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Transcript

What Did the Military Take From Kecksburg? Inside the 1965 UFO Crash Mystery · Aliens? Yes! But Maybe No | UFOs, UAPs & Alien Mysteries

• 0:03
  Josh: Aliens Aliens.
• 0:07
  Travis: Yes.
• 0:08
  Travis: But maybe no.
• 0:10
  Travis: Well, hello there, good listener.
• 0:22
  Travis: Welcome back to the show.
• 0:23
  Travis: Aliens, yes, but maybe no with Josh and Travis.
• 0:27
  Travis: I'm Travis.
• 0:28
  Josh: I'm Josh.
• 0:29
  Travis: And this is an otherworldly podcast as ambiguous as our title.
• 0:33
  Josh: Most people don't know this.
• 0:34
  Josh: We record for a really long time because Travis's hair grows very similar to that of the hair on the movie Santa Claus.
• 0:44
  Travis: Yeah.
• 0:44
  Travis: So it's constantly shaving.
• 0:46
  Josh: Yeah, he has to about every eight minutes he goes and shaves.
• 0:49
  Travis: Yep.
• 0:49
  Travis: That's the opener that you settled on.
• 0:52
  Travis: Do you want to workshop that opener, Josh?
• 0:54
  Josh: No, I is that bad.
• 0:55
  Travis: You're happy with it?
• 0:55
  Travis: Happy with the way that turned out?
• 0:57
  Josh: Yeah.
• 0:57
  Travis: Yeah.
• 0:57
  Travis: Is that okay?
• 0:58
  Travis: Well, let us know.
• 0:59
  Travis: Was that funny, listeners?
• 1:01
  Josh: I think so.
• 1:01
  Travis: Do you do you want to listen to more hair-themed jokes?
• 1:04
  Josh: Santa Claus jokes?
• 1:06
  Travis: Or the Santa Claus, for sure.
• 1:08
  Josh: I did not look at what we did last episode.
• 1:11
  Josh: Anunnaki?
• 1:12
  Travis: Yeah.
• 1:12
  Travis: Anunnaki.
• 1:14
  Josh: Yeah.
• 1:15
  Travis: Did you have to look?
• 1:16
  Josh: I was about to look and then I remembered.
• 1:18
  Travis: Yeah.
• 1:18
  Travis: Did your your lady boner soften in the last two weeks since talking about the Anunnaki?
• 1:23
  Travis: A lady boner is like where it's hard on the inside, right?
• 1:25
  Josh: No comment.
• 1:26
  Travis: Is that how you get with when you talk about the Anunnaki?
• 1:28
  Travis: Hard on the inside?
• 1:29
  Travis: That's how girl anatomy works too, right?
• 1:31
  Josh: I don't know.
• 1:32
  Josh: I think I'm still just as excited.
• 1:35
  Josh: It was nice to get a little bit more info.
• 1:37
  Josh: It was a lot more lore heavy than I would have expected.
• 1:41
  Travis: Yeah.
• 1:41
  Josh: It was fascinating though.
• 1:43
  Travis: Yeah.
• 1:43
  Travis: Found it very interesting.
• 1:44
  Josh: Yeah, go listen to the episode if you guys want to learn about the Anunnaki, one of the famous alien species.
• 1:50
  Josh: Sure.
• 1:50
  Josh: Potentially are creators.
• 1:52
  Josh: I don't know.
• 1:53
  Travis: Creators?
• 1:54
  Travis: Question mark.
• 1:55
  Josh: Mm-hmm.
• 1:56
  Josh: Hmm.
• 1:56
  Josh: So this episode, we're talking about Kexburg UFO crash.
• 2:00
  Travis: Yeah.
• 2:01
  Travis: Really quick, I want everybody to do a Google image search on Kexburg incident and tell me what image pops up.
• 2:08
  Josh: I'm gonna do it right now.
• 2:10
  Travis: You should know because I sent you this picture.
• 2:12
  Josh: Oh, yeah, there it is.
• 2:14
  Travis: Mm-hmm.
• 2:14
  Travis: So is it fair to say that we're just gonna cover the tip of the Kexburg incident?
• 2:19
  Travis: It looks like a tip.
• 2:20
  Travis: Just the tip of it.
• 2:21
  Travis: It's a tip.
• 2:22
  Travis: It certainly is.
• 2:23
  Travis: It's huge.
• 2:24
  Josh: It is huge.
• 2:25
  Josh: It's a big tip.
• 2:26
  Travis: It is.
• 2:26
  Travis: I think they did themselves a real disservice by painting it flesh colored.
• 2:30
  Josh: Yeah.
• 2:31
  Josh: Yeah, it looks like uh an acorn.
• 2:33
  Travis: Sure.
• 2:34
  Travis: I mean, now that you say it now, I'm like, oh yeah, of course.
• 2:37
  Travis: It's an acorn.
• 2:38
  Josh: Yeah.
• 2:39
  Travis: Right.
• 2:40
  Josh: So this incident is witness heavy.
• 2:42
  Travis: Yeah.
• 2:43
  Travis: Did you watch the video?
• 2:44
  Josh: I did.
• 2:45
  Travis: What did you think?
• 2:46
  Josh: It was witness heavy.
• 2:47
  Travis: It was so I didn't finish it.
• 2:50
  Travis: And I feel like I got the gist of it though, because it it was just the same accounting over and not the same, but they're like military, military, military, military personnel.
• 3:00
  Josh: Right.
• 3:01
  Travis: Well, how do you describe it?
• 3:02
  Travis: They were wearing green clothes and a beret.
• 3:05
  Travis: There were some heavy set guys, there were some tall guys, but they were definitely military.
• 3:08
  Travis: And SARS is like, okay, I mean, that's that's great.
• 3:12
  Josh: Near the end, there's some really good different stories.
• 3:15
  Josh: Yeah.
• 3:15
  Josh: I'm just letting you guys know, the listener, if you have a witness sensitivity, you might want to skip this episode.
• 3:22
  Josh: What does that mean?
• 3:23
  Josh: If you have a sensitivity to witnesses.
• 3:25
  Travis: Is this is this a bit?
• 3:27
  Josh: I'm trying to.
• 3:28
  Josh: What are you doing?
• 3:29
  Josh: Why is why are you hurting me?
• 3:30
  Josh: Because you're not like you hurt me.
• 3:34
  Travis: Hey, listener, we don't set any of these bits up before we go.
• 3:37
  Travis: Sometimes Josh just rolls and he does it so sincerely, I never know when it's a bit.
• 3:42
  Josh: My kids never know when I'm joking either.
• 3:44
  Travis: Nobody does.
• 3:45
  Travis: It could be very confusing.
• 3:46
  Josh: I know.
• 3:47
  Josh: Most of the time I'm joking.
• 3:49
  Travis: So if you have witness sensitivity.
• 3:51
  Josh: Right.
• 3:51
  Travis: Yeah, there's a witness sensitivity warning right at the beginning.
• 3:54
  Travis: Love this bit.
• 3:55
  Travis: This should continue.
• 3:56
  Travis: Let's make this a full-time bit.
• 3:58
  Josh: Yeah.
• 3:58
  Josh: If you have a evidence sensitivity.
• 4:01
  Travis: Oh, and now it's uh everything.
• 4:03
  Travis: Okay.
• 4:03
  Travis: Yeah.
• 4:03
  Travis: Got it.
• 4:04
  Travis: A personal accounting sensitivity.
• 4:06
  Travis: Idiot sensitivity.
• 4:07
  Travis: Jeez, it's calling out people from Kecksburg, Josh.
• 4:10
  Travis: I didn't think you were going to do that on this podcast.
• 4:11
  Travis: No, it'd be us.
• 4:12
  Travis: Oh, sure.
• 4:13
  Travis: I mean, now we're on mic, you're backtracking.
• 4:15
  Travis: No, I never said anything.
• 4:16
  Travis: But before this record happened, you were pretty brave.
• 4:20
  Travis: No.
• 4:20
  Travis: And talking about how dumb you thought the people of Kecksburg were.
• 4:23
  Josh: No, I never said that.
• 4:25
  Travis: So.
• 4:25
  Travis: No way.
• 4:26
  Travis: Oh boy.
• 4:27
  Josh: Okay, but we are talking about the Kexburg UFO crash.
• 4:30
  Josh: And we're going to go through some of those witnesses.
• 4:33
  Travis: Okay.
• 4:33
  Travis: So let's just get going with the initial story.
• 4:36
  Josh: Yeah.
• 4:37
  Travis: So on December 9th, 1965, good year, a brilliant object blazed across the sky over Canada and the northeastern U.S.
• 4:44
  Travis: Observers noted the fireball, in quotes, performing control maneuvers before descending into woods near Kecksburg, Pennsylvania.
• 4:52
  Travis: The event quickly escalated as police, military, and reporters flooded the rural village.
• 4:56
  Travis: Locals reported blocked roads, sealed woods, and armed soldiers.
• 5:00
  Travis: Witnesses claimed a military flatbed truck hauled away a tarp-covered, acorn-shaped object.
• 5:07
  Travis: Acorn, wink wink.
• 5:09
  Josh: Mm-hmm.
• 5:10
  Travis: While the government officially dismissed it as a meteor with no recovery, those present insist a physical craft was seized.
• 5:16
  Travis: We're exploring Pennsylvania's most persistent UFO mystery, the Keksburg incident.
• 5:23
  Josh: Boom boom boom boom.
• 5:24
  Josh: So something was there, right?
• 5:27
  Josh: I mean, I believe the people.
• 5:29
  Josh: Sure.
• 5:30
  Josh: Yeah.
• 5:30
  Josh: Yeah.
• 5:30
  Josh: And it happened in late afternoon.
• 5:33
  Travis: I just wish that some of these, so this incident, or at least the video that we watched, was recorded years after.
• 5:39
  Josh: I wish that it was a little sooner.
• 5:41
  Travis: Closer to the incident happening, yes.
• 5:43
  Travis: I do.
• 5:44
  Travis: Because like memory is we've talked about this a ton on this podcast.
• 5:48
  Travis: Memory is pretty faulty, and you tend to remember things a little differently as you start to create your own narrative of what happened in your head.
• 5:56
  Josh: Yeah, I think there was even a couple of witnesses in their interview where they're like, it's been so long, I just don't remember.
• 6:03
  Travis: Yeah.
• 6:04
  Josh: So in the late afternoon of December 9, 1965, witnesses from Canada, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and other parts of the northeastern United States reported a brilliant object streaking across the sky.
• 6:16
  Josh: Uh in the Pittsburgh and Greensburg area of Pennsylvania, witnesses described a bright fireball moving rapidly before turning again and heading towards the Cacksburg area.
• 6:26
  Josh: The official explanation would later center on a meteor, but several local witnesses insisted this object behaved differently than a meteor should.
• 6:34
  Josh: So the sighting occurred around late afternoon, close to sunset.
• 6:37
  Josh: The object was bright enough to draw widespread attention.
• 6:40
  Josh: Some witnesses described it as moving too slowly for a meteor.
• 6:44
  Josh: Some accounts describe turns or directional changes.
• 6:48
  Travis: What?
• 6:49
  Josh: Right.
• 6:50
  Josh: That's pretty wild.
• 6:51
  Josh: That's saucery.
• 6:52
  Josh: Sorcery?
• 6:54
  Travis: Saucery.
• 6:54
  Travis: Like uh saucer, like a flying one.
• 6:58
  Josh: I like that.
• 6:58
  Josh: So the object reportedly came down in the woods near Kecksburg, a small rural village in Westmoreland County.
• 7:06
  Travis: I should have said TM after a saucery.
• 7:08
  Travis: That is uh I I own all the saucery-related IP and merchandise.
• 7:13
  Travis: Okay.
• 7:15
  Josh: Okay.
• 7:15
  Josh: So the object reportedly came down in woods near Kecksburg, a small rural village in Westmoreland County, Pennsylvania.
• 7:22
  Josh: So that's the flight overpath observation to where it landed.
• 7:28
  Travis: Yeah.
• 7:28
  Travis: Yep.
• 7:29
  Josh: And a lot of people witnessed it.
• 7:30
  Travis: Yeah, let's start with one of those witnesses.
• 7:32
  Travis: Okay.
• 7:33
  Travis: Want to?
• 7:34
  Travis: No.
• 7:35
  Travis: Okay.
• 7:36
  Travis: Well, thanks for coming to the show.
• 7:38
  Travis: It's been fun.
• 7:38
  Travis: Bye.
• 7:39
  Travis: No, yeah.
• 7:40
  Travis: I want to hear it.
• 7:41
  Travis: So one of these witnesses that Josh was setting up for me, his name was Randy Overly.
• 7:47
  Travis: He was about 10 years old at the time.
• 7:48
  Travis: So we already know right from the jump.
• 7:50
  Travis: Very reliable witness.
• 7:52
  Josh: Truthful, honest, everything as he's happened.
• 7:55
  Travis: He was playing outside an open field near Norvelt, Pennsylvania, with another boy when they heard an unusual noise and looked up.
• 8:02
  Travis: Randy described the object as acorn shaped, being brownish gray, smooth and constructed looking.
• 8:09
  Travis: I don't know what that means, like formed, intentional.
• 8:12
  Josh: In the interview, he was saying that it definitely wasn't like a natural thing.
• 8:16
  Josh: It looked like it was built.
• 8:18
  Josh: It wasn't like just a meteor.
• 8:20
  Josh: Okay.
• 8:21
  Travis: Man.
• 8:22
  Josh: Smart kid.
• 8:23
  Travis: Oh, okay, sure.
• 8:24
  Travis: But then it's also covered in a kind of vapor, trailing fire from the back.
• 8:28
  Travis: So I just, I mean, all these details are are are great, I think, individually, but now it's like it was covered in vapor, trailing fire from the back, that's pretty incredible.
• 8:38
  Travis: Making a hissing noise.
• 8:40
  Travis: Flying only about 200 feet above them and moving no faster than a small aircraft.
• 8:46
  Travis: So from Randy's perspective, this couldn't have been a meteor.
• 8:49
  Josh: Yeah, I was listening to his interview.
• 8:51
  Josh: But I mean, I don't know.
• 9:01
  Josh: I wasn't there.
• 9:02
  Travis: Yeah, I wasn't there.
• 9:03
  Josh: Who knows?
• 9:04
  Josh: So our next witness is Billy, otherwise known as Bully.
• 9:08
  Josh: Bush.
• 9:09
  Josh: Billy Bush or Bully Bush.
• 9:11
  Josh: He was outside working on a CD radio in his car when he saw a bluish fireball moving through the sky.
• 9:17
  Josh: He said the object appeared to come from the direction of Norvelt, heading towards Laurelville and the mountain.
• 9:24
  Josh: Then according to him, it looked as if the object could not clear the mountain.
• 9:28
  Josh: He described it as hesitating, then making a kind of U-turn and heading down towards Kexburg.
• 9:34
  Josh: Bush also later claimed that he went to a high point overlooking the area and saw what appeared to be blue sparking or flashlights down in the woods.
• 9:42
  Josh: And then an important note, some blue lights reported in this incident that night may have been caused by local boys using a camera strobe as a prank after hearing about the incident.
• 9:53
  Josh: And that doesn't automatically explain all the blue light accounts, but it does muddy the history just a little bit.
• 9:59
  Travis: So while witnesses were watching the sky, the story was already spreading through local media.
• 10:03
  Travis: And one of the central places this unfolded was WHJB Radio in Greensburg.
• 10:08
  Travis: WHJB, the county's first commercial radio station, began receiving call after call from listeners reporting a strange object.
• 10:15
  Travis: Mabel Mazza, the station's bookkeeper and office manager, recalled that calls started around 5 to 5.30 p.m.
• 10:23
  Travis: At first she thought people might be joking, but as the calls continued, she realized callers sounded serious, emotional, and excited.
• 10:30
  Travis: The station began hearing from locals, other radio and TV stations, and even the military.
• 10:35
  Travis: What do you think the military was doing calling?
• 10:38
  Josh: That that's the weird thing.
• 10:39
  Josh: In her interviews in the video, she mentioned that they called, was asking lots of questions, what other people are asking.
• 10:46
  Josh: They eventually asked for directions where this happened, where it landed.
• 10:54
  Travis: Yeah.
• 10:55
  Travis: Not Mr.
• 10:56
  Travis: Pentagon.
• 10:56
  Travis: Mr.
• 10:56
  Travis: Pentagon's my father's name.
• 10:58
  Josh: Oh.
• 10:59
  Travis: You can call me Joe.
• 11:01
  Travis: Joe Pentagon.
• 11:02
  Josh: A lot of bergs in this area.
• 11:04
  Travis: There are a lot of lot of bergs.
• 11:05
  Josh: Bergs and Vills.
• 11:06
  Josh: Yeah.
• 11:07
  Josh: So once the report changed from something in the sky to something came down, local authorities responded the way they would to a possible aircraft crash.
• 11:16
  Josh: Firefighters and police started moving towards the woods.
• 11:19
  Josh: After 6 30, WHJB reportedly received word that something had fallen into the woods near Kecksburg.
• 11:26
  Josh: John Murphy notified the Pennsylvania State Police in Greensburg and drove to the scene arriving around 7 20 p.m.
• 11:34
  Josh: At the scene, Murphy encountered Carl Metz, a state police fire marshal and another investigator.
• 11:40
  Josh: They reportedly entered the woods with a Geiger counter and a flashlight.
• 11:45
  Josh: When they returned, Murphy asked what they found.
• 11:47
  Josh: According to Murphy, Metz eventually told him, You better get your information from the Army.
• 11:52
  Josh: Soon after, Murphy went to Greensburg State Police Barracks where he said he saw Army and Air Force personnel.
• 11:58
  Josh: And when he returned to the Kexpert site with police and military, he was denied entrance to the woods.
• 12:04
  Josh: Hearing a lot of locals talk about this incident, everything was like cordoned off.
• 12:10
  Josh: People who wanted to go see or go down, they were denied.
• 12:15
  Travis: Yeah.
• 12:15
  Josh: Sometimes aggressively.
• 12:17
  Travis: Who brought the Geiger counter?
• 12:19
  Josh: I don't know.
• 12:19
  Josh: That's a weird thing to bring.
• 12:22
  Travis: That's a weird thing to just have.
• 12:23
  Josh: Yeah.
• 12:24
  Josh: That is true.
• 12:25
  Josh: I don't know anyone with a Geiger counter.
• 12:27
  Travis: Nor do I.
• 12:28
  Josh: And I know a lot of people.
• 12:30
  Josh: And I ask every single person.
• 12:32
  Travis: So it says soon after Murphy went to Greensburg State Police Barracks, he saw Army and Air Force personnel.
• 12:39
  Travis: Then he brought those same personnel to the site.
• 12:43
  Josh: Yeah, I would imagine it took a little bit of time for the Army and military to get there.
• 12:48
  Josh: And when they got there, they wanted to know exactly where it was.
• 12:51
  Travis: Interesting.
• 12:53
  Josh: And these are all just like different people's reports, too.
• 12:56
  Travis: Yeah, who's this John Murphy?
• 12:57
  Josh: I don't know.
• 12:58
  Travis: They didn't just some guy and the the police and military were like, John Murphy, I'll follow you anywhere.
• 13:03
  Josh: Yep.
• 13:04
  Josh: It's a strong name.
• 13:05
  Travis: Yep.
• 13:06
  Travis: I'd follow John Murphy into Eddie Woods.
• 13:08
  Travis: Yep.
• 13:08
  Travis: Totally normal thing to do.
• 13:10
  Travis: Normal and chill.
• 13:11
  Josh: Yeah.
• 13:11
  Travis: Okay.
• 13:12
  Travis: So we're going to talk a little bit about some of the struggles reporters have had bringing the story to light.
• 13:17
  Travis: So local reporters also showed up and several of them described the same thing.
• 13:21
  Travis: Bob Gaddy, a reporter for the Greensburg Tribune Review, was assigned to cover the story.
• 13:26
  Josh: I just want to say I would not follow a Bob Gaddy to many places.
• 13:30
  Travis: No, like it sounds like caddy, almost like gossipy.
• 13:35
  Josh: Or daddy.
• 13:36
  Travis: Sure, Bob Daddy wouldn't follow that guy into the woods.
• 13:39
  Travis: No way.
• 13:39
  Travis: Nope.
• 13:40
  Travis: Uh-uh.
• 13:40
  Travis: So Bob Gaddy expected to find nothing and said he found a large crowd, police and military officials, and a cordoned off area.
• 13:47
  Travis: Bob recalled being told the area was restricted because whatever came down could be radioactive.
• 13:52
  Travis: Classic.
• 13:53
  Josh: Yeah.
• 13:54
  Travis: He said he had covered accident scenes before, but this felt different.
• 13:57
  Travis: When he asked to go down and see what had landed, he was told he would be arrested.
• 14:01
  Travis: Jeez.
• 14:02
  Travis: But didn't they just refuse police?
• 14:04
  Travis: Who would be arresting him?
• 14:05
  Travis: The military?
• 14:06
  Josh: Well, that's what I was just thinking.
• 14:07
  Josh: Can military arrest people?
• 14:09
  Travis: Uh yeah, I believe.
• 14:10
  Travis: I believe they can.
• 14:11
  Travis: I mean, anybody can arrest anybody.
• 14:13
  Travis: That's what like essentially what a citizen's arrest is, right?
• 14:16
  Josh: Yeah, but no one does it.
• 14:18
  Travis: You have to declare you're doing a citizen's arrest, though.
• 14:20
  Travis: It's like you declare bankruptcy.
• 14:22
  Travis: You do it really loud on a group of your closest friends.
• 14:24
  Travis: It's true.
• 14:25
  Travis: Later that night, Ernie Hoffman, another Tribune Review reporter, arrived near Kexburg.
• 14:30
  Travis: He recalled seeing what appeared to be a military flatbed tractor trailer moving near a tree line with something under a tarp.
• 14:37
  Travis: Oh, well, what was it?
• 14:39
  Travis: An acorn?
• 14:40
  Travis: Maybe.
• 14:41
  Travis: A very big one.
• 14:42
  Travis: Hoffman said the next day's official explanation that people saw a meteor, but nothing landed there, felt unsatisfying because there had been too much activity for nothing to have happened.
• 14:53
  Josh: Yeah, I would have wanted an owl explanation.
• 14:56
  Josh: I would have preferred that.
• 14:58
  Travis: Yeah, I mean, like we get hit by meteors all the time here on Earth.
• 15:03
  Travis: The moon does, you know, a fair share of blocking and deflecting the Earth from a lot of meteors, but we do get a lot, and I don't think even big ones would warrant a military response.
• 15:16
  Travis: I mean, if it it was really big, it would be going really fast and it would cause I mean, you would hear it.
• 15:22
  Josh: Yeah.
• 15:22
  Travis: It would cause environmental disturbances.
• 15:26
  Josh: Yeah.
• 15:26
  Josh: But them saying nothing, and it's very obvious that they have this many people.
• 15:30
  Josh: Something's a little suspicious.
• 15:33
  Josh: Yeah, just like Roswell.
• 15:35
  Josh: If it was just an air balloon, why was the entire town swarming with military people?
• 15:40
  Travis: Yeah.
• 15:40
  Josh: That doesn't make sense.
• 15:42
  Travis: Yeah.
• 15:42
  Travis: What do you think these people in the military are told?
• 15:44
  Travis: Like the guys that are just out there picking stuff up.
• 15:47
  Travis: Do you think they're being told it's a weather balloon also?
• 15:49
  Travis: Because I think that is how you protect whatever it is you're trying to hide.
• 15:54
  Travis: And I just want to be clear like, this is not necessarily, I know that the military is like falls under the executive umbrella, but I don't think there are like senators in any of these rooms or people that work for like city council or town councils or whatever that are in like these military rooms watching radar and seeing these anomalous events land.
• 16:18
  Josh: Yeah.
• 16:19
  Travis: I think this is all 100% controlled by the military and kind of like, you know, need to know basis, you don't need to know.
• 16:27
  Josh: Yeah, I would imagine most of the people in the military are lied to or not told any information.
• 16:32
  Travis: That's that is what exactly what I think.
• 16:34
  Josh: Yeah.
• 16:35
  Travis: Or they're just told enough information to carry out or don't ask questions.
• 16:39
  Travis: Yeah, it's a chain of command type thing, right?
• 16:41
  Travis: Like if you're just a lowly grunt, you're not gonna ask your commanding officer why you have to go and recover this.
• 16:49
  Travis: You're just gonna go out and recover this thing and then bring it back.
• 16:52
  Travis: Yeah.
• 16:52
  Travis: But what I also am curious about is that people have a really hard time keeping a secret.
• 16:59
  Travis: Why haven't any of these military personnel come out and said, Oh, I was part of that operation in Kecksburg.
• 17:08
  Travis: This is what I saw.
• 17:09
  Josh: I mean, we don't know.
• 17:11
  Josh: We do know that people have been silenced.
• 17:14
  Travis: Uh oh.
• 17:15
  Josh: And we don't know who any of these military people are, so maybe they are not around anymore.
• 17:20
  Travis: Sure.
• 17:20
  Travis: I mean, that's that's a lot of speculation done on our part as podcasters.
• 17:25
  Josh: Right.
• 17:26
  Josh: But maybe they don't know that it was a big deal.
• 17:29
  Travis: Sure.
• 17:30
  Josh: So here's the firefighters' accounts.
• 17:32
  Josh: Uh James Mays.
• 17:33
  Josh: Strong name.
• 17:34
  Travis: I like that name too.
• 17:36
  Josh: Yeah.
• 17:36
  Josh: The first assistant fire chief of Kecksburg in 1965.
• 17:40
  Josh: He reportedly said firefighters were waiting at the fire station to assist in the search for a possible downed aircraft.
• 17:47
  Josh: Uh uh.
• 17:47
  Josh: He recalled seeing bright flashing blue lights from a hill, military personnel arriving, uh, the fire station being used as a command post, uh, around 20 to 25 military personnel in the area, firefighters transporting military officers by four-wheel drive fire vehicles towards the crash area and being told to stop before reaching the woods while military officers continued on foot.
• 18:09
  Travis: What do you think these flashing blue lights are?
• 18:12
  Josh: I don't know.
• 18:13
  Travis: I don't think that if this was a spacecraft, right?
• 18:16
  Travis: Do you think that they have like safety lights on their craft that flash?
• 18:22
  Travis: Like that seems ridiculous.
• 18:24
  Travis: What I think that this probably is, is it was probably military personnel vehicle lights maybe that were flashing up in the woods to just alert everybody around that was working on this where they were.
• 18:37
  Travis: I don't I have a hard time believing that this was the craft with lights flashing.
• 18:41
  Travis: Like, what would what would the purpose of that be?
• 18:43
  Travis: But I'm I'm asking that question as just like a dumb earthbound human who may not understand all of this newfangled alien technology that is or isn't being introduced to our humble planet.
• 18:58
  Josh: It could be the electrical stuff going haywire or something, or I mean, maybe they're mixed in memories.
• 19:05
  Josh: Yeah.
• 19:06
  Josh: And it is those youth being pranky.
• 19:09
  Josh: I don't know.
• 19:10
  Travis: Being pranky?
• 19:11
  Travis: Like being a pranky.
• 19:12
  Travis: Like doing doing a prank?
• 19:13
  Travis: Prankish, maybe.
• 19:14
  Travis: Yeah.
• 19:15
  Travis: I don't know, Josh.
• 19:16
  Travis: I'm just I'm just asking questions.
• 19:17
  Travis: That's all.
• 19:18
  Travis: That's crazy.
• 19:20
  Josh: So another firefighter, Robert Bittner, a Kexburg fireman, said he arrived near the impact area later that evening and saw a military truck, including a personnel carrier and a six by six army style vehicle.
• 19:32
  Josh: He and the other firefighters asked to go down into the ravine with the military, but were told no.
• 19:37
  Josh: The military reportedly went down for about half an hour, returned, and told the firefighters they were finished with their trucks.
• 19:43
  Travis: Um wild.
• 19:46
  Josh: Yeah, it is wild.
• 19:47
  Josh: Why get their own trucks?
• 19:48
  Josh: Why do they need to do that?
• 19:49
  Travis: Well, they didn't they shape their terribly unprepared, I guess.
• 19:52
  Travis: I don't I don't I don't know.
• 19:55
  Travis: I wonder if they had them sign out those trucks, like a vehicle acquisition paperwork or something.
• 20:04
  Travis: Or do you think they just showed up and they're like, I'm with the military, we're commandeering these vehicles.
• 20:09
  Josh: I would imagine something like that, or just you need to take us there now.
• 20:12
  Travis: And then told the firefighters they had to wait outside of the cordon off area.
• 20:17
  Josh: Yeah.
• 20:17
  Josh: Yeah, it's weird.
• 20:18
  Travis: Like, thank you, you got us this far, we'll get there the rest of the way.
• 20:21
  Travis: This yeah.
• 20:22
  Travis: That's the thing about personal accounts is that everybody has their own interpretation regarding these.
• 20:28
  Travis: And I'm not saying that this something didn't happen because quite clearly something did happen according to all of these accounts.
• 20:35
  Travis: I just it's just hard to get like a concrete idea, a concrete picture from all of these people saying, and not, and they're not like wildly different, but they are giving us information that is a bit of a head scratcher, at least for me.
• 20:51
  Travis: Again, dumb earthbound human.
• 20:54
  Josh: No, I I agree, but that's what's so nice about having so many witnesses, is like you can kind of piece it together enough to get the big picture.
• 21:03
  Travis: So one family lived much closer to where the object allegedly came down.
• 21:07
  Travis: Their farmhouse became one of the strangest pieces of the Keksburg story.
• 21:11
  Travis: The Hayes family had recently rented a farmhouse near the suspected impact area.
• 21:15
  Travis: Family members recalled hearing radio reports that a fireball had fallen near Acme.
• 21:20
  Travis: Oh, classic Acme.
• 21:22
  Travis: Those guys with their dynamite and always giving the coyote faulty gear.
• 21:27
  Travis: I hear there's gonna be a lawsuit.
• 21:29
  Josh: There should be.
• 21:30
  Travis: Coyote versus Acme in theaters in August.
• 21:32
  Travis: It is, it is actually a movie.
• 21:34
  Travis: Is it?
• 21:34
  Travis: It's coming out this year, yeah.
• 21:36
  Travis: Uh starting Well Forte.
• 21:37
  Josh: Cool.
• 21:37
  Josh: I'd watch that.
• 21:38
  Travis: Anyway, fireball fallen near Acme.
• 21:40
  Travis: Uh, then realizing the activity was much closer, essentially behind their home.
• 21:45
  Travis: Okay.
• 21:45
  Travis: So what they saw was heavy traffic with vehicles all along the road and driveway.
• 21:50
  Travis: They experienced a sulfur like smell.
• 21:53
  Josh: Which goes back to Virginia.
• 21:55
  Travis: Yeah.
• 21:55
  Travis: Yep.
• 21:55
  Travis: Oh, just bad farts.
• 21:57
  Travis: State police, or maybe just military likes hey.
• 21:59
  Travis: You know?
• 22:00
  Josh: Yeah.
• 22:01
  Josh: But I mean, having the creatures from the Virginia incident having that strong sulfur smell.
• 22:07
  Travis: Maybe they experience state police and military personnel coming into the house.
• 22:11
  Travis: Uh, that sucks.
• 22:12
  Travis: Yeah.
• 22:13
  Travis: Officials using their phone repeatedly.
• 22:15
  Travis: Keep in mind this is 65, so well before.
• 22:18
  Travis: Cell phones.
• 22:20
  Josh: Weird.
• 22:20
  Josh: So they kind of made their house one of the command areas, too.
• 22:25
  Travis: That would suck.
• 22:26
  Josh: That would.
• 22:27
  Travis: Talk of NASA being contacted.
• 22:29
  Travis: Men in I think that's a nice little touch there.
• 22:34
  Travis: Uh men in uniform and playing clothes moving in and out.
• 22:36
  Travis: Men in white coverall type suits, one reportedly with a NASA patch.
• 22:40
  Travis: So they got the NASA guys got there pretty quick.
• 22:43
  Travis: I mean, NASA's down in Florida, right?
• 22:46
  Josh: I mean they got rockets.
• 22:47
  Travis: Yeah, rocket cars, though.
• 22:49
  Travis: Maybe.
• 22:50
  Travis: Is that how these scientists get around?
• 22:53
  Travis: They just put them on a on a rocket and hope for the best.
• 22:56
  Travis: Bobles are dead.
• 22:58
  Travis: Kind of like Tom Cruise in Mission Impossible, where he's like dangling off the side of a plane.
• 23:02
  Travis: That's just how scientists get around.
• 23:04
  Josh: Mm-hmm.
• 23:04
  Josh: You gotta get all that data.
• 23:06
  Travis: Yeah.
• 23:06
  Travis: Um, one family uh member who was a child of the time said he watched from upstairs as trucks and flashlights moved around.
• 23:12
  Travis: This is the guy that I I liked.
• 23:14
  Travis: I thought he was really funny uh in the video that we watched.
• 23:16
  Josh: Yeah, he was the one that looked like Uncle Rico from Napoleon Dynamite.
• 23:20
  Travis: Uh a little, a little bit.
• 23:21
  Travis: So he claimed an empty flatbed truck went down through a wet field area and it came back out carrying something about the size of a Volkswagen.
• 23:28
  Travis: So big acorn.
• 23:30
  Josh: Yeah.
• 23:30
  Travis: The next day he and his brother went down to the area and said they saw damaged trees, a disturbed area that looked like it had been covered over, and a man with a detector who warned them about possible radiation.
• 23:40
  Travis: So I just want to say, like, being a kid with all of this happening has to be like the most exciting thing you've ever experienced in your life.
• 23:48
  Travis: And even going down and exploring the area behind your house where this happened is just like you would create like a narrative in your head of like, oh my god, spacemen or or whatever.
• 24:01
  Travis: But it would just be like a cool thing to explore with that childlike imagination.
• 24:07
  Josh: Yeah, he explained that he was super excited and that he was upstairs and the bathroom was downstairs, and he said he had to use the bathroom a lot that night.
• 24:15
  Travis: Like, yeah, they were all in our house, and I was upstairs and our bathroom was downstairs.
• 24:19
  Travis: So I used the bathroom a lot that night.
• 24:21
  Travis: And I was like, you sneaky little shit.
• 24:23
  Josh: He did describe, you know, putting up a fence because they had cattle, a fence was knocked over, so he picked that up, and then him and his brother went down and he said it was really exciting.
• 24:32
  Josh: Like it was like a movie, I imagine.
• 24:34
  Travis: Pretty cool.
• 24:35
  Travis: Until they get that old man with the detectors screaming at him.
• 24:39
  Josh: Yeah.
• 24:39
  Josh: So Jim Romansky was a volunteer firefighter from another Jared's diction, called to assist in the search for a possible aircraft crash.
• 24:46
  Josh: He said his team was moving through the fields and woods with flashlights when they heard another team report over Walkie Talkie they had found the impact area.
• 24:54
  Josh: Romansky's group moved towards the location and found what he described as a large metallic object.
• 25:00
  Josh: His description, roughly 10 to 15 feet long, visible above ground, around eight to twelve feet in diameter, shaped like a huge acorn, metal, seamless, and smooth, no visible doors, windows, wings, or tail, a raised bumper or a ring around the back, and strange markings on the ring, including lines, circles, stars, zigzags, and shapes that reminded him of Egyptian hieroglyphs.
• 25:24
  Josh: Romansky said the object looked cast as one solid piece of metal.
• 25:29
  Josh: After about 15 minutes, two men in overcoats arrived and told the firefighters that Ari was quarantined and they had to leave.
• 25:35
  Josh: As Romansky's group walked away, he said they passed military personnel coming down through the woods carrying equipment.
• 25:41
  Josh: And I remember in his interview, he was also saying that it was definitely big enough for a grown adult to stand up and move around in.
• 25:49
  Josh: Okay.
• 25:50
  Josh: So we're getting the story slowly.
• 25:52
  Josh: We're getting little bits and pieces.
• 25:53
  Josh: I'm loving it.
• 25:55
  Travis: So if there's one image that defines Kexburg, it is this: a military flatbed truck leaving the area with a tarped acorn-shaped object on the back.
• 26:04
  Travis: Multiple witnesses describe seeing a military convoy that included a Jeep or escort vehicle, a flatbed truck, a large object under a tarp, another military vehicle behind it.
• 26:14
  Travis: Some witnesses said the cover shape looked like an acorn or bell-shaped object, matching the description from the woods.
• 26:19
  Travis: Jerry Betters, a Pittsburgh jazz musician, oh shit, so he was on drugs.
• 26:24
  Travis: No.
• 26:25
  Travis: Claimed he briefly saw the object uncovered in the back of a military.
• 26:28
  Travis: Oh yeah, jazz musicians, famous for smoking that devil's lettuce, Josh.
• 26:33
  Travis: Uh he described it as a copperish or bronze-colored acorn shape and marked with hieroglyphic-like writing.
• 26:40
  Josh: So it is weird that the official explanation was we didn't find anything, and tons of people saw a flatbed truck carrying something large out.
• 26:51
  Josh: It's kind of like when the government is caught in a lie and they just keep lying, even though everyone knows it's a lie, but no one can do anything about it.
• 26:59
  Josh: That's why they're like, Yeah, we didn't see anything.
• 27:01
  Josh: Like, no, I can see it right there.
• 27:02
  Josh: You're like, no, you can't.
• 27:03
  Josh: Didn't happen.
• 27:04
  Josh: So the Kexburg story does not end in Pennsylvania.
• 27:07
  Josh: According to a couple witnesses, the object was taken to Ohio, first to Lockbourne Air Force Base, then to Wright Patterson.
• 27:14
  Josh: A truck driver named Myron said he was delivering special bricks to Wright Patterson Air Force Base a few days after the incident when he saw a large bell-shaped object with a ladder leaning against it.
• 27:27
  Josh: There were personnel apparently trying to access it and bricks being used to wall off the area so the object would be hidden.
• 27:34
  Josh: That's wild.
• 27:35
  Travis: Yeah.
• 27:36
  Josh: He said the building that it was in was like a World War II building, like a training building for new military people.
• 27:42
  Josh: And this was just in the back of the building, and he was bringing in bricks that matched the bricks of the original building.
• 27:49
  Josh: And he said they're basically just gonna wall off that whole area and no one would ever know.
• 27:54
  Josh: So a second driver from the same supply company also saw the Liberty Bell-shaped object on a flatbed trailer at the base, and that was, I think, the day before.
• 28:03
  Josh: Then Myron added an even more dramatic claim.
• 28:06
  Josh: He said that he saw what appeared to be a body on a workbench covered with a white pad and a three-fingered hand visible.
• 28:13
  Travis: Interesting.
• 28:14
  Travis: You know, while you were talking, I was actually looking up what the craft looks like when astronauts land back on Earth, and it is kind of similar to what we're describing here.
• 28:25
  Josh: Yeah, like a pod.
• 28:26
  Travis: Yeah, it's like the tip of the rocket.
• 28:30
  Josh: Yeah.
• 28:31
  Travis: Acorn shaped.
• 28:32
  Travis: Maybe you might even describe it as a bell.
• 28:34
  Josh: Yeah.
• 28:34
  Josh: But this was what five sixty five four years before.
• 28:38
  Josh: So it could have been the moon landing.
• 28:40
  Travis: Test.
• 28:40
  Travis: Yeah, but we'd already send rockets into space.
• 28:42
  Travis: Yeah.
• 28:42
  Travis: Before we went to the moon, we had people in space.
• 28:45
  Travis: And so they have to come back somehow, some way, in something.
• 28:49
  Josh: Yeah.
• 28:49
  Travis: Could have been a test.
• 28:50
  Travis: Who knows?
• 28:51
  Josh: And early tests, they didn't have the math down exact because I mean if you're off one little number with the distance that they're traveling, a thousandth of a degree, you could be off hundreds and thousands of miles in the long term.
• 29:05
  Travis: Yep.
• 29:05
  Travis: Yep.
• 29:05
  Travis: Tell me more about math.
• 29:07
  Travis: That's all I know.
• 29:08
  Travis: That's that's enough.
• 29:09
  Travis: That was enough for me.
• 29:10
  Travis: You're enough for me, Josh.
• 29:11
  Josh: Thanks.
• 29:12
  Josh: I needed that.
• 29:13
  Travis: So now we come back to John Murphy, the WHJB news director.
• 29:16
  Travis: Remember him?
• 29:17
  Josh: Mm-hmm.
• 29:18
  Travis: Because if the Kexburg case had a local journalist in the center of it, it was Murphy.
• 29:22
  Travis: A few days after the incident, Murphy and the WHJB staff prepared a radio documentary called Object in the Woods.
• 29:29
  Travis: That sounds pretty cool.
• 29:31
  Travis: I would definitely listen to that.
• 29:32
  Travis: But the version that aired was reportedly cut and censored.
• 29:35
  Travis: Murphy said on air that some people had changed their minds about giving statements.
• 29:39
  Travis: One person was reportedly afraid of the state police.
• 29:42
  Travis: Classic.
• 29:43
  Travis: Another did not want trouble with the army.
• 29:45
  Travis: Also, of course, why would you try to mix it up with either of those two?
• 29:49
  Travis: People close to Murphy later said something changed.
• 29:52
  Travis: His former wife, Bonnie Milo, said Murphy had been excited about the story, then suddenly stopped discussing it.
• 29:57
  Travis: She believed someone had gotten to him.
• 29:59
  Travis: Another WHJB employee, Linda Foscia, recalled men coming to the station to speak with Murphy and said he was upset afterward.
• 30:07
  Travis: She remembered him saying they had taken tapes he'd prepared.
• 30:10
  Travis: Another account claimed Murphy told somebody over CB that he saw an object partially buried in the woods with strange writing on it, had taken pictures, and that some film was removed from his camera.
• 30:20
  Travis: Years later, Murphy died in a hit and run accident in California.
• 30:24
  Travis: Uh there's no evidence connecting his death to Kexburg, though his former wife found the circumstances suspicious.
• 30:31
  Travis: Well, it was a hit and run.
• 30:32
  Travis: I mean, those are always those are always suspicious.
• 30:35
  Josh: Yeah, it was kind of weird.
• 30:36
  Josh: It was 10 o'clock at night.
• 30:38
  Josh: He was crossing the street to go look at oil slicks or something like that.
• 30:42
  Josh: She's like, I don't understand any of that story.
• 30:45
  Josh: With who he was, and then the kind of sudden being quiet, it was very uncharacteristic of him because he was kind of a go-getter reporter, very transparent about not censoring things.
• 30:57
  Josh: And he just changed, stop talking about it, and he's not someone to stop talking about something like that.
• 31:02
  Josh: And then he dies with a hit and run.
• 31:04
  Josh: That's I don't know.
• 31:05
  Josh: That just happens a lot.
• 31:06
  Josh: I mean, thinking about the missing scientists right now that have all the connections with the UFO community and stuff like that.
• 31:13
  Josh: It seems like the military's go-to, or maybe not military, maybe contractors.
• 31:18
  Josh: I don't know.
• 31:18
  Josh: So what could it have been?
• 31:21
  Josh: We now have the pieces, a fireball seen across multiple states, multiple countries, because it was up in Canada too.
• 31:28
  Travis: I might say international.
• 31:30
  Josh: Well, I okay, Mr.
• 31:32
  Josh: Thesaurus.
• 31:33
  Travis: Well, Canada involved.
• 31:34
  Travis: Jeez.
• 31:35
  Josh: Witnesses near Kexburg describing something low and controlled.
• 31:39
  Josh: Firefighters and reporters running into a restricted area, claims of military personnel in the woods, and multiple people saying a flatbed truck carried something away.
• 31:48
  Josh: The question is, what explanation actually fits all of that?
• 31:51
  Josh: Theory one, it was a meteor.
• 31:54
  Josh: Project Blue Book Records treated the Kexburg Acme event as meteor related, and many astronomers supported that explanation.
• 32:01
  Josh: This part makes sense on the surface.
• 32:03
  Josh: A bright fireball has been seen over the wide area, and December lines up with the Gemini meteor shower.
• 32:09
  Josh: But the meteor theory has problems.
• 32:12
  Josh: Witnesses like Randy Overly and Bill Bush describe something that seemed too slow, too low, and too controlled.
• 32:18
  Josh: Some accounts describe the object turning or changing direction.
• 32:22
  Josh: A meteor also does not neatly explain reports of armed military personnel in sealed-off wooded area, Geiger counters, or a flatbed truck allegedly hauling away a tarped acorn-shaped object.
• 32:33
  Josh: So meteor is plausible for the sky sighting, but weaker for the ground activity.
• 32:38
  Travis: So, theory two, which is kind of like what we were talking about.
• 32:43
  Travis: Yeah.
• 32:43
  Travis: One of the largest theories is that the object was Cosmos 96, a failed Soviet Venus probe that re-entered Earth's atmosphere on December 9th, 1965.
• 32:52
  Travis: This theory has a lot going for it.
• 32:53
  Travis: A Soviet space probe could explain the A-Corner bell shape, the strange metallic construction, the Cold War secrecy, the military response, the possibility that the U.S.
• 33:03
  Travis: recovered something it wanted to study quietly.
• 33:05
  Travis: It also lines up visually with some witness descriptions of a rounded capsule with a raised rim or collar.
• 33:11
  Travis: But this theory has a major problem, which is timing.
• 33:14
  Travis: So records reportedly placed Cosmos 96 re-entry around 318 a.m., many hours before the Kecksburg object was seen late that afternoon.
• 33:23
  Travis: The Russian Space Agency also later stated they could not find a direct correlation between Cosmos 96 and the Kecksburg incident.
• 33:30
  Travis: There's also the treaty issue.
• 33:32
  Travis: If the US recovered Soviet space debris, international agreements would have required its return.
• 33:37
  Travis: So if this was Cosmos 96, a cover story would make sense, but the timing keeps it from being a perfect solution.
• 33:42
  Travis: So we're talking about like a 12-hour, 14-hour difference.
• 33:46
  Josh: It's an entire day.
• 33:47
  Josh: Yeah.
• 33:48
  Josh: So theory three, another possibility is that it was something man-made that the government just didn't want to talk about.
• 33:53
  Josh: This could have been anything from a secret US test project, a foreign spy device, a missile or re-entry vehicle that went off course, some kind of experimental Cold War tech.
• 34:04
  Josh: This theory actually explains the heavy military presence better than the simple meteor does.
• 34:09
  Josh: It also makes sense of why they kept civilians away, why they were worried about radiation, and why the official story was so vague.
• 34:16
  Josh: The only catch is that the witnesses describe something that didn't look like any normal plane or missile.
• 34:22
  Josh: That seamless acorn-shaped object with the weird markings is still kind of hard to explain away.
• 34:28
  Travis: Fourth theory is that it was extraterrestrial.
• 34:31
  Travis: This is the big one, obviously.
• 34:34
  Travis: The extraterrestrial theory leans on the strangest witness claims.
• 34:37
  Travis: Did you want to say something?
• 34:39
  Josh: No.
• 34:40
  Travis: Okay.
• 34:41
  Travis: So witnesses claim that it had a controlled descent made of a seamless metallic object.
• 34:47
  Travis: No wings, windows, engines, doors, or visible seams, hieroglyphic like markings, military recovery, later claims of the object being taken to right Patterson, the alleged body claim from Myron.
• 35:00
  Travis: This theory fits the weirdest parts of the story, but it also depends heavily on testimony rather than physical evidence.
• 35:07
  Travis: No confirmed object photos, documents, or recovered materials have ever surfaced publicly.
• 35:13
  Travis: So the alien theory is the most fun explanation, but also the hardest to prove.
• 35:19
  Josh: This is a really hard one because it could be multiple things.
• 35:23
  Josh: You know, I don't think it was the Soviet space probe.
• 35:27
  Josh: I mean, they have that down to the minute.
• 35:30
  Travis: But where did that land?
• 35:31
  Josh: I don't know.
• 35:33
  Travis: If only there were a resource, perhaps a web-based database of information that we could access.
• 35:43
  Travis: Cosmos 96, widely speculated to have re-entered the atmosphere and crashed near Kecksburg, Pennsylvania on December 9th, 1965.
• 35:50
  Travis: While officially unconfirmed, many believe the Soviet Venus probe caused a fireball scene over the region, which was followed by an alleged military recovery of a metallic acorn-shaped object in the woods.
• 36:00
  Travis: So it did land there.
• 36:02
  Josh: That's what I'm trying to do.
• 36:04
  Travis: Some investigations have suggested the object could have been an Armenian spy satellite rather than a Soviet probe, but the connection to the Kecksburg UFO remains a popular, albeit unproven, explanation for the incident.
• 36:19
  Josh: The three main theories of where it landed, based on tracking data and eyewitness reports.
• 36:23
  Josh: So the most famous one is the Kecksburg theory.
• 36:26
  Josh: The scientific theory is Lake Erie.
• 36:28
  Josh: The U.S.
• 36:28
  Josh: Air Force tracking data and astronomical analysis of the Great Lakes fireball suggests the object seen that night was likely a meteor that disintegrated over West Lake Erie, but it could have been the re-entry of the satellite.
• 36:41
  Josh: There's also theory that was in Canada in 2003.
• 36:44
  Josh: So really there is no exact location.
• 36:50
  Josh: There's just theories.
• 36:51
  Josh: It remains subject to historical debate.
• 36:54
  Josh: Because there's no official confirmed crash site.
• 36:57
  Josh: Which is very strange too.
• 36:59
  Josh: I mean, it could have been that.
• 37:01
  Josh: Maybe.
• 37:01
  Josh: But the timing does seem a little off, but it also seems like maybe there is a lot off with that whole thing.
• 37:07
  Josh: Like we don't know where it where it went.
• 37:10
  Travis: Yeah.
• 37:10
  Josh: I don't think it was a meteor.
• 37:12
  Travis: No, I don't think it was a meteor.
• 37:14
  Josh: It's possible it's a classified military foreign device.
• 37:17
  Josh: And I'm not completely sold on it being extraterrestrial, just because there's no proof other than that one truck driver saying he saw a body.
• 37:25
  Travis: But it does feed into people's idea that the military is covering a lot of stuff up.
• 37:32
  Travis: That's why if our military was a little more open with what they were doing and released these things that aren't like a real threat to national security, like things landing here, there, and everywhere, I think that would, I don't know, help this narrative that people are hiding things from us.
• 37:54
  Josh: Yeah.
• 37:54
  Josh: And I mean, and this lines up with a lot of the stories where they have pretty good witness accounts of something extraterrestrial.
• 38:02
  Josh: Sure.
• 38:02
  Josh: And this is the MO of the military.
• 38:06
  Josh: This is what they do.
• 38:07
  Travis: Yeah.
• 38:08
  Travis: I I think the journalist is a pretty credible witness and trying to start a radio show, I think that's of very credible.
• 38:17
  Josh: Yeah.
• 38:18
  Travis: Because that would have been released right around I mean, as close to that incident as possible to give people some answers or at least a more informed direction for their questions, right?
• 38:29
  Travis: Yeah.
• 38:30
  Travis: I don't know that it's necessarily UFOs.
• 38:32
  Travis: I think that it was something that was probably either NASA directed or maybe Soviet directed.
• 38:39
  Travis: And again, they just told everybody on the ground that they had to, you know, just go and recover this thing.
• 38:45
  Travis: That could explain the Geiger counter because whoever was part of that recovery, there's going to be radiation surrounding these coming from space, I guess, essentially.
• 38:54
  Josh: Yeah.
• 38:54
  Josh: Going back to the radio guy, Stan Gordon, the UFO researcher who made the documentary that I'll link that we watched, he actually gave him the uncensored audio, the entire show that was unedited.
• 39:10
  Josh: And Stan Gordon in the movie near the end said that that mysteriously went missing in his possession, which is another weird thing.
• 39:18
  Travis: It could be, but also like having been on the editing side back in my video production days, there's a lot of stuff that just goes missing because you either forget to back it up or you accidentally deleted something, or it's a technical issue and it just wasn't captured correctly.
• 39:38
  Josh: So or he's messy.
• 39:39
  Travis: Yeah.
• 39:40
  Travis: I mean, he's messy and misplaced something, and then it's just an easy thing to say, you know, like, oh shit, yeah, I had this audio file and now it's just gone.
• 39:50
  Josh: I mean, it is true, but we do also know that the government andor military or private contractors have gone and taken things very often and destroyed evidence.
• 40:00
  Josh: So I mean, it's not out of the realm of possibility that it was trying to be covered up.
• 40:05
  Travis: Sure.
• 40:05
  Josh: So on aliens, yes, but maybe no for me.
• 40:09
  Josh: This is just a maybe.
• 40:11
  Josh: There's no proof that it's extraterrestrial.
• 40:12
  Josh: There's no proof that it's not.
• 40:14
  Josh: We just have a lot of witness testimonies, and a lot of them don't specifically mention it as a UFO, other than just what they assumed it was.
• 40:24
  Travis: Yeah.
• 40:24
  Travis: I'm gonna say for me, this is and and and again, I'm just speaking from my own opinion, not based on anything other than my own experience.
• 40:33
  Travis: I feel like this is probably a military incident that had just maybe gotten not gotten away from the military, but like they didn't inform the local population that this was happening, and then they just went in to recover it as quickly as as possible.
• 40:47
  Travis: I mean, the recovery looked like what, a 24-hour period, maybe less than that.
• 40:53
  Josh: Yeah.
• 40:53
  Travis: So this doesn't help move the needle, but it does, like I said earlier, this does push the narrative along that you know our military is hiding things from us.
• 41:04
  Travis: So I'm I'm a no.
• 41:07
  Josh: Well, this is the Kecksburg incident.
• 41:10
  Josh: Thank you for listening.
• 41:11
  Josh: Yeah.
• 41:11
  Josh: Give us some info on what you guys think.
• 41:15
  Josh: Uh we definitely want some opinions, other people's opinions.
• 41:19
  Travis: Because sure, not necessary.
• 41:20
  Travis: I don't I don't really care.
• 41:21
  Travis: I don't know.
• 41:22
  Josh: No, I do.
• 41:22
  Josh: I don't want to be stuck in my own little bubble.
• 41:24
  Travis: I want to hear other thoughts.
• 41:26
  Travis: Oh my gosh, you love your bubble.
• 41:28
  Josh: I get so weird inside my bubble.
• 41:30
  Travis: Yeah.
• 41:30
  Travis: No, of course.
• 41:31
  Travis: Yeah.
• 41:31
  Travis: Hit us up.
• 41:32
  Travis: Let us know what your wacky theories are on Kexberg.
• 41:37
  Josh: Yeah.
• 41:37
  Josh: Uh we do have fan mail.
• 41:40
  Travis: Oh boy.
• 41:40
  Josh: Yeah, and a comment on YouTube.
• 41:43
  Travis: Uh-oh.
• 41:44
  Josh: So the comment is a very simple subscribe to you.
• 41:49
  Josh: Oh, great.
• 41:50
  Josh: Yeah.
• 41:51
  Travis: Subscribe to you.
• 41:52
  Josh: Subscribe to you.
• 41:53
  Travis: Okay.
• 41:54
  Josh: Fan mail uh doesn't have a name.
• 41:56
  Josh: The only reason I keep coming back to the show is because of how much Travis loses at the quizzes.
• 42:00
  Josh: Don't change a thing.
• 42:02
  Josh: So can't.
• 42:04
  Travis: I physically cannot change a thing.
• 42:06
  Travis: I'm going to always lose a quizzes.
• 42:09
  Travis: So thank you for your vote of confidence listener.
• 42:11
  Travis: If that's what gets you back, sure.
• 42:13
  Travis: Love it.
• 42:14
  Josh: Hey, let's keep let's keep it happening.
• 42:16
  Travis: Uh that's not you, is it?
• 42:17
  Travis: You didn't send that in.
• 42:19
  Travis: You were uh someone in your house?
• 42:22
  Josh: What?
• 42:23
  Travis: Oh, okay.
• 42:24
  Travis: Loud and clear.
• 42:25
  Travis: Your silence is very reassuring, Josh.
• 42:28
  Josh: Yeah, it was me.
• 42:28
  Josh: Okay.
• 42:29
  Josh: You sent one.
• 42:30
  Josh: It was very attacking, and I felt like mine was attacking.
• 42:34
  Travis: Mine was like, Travis gets stronger with every wrong answer.
• 42:38
  Josh: It said maybe we should let him win every once in a while.
• 42:41
  Josh: And I will not have that.
• 42:42
  Josh: Yeah, to keep him from getting too strong.
• 42:44
  Josh: That's why I'm trying to kick you down a notch, trying to convince you through other people.
• 42:49
  Travis: Wasn't an attack.
• 42:50
  Josh: Well, what are you gonna do when you have all that power?
• 42:52
  Josh: You're just gonna sit on it and not attack?
• 42:54
  Travis: Oh, I'm gonna I'm gonna attack.
• 42:55
  Travis: I'm gonna use it.
• 42:56
  Travis: Yeah, I know you're for sure.
• 42:57
  Josh: Yeah, of course you do.
• 42:58
  Travis: Oh, for sure.
• 42:58
  Travis: I'm gonna use it for attacking.
• 43:00
  Travis: Yep, for karate.
• 43:01
  Josh: Yeah.
• 43:02
  Josh: Let me uh text Jordan to send the the quiz.
• 43:06
  Travis: Wouldn't want her to send it too early, now would we?
• 43:09
  Travis: That's it though.
• 43:09
  Travis: Those were the only comments.
• 43:11
  Josh: Yeah.
• 43:12
  Travis: Pretty good.
• 43:13
  Josh: The subscribe you one was really good.
• 43:15
  Travis: Subscribe you.
• 43:16
  Josh: Subscribe you.
• 43:17
  Josh: I'll take it.
• 43:18
  Josh: Better than uh unsubscribe.
• 43:20
  Travis: Burn in hell.
• 43:21
  Josh: Yeah.
• 43:22
  Josh: Stop making things.
• 43:24
  Josh: Alright, she read the text.
• 43:28
  Travis: Okay.
• 43:29
  Josh: Did it come?
• 43:31
  Travis: No.
• 43:31
  Travis: Constantly refreshing.
• 43:32
  Travis: Refresh.
• 43:33
  Travis: Refresh.
• 43:34
  Josh: The anticipation is killing me.
• 43:36
  Travis: I hope not.
• 43:37
  Josh: Oh, I got it.
• 43:38
  Josh: I got it.
• 43:39
  Travis: Who's gonna get there first?
• 43:41
  Josh: All right.
• 43:41
  Josh: Now we're gonna get into our quiz, our baseline quiz time.
• 43:44
  Josh: This is what our topic is gonna be for the next episode.
• 43:48
  Josh: This is so you know that we actually don't know what we're talking about.
• 43:51
  Josh: We're still amateur.
• 43:53
  Josh: I mean, we're not we know a little bit now.
• 43:54
  Josh: We know enough to know that something weird's going on.
• 43:58
  Josh: Mm-hmm.
• 43:58
  Josh: And This what are you doing?
• 44:01
  Josh: Are you Googling and looking up everything?
• 44:04
  Travis: Yeah.
• 44:04
  Travis: You son of a bitch.
• 44:06
  Josh: I just want to know how to pronounce this is called Dulce Bass.
• 44:10
  Travis: Or Dulce.
• 44:12
  Josh: Dulce, maybe.
• 44:14
  Travis: Mm-hmm.
• 44:15
  Travis: Don't you're looking up every Dolce?
• 44:18
  Travis: I'm just looking at pronunciations.
• 44:19
  Travis: Look, this is on my screen.
• 44:20
  Josh: Okay.
• 44:21
  Travis: Jesus Christ.
• 44:22
  Josh: Is it Dulce?
• 44:24
  Travis: Yeah.
• 44:24
  Travis: They say Dulce is actually a mispronunciation.
• 44:27
  Josh: Oh, interesting.
• 44:28
  Travis: Dulce.
• 44:29
  Josh: Okay.
• 44:29
  Josh: So Dulce Base.
• 44:31
  Josh: First question.
• 44:32
  Josh: Where is the Duelce base located?
• 44:35
  Josh: A Missouri.
• 44:37
  Josh: B Nevada.
• 44:38
  Josh: C New Mexico or D Alaska?
• 44:41
  Josh: Well, I think I would know if I knew what it was.
• 44:44
  Travis: Yeah.
• 44:44
  Josh: Come on.
• 44:45
  Travis: Yeah.
• 44:46
  Josh: I'm going to say Alaska.
• 44:48
  Travis: Oh, wow.
• 44:49
  Travis: Really north.
• 44:51
  Josh: Yeah.
• 44:51
  Josh: Okay.
• 44:52
  Josh: Like I'm wondering like that one episode where they had the base in the mountain.
• 44:56
  Josh: Maybe that's what it is.
• 44:58
  Josh: I don't know.
• 44:59
  Travis: Okay.
• 44:59
  Travis: I'm going to say New Mexico.
• 45:00
  Travis: Okay.
• 45:01
  Travis: Lock it in.
• 45:02
  Josh: All right.
• 45:03
  Josh: What is the Dulce Base rumored to be?
• 45:06
  Josh: A secret archaeological dig site.
• 45:08
  Josh: B underwater city, hopefully.
• 45:11
  Josh: Underground Joint Human Alien Base.
• 45:14
  Josh: Ooh.
• 45:14
  Travis: Oh, hopefully that one.
• 45:16
  Josh: Or D Crash Spacecraft Hangar.
• 45:18
  Josh: The Underground Joint Human Alien Base, that was the base inside the mountain that he saw with his mind powers.
• 45:25
  Travis: Yeah, but that wasn't.
• 45:26
  Travis: Where was that?
• 45:27
  Travis: Alaska?
• 45:28
  Josh: That was Alaska.
• 45:29
  Josh: And that's the answer I picked.
• 45:30
  Josh: So maybe I'm gonna I'm going down that trail.
• 45:32
  Travis: Okay.
• 45:33
  Travis: Uh I'm gonna say Crashed Spacecraft Hangar.
• 45:36
  Josh: Okay.
• 45:37
  Travis: Do you remember that guy's name?
• 45:38
  Travis: The Astral Traveler?
• 45:40
  Josh: Not off the top of my head.
• 45:41
  Travis: Oh, maybe this next question will tip you off.
• 45:44
  Josh: Oh, it's not any of those.
• 45:45
  Josh: Okay, which person is most associated with spreading detailed Dulce-based claims in the 1980s?
• 45:52
  Josh: Is it A, Bob Lazar, B, Paul Benowitz, C Stanton Friedman, or D, Travis Walton?
• 46:00
  Josh: Well, I don't think it's Bob Lazar.
• 46:02
  Josh: I don't think it's Travis Walton.
• 46:04
  Travis: No, it's definitely not Travis Walton.
• 46:05
  Travis: Travis Walton is the fire in the sky guy that got abducted in the woods.
• 46:09
  Josh: And then Stanton Friedman, Paul Benowitz, those sound really familiar, but I just don't know who they are.
• 46:16
  Josh: So I think it's between those two.
• 46:18
  Travis: I'm going Bob Lazar.
• 46:19
  Josh: Are you?
• 46:20
  Travis: Sorry.
• 46:21
  Travis: Yeah.
• 46:21
  Josh: Wow.
• 46:22
  Josh: Okay.
• 46:22
  Josh: I'm gonna go Stanton Friedman.
• 46:25
  Josh: Okay.
• 46:26
  Josh: It's a nice name.
• 46:27
  Travis: Fried man.
• 46:28
  Josh: Okay, next one.
• 46:29
  Josh: Dulce base stories often include claims of what occurring inside the facility.
• 46:35
  Josh: A genetic hybridization of humans and animals.
• 46:38
  Travis: Oh boy, I do not like that.
• 46:40
  Travis: That's like an Island of Dr.
• 46:41
  Travis: Moreau type situation.
• 46:43
  Josh: B, time travel experiments.
• 46:45
  Travis: Cool.
• 46:46
  Josh: C indigenous treasure and artifact storage.
• 46:49
  Josh: Or D moon landing filming.
• 46:52
  Josh: Uh I don't know, man.
• 46:56
  Travis: I'm going crazy.
• 46:57
  Travis: I'm saying time travel experiments.
• 46:59
  Josh: I'm flipping my, I'm not gonna go down that same path.
• 47:02
  Josh: I'm gonna say indigenous treasure and artifact storage.
• 47:04
  Travis: That would be very Oh, like uh Ark of the Covenant, an Indiana Jones type situation.
• 47:10
  Josh: Yeah, that would be really exciting.
• 47:12
  Travis: Or it's just a warehouse full of stuff that had been recovered.
• 47:15
  Josh: Yeah, through the Yeah, like an endless warehouse.
• 47:18
  Josh: Mm-hmm.
• 47:18
  Josh: So cool.
• 47:20
  Josh: Next question.
• 47:20
  Josh: How many underground levels does the Dulce base allegedly have?
• 47:24
  Josh: A3, B5, C7, or D12?
• 47:29
  Travis: I'm going max.
• 47:31
  Josh: I'm going max too.
• 47:32
  Josh: Like, why not?
• 47:33
  Travis: Why not?
• 47:34
  Josh: Yeah.
• 47:34
  Josh: Okay, last question.
• 47:36
  Josh: What species of alien is rumored to be inside the base?
• 47:40
  Travis: Uh oh.
• 47:41
  Josh: Is that a uh human alien joint thing?
• 47:45
  Josh: Maybe.
• 47:46
  Travis: Too late to change your answer.
• 47:48
  Josh: No, I that's what I picked.
• 47:50
  Josh: Okay.
• 47:50
  Josh: Is it A, Nordics, B, Grays, C tall whites, or D reptilians?
• 47:56
  Josh: Oh man, this is hard.
• 47:58
  Josh: Like what kind of lore?
• 47:58
  Josh: Like, I feel like reptilians are the bad guys, but they are here.
• 48:02
  Josh: So I don't think we would be working hand in hand with reptilians.
• 48:05
  Travis: I'm gonna say I'm gonna say reptilians are in it.
• 48:07
  Travis: They always say reptilians are underground.
• 48:09
  Travis: I don't I don't know.
• 48:10
  Travis: Tall whites just sound like a drink you get at Starbucks.
• 48:14
  Josh: Or who buy the drinks.
• 48:16
  Travis: Yep, tall whites.
• 48:18
  Josh: I'm gonna say Nordics.
• 48:21
  Travis: Oh.
• 48:22
  Josh: I don't know why.
• 48:23
  Josh: All right, we're gonna submit and check our answers.
• 48:27
  Travis: Bo boy.
• 48:27
  Travis: Classic me.
• 48:29
  Josh: Oh, okay.
• 48:30
  Josh: First one, where is the Dulce Base located?
• 48:33
  Josh: I said Alaska.
• 48:34
  Josh: That was wrong.
• 48:35
  Travis: I said New Mexico, right?
• 48:36
  Travis: Ding ding ding.
• 48:38
  Travis: You should edit in some sound effects there.
• 48:41
  Travis: I I can do that.
• 48:42
  Travis: So I don't have to say ding ding ding every time.
• 48:47
  Josh: Okay, next one.
• 48:48
  Josh: What is the Dulce Base rumor to be?
• 48:50
  Josh: I said an underground joint human alien base.
• 48:52
  Travis: Oh oh I said craft spacecraft hangar.
• 48:56
  Travis: And I was right.
• 48:57
  Travis: No.
• 48:58
  Travis: Damn it.
• 48:59
  Josh: It is an underground joint human alien base.
• 49:02
  Josh: Okay, so I was kind of right.
• 49:05
  Josh: Next one.
• 49:06
  Josh: What person is most associated with spreading detailed Dulce-based claims in the 1980s?
• 49:12
  Josh: I said Stanton Friedman.
• 49:13
  Travis: I said Bob Lazar.
• 49:15
  Josh: It was Paul Benowitz.
• 49:17
  Josh: Okay.
• 49:18
  Josh: I guess we'll figure out who he is.
• 49:20
  Josh: Dulce-based stories often include claims of what occurring inside the facility.
• 49:25
  Josh: I said indigenous treasure and artifact storage.
• 49:28
  Josh: That's wrong, sadly.
• 49:30
  Travis: I said time travel experiments, and it is actually the most horrific one.
• 49:34
  Josh: Genetic hybridization of humans and animals.
• 49:37
  Josh: I am really bummed it's not the artifacts and treasures.
• 49:41
  Travis: Do not like that.
• 49:42
  Travis: That really bums me out.
• 49:44
  Josh: That it's not the artifacts and treasures?
• 49:46
  Travis: No, it bums me out that that's what that's what's happening in there.
• 49:49
  Travis: Genetic hybridization of humans and animals.
• 49:52
  Josh: I mean, that's what the aliens do, man.
• 49:54
  Travis: That's a that's a real bummer.
• 49:55
  Josh: I just want to know where all the treasures and artifacts are.
• 49:58
  Josh: It's somewhere, right?
• 49:59
  Josh: It has to be.
• 50:00
  Travis: Yeah.
• 50:00
  Josh: Okay, next one.
• 50:01
  Josh: How many underground levels does the Dulce base allegedly have?
• 50:05
  Josh: You and I said 12.
• 50:06
  Josh: It is five.
• 50:08
  Josh: Okay.
• 50:09
  Josh: And then lastly, what species of alien is rumored to be inside the base?
• 50:14
  Josh: I said Nordics.
• 50:15
  Josh: Mm-hmm.
• 50:16
  Josh: That is incorrect.
• 50:17
  Josh: Mm-hmm.
• 50:18
  Josh: And you said Grays?
• 50:20
  Josh: No.
• 50:21
  Josh: Or tall whites.
• 50:22
  Josh: How do you not remember what I said?
• 50:23
  Josh: This is like seriously.
• 50:24
  Josh: You fart it right.
• 50:25
  Josh: It's reptilians.
• 50:26
  Travis: Reptilians.
• 50:27
  Josh: Oh, I just didn't want to admit it.
• 50:29
  Travis: Bringing my total to two.
• 50:30
  Travis: I got two right.
• 50:31
  Travis: I got one right.
• 50:32
  Travis: Eat a fart, Josh.
• 50:36
  Josh: See, this is that power that we did not want to see.
• 50:39
  Travis: Oh my God.
• 50:40
  Travis: I am getting stronger.
• 50:41
  Travis: I can feel it.
• 50:42
  Josh: You're going to attack.
• 50:43
  Travis: God, man.
• 50:43
  Travis: I could I could run a fucking mile now.
• 50:46
  Josh: I know.
• 50:47
  Josh: That's what's so scary.
• 50:48
  Josh: Uh-huh.
• 50:49
  Josh: All right.
• 50:49
  Josh: So we are looking at a base in New Mexico that does genetic hybridization of humans and animals.
• 50:57
  Josh: That's five underground levels that they're working with reptilians with.
• 51:02
  Josh: I don't like it.
• 51:03
  Travis: I don't like it.
• 51:03
  Josh: I'm surprised I haven't heard of this.
• 51:05
  Travis: Well, that's the whole point of the show.
• 51:07
  Josh: I guess.
• 51:07
  Josh: I swear I learned things.
• 51:09
  Josh: It's just some of these things I do not know.
• 51:12
  Travis: Well, yeah, and that's why we're doing this.
• 51:15
  Josh: You're right.
• 51:16
  Travis: To explore our curiosity.
• 51:18
  Josh: Yeah.
• 51:19
  Josh: Well, thank you for listening again.
• 51:21
  Josh: Thank you, Jordan, for putting our quiz together and our notes and telling us telling us what to say and how to do it.
• 51:30
  Josh: My outfits, my food.
• 51:32
  Travis: Yeah, Josh, Josh is pretty much uh a baby in a grown-up person's body.
• 51:38
  Josh: Nothing wrong with that.
• 51:39
  Josh: Yeah.
• 51:40
  Josh: I'm growing.
• 51:41
  Josh: I'm I'm a I'm a big boy.
• 51:43
  Josh: Yep.
• 51:44
  Josh: Well, thank you again.
• 51:45
  Josh: We will chat at you in the next episode.
• 51:48
  Travis: Okay, bye.