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Joaquin Luken - Smart Border Coalition · The Lawtino™

0:01
SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Latino podcast where we discuss the intersection of law and our Latino communities with legal, political, and community leaders and visionaries.
0:09
SPEAKER_00: Let's get started.
0:13
SPEAKER_03: Hey Sean Gomez, welcome to another episode of the Latino Podcast, where we discuss the intersection of law, culture, and our Latino communities.
0:25
SPEAKER_03: This episode, as always, is brought to you by your sponsor, Gomez Trial Attorneys.
0:31
SPEAKER_03: Gomez Trial Attorneys is a binational, bicultural, and best-in-class law firm located primarily in San Diego, but we provide the very highest level of legal representation, both in the English and Spanish language to victims of personal injury, employment thwarts, civil rights violations all along our California Mexico border.
0:57
SPEAKER_03: I have with me today is my co-host, a former guest on the uh program, David Areguin.
1:04
SPEAKER_03: You may recall, we talked to him a little bit back when he was at another law firm.
1:08
SPEAKER_03: He's now in-house in a new role, which he can explain to our listeners, and is now the co-host of this podcast.
1:16
SPEAKER_02: Thank you, John.
1:17
SPEAKER_02: Excited to be here.
1:18
SPEAKER_02: Uh as John said, now I'm in-house.
1:20
SPEAKER_02: Uh I am the managing attorney for the California-Mexico coroner.
1:25
SPEAKER_02: Very unique role.
1:26
SPEAKER_02: Uh, and it's mainly based on my background.
1:29
SPEAKER_02: Uh, just like our guest today, uh Joaquin, uh, I was born in San Diego, raised in Tijuana, and educated in uh the U.S., uh, both college and law school.
1:39
SPEAKER_02: So it's exciting to be back here as a co-host, uh, no longer a guest, and I still have a little conversation with John because I believe that podcast might have been a little interview, uh, which I think I nailed because now I'm here.
1:52
SPEAKER_02: Uh, so it's good to be here and uh ready to get started with our guest.
1:57
SPEAKER_02: Wonderful.
1:58
SPEAKER_03: So our guest today is Joaquin Lukin, um, who uh like uh David was, I believe, born here, raised in Tijuana, came back here.
2:08
SPEAKER_03: Uh, he is now the executive director of the Smart Border Coalition.
2:14
SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, here at Gomez Ral Attorneys, we really believe that we are bi-national, bicultural.
2:21
SPEAKER_03: We believe it's one uh community, you know, one group of you know people that share a lot.
2:28
SPEAKER_03: And so having you here today, Joaquin, you know, means a lot.
2:32
SPEAKER_03: So uh why don't you introduce yourself?
2:34
SPEAKER_03: Tell us a little bit about yourself and what you're doing today.
2:36
SPEAKER_01: Thank you, John, and thank you, David.
2:38
SPEAKER_01: Um, full disclosure, I did listen to David's interview.
2:42
SPEAKER_01: Okay, and um, we do have a lot of similarities, like you said, same school.
2:47
SPEAKER_01: It was like listening to myself.
2:49
SPEAKER_01: Um, and um I guess um listening to the interview, I was like, this guy's, you know, this is talking just like I would be talking, right?
3:00
SPEAKER_01: I was so I'm the executive director of Smart Border Coalition, born in San Diego, as you said.
3:07
SPEAKER_01: I'm 49 years of age.
3:09
SPEAKER_01: Um, I currently live in San Diego, have two kids, and so I'm I was a typical border brat growing up, right?
3:17
SPEAKER_01: Um, crossing the border back and forth.
3:19
SPEAKER_01: I like to say that I'm 49, but I've been crossing the border for 50 years, if you know what I mean.
3:25
SPEAKER_01: Um, so we we've been back and forth uh growing up in Tijuana and also just coming back for whatever back in the day where we would just cross for anything, right?
3:38
SPEAKER_01: I remember I used to cross with my dad to pick up the newspaper in San Isidro with the quarters, you know, in front of the post office and go back or get an ice cream where it was five o'clock, and he would say, let's go to a padre game, right?
3:50
SPEAKER_01: So we would just cross and just wait for 10, 15 minutes at the border, be at the stadium, head back, just a normal border family.
3:59
SPEAKER_01: Um, so fast forward, I went to the same school as David, Instituto México in in Tijuana.
4:05
SPEAKER_01: I went for elementary school, uh, high school, and junior high and high school.
4:11
SPEAKER_01: And then I went to Tecta Monterrey in Monterey, uh, Mexico.
4:15
SPEAKER_01: And I majored in business administration, and I I kind of liked and fell in love with the with the corporate world in Monterey.
4:25
SPEAKER_01: And I saw these big businesses, like uh, you know, the beer companies and the cement companies and the glass companies, all these big infrastructure, big, big corporate uh entities.
4:35
SPEAKER_01: And I said, you know what, I think I'm gonna stick around in Monterey for a while and try to see what uh what this is all about.
4:43
SPEAKER_01: And and and and coming back during the summers and the winters, my my dad would tell me, you know what, if you want to stay there, fine, but make sure just take one thing in mind.
4:56
SPEAKER_01: You're a U.S.
4:56
SPEAKER_01: citizen, you speak English, and you know people on both sides of the border.
5:01
SPEAKER_01: Over there, you're just another one in these huge corporations.
5:05
SPEAKER_01: And over here, you could probably do a little more or or or be of a better, I guess, uh service to your community that saw you grow up.
5:15
SPEAKER_01: And that kind of really resonated.
5:17
SPEAKER_01: And I said, you know what, I'm gonna come back.
5:19
SPEAKER_01: So I came back and I fast forward, I started working at a chamber of commerce in Otai Mesa.
5:25
SPEAKER_01: And that's where I started um knowing all these companies and folks that are in the binational, bicultural, uh, and cross-border business arena, which is all the brokers, freight forwarders, and the the twin companies that are the maquilas in Mexico, they would have their uh research or their warehousing facilities in San Diego.
5:50
SPEAKER_01: So that's where I started learning how important this trans border, transfronterizo, as I call, because a lot of people talk about being bicultural or binational.
6:03
SPEAKER_01: And there's another third concept called transfronterizo, which is which is actually to me a superpower because you have to deal with two countries every single day.
6:14
SPEAKER_01: You have to deal with two uh cultures.
6:17
SPEAKER_01: Even if they say it's the same culture, it's the same, it's not.
6:20
SPEAKER_01: It's really two different cultures: Mexico, the United States.
6:23
SPEAKER_01: You have to deal with two currencies.
6:25
SPEAKER_01: And this is this is this is going to resonate with you have to deal with two sets of laws on every single day.
6:32
SPEAKER_01: You have to have, as you know, insurance on your vehicle on the US side, and another one on the Mexican side.
6:40
SPEAKER_01: And you have to have sometimes even your healthcare uh insurance won't cover certain things in the border, even though you have an international policy.
6:49
SPEAKER_01: So it's it's all juggling all these things, and of course, the resilience of crossing the border back and forth when you live in Tijuana and work in San Diego.
6:59
SPEAKER_01: So that's kind of my background.
7:02
SPEAKER_01: Amazing.
7:02
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, we have uh some of our employees here cross, you know, and and you know, we hear about, you know, how was the way, you know, this morning versus that morning, and you know, around the holidays, you know, it it tends to be it, it seems more of a weight.
7:19
SPEAKER_03: You know, you were talking about as a kid just crossing over, grabbing ice cream or a newspaper going to the Padres game uh without any kind of hassle.
7:27
SPEAKER_03: That sounds like a perfect, you know, world to me.
7:31
SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah.
7:32
SPEAKER_01: It it it is, and it was until you know, uh fast forward when I was working uh in in in in Otai at the chamber, I was getting ready to go to work, and it was probably, I don't know, maybe a little after six or something, because again, uh the border was predictable, uh, but uh again, it it'll it'll it'll catch up with my story.
7:55
SPEAKER_01: I was getting ready to uh to go to work when I started hearing you know commotion at home.
8:00
SPEAKER_01: And uh back then we had uh the next little phones.
8:03
SPEAKER_01: Remember, the chirp phones started beeping, and you know, uh somebody in my house yelled, turn on the turn on the TV and turn on the radio.
8:11
SPEAKER_01: And and I'm looking, and it's of course September 11, right?
8:15
SPEAKER_01: When I we're looking at the planes going into the towers, and we're getting all these calls from my boss was calling me saying, you know what, don't I I don't think it's smart to cross today.
8:25
SPEAKER_01: I think let's uh let's regroup later to the day.
8:28
SPEAKER_01: And you know, that was the day that everything changed.
8:32
SPEAKER_01: Um, and I'm not saying that it changed for the worst, but it just changed, right?
8:36
SPEAKER_01: Um the the the Department of Homeland Security was created, customs and border protection was created, all these new uh um mechanisms for crossing goods and also people, you know, um uh sentry for truck drivers or CTPAT for international uh companies doing business.
8:56
SPEAKER_01: So kind of in a way, it was a more secure way to do trade and travel.
9:01
SPEAKER_01: But of course, it was now more uh more of a restrictive, more of a controlled environment, more of like a um it was just different when we would just cross.
9:14
SPEAKER_01: And I know you that'd be if you're a U.S.
9:15
SPEAKER_01: citizen, you used to cross and you just used to say, I was born here and you were on your way.
9:20
SPEAKER_01: That is correct.
9:21
SPEAKER_02: It was a simpler times.
9:22
SPEAKER_01: Simpler times.
9:23
SPEAKER_01: Now you need to have all your documentation, and you know, a lot of a lot of things have have occurred, you know, like the Sentry program, which was actually a pilot program that started in San Diego 30 years ago, exact.
9:35
SPEAKER_01: So it started in Otai Mesa as a pilot program for the Makila executives that were crossing back and forth.
9:42
SPEAKER_01: So after a study that was conducted by a group called the San Diego Dialogue, which is kind of like an um initial group that started the Smart Border Coalition, they hired a person, they did a study on who crosses the border.
10:00
SPEAKER_01: And the study came out and said, Well, you know what?
10:04
SPEAKER_01: Everyone, the everyone that's crossing the border is just a repeat commuter.
10:07
SPEAKER_01: You got a lot of repeat customers.
10:10
SPEAKER_01: As somebody says, we're the most auto-visited uh border in the world.
10:14
SPEAKER_01: We just keep coming back and forth, back and forth, commuting for work.
10:18
SPEAKER_01: And why don't we we keep asking people, where are you going?
10:21
SPEAKER_01: Where are you coming from?
10:22
SPEAKER_01: Where do you live?
10:23
SPEAKER_01: Where do you work?
10:25
SPEAKER_01: We kind of know that, right?
10:26
SPEAKER_01: So why don't we come up with a program that's a trusted traveler program, and that's kind of how Sentry, that's kind of, but that's how Sentry and now the Global Ventry program got started.
10:37
SPEAKER_01: So and and and now, I mean, it's just it's just been the best thing for for the this cross-border community.
10:45
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, for sure.
10:46
SPEAKER_03: Very uh, very grateful, you know, you because you you can definitely compare stories with people that have it, the people that don't that go down there, maybe.
10:56
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, especially around the holidays.
10:58
SPEAKER_02: It's just it's just crazy.
10:59
SPEAKER_02: The the wait times.
11:01
SPEAKER_02: Uh yeah, Century definitely changed everything.
11:03
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I've had Century for many, many years, but since I was 12 years old uh at that time, I believe it was only like maybe two cars in front of you, now a scroll and two hundred mace.
11:13
SPEAKER_01: Well, um, it's well let me just back up a little.
11:16
SPEAKER_01: So so the border has been recently been modernized uh back in, I think it was uh 2016 or so.
11:24
SPEAKER_01: Well, actually, even before that.
11:26
SPEAKER_01: So it it went under a$750 billion modernization.
11:31
SPEAKER_01: I'm talking about the San Isido Port of Entry, the one that we use every day, the one that has anywhere from 90 to 100,000 people crossing each and every day.
11:40
SPEAKER_01: Came uh had a$750 billion uh modernization.
11:44
SPEAKER_01: It went from 24 lanes to 36 lanes, which could actually be uh double stacked to 72.
11:52
SPEAKER_01: That's a different story.
11:53
SPEAKER_01: We'll get we'll we'll get there.
11:55
SPEAKER_01: But um now all the lanes are interchangeable lanes, which means that you can have all the 36 lanes being a central lane, or you can have all the 36 lanes being a ready lane, or you can have all the 36 being an all-traffic lane.
12:09
SPEAKER_01: Um, Century normally now has the same amount of travelers as the ready lanes.
12:15
SPEAKER_01: So for those who don't know, the border is uh, I guess, separated in three different areas.
12:21
SPEAKER_01: One is the all-traffic lanes, which is for people that don't have a readable document.
12:27
SPEAKER_01: Let's say somebody just walks in or shows up with a license or with a birth certificate or with nothing.
12:32
SPEAKER_01: If you're a U.S.
12:32
SPEAKER_01: citizen, you can go through.
12:34
SPEAKER_01: It's a little bit of a hassle.
12:35
SPEAKER_01: We might be referred to secondary, but you can cross as a U.S.
12:38
SPEAKER_01: citizen.
12:39
SPEAKER_01: A lot of people call us and ask us, hey, I don't have a passport, I just realized how can I get back?
12:44
SPEAKER_01: So that's one way.
12:46
SPEAKER_01: The other one way is the ready lane, which is to get back with a witty document.
12:51
SPEAKER_01: Witty means Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative Ready Card.
12:55
SPEAKER_01: I know it's a mouthful, but it's uh normally it's the enhanced IDs.
13:00
SPEAKER_01: And a lot of people confuse enhanced IDs with real IDs.
13:03
SPEAKER_01: It's two different things.
13:04
SPEAKER_01: So enhanced IDs are IDs normally issued on the northern states.
13:10
SPEAKER_01: And uh also your passport card is another witty ready document.
13:14
SPEAKER_01: So if you have one of those, you can cross through the ready lanes.
13:17
SPEAKER_01: And of course, obviously your B1, B2 border crossing visa.
13:20
SPEAKER_01: Um, and of course, there's the century lanes, century and global entry lanes, which of course are like David said, the fastest, the quickest, the more efficient, but also the the ones that that CBP and the and Department of Homeland Security knows who you are and you're a trusted traveler.
13:38
SPEAKER_01: That's why they tend to be a little smoother to cross.
13:42
SPEAKER_01: And so so now you have the same amount of ready lane uh users as century users.
13:49
SPEAKER_01: So let's put it in uh context.
13:51
SPEAKER_01: In San Isidro, any given day, there's 45,000 vehicles crossing cars every single day.
14:00
SPEAKER_01: Uh 43 percent is century, another 42 is ready, and the rest is all traffic.
14:09
SPEAKER_01: So we're talking 18,000 cars are crossing through century every day.
14:13
SPEAKER_01: Another 18 in a little change, ready, and the rest are the all traffic.
14:18
SPEAKER_03: Wow.
14:19
SPEAKER_03: You know, and uh the economic impact of uh of that uh you know, travel and that population, you know, in in terms of economic, you know, benefit to San Diego County or California or the United States, you know, what are we looking at in terms of economic impact?
14:40
SPEAKER_01: Well, let's start first with the the cost of the wait times.
14:44
SPEAKER_01: So it's estimated recent studies show that the cost of wait times are$3.6 billion a year.
14:52
SPEAKER_01: This is border wide from coast to coast on the San Diego-Tijuana border or on the Calibaja region, and I'll get back to the Calibaja region in a little in a little second, but on the Calibaja region, it's it's almost$2 billion.
15:05
SPEAKER_01: So it's a big lion's share of the cost uh for wait times.
15:10
SPEAKER_01: How do you calculate a cost for wait time?
15:12
SPEAKER_01: Well, of course, it's lost wages, lost sales, um, employee productivity, missed deadlines.
15:20
SPEAKER_01: So it's it's all these features, and there's studies that show on the commercial side how a reduction of 10 minutes in commercial border wait times, these are the trucks moving cargo from Mexico into the United States, how that could improve.
15:35
SPEAKER_01: And it can improve in just a 10-minute reduction is is a ridiculous amount, and I think the tens of millions of dollars in economic productivity.
15:44
SPEAKER_01: And let's let's uh let's also say how the border is uh is important because really the border touches everyone in San Diego County.
15:54
SPEAKER_01: You can live in Oceanside, you can live in San Marcos, you can live in Escondido.
15:59
SPEAKER_01: The border touches you one way or another.
16:03
SPEAKER_01: If you're a business owner and you have employees that cross the border, if you're a contractor and you're you're the folks that that you know the that build the houses or the projects for you, they're crossing the border.
16:16
SPEAKER_01: If you run a hospital, you have a lot of staff that crosses the border.
16:23
SPEAKER_01: These aren't just U.S.
16:24
SPEAKER_01: citizens.
16:25
SPEAKER_01: Let me give you an astonishing fact.
16:27
SPEAKER_01: Of the 90,000 people to 100,000 people that cross through San Isidro, and I'll ask you a question.
16:34
SPEAKER_01: Guess what amount of that, what percentage are U.S.
16:38
SPEAKER_01: citizens?
16:39
SPEAKER_01: Well, that's you, John.
16:40
SPEAKER_01: You know the answer, W.
16:41
SPEAKER_03: Oh, D already knows.
16:43
SPEAKER_03: Filming our university club presentation.
16:46
SPEAKER_03: He knows it.
16:47
SPEAKER_03: He knows it.
16:51
SPEAKER_03: I bet it's higher than I think.
16:53
SPEAKER_03: See, I would normally say uh maybe like 20%, but now I'll go a little higher.
16:59
SPEAKER_03: I'll say 50%.
17:01
SPEAKER_01: Okay, but your initial gut was 20.
17:03
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
17:03
SPEAKER_01: It's actually 80%.
17:05
SPEAKER_01: Hi.
17:06
SPEAKER_01: Like wow.
17:08
SPEAKER_01: It's so so it comes back to the narrative of immigration and illegal immigration.
17:13
SPEAKER_01: And we're we're all like immersed in this negativity that we see on the media, on the news.
17:19
SPEAKER_01: And it's really the border, it's just really men and women crossing to go to school, to go to work, to go do their uh social activities.
17:27
SPEAKER_01: And of course, I mean, I'm looking at this room.
17:30
SPEAKER_01: For if you're listening, you can't see it, but it's a beautiful mural with a lot of family and social uh connections, and that's that's what makes us also unique.
17:41
SPEAKER_01: Uh we're we're the we're the only border in the entire 2,000 mile um long border where the where the US is the largest city than the Mexican city.
17:53
SPEAKER_01: So that makes us unique in a way that we we really value this relationship and this interaction, right?
18:01
SPEAKER_01: So so yeah, that's uh that's that's really who's who's crossing, right?
18:05
SPEAKER_01: So that's why I say the border touches you one way or another, right?
18:10
SPEAKER_03: I had never uh well one, I'm astonished by that number, 80%.
18:15
SPEAKER_03: And I'd never stopped to think about like all these cross-border, you know, communities, like we're the one that has the larger city on the north side as opposed to the south side, everywhere else.
18:28
SPEAKER_03: The larger city is on the south side.
18:30
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
18:30
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, now that Walking mentions it, I've never thought about it before, so it's pretty uh it's pretty impressive.
18:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and uh, and I'll give you uh another another example, you know, during COVID, David, you may know this, uh the border was closed uh in a way to stop the COVID um virus, right?
18:49
SPEAKER_01: So so they said, well, let's cross the border so there's no activity going back and forth, right?
18:54
SPEAKER_01: But the border was only closed for Mexican citizens.
18:58
SPEAKER_01: So what happened was that the next day when they announced the border was closing, there's people lined up and thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands who were like, wait a minute, we didn't we close the border?
19:10
SPEAKER_01: Well, yeah, for a small fraction of people who couldn't cross.
19:14
SPEAKER_01: So so that's uh that was an eye-opening uh time for a lot of people that said, well, no one's gonna come from Mexico, so at least we're kind of limiting who's coming or reducing, I guess, interactions with people.
19:28
SPEAKER_01: And no, it was all the contrary.
19:30
SPEAKER_01: So we kept seeing 100,000 uh crossings in the whole Calibaja region.
19:34
SPEAKER_01: By Caliba, I keep saying Calibaja, and let me just explain to the listeners.
19:37
SPEAKER_01: So the Calibaja region is the region comprised of the cities in the state of Baja California in Mexico, which is Tijuana, Rosarito, Ensenada, uh Mexicali, San Quintín, Tacate, and also the uh San Diego County and Imperial counties.
19:56
SPEAKER_01: So it's a it's a mega region that interacts with itself every single day.
20:02
SPEAKER_01: There's around 7 million plus people, 250 billion dollars in GDP, um, 200,000 crossings if we count for the ports of entry to the east, Calexico, Calexico East, and Andrade, we have all those.
20:18
SPEAKER_01: So we function also as a region.
20:21
SPEAKER_01: So that's where the Calibaja name comes from, for all those who are asking.
20:26
SPEAKER_03: What differences would you describe between the Tijuana, San Diego, um uh port of entries and Calexico, Mexicali?
20:40
SPEAKER_03: Like what's different between those two places?
20:43
SPEAKER_01: Well, well, number one, the number of crossings, right?
20:46
SPEAKER_01: And the dependency of of of this of the US part of the of that.
20:54
SPEAKER_01: So if you if you drive around Mexicali, it's a very, very well uh developed, very well, well uh commercially developed.
21:03
SPEAKER_01: Um you have great restaurants, great hotels, great places to um be entertained uh indoor because it's so hot.
21:12
SPEAKER_01: And my family's from Mexicali, so that's why I say that.
21:15
SPEAKER_01: But on the northern, but but in in the Calexico uh portion, you feel that there's not that much of the need to be back and forth, right?
21:26
SPEAKER_01: So San Diego and Tijuana, I mean, you just gotta peek outside, right?
21:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
21:31
SPEAKER_01: Number one, you got the weather, you got the beaches, you got the Padres, you got everything, you got all the shopping centers, you have all these things, and but you also have all these um shared and co production manufacturing facilities that we have.
21:46
SPEAKER_01: And we have this border wide, right?
21:48
SPEAKER_01: Not just in Tijuana, San Diego, but we have a lot of interaction with um companies that are located in San Diego that have operations in Tijuana, right?
21:58
SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, like Qualcomm has an operation.
22:00
SPEAKER_01: in Tijuana.
22:01
SPEAKER_01: Sempra Energy has an operation in Tijuana.
22:05
SPEAKER_01: Go Mistral attorneys.
22:06
SPEAKER_01: Hey uh a company like a company like uh people that like music will will know this brand but Taylor guitars are the uh they're the uh top tier guitars in probably the world they're made in Tecate California and they also have a facility in Tecate the US side so it's also stories like that but it's really more on what I what I talked about a little earlier than how the border is fueling the binational workforce in San Diego and it fuels um even the defense industry you know a lot of people that work uh for contractors for the defense industry are crossing the border people that are building building the ships for the Navy are crossing the border you got welders you got painters you got steel workers uh and of course uh nurses doctors uh technicians for um equipment high-end equipment in hospitals uh you have the convention center that's a humongous uh economic driver in San Diego and if you ask around and I've I've spoken to the CEO and he's told me that probably anywhere from 100 to 150 of his core workers are crossing the border and he said guess what they're here on time every single day.
23:25
SPEAKER_01: Of course so that is even um uh when there's a padre game there's uh petco park has around a capacity around 45,000 give or take i mean they sell out every practically every day now um number one around it's estimated that anywhere from nine to eleven thousand fans are coming from Tijuana but also the people that work at Petco Park the people that sell the concessions the people that sell the tickets the greens keepers the technicians that help with the screens and with the scoreboard guess where they're coming from they're coming from Tijuana San Diego a couple years back and you may know this John was one of the most expensive cities to live in the entire nation and when you have Tijuana as an escape valve with a great community with great resid residential developments with a great vibe it just makes it a really really good feasible option.
24:22
SPEAKER_01: It's come with a cost of course wait times keep increasing and now we keep talking about wait times coming south.
24:30
SPEAKER_02: This is new um especially on Saturdays uh at one point I remember like playing tennis down in Tijuana like Saturdays and I stopped doing that because my wait time going to the south was of of about an hour.
24:43
SPEAKER_01: Yeah so add one hour coming in one hour coming back it's just not worth it and and and and you're leaving something important out you don't work at the border.
24:52
SPEAKER_01: You work you could work in Escondido you can work in San Marcos you can work in Oceanside you can work in La Mesa so you have to add the traffic in San Diego you have to add everything into consideration coming back as well if you're heading south you're hitting traffic on the 5, 805 or wherever and then you're hitting a one or two hour border wait to come into Mexico.
25:13
SPEAKER_01: So that's that's that's kind of like a just a trade off of this relationship that we that we have.
25:20
SPEAKER_01: What's driving that uh the southbound wait times just the amount of people that are living in Tijuana working here that's uh that's really the the the driver and and you can tell it because the traffic stops starts around three o'clock four o'clock peaking at five six even seven sometimes even eight and nine and ten o'clock so it's really and and and and now you said it David uh Saturdays Saturdays are also big now and tourism right it's well it's tourism and it's a lot of people that live in live in San Diego because remember they're living in a border area and immigrating legally is also a challenge because you're a legal permanent resident with the option to live in Tijuana the practical option not the legal uh uh option you have to if you're a legal permanent resident you have to legally permanently reside in San Diego County right or in the United States for for all that matters so a lot of people used to kind of like take advantage of the closeness the opportunities uh we'll have a green cart but I still live in Tijuana across every other day but uh but now with new laws regulations and all this noise about uh new immigration laws and what's happening where we're listening on the radio and seeing on TV, a lot of people are now living the whole week in San Diego and using the weekend to go back and see their families or do whatever they need to do, you know, get their hair done, car done, shopping you name it.
26:52
SPEAKER_01: So this is the dynamic that flows south as well as the one that flows north.
26:57
SPEAKER_03: Ah that's interesting.
26:59
SPEAKER_01: So in the old days with a green card you'd still get away with kind of well I mean not that you get away with uh you're an attorney and I you know the league you know the legal the legals the legal speak right but uh it was it's common so it's easier to do that I thought you were allowed to do that it well no legal permanent resident says it on the card right but uh but it's not the same as you were immigrating legally immigrating by marriage or by whatever in uh middle america right if you're middle america you don't have an option but just stay there right but you're in a border area it just makes it a lot uh it's it it makes it a pretty decent option right say hey cost of rent here versus cost of rent there and living yeah let me go back and forth especially if you're if you don't commute every single day if you can work from home that's another thing that COVID brought a lot of people could work from home so that that was that was good for these folks that were living from working from home didn't have to cross every single day uh so yeah because with technology the whole issue was the fact that now the US knew whether you were coming back and forth and where your car was sleepy.
28:11
SPEAKER_02: And I believe the issue is where the car is sleepy correct well yes I mean there's there's a lot of different factors.
28:17
SPEAKER_01: I mean it all comes down to an interview right like where do you live?
28:21
SPEAKER_01: And it comes back to like well I live in Chula Vista or San Marcos or wherever and officers are saying well you cross at 655 every single day right how how do you manage to do that right so so yeah technology plays a big role uh in in in in this but also technology and it's a segue to my my topic on technology on how technology can make the border smarter safer and more efficient so it's you know it's 2025 and we have one of the most powerful tools invented in human history which is a cell phone which could probably tell us the exact uh border weights it could also help CBP with identifying who you are with biometrics with screening so it can help us be a tool to make a border more efficient but more than more efficient a safer border because remember now uh from that day that I was getting ready to go to work with everything changed which was September 11 the main focus is security uh but as there's always there's also has to be the element of economic security right so economic security brings also um uh border security means economic security as well so it's um it's it's something that at smart border we work a lot with federal agencies with local state to how to leverage technology for data because data is very important uh on on these numbers that I just shared why do they mean something right it's it's with data that you can bring to elected officials and infographs that we publish on our website or on our social media that tell the story of who's crossing the border why are they crossing the border and and what's the profile not a lot of people know uh that breakdown that I just mentioned the 8020 that 8020 is actually 65% US 15% legal permanent residents and another 20 could be other nationalities normally Mexican.
30:27
SPEAKER_03: And so what you're talking about um you know increasing and better use of technology to kind of I study um crossing and also enhance security um like what would that look like?
30:42
SPEAKER_01: Well I'll give you an example uh are you for I'm sure you're familiar and you've traveled through CBX uh so see CBX is the is the ultimate example of cross-border collaboration cross border security and cross border efficiency so they're actually turning 10 uh literally next week yeah they they're turning 10 next week and CBX has been uh kind of like a testing lab for uh efficiency tools that have been slowly been used outside the CBX or airport environment says you know an airport environment is a safe environment you're you check with the airline you check with your airport you're checked with everyone um different countries that you're coming from so uh the people that are coming through um air travel are considered a let's say a safer group because you've been vetted and you've been right so all these all these tools like right now CBX has this thing called the EPP which is called the enhanced passenger processing which means that if you're a U.S.
31:48
SPEAKER_01: citizen, if you just swipe your passport and your boarding pass and of course your CBX ticket um now you don't even have to see an officer um coming back to the US yeah it's amazing so it's amazing all these little things and all these things will be trickling down on the pedestrian side where they do other pilot programs for students and for businesses it's through that technology.
32:32
SPEAKER_01: And when you really want to do something and you know it took a long time but finally they got together they figure out a way to make it economically feasible and it made it happen.
32:44
SPEAKER_01: Yeah that's amazing I I imagine there's going to be a feature in which like you said um you can cross through the principal ports of entry without any interaction with the human inspector you know I imagine there's technology that would allow you know um there is I mean there's there's there's way to digitalize digitalize the border in many many ways and there's I was mentioning the 36 lanes right now and um some of the challenges that are faced at the border is that not all of the booths are staffed because well that's because of staffing issues and and and and and budgets and appropriations that happens in DC uh which is also a big problem we're so far from DC and also in Tijuana we're so far from Mexico that decisions made in the capitals on how to that affect the border region don't really make not even make sense right so the it it it's really important for our local state federal representatives to have a bigger voice in the capitals to really paint the picture of who's crossing and how how a border that's more efficient turns into a border that's more secure.
33:56
SPEAKER_03: I think that's true.
33:56
SPEAKER_03: You know and I I remember um I was a federal prosecutor here um in the what we called uh border crimes and then narcotics and I remember um there would be times when like Mexico was mad at us mad at the United States I remember one time in particular um we arrested a bunch of bankers without telling without informing the government um and then I feel like sometimes we would have you know issues with Mexico that is United States would have issues with Mexico Mexico and I I felt like there I just want to ask is there is there times when our government on the United States side will intentionally constrict or slow entering into the United States to retaliate or send a message or for some political reason.
34:55
SPEAKER_03: Does that happen ever?
34:57
SPEAKER_01: You know what I honestly would say I I would tend to say no and and you know what the the border is a shared responsibility so it it's responsibility of Mexico to have an uh a safe and efficient border as well as the the US side um I'll go back to the example of September 11 the border was open for business on September 12th uh because I went back to work and uh of course there was this uh very interesting security display that I wasn't I'd never seen um but uh but they were open for business you know uh the border has never closed even though a few years ago we kept saying close the borders close the borders close the borders that was obviously uh national narrative on the ill illegal immigration and I'll I'll let me let me touch another data point there.
35:49
SPEAKER_01: Um a few years back um I think the record and I looked it up the record day for illegal immigration crossings border wide this is from San Isidro to Brownsville was I think 850 illegal crossings in a day and it made the headlines right it made front page news everywhere around the world nobody talked about the 5350 legal crossings that happened that day right dwarfing a number like 800 or 1,000 if you if you look at it.
36:25
SPEAKER_01: So every day half a million people cross legally from Mexico into the United States.
36:31
SPEAKER_01: And again um some shop of course some visit their families but most of them are working are generating prosperity for U.S.
36:41
SPEAKER_01: companies the border is a gateway for prosperity and also a gateway for security and and now we're as we and I'll talk a little bit about the trade uh Mexico and the U.S.
36:55
SPEAKER_01: were number one trading partners over any other country in the world and it makes sense right we're next door neighbors right and we are part of the USMCA with along with Canada.
37:05
SPEAKER_01: So it makes perfect sense to do business with your neighbor not with somebody that's you know uh uh a a day away right um so so that that's also something to consider right now where we where we talk about the USMCA renegotiations and revisions to really um note that with Mexico you have a strong partner you have a partner that it's in his best interest to keep working with you and it just makes perfect sense right we look at cars we look at how cars are co-manufactured and co-produced by Mexico by Canada and by the US you can't really throw pun intended but you can't really throw a wrench into that program right because it's just something that works perfectly uh fine we have uh hospitals all around the US that are using medical devices that are made and readily available in Tijuana Tijuana number one uh industry right now is medical devices for anything right uh hospital use stents valves uh even um paste pastemakers right so it's it's really important for people to know what comes in through those trucks right trucks are just big boxes 53 foot boxes they don't know what they what they're bringing in there they're bringing our food they're bringing our medical devices they're bringing our um clothing they're bringing everything that we use on a daily basis to pay a decent price for amazing and so you were talking about you know uh we have these uh necessary goods and necessary trading agreements we have uh employees coming up here the employees I don't I think I'm right but if if you're crossing over to work uh over here um you are and you're a U.S.
39:01
SPEAKER_03: citizen or a resident alien you're paying income taxes aren't you aren't you?
39:06
SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah oh yes you're paying of course you get a W2 and you pay your taxes like everyone uh that works here pays taxes so that's another number that uh that is that is important to note and also remittances remittances are done by also by people that are here legally right and they live somewhere else in you know in the country and are bringing in you know billions of dollars in remittances but that means I think the number uh in 2024 was 65 billion wow in remittances I don't even know what that means what's so remittances is um the money that you would send like through Western Union if you're like working and wherever and you somebody picks it up in Mexico right yeah so picture that number 65 billion uh but what does that tell you?
39:57
SPEAKER_01: I mean no one sends their entire paycheck right you keep a lot of that money in the states you spend it you save it you go to lunch you buy goods you buy services you buy everything so if you're messing with that formula who are you affecting you're affecting the US economy US businesses US small businesses instead of uh sending all that money to Mexico instead of spending that money here if you're there's no jobs so people won't be spending money in the state so that's that's that's an important uh thing to know as well yeah this is a small portion right it's basically exactly it's a small portion families why because they're doing the work here they're doing the work here yeah and it helps you know it it it it's it's it's all a circle right it helps people in Mexico be economically stable not want to cross illegally so it's all this I guess it's all in this symbiotic relationship that both countries have and so if I'm a um a person uh that uh lives here and I'm very very I belong to a a particular political element and I'm very very anti-illegal immigration um it it sounds to me like uh that uh perspective or opinion has little or nothing to do with an efficient and secure border uh which benefits uh the United States and its economy and primarily uh transits legally legal citizens of people that are allowed to be here yeah I mean exactly I mean there's there's space for prosperity the right way right there is uh all these um I'm looking at a a a field right there and and the men and women working that field are working with uh H2A visas right they're not you know hiding from anyone they're contributing economically they pay taxes they get withholdings so there's there is a way for everyone to have prosperity uh the right way right and what about um your kind of my final question and then we can kind of wrap up uh you know we've seen some pretty accelerated development in the South Bay of of San Diego with this huge resort out in Sula Vista and the new convention center and all these plans you know how how do you feel like that affects um the Cali Baja region and and you know what you're committed to doing these states no it's all for the better and you now that you mentioned development of the South Bay uh this is we forgot to talk a little bit about the new port of entry that's being uh currently built by Sandag which is Otamesa East Port of Entry which is probably a mile and a half east of uh the current port of entry so we'll now have eight ports of entry in the Kalibaca region and the particular thing about this uh port of entry is that uh it's it's in this 120-acre site and for perspective Disneyland started in a 120-acre site so imagine the immensity of this border it'll have the capacity to have 20 passenger lanes and I'm sorry 20 commercial lanes and 25 commercial and 25 45 lanes in all and you can switch bike trucks and cars so this is this means that it could be the largest port of entry in the entire border so and it it'll have all the latest technology and inspection equipment this is a military bunker being built so it's not just you know putting up a few walls and some booths uh this is top notch technology non intrusive equipment non intrusive technology um sensors radars it'll have the whole the whole nine yards so it'll it'll it'll probably be a benchmark for other ports of entry to come and And um, it'll just increase efficiency.
44:02
SPEAKER_01: And again, when when people talk about, well, it'll bring more trucks and more traffic.
44:06
SPEAKER_01: Again, these trucks are bringing the goods and services.
44:10
SPEAKER_01: Well, not the services, right?
44:11
SPEAKER_01: But the goods that you're consuming in a family, right?
44:14
SPEAKER_01: But but again, we just see white boxes moving along the freeway, but we don't know what's in them, right?
44:19
SPEAKER_01: So they're they're bringing our food, our produce from Mexico, they're bringing our components, they're bringing our medical devices, they're bringing our furniture, they're bringing everything that we use on a daily basis.
44:32
SPEAKER_01: And of course, when I started the podcast, when I said the border touches everyone, these are folks that probably leave in the eastern part of Tijuana and commute every day to, let's say, a hospital in Escondido or to a restaurant in Oceanside.
44:46
SPEAKER_01: And we got to make it easier for them to be a more productive employee for U.S.
44:51
SPEAKER_01: companies.
44:52
SPEAKER_03: For sure.
44:53
SPEAKER_03: Totally agree.
44:54
SPEAKER_03: Whenever my people uh have problems crossing, and then they got to get here super early, and then they have to go, you know, they they might want to do a workout before uh they make it work.
45:04
SPEAKER_01: But it the whole process it's a it's it's a resilient community.
45:08
SPEAKER_01: I'm part of it.
45:09
SPEAKER_01: David's part of it.
45:11
SPEAKER_01: It takes a lot of discipline.
45:12
SPEAKER_01: I was just had a meeting with somebody just this morning.
45:15
SPEAKER_01: Um, he's from San Diego, married a Mexican girl, had a baby over there.
45:20
SPEAKER_01: Now he's living in Playas de Tijuana and commuting back and forth, and he's like, How in the world did you guys do this for years?
45:28
SPEAKER_01: Right?
45:29
SPEAKER_01: So it's uh it's it's eye-opening.
45:32
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it just uh reminds me when you guys were talking.
45:35
SPEAKER_03: I have a kid that goes to uh St.
45:37
SPEAKER_03: Augustine and uh a lot of his, he plays soccer there, and a lot of his bros like cross every oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
45:44
SPEAKER_02: But they have our pool.
45:46
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, John and I we've we taped this conversation before where a lot of people from Instituto, Mexico suddenly for high school, they ended up going to these you know private schools in the US and they have these you know commuters, uh commuter bands.
45:58
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
45:59
SPEAKER_02: And they call them turbos, right?
46:01
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they uh yeah, like a bunch of kids in the same band, and then the the parents.
46:06
SPEAKER_01: And and there are talking about students, uh just really quick to finish, um, there are programs and new pilot programs that are that are being but being come into place uh next year.
46:17
SPEAKER_01: But currently the city of Tijuana has a pass, um, a fast pass.
46:22
SPEAKER_01: So we you can bypass the lane, the line, and and so you pay, you sign up.
46:28
SPEAKER_01: So it's for students.
46:29
SPEAKER_01: So if you're a student or a parent that takes kids in a carpool, you can use these special lanes.
46:34
SPEAKER_01: So you don't be have to be burdening for two hours on the border with you know six or seven kids heading to school, taking tests, doing their homework.
46:44
SPEAKER_01: You know, it's uh it's it's it's a great option for people to know about as well.
46:48
SPEAKER_01: And and of course, it's it's part of the FastPass program that's also uh for medical tourism, which has started with medical tourism, but a lot of people said, Well, hey, um, I also have customers that come and don't don't know how to get back.
47:02
SPEAKER_01: And how do we expand this program?
47:04
SPEAKER_01: So that's the uh it's a pretty successful program, the the the FastPass.
47:08
SPEAKER_01: So it's it's available to certain certain vendors and the CD of Tijuana website has a lot of information for people that want to just go across uh for one day for something.
47:18
SPEAKER_01: You want to go to lunch, you want to go to a cultural event, you want to go to the doctor.
47:22
SPEAKER_01: So that's another way to come back.
47:24
SPEAKER_01: Amazing.
47:25
SPEAKER_03: You know, you talked about medical tours, that reminds me, um, you say we have the all these experiences.
47:32
SPEAKER_03: I I'm actually going down there, they have a stem cell institute, um, the official stem cell partner of the UFC.
47:41
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
47:42
SPEAKER_03: And so I'm going down there in January, and they told me um, like I have a global entry, you know, but they they're like, hey, you know, uh, we pick you up over here, bring you down there, you're down there for like five days, and then they have a ban, and I guess they have medical.
47:57
SPEAKER_01: They have the med the fast pass.
47:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
48:00
SPEAKER_01: I guess yeah, exactly, exactly.
48:02
SPEAKER_01: So that's you know, stem cells.
48:04
SPEAKER_01: The other one is the elective surgery, like, you know, the rhinoplastys and the tummy textures are popular, but it's also for a lot of folks, it's access to affordable health care.
48:13
SPEAKER_01: Dentists, dentists, eye doctors, but also uh the the vet.
48:18
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
48:18
SPEAKER_01: I know a lot of people that do really well that bring their vet to Mexico.
48:22
SPEAKER_01: It's like, well, how much is a vet uh uh a vet in San Diego?
48:25
SPEAKER_01: So I was there on Thursday for that same thing.
48:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so everybody doesn't when you go, I want to be at a certain point where I can take my dog to the vet in San Diego.
48:35
SPEAKER_01: That means I've made it.
48:37
SPEAKER_01: That means you're yeah, that means I've made it.
48:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:40
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, it's uh so a lot of people also still have their primary care doctor in Tijuana and have uh you know smaller, not so serious surgeries in Mexico as well, because they don't even pass the threshold on their insurance.
48:55
SPEAKER_01: So that's that's also an option that you don't have if you live, you know, is somewhere else in the States.
49:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, even the by national healthcare providers, right?
49:03
SPEAKER_02: Through like employee, uh employer sponsored, people actually going down there for treatment, coming back.
49:08
SPEAKER_02: And you know, the the fast pass, I think it just makes it more attractive for these people to actually go down to Tijuana.
49:13
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
49:14
SPEAKER_02: He's a medical tourist and sitting alive.
49:16
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's that's a job on the healthcare provider to explain to people because there's there's a lot of myths, right?
49:23
SPEAKER_01: Of crossing the border, right?
49:24
SPEAKER_01: It's so scary.
49:25
SPEAKER_01: I don't know my way around.
49:26
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna get lost, I'm gonna get uh uh have to bribe somebody to do whatever if I get stopped by a police officer, all these myths, right?
49:35
SPEAKER_01: Um so it's it's it's on the facility that uh that's that's administrating your healthcare to sit to explain how this process works.
49:44
SPEAKER_01: And that's also why CBX is so successful, because you don't have to drive into Tijuana to catch a flight, right?
49:50
SPEAKER_01: And have to deal with taxi drivers over there and traffic over there.
49:54
SPEAKER_01: So that's what that's why it makes it so popular.
49:57
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, that uh it puts uh the US customs clearance and and airport like to shame.
50:07
SPEAKER_03: It's so fast and so good and so clean.
50:10
SPEAKER_03: It can be, yeah.
50:11
SPEAKER_03: Uh-huh.
50:12
SPEAKER_03: Um, and so like if if SDFC was playing solos, who would you root for?
50:16
SPEAKER_01: Oh I think we're out of time, right?
50:20
SPEAKER_01: Oh no, you said one hour.
50:21
SPEAKER_01: You know what I give up?
50:23
SPEAKER_01: I have one of those 50-50 jerseys now.
50:25
SPEAKER_01: Oh, perfect, huh?
50:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
50:26
SPEAKER_01: You're playing it right.
50:28
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
50:28
SPEAKER_01: It's front and back.
50:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
50:30
SPEAKER_01: It's part of the smart each.
50:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's part of the smart.
50:32
SPEAKER_01: That's why it's a smart border.
50:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
50:34
SPEAKER_01: Let's uh let's not actually focus on the smart side.
50:37
SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah, yeah.
50:38
SPEAKER_01: 50-50.
50:39
SPEAKER_01: Half Cholo, half uh FC, and a big S uh Sandio FC fan.
50:43
SPEAKER_03: I love it.
50:44
SPEAKER_03: So in closing, you know, what what would you like to kind of leave us with uh in our minds to think about uh this Cali Baja region and the shared community?
50:55
SPEAKER_03: Like how how do you see it as a whole?
50:58
SPEAKER_01: You know, it's and I could go on and on, right?
51:01
SPEAKER_01: Uh this is this is my topic, but if for for people to know and understand how how the border is uh and it'll sound kind of like a cliche, but it's not a barrier really.
51:12
SPEAKER_01: It's it's really a gateway for mutual and shared prosperity.
51:17
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's beautiful.
51:19
SPEAKER_03: Totally agree.
51:19
SPEAKER_03: You know, we here as a law firm, you know, try to make ourselves available to that community.
51:24
SPEAKER_03: You know, uh, we know that even a lot of non-everyday crossers have legal leads up here.
51:31
SPEAKER_03: So, you know, we try to be good partners.
51:34
SPEAKER_03: Uh, like I said, you know, we try to be binational, bicultural, and best in class.
51:39
SPEAKER_01: And so thank you for thank you, thank you for inviting me.
51:43
SPEAKER_03: It's uh it's been really fascinating for me to learn more about the border and the importance of this cross-border uh economy and uh the important things that it brings to each of us.
51:55
SPEAKER_03: So thank you for your time.
51:56
SPEAKER_03: Thank you, thank you, thanks, David, thank John.
52:00
SPEAKER_00: Thank you for listening to the Latino podcast.
52:02
SPEAKER_00: We'll see you again next time and be sure to click subscribe to get future episodes.