Transcript

Sharri | 20 June · Sharri

0:07
Speaker 1: Good evening.
0:08
Speaker 2: Will we learnt today that Victoria police is treating a
0:11
Speaker 2: spate of anti Semitic attacks on political offices as individual
0:16
Speaker 2: and separate investigations led.
0:18
Speaker 1: By local police.
0:20
Speaker 2: This is despite the fact it would at the very
0:23
Speaker 2: least be a credible working hypothesis that the same group
0:27
Speaker 2: of activists might be involved in each These incidents are
0:32
Speaker 2: escalating and growing more dangerous. It's astonishing these pro Hamas
0:38
Speaker 2: activists haven't been arrested. They were still loose on the
0:42
Speaker 2: streets and free to strike Josh Burns's.
0:45
Speaker 1: Office in the early hours just this week.
0:48
Speaker 2: In fact, the lack of police action might be spurring
0:52
Speaker 2: these unlawful vandals on to commit even more outrageous crimes.
0:57
Speaker 1: They're not hiding, they're not shy.
1:00
Speaker 2: They are ashamed of their racist exploits. They're boasting about
1:04
Speaker 2: them online in posts that the tech companies are just allowing.
1:09
Speaker 1: To stay up and go viral.
1:12
Speaker 2: Here is a clip of pro Palestinian radicals attacking the
1:16
Speaker 2: Attorney General Mark Drefus's office.
1:19
Speaker 3: See the probation the party policy tonight are brought together.
1:24
Speaker 4: I need commanded to.
1:25
Speaker 2: Israel security Palestinians.
1:27
Speaker 5: Maybe suffering is not the main Israeli concern.
1:30
Speaker 6: Now attack Palestinian targets without sixteen warplanes killing eleven people.
1:37
Speaker 7: Palestinians killed was twenty Palestinians were killed today.
1:42
Speaker 1: That was on the fifth of June.
1:44
Speaker 2: As you can see, they're shamelessly and brazenly waiving these.
1:48
Speaker 1: Videos under the nose of police.
1:50
Speaker 2: And that video said and the caption was the Labor government,
1:54
Speaker 2: including Mark Dreyfus, voted against recognizing the state of Palestine.
1:59
Speaker 2: We did some renovations to his office in response.
2:04
Speaker 1: Now in a warning that's only going to get worse.
2:07
Speaker 2: Their hashtag was escalate for rafa and into fada bring
2:11
Speaker 2: it home. And they film themselves also vandalizing Bill Shotton's
2:16
Speaker 2: office to have a look God.
2:19
Speaker 1: The government supports the people. If the UK didn't Sayanism
2:22
Speaker 1: is not compared.
2:23
Speaker 2: Up the WHICHUD isn't the hijack fee the state and
2:26
Speaker 2: is misrepresenting Israel equals.
2:29
Speaker 1: This policemen, then they're nick cleansing.
2:30
Speaker 2: D one one the lists for being more verbal curse
2:33
Speaker 2: every saying this says.
2:34
Speaker 1: The adorers and Balfour.
2:36
Speaker 2: Was not a ways Mancheme or Broschelt between them. The
2:39
Speaker 2: wsity created and.
2:41
Speaker 1: It went on.
2:43
Speaker 2: But perhaps this next video is the worst because you
2:47
Speaker 2: see the thugs violently smash labor politician Daniel Molino's office
2:52
Speaker 2: window with hammers, and they also paint the red upside
2:56
Speaker 2: down triangle that stands for hamastation.
3:01
Speaker 8: Lists that we were and which package that lets but
3:15
Speaker 8: la camo basshutin sis and I said, you know it's
3:18
Speaker 8: leffers de famous regions for unfair again but again, but
3:24
Speaker 8: again by again, Belgada ended the game. Maybe said, but
3:29
Speaker 8: Mata or Macusilader, not lama vic.
3:33
Speaker 1: Daniel Milino is a regular guest on this show. He's
3:36
Speaker 1: a labor MP.
3:37
Speaker 2: His office was closed for two weeks after it was trashed,
3:41
Speaker 2: and then just as he was about to move back in,
3:43
Speaker 2: it was trashed again.
3:46
Speaker 6: People are emailing or calling or walking off the street
3:49
Speaker 6: with individual concerns and.
3:53
Speaker 2: This that's right, all right, right, you do not remember
4:00
Speaker 2: that's artwork, which is beutiful.
4:04
Speaker 8: Seq.
4:07
Speaker 1: That's what he's dealing with on a daily basis.
4:10
Speaker 2: But the Insta account, the Instagram account that posted that
4:13
Speaker 2: video actually takes the credit. It says we his constituents
4:19
Speaker 2: opposed to genocide paid him a visit and it had
4:23
Speaker 2: that violent video that I just showed you before.
4:26
Speaker 1: I mean, they're all openly posting these videos.
4:30
Speaker 2: The Victorian editor for the Australian newspaper, Damon Johnston, reports
4:34
Speaker 2: today that despite pro Palestinian vandals attacking up to a
4:38
Speaker 2: dozen federal and state electored officers in the wake of
4:41
Speaker 2: October seven terror attacks, Victoria Police confirmed it was yet
4:46
Speaker 2: to call in or establish a dedicated.
4:49
Speaker 1: Task force to lead the investigation.
4:53
Speaker 2: Asked by The Australian whether it could confirm how many
4:56
Speaker 2: attacks on electored officers were being investigated, how many the
5:00
Speaker 2: arrests and charges had been laid, and whether calling in
5:03
Speaker 2: a specialist task force was being considered, Victoria Police said
5:08
Speaker 2: these incidents are investigated by local crime investigation units.
5:13
Speaker 1: We do not have overall stats. I mean, can it
5:18
Speaker 1: really be that hard for police to do their jobs.
5:21
Speaker 2: It's likely the attacks on different politicians officers are being
5:25
Speaker 2: done by the same group of people, given they're posting
5:29
Speaker 2: their own videos to the same social media accounts with
5:32
Speaker 2: the same hashtags and the same group is taking credit
5:36
Speaker 2: for them in a sign off image at the end.
5:39
Speaker 2: So how can police treat them as separate incidents and
5:42
Speaker 2: not set up a task force? Perhaps interviewing the people
5:47
Speaker 2: that run these pro Palestinian groups linked to the social
5:50
Speaker 2: media accounts would be one obvious place to start. Because politicians,
5:57
Speaker 2: their staff, and the entire Jewish commun unity are being intimidated.
6:02
Speaker 2: The activists themselves are warning this is going to escalate.
6:08
Speaker 1: Already.
6:09
Speaker 2: The fire and violence at Josh Burns's office this week
6:12
Speaker 2: was more dangerous than the attacks that came before, and
6:17
Speaker 2: Josh Burns is seriously worried that someone is going to
6:20
Speaker 2: get hurt or, as he says, or worse.
6:25
Speaker 9: This morning, six people turned up to my office. They
6:30
Speaker 9: came with kerosene, They smashed in windows with a hammer.
6:35
Speaker 9: They spray painted on the outside of my office. We've
6:39
Speaker 9: seen our family on the other side of the world
6:41
Speaker 9: being caught up in conflict, and I you know, if
6:45
Speaker 9: I could, if I could do anything to stop this
6:47
Speaker 9: conflict from happening any longer, I would do it. But
6:51
Speaker 9: we can't do that in Australia. We just don't have
6:53
Speaker 9: that sort of leverage. I'm nervous about it escalating even further.
6:56
Speaker 9: I'm nervous about someone getting hurt or worse.
7:02
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's no indication that police or the Prime Minister
7:06
Speaker 2: is taking this seriously.
7:08
Speaker 1: Enough and this is what worries me.
7:10
Speaker 2: This lawlessness is out of control and where are the authorities.
7:15
Speaker 1: It's a point former Treasurer Josh Friedenberg made.
7:19
Speaker 2: He said, what we need is more action from our
7:22
Speaker 2: political leaders and law enforcement to protect the community.
7:26
Speaker 1: Our leaders must step up and rest.
7:29
Speaker 2: Control back from the mob, a mob that has had
7:32
Speaker 2: free reign since October seven to act in a violent,
7:36
Speaker 2: hateful and UnAustralian manner. He says, it's not just the
7:40
Speaker 2: Jewish community that's under attack, it's Australia's social cohesion that
7:44
Speaker 2: is under attack and the very values that underpin it.
7:48
Speaker 2: And Josh says, as he keeps saying, this is Australia's fight, Let's.
7:53
Speaker 1: Be very clear.
7:54
Speaker 2: We are seeing a dereliction of duty. The truth is
7:58
Speaker 2: there's a lack of political will to take action. When
8:01
Speaker 2: Albineasy criticizes these attacks, and he does criticize them, he
8:06
Speaker 2: often says a line that it undermines the Palestinian cause.
8:12
Speaker 10: And how people think that they advance their cause through
8:15
Speaker 10: activities like this is beyond me.
8:18
Speaker 11: It does nothing.
8:19
Speaker 10: It undermines the cause that people purport to represent. It
8:25
Speaker 10: is unacceptable that misinformation has been consciously and deliberately spread
8:30
Speaker 10: by some Green senators and Mpeace. He have engaged in
8:34
Speaker 10: this in demonstrations outside.
8:38
Speaker 11: Offices and online.
8:40
Speaker 10: All of us have a responsibility to prevent conflict in
8:45
Speaker 10: the Middle East from being used as a platform for
8:47
Speaker 10: prejudice here at home.
8:50
Speaker 2: And in that statement he went on to say again
8:52
Speaker 2: that it undermines the Palestinian cause, for which he said
8:56
Speaker 2: he has advocated for his whole life. Well, these are
9:00
Speaker 2: very weak statements that it undermines their cause. Because these
9:03
Speaker 2: criminals are posting the hamas symbol and slogans like Zionism
9:07
Speaker 2: is fascism. It doesn't undermine the cause because there is
9:12
Speaker 2: no cause there. Anti Semitism isn't a cause, and that
9:17
Speaker 2: shows you how morally feeble our prime minister is. But
9:23
Speaker 2: it's not just the police and our politicians. You have
9:25
Speaker 2: to look at the media too.
9:27
Speaker 1: Now.
9:28
Speaker 2: The ABC seven thirty report had a good look at
9:30
Speaker 2: this issue, at the vandalism of politicians and their officers
9:34
Speaker 2: last week.
9:35
Speaker 1: It was a good report, but then look how they
9:37
Speaker 1: present it.
9:38
Speaker 2: They had this headline, are guars are protesters crossing the
9:42
Speaker 2: line by vandalizing MP's offices?
9:46
Speaker 1: Question mark? Yes, of course they are.
9:50
Speaker 2: The failure of law enforcement is so alarming that a
9:54
Speaker 2: former Deputy Director of Public Prosecutions for the Commonwealth, Mark Legrand,
9:59
Speaker 2: has been spur word to speak out.
10:02
Speaker 1: Legrand, who was.
10:03
Speaker 2: Also a member of the National Crime Authority, will he's
10:06
Speaker 2: going to come on my program on Monday night to
10:08
Speaker 2: speak about this. But in the meantime, he says that
10:12
Speaker 2: Jews have been abandoned by those charged with enforcing the
10:16
Speaker 2: rule of law and equal protection. He says they've been
10:19
Speaker 2: abandoned by governments, by police, and by the so called
10:22
Speaker 2: human rights and racial vilification bodies. And he holds the
10:27
Speaker 2: Prime Minister squarely responsible because he says it's Albanese's duty
10:33
Speaker 2: to protect the people or people, not just some. And
10:38
Speaker 2: Mark LaGrand recounts that in nineteen seventy five, Asio uncovered
10:43
Speaker 2: a plan by Palestinian terrorists to assassinate Bob Hawk for
10:48
Speaker 2: his support of Israel, along with several high profile Jewish figures. Now,
10:53
Speaker 2: Hawk at the time was a proud advocate for the
10:56
Speaker 2: state of Israel, and as you know, he said famous
11:00
Speaker 2: that if the bell tolls for Israel, it tolls for
11:04
Speaker 2: all of mankind. Well, Mark Legrand writes in the Australian
11:09
Speaker 2: that Albanesi would know this history from the official briefings,
11:13
Speaker 2: and he writes that in this context, by his failure
11:17
Speaker 2: to commit to urgent and serious action to rain in
11:21
Speaker 2: this rampant jew hatred, his government is complicit and playing
11:27
Speaker 2: with fire. This contagion of jew hatred is expanding exponentially
11:33
Speaker 2: from past experience. It soon will become difficult to control.
11:39
Speaker 1: He writes.
11:39
Speaker 2: The blood, libels and racial tropes that have bedeviled the
11:42
Speaker 2: Jewish people for.
11:43
Speaker 1: More than a millennium are being resurrected.
11:47
Speaker 2: Legrand says that to avoid a future tragedy, Albanesi must
11:52
Speaker 2: act with commitment, vigor and courage. And you have to
11:57
Speaker 2: ask is he even paying close attention?
12:01
Speaker 1: Is ASIO are the intelligence agencies? Is the AFP?
12:05
Speaker 2: Because we cannot let this get to the point where
12:09
Speaker 2: someone is injured or worse, our political leaders and our
12:14
Speaker 2: police must act now to arrest these extremists and stop
12:19
Speaker 2: this clear escalation in violence.
12:22
Speaker 1: Everyone can see it's happening. We can't put up with
12:25
Speaker 1: the Prime Minister.
12:26
Speaker 2: Being weak on this issue simply for some votes in
12:29
Speaker 2: marginal Western Sydney seats. The safety of politicians, their staff
12:34
Speaker 2: and Jewish Australians are far too important.
12:42
Speaker 12: Now.
12:42
Speaker 2: Also coming up on the show tonight, the farcical Simpson
12:46
Speaker 2: inspired response to Peter Dutton's nuclear plan, as Labor kicks
12:50
Speaker 2: off their Scare campaign today. Also ahead the gruesome trade
12:55
Speaker 2: in illegal human old and transplants in China. Renowned international
12:59
Speaker 2: human rights lawyer David Mattis will join me live in
13:02
Speaker 2: the studio.
13:03
Speaker 1: Plus why the new.
13:04
Speaker 2: ABC chair follows a predictable path, No new vision, just
13:09
Speaker 2: the same old demands for more of your money. But
13:14
Speaker 2: first let's bring in tonight's panel, Perth Mayre, Basil Zemplus
13:17
Speaker 2: and Bill Shorten's former chief of staff Cameron Milner. Welcome
13:20
Speaker 2: to you both, Basil. Let's first discuss the editorial, the
13:26
Speaker 2: issue that I've just spoken about. Basil, are you concerned
13:30
Speaker 2: that law enforcement isn't doing enough and this is going
13:33
Speaker 2: to get to the point where there's a serious incident
13:36
Speaker 2: and someone is injured?
13:39
Speaker 3: So I think we need to accept, don't we that
13:41
Speaker 3: whatever your view on the conflict in the Middle East
13:44
Speaker 3: is in that region, whatever people do here, certainly they
13:49
Speaker 3: can speak up and make forceful points and make their
13:53
Speaker 3: opinions known. But anything they do of a vandalism nature
13:57
Speaker 3: or of a violent nature, does nothing to address or
14:00
Speaker 3: arrest what is happening in the Middle East. And then
14:04
Speaker 3: to here, for example, the ABC pose that question, have
14:09
Speaker 3: those protesters cross the line? Let's put it nice and simply,
14:13
Speaker 3: if I walked out of the building I'm in right
14:15
Speaker 3: now when and vandalize the building across the road, would
14:19
Speaker 3: media say has he crossed the line? Or would they
14:21
Speaker 3: say throw the book at him? It seems almost incomprehensible
14:25
Speaker 3: that this sort of behavior can be tolerated, and we
14:29
Speaker 3: need to treat.
14:29
Speaker 7: It for what it is.
14:31
Speaker 3: They are violent acts, they are acts of vandalism, they
14:34
Speaker 3: are illegal acts, and we expect our law enforcement agencies,
14:39
Speaker 3: doesn't matter who's involved or perpetrating them, we expect them
14:44
Speaker 3: to act. And if they started acting here, it might
14:46
Speaker 3: go a long way to calming the situation down. Yeah.
14:50
Speaker 2: Look, I agree, and I just want to reiterate that
14:52
Speaker 2: I also agree with your opening statement. I say it
14:54
Speaker 2: many times that everyone has a different view on the war.
14:58
Speaker 2: We live in a free country. Freedom of speech. That's
15:01
Speaker 2: absolutely fine. What's not fine is the hatred and the lawlessness,
15:06
Speaker 2: the violence, the aggression, fires being burnt in someone's office.
15:12
Speaker 1: Cameron, the Prime Minister must.
15:13
Speaker 2: Realize he's got a major problem on his hands, but
15:16
Speaker 2: it seems like he just doesn't know how to respond,
15:19
Speaker 2: or he doesn't want to respond.
15:21
Speaker 1: What do you think is going on here?
15:24
Speaker 5: Well, Albanese is wallowing in his own complete weakness on
15:27
Speaker 5: this issue. It's disgusting to see. But worse, I mean
15:30
Speaker 5: Basil in your own state of West Australia, there's a
15:32
Speaker 5: Labor senator who's accused Israel not once, but three times
15:35
Speaker 5: of genocide and she still sits in the Labor caucus.
15:38
Speaker 5: That demonstrates how weak Albanese is. Wong's running a protection
15:42
Speaker 5: racket for someone who's disgraced herself on Israel, written for
15:45
Speaker 5: Al Jazeera, gone to the campus protest like a Green senator,
15:48
Speaker 5: the one that Prime Minister complains about, but Albo still
15:51
Speaker 5: has her vote. She should be gone from the Labour
15:53
Speaker 5: Party of albov Sirius about.
15:54
Speaker 2: This gone yeah, And look, if they were serious about this,
15:58
Speaker 2: they would have the judicial inquiry into anti Semitism on
16:02
Speaker 2: university campuses instead of shutting down debate.
16:05
Speaker 1: When Julian Lisa's football.
16:06
Speaker 2: There's all sorts of action they should be could be
16:08
Speaker 2: taking here they could designate his book to reer as
16:11
Speaker 2: a terrorist organization.
16:13
Speaker 1: There's a lot of action that they're just not taking.
16:16
Speaker 2: Let's turn to nuclear now, that has been the big
16:19
Speaker 2: story we've been covering this week, and Labor is already
16:23
Speaker 2: kicking off its scare campaign into Peter Dutton's nuclear energy announcement. Well,
16:28
Speaker 2: as you would have seen already on air tonight, Peter
16:31
Speaker 2: Khalil mocked Dutton's announcement of building seven nuclear reactors. He
16:35
Speaker 2: likened it to snow White and the nuclear reactors and
16:39
Speaker 2: the seven dwarves. Another Labor politician, Andrew Lee, posted a
16:44
Speaker 2: manipulated image of a three eyed blinky bill in front
16:47
Speaker 2: of a nuclear plant. So it's I guess trying to say,
16:50
Speaker 2: this is what's going to happen to our koalas.
16:52
Speaker 1: And then the.
16:52
Speaker 2: Victorian Premier just Into Allen posted an image of a
16:55
Speaker 2: three eyed fish in Gibbs that now they were, of
16:59
Speaker 2: course referencing this Simpsons episode where toxic spills caused three
17:03
Speaker 2: eight fish.
17:06
Speaker 13: All right, we gay.
17:10
Speaker 6: Wait a minute, one.
17:13
Speaker 2: Two basil, Given there are thirty two other countries around
17:24
Speaker 2: the world using nuclear energy as part of.
17:27
Speaker 1: Their energy mix.
17:28
Speaker 2: If Labour's resorting to referencing an outdated Simpsons episode. Isn't
17:33
Speaker 2: this juvenile and actually irresponsible and false?
17:39
Speaker 1: Well, it is juvenile.
17:41
Speaker 3: We can still find juvenile funny and hello to Pauline
17:44
Speaker 3: Hanson and Robert Irwin who are battling out their own
17:46
Speaker 3: issues in this space at the moment. But we also know,
17:50
Speaker 3: don't we, that of the top twenty economies worldwide, Australia
17:54
Speaker 3: is the only one not involved. We also know it
17:56
Speaker 3: is emissions free and we know how important that is
17:59
Speaker 3: to Australians. I wonder Sherry has Labor made a big
18:04
Speaker 3: mistake here? We know that the Coalition's fortunes and also
18:07
Speaker 3: in particular Peter Dutton's fortunes, have been on the rise,
18:12
Speaker 3: and we've known this announcement was coming for some time.
18:15
Speaker 3: But despite that, the polls heading in the right direction
18:18
Speaker 3: for Dutton and the coalition.
18:20
Speaker 1: He's been bold.
18:22
Speaker 3: Have Labor backed the wrong horse here by going out
18:25
Speaker 3: all out on the scare campaign? Would they not be
18:29
Speaker 3: better off trying to put their counterfacts. I don't think
18:33
Speaker 3: Australians are as opposed as what Federal Labor are trying
18:38
Speaker 3: to tell us. And as we know, Dutton stands for something.
18:43
Speaker 3: We know what he stands for. It's bold, its conviction,
18:47
Speaker 3: and he's prepared to put it to the people at
18:49
Speaker 3: the next federal election. And if Labor have called it wrong,
18:53
Speaker 3: they may pay the ultimate price.
18:55
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a really interesting take because the common view
18:59
Speaker 2: is that it's Peter Dutton who's taken the greatest political
19:02
Speaker 2: risk here. But Basil, you mentioned the PM going all
19:05
Speaker 2: in attacking Dutton. Will let's have a look at some
19:08
Speaker 2: of what he ought to say today.
19:10
Speaker 11: This is just a fantasy.
19:13
Speaker 10: Instead of snow White and the seven dwarves, this is
19:16
Speaker 10: Peter Dutton and the seven nuclear reactors.
19:19
Speaker 2: So Cameron, I mean the Prime ministers really attacking Darton
19:23
Speaker 2: over there.
19:24
Speaker 1: So what do you think on this question of political risk?
19:30
Speaker 5: Well, I think about the fairy tale where Anthony Albanese
19:32
Speaker 5: is Pinocchio. I think that's quite funny too. But look, seriously, seriously,
19:37
Speaker 5: Labour's got a challenge. Both Peter Dutton and Anthony Albaneze
19:40
Speaker 5: have a plan to be net zero by twenty fifty.
19:42
Speaker 5: Anthony Albanese's plan is massive cost of transition, huge smashing
19:46
Speaker 5: power bills from here for the next twenty five years,
19:49
Speaker 5: or proven reliable technology the rest of the world uses
19:52
Speaker 5: with nuclear power. That's Peter Dutton's pan plan. So Peter
19:55
Speaker 5: and Darton can actually keep power prices down now and
19:58
Speaker 5: still meet net zero by twenty fifty. Anthony Alberanez can't
20:01
Speaker 5: do that. Peter Dutton's plan is made in the US, France,
20:04
Speaker 5: and Germany. Albow's energy transition plan is made in China.
20:09
Speaker 1: That's the difference. Cherry too. The oing worth considering there.
20:14
Speaker 3: We know how much the we know how much the
20:18
Speaker 3: Labor government have liked to throw back at the coalition,
20:21
Speaker 3: the no Alis tag, always being negative, always criticizing, not
20:25
Speaker 3: giving opportunities a chance to breathe and see what people think. Well,
20:29
Speaker 3: that's what they're doing here with nuclear So I think
20:33
Speaker 3: Dutton has played this very very well. Ultimately, he's going
20:36
Speaker 3: to live and die by taking this policy forward in
20:39
Speaker 3: such a big way at the next federal election. But
20:42
Speaker 3: he's not a mug. He's thought it through, he's been
20:45
Speaker 3: very clear on his convictions, and he seems very confident.
20:49
Speaker 3: Shoulders pinned back making these announcements and suddenly suddenly the
20:54
Speaker 3: emphasis is back on Labor to see their response, and
20:57
Speaker 3: so far they're throwing up for snow White and the
21:00
Speaker 3: Seven Dwarfs sorts of responses, which doesn't cover them in glory.
21:04
Speaker 3: I don't think yeah.
21:05
Speaker 2: And I think also when you see people like Chris
21:08
Speaker 2: Bowen stand up and say that Peter Dutton's selling a scam, well,
21:13
Speaker 2: the problem is that Chris Bowen's credibility is so smashed
21:17
Speaker 2: to smithereens that are you going to believe Chris Bowen
21:21
Speaker 2: or Peter Dutton? And ultimately it does come down to
21:24
Speaker 2: a question of trust. Cameron, don't tell me you're going
21:26
Speaker 2: to try stick up for Chris Bowen over here.
21:30
Speaker 5: I think Chris is actually a visionary. I think he's
21:32
Speaker 5: actually done really well to put his ideas for just
21:34
Speaker 5: like Peter Dutton has. He's actually got the courage of conviction,
21:37
Speaker 5: which is something sadly lacking and missing in the Prime Minister.
21:40
Speaker 2: All right, Cameron Milner, Basil simplis great to see you
21:43
Speaker 2: both as always on a Thursday.
21:45
Speaker 1: Thank you.
21:46
Speaker 2: After the break will bring you new polling on New Clear.
21:49
Speaker 2: This will be the polling that shows whether Peter.
21:52
Speaker 1: Dutton is on the right track.
21:53
Speaker 2: It's just for us exclusively tonight, class I'll be joined
21:57
Speaker 2: live in studio by renowned human rights lawyer David Matters.
22:00
Speaker 1: That's after this quick break, welcome back.
22:08
Speaker 2: Well, China's record on human rights abuses is appalling, yet
22:12
Speaker 2: it's an issue that failed to get much airtime during
22:15
Speaker 2: this week's visit by Chinese Premier Lee.
22:19
Speaker 9: Well.
22:19
Speaker 11: We do have differences, and I've said we should cooperate
22:23
Speaker 11: where we can, we disagree where we must. We certainly
22:27
Speaker 11: raised all of the issues where Australia and China have differences,
22:33
Speaker 11: but we shouldn't allow those differences to solely define our relationship.
22:41
Speaker 2: And one growing problem is China's organ harvesting practices. We
22:44
Speaker 2: don't hear much about it, but there have been extensive
22:47
Speaker 2: reports that state run hospitals have secretly harvested body parts
22:52
Speaker 2: from tens of thousands of prisoners, removing their vital organs,
22:56
Speaker 2: sometimes while they're alive. It's reportedly been common practice in
23:01
Speaker 2: China for nearly two decades. David Matus is a renowned
23:05
Speaker 2: international human rights lawyer and he's been investigating this industry
23:10
Speaker 2: and joins me now. David, thank you very much for your.
23:14
Speaker 4: Time, Thanks for inviting me.
23:16
Speaker 1: Now.
23:16
Speaker 2: You're in Australia primarily to campaign for legislation and regulation
23:21
Speaker 2: in this area. How serious and extensive is the problem.
23:26
Speaker 2: And can you tell us just a bit about why
23:29
Speaker 2: China harvests organs?
23:33
Speaker 4: It's throughout China the problem, it's the numbers are large,
23:37
Speaker 4: one hundred thousand organs a year, so it's pervasive and
23:43
Speaker 4: it's been going on since the early two thousands. Why
23:46
Speaker 4: are they harvesting them? It's partly a money made scheme.
23:51
Speaker 4: There's a big demand for organs around the world, and
23:54
Speaker 4: it's partly a way of repressing political opponents. The victims
23:59
Speaker 4: are primarily prisoners or conscience practitioners of Fellongong, Wiggers, Tibetans,
24:04
Speaker 4: house Christians, and.
24:05
Speaker 2: Other particular body parts that are most commonly harvested.
24:11
Speaker 4: Well, it's a market that it depends on demand. So
24:15
Speaker 4: the biggest demand for organs is kidneys, but they'll and
24:21
Speaker 4: in theory you can survive with the loss of kidney,
24:23
Speaker 4: but in fact nobody survives these organ extractions because they
24:28
Speaker 4: extract several organs at once and people are killed through
24:31
Speaker 4: organ extraction.
24:31
Speaker 1: The brutal operations.
24:33
Speaker 2: And how do you go about investigating this? I mean,
24:36
Speaker 2: you know famously China it doesn't welcome journalists. So has
24:41
Speaker 2: this been a difficult area for you to examine.
24:44
Speaker 4: It's been time consuming, for instance, for transplant volumes. What
24:47
Speaker 4: we did is we went to the individual hospitals and
24:49
Speaker 4: added up what they posted on their websites, and we
24:52
Speaker 4: went to about seven hundred hospitals. So as you can imagine,
24:55
Speaker 4: it took a lot of time to do that, but
24:57
Speaker 4: it's conceptually not very difficult. We interviewed people who got
25:03
Speaker 4: out of a prison out of China, and they told
25:07
Speaker 4: us the Fell and Gong practitioners were blood tested, organ
25:11
Speaker 4: examined and the others were not. We had investigators calling
25:15
Speaker 4: into China pretending to be relative patients who wanted organs,
25:19
Speaker 4: asking if they had organs of Fell and Gong for
25:23
Speaker 4: sale on the basis that Talongong is an exercise regime
25:26
Speaker 4: and organs are healthy. And we got admissions throughout China
25:30
Speaker 4: recorded and transcribed translated saying yes, please come on down,
25:34
Speaker 4: we have them. So it's a concumulation of evidence.
25:37
Speaker 2: Like we've seen the United Nations and other international bodies
25:42
Speaker 2: take a keen interest in condemning Israel in recent months,
25:46
Speaker 2: how much interest have these bodies taken in the specific
25:51
Speaker 2: issue of organ harvesting, but also more broadly China is
25:56
Speaker 2: well recorded human rights.
25:58
Speaker 4: Abuses, well certainly is not treated with the intensity that Israel.
26:04
Speaker 1: Is at the UN.
26:06
Speaker 4: But there were twelve UN Human Rights rapporteurs in July
26:13
Speaker 4: or June twenty twenty one who issued a joint statement
26:16
Speaker 4: saying this credible evidence of foreign organ harvesting with prisoner
26:20
Speaker 4: of conscience victims Well Kong victims, that the expressed serious concern,
26:25
Speaker 4: asked China to cooperate with an independent investigation, and asked
26:32
Speaker 4: Chinese to respond, which they did with nonsense. So it's
26:35
Speaker 4: not as if they've been completely silent, but it's certainly
26:38
Speaker 4: in commensurate with the nature of the problem.
26:43
Speaker 2: Look, since Israel was attacked by terrorists on October seven,
26:47
Speaker 2: we do need to keep pointing that out.
26:49
Speaker 1: That Israel was attacked.
26:51
Speaker 2: There has been this very confusing, bewildering, inexplicable rise in
26:56
Speaker 2: anti Semitism globally, pretty much on precedent in Australia. What
27:03
Speaker 2: you focus on this area a lot? We've all thought
27:07
Speaker 2: about this topic a lot. What do you put this
27:09
Speaker 2: down to in twenty twenty four where in all other
27:12
Speaker 2: areas we have the most accepting, woke, you know, society
27:17
Speaker 2: that prides itself on equality and not being racist, and
27:21
Speaker 2: yet there's been this tolerance of anti Semitism.
27:26
Speaker 4: Well, I think it's got a large part to do
27:27
Speaker 4: with the Hamas strategy, which was first of all to
27:32
Speaker 4: attack Israel and then to retreat within tunnels and use
27:37
Speaker 4: Palestinian civilians as shields and trying to engineer Palestinian victimization
27:44
Speaker 4: to the extent possible and then blame the victimization on Israel.
27:48
Speaker 4: And to a large extent, many people around the world
27:51
Speaker 4: have bought into this Hamas strategy and blame Israel for
27:56
Speaker 4: the killings that Hamas has engineered as civilian Palestinians.
28:01
Speaker 1: David Matis really appreciate your time in you being here.
28:04
Speaker 1: Thank you very much.
28:04
Speaker 4: Okay, thanks for inviting me.
28:07
Speaker 2: Now let's return to the nuclear debate. I told you
28:09
Speaker 2: we would have new polling on this issue tonight. It
28:12
Speaker 2: is shaping up as the major political contest ahead of
28:15
Speaker 2: the next election, and the question is that we're all
28:18
Speaker 2: asking will vote as support Dutton's plan for nuclear energy
28:23
Speaker 2: or will they buy Labour's fear campaign. Well, we've got
28:27
Speaker 2: new polling tonight from Freshwater Strategy, and it shows that
28:31
Speaker 2: support for nuclear in the past nine months has gained
28:34
Speaker 2: five points to reach thirty seven percent. Meantime, support for
28:39
Speaker 2: renewables since May last year has declined fifteen points from
28:44
Speaker 2: seventy four percent to fifty nine percent, and support for
28:48
Speaker 2: non renewables is up.
28:49
Speaker 1: Four points in the same period.
28:52
Speaker 2: And the same poll has shown that the Prime Minister
28:55
Speaker 2: is now only two points ahead of Peter Dutton, sitting
28:59
Speaker 2: at forty three percent to Dutton's forty one percent on
29:02
Speaker 2: the preferred.
29:03
Speaker 1: Prime Minister survey.
29:05
Speaker 2: To break this down, let's bring in Freshwater Strategy Director
29:08
Speaker 2: Leo Shanahan. Leo, thank you very much for joining us.
29:12
Speaker 2: I'm so glad you've brought us this polling because this
29:14
Speaker 2: is what it comes down to now. This nuclear debate
29:17
Speaker 2: is going to be the big political battleground ahead of
29:21
Speaker 2: the next election. What is your polling show about and
29:25
Speaker 2: Labor's relying on the fact that Australians don't want to
29:28
Speaker 2: have nuclear What is your polling show about Australians sentiment?
29:32
Speaker 6: Well, I think it is interesting, Sherry, because as you
29:34
Speaker 6: mentioned at the beginning, nuclear is on the rise in
29:38
Speaker 6: terms of support now comparatively compared to solar gas is
29:45
Speaker 6: actually hugely popular as well, not as popular, but it
29:49
Speaker 6: is more popular now according to our polling than cole,
29:52
Speaker 6: which is already in the system and very much needed
29:55
Speaker 6: in the current environment. Here we are in the middle
29:57
Speaker 6: of winter, but look at thirty seven percent in our polling.
30:01
Speaker 6: That's up five points since June last year, sorry, since September,
30:06
Speaker 6: just September last year, and that is not an insignificant rise.
30:11
Speaker 6: And it's also coincided with this increasing awareness around nuclears.
30:17
Speaker 6: So to your point, if the government wants to turn
30:21
Speaker 6: the next election into a referendum on nuclear it does
30:27
Speaker 6: probably have to be a little careful in the way
30:30
Speaker 6: it constructs that argument, as we've seen these early rollouts
30:34
Speaker 6: of memes and you know, three eyed Fish, etc. Simpson's references.
30:39
Speaker 6: But it has to be a little careful that in
30:41
Speaker 6: doing that, people don't start to educate themselves a lot
30:46
Speaker 6: more on nuclear and the benefits of nuclear and decide
30:48
Speaker 6: this is perhaps not as scary as we thought. And
30:52
Speaker 6: in campaigns sometimes on one side pushes so hard so early,
30:56
Speaker 6: there is sometimes a corresponding pushback people to say, hang on,
31:02
Speaker 6: shouldn't we have some awareness of what this is actually
31:05
Speaker 6: about and rather than just rely on knee jerk fear mongering.
31:10
Speaker 2: It's interesting that the period over which support for nuclear
31:15
Speaker 2: has risen coincides with when Peter Dutton said that he
31:19
Speaker 2: was going to have a nuclear policy.
31:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's going to take one to the next election.
31:23
Speaker 2: So you know, perhaps this also is an indication that
31:27
Speaker 2: he's able to mount an argument and he has the
31:30
Speaker 2: time to convince Australians and you know what, the fear
31:34
Speaker 2: campaign might not be as effective given we look around
31:38
Speaker 2: the world and we see what other nations are doing.
31:40
Speaker 1: Yeah, both three eyed fish in France or Canada or
31:43
Speaker 1: the US.
31:44
Speaker 6: Yeah, we are the outlier really in the G twenty
31:47
Speaker 6: in terms of nuclear and many aren't. I think one
31:51
Speaker 6: of the few is Indonesia that don't have nuclear and
31:54
Speaker 6: they're looking into it as well. So, I mean, I
31:57
Speaker 6: think it's interesting because it's also coincided with an increasing,
32:01
Speaker 6: shall we say, skepticism about the ability of renewables to
32:07
Speaker 6: solve all our problems. We ask a question kind of
32:10
Speaker 6: based purely upon your preference, would it be for renewable
32:15
Speaker 6: energy sources or non renewable energy sources? And yes, renewable
32:21
Speaker 6: energy source is still very high. It's still very popular
32:24
Speaker 6: generally speaking, at fifty nine percent, But that is a
32:28
Speaker 6: pretty steep decline from seventy four percent just since September,
32:33
Speaker 6: and non renewable sources growing from about fourteen to eighteen
32:39
Speaker 6: percent in the same amount of time. It's cost of
32:41
Speaker 6: living time period exactly. So all our polling shows number
32:45
Speaker 6: one in terms of concern cost of living, one, two
32:49
Speaker 6: and three, you know, number one issues we.
32:51
Speaker 2: Lee I want to ask you about. You know, alban
32:53
Speaker 2: Ezi had a very long honeymoon. What does your polling
32:56
Speaker 2: show about his favorability, how voters are looking at him
33:01
Speaker 2: and Peter Dutton in terms of their preference for who.
33:04
Speaker 1: Would be PM.
33:05
Speaker 6: Yeah, well, I mean on that primary vote, that kind
33:08
Speaker 6: of key primary vote. We've got the Liberal National Coalition
33:12
Speaker 6: of forty percent. That's unchanged since our last poll labored
33:16
Speaker 6: down thirty two percent. There's actually an eight point gap
33:19
Speaker 6: in that primary vote. And news poll out last week
33:22
Speaker 6: had very very similar numbers. Now, what is interesting in
33:26
Speaker 6: terms of preferred prime minister, we're now looking at almost
33:31
Speaker 6: dead even, you know, forty one forty three percent. Another
33:34
Speaker 6: poll out this week.
33:35
Speaker 1: Had most polices.
33:36
Speaker 2: Should just remind people that the preferred prime minister measure
33:40
Speaker 2: that usually favors the incumbent. It usually favors the sitting
33:43
Speaker 2: prime minister because they're already in the.
33:45
Speaker 6: Job, definitely, and it's pretty rare for an opposition leader
33:49
Speaker 6: who isn't in an election winning position to start getting
33:53
Speaker 6: ahead or get ahead in preferred prime minister. So there
33:58
Speaker 6: would be a lot of comfort in Peter Tutton's campra
34:02
Speaker 6: and a.
34:02
Speaker 2: Lot of panic at labor side. You'd have to think it.
34:04
Speaker 2: Their polling is showing the same.
34:06
Speaker 6: Maybe not panicking yet, but yeah, if that, maybe they'll
34:09
Speaker 6: be rethinking that election.
34:10
Speaker 1: Tommy, Yeah, all right, Leo Shanahan, thank you very much
34:13
Speaker 1: for thank Now coming up.
34:15
Speaker 2: Is former Quantus CEO Alan Joyce really worth the one
34:19
Speaker 2: hundred and seventy million dollars he's been paid over the years,
34:23
Speaker 2: while flights keep getting canceled and the Democrats boycotting net
34:27
Speaker 2: In Yahoo's addressed to Congress as anti Israel's sentiment ramps
34:31
Speaker 2: up globally statued.
34:38
Speaker 1: Welcome back.
34:39
Speaker 2: Well, here's the one hundred and seventy million dollar man,
34:43
Speaker 2: Alan Joyce, and an independent consultant is now tasked with
34:47
Speaker 2: deciding whether the former Quantus chief executive deserves the sixteen
34:53
Speaker 2: million dollar bonus he was given Alan Joyce. Of course,
34:56
Speaker 2: he's pushing to keep his long term bonus of nearly
34:59
Speaker 2: fourteen million and his short term bonus of two million
35:02
Speaker 2: dollars and in total, The Australian reports that he has
35:06
Speaker 2: been paid over one seventy million over fifteen years as
35:10
Speaker 2: chief executive. Let's bring in tonight's panel, the Australians at
35:13
Speaker 2: National Affairs editor Joe Kelly and commentator Jason Morrison.
35:18
Speaker 1: Welcome to you both.
35:19
Speaker 2: Look Joe that the problems during Alan Joyce's reign as
35:25
Speaker 2: CEO of Quantas are well recorded. An aging fleet, he
35:29
Speaker 2: outsourced a number of important services, not to mention the
35:33
Speaker 2: three hundred million dollars in taxpayer subsidies during COVID never repaid,
35:37
Speaker 2: flights constantly canceled. But he says he deserves a bonus,
35:44
Speaker 2: his sixteen million dollar bonus.
35:45
Speaker 7: What do you think, Well, I think most Australians would
35:51
Speaker 7: think the idea of a sixteen million dollar windfall payment
35:54
Speaker 7: for Alan Joyce stinks, Sherry. That's what That's what I think.
35:58
Speaker 7: I think it's quite clear that the Quantas board is
36:01
Speaker 7: very concerned about how it will look for its image
36:04
Speaker 7: as well. This is a company going through a transition.
36:07
Speaker 7: That's really asking for a fresh start and a new
36:10
Speaker 7: beginning from dispirited Australian travelers. We've got a new chief
36:16
Speaker 7: executive and a new chair coming in and quite frankly,
36:21
Speaker 7: sixteen million dollars is huge. Recently the airline got hit
36:27
Speaker 7: with a one hundred and twenty million dollar penalty because
36:31
Speaker 7: it charged people for canceled flights. Well, Alan Joyce is
36:35
Speaker 7: asking for sixteen million dollars. That's more than a tenth
36:38
Speaker 7: of that payment that it's just been hit with. So
36:40
Speaker 7: I think it's a bad look for the airline and
36:44
Speaker 7: I think, you know, if they can get out of it,
36:47
Speaker 7: it would make sense for them to explore those options.
36:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they obviously I keen too, given there's this
36:54
Speaker 2: independent task Loss trying to find, you know, terms in
36:59
Speaker 2: the clause that could get them out of paying this
37:01
Speaker 2: amount of money.
37:02
Speaker 1: Jason, what's the board there for?
37:05
Speaker 13: I mean, the board's job is surely you stand up
37:07
Speaker 13: for the best interests of the airline. He did incredible
37:10
Speaker 13: damage to the airline. Whether it was intentional, accidental, or
37:15
Speaker 13: just the way the man is, whatever it was, he's
37:17
Speaker 13: left them with a skullal. You never know, You never
37:22
Speaker 13: know you never it seemed bizarre at the time. You
37:26
Speaker 13: can only wonder what the motives were at sometimes, but
37:28
Speaker 13: you look at what's going on in Quotas and you say,
37:31
Speaker 13: what the hell is the board doing? You know, you
37:34
Speaker 13: paid a lot of money and the chair is paid
37:37
Speaker 13: a lot of money and all the representatives there are
37:40
Speaker 13: all eminent people in the business community. Why you got
37:42
Speaker 13: to go and find an external report to tell you
37:46
Speaker 13: what's absolutely blaringly obvious here The answer is no, and
37:50
Speaker 13: have some courage and stand up and say no, rather
37:52
Speaker 13: than waive a reporter around and say, oh, we've got
37:54
Speaker 13: to report and the report said, you know, so we've
37:56
Speaker 13: got to go with the report. This is what's wrong
37:58
Speaker 13: with corporate Australia. A failure to make absolute decisions on
38:02
Speaker 13: things that are straight, plane and simple. And you know,
38:06
Speaker 13: I mean, I feel sorry for the shareholders. I felt
38:08
Speaker 13: sorry for them whilst Allan Joyce was doing what he
38:10
Speaker 13: was doing, and I feel worse for them now because
38:14
Speaker 13: their board is letting them down at a moment when
38:16
Speaker 13: they actually should stand up and say mate, you know
38:18
Speaker 13: you want it, you come suis.
38:20
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not even about their shareholders though, Isn't it
38:22
Speaker 2: about everyone who tries to catch a flight, and it
38:26
Speaker 2: feels like a third of the time, doesn't matter what airline,
38:30
Speaker 2: Virgin Quantas jetsty the flights just get canceled. It's mayhem
38:35
Speaker 2: on so many days at the airports around the country now.
38:38
Speaker 2: Peter Darton came out swinging today over the Chinese officials
38:43
Speaker 2: who body blocked Australian journalist Chang.
38:46
Speaker 1: Lei earlier this week.
38:47
Speaker 2: Darton said that he raised the incident immediately when he
38:51
Speaker 2: met with the Chinese premiere. We heard on the show
38:55
Speaker 2: last night Mike Bozulo indicate that the Prime Minister was
38:58
Speaker 2: slow to land on the right response. Joe, how do
39:02
Speaker 2: you think the Prime Minister handled this issue this week?
39:06
Speaker 2: These were clear bullying tactics that all Australians could see.
39:14
Speaker 7: Oh look, Sherry. My view on this is pretty simple.
39:16
Speaker 7: Australia is a liberal democracy with a free media. That's
39:20
Speaker 7: very important. It's a wonderful thing. Not all countries have
39:24
Speaker 7: a free media. It has to be defended, it has
39:27
Speaker 7: to be preserved, it has to be protected at the
39:30
Speaker 7: highest level. Frankly, I think this is terrible that this
39:34
Speaker 7: was allowed to happen in the first place, that an
39:36
Speaker 7: Australian journalist in Parliament House was blocked and intimidated by
39:41
Speaker 7: Chinese officials. It should be beyond question that foreign leaders
39:46
Speaker 7: and their officials when they come to this country, particularly
39:48
Speaker 7: and especially in the Australian Parliament, respect the freedom of
39:53
Speaker 7: the Australian media. So I just think that as soon
39:57
Speaker 7: as this was realized Anthony bees He should publicly have
40:01
Speaker 7: made clear this was unacceptable, it was a breach of
40:04
Speaker 7: what Australia expected, and that should have been conveyed privately
40:08
Speaker 7: to Premier Lee as well.
40:10
Speaker 2: I mean, Jason, I think the issue here is that
40:14
Speaker 2: Albanezi had tried to tell the public that he'd now
40:17
Speaker 2: got the right balance, and yet the Chinese.
40:19
Speaker 1: Officials were able to so brazenly.
40:23
Speaker 2: Behave like this in our parliament. I mean, do you
40:27
Speaker 2: think the current government has the right approach?
40:31
Speaker 13: Yes, the balance is a bit like that, isn't it really?
40:33
Speaker 11: And it stays like that.
40:35
Speaker 13: We live in fear of upsetting them, we live in
40:37
Speaker 13: fear of standing up to them, we plicate them, and
40:41
Speaker 13: it's it's just evidence that it continues on. I wonder
40:44
Speaker 13: in the briefing notes that were sent there to them
40:46
Speaker 13: as they arrived, So just a reminder, this is an
40:49
Speaker 13: open democracy where people are allowed to ask questions, even
40:52
Speaker 13: insulting questions, be prepared. It's going to happen. I doubt
40:56
Speaker 13: it's there. There were probably assurances given that it would
40:58
Speaker 13: be the best possible environl for the best possible outcome.
41:02
Speaker 13: I found the whole scene to be quite sickening, and
41:05
Speaker 13: I think the arming and ring that's followed since right
41:08
Speaker 13: across politics to be kind of even worse. I mean,
41:11
Speaker 13: we have to actually remember, while they're in that house
41:14
Speaker 13: and they're there to stand up for us, they're not
41:16
Speaker 13: there to play diplomat.
41:17
Speaker 9: All the time.
41:19
Speaker 7: Joe.
41:20
Speaker 2: In the US, a number of Democrats have indicated that
41:23
Speaker 2: they might boycott Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanya, who's addressed
41:27
Speaker 2: to Congress next month. Alexandria Ocazio Cortez. She went so
41:31
Speaker 2: far as to say that his invitations should be revoked. Joe,
41:36
Speaker 2: surely the prime minister of a democratic nation should be
41:40
Speaker 2: free to address Congress and an ally.
41:44
Speaker 1: Of the US.
41:48
Speaker 7: Well, there's no doubt, Sherry that Benjamin Nettania who should
41:51
Speaker 7: be free to do that. I don't think that should
41:55
Speaker 7: be questioned at all. I think the key thing about
41:58
Speaker 7: how this will play out politically in the US is
42:00
Speaker 7: what message Benjamin Netanya who comes with, what he will
42:04
Speaker 7: tell this joint meeting of Congress, and in particular, whether
42:08
Speaker 7: there is any update, progress or advancement on the achievement
42:12
Speaker 7: of Israel's political and military objectives in the Middle East.
42:17
Speaker 7: The reason that there is such frustration, it's significant frustration
42:22
Speaker 7: between the bid administration and Netnyahu government is because the
42:27
Speaker 7: Blind administration has lost confidence that Israel can achieve those objectives.
42:32
Speaker 7: So I think the key thing will be whether there's
42:34
Speaker 7: any update there. If there's not and it's still a
42:37
Speaker 7: continuation of this stalemate, I think that will be tricky
42:40
Speaker 7: for the Binded administration and how it responds to that,
42:44
Speaker 7: as it has to meet the demands of conflicting constituencies
42:48
Speaker 7: in America.
42:49
Speaker 2: Comes down to politics, probably over and above principle, just
42:53
Speaker 2: as it is here. All right, Jason Morris and Joe Kelly,
42:57
Speaker 2: thank you both very much for your time. National Senator
43:00
Speaker 2: Matt Canavan joins me Live with a major update on
43:04
Speaker 2: his move to.
43:05
Speaker 1: Have a national COVID inquiry. You don't want to miss it.
43:14
Speaker 1: Welcome back. Well.
43:15
Speaker 2: Australia's response to COVID nineteen has been the subject of
43:18
Speaker 2: much debate, whether it's vaccines or mask mandates. But despite
43:24
Speaker 2: all the questions, we still seem no closer to any
43:27
Speaker 2: real answers about the best way to deal with a pandemic.
43:32
Speaker 2: Let's bring in National Senator Matt Canavan. Matt tell us
43:35
Speaker 2: you've got some breaking news for us tonight. What are
43:38
Speaker 2: you planning to bring into Parliament next week?
43:44
Speaker 12: Well, next week I plan to introduce a bill to
43:46
Speaker 12: establish what's called a Commission of Inquiry into COVID nineteen.
43:50
Speaker 12: It's effectively just another word for a royal commission. As
43:54
Speaker 12: you probably know your viewers probably know, the Prime Minister
43:57
Speaker 12: promised to have a Royal Commission or Royal Commission life
44:00
Speaker 12: inquiry into COVID nineteen when he was opposition leader, and
44:03
Speaker 12: just like many other promises the primm is to make
44:06
Speaker 12: when in government, he's broken that promise. Instead he's established
44:10
Speaker 12: a Clayton's Review stacked with people that were supportive of
44:14
Speaker 12: the most Rycranian lockdown and other measures taken during the pandemic.
44:19
Speaker 12: In contrast, what I will introduce next week is an
44:22
Speaker 12: inquiry has the powers just like a royal Commission. It's
44:25
Speaker 12: just called something different because it's established by the Parliament,
44:28
Speaker 12: not the Executive. It is going to have a terms
44:32
Speaker 12: of reference that is based on a Senate inquiry that
44:35
Speaker 12: has just been completed, where we didn't inquiry to what
44:38
Speaker 12: the terms of reference should cover. It will cover all
44:40
Speaker 12: types of things lockdowns, vaccines, etc. And in that inquiry
44:44
Speaker 12: there were five hundred and fifty nine submissions to that
44:46
Speaker 12: Senate inquiry. Just three were opposed to a COVID nineteen
44:49
Speaker 12: proper commission of inquiry. So this has broad support. The
44:53
Speaker 12: Labor Party should get behind it because is what they
44:54
Speaker 12: promised the trained people to do and Australians deserve a
44:57
Speaker 12: proper inquiry into what happened during and how we can
45:00
Speaker 12: learn the lessons from what went wrong.
45:02
Speaker 2: Yeah, well it'll come down to whether you can get
45:05
Speaker 2: the numbers in the Senate to get this over the line.
45:07
Speaker 1: But it is something that absolutely.
45:09
Speaker 2: Every Australian should welcome because I mean, we've just seen
45:12
Speaker 2: hearings in the United States at the moment and we
45:15
Speaker 2: saw those shocking admissions from Anthony Facci that you know,
45:19
Speaker 2: the six meters of social distancing was just a figure
45:22
Speaker 2: he effectively made up but wasn't based on any firm research.
45:26
Speaker 1: You know, vaccines. People don't know what to believe.
45:30
Speaker 2: The interstate border closures, again, this is a major issue.
45:34
Speaker 2: We could have another pandemic matt God forbid, but we
45:38
Speaker 2: could have one, and we need to have some research
45:42
Speaker 2: based ways to react to it.
45:44
Speaker 1: If we do.
45:48
Speaker 12: Absolutely right, absolutely right, and you know, effectively. There was
45:53
Speaker 12: an experiment conducted on the populations of many countries about
45:58
Speaker 12: what governments could get away with. We know now that
46:01
Speaker 12: many times what they were telling us were straight out lies.
46:04
Speaker 12: Sometimes I suppose they were well intentioned lies to try
46:08
Speaker 12: and get people to comply, but there's got to be
46:10
Speaker 12: real questions asked about the damage to trust that's been
46:14
Speaker 12: done between the government and their people. I mean, a
46:16
Speaker 12: lot of people aren't taking even the normal vaccines now.
46:19
Speaker 12: We've had a massive drop off in those because, as
46:21
Speaker 12: I say, when you light to someone, you destroy that
46:23
Speaker 12: trust and it's very hard to get back.
46:25
Speaker 1: Once it's gone.
46:26
Speaker 2: Yeah, and yeah, we've seen the research that even vaccines
46:30
Speaker 2: for babies and children that have been shown to be
46:33
Speaker 2: safe over decades, that people are starting not to give
46:36
Speaker 2: their kids those because of the genuine issues that have
46:40
Speaker 2: emerged with COVID vaccines. You know a lot of people
46:44
Speaker 2: suffering well after months and even years after having the vaccine.
46:49
Speaker 1: Matt kim Williams, the new.
46:51
Speaker 2: ABC chair, gave a big speech today. He said he
46:54
Speaker 2: had a new vision for the broadcaster, yet again it
46:58
Speaker 2: came down to doubt more funding.
47:01
Speaker 12: What did you make of his vision, Well, it's not surprising,
47:08
Speaker 12: it's not shocking. I suppose your public servants always ask
47:10
Speaker 12: for more money. But what I'd like to see is
47:12
Speaker 12: more efficiency, more productivity out of all of our public service,
47:15
Speaker 12: including the ABC. They already get a budget of over
47:17
Speaker 12: a billion dollars a year and if they need to
47:20
Speaker 12: make investments in what he calls the iView app or
47:22
Speaker 12: whatever it is, just like any other business, they should
47:25
Speaker 12: be asked to look inside themselves first and then on
47:27
Speaker 12: the other side of this too. I really question why
47:31
Speaker 12: we need to put so much money into a public
47:33
Speaker 12: broadcast of these days, there's so much alternative media out there.
47:36
Speaker 12: It's a very different environment than it was ten or
47:39
Speaker 12: twenty years ago. People can watch your show for free
47:42
Speaker 12: in regional Australia. There's podcasts, there's so much media out there.
47:46
Speaker 12: Why do we do we really need to spend a
47:47
Speaker 12: billion dollars a year on a national broadcaster.
47:50
Speaker 2: I mean, what I find so shocking is that one
47:53
Speaker 2: point one billion dollars a year. Other media companies, by
47:56
Speaker 2: the way, are constantly looking to make saving they're having
48:00
Speaker 2: to make staff redundant. The ABC gets this amount of
48:04
Speaker 2: money and it can't cover in a meaningful way the
48:07
Speaker 2: current antisemitism crisis.
48:09
Speaker 1: What is wrong with the public broadcaster?
48:14
Speaker 12: Well, it's bias too, right of course. I don't have
48:17
Speaker 12: a particular issue with people having bias, as we all
48:19
Speaker 12: have them, we all have opinions. But the issue here
48:22
Speaker 12: is it's publicly funded and you and I can turn
48:25
Speaker 12: off Sky News or turn off the mainstream media as
48:28
Speaker 12: I say, there's lots of alternatives now to go to.
48:30
Speaker 12: But the ABC, I're going to pay for it whether
48:32
Speaker 12: I watch it or not, and it's not living up
48:34
Speaker 12: to its charter right now, to be fair and balves.
48:36
Speaker 12: There's no doubt about that, and it definitely doesn't deserve
48:39
Speaker 12: an increase in budget because of that.
48:41
Speaker 2: All right, Matt Canavan, thank you very much for your
48:43
Speaker 2: time tonight, and apology to everyone at home for my
48:46
Speaker 2: voice this evening. I had a bit of alergie early
48:48
Speaker 2: in the weekend. It's not quite recovered yet. I'll see
48:51
Speaker 2: you eight o'clock on Monday morning. Have a lovely weekend,
48:55
Speaker 2: but stay tuned. Paul Murray is up right now.