Latest / The Occult Rejects / RETURN TO WILLOWS WEEP — Digging Deeper Into America’s Strangest Haunted House

Transcript

RETURN TO WILLOWS WEEP — Digging Deeper Into America’s Strangest Haunted House · The Occult Rejects

• 0:02
  Speaker 1: You see, something's going to happen.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: What?
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: What's going to happen? Something wonderful.
• 0:14
  Speaker 3: What?
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: I understand how you feel.
• 0:18
  Speaker 4: You see, it's all very.
• 0:22
  Speaker 3: Clear to me now.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Occult Rejects. Today we're returning to Willow's Weep.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: with the girls from weekly bizarre podcast. We've got Jess
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: and Montana with us again. Uh, then again, and remember
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: we had covered this before. If you didn't catch that one, please, uh,
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: I mean, I wouldn't say shut this off and go
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: listen to the other one, but, um, there's going to
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: be a lot more probably background information on, on this
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: property done by Jess and Montana than you would hear tonight. So, uh,
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: I definitely suggest to go back and listen to that
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: one regardless. Um, Just a little bit of an update.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: You know, the house itself is gone, but the story
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: around is still full of questions. Once you get past
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: the paranormal TV version, you start finding a much messier
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: history involving the property, previous owners, documented deaths, alleged human remains,
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: the strange book found inside, the surrounding land, and a
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: whole lot of claims that don't always line up with
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: the records. So today, we're not just revisiting the haunting.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: We're digging into what we can actually prove, what might
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: have been exaggerated, and what still doesn't have a good explanation. Again,
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: the house may be gone, but the story of Willow's
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: Weep definitely isn't over. And today, again, like I said,
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: we got Jessa Montana joining me and Judith. Me and
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: Judith happened to, you know, when they presented this topic,
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: for some reason we both thought it was very interesting
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: and kind of went down rabbit holes with it. And
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: we both found different stuff, and we figured, like, why not,
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: you know, get the ladies back on and talk about
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: it again. So here we are. Before I introduce Jessa Montana,
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: Let me introduce Judith the Loon. What is going on, Judith?
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: How are you?
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: I'm fine. Thank you. Thank you for putting this together.
• 2:03
  Speaker 3: And I have to say thank you, ladies, because this
• 2:06
  Speaker 3: actually sparked something in me I thought was gone. thank
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: you for covering this topic. And, uh, it made me very,
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: very excited. I'm sure Nick could tell you how many
• 2:14
  Speaker 3: times he got texts from me. Very excited. And you
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: won't believe what I found. So I'm happy to take
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: a deeper dive in this with you guys and get
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: your opinion and everyone else. You could find me on YouTube,
• 2:26
  Speaker 3: Facebook X and Spreaker as the loon.
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: Awesome. No, thank you so much, dude. Like this is
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: definitely going to be, for me, it was fun. It was,
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: you know, cause then it sent me down a rabbit
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: hole too. And, I was like, oh, this is really interesting.
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: It kind of reminded me a little bit of how
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: we used to do shows a while ago on the
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: Occult Rejects when we used to do deep dives and topics.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: So it was definitely fun. And now we got the
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: ladies from Weekly Bizarre Podcast. What is going on? We'll
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: start with you first, Jess. How are you?
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: I'm doing well. Thanks for having us back on. It's
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: always a pleasure to see both of you. I enjoy
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: both of your companies so much. I'm very much looking
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: forward to this. I was so excited when you let
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: me know that you were actually going to do this.
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: I was like, oh, that'll be so cool. Because I
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: know that Judith was super excited as we were going
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: along with the last episode. I could tell just by
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: her body language. She's like, oh, I'm going to get
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: deeper into this. So very excited. Very excited.
• 3:27
  Speaker 3: Awesome.
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: Thank you for making it, for real. Montana, what is up?
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: Please let us know what's up with you and where
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: everybody can find all your work and everything. Please, promote
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: yourselves as much as you like.
• 3:40
  Speaker 4: Well, thanks for having us back. We love coming on
• 3:42
  Speaker 4: the show. We talk about it all the time. And
• 3:45
  Speaker 4: we're talking about having you on our show.
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: Yes. That's exciting. Yeah, hell yeah.
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: I mean, just like last time, you can find us
• 3:53
  Speaker 4: on all the social medias at Weakly Bizarre Podcasts.
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: Definitely.
• 3:56
  Speaker 4: Pretty easy to find. And we're on Spreaker now, too.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: Oh, nice.
• 4:01
  Speaker 4: So that's new for us.
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: Were you guys just on YouTube for a while? I
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: thought you were on audio. Anyway.
• 4:11
  Speaker 3: We are.
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: You just joined Speaker? We're like an app on Spotify. Oh, okay.
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: All right. So Speaker just happened to be. Okay. Gotcha. Gotcha. Nice.
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 4:18
  Speaker 4: This is brand new. Broadcasting Seeds. Bennett, he told us
• 4:22
  Speaker 4: about it.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: Oh, hell yeah.
• 4:22
  Speaker 4: So I was like, well, give it a try.
• 4:24
  Speaker 5: Oh, yeah.
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: You can monetize it, too. Make some money off of it.
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: Why not? Yeah. I mean, ads suck.
• 4:29
  Speaker 4: Sorry, guys.
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: But it's a lot of work. I, you know, I
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: was always big on like, for me, I try, especially
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: with what I cover. I just, I'm not totally comfortable
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: with charging people for shit. But I would like to
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: make some money off of what I do. So it's
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: just like, you know, for me to throw the commercials in,
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: it's like, instead of like, I'd rather do that than
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: be the dude who's like giving you 10 fucking reasons
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: to send me money. Like, I really hope that my
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: listeners would rather just deal with the commercials than hear
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: me trying to fucking come up with some excuse for
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: them to send me money or buy some crap they
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: don't need from me. So, you know, whatever. I think
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: the commercials, it's really not that bad considering the alternatives
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: listeners could have to deal with. I agree.
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah. One thing I do want to promote, too, for
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: both of you is you got to check them out
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: on Instagram if you're on social media. Definitely check out
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: their reels because they got some banging reels and they
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: do like, they cover stuff that I could be wrong,
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: but they cover stuff that's like not like on their show. Like, they'll, like,
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: you know, they actually do, like, I think now you've
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: got people sending you in stories and you're reading them, right?
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: Waiting for some.
• 5:35
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah.
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: No, I, yeah. Yeah. But, yeah, so go check out
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: their stuff. I think it's very well done. Thank you.
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: It's impressive. I wish I had time.
• 5:45
  Speaker 4: It means a lot. Thank you.
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: Of course, of course. I don't know which one of
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: you is. I know I kind of put you on
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: the spot. I should have told you a little bit
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: earlier than 1230 or a half hour before the show.
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: Do any of you want to kind of do, like,
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: even just a quick recap about you know, the issue
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: with the house. Yeah.
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: Hopefully it's not too shitty. Cause I did throw it together.
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: I'm so sorry.
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: No problem at all. I just pulled up some old notes.
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: So yeah, I'll give a quick little recap and then
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: you guys can take it away.
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: I can't wait.
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: So Willow's Weep is notorious for being one of the
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: most haunted places in America and It was a little
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: house built in 1890 in Cayuga, Indiana. It was allegedly
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: built by John Sykes and his family, which have a
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: pretty dark history there, which was kind of what snowballed
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: into deaths happening there, different suicides allegedly that have happened
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: there that have really given this place a dark reputation.
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: And eventually it was put in the hands of Dave Spinks,
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: who is a longtime paranormal investigator. And we don't know
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: if we like Dave Spinks or not. And I can't
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: wait to hear what you guys have to say more
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: about him. Because he's the one who eventually tore the
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: house down. And before he did that, he was allowing
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: other paranormal investigators to come through and, you know, do...
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: do readings, bring in the EVPs, the things like that.
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: And they were picking up some pretty dark shit and
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: some pretty dark things were happening to these, to these investigators.
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: One of the main things being a lot of times
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: they felt like they were kind of being controlled like through,
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: through just some dark energy, like giving them dark thoughts
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: of self harm, things like that. So that's a big
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: part of the history here. there are ties to native
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: American stuff. Allegedly there was a big presence there at
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: one time. So a lot of the speculation lies around.
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: Maybe some of this stuff is happening because of the,
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: the dark shit that happened to them there on the land.
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: But yeah, so unfortunately it's gone. And I think Judith,
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: you're going to go into more reasons for why that
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: probably is. Why they decided to tear it down.
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: And later on, I'll touch on it, but I just
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: want you to hold on to what you said about
• 8:23
  Speaker 3: people feeling it physically in their body.
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: That's key right there.
• 8:28
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: That was a big recurring theme throughout my research that
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: most people that went through that house in one way
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: or another were being influenced in that way.
• 8:40
  Speaker 3: Which is, Well, actually I'll just dive into that part
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: right there then, because, uh, we were, at one point
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: we were talking about the, um, minerals that may be
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: there on the land and I, they have an actual
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: website that give, uh, geographical, the geographical makeup for the, uh,
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: for the area. Give me one moment. I'm trying to
• 9:11
  Speaker 3: get to where I see. And they do tell you
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: what high concentration of minerals are in that area, which
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: is calcium and magnesium, sulfates and clay materials like precognitive
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: semulite and alee heavy clay. I'm not that good into minerals,
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: so I can't be precise on what that is, but
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: they also found a high concentration of iron. That's very key. Because,
• 9:41
  Speaker 3: and I just looked this up, when it comes to iron,
• 9:45
  Speaker 3: its main thing is initially to ground and work as
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: a defense barrier. Everybody saw Supernatural, so we know about
• 9:58
  Speaker 3: iron cutting through ghosts and everything. else. But it's also anchor.
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: It anchors for vitality. And I'm going to read this verbatim.
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: Iron does compromise under Earth and Mars, those two planets, astrologically,
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: if you want to go that route. But it also...
• 10:19
  Speaker 3: It's holding and wearing iron helps pull shattered, overactive, and
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: ungrounded mental energy back into the physical body, acting as
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: an energetic anchor. So it could come out as an
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: echo and taking form within the people residing in there
• 10:43
  Speaker 3: on that land with a high concentration of iron that
• 10:46
  Speaker 3: could bring on that overwhelming feeling of you know, dread
• 10:50
  Speaker 3: and everything else. If that place, and according for the
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: history of the original owners, was that miserable, it's trying
• 10:59
  Speaker 3: to disperse that energy and a new vessel comes. And
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: back then, I hate to say it this way, the
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: weakest form between male and female were the females. Because remember,
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: a lot of the females were the ones who were
• 11:11
  Speaker 3: always getting sick. And they're the ones who were either
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: getting sick or committing suicide. Well, the men committed, I
• 11:19
  Speaker 3: think it was more men that committed suicide. So that's
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: what I found out about the land that way. Just
• 11:27
  Speaker 3: with the minerals.
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the women would get sick and pass one way
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: or another. And then the men would be like wracked
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: with grief. And that's why they would take their lives.
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: I think that's how it was. Wasn't it, Montana?
• 11:43
  Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.
• 11:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah, because we made a comment like, why are the
• 11:46
  Speaker 4: men the ones killing themselves?
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 11:49
  Speaker 4: After their spouse died, yeah.
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: That is wild. That is interesting.
• 11:55
  Speaker 3: So that's what I found out about the minerals itself.
• 11:58
  Speaker 3: And I did find out on their website. It's maine.wsgs.wyo.gov
• 12:07
  Speaker 3: is where you could find out what that's makeup. I
• 12:10
  Speaker 3: was hoping to find quartz. I really was. Oh, yeah.
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: But the iron does work. Actually, it works, I think,
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: more effectively because it brings the negative energy into a
• 12:23
  Speaker 3: physical form, into the body, into that physical form that's there.
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: So that helps. To me, it helps explain the illness,
• 12:37
  Speaker 3: whether it be mental or physical illness. The females took
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: the physical form of the illness and the men took
• 12:42
  Speaker 3: the mental part because they ended up killing themselves. Which
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: would make, if you think about it, that means their psyche,
• 12:55
  Speaker 3: you don't know what they were seeing in their despair
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: or anything like that. And the iron did not help. Right.
• 13:02
  Speaker 3: And back then it comes off as a haunting.
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: So you're saying the iron made it worse.
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Because according to psychic energy, the physical body worked
• 13:17
  Speaker 3: as an anchor for whatever residual energy was there. So
• 13:20
  Speaker 3: instead of manifesting outside the body, it actually manifested within
• 13:24
  Speaker 3: their physical bodies. If you want to go that route.
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, makes sense. And I know a lot of the
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: people that we're actually seeing... ghosts, they were saying that
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: they were female a lot of the time. I don't
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: know if that has anything to do with that or not, but.
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: That's a nut. Well, that's unfortunately, that's a rabbit hole
• 13:53
  Speaker 3: I would love to go through, but unfortunately you would
• 13:55
  Speaker 3: have to speak to the people who was there because
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: then you would have to question what was the conditions
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: for the original family and how did they treat the women?
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: Because They didn't have a very good reputation in their
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: town either. And I did see a question about lead.
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: They wanted to know what lead does. Lead serves as
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: a powerful metaphor and energetic tool representing density, psychic defense,
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: and unrefined ego. I hope that answered your question, Eternal. Nick?
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, what's up?
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: No, no, I thought you.
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: No, I was listening to you and looking at the
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: notes that I had because there's stuff in there that
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: I don't even think I realized I had that I
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: was like, oh, that's actually really interesting. I don't think
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: I made the connection between them. Yeah, sorry.
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: Between which one?
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: No, there was stuff on the parcel. I was looking
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: at the owners now, and I was like, I don't
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: remember that when I made those notes, but I was like, wow,
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: that's really weird.
• 15:04
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: When I get to it, I'll get to it. I
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: wasn't trying to interrupt. I was listening to you and
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: kind of like had an aha moment looking at my
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: notes at the same time. And I was trying to
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: clean them up because there was a bunch of shit
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: in there that doesn't need to be there. I don't
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: know if you noticed. There was like extra shit in
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: our notes.
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: I didn't know about the pentagram shapes throughout the house itself.
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: But I did want to touch on the upside down cross.
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: That bothered me a lot.
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: Before we actually get into the house, because this, I guess,
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: you know, if you want to stay on the land
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: right now. One thing I did notice, the parcel itself,
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: the property is legally lot three, block one of W.C.
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: Colette's Addition. That would mean like if somebody bought a big,
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: gigantic piece of land and then chopped it up into
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: subdivisions to sell it out. All right. So that's where
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: it originally came from. It was a block one of W.C.
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: Colette's Addition. Now, W.C.E. Colette, this may not have anything
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: to do with it, but it's just, you know, it's interesting,
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: I think, to throw in there, especially people who, you know,
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: conspiracy theorists or whatever. Again, one of the major early
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: Colette landowners around Eugene Cayugu was definitely a Freemason. 19th
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: century of Vermilion County history says he joined, and this
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: is Joseph Colette, joined Ohio Lodge, number 30 of A.F.
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: and A.M. in November 1815. He also, uh, another Colette
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: describes him as a master Mason. So I even think
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: like the family was kind of involved. Uh, it gets
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: a little more interesting because the early Terre Haute lodge
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: number 19 records include Joseph Colette among its early members.
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: And that lodge actually held meetings rough, uh, from roughly
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: 1826 to 1820 house in a house associated with his brother,
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: Stephen Colette. Uh, so yeah. Um, Basically, all that is
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: to say that that property technically was originally bought and
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: sold off by a Freemason. So, I figured I'd throw
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: that in there. And, oh, you're muted, Judith. You just
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: muted yourself.
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: Sorry. What year was that?
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: Let me see.
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: Did he sell it?
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: I would probably think back in 1890 when it got
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: maybe around there. Let me see if I have an
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: exact date. It doesn't say when he got rid of it.
• 17:41
  Speaker 3: I noticed that that area did not keep meticulous records either.
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: It did show it, though, as 5173 North Elm, and
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: the year built, even the house being built on the property,
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: it shows that until 1890. But I don't know when
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: he got rid of the subdivision.
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: Wasn't Jesse Sykes alleged to be part of the Freemasons?
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: Did you stumble upon that anywhere in your research?
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: I tried looking into him. I'll just keep it real.
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: I guess I'm trying to be biased, but I'm not
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: trying to shit on anybody who has presented him as
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: being important, but there's actually zero proof that this guy
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: even owned that house or even died there. Yeah, that's like,
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: believe it or not, ChatGBT was like, oh, this would
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: be a great question to bring up, and it even
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: told me what proof is there of Jesse Sykes ever
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: even living in that house and dying there. Because it
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: knows he didn't. I was just like, how do you
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: bring that up? We're just going to keep it real.
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: There's no proof that that guy even had anything to
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: do with that house. So it's interesting how he's in there.
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: So the obituary that Dave Spade showed on the documentary
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: wasn't real?
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: It says there was nothing in any records that even
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: says he died inside that house.
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: But the obituary is online and everything.
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: I don't know. Maybe Chet GPT is wrong. But I
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: had asked it a few times, and it says there
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: is no proof that that person... Let me see where
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: I can find it again. You often hear that John
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: Henry Sykes was the original owner of Willow's Weep and
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: died in the bathtub in 1922. I can verify that
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: story exists all over the Willow's Weep mythology. What I
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: have not been able to verify is the important part,
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: a primary record showing Sykes owned this house and died there.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: until somebody produces the deed, census record, or death certificate
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: connecting him specifically to 5173 North Elm Street. Tree Road,
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: I am treating the bathtub death as lore, not established history.
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: And dude, ask Weekly Bizarre about this directly. This is
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: a great on-air question.
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: You know, he could be wrong or he, it could
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: be wrong. I can't believe I just fucking said shit.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: We call, we call chat GPT cheeks.
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: I call them all sorts of names to where he's
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: like starting to curse back at me now.
• 20:23
  Speaker 4: Fucking telling you AI take over. Yeah.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: But, uh, yeah, that piece of property though, uh, I
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: know that that, you know, it says that that guy
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: owned a huge lot or whatever, a huge parcel and
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: then broke it up in pieces. But I don't know
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: when it actually got broken up. That's all. I just
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: know it was originally a Freemason. So I figured, you know,
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: throw that in there. It's interesting.
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: But did they name the person he sold the house
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: to or anything like that?
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: Let me see. Let me look on what I have here. 1890s.
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: Let me see. I could try to find it. You
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: may want to maybe go on to something else, though.
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: Give me time to try to find that. It might
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: be in the notes, but that is interesting. You really don't...
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: I was kind of a little confused about that myself,
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: about who originally lived there. Because when you go by
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: the law, that's on TV. Yes, exactly. It's, yeah. I
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: really don't come across it. And I've like, this is
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: my third time I kind of did like deep searches
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: on it. So, I mean, I could have still missed it.
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: But like, I was trying to find that shit out myself.
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: And it just seems like it doesn't exist. Or it
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: just doesn't find it. I don't know. But it does
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: seem like there is a gap in between like, when
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: did this house actually show up and who built it?
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: And who lived there first? If that other guy didn't,
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: if that other person didn't, who the hell did then?
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: Who knows?
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: Someone had to build it. Right?
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: And why would there have been a connection with this
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: random dude in the first place, you know? Like, why
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: Jesse Sykes? Like, where did he even come into the picture?
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: It's kind of weird.
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: I mean, maybe his story. I don't know.
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: Who knows? Kiki might be an urban legend for that area.
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well, it was to help kind of like spice
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: up the story. I don't know. I mean, it could. Yeah,
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: I'll just be honest. I think because of the other
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: stuff that I'll probably get to, even the stuff with
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: the book, I'm pretty sure this guy, Spinks, knows he
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: was like overselling that. So it's like anything that, you know,
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't remember exactly what comes from
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: him and what. was known before his stories, but it's
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: like I do question some of it. Again, but I
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: think there's enough real shit there to make it interesting
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: anyway without embellishing. Right. But sometimes, that's the whole thing,
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: almost kind of like I was saying to you ladies
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: prior to the show. Sometimes the more actual intelligence shit
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: gets looked over and the sensationalized bullshit is what gets fucking,
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: oh my God, this is amazing.
• 23:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: And this could be proof of that. Yeah. You know,
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 23:26
  Speaker 4: You should have asked him to be on the show.
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: No.
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: No, if you check this out, if you check this out,
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: no way. It was funny. And I was like, yo,
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: this guy must not have watched the episode. Going back
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: a long time ago when Randall Nordica even kind of
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: first came out, we were just out for like maybe
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: a little bit. And me and the co-host I used
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: to have when the show first started, his name was Lux.
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: We covered the app, did a deep dive into it,
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: found out the programmers and everything, and it had, like,
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: total occult ties. I mean, there was one of the,
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: you know, again, doesn't mean it's nefarious, but we, you know,
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: we were like, you know, for some reason he was like, yo,
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: I have a feeling an occultist was behind this app.
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: And I was like, oh, let's look into it. So
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: we proved it, and they don't come out and say
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: that themselves. And one of the main guys whose face,
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: I forgot his name, for Randonautica, even hit us up.
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: He's like, oh, dude, I saw you covered the app.
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: I'd love to come on and promote it even more.
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: And I'm like, I don't think you really listen to
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: the show, dude. Wow, okay. Yeah. Sorry to drag that out,
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: but yeah.
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: Again, I had this thing look again one more time.
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: What we can establish is that the house at 5173
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: North Elm Street Road is recorded as being built around 1890,
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: and its legal description is Lot 3, Block 1, W.C.
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: Collette's Addition. That tells us the lot was part of
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: a subdivision carrying the Collette name, but it does not
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: identify the builder of the house. The Colette family absolutely
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: had major land interests in Eugene town and ship. I
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: don't think that has anything. Um, so the family was
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: involved in laying out and developing land there very early. Um,
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: we also know William Cole Colette, a son of Joseph
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: Colette inherited multiple tracks of Vermilion County land from his father.
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: And in a 1888 Indian Supreme court specifically deals with
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: those inherited lands. Okay. Um, But here's the gap. I
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: have not found the original plot deed showing exactly who W.C.
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: Colette was, who bought Lot 3 from him, who commissioned
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: or built the house in 1890. And that means the
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: John Sykes claim becomes really important. If paranormal histories say
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: Sykes was the first owner, the test is simple. Does
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: his name appear in the grantee for Lot 3, Block 1, W.C.
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: Colette's edition around 1890? If it does, we have something substantial.
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: If it doesn't, the story starts to fall apart. He's
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: dead set on saying that guy's not associated with the house.
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: I just have to say real quick because it's freaking hilarious.
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: Last time I was on here, I called it Elm
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: Street and you just did too.
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: Oh, did I? It's Elm Road, right? Elm Tree. Yeah, fuck.
• 26:20
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: Freddy Krueger, man. He got you.
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: Yo, it was funny. I even did the gematria on
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: Elm Street to see if it even matched anything. Once
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: I saw a Freemason own the property, I didn't get
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: anything crazy. And then it made me think of looking
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: up Elm Street. I was like, oh, maybe that means
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: something to gematria.
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: So is there a limited information?
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: I don't know. Before, he was just telling me it's
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: part of the mythology, but he says it says that
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: there's no proof of it, though. Who knows?
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: Is there limited information on the other homes that were built? Like,
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: is it just a thing in that town? Because I
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: know you said the records were pretty shitty.
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: Let me see. Is there limited information?
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: I'm just curious.
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: You know what? We should expand on that. It's shitty online.
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: Because I was thinking this whole time, I'm like, this
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: is a place that you probably have to visit and
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: go see the county records.
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: Because they probably didn't transcribe everything. And if you are
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: tired of the people coming over there due to the
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: sensationalism of this house, you wouldn't post any of that
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: online anyway.
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: That's true.
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: That's a good point.
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: What other things? Was there anything that you wanted to
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: mention before we went on to actual stuff inside the house?
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: There were two things I wanted to touch on. First,
• 27:56
  Speaker 3: what bothers me is the upside down cross emphasis that
• 27:59
  Speaker 3: this whole story has. And for me, because we grew up,
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: even I grew up with the inverted cross being compared
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: to Satanism, which was not true for the people back then. Actually,
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: it was, it's called a pentron. I'm probably saying it wrong. Peg,
• 28:21
  Speaker 3: Petron cross. And it was, it was a huge, it is,
• 28:27
  Speaker 3: I think still a traditional Christian symbol representing humility. And
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: it's a modern to St. Peter. I mentioned that. I
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: mentioned that before. So back then a house in the
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: form of an upside down cross was not seen as dark,
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: had nothing to do with the occult or was not
• 28:45
  Speaker 3: considered a satanic symbol for Christianity. the people of that time.
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: And matter of fact, from what I was looking till
• 28:53
  Speaker 3: this day, scholars and theologians note that the inverted cross
• 28:57
  Speaker 3: is historically a Christian non-Satanic symbol. That started with Eugene Ventress.
• 29:07
  Speaker 3: He's a French mystic, lived in the 1800s, and he
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: was condemned and accused of heresy by Pope Gregory XIV
• 29:23
  Speaker 3: in 1851. So, according to documentation, this whole theory for
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: the upside-down cross being connected to the occult and being
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: demonic is considered false. heresy. So that's sensationalism and it
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: blew up. And I'm actually curious of when this particular
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: house became popular and known. I'm wondering if it was
• 29:58
  Speaker 3: around that time when it was starting to catch momentum
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: with the sensationalism of the satanic theme. That's one. That
• 30:08
  Speaker 3: was back then. But if you go a little further,
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: I did ask the Native American thing. That was a
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: big area for Native Americans. They had two main tribes
• 30:19
  Speaker 3: in that area. The Kickapoo, and please forgive me for
• 30:26
  Speaker 3: mispronouncing this, Potawatomi, those two main tribes, was in that
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: area for a very long time. They were prior to 1890,
• 30:38
  Speaker 3: and there's a reason for that. And the sub-tribe was
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: called the Wee Tribe and the Pankasha Tribe. which also
• 30:48
  Speaker 3: housed the Miami, a series of Miami tribes within that area.
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: So people from the North and that, it was like
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: a miniature hub where people came to, they held their
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: councils at what they call the Big Springs, which was
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: located a mile North of Cuyahoga's modern location. So about
• 31:12
  Speaker 3: a mile outside of that was where everybody gathered for
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: their council meetings and everything else. This tribe was not
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: associated with the tribe because there was another nation, a
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: Cayuga nation based here in New York, but the Native
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: Americans there did not migrate there. Actually it was the
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: white settlers who migrated to that area and that's how
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: they got their name. And the United States enacted Indian
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: Removal Act enforced in the 1830s, but Indiana did not
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: enforce it until 1890.
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: The year the house was built.
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: Exactly. And I'm trying to pair up what Nick added
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: on with it already being subletted. And I believe you
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: said just that they had the land prior, a very
• 32:07
  Speaker 3: long time prior to And I immediately figured out that
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: they probably did hold the land, but not legally. And
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: once the removal act was enacted, that's when it was
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: safe for them to build their house and move on
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: from there.
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: Makes perfect sense.
• 32:28
  Speaker 3: Which does not dismiss that whole idea that the land
• 32:34
  Speaker 3: might have been cursed.
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah.
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: So the gathering place, you said it was like a
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: waterfall or something like that?
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: It's called Big Springs.
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: Big Springs.
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: And it's about a mile north of the town where
• 32:53
  Speaker 3: it is now.
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: I know that there were a couple different rivers that
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: ran through the area, too. I do remember that.
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: Which makes sense, because if you look throughout other Native
• 33:06
  Speaker 3: American towns, histories in the, in the North America, that's
• 33:10
  Speaker 3: usually where they gathered to where the, where there's mountains
• 33:13
  Speaker 3: and lakes and streams and everything else. Yeah. So it
• 33:18
  Speaker 3: did not say whether that was considered sacred ground to
• 33:22
  Speaker 3: those tribes or anything like that, but I could imagine.
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: And let's be factual. The, during that time when that
• 33:32
  Speaker 3: removal act was enacted, it was not the most peaceful removal.
• 33:38
  Speaker 3: at times. And which brings up, was there a slaughter
• 33:41
  Speaker 3: on that land too?
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: Well, I know there were rumors of that when I
• 33:45
  Speaker 2: was doing my research, they said that was like a
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: massacre had happened there or something.
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: But that wouldn't be written down. It would be word
• 33:54
  Speaker 3: of mouth. Cause you know, you don't want that written down.
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: Well, it must've been an important place if they were
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: gathering there for like council meetings and whatnot, it had
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: to be a place of pretty significant. importance i would
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: say one.
• 34:12
  Speaker 3: Way it makes you wonder if it wasn't a red
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: wedding situation oh oh that's dark i accept the light
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: in the dark and it's not it's not a good
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: part of our history here but the facts well i
• 34:29
  Speaker 3: can't say the facts because we have no proof but
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: it does uh it does uh brings up those questions
• 34:37
  Speaker 3: and thank you for that Jug because I was wondering
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: about mounds that's the one thing I couldn't find evidence
• 34:43
  Speaker 3: of that they had a lot of mounds there and
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: someone just said they had a lot of Indiana has
• 34:48
  Speaker 3: a lot of.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: Mounds so I think there was one either possibly on
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: the property or not too far from it I think
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: I found the first one I think I did mention
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: that on the first show but I didn't I actually
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: totally forgot about looking for that this time around.
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah So, I mean, it seems like the sensationalism that
• 35:10
  Speaker 3: brings this house about so much almost looks like a
• 35:15
  Speaker 3: cover story to me. I don't know if my mind
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: went too twisted on that one, but how do you
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: move away from something that disastrous and say, well, no,
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: this is what really is going on on this land?
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: Yo, this is really weird. I'm glad I looked this up.
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: I asked, do the Colettes ever have anything to do
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: with the natives? It says there are several documented connections
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: between the Vermilion County Colette family and the indigenous sites
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: and artifacts. The biggest one is John Colette, the Indiana
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: geologist and politician. He grew up at Eugene and later
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: became an Indiana state geologist. In 19th century Vermilion County history,
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: says the author, personally went to the Colette to numerous
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: earthwork mounds, uh, thickly scattered over his farm. Um, the
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: same source says bones had been found in many examined
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: mounds in quotes, Colette's own 1870 geological report discussing the
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: earthworks and the possible funerary use. So Colette families even
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: pointed out mounds and found bones. Uh, Then it gets
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: even weirder. Josephus acquired, who's Josephus Collette from 1832 to 1893,
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: acquired two medals that had been removed from an indigenous
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: burial near the Vermilion River west of Danville. The historical
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: account says erosion exposed the skull and human remains. Two
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: young men were subsequently dug in the grave and recovered them.
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: Two men dug in the grave and recovered the medals.
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: They passed through Samuel Chester and were eventually purchased by
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: Josephus Collette. John Collette was actively documenting native burials. An
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: Indiana archaeology publication discusses an account recorded by Collette concerning
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: a Shawnee burial. It describes a Shawnee group returning a
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: dead chief named Big Fire to a traditional burial location
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: carrying his body from the river and burying him with
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: his blanket, moccasins, ornaments, and weapons. The Modern Archaeological Journal
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: cites this to Collette's 1875 work. John Collette's archaeological work
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: was extensively enough that a 1913 history and park of
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: a million counties basically used his writings as its principal
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: authority for its chapter on the region's prehistoric and indigenous populations.
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: So they're definitely into Native American shit as well.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: A lot going on there.
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Even one of them is even saying
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: that there was mounds possibly used for burial, funeral shit
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: in that area.
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: What about the alleged body that they found under the
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: house and the mound under the house? Like with the
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: fire pit and.
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: The bone? There was one bone found and it was
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: never tested. So the thing is that basically it's just
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: this guy's word of mouth and a photo and whatever
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: is typed online. That is proof of an actual bone
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: being found. Because it's not documented by the police or anything.
• 38:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that was one of the things that we were
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: talking about with Dave Spinks.
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: It's like.
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: If you had a military background or what, I don't
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: know what he was before he was a paranormal investigator.
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: It was a police officer or something like that. And
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: you find a bone. You get it tested. Yeah, investigate further.
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: Not tear the house down and just bury it all.
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: Makes no sense.
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: Well, yeah, it's a chicken leg. I mean... But, yeah,
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: I mean, then I could even just jump over this
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: and kind of go back. Like I said, with that book, just,
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: you know, real quick, that's another thing. Again, I think
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: this guy, like, really churched up some shit or whatever.
• 39:23
  Speaker 1: Just trying to make this thing sound more than it was.
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: The book found in the house was Spirit World Pamphlet.
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: Cover of... If you look at his site, he shows
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: you a book and says that this book was supposedly found,
• 39:38
  Speaker 1: I think, underneath the floorboards or some shit. And the
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: cover is... Is there a real... The cover of Is
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: There a Real Spirit World? And that was put out
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: by the Worldwide Church of God in 1989. So now, again,
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: even that time date just totally blows his shit out
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: of the water. It just doesn't make it look as
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: old as it was supposed to be. This 25-page WCG booklet,
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: Worldwide Church of God, covers subjects like spiritism and channeling,
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: Nat Black magic, And it kind of goes over it
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: in a bad way, covering it as this is bad stuff.
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: So that is even kind of, in my opinion, Spinks
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: kind of made that to sound a little bit different
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: than it really is. Maybe he's confused and maybe he
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: doesn't know, but that's the truth about that book. It's
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: a 1989 book.
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: I wonder how it ended up there in the first place.
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: Maybe just... through renovations, it just fell down there or something?
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: The house was renovated. But then I think when the renovations,
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: I did have that down. I think the renovations were
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: done in the 1960. Major renovation added the kitchen and
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: bath updates.
• 40:59
  Speaker 3: Was that when the book was found?
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: I think the book was found more recently than long
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: ago because it was when he moved in. After he
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: moved in, I think, right? Wasn't Sphinx the one who
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: kind of found it?
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: I thought it was Brenda.
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: Oh, okay.
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: Brenda and her son were doing renovations, I think, and
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: they were replacing the floorboards.
• 41:22
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: And I guess that's how they stumbled upon it because
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: that was another one of the stories was when they
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: were replacing the floorboards, one of them flew at him
• 41:30
  Speaker 2: and smacked him in the head or something.
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: Who knows? I don't know.
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: I don't know what to believe anymore.
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: But one thing, too, just one thing I want to
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: throw in there, and it doesn't really mean much of anything,
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: but I just do wonder sometimes. The documentary that was
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: done by Spinks was crowdfunded also. I'm just putting that
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: out there. It wasn't his money, and then hope to
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: make it back. People threw money, and he made a
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: movie out of it. So just put it that way, too.
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: That's a bummer. Yeah. Just, you know, whatever. Maybe you
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: wanted to try to produce the best movie people wanted.
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: They gave him money for it. But back to what.
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: You said, once again, it's like, why did he, he
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: could have actually dug up some really cool shit about
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: this place and. promoted it that way in a legit way.
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: Oh, just with the, some of the stuff we came
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: up with here that like still doesn't really tell you
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: what's going on, but it just, you know, adds more
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: to the weirdness. You could have like ran with that.
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: I mean, some fantastical shit, at least use something that
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: was legit. You know, it came up with some Freemason
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: native American fucking spiritual war, some shit, you know, like,
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: but no, you had to like use some pamphlet, say
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: it was older. And there's this guy who's, there's no
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: proof that I've owned the house. That starts off the
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: whole thing, if you think about it.
• 43:03
  Speaker 3: The thing about it is that the money grab did work.
• 43:06
  Speaker 3: It did.
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: But yeah. That I even do again have at the
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: bone because it's right here with the book. There is
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: no official records at all that that was ever tested
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: or looked at.
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: Such a shame.
• 43:22
  Speaker 3: Hold on. Is there records that it was actually found to?
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: No, it's just really, uh, it's only going by what's
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: been like, uh, it's basically just like whatever you find
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: online or that's coming out of this guy. Like there's no,
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: nobody else. Like there's no proof or like anything. Like
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: that's the only time this shit comes up is because
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: it came out of his mouth. I think.
• 43:51
  Speaker 3: That air actually someone jug here. You're great. Um, That
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: area alone has, I guess, a lot. I did not
• 43:59
  Speaker 3: know this about Indiana. It has a lot of history
• 44:02
  Speaker 3: with giant bones.
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: Well, I've heard of it.
• 44:06
  Speaker 3: That's a very historical active area. And I almost guarantee
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: a lot of the stories from that area is not
• 44:14
  Speaker 3: on paper. That's something, if you want to dig down.
• 44:22
  Speaker 3: and I do not have the funds, unfortunately, to dig
• 44:25
  Speaker 3: this deep, you would have to visit the descendants of
• 44:28
  Speaker 3: those tribes and the descendants of those areas to find
• 44:31
  Speaker 3: out what that land really is. Because that iron issue,
• 44:43
  Speaker 3: it would take more, in my opinion, than someone dying
• 44:48
  Speaker 3: by getting eaten by pigs. To resonate like that. So
• 44:58
  Speaker 3: maybe the body, maybe those bones were found, but maybe
• 45:01
  Speaker 3: those bones didn't date back as far as they did.
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: Maybe it goes back further. Maybe it proves it was
• 45:09
  Speaker 3: a burial ground.
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that would make more sense, especially with the trauma
• 45:15
  Speaker 2: that's been recorded in the stone or the mineral deposits.
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: If it was actually affecting people on that level, it
• 45:22
  Speaker 2: would have to be more than, yeah, like you said,
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: the pig slaughter story.
• 45:26
  Speaker 3: And unless that man was pure, surely the devil himself,
• 45:33
  Speaker 3: which we don't know if he had the lion, there's
• 45:36
  Speaker 3: not that much negative energy that the body could hold
• 45:38
  Speaker 3: to cause such an effect.
• 45:41
  Speaker 2: I do remember. And again, like we don't even know
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: if Jesse Sykes was actually a person or not, but,
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: somewhere along the way they were talking about how he
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: had done something horrible to his daughter, essayed her, was
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: fined like 700 bucks for it and let go, like
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: slap on the wrist kind of thing. And allegedly his
• 46:06
  Speaker 2: reputation was, he was just a piece of shit, like
• 46:09
  Speaker 2: awful person, but he wasn't even real. I don't even
• 46:12
  Speaker 2: know anymore, but still would that be enough?
• 46:17
  Speaker 3: You know, The problem is, is that also during that
• 46:21
  Speaker 3: time you had a lot of settlers because remember prior
• 46:26
  Speaker 3: to maybe the 1830s, it was basically empty land. It
• 46:31
  Speaker 3: was where the tribes traveled back and forth. So you
• 46:37
  Speaker 3: don't know if he was actually born there. So there's
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: not going to be a birth certificate for that town.
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: for many people, because they were mostly an influx of people.
• 46:50
  Speaker 3: And we don't know, they kept records of the people
• 46:52
  Speaker 3: who migrated there and moved there. And he may have
• 46:59
  Speaker 3: existed and may have migrated there, but he may have been,
• 47:02
  Speaker 3: for all we know, the town drunk.
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: Right. So. Hmm.
• 47:17
  Speaker 3: Which brings the reason why the house was probably destroyed.
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: The original story, it mentioned, what was his wife's name
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: again in the original, in the story?
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: Jesse's wife?
• 47:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I don't think she was mentioned.
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: I think John's wife was because I'm pretty sure John was,
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: Jesse was the one allegedly slaughtered by pigs. John was
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: the one whose wife got sick with pneumonia, I think,
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: passed away, and then he ended up taking his life
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: in the bathtub. But I can't remember her name.
• 47:50
  Speaker 4: I think it's Catherine.
• 47:53
  Speaker 2: Catherine?
• 47:55
  Speaker 4: Don't quote me, but I think it was Catherine. Okay.
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: I was just going to say, John Sykes' memorial records
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: mention that he was married to Martha Ella Dickin in
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: 1880 and that they have three kids. I was just
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: wondering if this matches up with what is actually showed
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: as legal and provable. I was wondering if this differs
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: from what's even told in the story. That's the reason
• 48:21
  Speaker 1: why I asked.
• 48:24
  Speaker 2: Does it say how Martha died?
• 48:28
  Speaker 1: I didn't know. It may not tell me that because
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: it may not have thought I needed to know that.
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: I was just trying to see if there was anything
• 48:35
  Speaker 1: that even proved that John, well, first John, except now
• 48:39
  Speaker 1: I'm on to Jesse, if John even existed. And there
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: is proof that he did exist. And it said he
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: was married to so-and-so with three kids. I was wondering
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: if that was in the story.
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: I do remember mention of they had a daughter. That's
• 48:59
  Speaker 2: all I remember, though.
• 49:10
  Speaker 1: Interesting stuff.
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: Judith looks confused.
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah. No, I am too.
• 49:15
  Speaker 3: You're muted.
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: Oh, Judith's muted.
• 49:19
  Speaker 3: I'm sorry. I said that. I said, I wonder if
• 49:22
  Speaker 3: the family's still around. Because they would have those stories.
• 49:27
  Speaker 3: They would know those stories. Even if it's, you know,
• 49:29
  Speaker 3: one of those stories that is hush hush at family reunions.
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: It's interesting how these guys, like, even though You know,
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: I find it was really interesting is that, all right, like,
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: it's saying that these two men never lived at this house,
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: but where did they? Like, it's not even telling me, like, oh,
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: they lived here, this X, Y, and Z. This is proof.
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: It doesn't seem to be finding that either, which is
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: really weird. Like, where did these motherfuckers live if they existed,
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: if they're not fake? Like, why are they attached to
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: that house? You know what I'm saying?
• 50:07
  Speaker 4: I have a whole timeline right here. Like the birth
• 50:12
  Speaker 4: of the sons and daughters from Jesse Sykes. And it goes.
• 50:26
  Speaker 4: I don't know if this family is real or not,
• 50:28
  Speaker 4: but if they are, there's a lot of people in
• 50:29
  Speaker 4: this family. Yeah.
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know. I'm just wondering about that. It's like,
• 50:38
  Speaker 1: all right, if they did exist and didn't live there,
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: because it's saying there's no proof that there is, well,
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: where did they live then? I figured it would just
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: tell me that to show, like, oh, this is the confusion. Yeah.
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: Imagine there's no proof of where these people ever lived either.
• 50:55
  Speaker 3: Well, you probably had a lot of people living on
• 50:58
  Speaker 3: the outskirts.
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: I mean, I say this is also old. I mean,
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: late 1800s.
• 51:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 51:04
  Speaker 1: I get that, but... I don't know. Again, like, not
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: trying to say, like, it's definitely fake, fake, but, I mean,
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: if you have a family that you can't prove where
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: the fuck they lived, I mean, that's better than trying
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: to make up a story with somebody who can prove
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: they didn't live there.
• 51:21
  Speaker 3: The only thing I could account for not knowing where
• 51:24
  Speaker 3: they live is because back then, it's not like now where,
• 51:28
  Speaker 3: you know, you move and there's a house already there,
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: you already have a zip code, you have to register.
• 51:34
  Speaker 3: People were just going for free land. So they picked
• 51:37
  Speaker 3: up shop wherever. They could have lived on the outskirts
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: of that town and just not registered and just wanted
• 51:41
  Speaker 3: to be left alone. And that's where the record-keeping issue
• 51:48
  Speaker 3: comes up. The family, yeah, I believe they probably did exist.
• 51:52
  Speaker 3: Did they live on that land? Could have they just
• 51:58
  Speaker 3: picked up the place and found the place and said, hey,
• 52:01
  Speaker 3: this is our land and this is gone? Yeah, they
• 52:02
  Speaker 3: could have lived on the outskirts and From how people
• 52:06
  Speaker 3: talk about it, they may not have been a very
• 52:08
  Speaker 3: liked family.
• 52:11
  Speaker 4: I mean, it could have been a scandal where you
• 52:14
  Speaker 4: would have to go to the archives. I only say
• 52:16
  Speaker 4: that because my house was a scandal. And we only
• 52:19
  Speaker 4: knew that because my dad went to the archives to
• 52:21
  Speaker 4: find that out. But you would only know that you're
• 52:25
  Speaker 4: not going to read that online.
• 52:29
  Speaker 1: I don't know. In the documents, the only thing, Jesse
• 52:34
  Speaker 1: Sykes in the census for 1880, all that's there is
• 52:38
  Speaker 1: that he lived in Vermilion Township in Vermilion County. And
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: John Henry Sykes in his 1922 obituary says he lived
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: in a little home in the Horseshoe neighborhood. And Horseshoe
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: neighborhood is in an area, Little Vermilion, by Little Vermilion River.
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: But there's nothing that actually ever connects those two to
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: an actual address at all.
• 53:08
  Speaker 3: I don't think it's a coincidence that you, Nick, and
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: Jess referred it to Elm Street. Because that's exactly what
• 53:16
  Speaker 3: it turned out to.
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: So who knows? You know what I'm saying? It could be.
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: I mean, it did say that... They would be, the
• 53:27
  Speaker 1: areas that they think they might be referring to, they said,
• 53:30
  Speaker 1: I think is in like a five mile radius from
• 53:32
  Speaker 1: the house. So, you know, they could have been at
• 53:35
  Speaker 1: the house or it could have been just somebody who
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: lived very close by. And even that guy, I mean,
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: obviously you guys know, but like, you know, even when
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: that one guy died, that wasn't even at his house,
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: it was at the brother's. So that doesn't even tell
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: you where the fuck he lived. Yeah.
• 53:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: So interesting. Yeah. So regardless, we'll never, I guess, uh,
• 54:00
  Speaker 1: no definite proof on who the fuck started off the,
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: and who built it. Just said, never know.
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: That's weird. That kind of reminds me of the house
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: that I lived in. That was haunted. It was the
• 54:14
  Speaker 2: very first house I ever moved into when I moved
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: out and we were trying to look into its history
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: and couldn't find anything on it either.
• 54:24
  Speaker 4: It's weird.
• 54:27
  Speaker 2: Like, who built it? When was it built? Like, I
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: couldn't even find out when that house was built. It's
• 54:33
  Speaker 2: very wild.
• 54:35
  Speaker 4: We couldn't even find it on maps.
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: Mm-mm.
• 54:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: Which is, uh, I don't know. It's interesting. Like, I
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: don't want to put too much emphasis on the Freemasonry
• 54:52
  Speaker 1: being involved, but I wonder if that's the reason why
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: there isn't so many details about who the land got
• 54:59
  Speaker 1: passed off to. Could it have been, like, kind of
• 55:03
  Speaker 1: just kept it within the Brotherhood or something like that?
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: I don't know. Or is it just, you know, back
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: then maybe they weren't that nosy or just the information
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: didn't make it onto the internet at this point. Who knows?
• 55:16
  Speaker 1: But I just.
• 55:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I bet you could find out a lot more
• 55:18
  Speaker 2: if you went and visited.
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you'd have to actually go down to, like, the
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: town hall, right?
• 55:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 55:26
  Speaker 3: And dust off a nice big ledger in a dusty box. Mm-hmm.
• 55:32
  Speaker 1: That could get interesting. Yeah, I think pretty much anything
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: that I had, unless there's anything else extra in there,
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: I think I'm done with my information. Which I think
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: that was a lot said in an hour, actually.
• 55:46
  Speaker 3: You actually mentioned the pentagram.
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: Oh, yes, that's right. That's right, the pentagram.
• 55:52
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 55:53
  Speaker 1: There is, all right, the historic photos and footprint, no
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: publicly posted images pre-2024. The house was oriented northwest of
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: a rural intersection. And the house used to be often
• 56:05
  Speaker 1: called the Cayuga Crossroads House. I don't know if I
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: mentioned that before. You may have. I'm sorry. Its roof trusses,
• 56:12
  Speaker 1: an inverted cross, which we talked about, and interior wall
• 56:17
  Speaker 1: junctions form a pentagram shape. It says according to law,
• 56:22
  Speaker 1: but also visible on inspection. And then, yeah, so that
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: is interesting, too. I wanted to add that in there.
• 56:32
  Speaker 1: Thank you for telling me that.
• 56:35
  Speaker 2: I wonder if that's just coincidence with the way that
• 56:37
  Speaker 2: it's shaped, like the cross shape.
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Then again, like I had said earlier, back in
• 56:45
  Speaker 1: the day, crosses and pentagrams, believe it or not, would
• 56:49
  Speaker 1: have been used synonymously or could have been used synonymously
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: with Christianity. So, again, it doesn't even mean it's negative.
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: The way the house is, I think, situated, you know,
• 57:02
  Speaker 1: if you look at, you know, facing east, I think
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: that might make the cross actually upright and not upside down.
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: But I'm not sure. So who knows? But again, like
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: I said, it may not necessarily be a negative thing,
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: and it could actually be Christian symbolism or mystic. I'll
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: put it more that way, Christian mystic symbolism. And then again,
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: that being built like that on purpose, coming from somebody
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: who originally owned it was a Freemason, could be something
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: with that. Yeah. Which is why, again, maybe that's why
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: we don't know who the fuck took it. Because again,
• 57:40
  Speaker 1: you know, they may have kind of been like, fuck
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: the feds too. I mean, who knows? And was just like,
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: I don't want to give everybody this information. They weren't
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: even trying to be sneaky. Just thought it was overreaching government.
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: And said, fuck yourself. My brother Mason, he's got it now.
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: Why do I need to tell anybody this shit?
• 57:59
  Speaker 3: Which was the majority sentiment of people.
• 58:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's why he even said that. A lot of
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: them were actually kind of anti-government back in the day.
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: A lot of mystic and occultists and Freemasons, believe it
• 58:10
  Speaker 1: or not, were like, fuck the government. But not in
• 58:18
  Speaker 1: the anarchist sense, where it's like, you know, just free
• 58:21
  Speaker 1: reign to do whatever you got to do. Let's act
• 58:23
  Speaker 1: like human beings and fuck the government. So who knows?
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: Who knows, again, with that connection. Interesting stuff, though, with
• 58:33
  Speaker 1: this whole house.
• 58:35
  Speaker 2: Definitely.
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Thanks again for bringing up the pentagram. Totally forgot
• 58:39
  Speaker 1: about it. I was all excited when I found that, too.
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: I was like, ooh.
• 58:43
  Speaker 3: But I have to go back. Honestly, if... It does
• 58:47
  Speaker 3: come off suspect that the house was tore down. And
• 58:50
  Speaker 3: that's the one part that bothers me. Yes.
• 58:53
  Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.
• 58:55
  Speaker 1: You know what I was just thinking now? If we
• 58:59
  Speaker 1: do want to go off of, like, occult stuff, I
• 59:03
  Speaker 1: wonder if it would fit the Abramelin working. Because I
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: think it has to face east. and it may even
• 59:11
  Speaker 1: almost kind of look like uh like the way it
• 59:14
  Speaker 1: would be built i'm wondering now like if that property
• 59:17
  Speaker 1: was even built to do like ritualistic work in because
• 59:22
  Speaker 1: again like i think uh if you're going to do
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: the abramelon Believe it or not, your house or wherever
• 59:27
  Speaker 1: you're staying has to be built and directed in a
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: certain way.
• 59:33
  Speaker 3: Which would be aided by the huge deposit of iron, too,
• 59:41
  Speaker 3: if they thought it was a protective shield.
• 59:49
  Speaker 1: According to this, it does say that it does match
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: a bunch of, but not fully, qualifications to do the Abramelin.
• 59:59
  Speaker 1: But it says overall, Willow's Weep could have been adapted
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 1: for the Abramelin operation. But I would not say the
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: house itself was built to Abramelin's specifications. That's one thing,
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: believe it or not, with my chat GPT, it is
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: so fucking anal on being specific. Because, no, when I
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: cover certain things, especially when I want to get into
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: academic shit, I make sure, make sure you are not
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 1: giving me bullshit. This stuff has to be correct. because
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 1: I don't want to get caught out there. So now
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 1: even if I want to try to be a conspiracy
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 1: theorist with this cocksucker, it doesn't want to. Or it's
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 1: got to get explicitly specific, that this isn't correct and
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: it's a theory. There's no proof. It kills it. Even
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: if I try to do conspiracies with it, it just
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 1: makes it suck.
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 4: I noticed that with our UFO President series.
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 1: Did it try to, like, actually, like... Yeah. Or it
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 1: always wants to throw it, like, yo, baby, you should
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 1: make this claim. There's no proof on this.
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 4: Yeah, because he wanted to debunk how the... It wasn't a... Well,
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 4: I mean, it's all a conspiracy, but this is why
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 4: he believes it's real. And then Chad TPT was like, no,
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 4: this is the evidence they found. It's not real. It
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 4: completely just debunked everything. But.
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 4: Again, that's the point of conspiracies, so.
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah. you know mine gets like that a lot too
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: and it's like damn man like you're really thanks fuck
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: you um yeah so I don't know I was just
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 1: thinking again thinking you know Freemason uh the cross and
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 1: the pentagram being there was it some sort of uh
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: magical house so who knows or a magical lodge could
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: never know could it have been a lodge in the
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 1: first place you know it's.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 3: True too.
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: You never know that that is true I mean, and
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 1: I'm just saying, like, what if, you know, now I'm
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 1: really going down and, you know, making my own bullshit
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: up or chat GPT would be like, don't prove for this.
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: You know, for all you know, it could have been, like,
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 1: the reason you don't know whoever, like, built it or
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 1: did it is because it was built and made in
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 1: secrecy to begin with. And then just eventually you're like, oh,
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 1: we don't need it for whatever we need it for.
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 1: We'll just, you know, use it as a regular house now.
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 1: So-and-so bought it, you know, and just no written past about.
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: What the fuck it was used for because it was
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 1: made in secret. Who knows? I mean, again, I mean,
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: you got a secret society. Maybe the piece of property
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: of the house was supposed to be secret. Who knows?
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 3: It have a large amount of time where there was
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 3: no incidents at that location, too. There is a gap.
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there was like quite a few years.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 4: Who knows maybe he tore it down because there's nothing
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 4: real about it nothing.
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 3: I wouldn't say nothing real but he didn't there was
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 3: nothing supporting what he was claiming.
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 4: Yeah yeah alright let's just tear it down this is
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 4: a waste.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 2: I know toward the end of the documentary they were
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 2: testing one of the pieces of furniture because allegedly that
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 2: was where somebody had taken their life and they thought
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 2: that there were blood stains soaked into the chair so
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: he went in with that I can't remember what it's
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 2: called the spray that you spray onto blood and it
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 2: lights up.
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: And it didn't.
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 2: It didn't it was like dirt or something or wine
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: yeah yeah So it wouldn't surprise me if more incidents
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 2: like that happened where he was, like, forced to tear
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 2: it down because it was just a bunch of bullshit,
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 2: you know?
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 1: Oh, God. Imagine that happened and, like, he knows he's
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 1: bullshit and he's like, God damn. Like, yeah, why would
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: you even, fuck, spray your own shit if you knew that? Wow,
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 1: that's weird. He might have actually gotten, like, he had to, like,
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 1: just go along with it. Like, fuck, I might be
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 1: busted on this. You know what I'm saying? Somebody might
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 1: have even came up with it. Like, oh, we'll spray
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: it with that shit and get it on camera. And
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 1: he's like, oh, fuck. I'll just go along with it
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 1: and hope for the best. And maybe something will be
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 1: there and it'll glow.
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 2: Like, oh, it's been too much time.
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's degraded.
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 3: It's degraded, yeah. That's hilarious. Ugh. But I mean, but
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 3: this place had that reputation prior to him going there.
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 3: That's the thing. So it started somewhere. Someone did something.
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 3: Unless, you know, I hate to think of it this way.
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 3: Maybe they were trying to bring in tourists.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 1: Oh.
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 3: Think about how many paranormal amateur people would make that trip. Yeah.
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 2: A lot did, too, and a lot documented it.
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 4: Zach Bagans did it.
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 3: I'm sorry. We didn't hear that.
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he got cut off.
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 4: Zach Bagans did it.
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 2: Not that I know of, no. Which really surprises me.
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 4: Maybe he even knew. He was like, nah, I'm good.
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 2: That's really saying something.
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 4: That's my point. He didn't investigate it.
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 1: He has.
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 4: no interest in it.
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 1: Especially with like uh with even the freemasonry connection like
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 1: he could have probably somehow tried to twist there was
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: a ceremony done here i don't know if you ever
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: noticed that's like half of his shows that always claiming
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: there was ritualistic shit done there.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 4: Well he probably doesn't do his own research.
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 1: Are you guys are you guys fans of him Okay,
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 1: all right. I was going to say, you guys are trash.
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 4: Sorry if you are.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 1: No, no, I just wanted to make sure what I
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 1: could say. I mean, I'll watch this shit for entertainment purposes, but,
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's just horrible.
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 4: To be fair, when they first started, you can see
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 4: a big difference where he's, like, genuine, and then as
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 4: the show goes on, he's all about money. He becomes
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 4: a bigger asshole.
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 4: No, I love his museum, though. So give me shit
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 4: for that. But it's really cool. But everyone that worked
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 4: for him, we looked it up on Reddit. So his
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 4: former employees all shit on him and say how terrible
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 4: it is. And it's fantastic.
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 1: I've not heard good things about it.
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 4: It is really cool. That's the only thing I'll say
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 4: about nice about him. Nice.
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: And that has the Oddfellows in it, right? Doesn't he
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 1: have like a replica of the Oddfellows Lodge? At his museum?
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 4: That one's not ringing a bell.
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 1: I could be wrong. I know he has that somewhere.
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 1: Somebody I had on the show went to something that
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 1: he has. I think they said there was like an
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 1: Onfello's Lodge, like a remake of it inside of the place. Yeah,
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 1: which is interesting because he has it covered, Onfello's Lodges,
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 1: which is in order of Freemasonry.
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 4: He does change a lot of stuff, too. It's different.
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 4: It was different.
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 1: Oh, he changes it? Okay.
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 4: Someone changes it for him.
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 3: How long has he been around? I try not to
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 3: follow paranormal investigators too much. But how long has he
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 3: been around, Zach Bagans?
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 4: A long time. He's like what season 20, 30 something
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 4: on Ghost Hunters. He's been doing it for a long time.
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 2: That's part of the thing that I would be embarrassed
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 2: about had I been one of those investigators going through
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 2: Willow's Weep and acting like that. Acting like all this
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 2: super crazy shit's going on from Jesse Sykes who didn't
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 2: really even exist.
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 1: Oops.
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 3: What gets me is that I'm wondering if they even
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 3: went to the town's record hall to do their investigation
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 3: as well.
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: Real quick, the first people, I'm looking it up now,
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe you covered, did you cover, did
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 1: you mention on the last one that it was Danville
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 1: Paranormal Investigations, DPI? That were the first ones that went there?
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 2: I'm not, I can't remember.
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 1: Because the story doesn't even really start until 2010. about
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: this house.
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 2: Isn't that when the lady Brenda owned it?
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 3: Is that?
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 2: Because she had all the wild stories. And that's when Dave,
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 2: he bought it from that woman. And I know she
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 2: didn't own it very long. I just can't remember.
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 4: She was lying.
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 2: She could have been.
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 3: She's the one who found the bone, I believe.
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was like her maintenance worker. That was helping
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 2: with renovations.
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 3: And she's the one who found the book too, right?
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 2: With her son.
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 4: She also didn't get the bone checked.
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 2: And then put it back.
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so that says something right there.
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 4: That's a little sus.
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 1: They even said that there was a petition made or
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: something done. There's an actual paper trail. What does it say?
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 1: There was a petition. In 2010, local resident Penny Burns
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 1: created a petition specifically opposing Danville Paranormal Investigations at 5173
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: Elm Tree Road. The petition says DPI was allegedly calling
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: or operating the property as willows weep, claiming that deceased
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 1: former occupants haunted it, posted their historical backstories online, and
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: they were planning paid overnight ghost hunts. Most importantly, the
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 1: petition explicitly alleged that some of those backstories were fictitious
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 1: and vulgar. And then there was a counter-petition against it,
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 1: but it looks like I guess maybe some people were
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: saying that what they were saying was bullshit, too.
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 2: I always wondered if that may have been part of
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 2: the reason he ended up tearing the house down because
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 2: the people that lived in that little town were pissed.
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 2: Like for, you know, people coming in constantly giving their name,
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 2: their town, a bad reputation. And actually more to that.
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 3: Actually, there was a big, uh, I, I did go
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 3: through other documentaries on the other side that I found
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 3: on YouTube on the, children of the father who committed
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 3: suicide and on that chair supposedly and uh the death
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 3: of his wife and everything else and they were saying
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 3: they're lying they're trying to make money off our parents
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 3: uh tragedy of the family tragedy and i think they
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 3: were the owners prior to brenda getting it okay so
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 3: i think she got it after that tragedy and started
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 3: to boost up everything, which actually says a lot about
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 3: what we're saying about them not actually digging for the truth,
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 3: but going with the sensationalism and the urban legend and
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 3: trying to debunk the urban legend, which wouldn't be that
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 3: hard since it's not true, instead of digging up on
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 3: the truth of what might have happened on that land.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 2: And what Brenda experienced, she may very well believe that
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 2: it was all legit, you know, and she was believable
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 2: enough for Dave to come in and be like, hey,
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 2: I can make some money on this. This is a
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 2: good story that she's painting here.
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 1: So here's another interesting situation. The Skinner's. When DPI started
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 1: going on about this house and stuff, people were even complaining,
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 1: saying that two people just recently died in that house,
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 1: which is true. That was the Skinners. So they came
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 1: in right after the Skinners died, and then the property
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 1: sold on May 26, 2010 for $ 22, 000. And you said
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 1: that was Brenda, correct? Yeah. DPI said on their side,
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 1: we purchased the house. So was she connected to the team?
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 1: And did they buy the house? I don't... And then
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 1: they're like, well, you know, they just fabricated this whole slur. Yeah.
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 1: I don't know. So that's really interesting. Hmm.
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 3: Well, think about it. It's an eye-catcher. It does. Okay,
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 3: you just had a recent... Death in the property. The
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 3: house is shaped in a, quote-unquote, supposedly a cult manner.
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 3: And you're finding all these things that could be traditional.
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 3: But the purpose of the house originally, we just don't know.
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 3: The history of the land, we don't know for sure.
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 1: And that's another thing, too. It says that, even legitimately,
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 1: it says that it doesn't even have the 2000 in deed.
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 1: I'm not saying that she's not on there. We don't
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 1: even have the deed to even show if it's really
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 1: Brenda who owns it.
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 2: Was her last name Johnson?
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 1: Yes. We know Brenda Johnson later owned Willows. We described
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 1: herself publicly as a former owner. And your accumulated research
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 1: says she bought it as a fixer and lived on
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 1: the site for a period. But I don't yet have
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 1: the actual 2010 deed naming Brenda as the May 26th guarantee.
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 1: So it's even saying I wouldn't even say that on
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 1: air is proven.
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 2: Now, you said it was GPI.
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 1: That said they bought it? The house sells 2006 to
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 1: DPI is operating and promoting Willow's Weep by summer 2010.
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 1: Brenda Johnson is subsequently documented as owner, former owner. Again,
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 1: like I mentioned before, they're doing ghost things in the house.
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 1: It's because they owned it.
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 2: And that was Dave Spink's company?
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 1: No, I think that was prior to him. Oh.
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 1: That was the first place that looked into it. And
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 1: then I think his was the last one that did. Okay. Yeah.
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 3: Hmm.
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 1: I think there was like maybe, because it had been
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 1: on one or two things on TV. But I think
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 1: it was DPI came in. Then I think it might
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 1: have ended up on TV on one or two shows.
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 1: And then I think that other guy. Spinks, if that's
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 1: his name, I can't remember now. Yeah, Dave Spinks. Then
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 1: I think he got involved. Okay. So I'm like thinking like,
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 1: you know, maybe originally, maybe the first team kind of
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 1: like embellished a lot and he ran with it.
• 1:15:54
  Speaker 2: Seems so. And then he got caught and tore down.
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 4: I think it's just all for money at this point,
• 1:16:05
  Speaker 4: now that we've gone down this little rabbit hole.
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 3: I think there is a history there.
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 1: Something weird, probably.
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 3: I think there is a history there, but not what
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 3: they're telling us.
• 1:16:23
  Speaker 4: Who knows?
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 1: It's fucking weird.
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 3: Did I put anything out on it?
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 1: Say that again?
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 3: Put anything out on this particular location.
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: I have uh the only things i know wait say
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 1: that i said i'm sorry i said one more time
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 1: i might have.
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 3: Did they did they put anything out because you said
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 3: they're not associated with uh what's his name david spikes.
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 1: No uh yeah i think on there they had a Yeah,
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 1: around 2010. I don't, it doesn't say here exactly, like,
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 1: I guess where this is coming from, but let me
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 1: ask if they had a website or something, but they
• 1:17:09
  Speaker 1: were known for coming out and publicly saying that they
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 1: bought it and that they were doing ghost stuff on there.
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 3: I don't know if I'm bummed or not.
• 1:17:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know either.
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 1: It's interesting.
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 4: Who knows?
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, who knows how all that stuff works? I mean,
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 1: because if you really know, like, what you're doing with things.
• 1:17:49
  Speaker 1: I mean, you know, that house could have been under, like,
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 1: an LLC. Like, did you put it in bankruptcy? And
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 1: were you just playing games? And was it really just like...
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 1: Kind of like I put some money into it to
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 1: take it over and then raped as much money as
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 1: I could out of the idea. Claimed bankruptcy and moved
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 1: on and just gave up the house to the bank.
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying? You could be playing some
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 1: silly games like that.
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 1: You know, it's like, all right, that company's credit is
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 1: shit now, not my personal stuff. You know.
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah, but tearing it down because it was too haunted
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 4: sounds better than I tore it down because I went
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 4: bankrupt or some shit.
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 3: Oh, yeah. No, no.
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 1: I'm just saying that I'm saying for DPI originally. I mean,
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 1: who knows what they were doing with that like originally
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 1: because it sounds like they were using it to make
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 1: money out of the idea. So, you know what I'm saying?
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 1: Like they could have just looked at it like literally
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 1: it was just like just kind of like let's try
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 1: to sell off a real Halloween haunted house. You know,
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 1: it was literally a business. for all you know.
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 2: So do paranormal investigators, I don't really know a whole
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 2: lot about them. Do they have to pay to have
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 2: access to places? Like, is that how he was making
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 2: the money?
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 3: I think some, some places I think you do.
• 1:19:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 3: Either which way, you need permits to go on the
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 3: property because it's considered private property. So if someone's not
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 3: owning it or is owned by the town, you need
• 1:19:18
  Speaker 3: permission to go in there. So if it's not owned
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 3: by an individual and you don't purchase it, you would
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 3: have to get permission from the town. And by the
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 3: reaction from when David was there, the town would not
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 3: have given that permission if they had hold of that property.
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, reading again, and what it says is that this
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 1: is how they found out, is through the petitions, is
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 1: that when this petition came out, which began by Penny Burns,
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 1: it identifies Danville Paranormal Investigations, DPIs, a.k.a. Willow's Weep, at
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 1: that address. And it said that this is where I'm
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 1: getting the ghost hunting thing from, that it was operating,
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 1: that they planned to operate it as a paid ghost
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 1: hunting business. Now, again, who knows, like, was it they
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 1: going to use that as their, you know, where they
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 1: work out of or were they planning on using it
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 1: as like an attraction?
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 1: And then.
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 3: Think about it. How many of us right here right
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 3: now was thinking about, hmm, I'm wondering if that's worth
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 3: a trip.
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 2: Before I knew any of this stuff.
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 2: Now, no, actually, I don't know. Maybe just out of
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 2: pure curiosity now, like just to see, you know, with
• 1:20:47
  Speaker 2: the iron deposits and the, like the overwhelming feeling of
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 2: dread people get, like, would that still be there anyway?
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 3: See, the thing is funny. I'm sitting here and my
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 3: sister lives in Indiana. So my first step is I
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 3: was going to, as soon as we finished here, I
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 3: was like, how far is it from where she lives?
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 3: And can I get to the town hall? And can
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 3: I arrange that? But you see, they invoked that. They
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 3: got what they wanted. Well, tearing down the house, they
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 3: can't do it as it's not that big of a
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 3: sale anymore. But if the house was still there, it
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 3: would have been flopped after he got off there. And
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 3: I think that petition put a hard brake on that.
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 3: A very hard stop.
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so.
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 3: I personally think there is history on that land. I
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 3: think there's something going on on that land. But it
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 3: is not what they told us. They fluffed it up
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 3: for people who get excited for this stuff, like us,
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 3: and wants to head on over and investigate themselves. Hence
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 3: why they would make it paranormal news. pay and investigate situation.
• 1:22:11
  Speaker 3: But I think there's a bigger history back there.
• 1:22:14
  Speaker 2: That's how I always felt. I always thought it was
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 2: the land and not the house specifically. I think it's
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 2: just where the house was built was a coincidence. And
• 1:22:23
  Speaker 2: because it looks like a cross that it just made
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 2: a good story. But yeah, definitely the land.
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 1: I would go for like the whole land or priors. Again,
• 1:22:34
  Speaker 1: like I'm not, And like me even saying this isn't
• 1:22:37
  Speaker 1: really trying to, I don't think it's really adding too
• 1:22:41
  Speaker 1: much to what the later claims were. But I find
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 1: more interesting that Freemasons owned the property earlier. And that
• 1:22:48
  Speaker 1: idea of where this house came from, there's no record
• 1:22:50
  Speaker 1: of it. You know, maybe it could have been something
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 1: used like that, which I would understand maybe that with
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 1: what's in the area. You know, could make the ground
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 1: like a little unusual, which could lead to maybe some
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 1: of the paranormal stuff. for sure but I just you
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 1: know all that other shit at the end I think
• 1:23:09
  Speaker 1: is all a bunch of bullshit I think the bone
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 1: and I think the book is a bunch of bullshit
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 1: yeah I would even question again I hate to say
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 1: it I question the first original story that they used
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 1: to start it off with because I guess maybe that
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 1: one does sound a little bit better if you I
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 1: guess you use the real ones you could use anyway
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 1: you're making it sound older you're making it sound like
• 1:23:30
  Speaker 1: it's even been a problem a lot longer you know
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 1: I don't know. Even throwing in that whole, like, you know,
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 1: guy got ate by pigs just fucking just makes this
• 1:23:42
  Speaker 1: whole thing sounds fucked up. You know what I'm saying?
• 1:23:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying? If you're looking for some
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 1: family to throw in there to be supposedly the people
• 1:23:53
  Speaker 1: who own the house, you hear that guy's story, you're like, oh,
• 1:23:55
  Speaker 1: we got to use them. I mean, this has got
• 1:23:57
  Speaker 1: some fucking crazy shit in its own that sounds, you know,
• 1:24:00
  Speaker 1: a horror. You know?
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 2: Something unheard of, really.
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, right? Did this come out before or after? We
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 1: got to look into... Oh, no, that's right, because it
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 1: is truth, though. I was going to say, if it
• 1:24:11
  Speaker 1: was fabricated, we got to see if it came out
• 1:24:13
  Speaker 1: after that. I think I brought it up last time.
• 1:24:16
  Speaker 1: Was that Hannibal or whatever, where they tossed that fucked
• 1:24:20
  Speaker 1: up dude inside the pig farm and killed him?
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:24:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I was like, oh, maybe they're influenced by that,
• 1:24:25
  Speaker 1: but that story's true, so.
• 1:24:28
  Speaker 3: That's a scene out of horror stories even going back
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 3: to the 70s and the 80s. Yeah.
• 1:24:32
  Speaker 1: Fucked up. Yeah, who knows? Who knows? Again, you know,
• 1:24:37
  Speaker 1: I guess my final verdict, I think there's something weird
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 1: probably going on there. Don't know what the fuck it is,
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 1: but I do think a lot of the stories from
• 1:24:45
  Speaker 1: the paranormal teams is bullshit. That's what I think, unfortunately.
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 2: As I was watching the paranormal investigators go through there,
• 1:24:53
  Speaker 2: it just seemed like a load of shit to me. Like,
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 2: they're really grasping here and, like, they have this idea
• 1:25:01
  Speaker 2: in their mind so strongly that that's all they can see.
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 2: And that's all they're focused on is like, Oh, it's
• 1:25:06
  Speaker 2: Jesse from the other side and he's pissed and he
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 2: doesn't want us here. He wants us out of here.
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 1:25:13
  Speaker 2: I just felt like it was much deeper than that.
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 2: And I'm actually a little disappointed that there isn't any
• 1:25:18
  Speaker 2: limestone there because that's really what resonated with me. Like
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 2: when I stumbled upon that, I'm like, man, that would
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 2: make a lot of sense.
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 3: But, Jess, if you would have only been there when
• 1:25:31
  Speaker 3: I saw that and I didn't see the line, I
• 1:25:32
  Speaker 3: was like, seriously?
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 3: I was like, oh.
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 1: Wild story. Wild and interesting situation. So that's the occult
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 1: rejects and the weakly bizarre deep dive on that, I guess.
• 1:25:50
  Speaker 1: That was fun. I'm glad you both came back to,
• 1:25:53
  Speaker 1: I guess, talk about it again. I loved it.
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 2: Thanks for having us.
• 1:25:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it was really interesting shit. I mean, it didn't
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 1: get us anywhere closer to knowing the truth, but.
• 1:26:03
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:26:05
  Speaker 2: And it makes you kind of wonder about other places
• 1:26:07
  Speaker 2: like this too. It's like, what else is going on here?
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 1: Stick around podcasting long enough and you'll start realizing how
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 1: many fakes are out there.
• 1:26:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 1: So it's like, you know, it's kind of funny because
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 1: it's like people are doing that already with a tiny
• 1:26:22
  Speaker 1: little podcast. I can imagine. how it gets when you
• 1:26:25
  Speaker 1: really get fame and money involved. Judith, before we wrap
• 1:26:32
  Speaker 1: it up, why don't you let everybody know what's up
• 1:26:34
  Speaker 1: with you? Thank you again for coming on. If you
• 1:26:38
  Speaker 1: have an opinion, too, before, sorry, I didn't mean to
• 1:26:41
  Speaker 1: cut you off, too, if any of you just want
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 1: to kind of give an opinion about anything or whatever,
• 1:26:44
  Speaker 1: just say, no, I'm good, whatever.
• 1:26:48
  Speaker 3: I'm curious to know your lady's opinion on this book.
• 1:26:53
  Speaker 3: Sydney Case.
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 2: Well, I think you've heard mine pretty much. Montana, what
• 1:26:59
  Speaker 2: do you think?
• 1:27:01
  Speaker 4: I mean, I agree with you. I think there's something
• 1:27:04
  Speaker 4: on the land. I think a lot of stuff happened
• 1:27:06
  Speaker 4: on that land and they heard stories and they ran
• 1:27:10
  Speaker 4: with it and it became like a money pit or
• 1:27:12
  Speaker 4: trying to be a money pit. Unfortunately. Because that's probably
• 1:27:20
  Speaker 4: also around the time that paranormal was becoming huge.
• 1:27:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I would also be interested in knowing like, uh,
• 1:27:29
  Speaker 1: which I didn't look into it. I'm not going to
• 1:27:31
  Speaker 1: be a baller now. Uh, it would be take too long.
• 1:27:34
  Speaker 1: Any of the people, even our Masons or no, they
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 1: were involved that even knew that like, again, not trying
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 1: to prove my point, but like, you know, knew that
• 1:27:43
  Speaker 1: maybe it was associated with something, but didn't want to
• 1:27:45
  Speaker 1: come out and tell those stories. It made a bullshit
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 1: ones to make it look interesting. You know, I don't
• 1:27:51
  Speaker 1: know because I, it's just, I, uh, From my experience,
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 1: I do think Masons are well-known for pimping out bullshit
• 1:27:58
  Speaker 1: Bigfoot and paranormal stuff. That's just my opinion.
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 5: My thing is, because this is such a long story,
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 5: I always try to figure out whether I heard whispers
• 1:28:11
  Speaker 5: of this place when I was young, and I don't
• 1:28:13
  Speaker 5: recall hearing about it.
• 1:28:18
  Speaker 3: And back then... because we had so many horror stories
• 1:28:21
  Speaker 3: going on in the 80s if there was a haunted
• 1:28:24
  Speaker 3: place that people knew they spoke about it yes we
• 1:28:27
  Speaker 3: did not have the internet back then to spread it
• 1:28:30
  Speaker 3: but it still went through by word of mouth if
• 1:28:32
  Speaker 3: you like haunted places you go here you go there
• 1:28:35
  Speaker 3: and i don't remember this place and i'm like maybe
• 1:28:37
  Speaker 3: it was a well-kept secret and secrets, yes, they probably
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 3: have there. This particular secret, no. But then again, when
• 1:28:50
  Speaker 3: it comes to Masons, and if the Masons did own
• 1:28:52
  Speaker 3: that place, remember back then, they were very, very more
• 1:28:56
  Speaker 3: secretive than they are now. So they may not have
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 3: started this rumor, but the people around who didn't know
• 1:29:03
  Speaker 3: what was going on in that house may have came
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 3: up with their version of this stuff too.
• 1:29:10
  Speaker 1: I forget how much that happens now. It still happens. Yeah,
• 1:29:20
  Speaker 1: there's like people that I had on my podcast that
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 1: if they probably like the ideas of what they thought
• 1:29:25
  Speaker 1: was going on in Tootie Lodge when me and you
• 1:29:27
  Speaker 1: were there were probably the fallest fucking thing. It's just like, what?
• 1:29:32
  Speaker 3: Oh, I think I've heard them all.
• 1:29:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just like, what? No, you got a bunch
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 1: of fucking nerds in there trying to practice magic. That's
• 1:29:42
  Speaker 1: about it. I don't know.
• 1:29:46
  Speaker 3: Sometimes it's not even the people who are on the
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 3: land who Are there, okay, this situation different, this particular
• 1:29:53
  Speaker 3: situation different, but they're not the ones who hype up
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 3: these stories and stuff like that. Could there always be
• 1:30:00
  Speaker 3: something behind it? Yes, but not as grandiosos. Or could
• 1:30:04
  Speaker 3: it be a cover-up for embarrassing history? Yes. Done diving.
• 1:30:15
  Speaker 3: I'm just going to let you know.
• 1:30:20
  Speaker 4: All right.
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 1: Well, Judith, thank you so much again for, especially, I mean,
• 1:30:25
  Speaker 1: the ladies brought the topic. You started going into it more.
• 1:30:28
  Speaker 1: Gave me the, you know, gave us the idea of
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 1: doing another one. So thanks. This was really awesome. I
• 1:30:32
  Speaker 1: had a really good time. And it was a fun
• 1:30:34
  Speaker 1: one to even look into. Even as like, you know,
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 1: and I wasn't totally dead set on trying to make
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 1: this guy look like shit. But at least I was
• 1:30:40
  Speaker 1: getting answers or at least stuff to prove that like
• 1:30:43
  Speaker 1: there's no history of this. So, you know, it went somewhere.
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 1: At least I think. It just still got us nowhere. But,
• 1:30:51
  Speaker 1: It did get us somewhere. Yeah, I guess, technically.
• 1:30:57
  Speaker 3: It took away the quote-unquote occult is evil type situation
• 1:31:01
  Speaker 3: and rumors and sensationalism.
• 1:31:04
  Speaker 1: That is true with that book. I feel like they
• 1:31:07
  Speaker 1: were trying to push that with that book. Like, oh,
• 1:31:09
  Speaker 1: look what we found here. Satanism. It's a church book.
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 1: Fuck's sakes.
• 1:31:16
  Speaker 3: Church pamphlet. Yes.
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 1: Pamphlet.
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 3: 25-page pamphlet.
• 1:31:22
  Speaker 2: I thought it looked like a little paperback pamphlet. I'm like,
• 1:31:25
  Speaker 2: what is this?
• 1:31:26
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yo, I think no lie. I think you can
• 1:31:29
  Speaker 1: buy that on Amazon.
• 1:31:31
  Speaker 4: Yes, you can.
• 1:31:32
  Speaker 3: I Googled it while you were looking at it.
• 1:31:34
  Speaker 1: That's great. All right, Jess, please go ahead. Let everybody
• 1:31:43
  Speaker 1: know what's up with you.
• 1:31:45
  Speaker 2: Well, you can find us on all the social medias,
• 1:31:48
  Speaker 2: weekly bizarre podcast. If, you would like us to share
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 2: a cool story that you have, you can always email
• 1:31:56
  Speaker 2: us at weeklybizarrepodcast at gmail.com. Like Nick said, feel free, please,
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 2: to check out our Instagram. We, especially Montana these days,
• 1:32:06
  Speaker 2: has been putting out the content over there.
• 1:32:10
  Speaker 3: Oh, yeah.
• 1:32:10
  Speaker 1: Girls are killing it.
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 2: Just trying to get more people to the page, you know,
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 2: because there's only so much you can do with, you know,
• 1:32:18
  Speaker 2: we do a story a week and we, we try
• 1:32:20
  Speaker 2: to put the content out to promote that, but you
• 1:32:23
  Speaker 2: just got to do more. Like if you're supposed to
• 1:32:25
  Speaker 2: be posting daily, it's kind of hard to do that.
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 2: So yeah, we're branching out to other ways to reach audiences.
• 1:32:31
  Speaker 2: So please go check us out.
• 1:32:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:32:35
  Speaker 1: Well said. Definitely check out their Instagram and thank you
• 1:32:37
  Speaker 1: just so much. Montana, what is up? Please let everybody
• 1:32:42
  Speaker 1: know what's up.
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 4: I mean, she covered it.
• 1:32:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:32:46
  Speaker 4: We like to tell stories. You know, we're storytellers. So
• 1:32:50
  Speaker 4: if that's your thing, we're here for it. Let's be friends.
• 1:32:55
  Speaker 1: Nice.
• 1:32:55
  Speaker 4: But thanks for having us.
• 1:32:57
  Speaker 1: Oh, no, of course. Of course. Always, always enjoy. And
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 1: I'm sure we'll have you on again sometime in the
• 1:33:02
  Speaker 1: future for sure. Thank you, everybody, in the chat. That
• 1:33:05
  Speaker 1: is what's up. Thank you, everybody, who tuned in. I
• 1:33:07
  Speaker 1: appreciate it. That's why we go live. And that's the
• 1:33:10
  Speaker 1: end of another Cult Rejects. And until the next one,
• 1:33:12
  Speaker 1: everybody be well. Later.
• 1:33:13
  Speaker 3: Later.