like, Sophie's friends are having different experiences with
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 2: her returning to the group because of their experiences with
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: her when she was using. That is set up. I
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 2: didn't feel particularly, like, satisfied with how that is, like,
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: handled especially at the end where that is you know
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 2: like sophie has like relapsed which is very serious and
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 2: that is like stated she she both relapses and sees
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 2: something very very she sees emma fall down the stairs
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 2: and feels guilty because like of all these things and
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 2: b's response is let me see your phone and so
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 2: like that at the end is like acknowledged and like
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 2: that that should be huge and then they just kind
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: of move right and i don't know like it's just
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: the the end with what i think that where the
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: movie is like trying to say this is what it's
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 2: about i still sort of was like i don't know
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 2: i yeah i don't know we simply don't know.
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 5: Uh can we talk about how to I watched this movie, obviously,
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 5: when it came out. And then I watched Baby Girl.
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 5: I had a Baby Girl screener, so I watched it
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 5: shortly after it came out. And both of them have
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 5: Hedda Gabler. And when I re-watched this one, I was like,
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 5: wait a second.
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 2: Hold on.
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 5: Because in Baby Girl, Antonio Banderas is directing a production
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 5: of Hedda Gabler.
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 4: I totally forgot that. Oh, my God.
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 5: And Helena Rein, I don't know how I pronounce Dutch. Yeah.
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 5: this nice director lady is obsessed with Hedda Gabler. And
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 5: I went looking because I was like, has anyone talked
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 5: about this? And she actually did talk about it on
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 5: KCRW briefly. Wow. So they do a segment called The Treatment,
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 5: I believe it's called. And I just, can I read
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 5: really quickly from it?
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 2: Please.
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 5: So for her treat, I'm going to say Ryan. I've
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 5: decided that's where I'm going. For her treat, Ryan reflects
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 5: on her appreciation for Hedda Gabler, the iconic play from
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 5: 1891 by Norwegian playwright Henrik Ibsen. She first encountered the
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 5: work during her time at theater school in Maastricht and
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 5: found the role to be a rare opportunity to showcase
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 5: her full range as an actress. Playing Hedda off the
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 5: chance for her to dig into a character's full emotional depth,
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 5: unlike some of the more limiting roles she had taken
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 5: on before. Hedda struggles being stuck in an unhappy marriage
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 5: while having the ability to shape her own fate, delved
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 5: into the character's inner turmoil and existential despair. For Rhyme,
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 5: stepping into Hedda's shoes was not only a deeply fulfilling
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 5: experience as an actress, but also turned out to be
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 5: a big inspiration for creating Baby Girl. Wow. And then
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 5: later it says, she says that with a lot of
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 5: other roles, she felt very imprisoned and felt very limited.
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 5: And she felt that the man had the better role.
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 5: She always wanted to play Hamlet, but she always had
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 5: to be Ophelia. And she talks a little bit about
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 5: A Doll's House by Henrik Ibsen, which is also referenced
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 5: in Baby Girl when the daughter does the tarantella. And
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 5: I noticed that too. And I felt like none of
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 5: the reviews for Baby Girl were talking about Ibsen. And
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 5: I was like, there's so much Ibsen in this. And
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 5: I feel like we're not talking about it. But maybe
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 5: I'm just a little theater major.
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 2: You have to be the change.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 5: But I thought it was interesting that Hedda Gabler comes
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 5: up in both of these movies. And that she talks
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 5: so much about the fact that it was a three-dimensional
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 5: role for her. But it doesn't really feel like that's
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 5: implemented properly. And I know she didn't write this one.
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 5: And she did write and direct Baby Girl. And I
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 5: will say that Baby Girl does feel like Nicole Kidman's
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 5: character is more three-dimensional. But even in the performances, which
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 5: were good, I didn't feel like I was seeing three-dimensional moments. Like,
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 5: you just talked, Jamie, about the scene where Bea is like,
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 5: show me your phone after she's told this traumatic thing.
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 5: And I feel like there could be an expression of like, oh,
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 5: I see that you're struggling with this, but also through that,
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 5: I need to get satisfaction for the thing that I
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 5: need to know. Like, there was no push-pull in the
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 5: realization of that. And I think it's interesting that she's
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 5: obsessed with Hedda Gabler. And that's, like, a thing that
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 5: keeps coming up. And I just had to talk about it.
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 2: That is an incredible... I'm so... I totally forgot that
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 2: that Hedda Gabler is so directly, like, name-checked and in
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 2: the plot of Baby Girl. And like you're saying, like,
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 2: it does seem to be there with a little more
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 2: purpose maybe than it does here.
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 4: Because in this.
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 2: Because, again, with Bodies, Bodies, Bodies, I feel like this
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 2: is maybe... And maybe this is, like, a thing that
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 2: in the horror and horror comedy genre... is just kind
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 2: of being worked out or especially around 2022 is like,
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 2: is this a horror movie that you can like glean
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 2: societal messaging from? Or is this, is this a movie
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 2: about society being told through horror? And I feel like
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 2: this movie can't quite decide. Is it like a satirical
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 2: look at Gen Z or is it like, Are we
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 2: supposed to leave being like, wow, that really made me think?
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 2: It kind of goes back and forth, which is why
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 2: that scene towards the end where everyone's where it's like they're,
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 2: you know, it's basically setting you up for there is
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 2: no killer. This group of people, depending on how you
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 2: look at it, are either like not smart enough to
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 2: live or are too traumatized to live. Again, you're like,
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 2: which I don't really know. Which it is.
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 3: Or, like, too self-absorbed.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 2: Like, I don't... But going back to Emma, yeah, like,
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 2: Emma playing Hedda Gabler, if that.
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 4: It doesn't seem to, like, connect to.
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 2: Her character at all outside of, like, she is an actress?
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 4: Or does it?
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 5: I mean, there's one little thing where they have their argument,
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 5: and part of it is that Emma's like, no, I
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 5: loved David. And Sophie says, no, you didn't. You liked
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 5: having a boyfriend. And you were miserable. And I guess
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 5: Hedda Gabler is somebody who is trapped in a marriage
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 5: that she doesn't want to be in. So there is
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 5: that slight analog. But I do think overall, she barely
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 5: has a character, frankly. I think she probably has the
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 5: least character of anybody in this, which is saying something
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 5: because David dies very quickly.
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 4: So quickly.
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 2: And still does sort of get the last word of...
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 2: the movie, but, you know, many such cases. I do
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 2: like that twist, like, that they're, I don't know, like,
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 2: a slasher with no killer is a fun idea.
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 5: Speaking of no killer, do we know who the killer
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 5: was in the game, in the movie? Did we ever
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 5: find out?
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 2: We do find that out, yes. Oh, okay, I forgot.
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 5: Oh, it was Jordan.
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 4: In that, like, big info dump, yeah.
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 3: B comes back into the house after they kicked her
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 3: out into the hurricane, and she has seen Jordan with
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 3: a gun and says, empty your pockets. And Jordan empties
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 3: her pockets and she has the little paper with the
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 3: X on it. And so everyone's like, you are the killer.
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 3: And she's like, yeah, in the game. What are you
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 3: talking about?
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 5: I do think it's so messed up that Sophie lets
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 5: them kick B out of the house into a storm.
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 5: Like lock her in, lock her in a room. There's
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 5: 85 rooms in this house.
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 3: I did write down visibility of underarm hair.
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 4: On a woman.
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 5: Yes. Liked that.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 2: That's true.
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 4: That's true.
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 3: Jordan has underarm hair. I liked the line where Alice
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 3: is defending Greg when they think that he might be
• 1:14:22
  Speaker 3: the killer. And she says, he's a Libra moon. That
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 3: counts for a lot.
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 2: And you know what?
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 5: It does count for a lot. She was right. He
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 5: wasn't the killer.
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 2: He wasn't. That's so true.
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 5: She knew his heart. When Jordan has the gun and
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 5: Bea sees her holding the gun, I said, oh no,
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 5: Chekhov has entered the chat.
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 4: First Ibsen, now this.
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 3: Which like, again, that's the part that I'm like, what?
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 3: Jordan wielding the gun... And shooting Alice, I was like,
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 3: there were smarter ways. If everyone, if people need to
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 3: keep dying and bodies, bodies, bodies need to keep piling up,
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 3: there were just cleverer ways to do it. I feel
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 3: like there just needed to be a little bit more
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 3: backstory that gets established as far as. beef between characters
• 1:15:15
  Speaker 3: and they do attempt to do that, but I feel
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 3: like it just doesn't pay off in satisfying ways.
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 2: Maybe this is like, I'm like talking my way around
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 2: this over the course of this like hour, but like
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 2: there was like information about this friend group being withheld
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 2: from us that I don't think needed to be like, why? Like,
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 2: I guess that there's certain like reveals that are like, oh,
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 2: that actually would have been really helpful to know an
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 2: hour ago to like get me invested in this, character
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 2: like there's so many reveals about the friend group at
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 2: the end that like it just it felt like maybe
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 2: if that information had been paced a little bit differently
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 2: but sometimes by the time you find out something like
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 2: empathetic about a character they're either already dead or like
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 2: they're about to die so yeah it gets back to
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 2: the like I guess be on paper is the easiest
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 2: character to root for but she's not the most fun
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 2: to watch like so it's just it's it it's all
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 2: it's all over the place.
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 5: I found them all to become less likable as the
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 5: story went on too which i feel like if you
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 5: have an unlikable character you kind of have to make
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 5: them slightly more likable yeah right like they can say
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 5: unlikable but give them a quick moment of redemption.
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah save the cat for example or just more like
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 3: i mean with these like big hangout movies you do again,
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 3: like you get a moment where.
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 2: Everyone is kind of having fun together, but it's mostly
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 2: just like Sophie, like surveilling B is the focus of
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 2: the one scene where they're all technically bonding and like
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 2: having a good time, but there's no dialogue.
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 4: I think it's like mostly a Charlie XCX.
• 1:16:56
  Speaker 2: Song is playing and Sophie is like locking in on like,
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 2: I am not okay with this, with how B is acting. And,
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 2: and it, those, I don't know, like would have been
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 2: fun to have, you know, like those little friendship dynamics
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 2: that these actors, I'm sure, you know, would have been
• 1:17:14
  Speaker 2: wonderful at just like being like, oh, these two are
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 2: close for this reason or, you know, whatever, those little
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 2: things in these kind of hangout movies that just felt
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 2: like we, we kind of rushed through to get to
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 2: the game that we don't play. That they barely play.
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:17:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 3: Worth noting that several of the characters are queer. because
• 1:17:36
  Speaker 3: we have Sophie and Bea are obviously in a relationship.
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 3: Sophie and Jordan formerly dated.
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 2: I think is what's implied.
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 3: And at the very least, they had sex in Sophie's
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 3: car a few days prior.
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, all three of our final girls are queer.
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 3: And then there's also the scene where Emma kisses, well,
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 3: surprise kisses Emma, Sophie when Sophie is apologizing to her
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 3: after she had said some of the cruelest things a
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 3: person can say to another person and Sophie's like what
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 3: the hell like what are you doing why are you
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 3: kissing me and I also thought this was weird because
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 3: I'm like Emma's like isn't this what you wanted I
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 3: don't know if we are to understand that Emma is
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 3: also queer or if she is just kissing Sophie for
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 3: She's an enigma.
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 5: Who knows anything about Emma?
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 2: We know nothing.
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 4: She was Hedda.
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 2: She was Hedda.
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 4: And we know that. And that's for damn sure.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 5: Apparently, she wasn't that good, too.
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 4: And they just... Like, R.I.P. R.I.P.
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 5: God.
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 4: These friends.
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 2: I mean, obviously, all these people hate each other. They're like,
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 2: she's horrible in her play. Her podcast sucks ass. She
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 2: is normal style rich, unlike she says. Like, it's just,
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 2: I guess it's like, at the end of the day,
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 2: I just feel like this movie.
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 4: Is, like, not my thing.
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 2: I like unlikable characters, but this one doesn't really.
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 4: I don't know what.
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 3: I think the movie would have worked better if it
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 3: was more clearly a movie about class and commenting on
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 3: class and commenting on the uber rich and leaned away
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 3: from making fun of Gen Z and just focused more
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 3: on the class aspect of it all.
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 5: I also feel like there was so much like class
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 5: commentary film coming out in that era. We had like
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 5: The Menu, Triangle of Sadness. We had Glass Onion. And
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 5: if they were going to make fun of Gen Z,
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 5: just do that, no class or just do class, no
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 5: Gen Z. I feel like it does both poorly. And
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 5: congratulations if you enjoy this film. I love that for you.
• 1:20:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:20:02
  Speaker 2: No judgment.
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 5: I just, and I liked it more this time. So,
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 5: you know, it grows on you, I guess for people
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 5: like me, but it just feels kind of very in
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 5: between in a way that doesn't feel like it's committing
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 5: to anything.
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 3: I laughed at a lot of the jokes, but yeah,
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 3: it doesn't, the movie doesn't know what its intentions are
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 3: slash maybe doesn't really have clear ones.
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 2: And it's not like, yeah, and it's not like a director,
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 2: you know, that is not of a generation can't make
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 2: a smart, incisive movie about a.
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 4: Generation they're not a part of. But this movie did.
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 2: I did sort of leave this viewing being like, man,
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 2: I'm glad that Gen Z directors are like kind of
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 2: working now. Shout out Backrooms. Yeah, exactly.
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 5: I think as an actor, your acting coaches and your
• 1:20:49
  Speaker 5: acting teachers always tell you that if you have a character,
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 5: you cannot hate your character. And I feel that the
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 5: directors and writers do not like Gen Z and are
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 5: annoyed by them. And I think you have to love
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 5: something about them and that love has to come through.
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 5: And I didn't see any love. I could even take
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 5: all of the stuff that's in this movie if I
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 5: saw additional love of Gen Z in some way. And like,
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 5: you know, I'm not Gen Z. I love many people
• 1:21:18
  Speaker 5: who are Gen Z. Robert Pattinson, for one, famously Gen Z.
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 4: He's always saying this.
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 1: What?
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 4: That's not right.
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 5: No, no, no. He said in a Vanity Fair lie
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 5: detector test thing, he was like, I'm Gen Z. Doesn't
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 5: say I'm lying. No, exactly. So he's convinced he's Gen Z.
• 1:21:36
  Speaker 5: He believes it in his heart. But I do think
• 1:21:39
  Speaker 5: that like, Yeah, there are flaws with every generation and
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 5: there are triumphs that every generation has over the generation
• 1:21:46
  Speaker 5: before and the generation that follows. And I feel like
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 5: we don't see any of that in commentary on Gen Z.
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 5: It feels like a send up without like it's like
• 1:21:55
  Speaker 5: how roasts are not fun when it's just random famous people.
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 5: They were fun when it was comedians who knew each
• 1:22:02
  Speaker 5: other and who are like, we're going to hang out
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 5: and get a drink after the show.
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 5: Who were doing that.
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 2: Because we all actually like each other.
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 5: But, like, why is Ann Coulter at your roast?
• 1:22:13
  Speaker 2: We really lost the plot on that one. Yeah. Yeah,
• 1:22:17
  Speaker 2: I guess maybe that is getting a little closer to, like,
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 2: I mean, I think we're all millennials. But, like, it
• 1:22:23
  Speaker 2: kind of brought me, gave me war flashbacks of, like,
• 1:22:26
  Speaker 2: avocado toast commentary.
• 1:22:28
  Speaker 5: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 2: You know, and in a way that, like, you can
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 2: tell that the actors are care about the characters they're
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 2: portraying but but when you can't feel it in the
• 1:22:37
  Speaker 2: writing there's only so much the actors can do right
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 2: right yeah yeah.
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah exactly does anyone have anything else they'd like to
• 1:22:45
  Speaker 3: say about bodies times three justice for greg Justice for Greg.
• 1:22:52
  Speaker 2: Lee Pace.
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 3: We talked about him recently on our episode on The
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 3: Fall and how great he is.
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 5: He was a vet. He liked puppies.
• 1:23:02
  Speaker 4: I think that was my favorite joke.
• 1:23:04
  Speaker 2: That was silly.
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 3: They think he's like a war veteran and he's actually
• 1:23:09
  Speaker 3: a veterinarian's assistant.
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah. I was laughing.
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 3: This movie does have good jokes.
• 1:23:15
  Speaker 2: I'll give it that. Yeah.
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 3: It does pass the Bechdel test.
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 4: Handily.
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 2: Quite a bit.
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 5: Yes. Very well.
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 1:23:23
  Speaker 3: When Alice is talking to the other young women about
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 3: her podcast, it passes with flying colors.
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 2: Easily.
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:23:32
  Speaker 3: As far as our nipple scale though, where we rate
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 3: the movie on a scale of zero to five nipples
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 3: based on examining it through an intersectional feminist lens. I mean, they're,
• 1:23:42
  Speaker 3: There are things to appreciate about it, such as the
• 1:23:46
  Speaker 3: men die immediately and the women stay living, at least
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 3: a few of them by the end.
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 2: Queer women specifically.
• 1:23:53
  Speaker 5: Yes. Docket a little bit because Max is also alive
• 1:23:56
  Speaker 5: at the end. So they left one man alive unscathed.
• 1:23:59
  Speaker 2: That's true. Fair.
• 1:24:01
  Speaker 3: Because it is so all over the place when it
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 3: comes to things like race and class and it doesn't
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 3: really know what to say or have anything.
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 2: Seems like it's.
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 3: Wanting to say things. wanting to comment on these things.
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 2: But simultaneously saying that but like making fun of people
• 1:24:20
  Speaker 2: who do want to yeah right thoughtfully examine class and
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 2: race and things like that there it is okay there
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 2: it is okay we i i just felt an enormous
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 2: sense of relief it's it's just it's just like sometimes
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 2: i think especially in like comedy writing it's like if
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 2: you're going to be cringe, you have to own it.
• 1:24:39
  Speaker 2: You have to embody it. You cannot in the same
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 2: breath say, and anyone who says this, who.
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 4: Isn't me is an insincere loser.
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 2: Like, no, you have, you have to accept, you know? Right. Yeah.
• 1:24:51
  Speaker 3: So yeah, we got to the core of the issue
• 1:24:54
  Speaker 3: with this movie as such. I will give it two
• 1:24:59
  Speaker 3: and a half nipples. It feels like a split down
• 1:25:01
  Speaker 3: the middle for me.
• 1:25:02
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 1:25:03
  Speaker 4: What do you guys think?
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 5: I was going to say, I was going to say
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 5: two nipples. one nipple for keeping the women alive and
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 5: one nipple for visible armpit hair.
• 1:25:13
  Speaker 2: I'm going to go two and a half. I, I'm,
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 2: I feel, I mean, maybe I'm just like, because it
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 2: was written and directed by women. I want to, I
• 1:25:22
  Speaker 2: want to like enjoy it maybe more than I did, but, uh,
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 2: I think that there are Just, I don't know.
• 1:25:30
  Speaker 4: There's, like, right now I feel like.
• 1:25:31
  Speaker 2: We're kind of entering a renaissance of, like, Gen Z
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 2: comedies in general.
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 4: And we'll keep seeing that.
• 1:25:36
  Speaker 2: So this is, like, this was a start that's kind
• 1:25:40
  Speaker 2: of a blip.
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 3: We need to see Gen Z films by Gen Z.
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 2: Is the solution.
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 4: I mean, and we are, as a thing.
• 1:25:47
  Speaker 5: But I also will say, let women make mediocre movies.
• 1:25:51
  Speaker 4: Yes, exactly. Yeah, exactly.
• 1:25:53
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 1:25:53
  Speaker 3: Like, I love movies about, like, women misbehaving.
• 1:25:56
  Speaker 2: That's not the issue.
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 3: Mm-mm. Yeah, it's just that the movie hates its characters.
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 1:26:02
  Speaker 2: It's just like there's an open contempt for literally every
• 1:26:06
  Speaker 2: person on screen that didn't feel like there was a
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 2: reason that was clear to me. Anyways, Helena, Rain, Ryan,
• 1:26:17
  Speaker 2: I don't know where we fell there, but went on
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 2: to make a better movie immediately.
• 1:26:22
  Speaker 4: Exactly.
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 2: It's nice. It's like not every movie is going to
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 2: be an instant classic as, to your point, Karama, I
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 2: think the way that we talk about, or the way
• 1:26:31
  Speaker 2: that culture talks about marginalized filmmakers is you have to
• 1:26:36
  Speaker 2: be Ryan Coogler, no misses allowed. And for the majority
• 1:26:41
  Speaker 2: of directors, that's not going to be the case. For
• 1:26:44
  Speaker 2: most white male directors, that is certainly not the case.
• 1:26:47
  Speaker 2: So there's a leveling of the playing field here. This
• 1:26:50
  Speaker 2: movie is fine it's fine it's it's two and a
• 1:26:55
  Speaker 2: half nipples for me i'm gonna give uh i don't
• 1:26:59
  Speaker 2: know i'm gonna give one to amanda stenberg i'm gonna
• 1:27:03
  Speaker 2: give one to helena rhine's next film baby girl and
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 2: i will give the last the half nipple to the
• 1:27:12
  Speaker 2: sword the sword sword.
• 1:27:15
  Speaker 3: I really want to learn that party trick.
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 5: I think it's called sabering like it's like a whole
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 5: thing I could be lying. We'll never know. Cause we
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 5: are done.
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 2: There's no way to find out. There's no way.
• 1:27:29
  Speaker 3: Well, Karama, thank you so much for joining us for
• 1:27:31
  Speaker 3: a fifth time.
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 4: Congratulations.
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 2: Come back for a sixth. Of course.
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 5: Yes. I'm going to go into another hand. It's reverse.
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 5: Never have I ever.
• 1:27:40
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 1:27:42
  Speaker 3: Tell us where people can follow your work, follow you
• 1:27:46
  Speaker 3: on social media, et cetera.
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 5: People can follow me on social media, uh, Threads, Instagram, TikTok,
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 5: at KaramaDrama. K-O-R-A-M-A-D-R-A-M-A.
• 1:27:56
  Speaker 3: Hell yeah.
• 1:27:56
  Speaker 2: Hell yeah.
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 3: You can follow us on Instagram at BechtelCast. You can
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 3: subscribe to our Patreon, a.k.a.
• 1:28:02
  Speaker 2: Matreon.
• 1:28:03
  Speaker 3: That's the best way to support the show at Patreon.com
• 1:28:07
  Speaker 3: slash BechtelCast. And also you can support the show by
• 1:28:10
  Speaker 3: seeing us at upcoming live shows.
• 1:28:13
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 3: We will be continuing our 10-year anniversary tour in different regions.
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 3: We may have also already announced the next leg by
• 1:28:23
  Speaker 3: the time this comes out. If not, stay tuned. Go
• 1:28:26
  Speaker 3: to linktree.com for more information, for ticket links, etc.
• 1:28:32
  Speaker 2: And with that.
• 1:28:36
  Speaker 3: Should we all get together for a hurricane party?
• 1:28:39
  Speaker 4: No, we shouldn't.
• 1:28:41
  Speaker 5: Yes, I'll bring the games.
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 4: Yes, wait, what are the rules? Let's play a game.
• 1:28:47
  Speaker 2: I want to play a game. Bye. Bye. The Bechdelcast
• 1:28:54
  Speaker 2: is a production of iHeartMedia. Hosted and produced by me,
• 1:28:58
  Speaker 2: Jamie Loftus.
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 3: And me, Caitlin Durante. The podcast is also produced by
• 1:29:03
  Speaker 3: Sophie Lichterman.
• 1:29:04
  Speaker 2: And edited by Caitlin Durante. Ever heard of them? That's me.
• 1:29:08
  Speaker 3: And our logo and merch and all of our artwork,
• 1:29:11
  Speaker 3: in fact, are designed by Jamie Loftus.
• 1:29:14
  Speaker 2: Ever heard of her?
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 4: Oh, my God. And our theme song, by the way,
• 1:29:18
  Speaker 4: was composed by Mike Kaplan.
• 1:29:20
  Speaker 3: With vocals by Katherine Voskrasinski.
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 1: Iconic.
• 1:29:23
  Speaker 2: And a special thanks to the one and only Aristotle Acevedo.
• 1:29:27
  Speaker 3: For more information about the podcast, please visit linktree.com.