Latest / Cultural Wars | America Out Loud News / Vaccines Amen: The deposition that shook vaccinology and what they admitted under oath

Transcript

Vaccines Amen: The deposition that shook vaccinology and what they admitted under oath · Cultural Wars | America Out Loud News

• 0:27
  Well, hello, everyone, and welcome to the Tenpenny Files.
• 0:29
  I'm your host, Dr.
• 0:30
  Sherry Tenpenny.
• 0:32
  Every day we dive into vital and sometimes controversial topics with authors who challenge what you've been told and reveal what's been hidden.
• 0:40
  These compelling conversations will make you think, spark debate, and inspire action.
• 0:45
  Join me each day to hear these conversations with important authors that have something to say when the world has tried to suppress and siloed them.
• 0:54
  You know, I've said for so many years, so many books and so little time.
• 0:57
  And so this is a way to get you introduced to these wonderful books, these great authors, and hopefully inspire you to read.
• 1:03
  This is the great place to start.
• 1:05
  America Out Loud Talk Radio plays on iHeart Radio Network.
• 1:09
  You can listen to this show, the 10 Penny Files, every day at 3 p.m.
• 1:13
  Eastern time.
• 1:14
  You can also listen to it to America Out Loud's Media Player from anywhere in any browser in the world.
• 1:20
  So with that, I'm going to introduce to you our special guest, Aaron Seary.
• 1:26
  Great to be here, Dr.
• 1:26
  Chempenny.
• 1:27
  It's great to have you on here, Erin.
• 1:30
  Who you, I'm going to read your bio in just a second.
• 1:33
  But while we got you here on this pause, I want to introduce everybody, tell everybody a little bit about who you are, and then we'll dive into your book.
• 1:43
  Sure.
• 1:45
  I've an attorney.
• 1:46
  I've been involved in vaccine-related work for over a decade at this point.
• 1:51
  Um, and uh it's not something I ever thought I would do.
• 1:54
  It's not something I I thought I'd be doing when I uh uh was at Berkeley for law school, nor when I worked at one of the biggest firms in the world for you know many years.
• 2:03
  Um, or even when I opened my own firm well over a decade ago, um, continuing to do the work I had done of that big firm, which is commercial litigation, you know, uh instead of billion dollar disputes, I was doing 10 hundred million dollar disputes at my own firm.
• 2:17
  And then um, you know, I came across something I couldn't unlearn, which is the National Child to Vaccine Injury Act.
• 2:25
  Um, that was my first data point into vaccines, and I understood um how corporations work.
• 2:33
  I understood how boardrooms made decisions, I understand how CEOs make decisions.
• 2:37
  Wall Street investors, they all want one thing.
• 2:40
  They all want to see profitability go up.
• 2:42
  And if you take away the liability for these products, right?
• 2:49
  And you take away the ability to sue to claim had you made this vaccine safe there, my child wouldn't have died.
• 2:54
  That I understood what that did in terms of corporate conduct.
• 2:59
  I didn't understand anything about science at that point.
• 3:00
  I didn't know it's immunology or vaccinology, but that I understood.
• 3:04
  And so from there, you know, uh the journey began.
• 3:07
  And at this point, I've I've deposed uh the world's leading vaccinologists, many other vaccinologists, many of the world's leading vaccinologists, as well as um immunologists, you know, infectious disease doctors, pediatricians, uh sued um hundreds of lawsuits against state and federal health authorities, as well as um uh relating and otherwise to vaccines and so forth.
• 3:30
  And so, you know, in that journey, I've got to one directly test the claims that they make about vaccines, right?
• 3:39
  Um, on when they're under oath, they have to answer.
• 3:42
  When they're on the stand, they have to answer.
• 3:44
  They don't get to wiggle out of it, and I get to keep coming at them until I get an actual answer.
• 3:49
  Um, unlike, you know, what you'll often get is the CDC will just say something, and then it's like, is it true?
• 3:54
  Is it not?
• 3:54
  You know, um, I got to actually test that, and then separately, I got to hold them to their proof, which is you made a claim, I want the evidence, and I could force them to give it or or admit they don't have it.
• 4:08
  So uh that's a very big nuts, nutshell my journey.
• 4:12
  Yes, and you've also litigated in one high profile mandate cases, restored exemptions to the U.S.
• 4:18
  military service, and compelled federal agencies to release documents related to theirs.
• 4:24
  It's just amazing what you've been able to do and to and uh that you've really stepped into this ring.
• 4:30
  And today we're gonna discuss the details of your book, Vaccines AM.
• 4:35
  What amen?
• 4:36
  Vaccines, amen.
• 4:37
  What a great book, because we've often said that vaccines was a religion, you know.
• 4:43
  I believe in vaccines.
• 4:45
  Like you don't say, I believe in screwdrivers, I don't believe in wrenches, you know, but I believe in vaccines.
• 4:51
  So you've so we've known each other for a really long time, and I believe that that is somewhat behind the name of vaccines amen, but I'd like to hear that in your own words, how you chose that title.
• 5:03
  I chose the title because um, you know, when you uh listen to what public health authorities will tell you or the medical community, you know, the general medical community, uh, they'll tell you certain things, they'll tell the public certain things, and then there's what they admit or what they have to say when they're under oath.
• 5:24
  And they're very divergent.
• 5:26
  They'll tell you the public, these are the most thoroughly tested products before they go on the market.
• 5:32
  You know, the clinical trials are the most robust because we have to make sure they're safe, they go into healthy children.
• 5:37
  That part of it I agree with.
• 5:38
  But the first part, being the most robust is nonsense.
• 5:42
  It's not a true statement.
• 5:43
  They keep repeating it to this day, but when they're actually in a deposition, and you've got, you know, a vaccinologist sitting there in the room and he's sworn under oath, you get to say, okay, let's go through each vaccine.
• 5:55
  We've never done this.
• 5:56
  So you say they're the most robustly studied products prior to licensure.
• 6:00
  And as you go through the underlying primary sources of the clinical trials, it's clear they're not.
• 6:05
  Most of them are licensed based on trials that never in any way validated their safety.
• 6:10
  And so that's how I came to it.
• 6:13
  There is the um there's what they say, and then there's what the reality is.
• 6:17
  But nonetheless, they believe in their slogans.
• 6:21
  They have been saying them for so long, these mantras, these beliefs that they um um they believe them very much like a religion.
• 6:30
  It's not based on facts or evidence, it's based on leaps of faith, except it's not like a religion because when a religion you know it's a leap of faith.
• 6:37
  It's the point of a religion is to answer the unanswerable.
• 6:40
  Where do we go after we die?
• 6:42
  Where does everything come from?
• 6:44
  But with this religion, they think that it's based on data on evidence, but it's not.
• 6:51
  And hence that's why when you call them out on it, they get angry, they get upset, they don't respond to you intellectually.
• 6:58
  You know, I want to read this.
• 7:00
  I want to read part of one of the first paragraphs of your book.
• 7:04
  So you you just charge out of the box with great statements and really truisms.
• 7:11
  This is from your book.
• 7:12
  It says the tiny group of vaccinologists leading this discipline repeats their self-reinforcing belief system in their speeches, journal articles, medical textbooks, and to each other at medical conferences.
• 7:26
  Those who do not iterate the correct mantras quickly lose their needed patronage from pharma and do not rise in the ranks of vaccinology.
• 7:36
  That is an incredibly accurate and incredibly powerful statement.
• 7:41
  Can you expand on that a bit for our listeners?
• 7:43
  Absolutely.
• 7:44
  Just to put the importance of vaccinologists into perspective.
• 7:48
  People think, you know, the general public are like, oh, they're doctor, you know, they're doctors and there's a medical community.
• 7:54
  Yes.
• 7:55
  Um, but they virtually none of them, except for folks like you, Dr.
• 7:59
  Ted Penny and others who've looked into it, know anything about vaccines.
• 8:03
  And I don't, and certainly uh all discipline virtually know nothing, including the pediatricians, the immunologists and the infectious disease doctors.
• 8:13
  They virtually know nothing about vaccines.
• 8:15
  I say that based on my experience deposing them and engaging with them in many, many ways.
• 8:20
  The only ones who know somewhat about who know about vaccines to any real degree are the vaccinologists, right?
• 8:27
  From now, here's the thing about the vaccinologists.
• 8:30
  They are the ones I just noted.
• 8:32
  They conduct the clinical trials for vaccines, they do the peer-reviewed studies, they publish the textbooks.
• 8:37
  And that is critical because it's the clinical trials the FDA relies upon to license the products.
• 8:43
  And then for the CDC, then once it's licensed, decides whether to recommend it.
• 8:47
  And they look at what?
• 8:48
  The peer-reviewed literature, and who's publishing that?
• 8:50
  The vaccinologists.
• 8:52
  So the vaccinologists in many ways shape what the FDA, the CDC, the NIH do with regards to vaccines, which then filters down into the rest of the medical community.
• 9:00
  And then it goes out because into the public, because it's, you know, the when the media goes and interviews, who are they interviewing?
• 9:06
  They'll interview the random pediatrician or the random infectious disease doctor who's just regurgitating what they've been told from the uh agencies often, which comes from where?
• 9:15
  The vaccinologists.
• 9:16
  So they're critically important to this entire vaccine religion.
• 9:20
  They sit literally there at the top of the heap.
• 9:23
  Here's the thing about the vaccinologists.
• 9:26
  They probably believe that they have ascended in the ranks of vaccinology of their own merit, so to speak.
• 9:34
  But the reality is, as I explain in my book, that vaccinologists who don't hold the right beliefs, they don't get the money from pharma.
• 9:44
  They don't get funded to do the clinical trials.
• 9:46
  Why why would pharma fund them to do clinical trials if they're not saying and doing the right things?
• 9:52
  They don't get the funding to do the research.
• 9:54
  They don't get go down the list, okay, of all the ways that pharma uses its billions of
• 10:00
  Dollars a year from vaccines to do what?
• 10:02
  To make more money from vaccines.
• 10:03
  They pump it back in.
• 10:04
  Car companies do TV ads.
• 10:06
  Pharma companies pay for conferences, pay for journals.
• 10:11
  That's how they do it to perpetuate their products.
• 10:14
  Okay.
• 10:14
  So these vaccinologists, you know, like the world's leading vaccinologist, Dr.
• 10:20
  Stanley Plockin, I have not identified any vaccinologists that has received more patronage more, you know, broadly than Dr.
• 10:28
  Plotkin.
• 10:29
  And he's at the top of the heap.
• 10:30
  And if you go down the list of vaccinologists, the more they the more they've ascended, they've often reflects how much support they've gotten.
• 10:41
  Because if they're not doing as little safety review as possible, getting it licensed as quickly as possible, avoiding any claim the vaccine causes harm, pharma wouldn't fund them.
• 10:51
  So it's brilliant.
• 10:52
  Pharma is so good at what they do.
• 10:55
  They have these vaccinologists believing that they ascended on their own merit.
• 10:59
  But the reality is it's not that these vaccinologists are being, in a sense, bribed to think what they think.
• 11:08
  It's that they had the right way of thinking from pharma's view and hence got the money and rose up.
• 11:13
  So it's, you know, it's all, and so anyway, I think that puts it into a bigger context.
• 11:17
  You know, I've said for many, many years that if the pharmaceutical company and what they do, making products out of petroleum and convincing you that you need them that's going to make you more healthy, and then all of the vaccine division and all the cancer things and stuff that they do, it is the most brilliant business model ever.
• 11:38
  You know, that you take the youngest and the brightest out of high school and college who compete to enter into the hallowed halls of medical school and convince these young doctors to go 400,000 in debt to get out to wear a title and have the privilege of writing words on a piece of paper called a prescription.
• 11:58
  And they it doesn't matter if you write the wrong word, the doctor gets sued because not the pharmaceutical industry.
• 12:04
  Pharmaceutical industry doesn't have to pay for that 400,000 in debt education.
• 12:08
  They, you know, they send little cute little drug reps by and take them, give them cups and pens and bring them lunch once in a while, and as little rewards for for performing well and writing their little words on a piece of paper and writing them more than any other word that you write in terms of this particular drug, give it prescribed more.
• 12:26
  And if you do the wrong thing or somebody gets sick or somebody gets injured, you, the doctor, who's 400,000 in debt to have that privilege, takes all the heat from malpractice lawsuits.
• 12:37
  I mean, it's a brilliant business model if it wasn't so nefarious, really.
• 12:43
  Yeah, but you know, it's even more nefarious with vaccines, of course, as you know, Dr.
• 12:47
  Tenpenny, because that's the typical model you describe, but with vaccines, because of the National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986, there's uh an immunity that exists for pharmaceutical companies and for doctors with regards to vaccine injuries that is unprecedented.
• 13:03
  There's no other product in this whole country that has that immunity, right?
• 13:07
  I mean, every other product out there, the reason that they're safer is nothing to do with the government.
• 13:11
  The reason your car is safer, your planes are safer, the reason your sheetrock may not be giving you cancer, is because the companies have a self-economic interest to make money.
• 13:20
  So they don't want to hurt, they don't want to cut out a product that's going to cause liability, right?
• 13:25
  So they look at it carefully before they put it on the market and they look at it carefully after they put it on the market.
• 13:29
  That's true of every other product that if it injures you, right?
• 13:33
  And you can bring a claim to say, hey, had you made that safer, me or my kid would have been injured, you can hold the company accountable.
• 13:40
  But the only product you can't do that with are vaccines because of that 1986 law.
• 13:44
  So what is the business model of vaccines?
• 13:46
  It's a model in which uh basically goes like this.
• 13:50
  Imagine Dr.
• 13:51
  Tempani I approached you and I said, Hey, look, I got a business idea, okay?
• 13:54
  We're gonna sell this injection.
• 13:57
  And you might say, uh, okay, and what does it do?
• 14:00
  Don't worry about what it does.
• 14:01
  Well, is it gonna hurt people?
• 14:02
  I would say to you, don't worry if it hurts people.
• 14:04
  Federal government said they can't sue us, so we're not liable.
• 14:08
  Well, then why would anybody take it?
• 14:10
  Don't worry, Dr.
• 14:11
  Tenpenny.
• 14:12
  Federal government's gonna mandate people to take it.
• 14:14
  Really?
• 14:15
  But what if they still don't want to take it?
• 14:16
  Even with the mandate, like they get upset.
• 14:19
  Don't worry, Dr.
• 14:20
  Tenpenny.
• 14:20
  The federal government's gonna spend billions of dollars to promote your products.
• 14:23
  Well, okay, then, but what if they still don't want to take it?
• 14:27
  Or if what if they don't have the money to pay for it?
• 14:29
  Don't worry.
• 14:30
  The federal government, because the vaccines for children program is gonna guarantee payment.
• 14:35
  So you think about it.
• 14:36
  It's a you have a product where you can't be, you're not accountable for the injuries for the most part.
• 14:43
  You have a guaranteed market because it's mandated, you have free publicity, and you have a guaranteed payment.
• 14:49
  Who what industry wouldn't go into this business?
• 14:53
  Right?
• 14:53
  Yeah.
• 14:56
  When the CDC in the US government is the largest purchaser of that product and then distributes it out to the public health departments.
• 15:03
  So you not only have liability, you have a guaranteed buyer uh on the one end and a guaranteed buyer on the other end in terms of use as the product.
• 15:13
  You're absolutely right.
• 15:14
  And thank you for laying that out so brilliantly, because it's absolutely bedrock the truth.
• 15:20
  You know, in the first part of your book, you begin with talking about your 2017 deposition.
• 15:26
  You conducted like it was a nine-hour deposition with Dr.
• 15:30
  Stanley Plotkin, the father and I would also say grandfather of vaccinology.
• 15:35
  And I remember when that when uh I don't remember if I if it all came out in total or if there were clips of it, but I remember listening to a lot of it.
• 15:44
  And I remember the interview, and I don't remember how Potkin climbed up the ladder and then was on the ACEP committee.
• 15:51
  You said for for 60 years, he's got all of the textbooks and the textbooks are like two and three inches thick, and that he's got more published studies in his name, and everybody in the world, everybody in the vaccine world thinks he is it.
• 16:06
  But you go to great details to describe him as the high priest with nothing, no documented evidence to support anything in this industry.
• 16:16
  I found that so disturbing.
• 16:19
  Please please expand on that in terms of how you wrote that in your book.
• 16:24
  Sure.
• 16:24
  Uh you know, Dr.
• 16:25
  Stanley Plockin, uh, often dubbed the godfather of vaccinology or vaccines, um, is the world's leading vaccine vaccinologist.
• 16:34
  Um, he, the uh standard medical textbook on vaccines is called Plocken's vaccines.
• 16:38
  He's still the editor, it's in its eighth or ninth edition.
• 16:41
  Um the Gavel uses that ACIP, that's the CDC's advisory committee, is literally called the Plockin Gavel.
• 16:48
  He's published more uh studies about vaccines than I think any other author, any any excuse me, individual out there, including reviews and notes and so forth.
• 16:57
  He is also the developer of many vaccines, including the Rebella vaccine, uh the rotavirus vaccine.
• 17:03
  He's contributed to chicken pox, polio, you name it, a whole bunch of them.
• 17:07
  Um, and maybe most critically, as Dr.
• 17:10
  Pauloff has said, that Dr.
• 17:12
  Stanley Plotkin has trained a generation of physicians, vaccinologists to think the way that Dr.
• 17:19
  Stanley Plotkin thinks, and he did.
• 17:21
  Meaning all of the other vaccinologists we see out there, Dr.
• 17:24
  Stanley, excuse me, Dr.
• 17:26
  Paul Offitt and so many of the others.
• 17:29
  Dr.
• 17:30
  Plockin is their idol.
• 17:31
  Dr.
• 17:32
  Plotkin is their mentor.
• 17:34
  He is who they look to for you know, guidance on vaccinology.
• 17:38
  What he says about vaccines and vaccinology, it's often just taken as, you know, as uh like words from uh the Bible.
• 17:47
  They're just taken as true.
• 17:49
  Um, and uh, and he's you know, he wasn't on ASIP, but he had a better position than that.
• 17:55
  He attended the ACIP meetings for decades, and one of the few people that I know, in fact, the only person I know who could just literally walk up to the mic at any time and just give them guidance and they would thank him.
• 18:06
  You know, and that's why they put his name on the gavel and they, you know, they themselves said, you know, that his influence has been hard to calculate.
• 18:14
  I mean, I think when you look at the CDC schedule today, um, you could trace a lot of what is on there back to Dr.
• 18:23
  Stanley Plotkin's guidance in one form or another.
• 18:26
  So, yeah, his influence has been outsized.
• 18:29
  And um, there was a case in which I was gaining national attention, a mother didn't want to vaccinate, the father did.
• 18:37
  Um, and um, because of the prominence, Dr.
• 18:42
  Plockin, um, a nonprofit, I apparently reached out to Dr.
• 18:46
  Plotkin, who promotes vaccines and got him to get involved, and he showed up as the expert to say this child should be vaccinated.
• 18:54
  Um, and I had an opportunity to depose him for nine hours, all caught on video, the whole thing was released at some point on uh YouTube, garnered millions of millions of views, and then YouTube took it down, and uh all I'm doing is asking questions.
• 19:08
  He's answering them, and then people keep putting them back up, putting clothes back up, and this has been going on for years, have watched it with amusement.
• 19:18
  Well, his um how did he rise to such prominence, other than just um genuflecting to the pharmaceutical industry?
• 19:27
  How did he get to be the godfather of vaccines?
• 19:31
  Well, I I think that it's a combination of a few things.
• 19:33
  First of all, his approach to vaccines, in my opinion, are part of why pharma wants to patronize him.
• 19:40
  Um, you know, he was, I believe, the chief medical officer at Sinofi, pharmaceutical company.
• 19:45
  He has been a consultant for every major pharmaceutical company.
• 19:49
  He uh he's received millions of dollars in royalties, as far as I understand it, um, based on the available data for um uh at least one, probably two.
• 20:00
  And maybe more vaccines that he's developed.
• 20:03
  Um, and so over the course of that time, and he has conducted many of the clinical conducted clinical trials.
• 20:08
  I mean, he's he's done everything.
• 20:10
  Um, and I think that over time, despite the fact that he's completely intertwined with pharma companies, as you could see based on the deposition, right?
• 20:20
  Uh, you if you watch the first two hours, you could see his incredible entanglements.
• 20:25
  Um, he's not viewed as a pharma insider.
• 20:29
  Meaning, there's no crime in being a consultant to pharmaceutical company.
• 20:34
  That's fine.
• 20:35
  There's no crime in uh whatsoever in and doing clinical trials for pharmaceutical companies for being consultant to pharmaceutical companies, for getting paid millions for getting royalties from companies.
• 20:46
  No crime in any of that.
• 20:48
  The problem is that when it comes to Dr.
• 20:50
  Plockin, he is viewed as an impartial scientist by most of the medical community, as far as I'm aware.
• 20:56
  So think about that.
• 20:58
  He has all of these conflicts, but they're he's not viewed as a pharma scientist, as a pharma consultant, as a pharma advocate, he's viewed as an impartial scientist.
• 21:09
  That's the problem.
• 21:11
  That is the issue.
• 21:13
  And so, you know, um, how did he become the godfather of vaccinology?
• 21:19
  Um, because with all of that support over the over the period of his career, because he kept, in my opinion, doing the things that um were in pharma's interest.
• 21:31
  He kept ascending.
• 21:32
  They kept supporting his work in one form or another.
• 21:37
  So uh absent that had he deviated in his views, had he not engaged in the approach to vaccines that would have made them as much money as possible.
• 21:47
  I doubt he would have, of course he wouldn't have descended because uh they wouldn't have been patronizing him, they wouldn't have been paying royalties, made him a consultant.
• 21:54
  Go down the list.
• 21:55
  You know, in the in your deposition, you include pieces of the transcribe deposition in the first part of your book, and you were having him read a package insert about following out side effects five days, and he admitted that wasn't long enough.
• 22:10
  Um what what was the follow-up to that?
• 22:12
  I mean, when he's actually admitting that these clinical trials of only five days were not long enough to watch for autoimmune disease or neurological complications or any of those things.
• 22:23
  And the, you know, the FDA put a stake in the ground when they wrote the the injury compensation table of if it hasn't happened within 48 to 72 hours, it has nothing to do with the vaccine, it's something else.
• 22:36
  How did he explain that at the end of the day, other than just a shrug?
• 22:42
  Uh uh, so uh I think you're referring to my questioning him about Recombo VAX HB, one of the two have B vaccines given on the first day of life.
• 22:51
  And um, you know, I will tell you, going into that deposition.
• 22:55
  I assume there was something like it could have it seemed incredible to me, honestly, back then.
• 23:00
  Because I was I knew a fraction back then of what I know now about vaccines vaccinology.
• 23:05
  But it just seemed incredible to me, even though it was right there in the package insert, right?
• 23:09
  Which by federal law has to summarize the clinical trial, relied upon to license that product.
• 23:15
  Even though it said that the Recom Vac CHB was licensed based on the clinical trial that only had 147 kids and only monitored safety for five days after injection, and has didn't list any control group.
• 23:29
  It just seemed it cannot be that that's what they licensed as product injection into millions.
• 23:34
  And the only other one, NRXB, only have four days of safety monitoring after injection.
• 23:39
  So during that deposition, I pulled it out and I said, Hey, Dr.
• 23:42
  Plockin, look at this.
• 23:44
  You know, is you know, five days.
• 23:47
  Is that long enough?
• 23:48
  I would thought he was gonna fight me on it.
• 23:50
  I thought he was going to tell me there's a trial that went five years because it's a baby and had 100,000 kids.
• 23:58
  Nothing like that.
• 24:00
  He insinuated on it about it when we got to Android's B because you realized how damning the admission was on Recomavax HB.
• 24:07
  So after the deposition, I subpoenaed him behalf of my client to produce any and all records to support that there was anything other than these five days of safety monitoring after injection with 147 kids, right?
• 24:22
  To license this product.
• 24:24
  You know what he did?
• 24:25
  He didn't give me any data.
• 24:26
  He didn't give me any studies.
• 24:27
  He went and hired a lawyer to file to quash that subpoena because he was in Pennsylvania, the case was in Michigan in a Pennsylvania court, believe it or not.
• 24:37
  That's what he went and did.
• 24:38
  He still has never provided any documents whatsoever to support that.
• 24:43
  I will tell you, I still found it incredible, even though there it was.
• 24:47
  We so we, on behalf of ICANN, the informed action network, which is the nonprofit we represent that supports a lot of our policy work.
• 24:55
  We went and we uh uh FOIA to the Freedom of Information Act, the FDA to give us the clinical trial documents, the underlying records to see is it really five days?
• 25:05
  And we got them.
• 25:07
  And when we got records, there it was.
• 25:10
  It was five days.
• 25:11
  And you want to hear the most incredible part.
• 25:13
  You ready for this, Dr.
• 25:14
  Tenpenny?
• 25:15
  When we got them, it also listed who the principal investigator was for the Recombovax HB trial for that trial with the five days for children.
• 25:25
  It was Dr.
• 25:25
  Stanley Plotkin.
• 25:27
  Meaning, when I sat in that deposition and I asked him about that trial and the five days, he was the principal investigator.
• 25:36
  The most incredible part is that he genuinely seemed uncertain of what the safety review period was until he looked it up in the package insert, even though he was the clinic investigator, which to me, as I write in the book reflects how little or how much safety really is an afterthought in these trials.
• 25:59
  It's almost like they don't really care.
• 26:01
  They just, I shouldn't say it that way.
• 26:02
  It's not about not caring.
• 26:04
  It's that they are already a priori assumed it is safe.
• 26:08
  They believe it.
• 26:09
  So they're not even worried about it.
• 26:10
  They're not really looking.
• 26:12
  Wow.
• 26:13
  Wow, Aaron, this is just so compelling and so interesting.
• 26:16
  And I just love how you've written these things in your book, Vaccines Amen.
• 26:21
  And so for right now, we're gonna take a really quick break.
• 26:24
  Uh hold that thought.
• 26:25
  We've got more to talk about in just a just a minute after this break.
• 26:28
  America Outloud um is as uh sponsored.
• 26:32
  This show is sponsored by America Outloud.news.
• 26:35
  America Outloud Talk Radio plays the 10 Penny Files on iHeartRadio Network at 3 p.m.
• 26:40
  Eastern every single day.
• 26:42
  All of our shows are then posted the following day on Spotify, Pandora, Apple Music, I um Tune In and iHeart Radio Studios the following day.
• 26:54
  We have virtual studios that are listening to us all across the world, and they're always here for you to go back and listen to them again.
• 27:02
  Um, this is uh we've got a great message coming up from our sponsor.
• 27:05
  They're the people that keep us alive and keep us on the on the air.
• 27:08
  So listen closely, we will be right back.
• 27:11
  There are an awful lot of people that are affiliates for Mike Lindell, because we all really appreciate what he does for this country.
• 27:16
  We appreciate the hard work that he does, and we appreciate his products.
• 27:21
  He has more than 200 products in his store, everything from pillowcases and comforters to doggy beds and to uh wonderful slippers and bathrobes.
• 27:30
  There's something for everybody and something for everybody in each age group.
• 27:35
  I mean, one of the things that I really like a lot are the pillowcases, the children's Bible story pillowcases that I just think are such a great way when you tuck your child into bed at night to use these pillowcases that they're they come from his store to start to tell the story about Adam and Eve and knowing the ark and and different things, and they're colorful and they're really pretty.
• 27:57
  So from children all the way up to uh you know, gentlemen that want to have like nice slippers, or to your dog, the doggy beds and things are just wonderful.
• 28:06
  So my pillow is a great place to shop for just about anything that you want.
• 28:10
  And if you use our affiliate code DRT, that helps us, that can benefit us, it helps Mike Lindell, and you'll get a great product for anybody that you're shopping for.
• 28:19
  Feeling the strain of rising costs, one of the biggest offenders isn't gas or groceries, it's health care.
• 28:25
  Over the past decade, health insurance premiums have skyrocketed by 47%.
• 28:30
  So ask yourself is your money working for you, or are you stuck in the old sick care system?
• 28:35
  The wellness company offers a better way, holistic, natural, and preventative care without middlemen or red tape.
• 28:42
  With their one wellness elite membership, you get incredible value for just 100 a month, two free medical grade nutraceuticals, free prescriptions on over 800 medications, free 24-7 concierge telemedicine access, discounts on supplements and emergency kits, no tricks, no hidden fine print.
• 29:02
  If you're already spending 100 plus a month on health expenses, this membership can save you money while providing real useful care.
• 29:10
  This isn't insurance, it's well care.
• 29:13
  Listeners get an exclusive discount with code outloud at TWC.health slash out loud.
• 29:19
  Take control of your health today.
• 29:20
  You wouldn't go a day without brushing your teeth or washing your hands.
• 29:24
  What about washing your nose?
• 29:26
  I mean, your nose does filter the air you breathe, air loaded with bacteria, viruses, and irritants.
• 29:31
  Make nasal hygiene part of your routine with clear.
• 29:35
  No messy bottles to fill, no drowning sensation.
• 29:38
  Clear is a natural drug-free saline with the added benefit of xylitol, which blocks bacterial and viral adhesion.
• 29:45
  Available in stores and online at clear.com.
• 29:48
  That is XLEAR.com.
• 29:50
  Have you been looking for a healthy snack for on the go?
• 29:52
  But all the energy and protein bars are just too sweet and full of sugar preservatives and mystery ingredients.
• 29:58
  Well, not all energy bars are soft and sugary.
• 30:00
  Bear bars are a crunchy savory bar made from just six simple natural ingredients made with veggies, nuts, and seeds.
• 30:06
  Bear bars are plant-based, organic, gluten-free, contain six grams of protein, and are low temp dried for a unique crunch.
• 30:13
  To learn more, just visit barebar.com forward slash out loud and get the exclusive discount just for America out loud listeners.
• 30:20
  That's B-E-A-R, B-A-R.com forward slash out loud.
• 30:25
  In just two minutes per day, you can reclaim your health and cut your grocery bill in half with one simple convenient product.
• 30:31
  Our doctor formulated green 85 juice formula's powerful dose of ultra-concentrated essential nutrients, stops hunger in its tracks, and supplies your cells with what's missing in the grocery store food.
• 30:44
  Go to chemicalfree body.com forward slash out loud today, get nature's super multivitamin green 85, empower your immune system, cut down on your grocery bill, and save 20% on your first order.
• 30:59
  Well, did you see Google quietly updated its AI principles removing its pledge not to use AI for weapons or surveillance?
• 31:08
  A promise they agree to in 2018.
• 31:11
  Well, the American people have seen Google's track record.
• 31:14
  Prompt in the question is Google, an untrustworthy player in the AI race.
• 31:24
  Now is our time, my fellow Americans.
• 31:27
  America outmaud news, liberty and justice for all.
• 31:38
  Welcome back, everyone.
• 31:39
  Today we're talking to attorney Aaron Seary about his book, Vaccines, Amen.
• 31:44
  And that's kind of the way that the pro-vaccine people look at it.
• 31:47
  You know, one of the things that you talked about in the beginning, and I mentioned that this to you previously.
• 31:53
  The very first when I took a deep dive down the first rabbit hole and found the um I read the general recommendations of vaccination, the 1998 version, because my first introduction to all of this was in September of 2000.
• 32:07
  And when I read that, it was poorly written, written to about a third grade level, and then there were like 20 or 30 different references, and all the references were the CDC and you know the MMWR, and it would be like uh for the audience, it would be like Sherry Tempany writing an uh a journal article, and then all of the references inside of that article were written by Sherry Tenpenny, and that's kind of the way it was it is and has been with Plattkin and his textbooks and that.
• 32:34
  And you mention in your book about the MMWR and how the rules are that things get published there.
• 32:41
  Tell us about that.
• 32:42
  Oh, sure.
• 32:43
  Uh yeah, it uh or a lot of times when you see the FDA come out with its guidance, including guidance that results in just rights crushing mandates, right?
• 32:54
  Taking away our civil individual rights with regards to choice, they often cite back to their own studies, their own data in the MMWR, which um a lot of uh folks will call their journal, I call it their newsletter, and here's why.
• 33:08
  First of all, it doesn't go through peer review.
• 33:11
  Not not by the way, that the peer review process is such a great thing.
• 33:15
  It's got real problems, but it doesn't even do that.
• 33:19
  Instead, MMWR articles, they go through something called clearance process within the CDC.
• 33:26
  In that clearance process, one of the requirements for the article to get published is that it meets that it conforms, excuse me, with the CDC's policy.
• 33:37
  So if the CDC policy is that vaccines are safe and effective, it has to align with that policy.
• 33:43
  If it doesn't, it doesn't get published.
• 33:46
  That's called selection bias.
• 33:47
  That's not science.
• 33:48
  That is the perversion of science.
• 33:51
  And I'll give you one real world example.
• 33:54
  You might remember the very beginning of COVID.
• 33:56
  The CDC put out guidance and said if you've got vaccines, if you've got the COVID shot, you can no longer, you can, you don't have to wear your mask.
• 34:04
  This is the very beginning.
• 34:05
  You can now go out, you can go to school, you can go to your work, you can enjoy all your civil liberties.
• 34:12
  But if you didn't get the COVID vaccine, no rights for you.
• 34:16
  Okay.
• 34:17
  So one of the things we did was we immediately wrote to the CDC and we sent a formal petition to them, and we said, hey.
• 34:25
  Because at this point, by the way, most folks had already been infected.
• 34:28
  Because by 20, by 2021, by middle of the year when these guidance was coming out, most of the people had been infected already.
• 34:35
  So we wrote, or by the end of 2021.
• 34:38
  And so we wrote them and said, hey, look.
• 34:40
  The data, the studies that are out there show that those who have been infected already have even more robust immunity than those who've had vaccine.
• 34:51
  But you don't have that on your list.
• 34:53
  You don't have on your list that if you've been infected, you can have all your rights back.
• 34:58
  By the way, you should always have your rights.
• 35:00
  The whole notion that your rights are contingent, what some bureaucrat puts on a list that the CDC is is antithetical to freedom, it's destructive to our liberties.
• 35:09
  Just putting that aside.
• 35:10
  But at least on this point, it was, you know, I didn't have to argue, I wasn't arguing a rights point.
• 35:16
  I was arguing a basic science point.
• 35:18
  Like you can't leave these folks out because they have even better immunity.
• 35:23
  And I pointed to studies that had millions of people in them that have been conducted all around the world.
• 35:28
  The CDC wrote us back, because they had to.
• 35:31
  It was a formal petition.
• 35:32
  They cited one study in response.
• 35:35
  It was a silly CDC case control study involving a few hundred people in the South that they did.
• 35:41
  That was the most ridiculous quote unquote study you've ever seen that supported their position to not include those who are uh already had been infected and weren't vaccinated on their list of people who can have their rights.
• 35:56
  So think, and then we wrote them back and listed like a hundred more studies.
• 35:59
  So they had one nonsense study in the MWR to support their position, ignored the entire body of science, but yet that is what they use to make their policy.
• 36:09
  That is how the MMWR works.
• 36:11
  It's selection bias.
• 36:12
  You cannot trust any study out of the MWR because they're all confounded for that reason.
• 36:18
  The CDC could have done 20 studies, 19 showed harm, one showed benefit, but they'll only publish the one that shows benefit if that's the one that conforms with their policy.
• 36:31
  Isn't that the standard now, even within medical journals?
• 36:36
  I know that that was discussed uh a few years ago that negative studies were not going to be published anymore, whether it was a vaccine or a drug.
• 36:45
  Uh what's the status of that?
• 36:48
  Well, I quoted my book um uh a number of former editors of major publications of the New England Medical Journal and a bunch of others.
• 36:56
  And in their own words, or um power or or to paraphrase others, medical journals, unfortunately have become a money, a not a money laundering, an information laundering operation, probably worse than money laundering, actually.
• 37:10
  Information laundering operation for pharmaceutical companies.
• 37:14
  These journals need to survive, they need pharma patronage, and not only that, those who work at the journals, they eventually are going, work other places.
• 37:21
  They work at hospitals, they work in in other institutions.
• 37:24
  Um, and if they, you know, don't publish, edit, review, or accept things in a manner that align with pharmaceutical company interests, they're gonna save face severe backlash.
• 37:37
  And so what you end up is yes, you also end up with very bad selection bias um in the pharmaceutical, excuse me, in the medical journals.
• 37:45
  And again, that's not me saying that.
• 37:48
  That's those who've directly been editors in chief and editors of the major journals around the world.
• 37:54
  Oh, it so it is true that they don't publish if they if there were 10 negative studies, those don't get published.
• 38:01
  Um, well, that happens for a few reasons.
• 38:04
  That actually doesn't happen at the journal level per se.
• 38:07
  That happens actually at the funding level.
• 38:10
  So if pharmaceutical company goes out and funds a study, if they don't like the results, they just don't publish it.
• 38:16
  If they like the result, they will publish it.
• 38:19
  That happens all the time.
• 38:20
  There's a lot, there are many documented cases of that happening.
• 38:23
  Um, and uh, you know, and I've spoken to many researchers privately about this very topic.
• 38:29
  Because at the end of the day, the funding source often dictates whether it gets published.
• 38:33
  And so um, you know, yes, you end up with a selection bias.
• 38:37
  So if the pharma company does, let's say 10 studies, one shows a strong benefit, nine show a week, and seven show the opposite, they'll maybe just publish the one that shows the benefit.
• 38:49
  You know, the the deeper you dig into this rabbit hole, the more nefarious and awful it gets.
• 38:56
  And since there is no real data, there's no safety studies that have ever been done uh for the long long enough period of time.
• 39:03
  And if they have done them, they're not, they're probably not punished.
• 39:07
  How can we even talk to parents about informed consent?
• 39:12
  And what does that, I mean, what does that look like the way it is now, and what should it look like?
• 39:18
  Sure.
• 39:19
  Um I think informed consent comes in many forms.
• 39:24
  You can have a parent that says, look, I just trust my doctor, I'm just gonna do what they say.
• 39:28
  Um, you have other parents who say, I would like to know more.
• 39:32
  You have others who will do extensive research.
• 39:35
  You know, informed consent is the idea that look, I'm gonna I'm gonna be informed.
• 39:40
  Um, I'm gonna take the information I want, and then I'm gonna choose whether to consent, right?
• 39:45
  And once you've made that choice, um, that should be the end of the story.
• 39:49
  Unfortunately, mandates, they often use coercion to still get you to take the product.
• 39:54
  Now, with that said, I think the first step in getting to true informed consent.
• 40:00
  Is getting parents to start thinking about these products and stop believing in them.
• 40:04
  Most parents are good parents.
• 40:06
  They want to do what's best for their children.
• 40:08
  I rarely met a parent who's like, I want to do bad for my kid.
• 40:11
  Most parents love their children.
• 40:12
  They want to do what's best for them.
• 40:14
  And most parents, um, you know, what they know is uh what they see on TV, what they see on the news.
• 40:20
  Trust my doctor, do what my doctor says.
• 40:23
  They don't typically follow that in any other an arena.
• 40:26
  You know, most people don't go into a car dealership and go, oh, yeah, I'm just gonna trust the salesman.
• 40:32
  No, they say, I want to see the uh, I want to see the crash test reports on that before I get that car from my daughter or my son and put them behind the wheel.
• 40:41
  I I'd like to see the crash test rating, please.
• 40:43
  You know, I want to kick the tires.
• 40:45
  And if you think about any other consumer product, you often you take a minute to just evaluate.
• 40:51
  It doesn't need to be deep.
• 40:52
  I mean, but you you you you you you take that opportunity to really look at it because you don't believe in them.
• 40:58
  You think about them, you treat them as products.
• 41:01
  And the problem with vaccines is most parents of their no not no fault of their own, because that's all they've ever been exposed to is they just believe in these products.
• 41:12
  They're like, oh, I believe in this.
• 41:14
  In fact, you hear all the time, people when you say something about vaccines, they'll they'll go, you don't believe in vaccines?
• 41:20
  Like, how could you not?
• 41:22
  Right?
• 41:22
  But you don't hear them about anything else.
• 41:24
  So to me, the way you get to informed consent is we need to get enough, and you and you know, you've been out there for a long time, Dr.
• 41:32
  Tenpenny trying to do exactly this.
• 41:34
  You've been trying to get people to think about vaccines, not believe in them, right?
• 41:40
  That's what you need.
• 41:40
  It's it that doesn't mean that people need to become an expert in these products.
• 41:44
  They don't need to like learn a lot about them, even they just need to start seeing them as products.
• 41:50
  Because if you when you see them as a product, you will ask questions.
• 41:55
  You will think before you inject, you know, should I get this one?
• 42:00
  Should I not get this one?
• 42:01
  Maybe I should get more of it, maybe I should not.
• 42:03
  And that actually is the whole purpose, I think, you know, we talked about earlier why I wrote this book.
• 42:07
  It wasn't to get people to think vaccines good, vaccines bad, be anti-vaccine, be pro-vaccine.
• 42:14
  Those are it's it's you know, I'm not, I don't think uh this camera I'm I'm looking at right now is good or bad, and I'm not pro or anti the camera I'm looking at.
• 42:22
  It's just a camera.
• 42:23
  Okay.
• 42:24
  It could do good, it could do bad, it could, right?
• 42:27
  The point is I treat it like a product.
• 42:29
  And I wrote the book to get parents and everybody in the public to think about these products, stop believing in them.
• 42:36
  Because once we do that, we can start addressing some of the real issues that occur and people can start making good choices, real informed consent.
• 42:44
  That's really excellent.
• 42:45
  You know, I've been doing this for 25 years, Aaron, you know, and I've long said, because it's really true that if I'm not sleeping, I'm probably reading about, talking about, listening about something that has to do with the vaccine industry, because there's a big scope of things that you listen to, either new vaccines, new adjuvants, um, new products, new political things, uh, things that are going on in the government.
• 43:08
  There's always there's always some moving part somewhere.
• 43:11
  And I remember coming to the hearing recently, a few months ago, uh, that you were testifying at that hearing, and I loved what you said to Senator Blumenthal when he was trying to like nail you against the wall for not being a doctor, and you said no, but I've deposed a lot of them, and I have to depend on facts, not just on my title or something like that.
• 43:32
  It was so good because it's so true, because you just nail out the facts.
• 43:37
  So we're having all of these um Senate hearings now about vaccines.
• 43:41
  We've got Secretary Kennedy up there, you know, fighting off all of the angry, rabid alligators that he's swimming with, trying to do what he's trying to do.
• 43:51
  We've got the president of the United States for the first time ever, the leader of our country standing up going, what is it about that autism thing?
• 43:58
  That's pretty bad.
• 43:59
  We should get to the bottom of it.
• 44:01
  And there's more and more books.
• 44:02
  There's books like yours, vaccines, amen.
• 44:05
  You know, I just came out with a book, Zero Accountability in a Failed System.
• 44:08
  Um, there's more and more books out now that when I started this 25 years ago, nobody talked about it except in Hush Voices around a vaccine-injured child.
• 44:17
  There were very few references.
• 44:19
  It was hard to even find things on the internet, and there weren't very many books.
• 44:24
  But now the the volume of information that's now out there, like you said, to get people to stop believing in vaccines and start thinking about them as a product, or to start looking at the at the at the risk about this and knowing that has really the the crescendo has never been bigger.
• 44:43
  Do you think we're ever going to get to the place where people just say, no, thank you, I'm not doing this anymore.
• 44:49
  Do you think the house of cards will ever come down?
• 44:52
  Um I I think we're going to get to a place.
• 44:55
  I believe we are going to get to the place to use uh language of religion.
• 45:00
  Um I'm confident that in time we will get to a place where everybody will have choice.
• 45:08
  We all do things in our lives that come with risks.
• 45:12
  Um, but that's what freedom is about, is the ability to let every individual choose what they do.
• 45:18
  Some far greater risk than others.
• 45:21
  And to me, um, at the end of the day, you know, what separates a statin from a vaccine is the fact that with statins, nobody's coercing you to get them.
• 45:32
  Nobody's compelling you to get them.
• 45:35
  And if you're injured, you can sue the manufacturer for them.
• 45:38
  We need to get to a place with vaccines where people can have true choice.
• 45:44
  And that means if I say no, you don't kick my kid out of school.
• 45:48
  If I say no, you don't throw me out of my job.
• 45:50
  If I say no, you don't exclude me from public places.
• 45:53
  If I say no, you don't take away my medical license.
• 45:55
  If I say no, you don't try and gaslight me, you don't try to throw me out of your medical practice.
• 46:00
  Go down the list of the things that they do to people who choose not to get this product.
• 46:04
  I mean, they're treated in a manner that is hard to fathom.
• 46:10
  Replace unvaccinated as a group with any racial ethnic minority.
• 46:16
  And imagine saying to that group, what you say they're unvaccinated.
• 46:20
  They're selfish, they're bad, throw them out of school, kick them out of society.
• 46:25
  You'd be horrified.
• 46:26
  That's how they treat these folks.
• 46:27
  And who are these folks who don't vaccinate to your point of a second ago?
• 46:30
  They're often they're often families who have an injured child, or they are or an injured adult, often an injured child.
• 46:38
  And they don't want to keep vaccinating that child.
• 46:41
  Because medical science can't validate it.
• 46:42
  It won't, more vaccines won't make it worse.
• 46:45
  And medical science cannot validate that their other children won't be seriously injured as well, or even die.
• 46:50
  I have cases like that as well.
• 46:52
  And so that's who mandates impact.
• 46:56
  They don't impact those who want to get them.
• 46:58
  You want to get them, that's freedom, it's America.
• 47:01
  But the mandates, they harm those who need to avoid these products the most.
• 47:08
  Because, you know, most people don't wake up one day and say, you know what I want to do today, I'm just going to stop vaccinating.
• 47:13
  I'm going to take a position that gets my kids kicked out of school, meet thrown out of a job, called all kinds of, you know, pejoratives.
• 47:20
  No.
• 47:21
  People have a powerful experience that often results them taking this socially often socially ostracized, socially bucking decision with often serious repercussions.
• 47:33
  And so I am confident that the public will over time begin to understand what they have doing to these families is so wrong, so bad that, like we are now seeing in Florida, mandates are going to go away.
• 47:50
  Right.
• 47:50
  And that just means we'll be as free as Sweden, Normark, Denmark, uh, you know, uh, where they don't have any mandates.
• 47:58
  Um, because if once you remove the mandates and you remove the coercion, people can start really thinking rashly.
• 48:04
  And then I think Dr.
• 48:05
  Tenpenny, we can get we are we'll will move in a better direction when it comes to these products.
• 48:12
  You know, I agree with you to a large degree that that's really true, that people should be given a choice.
• 48:18
  But it's sort of like a choice to play Russian roulette.
• 48:22
  You know, you know that these products are dangerous, they've never been proven to be safe.
• 48:27
  They've got loads of aluminum chemicals, cow blood, chicken parts, dog kidney cells, human aborted fetal cells, and on and on in there.
• 48:37
  And yet we can say, if you want to take this, it's okay.
• 48:40
  I guess that's a libertarian, you know, maybe a free American choice position.
• 48:46
  But on the other hand, um, would it be okay to keep uh a licensed product on the market like that has that's full of arsenic, or that it's that we know that as soon as you take that, you're gonna get very sick and will and like and you could very well die, which is what happens with vaccines, and particularly with given so many at the same time.
• 49:06
  Um I it I struggle with that, that free the the balance between freedom of choice and uh allowing people to be given uh a whole series of products that we know is dangerous.
• 49:20
  Well, I'll distinguish between two things the licensure and the mandates.
• 49:24
  So with the licensure, I completely agree with you.
• 49:27
  The FDA should not be if the if the federal government is gonna put its stamp of approval on a product, then it better demand proper data before it does that, or don't do it at all, right?
• 49:42
  Because once it gives that imprint of legitimacy, people trust it.
• 49:48
  And so I completely agree with you that the licensure of these products should be done based on proper clinical trials, which they do with drugs, because they also have often multiple.
• 50:00
  Year of placebo controlled trials because the drug companies, the pharma companies, they'll be liable.
• 50:04
  They want to do those trials well, because they want to know if it's safe because they don't want to lose money afterwards, but they don't have that concern with vaccines.
• 50:12
  And so I agree with you, they should be you know multi-year placebo controlled trials um for um you know that are properly powered for for vaccines because not a single one has gone through that for a routine injected child vaccine has gone through that.
• 50:26
  So I agree with you in that score.
• 50:27
  And if that results in having to uh you know suspend or whatever, that's that's one thing.
• 50:34
  But I view that as separate from mandates, and I'll tell you why.
• 50:39
  Um if the government has the authority to, for example, um prohibit you from getting a vaccine, then in some ways you ceded them the authority to also mandate a vaccine.
• 50:59
  So to me, the government just needs to be out of the business of it entirely.
• 51:03
  Because today I say the government has to you know put a law in that says you can't get this product tomorrow.
• 51:13
  That means you've said they have the authority to decide whether you can or can't get it.
• 51:16
  And so it goes the other way.
• 51:18
  So I agree with you on the licensure part, which is I think what you're saying, which is shouldn't license them to begin with at all.
• 51:25
  Um, but you know, but once they're licensed, you know, I just think the government needs to be completely out of the business of these products.
• 51:32
  It's what's caused so many of the problems that we have right now.
• 51:34
  It's that ridiculous business model we went through a little bit ago.
• 51:38
  Think about all of that.
• 51:39
  It's all government involvement.
• 51:40
  It's it's corrupted the entire process.
• 51:42
  The entire thing is just to me, it's just a big ball of mess of unsafe products given to children that can't say no, thank you.
• 51:52
  I please don't inject me with that to coercion and mental uh changing that's happened to pediatricians and other types of doctors.
• 52:00
  I mean, it's just really a um uh a really bad situation all the way around.
• 52:06
  Um, do you think that the with what uh Secretary Kennedy is doing with demanding new studies and and and all of these things, do you think that they're gonna that's gonna dig into the NIH and will become a reality?
• 52:20
  I I sure hope so.
• 52:21
  I sure hope that proper clinical trials and proper post licensure safety review um will become a reality.
• 52:28
  Um he's got his work cut out for him, as you know.
• 52:31
  He's got about 65,000 career employees below him.
• 52:34
  Uh, and the closer they are to vaccine involvement, I mean the more zealous they are.
• 52:39
  And I say that from the millions of pages of internal documents we've gotten over the years and reviewed at my firm, um, you know, from within FDA, CDC, and IH, H H S, HERSA, all of them.
• 52:51
  Um, and then you know, and then he's got above in the White House who he has to get approval from for better or worse.
• 52:58
  And so he's you know, he's kind of sandwiched.
• 53:00
  Uh, but uh, he's trying.
• 53:01
  Um, and I know his heart's in it.
• 53:03
  You know, he's given up more than anybody I know.
• 53:06
  Um, he's walked away from you know, being a Kennedy, being the darling, being on the cover of magazines, having a million appointments where all I had to do is lend his name to sacrificing it all to stand up for for those injured by vaccines.
• 53:20
  He's you know, and uh um he's not uh I I see no I see I see I don't see him relenting in any way now.
• 53:27
  So I think he's gonna fight this as hard as he can to get to the truth.
• 53:31
  And and and I should just add, look, I completely agree with you.
• 53:34
  If if you're a doctor and um there's a you're gonna give a Happy vaccine to a baby, um, and you look at it and you now know that it was licensed based on a clinical trial with five days of safety monitoring with 147 kids.
• 53:50
  The medical by the excuse me, the drug uh ethics literature would tell you that using that product's unethical, that it's unethical to use a product that has not been properly trialed before licensure.
• 54:05
  And if you're a doctor out there and you're saying, well, okay, but after licensure safety tested, well, I challenge you to go read.
• 54:13
  Start with the 1991 MMWR report, where it became a universal recommendation and look at the seven studies they cited, read them.
• 54:21
  Four adults, three are children, and those also only had days of safety review, and then go look at the Institute of Medicine Reform from 2012 that look at the 21 supposedly most commonly claimed injuries from hepatitis B vaccine, according to the CDC and HRSA, another agency who's paying the Institute of Medicine to find that they the vaccines don't cause them, so they can deny claims.
• 54:44
  And IOM said, you haven't studied 20 or 21 of these injuries for us to reach a conclusion.
• 54:50
  So don't take our word for it on this show.
• 54:54
  Take the CDC's own word in their own MMWR, the Institute of Medicine reports reward, and the FDA's word in the package insert.
• 55:02
  And if you and if that doesn't persuade you, then all I could say to you is vaccines amen.
• 55:07
  You're a true believer.
• 55:08
  Because you won't even trust the data from your own, you know, church from the CDC, the FDA, and the IOM.
• 55:14
  That was you know, Aaron, I was so looking forward to this interview after reading uh I I admit I've read about half of your book, and now I'm looking forward to reading the rest of it, because vaccines amen really is a summary of all the things that we need to know.
• 55:29
  And I was so looking forward to having this conversation with you.
• 55:32
  And I was not disappointed, and I'm sure that our listeners were not were not disappointed either.
• 55:37
  So thank you so much for your time for joining us here today to lay out the truth about the religion of vaccination in your book, vaccines, amen.
• 55:46
  Um, I'm sure that the best you can find it where all books books are sold.
• 55:50
  And um, I think that it's just an incredible book that adds to all the information that we need to know and to need to study about uh problems associated with vaccine in your closing comment spoken well like an attorney, uh, the way that you just wound that up and got everybody to think you've got to know this, or you're just fire following the belief of vaccinology and you're believing in a myth, a 200-year multi-generational indoctrination that has really no foundation.
• 56:19
  And when you go back and even look at the smallpox vaccines and all the horrible stuff that was going on with that, um, and that it was just they just made it up.
• 56:27
  They just made it up and they perpetuated it all these years.
• 56:31
  So, with that, I want to thank everybody who's joined us here today.
• 56:34
  And you, if you want to re-listen to this, it'll be available tomorrow on all of those different podcast podcast platforms, Spotify, Pandora, Apple Music, tune in, iHeartRadio Virtual Studio, that's all be available again tomorrow.
• 56:48
  And go out and get Aaron's book.
• 56:49
  It's an incredible book.
• 56:50
  It's something that should be in your library.
• 56:52
  So with that, I want to close out with one of my favorite verses from the Bible.
• 56:55
  I close all of my podcasts with, whether it is live or pre-recorded, which is Romans 12, 12.
• 57:01
  Rejoice in hope, be patient in trouble, and be persistent in prayer.
• 57:05
  Lean into God, trust him for everything he won't let you down.
• 57:08
  I'll see you tomorrow at 3 p.m.
• 57:10
  Eastern right here at America Out Loud News and the iHeart Radio Station.
• 57:14
  Um, all of our shows are uplayloaded to those podcast platforms I mentioned afterwards, and the 10 penny files can also be found, and you can follow me at dr10penny.com, the and my substack, dr10penny dot substack.com.
• 57:28
  And um, I hope that you too will take a look at my new book, which is zero accountability in a failed system.
• 57:35
  So have a great day, everyone.
• 57:36
  We will see you here tomorrow, all right here on the 10penny files.
• 57:40
  Goodbye and God bless.