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Purpose in the Pain: Letting Go of Pride & Embracing Our Limitations · For Such a Time as This

• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome back to another episode of For Such a Time as This, a podcast about calling, timing, and trusting God in the season that you're actually in, not just the one you hope to be in.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: I'm your host, Bethany Garner, and this is season three.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_01: This season is called Purpose in the Pain.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_01: So we're talking to different individuals with chronic illnesses and how they're navigating that through their daily life, but also through their faith walk as well.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so excited for this episode.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: So let's just get started.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_00: Alright, guys, today I have my friend Rachel.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_00: We met doing marketing together back in her Chick-fil-A days.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um I miss her desperately, but she is off doing something that she loves.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: Much more impactful on the earth.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_01: So, Rachel, before we like jump into this whole chronic illness side of things, because I know you suffer with chronic migraines, and it's just for like mentioning Hashimoto's disease.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so before we come into that, what do you do like now?
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_01: What's your life look like?
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_01: What is work?
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: So I work in humanitarian aid.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we send life-saving supplies to a bunch of different local partners around the world and then domestically too.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: And then I work in summer camps around the world.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: So what does that look like?
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like each of those jobs?
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like what is your daily gosh like?
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_01: I do I send a lot of emails.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm a project administrator, project manager, I don't know, something like that.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: So it's a lot of emails.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: I work in a warehouse, I work with people.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of a smaller nonprofit, so it's like whatever they need.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_01: We kind of fill it.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: And because we are mostly in office, it's just kind of helping out where they need us.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a lot of odds and ends, but it's a lot of emails, a lot of reaching out, kind of cold calling, adjacent, cold emailing, I suppose.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then at camp, I gosh, there's I had some title, I don't remember what it was.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: International director or something like that.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: So it's that's a lot of admin to um it's working with the kids, developing the structure of the schedule, and kind of running the behind the scenes of the camp.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_01: But it's only like a week or two every year.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then we have a couple of retreats that I might go on, depending on funding.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: And you get to go.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: Do you go to Germany every year or is it different places?
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_01: It's different places.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's in Central Europe and then the Far East.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: So last year was Austria, we've done it in Belgium, we've done it in Germany, and then this year is in Germany.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so tell me when did like chronic migraines become a thing for you?
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: So I grew up having it, wasn't chronic migraines, but growing up I would get migraines.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_01: And then in 2020, I had a theory for a minute that I I formed something called long flu because I got the flu right before COVID broke out.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_01: And then I started getting migraines after that.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think that's a thing because I did test positive for the actual flu, so it's not COVID, um, or like a form of that.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_01: But also, I have a question.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_01: Is this edited?
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, cool.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: Really urgent I was gonna say stuff.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, anyways, long flu.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um and so yeah, 2020 is when it started.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_01: And then it was right around the time that I started Chick-fil-A.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_01: I graduated college, started Chick-fil-A, and then I was like, maybe it's the lights that like the fluorescent lights, because I don't know, that's was my first very yeah.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_01: And then I just kept going home from work, and then I was like, oh, I actually need to lay down and be in the dark for a very long time until I feel better.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_01: And it was like every other day.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: I said, No, I need to seek uh medical assistance with this one.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: So that's when that started.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: And then how what do you feel like when it like impacts your plans or your work life?
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh, it is aggravating because it's one of those, it's so with a migraine, it usually impacts like your either your eyes or your stomach or both of them.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so I get really nauseous and then I just have to sit in the dark.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's not like even if for work, like if I was supposed to work from home, it would still not um it would be difficult still because it's staring at a screen.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_01: So I often will find a bathroom to sit in because bathrooms are usually the darkest and the coolest.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, but I have missed like for life stuff, like I've missed weddings and events and stuff like that.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: I will say it's a little bit of a convenient excuse to get out of things because you're kind of always yeah, you can think by yeah.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_01: You go, oh, I never feel great.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_01: But for the most part, it's like things where you're like, it always happens on like big days of like things you don't want to miss, where you're like, oh, this is a wedding I want to go to.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: This is X, Y, and Z thing that I would like to be at.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: And I can't, and it's also I don't want to say the word awkward, but it's like you it almost feels like for me, it's like a not fake excuse, but people kind of view it as a fake excuse because I will everyone gets headaches.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, yeah, well, it's not a headache, and I see it differently.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: So people, though it is a good excuse because it's a valid excuse, will often see it as like, oh, you have a headache, and it's like this weird, they don't believe you.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: You go, okay, well, I'm gonna go cute.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: So see your eyes.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm showing up.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's yeah, it's really hard with like so many invisible illness, chronic illnesses, because it's like people are like, uh, okay, I feel like you're just a random excuse.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, no, yeah.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_01: I don't feel well.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_01: I know I look like I feel fine, but not accurate.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I think like with neurological ones, or like, I don't know if this happens for you with like pots, uh, but like sometimes it's hard to drive.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's like I might feel fine, but also I know I actually can't drive because it like impacts almost my um oh my gosh, what is it like clear decision making?
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like, no, oh my gosh.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_01: When you response time, yeah, where you're like driving, you're like, I feel like maybe if there was something to pull out in front of me really quickly, you're like a deer or a person or something, I wouldn't have the reaction time to respond appropriately and keep everyone safe and alive.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so it's yeah, just always a little, you know, sorry guys, enjoy without me.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_01: I'll get at home with my heating pad, my ice pack, and my exeterant I Eprofen, some kind of painkiller.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: Do you know like what your triggers are for them?
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_01: I have so many.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_01: Great question.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um so one is which it all kind of impacts every not every part of my life, but like, so one is dust, which I have learned recently that's a pretty bad one because it's a lot of sinus stuff.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I work in a warehouse where it's very dusty.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_01: And then change in altitude can be a bad one, which I live in right outside of the Blue Ridge Mountains, yeah, where we have higher altitude.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then the obvious ones that I feel like everyone kind of just gets headaches for.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_01: So like sometimes it's well, this is it, uh, weather related.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_01: So when the pressure is yeah, something changing.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_01: Ouch.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_01: And then um I am really bad about being hydrated.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_01: And so I can tell when I haven't drank enough.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but I will say that one does get me from time to time where I don't, yeah, um, gonna be suffering.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not like necessarily what you eat, like caffeine or chocolate or stuff like that.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_01: No, I feel like that makes it worse because then it's not that you're like, I have no control over this.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, and there's certain ones, like with the weather one, where I'm like, I know nothing I take or do will make this better.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so you just have to like wait it out.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_01: Whereas like dust, it's I I think you become very like attuned, at least I have to become very attuned to like my body because I can kind of feel the difference where it hurts in my face, um as to like what I need to take, what I can take, what I can't do, and like the next steps.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, whereas I don't think kind of earlier in the journey of me with migraines, I don't think I knew those things.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_01: So it's just it, I just took whatever and hoped for the best.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: Right, yeah, exactly.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_01: Does it ever feel like you second guess or question like your calling in life or like what you're doing for work or anything like that?
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_01: Gosh, I I know it's a deep question, yeah.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_01: I don't I think it could have, but both sets of my parents, both sets, both of my parents had migraines at one point in their lives, and then like my mom's side especially has a like history of migraines.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_01: So it's just one of those things, same with like thyroid disease, where it was like that's just kind of the way that cookie crumbled.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: So, and I don't think any other job would make it easier.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I think because both nonprofits that I work with are so small, they're much more like understanding than if I were to work at like some big hotshot place that has like very uh important deliverables and like things that I need to be working on a spreadsheet and like using my full brain all the time at a screen.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, yeah.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_01: What about the like faith side of things?
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: Does do you get frustrated in your faith by having like chronic migraines?
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think a lot of it is like I was thinking about this on my drive back, or like here from Virginia, but with like certain things like with like mental health or with like other trials in life where you go there, this feels purposeful.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like you can learn a lot about God um and who he is in his character and who you are in him.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_01: Physical illness to me feels like not yeah, like it doesn't have a purpose, and you're like, I don't know what to learn.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like I know God can heal it.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_01: And it also it does it's God can heal anything very quickly, obviously.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's like, what am I supposed to do with this?
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_01: Is there a purpose in this, or is it just kind of like the impact of a fallen world?
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: And how do you um navigate what that could look like or should look like?
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah, I think it's frustrating in that sense of not knowing why, or if there is a bigger why, or if it's just like it is what it is.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_01: I a lot of I like goes so back and forth between like, is this like the thorn in my side?
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like, that's okay if it is, but also I'm supposed to believe that like you're a healer and I'm a healer, and you can be like, oh, all of a sudden, all better.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: But if you don't, then I'm okay with that.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_01: But I I I'm just like the first thing who's I just want to know.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's what's which and it's I don't know for me, and I don't know if it's the same for you, but it's like that in between of I want to know the purpose behind it, and then also like yeah, I would just love if God was like, there isn't a purpose or there is, right?
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't have to know the purpose, but I can just I would be okay with one.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_01: Cause it's just so odd.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: I think especially with like having a lot of like not healthy friends, like I'm unhealthy, but like people who don't have chronic illness, I guess, um, around me, where it's like, so this is a real reality for people.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: Or if they have a chronic illness, it's not like actually, I don't think many of my friends have chronic illness besides you.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_01: So it's just weird being like, okay, I don't feel like this is making me any more sanctified than and again, this is me in my own like human nature, yeah, being like, this doesn't make sense.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_01: And one day it might.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think also just having like family who has had migraines before and being like, I don't know, not like you have to be better for everything that happens in your life, but it's like, come on, come on.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just a girl, right?
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_00: I can relate to that.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_01: What do you I feel like I was gonna say something else and it went on my brain.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_01: So if it comes back, we're gonna circle back to this.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_01: But um, how does it impact your like work life now?
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: I know you said it's easier working for like a smaller nonprofit or there are like lots of days where at the last minute you're like, I can't come in today.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: I so this past summer.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, so usually it's fine.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'll get a migraine closer to the end of the day, and I can like stand withstand the like two hours and go home.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but this past summer it rained every day for two or three months.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: It was the weirdest thing.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's never happened before, like when I've lived in um Virginia.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_01: And so that was one of those things that like it's because I feel a little goofy being like, I have a headache, can I go home?
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_01: And obviously, it's a migrant, it's different, but I still feel a little silly um talking to my boss and being like, yay.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um and so that has been, I think that opened like the bigger now dialogue, but like my boss was like, Do you have a brain tumor?
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like, do you need to go check out?
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, no.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: And growing up, my mom would tell me when I would get headaches or like migraines, she'd be like, if you like, you're going to think you have a brain tumor.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_01: You don't, it's just a migraine.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so I think there's now being aware of like how bad dust impacts me.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um I think that is something I can really plan for with taking like preemptive allergy meds.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um so, and then I kind of know like if we have a big warehouse day, I am going to talk to my boss and be like, hey, I might not be in tomorrow because of the dust, because and I'll wear masks and stuff like that.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um so that's usually those two things are usually the worst throughout the week with the weather and dust for when I work at camp, it's constant, it's always a little bit different.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: It's either change in altitude, and some years I have no migraines at all.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_01: And then some years it's really hot, it's really humid, it's I'm not drinking enough, I'm not doing whatever.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and those you can't just call out of because it is a like an intensive week of that's what I worked your whole year for.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um in a different country.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_01: Those you really have to just I have to grit my teeth and try and work through, which is not horrible.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's not fun.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_01: But one of my other, like one of the other people, I guess, on staff, um, she also has migraines.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_01: So it's we can empathize with each other.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_01: I don't feel good.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and there's always time for me to like step back and be like, hey, I need to go play down.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: I need to go stand in last.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_01: The past couple of years, we had like a walk in where I would just stand in the walk-in and like try and like cool down because heat's also like really aggravating for migraines.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um so yeah, those are the things where you're just like, it it just feels like a l enough of an inconvenience that you're like this, like it's not like I'm going to say something.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if this is not woke.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_01: But I feel like if it was like diabetes or like kidney disease or something where it is more like not impactful, but it's more of a daily occurrence, I'd be like, wow, this feels more sanctifying or something.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, that makes such sense.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: But it's like, this is more of an inconvenience than anything.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I have to go like to the pharmacy more often than other people would because I take like stuff to make like the pressure in my face go down.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just like you're like, okay, well, I have to go to work.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: Some days I feel fine, and some days I feel really not fine.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: Did that answer the question?
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_01: And and you added a little more, and I think I was good.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_01: And you like brought up what I thought I was gonna talk about before.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_01: Just the sanctification type thing is just I think when I first like got pots and the whole like the anxiety and all that that came from it at the beginning, like the first couple years, yeah.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like I can, I I get that.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_01: Like that was when I got closest to God.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, was when that was happening because it was so scary.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_01: So like I I understand like that was needed to like bring me to be like truly his daughter.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: But when we get here, and and and I'm like, it's been like 13 years, I think.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, now I'm like, okay, where are we gonna?
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_01: Am I still getting, am I still learning something like what am I supposed to be learning?
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: So just just went into yeah.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_00: Rego back to that because I remembered my thoughts.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: Hey you guys, it's me again.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: Don't worry, we'll be right back with our guest.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_01: I just wanted to say, isn't this episode so great so far?
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: Aren't we learning such a cool perspective?
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: I really hope you're enjoying it.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_01: And if you are, make sure to like, subscribe, comment, share, all the things on all the platforms.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: You can find us on YouTube for such a time as this with Bethany Garner or wherever you listen to your podcasts, Apple, Spotify, just type for such a time as this Bethany Garner.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_01: All right, let's get back to them.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_01: So what do you think is like if you had to pinpoint the hardest part of having migraines?
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: What is it?
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: Oh gosh.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um I think, and this I have like I think it's the um like personal not personal, it's the expectation that I have because I developed migraines when I was 21 or 22, like I had lived a lot of life without them.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's like that expectation that I still should be able to go at that full capacity all the time.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_01: And to a certain extent, you still can, like I still could, but I know I'm going to feel really terrible because of it later.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm going to like suffer those consequences.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's, yeah, like the inner personal, like, I'm really sorry.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_01: I do want to go to this thing.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_01: I do want to hang out with you.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_01: I do want to work, like whatever.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_01: And then you're just like, I can't.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: And it's not something, I think the other thing is like, it's not something that um you can let blood work done for, or like, I don't know, something that like proves that you have it, besides you being like, I'm in pain.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_01: A lot.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: That's true.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um and I think the other thing that I was thinking about on the way here was like people's um like with more common or less scary or less um invasive, maybe invisible illnesses, people feel much more entitled to your like medical history.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: And you're like, okay.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I was talking to someone that I had known for a while about going to the endocrinologist for my thyroid, and they were like, You never told me that.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_01: You never told me you have thyroid disease.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, it didn't seem relevant.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_01: Like none of this, like it doesn't seem relevant to tell you that.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_01: And so people get like really weird, which I grew up in like a lot of sick people were around me.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: So chronic illness, stuff like that wasn't abnormal.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that's the other thing where it's like, one, it's abnormal to some people.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_01: Two, they get really like weird about not knowing, and then what they do want to know, and like how you do interact with the world and with having a chronic illness is odd.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then just like the interpersonal, like, I can't go, and it's like could be like last minute, which I might need to get better at, because it's like you could have a flare-up in the like my migraines could start in the morning and then they could be gone before whatever event or not.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't want to like call out and be like, oh, sorry, I can't go to this thing in the morning because I have a migraine when it could be gone by the start time.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: But then it's like, is it better to do it last minute?
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: Be like, sorry, I knew about this all day, but could have gone away.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: No, yeah.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: That part for me, the interpersonal part too, is like, I really want to do yes, I promise I do.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's not you, yeah, yeah.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, like the big things that like come to my mind are like like travel things.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, I want to go places, they really do, but I I I can't.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I'll tell I'll like sit down and I'll tell people like I can't travel, and they'll be like, What do you mean?
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, if I travel, I will just be passing out, yeah, growing up like the entire time.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there's no point going.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I'll be like, Don't you take dramamine?
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_01: Uh he said I need for scripts.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, even be on my like meds, like I see them gonna be sick.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's not just like oh copa dramamy.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's like better.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_01: That's just that's all it's for.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_01: And like the wrist things, yeah.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I wear those, and and I'm still is it not gonna be driving or is it driving and flying?
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_01: It's driving and flying.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know that because it's the different, well, it's different for different ones, like the different altitudes with driving and flying, yeah, or like driving when if I'm sitting or if I'm standing for like a long period of time and not moving, yeah.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_01: My blood leg doesn't mix up muscle, yeah.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um so that's a part of it too.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and so it's yeah, it I feel bad because people don't understand.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_01: It's like I'm sorry, but like.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: But like my my cousin's wedding um in May.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like I had to miss my cousin's wedding.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I and I I didn't even tell her that I couldn't go until like the day before Josh was supposed to be leaving because I was like in a pot splair.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, I called her and was like, I'm so sorry.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm so sorry.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: I can't come.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_01: Weddings are always so weird.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like the two I've had to miss were friends' weddings or like coworkers' weddings.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but it's like, do you do you text them?
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: Because they're like the bride, and I wasn't particularly like, it's not like I'm in the wedding party or anything.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, right, you do that, yeah, yeah.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_01: What's the decorum around chronic illness anyway?
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: And how do you like?
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_01: It's just always odd.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like miss those things.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: I yeah.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: I also was like, do I text her?
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_01: Do I yell at her?
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like, she's busy, like two days before the wedding.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm just like, hi.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_01: Hi, I won't be there.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure the pictures are lovely.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: My I was like, wait, just trying to figure out with my dad because we had to go down to Tennessee because that's where he audience was.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_00: And he was like, just call her.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, okay, I just feel very sad.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_00: How do you how do you handle the moments when you kind of touch this already, but like how do you handle the moments in like work settings when you're like, I have to go home?
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think so, not that this is like a good way to do it, but I think for the first couple of years that I worked where I currently work, I I think I built enough like rapport and perhaps trust with my boss so that he doesn't think I'm like, I think that's my fear is people think I'm making it up.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_01: And so like I recently had talked to him because I was like, I need you to know like I'm diagnosed with this.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like I have, I don't know, it says it on my chart.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I'm not like just like, oh, I had a headache, ouch, I need to work from home because my teen can't work from home.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um so I think, and he during that conversation was like, Well, yeah, that makes sense.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: And like I didn't think anything of it, like I didn't think you were just making it up to be able to work from home, which I was like, that would be really kind of crazy to make that up and like just constantly be like, I'm in pain, I need to sit alone.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I wouldn't put it past people though, but like, yeah.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and that's it's like I think people have done that in the past.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I said, okay, that makes me feel better that this isn't like unjustified.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but yeah, I think a lot of it is just like having that like rapport amongst my boss and my team where they know it's not just like me being like, oh, ouch, whatever.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_01: Which again, so fine if you have to go home just with like a regular headache, but it's like because of how chronic it is and also unpredictable.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_01: And like, I don't know, people are like, oh, just take in a hackdown and drink some water.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_01: Just take some drink.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_01: I wish, yeah.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_01: That's not gonna help.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: I even like I'm building itself.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, I need excedrin, right?
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's the easiest way.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then also I think for me, it's just generally important to do work well, but kind of having that like yeah, I guess that goes into rapport of like you they know your quality of work.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_01: They know that you're not just like at this job, I'm not at this job, but I mean it's a small nonprofit, so it's certainly not for the paycheck, but I think yeah, just having that trust.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I said that like four times.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that makes sense.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: So, um what rhythms, habits, or boundaries do you help like use to help manage your migraines?
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_01: Gosh.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um I think well, first it was kind of just like accepting that I in fact did have chronic migraines, and it wasn't just like, oh, sometimes my head hurts, which for a long time for some reason that's what I had like convinced myself, which is a chronic migraine, but I like classified it differently in my brain.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think something that I have been trying to get better at is taking those breaks and like saying no to things, even if it's like a little bit awkward, um, or like asking if I can't have some kind of modification, even if I think it's maybe like a pride thing where I'm like, oh, I can just work through it and tell you, oh, you don't have to.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: Like you're going to be, if you do this thing, then you will be in pain for the next three days.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: So just do the modification, then you can come back tomorrow better for it.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so I think doing that and then just like being on top of if I start to get a migraine, like you need to take your meds right away, or else it will for me, my migraines obviously get worse and it's harder to like taper it down.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_00: Do you think there are like spiritual or emotional like things that you've learned through the process?
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_00: Gosh.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think part of it it's like surrender famous type things.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_01: I think in it has to do a lot with uncertainty, which is like I both Bethany and I have OCD.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'll say my therapist all the time is like, we know you don't like uncertainty.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's one of those things where it's like goes back to wanting that certainty of like there's a reason, there's not a reason, and like trusting the Lord in whatever answer there is, but also knowing I don't have to know that.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because at the end of the day, if you have a chronic illness, you do kind of have to work around um, like, I don't know, pride and stuff like that, which is not I think it's everyone kind of has to work in that area, very likely.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think for me, this is definitely an area that like the Lord has used chronic illness to make me have to ask for help, have to ask for those modifications, step like that.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I haven't really thought about that price for myself too.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe that's another lesson I'm supposed to be learning.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_01: Writing out the city pass.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: Is this the not having a pride?
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but then actually accepting that I need help.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like, no, I can do it.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_01: And then you're like, I really pass out, you can't exactly.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_01: All right, Rachel.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so if there's someone who's listening that feels trapped by their like chronic illness or discouraged by it, what encouragement do you have to them?
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_01: Gosh.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think going off of what we were just talking about, like it's not bad to ask for like help or modifications, or like even for me, for a long time, like I said, like it was even hard to be like, oh, well, this is a part of me.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_01: And I think a lot of times in churches and like in Christian groups, I guess I should say, um, people let me specify more.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_01: The Christian communities I have been around, it's often very focused on the Lord healing you.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_01: And like, I think there's an acceptance and like uh yeah, a surrender of like, I might not receive healing for this.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_01: And also like that doesn't mean this part of me, I don't want to say is sinful, but it's almost painted that way.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, oh, you don't have enough faith.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_01: You if you're prayed over, if you're this, if you say the right words, if you whatever.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't think what I don't think that's fair, and I don't think that's biblical, and I think in chronic illness, you learn a lot about, you spend a lot of time alone, at least I do, um, because of having migraines and being in the dark or whatever I need to do.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so it gives you like a lot of space and time to kind of reflect on who God is, who you are, and how to navigate it.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_01: And it makes me really reliant on the Lord.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I think though this whole little episode has been me complaining about chronic illness, basically, I think there is kind of a gift in it, in like ways that I don't know, I think when you think about like the people who were healed by Jesus, there's obviously a gift in healing, but there's also a gift in like people getting to know Jesus closer because of their brokenness, um, and like in their brokenness in a way that healthy people are uh non-chronically ill, I suppose, people would experience uh the Lord in that way.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm like that was a lot and trying to like invoice things.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um are there like small like practices or habits um or like mindset shifts that make like a big difference for you like small meanie like things that you can taught yourself like on a daily basis?
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_01: I think it all just goes back to like the the shifting the idea of like what my life like should look like and what I should be able to do um into like this is just the reality right now, and it might not be forever, right?
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_01: But it's okay.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's not a moral thing, maybe, where sometimes it does feel almost moral.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um I don't know what like it's like one of probably like a cultural understanding of like bad and illness and whatever.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but it's not necessarily like something that is it defines parts of my existence just in what I can do and what I can't do.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_01: But outside of that, it's not like a defining right.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like this is like who I am.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_01: This chat, like I don't introduce myself because, like, hi, I'm Rachel.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_01: I have chronic Yeah, exactly.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, yeah, yeah.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_00: All right, well, Rachel, thank you so much for joining us.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_00: You for having us know.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_00: Do you have any like last-minute thing you want to throw at us?
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_01: No, I wish I did.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_01: I was trying to think of something.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_00: Just want to make sure.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: I really appreciate you taking time to come join us.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I uh look forward to hopefully having you next season for Imagine Health.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: You'll see me up.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_00: Bye guys.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_00: Bye.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_01: I really hope that episode was as impactful for you as it was for me.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_01: If you loved it, make sure you share it with someone you know.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_01: I'd also love if you guys would comment what stood out to you, or if you have questions that we can answer on future episodes coming up.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: Remember, each of you was born for such a time as this.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_00: Until next time.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: Bye!