Latest / Stuff Mom Never Told You / SMNTY Classics: The Feminism of K-Pop

Transcript

SMNTY Classics: The Feminism of K-Pop · Stuff Mom Never Told You

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Hey, this is Anny and Samantha and ofcome stuff I
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: Never told your production iHeart Radio. And today we are
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: bringing back an episode that we should we should come
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: back to. I think I I yeah, I think you
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: would agree to math. But it was about the feminism
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: of K pop.
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: Yes, and I go into a history because obviously this
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: was for me as well, about the good and the
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: bad of K pop and feminism behind it. There's a
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: lot going on in K pop world right now between
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: the K pop demon Hunters and BTS coming back uh
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: and going full throttle with their tour y'all. I don't
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: know if you listen to the new album, but I
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: dig it. But they also have a lot of controversy
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: as well. But all of that to say, I thought
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: it would be a good time. We thought it'd be
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: a good time to bring it back to kind of
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: brush up on some of the backgrounds of Cabo.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely so please enjoy this classic episode. Hey, this
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: is Annie and Samantha and welcome to Stephan Never Told
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: you production of iHeartRadio.
• 1:29
  Speaker 3: Annie, can we talk about boy bands and girl bands?
• 1:35
  Speaker 3: Are you ready for this?
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: I don't know, I hope so.
• 1:39
  Speaker 3: I think you will be ready. But as a precursor.
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: We talked about boy bands in the US and what
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: was your favorite boy band?
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: Well, I guess it was Backstreet Boys. I didn't really
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: I didn't get as caught up in all of that.
• 1:55
  Speaker 3: You were a little younger for that.
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I like the most of the music I listened
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: to at a young age, like the first CD I
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: bought this Jimmy World, Green Day and the Phantom Menace soundtrack.
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: Like if that gives you any.
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: So you were cool, you were one of the cool kids.
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: I was not cool. No, But I think of like
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: the you know, ncinc Versus Backstreet Boys, right debate. I
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: was on the Backstreet Boys side.
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: Okay, so you have been with my older sister, which
• 2:23
  Speaker 3: is really funny because typically the older generation goes with
• 2:26
  Speaker 3: the older people who got into the boy band would
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: probably say Backstreet Boys. And I do mean, like, my
• 2:33
  Speaker 3: sister was in the era of new Kids on the
• 2:35
  Speaker 3: Block and I was too, and I really did like them.
• 2:37
  Speaker 3: But I was super young for that. But yeah, I
• 2:40
  Speaker 3: was an n Sync fan. I was in high school
• 2:42
  Speaker 3: when Enzync came out, like right before I think it
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: was right as I was graduating. But I really enjoyed
• 2:47
  Speaker 3: that music more so than the Backstreet Boys. I am
• 2:50
  Speaker 3: team in sync. I will say that for myself, but
• 2:53
  Speaker 3: I really enjoy a good like pop band because one
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: of the first CDs outside of No Doubt for me
• 3:00
  Speaker 3: was Spice Girls and I back then, of course, I
• 3:04
  Speaker 3: was embarrassed because I really wanted to be the person
• 3:07
  Speaker 3: that says, yeah, I definitely only listened to Green Day
• 3:10
  Speaker 3: and Bush and all that, and of course I loved
• 3:12
  Speaker 3: No Doubt, but like saying Spice Girls was like, oh,
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: get that, keep that under wraps. We're gonna keep that
• 3:18
  Speaker 3: under wraps. But now we all know they are a delight,
• 3:22
  Speaker 3: and we still we celebrate them today as you should.
• 3:24
  Speaker 3: I feel like the gen z ers understand and have
• 3:27
  Speaker 3: kind of come back to love them as they should.
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: So I'm a fan. I'm a fan, so of course,
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: being that when I've been listening to K pop recently,
• 3:37
  Speaker 3: I know everybody knows my new obsessions I have, like, yeah,
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: I enjoy this. Okay, let's talk about this. And because
• 3:45
  Speaker 3: I've been wanting to talk about this and I've been
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: geeking out about it, We're gonna do this topic and
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: I'm forcing you into this, and it's long and it
• 3:52
  Speaker 3: is somewhat dark of a subject. So let's go ahead
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: and put a content warning. Y'all, we are going to
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: talk about eating disorders, abuse, and suicide in this conversation.
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: If you know much about K pop, I have a
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: feeling you know about that as well. So we can't
• 4:06
  Speaker 3: ignore that I sent you some homework you did. I
• 4:10
  Speaker 3: slowed it down because this has been in the making
• 4:12
  Speaker 3: for a while, but it's a huge outline, be a
• 4:16
  Speaker 3: huge one. So what do you know about K pop?
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: I know that people love it, uh, and it has
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: a lot of fans. Most of what I know is
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: through you and our shared friend Marisa, who had I
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: told you a lot of the videos you sent me
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: she had shown me before. I actually think we were
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: together when that happened. I feel like vaguely we were.
• 4:38
  Speaker 3: Oh watch the videos videos, Yes, yeah, I think the
• 4:41
  Speaker 3: majority of the videos that we watched were BTS because she,
• 4:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah and her mom are BTS fans. Hey, Marissa. Because
• 4:48
  Speaker 3: there was another K pop group who was made up
• 4:50
  Speaker 3: of all women who actually are like kind of queer icons, uh,
• 4:56
  Speaker 3: I love them, called Mama Moo. They were here and
• 4:59
  Speaker 3: there was an opportunity for someone to go and I
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: don't go to shows because I'm like, I'm too old.
• 5:03
  Speaker 3: I don't want to stand up. I don't I can't
• 5:04
  Speaker 3: deal with this. I don't want to deal with traffic.
• 5:07
  Speaker 3: I sent a Marissa a message and she was like,
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: I don't know who that is. So I think she
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: kind of leans into the BTS world, which is perfectly
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: understandable because they are kind of what you think of
• 5:16
  Speaker 3: when you think of K pop now, and we're going
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: to talk a little bit about them. But she she knows,
• 5:21
  Speaker 3: she knows, and her mom apparently knows a lot.
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, a concert, I love that, la, Yeah, I love that.
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: I love all about that.
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: So we are that's what we're talking about today is
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: K pop, and we are talking about how it's influencing internationally,
• 5:38
  Speaker 3: and because the majority of fans are women, when we're
• 5:42
  Speaker 3: talking about the impact they have and the implications, we
• 5:45
  Speaker 3: are talking about it in the perspective of influencing more
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: women and girls than anything else. So even though you
• 5:51
  Speaker 3: may be like, why is this about feminism, this is why,
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: and when you hear about the topics, especially in the
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: dark topics, it's something to remember. So we're gonna go
• 6:00
  Speaker 3: with the history and definitions because that's what we do,
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: so and we have a lot of them. I did
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: cut them down because I'm like, this is unnecessary. This
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: is unnecessary because I don't know why. I just love
• 6:10
  Speaker 3: the fun facts of it all, I guess. But the
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: history of kpop idols is much older and more complicated
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: than I had thought. So we were going to take
• 6:18
  Speaker 3: a look at the background of K pop and the
• 6:20
  Speaker 3: world around it before we do anything else. And I
• 6:23
  Speaker 3: think before we start, we need a quick overview of
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: the definitions related to K pop. Keep this in mind
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: as we go through the ins and outs of kpop
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: because we're probably gonna be referencing it or talking about it,
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: and it's international growth and popularity, so.
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: Worse to know.
• 6:38
  Speaker 3: And these are the definitions we're giving you are exactly
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: off of these pages. So we're giving you the reference
• 6:44
  Speaker 3: now from Hello to how you dot com and StyleCaster
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: dot com. So they're direct definitions. So pretend like we
• 6:53
  Speaker 3: put quotes in.
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: All of these.
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: Okay, So starting simply with k pop, which this one
• 6:59
  Speaker 3: came out of the main webster is popular music originating
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: in South Korea and encompassing a variety of styles aka
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: Korean pop music.
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: Paul you the Hungkol or Korean language term for the
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: Korean wave, literally meaning the flow of Korea. This term
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: refers to the increase in worldwide popularity of South Korean
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: media since the end of the twentieth century. Idol a
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: word used for K pop stars. Idols can be soloists
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: or members of a group, but the word is often
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: used to a K pop artist who has debuted and
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: is no longer a trainee and an entertainment agency trainee.
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: Before K pop artists are idols and more on that later,
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: they're trainees. Trainees are students at K pop entertainment companies
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: who have either auditioned or been scouted, who spend several
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: years training in dancing and singing before they debut as
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: a soloist or as part of a group. Along with
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: singing and dancing, many trainee programs also include lessons in
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: languages such as Korean if the trainee is an already
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: fluent English and Japanese.
• 8:01
  Speaker 3: Right so, the word debut is often used in K
• 8:04
  Speaker 3: pop to refer to a trainee who has transitioned to
• 8:07
  Speaker 3: an idol by releasing their first official single, either as
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: a soloist or in a group, or performing in public
• 8:13
  Speaker 3: for the first time. Then there's the Big Three. The
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: Big Three refers to the three big entertainment companies that
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: have launched the most successful acts and believed to have
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: majorly influenced K pop, which are SM Entertainment, which has
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: groups like Girls Generation, Super Junior, Shine, JYP Entertainment which
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: has twice Wonder Girls and miss A and Stray Kids
• 8:34
  Speaker 3: more recently, and then YG Entertainment and side note. You
• 8:40
  Speaker 3: might be wondering why this would be of interest in
• 8:42
  Speaker 3: the K pop industry. These three labels control a lot
• 8:45
  Speaker 3: of the content, the publicity, and even the popularity of
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: individuals and groups, and are almost as famous as some
• 8:51
  Speaker 3: of their groups.
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: Wow m HM. And within the groups which often have
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: several members, BTSs seven like Exo have up to twelve
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: members and one group had twenty one members, there are
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: specific roles and titles given to them and in groups
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: sometimes referred to as idol groups, which is a band
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: of two or more performers that perform, record and essentially
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: live together. Each member takes on a persona and a
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: role within the group. Depending on the size, there can
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: be a leader, main lead and sub vocalist, main lead
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: and sub rappers, main and lead dancers, visuals including the
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: face of the group in the center and the mockne okay.
• 9:35
  Speaker 3: So with that, let's talk about the fan base and
• 9:38
  Speaker 3: the words we hear in regards to fans or anti
• 9:40
  Speaker 3: fans within the group. There's lovers and haters, and there
• 9:43
  Speaker 3: are specific terms for different groups of people in the
• 9:45
  Speaker 3: K pop world, and we'll start with Fangirls are fanboys,
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: which we talked about in our Fangirls episode before, so
• 9:52
  Speaker 3: fangirl or fanboy. These terms can be used as nouns
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: to describe someone who expresses strong passionate feelings passionate about
• 10:01
  Speaker 3: K pop or K drama, especially in regards to their
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: biases and favorite groups. As a verb, a fanboying and
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: fangirling are usually demonstrated through uncontrollable physical and emotional freakouts
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: in reaction to scene, hearing, touching, or smelling a bias
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: or favorite group that is really specific. Anti fans so
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: anti or an anti fan is someone who hates a
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: specific idol or group. Some antis will go out of
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: their way to discredit the idol they hate by creating
• 10:30
  Speaker 3: fake rumors or finding evidence that diminishes an idol's talent,
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: so they put just as much energy as a fan, essentially,
• 10:37
  Speaker 3: but to ruin them. There's also saysungs, which refers to
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: fans who have crossed the line and are closer to stalkers.
• 10:45
  Speaker 3: These are fans who invade idols privacies or make them
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: feel uncomfortable or unsafe in some way.
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: Then there's bias, a fan's absolute favorite actor or idol,
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: whom they will fiercely support and keep track of no
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: matter what content they produce. Fans pick one BYI from
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: their favorite group and usually only have one bias at
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: a time. Bias ruiner or a wrecker an actor or
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: idol who is revealed in a new light or newly
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: enters the scene, altogether making a fan question their devotion
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: to their original bias. So there are some of the
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: in depth definitions you might need to know as we
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: talk about the K pop industry and the people who
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: love or love to hate it and its effect on
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: international audiences and society.
• 11:36
  Speaker 3: So as we look at the history of K pop,
• 11:38
  Speaker 3: but it might be surprising to know that the idea
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: of Korean popular music and idols have been around for
• 11:43
  Speaker 3: a long time. Some of the earliest ideas can be
• 11:46
  Speaker 3: found in the nineteen thirties with the Jagori Sisters who
• 11:49
  Speaker 3: debuted in nineteen thirty nine and the first idols to
• 11:52
  Speaker 3: go abroad and had performances featured on shows like The
• 11:55
  Speaker 3: Ed Sullivan Show not once, but twenty two times. Was
• 11:58
  Speaker 3: the Game's Sisters who laid down the basis of K
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: pop music, and there were several more groups that would
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: come along until the eighties, made up of.
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: Mostly sister groups.
• 12:07
  Speaker 3: Surprisingly so, in the eighties and nineties we had what
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: you would consider the boy or girl groups we see today,
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: with performances that were accompanied by fancy choreography and the
• 12:17
  Speaker 3: nineties incorporating rap into the music.
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: Which brings us to what is known as the first
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: generation of idols and K pop groups. Here's a quote
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: from Lafilm dot Edu about the first generation. Once the
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: K pop stardom recipe was discovered, genre bending music, attractive performers,
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: fall less appearances, and intricate choreography. The first generation of
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: K pop stars ushered in Hot is considered to be
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: the first true kpop idol group because the group was
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: highly manufactured and made up of trained pop stars. They
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: released the song Candy in nineteen ninety seven, and it
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: would become a bubblegum pop hit in Korea and the
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: information according to Wikipedia says the first generation I groups
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: are usually groups of approximately five people, each of whom
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: divided their roles into lead vocal, sub vocal, dancer, and
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: rapper while singing on stage. Their synchronous choreography, known as
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: group dance, was more sophisticated compared to previous dance music,
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: but at the same time included point choreography that teenagers
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: could easily imitate. Musical performances were done only for two
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: or three songs in the album, the title song and
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: follow up song, and these songs were produced with music
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: videos that showed each member's characteristics. After several months of performing,
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: the singers took a break and resumed their career with
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: their next album. This system became the basis for the
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: second and third generation idols. The first generation did have
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: a lot of controversy. The same Wikipedia page rights first
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: generation idols lost popularity in the two thousands. They often
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: lip synced as they performed, with a focus on choreography,
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: and most of the audience recognized that the songs heavily
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: relied on digital techniques to correct the vocals of the
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: idle singers. As a result, many people began to question
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: the authenticity and competency of the singers. In addition, a
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: series of controversies had erupted in contracts with idle members
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: and adjustment of profits, and the idle training system relied
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: on terrestrial broadcasting while the music market was being converted
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: into digital centers.
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so the second generation is y two K. After
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: the decline of the first generation, the agencies tried some
• 14:24
  Speaker 3: new ways, and many of those new ways were ways
• 14:27
  Speaker 3: to make money quote. The second generation idol groups usually
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: consisted of six or more members, formed a group in
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: a group called a unit, and they ran group and
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: unit activities at the same time. The agencies tried to
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: manage their aisle groups more thoroughly than the first generations.
• 14:43
  Speaker 3: To prevent those problems, they regularly evaluated trainees singing and
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: dancing abilities and ended contracts with trainees if their abilities
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: did not improve or were significantly inferior. They also put
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: on emphasis on personality and dismissed trainers whose behavior was controversial.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: And though the major entertainment companies had already been established,
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: it was at this point the Big Three were highlighted,
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: and they are still the top moneymakers in the K
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: pop realm. The beginning of hollw could also be attributed
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: to this generation, largely in part due to the beginning
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: of social media outlets like Twitter and Within the second generation,
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: there were two categories. Here's the quote from creatrip dot com.
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: The second generation idols were divided into two categories. They
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: were the record idols and music idols. Items with a
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: large fandom and low mainstream popularity were labeled as record idols.
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: In Idols with a relatively smaller fandom but large mainstream
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: popularity were labeled as music idols. In Korea, male idols
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: were usually record idols and female idols were music idols.
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: Regardless of which category they belonged to, it seemed certain
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: that the second generation idols were loved by most Koreans overall.
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: So then we come to what many of the non
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: K pop diehards may know more about, which is the
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: third generation idols, which does include BTS and Black Pink
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: and for me, Exo, who kicked off the new generation
• 16:08
  Speaker 3: with their hit Growl Again, this is my first true
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: introduction to what I know is K pop now and
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: though there isn't as much distinction between second and third generation.
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: The massive usage of social media at this point helped
• 16:20
  Speaker 3: the international interest in K pop, with groups being featured
• 16:23
  Speaker 3: through content on YouTube and navver v which I think
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: is a Korean thing. Companies pushed a more personal look
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: at the different groups. Here's a quote from that Wikipedia
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: page we would talked about earlier. The Idol group's marketing
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: strategy had become more diverse due to social media, which
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: has led to the emergence of unprocessed, self produced content
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: on sites such as YouTube, Africa TV, and v app
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: rather than through TV programs. Idol members also began to
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: post on social networking services to get closer to their fans.
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: In terms of planning, the quote localization strategy expanded not
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: only through releasing albums in different country or performing in
• 17:01
  Speaker 3: different languages, but by including foreign, non Korean members directly
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: into groups. So also of note, we are seeing more
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: groups writing and producing their own music in this generation.
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: So BTS has been credited with producing and writing their
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: own music for a chunk of it, which has been
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: a criticism from the previous generations of K pop.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: And to add to all of that, entertainment, companies capitalized
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: on the love of fans. They started selling merchandise, including
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: photo cards, fan events, the usage of competitive reality shows
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: that have you invested before a group is even formed,
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: or if that's what they want you to think anyway.
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: They also understood the importance of the female gaze with
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: groups like Mama Moo and Red Velvet. They have utilized
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: the idea of girl crushes, which they might do through
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: things like attire, like many will wear suits and tuxes.
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: As one girl group said, their idea is quote to
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: be girls seen from a girl's gaze, and as the
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: fourth generation is rolling out, we are seeing more and
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: more fallow suit.
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: And yeah, that was actually something that we don't talk
• 18:06
  Speaker 3: about into this, but I will say a lot of
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: the articles talk about how sexuality really has nothing to
• 18:12
  Speaker 3: do with it. Oftentimes you will see, uh, if you
• 18:15
  Speaker 3: see a gay man or a gay men, they love
• 18:20
  Speaker 3: the women groups as much as cishetero women do. And
• 18:23
  Speaker 3: then a lot of the gay women or lesbians love
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: the male groups as much as cissetero groups do. So
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: it's kind of like it doesn't matter. They just love
• 18:33
  Speaker 3: who they love. It's kind of interesting to see because
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: they do and they don't play the masculine and feminine
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: roles as much. In K pop, you'll see that they're
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: a little more especially when it comes to like male groups.
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: It does seem like they're a little more effeminatee to some.
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: Some like they're very pretty. It's untally how pretty they are,
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: but so are the women.
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: They're very pretty.
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: So that brings us to the newest generation, the fourth generation.
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: Here's what Nocturnal dot com has to say about the
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: newest generation. Any group who made their debut in twenty
• 19:02
  Speaker 3: eighteen or twenty nineteen was considered to be a part
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: of the current fourth generation. The fourth generation shows kpop
• 19:08
  Speaker 3: at an unprecedented skill that we have never seen before.
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: Groups are debuting and immediately gaining millions of followers on
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: music videos and going on showcase tours around the world.
• 19:19
  Speaker 3: And the article continues. Within the influx of new groups
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: and the lack of boy bands and girl bands in
• 19:24
  Speaker 3: the West, since notable acts like One Direction and Fifth Harmony,
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: k pop has been able to take over and found
• 19:30
  Speaker 3: a new sense of popularity throughout the global pandemic. Something
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: that differentiates K pop from the typical teenage pop group
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: is the amount of time and production that goes into it.
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: Some idol groups like Straight Kids in seventeen are also
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: labeled as self producing because they take part in writing, producing, mixing, choreographing,
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: and doing many other things. These all rounder groups are
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: ensuring that they cement a place for themselves globally and
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: need to be recognized for their hard work and legitimate
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: artistry instead of a teenage craze. So they're trying to
• 20:02
  Speaker 3: make it more legits the kids, as the kids would say.
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: But yeah, So it's interesting to note all of that,
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: as well as the fact social media like TikTok has
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: really picked up even more so the popularity of K
• 20:21
  Speaker 3: pop groups because not only do they have dance challenges
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: and like more and more interaction fans are able to
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: produce fan content things like fan cams where they just
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: literally find their their bias as we talked about, and
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: then do a collage essentially a montage for these people.
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: But it really they do a great job. I will say,
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: they do an amazing job. I will also say I
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: believe in the second generation fans were called cannons because
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: they carried around professional cameras to shows. Yeah, and they
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: made like they made an incredible photograps of their favorite fans.
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: It was interesting, like the it is so professional is absurd,
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: but the fans were the ones that doing it, and
• 21:08
  Speaker 3: they were carrying like thousands of dollars cameras to these shows.
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: How times have changed?
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: They all times of change, although I have seen people
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: competing with their phones and talking about how they do
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: better of filming.
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: Quite funny.
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: But here's another quote from NPR about the fourth generation.
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: The last generation of K pop stars are no longer
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: bound by borders. They can debut or train outside of
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: South Korea and become just as or even more successful
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: in the West than they are back home. They also
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: continue to expand upon K pop's constant musical experimentation. And
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: actually that was one of the some of the articles
• 21:44
  Speaker 3: that I've seen that they no longer are catering to
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: Korean fans, that it is all about catering to international fans,
• 21:52
  Speaker 3: and a lot of Korean fans feel like this is
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: leaving them out because more and more K pop people
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: are doing songs in English, songs in Japanese, all of
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: these things. So the question is who is this actually
• 22:02
  Speaker 3: four and is the origin changing?
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: Right? Well, if you're thinking, well, this sounds fun. How
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: do I become an idol? Here's the process according to
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: ninety day Korean dot Com.
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: Which is a great program by the way of learning Korean.
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: Not a sponsor, but I do use them.
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: Not a current sponsor. Not a current sponsor, so you
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: must first audition. Many of the stories we see of
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: K pop idols begin with auditioning for different companies and studios.
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: Are Kpop College, many companies who feed directly to the
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: major entertainment companies, and there are many different schools and
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: studios with hopeful beginners, some auditioning at the age of ten.
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: And you don't even need to be a current resident
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: of Korea or even Korean. Look at Lisa from Blackpink,
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: who is from Thailand. Second, all right, if you've passed
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: the audition, you become a train At this point you
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: are trained with a purpose and intensity. Not only will
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: you learn to sing and dance, you may be taught
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: how to act. You must take different language courses, such
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: as English and Japanese. And it's during this time you
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: are under scrutiny not only for your talents, but for
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: your looks, and are constantly evaluated physically, and based on
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: your talent. Stories of young trainees being weighted twice a
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: day and being heavily restricted with their food intake, and
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: even getting suggested to have plastic surgery if they don't
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: have a specific look. These are stories that we've heard,
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: and refusing can result in being cut. Interestingly, in Korea,
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: mail instructors are not allowed to tell the ladies that
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: they need to lose weight or placed restrictions on them
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: by law, and plastic surgery is seen as just a
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: regular thing. Here's a quote from Vice. One of the
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: most well known methods of transforming teenagers into pop stars
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: in Korea is with plastic surgery. In Korea, there's no
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: stigma attached having your face changed to better your public image.
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: The first most important thing is their appearance, says Kim Mansuk,
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: a former master trainer with YG who now runs his
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: own training center, sand Factory. If a girl has a
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: bad face and a good body, the problem can be
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: fixed with plastic surgery, he says, matter of factly. Often
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: a hopeful star will get a loan from a label
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: for fifty percent of the costs of the surgery, but
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: she'll have to pay it back.
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: It's also During this time, you are most likely placed
• 24:30
  Speaker 3: in a specific position in a group and are then
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: assigned to train and live with this newly formed group,
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: and strict rules are implemented, including dating bands, which may
• 24:39
  Speaker 3: follow even after a debut and rise in popularity. According
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: to that ninety Day Korean article quote, while the South
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: Korean idol hopefuls are in training, they are expected to
• 24:50
  Speaker 3: maintain the same polished image once they have debuted. As
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: a part of the idol group. They should hold at
• 24:56
  Speaker 3: least basic etiquette and media training, but most importantly stay
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: out of trouble, namely dating and drinking scandals. Although luckily
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: for idols, the industry is changing to allow a little
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: more freedom with dating in some regards, just not right
• 25:10
  Speaker 3: as they debut. There may also be some pressure to
• 25:13
  Speaker 3: maintain a certain weight in some companies. There is I
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: don't know why they said they may because there is
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: point blank. However, as rigorous as a trainee system may seem,
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: trainees also get some freedom. It is still totally okay
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: to have social media accounts and use them as they wish,
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: of course, while keeping up with a positive image. They
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: could also work in commercials and music videos, modeling, gigs
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: and sometimes even act in dramas or movies while in training,
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: and then.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: For a selected few we get to the debut. According
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: to Wes, the number is very small quote. Out of
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: all the teens who train, it's difficult to say who
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: will make it, though it's certain that few will move
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: on to the big time pop scene. Kim says that
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: of his two hundred students, only about fifteen will be
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: signed with one of the three major labels, and he
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: says girls have a better chance than boys. Girls tend
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: to want to be k pop stars more and with
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: a bigger market for girls. He says, of course, one
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: of the reasons that girls may be more likely to
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: make it may have something to do with the mandatory
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: military service required for all Korean men, who have to
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: serve for two years between the ages of eighteen to
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: thirty five, which was recently changed from eighteen to twenty
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: eight due to the success of BTS, and there are
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: currently two members of BTS serving the required time. Also,
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: there is no real timeline for a trainee to train.
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: Some may train for years and some for only a
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: few months, and according to k poplife dot Com quote,
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: once a trainee has been deemed ready, they are then
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: given the opportunity to debut as part of a K
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: pop group. The debut process involves the creation of a
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: new group and the selection of members who will make
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: up the group. The selection process is highly competitive, with
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: only a handful of trainees being selected to debut. The
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: newly formed group then begins the process of preparing for
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: their debut, which includes recording their first album and rehearsing
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: for their first performance.
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: Right, so, now that we have the fundamentals of kpop,
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: let's talk about the people who loved them. And the
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: audience is vast and diverse and has had different race
• 27:15
  Speaker 3: of growth all over the world. So we're gonna break
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: it down. The K pop has been around for decades now.
• 27:20
  Speaker 3: The international popularity is fairly new, probably a couple of decades,
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: but you know, still fairly new. It's going to where
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: you're from, even in the Asian countries, but the popularity
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: has spread vastly. According to reports, the biggest fan groups
• 27:32
  Speaker 3: of kpop actually are outside of Korea, with China having
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: the highest number of fans. But I know, at one
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: point when there was this whole conversation because uh, there
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: was the skirmish between China and Korea. The Chinese government
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: banned capop for a little while, so I don't know
• 27:47
  Speaker 3: how that affected anything. But according to Billboard dot Com,
• 27:50
  Speaker 3: as of twenty nineteen, the Korean Foundation has tracked at
• 27:53
  Speaker 3: least a ninety nine point three million fans across the
• 27:56
  Speaker 3: globe who are associated with Korean entertainment related fan club
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: and at least seventy two million are based in Asia.
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: Now.
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: According to a more recent report breakdown, the numbers are
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: like this, eighty four point three million Hallyu fans in China,
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: sixteen point eight million in Thailand, thirteen point three million
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: in Vietnam, thirteen point two in Europe. And these numbers
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: is from twenty twenty, with report showing a thirty seven
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: percent increase last year, so most likely higher now. So
• 28:27
  Speaker 3: obviously that ninety nine point three is low. It is
• 28:30
  Speaker 3: I think I saw around one hundred and fifty million,
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: if not more, probably way more so. Finding statistics for
• 28:38
  Speaker 3: North America was a bit difficult, but according to one
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: report from Korean dot Net, when it comes to Halou altogether,
• 28:45
  Speaker 3: in twenty twenty two, the US, along with Canada and
• 28:48
  Speaker 3: Argentina had the highest increase in popularity with a whopping
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: one hundred two percent increase from fourteen point six million
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: to twenty eight point nine million fans, and a majority
• 28:59
  Speaker 3: of the increase is thanks mostly to K pop. According
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: to another survey done on Reddit, many of the respondents
• 29:06
  Speaker 3: were from North America and they made up fifty two
• 29:08
  Speaker 3: percent of the fandom. Again, Reddit may be more of
• 29:11
  Speaker 3: a US thing, though, I don't know. Yeah, so that
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: might be why.
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: Well, you can see I read It episode for more
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: about that, which needs to be updated actually probably, And
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: the majority of fans do seem to be women, holding
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: it around seventy or more percent, with the average age
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: around twenty three to twenty four years old. According to
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: the Reddit survey we mentioned, forty percent of the respondents
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: were in the age range of twenty five to thirty four,
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: and not surprisingly, it is those with more disposable incomes
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: that make up a large part of the growing industries.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: Conventions like k Con, which according to their site, is
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: quote the world's largest fan celebration of Korean culture and music.
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: We launched our flagship Los Angeles event in twenty twelve,
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: expanded to New York and twenty five fifteen, and have
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: since created events in Japan, Thailand, Mexico, Australia, UAE, Saudi
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: Arabia and more welcoming one point for eight million fans
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: spanning thirty three events in twelve regions, and it had
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: around nine hundred thousand attendees last year and has brought
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: more in person experiences and experiences in general for all
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: of these fans, with the average age of the attendee
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: being in their mid twenties. And it possibly is because
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: of the locations that we just listed, but the attendees
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: are predominantly not Korean, and though the age range does
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: keep it at a more younger adult side, the fans
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: over thirty are committed and at the aforementioned convention there
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: was even a panel titled the Secret Lives of K
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: pop Fans over thirty. Fan groups who often labeled themselves
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: as ajumas sort of translated as missus ma'am or anti
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: are their own form of anties. One group from the
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: Philippines called themselves the Titas of BTS and as bands
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: like BTS who are still a favorite around the world age,
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: the fans age with them right.
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: Of course. The origins of K pop is based in
• 31:21
  Speaker 3: South Korea in the times of no Internet and going analog,
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: the fans relationship was different. According to one report, at
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: the start of the generation of k pop idols, fans
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: even had access to home addresses and locations, and everybody
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: thought this was normal. It was during this generation that
• 31:39
  Speaker 3: color representation for each group became a thing like, you know,
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: I think army bts are purple. So they that began
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: in the first generation also chanting names of their favorite idols,
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: and deep seated rivalries between fandoms formed. And during this time,
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: idols who are not liked were not only bullied, but
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: sent death threats and sometimes unpleasant gifts like dead mice, razors,
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: blood and a good deal of that was often sent
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: to women who may have been rumored to date another
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: male idol, and not surprisingly, this was most isolated to
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: the Korean community because it was typically local during the
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: first generation and those who could be considered say songs
• 32:21
  Speaker 3: and anti fans have been around for a while as well.
• 32:23
  Speaker 3: Their presence have put idols and fans on edge. Stories
• 32:28
  Speaker 3: have come out about the intensity of the love or
• 32:30
  Speaker 3: hate of both fans and anti fans. Idols have been stalked, threatened,
• 32:34
  Speaker 3: and even physically harmed different stories like one idol being
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: poisoned with super glue in his drink, causing him to
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: be hospitalized while at a show performing, and then there's
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: a more recent one of a BTS member being sent
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: food delivered food because they found his address and him
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: being threatened on social media to the point that other
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: members docks the person who threatened him. Interestingly enough, and
• 32:58
  Speaker 3: reasons may vary, such as the dating rumors we talked about,
• 33:01
  Speaker 3: as well as just being in a group that they
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: may feel as a rivalry to their favorite groups, Saysungs
• 33:06
  Speaker 3: who love their idols a bit too much have also
• 33:08
  Speaker 3: made many of them nervous and even threatened. Incidents of
• 33:12
  Speaker 3: stalking to the point of causing a car chase slash
• 33:15
  Speaker 3: car wrecks, to ripping off of clothes to fans sending
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: messages in menstrual blood have been brought up to point
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: out the level of toxicity that the fandoms can have.
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: Here's a quote from a raptler dot com article talking
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: about the ugly side of fantom ash Shells and Katie,
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: the host of Spill Thesoji Podcast, have been fans of
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: kpop groups since two thousand and six. Throughout there more
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: than a decade of following idol groups, they've witnessed several
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: instances of celebrities being put into harmful situations because of
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: their fans. The list includes calling the idol's personal phone numbers,
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: hacking their social media accounts, stalking their idols, group overcrowding
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: at airports, and in more extreme instances, can't be outside
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: their idols' dorms or houses, installing secret cameras, placing recording
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: our tracking devices at hotels or in cars, sending disturbing
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: gifts or fan letters. A female fan reportedly sent a
• 34:11
  Speaker 1: love note written in mentrual blood to Ok Taysion, a
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: member of K pop group two PM, and even attempting
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: to kidnap them. SNSD's Kim Tejan was dragged away in
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: the middle of a performance by an obsessed fan, although
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: it should be noted here that there are more fans
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: who often stand to protect their idols. Here's another quote
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: from that Rappler article, and it's about how the fans
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: will go to that for their faves. Generally, fans would
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: strongly voice out their opinions and call out whoever needs
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: to be called out across several social media platforms. Ash
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: said they would also mass email the company for investigation
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: or legal action against the perpetrators. Usually there is a
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: unity against unhealthy behavior, but there are instances when the
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: opinion is divided because of differences in perspectives. As active
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: a community as celebrity fandoms, issues tend to circulate fast,
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: with every fan chiming in with their opinion. But when
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: it comes to keeping their idols safe, Rees said that
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: the majorities still know when to put their foot down.
• 35:13
  Speaker 3: But it isn't just that the fan bases try to
• 35:15
  Speaker 3: protect their favorite fans, but they also will do what
• 35:18
  Speaker 3: is needed to protect society as a whole. Instances of
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: fandoms like the BTS Army, overtaking racists and sexist hashtags
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: dominated during heated times, such as the movement for the
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: Black Lives Matter and shutting down of websites that are
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: seen as oppressive, or even registering for hundreds of thousands
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: of tickets to Trump rallies so it would be empty.
• 35:37
  Speaker 3: So here's a quote from the Washington Post article about
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: the power of K pop fans in American politics, and
• 35:43
  Speaker 3: so K pop fans have emerged as empowered, socially conscious
• 35:47
  Speaker 3: globally minded LGBDQ friendly and attentive to issues of racism
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: and discrimination. Because in their multi ethnic countries such as
• 35:55
  Speaker 3: the United States, fans are often ethnic minorities themselves. Social
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: media has exis eleted existing fan dynamics and made them global.
• 36:03
  Speaker 3: Twitter has given fans around the world a chance to
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: observe effective online campaign tactics, all of which can be
• 36:09
  Speaker 3: applied to causes beyond K pop. Now digital narratives congregate
• 36:13
  Speaker 3: on Twitter, TikTok, and Twitch, expanding the arena of K
• 36:16
  Speaker 3: pop fandom. As the Black Lives Matter movement generated massive
• 36:20
  Speaker 3: attention after the death of George Floyd in Minneapolis police custody.
• 36:24
  Speaker 3: K pop fans on Twitter, acting on their own but
• 36:27
  Speaker 3: inspired by the advice groups such as BTS to speak
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: their own truth, began changing their screen names to reflect
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: their support of BLM. Shared appeals to donate to Beilfunds
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: or show up for March's appeared back to back with
• 36:40
  Speaker 3: links to K pop media and photos evincing thirst's desire
• 36:44
  Speaker 3: for the attractive young stars. Now that these fans have
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: flexed and the world has seen their power, the real
• 36:50
  Speaker 3: question is what campaign and goals will they choose next.
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: But uh, that brings us to the conversation of how
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: different fan groups are treated so total transparency, we know
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: that racism within K pop culture is very present. Though
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: there is a sizable number of fans from the black community,
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: the level of treatment for these fans, whether it's from
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: the other fan members or even from the idols themselves,
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: are not equal. Stories of mistreatment and abused by black
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: K pop fans are common. In fact, there are stories
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: coming out about black fans being docked within the fandoms.
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: A Refinery twenty nine article called when Black K pop
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: fans are Terrorized Online? Who Listens describes different instances about
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: looking into this about when fans have been harassed, threatened,
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: and doxed. They write, K pop has long reference to
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: black music, fashion, language, and beauty when done with innovation
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: and talent. This quality has won many groups black fans.
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: But while the majority of K pop musicians and fans
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: do it respectfully, some prefer to strip black people from
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: black culture. This disrespectful appropriation has contributed to an unjust
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: sense of ownership. Anyone who disagrees is overly sensitive and
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: thus is a fair target for abuse. Among stand communities,
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: there is an appropriation to abuse pipeline. According to May Santiago,
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: a PhD candidate and cultural studies who notes that racist language,
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: online harassment, and cyberbowling is all perceived to be an
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: extension of how devoted a stand is to the object
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: of their fascination. Their chosen media figure is God and
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: they're the disciples. If anyone dares question the integrity of
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: such iconography, all bets are off. She said. This is
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: particularly hateful when a critical user is black or brown.
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: Under this warped logic, any criticism comes from a malevolent place.
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: So even though black fans have been instrumental in helping
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: their idols learn and evolve when it comes to cultural appropriation,
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: some stands consider these learning moments to be insulting, an
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: offense worthy of punishment.
• 38:57
  Speaker 3: A and that article continues, says in a study conducted
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: by The Fighting Stripes in twenty twenty, a site founded
• 39:03
  Speaker 3: in twenty twelve to give Korean Americans a platform to
• 39:06
  Speaker 3: talk about what they love, ninety three point six percent
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: of the participants reported feeling as though black capepop fans
• 39:11
  Speaker 3: tend to receive more backlash for calling out instances of
• 39:15
  Speaker 3: cultural appropriation within kpop and were more likely to be
• 39:18
  Speaker 3: threatened with doxing. That's consistent with the rest of the Internet,
• 39:22
  Speaker 3: where black women are disproportionately vulnerable to online harassment, which
• 39:26
  Speaker 3: we've talked about at length, including with Bridget and it's
• 39:29
  Speaker 3: not gotten much better. Many black capop fans are seeking
• 39:32
  Speaker 3: safe spaces for themselves as many continue to deal with
• 39:35
  Speaker 3: these types of harassment. In another article from Girls United
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: dot Essence dot com, they write, there is no denying
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: that non black fandom spaces can be racist at times,
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: with black fans having called out digital racial violence over
• 39:49
  Speaker 3: the years. In July twenty twenty one, black fans of
• 39:52
  Speaker 3: Inhipen were attacked on social media for saying that the
• 39:55
  Speaker 3: member he sung allegedly mouthed the N word while listening
• 39:59
  Speaker 3: to Sizza's Love Glory. The majority of the abuse that
• 40:02
  Speaker 3: took place on Weavers, an app where fans can connect
• 40:05
  Speaker 3: with their favorite kap pop artists like Engenes, experienced so
• 40:08
  Speaker 3: much stress and racist abuse that a protective account, the
• 40:12
  Speaker 3: Black Engine Protection Team, was formed to monitor and report
• 40:15
  Speaker 3: any anti blackness, and there have been allegations of idols
• 40:19
  Speaker 3: being racist as well. One idol was accused of purposely
• 40:24
  Speaker 3: ignoring his black fans, while others have been caught using
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: derogatory terms as we kind of mentioned above, although some
• 40:31
  Speaker 3: try to excuse it as ignorance. I do have opinions
• 40:34
  Speaker 3: about this, but let's be honest here, a chunk of
• 40:39
  Speaker 3: the idols have been either born or raised outside of
• 40:42
  Speaker 3: South Korea. If not, their producers, managers and execs should
• 40:47
  Speaker 3: be able to educate them before they go internationally. I
• 40:50
  Speaker 3: do have a lot of that. We do know that
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: there are two specific terms for I and me and
• 40:56
  Speaker 3: you that sound close to that word as well, So
• 40:58
  Speaker 3: there's a little bit like backlashes if you if you're
• 41:00
  Speaker 3: ignorant of those words. So there's a lot to be
• 41:03
  Speaker 3: said about this controversy. And yes, I do remember the
• 41:06
  Speaker 3: mouthing the rap not realizing what they are saying, but
• 41:11
  Speaker 3: again that's just an excuse and that needs to be
• 41:13
  Speaker 3: corrected point blank. And oftentimes it seems that there is
• 41:18
  Speaker 3: very little repercussions for racist incidents. In fact, it seems
• 41:22
  Speaker 3: dating and partying is seen as more of a problem
• 41:25
  Speaker 3: by industry standards than being racist.
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: And this also leads to the problematic use of black culture.
• 41:33
  Speaker 1: Just recently, one girl group has been heavily criticized for
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: their usage of black hair styles such as box braids
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: and almost caricture level outfits that are reminiscent of nineties
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: hip hop, even warranting a slapping face emoji from hip
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: hop star Anderson Pack, which once again has brought up
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: the topic of the constant cultural appropriation from key pop
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: groups and idols.
• 41:57
  Speaker 3: So there are many articles seeing the repeated question why
• 42:02
  Speaker 3: do they continue to use black culture and styles but
• 42:05
  Speaker 3: continue to not give credit or respect to the black community. Also,
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: I would ask who was allowing this again and not
• 42:12
  Speaker 3: vetting these things as twenty twenty three, If you're aware
• 42:15
  Speaker 3: enough to put Black Lives Matter posts out, but aren't
• 42:18
  Speaker 3: not aware enough that taking credit or trying to make
• 42:20
  Speaker 3: money off of culture without understanding it, I mean, what
• 42:23
  Speaker 3: are you doing?
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: Accusations from black producers, writers, choreographers and so many others
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: of not being compensated or not even being credited has
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: been rampant in the industry. In a Guardian article, they
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: write about a specific incident. SM Entertainment is one of
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: South Korea's three largest entertainment companies. It is credited with
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: producing the first K pop idol group Hot in nineteen
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: ninety six, which establishes the SM performance style that the
• 42:52
  Speaker 1: brand still employs today, a combination of impressive visuals, dance, rock, rap,
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: and hip hop that took inspiration from Black America. An
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: artist of the MTV generation, songwriter and producer Micah Powell
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: attended six SM songwriting camps between twenty fifteen and twenty eighteen.
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: At one camp, he wrote a song called Devil and
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: created the dance move to go with it, which he
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: then showed to SM executives. The entire staff lit up,
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: Powell says of their reaction. Devil became the lead single
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: of SM group Super Junior's twenty fifteen album of the
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: same name. When Powell watched the music video for Devil
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: for the first time, he was shocked to see that
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: his dance move, a hip tap and high clap combination,
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: have been used as part of the song's chorus without
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: his permission, without credit or compensation. Powell's background vocals on
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: the track had also been used without payment or credit right.
• 43:44
  Speaker 3: And they did the bare minimum and after a lot
• 43:47
  Speaker 3: of backlash again, we talked about the top three. This
• 43:51
  Speaker 3: is one of them, their billion dollar company. So the
• 43:55
  Speaker 3: constant usage of black community's content has brought division in
• 43:59
  Speaker 3: K pop fandom, making the black K pop fans feel
• 44:02
  Speaker 3: more isolated. Stans who excuse artists by using the term
• 44:06
  Speaker 3: appreciation instead of appropriation allows room for continued ignorance within
• 44:10
  Speaker 3: the industry. There are fans who have taken action, including
• 44:13
  Speaker 3: using blackout tactics and calling for boycotts among some groups
• 44:18
  Speaker 3: who continuously abuse the appreciation slash appropriation, but has also
• 44:22
  Speaker 3: led to the harassment of those fans as we mentioned earlier,
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: and there have been groups who have taken steps to
• 44:28
  Speaker 3: correct these actions. Groups like BTS, who have been outright
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: in their usage of black culture and their music, has
• 44:35
  Speaker 3: taken steps to undo some of their past mistakes, as
• 44:38
  Speaker 3: well as groups like p One Harmony who have openly
• 44:40
  Speaker 3: acknowledged the role of AAVE in their music. In the
• 44:44
  Speaker 3: interview in the US, leader Kiho addresses the issue openly,
• 44:48
  Speaker 3: saying quote, I believe it is a responsibility, and I
• 44:50
  Speaker 3: also feel like if you're going to have that big
• 44:52
  Speaker 3: of a platform, you need to be able to respect
• 44:54
  Speaker 3: and appreciate all cultures without appropriating them. He continues. Whenever
• 44:59
  Speaker 3: it comes to our or music or whatever, it's always
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: a sensitive topic. That we always have to think once,
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: three times, four times about in every step of the
• 45:07
  Speaker 3: way visually or musically or the language itself said Ko,
• 45:11
  Speaker 3: while other ONEH members not in agreement. Obviously, there's a
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: aave and a whole bunch of other cultural stuff that
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: is very sensitive and so we need to respect that.
• 45:21
  Speaker 3: And I feel like it's a responsibility too. So I
• 45:23
  Speaker 3: feel like it's something that we are always thinking about
• 45:25
  Speaker 3: and taking action about. And hopefully more groups, more and
• 45:30
  Speaker 3: more groups will start putting in an effort in learning
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: the difference of appropriation and appreciation. But again, currently we're
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: not seeing in it across the board.
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and while we look at the not so good
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: side of kpop, we have to talk about other controversies
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: within the industry, including the many scandals that have affected
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: groups and have some people even saying to boycott the
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: industry altogether. So we've talked about the unrealistic beauty standards
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: we often see in South Korea, whether it's weight, skin color,
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: are just overall appearance, and for the K pop stars
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: it's even worse. Stories of trainees being told to only
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: eat rice or their diets being so restrictive that other
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: members sneak food in for them. It's a big concern.
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: Many of the fan sites not only give details like
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: birth dates and signs, but they will give height and
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: weight for many of them. And though everybody is different,
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: it is disheartening to see a young woman who may
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: be five foot seven weighing ninety five pounds and being
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: called chubby are not meeting the standard of the music industry.
• 46:43
  Speaker 1: In a research paper about the effects of K pop
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: idols on Korean beauty standards, they say this about the
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: dieting culture. Another way K beauty standards can be harmful
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: is they can lead to extreme dieting, which leads to
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: other outcomes like poor health, depression, and eating disorders. Since
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: the slim is a part of the standard, idols may
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: be forced to a diet that causes them to lose
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: an unhealthy amount of weight in a short period of time,
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: which is usually before a new song or album is released.
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: In an Insider interview with the K pop group Great Guys,
• 47:15
  Speaker 1: member Ho Rung says that they quote don't have much
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: time for eating and aren't free to eat what they want.
• 47:22
  Speaker 3: And with this type of damaging influence, it has made
• 47:25
  Speaker 3: an impact in Korean culture. Here's a quote from another
• 47:28
  Speaker 3: article written for the waveclinic dot com. For several years,
• 47:32
  Speaker 3: media outlets have reported that many young artists have left
• 47:35
  Speaker 3: behind the kpop world in order to focus on eating
• 47:38
  Speaker 3: disorder treatment. Jenny of the popular eight member a girl
• 47:41
  Speaker 3: band Oh My Girl have bravely discussed her year long
• 47:44
  Speaker 3: treatment for an eating disorder and they continue. The extreme
• 47:47
  Speaker 3: diet and beauty ideals that have some cultural underpinings are
• 47:51
  Speaker 3: without a doubt harmful to both the K pop stars
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: and also to the tween and teen girls who eagerly
• 47:56
  Speaker 3: follow them. Restricting and extreme dieting, cosmetic surgery, and an
• 48:00
  Speaker 3: obsession with the perfect look have been synonymous with the
• 48:03
  Speaker 3: South Korean music industry. Here are some disturbing statistics from
• 48:09
  Speaker 3: South Korea. According to the Korea Jungan Daily, the number
• 48:14
  Speaker 3: of teens suffering from eating disorders in recent years has
• 48:17
  Speaker 3: shot up significantly. According to the Health Insurance Review and
• 48:20
  Speaker 3: Assessment Service earlier this month, the number of patients that
• 48:23
  Speaker 3: have visited a hospital due to anorexia and nervosa increased
• 48:26
  Speaker 3: by thirty percent over five years, from six hundred and
• 48:30
  Speaker 3: sixty one people in twenty seventeen to twenty two hundred
• 48:33
  Speaker 3: and one people in twenty twenty one. In twenty twenty one,
• 48:36
  Speaker 3: six hundred and forty eight or seventy five percent were women,
• 48:40
  Speaker 3: with teenagers taking up the majority with twenty five percent
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: or four hundred and eighteen For the past five years,
• 48:47
  Speaker 3: excluding seniors in their seventies and above, female teenagers or
• 48:52
  Speaker 3: the largest group that were treated for anorexia and their
• 48:55
  Speaker 3: story starts with a young girl wanting to be like
• 48:59
  Speaker 3: an idol, so she starts herself to achieve the same look.
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: And of course, it is important to acknowledge that the
• 49:06
  Speaker 3: overall beauty standards, not only in South Korea, but in
• 49:09
  Speaker 3: countries like the US as well, have just as much
• 49:12
  Speaker 3: influence on the kpops or culture as does K pop
• 49:16
  Speaker 3: culture does on the overall beauty standards, so it's vice versa.
• 49:19
  Speaker 3: It affects both of us, both of them and the fans.
• 49:23
  Speaker 3: When fans are anti, fans feel like they're able to
• 49:25
  Speaker 3: comment on what they deem as attractive or unattractive and
• 49:28
  Speaker 3: use this as a way to harass and bully and idol.
• 49:31
  Speaker 3: They reinforce the almost impossible standard as if it should
• 49:34
  Speaker 3: be the norm.
• 49:35
  Speaker 1: And these types of bullying have been lethal. Different stars
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: and idols have died by suicide after being relentlessly harassed
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: and bullied, as well as being depressed and unhappy due
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: to their careers, and unfortunately, the level of standards that
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: often push idols too far is correlated with the unreal expectations.
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: In another article specifically talking about mental health and kpop
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: from mindlessmag dot com, they write Sully from passes away
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: at age twenty five. She had been suffering from panic
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: disorder and social phobia, so it speculated that it was
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: through suicide, mainly because she was one idol who was
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: going against the norm, which led to cyber bullying. She
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: was one to openly discuss mental health, dating bands, social
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: issues and such. To add to that, apparently her attire
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: was not appropriate and this all built up over the
• 50:23
  Speaker 1: years and she could not take it anymore. It is
• 50:26
  Speaker 1: said that South Korea holds the highest rate in suicide,
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: whether attempted or not, and this mainly occurs due to
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: the overly high and even unachievable standards the environment that
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: the Koreans live in. Government figures show that suicide is
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: amongst the top cause of death for those under forty
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: in age range where life demands a lot for those
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: living there right.
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: The k pop and Korean celebrity industry have had to
• 50:50
  Speaker 3: acknowledge the level of need to address the issues that
• 50:52
  Speaker 3: have been stigmatized for so long. In the SEMP dot
• 50:55
  Speaker 3: Com report, they write the Korea Creative Content Agency, which
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: supports pop culture artists, have reported that the number receiving
• 51:02
  Speaker 3: counseling rose from one hundred and forty six in twenty
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: twenty to six hundred and sixty one in twenty twenty two.
• 51:09
  Speaker 3: That figure relates just to those who admitted to having counseling. Libungchul,
• 51:14
  Speaker 3: director of medical insurance policy at the Korean Neuropsychiatric Association,
• 51:19
  Speaker 3: said pop idols were often isolated from support networks. They
• 51:23
  Speaker 3: are completely lonely. It's impossible for them to go to
• 51:26
  Speaker 3: communicate and get some consolation. Lee said. It is a
• 51:29
  Speaker 3: very dangerous situation, and with South Korea having the highest
• 51:33
  Speaker 3: statistics when it comes to suicide, the government has realized
• 51:37
  Speaker 3: that they needed to step in. Here's another quote from
• 51:40
  Speaker 3: the same SEMP article, which was written in twenty twenty three. Recently,
• 51:43
  Speaker 3: South Korea's Ministry of Health and Welfare announced a plan
• 51:47
  Speaker 3: last month aimed at reducing the suicide rate by thirty
• 51:49
  Speaker 3: percent by twenty twenty seven. The five year plan includes
• 51:53
  Speaker 3: more frequent mental health examinations, better counseling services for victims
• 51:57
  Speaker 3: of crime, and improved care for those who've attended suicide.
• 52:01
  Speaker 3: There are no details released on how much money will
• 52:03
  Speaker 3: be allocated. The Korean Suicide Prevention Center, funded and run
• 52:07
  Speaker 3: by the government, will also provide counseling and treatment support
• 52:10
  Speaker 3: for vulnerable individuals, and the government will fund medical expenses
• 52:14
  Speaker 3: starting this year. South Korean Prime Minister Hendokshu said during
• 52:19
  Speaker 3: a conference on suicide prevention in April. In twenty twenty
• 52:22
  Speaker 3: one alone, there were about thirteen thousand people who took
• 52:25
  Speaker 3: their own lives. It's really unfortunate. It is the nation's
• 52:27
  Speaker 3: first responsibility to prodict lives, and.
• 52:30
  Speaker 1: Much like society everywhere, Korea's attitude toward mental health is
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: typically not one talked about. Oftentimes, it's treated as if
• 52:37
  Speaker 1: it is an inconvenience or a fleeting stage. It is
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: very quickly dismissed and typically ignored until it's too late. However, recently,
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: more and more idols have opened up and talked about
• 52:48
  Speaker 1: their own mental health diagnosis and the importance of seeking help.
• 52:52
  Speaker 1: Groups like BTS and GOT seven have been openly talking
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: about their own struggles and trying to change the attitude
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: about mental health in society. A teen Vogue article talking
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: about K pop influence in mental health conversation rights. In
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: Asian communities, there's still a stigma about treating mental health issues.
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: Being depressed isn't seen as a real problem, and some
• 53:13
  Speaker 1: Asians are very wary of being perceived negatively if they
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: do seek outside help. But the article goes on K
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: pop stars efforts to raise mental health awareness and the
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: empathy from global fans allows us to recognize that some
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: issues such as cyberspace bullying, problematic ideals of masculinity and
• 53:30
  Speaker 1: femininity misogyny are cross cultural, extending beyond national boundaries. This
• 53:35
  Speaker 1: is Juwon Park, a cultural anthropologist. The empathy and encouragement
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: from fans as a result could be a source of rejuvenation, passion,
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: and energy. Music companies have also realized that mental health
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: is a global issue that having their idols speak about
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: mental health is not a minus to the business. The
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: transparency could create more engagement from the fan base.
• 53:56
  Speaker 3: And there are other controversies outside of the mental health,
• 54:00
  Speaker 3: including sexual harassment within the industries. Stories from different groups
• 54:04
  Speaker 3: and trainees of being abused and harassed by their own
• 54:06
  Speaker 3: CEOs and managers, and idols who've been caught filming and
• 54:10
  Speaker 3: abusing fans or other members. One big scandal, the Burning
• 54:14
  Speaker 3: Sun scandal, involving several celebrities and idols, were just recently
• 54:17
  Speaker 3: sentenced and caused a wave of backlash for the industry
• 54:20
  Speaker 3: as a whole. Those involved were accused of rape, drug charges,
• 54:24
  Speaker 3: illegally filming, and embezzlement. So much fallout occurred, including raids
• 54:29
  Speaker 3: that would lead to over five hundred arrests, so it
• 54:31
  Speaker 3: was a huge deal in Controversy over the overworking and
• 54:36
  Speaker 3: underpayment of idols have been recurring as well. Past incidents
• 54:40
  Speaker 3: of idols being underpaid or not even paid at all
• 54:43
  Speaker 3: have many questioning the ethicalness of the industry. Recently, Black
• 54:47
  Speaker 3: Ping's Jenny was seen performing with an IV after having
• 54:51
  Speaker 3: to sit out of a couple of performances due to
• 54:53
  Speaker 3: COVID and at the same time, at the same event,
• 54:57
  Speaker 3: she had to be rushed off the stage because she
• 54:59
  Speaker 3: was not doing well. The group has been touring NonStop
• 55:02
  Speaker 3: across the world and many wonder at what cost newer
• 55:07
  Speaker 3: groups like New Gene, who have just started has brought
• 55:11
  Speaker 3: to light the same conversation about how young is too
• 55:14
  Speaker 3: young for someone to be an idol, and with acts
• 55:17
  Speaker 3: like New Gene and past controversy of another young idol,
• 55:21
  Speaker 3: the Korean government has finally passed a policy in hopes
• 55:24
  Speaker 3: to address it. From an Insider article, it says, on Thursday,
• 55:28
  Speaker 3: a bill to protect the underage K pop idols from
• 55:31
  Speaker 3: exploitation was passed in South Korea. The Culture, Sports and
• 55:34
  Speaker 3: Tourism Committee of the National Assembly passed the Popular Culture
• 55:38
  Speaker 3: and Arts Industry Development Act during uplinary session. Per South
• 55:42
  Speaker 3: Korean outlet Yon Hop. Also known as a lesung E
• 55:45
  Speaker 3: Crisis Prevention Act, the newly passed law aims to prevent
• 55:48
  Speaker 3: celebrities from suffering damages resulting from exploitative contracts by reinforcing
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: financial transparency. The act is named after singer Lee, who
• 55:57
  Speaker 3: was under a quote slave contract where he was never
• 56:01
  Speaker 3: paid for his music for over eighteen years of his career.
• 56:04
  Speaker 3: Per K pop news outlet Korea Boo, the amendment also
• 56:07
  Speaker 3: reinforced requirements aimed at protecting the rights and interest of
• 56:11
  Speaker 3: underage workers in the Korean entertainment industry by lowering the
• 56:15
  Speaker 3: number of working hours again per Jon Hopps, citing the committee.
• 56:19
  Speaker 1: And a little more to explain what the amendment is quote.
• 56:23
  Speaker 1: Under the new amendment, entertainers under the age of twelve
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: are allowed up to twenty five hours a week up
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: to six hours a day. Those aged twelve to fifteen
• 56:31
  Speaker 1: are allowed thirty hours a week, while those above the
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: age of fifteen can work thirty five hours a week.
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: Both age groups are limited to seven hours a day.
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: In addition, the act prohibits any infringement of underage entertainer's
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: rights to education by forcing them to be absent from
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: or drop out of school per Yon Help. The South
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: Korean amendment also forbids any acts that may threaten the
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: health and safety of minors, which includes imposing an over
• 56:57
  Speaker 1: emphasis on physical appearance upon the children. Assaults, abusive language,
• 57:02
  Speaker 1: and sexual harassment are among the other prohibitions listed in
• 57:05
  Speaker 1: the act. Pop culture and arts businesses are now mandated
• 57:09
  Speaker 1: to designate a person in charge of youth protection who
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: will help to guarantee the human rights of young entertainers
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: or Yon Happ quote. This amendment will abolish the industry's
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: absurd practices behind the development of k content and provide
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: an environment where children and youth of pop culture artists
• 57:27
  Speaker 1: can pursue their dreams while protecting their human rights, said
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: Park Bogyin, the country's Minister of Culture, Sports and Tourism
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: per South Korea outlet mail business. But as the article
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: states later, many production companies find ways to bypass these laws,
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: so it will be interesting to see how this affects
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: touring as well.
• 57:47
  Speaker 3: Right, and that does bug the question who was profiting
• 57:52
  Speaker 3: off all this hard work. Unsurprisingly, the industry has made
• 57:55
  Speaker 3: a lot of money, over five billion dollars to be specific,
• 57:59
  Speaker 3: and that's probably underestimated. The big three, YGJYP and SM
• 58:04
  Speaker 3: have made a hefty profit, and controversial things like dynamic
• 58:07
  Speaker 3: pricing has only increased the amount. These kpop entertainment companies
• 58:12
  Speaker 3: take ninety percent of the profit at the top, and
• 58:14
  Speaker 3: the K pop artists split the rest of the ten percent.
• 58:17
  Speaker 3: So if there's like seven members and you have what
• 58:20
  Speaker 3: maybe a million dollars, but then you get one million
• 58:23
  Speaker 3: dollars today, you know, like that's how or one hundred
• 58:25
  Speaker 3: thousand dollars and then you split it seven ways not
• 58:29
  Speaker 3: a lot to be honest, but some groups like bts
• 58:33
  Speaker 3: have better deals, so they were able to get stock
• 58:35
  Speaker 3: shares from their label, which was a smaller label at
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: the time, but they've now made a lot of money,
• 58:40
  Speaker 3: which is now known as hibe or big hit earlier.
• 58:42
  Speaker 3: But typically K pop stars are not that lucky, and
• 58:45
  Speaker 3: it's estimated that only five percent of the groups actually
• 58:48
  Speaker 3: go get beyond just idle status. Anyways, to that superstar era.
• 58:53
  Speaker 3: And by the way, for the trainees, they technically don't
• 58:57
  Speaker 3: get paid. Instead, they they're room and and all of
• 59:00
  Speaker 3: that stuff is covered, so they calculate and say they
• 59:03
  Speaker 3: get fifty thousand dollars worth of things I guess education worth.
• 59:08
  Speaker 3: But all obausly we heard earlier that they had to
• 59:10
  Speaker 3: pay for their own plastic surgery and such. So with
• 59:15
  Speaker 3: all that, what does the feature of K pop look like?
• 59:17
  Speaker 3: There are many who speculate that K pop may be
• 59:20
  Speaker 3: plateauing at this point. Perhaps it's the oversaturation of K
• 59:24
  Speaker 3: pop groups or the controversies that have come with the industry,
• 59:27
  Speaker 3: or even the loss of bts, which many filth is
• 59:30
  Speaker 3: actually the reason. And I know there aren't disbanding. They're
• 59:33
  Speaker 3: on hiatus, they're still in contract and they'll be back
• 59:36
  Speaker 3: after the military services, and there are a lot of
• 59:38
  Speaker 3: individual projects that By the way, if you've not listened
• 59:41
  Speaker 3: to August D Yungi, you should because it's really good
• 59:44
  Speaker 3: and RM it's really good. He does some things with
• 59:46
  Speaker 3: Anderson Pok and Erica Badu. You should go listen to it.
• 59:50
  Speaker 3: According to experts, there have been a slowdown in the market,
• 59:54
  Speaker 3: and one expert told NPR that BTS may have set
• 59:57
  Speaker 3: the bar too high. Here's a quote. The biggest influence
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 3: of BTS is that they increased K pop's dependency on
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 3: the oversea market and made it truly a part of
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 3: the global popular music market, says the Hutah, an associate
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 3: professor of George Mason University, Korea, who has studied the
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 3: globalization of K pop. And they transformed the entire K
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 3: pop industry in their wake. We raised our bar so high,
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 3: says music critic Kim Dehion about expectations for K pop
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 3: artists from both the industry and fans. An increasing number
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 3: of K pop groups are going on billbar charts and
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 3: holding large scale concerts overseas at a faster pace than BTS,
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 3: but their achievements no longer received the kind of nationwide
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 3: attention and celebration that BTS did in a sign that
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 3: success in the global market is now almost anticipated of
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 3: K pop idols. Yeah, but some of the experts say
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 3: this could just be a transition where K pop is
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 3: no longer a new thing, but again an industry that
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 3: will maintain and could never really disappear like they're going
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 3: to be here. So with different groups breaking records and
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 3: being first at many things BTS, Blackpink, Straight Kids and Twice,
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 3: it's doubtful it will go anywhere. But let's hope that
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 3: the transition we see within this industry is more inclusive
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 3: and better equipped to handle the care for not only
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 3: the idols but as fans.
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we'll see, we'll see.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 3: And now you're an expert, Annie.
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 1: Oh well, I don't know about that. We didn't even
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: we cut some stuff out, we did. It is more
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 1: for me to learn. Perhaps we'll revisit. And I would
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: love to hear from listeners. I have heard from some
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 1: of you about BTSH in the past. Oh yes, yes, yes, yes,
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: So please let us know if you have any thoughts
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 1: about this. You can email us at Stuffmedia Mom Stuff
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: at iHeartMedia dot com. You can find us on Twitter
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: at mosta podcast, or on Instagram and TikTok at stuff
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 1: I've Never Told You. We're also on YouTube. We also
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: have a tea public store and we have a book.
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 1: You can pre order it at stuff you Should Read
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: books dot com and on Audible I Hear. Thanks as
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: always to your super producer Christina, our executive producer Maya,
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 1: and our contributor Joey.
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 3: Thank you all, yes, and.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 1: Thanks to you for listening. Stefan Never Told You is
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts in my heart Radio,
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 1: you can check out the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: or where you listen to your favorite shows.