Latest / Queer Voices / APRIL 22nd - Houston Area LOVE Survey with Avery Belyeu & Tammi Wallace, Pride 365 with Kerry-Ann Morrison, and THE DESIGNATED MOURNER

Transcript

APRIL 22nd - Houston Area LOVE Survey with Avery Belyeu & Tammi Wallace, Pride 365 with Kerry-Ann Morrison, and THE DESIGNATED MOURNER · Queer Voices

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_03: This is KPFT 90.1 FM Houston, 89.5 FM Galveston, 91.9 FM Huntsville, and worldwide on the internet at KPFT.org.
• 0:23
  Brett: You're listening to Queer Voices, a radio show and a podcast that has been an outlet for the LGBTQIA Plus community since the 70s.
• 0:31
  Brett: I am Brett Cullum, and in this episode, I talk to Avery Belliew and Tammy Wallace about the Kinder Institute's survey of the queer community and what it hopes to achieve.
• 0:40
  Brett: Then Deborah Moncrief Bell talks with Carrie Ann Morrison, who is president of Pride 365, about this year's Pride Festivities.
• 0:48
  Brett: Finally, I discuss with Jason Nodler and Greg Dean why the Catastrophic Theater is reviving the designated mourner at the match.
• 0:57
  Brett: Queer Voices starts now.
• 1:02
  Brett: Hi, this is Brett Cullum, and today I am joined by Avery Bellieu and Tammy Wallace.
• 1:07
  Brett: You may know these women as the CEO of the Montrose Center and the co-founder, president, and CEO of the Greater Houston LGBTQ Chamber of Commerce.
• 1:16
  Brett: Now, I think you both are frequent flyers to queer voices, so uh welcome back.
• 1:20
  Brett: Thank you.
• 1:21
  Brett: Thank you.
• 1:22
  Brett: Glad to be here.
• 1:22
  Brett: Yeah, we're talking about a survey from the Kendra Institute at Rice University and the Montro Center, and it's called the Houston Area Love Survey, but they spell it out like L-O-V-E.
• 1:33
  Brett: Can you why don't you tell me a little bit more about it?
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: I'll kick it off here.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_01: And so the Love Survey, first of all, this is very uh, you know, historic in nature for our community.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: It's the first ever community-wide, region-wide survey for the LGBTQ community.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_01: Love stands for LGBTQ opinions, voices, and experiences.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: So that's that's our acronym.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_01: And the core partners, of course, the Montrose Center, the Chamber, and the Kinder Institute.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_01: And so we are really trying to capture data, information from our community about lived experiences so we can help drive outcomes, policies.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of reasons why we want to collect this information, but we're incredibly, incredibly proud to partner the Montrose Center and the Kinder Institute on this very, very comprehensive community transfer.
• 2:21
  Brett: Now, I actually took this.
• 2:22
  Brett: It's quick.
• 2:23
  Brett: It's it's not a very long one.
• 2:24
  Brett: And I kept wondering, what are they hoping to find out exactly?
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's a great question.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: So what you'll notice is that the questions are across several different domains, right?
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_00: We ask about education.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: We ask about experiences of discrimination in the workplace or in education settings.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: We ask about educational attainment, right?
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: We ask about health care.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_00: So we're asking questions across several different domains.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: And this was really intentional.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: The survey is structured around what in the kind of research world is called the social determinants of health, or, you know, there's a few different phrases now that are kind of floated around in these domains.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_00: But it really is designed to capture across these different domains what is it like to be an LGBTQ person living in the greater Houston area?
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: What is your quality of life like in these primary areas that are evaluated to understand quality of life and ability to lead a happy, successful, and happy life?
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so what we're really hoping to understand is to get a baseline from our community of where we currently are.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: And to Tammy's point, the reason why this is so important, you know, a couple, a couple things.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_00: We'll talk about, I'm sure, many reasons.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: But one is so very often our community does not respond to larger queries for data, or our community is not particularly singled out and asked for their identities when these larger surveys are done.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_00: And so the data that we do often have access to that that does look across all these domains, oftentimes our community is underrepresented.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: And so we therefore don't really have a good sense about our community.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: And this survey is designed to change that.
• 4:01
  Brett: Who's who's able to participate?
• 4:02
  Brett: What are the parameters of this?
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: Obviously, part of the LGBTQ community, 18 years of older or older, residing in the greater Houston area for purposes of the survey.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_01: We're defining that as Harris, Fort Ben, Montgomery, Galveston, Brazoria, Chambers of Liberty, or Waller County.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, again, self-identifies as a member of the LGBTQ community.
• 4:23
  Brett: Where do we go to take it?
• 4:24
  Brett: I mean, where where do we have the jumping off point to get an invite for it?
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_01: Good question.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_01: We actually, there's a longer URL with the Kinder Institute, but both the Montrose Center and the Chamber, we have this survey prominent on our websites so the community can easily access it.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: We're also promoting the survey on our social media channels and working with and going to be it growing this these partnerships to really push out the survey with a lot of community partners who are going to help us get the word out.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like us.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: There you go.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_01: And we appreciate that.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I Brad, I wanted to say, you know, to Avery's point, you know, this this data, this information is so important for a variety of reasons.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: But think about this.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_01: We have not had this kind of collection of data for our community ever in Houston or the region.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_01: Think about that.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_01: That we can't really, really explore our lived experiences and talk about that in the sense of having quantitative data about what our community is experiencing, what our needs are, what the gaps are.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_01: So this is not only just fill in your information, fill it out, give us, you know, give us, you know, answer these questions, but it's truly, truly about collecting data to help us drive and understand what the community and really different parts of the community, what we're experiencing right now, so we can help formulate policies.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: Imagine if we can go to elected officials and Avery and I and other community leaders can go and sit in front of our elected officials and say, look, this is what the data from our recent survey says.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_01: And here's what we know.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_01: And we need, because of this, we need to change policy A versus when we go in and we talk to them and say, hey, we, you know, the community has this gap and we need to change it.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_01: So much more powerful when we have the data to back up.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and if I could just build on that point, I think why this is more urgent now than ever is that in many ways, our community has been relying on the data collection that's happened through various government mechanisms.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: So there's a lot of different ways that the CDC and other large governmental institutions have across the last many years, because of internal advocacy, worked to include our community so that we would have large data sets that were national, that we could all refer to, that would talk about our community's experiences across a lot of these domains.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_00: What we've seen very intentionally in this administration is an attack on the inclusion of our data in that data collection.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_00: And not only an erasure of our identities from the data collection, but in fact, an erasure of the data that was collected, right?
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of that's been taken down from websites.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: So we don't have that data any longer.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_00: And so what that does mean is that the landscape has changed.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's going to depend upon us to gather this data at the local level to do so in ways that our community will trust that that data is being kept safe, that it's not going to be used to harm them, right?
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's going to be kept confidential.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_00: And so this kind of mechanism of data collection, I think, is more urgent now than ever.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: And to Tammy's point, both for creating policies and for advocating for policies, but also for funding, right?
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: Not just from governmental agencies and from our city and from our county, but also from our foundations, because we have this beautiful landscape of social service organizations here in Houston, you know, the largest of which I'm privileged to lead.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: And all of us have to advocate to our funders for why our community needs the resources that we need.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_00: That's really hard to do without good data.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think this is going to help all of our organizations that are on the ground trying to provide social services to make a better case, whether it's to the city, to the county government, or to our foundation funders or large individual funders of why our social service organizations need to fund the activities that we need to fund.
• 8:12
  Brett: Well, and it's tough, I think.
• 8:14
  Brett: We have this paranoia about big data in our community because there's this perception.
• 8:19
  Brett: And I know in the community where I heard people say, I don't even want to get my driver's license updated because they're going to change something.
• 8:26
  Brett: Or, you know, I don't want them to know that I identify this way because I don't want to be targeted.
• 8:31
  Brett: I don't want to be on some funky list somewhere, you know.
• 8:34
  Brett: So how is this data?
• 8:35
  Brett: It's not going obviously to any government institutions.
• 8:38
  Brett: It's it's definitely stay with the there are guardrails there, right?
• 8:41
  Brett: That's correct.
• 8:42
  Brett: Yeah, Tim, you want to speak to that?
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that so the data is, you know, the data is completely safe.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_01: Responses are completely, as Tinder says, de-identified.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_01: That's very standard for a lot of a lot of different surveys like this, which basically means these answers can't be traced back to the individual respondent.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: And the data is stored securely on drives at Rice University and protected really to the fullest extent of of the law.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_01: And certainly Kinder is never going to sell the data, which is another concern that that comes up.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: So this data is used exclusively for research purposes.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_01: So, and I think I can speak for Avi, but had we not felt confident with partnering with Kinder, we understand those challenges for the LGBTQ plus community, particularly for our trans community.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: We wouldn't be partnering with the institution, but they have been extraordinary partners, both in helping us get the community survey up, leading it, and putting tremendous, tremendous resources from the institute into this.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_00: I was just going to say, you know, to your point, I mean, obviously, you know, I am a trans woman.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_00: I face all those concerns that you mentioned, Brett, right?
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_00: Around all sorts of security and my own, my own safety.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, I think all those concerns are really valid and they're very real.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think, you know, I will say I have taken the survey myself.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_00: To Tammy's point, we would not have launched into this effort if we were not very confident that our community would be kept safe.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I will add, this was a very active part of early conversations with Kinder.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: And the reason why we felt particularly comfortable partnering with them, they are a private institution, which I think is important in this moment.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: And what was clear to both of us was they understood this concern.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: In fact, part of their eagerness to engage in this is because when they had done other surveys, they had struggled with our community because of this concern.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: And so part of why we're we've entered into this partnership is so that we can work directly with our community to communicate that we do understand those concerns and we've taken measures to address them.
• 10:42
  Brett: Yeah, and I think it's important to note that Rice is obviously a private university, not tied to any kind of government institutions or anything like that.
• 10:49
  Brett: It is a lot safer.
• 10:50
  Brett: And Rice has been such a big partner with our community over the years, especially with some of the initiatives against EI and the queer organizations and schools.
• 10:59
  Brett: You know, their queer resources are shared with all students.
• 11:02
  Brett: I mean, they just basically open it up to everybody.
• 11:05
  Brett: So a lot of a lot of collaboration with them.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_01: And Brad, I was going to say about Kender.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, think about in this political environment when so many organizations, companies, you know, are stepping back, some because, you know, they're just feeling feeling the pressure, or in some cases, they're just completely caving.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_01: Here's an institution like Kender not only stepping up, but like I mentioned, they are really investing some significant resources into making sure this survey is successful and put the full breadth of their team around the survey.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: And so we're just incredibly proud to partner with them.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_01: Of course, they're a leading university research institute in the country.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_01: But to their credit, seeing a gap, understanding that, as Avery mentioned, they had not been able to reach our community.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_01: And so when we talked to them about this, they were like, we're in.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: What can we do?
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_01: Let's make this happen.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_01: And that's something to be celebrated in a world right now where there's a there's a lot of challenges and a lot of difficult times.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_01: So hard to find those wins, but this is definitely one of them.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, I think for us, this is a way to transform our fear right now, right?
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: So I think to your point, Brett, I think that, you know, both Tammy and I are on the front lines of holding and hearing from our community exactly what this moment is meaning for so many of us.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: It is frightening for a lot of us, I think across our identity spectrums, not just the trans community.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, one of the tactics of this moment is to seek to erase our community, erase us from the public realm, erase the fact that we exist, erase our history, right?
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes we're we're fighting back and winning, like at Stonewall right now, which we should all celebrate that our flag is back, right?
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: However, key tactic is to erase our community.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: That erasure can only occur if we let it.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_00: And so this survey is a way of fighting back against that erasure, of saying, no, I'm going to be seen.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to be heard.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_00: My voice will be counted.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, I would say with folks who are maybe thinking about whether or not to take this survey, I would say this is a great action you can take to resist the effort to erase you, to make sure that your identity is understood, that your experiences are seen and collected by people that you trust so that we can fight on your behalf in this moment.
• 13:19
  Brett: Very well said.
• 13:20
  Brett: And I think the survey, as I said, I took it.
• 13:23
  Brett: It it doesn't ask a lot of like super personal questions or anything, except for some things maybe around discrimination or experiences that you've had with that.
• 13:31
  Brett: But those are important to capture.
• 13:33
  Brett: I mean, obviously in this day and time.
• 13:34
  Brett: And I I can't think of any one of us that couldn't give an example, unfortunately, in the recent history.
• 13:40
  Brett: So, and as we continue to live in this, whatever this era is, whatever we want to call it.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_01: But I I was gonna mention Brett too, to to Avery's point.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_01: Look, the the the survey takes uh two two to three minutes roughly for the screener, 15 to 20 minutes to fill it out.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_01: Look, grab a cup of coffee, whatever your your drink of choice, sit down, take the survey.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_01: And really, from that mindset that Avery mentioned, if you do it alone for the reason that we will not be erased, we will have a voice, sit down, spend the 20 minutes or so to just take the survey.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_01: We're really looking to get at least 5,000 responses to this survey by the end of June, which is when we are going to finish up the survey with the intention of rolling out the Kinder Institute, their analysis of the survey data in October, which of course, as we all know, celebrating LGBTQ History Month.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_01: So how perfect.
• 14:33
  Brett: Exactly.
• 14:34
  Brett: Now remind me again, where can I find this?
• 14:35
  Brett: It's on your websites, both of your websites, right?
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: Our website, Houston LGBTQchamber.com and Aver.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and the MontroseCenter.org.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_00: And then I would also say look at our social.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: To Tammy's point, one of the ways that we know we we are going to succeed, right?
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_00: And this was a theme for folks who came to the Greater Houston LGBTQ Plus Community Summit, right?
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: The way we go forward is together.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, like Bad Bunny had on that football at the end of a Super Bowl on the same day where we were all saying that together, right?
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: I think there was some synergy there.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: The way we go forward is together.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: And so we are in the coming weeks, we're gathering together a big group of community partners, our other LGBTQ organizations.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_00: So our hope is that across May and definitely especially across June, that all of our organizations that represent our community are going to be promoting this.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so you're going to see it hopefully on every social media website you go to for any one of your community organizations that you know and trust.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: So that that QR code, that URL will be kind of blasted across our entire community is our goal.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_00: But right now, if you're excited and interested, definitely our two websites are the place to go to.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_01: And if if any community partners, if they're interested, organizations, businesses, just reach out to us here at the Chamber of the Montrose Center, and we're glad to get them connected into these upcoming meetings.
• 15:55
  Brett: Well, any big things going on at the chamber coming up real quick that you want to kind of plug aside from just this survey?
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I have to say, we just announced our Pride and Business Award honorees, and we're incredibly, incredibly proud that the Montrose Center is our nonprofit member of the year.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: Congratulations, Avery.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_01: She and her team.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: They have been an inaugural member with us for the last 10 years.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_01: So we cannot wait to honor them at our Pride and Business celebration coming up on June 12th.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_01: Well, we have a thousand plus people in the room.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: And um we're also, it's a, it's a this is our milestone year at the chamber.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_01: We'll be celebrating 10 years.
• 16:31
  Brett: Crazy.
• 16:32
  Brett: 10 years.
• 16:33
  Brett: Avery, anything uh that I need to look out for at the Montrose Center?
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: So a couple things that are coming up that are special, and then just a couple things that continue to occur on a regular basis.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: So I'll start kind of some things that you can plug into on a regular basis.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_00: A few months ago, we launched two times a month where folks can plug into the center and it's a rolling set of different activities.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: There's Montrose Mondays and then wellness Wednesdays.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: And those happen once a month.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_00: There are opportunities to come to the center, to be in community.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: There is a different activity each time.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: So if you follow our social, you'll see what the activity is for that month.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: We've done things from floral arranging to learning how to write poetry with a poet.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it's more physical and activity related.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of different types of activities, but it's really just a moment to come to be together in community.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_00: Being together is so important right now.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: And if you're looking just for a place to be with other folks in our community across a diverse set of ages and experiences, the Montre Center is your home for that.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so, so look out on our social for those two events.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: They're really, really fun and great to come to.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_00: And then I would also name, um, not this Saturday, but the following Saturday, is our Empowering Our Future Gala.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_00: And we still have a couple seats left.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_00: And we would love for folks to join us.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: We have, I think, a couple tables left.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_00: If folks are interested in purchasing a table or individual tickets, this gala has come to be such a really fun moment that really is a time when we come together to talk about our youth services.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: The way that the Montreux Center has been supporting youth for almost 40 years, so our hatch program, which is such a unique and special program for this entire geographic area.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_00: Folks drive their kids from near and far to come to the center.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_00: And this is designed to tell you about that work, explain to you why it's so important, and to help us fund that work and continue to grow that work.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: So would love to have you join us.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's going to be at the ballroom by you place.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's always entertainment-packed, super fun, amazing, and energetic event.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_00: So would love to have you join us.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: You can see that on our social media and on our website, empowering our future here coming up in a few weekends.
• 18:35
  Brett: Yeah, and it's always a fun time.
• 18:37
  Brett: And I have to say, I did go to the Montrus Monday with the floral arrangements.
• 18:40
  Brett: My gosh, the arrangements that people made.
• 18:43
  Brett: I knew that our community was pretty creative, but I was like, I love it.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so glad you went and had a good time.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_01: We might have some buddy entrepreneurs there.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: There we go.
• 18:52
  Brett: Yeah.
• 18:52
  Brett: Almost all of them were.
• 18:53
  Brett: It was crazy.
• 18:54
  Brett: Well, thank you both.
• 18:55
  Brett: I mean, this survey is certainly something that I think will help both of your organizations just inform the higher powers of who we are, where we are, what we're facing, all of the different things.
• 19:08
  Brett: So it is really important to uh go out there and find that.
• 19:11
  Brett: The love survey, is that what we're calling it?
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: The love survey.
• 19:15
  Brett: The love survey.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_01: And Brett, thank you.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for highlighting the love survey today.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's conversations like this that are helping us increase visibility that the survey is available.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: And as we pilot this year, we're excited about the years ahead.
• 19:28
  Brett: Absolutely.
• 19:29
  Brett: So go on either the Chambers website or the Monter Center's website, check out the survey, check out the events coming up, and thank you both.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much, Brett.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 19:46
  Deborah: This is Deborah Moncrief Bell, and I'm talking with Carrie Ann Morrison.
• 19:52
  Deborah: Carrie Ann is the president of Pride Houston365.
• 19:57
  Deborah: And you're probably thinking, wait, it's just the middle of April.
• 20:01
  Deborah: What are we doing talking about pride?
• 20:04
  Deborah: Well, here's the thing.
• 20:06
  Deborah: Pride's going to be a little bit earlier this year.
• 20:09
  Deborah: Now, Carrie Ann, you want to go into a little bit of why that is and exactly when that is?
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_09: Most certainly.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_09: So pride is on June 6th this year, which is completely not what we're used to in Houston.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_09: We're used to the last weekend in June.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_09: However, because of FIFA, we had no choice.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_09: It was either no pride or take the only date that is available.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_09: And we did.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_09: So we took June 6th that was handed to us, and we're making it happen, and we're going to show up and show out and advocate.
• 20:42
  Deborah: Although now we're hearing that some countries may boycott the World Cup, so we may not be getting the influence of people for that that we thought we were, but we'll still be able to have pride.
• 20:54
  Deborah: And when you look at the calendar, you'll realize that's roughly six weeks away.
• 20:58
  Deborah: So it's not that far.
• 21:00
  Deborah: So we're here to talk about all things pride.
• 21:03
  Deborah: And let's start off, first of all, with the Grand Marshals.
• 21:09
  Deborah: Let's talk a little bit about the Grand Marshall selection process and the big announcement, which was revealed on April 16th at Brazil.
• 21:19
  Deborah: So, first of all, what is the process for selecting Grand Marshall?
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_09: There's a process, and it's a first we ask the community to nominate someone who embody what it takes to uplift the LGBT community.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_09: So that could be advocacy, that could be program, that could be even so much as making noise, right?
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_09: Because we know we have to make noise for change.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_09: And that person has to be a Houstonian or at least live in Houston and have a body of work that can be backed up.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_09: Once they make the summonation and the Grand Marshal Committee sit down.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_09: Have a meeting and then decide who move forward based on those qualifications that I mentioned.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_09: And once that is decided, we put out the vote and people within the community vote.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_09: And I will say this year the canvassing for votes was was very um entertaining what people were doing to rake in the vote and showing what they are about with the community.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_09: So uh that's the process.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_09: And once you're have the highest vote, you become the grand marshal for the season.
• 22:28
  Deborah: There was some confusion about the voting process this year because when one went to the website, it was actually giving totals of percentages of how many votes each person had.
• 22:41
  Deborah: And also it was where people could vote more than once, which is not the way we have done it in the past because it was one person, one vote.
• 22:51
  Deborah: I think some things were done to correct that situation.
• 22:54
  Deborah: But can you tell me how why it got that way to begin with?
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_09: So I would say that last year it wasn't one vote per person.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_09: Last year, when I joined in, um vote was already open.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_09: And what it was, it was you can vote as many times as you want or as you could last year and could also vote for yourself.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_09: The system that we use was showing an average, it wasn't the entire totality of vote.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_09: So when people, especially Grand Marshals and old Grand Marshals, was reaching out and say, hey, someone just voted for me and the number didn't move.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_09: And I consistently had to answer that question, or the team had to consistently answer the question that, or to advise folks that it is not live.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_09: The vote that you're seeing is not real count in the time.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_09: So we went ahead and changed it just to kind of put people's minds at ease to say, okay, your votes are being captured.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_09: You may not be able to see the live count, but your votes are being able to capture it.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_09: And we wanted to kind of let people know that they still had opportunity to win, even though one person may have more vote than what it may have seen.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_09: So we changed the system to one that they couldn't see it.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_09: So this way it was easier for us to maneuver, easier for the community community to maneuver.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_09: And we change it from multiple votes to um one vote per device.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_09: So if you have multiple devices, then of course you can cast multiple votes.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_09: But once you cast a vote on that device, you were no longer able to.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_09: And we're not going to keep it that system moving forward.
• 24:27
  Deborah: Well, I wasn't aware that last year there was more than one vote.
• 24:31
  Deborah: I just went and voted once because the way that it had been previously was that it was tied to your phone number.
• 24:39
  Deborah: So you could only vote one time because you had the login connected to your phone number.
• 24:46
  Deborah: So that'll be interesting to see.
• 24:48
  Deborah: And maybe with the Grand Marshall's review committee, we can come up with some more guidelines about how to conduct this.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_09: What the mitigation once folks were writing in and asking the question, we made sure that we went in and changed it back to the system or to a system that is one vote per device and where people could not see the vote.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_09: I think that system worked absolutely fantastic.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_09: No one was able to see how many votes were being cast, and um, you could only vote for one device, as I said.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_09: And if you have two phones and you vote on both phones, then that was it.
• 25:27
  Deborah: Well, that's something to consider by all means.
• 25:30
  Deborah: I guess people could go, there could be room for abuse there, but let's hope not.
• 25:36
  Deborah: So, in addition to the grand marshals that are selected by the community, there are several special categories.
• 25:43
  Deborah: One of them is the trendsetter grand marshal, which goes to someone who's under the age of 25 and who maybe is a rising star in the community, maybe someone whose activism started in high school, or who's doing something on their college campus, or is just an activist in the community, maybe has gotten involved in some of the organizations.
• 26:07
  Deborah: The other uh special category is the distinguished grand marshals, previously called honorary grand marshals, but we kind of said honorary makes it sound like it's a honorable mention.
• 26:20
  Deborah: We need a name that denotes that these are the people who maybe are just it's it's the supreme level.
• 26:28
  Deborah: These these are people that have such a great body of work who have contributed so much to the community.
• 26:36
  Deborah: And that's not only uh the the queer community, but the greater Houston community as well.
• 26:43
  Deborah: So that those people are selected by a committee of previous grand marshals.
• 26:50
  Deborah: And we take that job very seriously.
• 26:53
  Deborah: We really pay attention and we we seek to uh find diversity and inclusion within the process.
• 27:01
  Deborah: And I say we because as a former grand marshal, I'm on that committee.
• 27:06
  Deborah: So let's talk about the grand marshals, the big announcement.
• 27:10
  Deborah: Tell me what's the word.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_09: The female grand marshal is Ashley Barnes, the male identifying grand marshal is Dr.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_09: Roy Rivera, organization grand marshal is heavy hitter, ally is Mandy Giles, Distinguished Grand Marshal.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_09: We have Jet Berger and we have Brad Pritchett and Judy Reeves, and I'm missing someone.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_09: Non-gender, gender non-conforming, non-binary.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_09: We had flawless Oz.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_09: And we also went ahead and did, I guess, what is called a post-mortem.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_09: Someone who have a body of work but is no longer with us.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_09: And those grand marshals are people that we wanted to make sure that we were still honoring past life, and that those were were mentioned yesterday as well.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_09: Um along with the ceremony that we had.
• 28:03
  Deborah: And that was Carl Hahn, who unfortunately we lost this past year, and Kennedy Lofton.
• 28:10
  Deborah: We are still mourning their passing.
• 28:12
  Deborah: They were great people, certainly deserving to be recognized in this way.
• 28:18
  Deborah: I understand though that there was some miscommunication, and representatives of their families and friends didn't get informed in time to be there for the announcement.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_09: A couple of things, and completely we missed one.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_09: As I mentioned, we had the treek who was who is our transcendent grand marshal.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_09: So yes, we are the emails were sent to to one of the the post-grand marshal or post distinguished to another email, and I believe this is Kennedy Lofton uh twin.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_09: That email wasn't sent, and the reason for that is because probably don't have a database of folks to find the the information offhand.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_09: Did reach out and ask for assistance in gathering those information or those folks.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_09: I did not receive it, our board did not receive it, so therefore we couldn't send the invite.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_09: However, I'm very grateful to Brandon Wolf, who have been extremely helpful in saying, hey, what are some of the things that you need or what are you missing yesterday and made sure that I had that information to get it off to them.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_09: And that's what community is, right?
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_09: It's realizing that I'm not going to have all the information.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_09: I'm new to the board.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_09: The board is not an organization that has a body of paid folks where information and data are stored in a particular way.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_09: Sometimes data get lost because, again, it is all volunteers who have nine to five and who have their other uh service that they provide to the community.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_09: But when we have community members that realize that there may be a lack and or where there may be lack of information that we may not have, and to come forward and say, hey, I'm here to help.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_09: What do you need?
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_09: Here's some information.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_09: Let's make sure we get in contact with them.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_09: So that's that's what community is.
• 29:59
  Deborah: Yeah.
• 29:59
  Deborah: So in the future, when we make these selections, we need to make sure that we provide Pride Houston with the contact information.
• 30:08
  Deborah: I I'm not sure we have the contact information for all previous grand marshals, although we we sure try to inform everyone.
• 30:17
  Deborah: So we we'll we'll keep doing it till we get it right.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_09: I will tell you one thing I've implemented as a database where we store everything.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_09: Should tomorrow I not be here or should I not be in the seat?
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_09: The next person that succeeds me will have legacy knowledge so they don't have to start all over again.
• 30:36
  Deborah: Yeah, that's the way you do it.
• 30:38
  Deborah: And that was one reason for forming Pride as an ongoing committee rather than an ad hoc committee that was formed anew every year.
• 30:47
  Deborah: Although there's always room for people to get involved.
• 30:51
  Deborah: As you said, it's it's all volunteers.
• 30:54
  Deborah: So if people want to contribute, if they have ideas, if they think it should be done differently, put put your money where the your mouth is.
• 31:02
  Deborah: Well, put your action where your mouth is and and get involved with pride and you can help shape it and make it better and stronger.
• 31:11
  Deborah: Um, and so here we are with you know it looming, like you said.
• 31:17
  Deborah: I probably set you into a panic when I said six weeks because you probably hadn't you've been so busy you haven't even thought of that.
• 31:23
  Deborah: But there's other events.
• 31:25
  Deborah: What are some of the things that will be coming up that people will need to know about and give information about how people do volunteers, what kind of things that are needed, just what's involved with all of that?
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_09: So, first, definitely not a panic, but I want the community to know that it's just around the corner.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_09: So for them to start getting involved, I have a strong festival team who's making sure that festival and parade is seamless.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_09: And not only that, just bringing some of my legacy knowledge from being in Toronto, being in New York, being in LA, and being a promotional part of Atlanta Black Pride, bringing some of that knowledge and some of what that fun and what that interactive celebration looked like.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_09: We're implementing some of those this year.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_09: So when I say you walk on festival ground, you're going to be shocked and awed and feel like you're being seen in every colors of the rainbow.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_09: You will feel it and you will enjoy it and you will take multiple pictures.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_09: We have quite a few events coming up.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_09: One of the events is our Grand Marshall and opening reception.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_09: And this is on May 30th at the Houston Club, which is right across from City Hall.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_09: It's 910 Um Louise Louisiana Street on the 49th floor, beautiful view.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_09: And what we're doing different with that this year is we're also giving some awards to some movers and shakers that are not Grand Marshall, but their work is significant.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_09: So we have five awards that we're handing out at the ceremony that we're doing from 11 a.m.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_09: to 3 p.m.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_09: We're bringing our pool party back.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_09: I heard this is something it's hot in Houston, right?
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_09: So we need some water to freshen up and beat the heat in.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_09: And we're bringing back the pool party, which will be on the 31st on Sunday.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_09: And it's from 2 p.m.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_09: to 8 p.m.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_09: It's going to be at the Heights House Hotel.
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_09: They've done great renovation.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_09: It is beautiful there.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_09: And what we're bringing in is also going to enhance the experience for our guests.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_09: And we have Rot the Runway, which we all know is a staple and it's well attended media, and the who's of who's and the fashionistas are all there.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_09: And that is on June 3rd at Nodo.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_09: Then we have Eden, all female, female party.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_09: We have our special guest, Dawn Richard.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_09: And Dawn is from Danity Kane.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_09: Very much in the news recently with the some of the allegations that was brought against Puff Daddy.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_09: She came out and make her voice be heard.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_09: So she'll be present.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_09: And then, of course, we have Festival and Parade, which is on June 6th.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_09: Festival gates open at 11 a.m.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_09: And we've expanded this year.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_09: So one of the things that I again wanted to bring is a community stage.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_09: The ability to still have our main stage, but have another stage where we can put our community members and showcase their talent.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_09: So we have HPL, the Houston Public Library Courtyard, and we're turning that into another festival that is attached to the main event.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_09: Our family fun zone, we're bringing the trampoline, we're bringing the cotton candy machine, we're bringing the blow-up bowls, we're bringing all the things that can make, and of course, the foam, because everyone loves the foam and bubbles.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_09: To make sure the kids have fun and children are free, 12 and under, of course, accompanied by a parent.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_09: And we have Big Frida, who's going to be our host.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_09: And what we're doing again is we're doing an after party.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_09: And this is to raise fund in order to do our golf and charity tournament.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_09: And also to um one thing that we brought to festivals is we're doing a scholarship program this year.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_09: So we're giving scholarship to two youth who's going off to college.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_09: We have a few applications, and the board and I are going over these applications to see the best fit and to allocate fund for these two students.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_09: We also have a RISE recipient program, which has been longstanding in pride, but we know we're heavily funded by sponsors and by the festival and parade.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_09: So we've asked the community to step up, donate what you can, and we're going to be giving this funds to organizations that may not have the day-to-day finance or could use an extra buck to make sure that their program is staying afloat.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_09: So we're giving away two Rise recipient recipient grants as well this year.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_09: We are, we're we're busy.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_09: We're in full season 48 mode, and we're making sure that we're doing more than just, you know, festival.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_09: We're doing something that is going to be long-lasting and impactful to our community.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_09: A part of the parade that we're doing is we're bringing back judges.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_09: So we'll have uh four to five judges that will be judging the parade contingent, and that is on the most spirit, the most decorated, the most entertaining.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_09: Judge Faber.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_09: We're giving five awards to the best float based on these categories because we're asking folks like really bring the fun, really put the um the work in uh designing your float and coming out with the spirit because people are are coming to to support and to see this and to to have fun.
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_09: So make sure that you're bringing the fun to our patrons.
• 36:32
  Deborah: Who are gonna be those judges?
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_09: We have not decided yet.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_09: We want it to be folks that we know are we're all trustworthy, but we want folks that we know one, they have an eye for beauty because we're we're asking for that's design.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_09: We want honorable folks in our community.
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_09: So if there's someone out there who's interested, we're looking at judges, Judge Shannon Baldwin, who used to be with um Producent, looking to reach out to her.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_09: We know Jolonda Jones who have supported the LGBT community in so many ways, looking to reach out to her as well.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_09: So there's a number of people, about four or so folks that we have on our list, hoping to reach out to and ask if they would be that join us in an honor to be judges on the parade contingent and help us choose who these winners are.
• 37:24
  Deborah: Deborah Moncrief Bell, I'm talking with Carrie Ann Morrison of Pride Houston 365.
• 37:30
  Deborah: And we're talking about all things pride from grand marshals to rocking runways to having fun, having a festival and our our famous nighttime parade.
• 37:42
  Deborah: And if you want to be part of it, if you want to check it out, then what's that email address and the website?
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_09: That is pridehouston.org, is our website.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_09: Our email address is info at pridehouston.org.
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_09: Or you can follow us on social media where all things are published at Pride Houston TX.
• 38:06
  Deborah: And we'll be interviewing the grandmarshals in the upcoming weeks uh receiving pride.
• 38:12
  Deborah: And we look forward to celebrating because we are without limits as a community because we're not going to be limited.
• 38:21
  Deborah: Thank you, Carrie Ann, for being with us.
• 38:23
  Deborah: For having me.
• 39:00
  Deborah: So KPFT is very important to give voices to those who might not otherwise have voices.
• 39:08
  Deborah: So as Glenn always says, you participate by listening.
• 39:14
  Deborah: You should also participate by supporting the station.
• 39:18
  Deborah: So please go to kpft.org and make your donation right away.
• 39:27
  Brett: Hi, I'm Brett Culleman, The Designated Mourner by Wallace Sean is a show that the Catastrophic Theater has done twice before.
• 39:34
  Brett: I actually reviewed it back in 2017 when we were in the first term of, well, our current president, and it is a show about authoritarianism and a government that targets the intelligentsia.
• 39:47
  Brett: Now, the play explores themes of anti-intellectualism, complicity, and the uneasy burden of being the designated mourner for a culture that has basically been decimated or destroyed.
• 39:58
  Brett: So there are three characters in this show, and we get the play through their monologues, and it's a very word-heavy piece.
• 40:04
  Brett: We've got Greg Dean, who plays Jack, a self-described former student of English literature, who went downhill from there.
• 40:11
  Brett: We've got Patricia Duran, who plays Jack's refined, solid ex-wife, Judy.
• 40:16
  Brett: Charlie Scott is going to be playing Judy's famous father, who is named Howard.
• 40:20
  Brett: He's an esteemed writer whose early expressions of sympathy for the nation's poor continue to threaten him and his circle.
• 40:26
  Brett: So today I am joined by the show's director, Jason Nadler, and Greg Dean, who is in it.
• 40:31
  Brett: And uh the show runs at the match through April 25th.
• 40:35
  Brett: So thank you, Jason and Greg.
• 40:37
  Brett: Thanks for having us, bro.
• 40:38
  Brett: Thank you.
• 40:39
  Brett: Yeah.
• 40:40
  Brett: So you've done this twice before.
• 40:42
  Brett: What is it about this particular show that haunts you enough to put it on repeat?
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_06: My feeling is that we have not reached the bottom of it yet.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_06: You know, it uh it it just gets deeper and deeper.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_06: You think you've wrung every bit of nuance out of it, and uh turns out you haven't.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_06: So there's there's further to go.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_06: It's yeah, and and this character, I was saying the other day in rehearsal that it's one of the few times where it feels like uh a character written in a play that has, you know, at least almost the same complexity as a living, breathing human person.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_06: I mean that's my feeling about it anyway.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, Jason, what do you think?
• 41:21
  Brett: About Jack?
• 41:22
  Brett: No, no, it's about this about this play.
• 41:24
  Brett: What what do you think it is that uh keeps you wanting to put it on there?
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_04: Well, uh I think Greg put it well when he said it was bottomless.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_04: I think that the play is just i i it's about everything.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_04: And you know, so I I think it's something that you can't I mean, I I've read it what uh 200 times over the years, I think.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_04: It used to be my favorite thing to do is like get friends together, come over after the bar closes, and read this play out loud.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_04: And so but I've never been able to pick it up and not put it down.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_04: And so it felt like time.
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_04: It felt like time to bring it back.
• 41:56
  Brett: How many times?
• 41:56
  Brett: Yeah, no, how many times have you played this character, Greg?
• 41:59
  Brett: This is number three.
• 42:01
  Brett: Yeah, so you've been with it all three times, third times the charm.
• 42:04
  Brett: Patricia, I know was in the original.
• 42:07
  Brett: She was in the second one.
• 42:08
  Brett: Yeah, the second, the the 2017 one.
• 42:10
  Brett: So this is her second.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_04: And Charlie is in it for the first yeah, so you got three C1.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, we replace someone every time.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_04: So next time uh I'm out.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_04: It better not be.
• 42:22
  Brett: I tell you what, but you know, uh your company does revivals quite a bit.
• 42:28
  Brett: I mean, I I think that you kind of circle back around.
• 42:30
  Brett: I think, Greg, last season we saw you kind of reprise a role in Endgame.
• 42:35
  Brett: How do you approach revivals?
• 42:36
  Brett: Like coming back to material again, because it's gotta be it's gonna be hard to just kind of resist, oh, I've done this before.
• 42:42
  Brett: It's you know, let's just redo it.
• 42:45
  Brett: Do you do you change things?
• 42:47
  Brett: Do you approach it differently?
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_06: Like the second time I did Waiting for Godot, I uh I I came to it and like, well, you know, I was very successful the first time I did it.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_06: I would like to uh you know, hey, this is tr uh tested and and proven to work.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_06: So let me just do my thing.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_06: Now I don't do that so much.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_06: It's uh I I really want to um fix anything that that maybe was uh you know not working, dig deeper when I could, you know, and watch previous performances, videos of them, and I can see like I never really knew what that meant, and it's clear to me that I didn't know.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_06: I I want to solve that, you know.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_06: So I find the places that that you know I never got around to fixing or didn't have the tools to fix.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_06: And you know, usually I tell Jason, like about I don't know, six months before we even start rehearsals, I want to work on this stuff this time, you know, and uh and we always end up uh carving out time for it.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_06: But it's thankfully I'm not trying to repeat myself anymore.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_06: I don't want to.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_06: I want I want to go better, you know, and never never really satisfied so I could do revivals forever and never feel like uh work.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_06: Well it's interesting to come back to a piece.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_06: It's almost like you've got this second chance or third to get it.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_06: Absolutely.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_06: Also I I think the only repeat plays that are really worth repeating, you know, like the idea that how many theater students in Houston had never seen a Beckett play, you know, and we would or or had hadn't seen Waiting for Godot.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_06: And like, you know, there are a lot in I knew a lot of people that said, Yeah, I've heard of it.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_06: I don't know anything about it at all.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_06: So, you know, gotta do it because uh you know, give people a you know, give give the new generation of artists a chance to see it, let people see it who want to come back, you know.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, I I was gonna say before, I think it's appropriate to use the to to say that the the these plays of revivals.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_04: And I I prefer to think of them as as revisiting the plays because I'm sorry.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_04: I don't think that we have um well, we're we're not trying to do what we've done before, as Greg said.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_04: And you can't step in the same river twice, regardless.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_04: And you certainly can't step in the same play eight years later or whatever this is, um nine years later.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_04: It's nine.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_04: Isn't that crazy?
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_04: You can't break because we're different people, you know, and the world is different.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_04: And so it's not the same play.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_04: When we come back to it, it has the same words in it, but but everything has changed.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_04: So it doesn't feel like we're hears in the same play.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_04: It feels like we're discovering entirely new things.
• 45:18
  Brett: Well, I always think, you know, if 2017 me met 2026 me, I would never believe myself.
• 45:25
  Brett: You know, I wouldn't, I wouldn't be like, what are you talking about?
• 45:28
  Brett: None of this could happen.
• 45:30
  Brett: Possible.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 45:32
  Brett: So I mean, I'm just when I saw this coming back around, I was like, oh, well, this makes too much sense.
• 45:36
  Brett: What the heck?
• 45:38
  Brett: But one of the things that I like about Wallace John's script is it's not preachy about politics.
• 45:45
  Brett: I mean, you're not going in and getting hit over the head with it.
• 45:48
  Brett: It's it's more of a quiet, slow burn, I think.
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_06: Oblique is a good word for it too.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_06: You know, it's about all these things, but it comes at them from an unexpected angle.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_06: But yeah, I I mean I agree with you.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_06: I agree with you.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_06: Uh it's it's they're sneaky.
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_06: When did he write this?
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_05: It was uh who was published in ninety one.
• 46:08
  Brett: Oh, okay.
• 46:09
  Brett: That's crazy.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_06: Because it speaks so well to we tried for like 15 years to put it on, but we could never get the rights.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_06: No one got the rights.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_06: So you wouldn't let anyone produce it for like the first 17 years in America.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_06: So finally, finally.
• 46:23
  Brett: Well, Wallace Sean, I think that most people know him from his movie roles.
• 46:27
  Brett: Great character actor, Princess Pride, clueless, but a pretty prolific playwright, too.
• 46:33
  Brett: How many of his scripts have you done as a company?
• 46:35
  Brett: I think it was uh quite a few, actually, of his canon.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_04: Let's see.
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_04: We did Marie and Bruce twice.
• 46:43
  SPEAKER_04: Marie and Bruce.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_04: Talkhouse.
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_04: That's right.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_04: Evening at the talkhouse.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_04: I feel like there's been one more.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_04: Maybe it's that we've done we're on this for a third time.
• 46:51
  SPEAKER_04: But I think I feel like there's one more because I counted, and uh Wally is actually our third most produced playwright after after Tamry.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, Tamry and uh and Mickle.
• 47:05
  Brett: Yeah, behind Tamry.
• 47:08
  Brett: Yeah.
• 47:09
  Brett: Well, so it was kind of a an old standard, an old friend.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_06: And I did the fever independently about ten years ago.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_06: And that was uh yeah, that was just a monologue, no other characters, just all me.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_06: And I uh you know, I wanted to put a warning and like a little bit of me goes a long way.
• 47:25
  SPEAKER_06: But yeah, a two-hour day and nothing but yeah.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_04: Well, what do you you could almost put that warning on this play?
• 47:33
  Brett: Yeah, yeah.
• 47:34
  Brett: It is a two-hour play.
• 47:35
  Brett: I I remember it is uh and and like I said, it's it's it's word dense.
• 47:40
  Brett: I think he writes very densely, which is interesting.
• 47:43
  Brett: And I I think I think I even described your performance, Greg, as word porn.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, I you know, I mean, definitely, definitely.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_06: Lots of words, I mean, you know, see do you see and and trying to get those, you know, nailed into place in your head.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_06: Yikes.
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah.
• 48:01
  Brett: Well, what do you what do you hope that this says now to everybody, like catastrophic audiences?
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_06: Well, what I I mean, all I can say is I I hope it I hope it seems honest and I hope it, you know, makes people feel something, you know.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_06: But as far as a goal, I mean, I don't I don't really have one in terms of uh trying to convey something.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_06: I just I just hope that I'm you know, hope I'm doing it on the level and and and and and truthfully and uh and uh you know with as little ego as possible.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_06: And you um I wish that every year for everything.
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_04: I think that it's pretty common when you produce a play and you do interviews anyway, to be asked uh why this play now?
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_04: And my answer is typically because this play always, you know.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_04: But this one is maybe different because it just seems to take on a different level of timeliness and and and that timeliness m makes it into a different thing, too.
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_04: E each time that you come back to it.
• 48:57
  SPEAKER_04: The first time it ha it felt like it had to do with the death of culture to to a lot of people who saw it.
• 49:03
  SPEAKER_04: That was in all the headlines anyway.
• 49:04
  SPEAKER_04: In 2017, it felt like this, you know, urgent panic about Trump being elected.
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_04: And uh this time I I don't know, in in some ways, feels like all politics are local and it's a very personal play, and and the play has always sort of, I think, ridden that parallel track.
• 49:23
  SPEAKER_04: It's about the dissolution of a marriage as much as anything else, and about ideas of the self and uh a lot of personal things.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_04: But I mean, I think that it ties into what's going on in our world today in various ways that I I don't really want to explain because I this is a Rorschach test, this play.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_04: You know, you come and see it, and like you were saying before, I think it was you, Brett, it doesn't have one political point of view, you know, and it would be impossible to walk out of this play and think, I agree with the play, you know.
• 49:54
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, you can agree with the perspective in the play, perhaps, even though the perspectives are shifting too.
• 50:01
  Brett: You know, the play is about anti-intellectualism.
• 50:04
  Brett: And I wanted to ask you both about anti-intellectualism in the arts.
• 50:09
  Brett: Do you feel like that that is happening just in a broad sense with theater?
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_06: I think it's it's baked into America, so anything that happens in America uh is has that baked in, you know.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_06: I mean, from the beginning, the pilgrims were kicked out because they were too awful.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_06: You know, they wanted to punish people more, they wanted a stricter religion.
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_06: They weren't like uh seeking freedom, they wanted uh maybe freedom to persecute people, but you know, and and and being smart was very suspect to them, you know, but that's what our nation was founded with, and and it never went away.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_06: So in the arts, and it's in sports, it's stamp collecting, it's in everything.
• 50:50
  Brett: Yeah.
• 50:51
  Brett: How does anti-intellectualism affect you in the arts is kind of the idea.
• 50:57
  Brett: No, I think it's an interesting idea because I think that what your company has provided is an outlet for people that do want to be challenged.
• 51:07
  Brett: I think a lot of times people look at theater as a place to escape, and I think that what you are doing is creating a conversation rather than letting them just kind of sit there and dream about tap numbers for two hours, you know.
• 51:20
  SPEAKER_06: I like escaping too, but but I I like I like the I like the hard stuff.
• 51:25
  SPEAKER_06: I mean, it's so it's exhilarating to uh, you know, think and feel difficult things, you know.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_06: I I I love this kind of work.
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_06: Maybe the biggest effect it's had on me over the years is uh just being told by people like, oh, you can't do that play.
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_06: No one no one wants to see that.
• 51:41
  SPEAKER_06: And you know, turns out people do.
• 51:44
  Brett: Yeah, that's that's our programming keto sort of yes, do the plays that we think that nobody wants to see and then make everybody see them.
• 51:52
  SPEAKER_04: If it's you and I I enjoy escapism to a nine degree I've pro and I I acted almost exclusively on musical comedies when I was in high school.
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_04: I was act trying to act but that also is maybe a good answer to the anti-intellectual question, anti-intellectualism affecting the program at uh the programming since the regional theater movement kicked in, really.
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_04: But but those are great plays too.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_04: The canon are are great plays, and the new plays that most theaters are doing, and a lot of them really great plays, and they're being produced really, really well in Houston.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_04: So we just don't feel like it's w we're needed in that in those areas.
• 52:32
  Brett: Yeah.
• 52:32
  Brett: Well it's it's interesting.
• 52:34
  Brett: I think that the biggest thing that I see is I look at something like the NEA or what's happening with like the Kennedy Center, where things are really getting almost programmed, if you will, to to do a certain slant of of anti-intellectualism.
• 52:49
  Brett: And I think that's where I was trying to go with that, as opposed to saying that there is some kind of thing.
• 52:54
  Brett: Because you know, you just see productions, musicals obviously address a lot of things like cabaret and you know, they make political statements and they they talk about the world and the world past and how it clashes into today.
• 53:05
  Brett: So there is an intellectualism in that art form.
• 53:08
  Brett: I just think that you've chosen pieces that are a little bit more wearing that on their sleeve.
• 53:13
  Brett: Maybe the question's as buried.
• 53:16
  SPEAKER_06: Yeah, for me, working on these are just the kind of things that I really want to work on the most.
• 53:21
  SPEAKER_06: So whenever I was trying to, you know, be a part of a a new organization or start up something, it was always really to do these plays that I wanted to do that nobody else was doing.
• 53:33
  SPEAKER_06: And it was a purely selfish thing that I wanted to do the plays.
• 53:37
  SPEAKER_06: So I'm going to make something that will allow me to do them.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_06: And then, you know, over the years it's been wonderful because Jason has a similar reading list.
• 53:44
  SPEAKER_06: So I've gotten to do nearly everything that I wished I could do thanks to uh thanks to uh catastrophic and infernal bridegroom, you know.
• 53:53
  Brett: Well, you know, I think it's funny because when you say that, I think about all of the artistic directors that I've interviewed, and I think a lot of them say that you go into producing to produce the plays that you want to see produced.
• 54:05
  Brett: And I think that that's a very common objective, if you will, but it's one that is very vital too, because obviously, you know, you're offering something that's completely different than programming.
• 54:15
  Brett: And that's why I've always enjoyed catastrophic, is I know that I am going to be caught off guard.
• 54:20
  Brett: I'm going to see something a little bit newer or progressive or something that plays with a form or plays with words or does something in an unexpected way, maybe, than going in and seeing the traditional proscenium, you know, two-act intermission.
• 54:35
  SPEAKER_06: Bottom line, you know that daffy is gonna happen.
• 54:39
  SPEAKER_06: That the what?
• 54:40
  SPEAKER_06: You know that something gaffy is gonna happen.
• 54:42
  Brett: Yes, and that should be on your season announcement.
• 54:45
  SPEAKER_04: But um I I'm gonna go back if we could to the um anti-intellectualism question, uh, because I've been thinking about it while we've been talking.
• 54:53
  SPEAKER_04: And um, I think that it speaks well to how this play resonates in 2026 versus uh some other years.
• 55:00
  SPEAKER_04: And I I think it has a lot to do with well, the the the notion of enemies in in our culture and and how that's changed as a result of social media and the the division that uh I mean how we don't see each other, we don't communicate in person anymore, we don't have meetings, our meetings in person, we don't have our interviews in person, obviously.
• 55:22
  SPEAKER_04: And I th this play is such a it has so much to do with morality, you know, and what you might do in a given s situation.
• 55:29
  SPEAKER_04: And, you know, there's nobody that I know that is happy about somebody needing to sleep on the street, for example.
• 55:36
  SPEAKER_04: But there's also nobody I know that's offering up a room, you know.
• 55:40
  SPEAKER_04: So I know that people volunteer and some people dedicate their whole lives to uh taking the cause of caring for people, and I really honor that because what I do when I'm faced with the injustice or suffering in the world is come home to my comfy home, semi-comfy home, and uh and write about it on the internet, which is what most people do.
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_04: So I th I think this play sort of predicts the manosphere in a way.
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it it predicts the um certainly the sort of separation that kicked in as a result of the pandemic and and not just um the um the rise of social media.
• 56:13
  SPEAKER_04: But I think it speaks well to what can happen, the division that can set in when we are also separated from one another.
• 56:21
  Brett: Well, that's a good segue into just saying that the designated mourner runs at the match through April 25th.
• 56:27
  Brett: Thank you both for timing in on what it means and why we're reviving it here for the third time.
• 56:33
  Brett: And I hope that we don't have a fourth time where it feels quite as resonant.
• 56:37
  SPEAKER_06: I hope that with the fourth time we look at it and say we might look back at a darker time.
• 56:42
  SPEAKER_06: That's about that it's all coming true.
• 56:46
  SPEAKER_06: Exactly.
• 56:47
  SPEAKER_06: Well, thank you very much for uh doing this.
• 56:50
  SPEAKER_04: Oh, thanks, Brett.
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_03: This has been Queer Voices, heard on KPFT Houston and as a podcast available from several podcasting sources.
• 57:08
  SPEAKER_03: Check our webpage queervoices.org for more information.
• 57:14
  SPEAKER_03: Queer Voices executive producer is Brian Levinka.
• 57:18
  SPEAKER_03: Deborah Moncrief Bell is co-producer, Brett Collum and David Mendoza Gruostman are contributors.
• 57:26
  Ghost of Glenn: Some of the material in this program has been edited to improve clarity at runtime.
• 57:29
  Ghost of Glenn: This program is added to any protocol used or appeal to opinion set or the organization.