Latest / Retro Sports Radio: Classic Games from History / 2006 • Baseball Clip • Ernie Harwell • Part 2 of 8 - Early Radio Days - Radio Interview

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2006 • Baseball Clip • Ernie Harwell • Part 2 of 8 - Early Radio Days - Radio Interview · Retro Sports Radio: Classic Games from History

• 0:00
  This is Retro Sports Radio.
• 0:03
  Visit RetroSeasons.com for more sports history.
• 0:06
  All right, the Atlanta Crackers, you're going to get your first chance to do play-by-play.
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  What did you do to get ready for your first broadcast?
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  Well, to begin with, the problem with my first broadcast, I didn't know whether they'd ever
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  be one or not because when I was in the Marines, I'd done maybe one or two games for Earl Mann,
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  the owner of the team.
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  He'd asked me to maybe fill in, they couldn't find an announcer, and I said, well, I don't
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  really want to do it in uniform, but if you clear it with a colonel, I'll do it and I'll
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  give my check to the Red Cross.
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  I didn't feel like I should do it, but I went ahead and did it anyway, and he told me then,
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  he said, if you ever get out of the service, I want you to be my announcer.
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  So I was sort of basing my future on that promise to some degree, although I know a
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  lot of things can happen.
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  Well, what happened was that Wheaties bought the games on the radio station.
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  The radio station had a good sports announcer named Stan Raymond, and they wanted to use
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  him because, number one, he was established as their announcer on their staff, and number
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  two, they wouldn't have to pay anything extra.
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  I told Earl Mann about the problem and he said, well, Wheaties and WATL, they probably
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  want to use Stan Raymond, but I tell you what, I'm going to give them a battle because I
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  made you this promise and I'm going to give you a battle.
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  So the thing went back and forth for a long, long time, and a month or so before the season
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  starts I still don't know.
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  Now we get up to a couple of weeks before I still don't know.
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  Now the last week before the opening game I don't know, and now we finally get up to
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  the day before the opening game, and Earl Mann calls and says, I'm going to hold out
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  for you as much as I can.
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  Well, I figured, you know, in most cases in that situation in radio, the guy would say,
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  well, Ernie, I did my best and I'm sorry, but we couldn't do it any better.
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  Earl Mann hung on and he finally called me the morning of opening day.
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  And he says, come on down, you're going to be my announcer.
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  So I really didn't have much time to get ready.
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  But I love baseball so much, it was sort of natural for me.
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  And I never had any real problems doing play by play.
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  I did the best I could.
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  And my idea was I'm going to tell these people what I would like to hear if I were a listener.
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  And I just did it that way.
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  And it seemed to work okay.
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  The first walk out Tommy Thompson, put a man on first, nobody down, and Hal Jeffco, who
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  has a single in one trip, is a batter.
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  He had the first hit off Thompson, a bouncing ball over the hill in the first inning.
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  Jeffco hitting 366.
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  He's a pitch, fast ball, strike one call, right down the middle about felt high.
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  No balls and one strike on Hal Jeffco.
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  45 RBI to this fellow during the season.
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  I'll feel deep to left.
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  He's a pitch, fast ball, slam down to first base.
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  Ducola sketches and touches the bag.
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  Double play.
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  That one rocketed off the bat of Hal Jeffco and direct into the hands of Vic Ducola at
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  first base.
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  Vic smacked the ball.
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  It was just a matter of reflex and stepped on the bag for the double play.
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  And that is the 60th double play for the crackers this season.
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  Radio advertising and sponsorships and television has changed so much over the years because
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  when you started doing those Atlanta crackers games, Wheaties was the entire sponsor.
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  They had it in its entirety.
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  Wheaties was the sponsor, no question about that.
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  They sponsored, I'd say, 90 different broadcasts, some of minor leagues and some of them in
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  the major leagues.
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  And they even had a little trade paper about broadcasting and they would bring in the broadcasters
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  to a convention once a year, talk about the techniques of announcing how to do the commercials.
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  And during the first season that I worked for Wheaties, the company made us write our
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  own commercials for one week.
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  We had to do a commercial every half inning and we had to write a different commercial
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  for each half inning.
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  So they made us do a lot of things that were a little bit extra from just announcing.
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  But it was a great outfit.
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  General Mills had an idea about marketing that was excellent and also they had a good
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  product and it was wonderful to work for Wheaties.
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  So not only did you have to do the games, you also had to read the commercials that
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  you yourself had written.
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  Did you have to get that copy approved by General Mills?
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  No, you didn't.
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  You just did it and they trusted you and you winged it.
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  All right, let's go back to the cracker games.
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  You got that first one under your belt.
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  Did you have a feeling of accomplishment or a rival?
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  I've done it now, I are one.
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  I think Bob, what happened was I had done a game and I was glad the first one was over.
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  And I think I got through it okay.
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  It seemed to be all right.
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  The reaction was favorable, but I knew that I was going to have to get better and I made
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  an intense study about what I wanted to do and I began to collect anecdotes that I could
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  use, put them down on the index cards and I used that throughout my broadcasting career.
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  I also had the idea that I would get the information about each player.
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  And in the Southern League in 1946, there was no such thing as a PR man.
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  You didn't even get a roster from the teams.
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  You had to get the stats that you did get out of the Sunday paper, which went through
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  the Thursday games.
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  So I would get them out of the Sunday paper, then I'd bring them up to date as the games
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  went on and to get information about a player, I'd go down to the hotel and as the players
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  would come into the lobby, I'd collar them and we'd sit down there and I'd take out my
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  index cards and I'd say, how tall are you?
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  What are your weigh?
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  Where do you live and what do you do in the off season?
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  And also where did you play last year and where did you start?
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  Now they give you these books and all that stuff is automatic so you don't have to worry
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  about it.
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  But in those days, you had to dig for every fact that you got.
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  Wow, you had to be not only your play by play man, you had to be an advertising man, a copywriter,
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  a public relations director for both teams, a statistician.
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  When did you have time to sleep?
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  At the same time I was doing the cracker games, I was doing a major league game of the week
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  on WAGA.
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  We get a telegraphic report, maybe the Cub Cardinal game in St. Louis.
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  I'd be in a studio at WAGA in Atlanta and I'd recreate the game that afternoon.
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  I might go out to Ponce de Leon Park that night and do a double head of live.
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  But you didn't mind that, you enjoyed it, you know, it's part of the business and you
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  love what you were doing.
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  Now you mentioned the word recreation.
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  There may be a lot of people who have absolutely no idea what it means to recreate a ball
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  game.
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  Take me through it.
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  That was a fairly common process back until I'd say in the major leagues recreation went
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  out around 1952 or 3.
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  Pittsburgh Pirates were the last broadcast team to do recreation.
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  But basically what an announcer did in a recreation went this way.
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  Let's say the Atlanta Crackers were playing the Birmingham Barons in Birmingham.
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  I'd be in a studio in Atlanta with a telegrapher.
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  He'd have his telegraphic machine and he'd have a typewriter.
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  He'd have a cohort from Western Union in the press box in Birmingham who'd have the same
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  equipment and he'd send the dot dashes to my guy in the studio.
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  He would write it down on a typewriter and he'd write down the play by play of the game.
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  Now generally the announcer when he did a recreation he'd stay maybe an inning or an
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  inning and a half behind because a lot of things would happen.
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  You'd lose a line or something would happen that you couldn't continue and you'd have
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  to fill.
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  So you wanted a little bit of a cushion to fill with.
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  But what would happen, my telegrapher, he would write out say Jones up for Atlanta.
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  He's leading off for Atlanta.
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  He'd say Jones up.
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  B1W that's ball one wide.
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  S1C strike one call.
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  F-L-O-G-S fouled over the grandstand.
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  And then he'd say Jones out short to first.
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  One out.
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  That's all you'd get.
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  So the announcer would say Smith's out there on the mound.
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  He's looking into Brown to get the sign now.
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  The infield's in a little bit.
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  The outfield's around toward left.
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  Now wait a minute.
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  Jones is going to step out and go back for the Rossen bag.
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  Now he's back in the batter's box.
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  Now so-and-so looks in, gets the sign.
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  Here's the wind up.
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  Here's the pitch.
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  Ball one outside or curveball just missed the outside corner.
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  Ball one to count on him and then you go through the other pitches and foul one over the grandstand
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  and so forth.
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  And then you'd say here's the pitch.
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  Ground ball hits you short.
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  He's back.
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  He has it long.
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  Throw the first base to Smith and he's out by a step and a half.
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  Now all you got was out the shortstop.
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  But you had to sort of be an actor more than you were the announcer.
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  And if you had a lull like Ronald Reagan told a story at the White House about this.
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  He said he fouled off 17 pitches.
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  You know they lost their line.
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  The guy fouled off 17 pitches.
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  Or you'd have a dog run on the field.
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  Dog would run on the field.
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  They'd have to call time.
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  Or sometimes you'd get a sprinkle that really didn't happen.
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  And the guys had come back from the road trip and their wives say what about that dog.
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  Oh no that wasn't a dog.
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  What are you talking about?
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  And another thing that would happen.
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  You'd get down to the ninth inning and the announcer wanted to go home.
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  Now he was an inning and a half behind so he'd catch up in a hurry.
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  And usually in the ninth inning the batter went zam zam zam.
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  They hit the first pitch whether they really did or not.
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  But it was a lot of fun and you know there were some guys could do a real good recreation
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  and couldn't broadcast a live game.
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  And there were others that could do a game live very well but they couldn't do a good
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  recreation.
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  You can actually do a better broadcast knowing what has already happened.
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  But did you use sound effects with it?
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  The only sound effect we had we took up from the guy who preceded me because people were
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  used to it.
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  When a guy got a hit we would hit a gong like the NBC gong.
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  Bong.
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  He got a single we'd give him one.
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  Bong-bong would be a double.
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  And that would create an interest for people that weren't quite listening.
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  You know they'd hear this and this.
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  There was something happening.
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  But the only thing I had other than that was just slap a ruler on the table and that was
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  a ball hitting the bat.
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  But some guys had very intricate crowd noise and press box PA.
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  And I know when I worked with Red Barber in Brooklyn we did some recreations in 1948 and
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  49 and he didn't use anything.
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  He just gave it as it happened.
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  And there were guys in bars you know who could interpret those dots and dashes that you hear
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  in the background and they'd bet say hey this guy's going to hit a home run.
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  Give me some odds and make a little bar money.
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  Now he didn't succeed you in Brooklyn but there was a company later in Brooklyn in the
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  50s because that's how I grew up a Brooklyn fan who did the recreation with the soundtrack
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  with the xylophone hammer on a block of wood for a hit.
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  And I wondered why I always heard about every four minutes attaboy Duke.
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  Whether Schneider was at the plate or anything.
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  That's your recording and Nat Albright was that guy wasn't it.
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  Yeah that did a good job.
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  He had a network down there toward your home in Carolina.
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  Absolutely.
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  But now you did not travel with the team at all with Atlanta.
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  No not at all.
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  And all the home games live but the recreation on the road.
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  We did one road game.
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  It was in 1948.
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  We went to Birmingham and I thought that was really a big shot going on the train with
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  the team and getting over there to Birmingham and doing the broadcast direct from Birmingham
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  live.
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  But that's the only time I ever did one.
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  Everything else I had a picture of the ballpark.
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  I'd say it hit the Coca-Cola sign in right field something like that.
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  But I'd never seen those parks.
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  You actually turned down the first major league broadcasting job that you had offered to you
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  didn't you?
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  I didn't really turn it down but I was unable to accept it.
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  I had signed a contract with Old Gold to do the Atlanta Cracker games in 47.
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  And really I thought I was a big shot now.
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  Finally signed a contract.
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  I've never even seen a contract before but I signed.
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  I felt real good.
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  I'm going to do the games.
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  They're going to pay me X number of dollars and that's great.
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  And then the Giants had an interest in me the New York Giants and they sent a guy down
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  and said that they'd like for me to come and broadcast the giant games with Frank Frisch.
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  Big had been doing the color with a guy named Ellis and they wanted to replace him.
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  So I said wow I'm going to the big leagues this is great.
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  But I did have a contract with Old Gold.
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  However they had agreed not in writing but they had agreed that if I got a big league
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  offer I would be released and I could get out of my contract.
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  So I was very anxious to go and I found out that they weren't going to let me out of my
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  contract and I talked to Earl Mann my patron saint there the owner of the crackers and
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  he said well I'm going to do everything I can.
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  I don't want to lose you but I want you to get to the big leagues.
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  And he said we'll try to fight this and I'll talk to him and see if they'll release you
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  although it's not written into the contract.
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  Well they wouldn't budge.
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  They said no.
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  So it was very disappointing that I had to stay at least another year and do the cracker
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  games.
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  I didn't get a chance to go to the big leagues and that's when Brooklyn came down and scouted
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  me and got me and then I did go to Brooklyn and work for Old Gold.
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  You mentioned the Dodgers.
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  They came looking at you.
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  Branch Rickey who owned the team was the guy who pulled all the strings.
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  He was an innovator to the nth degree.
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  Give me your recollections of Branch Rickey.
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  Branch Rickey was about the smartest man I ever saw in baseball.
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  He was ahead of everybody.
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  He was a man who really brought the farm system to fulfillment.
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  He was a guy that first really put paddings on the walls around the ballpark.
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  He was the first executive that insisted that the players wear batting helmets.
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  A lot of things that now we take for granted were innovations brought into the game by
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  Branch Rickey.
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  He was also the best man as they say of putting a dollar sign on a muscle.
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  He could look at a guy as a prospect and figure out better than anybody else whether this
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  guy would develop into a true major leaguer.
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  He had success wherever he went.
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  He was probably the most brilliant baseball man that ever ran a front office.
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  He did have an eye for talent and it wasn't always on the field.
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  Sometimes it was in the broadcast booth.
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  Unbeknownst to you, he had some of his scouts listening to you do the Atlanta Crackers games.
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  That's true and it was quite a surprise to me.
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  I think what happened in relation to Mr. Rickey and me was that first of all there was a sports
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  writer named Kyle Crichton, sports editor to the Cuyahs magazine.
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  He's the father of Michael Crichton, the famous novelist.
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  He came down to do an interview for Cuyahs with Frankie Sinkwitz, a great Georgia football
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  player and in the process I guess he heard me broadcast.
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  He went back and told Mr. Rickey about it and Branch Rickey I found out just recently
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  also sent Buzzy Bavasi who had been the general manager at Montreal, later became the GM at
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  Brooklyn, a lot of other places.
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  He sent him down and he listened to me.
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  He talked to the cab drivers and the fans and the ball players and people like that
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  and he sent a report back.
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  And then he had another guy named Arthur Mann who was sort of an advisor on public relations
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  and media relations and he came down and talked to me.
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  So I was really surprised that Branch Rickey took that kind of an interest in me.
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  But he did scout me quite thoroughly.
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  If anything Branch Rickey kept things close to the best.
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  He didn't want anybody knowing what he was doing, nobody messing in his business.
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  That also involved you in your first scheduled meeting didn't it?
• 15:58
  Oh it sure did.
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  I was contacted by Arthur Mann, the man that I mentioned and he said Mr. Rickey wants to
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  meet you at the battle house in Mobile.
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  He gave me a certain date.
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  He said can you make it?
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  And I said yeah I'll be there.
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  So I was in spring training in Gainesville with the crackers.
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  I caught a little puddle jumper, went through a storm, got to the battle house early in
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  the morning and we were going to meet about four or five o'clock in the afternoon.
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  I was ready.
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  I waited.
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  And Branch Rickey didn't show up.
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  I waited, I waited.
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  Five o'clock's gone, six o'clock, nine o'clock, ten o'clock.
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  And I finally got in touch with Arthur Mann.
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  He said well Mr. Rickey couldn't get away.
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  He's sorry but he'll see you sometime probably in Atlanta.
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  So I was very disappointed and that waiting almost killed me but I figured something good
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  is going to happen.
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  I got back to Atlanta and I played sound that ball for a little guy who was a hunchback
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  named Rach Bell and he'd been sort of a bird dog scout for Branch Rickey.
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  And one morning at my home in Atlanta I got this phone call and the voice said I'm not
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  going to tell you who this is but somebody wants to see you at the Anthly Hotel.
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  You'll be in the coffee shop at 8 a.m.
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  Be there.
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  So I had heard all these stories about Branch Rickey, you know, how hard he wants to talk
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  to and so forth and what a tough guy he was and negotiating and things like that.
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  I went down to the Anthly Hotel and I got to the coffee shop and he was there and we
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  sat there and he said you know I've got a plane to catch.
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  I've got to get out of here pretty quick but we'll get to the point.
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  Well we stayed there about an hour and a half I guess and he did all the talking and I was
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  enthralled by him.
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  I was hypnotized almost and he told me then that he wanted me to come up to Brooklyn and
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  the theory at that time was that Red Barber, the chief announcer, was going to have to
• 17:49
  do the Olympics for CBS Radio.
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  The Olympics that year were in London and Red was going to have to be gone for maybe
• 17:56
  a month or three weeks and they would bring me up and I would take his place while he
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  was gone.
• 18:01
  Well later on they decided they'd do it another way that they'd have guest announcers come
• 18:06
  on and be the announcer they wouldn't need me.
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  In the meantime in late July Red Barber got stricken by a bleeding ulcer in Pittsburgh
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  and I guess that's another story.
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  But then you ended up going to Brooklyn?
• 18:19
  Mm-hmm.
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  What happened was Branch Rickey called Earl Mann, my boss in Atlanta, and said I'd like
• 18:25
  to have Ernie come up and replace Red Barber as my announcer.
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  And Earl Mann said well Mr. Rickey that's fine but I've got Ernie under contract and
• 18:34
  if you're serious about that if you really want him you're going to have to make a deal
• 18:38
  with me.
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  You send me your catcher Cliff Dapper from Montreal and you can have Ernie Harwell to
• 18:44
  announce your game.
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  So I was traded for minor league catcher.
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  That has never happened before nor since.
• 18:51
  No I think that's the only time as far as anybody knows.
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  You go to Brooklyn to do your first game.
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  Was this your first major league ball game to see?
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  No I'd seen a game before in Chicago back in 1934.
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  My Uncle Lauren who lived in Evanston wanted me to come up because he knew I was a great
• 19:09
  baseball fan.
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  I had started working with the sporting news but I never seen a big league ball game.
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  So he brought me up and the first game that we were scheduled to go see was rained out.
• 19:19
  And I was so anxious to see a game I was going crazy.
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  It kept raining and it rained again the next day.
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  And he said don't worry about it.
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  I know you got a ticket to go home but we're going to change that ticket and you're going
• 19:31
  to stay here.
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  I don't care how long it rains.
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  You're going to stay here and you're going to see a big league ball game.
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  So finally we went out to Old Comiskey Park.
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  The Yankees were in town.
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  They were playing the White Sox.
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  Red Ruffing against Ted Lyons two great Hall of Fame pitchers.
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  And the Yankees had Babe Ruth playing left field.
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  He made a great running catch in left field.
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  It was his final America League game in Chicago.
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  Lou Gehrig was in the lineup.
• 19:59
  Lou Gehrig got two doubles that afternoon and he did something I've never seen in my
• 20:03
  whole broadcasting career.
• 20:05
  He ducked a pitch.
• 20:07
  It ricocheted off his bat over the third baseman's head for two bagger and he did it again the
• 20:12
  next time up.
• 20:13
  Two straight times he got a double the same way.
• 20:15
  Trying to get out of the way.
• 20:16
  And the Yankees won that game.
• 20:18
  The crowd was probably about two or three thousand people on that September afternoon.
• 20:23
  But do you remember it well?
• 20:24
  Oh absolutely.
• 20:25
  Yeah.
• 20:26
  Good paper.