Latest / The Vault: The Epstein Files / Mega Edition: Lesley Groff And The Transcript From Her Epstein Related Trip to Congress (Part 9-11) (8/21/26)

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Mega Edition: Lesley Groff And The Transcript From Her Epstein Related Trip to Congress (Part 9-11) (8/21/26) · The Vault: The Epstein Files

0:00
Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
0:03
Speaker 1: Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to pick up
0:06
Speaker 1: where we left off with the Leslie Groff transcript from
0:09
Speaker 1: her interview with Congress, and now we have mister Lynch
0:14
Speaker 1: asking the questions. Okay, ms Groff, thank you for your
0:17
Speaker 1: willingness to be interviewed. You said early in the Republican
0:21
Speaker 1: Hour that your relationship with Jeffrey Epstein you really didn't
0:24
Speaker 1: have a relationship, You wouldn't call it a relationship. And
0:27
Speaker 1: you said in this hour that he basically kept you
0:31
Speaker 1: on the outside and you didn't have a connection with him.
0:35
Speaker 1: I want to refer to a New York Times article
0:37
Speaker 1: on February fifth, two thousand and five, if co Council
0:41
Speaker 1: wants copies of that, I made some mister Wickham is
0:45
Speaker 1: the word brain in there, mister Lynch, Sorry, there are
0:49
Speaker 1: some others here if staff wants them. Mister adapted and sir,
0:53
Speaker 1: if you will hold on, we will enter this as
0:55
Speaker 1: minority Exhibit B. Mister Lynch, this is an New York
1:00
Speaker 1: Times article February fifth, two thousand and five by Lyndon
1:03
Speaker 1: Thomas Junior, and it sounds like they interviewed both of
1:06
Speaker 1: you and Jeffrey Epstein in the article. I'll just go
1:09
Speaker 1: to the bottom paragraph which is highlighted. This is an article,
1:13
Speaker 1: the title of which is working for Top Bosses on
1:16
Speaker 1: Wall Street has its perks. When it comes to discussing
1:21
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein, it says, then there's the case of Jeffrey Epstein,
1:24
Speaker 1: who pays his three executive assistants more than two hundred
1:27
Speaker 1: thousand a year. It goes on to say a finance
1:30
Speaker 1: here who they manage his executive his three women executive team,
1:36
Speaker 1: which manages his hectic life to go globe trotting and
1:39
Speaker 1: hobnobbing with the likes of former President Bill Clinton. It
1:43
Speaker 1: goes on to say, on the next page, he calls them,
1:47
Speaker 1: meaning his you as part of his executive team, a
1:50
Speaker 1: social prostesis. So something attached the limb of who he is,
1:55
Speaker 1: with an intuitive knowledge of his manifold needs and a
1:58
Speaker 1: twenty four hour presence that make them virtually indispensable to
2:01
Speaker 1: his personal and business success, he said. It goes on
2:05
Speaker 1: to say, again referring to you and the other two assistants,
2:09
Speaker 1: they are an extension of my brain. Said mister Ebstein,
2:12
Speaker 1: who rarely talks publicly. Their intuition is something that I
2:16
Speaker 1: don't have. It goes with more some details than it
2:19
Speaker 1: goes on to say. The reporter says, when one of them,
2:22
Speaker 1: Leslie Groff, who was thirty eight, became pregnant last year
2:25
Speaker 1: and talked of leaving, he bought her a Mercedes Benz
2:28
Speaker 1: E three twenty to make her commuting easier and agreed
2:32
Speaker 1: to pay for a full time nanny so that she
2:34
Speaker 1: could keep working for him. And then there's a quote
2:37
Speaker 1: here by mister Epstein. There's no way I could lose
2:40
Speaker 1: Leslie in a motherhood, said mister Ebstein, who is nearly
2:44
Speaker 1: in his who is in his early fifties, and as
2:46
Speaker 1: a bachelor. Going further to just the last page, the
2:50
Speaker 1: last page, the third paragraph from the bottom. I'm sorry,
2:53
Speaker 1: let's go to the last two lines here, the last
2:55
Speaker 1: two paragraphs. Miss Groff said that she thought both she
2:58
Speaker 1: and miss Lee, one of them the other two executive assistants,
3:02
Speaker 1: were worth the price.
3:03
Speaker 2: Here's the quote.
3:04
Speaker 1: This is from you. It comes down to the bond,
3:06
Speaker 1: said miss Groff, a graduate of the University of Texas,
3:10
Speaker 1: who's been with mister Epstein four or four years. A
3:13
Speaker 1: further quote by you. I know what he's thinking, and
3:16
Speaker 1: I know when I need to be fast. It's a
3:18
Speaker 1: nice role that we're on. Now, that's what the reporter
3:22
Speaker 1: said that you said. Have you ever requested or adaction
3:26
Speaker 1: or recanted any of this that was printed in the
3:29
Speaker 1: New York Times? Mis Groff, No, Lynch, you haven't disputed
3:32
Speaker 1: that Graff. No, Lynch. It makes it hard to believe
3:36
Speaker 1: that there's no connection when he's talking about you as
3:39
Speaker 1: part of him and a prosthesis, and you know, part
3:42
Speaker 1: of his operation. And how long did you work for
3:45
Speaker 1: mister Epstein beginning to end Groff February of two thousand
3:48
Speaker 1: and one to July of twenty nineteen. Mister Lynch, So
3:52
Speaker 1: eighteen years? Is that correct, miss Groff, Yes, question by
3:56
Speaker 1: mister Lynch. Yeah. It's hard to believe that somebody who
3:59
Speaker 1: worked with somebody for eighteen years and then they say
4:01
Speaker 1: that they don't have a relationship, especially when we have
4:04
Speaker 1: earlier statements. Let me also ask, now, when you went
4:09
Speaker 1: to work for mister Epstein, he was a registered sex offender,
4:13
Speaker 1: isn't that correct?
4:14
Speaker 2: Mis Groff?
4:16
Speaker 1: That was after I started working for him that he
4:18
Speaker 1: became a registered sex offender. Mister Lynch. Yeah, stuff going on,
4:22
Speaker 1: and then he was his conviction became final. He did
4:26
Speaker 1: what thirteen months in prison? No, thirteen months in the stockade?
4:29
Speaker 1: You mean.
4:33
Speaker 2: Groff, correct, Lynch, And.
4:35
Speaker 1: You were responsible at making sure that he lived up
4:37
Speaker 1: to his restrictions as a sex offender.
4:39
Speaker 2: Correct.
4:40
Speaker 1: He had reporting, travel requirements, he had no contact requirements.
4:45
Speaker 1: So actually you sort of made sure that he was
4:47
Speaker 1: compliant with his status as a registered sex offender, Miss Groff. No,
4:52
Speaker 1: I did not. I was not the one in charge
4:55
Speaker 1: of making sure. I did remind him that he needed
4:57
Speaker 1: to register when it was that time of year, that
5:00
Speaker 1: as part of his directive to remind him. But I
5:02
Speaker 1: had nothing to do with she gets cut off by
5:05
Speaker 1: mister Lynch. It says here that you dealt with several
5:08
Speaker 1: tasks related to his status as sex offender. Those included
5:11
Speaker 1: sending reminders to update his registration status and photograph, and
5:15
Speaker 1: attempting to get him a Russian visa despite his status
5:19
Speaker 1: as an offender.
5:21
Speaker 2: Miss Groff.
5:21
Speaker 1: All I did was remind him that it was time
5:23
Speaker 1: for him to get Mister Lynch cuts her off. But
5:26
Speaker 1: your earlier statement that now mister Whitcomb jumps in, Sir
5:30
Speaker 1: can Will you just let her finish her response, please.
5:34
Speaker 1: She has tried a couple of times to respond to
5:35
Speaker 1: your question and she hasn't been able to finish it.
5:38
Speaker 1: Mister Lynch, Okay, have had it all right, mims Groff.
5:42
Speaker 1: All I did was remind them on a schedule that
5:44
Speaker 1: he was supposed to go and register if he was
5:46
Speaker 1: in pom Beach. I think that was the standard, and
5:50
Speaker 1: I was directed by him to include that on his schedule.
5:53
Speaker 1: I did not make any appointments for him to go register.
5:56
Speaker 1: He did that on his own if you went to
5:58
Speaker 1: pom Beach. I believe it was once a year, and
6:01
Speaker 1: I was told to remind him three months ahead of
6:03
Speaker 1: the time, two months ahead of time, and then after
6:06
Speaker 1: that every other week or something like that. It was,
6:09
Speaker 1: But that was all I ever did, mister Lynch. You realize, however,
6:14
Speaker 1: that having knowledge of that certainly is not consistent with
6:16
Speaker 1: your earlier statement that there was a vague awareness on
6:19
Speaker 1: your part about what mister Epstein was charged with and
6:22
Speaker 1: what his status was and what he was guilty of
6:25
Speaker 1: at the same time that you were scheduling massages for
6:29
Speaker 1: young women with a registered sex offender. And yet you
6:32
Speaker 1: maintain that you didn't see anything improper in that, and
6:35
Speaker 1: you've said that multiple times, sending young women to give
6:39
Speaker 1: a massage to a registered sex offender, and you yet
6:42
Speaker 1: you tell the committee and you tell others that you
6:46
Speaker 1: saw nothing improper with that. I just find it it
6:48
Speaker 1: just hurts your credibility, mister Backner. With all due respect,
6:52
Speaker 1: the record speaks for what she said. I don't believe
6:55
Speaker 1: that's an accurate characterization of what she said. But go ahead,
6:59
Speaker 1: mister Lynch. Okay, mister Wickham. And it's also please just
7:03
Speaker 1: bear hear me out. She's here as a witness. She's
7:05
Speaker 1: not an attorney like me and you, sir. She's not
7:08
Speaker 1: familiar with all the legal jargon and the legal leads
7:11
Speaker 1: regarding a guilty plea, So that should respectfully be born
7:15
Speaker 1: in mind. Mister Lynch. Well, I appreciate that. But she
7:18
Speaker 1: is a witness, mister witcom sure, mister Lynch, And she's
7:22
Speaker 1: at the hub of this, at the very hub of this.
7:26
Speaker 1: She has contact with all the people, all the victims,
7:29
Speaker 1: the high powered people. She's at the hub of all
7:31
Speaker 1: of this. She's a very important witness, and we're trying
7:34
Speaker 1: to get to the truth, get at the truth on
7:36
Speaker 1: behalf of these victims who I think we agree, we
7:38
Speaker 1: feel deeply for, and so that's the mission here. I'm
7:43
Speaker 1: over my time and so I have to relinquish it
7:46
Speaker 1: until we do another hour. But thank you, I yield,
7:48
Speaker 1: mister Garcia, just briefly. We're going to continue this questioning
7:52
Speaker 1: in the next hour. But just miss Groff, it's been
7:55
Speaker 1: reported by the Wall Street Journal that mar A Lavo
7:58
Speaker 1: was sending spawn employees, usually young women, to Epstein's Palm
8:01
Speaker 1: Beach home to provide massages. We know that Glenn Maxwell
8:05
Speaker 1: was accused of recruiting and trafficking survivors as well. Do
8:09
Speaker 1: you recall any of this when you were working employed
8:12
Speaker 1: by mister Epstein, Miss Groff, No, mister Garcia, So did
8:17
Speaker 1: you ever schedule any appointments for mar A Lago, or
8:19
Speaker 1: through mar A Lago, for mar A Lago employees to
8:22
Speaker 1: come to Epstein's home and provide any sort of spa services,
8:26
Speaker 1: Miss Groff. Know Garcia, So, as far as your work
8:30
Speaker 1: is considered through the Wall Street Journal, we've seen the
8:32
Speaker 1: Wall Street Journal reporting that there was actually women being
8:36
Speaker 1: brought in from mar A Lago. That's something that you
8:39
Speaker 1: had no interaction with. And never heard about, correct, Miss Groff,
8:44
Speaker 1: That is correct, mister Garcia. Is there anyone that you
8:48
Speaker 1: think would have information about who was actually connecting these
8:51
Speaker 1: women from mar A Lago to mister Epstein? Miss Groff,
8:54
Speaker 1: I don't know, Garcia, so you wouldn't have any Could
8:57
Speaker 1: you maybe think who would be a person or two
9:00
Speaker 1: that would be making these connections? Do you have any idea,
9:03
Speaker 1: Miss Groth? I would think Miss Maxwell was with him
9:06
Speaker 1: in Palm Beach, but I don't know that for sure.
9:08
Speaker 2: I don't know.
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Speaker 1: Mister Garcia will have additional questions later misredacted. That's it
9:14
Speaker 1: for now, and we'll go off the record. Back on
9:17
Speaker 1: the record now, and it's miss Tolan asking the questions question.
9:21
Speaker 1: I'm just going to ask a few clarifying questions that
9:24
Speaker 1: focus on what we asked you during our first round.
9:27
Speaker 1: So to begin with, we discuss the physical phone directories
9:31
Speaker 1: with the list and the names, and then you also
9:34
Speaker 1: mentioned that there was an electronic version of that. Is
9:37
Speaker 1: that correct?
9:38
Speaker 2: Answer?
9:39
Speaker 1: Correct question? And I believe I asked you already, But
9:43
Speaker 1: you don't know the platform or the database that electronic
9:46
Speaker 1: one was stored on the Citrix sound familiar to you?
9:50
Speaker 1: Answer it does now question yes, answer because I heard
9:54
Speaker 1: Sarah say that. Question okay. And do you know does
9:57
Speaker 1: that ring a bell? Is that what it was stored on?
10:00
Speaker 2: Answer? I don't. I don't know. Question okay.
10:05
Speaker 1: And do you know where the backup information for those
10:07
Speaker 1: directories are stored?
10:08
Speaker 2: Answer?
10:09
Speaker 1: I don't know, question okay. And then in the previous
10:12
Speaker 1: hour you also mentioned, I believe, but who prepared the
10:16
Speaker 1: rooms for the massages at the New York residence. Answer
10:19
Speaker 1: I don't know. I would think a maid would be
10:21
Speaker 1: responsible for cleaning, but I don't know. I wasn't there.
10:25
Speaker 1: Question Do you know who set up the room in
10:27
Speaker 1: order for it to be ready for a massage? Answer
10:30
Speaker 1: no question? And I believe you mentioned individuals who would
10:34
Speaker 1: let the messuses into the property.
10:35
Speaker 2: Who did you say that was?
10:37
Speaker 1: Answer the people that answered the doors question yes, answer
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Speaker 1: that would be the maid Lynn Fontania or her husband
10:44
Speaker 1: Jojo who was his driver, or possibly.
10:47
Speaker 2: It was really those two, but possibly it could be Rich.
10:49
Speaker 1: Barnett or I think also Buzz somebody in like New
10:53
Speaker 1: York apartment type of thing. Question and so those individuals
10:57
Speaker 1: would have to let the messuses into the property? Answer correct.
11:00
Speaker 1: Question did you on any occasion ever let any of
11:04
Speaker 1: them in answer, no question. Did you ever buzz any
11:08
Speaker 1: of them in like you just mentioned, answer, I don't
11:11
Speaker 1: know how to do that question. Did you ever have
11:13
Speaker 1: discussions with any of these individuals about the women they
11:16
Speaker 1: were seeing coming in and out of the property? Answer
11:20
Speaker 1: no question. And then I believe you briefly covered this
11:23
Speaker 1: as well. But did you ever pay money or cash
11:25
Speaker 1: to any of the messuse's Answer? I never directly paid anyone.
11:30
Speaker 1: It's possible that mister Epstein may have directed me to
11:32
Speaker 1: ask or adacted in the accounting department to put two
11:35
Speaker 1: hundred in an envelope to have picked up and messengered
11:39
Speaker 1: over to someone who had done some sort of job
11:41
Speaker 1: for mister Epstein, and that was either picked up by
11:44
Speaker 1: the messenger or Jojo. Mister Timmins, did you ever see
11:48
Speaker 1: a black bag of cash?
11:49
Speaker 2: Groff?
11:49
Speaker 1: A black bag, Timmins, a black bag that had cash
11:53
Speaker 1: in it Graff? No, Timmins, you never saw that Groff,
11:57
Speaker 1: no question. And the messenger did you know who the
12:01
Speaker 1: messenger was or was it he gets cut off by growth?
12:04
Speaker 1: It was a messenger service. I don't recall who the
12:07
Speaker 1: messenger service was. That was a long time ago. Question
12:11
Speaker 1: was the same messenger service always used? Answer? Probably, I
12:15
Speaker 1: mean there might have been a couple. I don't recall.
12:17
Speaker 1: Question did you ever meet anyone with the messengers? Answer
12:21
Speaker 1: no question. Did you ever have a conversation with any
12:24
Speaker 1: of them? Answer no question? And why was the cash
12:27
Speaker 1: given to these messuses?
12:30
Speaker 2: Answer?
12:31
Speaker 1: I just figured that's the way people get paid. Question
12:34
Speaker 1: And I guess more clarification, why cash as opposed to
12:37
Speaker 1: checks or any other form of payment? Answer? I don't know.
12:42
Speaker 1: All right, folks, we're gonna wrap up right here, and
12:45
Speaker 1: then the next episode dealing with the topic, we're gonna
12:47
Speaker 1: pick up where we left off. All the information that
12:49
Speaker 1: goes with this episode can be found in the description box.
12:54
Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
12:57
Speaker 1: Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to pick up
13:00
Speaker 1: where we left off with a Leslie Groff interview with Congress.
13:05
Speaker 1: Question and was Glenn Maxwell ever present in the room
13:08
Speaker 1: when mister Epstein was receiving a massage?
13:11
Speaker 2: Answer?
13:11
Speaker 1: I don't know. Question did miss Maxwell ever instruct any
13:14
Speaker 1: woman or a girl on how to give mister Epstein
13:17
Speaker 1: a massage? Answer? I don't know. Question was anyone else
13:21
Speaker 1: ever present in the room when mister Epstein was receiving
13:24
Speaker 1: a massage. Answer, I don't know. Question, as you testified
13:28
Speaker 1: to earlier. You began working for mister Epstein in two
13:31
Speaker 1: thousand and one. In two thousand and eight, he pleaded
13:34
Speaker 1: guilty to two felony accounts of soliciting and procuring a
13:37
Speaker 1: minor for prostitution. We'll get into the details of the
13:40
Speaker 1: investigation much more later, but the investigation into him began
13:44
Speaker 1: in two thousand and five while you were still working
13:46
Speaker 1: for mister Epstein. When did you first learn about the investigation?
13:51
Speaker 2: Answer?
13:52
Speaker 1: I believe it was two thousand and seven. Question and
13:55
Speaker 1: how did you learn? Answer because the FBI came to
13:58
Speaker 1: my door in Connecticut and handed to serve me a subpoena.
14:01
Speaker 1: Question and did you speak with them? Did you give
14:04
Speaker 1: testimony to them? Then? Answer? I let them into my
14:07
Speaker 1: house and sat them on my sofa and they started
14:10
Speaker 1: asking some questions, and yeah, that was it. That was
14:13
Speaker 1: how I found out. Question what questions did they ask? Answer?
14:17
Speaker 1: It was so long ago. I think they just asked
14:20
Speaker 1: if you know, they said that they were here. They
14:22
Speaker 1: were very friendly. They just said, you know, we're here
14:24
Speaker 1: because we understand you work for mister Epstein as a secretary,
14:28
Speaker 1: and we just want to talk to you. I really
14:30
Speaker 1: don't remember what they said. I think my head was
14:33
Speaker 1: probably spinning. I had no idea, Miss Brygnac. Question who
14:37
Speaker 1: did you speak to?
14:38
Speaker 2: Next?
14:39
Speaker 1: Answer my son who was with me because he had
14:41
Speaker 1: just gotten up from a nap. He was about two
14:43
Speaker 1: and a half to three years old. And I really
14:46
Speaker 1: didn't know what to do. So I went upstairs and
14:48
Speaker 1: I called Darren Endyke, who is the in house counsel,
14:51
Speaker 1: just to say that people are here. I don't, you know,
14:54
Speaker 1: I don't know what to do. And he just said
14:56
Speaker 1: you should not speak to them without an attorney. And
14:59
Speaker 1: I've watched enough TV. Okay, So I went downstairs and
15:02
Speaker 1: I said, I don't think I should be speaking to
15:04
Speaker 1: you without an attorney president, And they didn't really like that,
15:08
Speaker 1: and then they left. Question did you in fact retain
15:11
Speaker 1: an attorney? Answer? I did not retain an attorney myself.
15:15
Speaker 1: Mister Epstein got me an attorney and I went and
15:17
Speaker 1: spoke to him.
15:18
Speaker 2: Once.
15:19
Speaker 1: Question when you spoke to mister Indicke, did he seem
15:22
Speaker 1: privy to the investigation? Answer? No question, it was news
15:26
Speaker 1: to him. Answer, it sounded like it was news to him. Yeah,
15:29
Speaker 1: Miss Tolin. Did anyone ever instruct you besides without having
15:33
Speaker 1: an attorney, but did anyone generally instruct you not to
15:36
Speaker 1: talk to the FBI?
15:37
Speaker 2: Answer?
15:37
Speaker 1: No?
15:38
Speaker 2: Question?
15:39
Speaker 1: And at what point did the massages stop occurring for
15:42
Speaker 1: mister Epstein? Answer when he went to jail? Question in
15:46
Speaker 1: July of two thousand and six. Answer, No, he went
15:49
Speaker 1: to jail. When did he go to jail two thousand
15:51
Speaker 1: and nine, two thousand and eight, Yeah, Brignac. Did the
15:54
Speaker 1: massages stop occurring at that time? Miss Groff?
15:56
Speaker 2: Yeah?
15:57
Speaker 1: Question did they resume at any point after he was
16:00
Speaker 1: released from jail? Miss Groff? No, Mister Emmer, what was
16:03
Speaker 1: your understanding of why the massages stopped at that point?
16:06
Speaker 1: Miss Groff, you never said there was no reason. They
16:08
Speaker 1: just stopped. Mister Timmins when he was on work release.
16:12
Speaker 1: Did he not get massages when he was out of
16:14
Speaker 1: jail temporarily, Miss Groff? No, Brignac, I'm sorry, Miss Groff,
16:19
Speaker 1: you said they never resumed, Miss Groff, They did not
16:22
Speaker 1: resume after he got back or when he came got
16:25
Speaker 1: out of jail. Miss Brignac, you never booked a massage
16:27
Speaker 1: for mister Epstein once he was released from prison, Miss Groff,
16:31
Speaker 1: It's possible that there was a massage had a spawn
16:33
Speaker 1: pomp Beach don Wick that we discussed earlier. They had
16:37
Speaker 1: a medical chiropractic care spa, and I think that might
16:40
Speaker 1: have been one time. I think he bought like a
16:43
Speaker 1: package of ten for a nutritionist. They were nutritionists in
16:47
Speaker 1: chiropractic care, and don was also a registered massuse mister Timmins.
16:52
Speaker 1: So in twenty thirteen when you moved into the residence
16:55
Speaker 1: and your office was there, he never had you book
16:58
Speaker 1: a massage for him until he died in twenty nineteen,
17:01
Speaker 1: Miss Groff, that's correct, Miss Brignac. But he continued to
17:05
Speaker 1: receive massages correct? Did someone else book them, Miss Groff,
17:08
Speaker 1: Not that I know of. I don't know that massages
17:10
Speaker 1: were being booked or made. Brignac. Why would the massages
17:13
Speaker 1: need to cease if that was a regular part of
17:16
Speaker 1: his day and he said, in fact he was not guilty,
17:19
Speaker 1: Ms Graff, I don't know. He also stopped drinking tea.
17:22
Speaker 1: Miss Witcombe, you answered the question, Ms Graff, Yeah, Miss Witcombe,
17:26
Speaker 1: you answered the question. Ms Graff, I don't know. Yeah,
17:30
Speaker 1: Miss Brignac. Did you find it odd that it was
17:32
Speaker 1: a regular part of your practice, the schedule his massages,
17:35
Speaker 1: and then it suddenly stopped, Miss Groff, know, Miss Tolan,
17:39
Speaker 1: And now we're just going to ask a few general
17:41
Speaker 1: questions about your role and get into some more details
17:44
Speaker 1: about it. Did you have to sign a non disclosure
17:47
Speaker 1: agreement upon being hired as mister Epstein's secretary? Answer yes,
17:51
Speaker 1: question what were the details of this agreement? Answer? What
17:56
Speaker 1: I recall is that I was not supposed to discuss
17:59
Speaker 1: any of mister epstein clients with anyone, and if I
18:01
Speaker 1: did so, it would be one hundred thousand dollars fee.
18:04
Speaker 1: Question And you understood this to mean his business clients
18:08
Speaker 1: who he managed money for. Answer correct. Question And how
18:12
Speaker 1: did you know? I know we discussed earlier your knowledge
18:14
Speaker 1: of who clients were, But how did you know who
18:17
Speaker 1: was a client at the time? Answer? I believe that
18:20
Speaker 1: NDA might have specifically said las Wexner and then clients
18:23
Speaker 1: and clients. Question But at the time you would have
18:27
Speaker 1: understood who fell into that category? Answer sure, as clients
18:31
Speaker 1: is wealthy clients? Uh huh.
18:33
Speaker 2: Question did you keep a copy of the agreement?
18:35
Speaker 1: Answer? I did not. Question did all the employees of
18:38
Speaker 1: mister Epstein have to sign the agreement? Answer? I don't know.
18:41
Speaker 1: Question did mister Epstein himself ask you to sign the agreement?
18:45
Speaker 2: Answer?
18:45
Speaker 1: No, it was part of onboarding. It was probably redacted,
18:49
Speaker 1: is my bet? Question and you mentioned previously, but can
18:52
Speaker 1: you explain again where you maintained office space while working
18:55
Speaker 1: for him?
18:56
Speaker 2: Answer?
18:57
Speaker 1: Sure, so from two thousand and one to two thousand
18:59
Speaker 1: and nine it was part of Helmsley Palace, part of
19:02
Speaker 1: the Villard House, and I was located in the rear
19:05
Speaker 1: of the suite, directly back from the reception as desk.
19:08
Speaker 1: There was a door to my office and then my
19:10
Speaker 1: desk sitting. If you looked outside the window you could
19:13
Speaker 1: see Saint Patrick's Cathedral. Answer and where did you move
19:17
Speaker 1: to in two thousand and nine? Answer in two thousand
19:20
Speaker 1: and nine, we moved to three oh one E sixty
19:22
Speaker 1: sixth Street. Answer and how long were you in that
19:25
Speaker 1: office space? Answer? I believe it was two or three years.
19:29
Speaker 1: Question When did you get moved to that office space? Answer?
19:33
Speaker 1: We were told that the premier location at Helmsley Palace
19:36
Speaker 1: was very expensive location, and since mister Epstein wasn't going
19:40
Speaker 1: to be here, anymore what we needed to We were
19:43
Speaker 1: downsizing and needed to find other space. I don't know
19:46
Speaker 1: why it became three oh one E sixty sixth Street.
19:51
Speaker 1: Question did you ever work out of the four fifty
19:53
Speaker 1: seven Madison Avenue building? Answer that was Helmsley Place? Yes,
19:57
Speaker 1: question Okay, did you ever? Timmins jumps in real quick?
20:00
Speaker 1: Can I get back to something? So it's my understanding
20:03
Speaker 1: that Epstein had a massage every day for his entire life,
20:07
Speaker 1: but after he got out of jail, you never booked
20:09
Speaker 1: a massage therapist. Did you book the eight assistants for
20:12
Speaker 1: an hour? And did just say name hour or what
20:15
Speaker 1: he was getting massage? So like, and you were in
20:18
Speaker 1: charge of his schedule, so what was going on? I mean,
20:21
Speaker 1: did you book a redacted ten am for an hour?
20:24
Speaker 2: Graf?
20:25
Speaker 1: No Timmins, no Graff, no Timmins. Okay, he got a
20:29
Speaker 1: massage for every day of his life. So when after
20:32
Speaker 1: twenty ten, when he got out of jail, when when
20:35
Speaker 1: did that happen? I mean, if you do a schedule, Graf,
20:38
Speaker 1: when did it stop? Timmins? He was getting them. The
20:42
Speaker 1: question is who was giving them to him? If you
20:44
Speaker 1: were not coordinating it? So how did he who was
20:48
Speaker 1: doing it? Mister Wickham jumps in. Was there someone else coordinating?
20:53
Speaker 1: Mister Timmins, Was there like a logical spot in his
20:56
Speaker 1: schedule on a regular basis that used to have a
20:59
Speaker 1: massage that now has something else? A pattern? Backner? Maybe
21:03
Speaker 1: if you ask, I don't know if we ask her
21:05
Speaker 1: if she knew he was getting massages? Timmins okay, Graff, Yeah, Timmins.
21:11
Speaker 1: Was there a pattern in the schedule that would suggest
21:14
Speaker 1: that there was a moment in his day on a
21:15
Speaker 1: regular basis that he was getting a massage since you
21:18
Speaker 1: stopped scheduling them?
21:19
Speaker 2: Graff?
21:20
Speaker 1: No, Timmins, okay, Sorry, Back to miss Tolan and then
21:24
Speaker 1: just a few more office questions. Did you ever work
21:27
Speaker 1: out of the Palm Beach home?
21:28
Speaker 2: Answer?
21:28
Speaker 1: No, question did you? And did you mentioned an office
21:33
Speaker 1: space in Manhattan Town home?
21:34
Speaker 2: Later on?
21:35
Speaker 1: Answer? Later on yes? Question And aside from scheduling massages,
21:39
Speaker 1: can you describe your other roles and responsibilities as mister
21:42
Speaker 1: Epstein's secretary? Answer?
21:44
Speaker 2: Sure.
21:45
Speaker 1: I scheduled his business meetings. I schedule a breakfast, lunch, dinner.
21:49
Speaker 1: If he was going to have a party, I might
21:51
Speaker 1: coordinate with that. I coordinated with his staff at all
21:54
Speaker 1: the homes on his island. I coordinated with his pilots.
21:57
Speaker 1: I would sometimes coordinate trips to say a head conference.
22:01
Speaker 1: I would the call list, as I said, was very extensive.
22:05
Speaker 1: He would make calls every day. And yeah, question and
22:09
Speaker 1: also aside from the massages, did you ever spend money
22:12
Speaker 1: or provide cash on behalf of mister Epstein during your
22:15
Speaker 1: time as his secretary to anyone? Answer no question. Did
22:19
Speaker 1: you ever help order or purchase gifts for anyone on
22:22
Speaker 1: behalf of mister Epstein? Answer no question. And I'm just
22:26
Speaker 1: going to answer some more clarifying questions about purchasing gifts,
22:30
Speaker 1: Miss Backner. Could I have one word with her?
22:32
Speaker 2: Tolan?
22:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, they go off the record. Now they're back on
22:35
Speaker 1: ms Graff. Yeah, okay, I was going to say sorry
22:38
Speaker 1: after you asked that, I would say that I definitely
22:40
Speaker 1: coordinated about forty people to receive Apple watches, and you know,
22:44
Speaker 1: I might be asked to buy the gift card for
22:46
Speaker 1: Kathy Ruhmler to a SPA something like that, Miss Tolan.
22:51
Speaker 1: Question what were the Apple watches for? Answer? I think
22:54
Speaker 1: there were Christmas gifts, holiday gifts. That was about There
22:57
Speaker 1: was a list of about forty people, men and women,
23:00
Speaker 1: high profile people on there, and mister Epstein just wanted
23:02
Speaker 1: to give everybody a watch for Christmas. Question do you
23:05
Speaker 1: recall any of the names who received watches? Answer I do.
23:09
Speaker 1: I was one of them. Steve Bannon was one of them.
23:12
Speaker 1: Jojo and Lynn I believe were on there. I don't
23:15
Speaker 1: recall who else. Question what year was that?
23:19
Speaker 2: Answer?
23:20
Speaker 1: I think that was twenty eighteen. Question and did you
23:23
Speaker 1: ever purchase any gifts for any of mister Epstein's assistants? Answer?
23:27
Speaker 2: I don't think so.
23:28
Speaker 1: Question did you purchase gifts for any other woman associated
23:31
Speaker 1: with mister Epstein?
23:34
Speaker 2: Answer?
23:34
Speaker 1: I know Kathy Rumler got a gift card at Christmas time?
23:37
Speaker 1: I recall getting Leon Black's assistant. I think she got
23:40
Speaker 1: a spot card. Question did you ever purchase lingerie for
23:43
Speaker 1: women associated with mister Epstein? Answer no? Question What about flowers?
23:49
Speaker 1: Answer Kathy Rumler might have received flowers. What about chocolates?
23:53
Speaker 1: Answer not that I recall, Miss Britnak. What was his
23:57
Speaker 1: relationship with Kathy Rumler?
23:59
Speaker 2: Answer?
23:59
Speaker 1: Business? Yes, they were. From what I could tell, it
24:02
Speaker 1: was a business relationship. Question it seemed like a business
24:05
Speaker 1: relationship after he was sending flowers and SPA appointments.
24:09
Speaker 2: Answer.
24:10
Speaker 1: I think he thought of her as very professional, and
24:12
Speaker 1: he was very generous, and I think he found her
24:14
Speaker 1: she was very busy and probably enjoyed some flowers on
24:17
Speaker 1: her birthday or a SPA gift card. Question was there
24:20
Speaker 1: any office gossip about their relationship? Answer no? Question did
24:24
Speaker 1: you wear any rumors about their relationship? Answer no? Mister Emmer,
24:30
Speaker 1: what was her job during this period? Answer by Miss Groff.
24:34
Speaker 1: She was an attorney?
24:35
Speaker 2: Emmer.
24:36
Speaker 1: Do you know gets cut off by Groff. I don't
24:38
Speaker 1: know exactly, but I knew her to be an attorney,
24:41
Speaker 1: Miss Tolan. And you said mister Epstein knew her. Their
24:43
Speaker 1: relationship was strictly business. What kind of business were they
24:46
Speaker 1: engaging in together? Can you elaborate, Miss Groff, I don't know.
24:51
Speaker 1: He did not talk to me about that, Mister Backner.
24:53
Speaker 1: Can I ask her another question? Goes off the record
24:57
Speaker 1: back on Miss Brignac, and you add access to mister
25:01
Speaker 1: Epstein's personal email accounts? Did you see any conversations about
25:04
Speaker 1: Miss Rumler's job position. Ms Groff, I did not have
25:08
Speaker 1: access to his personal email account. I mean I would
25:10
Speaker 1: email them, but I didn't see his emails. Miss Britnak,
25:13
Speaker 1: were U c seed on any emails at reference Roomler's profession? Groff,
25:18
Speaker 1: I don't recall Emmer in relation to Rumler. The Committee's
25:22
Speaker 1: interested in how mister Epstein may have surrounded himself with
25:25
Speaker 1: influential individuals to curry favor. Did you understand Rumler to
25:29
Speaker 1: be an individual that was working at the White House
25:32
Speaker 1: during the period that you had been scheduling their meetings,
25:35
Speaker 1: Ms Groff, I thought you worked at the White House
25:37
Speaker 1: prior to mister Epstein's meeting mister Emmer, Thank you.
25:41
Speaker 2: All right.
25:41
Speaker 1: We're going to wrap up right here and in the
25:43
Speaker 1: next episode dealing with the topic, we're going to pick
25:45
Speaker 1: up where we left off. All the information that goes
25:48
Speaker 1: with this episode can be found in the description box.
25:52
Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
25:55
Speaker 1: Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to pick up
25:58
Speaker 1: where we left off with the Leslie Groff interview with
26:02
Speaker 1: Congress Miss Tolan. Question a few more questions on gifts. Generally,
26:08
Speaker 1: did you ever facilitate payment for school tuition for any
26:12
Speaker 1: woman or girl associated with Jeffrey Epstein?
26:15
Speaker 2: Answer?
26:16
Speaker 1: I did not facilitate payment. Question did you purchase order
26:20
Speaker 1: or in any way help procure gifts for any of
26:22
Speaker 1: the following individuals Glenne Maxwell answer no, Leon Black answer no.
26:27
Speaker 1: Doug Band answer no. Bill Gates answer no question. And
26:32
Speaker 1: as we have mentioned, part of the committee's investigation is
26:35
Speaker 1: trying to understand how mister Epstein sought to curry favor
26:39
Speaker 1: with prominent individuals. Are there any other prominent individual that
26:43
Speaker 1: mister Epstein would send expensive or frequent gifts to answer
26:47
Speaker 1: in the government question just any prominent individual? Answer there
26:52
Speaker 1: was a time when him and Tommy Mottola used to
26:55
Speaker 1: send each other gifts, but that's all I can remember.
26:58
Speaker 1: Question and you what kind of gifts? Answer? I don't know,
27:01
Speaker 1: maybe a four whiller, I don't remember. I felt like
27:04
Speaker 1: they were just trying to give each other. I'll do
27:06
Speaker 1: one another with a better gift at one time? Question
27:10
Speaker 1: did you have a credit card for work? Answer no.
27:13
Speaker 1: Question did you ever use your personal credit card for
27:15
Speaker 1: making purchases? Answer no, Miss Brignac. Were you reimbursed for
27:20
Speaker 1: purchases Graf No Brignac. Were you expected to cover your
27:25
Speaker 1: own travel and expenses related to your position? Graff If
27:29
Speaker 1: I was I barely traveled? But no? If I did
27:31
Speaker 1: travel that would be reimbursed. Backner, Can I have one
27:35
Speaker 1: more word? Graf ya go off the record now they're
27:38
Speaker 1: back Brignac. In your role, did you ever coordinat, or
27:42
Speaker 1: facilitate trips for foreign women or girls?
27:45
Speaker 2: Answer?
27:46
Speaker 1: I would coordinate airfare for women and men to see
27:48
Speaker 1: mister Ebstein. Question could you walk me through that process?
27:52
Speaker 2: Answer? Sure.
27:53
Speaker 1: Mister Epstein would direct me to give me a name
27:56
Speaker 1: and ask me to coordinate a flight for someone to
27:58
Speaker 1: wherever it was that they needed to fly from to
28:01
Speaker 1: go visit them. Question why answer he did not tell
28:04
Speaker 1: me that question you never asked? Answer no question. Did
28:08
Speaker 1: you ever identify, recruit, screen, interview, or recommend any foreign
28:13
Speaker 1: women or girls for meetings or employment with mister Epstein
28:16
Speaker 1: or his associates? Answer no. Question did you ever assist
28:21
Speaker 1: anyone else to recruit a foreign woman or girl? Answer no?
28:25
Speaker 2: Question.
28:26
Speaker 1: How are these women identified that you did assist in
28:29
Speaker 1: coordinating travel for answer?
28:31
Speaker 2: I don't know.
28:32
Speaker 1: Question who provided their names in contact information? Answer mister Epstein.
28:37
Speaker 1: Question who made the final determination on whether a young
28:40
Speaker 1: woman or girl receive visa sponsorship?
28:43
Speaker 2: Answer?
28:43
Speaker 1: I don't know. Question do you have any role in
28:46
Speaker 1: a visa sponsorship process answer, no, Timmins. Can I back up?
28:52
Speaker 1: She asked you a question if you ever coordinated the
28:54
Speaker 1: introduction of any foreign nationals and you said no, graff
28:58
Speaker 1: the introduction of what was the question? Have you ever
29:02
Speaker 1: participated in visa sponsorship for a foreign woman or a girl? Timmins?
29:07
Speaker 1: Did you ever identify, recruit, screen, or recommend foreign women
29:11
Speaker 1: or girls for employment or meetings with mister Epstein or
29:14
Speaker 1: his associates graf No Timmins. Were you ever involved in
29:18
Speaker 1: the process graf No Timmins. On May first, twenty twelve,
29:23
Speaker 1: you're emailing back and forth regarding of a girl from Ukraine. Darling.
29:27
Speaker 1: Here's a picture of the new girl. She's twenty one,
29:30
Speaker 1: very sweet and lovely. Let me know when you receive
29:32
Speaker 1: them please. I took them from her portfolio. Maybe the
29:36
Speaker 1: quality is not so good, but I think you can
29:38
Speaker 1: still see everything. So you have a person their names
29:41
Speaker 1: are adapted here and I'm not going to use their name,
29:44
Speaker 1: but the person is Eastern Europe that is communicating with you,
29:48
Speaker 1: not with mister Epstein, and providing photos of a girl.
29:51
Speaker 1: And it seems that, I mean, there's a nineteen year
29:52
Speaker 1: old girl and there's a twenty one year old girl.
29:55
Speaker 1: So how do you reconcile the email? I mean, we
29:57
Speaker 1: can get the print out for you. That seems like
29:59
Speaker 1: what you're doing, Graf. No, Timmins, So what was the
30:03
Speaker 1: purpose of the communication, Graf. I don't recall the purpose
30:08
Speaker 1: or what it was. To me. It sounds like this
30:10
Speaker 1: was models or possibly I don't know. Timmins. Okay, I
30:14
Speaker 1: saw it on the document. We'll get it printed, Tolan.
30:16
Speaker 1: And the follow up on that point, I'll now introduce
30:19
Speaker 1: majority exhibit too, Tolan. We'll give it a second to
30:23
Speaker 1: get passed out. But this is a chain of emails
30:25
Speaker 1: between as Groff and a redacted name. These emails are
30:28
Speaker 1: dated April eighteenth, twenty twelve, and the subject line reads
30:32
Speaker 1: first girl redacted. The Bates number is EFTA zero two
30:36
Speaker 1: zero two seven six three eight. Will give you a
30:40
Speaker 1: moment to review, Tolan.
30:42
Speaker 2: Question.
30:44
Speaker 1: This is an email that was just being referenced. If
30:46
Speaker 1: you read it from the bottom up. The first email states, Hi, Leslie,
30:50
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry in front of Jeffrey for my delay.
30:53
Speaker 1: I'm sending you pictures of to of my friends now.
30:55
Speaker 1: They're both Russians, winky face.
30:57
Speaker 2: Here's first.
30:58
Speaker 1: Her name is redacted, and it says there's another name
31:02
Speaker 1: listed below, and on the back of the page, page two,
31:05
Speaker 1: there's an entirely redacted image answer okay question and then
31:09
Speaker 1: miss Groff, you respond on the same day with just
31:12
Speaker 1: a winky face. So, just for the record to be clear,
31:15
Speaker 1: are you familiar with this email? Answer? I don't recall it,
31:19
Speaker 1: but I think I said no worries, thanks, and someone
31:21
Speaker 1: else had the winky face question Okay, thank you answer.
31:26
Speaker 1: I don't recall this email. The date seems to suggest
31:28
Speaker 1: that it's possible he was looking for new traveling assistance. Timmins. Sorry,
31:33
Speaker 1: let's be very clear. He was attempting to find people
31:36
Speaker 1: that he was going to sex and human traffic for
31:38
Speaker 1: the next decade. So I mean, yeah, it's an assistant,
31:41
Speaker 1: but that's what he was doing, Miss Buckner. Are you
31:44
Speaker 1: asking if she knew it? Timmins? I just I don't
31:47
Speaker 1: like people using that word assistant. I correct people when
31:49
Speaker 1: they say it because it's not accurate. She's an assistant,
31:53
Speaker 1: mister Witcomb. She's testifying, sir, you're not mister Backner. In
31:57
Speaker 1: all fairness, she's not disputing what Jeffrey Epstein did. If
32:00
Speaker 1: you're asking what she knew back then. She'll gladly answer
32:03
Speaker 1: the question, but she's not disputing that mister Epstein was
32:06
Speaker 1: his person doing what you're claiming she was doing or
32:08
Speaker 1: he was doing, mister Timmins, and that was to find
32:12
Speaker 1: culpability in the process. Bagner understood Timmins. When she's facilitating
32:16
Speaker 1: the flow of information and people, that's why we're here.
32:20
Speaker 1: Bagner understood, well, the issue is whether there was knowledge
32:24
Speaker 1: or not, which she doesn't have. Timmins correct toll In question,
32:29
Speaker 1: so why was this individual sending you images of other women?
32:33
Speaker 2: Answer?
32:33
Speaker 1: I don't know.
32:34
Speaker 2: Question did you ask for the photos?
32:36
Speaker 1: Answer no? Question did mister Epstein ask for the photo?
32:39
Speaker 1: Answer I don't know. Question where you aware that this
32:42
Speaker 1: is this is a nude photo?
32:43
Speaker 2: Do you recall?
32:44
Speaker 1: Answer no. Brignac, why would he need a photograph in
32:48
Speaker 1: order to recruit an assistant? Graff, I don't know that
32:52
Speaker 1: this was to get a traveling assistant. I said it's
32:54
Speaker 1: possible that it was. He was always wanting to find
32:57
Speaker 1: better and I don't know what it was for. I
33:00
Speaker 1: also know that he was very, very connected to the
33:01
Speaker 1: modeling world. He was in business with Jean lu Brunel
33:05
Speaker 1: as well. As other agencies. Brignak. This is in twenty twelve,
33:09
Speaker 1: after he cut ties with Les Wexner. So I don't
33:11
Speaker 1: think you would have thought this was for a modeling position.
33:14
Speaker 1: What did you mean by your winki face, Miss Groff.
33:17
Speaker 1: That's not my winki face, it's whoever sent the email,
33:20
Speaker 1: Miss Tolan? And do you know how this individual was
33:24
Speaker 1: in the photo? Answer? I do not question? What did
33:28
Speaker 1: you do with this image? After answer I probably forwarded
33:31
Speaker 1: to mister Epstein. Question and did this happen on multiple occasions?
33:35
Speaker 1: How often were you receiving images of women to give
33:38
Speaker 1: to mister Epstein?
33:39
Speaker 2: Answer?
33:39
Speaker 1: Not often, Miss Toland. I'll now introduce majority exhibit number three.
33:44
Speaker 1: This is another email chain dated May first, twenty twelve,
33:48
Speaker 1: between miss Groff and another adacted email address with the
33:52
Speaker 1: subject line Jeffrey Epstein. Debates number is EFTA zero one
33:56
Speaker 1: eight eight four seven eight nine. I'll give you a
33:59
Speaker 1: momentary you this one as well, Backner, Okay, Tolan, I'll
34:03
Speaker 1: direct your attention to the bottom of the page one,
34:06
Speaker 1: where the email reads, dear Leslie, just wanted to make
34:09
Speaker 1: sure you got the new photo. Let me know please,
34:12
Speaker 1: to which you appear to respond that you have not
34:14
Speaker 1: received any new photos, and the email address, which is redacted,
34:18
Speaker 1: says they'll try to send the email again. Then the
34:21
Speaker 1: following email near the top of the page reads, Darling,
34:24
Speaker 1: here's the picture of a new girl redacted. She's twenty one,
34:27
Speaker 1: very sweet and lovely. Let me know you receive them please.
34:31
Speaker 1: I took them from her portfolio, so maybe the quality
34:34
Speaker 1: is not so good, but I think you can still
34:36
Speaker 1: see everything with a winky face, Miss Groff. Are you
34:39
Speaker 1: familiar with this email? Answer? I am not. Since we've
34:42
Speaker 1: been getting ready to see you, I've seen this email.
34:45
Speaker 1: To me, I sound it sounds like she's a model.
34:48
Speaker 1: Question and what was the purpose of these images to
34:50
Speaker 1: send to mister Epstein?
34:52
Speaker 2: Answer?
34:53
Speaker 1: I would think so, yes, Brinyak, Why would you be
34:56
Speaker 1: sending modeling photos to mister Epstein?
34:58
Speaker 2: Answer?
34:59
Speaker 1: Because he had a business for relationship with Jean Luke
35:01
Speaker 1: Brunel and Kate's faith with Next Modeling, and he knew
35:05
Speaker 1: lots and lots of models Naomi Campbell, Petro Nokiva, Tatiana Stepanova,
35:10
Speaker 1: famous models. It made sense to me that he'd be
35:12
Speaker 1: helping coordinate models. Question did you ever see these women
35:16
Speaker 1: receive job offers? Or modeling contracts. Answer, I don't recall.
35:20
Speaker 1: That was not something that was discussed with him. Question
35:23
Speaker 1: did you have any concerns with sending him these photos
35:27
Speaker 1: after he was arrested in charge and indicted for soliciting
35:29
Speaker 1: prostitution of minors. Answer no, Miss Tolan, and all of
35:34
Speaker 1: the images that are attached to have facial redactions. However,
35:37
Speaker 1: the image on what should be page seven, the second
35:40
Speaker 1: to last, the very last physical image, second to last image,
35:44
Speaker 1: is clearly a full body redaction? Is it because the
35:46
Speaker 1: woman was nude in this photo? Answer?
35:49
Speaker 2: I don't know.
35:50
Speaker 1: I don't remember the photo, but I don't believe I
35:52
Speaker 1: ever saw nude photos. Question did you ever the email
35:55
Speaker 1: states that she was twenty one? Did you ever verify
35:58
Speaker 1: the age of the individual?
35:59
Speaker 2: Answer?
36:00
Speaker 1: I don't know. Question and did you forward these images
36:03
Speaker 1: to Jeffrey Epstein? Answer? I would think I did it,
36:07
Speaker 1: says to Jeffrey Epstein. Brignac, Miss Groff, have you ever
36:11
Speaker 1: served or sponsored a foreign woman for a girl's visa?
36:15
Speaker 2: Graff? No, Brignac.
36:17
Speaker 1: I'm going to enter majority Exhibit four, which is EFTA
36:20
Speaker 1: zero two zero six two five. Excuse me, zero two
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Speaker 1: zero six two nine five to one. This is an
36:27
Speaker 1: email from you to AMEX Centurion Travel dated January fourteenth,
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Speaker 1: twenty sixteen, Miss Brignac. The email reads, Natasha, we need
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Speaker 1: to find a flight that departs Roam and goes to
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Speaker 1: London on the twenty ninth four redacted. This flight should
36:41
Speaker 1: depart around the same time the flight we're holding for
36:44
Speaker 1: redacted rome to Miami. No return flight for this flight.
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Speaker 1: This is a decoy flight. She will not really take it,
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Speaker 1: but she needs to show it on the itinerary for
36:54
Speaker 1: this flight. Can you put something together for me? I'm
36:57
Speaker 1: going to give you a moment to review this, Miss
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Speaker 1: bok would he have just one second? Goes off the
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Speaker 1: record now they're back Backner, were ready? Miss Brignac?
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Speaker 2: Question? What's a decoy flight? Answer?
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Speaker 1: It means she's not going to take the flight. Question
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Speaker 1: did you regularly engage in requesting decoy flights for securing visas?
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Speaker 2: Answer? No question.
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Speaker 1: How many times have you engaged in this practice, mister Backner,
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Speaker 1: with all due respect, there's no indication it was to
37:23
Speaker 1: obtain a visa. Brignac? Okay, how many times did you
37:27
Speaker 1: engage in the practice of registering decoy flights?
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Speaker 2: Miss Groff?
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Speaker 1: This is the only decoy flight that I recall, and
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Speaker 1: the only reason I recall it is because while getting
37:36
Speaker 1: ready for to come speak with y'all voluntarily, I saw
37:39
Speaker 1: this email along with others about the trip Miss Tolan.
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Speaker 1: You said it was a decoy flight because she wasn't going.
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Speaker 1: She was not going to take it. Why grof Wright,
37:49
Speaker 1: So this person the woman wanted to take a flight
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Speaker 1: to mister Epstein's. She did not want to tell her
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Speaker 1: parents that she was going to take this flight. She
37:56
Speaker 1: wanted to keep the flight that was taking her to
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Speaker 1: London and have a different flight though, take her really
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Speaker 1: to see mister Epstein. I don't know why she didn't
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Speaker 1: want to tell her parents, but this was not for
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Speaker 1: a visa, Miss Brignac. I'm entering majority of Exhibit five
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Speaker 1: into the record, which is marked EFTA zero zero five
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Speaker 1: zero one six y two two through EFTA zero zero
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Speaker 1: five zero one six two five, Miss Brignac. These emails
38:21
Speaker 1: are between you and redacted an executive travel counselor about
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Speaker 1: paying for flights for a hotel for a woman with
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Speaker 1: her visa, dated December seventeenth and eighteenth, twenty twelve. I'll
38:32
Speaker 1: give you a moment to review. Question who was redacted?
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Speaker 2: Answer?
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Speaker 1: She was the MX Centurion Rep. Question how did you
38:40
Speaker 1: meet her? Answer? I never met her in person. She
38:42
Speaker 1: was somebody that I was told was going to be
38:44
Speaker 1: our rep. Answer by who? Or question by who? Answer?
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Speaker 1: It was a long time ago. I don't know how
38:50
Speaker 1: she came to be the rep. Question did mister Epstein
38:53
Speaker 1: introduce you to her? Answer? I don't think he introduced
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Speaker 1: me to her. I'm sure he may have just called
38:57
Speaker 1: one day and said that she was now going to
38:59
Speaker 1: be our rep. I really don't recall how it happened.
39:03
Speaker 1: Question how many people at AMEX did you deal with? Answer?
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Speaker 1: I dealt with her mostly, but if she was on
39:08
Speaker 1: vacation or sick or something, someone else would take her spot.
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Speaker 1: Question in this exhibit, you send an email that states
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Speaker 1: redacted has an interview with the Consulate at ten thirty.
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Speaker 1: She needs proof of a hotel, stay and air for
39:20
Speaker 1: this meeting. If any way you can do faster, would
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Speaker 1: really appreciate it. What was the reason for this individual's
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Speaker 1: travel Answer? I don't know. I think that this was
39:30
Speaker 1: an assistant of mister Epstein that wanted to get her visa.
39:33
Speaker 1: Question and you assisted in facilitating that visa. Answer the
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Speaker 1: only thing I facilitated was getting her a ticket and
39:40
Speaker 1: a hotel room reservation.
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Speaker 2: That was it.
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Speaker 1: Question but we can agree that she needed that ticket
39:45
Speaker 1: and hotel reservation in order to secure a visa. Answer
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Speaker 1: I was directed to please purchase it for her. Question
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Speaker 1: What were you told was the purpose of the woman's travel? Answer?
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Speaker 1: I don't think I was told. It looks to me
39:58
Speaker 1: like she needed to get a visa and she was
40:00
Speaker 1: requesting it, and that's it. I was asked to get
40:03
Speaker 1: her a ticket. I was dealing with amexenturion.
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Speaker 2: That's it. Question is this an example of a decoy flight?
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Speaker 1: Answer? No. Question Why did you ask if it would
40:11
Speaker 1: be fully refundable?
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Speaker 2: Answer?
40:13
Speaker 1: I don't recall. Maybe I was asked to ask if
40:16
Speaker 1: it would be fully refundable? Answer who paid for the travel? Answer?
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Speaker 2: I don't know.
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Speaker 1: Question who paid for a visa application?
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Speaker 2: Answer?
40:23
Speaker 1: I don't know. Question did these women meet with mister
40:27
Speaker 1: Epstein upon their arrival to the US? Answer I don't know.
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Speaker 1: I'm not positive who this even is. I believe it
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Speaker 1: was a traveling assistant, but I don't know. Question did
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Speaker 1: you facilitate lodging for any of the women who entered
40:39
Speaker 1: the US on a visa. Answer it's possible that I
40:42
Speaker 1: was directed to provide them an apartment or a hotel room.
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Speaker 1: Question were any of these women scheduled to give massages?
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Speaker 2: Answer? I don't know.
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Speaker 1: Question was this woman ever identified as a victim of
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Speaker 1: mister Epstein?
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Speaker 2: Answer? I don't know who this is. It's redacted.
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Speaker 1: Sorryquestion were any of these women that you work with
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Speaker 1: the secure a visa identified as a victim of mister Epstein?
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Speaker 2: Answer?
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Speaker 1: I believe his traveling assistance for all victims, now yeah.
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Speaker 1: Question who else did you facilitate housing for? Answer? I
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Speaker 1: didn't facilitate housing. If I was directed and asked to
41:16
Speaker 1: set aside an apartment, I would do that. All right, folks,
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Speaker 1: we're going to wrap up right here and to the
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Speaker 1: next episode. We're going to pick up where we left off.
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Speaker 1: All the information that goes with this episode can be
41:28
Speaker 1: found in the description box.