Latest / Miss Understood with Rachel Uchitel / Lunden Roberts: My Relationship and Co-Parenting with Hunter Biden

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Lunden Roberts: My Relationship and Co-Parenting with Hunter Biden · Miss Understood with Rachel Uchitel

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Speaker 1: real conversations in a new language today. Hey, everyone, Rachel,
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1:57
Speaker 1: back to Misunderstood. I'm your host, Rachel Yucatel. So today
2:00
Speaker 1: we are joined by London Roberts, whose name became a
2:03
Speaker 1: headline after her relationship with Hunter Biden, a relationship he
2:06
Speaker 1: initially denied, led to a paternity suit that confirmed their daughter,
2:10
Speaker 1: Navy Roberts, as his. London is here to share her
2:13
Speaker 1: side of the story and discuss her new book, which
2:15
Speaker 1: delves into the complexities of her relationship with Hunter, the
2:18
Speaker 1: legal battle that followed and the challenges of being thrust
2:21
Speaker 1: into the public eye. It's called Out of the Shadows,
2:24
Speaker 1: My Life Inside the Wild World of Hunter Biden.
2:27
Speaker 2: By the way, I read it. It is really good.
2:29
Speaker 3: And shocking.
2:30
Speaker 1: And also in another shocking twist today, Hunter Biden has
2:33
Speaker 1: taken an Alford plea deal just as London was scheduled
2:36
Speaker 1: to testify, adding yet another layer of intrigue to an
2:39
Speaker 1: already complicated story. You're going to love this episode. Sit
2:42
Speaker 1: back and enjoy my conversation with London Roberts. London, I'm
3:16
Speaker 1: so excited that you are here with me today. Welcome
3:18
Speaker 1: to Misunderstood.
3:19
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's my pleasure.
3:22
Speaker 1: So it's really interesting because as you know, I've obviously
3:25
Speaker 1: heard about.
3:26
Speaker 3: You in the past.
3:27
Speaker 1: I don't know that I ever knew your name because
3:29
Speaker 1: the way that they had represented you in the media
3:31
Speaker 1: was a former stripper.
3:33
Speaker 2: Or a current stripper or however they would write it.
3:36
Speaker 1: And then when I was pitched you as a guest,
3:39
Speaker 1: I was like, oh my God, this woman is exactly
3:41
Speaker 1: why I have this kind of podcast. I got the
3:45
Speaker 1: book this weekend, the book that you've written called Out
3:47
Speaker 1: of the Shadows, My Life Inside the Wild World.
3:50
Speaker 2: Of Hunter Biden.
3:51
Speaker 1: And I could not put it down. I have to say, yeah,
3:54
Speaker 1: I wasn't able to finish it yet, but I am
3:56
Speaker 1: going to finish it.
3:58
Speaker 3: It is really good. It's fascinating.
4:00
Speaker 1: And the first, I mean, I already knew this just
4:02
Speaker 1: from hearing from your PR people, but like you are
4:05
Speaker 1: not what people make you out to be. And so I'm,
4:08
Speaker 1: it's my honor to have you here. I want you
4:10
Speaker 1: to know that. And I, and I, and I'm really
4:12
Speaker 1: happy I get to be part of helping people hear
4:15
Speaker 1: your story. So I just wanted to say that.
4:17
Speaker 3: I appreciate that.
4:19
Speaker 4: Yeah, I always tell people, you know, the real story
4:21
Speaker 4: is so much more than the media portrayed it. You know,
4:24
Speaker 4: it's there's so much more to it that, you know,
4:27
Speaker 4: it was always stripper baby mama. He had no recollection
4:30
Speaker 4: of me, all this, you know, one night stand type stuff.
4:33
Speaker 4: And it's like, no, the truth is actually a better
4:36
Speaker 4: story than what the media portrayed. Right.
4:39
Speaker 3: Of course.
4:40
Speaker 5: All right.
4:41
Speaker 1: So let's start way back when, though, because I do
4:43
Speaker 1: want people to know a little bit about you, where
4:45
Speaker 1: you're from, why you came to D.C., because that story
4:48
Speaker 1: is so fascinating.
4:50
Speaker 6: Yeah.
4:50
Speaker 3: So I'm originally from Arkansas, born and raised, and I
4:54
Speaker 3: was a college athlete.
4:55
Speaker 4: I went on to play basketball at Arkansas State. And
4:59
Speaker 4: then after that, you know, I started working for my
5:01
Speaker 4: dad at his company. But I always was, you know,
5:04
Speaker 4: my minors are like psychology and criminology. And I always
5:09
Speaker 4: wanted to live in D.C. And I got to go
5:10
Speaker 4: on a trip to D.C.
5:11
Speaker 3: Or the East Coast. But then I went on a
5:13
Speaker 3: trip to D.C. when I was in junior high and
5:16
Speaker 3: just fell in love with it. And it was just odd.
5:19
Speaker 4: One day it came up on the computer while I
5:21
Speaker 4: was at work, you know, a CSI program in In D.C.,
5:25
Speaker 4: two of the things that I love.
5:26
Speaker 3: And so I applied. I even went and met the
5:29
Speaker 3: director of the program to secure my spot and got
5:32
Speaker 3: into it. And that's, you know, I think I moved
5:34
Speaker 3: to D.C. within a month of applying. Like it was
5:38
Speaker 3: within no time.
5:39
Speaker 4: Right.
5:39
Speaker 2: And then also, I mean, you talk about being an athlete.
5:43
Speaker 2: What was that like?
5:45
Speaker 3: You know, growing up, it's you have all this pressure
5:48
Speaker 3: and stuff on you, but it was more of like.
5:52
Speaker 3: It molded me. It disciplined me.
5:54
Speaker 4: It helped me in more ways than, you know, you
5:58
Speaker 4: think about because growing up and then going through a
6:01
Speaker 4: situation like this, you know, someone had told me like,
6:03
Speaker 4: maybe that's why.
6:04
Speaker 3: You were so disciplined. It was so easy for you
6:06
Speaker 3: to do certain things.
6:07
Speaker 4: Well, I wouldn't say it was ever easy, but yeah,
6:09
Speaker 4: I think that, you know, being an athlete growing up
6:11
Speaker 4: definitely like molded me into the person that I am
6:14
Speaker 4: today and helped a lot.
6:15
Speaker 3: With the things that I've gone through and that strength. Yeah.
6:18
Speaker 1: I was going to say, because, you know, later on you,
6:22
Speaker 1: it seems like you need to draw on that strength,
6:24
Speaker 1: of course, but.
6:25
Speaker 2: It is the discipline. It is the fact that you.
6:27
Speaker 1: Have some sense of, you know, camaraderie, some, you know,
6:31
Speaker 1: what it's like to be a team player, but also,
6:33
Speaker 1: you know, your level of importance and who you are
6:37
Speaker 1: to make up that team. I just think athletes learn
6:39
Speaker 1: different skills than, you know, just, an everyday person, to
6:43
Speaker 1: be honest with you. So once you get to DC,
6:46
Speaker 1: tell us a little bit about what, what jobs you
6:48
Speaker 1: were into, what, why you were working and where you
6:51
Speaker 1: were working.
6:52
Speaker 4: Um, so I was going to CSI school at GW and, um,
6:57
Speaker 4: I was kind of relying on my parents for money
6:59
Speaker 4: and stuff like that to get through school.
7:01
Speaker 3: And I actually ran into Hunter. And my first like.
7:04
Speaker 4: Big job was was that, you know, I was there's
7:08
Speaker 4: a there's a chapter on the pole where one of
7:10
Speaker 4: my friends was a cocktail waitress at a club and
7:13
Speaker 4: invited me, you know, to come work with her. And
7:16
Speaker 4: I never met Hunter at a club. I've gone to
7:19
Speaker 4: clubs with him, but I didn't.
7:21
Speaker 3: I didn't meet him there. I actually met him at
7:23
Speaker 3: Rosemont Seneca. And, you know, you get in D.C. and
7:28
Speaker 3: it's a lot.
7:29
Speaker 4: I don't know if you're real familiar or anything, but it's,
7:32
Speaker 4: you know, it's all about who you know and the
7:35
Speaker 4: connections and things like that. But, you know, I ran
7:39
Speaker 4: into him at, I say after party, but it really
7:42
Speaker 4: wasn't a party. It was more of just kind of
7:44
Speaker 4: a small gathering. And I always say, you know, before
7:49
Speaker 4: and after. And it was after that night that my
7:51
Speaker 4: life changed after the night.
7:53
Speaker 3: I met him.
7:54
Speaker 1: So you were not working at the strip club before.
7:58
Speaker 2: You met him or you were?
8:00
Speaker 3: Yes.
8:01
Speaker 4: Yes. The club came right before, soon before, somewhere around
8:05
Speaker 4: that time. And I have a really hard time with timelines.
8:08
Speaker 4: And I don't know why that is. I went to
8:09
Speaker 4: like brain spotting and stuff where they try to compartmentalize
8:13
Speaker 4: and do all this.
8:13
Speaker 3: And I'm pretty much a lost cause.
8:15
Speaker 4: And they say that it's because my brain has been
8:17
Speaker 4: through so much in so.
8:19
Speaker 3: Little time that a lot of times one of the
8:21
Speaker 3: first things to go is dates.
8:24
Speaker 4: And so, you know, I sit there and like with
8:26
Speaker 4: my co-authors that I'm telling these stories to, I sit
8:29
Speaker 4: there and I can tell you everything that he.
8:31
Speaker 3: Was wearing or where we were or what the time
8:34
Speaker 3: of the day it was.
8:35
Speaker 4: I can't tell you what day it was like. It's
8:37
Speaker 4: crazy the way that I've, you know, had to go
8:40
Speaker 4: back and look at Snapchat memories and stuff to figure
8:42
Speaker 4: out what days are what and how it all molded
8:45
Speaker 4: together in chronological order.
8:47
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree with that.
8:48
Speaker 1: I sometimes worried about my memory because I feel like
8:52
Speaker 1: I do not remember things that I feel like anyone
8:54
Speaker 1: else does. Or I'll get a random text from someone
8:58
Speaker 1: in my past that acts like they know me so well.
9:00
Speaker 2: And they're like, remember the time we did this, this mess.
9:02
Speaker 2: And I'm thinking, am I the person that did that
9:05
Speaker 2: with them?
9:05
Speaker 1: Because I don't even recall that, but it has been
9:08
Speaker 1: because I've been through a lot. And I feel like
9:10
Speaker 1: I definitely have blurred out a bunch of things or
9:13
Speaker 1: my memory just can't keep it all straight.
9:15
Speaker 4: So I totally says that it's a way of our
9:18
Speaker 4: brain saving us and keeping us sane. And I'm like, well,
9:22
Speaker 4: you know, When I'm writing a book, I need it to,
9:25
Speaker 4: I need it because, yeah, because I don't want.
9:28
Speaker 3: To, you know, just tell a story and not have
9:30
Speaker 3: it fact checked in.
9:31
Speaker 4: Some, in some sense. Like I want to know, it
9:33
Speaker 4: was hard for me, like a couple of stories, you know,
9:35
Speaker 4: we had to kind of mold together because of the timeframe.
9:38
Speaker 4: I initially wrote 125,000 words and we had to shorten
9:45
Speaker 4: it to 80.
9:46
Speaker 3: So yeah, it was a lot trying to mold it
9:50
Speaker 3: all together.
9:51
Speaker 2: So talk to me about that first night that you
9:53
Speaker 2: met Hunter.
9:55
Speaker 4: I met Hunter, like I said, at Rosemount Seneca. I
9:58
Speaker 4: was invited through a friend and I was actually going
10:01
Speaker 4: to the bathroom and he was, I talk about how,
10:05
Speaker 4: you know, most people in DC, the party life, you,
10:08
Speaker 4: you might go to the bathroom and take a bump
10:10
Speaker 4: or you're drinking shots out there in front of everyone. And,
10:13
Speaker 4: and Hunter's demons kept him, you know, in the back
10:15
Speaker 4: room in the dark. And I stumbled across the room
10:19
Speaker 4: and I talk about how, you know, William Shakespeare said,
10:22
Speaker 4: the eyes are the windows to the soul. And I
10:25
Speaker 4: never thought that was more true until I looked him
10:27
Speaker 4: in the eyes. This was such a complex person. And
10:30
Speaker 4: he was immediately, you know, very genuine, very sincere. And
10:34
Speaker 4: he wanted the spotlight on me and he wanted to
10:36
Speaker 4: talk about me and know all this stuff. And, you know,
10:39
Speaker 4: I ended up talking to him for hours and hours
10:41
Speaker 4: until I realized the sun's come up.
10:44
Speaker 6: And the car is beautiful. Where did you end up
10:47
Speaker 6: going for it?
10:47
Speaker 7: This exclusive place that Dad has connections with. They have
10:50
Speaker 7: more cars for more dealerships than, like, anywhere else.
10:53
Speaker 6: You have to put me in touch. What's it called?
10:55
Speaker 5: It's Dune-A-D-L.
10:57
Speaker 3: Where?
10:59
Speaker 6: Dune-A-D-L.
11:00
Speaker 5: There's an accent on the E.
11:03
Speaker 6: Do you mean.
11:03
Speaker 5: Yes, I got it on Done Deal Cars.
11:05
Speaker 7: Lift?
11:06
Speaker 4: Please.
11:06
Speaker 6: Are you going past Kimmage?
11:08
Speaker 5: Oh, Kimmage!
11:09
Speaker 3: No.
11:10
Speaker 5: Done Deal Cars. You couldn't possibly go anywhere else.
11:14
Speaker 4: I was immediately, you know, intrigued by him and people
11:18
Speaker 4: think that's crazy. And it sounds crazy when I'm saying
11:20
Speaker 4: that because he's sitting there with, you know, these parrot
11:23
Speaker 4: boxer briefs in the back room and he's got this
11:26
Speaker 4: paraphernalia all over the desk that I'd never seen before.
11:29
Speaker 3: I'd never seen anything like that.
11:31
Speaker 4: I'd seen like cocaine and stuff, but not like the
11:34
Speaker 4: pipes and all this other paraphernalia. And it was just like,
11:38
Speaker 4: you would think run, like get out of this room,
11:41
Speaker 4: go somewhere else, leave the building. But no, it's I
11:44
Speaker 4: had this immediate empathy for him. And, you know, I
11:48
Speaker 4: like to say that I felt a real connection the
11:51
Speaker 4: first night I met him. Right.
11:53
Speaker 1: So it's interesting in reading your book. It seems like
11:56
Speaker 1: immediately you guys become very close. You guys become very
12:00
Speaker 1: good friends. And obviously you.
12:02
Speaker 2: Have some intimate encounters.
12:04
Speaker 1: But first and foremost, it really reads like you guys
12:07
Speaker 1: were very close. He trusted you and you clearly trusted him.
12:11
Speaker 2: Am I correct?
12:12
Speaker 3: Absolutely. Yes, absolutely.
12:14
Speaker 4: Yes.
12:15
Speaker 2: And did you feel like.
12:16
Speaker 1: Because you don't hear a lot in your book that
12:18
Speaker 1: he came with a bunch of friends, like you come
12:21
Speaker 1: with a couple of girlfriends that you trust, that you
12:23
Speaker 1: let into his life. But did you ever feel like
12:26
Speaker 1: he was kind of a loner, that he didn't have
12:28
Speaker 1: a lot of friends when you met him and he
12:30
Speaker 1: needed you?
12:31
Speaker 2: Or what was that?
12:32
Speaker 4: Yes, in a way, you know, I knew that he
12:35
Speaker 4: had just lost Beau, who was his best friend. And
12:37
Speaker 4: I knew that he was going through this divorce and,
12:39
Speaker 4: you know, him and his wife had been separated. They
12:41
Speaker 4: were going through the legal battle. And Um, he was
12:44
Speaker 4: having issues, you know, with his family and stuff. And,
12:47
Speaker 4: you know, even to the point there was sometimes he
12:49
Speaker 4: would tell me like there was a guy in Delaware
12:52
Speaker 4: that he grew up with, used to be his best
12:53
Speaker 4: friend and they were.
12:54
Speaker 3: Kind of falling off.
12:55
Speaker 4: And it, he had so much turmoil that was, that
12:59
Speaker 4: was happening around him. And, you know, yeah, I brought
13:02
Speaker 4: friends around him that I trusted. And I also thought that,
13:05
Speaker 4: you know, they would keep his secrets and his addiction
13:07
Speaker 4: a secret, not go public with it because it seemed
13:10
Speaker 4: like every time Hunter turned around, He was another scandal
13:13
Speaker 4: to his father and he hated that.
13:14
Speaker 3: Absolutely hated it. And so he yeah, he didn't ever
13:19
Speaker 3: really want to.
13:21
Speaker 4: Be around people because I think those people that, you know,
13:23
Speaker 4: he were he was friends with before his addiction and
13:26
Speaker 4: everything would would probably be more strict and.
13:29
Speaker 3: Calling him out on it rather than an agent on it.
13:32
Speaker 1: I'm curious what you knew of him before you met
13:35
Speaker 1: him and how you knew of him by just his name.
13:39
Speaker 1: Like we all I mean, clearly, I don't know him.
13:41
Speaker 1: A lot of people that are listening to this have
13:42
Speaker 1: never met him personally. So you just know what you read.
13:45
Speaker 1: And in the last couple of years, of course, you
13:47
Speaker 1: read all sorts of scandalous things. negative things um more
13:51
Speaker 1: drug related obviously some issues with relationships and women um
13:57
Speaker 1: and you know it seems like he's been pretty much
13:59
Speaker 1: of a mess but you know him in a different
14:00
Speaker 1: light how how did you know of who he was
14:05
Speaker 1: before you met him and when you met him what
14:06
Speaker 1: was he like I mean you mentioned some things but yeah.
14:09
Speaker 4: So initially on um on the ride over there I'm
14:12
Speaker 4: riding with my friend and And she tells me his
14:16
Speaker 4: name and he's I forget.
14:18
Speaker 3: The exact way that she described it.
14:20
Speaker 4: But he had something to do, something like some powerful job,
14:26
Speaker 4: like a senator or something like that.
14:28
Speaker 3: But we didn't know exactly what it was. And he
14:30
Speaker 3: wasn't a senator. So it was just like, OK. And
14:33
Speaker 3: so we get there and we're all hanging out and stuff.
14:35
Speaker 4: And then it's when I'm sitting in his chair. And
14:39
Speaker 4: it has a label on it that said Senator Barack Obama.
14:42
Speaker 4: And it had the years that he served in the Senate.
14:43
Speaker 4: And there was a it was a wooden chair. And
14:47
Speaker 4: it just it clicks because at that time there were
14:49
Speaker 4: so many memes going around of Joe and Obama, you know,
14:53
Speaker 4: those infamous memes that everybody was sharing. And it was,
14:58
Speaker 4: you know, comical. And I instantly put the names together.
15:02
Speaker 4: I did not know that was his son until he
15:07
Speaker 4: told me that.
15:08
Speaker 7: Oh, wow.
15:08
Speaker 3: OK. And I asked him, you know, are you related?
15:10
Speaker 3: And he's like, yeah, that's my dad. And I was
15:13
Speaker 3: just like, no way. And I Googled it right then. Right.
15:17
Speaker 1: So at the point you were going to meet him,
15:19
Speaker 1: you didn't think, oh, here's a guy with a ton
15:20
Speaker 1: of drug problems and.
15:22
Speaker 4: No.
15:22
Speaker 3: OK.
15:24
Speaker 2: I'm curious. You said that he had just lost his brother.
15:27
Speaker 2: How did he express that to you?
15:32
Speaker 3: In different ways over time. You know, I can remember me.
15:35
Speaker 4: And him discussing at Cambridge at his house in McLean
15:40
Speaker 4: about the funeral and how hard it was. I want
15:43
Speaker 4: to say that he had Coldplay or somebody like gave
15:46
Speaker 4: or had a song at some point for like, I
15:49
Speaker 4: don't know if it was after or what it was. But,
15:52
Speaker 4: you know, he he would tell me certain details, but
15:55
Speaker 4: he also was very good at.
15:57
Speaker 3: Deflecting things that, you know, were hard.
15:59
Speaker 4: For him to talk about. And sometimes he would try
16:02
Speaker 4: to make light of it. Um, I can't remember just
16:06
Speaker 4: exactly any like statements and stuff that he would say,
16:09
Speaker 4: but I do know how much like it, it hurt
16:12
Speaker 4: him losing Bo. And there were times like, you know,
16:15
Speaker 4: we would look through pictures or he would show me
16:17
Speaker 4: something and, and he always would talk about how great
16:20
Speaker 4: Bo was as a person and how he would even
16:24
Speaker 4: say that he wouldn't be in the state that he
16:25
Speaker 4: was in if Bo was still alive.
16:27
Speaker 3: Oh, wow.
16:28
Speaker 1: And did he ever talk about his father's emotional state
16:32
Speaker 1: after Bo died?
16:33
Speaker 2: Had passed?
16:34
Speaker 3: You know, he, he never really did.
16:35
Speaker 4: And, um, really, you know, he didn't talk a whole
16:41
Speaker 4: lot about his dad other than the fact that, you know,
16:43
Speaker 4: he felt like he had hurt him and he's always
16:45
Speaker 4: a mess up and he's always a loser of the bunch.
16:48
Speaker 4: And he would say things like that, you know, victimizing
16:51
Speaker 4: himself for his scandals, but no, he never, you know,
16:54
Speaker 4: he never really talked about his dad's, you know, I,
17:01
Speaker 4: personal stuff, I guess. Um, the only time was, you know,
17:05
Speaker 4: a time that I was in Delaware and, um, Joe
17:09
Speaker 4: knocked on the door and I saw, you know, especially
17:13
Speaker 4: now being a parent, I could really, you know, relate
17:15
Speaker 4: to that. I can't imagine, honestly, the pain that he,
17:19
Speaker 4: he felt looking at his son who's suffering from, you know,
17:23
Speaker 4: this addiction and, um, you know, Joe's one of the
17:25
Speaker 4: most powerful people in the world and he's watching his
17:28
Speaker 4: son fight a war that he can't pull him out of,
17:30
Speaker 4: you know, his son has to win that battle himself.
17:32
Speaker 4: And it was just, that's really the only thing that,
17:35
Speaker 4: you know, was, was real personal about Joe that, that
17:38
Speaker 4: I saw and was able to open up to. And
17:40
Speaker 4: Hunter immediately, you know, when he walked in from there,
17:43
Speaker 4: he was just kind of closed off. You know, I didn't,
17:46
Speaker 4: you don't want to ask, what were y'all just talking about?
17:48
Speaker 4: What'd your dad say or anything like that? You could
17:50
Speaker 4: tell it, if there was some.
17:52
Speaker 3: Form of hurt.
17:53
Speaker 1: Right, but you didn't hear Joe Race's voice to him
17:56
Speaker 1: or anything like that?
17:58
Speaker 7: No.
17:59
Speaker 1: A little bit into your book, you do talk about
18:01
Speaker 1: the scandal that comes out that Hunter is in a
18:04
Speaker 1: relationship with Hallie, the wife of Beau, his brother who died.
18:11
Speaker 2: First of all, did you know anything about that? Okay,
18:14
Speaker 2: before it happened? Yes, before it happened.
18:16
Speaker 3: So no, before it.
18:17
Speaker 4: Happened, I was actually caught off guard because I had
18:20
Speaker 4: seen him a few times and I'm getting to know
18:22
Speaker 4: this guy and then it's.
18:24
Speaker 2: Out there and you think you're kind of dating him.
18:27
Speaker 4: Yeah I'm seeing myself like I'm going on a few
18:30
Speaker 4: dates with this guy in Georgetown and you know I've
18:32
Speaker 4: stayed with him and.
18:33
Speaker 3: I'm just like this is odd and so you.
18:36
Speaker 4: Know you always hear the media make stuff up and
18:39
Speaker 4: and so I send him a message and I'm like
18:41
Speaker 4: and I because I know like I said you know
18:43
Speaker 4: how much he hated being another scandal so I sent
18:46
Speaker 4: him a message and tell him you know that I'm
18:47
Speaker 4: thinking about him just checking in and It was about
18:51
Speaker 4: a day later, he messages me and thanks me for it.
18:53
Speaker 4: And then he wants to meet up shortly after and
18:55
Speaker 4: I meet him and he has a way of charming
18:57
Speaker 4: himself out of it and making it be like, the
19:01
Speaker 4: media makes it more than what it is.
19:02
Speaker 3: Like it was more of.
19:03
Speaker 4: An open type relationship and something that was outed.
19:06
Speaker 3: And so now he just kind of has to like
19:08
Speaker 3: roll with it for a little bit.
19:10
Speaker 4: And I didn't realize how crazy it sound until I
19:14
Speaker 4: wrote the book.
19:15
Speaker 3: And I'm like, yeah, I get it where people are like,
19:18
Speaker 3: what were you thinking? It's like, I don't know.
19:21
Speaker 4: It was like the hunter package. It just he made
19:24
Speaker 4: it seem like it was nothing like it was normal.
19:26
Speaker 3: Right.
19:27
Speaker 1: So you end up and we read in the book
19:29
Speaker 1: that you end up spending a decent amount of time
19:31
Speaker 1: with Hallie or at least being around her.
19:34
Speaker 2: I find that fascinating.
19:36
Speaker 1: So as someone who read about the scandal and kind
19:38
Speaker 1: of after the fact, because, you know, wasn't like what
19:41
Speaker 1: I normally listen to or followed. But then that was
19:45
Speaker 1: the hook to bring it into almost like entertainment news.
19:48
Speaker 2: Like, wait a minute.
19:50
Speaker 1: This guy, and forget that he was a Biden, but
19:52
Speaker 1: it was like, hold on, there's a guy who ended
19:54
Speaker 1: up dating the wife of his dead brother and a
19:59
Speaker 1: big powerful family and that came out and then there
20:02
Speaker 1: was drugs related to it and may have gotten her
20:04
Speaker 1: into drugs and that's crazy like to me that kind
20:08
Speaker 1: of was the icing on the cake of like wait
20:09
Speaker 1: a minute there's some problems going on here so can
20:12
Speaker 1: you tell us a little bit about the interaction with
20:15
Speaker 1: you and Hallie between him and Hallie and like did
20:20
Speaker 1: they seem to think it was weird were they like
20:22
Speaker 1: oh my god I'm this is shameful I'm embarrassed like
20:25
Speaker 1: I just, I can't fathom how that went down.
20:28
Speaker 3: You know what I mean? Yeah, no.
20:31
Speaker 4: There wasn't a whole lot of shame that they seemed
20:33
Speaker 4: to show. But, you know, they were both in this
20:36
Speaker 4: very dark time. And it seemed like, you know, they
20:38
Speaker 4: depended on each other. And then they crossed that line.
20:41
Speaker 4: And now it's like, you know, it's too late. You
20:44
Speaker 4: can't take it back. So you got to make it
20:46
Speaker 4: worth it. It was kind of like that because... They
20:49
Speaker 4: were very, very toxic.
20:51
Speaker 3: And, you know, I wanted to be respectful as possible
20:53
Speaker 3: and not say anything about Hallie and her addictions and.
20:57
Speaker 4: Stuff throughout the book because, you know, what she suffered
21:00
Speaker 4: from and her demons and her.
21:01
Speaker 6: The car is beautiful. Where did you end up going
21:04
Speaker 6: for it?
21:04
Speaker 7: This exclusive place that Dad has connections with. They have
21:07
Speaker 7: more cars for more dealerships than, like, anywhere else.
21:10
Speaker 6: You have to put me in touch. What's it called?
21:12
Speaker 5: It's Dune ADL.
21:14
Speaker 3: Where?
21:16
Speaker 6: Dune ADL.
21:17
Speaker 5: There's an accent on the E.
21:20
Speaker 6: Do you mean?
21:20
Speaker 5: Yes, I got it on Done Deal Cars.
21:22
Speaker 3: Lyft, please.
21:24
Speaker 6: You're going past Kimmage?
21:25
Speaker 5: Oh, Kimmage.
21:26
Speaker 2: No.
21:27
Speaker 5: Done Deal Cars. You couldn't possibly go anywhere else.
21:30
Speaker 4: Addiction isn't something that I should talk about if she's
21:34
Speaker 4: not been public with it.
21:36
Speaker 3: And it wasn't relayed. So I went about it a
21:39
Speaker 3: respectful way.
21:40
Speaker 4: But I actually recently heard that she has been candid
21:44
Speaker 4: with it in public with her addiction to cocaine during
21:47
Speaker 4: that time as well. And so they were both just
21:50
Speaker 4: in a dark place. They were both, you know, becoming
21:52
Speaker 4: addicted or they were at, they were addicted at the time.
21:55
Speaker 4: And it was a constant argument 24 seven with, with
21:59
Speaker 4: both of them. And, you know, it was an always,
22:03
Speaker 4: they couldn't have a conversation without misunderstanding one misunderstanding the other.
22:06
Speaker 3: And then the other one gets defensive and it was,
22:09
Speaker 3: it was turmoil. It was chaos.
22:11
Speaker 1: But how did this sort of rubble work out? Like,
22:14
Speaker 1: did she know that you were a girlfriend? Did she like,
22:17
Speaker 1: how did that play out?
22:19
Speaker 4: So to him, to me, he made it seem that way,
22:23
Speaker 4: you know, that he was kind of seeing me that
22:25
Speaker 4: this whole media thing was, you know, something.
22:28
Speaker 3: That he just kind of had to roll with at
22:29
Speaker 3: the time.
22:30
Speaker 4: And when I first met her, we were going out
22:33
Speaker 4: to dinner and it was awkward because I'd never been
22:35
Speaker 4: in this situation before.
22:36
Speaker 3: And I could tell she was. She didn't know how
22:39
Speaker 3: to act either. And so we just kind of chop
22:42
Speaker 3: it up with small talk. And how are you?
22:44
Speaker 4: And. And, you know, she was very pleasant, very nice,
22:48
Speaker 4: sweet woman. And Hunter was doing his own thing. And
22:51
Speaker 4: then we go back and Hunter or.
22:54
Speaker 3: Callie goes to sleep.
22:55
Speaker 4: You know, she doesn't really hang out with us a lot.
22:57
Speaker 4: There are a few times that I've said I've talked
22:59
Speaker 4: to her and stuff. But most of the time when
23:01
Speaker 4: she's there, she was, you know, in another room wanting
23:03
Speaker 4: to lay.
23:04
Speaker 3: Down or had a headache.
23:06
Speaker 4: And I think a lot of that was because, you know,
23:08
Speaker 4: one of the last conversations I had with her, she
23:11
Speaker 4: tells me that she's like, you know, Hunter really trusts you.
23:14
Speaker 4: Like he trusts you with things he would never trust
23:16
Speaker 4: me with. And we have that conversation and I can
23:20
Speaker 4: tell it hurts her to admit that and talk to
23:23
Speaker 4: me about that. And, you know, I can't imagine what
23:27
Speaker 4: she felt because at that point, you know, I don't
23:30
Speaker 4: know if she was in love with him, if she just,
23:32
Speaker 4: you know, was hurt because of losing Bo and kind
23:38
Speaker 4: of depended on that and then didn't know what to do.
23:40
Speaker 4: It was a complicated situation and very odd.
23:44
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that unless someone has really lost someone
23:49
Speaker 1: in the way that she did, I mean, it's very
23:51
Speaker 1: hard to understand what it's like. I think they have
23:54
Speaker 1: proven that there are studies that people do transfer that
23:57
Speaker 1: affection to someone else who is also going through it.
24:00
Speaker 2: I know.
24:01
Speaker 1: people that died in September 11th, there are, you know,
24:04
Speaker 1: I lost my fiance on September 11th.
24:06
Speaker 2: I know I became, thank you.
24:08
Speaker 1: I became very close to one of his best friends
24:11
Speaker 1: that survived.
24:14
Speaker 2: People used to say, you guys should get together.
24:16
Speaker 1: We never crossed that line, but I do know, had
24:18
Speaker 1: we ever crossed that line, it's like what you're saying.
24:20
Speaker 1: You can never go back because it's a line that's
24:24
Speaker 1: different than just an everyday person. You share such a
24:27
Speaker 1: loss and that it almost bonds you, even if it's
24:31
Speaker 1: not meant to be. But I do know there are
24:34
Speaker 1: plenty of people that lost their husbands or wives in
24:37
Speaker 1: September 11th, and they ended up with another firefighter or
24:40
Speaker 1: someone that they met through that loss. And that so
24:45
Speaker 1: many cases of that after. So I do get that.
24:48
Speaker 1: I want to just talk about before we get to
24:50
Speaker 1: you having your daughter, Navy. what the lifestyle was like,
24:55
Speaker 1: because you do do a nice job in the book
24:57
Speaker 1: of talking about how he, you know, would give you these,
25:01
Speaker 1: these great, not parties, but you know, things that you
25:04
Speaker 1: can have or paying for rooms or can you just
25:07
Speaker 1: talk about the lifestyle a little bit and what you
25:08
Speaker 1: experienced with him?
25:10
Speaker 3: Yeah.
25:10
Speaker 4: You know, Hunter would, he would just make problems go away,
25:16
Speaker 4: take care of anything. You know, it was, um, anything that,
25:21
Speaker 4: you know, if we're together, I didn't, I didn't have
25:22
Speaker 4: to worry about anything. Like I knew that I was
25:24
Speaker 4: taken care of. I knew that I was going to
25:26
Speaker 4: have a good time. And, and, you know, I knew
25:29
Speaker 4: that I was going to be, I always wanted to
25:32
Speaker 4: be around him. I didn't care what he was doing
25:33
Speaker 4: or anything like he, I was like a magnet to him.
25:36
Speaker 3: I was.
25:38
Speaker 4: Really drawn to him because he was suffering so much. And,
25:41
Speaker 4: you know, it's somebody that you would expect to like,
25:44
Speaker 4: seem so entitled and be this, you know, arrogant jerk.
25:48
Speaker 4: And he, had a way of, you know, caring for
25:51
Speaker 4: people and going out of his way to, to care
25:53
Speaker 4: for people. And yeah, when, you know, if I wanted
25:57
Speaker 4: for my birthday, I just wanted to relax and he
26:00
Speaker 4: buys one of the fanciest suites, you know, in, in
26:04
Speaker 4: DC for me to stay at that night.
26:06
Speaker 3: And, and, you know, he'd take care of my friends
26:09
Speaker 3: and stuff. If, if, if they were.
26:12
Speaker 4: Around and he would, you know, we would stay at
26:14
Speaker 4: the nicest place and, He would definitely, you know, show
26:17
Speaker 4: me things. I'd never even been in New York City
26:20
Speaker 4: until he took me to New York City.
26:22
Speaker 3: Right.
26:23
Speaker 1: And you talk in your book about a number of
26:25
Speaker 1: different times where he sort of disappears and then you
26:27
Speaker 1: see he's ultimately doing some sort of, you know, drug
26:31
Speaker 1: purchasing drugs or whatever. Did you ever wonder where all
26:34
Speaker 1: this money was coming from? You talk about seeing the
26:36
Speaker 1: laptop often and he always had to be on it.
26:38
Speaker 1: Did you wonder if he was working? Like where was
26:41
Speaker 1: he getting the funds for all this?
26:43
Speaker 4: You know, no, I just assume that, you know, there's
26:45
Speaker 4: plenty of people like that in D.C., in that area that,
26:49
Speaker 4: you know.
26:49
Speaker 3: They just they have the funds. I assumed if his
26:52
Speaker 3: father was vice president that. He was well off.
26:56
Speaker 4: And, you know, I didn't ever really think about it
26:59
Speaker 4: to break it down and think, where is this coming from?
27:02
Speaker 4: What does he do? You know, when I when I
27:05
Speaker 4: initially just jumped in at first, I didn't think about that.
27:08
Speaker 4: And I talk about during that time, it was like young,
27:11
Speaker 4: wild and free. I wasn't thinking about my future. I
27:14
Speaker 4: wasn't thinking about how this might affect me or the
27:17
Speaker 4: consequences of my actions.
27:19
Speaker 3: I was just living in the moment. And that's, you know,
27:21
Speaker 3: a lot of what it was with Hunter.
27:23
Speaker 1: So you talk about him being hurt and, you know,
27:27
Speaker 1: someone who had a lot of demons, but you did
27:29
Speaker 1: see a very intimate side of him where I don't
27:32
Speaker 1: want to speak for you, but it seems like he
27:35
Speaker 1: was very, obviously very generous. very compassionate, empathetic, um, and,
27:40
Speaker 1: and all sorts of other wonderful qualities. At some point
27:44
Speaker 1: you end up, you know, being intimate enough that you
27:47
Speaker 1: get pregnant. Where were you in the relationship with him
27:50
Speaker 1: at that time? And what, what year was that by
27:52
Speaker 1: the way?
27:52
Speaker 3: Um, you're talking about when I got pregnant?
27:55
Speaker 6: Yeah.
27:55
Speaker 3: That was, uh, I'd known him for about a year
27:58
Speaker 3: when I found out I was pregnant.
28:00
Speaker 2: What year was that?
28:02
Speaker 3: Uh, It was 2017, the end of 2017 when I
28:06
Speaker 3: got pregnant and I found out I was pregnant and
28:08
Speaker 3: New Year's of 2018. Wow. Okay.
28:13
Speaker 1: So were you guys in a good space? Were you
28:16
Speaker 1: guys kind of exclusive? Was it just something that happened
28:18
Speaker 1: every so often?
28:21
Speaker 3: As far as intimacy, it would, you know, it happened
28:24
Speaker 3: on and off.
28:24
Speaker 4: It happened shortly after I met him. It happened, you know,
28:29
Speaker 4: on and off for that year. It would just depend,
28:32
Speaker 4: you know, when he was with me, most times we
28:34
Speaker 4: would be intimate. I didn't go into great detail.
28:36
Speaker 3: About that throughout the book because.
28:38
Speaker 4: You know, I wanted I wanted to be known that,
28:40
Speaker 4: you know, I cherished who he was. I wanted to
28:42
Speaker 4: get that out there more than, you know, talk about
28:44
Speaker 4: all the times that we were intimate. And it was definitely,
28:48
Speaker 4: you know, more than a handful of times. And just
28:52
Speaker 4: about every time that we were together, we were we
28:54
Speaker 4: were intimate.
28:55
Speaker 3: Well, yeah.
28:56
Speaker 1: And I don't I'm trying to establish that because as
28:58
Speaker 1: someone who has started to read the book and. Um,
29:02
Speaker 1: it's fascinating in that way, but I think the question
29:05
Speaker 1: that in my mind, as I was reading it was, oh,
29:08
Speaker 1: are they just really close as friends or were they,
29:11
Speaker 1: you know, did she think they were dating, you know,
29:13
Speaker 1: but it is, you know, it is very clear through
29:16
Speaker 1: that you respect him and you care about him. So
29:18
Speaker 1: I don't want you to worry about that.
29:19
Speaker 3: And I don't want this. I'm Yeah.
29:21
Speaker 1: I just am trying to figure out like your frame
29:23
Speaker 1: of mind when you guys were together, when you do
29:25
Speaker 1: get pregnant. Like, did you assume that you guys were
29:28
Speaker 1: dating or was this kind of the same thing from
29:31
Speaker 1: the whole year where you.
29:32
Speaker 2: Kind of were in and out of an intimate relationship?
29:34
Speaker 4: No, it would have been the same thing, you know,
29:36
Speaker 4: through the entire year where we're in and out of
29:38
Speaker 4: a relationship, because I talk about.
29:40
Speaker 3: This commitment phobia.
29:41
Speaker 4: That I have like I've I've never wanted to be
29:44
Speaker 4: in a relationship never wanted to be married I never
29:46
Speaker 4: wanted to have kids like that was just always me
29:48
Speaker 4: I wanted to live in the moment and be you
29:51
Speaker 4: know carefree and just have fun and live my life
29:54
Speaker 4: and Um, no, I mean, we, I, I felt like
29:57
Speaker 4: I described us a lot as like friends with benefits.
29:59
Speaker 4: Like I hated labels and I hated titles to things. And, um,
30:04
Speaker 4: I even talk about, you know, now the only title
30:06
Speaker 4: that I've ever been proud of or ever accepted was mom.
30:11
Speaker 3: And that's, you know, the only label that, that I want.
30:15
Speaker 1: So let's talk about that for a minute. You have
30:16
Speaker 1: a beautiful girl. Her name is Navy, by the way,
30:19
Speaker 1: how did you come up with that name? So my
30:22
Speaker 1: sister actually did.
30:23
Speaker 4: I was moving out all the stuff from Rosemont Seneca,
30:27
Speaker 4: the office that I started working for Hunter, you know,
30:30
Speaker 4: as his executive assistant. And so I'm there on the
30:33
Speaker 4: rooftop and the House of Sweden lady, like she she
30:38
Speaker 4: wasn't a fan of Hunter.
30:39
Speaker 3: And I'm for very honest.
30:42
Speaker 4: Multiple reasons that everyone knows, you know, he would bring
30:44
Speaker 4: people in that she didn't like or everything that he
30:47
Speaker 4: was doing throughout the book there at the house of Sweden,
30:50
Speaker 4: you know, she didn't really like that. So she was
30:53
Speaker 4: happy to see him go, but there was a couch
30:55
Speaker 4: and it was a couch that was gifted to him
30:57
Speaker 4: from somebody. And, She said it had to go through
31:00
Speaker 4: the staircase and the movers couldn't get it through the staircase.
31:03
Speaker 4: And she's like, cut it in half and just take
31:05
Speaker 4: it down the staircase. He's like, no, you're not going
31:07
Speaker 4: to cut my couch in half. And so he was
31:09
Speaker 4: trying to, you know, make things more difficult. So we
31:11
Speaker 4: had to get this crane to come get this couch
31:14
Speaker 4: off the balcony.
31:16
Speaker 3: And so me and his other.
31:17
Speaker 6: The car is beautiful. Where did you end up going
31:20
Speaker 6: for it?
31:20
Speaker 7: This exclusive place that Dad has connections with. They have
31:23
Speaker 7: more cars for more dealerships than like anywhere else.
31:26
Speaker 6: You have to put me in touch. What's it called?
31:28
Speaker 5: It's Dunaidial.
31:30
Speaker 3: Where?
31:32
Speaker 6: Dunaidial.
31:33
Speaker 5: There's an accent on the E.
31:36
Speaker 6: Do you mean.
31:37
Speaker 5: Yes, I got it on Dundale Cars.
31:38
Speaker 7: Lift?
31:39
Speaker 3: Please.
31:39
Speaker 6: Are you going past Kimmage?
31:41
Speaker 3: Oh, Kimmage.
31:42
Speaker 2: No.
31:44
Speaker 5: Dundale Cars. You couldn't possibly go anywhere else.
31:47
Speaker 3: Assistant are actually at the top on the rooftop of
31:50
Speaker 3: House of Sweden.
31:51
Speaker 4: And we're standing there watching all of this happen right
31:54
Speaker 4: there on the waterfront. And my phone rings and it's
31:57
Speaker 4: my sister and she knew I was pregnant. And so
32:00
Speaker 4: she called and me and Hunter had already done this
32:02
Speaker 4: little test where you pee in a cup and it
32:06
Speaker 4: turns blue if it's a girl or green if it's
32:08
Speaker 4: a boy or vice versa.
32:10
Speaker 3: I don't remember. And it It had said boy.
32:12
Speaker 4: And I was like, no, if I have a girl,
32:14
Speaker 4: if I have a baby, it better be a girl.
32:16
Speaker 3: You know, I want to dress her up and I
32:17
Speaker 3: want to do her hair.
32:18
Speaker 4: And so my sister calls me and she says, if
32:22
Speaker 4: you have a girl, I know what you have to
32:24
Speaker 4: name it.
32:24
Speaker 3: And I said, what?
32:25
Speaker 4: And she said it because I wanted something short. I
32:28
Speaker 4: wanted something unique. And when she said.
32:30
Speaker 3: Navy, I was like, oh, I love that. And I
32:33
Speaker 3: loved Navy Joe. And that's what we call her.
32:35
Speaker 4: But I didn't want to put Joe as her middle
32:38
Speaker 4: name and, you know, name her after somebody. And if
32:41
Speaker 4: it was, you know, a middle name, Joan just happened
32:44
Speaker 4: to be my mom's middle name. So we named her
32:46
Speaker 4: Navy Joan and some people call her Navy Joan. Some
32:49
Speaker 4: people call her Navy Joe for short. You know, it
32:51
Speaker 4: just that's and I honestly said to the phone on
32:55
Speaker 4: my sister, to my sister on the phone, I said,
32:58
Speaker 4: you know, I can't name her that because he was
33:01
Speaker 4: dishonorably discharged or discharged at some point from.
33:05
Speaker 3: The Navy for cocaine. And she said, well, it's.
33:08
Speaker 4: Not like no one's ever going to know, you know,
33:10
Speaker 4: no one's ever going to know who the child's father is.
33:12
Speaker 4: Because at that point, I planned on coming back to Arkansas,
33:15
Speaker 4: having this baby and not being a scandal, just keeping
33:17
Speaker 4: it a private matter that I'd had a child, not
33:20
Speaker 4: ever tell anyone who the.
33:21
Speaker 3: Child's father was.
33:22
Speaker 6: Right.
33:22
Speaker 3: Because I thought I was protecting him by doing that.
33:25
Speaker 3: So I was like, yeah, you know what? You're right.
33:27
Speaker 3: He'll never know. Right.
33:29
Speaker 1: OK, so talk about the moment where you found out
33:31
Speaker 1: that you were pregnant and then the first time you
33:34
Speaker 1: spoke to Hunter about that.
33:36
Speaker 4: It was a lot because, you know, it's like I
33:39
Speaker 4: say in the book, I knew who was on the
33:40
Speaker 4: other end of that positive pregnancy test. And then you immediately,
33:45
Speaker 4: you know, become consumed in these conspiracies and this fear
33:50
Speaker 4: and everything that comes with it. Because when I found
33:54
Speaker 4: out I was pregnant, I had two phones. One was
33:56
Speaker 4: AT & T and one was Sprint. And the reason
34:00
Speaker 4: I had to get another carrier is because my Arkansas
34:02
Speaker 4: phone didn't get service where I lived at in DC.
34:04
Speaker 4: So I ended up having two phones, two separate carriers.
34:08
Speaker 4: And after I found out I'm pregnant, I talked to
34:09
Speaker 4: my sister on the phone. She's, you know, my lifeline,
34:12
Speaker 4: one of the first people I call, um, both phones.
34:17
Speaker 3: Crash at the same time. And it was, it was, um, eye-opening.
34:22
Speaker 4: It was terrifying because you think, you know, I don't
34:25
Speaker 4: believe all these conspiracy theories that people have about politics
34:29
Speaker 4: and scandals, but if by chance, you know, that anything
34:34
Speaker 4: about those are true, you know, is this a coincidence?
34:37
Speaker 4: And if it's not a coincidence that this happened, then
34:40
Speaker 4: who would go this far to protect Hunter and how
34:43
Speaker 4: far would they go? And it became really, you know,
34:46
Speaker 4: really scary. And I even avoided, you know, telling Hunter
34:49
Speaker 4: there at the developed complications early on due to the
34:55
Speaker 4: stress level.
34:57
Speaker 1: And okay go ahead oh no i'm sorry no no
34:59
Speaker 1: so that's what you're gonna.
35:00
Speaker 4: Say and um when i finally get it in there
35:03
Speaker 4: i say you know i wasn't scared to tell hunt
35:06
Speaker 4: this man that i'd grown to love and care about
35:09
Speaker 4: i wasn't scared to tell him i was terrified to
35:12
Speaker 4: tell hunter biden because you know he's the one that
35:15
Speaker 4: his father was going to run for president and in
35:18
Speaker 4: this political scandal and it wasn't At that point, it turned,
35:22
Speaker 4: I thought, I got in my head, you know, this isn't,
35:25
Speaker 4: this is like me telling almost a stranger because, you know,
35:29
Speaker 4: I don't know, I don't know what lies behind.
35:31
Speaker 3: The politics and the scandals that come with them. And
35:34
Speaker 3: so I was terrified. Right.
35:37
Speaker 1: And what was that conversation like when you did finally
35:39
Speaker 1: tell him?
35:41
Speaker 4: I told him at his house in Annapolis that he
35:43
Speaker 4: was leased in at the time. And I'd actually brought
35:46
Speaker 4: one of my, our mutual friends in.
35:49
Speaker 3: To kind of be there just because I was scared.
35:51
Speaker 4: And she's in the bathroom and people ask, you know,
35:54
Speaker 4: why were you scared? Was it because, you know, he
35:56
Speaker 4: was he abusive?
35:57
Speaker 3: Was he? No, he didn't have a mean bone in
35:59
Speaker 3: his body.
36:00
Speaker 4: He was he went above and beyond to, you know,
36:03
Speaker 4: respect women at that point.
36:05
Speaker 3: You know, in our situation, he respected me. He had
36:07
Speaker 3: never not.
36:09
Speaker 4: And I set him down and I tell him and
36:13
Speaker 4: I always talk about people that watch friends TV show.
36:16
Speaker 4: It's a lot like that because I tell him I'm
36:19
Speaker 4: pregnant and it's like Ross and Rachel.
36:21
Speaker 3: And when Rachel tells Ross that she's pregnant, it's just.
36:24
Speaker 4: Like blank, like, oh, my God. And, you know, his
36:27
Speaker 4: eyes are big and he's just looking at it. She's like,
36:29
Speaker 4: by the way, it's it's yours. I'll give you a
36:31
Speaker 4: little time to process that. And I just kind of
36:33
Speaker 4: like sit back and I'm just watching him. And then
36:36
Speaker 4: it just clicks like.
36:36
Speaker 3: Honey, I know it's mine. Why would you say that?
36:40
Speaker 4: You know, whatever you decide, I'll be here for you.
36:43
Speaker 4: I'll be here financially, emotionally, spiritually, whatever you decide, I'll
36:47
Speaker 4: respect that and I'll be here for you. And it
36:50
Speaker 4: was comforting, that conversation. It was, you know, I talk
36:54
Speaker 4: about the intimacy, that and I being more passionate because
36:57
Speaker 4: of that.
36:57
Speaker 3: It just seemed.
36:59
Speaker 4: It seemed like he was good with it. Everything was
37:02
Speaker 4: going to be okay. I was going to be safe.
37:04
Speaker 3: And, you know, we were going to have a baby.
37:06
Speaker 4: And it's not instantly like I've trapped him and now
37:09
Speaker 4: we got to get married type thing. It was like
37:11
Speaker 4: I could co-parent with my friend and raise this child.
37:14
Speaker 4: You know, I didn't immediately think that we were just
37:17
Speaker 4: going to be together.
37:19
Speaker 1: So how did you get from that moment to the
37:22
Speaker 1: point where you thought, okay, no one's going to know
37:25
Speaker 1: that this is a Biden and I'm going to have
37:26
Speaker 1: to go raise this child by myself in Arkansas.
37:30
Speaker 4: So, you know, Hunter's addiction was at a pretty high peak.
37:35
Speaker 4: And after I tell him that, you know, there's that
37:38
Speaker 4: comfort and everything. And then there's a few times I
37:40
Speaker 4: see him and there's still a little comfort, but I
37:43
Speaker 4: schedule an ultrasound to listen to the baby's heartbeat for
37:45
Speaker 4: the first time. And I schedule it in Annapolis. So
37:48
Speaker 4: it's easier for him to get to. And He doesn't
37:50
Speaker 4: show up. And, you know, I listen to the baby's
37:52
Speaker 4: heartbeat by myself. And after that, I'm at every doctor's
37:55
Speaker 4: appointment by myself. And I realize within the next month
38:01
Speaker 4: of that, you know, he's he's becoming more distant and
38:05
Speaker 4: and avoiding. And I know what that is. I've now
38:08
Speaker 4: become a burden to him. And, you know, he's just
38:11
Speaker 4: kind of getting away from it out of sight, out
38:13
Speaker 4: of mind.
38:14
Speaker 3: And one of the last times.
38:15
Speaker 4: That I had seen him, he he brought up like
38:18
Speaker 4: finances and how he didn't have the money.
38:21
Speaker 3: And, and blah, blah, blah.
38:22
Speaker 4: He was having to buy one of his children a
38:24
Speaker 4: laptop and he couldn't even afford that. And I knew
38:27
Speaker 4: there was making digs at me. And I was like,
38:29
Speaker 4: you know, this is somebody that I've grown to love
38:31
Speaker 4: and care about. And I thought had grown to love
38:33
Speaker 4: and care about me because he's, he's gotten to know me,
38:36
Speaker 4: but yet he's questioning my character right now.
38:39
Speaker 3: And that was, you know, really hurtful.
38:40
Speaker 4: And I talk, I even, I even say, you know,
38:44
Speaker 4: that's the last time I called him hunt. After that,
38:46
Speaker 4: he was Hunter, you know, I'd when all the people
38:50
Speaker 4: that were close to him called him hunts.
38:52
Speaker 3: And, um, at that point I was, I was so offended.
38:56
Speaker 3: And in my head, I'm thinking, was this all a lie?
38:58
Speaker 3: Like everything. And I, you know, I, I call him Hunter.
39:01
Speaker 3: I'm offended. And I'm like, I'm going to raise this
39:03
Speaker 3: baby on my own.
39:04
Speaker 4: And, um, I decide, I talked to my dad, I
39:07
Speaker 4: decided I'm going to come home. And, you know, my
39:09
Speaker 4: family knew who the child's father was, but we also
39:11
Speaker 4: knew that his father was going to be running for president. And, um,
39:15
Speaker 4: The future of that itself is unknown. And so we
39:19
Speaker 4: wanted to keep it as quiet as possible. And I
39:23
Speaker 4: come back to Arkansas and there's so many people, so
39:25
Speaker 4: many rumors going around. You know, I've I've been in
39:27
Speaker 4: this big city and I come back and people are like, oh,
39:30
Speaker 4: she's pregnant with this NBA players baby or her parents
39:33
Speaker 4: are hiding her.
39:33
Speaker 3: In the attic.
39:34
Speaker 4: And I was like, no, I just am going through
39:36
Speaker 4: a very depressive time. I don't want to be out
39:39
Speaker 4: in public. And, you know, it's it's hard because you
39:43
Speaker 4: take in this Sometimes when you get pregnant, it's not
39:47
Speaker 4: a time to celebrate. Some women get pregnant and it's
39:50
Speaker 4: unplanned and it's scary. And, you know, take in the
39:53
Speaker 4: fact that there's that abandonment. There's you feel alone.
39:57
Speaker 3: You don't have your families there, but you're more alone
39:59
Speaker 3: than you've ever been.
40:00
Speaker 4: You're carrying a child to this man who's in such
40:03
Speaker 4: a dark place and he's addicted and his dad might
40:06
Speaker 4: run for president.
40:07
Speaker 3: And it's scary. It's terrifying.
40:10
Speaker 1: I mean, I can totally understand that London. I feel
40:12
Speaker 1: like it's so evident to see how hard you must
40:15
Speaker 1: have been. I know you talk in your book about
40:18
Speaker 1: struggling with suicidal thoughts during pregnancy because of that, but
40:22
Speaker 1: you know, I can really understand that, that here is
40:25
Speaker 1: a guy.
40:26
Speaker 2: And again, from reading it, you laid out that you
40:30
Speaker 2: just love him. You care about him no matter who
40:33
Speaker 2: he is.
40:34
Speaker 1: And to, to, you know, find out that you're having
40:37
Speaker 1: his child and you're not necessarily looking for, you know,
40:41
Speaker 1: anything more than just like validation of like, we can
40:44
Speaker 1: co-parent as friends, like you said, or continuing the relationship
40:48
Speaker 1: that you had. But it seemed that his addiction won,
40:52
Speaker 1: you know, and continues to win in different circumstances. But,
40:56
Speaker 1: and that is very sad, not only for you, who
40:58
Speaker 1: was the young girl, you know, that was going through
41:01
Speaker 1: being pregnant, but then for this child that ends up-
41:05
Speaker 1: being without a father for no fault of her own
41:09
Speaker 1: were yours. And it's just a really sad circumstance what
41:12
Speaker 1: drug addiction does. I will just say, just to tell you,
41:17
Speaker 1: my father died of a cocaine.
41:19
Speaker 2: Overdose when I was 15.
41:20
Speaker 3: Oh, I'm so sorry.
41:22
Speaker 2: Thank you.
41:22
Speaker 1: And my parents were divorced very young because of that
41:25
Speaker 1: whole thing. And it was very hard to get him
41:29
Speaker 1: to come around. He would say he was coming around.
41:31
Speaker 1: He would never show up.
41:33
Speaker 6: The car is beautiful. Where did you end up going
41:36
Speaker 6: for it?
41:37
Speaker 7: This exclusive place that Dad has connections with. They have
41:39
Speaker 7: more cars for more dealerships than like anywhere else.
41:42
Speaker 6: You have to put me in touch. What's it called?
41:44
Speaker 5: It's Dune ADL.
41:46
Speaker 3: Where?
41:48
Speaker 6: Dune ADL.
41:49
Speaker 5: There's an accent on the E.
41:52
Speaker 6: Do you mean.
41:53
Speaker 5: Yes, I got it on Dundale Cars.
41:54
Speaker 7: Lift?
41:55
Speaker 1: Please.
41:55
Speaker 6: Are you going past Kimmage?
41:57
Speaker 3: Oh, Kimmage. No.
42:00
Speaker 5: Dundale Cars. You couldn't possibly go anywhere else.
42:04
Speaker 1: I had to learn, and it took me years of
42:06
Speaker 1: therapy and doing all sorts of things to realize it
42:08
Speaker 1: wasn't him that didn't love me, you know, and it
42:11
Speaker 1: wasn't that he chose the addiction over me, but half
42:14
Speaker 1: the time, more than half the time, it was the
42:16
Speaker 1: addiction speaking.
42:17
Speaker 2: It wasn't really him.
42:18
Speaker 1: And like you talk about Hunt versus Hunter, I do
42:21
Speaker 1: really understand that.
42:22
Speaker 2: And, you know, I do hope.
42:25
Speaker 1: For your daughter's sake, that she does get some time
42:29
Speaker 1: and understanding of who her father is. But if she doesn't,
42:31
Speaker 1: that you spend enough time explaining to her that.
42:35
Speaker 2: It's no fault of her own.
42:36
Speaker 1: And it's almost no fault of his, because that is
42:39
Speaker 1: what addiction does to people.
42:42
Speaker 3: You know, I've talked about that.
42:43
Speaker 4: That's one of the, the main purposes of the book,
42:46
Speaker 4: you know, it's solely dedicated to my daughter and, and,
42:48
Speaker 4: and I want her to see what it was like,
42:52
Speaker 4: what it was like to fall in love with her
42:54
Speaker 4: father and the good and the bad that.
42:56
Speaker 3: Comes with it. I want her to be resilient. I
42:58
Speaker 3: want her to be forgiving. You know, and in order.
43:00
Speaker 4: To ask her to have those traits, I have to
43:04
Speaker 4: instill them in myself and be that example for her.
43:06
Speaker 4: And I truly believe that people don't understand addiction unless
43:09
Speaker 4: you've gone through it yourself or you've loved and cared
43:12
Speaker 4: about someone who has.
43:14
Speaker 3: You know, I didn't understand it until.
43:17
Speaker 4: I fell in love with someone who, who suffered from
43:20
Speaker 4: addiction and I want Navy, you know, to be open-minded
43:23
Speaker 4: to that and always, you know, give people that grace
43:26
Speaker 4: and know, you know, especially people that are, that are
43:28
Speaker 4: suffering from those sorts of demons to, to at least
43:31
Speaker 4: give that sort of grace to people because it's needed.
43:33
Speaker 3: And, you know, you talk about, it's not any fault
43:38
Speaker 3: of her own.
43:39
Speaker 4: And she, the other day she sees Trump on TV
43:43
Speaker 4: and that's what she sees as her She knows he's
43:47
Speaker 4: this political figure and he's the president. And she knows
43:50
Speaker 4: what he looks like. She picked when we went to D.C.
43:53
Speaker 4: a month or two ago. We she got to pick
43:55
Speaker 4: one souvenir out of White House gifts. And she looked
43:58
Speaker 4: all over and bypassed the Barbies and everything. And she's like, oh,
44:01
Speaker 4: I found it. And I was like, OK.
44:03
Speaker 3: And she threw it in. It was a little postcard
44:05
Speaker 3: with Joe's picture on it.
44:07
Speaker 4: And that's what she wanted. And so I'm like, you
44:09
Speaker 4: want a picture? You know, are you sure you don't
44:11
Speaker 4: want a toy or anything? She's like, nope, that's what
44:12
Speaker 4: I want.
44:13
Speaker 3: I want my grandpa. And I said, okay.
44:14
Speaker 4: And then, you know, that picture is sitting on her
44:17
Speaker 4: dresser in her room because I give it to her
44:19
Speaker 4: when she gets home, that's where she puts it.
44:21
Speaker 3: And, um, so she sees Trump on TV a few.
44:25
Speaker 4: Weeks ago and, and she's like, mom, that's not my grandfather,
44:29
Speaker 4: is it?
44:29
Speaker 3: And I'm like, no, you know, that that's not him.
44:33
Speaker 4: And she says, uh, Fast forward to just a few
44:37
Speaker 4: days ago, she sees him again and she says, Mom,
44:40
Speaker 4: I don't think I'm ever going to see, ever be
44:42
Speaker 4: able to meet my grandfather.
44:43
Speaker 3: And I said, really?
44:44
Speaker 4: Why?
44:44
Speaker 3: She said, because if he's as busy as that guy is,
44:47
Speaker 3: you know, he's everywhere. So I'll never get to meet him.
44:51
Speaker 3: And I started laughing. I'm like, well, honey, you know,
44:53
Speaker 3: it's because you're in Arkansas.
44:54
Speaker 4: But I tell her if... If God meant for it
44:58
Speaker 4: to happen, it will. If not, you know, maybe God's
45:01
Speaker 4: saving you from something greater. But all you can do
45:03
Speaker 4: is be in the moment that you're in now and
45:06
Speaker 4: live the life that you can and know that it's
45:08
Speaker 4: not up to me and you.
45:10
Speaker 3: It's up to God if that happens.
45:12
Speaker 4: And I put I try to get her to rely
45:14
Speaker 4: more on faith during, you know, those times. And after,
45:18
Speaker 4: you know, she talks and she says, OK, she said,
45:20
Speaker 4: you know, I really, really want to meet.
45:21
Speaker 3: And I said, who? And she says, my daddy. I
45:23
Speaker 3: just want to give him a big hug. And I
45:25
Speaker 3: was like, wow, he would love that.
45:27
Speaker 4: You know, I try to do the most I can
45:29
Speaker 4: to let her know that she's, you know, loved and it's.
45:32
Speaker 3: Not her fault. Yeah.
45:34
Speaker 4: Okay.
45:34
Speaker 1: So let's talk about that for a second, because I
45:36
Speaker 1: think your name came to the forefront when you had
45:39
Speaker 1: to do the paternity test and that became front page news.
45:44
Speaker 2: Why did it get to that point?
45:47
Speaker 4: I think just so much of For a long time,
45:50
Speaker 4: I enabled and I felt like I had enabled his
45:52
Speaker 4: his addiction because he the abandonment during pregnancy. And then,
45:57
Speaker 4: you know, he meets with one of my friends. And
45:59
Speaker 4: after I'd had maybe he's like, do I even know
46:01
Speaker 4: if the child is mine?
46:02
Speaker 3: It's like, whoa, what? So he's out here telling people
46:05
Speaker 3: that this child isn't his. And I just I was frustrated.
46:09
Speaker 4: And I thought, no, you know, I just want him
46:10
Speaker 4: to take accountability because at this point, you know, I
46:13
Speaker 4: was protecting him and not being a scandal towards him.
46:16
Speaker 4: And then you have a child and you become a mother.
46:18
Speaker 3: And, you know, my love for her outweighs all of it. And,
46:23
Speaker 3: you know, I'd break down any barrier for, um, Oh,
46:26
Speaker 3: I'm sorry. You know, for her.
46:30
Speaker 4: And, uh, um, I knew that I was protecting the
46:36
Speaker 4: wrong person and, you know, it's her that I have
46:39
Speaker 4: to fight.
46:39
Speaker 3: For and I have to protect not, not him.
46:43
Speaker 6: Right.
46:44
Speaker 1: And so obviously the court comes back and says that
46:48
Speaker 1: he is the father. How did he respond to that?
46:52
Speaker 3: Was a general denial.
46:54
Speaker 4: And I was kind of I was kind of taken
46:57
Speaker 4: aback by it because I thought that I.
47:01
Speaker 3: Thought I didn't think that he would deny it.
47:03
Speaker 4: And then I didn't think, you know, that he would
47:05
Speaker 4: deny ever even knowing me. and want to know if
47:08
Speaker 4: he was even in the country during that time and
47:10
Speaker 4: I was just like I was so mind blown like
47:13
Speaker 4: it was I I me and my friend she actually
47:16
Speaker 4: the mutual friend was actually here for Navy's birthday the
47:19
Speaker 4: other day and and we got to sitting down and
47:22
Speaker 4: talking and she was like that is like gaslighting 101
47:26
Speaker 4: she was like that is the biggest public gaslight of
47:28
Speaker 4: all time is what he did to you because at
47:30
Speaker 4: one point you know I'm calling her and I'm like
47:33
Speaker 4: this did happen, didn't it? Like, I did know him, right?
47:36
Speaker 4: She's like, oh my gosh, yes.
47:38
Speaker 3: I was like, I feel like I'm losing my mind.
47:40
Speaker 4: You know, you read about those cases of these people
47:44
Speaker 4: with all these mental disorders, and now I'm feeling like,
47:46
Speaker 4: you know, I've diagnosed myself with one. And she's like, no, like,
47:49
Speaker 4: this is what needs to happen. Like, you're doing the
47:53
Speaker 4: right thing. You know, don't let him gaslight you. And
47:56
Speaker 4: I just continued fighting for Navy and for that accountability.
47:59
Speaker 4: That's the one thing that I wanted. And I told
48:01
Speaker 4: my attorney that I said, I just want a DNA
48:03
Speaker 4: test done. I want it done the right way. So
48:06
Speaker 4: he won't be able to stand there and say that
48:08
Speaker 4: not only does he not know me, that he doesn't
48:10
Speaker 4: know that he had a child.
48:12
Speaker 1: So I know that eventually, as we've seen in the news,
48:15
Speaker 1: Joe Biden has actually mentioned Navy as being one of
48:19
Speaker 1: the seven grandchildren, correct?
48:22
Speaker 3: I believe so. They made a statement a little over
48:25
Speaker 3: a year ago. Right.
48:26
Speaker 1: But up until this moment, has your daughter gotten to
48:31
Speaker 1: meet either one of them, meaning Joe or Hunter?
48:35
Speaker 3: No, no, she's not met anyone from her paternal side.
48:39
Speaker 2: And when was the last time you spoke to Hunter?
48:42
Speaker 4: It would be when he found out that I had
48:46
Speaker 4: wrote a book. You know, when you write a book,
48:48
Speaker 4: you have to sign things where you can't, you know, tell.
48:50
Speaker 3: Certain people or not certain people.
48:52
Speaker 4: You can't tell people you can't discuss it until, you know,
48:55
Speaker 4: it's in writing or until a certain date. And when
49:00
Speaker 4: a publisher and stuff released it, I was able to
49:02
Speaker 4: tell him and he didn't handle it so well.
49:06
Speaker 2: Oh, how did that conversation go?
49:08
Speaker 4: He asked if it was a joke. And that was
49:11
Speaker 4: the last I've heard from him. He, you know, he
49:14
Speaker 4: won't call Navy and talk to her. And I've reached
49:18
Speaker 4: out a couple of times, even on Navy's birthday.
49:20
Speaker 3: And I said, you know, it's Navy's birthday. She asks
49:22
Speaker 3: about you every day.
49:23
Speaker 4: And, you know, you and I might have our disagreements
49:26
Speaker 4: and we might not see eye to eye, but don't
49:28
Speaker 4: let our child be the one to suffer from that because.
49:32
Speaker 4: I don't feel like I went out of my way
49:33
Speaker 4: to bash him or bash his dad. I just I
49:36
Speaker 4: told my side of the story. I did that for
49:39
Speaker 4: my daughter's sake. You know, I would I would want
49:41
Speaker 4: her to do the same thing. I would want her
49:42
Speaker 4: to stand up for herself.
49:45
Speaker 1: And honestly, London, it seems like it was for credibility sake, though.
49:49
Speaker 1: I mean, had you waited for many, many years, then
49:52
Speaker 1: people have more questions about it, right? Like running out
49:54
Speaker 1: of money, then you want money for, you know, it
49:57
Speaker 1: or whatever. And it seems like it was just like,
50:00
Speaker 1: this is the time that I wanted to do it
50:02
Speaker 1: before my daughter got too old to not know her,
50:04
Speaker 1: who her real father was, and also give him the
50:07
Speaker 1: opportunity to step in, you know, If he could. And
50:11
Speaker 1: so he's never even tried to do a FaceTime or
50:14
Speaker 1: a phone call. I mean, I know it's written that
50:16
Speaker 1: he does pay some sort of child support. So he
50:18
Speaker 1: does acknowledge that she is his child at this point, correct?
50:22
Speaker 3: Correct. And, you know, they spoke on on Zoom calls.
50:26
Speaker 4: And I also believe it's court ordered that he is
50:29
Speaker 4: to let her pick out a painting every month.
50:32
Speaker 3: Via Zoom and things like that.
50:34
Speaker 4: And that's how they were initially going to build their
50:36
Speaker 4: bond was through, he claims, the two things that saved
50:39
Speaker 4: him in his darkest times were his family and art.
50:42
Speaker 4: So what better way to build a relationship with his
50:45
Speaker 4: daughter than through art?
50:46
Speaker 3: And so that was, you know, that was the deal.
50:48
Speaker 4: But we've not heard anything else from him since the book.
50:54
Speaker 2: Is that court ordered, you mean?
50:55
Speaker 3: I mean, is he not following court's orders?
50:58
Speaker 1: Are you thinking of taking him back to court so
50:59
Speaker 1: that she gets to see him again?
51:02
Speaker 3: Um, you know, I feel like I shouldn't have to
51:05
Speaker 3: do that.
51:06
Speaker 2: Yeah, of course you shouldn't have to.
51:08
Speaker 7: Right.
51:09
Speaker 4: And it's just, I want to give him, I tell
51:13
Speaker 4: people all the time, you know, I've had years to
51:14
Speaker 4: process him in a book saying that, you know, his
51:18
Speaker 4: memoir saying that he was being sued by an Arkansas
51:21
Speaker 4: woman that he had no recollection of. And then saying
51:23
Speaker 4: that I was hardly the dating type. Um, I've had
51:26
Speaker 4: years to process that. And, you know, I, I want
51:29
Speaker 4: Hunter to have time and i want to give him
51:32
Speaker 4: grace to process my recollection because i'm pretty for sure
51:36
Speaker 4: he's he's familiar with it and it's probably a little
51:38
Speaker 4: a little triggering for him to read.
51:40
Speaker 3: Because that was one of his darkest times.
51:43
Speaker 4: So do you think that he's read the book i
51:46
Speaker 4: don't know i don't know um you know i've i've
51:51
Speaker 4: not read his i've i've seen certain articles and um
51:54
Speaker 4: it was sent to me you know what he what
51:56
Speaker 4: he had said about me and having no recollection um But,
52:00
Speaker 4: you know, I don't know if he will, because if
52:03
Speaker 4: I try to think about if I was in his shoes, curiosity, yeah,
52:07
Speaker 4: you'd want to.
52:08
Speaker 3: But would you really want to relive a.
52:12
Speaker 4: Time where it was really dark for you and then read,
52:14
Speaker 4: you know, all this stuff about your daughter that you
52:17
Speaker 4: have this guilt and remorse for every day for not
52:20
Speaker 4: stepping into her life? I think it would be very
52:22
Speaker 4: difficult for him to read.
52:25
Speaker 1: OK, so Hunter has been in the news, obviously, in
52:27
Speaker 1: this last year, because not only with his father running
52:31
Speaker 1: for president, then, you know, not running for president, but
52:35
Speaker 1: also because.
52:35
Speaker 3: Of the trials.
52:36
Speaker 1: He has an upcoming one and then he was convicted
52:39
Speaker 1: on one. So, you know, it's interesting to me because
52:42
Speaker 1: if he was clean and sober, you would think that
52:45
Speaker 1: he would do the right thing. Like his mind would
52:48
Speaker 1: sort of reset and he would say, well, let me
52:51
Speaker 1: reach out to my daughter.
52:53
Speaker 2: Let me make things right. And that hasn't happened. It
52:56
Speaker 2: sounds like yet. So do you think that he's clean
52:59
Speaker 2: and sober at the moment?
53:01
Speaker 3: I do. I think that, I think that he's clean
53:03
Speaker 3: and sober.
53:04
Speaker 4: I think that, um, I think that he has someone
53:08
Speaker 4: who keeps a tight grip on.
53:11
Speaker 2: Him and, you know, his new wife or what?
53:15
Speaker 4: Um, I don't know. It may be like some form
53:17
Speaker 4: of like, um, handler to kind of watch over him.
53:20
Speaker 4: I wouldn't say like a babysitter because he's not a baby,
53:22
Speaker 4: but someone who, who, uh, does, who tells him, you know, what,
53:27
Speaker 4: like a PR type person who tells him like what,
53:29
Speaker 4: what should and shouldn't do and stuff. And because of,
53:33
Speaker 4: I think, you know, they've been under such scrutiny with,
53:36
Speaker 4: with this, especially, you know, and not stepping into her life.
53:39
Speaker 3: No one really understands it. So I think he, he
53:41
Speaker 3: just treads, you know, lightly.
53:44
Speaker 2: Right.
53:45
Speaker 1: OK, so he's been in the news in the last
53:46
Speaker 1: couple of days. He has a new tax trial coming up.
53:50
Speaker 1: He there's criminal charges where he failed to pay more.
53:53
Speaker 3: Than a million dollars.
53:54
Speaker 1: I think it's like one point four million dollars in
53:57
Speaker 1: federal taxes. And there's been rumors that you might be
54:00
Speaker 1: on the witness stand.
54:01
Speaker 2: Is that true?
54:03
Speaker 3: It is. Yes.
54:05
Speaker 4: I was notified that I do have to be there.
54:08
Speaker 4: I'm not really sure the.
54:10
Speaker 3: Details are right. who's asking me what or.
54:13
Speaker 4: Anything like that. But, but yes, I have been subpoenaed
54:17
Speaker 4: to be there.
54:18
Speaker 1: Were you subpoenaed by the prosecution or the defense?
54:21
Speaker 3: I believe I was subpoenaed by the prosecution.
54:24
Speaker 4: Wow.
54:24
Speaker 3: Okay. Interesting.
54:25
Speaker 1: Probably to talk about his use of money at the
54:28
Speaker 1: time you guys were together or how much he's paid
54:30
Speaker 1: you since or something.
54:33
Speaker 2: Interesting.
54:33
Speaker 1: So do you have any thoughts on, you know, he's
54:36
Speaker 1: he's I think the sentencing could be 25 years up
54:40
Speaker 1: to 25 years for the other thing that he was
54:42
Speaker 1: already convicted of.
54:43
Speaker 2: What are your thoughts on that?
54:47
Speaker 3: Yeah, see, that's a lot.
54:48
Speaker 4: I didn't you know, I don't ever look into that
54:50
Speaker 4: type of stuff. I probably should, but I don't. I
54:55
Speaker 4: wish the best for him because, you know, he is
54:57
Speaker 4: my child's father and. I want her to have, you know,
55:01
Speaker 4: the best childhood that we can make of it, of
55:04
Speaker 4: the situation, you know, that we're in. And so, you know,
55:08
Speaker 4: I would hope that, you know, he's able to get
55:11
Speaker 4: through this and be a father to all of his children.
55:14
Speaker 3: I definitely, you know, would hate to see him go
55:17
Speaker 3: to prison.
55:18
Speaker 1: Right.
55:19
Speaker 2: Are you following politics? You're in Arkansas now, right?
55:23
Speaker 4: I am, but no, I'm not following politics. I try
55:27
Speaker 4: to keep the TV and stuff off the news and everything.
55:31
Speaker 4: I've never been just a real political person, but especially
55:34
Speaker 4: for Navy's sake here lately, when there's all these things
55:40
Speaker 4: on the news and the laptop comes out, I don't
55:42
Speaker 4: want Navy to see those leaked photos.
55:44
Speaker 3: Someday she's going to have to, but not right now.
55:47
Speaker 4: She shouldn't have to see that of her father or, um,
55:50
Speaker 4: you know, there's pictures they'll put, they'll have on the
55:52
Speaker 4: screen if they're talking and it'll be like inauguration picture
55:55
Speaker 4: and there's the whole family and she'll be like, you know, mom,
55:57
Speaker 4: who is that? Who's, who is my dad holding? And
56:00
Speaker 4: then she wants to know, well, how come they're all
56:02
Speaker 4: there and I'm not. And so I try to keep
56:05
Speaker 4: the news off and stay out of it.
56:07
Speaker 3: And it, I know it's horrible.
56:10
Speaker 4: I'm not able to answer all these political questions that
56:12
Speaker 4: people throw at me because I'm so out of the
56:14
Speaker 4: loop when it comes to it. But yeah, no, I'm
56:18
Speaker 4: not a political person. I was on one podcast at
56:21
Speaker 4: one point. And before we went on, they were talking
56:25
Speaker 4: about something. I was just sitting there and he's like,
56:27
Speaker 4: you're really not a political person. I was like, no,
56:30
Speaker 4: I don't.
56:30
Speaker 3: Have no clue what you're talking about right now.
56:34
Speaker 2: Are you going to be voting Democrat this year?
56:36
Speaker 3: You know, I don't, I don't know.
56:38
Speaker 4: I don't know enough about, about Kamala. Got it.
56:43
Speaker 2: Okay.
56:43
Speaker 1: So I do want to ask you, what do you
56:45
Speaker 1: think is the most misunderstood aspect of your relationship with
56:48
Speaker 1: Hunter Biden?
56:49
Speaker 4: The fact that it was, you know, like met at
56:52
Speaker 4: a club and a one night stand. It was, and
56:55
Speaker 4: that's one thing, you know, I didn't want my daughter
56:57
Speaker 4: to think that that narrative that everyone had created is.
57:00
Speaker 3: Is what it was. I knew Hunter. I had been
57:03
Speaker 3: around Hunter multiple times.
57:04
Speaker 4: I'd been to all of his houses. I, fell in
57:06
Speaker 4: love with Hunter and this beautiful child came from it.
57:12
Speaker 4: And I'll always care about him and always wish him
57:15
Speaker 4: the best. And, you know, I just, with all of
57:19
Speaker 4: this being said, you know, there's that hope for redemption.
57:21
Speaker 4: I think the book ends with that hope for redemption
57:24
Speaker 4: as well.
57:25
Speaker 2: Right.
57:26
Speaker 1: And I mean, this is like a very cliche thing
57:29
Speaker 1: to ask you, but if Hunter was listening, if you
57:32
Speaker 1: could say something to him, what would your words to
57:34
Speaker 1: Hunter Biden be right now?
57:36
Speaker 3: Call your daughter. It's really simple.
57:41
Speaker 4: You know, I can't imagine having a child out there
57:44
Speaker 4: and not being in his life. I can't imagine not
57:46
Speaker 4: being in this child's life.
57:48
Speaker 3: She's absolutely the best of both worlds.
57:52
Speaker 4: She's so much of him and she's so much of
57:54
Speaker 4: me and she's great all the way around.
57:56
Speaker 3: And, you know, I think he could learn a lot
57:58
Speaker 3: from her. She's great.
58:01
Speaker 4: I tell her, you know, the first time I'm explaining
58:04
Speaker 4: to her who her dad is and, you know, why
58:08
Speaker 4: haven't they been to see me? Why can't, you know,
58:10
Speaker 4: why have they not visited me? And I talk about how,
58:12
Speaker 4: how busy they are and how far off they live. And,
58:15
Speaker 4: you know, then we get to talking about her grandfather
58:18
Speaker 4: being the president. I'm trying to explain it to her
58:20
Speaker 4: in a way, you know, she's a little mind. And so,
58:23
Speaker 4: you know, just some things at a time.
58:24
Speaker 3: And, And she says, oh, that's why they haven't been
58:29
Speaker 3: to visit me.
58:30
Speaker 4: They've been out there helping everybody else. But when they're
58:32
Speaker 4: done helping everybody else, then they'll find time to.
58:35
Speaker 3: Come see me.
58:35
Speaker 4: And it's like, you know, I wish that I had that,
58:39
Speaker 4: you know, that that way of thinking like, you know, oh, OK.
58:42
Speaker 4: And making excuses because she's great and she's so much
58:46
Speaker 4: of him and so.
58:47
Speaker 3: Much of me. But she got the best of both worlds.
58:50
Speaker 2: You are an author now. What can we expect in
58:53
Speaker 2: the future from you?
58:53
Speaker 3: What are you going to be doing?
58:55
Speaker 4: I would actually love to advocate for those women that
58:59
Speaker 4: find themselves in these type situations. And here recently, there's
59:04
Speaker 4: been I've been getting a lot of messages and and
59:06
Speaker 4: even one has sent me this last response. week and
59:10
Speaker 4: it was a lady and she told me prior to
59:13
Speaker 4: that her situation was dead similar to mine.
59:17
Speaker 3: And I just, I was like, oh, okay, well, you know,
59:19
Speaker 3: loved it. And then she sent me an article that
59:21
Speaker 3: the Daily Mail did on it.
59:23
Speaker 4: And apparently it was, you know, her child's father was
59:26
Speaker 4: some big public figure in like Saudi Arabia or someplace.
59:29
Speaker 4: And She said, you know, you motivated me and you
59:31
Speaker 4: inspired me to fight for my daughter the.
59:33
Speaker 3: Way that you have fought for yours.
59:34
Speaker 4: And, you know, I read the article that she sent
59:38
Speaker 4: and I just it it resonated with me because I thought,
59:42
Speaker 4: you know, if my life could impact or my story
59:45
Speaker 4: could impact one person, then it's worth telling, you know.
59:48
Speaker 4: And it has, it's, it's already impacted people. And I
59:51
Speaker 4: would love to, you know, help people who find women
59:54
Speaker 4: who find themselves in that situation and, and mothers who
59:57
Speaker 4: go through the fact that, you know, they do it
59:59
Speaker 4: all alone and, and their child's father either doesn't want
1:00:04
Speaker 4: to be in its life and the child's life.
1:00:06
Speaker 3: Or hasn't stepped forward. And, and, you know, even, even addiction, if.
1:00:10
Speaker 4: If I can be a voice for people who have
1:00:12
Speaker 4: cared about someone with addiction and the way that it's
1:00:14
Speaker 4: not only impacted my life or, but, you know, my
1:00:17
Speaker 4: daughters and, If I can help anyone else in a
1:00:21
Speaker 4: situation that I feel like my stories were telling and
1:00:24
Speaker 4: that's what I would love to do moving forward.
1:00:27
Speaker 1: Out of the shadows, my life inside the wild world
1:00:29
Speaker 1: of Hunter Biden is out now. London, tell people where
1:00:33
Speaker 1: they can buy the book. I believe it's on Amazon
1:00:36
Speaker 1: and anywhere books are sold. I can attest, you guys,
1:00:40
Speaker 1: this is a great book. It's really well written. It's
1:00:43
Speaker 1: good from the moment you open it. I can't wait
1:00:45
Speaker 1: to finish it. Honestly, London, I think it's great. I
1:00:48
Speaker 1: enjoyed you so much. I think you're fascinating. I wish
1:00:51
Speaker 1: you and your daughter, Navy, nothing but the best.
1:00:54
Speaker 3: Well, thank you. I appreciate that.
1:01:06
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for listening to Misunderstood. I'm your host,
1:01:09
Speaker 1: Rachel Yucatel. Please be sure to subscribe to the show
1:01:12
Speaker 1: and give us a five-star rating and review. You can
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1:01:20
Speaker 5: With Rachel Yucatel.
1:01:21
Speaker 1: Do you have ideas for the show or want to
1:01:22
Speaker 1: reach out? Email us at infomisunderstoodpodcast at gmail.com. That's spelled
1:01:28
Speaker 1: M-I-S-S understood. Thank you so much, and I'll see you
1:01:32
Speaker 1: next time.
1:01:37
Speaker 6: The car is beautiful. Where did you end up going
1:01:40
Speaker 6: for it?
1:01:40
Speaker 7: This exclusive place that Dad has connections with. They have
1:01:43
Speaker 7: more cars for more dealerships than like anywhere else.
1:01:46
Speaker 6: You have to put me in touch. What's it called?
1:01:48
Speaker 5: It's Dunaidial.
1:01:50
Speaker 4: Where?
1:01:52
Speaker 6: Dunaidial.
1:01:53
Speaker 5: There's an accent on the E.
1:01:56
Speaker 6: Do you mean.
1:01:56
Speaker 5: Yes, I got it on Dundale Cars.
1:01:58
Speaker 7: Lift?
1:01:59
Speaker 6: Please. Are you going past Kimmage?
1:02:01
Speaker 5: Oh, Kimmage.
1:02:02
Speaker 6: No.
1:02:03
Speaker 5: Dundale Cars. You couldn't possibly go anywhere else.