Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Cops: Star Denver Cardiologist Drugs, Rapes 10 Women, Courted Online

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Cops: Star Denver Cardiologist Drugs, Rapes 10 Women, Courted Online · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
0:12
Speaker 2: If you can't trust your doctor, who can you trust
0:18
Speaker 2: the thought of a doctor hovering over your unconscious body,
0:23
Speaker 2: you got to really trust that person, right.
0:26
Speaker 1: I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.
0:29
Speaker 2: Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation
0:31
Speaker 2: in series XM one eleven. First of all, take listen
0:35
Speaker 2: to our Franzy, Casey and c.
0:37
Speaker 3: According to this Denver police affi David, a woman met
0:40
Speaker 3: up with Matthews after connecting with him on Hinge, a
0:43
Speaker 3: dating app. They had brunch on a Sunday morning in January,
0:46
Speaker 3: then walked to his West Denver townhouse. There, she said,
0:50
Speaker 3: they hung out in his hot tub. Matthews later told
0:53
Speaker 3: police they had consensual sex, but the woman says she
0:57
Speaker 3: remembers none of that, has no recollection of having sex
1:00
Speaker 3: with the doctor, only remembering finding herself hours later at
1:04
Speaker 3: home with paramedics checking her out.
1:07
Speaker 1: Wow.
1:08
Speaker 2: Did we mention the so called doctor she had a
1:11
Speaker 2: date with is a leading cardiologist?
1:17
Speaker 1: Wow?
1:19
Speaker 2: Okay, what exactly is happening and what is hinge?
1:24
Speaker 1: With me?
1:24
Speaker 2: An all star panel to make sense of what we
1:27
Speaker 2: know right now? First of all, Lee and Newbecker joining
1:31
Speaker 2: us a digital forensics expert, President of Enigma Forensics. You
1:37
Speaker 2: can find him at Leeneubecker dot com. Lee, thank you
1:40
Speaker 2: for being with us. What is hinge well?
1:42
Speaker 4: Hinge is one of many social dating websites out there.
1:48
Speaker 4: Markets itself has been the last app you need that
1:52
Speaker 4: you'll find someone and delete the app and live happily.
1:55
Speaker 2: Ever Elster, oh, hey, that is a great marketing tool.
2:00
Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst joining us out of Beverly Hills.
2:04
Speaker 2: You can find he right, Doctorbethanymarshall dot com. Don't pooh
2:08
Speaker 2: pooh online dating. My nephew met his now wife online.
2:16
Speaker 2: He dated a lot of other ladies he met online.
2:19
Speaker 2: They got married, they just had their second son and
2:22
Speaker 2: bought a home, so that's working out. However, you do
2:28
Speaker 2: meet a lot of nuts.
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Speaker 5: Online, Nancy. You have to have really good antennas when
2:32
Speaker 5: you go online. But you're not all we're all not
2:35
Speaker 5: forensic experts like our previous guest was. You know, I
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Speaker 5: think of this is this is a wonderful tool, a
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Speaker 5: dating tool, right And the more, as I say to
2:46
Speaker 5: my patients all the time, the more tools you have
2:48
Speaker 5: in your toolbox, the better. So if you're going to date.
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Speaker 5: A good tool is self love. A good tool is
2:55
Speaker 5: good judgment, knowing to how to evaluate another person on
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Speaker 5: a date, receptivity, generosity, optimism towards the future. Knowing where
3:05
Speaker 5: to meet people is an excellent tool, but this tool
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Speaker 5: has become a feeding ground for predators, crazy people who
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Speaker 5: want something other than dating. And just a quick comment
3:21
Speaker 5: about that. What I hear from my patients is that
3:24
Speaker 5: they don't know how to distinguish between somebody who wants
3:28
Speaker 5: to go on a date because they want a bright
3:30
Speaker 5: future with another person, or somebody who's just looking for sex,
3:35
Speaker 5: somebody who just wants to hook up, or somebody who
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Speaker 5: just wants a friend and this is their only way
3:41
Speaker 5: to make a friend. So it's hard to ferret that
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Speaker 5: out at the beginning. Let alone, if you're going to
3:46
Speaker 5: be on the date with a sex predator or a monster.
3:48
Speaker 1: Well wait a minute, wait a minute, lead Meanbecker.
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Speaker 2: Let me follow up on doctor Bethany Marshall just said, Lee,
3:55
Speaker 2: wouldn't you say that as a matter of perception anyway,
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Speaker 2: there's a big difference between, for instance, plenty of fish
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Speaker 2: and tender.
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Speaker 4: Yeah, well, you just have to you have to inspect
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Speaker 4: your fish before you're real on men.
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Speaker 5: Yes, yes, but plenty of fits of the dating site right.
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Speaker 1: Yes, that's another one.
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Speaker 2: But I'm saying it is perceived as being about love
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Speaker 2: and relationships and finding your forever partner, as opposed to
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Speaker 2: other websites where it's basically a hookup.
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Speaker 4: Yeah, William a booty call.
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Speaker 2: I mean Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor, author of Why Bad
4:34
Speaker 2: Looks Good that's a great name, by the way, and
4:36
Speaker 2: author of Red Flags. She's at wendypatrickphd dot com and
4:40
Speaker 2: she's the host of Today with Doctor Wendy at KC
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Speaker 2: b QT Wendy. There's a big difference, and here comes
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Speaker 2: the bride and a booty call.
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Speaker 6: That's exactly right. And some of these apps are geared
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Speaker 6: specifically to one group or the other. You've got at
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Speaker 6: e Harmony, You've got Christian Mingle, You've got places where
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Speaker 6: people are supposedly looking for long term, committed relationships versus
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Speaker 6: the hookup sites. So absolutely looking at where somebody's posting,
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Speaker 6: assuming they're not cross posting date right.
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Speaker 2: You know, there are romantic slash, let's get married websites,
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Speaker 2: and then there it's Tender and others Buffy.
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Speaker 5: Meets Bagel is one here in Los Angeles, Jay Date,
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Speaker 5: you know, Nancy. Here's the tricky thing is that the
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Speaker 5: people on the hookup sites don't want the other people
5:36
Speaker 5: on the hookup sites, so they gravitate towards the dating
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Speaker 5: sites because those people, I think, no value judgment here,
5:43
Speaker 5: but those people are a little more optimistic. They want
5:46
Speaker 5: to spend little trying together, so they gravitate towards the
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Speaker 5: other sites and then they becometh hookup people on a
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Speaker 5: dating site.
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Speaker 6: They also want to exploit vulnerability. I agree exactly what
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Speaker 6: doctor Bethannie. They want to exploit the vulnerability of people
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Speaker 6: honestly looking for a relationship because they're going to be
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Speaker 6: more open to it. So that's a great point as well.
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Speaker 2: Also joining us Rachel Countryman, forensic nurse expert for Godoy
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Speaker 2: Medical Forensics. She's a sex assault nurse examiner, a saying
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Speaker 2: sex assault nurse examiner, Rachel, thank you for being with us.
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Speaker 1: Rachel.
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Speaker 2: You heard our friends speaking from Casey enc The woman
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Speaker 2: says she remembers nothing about consensual sex. She remembers meeting
6:40
Speaker 2: up after a discussion or an interaction on Hinge dating app.
6:48
Speaker 2: They go for what sounds like a nice day brunch
6:50
Speaker 2: on Sunday morning, and then they walk to his West
6:55
Speaker 2: Denver townhouse. They hung out in the hot tub. The
6:59
Speaker 2: next thing she remembers is finding herself hours later at
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Speaker 2: home with paramedics checking her out. She has no recollection
7:09
Speaker 2: of having sex with this top Denver cardiologist age thirty five.
7:15
Speaker 2: Sounds like a wonderful, eligible bachelor. I mean, he's got
7:19
Speaker 2: to be smart because he got through med school. He
7:23
Speaker 2: apparently has all of his teeth and full insurance.
7:27
Speaker 1: So go for it, ladies.
7:28
Speaker 2: So she wakes up in her own home with no
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Speaker 2: recollection of what happened. So, Rachel Countryman, how do you
7:36
Speaker 2: know if you have been raped if you can't remember it?
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Speaker 7: Well, Nancy, I think that we need to point out
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Speaker 7: here that you know, sexual assault is a crime of
7:44
Speaker 7: violence against a person's body and their will. Right they can't.
7:49
Speaker 7: They can have physical trauma and significant mental anguish and suffering,
7:53
Speaker 7: and especially in situations like this. So she went to
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Speaker 7: this person's apartment that she obviously had some trust in,
8:02
Speaker 7: and she doesn't know what happened. That right there, makes
8:06
Speaker 7: someone less likely to report they don't remember themselves what happened.
8:11
Speaker 7: So how can they tell somebody else what happened to
8:13
Speaker 7: them and be believed. So that's a huge part right there.
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Speaker 2: So why would she believe she had been raped? What
8:20
Speaker 2: would lead a victim to believe they had been raped
8:24
Speaker 2: when they can't remember anything?
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Speaker 7: Well, I think that victims report and end up going in. Remember,
8:31
Speaker 7: a sexual assault forensic exam also known as a STATES
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Speaker 7: is a medical exam first and foremost, And it's not
8:38
Speaker 7: going to show a proof that there was somebody was assaulted,
8:43
Speaker 7: and it's not going to show proof that they were
8:46
Speaker 7: even penetrated. I think the purpose of the exam is
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Speaker 7: to make sure they're okay and possibly collect some evidence
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Speaker 7: and that could possibly id the assailant. And you know,
9:01
Speaker 7: with DNA results and stuff, we can then you know,
9:05
Speaker 7: determine that there was sexual contact that occurred some things.
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Speaker 2: Wendy Patrick is California prosecutor, having prosecuted media rapes and
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Speaker 2: sex assault cases. Wendy, In addition to what the rape
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Speaker 2: victim says, there are other endisha of rapes, such as
9:25
Speaker 2: you wake up and your underwear is on backwards or
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Speaker 2: inside out.
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Speaker 1: You wake up and.
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Speaker 2: Your underwear is torn, or your clothes are not back
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Speaker 2: on you correctly, or you're missing an article of undergarment,
9:39
Speaker 2: your bra or your underwear. You may find blood or
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Speaker 2: sticky fluid, you may suffer pain, all sorts of indisha
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Speaker 2: that you were raped and you can't remember it.
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Speaker 6: That's exactly right, and that's one of the reasons start
9:59
Speaker 6: exams can and be a tool among others. As you know,
10:02
Speaker 6: when it comes to a consent defense, which is often
10:05
Speaker 6: the case in these I don't remember much type of
10:08
Speaker 6: scenarios where somebody has been drugged or they've had too
10:11
Speaker 6: much a drink or one of the other things that
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Speaker 6: start exam can show is the type of contact nobody
10:17
Speaker 6: would ever consent to. Anal injuries fall into this category
10:21
Speaker 6: very frequently. So there's lots of reasons in addition to
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Speaker 6: what we just heard talking about the SAC and AA
10:28
Speaker 6: can be collected, et cetera, that this can be one
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Speaker 6: of many tools to indicate unwanted sexual contact.
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Speaker 2: So we hear what this woman is saying, and so
10:37
Speaker 2: far a rape case we cannot make out. We know
10:43
Speaker 2: a little bit about her, but what do we know
10:46
Speaker 2: about him? Take a listen to Brian Moss at case
10:50
Speaker 2: and c the.
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Speaker 3: Woman had two mimosas at breakfast, then another at his
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Speaker 3: home along with two shots of tequila. Doctor Matthew's lawyer
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Speaker 3: says to his client and the woman had sensual sex
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Speaker 3: on their first date. That lifestyle can result in buyer's remorse,
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Speaker 3: jilted lovers, and tall tales, but the attorney said it
11:09
Speaker 3: is not a crime.
11:17
Speaker 8: Hi, guys, Nancy Grace here, please join us now on
11:21
Speaker 8: Fox Nation for a brand new investigation, Parallels of Evil
11:26
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11:32
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11:35
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11:43
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11:49
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11:55
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11:59
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12:03
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12:08
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12:13
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12:18
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12:24
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12:29
Speaker 8: on Fox Nation.
12:45
Speaker 2: Joining me right now, Christopher Gavin, breaking news reporter for
12:49
Speaker 2: The Messenger at The Messenger dot com.
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Speaker 1: Christopher, thank you for being with us.
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Speaker 2: Buyers remorse that lifestyle can result in buyers remorse, jilted lovers,
13:03
Speaker 2: and tall tales.
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Speaker 1: But the lawyer says it's not a crime. Man.
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Speaker 2: I would have thought long and hard before I put
13:12
Speaker 2: that statement out there. So the defense is buyers remorse.
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Speaker 2: What exactly does that mean, Christopher Gavin, That's what this
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Speaker 2: doctor has to say back.
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Speaker 9: Well, basically, you know that doctor Matthews had told police,
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Speaker 9: according to the affidavit, that to him and the woman
13:31
Speaker 9: had contential sex. She vomited a few times after she
13:35
Speaker 9: had some drinks. She offered her water but she declined,
13:40
Speaker 9: and offered her a shower, but she accepted, and he
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Speaker 9: claimed that she was doing better after a while and
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Speaker 9: she called nouber and went home.
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Speaker 1: Wow.
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Speaker 2: So, doctor Bethidy Marshall, in that scenario that Chris Gavin
13:52
Speaker 2: with The Messenger accurately pointed out as having been the
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Speaker 2: outline the good doctor gave buyer's remorse. That lifestyle can
14:03
Speaker 2: result in Buyer's remorse, jilted lovers and tall tales what she.
14:07
Speaker 5: Thinks he's the best thing out there?
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Speaker 1: Waitte. But wait, how can that resonate with anybody?
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Speaker 5: Doesn't It points to his psycho pathology.
14:16
Speaker 1: Buyer's remorse.
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Speaker 2: I don't think rape allegations by a victim are buyer's remorse, Nancy.
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Speaker 5: This speaks to motivation on his part. He thinks he
14:32
Speaker 5: has rationalized that he is the best thing out there
14:37
Speaker 5: and that she wanted him, and now she's regretting it.
14:40
Speaker 5: But if you just think of the storyline of what
14:43
Speaker 5: happened that night. He's a cardiologist, and then he gives
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Speaker 5: her water when she's thrown up three times. I mean,
14:50
Speaker 5: we all know that she probably needed an IV At
14:53
Speaker 5: that point, he puts her in the shower. Well, that's
14:57
Speaker 5: not great, and then.
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Speaker 1: Get rid of that, get rid of us exactly.
15:01
Speaker 5: And then she puts her in an uber. We all
15:04
Speaker 5: know that even if you go for a colonoscopy or
15:07
Speaker 5: any kind of medical procedure where you are put under anesthesia,
15:13
Speaker 5: you're told to have a familiar person drive you home.
15:17
Speaker 5: So he puts her in an uber and she's out
15:19
Speaker 5: of it. I mean, it has wrong written all over
15:23
Speaker 5: this story.
15:25
Speaker 6: You know, I think buyer's remorse is the wrong analogy.
15:27
Speaker 1: Well, that's one way of putting it.
15:29
Speaker 2: I think they stuck their foot right in their mouth,
15:32
Speaker 2: and I'd like to stick it somewhere else. But I mean,
15:35
Speaker 2: you at very best have sex with a woman, she says,
15:39
Speaker 2: she recalls nothing of it, and wakes up, and the
15:43
Speaker 2: EMTs are working on her. She for whatever reason, believes
15:47
Speaker 2: she's been raped. And the response is buyer's remorse, jilted lover,
15:53
Speaker 2: Oh ha, double Lno, if the lawyer had any brains,
15:58
Speaker 2: they would have said nothing. But if they felt they
16:02
Speaker 2: had to speak, I would have exhibited caring and sympathy
16:07
Speaker 2: for the female complainant instead of jilted.
16:12
Speaker 4: Oh.
16:14
Speaker 2: They better not put a single woman on that jury
16:16
Speaker 2: if it ever comes to that, because that is going
16:18
Speaker 2: to fall flat. What were you saying, Wendy Patrick, You.
16:21
Speaker 6: Know the reason that's the wrong analogy is women don't
16:23
Speaker 6: claim rape as the result of a bad date. When
16:27
Speaker 6: you claim rape and you are interviewed and everything that
16:31
Speaker 6: goes along with that, you're on trial and you're in
16:33
Speaker 6: the spotlight, and that is not where sexual assault victims
16:36
Speaker 6: want to be. It is a painful, difficult, challenging process
16:40
Speaker 6: to work through some of the what goes on after that.
16:43
Speaker 6: So I think what we're looking at here is not
16:46
Speaker 6: knowing what happened, trying to figure it out, and just
16:49
Speaker 6: being honest about what they do remember and why they
16:51
Speaker 6: wouldn't have consented to some of what went next. That's
16:55
Speaker 6: what seems to be the.
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Speaker 2: Fact beatter Rachel Couchman joining us friends saying nurse and
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Speaker 2: a saying sex assault nurse examiner. Let's just go on
17:03
Speaker 2: what the defendant said. Excuse me, the good doctor, Rachel.
17:08
Speaker 2: What would a shower? What effect would a shower have
17:12
Speaker 2: on evidence regarding a rape victim?
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Speaker 7: Well, the shower could help wash away evidence. Touch DNA,
17:19
Speaker 7: you know we have we are able to get DNA
17:21
Speaker 7: now on touch saliva. Depending on how much she bathed
17:27
Speaker 7: and showered and washed those areas, potentially DNA could have
17:32
Speaker 7: been washed.
17:33
Speaker 2: Away saliva as Rachel country and points out sperm if
17:37
Speaker 2: it's on her body, pubic hair, which will be part
17:43
Speaker 2: of a pelvic exam.
17:44
Speaker 1: The pubic hair of the victim is combed with.
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Speaker 2: A special type of comb. It's very fine to gather
17:57
Speaker 2: pubic hairs left by the rapist on the victim. All
18:02
Speaker 2: sorts of evidence is gathered during a pelvic exam, but
18:07
Speaker 2: a shower could get rid of a lot of evidence.
18:12
Speaker 2: Even if sperm DNA is found in her vagina or rectome,
18:19
Speaker 2: there's still the defense it was all consensual. She can't
18:24
Speaker 2: remember what happened, so what does that mean? What more
18:29
Speaker 2: do we know? Take a listen to our forensic case.
18:33
Speaker 3: NC Matthews had a dating profile on the Hinge app
18:37
Speaker 3: in twenty twenty and connected with a woman we'll call Jane,
18:40
Speaker 3: who went with him to his Uptown apartment. There, she says,
18:43
Speaker 3: after minimal drinking, she blacked out, woke up naked on
18:47
Speaker 3: the floor, and texted a family member, I think there's
18:50
Speaker 3: a good chance something very bad happened to be The
18:53
Speaker 3: next day, September twenty ninth, twenty twenty, she underwent a
18:56
Speaker 3: rape exam and sent an email to Hinge about what
18:59
Speaker 3: she says happened. We'll be taking immediate steps, wrote back Hinge.
19:03
Speaker 3: We permanently banned him from Hinge. The company told.
19:06
Speaker 1: Her, so is he is? He banned from Hinge? Take
19:13
Speaker 1: a lessen.
19:13
Speaker 3: But four months later, as she was on the dating
19:16
Speaker 3: app again, she again found his profile and again wrote
19:20
Speaker 3: Hinge on January thirtieth, twenty twenty one, I was raped
19:25
Speaker 3: after a first day with an individual I met and
19:27
Speaker 3: communicated with via a Hinge. He still exists within your ecosystem,
19:32
Speaker 3: she wrote, and is posing a potential threat to other
19:35
Speaker 3: women within the Hinge community.
19:38
Speaker 1: Their ban is essentially meaningless.
19:41
Speaker 3: Eva Galprin is the director of cybersecurity for the Electronic
19:45
Speaker 3: Frontier Foundation.
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Speaker 1: Whatever they did was clearly insufficient. It did not even.
19:52
Speaker 7: Clear the most basic bar of what you want to
19:56
Speaker 7: do when you want to ban someone.
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Speaker 2: So let me understand Christopher Gavin joining us from the Messenger.
20:03
Speaker 2: This woman goes to Hinge, tells them what happened, and
20:07
Speaker 2: they agree to quote ban him before Moss letter. She
20:11
Speaker 2: checks and he's back. Do I have those facts correct,
20:14
Speaker 2: Christopher Gavin?
20:16
Speaker 9: Yeah, according to that tv S report, Yes, yes, ma'am.
20:19
Speaker 4: I mean you have a problem if you're going to
20:20
Speaker 4: ban someone. The principle ways they do it are based
20:23
Speaker 4: on an email and a phone number, and it doesn't
20:26
Speaker 4: take but ten minutes to create a new email account
20:29
Speaker 4: by Berner Phone. So the only way these dating apps
20:32
Speaker 4: potancially forced us is to use AI photo recognition and
20:37
Speaker 4: ID the purpse based on their profile pictures, and that
20:41
Speaker 4: doesn't appear to be him.
20:42
Speaker 2: Guys, you're hearing Lee Newbecker, digital forensics expert at Enigma Forensics,
20:47
Speaker 2: where he is the president and CEO.
20:50
Speaker 1: You're saying, and.
20:51
Speaker 2: Regular people talk, not technical digital talk, that it would
20:55
Speaker 2: have been an easy thing for Hinge to ban him
20:59
Speaker 2: unless he came back and raburn our fund exactly.
21:01
Speaker 4: And people who are doing bad things they find ways
21:05
Speaker 4: to get around it. Even with photo detection. They can
21:08
Speaker 4: alter photos, make photos unique so they can't be identified.
21:11
Speaker 2: As easily interesting. But Hinge didn't do that. Okay, guys,
21:17
Speaker 2: take a listen more of Brian mass.
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Speaker 3: After Jane's second report to Hinge in twenty twenty one,
21:23
Speaker 3: Hinge emailed her. It appears he created a new account
21:27
Speaker 3: using completely different login credentials. We have now permanently banned
21:31
Speaker 3: that account and taken additional steps to ensure that he
21:34
Speaker 3: stays permanently off Hinge. But whatever steps they took clearly
21:40
Speaker 3: didn't work. Hinge declined to be interviewed and wouldn't say
21:44
Speaker 3: exactly what happened. But dating sites can blocker user's phone number,
21:49
Speaker 3: email address, IP address, and other identifying information. But according
21:55
Speaker 3: to text messages between Matthews and other women, he was
21:58
Speaker 3: back on the Hinge app again and twenty twenty two
22:00
Speaker 3: and twenty twenty three.
22:02
Speaker 2: The fact that he's back on a dating app is concerning,
22:06
Speaker 2: and I certainly do not want to limit his freedom
22:09
Speaker 2: of speech.
22:11
Speaker 1: It's concerning because of this Listen.
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Speaker 3: He was back on the Hinge app again in twenty
22:16
Speaker 3: twenty two and twenty twenty three, meeting more women like
22:20
Speaker 3: this woman he went out with in January of this year.
22:24
Speaker 10: I should have never ever even been able to match
22:27
Speaker 10: with him, because he should have never been able to
22:29
Speaker 10: make another account.
22:31
Speaker 4: She says.
22:31
Speaker 3: After several drinks with Matthews at his home, she blacked
22:34
Speaker 3: out and underwent a rape test the next day, which
22:37
Speaker 3: she says showed she had intercourse which she does not remember.
22:41
Speaker 3: Matthews claims the sex was consensual.
22:44
Speaker 2: So to Christopher Gavin from The Messenger, let me understand,
22:47
Speaker 2: we now have two victims saying essentially the same thing,
22:50
Speaker 2: except the first one had drinks with him at Sunday
22:53
Speaker 2: Brunt and the other one had.
22:55
Speaker 1: Drinks at home.
22:57
Speaker 2: Is that the only difference, except drinks at his home
23:02
Speaker 2: not her home.
23:03
Speaker 4: Well, I believe that there.
23:05
Speaker 9: Yeah, there were some drinks in the January case at
23:10
Speaker 9: the Back Branch, but there was also drinks I believe,
23:12
Speaker 9: in both cases at doctor Matthewson's personal home.
23:16
Speaker 2: That's really interesting that you said that, Chris Gavan to
23:20
Speaker 2: doctor Bethany Marshall. I want to go into the dynamic
23:23
Speaker 2: of why you'd want to have sex with a basically
23:25
Speaker 2: unconscious person. But before I go to that, let me
23:30
Speaker 2: ask you this. Do you see his mo unfolding? If
23:33
Speaker 2: in fact these allegations are true, it has to be
23:36
Speaker 2: at his home so he can control the arena, he
23:41
Speaker 2: can control the crime scene.
23:43
Speaker 5: Nancy, Absolutely, this is a well oiled machine. At this point.
23:48
Speaker 5: He knows where control For victims. He probably knows based
23:53
Speaker 5: upon their response patterns, we know how far he's going
23:57
Speaker 5: to get with them. Not to blame the victim, but
23:59
Speaker 5: he probably has some in his own mind, even if
24:01
Speaker 5: it may not play out in reality. He takes them
24:05
Speaker 5: to a public place where they drink something so he
24:08
Speaker 5: can say, oh, they drink too much when they were
24:11
Speaker 5: you know, out at brunch.
24:12
Speaker 2: Ah there'll be Surveilla's video of them at brunch most likely, but.
24:18
Speaker 1: For lunch.
24:19
Speaker 5: Yeah, go ahead, Well, who knows what else is in
24:21
Speaker 5: his home? You know, That's that's what I was wondering.
24:24
Speaker 5: You know, are there is there a bondage kit?
24:27
Speaker 9: Uh?
24:27
Speaker 5: Is there? Remember the Max Factor hair when air when
24:31
Speaker 5: he was raving victims drugging them, but then he would
24:35
Speaker 5: take films of them and then replay and replay them.
24:40
Speaker 5: So you know, are these women being taped? You know what?
24:44
Speaker 5: What what is he doing with that tape or with
24:46
Speaker 5: that footage? And you know, I think you're right in
24:52
Speaker 5: his home, other than him taping them, there's not going
24:56
Speaker 5: to be any surveillance. That's an excellent point. So he
25:00
Speaker 5: he can do whatever he wants while they're out of
25:03
Speaker 5: it and don't remember, and he can basically gaslight and
25:06
Speaker 5: see nothing happened. And by the way, you know he
25:09
Speaker 5: found an attorney who's just like him, who's misogynistic and
25:13
Speaker 5: makes things up that are deprecating about women.
25:16
Speaker 2: Well, you can hire a great lawyer that won't stick
25:18
Speaker 2: his fitness mouth as soon as he starts talking about
25:22
Speaker 2: comparing these alleged victims to buyer's remorse. Wendy Patrick, California,
25:28
Speaker 2: prosecutor and author. I was thinking about a scenario not
25:32
Speaker 2: as complex as what doctor Bethany Marshall just told us.
25:35
Speaker 2: I was thinking of something more fundamental to keep the
25:38
Speaker 2: victim at his home control the crime, saying, you don't
25:42
Speaker 2: have to worry about a roommate walking in. You don't
25:45
Speaker 2: have to worry about does she live with her family,
25:47
Speaker 2: does she have children? Of course, a lot of that
25:49
Speaker 2: he could determine in their discussions on him if they were,
25:53
Speaker 2: you know, going back and forth in a sort of
25:55
Speaker 2: digital conversation. You don't have to worry about her having
26:00
Speaker 2: surveillance vidia in her home that she can then pull
26:02
Speaker 2: up and go, ah, look you riped me. There's not
26:06
Speaker 2: a dog bounding through that's going to bite you in
26:08
Speaker 2: the rear end. There's all sorts of factors that would
26:12
Speaker 2: make it more conducive to a nefarious rape at his place.
26:17
Speaker 6: That's exactly right, and it also forecasts the potential defense
26:21
Speaker 6: if you've got a stranger rape. Oftentimes you don't see
26:24
Speaker 6: somebody picking up someone at the bar and going back
26:26
Speaker 6: to the perpetrator's home, because then the victim will know
26:28
Speaker 6: who it is and where he lives. But if you
26:30
Speaker 6: need on a dating app, you're not hiding identity. The
26:33
Speaker 6: defense is going to be consented. So controlling the crime
26:36
Speaker 6: scene avoids interruptions like Amazon deliveries, relatives, stopping over all
26:41
Speaker 6: the types of things that you have no control over
26:43
Speaker 6: because you don't know the person well enough, hence the
26:46
Speaker 6: unconsens and that's one of the things that really distinguishes
26:49
Speaker 6: the case like this from hookups at a bar where
26:52
Speaker 6: there's no preconceived or pre existing relationship, even from a
26:56
Speaker 6: dating app.
26:57
Speaker 2: Now we've focused on the doctor, but what role, if any,
27:02
Speaker 2: does Hinge play in this? And just remember, so far
27:07
Speaker 2: only told you about two alleged to victims. Take a
27:11
Speaker 2: listen to our cut fifteen.
27:13
Speaker 10: If they had listened to the multitude of reports that
27:17
Speaker 10: they had received about this person and just banned him
27:20
Speaker 10: in the first place, I would not be sitting here
27:23
Speaker 10: today having this conversation.
27:25
Speaker 3: Doctor Matthews lawyer previously indicated his client as innocent. Hinge
27:29
Speaker 3: said in a statement what's been reported is horrible, and
27:32
Speaker 3: they said they would assist law enforcement in any way
27:35
Speaker 3: they can.
27:36
Speaker 1: Important to note here Hinge would.
27:38
Speaker 3: Not answer our repeated questions about how after this doctor
27:42
Speaker 3: was reportedly banned from their website, how he managed to
27:45
Speaker 3: maintain a Hinge dating profile for several years.
27:48
Speaker 1: I bet they aren't.
27:49
Speaker 2: I bet they are not saying a word, So Lean Neebecker,
27:52
Speaker 2: how did he stay on Hinge?
27:54
Speaker 5: Well, I think we've.
27:54
Speaker 4: Got to be a little bit fair here because the
27:58
Speaker 4: notion that any app like hints as total control over
28:03
Speaker 4: the users is a little unfair because it's very easy
28:06
Speaker 4: to create a new account, new credentials and log and
28:09
Speaker 4: what I don't know if him just doing or not.
28:12
Speaker 4: Are they tracking the photos because once a perpetrator is identified,
28:16
Speaker 4: they can take the digital hash values of those photos
28:20
Speaker 4: and identify any other user transmitting this And we don't
28:23
Speaker 4: know if they're doing that or not. If they are,
28:25
Speaker 4: they're doing the best they can do.
28:29
Speaker 2: Good point, very good point, Lee Nee Beecker. Okay, so
28:32
Speaker 2: let's just pretend for arguments say that Hins did everything right,
28:37
Speaker 2: which I'm not sure I believe that. But how is
28:41
Speaker 2: this guy still practicing? Take a listen to our friends
28:45
Speaker 2: at nine Knews.
28:46
Speaker 3: The woman says she decided to go forward with the
28:49
Speaker 3: criminal case after she learned that a family friend had
28:52
Speaker 3: gone on a date with doctor Matthew several years ago,
28:55
Speaker 3: and said she had a similar experience.
28:58
Speaker 11: Police say the first came forward. She accused of cardiologist
29:02
Speaker 11: Stephen Matthews of sexually assaulting her after meeting him on
29:06
Speaker 11: the dating app Hinge. On March twenty eighth, the Denver
29:09
Speaker 11: prosecutors charged him with three felony accounts of sexual assaults.
29:13
Speaker 11: One month later, Matthews was still able to renew his
29:17
Speaker 11: license to practice medicine.
29:19
Speaker 1: So what echo ink youdink.
29:22
Speaker 2: One eliged victim actually is in contact with a family
29:27
Speaker 2: friend who went through an almost identical alleged sex assault
29:34
Speaker 2: by this cardiologist. So the police go ahead and they
29:42
Speaker 2: charge him, but yet one month later he's still is
29:46
Speaker 2: able to renew his practice, his medical license to continue
29:52
Speaker 2: to practice.
29:54
Speaker 1: More from nine News.
29:56
Speaker 12: I'm shocked and dismayed as a person, as a FI
30:00
Speaker 12: physician and as a colleague who practices in cardiology.
30:03
Speaker 11: That I News medical expert doctor Pyle Coley thinks there
30:05
Speaker 11: needs to be more oversight. She knows how renewals work
30:09
Speaker 11: because she submitted her application last month.
30:11
Speaker 12: And it was a less than five minute process and
30:15
Speaker 12: it didn't require me to talk about my criminal convictions
30:18
Speaker 12: or mental health changes. It was just a blanket sort
30:20
Speaker 12: of a question, have there been any changes that you
30:23
Speaker 12: would like to report?
30:24
Speaker 11: Yes, that you would like to report. According to a
30:27
Speaker 11: notice by DORA the Department of Regulatory Agencies, it's up
30:31
Speaker 11: to the applicant to list any arrests or charges.
30:34
Speaker 12: Which physician would voluntarily give up information when they haven't
30:39
Speaker 12: yet been convicted, only been charged that may put their
30:41
Speaker 12: license at risk.
30:42
Speaker 2: Wow, so the whole process is basically anything you want
30:47
Speaker 2: to tell us, And of course he says no and
30:51
Speaker 2: continues to practice medicine, having one lady after the next
30:55
Speaker 2: undress up in front of him and more listen.
31:00
Speaker 1: Dora says.
31:00
Speaker 11: The medical Board renews a license unless it's under suspension
31:04
Speaker 11: or an applicant reports something bad about themselves. Two weeks
31:08
Speaker 11: after the board approved Matthew's application, the Denver District Attorney
31:12
Speaker 11: charged him again for assaulting nine more women.
31:15
Speaker 12: But it should really be some sort of a bigger
31:17
Speaker 12: systemic thing that if there is a criminal charge against you,
31:21
Speaker 12: that should be reported to DORA directly, you know. So
31:25
Speaker 12: it's a way to protect our patients.
31:26
Speaker 11: NDA claims Matthews drugged ten women and sexually assaulted three
31:30
Speaker 11: of them. Matthews agreed with the board to not practice
31:33
Speaker 11: right now after the additional charges.
31:36
Speaker 2: After the additional charges, prime stories with Nancy Grace, how
31:56
Speaker 2: many more women did he meet?
31:58
Speaker 1: I mean, doctor Bethany.
32:00
Speaker 2: Not only is social media completely failing these women. I'm
32:05
Speaker 2: talking about Hinge unless, as Neebacker says, they did everything
32:10
Speaker 2: possible to keep him off their site, which I doubt,
32:13
Speaker 2: but that's what they're saying. And now the medical board,
32:18
Speaker 2: who does no investigation at all. I mean to get
32:24
Speaker 2: a law license. They even will go and talk to
32:26
Speaker 2: neighbors to find out about you, Nancy.
32:30
Speaker 5: The Board of Behavioral Science Examiners here in California, which
32:33
Speaker 5: I have to be is a board that renews my
32:37
Speaker 5: license psychoanalyst, Marriage and Family Therapists LCSW clinical psychologists. You
32:45
Speaker 5: have to answer a questionnaire in which you're asked, have
32:48
Speaker 5: you ever been arrested? And then they investigate. The board
32:55
Speaker 5: is connected to the DMV, it's connected to I don't
32:59
Speaker 5: know what ever edge agency it is, or they would
33:01
Speaker 5: check to see if you get arrested. It's not a
33:04
Speaker 5: self reporting they mean you're required to self report, but
33:07
Speaker 5: then if you haven't arrested and you don't report it,
33:11
Speaker 5: then that's a whole other offense. Because you've perjured yourself
33:13
Speaker 5: and you likely will never get your license renewed again.
33:16
Speaker 5: And you know Nancy, and another aspect of this, so
33:19
Speaker 5: many people came in contact with this guy as a
33:22
Speaker 5: physician who maybe should have had some suspicion he knew
33:26
Speaker 5: how to drug these women so that they didn't remember
33:29
Speaker 5: what was happening. And I know there are you know,
33:31
Speaker 5: common date rate drugs, but I'm sure she had friends
33:34
Speaker 5: who were pharmacists, who were anesthesiologists, people who are experts
33:40
Speaker 5: in you know, administering profile fill and things like that,
33:43
Speaker 5: and so kind of wonder it's not just the licensing board,
33:47
Speaker 5: it's this broader network of professionals that should be holding
33:52
Speaker 5: each other to a higher standard. This is not just
33:55
Speaker 5: your neighbor, this is your guy. You're in the o.
33:57
Speaker 2: R with guys. Ultimately, do we ever find out how
34:03
Speaker 2: many alleged victims have been raped by this top Denver
34:08
Speaker 2: cardiologists Drug and rape allegedly take a listen to hour
34:13
Speaker 2: cut nine our forensic CAC and C.
34:15
Speaker 3: The new cases have been sealed, but court records show
34:18
Speaker 3: two of the new cases against Matthews involve alledged sexual assault.
34:22
Speaker 3: The other seven charge him with second degree assault for
34:25
Speaker 3: allegedly drugging women. Within hours, Denver police descended on Matthew's
34:30
Speaker 3: West Denver townhouse, executing a search warm and seizing evidence.
34:34
Speaker 13: Stephen Matthews in charge with sexual assault in March after
34:38
Speaker 13: a woman he met on Hinge said she was drugged
34:40
Speaker 13: and raped after a date with the Colorado cardiologists. Since then,
34:45
Speaker 13: nine other women have come forward claiming to be sexually
34:48
Speaker 13: assaulted by the thirty five year old In a similar manner.
34:51
Speaker 13: According to court filings, Matthews would meet women on Hinge,
34:55
Speaker 13: take them on a date, later inviting them back to
34:57
Speaker 13: his place to play djanga and get in the hot tup.
35:01
Speaker 13: Matthews would then serve the women alcohol and they'd become
35:04
Speaker 13: violently ill, black out, and have no memory of what happened.
35:08
Speaker 2: Okay, Christopher Gavin joining us from the Messenger, how many
35:12
Speaker 2: victims do we know about right now?
35:15
Speaker 9: Cerly, we know about ten women who have come forward
35:18
Speaker 9: to accuse doctor Matthews.
35:20
Speaker 2: Ten women that have come forward accusing him, and of
35:25
Speaker 2: course guys. He is claiming that he is not guilty,
35:30
Speaker 2: but this really brings back memories another well known person
35:39
Speaker 2: charged with a similar crime.
35:41
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our cut thirty.
35:43
Speaker 14: Bill Cosby called me out of the blue and he said,
35:47
Speaker 14: can you come by and see me? And I was like,
35:50
Speaker 14: of course, and I went up to his hotel and
35:53
Speaker 14: I was alone. He talked about, let me see what
35:56
Speaker 14: type of acting skills you have. I want you to
35:58
Speaker 14: improv as I tried to do improv. He fixed a
36:02
Speaker 14: drink and then he brought it to me. It was
36:04
Speaker 14: a brown liquid and it looked like a shot. I
36:07
Speaker 14: told him I didn't drink. He said that this was
36:09
Speaker 14: going to relax me so that the lines would flow
36:12
Speaker 14: out a lot easier. So I did drink it. He
36:15
Speaker 14: made a second drink and had me drink the second
36:18
Speaker 14: drink as well. I noticed myself getting a little dizzy.
36:22
Speaker 2: And more, guys, you were just listening to our friends
36:25
Speaker 2: at doctor Field Take to listen to ABC.
36:27
Speaker 15: Cosby was convicted of drugging and sexually assaulting Andrea.
36:30
Speaker 1: Constant at his home.
36:32
Speaker 15: The court will now also revisit the judge's decision to
36:36
Speaker 15: allow five other women to testify about Cosby giving them drugs.
36:41
Speaker 16: This is something that we've been clamoring about for quite
36:45
Speaker 16: some time, and finally the Pennsylvania Supreme Court has agreed
36:49
Speaker 16: that it's worth looking at more closely.
36:53
Speaker 15: Constant did release a statement of her own today, saying,
36:56
Speaker 15: in part quote, I have no doubt that the Supreme
36:59
Speaker 15: Court of PA will do the right thing and allow
37:01
Speaker 15: Cosby's wealth, fame and fortune to win an escape from
37:06
Speaker 15: his maleficent, malignant, and downright criminal past and seek justice
37:11
Speaker 15: at all costs. So now we wait for the Supreme
37:14
Speaker 15: Court's review and what might come next and.
37:17
Speaker 2: What became of the case after Cosby was convicted. He's
37:21
Speaker 2: out walking free and he is planning to tour. He's
37:28
Speaker 2: actually planning to tour as a stand up comedian.
37:34
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what's happening, you know.
37:37
Speaker 2: To doctor Bethany Marshall joining us, Doctor Bethany, what is
37:42
Speaker 2: the psychopathy behind someone that enjoys raping a lady while
37:49
Speaker 2: she is completely unconscious, drunk or drugged.
37:53
Speaker 5: One of the things we know about perversions is that
37:57
Speaker 5: when you have a perversion, you are actually excited by
38:02
Speaker 5: anything other than the other person's personality. You might be
38:06
Speaker 5: as stimulated by let's say, only pictures, or being stomped
38:13
Speaker 5: on by high heels, or being whipped, or maybe by children,
38:18
Speaker 5: stimulated sexually by children, or rubbing up against unsuspecting people
38:23
Speaker 5: in public fraudterism, exhibitionism, voyeurism. But boy, you do not
38:28
Speaker 5: want to relate to another person in terms of who
38:31
Speaker 5: they are, with thoughts and feelings and emotions of their own.
38:34
Speaker 5: And that's one of the ways we diagnose perversions in
38:38
Speaker 5: clinical practice is the person is excited by an aspect
38:44
Speaker 5: of sexuality, but not by the person. They want that
38:47
Speaker 5: person to be dead, gone, an object when you.
38:52
Speaker 2: Know, not a real person, Doctor Bethany, before I went
38:55
Speaker 2: out of tune, I want to fall up on something,
38:56
Speaker 2: you said, Christopher Gavin with the Messenger. One accuser says,
39:01
Speaker 2: at least one that we know of, says Matthew sent
39:04
Speaker 2: her photos of her naked in the hot tub after
39:06
Speaker 2: she refused to see him again. Another says she woke
39:10
Speaker 2: up with bite marks on her arms. What can you
39:13
Speaker 2: tell us about allegations of revenge porn?
39:16
Speaker 9: Those are some things that came up in the affidavit.
39:21
Speaker 9: That's kind of all we know right now in terms
39:24
Speaker 9: of how those photos might have been distributed. That doctor
39:27
Speaker 9: Matthews allegedly send them back to the woman, we don't
39:30
Speaker 9: know if they had appeared anywhere else, which I think
39:34
Speaker 9: bench porn would imply. But that's all we know right now.
39:38
Speaker 2: So what do you think about that, doctor Bethany, alleged
39:41
Speaker 2: photos and videos taken of the victims.
39:44
Speaker 5: Well, I mean, I think in that case, whatever he
39:47
Speaker 5: can do while they're unconscious and it's outside of their
39:51
Speaker 5: awareness is going to steal him. I think the minute
39:54
Speaker 5: they start to wake up and become conscious, he probably
39:58
Speaker 5: loses interest in them, other than if he can use
40:01
Speaker 5: the revenge porn to lure them back in, render them unconscious,
40:06
Speaker 5: and then do whatever he wants to do with them again.
40:08
Speaker 5: And Nancy, you know, I'm scared to think about what
40:11
Speaker 5: he did do to them when they're out. I mean,
40:14
Speaker 5: we know about the bitemarks, we know about all of
40:19
Speaker 5: the other things that the reporter just now mentioned, what else,
40:23
Speaker 5: you know, bringing out their purpose stuff?
40:25
Speaker 6: And I think that's a great point because one of
40:27
Speaker 6: the ways we can answer that is to what else happened?
40:30
Speaker 6: Is when you have a classic case.
40:32
Speaker 9: You know, I.
40:32
Speaker 6: Normally say patterns make the predator, but after listening to
40:34
Speaker 6: doctor Bethany, I'd say patterns make the perversion. But if
40:38
Speaker 6: that pattern includes filming when the search warrant was served,
40:41
Speaker 6: they may turn up some of the evidence about what
40:43
Speaker 6: else happened, what happened to each of them, what are
40:46
Speaker 6: the similarities. You know, there's safety in numbers. We've had
40:49
Speaker 6: a number of women that have come forward, but for
40:51
Speaker 6: other victims that are out there, you know, silence is
40:54
Speaker 6: not golden, and this may encourage them to find their voice.
40:57
Speaker 6: Maybe there'll be more allegations in the future once they
41:00
Speaker 6: find some of this footage.
41:01
Speaker 2: Lee Newbecker, is it possible that any evidence is going
41:06
Speaker 2: to be discovered through digital seizure?
41:09
Speaker 4: Well, certainly if police seizes his cell phone in his computer,
41:13
Speaker 4: it's highly likely that he has images of victims on
41:16
Speaker 4: the computer and they may be able to identify other
41:18
Speaker 4: people that were perpetrated and trace those leads. Same thing
41:22
Speaker 4: with Hinge. Hinch may have a history of all the
41:24
Speaker 4: people he communicated with, and they may have that data.
41:27
Speaker 4: So we don't know exactly what police have or have
41:30
Speaker 4: not done, but I would fully expect it with the
41:33
Speaker 4: rest they would want his computer in his phone so
41:37
Speaker 4: that they could identify other victims.
41:40
Speaker 2: If you have information regarding the case, Doctor Steven Matthews,
41:46
Speaker 2: top Denver cardiologist, please call seven to zero nine one
41:51
Speaker 2: three two thousand, repeat seven to zero, nine, one, three,
41:57
Speaker 2: two thousand.
41:59
Speaker 1: Goodbye, friend, you