Latest / Beyond The Blood: A Horror Movie Commentary Podcast / Clark Collis Interview - Author of 'Screaming & Conjuring' & 'You've Got Red on You'

Transcript

Clark Collis Interview - Author of 'Screaming & Conjuring' & 'You've Got Red on You' · Beyond The Blood: A Horror Movie Commentary Podcast

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: You are now listening to the Someone's Favorite Productions podcast network.
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: Hello everybody, and welcome back to a brand new episode
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: of the Beyond the Blood podcast. And today we're joined
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: by a very special guest. We have author Clark Cullis
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: on the show, author of Screaming and Conjuring, The Resurrection
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: and Unstoppable Rise of the Modern Horror Movie, published by
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: nineteen eighty four Publishing, and this is a book that
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: has pretty much become a bible of mine since the
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: later half of last year when it was released. And
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: this book pretty much chronicles the shifting of the horror tide,
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: starting at nineteen ninety six's Scream all the way up
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: to twenty thirteen's The Conjuring, Everything in the middle, including
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: the international remakes, the new wave, French extremity, torture Horn,
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: everything in the middle, but not just talking about the movies,
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: also talking about the people behind the movies, the business
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: of things, the production companies. It's an incredibly fascinating read
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: that is candy to people like myself who grew up
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: in this era. This is kind of the most impactful
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: era for me as well as Steve as a horror fan.
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: This shaped so much of what we love today about
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: horror movies. So Clark was nice enough to give us
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: an hour of his time. We sat down and talked
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: about pretty much everything we could squeeze into an hour,
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: covering late nineties and early two thousands horror. So we
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: hope that you enjoy this. Please go to the link
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: down below go to nineteen eighty four Publishing dot com.
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: You make sure to pick up a copy of Screaming
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: and Conjuring All also link below Amazon various other links
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: where you can get his book, as well as a
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: previous book of his, You've Got Read On You, How
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: Sean the Dead was Brought to Life. So I'll make
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: sure I have all those linked below. I hope you
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: enjoyed this conversation with Clark. Call us all right, So Clark,
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: I first want to start off by saying thank you
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: again for doing this. But I also want to say
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: that my wife a couple of years ago picked up
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: your book You've Got Read On You, and she blew
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: through it. I actually have it sitting right next to me.
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: She blew through it, was obsessed with it. It took
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: her a little bit too. I consider myself a loose
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: Sean of the Dead fan, So it took her a
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: little bit of time to get me to dive into it.
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: But by the time I took the plunge into it,
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: screaming and conjuring, was already the marketing had already begun.
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: We were heavily anticipating that. So I just wanted you
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: to know from this hell hold that I'm currently sitting in,
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: we are huge fans of your work. So thank you
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: for that as well.
• 4:06
  Speaker 3: Uh no, my well, thank you. And is your wife?
• 4:09
  Speaker 3: I assume my wife is a ban of Short of
• 4:11
  Speaker 3: the deads was.
• 4:12
  Speaker 4: Like some random book that she picked up, you know,
• 4:15
  Speaker 4: from one of those little kind of free libraries and
• 4:18
  Speaker 4: what have you.
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: No, no, no, she is a massive fan, and that
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: you've got read on you was sort of like the
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: dream book of hers. And I found it through I
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: think I was buying something else from nineteen eighty four
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: when this had just come out, and I remember running
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: out of the office going to her saying, hey, there's
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: a massive book just on Sean of the Dead, and
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: she forced me to buy it, and I'm pretty sure
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: she got through the book in less than a week.
• 4:45
  Speaker 3: That's that's good to hear. That's good. That's good.
• 4:47
  Speaker 4: I mean I did obviously, and I did plan I
• 4:49
  Speaker 4: mean everybody. I mean, that's you're James Joyce. You don't
• 4:52
  Speaker 4: deliberately set out to write a book that sort of
• 4:55
  Speaker 4: set me incomprehensible and impossible to read.
• 4:58
  Speaker 3: But that's very nice to hear, because I I did
• 5:00
  Speaker 3: want it to be as read a book book. Yeah.
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, before we get into kind of questions about
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: and around screaming and conjuring, I wanted to ask how
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: long did you prep you've got read on you for?
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: Because the information in this book, in this book is
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: out of control, Like I can't imagine the amount of
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: time that went into just research alone for it.
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: It was actually done very quickly, and.
• 5:27
  Speaker 4: My girlfriend often says to me, like, I can't believe
• 5:30
  Speaker 4: you wrote that book so quickly.
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: And she works in publishing as well.
• 5:35
  Speaker 4: She has a graphic novel company called Self Made Hero,
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: which puts out fantastic books.
• 5:43
  Speaker 3: Well, I had done.
• 5:44
  Speaker 4: I worked at Entertainment Weekly for eighteen years and in
• 5:47
  Speaker 4: the course of that time had got to know Edgar Wright,
• 5:53
  Speaker 4: the director and co writer of Short of the Dead,
• 5:56
  Speaker 4: and Simon Pegg, the star and co writer of Short
• 5:59
  Speaker 4: of the Dead, and also Nick asked, and I'd interviewed
• 6:01
  Speaker 4: them about various projects over time, and then Entertainment Weekley
• 6:08
  Speaker 4: wanted to do We did a Halloween issue, I think,
• 6:10
  Speaker 4: and Entertainment Whekney wanted to do an oral history of
• 6:14
  Speaker 4: Shawn of the Dead. So I interviewed Edgar and Simon
• 6:18
  Speaker 4: and Nick and their producer Nira Park, who's kind of
• 6:23
  Speaker 4: the I wouldn't say she's the fifth beetle of the group.
• 6:27
  Speaker 4: She's more like the second beadle of the group, or
• 6:29
  Speaker 4: the third beaddle of the group. Really, and so I
• 6:32
  Speaker 4: had quotes from them and so, and then a couple
• 6:37
  Speaker 4: of years later it was actually just when at the
• 6:39
  Speaker 4: start of COVID, I successfully pitched the idea of doing
• 6:44
  Speaker 4: a book on Shaun of the Dead to Matthew, my
• 6:47
  Speaker 4: great publisher at nineteen eighty four Publishing. And then it
• 6:53
  Speaker 4: was very quick. I think I reached out to Edgar
• 6:56
  Speaker 4: in the summer of two thousand. I mean it's like you,
• 7:02
  Speaker 4: not two thousand, I mean my since COVID, my.
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: Concept of time, I become a bit warm people.
• 7:08
  Speaker 4: It was a summer of twenty twenty because I did
• 7:11
  Speaker 4: a bast oral history about Scott Pilgrim, which was then
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: I think it was its tenth anniversary and Edgar had
• 7:19
  Speaker 4: directed that and I interviewed a gear as a you
• 7:21
  Speaker 4: know a lot of people for that and wound up
• 7:24
  Speaker 4: posting like a twenty thousand word or maybe fifteen thousand
• 7:28
  Speaker 4: word oral.
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: History of that on w dot com.
• 7:32
  Speaker 4: And I remember Edgar saying after that came out that
• 7:35
  Speaker 4: was posted, we should write a book about Scott Pilgrim,
• 7:38
  Speaker 4: And I was like, well, funny you said you should
• 7:40
  Speaker 4: say that, because I did want to write a book
• 7:41
  Speaker 4: and I want to write a book about Short of
• 7:43
  Speaker 4: the Death.
• 7:44
  Speaker 3: And then I think it took me. Wow, it's hard.
• 7:49
  Speaker 4: To believe, but I think I started in the summer
• 7:51
  Speaker 4: of twenty twenty and then we kind of finished it
• 7:56
  Speaker 4: by the by finished, I mean it had been written
• 7:59
  Speaker 4: and you know, edited and proved by the spring of
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: twenty twenty one. So I only really took about six
• 8:07
  Speaker 4: months to write. But in that during that period I
• 8:10
  Speaker 4: tracked down. I mean, Edgar was, I mean, what would
• 8:14
  Speaker 4: happen is I would like get in touch with the
• 8:16
  Speaker 4: production designer saying I was writing a book Aboutean and
• 8:19
  Speaker 4: the Dead, and then the production designer would email Edgar
• 8:22
  Speaker 4: being like, hey, this looney wants to, you know, write
• 8:24
  Speaker 4: a book about Sean said, is he like you know, kosher?
• 8:29
  Speaker 4: And Edgar will be like, yeah, that's bucking fu.
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 8:33
  Speaker 4: And I interviewed about thirty or forty people, maybe more actually,
• 8:37
  Speaker 4: but and then some and I did it like nine
• 8:39
  Speaker 4: months in all, I would say, and I have no
• 8:42
  Speaker 4: idea how I did it. But and also I was
• 8:44
  Speaker 4: still working at EW, so I had a you know,
• 8:47
  Speaker 4: a job at the same time.
• 8:49
  Speaker 3: Although it was it was you know, during.
• 8:50
  Speaker 4: COVID, so you know, they did seem to be a
• 8:54
  Speaker 4: lot more time frankfully, but yeah, that kept me.
• 8:58
  Speaker 3: That was the project that really kept me saying during
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: during the post year of COVID. Yeah. Yeah.
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: Well, your follow up book, Screaming and Conjuring, which came
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: out the later half of last year from nineteen eighty four,
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: again is to me a more daunting project. You're covering
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: basically the evolution of horror from nineteen ninety six to
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: twenty thirteen and everything in between in this book. For me,
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: I know, Steve is around my age as well. This
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: is a pivotal time for us because Scream came out
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: I was seven, and then when you get into the
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: early two thousands, I'm becoming a teenager, and I'm finding
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: the remakes. I'm discovering all these little gems of the
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: video store, and at the same time you're kind of understanding.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: I remember going on websites and looking up like what
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: is dimension, what is miramax, what's the difference? Who's this?
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: And funny enough, actually this morning I threw on my
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: DVD of the Hitcher remake from two thousand and seven
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: and kind of went on this little, this little like
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: path down like Rogue Pictures and Platinum Dunes and and
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: I made this post and I talked about how when
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: it comes to the remake era of the two thousands,
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: the Platinum Dunes stretch, how there was kind of two camps.
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: One camp was on this high horse of you don't
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: touch these original films. The other camp, my camp, was
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: much more like these were like gateway drug films for us,
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: because we would see the remake a statement, dude, Well
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: you would see like I had already seen Texas Chainsaw Maasker,
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: But at the time I remember watching like the Amityville
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: Horror remake and it's it's glossy, you know, you know
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: Ryan Reynolds. You know the cast, it looks really cool,
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: but then from there you find out it's some remake.
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: So you go backwards, you find the original, and you
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: start learning. So this book tapped into something that's very
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: hard for me to explain, because it almost felt like
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: I was rewinding to a different era of my life
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: and somebody was there to teach me. You were almost
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: like a teacher for me now going backward, if that
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: makes sense. So, you know, I wanted you to understand
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: kind of what for people my age deep in this genre,
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: this book is incredibly important, and now it's become a
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: reference for me where I've already read it cover to
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: cover and now when we're discussing films of this era,
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: it's one of those books I go back to and
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: I just find that section and dig in again and
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: again and again. So I wanted to kick this off
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: by kind of asking, like what made you sit down
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: and kind of say, all right, it starts with scream
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: and I'm going to go for you know, until twenty thirteen,
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: how did you form that?
• 11:49
  Speaker 3: Well?
• 11:50
  Speaker 4: As I'm sure you're aware, the seventies and the eighties
• 11:53
  Speaker 4: have been very well, very well covered horror in the
• 11:56
  Speaker 4: seventies and the eighties very well covered terricory. The seventies
• 12:01
  Speaker 4: is kind of the time when you have all these
• 12:04
  Speaker 4: classic films, yeah, these breakthrough movies from I mean, I
• 12:08
  Speaker 4: know it's the late sixties, but like from you know,
• 12:10
  Speaker 4: Rosemary's Baby onwards Rosemary's Baby and the Sectors, Chainsaw, Massacre
• 12:16
  Speaker 4: and Halloween and carry and so on and so forth. There's
• 12:20
  Speaker 4: no denying that that was an incredible time for new
• 12:24
  Speaker 4: types of horror, and it's you know, and arguably remains
• 12:28
  Speaker 4: certainly many people think of that as the golden age
• 12:31
  Speaker 4: of horror. And then you have the eighties, which are
• 12:34
  Speaker 4: which is a kind of golden era of a different
• 12:38
  Speaker 4: age because of the of a different stripe, because of
• 12:41
  Speaker 4: all the slasher movies than all the you know, sequels
• 12:45
  Speaker 4: to Halloween, and you have you know, all the sequels
• 12:47
  Speaker 4: to Friday the Thirteenth, and you know, the Wes Craven
• 12:51
  Speaker 4: director Night Right on the Street, and then you have
• 12:53
  Speaker 4: those sequels, and then you have the Chucky movies, and
• 12:56
  Speaker 4: so there's a huge amount of fondness to that age.
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: And then you have the nineties, which are much less.
• 13:05
  Speaker 4: Well, which are covered for the most part, certainly in
• 13:09
  Speaker 4: the first half. Yeah, there's not a lot of books
• 13:12
  Speaker 4: about but not any books really about that period because
• 13:14
  Speaker 4: certainly the first half is a bit of a desert
• 13:17
  Speaker 4: thought for horror movies, although some good ones were made,
• 13:21
  Speaker 4: and so you're into the two.
• 13:22
  Speaker 3: Thousand and it was a period.
• 13:25
  Speaker 4: There are certainly books about about various movies in the
• 13:29
  Speaker 4: two thousands. Well, I didn't feel that they'd been the
• 13:32
  Speaker 4: kind of comprehensive look at that period.
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: That it deserves. And also, and I'm so glad.
• 13:40
  Speaker 4: You know you were talking about being a kid and
• 13:43
  Speaker 4: growing up with these movies, because you're exactly the person that.
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: I was writing the book for. Because if you were.
• 13:50
  Speaker 4: I mean even if you were born when the screen
• 13:52
  Speaker 4: came out, then you'd be sorry, I'm trying to do
• 13:56
  Speaker 4: the math on this, then you'd be what like twenty
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: nine at this point. It's not I think older horror writers,
• 14:03
  Speaker 4: or most older horror writers.
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: Still it's still easy for us. I mean, I'm fifty eight,
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: sort of, you.
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: Know, I was a fully grown adult during these even
• 14:12
  Speaker 4: when Scream came out. But it's easy to think about
• 14:15
  Speaker 4: Scream as a fairly recent frenchise, you know, as comparatively speaking,
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: I guess it is.
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: But like that's all I mean, that's like thirty.
• 14:27
  Speaker 4: Years ago, you know what I mean, And so it
• 14:31
  Speaker 4: really does seem like history to you know, quotes of
• 14:35
  Speaker 4: your age, and I thought it was a history worth depicting.
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: And I love the fact that you but it's true
• 14:41
  Speaker 4: that I love the fact that you've.
• 14:42
  Speaker 3: Picked up on the fact that I cover this.
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: I mean, the book is is kind of a business
• 14:48
  Speaker 4: story as well.
• 14:49
  Speaker 3: And I look at you know, where to mention came from.
• 14:53
  Speaker 3: And then all these other companies.
• 14:56
  Speaker 4: Or subsidiaries of companies sprung up to kind of exploit
• 15:00
  Speaker 4: And the classically example of this to me is Lions,
• 15:04
  Speaker 4: which started off as a relatively quote unquote normal company
• 15:10
  Speaker 4: established by a Canadian businessman in the mid nineties.
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: And at first they were known, I mean, at first
• 15:16
  Speaker 3: they were known at all, but that the schedule was what.
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: You would regard as the kind of schedule that a
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: mainstream studio.
• 15:24
  Speaker 3: Would put out at that time. And they did thrillers
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: and they did some horror movies, but they did.
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: American Psycho and they did thrillers and comedies and such.
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: But then, you know, midway through the.
• 15:36
  Speaker 4: Two thousands, became associated with probably two types of movies
• 15:41
  Speaker 4: or two brands, I guess, one of which was Tyler
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: Perry movie, which I don't dover with the book sort
• 15:47
  Speaker 4: of mentioned, but like were enormously successful, and you.
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: Know, Tyler Perry's a prolific hoteur really of comedies and dramas.
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: But the other type of movie, which they became well
• 16:03
  Speaker 3: known was what horror movies.
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: This was the studio that saw in its many sequels
• 16:09
  Speaker 4: that distributed Hostel, The Descent, House of One Thousand Corpses
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: and Double Rejects.
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: And so you had this interesting.
• 16:20
  Speaker 4: You know, notion of a company who's who's.
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: Maybe whose president or whatever was not.
• 16:27
  Speaker 4: Really into horror, but their executive, but as executive, knew
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: that that horror.
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: Was a reliable source of income for a new studio.
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: That's obviously very important for any studio, it's very important.
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: But if you've been on horror, you're likely to get
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: some sort of return.
• 16:43
  Speaker 4: And so out of nowhere, Lionsgate became a house of
• 16:47
  Speaker 4: horror in the same the New the same way. The
• 16:49
  Speaker 4: New Line was a house of horror in the Noticing
• 16:52
  Speaker 4: a house of horror in the eighties, and Hammer was
• 16:55
  Speaker 4: a house of horror in the you know, fifties and
• 16:57
  Speaker 4: six years before that Universal. I mean I could remember
• 17:00
  Speaker 4: very clearly, you know start. I mean I would go
• 17:04
  Speaker 4: and see pretty a lot of these movies when they
• 17:07
  Speaker 4: came out.
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: And I started to see the very distinctive.
• 17:12
  Speaker 4: Lions Gate logo at the Friend of the Movies, and
• 17:14
  Speaker 4: I was like, who the hell is lions because I.
• 17:18
  Speaker 3: Need Warner Brothers in Paramount and.
• 17:22
  Speaker 4: Even you know, Sony and all these other studios, right,
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: why is.
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: No one telling me what lions Gate is? And that's
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: you know, uh, that's sort of one of the questions
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: that I saw to answer and to explain in my book.
• 17:38
  Speaker 4: And there was definitely a point where I thought, maybe
• 17:40
  Speaker 4: I should just write a book about the lions Gate
• 17:42
  Speaker 4: because this is fascinating son.
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: But I think that would be more of a sort
• 17:47
  Speaker 3: of niche as to what peculiar books.
• 17:51
  Speaker 4: But in a strange way, Lion's Gate very much one
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: of the quote unquote characters.
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: In the book.
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah they are, and to two production company logos I
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: remember most from that era, and it's because of Saul
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: and it was Lionsgate, you know, the thunder and then
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: Twisted Pictures YEP, with the barbed wire spike, and those
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: were I still to this day like get chills when
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: I see the Lion the old school Lionsgate logo pop up.
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: I love that.
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So it just and also it seemed like, I mean,
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: Scream seemed like.
• 18:24
  Speaker 4: A very obvious start because, as I said, in the
• 18:27
  Speaker 4: first half of the nineties, you did.
• 18:28
  Speaker 3: Have some horror movies.
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: You had, I mean Candy Man particularly, and you also
• 18:33
  Speaker 4: had these big budget gothic horror movies, so Frond, the
• 18:39
  Speaker 4: School Couples, Dracula, Kenneth Branner's Frankenstein.
• 18:45
  Speaker 3: And Interview with a VAMPIREA.
• 18:47
  Speaker 4: But none of these films really because they were so
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: big budget, because they most you know, such huge star
• 18:55
  Speaker 4: none of these films became franchises. And the kind of
• 18:59
  Speaker 4: way that that horror sort of relies on franchises, horrors
• 19:02
  Speaker 4: are very.
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: I find horror very interesting because.
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: The huge horror, the sort of landmark horror movies tend to.
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: Be incredibly original. So in one sense, horror is based
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: on originality.
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: And then those those films are then sequelized, so it's
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: then that becomes you know, there's also the backbone.
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: Of horror as an institution. So I always find it interesting.
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: Do you have this.
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: World where both originality and conservatism with a small theme
• 19:34
  Speaker 4: are sort of, you know, hugely prized.
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, this was a tough This is a tough era.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: There is a great book out there, and I was
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: trying to see if I could spot it on my
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: shelf so I could grab it. I think Erne is
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: aerial powers. She did a great book called Millennial Nasties,
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: which I believe was distributed or published by Encyclo Apocalypse
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: pub And that is sort of a title by type
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: analysis of like the post a nine to eleven, kind
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: of like torture porn era. That's really the only other
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: book I've come across that kind of covers at least
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: a section of you know, crossover there. But it's funny
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: looking back because when I was twelve, thirteen, fourteen years
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: old watching Saul and Hostile or same with you, Steve,
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: we just loved it because it was it was gore right,
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: where like, yeah, we're like these movies are sick, Like
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: I love this. And meanwhile, what was happening was a
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: complete shift in genre tone because of the state of
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: a country that was under fear and really was kind
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: of wrapped up in the violence, and all of this
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: was commentating on that in ways that we didn't understand
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: at that time, and now we look back on it
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: and we interpret it all so differ friendly, which is
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: the most interesting thing about the passage of time. And
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: I always encourage people rewatch movies, go back, you know,
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: watch them again, because as I get older and my
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: you know, my thoughts change and I kind of develop
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: more of like where I stand on things. A lot
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: of these movies have changed heavily in my mind. They've
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: gone from a slasher to something much more meta, something
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: that's much more a commentary on something, And now I
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: watch it through that lens and it changes it for me,
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: and then that changes, you know, how I view that
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: particular genre as a whole. So it's incredibly interesting going
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: back and kind of reanalyzing all of these movies. You know,
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: and your your book does a fantastic job of moving
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: through them quick enough that you kind of like with
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: every couple pages you're on, you're moving on to something else,
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: but you've gotten all the juicy bits that you need
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: and you feel one hundred percent satisfied after every title
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: is cover.
• 22:01
  Speaker 5: Well, this this definitely feels like very reflective of that
• 22:04
  Speaker 5: specific point in time, you know, like kind of branching
• 22:08
  Speaker 5: out from what Chris was saying. But I mean I
• 22:10
  Speaker 5: distinctly remember, you know, you guys were talking about Lionsgate,
• 22:13
  Speaker 5: and you know, the first movie that comes to mind,
• 22:15
  Speaker 5: like Kevin Fever for example, or Saw. You know, those
• 22:18
  Speaker 5: are movies that, in my mind were always pushing the
• 22:21
  Speaker 5: boundaries to what you could expect with horror films compared
• 22:24
  Speaker 5: to what I grew upon. But you know, kind of
• 22:28
  Speaker 5: going back to what you were mentioning earlier, Clark, you know,
• 22:30
  Speaker 5: especially with Scream, I mean that really laid the groundworkout
• 22:35
  Speaker 5: for I think for both Chris and I for really
• 22:38
  Speaker 5: heavily getting into horror like that and in a lot
• 22:41
  Speaker 5: of ways revitalized the slasher genre. Why do you think
• 22:44
  Speaker 5: that it resonated so strongly with audiences at that moment
• 22:48
  Speaker 5: in time.
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: I mean, well, this is a very interesting hob but
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: it's a hell of a good.
• 22:56
  Speaker 5: Movie, that is true.
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: I mean, you know that.
• 23:03
  Speaker 4: I mean it's interesting that obviously I had seen you know,
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: the vast majority of these films when they came out,
• 23:11
  Speaker 4: and then while writing this book would go back and
• 23:15
  Speaker 4: revisit them, and I was kind of both stunned and
• 23:22
  Speaker 4: delighted by how many of them, you know, have stood
• 23:25
  Speaker 4: the test of time. And Scream in particular, I mean,
• 23:29
  Speaker 4: it's it's just a cranker of a movie. But beyond that,
• 23:33
  Speaker 4: I think, I mean, it's it's it's why was you know,
• 23:37
  Speaker 4: it was successful because it seems I think it seemed so.
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: Bright and shiny and new and cool.
• 23:45
  Speaker 4: And we talked about this a little bit earlier, but
• 23:48
  Speaker 4: the first half of the nineties, those old franchises Halloween
• 23:53
  Speaker 4: at NIGHTFA and Alm Street and Chucky and Friday the
• 23:58
  Speaker 4: Thirteenth was still kind of, you know, staggering on, but the.
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: Budgets were getting smaller.
• 24:07
  Speaker 4: The you know, talent of the people involved, well, I
• 24:11
  Speaker 4: mean it's no slur.
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: To suggest that the people directly it went on in
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: the same.
• 24:15
  Speaker 4: League as John Carvier and Wes Craven and you know,
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: I think they've seen you know, and.
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: They seemed to a degree, you know, it was sort
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: of uncool idea.
• 24:28
  Speaker 4: And then suddenly you had Scream, you know, which which was.
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: A great movie, but also.
• 24:37
  Speaker 4: Dimension, which is you know, the subsidiary of Mirramax, which
• 24:41
  Speaker 4: produced the film Bob Weinstein who was in charge of Dimension.
• 24:46
  Speaker 3: Was insistent that they put famous.
• 24:48
  Speaker 4: People in the film, and not even film stars.
• 24:53
  Speaker 3: But but you know, the movie's cast included.
• 24:57
  Speaker 4: Nev Campbell was famous from a party of at the time.
• 25:02
  Speaker 4: Fortney cast obviously was famous from friends. I mean, Drew
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: Barrymore was was just kind of famous. And I remember,
• 25:10
  Speaker 4: it's funny, I remember being I remember not going to
• 25:13
  Speaker 4: see screen when it came out because to me, that
• 25:17
  Speaker 4: didn't seem like a great cast because I was.
• 25:20
  Speaker 3: Old enough to think that if a if a movie.
• 25:23
  Speaker 4: Has TV stars in it, which which is essentially what
• 25:26
  Speaker 4: the cast of Scream was, then it was probably not
• 25:29
  Speaker 4: very good because I grew up at the time when
• 25:32
  Speaker 4: there were.
• 25:33
  Speaker 3: Film stars and then there were TV stars.
• 25:35
  Speaker 4: The TV stars were definitely lesser than film stars. And
• 25:40
  Speaker 4: in fact, it was it was Scream and you know
• 25:44
  Speaker 4: Courtney Coxx and their Campbell, which sort of was what
• 25:47
  Speaker 4: was one of the films that definitely started to break
• 25:49
  Speaker 4: those those barriers down. But like if you're a kid,
• 25:54
  Speaker 4: you're just thinking, oh wow, this is like this is
• 25:57
  Speaker 4: like a top notch cast.
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: Rather than the of you know, whoever was in no
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: I mean.
• 26:03
  Speaker 4: No evacts, but whoever was in like the eighth that derayed,
• 26:06
  Speaker 4: you know, the eighth fo sequel of some now old
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: slasher franchise.
• 26:12
  Speaker 3: So you know, it was well made.
• 26:15
  Speaker 4: It had a famous cast, and then you had this
• 26:18
  Speaker 4: this addition, I mean you had it was a great script.
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: There was also a great script which referenced famously previous
• 26:27
  Speaker 4: horror movies. I remember, I think it was it was
• 26:30
  Speaker 4: either Matthew Lillard or sk Ulrich was like talking about
• 26:35
  Speaker 4: talking to me about reading this and being like, no
• 26:37
  Speaker 4: one had ever done this before because because the point about,
• 26:41
  Speaker 4: you know, it was previously believed that in some way
• 26:44
  Speaker 4: referencing those other movies would kind of date the movie
• 26:48
  Speaker 4: you were making. And you know, but but you know,
• 26:52
  Speaker 4: Kevin Williamson so brilliantly had fun referencing those, you know,
• 26:57
  Speaker 4: there's previous movies. And that seemed I mean, obviously now
• 27:00
  Speaker 4: that doesn't seem incredibly new and different, but it certainly did.
• 27:04
  Speaker 4: I mean, it seemed almost transgressive to be you know,
• 27:08
  Speaker 4: especially it's a horror fat if you're watching a movie
• 27:10
  Speaker 4: and you know who's grave and has made it, and
• 27:13
  Speaker 4: the opening scene has drew very more, you know, has
• 27:16
  Speaker 4: a conversation between Drew Verrymore on Ghost Face, in which
• 27:19
  Speaker 4: they're talking about the fact that the first Nightmare on
• 27:22
  Speaker 4: ELM stream movie is great, but the subsequent ones are different.
• 27:24
  Speaker 4: I mean that's like, you know, I mean, even if
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: you didn't know all the details of the people involved,
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: if you were just a normal audience member, you could
• 27:32
  Speaker 4: still you know, you can still find that funny and
• 27:34
  Speaker 4: this is just and it all seems incredibly new and fantastic,
• 27:38
  Speaker 4: and it's got the Nick Cave song and you know
• 27:41
  Speaker 4: all the rest of it. I mean, Scream seems so
• 27:43
  Speaker 4: mainstream now we've just you know, had the seventh movie released,
• 27:48
  Speaker 4: but I think in retrospect it seems like a you know,
• 27:52
  Speaker 4: a very entertaining and cool and also quite nasty movie.
• 27:57
  Speaker 4: I mean, you know, yeah, it's actually I interviewed Greg
• 28:01
  Speaker 4: Nico Terra's special specials Mega Artist and Walking Dead, you know,
• 28:06
  Speaker 4: executive producer, and he was like, that was that was
• 28:10
  Speaker 4: the screen where it was nasty and after that kind
• 28:13
  Speaker 4: of wears, you know, brought it back a bit.
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: But you've got Rose, you know, Rose McGowan being being crushed,
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: and then you've.
• 28:18
  Speaker 4: Got that fantastic sequence at the end where you know,
• 28:21
  Speaker 4: skeets and Matthew were stabbing each other, which is comic,
• 28:25
  Speaker 4: but I mean, you know, it looks.
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: Like they're really stabbing each other.
• 28:27
  Speaker 6: Yeah, it's quite and then they realized that they're things
• 28:32
  Speaker 6: that killed.
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: Each other, and then you go to the hospital or whatever.
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: So yeah, I mean for all those reasons. I mean,
• 28:38
  Speaker 3: I mean, I think do because I think one of
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: the points I make in the book is that you know,
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: just because a genre it was once a.
• 28:46
  Speaker 4: Big deal, does not mean that it's going to be,
• 28:50
  Speaker 4: you know, around forever. And you know, I mean famously,
• 28:55
  Speaker 4: you know us as a day and then you know,
• 28:59
  Speaker 4: faded to near Oblivia, and these days it looks like
• 29:03
  Speaker 4: romantic comedies. I mean, certainly in terms of a theatrical presence,
• 29:07
  Speaker 4: but romantic comedies or indeed comedies as a whole, seemed
• 29:10
  Speaker 4: to be a drifting away as thrillers.
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, well we had to remember too that Scream
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: was not a opening weekend hit. It was one of
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: those rare occurrences where it made more money as the
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: weekends went on, so word of mouth at that time
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: was so heavy. Whoever did catch it on the opening weekend,
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: they talked about it, and then whoever caught it on
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: the next weekend, talked about it even more so it
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: brought in more money. It was kind of a phenomenon
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: in that way.
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean at the opening weekend it was. It
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: was fourth.
• 29:42
  Speaker 4: Over the opening weekend, it was thrashed by Favis and
• 29:45
  Speaker 4: butt Head to America, which came out the same weekend.
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: I think verse twenty million. Over its opening weekend.
• 29:52
  Speaker 4: It was also beaten by the live action of the
• 29:55
  Speaker 4: Glenn Close starring live action version.
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: Of one hundred and one thou Natians, and by another movie. Yeah,
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: it came forward.
• 30:03
  Speaker 4: I think it had cost about fifty million, and it
• 30:07
  Speaker 4: grossed about nine million and was seen as something of
• 30:09
  Speaker 4: a failure.
• 30:12
  Speaker 3: The interesting thing, I mean.
• 30:13
  Speaker 4: One of the fun things about a book, one of
• 30:14
  Speaker 4: the first it's not exasperating book.
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: One of the things you have to do with a
• 30:17
  Speaker 3: book like this is explained.
• 30:20
  Speaker 4: The younger readers how things were in the in the
• 30:23
  Speaker 4: olden times and in the mid nineties. You know, there
• 30:29
  Speaker 4: wasn't the kind of you didn't have the media, you
• 30:32
  Speaker 4: didn't have the.
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: The you know, it was pre internet, so this.
• 30:36
  Speaker 4: Whole kind of like obsession and coverage of box office
• 30:40
  Speaker 4: just didn't exist. I mean, you had variety, you know,
• 30:44
  Speaker 4: literal paper versions of variety.
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: And so the film came out was not I mean,
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: everybody went to the premiere pretty much.
• 30:52
  Speaker 7: The film came out, it was not a success, and
• 30:55
  Speaker 7: then the cast went on with their lives, and about
• 30:59
  Speaker 7: three weeks later, they all got a call that the weds.
• 31:03
  Speaker 4: Wanted to have a dinner to celebrate the movie becoming
• 31:05
  Speaker 4: a hit and the news that it was. This was
• 31:08
  Speaker 4: how most cast members realized or found out that the
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: film hadn't they name to become ahead around thirty million
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: over the course of the three weeks, which I find
• 31:17
  Speaker 4: quite hilarious that people didn't even know that their.
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: Own movie, because I know nowadays they have like instant
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: they know they know Night of you know, yeah, yeah,
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: it's absolutely well.
• 31:32
  Speaker 5: I was gonna say, I mean, you mentioned Wes Craven
• 31:34
  Speaker 5: and you know him being in contact with the screen
• 31:36
  Speaker 5: cast members, but I mean, how would you how would
• 31:40
  Speaker 5: you define really Wes Craven's influence on shaping modern horror
• 31:44
  Speaker 5: during that time.
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: Well, I think it's enormous.
• 31:48
  Speaker 4: I mean I was just thinking that the other reason
• 31:49
  Speaker 4: I wasn't very king to see a Scream was that
• 31:52
  Speaker 4: Wes Craven was going through a real had gone through
• 31:55
  Speaker 4: a real lean patch in the years leading up to
• 31:59
  Speaker 4: screen and you know, more for me for not having.
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: More trust in webs.
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: But he had had a very sort of tumultuous career
• 32:08
  Speaker 4: and had scored a big hit with The Hills Have
• 32:10
  Speaker 4: Eyes in the in the late seventies, but then you know,
• 32:14
  Speaker 4: it made several films that weren't all that successful, including
• 32:17
  Speaker 4: the version of the Swamp Thing, and then came back
• 32:19
  Speaker 4: with A Nightmare and Elm Street which was which was
• 32:22
  Speaker 4: a big hit and re established his reputation, but then
• 32:25
  Speaker 4: made more films of you know, he made a Serpent
• 32:27
  Speaker 4: in the Rainbow, but but made other films which were
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: less successful, like Shocker, which was an attempt to really
• 32:35
  Speaker 4: make another a Nightmare in Elm Street.
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: And then he made the you.
• 32:42
  Speaker 4: Know, West Graves's Seen a Nightmare, which is an attempt
• 32:45
  Speaker 4: to revive the Nightmare and Elm Street franchise in quite
• 32:48
  Speaker 4: a metter way that sort of.
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: Pressaged Scream, but was much much less successful. It was
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: kind of a bomb.
• 32:57
  Speaker 4: And then he made his his his The film that
• 33:00
  Speaker 4: he made immediately before Scream was Vampire in Brooklyn, which
• 33:04
  Speaker 4: was sort of a sort of a horror comedy starring.
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: Eddie Murphy as the vampire in Brooklyn, and no one
• 33:14
  Speaker 3: was very sure whether.
• 33:15
  Speaker 4: It was a horror a comedy when they were making it,
• 33:17
  Speaker 4: and no one involved with the movie particularly seemed to
• 33:20
  Speaker 4: like it, and audiences agreed and mostly stayed away.
• 33:24
  Speaker 3: So where's this? And I guess going back in time,
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: you're like, well, where's has made?
• 33:28
  Speaker 4: Like, you know, I think the Last House on the
• 33:31
  Speaker 4: left has sort of rewritten the Hollywood rule book, you know,
• 33:35
  Speaker 4: three or four.
• 33:36
  Speaker 3: Times now, the chances of it, you know, and wasn't.
• 33:39
  Speaker 4: A young man by it by the time he made
• 33:41
  Speaker 4: the Scream. What's the chance of him.
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: Doing it again?
• 33:44
  Speaker 4: But of course he, you know, he does do it again,
• 33:46
  Speaker 4: and it arguably the most definitive way.
• 33:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 33:50
  Speaker 4: And the influence, certainly, the influence of Scream.
• 33:54
  Speaker 3: On the horror.
• 33:57
  Speaker 6: On the horror genre was enormous because it was it's
• 34:00
  Speaker 6: sort of pioneered the teen slasher craze, which would then
• 34:04
  Speaker 6: nominate horror for the next for the next four years.
• 34:08
  Speaker 4: And with you know, Kevin Kevin Williamson wrote I Know
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: what You Did Last Summer, which he had written before
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: Scream came out or written the script for before Scream
• 34:21
  Speaker 4: came out.
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: But then you had, you know, immediately the Weinstein Bob
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: Weinstein greenlit.
• 34:27
  Speaker 4: Screen two, so you've got you know, Scream, screen two,
• 34:29
  Speaker 4: Screen three.
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: I know what you did last summer. I still know
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: what you did last summer. And then I believe more
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: recorded street the DVD screen Quill.
• 34:38
  Speaker 8: And then you had but sort of less famously but
• 34:42
  Speaker 8: still being released Urban Legends, and then the Urban Legend
• 34:45
  Speaker 8: sequel and Ballantine and on and on and on until
• 34:49
  Speaker 8: you get to a point.
• 34:50
  Speaker 4: Where people really have had a number of Chinese Chinese
• 34:53
  Speaker 4: teeth teenagers being you know, being murdered.
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: Although I have to say that the that the another.
• 35:01
  Speaker 4: Reason I think, well why Scream with the success that
• 35:04
  Speaker 4: people don't really talk about this that much is.
• 35:07
  Speaker 3: That it's kind of a murder mystery.
• 35:08
  Speaker 4: It's like an Agatha Christie style murder mystery.
• 35:14
  Speaker 3: And I find that because I mean, just to state
• 35:18
  Speaker 3: the obvious. In a Friday the Thirteenth movie, who's.
• 35:21
  Speaker 4: Doing the killing, Jason is doing the killing, unless it's
• 35:24
  Speaker 4: that movie where Jason turn.
• 35:27
  Speaker 3: And but but went Scream, you.
• 35:30
  Speaker 4: Never know.
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: You know who's doing the killing.
• 35:33
  Speaker 4: And that's I have to say it's the most recent
• 35:34
  Speaker 4: Scream movie, which point I'm going, well.
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: That first, but yeah, the whole that's the whole other story.
• 35:43
  Speaker 3: And I and I'm kind of a.
• 35:44
  Speaker 4: Sucker for you know, Agatha Christie mystery. And there's an
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: argument that Scream is really as much you know, in
• 35:51
  Speaker 4: the in the tradition of that kind of murder mystery
• 35:54
  Speaker 4: as it is, you know, a horror movie.
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: Well, my favorite evolution of like you know, I like
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: Urban Legend, I like you know, and I like I
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: know what you did last summer, But my favorite was
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: the Final Destination franchise, which felt like screened in the
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: Floating Head poster. It was young, it was hip, but
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: it was so much fun to watch those movies. And
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: they like the fact that if that had come out
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: as an X Files episode, I would have been so
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: disappointed at all the years I would spend watching these
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: movies on repeat, and I think Final Destination had just
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: a different enough idea to kind of revitalize that younger
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: hip or cast again until you hit like, I guess, yeah,
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: it's sort of into Final Deestation three, but by that
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: point you're already long into torture porn. But they just
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: started getting more violent to kind of fit in. But
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: what's interesting is even now, like Final Destination Bloodlines just
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: last year did incredible, So they're still.
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: In terms of in terms of the most fun I
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: had at the cinema last year, the.
• 37:03
  Speaker 4: Final Destination Bloodlines would be number one without a shadow
• 37:07
  Speaker 4: of isn't the best?
• 37:08
  Speaker 3: Is it the quote unquote best film I saw last year?
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: I'm not necessarily going to go that far, but I mean,
• 37:15
  Speaker 4: to be clear, I thought it was.
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: It was. It was a great movie. I had a
• 37:20
  Speaker 3: lot of fun with it. But I just had that.
• 37:23
  Speaker 4: Sort of perfect screening experience where I was lucky enough
• 37:27
  Speaker 4: to go to a previous screening in London at one
• 37:30
  Speaker 4: of you know, huge screens in Leicester Square.
• 37:33
  Speaker 3: It was a packed audience that you know, gave away
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: a couple of beers before we started.
• 37:39
  Speaker 4: I'm not sure it's saying you needed to be drunk,
• 37:41
  Speaker 4: as I wasn't drunk, and I was like, oh, that's nice,
• 37:45
  Speaker 4: you know, it's very slightly buzzed. And then I just
• 37:49
  Speaker 4: thought that film absolutely kicked. I mean, I thought, I've
• 37:53
  Speaker 4: never seen a franchise be reinvigorated was quite bad, quite bad,
• 37:59
  Speaker 4: you know, sense of brio and you know, they stuck
• 38:04
  Speaker 4: to the rules, but they also you know, kind of
• 38:07
  Speaker 4: reinvented it all. And then there was that magnificent send
• 38:11
  Speaker 4: off for Tony Todd and I just thought it was great.
• 38:14
  Speaker 3: I was so so happy to watch that movie.
• 38:17
  Speaker 4: And I'm pretty sure, I mean, I'm sure I've seen
• 38:19
  Speaker 4: all the others and yeah, it's a.
• 38:22
  Speaker 3: Great friend of it. And I mean, as a point
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: out in the book, I mean, it was released right.
• 38:26
  Speaker 4: At the end of that Team Smash a craze and
• 38:30
  Speaker 4: I think, I say, something like Final Destination proved that
• 38:34
  Speaker 4: people would still go to see teenagers being exploded by
• 38:37
  Speaker 4: a killer.
• 38:38
  Speaker 3: Gets that killer happened to be Dad itself.
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well it taps into that, like I know, you know,
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: we're all afraid of being stocked and killed by somebody, right,
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: But I think I'm more afraid of what's in the
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: traffic up ahead, or the water leaking on my bathroom
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: tub that could knock me over. And you know what
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: I mean, like these little idiosyncrasies that could happen around
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: me that could cause in what I would reflect on
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: in the afterlife as like, wow, that's how I went out, okay,
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: or likes well, that's I mean, couple dude, who who?
• 39:10
  Speaker 5: Well, first of all, I won't dry behind it.
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: I still think of Final Destination every single time I
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: bore a plane. You know, It's the first thing that
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: comes in my head. Unfortunately, but it happens. It's there,
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: It lives deep in here. No matter how many times
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: I watch it, it never it will never go away.
• 39:26
  Speaker 4: Well and show that to Jeffrey Reddick, who was working
• 39:30
  Speaker 4: at you know, a New Line at the time and
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: came up with the idea and did indeed picture it.
• 39:35
  Speaker 3: As the originally as the next Fell script.
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: And I mean his his script was then for a
• 39:42
  Speaker 4: Final Destination was then you know, retold by other hands.
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: But he did come up with it.
• 39:48
  Speaker 4: They were struggling for the second movie to think of
• 39:50
  Speaker 4: what the disaster the start, and Jeffery suggested the log you.
• 39:56
  Speaker 3: Know, the love Truck, and he said that when I
• 39:59
  Speaker 3: ended it, and he said, he said, every week someone
• 40:01
  Speaker 3: sends him the photo like behind the Love Druck. That
• 40:06
  Speaker 3: is something that yeah, just really stuck with people.
• 40:10
  Speaker 4: And obviously, you know, Final Destination Bloodlights does reference that.
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's me the horror you know, and I.
• 40:19
  Speaker 4: Mean horror does obviously the popularity of horror is tied into.
• 40:26
  Speaker 3: Our horror of it or the horror of horror, and
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: you know, the horrors of real life and Final Destinations.
• 40:34
  Speaker 4: The franchise that definitely takes that literally.
• 40:40
  Speaker 5: Well, I was I was also going to mention, you know,
• 40:43
  Speaker 5: kind of taking it back a little bit before Final Destination,
• 40:46
  Speaker 5: but I just didn't want to gloss over an iconic
• 40:49
  Speaker 5: film such as the Blair Witch Project. Did you feel
• 40:52
  Speaker 5: like that film changed how studios thought about, you know,
• 40:56
  Speaker 5: budgeting and marketing for horror, you know, specifically with that movie.
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean that's that movie is interesting too for
• 41:04
  Speaker 4: many reasons, but a couple of spring to mind, one
• 41:06
  Speaker 4: of which is that it took advantage.
• 41:08
  Speaker 3: Of the Internet in a way that.
• 41:12
  Speaker 4: Had not been used before, and to a degree would
• 41:14
  Speaker 4: not be used in that specific way.
• 41:16
  Speaker 3: Again, but this is the very early days of the Internet.
• 41:19
  Speaker 3: I mean I was just thinking.
• 41:22
  Speaker 4: I worked in a magazine office in like nineteen ninety six,
• 41:27
  Speaker 4: and I think we had.
• 41:28
  Speaker 3: One we had like one access point to.
• 41:31
  Speaker 4: The Internet, and none of us knew how it worked really,
• 41:34
  Speaker 4: you know. So that's that's where we are.
• 41:38
  Speaker 3: I mean, you know, just a year or two before
• 41:41
  Speaker 3: the Player Witch project.
• 41:42
  Speaker 4: But the makers of the film, which obviously costs very
• 41:45
  Speaker 4: little money, had set up their own website giving sort
• 41:50
  Speaker 4: of like teaser stuff for the for the movie, and
• 41:54
  Speaker 4: then for the film got brought by artists and they
• 41:57
  Speaker 4: kind of resuited the website but used they used the
• 42:01
  Speaker 4: Internet to.
• 42:01
  Speaker 3: Sort of imply that this was.
• 42:03
  Speaker 4: A real documentary and that the three cast members had indeed.
• 42:07
  Speaker 3: Gone missing, and this was this idea was.
• 42:14
  Speaker 4: Further spread in more kind of less kind of digital
• 42:17
  Speaker 4: ways that they would have film screenings with colleges and
• 42:19
  Speaker 4: put up I believe, little missing posters for the for
• 42:23
  Speaker 4: the for the cast, and the cast had been interviewed
• 42:28
  Speaker 4: that that sunds I believe when they were trying to
• 42:31
  Speaker 4: tell the film clearly alive and well.
• 42:34
  Speaker 3: But this is the early days of the internet where
• 42:37
  Speaker 3: you know, you didn't know that they'd been interviewed.
• 42:39
  Speaker 4: So that was all the unis that there was some
• 42:41
  Speaker 4: crazy website promoting what seemed to be a documentary which
• 42:44
  Speaker 4: applied that it was a true story.
• 42:46
  Speaker 3: And there was no.
• 42:49
  Speaker 4: You know, there was no really easy way to check
• 42:52
  Speaker 4: any of this, and so that definitely helped. That definitely
• 42:58
  Speaker 4: helped promote the film, and thank good that the sort
• 43:01
  Speaker 4: of investigator. It's like, good is the idea of sort
• 43:04
  Speaker 4: of conspiracy theories as well theories wise that did not then,
• 43:07
  Speaker 4: you know, properly get across the internet.
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: What's funny because like the closest similarity is like twenty
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: years earlier with Rigardio Data does with Cannibal Holocaust by
• 43:19
  Speaker 2: kind of putting putting the cast in like hiding, I
• 43:22
  Speaker 2: guess you could say, and then he gets brought up
• 43:24
  Speaker 2: on murder charges and then at the last minute he's like, oh, hey,
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: look look who I found. You know, it's kind of
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: like it's just a it's just a new version of
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: that in a way.
• 43:34
  Speaker 4: But then what so that's one aspect here. But the
• 43:37
  Speaker 4: other thing I mean, I mean, Blair Wench really showed
• 43:39
  Speaker 4: what you could do in terms of marketing on the Internet.
• 43:43
  Speaker 4: But then the very nature of the movie, the fan
• 43:44
  Speaker 4: footage nature.
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: Of the movie was not something which uh, the filmmakers invented,
• 43:50
  Speaker 3: because then you say.
• 43:50
  Speaker 4: They expect the Cannibal Holocaust and there'd be another film
• 43:53
  Speaker 4: that's done this. But it was the first time a
• 43:55
  Speaker 4: movie like that had become an absolute monster hit. And
• 43:59
  Speaker 4: what's interesting is that the you know, the studio, both
• 44:03
  Speaker 4: artists and and other studios assumed that this was something
• 44:08
  Speaker 4: which could not be repeated.
• 44:09
  Speaker 3: You know, that no one was going to now but
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: watch another found footage movie. I guess tied into.
• 44:14
  Speaker 4: The idea that it had become successful because people thought
• 44:17
  Speaker 4: it was real and studios maybe thought that they couldn't
• 44:21
  Speaker 4: be fooled again.
• 44:21
  Speaker 3: So when they come to make blair Witch too, that
• 44:24
  Speaker 3: is not a fan of footage, you know.
• 44:26
  Speaker 4: And indeed it takes seven.
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: Or eight years because of.
• 44:31
  Speaker 4: You know, the found I mean, it takes I mean really,
• 44:34
  Speaker 4: it's not until Paranormal Activity.
• 44:37
  Speaker 3: Ten years later that the that the found the craze
• 44:40
  Speaker 3: for found footage horror stunt. But it's just remarkable that
• 44:44
  Speaker 3: studios were like, no, that's it.
• 44:46
  Speaker 9: We never you know, given you know, given how keen
• 44:50
  Speaker 9: studios a sort of repeat the formula of a successful
• 44:54
  Speaker 9: horror movie, it's remarkable that everybody collectively went, We're never
• 44:58
  Speaker 9: going to do that again.
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And Book of Shadows is a weird like when
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: people if you've never seen Book of Shadows and you've
• 45:06
  Speaker 2: seen blair Witch, going into Book of Shadows is whiplash.
• 45:09
  Speaker 2: You're like, what that will happened to? What I love
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: so much about that first movie and it all it's
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: like and it's such a mess.
• 45:16
  Speaker 4: It almost takes its us go from screen really because
• 45:19
  Speaker 4: Book you know, the sequel very much references, but seriously.
• 45:25
  Speaker 3: Beautiful. Well, let's just let's just do it again, you know,
• 45:28
  Speaker 3: or something you know, or send some more gives to
• 45:31
  Speaker 3: the wood. That would be the I mean, I guess
• 45:35
  Speaker 3: they're doing They do that with Book of Shadows too,
• 45:38
  Speaker 3: but yeah, that's kind of dumb.
• 45:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, well to kind of pivot a little bit
• 45:46
  Speaker 5: compared to you know, the found footage, uh sub genre.
• 45:51
  Speaker 5: But I have to ask, you know, we've got films
• 45:55
  Speaker 5: like The Ring, The Grudge that come out roughly around
• 45:59
  Speaker 5: that same time. You know, how much did international horror
• 46:03
  Speaker 5: impact American horror during that time, because obviously that's kind
• 46:07
  Speaker 5: of a you know, it was influencing it in ways
• 46:10
  Speaker 5: that we really hadn't seen before up until that point.
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: Well, that's another.
• 46:16
  Speaker 4: Interesting difference between two thousands of horror and the seventies
• 46:22
  Speaker 4: horror that if you look at the Masters of Horror
• 46:24
  Speaker 4: from the seventies, they're all white male.
• 46:29
  Speaker 3: I mean, even if I'm saying.
• 46:31
  Speaker 4: This, you know, I'm aware that that there are some exceptions.
• 46:35
  Speaker 3: But if you think of the people, if you think.
• 46:37
  Speaker 4: Of some of the great horror exponents of the seventies,
• 46:41
  Speaker 4: it's like John Carpenter, where's Craven Tobe Hooper, I mean Spilberg,
• 46:47
  Speaker 4: I guess to a degree with Jaws, And so they're
• 46:51
  Speaker 4: all like these white white American dudes. And then like Cronberg,
• 46:55
  Speaker 4: seems seems like the outside these these are white today.
• 47:02
  Speaker 4: But starting we're not starting, but certainly the period I cover,
• 47:07
  Speaker 4: you have.
• 47:08
  Speaker 3: A lot of it's more, it's a lot.
• 47:14
  Speaker 4: Of different types of people, I think, far more than
• 47:17
  Speaker 4: in the seventies, and that you know, covers race and sexuality,
• 47:22
  Speaker 4: and not just sexuality, but.
• 47:23
  Speaker 3: But you know, race, sex, where people are from, and
• 47:28
  Speaker 3: so on and so forth, and so specifically.
• 47:31
  Speaker 4: In regard to the international market or international influence, yes,
• 47:35
  Speaker 4: you have.
• 47:37
  Speaker 3: America remaking a lot of you.
• 47:40
  Speaker 10: Know, what became the Jay horror with the Ring and
• 47:43
  Speaker 10: the Grudge, and I think those are the two most
• 47:45
  Speaker 10: successful examples, both certainly financially and also creatively, but my god.
• 47:51
  Speaker 4: They then you know, they made about twenty five other
• 47:54
  Speaker 4: you know, largely much less successful Jay horror adaptation, and so.
• 47:59
  Speaker 3: You have America. I mean the you know, the American
• 48:02
  Speaker 3: version of the Grudge is directed by the by the
• 48:07
  Speaker 3: director with.
• 48:07
  Speaker 4: The filmmaker with made the Japanese version of the Grudge.
• 48:12
  Speaker 3: So you have that, but you also have you also
• 48:14
  Speaker 3: have people like yamadul Toro coming.
• 48:17
  Speaker 4: In Alexander Aya, you know, I mean, twenty eight Days Later.
• 48:23
  Speaker 3: Is obviously a British movie. You have. What's interesting is
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: you have more and more for various reasons, including I
• 48:31
  Speaker 3: think techn you know, technological reasons. You have these these.
• 48:36
  Speaker 4: Filmmakers you make it, you know, in case of Yama
• 48:39
  Speaker 4: del Toro, make an impact in their.
• 48:42
  Speaker 3: Own country with the cronos.
• 48:44
  Speaker 11: And then come and work in you know, in the
• 48:47
  Speaker 11: US and sort of bring their own, you know, the
• 48:51
  Speaker 11: flavors I mean, I mean obviously Yamadulta was hugely importanced
• 48:55
  Speaker 11: by American movies.
• 48:56
  Speaker 4: But there's then sort of you know, putting them through
• 49:01
  Speaker 4: the del Torrow you know mine, and coming up to
• 49:04
  Speaker 4: sort of thing you know, very different when you came
• 49:07
  Speaker 4: back to make them, when he arrived to make them.
• 49:10
  Speaker 4: So yeah, it's a very exciting, I mean hugely exciting period.
• 49:15
  Speaker 4: And you've got the and I mentioned ow anxiety, you've
• 49:17
  Speaker 4: got the whole you know, French extreme movement, which.
• 49:23
  Speaker 3: Like I mean, I did see. I had to say,
• 49:25
  Speaker 3: I wasn't before writing the book, I wasn't that.
• 49:29
  Speaker 4: I wasn't that familiar with French you know, the French
• 49:34
  Speaker 4: extreme films, and they had to watch them.
• 49:38
  Speaker 3: So, I mean, not all of.
• 49:39
  Speaker 4: Them, but they're they're just so well made, and they're
• 49:41
  Speaker 4: doing things in such an unpleasant passion. And I mean
• 49:45
  Speaker 4: I see Martyrs which Origin, which is an incredible piece
• 49:50
  Speaker 4: of work, but firstly, the last third I found so
• 49:54
  Speaker 4: tough to watch.
• 49:55
  Speaker 3: That didn't kind of encourage me to further explore.
• 49:59
  Speaker 4: And some one, you know, someone that if someone says
• 50:02
  Speaker 4: to me, oh this is the the you know, this
• 50:04
  Speaker 4: is a very tough this horror movie is a very
• 50:06
  Speaker 4: tough watch. I'm like, now I'll watch the thing else
• 50:08
  Speaker 4: I'll watch, you know, I'll watch the finals yesterday.
• 50:10
  Speaker 3: I don't, you know, I don't. I'm not someone I
• 50:13
  Speaker 3: don't need to eat. I don't need to watch the
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: horror version of like the hottest curry you could eat.
• 50:19
  Speaker 3: Prove of that, although, but I just a little a
• 50:21
  Speaker 3: good time watching the French six Stree movies. I think
• 50:25
  Speaker 3: probably because Marnys is like, it's such a tough watch.
• 50:31
  Speaker 3: But then comparatively, I watched Inside.
• 50:33
  Speaker 12: And I was like, I mean, I mean this is
• 50:36
  Speaker 12: tough as well, but I'm feel like it's fun. Dren
• 50:39
  Speaker 12: Stale is kind of amazing and it's Yes, so some
• 50:44
  Speaker 12: of those songs.
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: Are a real discovery for me. But yeah, you do
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: have you know.
• 50:48
  Speaker 4: The mount Rush War, of the mount Rush War of
• 50:52
  Speaker 4: great horror directors of the two thousands looks you know.
• 50:56
  Speaker 3: Literally quite different in a lot of ways. I think
• 51:00
  Speaker 3: the Matt.
• 51:00
  Speaker 5: Rushmore horror se well, I was gonna say too, because
• 51:05
  Speaker 5: we saw a resurgence in you know, throughout the two
• 51:09
  Speaker 5: thousands where we were getting a lot of remakes the
• 51:11
  Speaker 5: Texas Chainsaw Massacre, Halloween. Why do you think studios lean
• 51:16
  Speaker 5: so heavily into remaking classic horror films during that specific period.
• 51:22
  Speaker 3: Well, because they love making money.
• 51:23
  Speaker 5: I guess that.
• 51:28
  Speaker 2: Answered.
• 51:29
  Speaker 4: Yeah, But no, I think what's interest is the what's
• 51:35
  Speaker 4: interesting is the I mean, there were a lot of
• 51:38
  Speaker 4: horror remakes in the eighties and nineties.
• 51:42
  Speaker 3: I mean you couldn't say there one, but.
• 51:47
  Speaker 4: You know, horror fims always pushed back, you know, the
• 51:50
  Speaker 4: horror fans were rarely delighted to hear the classic horror
• 51:55
  Speaker 4: film is being remade.
• 51:57
  Speaker 3: And so I think.
• 52:00
  Speaker 4: Videos tended to go to the sequel route, you know,
• 52:02
  Speaker 4: and you got some wise.
• 52:04
  Speaker 3: Well, because if the person is a hit, then it.
• 52:07
  Speaker 4: Makes more sense to do a sequel to that than
• 52:11
  Speaker 4: you know, to remake some some old horror movies that
• 52:13
  Speaker 4: people might not have.
• 52:14
  Speaker 3: Heard about it.
• 52:16
  Speaker 4: So then you get to the early two thousands, and
• 52:19
  Speaker 4: as he said, Platinam Dunes stuff started going, and Platinam
• 52:22
  Speaker 4: Dunees was was created originally with with remakes in mind.
• 52:30
  Speaker 4: For those who don't know, Platinum Dune was co founded
• 52:32
  Speaker 4: by Michael Bay in the early two thousands, who was already,
• 52:36
  Speaker 4: like you know, one of the most commercial, one of
• 52:38
  Speaker 4: the most successful.
• 52:39
  Speaker 3: Directors around, and he had an idea too, well, no idea,
• 52:44
  Speaker 3: but he was aware that.
• 52:47
  Speaker 4: That they can remake the Texas Chainsaw massacre. And then Michael,
• 52:50
  Speaker 4: Michael Bay himself made a little teaser while shooting a
• 52:54
  Speaker 4: commercial from Mercedes or whatever which avolved, you know, a
• 52:57
  Speaker 4: chainsaw coming through wall, and then you know, got financed
• 53:02
  Speaker 4: to do that, and that was hugely successful.
• 53:06
  Speaker 3: Although I guess by then, in fairness, by then the Texas.
• 53:09
  Speaker 4: James saw franchise had been someone I don't say tarnished,
• 53:14
  Speaker 4: but I mean they'd made My Mother sequels of that,
• 53:17
  Speaker 4: so you know, perhaps people were more at home to it.
• 53:20
  Speaker 4: I mean what people got very upset about was was
• 53:22
  Speaker 4: the remake of Dawn of the Dead, which Zack Snyder
• 53:26
  Speaker 4: directed as James Gunn wrote and famously has running zombies
• 53:31
  Speaker 4: and it's funny.
• 53:33
  Speaker 3: Zac Clone is not really a horror guy.
• 53:35
  Speaker 4: And it was what was extremely successful virtual director at
• 53:39
  Speaker 4: that point and was kind of very surprised to learn
• 53:42
  Speaker 4: that people were upset him making a Dawn.
• 53:48
  Speaker 3: Of the Dead remake.
• 53:49
  Speaker 4: And James Gunn, who had had early in his career
• 53:53
  Speaker 4: who worked for Troma, which you would have thought would
• 53:55
  Speaker 4: have established this horror bona fides, but was best known
• 53:58
  Speaker 4: as the guy who'd written the Scooba Do movie.
• 54:00
  Speaker 3: So, but it's announce So I think firstly announced the
• 54:03
  Speaker 3: zax Nighter, knowing for directing.
• 54:06
  Speaker 4: The Budwiser Clydesdale commercial, I was going to direct this film,
• 54:12
  Speaker 4: and then James Gunn, best known.
• 54:14
  Speaker 3: For writing the Scooby Doo film, was going to write it.
• 54:17
  Speaker 3: There was absolute.
• 54:18
  Speaker 4: Outrage, and you know, Adical News wrote an editorial saying
• 54:24
  Speaker 4: headline something like when when there's no more room in Hell,
• 54:27
  Speaker 4: James Gunn.
• 54:28
  Speaker 3: Will write a remake of Dawn, and.
• 54:32
  Speaker 4: Uh, you know, gun says that he received death threats,
• 54:36
  Speaker 4: and I'm sure he did.
• 54:38
  Speaker 3: So this was like so that was the sort of
• 54:41
  Speaker 3: height of pushback on that. But then both of those
• 54:44
  Speaker 3: movies and that's the like really good and I mean
• 54:48
  Speaker 3: I think the doorn that that remake is terrific, and
• 54:51
  Speaker 3: I think the I thinks of James and Mansac remake
• 54:53
  Speaker 3: is terrific.
• 54:54
  Speaker 4: I remember seeing that at ah, you know, public screening
• 54:58
  Speaker 4: in in New York on a big screen and when
• 55:02
  Speaker 4: the you know, they pick up the hitchhiker and then
• 55:05
  Speaker 4: like the bullet goes through the back of her brain
• 55:08
  Speaker 4: and the back of her head of it, and the
• 55:10
  Speaker 4: camera sort of like follows or I'm sure I'm just
• 55:13
  Speaker 4: describing it.
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: But you're like, holy God, like yeah, and you have
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: Daniel Pearl returning as a cematographer. So this is shot
• 55:24
  Speaker 2: by the same guy who shot the original film. He
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: comes back and I think Texas Chainsaw three is the
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: best shot, the best of looking Texas Chansaw Mascer movie.
• 55:37
  Speaker 2: It looks incredible, especially now when you have it on
• 55:40
  Speaker 2: four K from Aero video and you know it was
• 55:43
  Speaker 2: this this transfer was approved by Marcus the Spell and
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: Daniel Pearl, and even in their commentary track, like he
• 55:50
  Speaker 2: talks so highly about it, And that was growing up
• 55:55
  Speaker 2: that that was maturing for me as I was, like,
• 55:58
  Speaker 2: I remember watching it, oh three, I loved it, and
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: then like twenty twelve learning like more crew and learning
• 56:06
  Speaker 2: who Daniel Pearl was, and then going going back and
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: rewatching it knowing it is Daniel Pearl and falling in
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: love with it. So like that's the kind of stuff
• 56:14
  Speaker 2: that that I love so much. As time passes and
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: you kind of become more educated in this, there's like
• 56:18
  Speaker 2: the fun little tidbits that allow you to go back
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: and kind of reanalyze again for other reasons.
• 56:25
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's brilliantly shot awfulness, you know, so it's so
• 56:30
  Speaker 4: well shocked.
• 56:31
  Speaker 3: It's also what he's shooting is so griming unpleasant. And
• 56:34
  Speaker 3: I interviewed the market from this belt on my book,
• 56:37
  Speaker 3: and I guess he wasn't.
• 56:38
  Speaker 4: Entirely sure what like the film's look was going to be,
• 56:43
  Speaker 4: or had a different idea, but then he said, like
• 56:45
  Speaker 4: I think he said, they started shooting in the van
• 56:48
  Speaker 4: and by the end of the day everybody was just
• 56:50
  Speaker 4: like covered in film, and he was like, well, I
• 56:54
  Speaker 4: guess that's.
• 56:54
  Speaker 3: What I guess that's what it's gonna look like. And
• 56:56
  Speaker 3: the about that is that about Jessica Biel sells Jessica
• 57:02
  Speaker 3: Bill She's the final girl in the movie, and he
• 57:04
  Speaker 3: was saying how great she was and how she really
• 57:07
  Speaker 3: got into her character.
• 57:08
  Speaker 4: And at one point during the year is marketing is
• 57:12
  Speaker 4: both too young seeing sons came out come to visit
• 57:17
  Speaker 4: and during lunchtime they asked that Dad becose the woman
• 57:21
  Speaker 4: was crying in the corner.
• 57:23
  Speaker 3: He said, I think he was lying she was crying
• 57:30
  Speaker 3: because she was in character.
• 57:32
  Speaker 4: It was phenomenally hot, and you know she's asking she's
• 57:36
  Speaker 4: perpetually screaming and crying and running around, so I can't
• 57:40
  Speaker 4: imagine that.
• 57:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, this is what like a couple of years after
• 57:45
  Speaker 2: her role in Seventh Heaven Ends so far removed. Well, Steve,
• 57:51
  Speaker 2: before we before we part ways here man, any final
• 57:54
  Speaker 2: questions that.
• 57:54
  Speaker 5: You want to you want to get in, I would say,
• 58:01
  Speaker 5: you know, were there any films from this specific era
• 58:05
  Speaker 5: that you were covering in your book that you feel
• 58:07
  Speaker 5: like we're either underrated or overlooked at that time.
• 58:12
  Speaker 3: I mean, it's an obvious answer, but I mean it wasn't.
• 58:17
  Speaker 3: It wasn't overlooked by me. I've paid money to go
• 58:19
  Speaker 3: to see it. But Bubba Hotel, I really like.
• 58:23
  Speaker 4: This is Don Costarelli's adaptation of a of a Joe
• 58:26
  Speaker 4: Landel book, starring Bruce Campbell as a guy who believes
• 58:33
  Speaker 4: he's Elvis and Ozzie Davis, who is a black actor
• 58:40
  Speaker 4: which I mentioned because he plays a character he's John F.
• 58:43
  Speaker 3: Kennedy, and together they team up to battle an ancient.
• 58:48
  Speaker 4: Mummy team that has an old people's facility and us
• 58:54
  Speaker 4: directed by Don Coscarelli, the director of fantasm a these
• 59:01
  Speaker 4: and it's like it's a movie that that wouldn't have
• 59:04
  Speaker 4: happened if Don Costarellia had not dragged that project up
• 59:08
  Speaker 4: at the August Mountain and then dragged it up another
• 59:11
  Speaker 4: mountain to get distribution.
• 59:13
  Speaker 3: And I mean, I feel it was certainly overlooked the time.
• 59:17
  Speaker 3: I feel, you know, in the ensuing thirty years, it
• 59:21
  Speaker 3: certainly not overlooked.
• 59:22
  Speaker 4: My horror facts, but that's terrific, and I have to say,
• 59:25
  Speaker 4: I don't even sure I mentioned in the book, but
• 59:28
  Speaker 4: is Coustarelia's John dies at the end absolute who's as
• 59:32
  Speaker 4: well and has like just a fantastic opening sequence which
• 59:38
  Speaker 4: is which is a metaphysical.
• 59:40
  Speaker 3: Debate about what is it if you if you've got an.
• 59:44
  Speaker 4: Axe or something, and you've changed the head and you
• 59:46
  Speaker 4: change the handlers, it's the same acts, which sounds a
• 59:49
  Speaker 4: really boring way to open the movie, but the way
• 59:52
  Speaker 4: he's using that act and damaging it, it's definitely worth
• 59:58
  Speaker 4: checking out.
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 3: I mean, you definitely, I definitely.
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 4: Find myself, for the most part, routings of people I'd
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 4: done Coscarelli who in the same world, you know.
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 3: Would be given them limited funds to make his movies.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 4: But but in the real world, you know, all is
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 4: always having to battle to find out his next film,
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 4: even though so many of his previous films have been successful.
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 3: I think, yeah, I think that's a good one. I mean,
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 3: the great thing.
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 4: About horror, I always think is that there are horror
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 4: horror movies, which.
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 3: Like in the horror movies, can be very divisive when
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 3: they are released.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 4: But over time, it's hard to think of a horror
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 4: movies that does not eventually get some sort of following,
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 4: and you know, I'm I'm both surprised and delighted by uh,
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 4: you know, the obscure titles that sort are now getting,
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 4: you know, Christie four Gay Restorations with you know, seven
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 4: different commentaries. I mean, what was one of the one
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 4: of the great uh, I mean, it's something we haven't
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 4: talked about, which is hugely important.
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 3: Is that the certainly the first half of the two
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 3: thousands of the absolute key of the DVP.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 4: And so I mean Joe's Joe Lynch, the dragor had
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 4: told the story many times and I stole it from
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 4: my book.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 3: But Joe Lynch's first movie was Wrong Turn two and
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 3: he goes into see the head of the you.
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 4: Know, Pops Home Video division, and he's laying out all
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 4: his plans, and the executives says, that's great, Joe.
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 3: I mean, but you know, as long as you know, we.
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 4: Could put diarrhea into a d v d K and
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 4: if it's not on.
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 3: The cover, then well we'll still make our money back.
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 3: If Joe always jokes that he heard that and he
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 3: resolved to make the finest.
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 4: Diarrhea, I think it's right that he decided he would
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 4: be eating phil a mign and that's creating.
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 2: Diarrhea, which I mean wrong wrong Go two is obvious.
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but but the dance, I mean, it's not really
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 3: a down side. But what what what.
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 4: You knows, as you're aware, they would release a movie
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 4: on DVD.
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 3: A horror movie, and then like six months.
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 4: Three year later it was released like the unrated version
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 4: of DVD, which you know, sometimes we're containing four or
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 4: five minutes.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 3: Of extra footage or sometimes it would be saying like
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 3: three seconds of extra footage, and then maybe two years
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 3: later it would release the collection of edition.
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 4: And all of these had like an increasing number of
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 4: commentaries to my mental conferies earlier on.
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 3: But you know, I fell obliged to listen to a
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 3: lot of these commentary.
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 4: So with something like Hostel by the End or Kevin Beaver,
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 4: there's like five six seven commentary, so I'm having to
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 4: effect and you know, not watch the bold.
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 3: And listen to the film or listen to the commentary
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 3: so that you know, in case.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 4: There's some great story I missed, or you know, I
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 4: mean I DVD like Ross for the book and didn't
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 4: just want into regurgitate stuff the set of commentaries at
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 4: the time, but like every commentary, Yeah, as the directors commentary,
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 4: and then there's the collge Kupry with Eli and sonas opos.
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 4: I'm certainly no complaining, but it was quite a quite
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 4: a time consuming exercise.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 3: But again, av.
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well that's you know, with our show. Luckily over
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 2: the you know, we're on season three of our show now,
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 2: and our goal was to try to educate people and
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 2: why they should listen to audio commentaries, because at this
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 2: point it's kind of become like it feels reserved for
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 2: the deepest of fans. But one thing that we've learned
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 2: in doing the show is that, you know, we're not
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 2: just regurgitating the commentary. We're taking interesting bits and then
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 2: forming the conversation around those because unless you listen to
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 2: the commentary, there's nobody having conversations about those bits. So
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 2: in the years that we've been doing or now year
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 2: and a half that we've been doing this, the amount
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: of people who reach out and say, hey, I've never
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 2: listened to a commentary. Try before I checked out your show,
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 2: and now like that's my favorite piece. It's it's incredible
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 2: and I would love to have you back again one
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 2: day and we could just talk about we could just
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 2: talk about DVDs, the DVD era of the two thousands.
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, I mean it just meant that so many more,
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 3: it was so much easier. I mean, it's never easy
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 3: to get finance for a movie, but you know it was.
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 3: It was the dvdtail. I mean, the reason that's you.
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 4: Know five, five or four or my Final lest Nation
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 4: movies is the reason that there's the three, four, and
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 4: five exists is because they knew that they would make money.
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 3: On d V day.
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly. Well, I'll make sure to link
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 2: everything down below, obviously for screaming conjuring. If you've got
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 2: read on you links to nineteen eighty four Publishing. I'll
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 2: even put up the Amazon links for people if that's
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 2: where they choose to purchase from. I'll make sure all
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 2: those links are down below. Thank you again for doing
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 2: this with us taking the hour to do this, you know,
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 2: appreciate it.
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 3: It's it's my abscreen. It's load of people who are
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 3: taken the time to have a good list of book Yeah.
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, it's incredible. I encourage everybody to seek it
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 2: out and I will be screaming to the mountains waiting
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 2: to see kind of what you got coming for us next.
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 13: So very excited I got to I got to my
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 13: das to write about stuff that the people he did
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 13: that stuff don't know that I'm I'm thinking about it.
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 3: That's the truth.
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 2: Well, very very excited for it. Thank you again, As always.
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to hear more shows from the
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: Someone's Favorite Productions podcast network. Please select the link in
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: the description.