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469 When Harry Met Sally Part 3 - SEASON OF ROB REINER · The Cine-Files

0:07
[SPEAKER_13]: Hey, Steve, before we jump into Win Harry Met Sally, I'm gonna talk to you about a new film that is coming out from A24.
0:14
[SPEAKER_13]: It is called The Drama.
0:17
[SPEAKER_13]: And it stars in day out, Robert Pattinson, a lot of Hayme, Maba, do Athi, some really good actors.
0:22
[SPEAKER_13]: And it's focused on a happily engaged couple who has put to the test when an unexpected turn sends their wedding week off the rails.
0:30
[SPEAKER_13]: We both got a chance to see this trailer earlier this week.
0:32
[SPEAKER_13]: What do you thoughts on the trailer?
0:34
[SPEAKER_13]: What do you thoughts on the movie here?
0:35
[SPEAKER_03]: So I started off.
0:36
[SPEAKER_03]: I literally knew nothing about it.
0:38
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't even know that line of description that you gave.
0:40
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm watching.
0:40
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, oh, here's some actors.
0:42
[SPEAKER_03]: I like Sunday, Robert Pattinson, interesting relationship is dressing set up.
0:46
[SPEAKER_03]: And then it gets to a point.
0:47
[SPEAKER_03]: And this is what makes a really good trailer where a question is asked.
0:51
[SPEAKER_03]: We do not hear the answer, but the shock waves that go through this group with that answer are huge.
0:58
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was immediately hooked.
1:00
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, it is a fascinating trailer because, first of all, you got to end up in Robinson, who are both leading massive, you know, superhero franchises with Batman, Spider-Man, and stuff, but then seeing their connections with each other and the way they're bouncing off back before thing, and it laws you into the sense of like, oh, is this going to be like an A24?
1:19
[SPEAKER_13]: romantic comedy and then there's that twist and everything changes in such an extreme way in that trailer and it just kind of, and I sense from the film that it's going to explore what relationship or like when you find out a secret about your partner does that affect everything or does the love you have for your partner overcome that secret but it gets real twisty and weird by the end of the trailer which is exciting what do you think the twist might be?
1:49
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, it's funny.
1:49
[SPEAKER_03]: It's it's interesting that we're right in the middle of when Harry Matt Sally, which is asking this question about can women be friends or men and women be friends or does the sex part get in the way?
1:57
[SPEAKER_03]: If this also seems to be asking a question of if you have characters that genuinely love each other, how terrible of a secret would there have to be to ruin that?
2:07
[SPEAKER_03]: And so to answer your question, I don't know.
2:10
[SPEAKER_03]: But I have been around a few secrets.
2:13
[SPEAKER_03]: We were at a party once, or somebody revealed something, and it was unbelievably serious, and I didn't find out for three years what it had been revealed.
2:24
[SPEAKER_03]: I think this secret is at this level.
2:27
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if it's a crime.
2:28
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if it's something sexual, but I do know that it's something really, really bad.
2:35
[SPEAKER_03]: And I can't wait to watch the show to find out.
2:37
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, I think it has to do, I mean, she pulls that knife at the end of the trailer.
2:41
[SPEAKER_13]: So to me, I go to that place, but it's got to be something even more kind of out there for the reactions that were so strong and how it's affecting both of the relationships that we see in the trailer.
2:53
[SPEAKER_13]: So listen, you guys got to see the trailer for the drama.
2:55
[SPEAKER_13]: It's out now on YouTube, from A24.
2:59
[SPEAKER_13]: Let us know what you think about it.
3:00
[SPEAKER_13]: And the film comes out on April 3rd as well.
3:03
[SPEAKER_13]: So
3:03
[SPEAKER_13]: on your calendars.
3:04
[SPEAKER_10]: But go watch the trailer now and let us know what you think about it, especially as we're talking about relationships and when Harry Metsyan, let's get to it.
3:30
[SPEAKER_03]: Hello and welcome once again to the cinephiles where this week we are concluding our exploration of the Rob Reiner, Rob Com, Classic, when Harry Met Sally.
3:39
[SPEAKER_03]: My name is Steve Morris.
3:40
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm a filmmaker and directing instructor in Los Angeles, California.
3:43
[SPEAKER_13]: Hello everyone.
3:44
[SPEAKER_13]: My name is John.
3:44
[SPEAKER_13]: I'm a writer, producer, host, voice of artists here in St. Diego, California.
3:48
[SPEAKER_13]: And you just caught Steven I right after we've just argued about this stupid, Roy Rogers, wagon wheel coffee table.
3:58
[SPEAKER_03]: that is that is it fact this thing we are about to walk into but right before we do that we should thank our supporters on patreon.com slash the cinephiles as well as apple podcasts who are right now listening to this episode ad free they also get to listen to our cinephiles short we just had one on star fleet academy and this night of the seven kingdoms that's on patreon and apple podcast for subscription right now
4:22
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4:29
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4:36
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4:45
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4:54
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4:56
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5:00
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5:04
[SPEAKER_03]: There's some pretty exciting stuff.
5:05
[SPEAKER_03]: In fact, I just got a package in the mail that relates to one of those things very exciting.
5:10
[SPEAKER_03]: As John mentioned, we were about to see a beautiful wagon wheel coffee table and this is what's so great is this is what's this is what great screenwriting looks like which is that we just had this scene in the sharper image where Harry saw Helen and Sopp.
5:25
[SPEAKER_03]: Ira, I have the first time and we have this moment outside where we absolutely know Harry is in a bad place and emotionally I think we're with him
5:40
[SPEAKER_09]: I like it.
5:41
[SPEAKER_09]: It works.
5:42
[SPEAKER_09]: It says home to me.
5:44
[SPEAKER_09]: All right.
5:44
[SPEAKER_09]: All right.
5:44
[SPEAKER_09]: Well, let Harry and Sally do the judge.
5:46
[SPEAKER_03]: So first of all, I don't actually think this is a cool move to bring to other people into your couple conflict, not great.
5:54
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't condone this at all.
5:55
[SPEAKER_13]: It's nice.
5:56
[SPEAKER_13]: Case closed.
5:57
[SPEAKER_03]: And we can, I think you can palpably see the rage and upset coming off of Billy Crestore.
6:03
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, he's not even paying attention to the question.
6:05
[SPEAKER_03]: Just wants to gaze lost in his own world.
6:08
[SPEAKER_11]: of course he likes that he's a guy.
6:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Turns to Sally back where I hence little head shaken and no is fantastic.
6:17
[SPEAKER_03]: Obviously, what this scene is about is where Harry is emotionally and what's going to happen with him.
6:23
[SPEAKER_03]: But I just, I feel so bad for Bruno Kirby.
6:26
[SPEAKER_03]: I just, just loves this wagon wheel and everybody's gonna gang up on him.
6:30
[SPEAKER_13]: Well, sometimes you gotta let go of those things that are, it's like the beer side, right?
6:35
[SPEAKER_13]: I mean, I'm sure there are plenty of people listening to us right now, Steve, who would tell you stories.
6:39
[SPEAKER_13]: I mean, the straight women who would tell you stories about.
6:42
[SPEAKER_13]: The, the, the, the, actually, sorry.
6:43
[SPEAKER_13]: No, oh, I mean, right?
6:44
[SPEAKER_03]: Cause it's, it's, it's, it's, it's a reality can tell you that it's time to move on from the pier sign.
6:49
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, but mostly, yeah, because it's usually the guys that have to let go of their man stuff in order to, but of course, there are man caves now.
6:57
[SPEAKER_13]: So if you're wealthy enough, you can build out a room, but, you know, most of the time, you're specifically told that you've got to move your stuff out of a certain area.
7:05
[SPEAKER_13]: So because your taste isn't quite,
7:10
[SPEAKER_13]: I went to before many times.
7:12
[SPEAKER_03]: It never occurred to me until this moment that when she says, yes, you can if we had an extra room Yeah, but the wagon wheels and the barstools that would have been a man cave.
7:22
[SPEAKER_03]: A hundred percent would have been a man cave.
7:23
[SPEAKER_03]: That is what it is.
7:25
[SPEAKER_13]: Yes.
7:25
[SPEAKER_13]: Yes.
7:26
[SPEAKER_03]: What's so awesome?
7:27
[SPEAKER_13]: My office is a man cave.
7:28
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
7:29
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, this is, I mean, I mean, honestly, I, you know, I'm no longer with it.
7:33
[SPEAKER_03]: So the whole house is really a man cave.
7:36
[SPEAKER_03]: My son is the only other person who lives here.
7:38
[SPEAKER_03]: So he gets pretty, but man, one of the main reasons that I kept the house is because of this office I'm sitting right now.
7:45
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
7:45
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that makes sense.
7:47
[SPEAKER_03]: What's so awful about it?
7:49
[SPEAKER_11]: It's so awful.
7:50
[SPEAKER_11]: There's no way to even begin to explain what's so awful about it.
7:53
[SPEAKER_13]: What's great too is that she is being considered to him.
7:56
[SPEAKER_13]: Like she's she is making it clear to him what the situation is.
8:00
[SPEAKER_13]: But she's not like trying to insult him.
8:02
[SPEAKER_13]: She's just saying like look, this stuff is going to work in the main area.
8:05
[SPEAKER_13]: I'm trying to soft shoe you into understanding what's happening here.
8:09
[SPEAKER_13]: And so it's police.
8:10
[SPEAKER_13]: She's being considered as possible.
8:12
[SPEAKER_13]: Even though I don't think there's been any scene Steve throughout the whole movie where I thought Marie had any sense of fashion.
8:18
[SPEAKER_13]: or style, you know, that's how they're ironic.
8:22
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
8:22
[SPEAKER_03]: So first of all, I don't think she's being as considerate as possible.
8:25
[SPEAKER_03]: You don't say that's so well, if you say it's awful, it's so awful.
8:29
[SPEAKER_03]: There's no way to begin to say what's so awful about it about something that somebody loves, you are not being as considerate as possible.
8:37
[SPEAKER_03]: She's not yelling anymore about it, I guess.
8:39
[SPEAKER_03]: No, yes, what she is being is extremely politely and nicely condescending is what she is being.
8:46
[SPEAKER_03]: I have taste and you don't.
8:48
[SPEAKER_03]: Now, I probably don't love this wagon wheel either, but I'll beat everybody like.
8:53
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'll sort of weird shit that I don't like.
8:55
[SPEAKER_03]: That's not your life.
8:57
[SPEAKER_03]: And of course, what's really going on again is Harry Stern out the window.
9:01
[SPEAKER_03]: He's not participating.
9:02
[SPEAKER_03]: And Jess is defending himself and he says, I have good taste.
9:06
[SPEAKER_03]: And this line is an exact Nora from line.
9:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Everybody thinks they have good taste in a sense of humor, but they
9:16
[SPEAKER_03]: It's true.
9:17
[SPEAKER_03]: I agree with you.
9:20
[SPEAKER_03]: No.
9:20
[SPEAKER_03]: No.
9:20
[SPEAKER_03]: When Nora lays down some, this to me is exactly like all women say they've faked him at one time or another, so you'd be the judge.
9:29
[SPEAKER_03]: It's using the exact same logic of percentage and math, everybody can't have a good sense of humor.
9:36
[SPEAKER_03]: That's not possible.
9:37
[SPEAKER_03]: And then here it goes off.
9:39
[SPEAKER_10]: We started out like this, I went and I, we had blank walls, we hung things, we picked out tiles together.
9:45
[SPEAKER_10]: then you know what happens?
9:46
[SPEAKER_10]: Six years later, you find yourself singing sorry with a fringe on top, and for an Avaira.
9:50
[SPEAKER_13]: I love that line.
9:52
[SPEAKER_13]: Again, court that line all the time.
9:53
[SPEAKER_13]: Just all the time.
9:55
[SPEAKER_13]: So over the French on top, in front of Ira, there's just like great exposure.
9:58
[SPEAKER_13]: Because you know what, we haven't seen Harry Break.
10:01
[SPEAKER_13]: Now, whole movie.
10:03
[SPEAKER_13]: This is the first time we've seen Harry Rattles.
10:05
[SPEAKER_13]: We've seen Harry on Compton.
10:06
[SPEAKER_13]: We've seen Harry, awkward.
10:07
[SPEAKER_13]: We've seen Harry Apologize.
10:09
[SPEAKER_13]: We've seen Harry, you know, have sense of humor, laugh, joke, have his points of views, but we've never seen him get rattled.
10:14
[SPEAKER_13]: And clearly, Helen Rattles him on so many levels.
10:19
[SPEAKER_13]: Because the way he spins around,
10:22
[SPEAKER_13]: and then it and just start in on it, right?
10:24
[SPEAKER_13]: That in Sally tries to stop him.
10:27
[SPEAKER_13]: And she says, you know, do you think our friends need to hear this right now?
10:30
[SPEAKER_13]: And he goes, yes, I think our friends need to exactly right now.
10:33
[SPEAKER_13]: And she spins around out of frame again.
10:35
[SPEAKER_13]: She walks off for him, which I think is great.
10:36
[SPEAKER_13]: But he is so determined to get this point across to these guys, because he is working out his anger at the embarrassment he feels and the shaming feels over how Helen is essentially just castrated him in front of Sally, and publicly out in front of a store.
10:53
[SPEAKER_03]: I think, you know, we talked at the beginning about these parallels in their relationships, you know, where they're each with another person, then they're with another person, again, in a serious way.
11:03
[SPEAKER_03]: They both have their breakups around the same time.
11:05
[SPEAKER_03]: They both are dealing with it in the way they're dealing with.
11:07
[SPEAKER_03]: To me, this is the next parallel, which is that this,
11:10
[SPEAKER_03]: is Harry's breakdown.
11:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And if you've seen from now, we're going to hear Sally's breakdown, which she finds out Joe's getting married.
11:18
[SPEAKER_03]: Both of them have to do with the actual unresolved feelings over the relationship that is ended.
11:23
[SPEAKER_03]: And they both have to go through those feelings in order to be able to eventually get to where they can have a healthy relationship on the other side.
11:37
[SPEAKER_13]: Terrible things in relationships is when you don't get closure, and you desperately need closure.
11:45
[SPEAKER_13]: And it can be tough, and I don't think everyone's built this way.
11:48
[SPEAKER_13]: I think some people are quite fine hopping from one relationship to the next.
11:52
[SPEAKER_13]: It's really a marvel.
11:54
[SPEAKER_13]: I, as I got older, I realized that I was never built that way that I always saw closure.
11:59
[SPEAKER_13]: It's not trying to find out who's right or wrong.
12:01
[SPEAKER_13]: It's more a matter of, obviously, you were right.
12:03
[SPEAKER_13]: I mean, but I think that's the thing.
12:05
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, I stupidly did think I was right for a number of those breakups, but it's more a matter of like, well, what is,
12:12
[SPEAKER_13]: what, how can we find that middle ground?
12:15
[SPEAKER_13]: And the truth is, you have to grow as a person to understand how to get that closure too, because I think that's also a mistake people make thing, I want closure, I want closure, but the closure they want is to satisfy themselves, you're not actual closure.
12:28
[SPEAKER_13]: And once you understand what actual closure really is, that's something you're gonna aspire to achieve.
12:32
[SPEAKER_13]: However,
12:33
[SPEAKER_13]: It doesn't mean the other person is going to be able to give it to you or be in the space to give it to you or want to give it to you and I think that's one of the toughest things about relationships is when you want that closure, but that person doesn't want to give it to you and certainly I don't think Helen would ever give Harry closure or any closure that Harry would feel satisfied, honestly.
12:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Honestly, dude, I am not the biggest believer in closure.
12:56
[SPEAKER_03]: Not that I think that I'm literally not surprised by that but go ahead Yeah, I just don't it and what I mean is that
13:08
[SPEAKER_03]: There is a fantasy that lives in our heads about what I will need to move on, and that it's almost never going to happen.
13:15
[SPEAKER_03]: You might be able to have a conversation, and it could be better.
13:19
[SPEAKER_03]: You know what I mean?
13:20
[SPEAKER_03]: But you might not, and what I actually really think is that the only thing you do with is yourself.
13:26
[SPEAKER_03]: It's those things inside yourself that have not closed that you need to find out how to get to.
13:31
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like, yeah, maybe you could have a maybe Harry could have a conversation with Helen.
13:34
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think he's going to get that much out of that.
13:37
[SPEAKER_03]: I think in a lot of ways it might enrage him more.
13:39
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like, well, to me, it's accepting the fact that there isn't closure is the secret to finding closure.
13:45
[SPEAKER_13]: You and I, you and I, from two different points of view is completely on this.
13:49
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, because I've achieved closure with a number of ex-girlfriends over the last 10 years, not 20 years, and achieved closure with my dad before he passed on.
13:57
[SPEAKER_13]: So that's great.
13:58
[SPEAKER_13]: But I think that's, it's just a different approach, right?
14:00
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think there are some people who, who can achieve it and seek to achieve it, and some, and, and other people who don't think it's that important have to work from the inside out for themselves.
14:10
[SPEAKER_13]: And I agree with you, because that's a self-sustaining model.
14:12
[SPEAKER_13]: If you could achieve closure within yourself, then you won't need to get closure with the other person and move on.
14:18
[SPEAKER_13]: And some people have built their way and envy those people.
14:20
[SPEAKER_13]: I am not one of those people.
14:22
[SPEAKER_13]: I definitely need to have that conversation.
14:24
[SPEAKER_13]: But again, it has to be the other person wanting to also have that conversation.
14:28
[SPEAKER_13]: Because I do think people sometimes try to force closure and that's never effective.
14:34
[SPEAKER_03]: I agree, and I think that what we see, and this is why this movie just got so much better in this last watching, even though I had dored it already, because of watching it as a study of two characters who had to grow, as much as it's a study of a romantic comedy of two people falling in love.
14:51
[SPEAKER_03]: What you did, the other interesting thing that happens is that Sally, what Sally says next, I think is exactly what your spouse says, you know, like this is a relationship thing to say.
15:02
[SPEAKER_03]: She says, do we have to talk about this right now, right?
15:06
[SPEAKER_12]: Yeah.
15:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, because she's trying to protect Harry and trying to protect Jess and Marie who don't know what they're about to be into.
15:14
[SPEAKER_10]: Yes, I think that right now actually is the perfect time to talk about this because I want our friends to benefit from the wisdom of my experience And that what he does is he rains on their parade.
15:23
[SPEAKER_10]: Yeah, completely Right now everything is great everyone is happy everyone is in love and that's wonderful But you gotta know that sooner or later you're gonna be screaming at each other But who's gonna get this dish?
15:34
[SPEAKER_10]: This eight dollar dish will cost you a thousand dollars in phone calls So the legal promo that's mine that's your choice
15:39
[SPEAKER_13]: This is a great moment of, of, of, of, of Harry just going and by the way, this is the dark side of Harry just so clearly like we've enjoyed and it's been fun to watch Harry talk about reading the last page of the novel or how many women can't be friends or have these kind of funny darker approaches to the world.
15:58
[SPEAKER_13]: But this is where the darkness can get, you know, go into a bad place that he is telling them that you need to plan ahead for your divorce.
16:06
[SPEAKER_13]: Don't even, he's trying to be so practical that he's removing love out of it completely and be like, you need to be aware of this and that, that this and that is removing the joy and spontaneity and organic nature of love and replacing it with this more pragmatic, practical approach.
16:22
[SPEAKER_13]: which is Harry's bitterness and anger and frustration over what happened with him in Helen, which as you said earlier, Steve, he is clearly still not over even with all this, all the time he has spent with Sally, because he's just ran into her and embarrassed himself in his mother.
16:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah.
16:39
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, and what is he doing?
16:40
[SPEAKER_03]: What did he just do?
16:41
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, you said that he wants to look at the last page of the novel.
16:45
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, what did he just do?
16:46
[SPEAKER_03]: You're happy right now, right?
16:48
[SPEAKER_03]: But at some point, you're going to be getting divorced.
16:50
[SPEAKER_03]: The novel ends.
16:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
16:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
16:53
[SPEAKER_03]: And what does this say?
16:54
[SPEAKER_03]: This says that Harry, at this moment, does not believe love is possible.
16:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Because he knows the only place it can end is in sadness.
17:02
[SPEAKER_10]: Because someday, believe it or not, you'll go 15 rounds of a who's going to get this coffee table.
17:08
[SPEAKER_10]: The stupid wagon wheel, Roy Rogers, Geraisel, coffee table.
17:13
[SPEAKER_10]: I thought you liked it.
17:15
[SPEAKER_10]: I was being nice!
17:18
[SPEAKER_13]: That was an amazing quote.
17:20
[UNKNOWN]: Amazing.
17:21
[SPEAKER_13]: I was being nice, but it's so perfect.
17:23
[SPEAKER_13]: It's so perfect Steve.
17:25
[SPEAKER_13]: It's just such a perfect move.
17:26
[SPEAKER_13]: But again, you're so right to point that out.
17:28
[SPEAKER_13]: He's looking at the last page of the novel.
17:30
[SPEAKER_12]: Yes.
17:30
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, Andy's wrong.
17:32
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, because that all novels end unhappy.
17:34
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, some people actually have relationships that last.
17:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
17:38
[SPEAKER_03]: And I love too as we sit there just in the wake of his anger that Sally just very calmly says.
17:45
[SPEAKER_01]: He just bumped into Helen.
17:47
[SPEAKER_03]: It's great.
17:48
[SPEAKER_03]: Really great.
17:49
[SPEAKER_11]: Then after Sally's gone, Marie turns to Jess and says,
18:04
[SPEAKER_03]: a great button.
18:05
[SPEAKER_03]: It's great.
18:06
[SPEAKER_03]: And this is, you know what this is, this, you know, I never thought about it quite in this way, but you know part of why we love Rob Reiner is because Rob Reiner came up and television sitcoms.
18:17
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
18:17
[SPEAKER_03]: This is the, this is a television sitcom.
18:20
[SPEAKER_03]: There's the button on the scene.
18:21
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, great point.
18:22
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think Rob Reiner is, is Harry in this scene.
18:25
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, 100, right.
18:26
[SPEAKER_13]: Oh, right.
18:26
[SPEAKER_13]: I would deliver the lie like that.
18:28
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
18:29
[SPEAKER_03]: 100%.
18:29
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, this is him always anticipating disaster and being, but, but I just want to,
18:33
[SPEAKER_03]: focus this on a second longer while princess bride there always those little buttons there's always those little jokes there's always those little thing even in misery is funny you know in its way like it's that sort of I think maybe that's part of what makes it so comforting his films is that they remind us of our friends on television you know yeah yeah yeah that's a great point we're outside I know I know I shouldn't have done
18:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Harry, you're gonna have to try and find a way of not expressing every feeling that you have every moment that you have them.
19:05
[SPEAKER_03]: Which is that's totally Nora.
19:06
[SPEAKER_03]: It's so funny how this is a conversation between Nora and Rob.
19:10
[SPEAKER_09]: Really?
19:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
19:12
[SPEAKER_01]: There are times and places for things.
19:15
[SPEAKER_10]: Well, the next time you're giving a lecture series on social graces, would you let me know because I'll sign up.
19:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Sally may be a decade ago, maybe wouldn't have responded in this way, but this Sally is so much clearer on herself.
19:29
[SPEAKER_01]: You don't have to take your anger out on me.
19:31
[SPEAKER_10]: Oh, I think I'm entitled to throw a little anger away, especially when I'm being told I'd live my life by Ms. Hospital Corners.
19:38
[SPEAKER_03]: The thing I realize is they both break up with their significant others.
19:44
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah.
19:44
[SPEAKER_03]: Harry really is dealing with unexpressed anger.
19:49
[SPEAKER_03]: That's really what's going on with Harry.
19:51
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, it's the worst.
19:52
[SPEAKER_03]: He hasn't been yelling.
19:54
[SPEAKER_03]: He hasn't been acting angrily mostly, but it all explodes out in the wagon wheel scene.
20:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And I also think Sally's diagnosis of that anger is fueling him sleeping with all sorts of women is 100% true.
20:09
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think so.
20:10
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think Sally is really, really sad and hasn't dealt with her sadness.
20:16
[SPEAKER_03]: So Harry needs to get that anger out of him and Sally needs to get through the sadness that she's not dealing with.
20:22
[SPEAKER_13]: They're both right in assessing each other in this moment.
20:26
[SPEAKER_13]: It's inappropriate to do it in this a heated situation because the message gets lost.
20:32
[SPEAKER_13]: but they're absolutely right in what they're saying to each other in this moment because because he's right Sally pretends like nothing's bothering her and that she's totally fine but she's she's sitting on it and her is as you just said Steve he's unleashing it all over the all over the place and now it's blown up here at his best friend and his best friends soon to be wife
20:53
[SPEAKER_13]: Yep.
20:54
[SPEAKER_13]: And credit to those two for not exploding back at Harry.
20:57
[SPEAKER_13]: Yep, they take the abuse and just kind of sit there and have the nice button at the end.
21:01
[SPEAKER_13]: But yeah, I mean, but this is coming between him and Sally.
21:04
[SPEAKER_13]: This has been coming.
21:05
[SPEAKER_01]: What's that supposed to mean?
21:06
[SPEAKER_10]: I mean, nothing bothers you.
21:09
[SPEAKER_10]: You never get upset about anything.
21:11
[SPEAKER_10]: Don't be ridiculous.
21:12
[SPEAKER_10]: You never get upset about Joe.
21:14
[SPEAKER_10]: I never see that backup on you.
21:15
[SPEAKER_10]: How is that possible?
21:17
[SPEAKER_10]: Don't you experience any feelings of laws?
21:19
[SPEAKER_03]: There are moments where the truth in a friendship
21:23
[SPEAKER_03]: you know, and sometimes those moments can be really destructive and really painful, and sometimes those moments are just what the friendship needs, you know, right?
21:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
21:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Agreed.
21:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
21:34
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, and it occurs to me, they haven't been friends that long.
21:37
[SPEAKER_03]: Like we're like, you know, heading towards a year into the friendship, I think.
21:40
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
21:40
[SPEAKER_03]: Is that they probably haven't had fights yet?
21:43
[SPEAKER_03]: No, not like this.
21:46
[SPEAKER_10]: If you're so old the Joe, why aren't you seeing anyone?
21:49
[SPEAKER_00]: I see people.
21:50
[SPEAKER_10]: See people.
21:51
[SPEAKER_10]: I've just slept with one person since you broke up with Joe.
21:54
[SPEAKER_03]: Has she slept with anyone since break up?
21:57
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think so either.
21:57
[SPEAKER_03]: Hell no.
21:58
[SPEAKER_01]: That will prove I'm over Joe because I fuck somebody.
22:01
[SPEAKER_03]: I think giving the word fuck to Sally in this contest.
22:05
[SPEAKER_03]: There're not a lot of fucks in this.
22:06
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't give a lot of fucks in here and giving it to her at this moment is great.
22:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Harry, you're going to have to move back to New Jersey because you slept with everybody in New York and I don't see that turning hell into a fake memory for you.
22:17
[SPEAKER_13]: That is a rough line, but I think it's, again, as you just said earlier and we've been saying both of us throughout the these episodes is that Sally is coming into our power as she gets older.
22:28
[SPEAKER_13]: Sally five years ago would not have said this to Harry about, you know, fucked everyone in Jersey, like that's a big defiant stance.
22:36
[SPEAKER_13]: That is a pushback on Harry because Harry at times has steam rolled her in the past and their interactions.
22:42
[SPEAKER_13]: But this is a moment where she is like standing her grud and pushing back on her and calling him out and trying to, and essentially telling him, your point of view is not me, trying to stop trying to make me you.
22:53
[SPEAKER_13]: I don't see the way the world you do, you know, because Harry is a cynic.
22:57
[SPEAKER_13]: And Sally is a romantic.
23:00
[SPEAKER_13]: She's a hopeful person and so he thinks that if she thinks around with people she's somehow gonna get over it And he calls him out and she calls him out and said you best like everybody you're not fucking over it And I and it's great because it stops him.
23:13
[SPEAKER_13]: It stops him when she pushes back on he doesn't go forward with the argument He realizes that she's right
23:20
[SPEAKER_03]: And then she comes even stronger.
23:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Besides, I will make love to somebody when it is making love.
23:26
[SPEAKER_01]: Not the way you do it like you're out for revenge or something.
23:29
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a great analysis.
23:31
[SPEAKER_03]: Great.
23:32
[SPEAKER_03]: It's brutal.
23:33
[SPEAKER_03]: It's honest.
23:34
[SPEAKER_03]: And this is the next moment to me is so amazing because these words are almost friendship ending.
23:41
[SPEAKER_03]: They're so strong at this moment.
23:44
[SPEAKER_03]: And there's this pause.
23:45
[SPEAKER_03]: And this is the essence of a real friendship.
23:48
[SPEAKER_10]: Are you finished now?
23:49
[SPEAKER_03]: She says after a moment.
23:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
23:53
[SPEAKER_03]: Can I say something?
23:55
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
23:57
[SPEAKER_03]: And then instantly.
23:59
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm sorry.
24:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And they are good.
24:01
[SPEAKER_03]: That's great.
24:02
[SPEAKER_03]: It really, it's getting me teary-eyed right now, just reading my notes, you know, because I think that's such, this is what friendship is.
24:10
[SPEAKER_03]: Putting aside before we get to the relationship and love and marriage and all that stuff which is where we're heading, the key to this movie is its men and women being friends.
24:19
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a friendship.
24:20
[SPEAKER_03]: And that moment of, you just said something unbelievably hurtful to me and I said things
24:29
[SPEAKER_03]: and I want to move right past it to the hug in the apology.
24:33
[SPEAKER_13]: Well, friendship.
24:34
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, and this is the difference.
24:36
[SPEAKER_13]: Harry would have never apologized five years ago or ten years ago.
24:39
[SPEAKER_13]: It wouldn't get going that it blown up and he walked out.
24:42
[SPEAKER_13]: Right?
24:43
[SPEAKER_13]: It just walked away.
24:44
[SPEAKER_13]: but him realizing that he had to apologize because he is taking his anger out on her is a great indicator of growth and her receiving his hog, receiving his apology is also growth on her part.
24:58
[SPEAKER_13]: So I think friends can say harsh shit to each other, that's right.
25:02
[SPEAKER_13]: Life, right, and so it's about like, well, when the person realizes they've gone too far, or realizes they've hurt the friend,
25:10
[SPEAKER_13]: seeking that apology or being honest with that apology.
25:13
[SPEAKER_13]: That's what's great because later in the film, Steve, we're going to have issues about how honest Harry's apology is about a certain thing when it happens versus an authentic apology, which is what we're witnessing now.
25:25
[SPEAKER_13]: And remember earlier, he said, what is the statue of the limitations on apologies when she was implicated, which he was remembering the things he said to her when they first met.
25:33
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's funny to say that because I think this moment just so parallels that moment.
25:38
[SPEAKER_03]: There's like this is the evolution of that.
25:41
[SPEAKER_03]: So as I think I said before, there are some stories that become Hollywood eyes.
25:46
[SPEAKER_03]: They become their own story.
25:51
[SPEAKER_03]: to what degree what I'm about to say there there is definitely truth in this story but whether or not it's quite as romantic as the way I'm about to describe it.
25:58
[SPEAKER_03]: So obviously what you're making this movie everybody is talking about dating and relationships and Barry's on and felt comes in as the DP and Rob is talking to him about his dating experience and just how hopeless he really thinks he is.
26:11
[SPEAKER_03]: He's kind of going like there's probably I'm probably not going to fall in love again and stuff like that and Barry said don't worry.
26:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Did Barry Sonnenfeld really say this to him?
26:23
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not a hundred percent sure, but he said he knows the perfect person.
26:28
[SPEAKER_03]: I know who you're going to marry and I'm going to bring her to set.
26:32
[SPEAKER_03]: And the next and on this day, when they are shooting this scene, a photographer friend of Barry's came on the set to take publicity show photos.
26:42
[SPEAKER_03]: It is the first day that Rob met her and that is Michelle Singer, who would be.
26:46
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, wow.
26:47
[SPEAKER_03]: So Barry Sonnenfeld did introduce them.
26:50
[SPEAKER_03]: whether or not all this I know who you're going to marry stuff is true.
26:53
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't really know, but he definitely introduced them and this is the first moment they met.
26:58
[SPEAKER_03]: That's amazing.
26:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Amazing.
26:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Cut, too.
27:00
[SPEAKER_03]: Pictionary.
27:04
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, having world-class improvisers improvise a dictionary thing is awesome.
27:10
[SPEAKER_03]: It's Sally's drawing.
27:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Everyone is yelling out.
27:14
[SPEAKER_03]: In particular,
27:18
[SPEAKER_10]: Baby, Rosemary's baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby,
27:33
[SPEAKER_09]: Baby talk, what's that?
27:36
[SPEAKER_09]: Let's not say.
27:37
[SPEAKER_10]: All the baby fish mouth is sweeping the nation.
27:39
[SPEAKER_03]: To this day, Billy Crystal gets baby fish mouth is sweeping the nation all the time.
27:44
[SPEAKER_13]: I bet, for quite a few years, I would say that when someone said something ridiculous.
27:49
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, but baby fish mouth is weird.
27:51
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think this is a great moment because the game ends.
27:54
[SPEAKER_03]: We've been following Harry and Sally's friendship and their relationship.
27:58
[SPEAKER_03]: We know they are super, super close.
28:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And then when that round of pictionary ends and people get up, Harry goes to this one girl and Sally goes to this guy and we're going, what the hell is going on?
28:11
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, the exchange looks, not with each other, but sneak looks off at each other's significant other.
28:20
[SPEAKER_13]: Harry significant other is Tracy Reiner, who is, of course, Penny Marshall's daughter that Rob adopted, and she is Betty Spaghetti from League of their own.
28:30
[SPEAKER_13]: So she has a small part here as Emily that is Betty Spaghetti that you see there as Billy Crystal's date, I guess, for lack of a better term and Frank Luz is the Julian who's Sally's date, but he's been in stuff, but it wasn't too many things.
28:44
[SPEAKER_13]: So yeah, but it was nice to see Tracy Reiner in there.
28:47
[SPEAKER_13]: Um, because she gave a go of it.
28:49
[SPEAKER_13]: She, you know, she tried to make a go of it as an actress and did her thing before a little bit, but didn't quite keep going with it for sure.
28:56
[SPEAKER_03]: Um, and then we're going to do a little cinephiles move, which is we were going to, in the movie, there are two scenes in her cut where Sally is talking to Marie about Harry's date and Harry is talking to Jess about Sally's date.
29:08
[SPEAKER_03]: We'll just handle them all at once rather than going back and forth.
29:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
29:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Emily's a little young for Harry, don't you think?
29:14
[SPEAKER_11]: Well, she's young, but what she's done.
29:16
[SPEAKER_03]: And we find out that she is Aunt Emily, who makes 3500 chocolate mousse pies a week.
29:22
[SPEAKER_11]: Julie and is great.
29:24
[SPEAKER_11]: I know.
29:26
[SPEAKER_11]: He's a grown-up.
29:26
[SPEAKER_03]: And so there's one side of what's going on, and then we go to the other side, Harry and Jess, where it's exactly the same scene because Sally started with undercutting Emily and the first thing Harry says is, does Julian seem a little stuff for you?
29:42
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's, again, the same thing on the other side, because Marie said how awesome Emily is and now Jess is gonna say how awesome Julian is.
29:49
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, it's fun to vent the situation, but they're both clearly, you know,
29:57
[SPEAKER_13]: jealous?
29:58
[SPEAKER_13]: I guess about the fact that you know the person is with someone else.
30:01
[SPEAKER_09]: Emily used to riff.
30:02
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
30:03
[SPEAKER_03]: And then it's a thing about where Sally said, yes, he's a grown-up.
30:07
[SPEAKER_03]: Now we're talking about Emily being really young.
30:10
[SPEAKER_10]: Of course, when I asked her where she was, when Kennedy was shot, she said, Ted Kennedy was shot?
30:14
[SPEAKER_13]: No.
30:16
[SPEAKER_13]: No, I love Jess's reaction.
30:18
[SPEAKER_13]: No, like, it's so perfect, you know?
30:21
[SPEAKER_13]: And Billy used to have a bed in the 80s on his standup where he talked about his daughter coming to him, asking him if Paul McCartney was in a band before wings.
30:30
[SPEAKER_13]: And he said that that made him that he could feel the age spots blowing up on my hands when she asked me that question.
30:37
[SPEAKER_03]: That's so great.
30:38
[SPEAKER_03]: And one, and it is interesting that, for Sally, I like this guy, he's a grown-up.
30:44
[SPEAKER_03]: And for Harry, the girl I'm dating is very young.
30:48
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you know, that just shows some things about what they think about men and women.
30:53
[SPEAKER_03]: Agreed.
30:55
[SPEAKER_10]: Hello, are you alone?
30:58
[SPEAKER_10]: Yeah, I was just finishing a book.
31:00
[SPEAKER_10]: Could you come over?
31:02
[SPEAKER_10]: What's the matter?
31:03
[SPEAKER_01]: He's getting married.
31:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Joe, I'll be right there.
31:09
[SPEAKER_03]: And again, this is good friends.
31:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you think that he's still dating Emily and she's still dating Julina at this moment?
31:16
[SPEAKER_13]: Oh, yeah, but neither one or serious.
31:19
[SPEAKER_13]: I don't think either one or serious.
31:22
[SPEAKER_13]: Because I've had feeling Harry goes through dates every three weeks, three or four weeks, dating somebody new.
31:28
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think the Julian thing probably ran its course.
31:32
[SPEAKER_03]: My theory of which I have no evidence, I think they broke up almost right after that party.
31:37
[SPEAKER_03]: Probably, and in particular, because they're not into Emily and Julian.
31:41
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, they're in Paris and Sally.
31:43
[SPEAKER_03]: And we get to Sally's apartment, and we open the door, and she is just a adorably sobbing mess, a complete mess.
31:53
[SPEAKER_05]: Hi.
31:53
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you all right?
31:58
[SPEAKER_03]: And there's something that Rob talks about, which I remember hearing Carl Reiner talk about, which is Carl Reiner was worried when they cast the Dick Van Dyke show, whether or not Mary Tyler Moore would be able to do the comedy cry.
32:13
[SPEAKER_03]: The comedy cry made famous by Lucille Ball, is that you could have someone be completely emotional and crying and have it be hilarious.
32:23
[SPEAKER_03]: and, of course, Mary Tyler Moore going, oh, Rob, you know, perfect at it.
32:30
[SPEAKER_03]: And this was the big question for Meg Ryan.
32:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Can she do the comedy cry?
32:34
[SPEAKER_03]: And boy, she can.
32:36
[SPEAKER_03]: The scene is, she's so good in the scene.
32:39
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry to go, I'm so late.
32:40
[SPEAKER_03]: It's all right.
32:43
[SPEAKER_00]: I need a Kleenex.
32:45
[SPEAKER_10]: Okay.
32:47
[SPEAKER_03]: What did he call her before?
32:48
[SPEAKER_03]: Miss hospital corners.
32:51
[SPEAKER_03]: This is not Miss hospital corners.
32:53
[SPEAKER_13]: No, Beth is unmade.
32:54
[SPEAKER_13]: She's like dropping tissues all over the place.
32:58
[SPEAKER_13]: She's crying and wiping her nose.
33:00
[SPEAKER_13]: This is hurt just like Harry.
33:02
[SPEAKER_13]: When Harry was rattled, he's yelling in his best friends and he's just like out of control.
33:08
[SPEAKER_13]: Here's Sally, who has gotten news that rattled her, and now she's off-kilter and you're seeing her behave in ways that she has not behaved before, you know, she's not in control.
33:20
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I'm sitting on the phone thinking, I'm over him.
33:23
[SPEAKER_00]: I really am over him, I can't believe that's ever remotely interested in any of that.
33:28
[SPEAKER_03]: And Harris beat a great friend.
33:29
[SPEAKER_03]: He's holding that tissue box.
33:30
[SPEAKER_03]: He's like, walky, watching where she goes like, because you know, there's no controlling your friend at this moment.
33:36
[SPEAKER_03]: There's no settling them down.
33:37
[SPEAKER_03]: They have to do what they have to do.
33:39
[SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
33:40
[SPEAKER_03]: And the outrage from Sally.
33:42
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not just that Joe is getting married.
33:44
[SPEAKER_03]: It's who she's getting married.
33:45
[SPEAKER_03]: He's getting married too.
33:47
[SPEAKER_00]: She works in his office.
33:48
[SPEAKER_00]: She's a paralegal.
33:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Her name is Kimberly.
33:51
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I love this is this thing that Nora Afron said that she was raised in this, she grew up believing in the romantic story.
33:58
[SPEAKER_03]: And so there was a way that things were supposed to go.
34:01
[SPEAKER_03]: And it took our long time to realize that things don't go the way they're supposed to go.
34:05
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's what Sally is struggling with.
34:07
[SPEAKER_00]: She's supposed to be a transitional person.
34:10
[SPEAKER_00]: She's not supposed to be the one.
34:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And then this line even more powerful.
34:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, this time I've been saying,
34:21
[SPEAKER_01]: But the truth is, he didn't want to marry me.
34:24
[SPEAKER_01]: He didn't love me.
34:27
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah.
34:29
[SPEAKER_13]: I think that's one of the hardest truths that you learn as you grow up in relationships is that things don't work out for a reason.
34:38
[SPEAKER_13]: And no matter how much you thought you guys were perfect together,
34:42
[SPEAKER_13]: If you break up, you just won't, you weren't or it's run its course and that's the hard thing.
34:49
[SPEAKER_13]: You think, I give it everything.
34:52
[SPEAKER_13]: How can they not be happy, but there's something you just can't explain, you know, and that makes the difference and always makes the difference.
35:01
[SPEAKER_03]: You know what I, I remember when I told the story of my, my first breakup, and I spent six months to a year listening to Bob Marley on and list for P.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A.A
35:20
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think what Sally did was she told herself a story about this mutual breakup that they were both responsible people who cared about she'd each other and made a rational decision for rational reasons and they just wanted different things and that was totally okay.
35:36
[SPEAKER_03]: And she forced herself to believe this thing that wasn't really true because she didn't want to face this idea.
35:44
[SPEAKER_03]: that he didn't want to marry me, that he didn't love me, you know, because that makes it about her and something wrong with her, you know, and it's only now that she's finally facing that reality.
35:56
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
35:56
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I think she's talked herself into the belief that
36:01
[SPEAKER_13]: She's fine with it.
36:02
[SPEAKER_13]: She was because she agreed with it, right?
36:04
[SPEAKER_13]: And so in a way, she thought she was having power in the breakup and rather than being honest about her feelings about the breakup that she still loved Joe and did want to let go.
36:14
[SPEAKER_13]: She thought the smarter thing was just to lean into the fact that he really wanted to go.
36:18
[SPEAKER_13]: And then I'll make it seem like I'm,
36:21
[SPEAKER_13]: I'm on board with him right and so you've got this situation here now clearly she's been exposed because of this reaction and that's the way it is grief you sit on grief you sit on grief then you see something and you have no idea and it triggers all of this outpouring of stuff Harry asks exactly the right question at this moment if you could take him back right now would you
36:42
[SPEAKER_00]: No, but why didn't he want to marry me?
36:48
[SPEAKER_03]: And she, I can't make her eye and so good.
36:50
[SPEAKER_03]: That she could be so adorable and so funny and completely just sobbing and, you know, sad and playing this all so real is so great.
37:01
[SPEAKER_03]: She plops back on the bed.
37:02
[SPEAKER_03]: We're in that top-down shot, looking down at her, it's sort of a cross-herry shoulder.
37:08
[SPEAKER_03]: It's already a very intimate, intimate position.
37:11
[SPEAKER_00]: What's matter with me?
37:12
[SPEAKER_10]: Nothing.
37:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, I'm difficult.
37:15
[SPEAKER_00]: You're challenging.
37:16
[SPEAKER_00]: I do structured.
37:17
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm completely closed off.
37:19
[SPEAKER_03]: But in a good way.
37:21
[SPEAKER_03]: Mm-hmm.
37:22
[SPEAKER_03]: Which I, A, Sally is very structured.
37:24
[SPEAKER_03]: She can be closed off.
37:26
[SPEAKER_03]: And Harry is in love with her.
37:28
[SPEAKER_03]: And so it isn't a good way.
37:29
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no.
37:31
[SPEAKER_00]: I drove him away.
37:32
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm gonna be farty.
37:38
[SPEAKER_10]: When?
37:41
[SPEAKER_10]: in eight years.
37:43
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's there.
37:44
[SPEAKER_13]: It's all so funny.
37:45
[SPEAKER_13]: You know, but it's something that there's a really an element of truth in this.
37:51
[SPEAKER_13]: And I discovered this being friends with some of some my friends coming through college.
37:58
[SPEAKER_13]: And of course, I'm not going to name names, but some of the people that we know
38:02
[SPEAKER_13]: But like there was this thing like if I'm not married by 27, if I don't have kids by 27, if I don't like there is there are these perceptions I think it's changed now I think women now the the new generation of women who come in through like they're much more in control and possession of like
38:18
[SPEAKER_13]: this idea of when they want to get married, when they want to have kids, there's less the pressure of like, well, if they don't do it by this time, then there's somehow seen as defective, right?
38:29
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think there was a perception for a number of decades that women had to get married, had to have kids by a certain time, because if they weren't, then they were seen as pariahs or defective or somehow abnormal.
38:42
[SPEAKER_13]: And so for her to say that like she's got to be 40, but it's eight years away, it's a bit of a hysterical, but you know what I mean, kind of reaction that's going a little overboard for it, but it's played for laughs, which I think is very fun and he's very soothing to her is very comforting to her is trying his best to speak to her pain and try to, you know, try to give make her feel better about the situation, which I think Harry might not have done five years ago or 10 years ago, which is great.
39:10
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you know, by the way, it just popped in my brain, because you mentioned, do you know what the word origin of hysterical is?
39:16
[SPEAKER_03]: I do not.
39:18
[SPEAKER_03]: It is from the uterus, which is why a removing the uterus is called a hysterectomy, because hysteria was associated with women.
39:28
[SPEAKER_03]: That is what, so it is, it is actually a sexist-based word.
39:33
[SPEAKER_03]: And I know that.
39:35
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
39:35
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
39:35
[SPEAKER_03]: And what's interesting is, like, actually, there are realities that women have to deal with in terms of time, in terms of their her uterie, that men don't have to deal with.
39:45
[SPEAKER_03]: And there are all these pressures that work because of it.
39:47
[SPEAKER_03]: And so these ticking clocks, they're, you know, like, they're not bullshit.
39:51
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, they're real things happening here.
39:53
[SPEAKER_03]: I agree.
39:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's not the same for men.
39:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Charlie Chaplin, that maybe is when he was 73.
39:59
[SPEAKER_10]: Yeah, but it was too old to pick them up.
40:02
[SPEAKER_03]: I remember going to see a production of lost in yonkers on brought home, and I remember having the experience in the place so good.
40:09
[SPEAKER_03]: I love Neil Simon so much is that I was literally laughing and crying at the same time, and I think this scene is like it's totally real emotionally and really, really funny.
40:21
[SPEAKER_03]: And he's comforting her and there's a little kid, a comforting kiss as he goes to, it says I'm going to go make you some tea and then she says, I mean, and we all know where this scene is going.
40:33
[SPEAKER_03]: From the moment he showed up, I think we know where this scene is going.
40:37
[SPEAKER_10]: I'll make some tea.
40:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Can you just hold me a little longer?
40:42
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, sure.
40:43
[SPEAKER_03]: And they're holding each other and he touches her face and another little kiss and then she kisses
40:51
[SPEAKER_13]: So this is interesting because I've never kissed any of my female friends on the lips.
40:55
[SPEAKER_13]: I think it's weird and that's my own point of view on it.
40:58
[SPEAKER_13]: So Harry is the one who initiates this.
41:01
[SPEAKER_13]: Harry leans in and kisses her the first time.
41:03
[SPEAKER_13]: It isn't her coming to him.
41:04
[SPEAKER_13]: It's him coming to her.
41:06
[SPEAKER_13]: And then the second time he does it again.
41:09
[SPEAKER_13]: He leans in and gets the kiss from her, right?
41:12
[SPEAKER_13]: And then the third time.
41:14
[SPEAKER_13]: is sure, and he's actually kind of taken a back by it, and then we go.
41:20
[SPEAKER_13]: So it's interesting.
41:22
[SPEAKER_13]: You could say, Harry, in a way, was giving the signs to her that he, you know, kiss her.
41:28
[SPEAKER_13]: I don't know if this is the first time he's ever kissed her on the lips in this way.
41:31
[SPEAKER_13]: And so the second time is almost saying like there is an interest here and Sally who's clearly had a dormant interest in Harry and clearly say Harry's had a dormant interest in her, you could argue that their movements here and the kisses here are their safe way of finally consummating this relationship and the feelings that there has been developing between them for quite some time.
41:54
[SPEAKER_03]: What I think is amazing about this movie is that we can know these characters really, really well and be really connected to them and feel with them and actually have no idea what they're thinking, the whole way leading up to this.
42:08
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't, you know what I mean?
42:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, it could be that every day, Harry was like, God, Sally's beautiful.
42:14
[SPEAKER_03]: Man, I wonder what she looks like naked.
42:15
[SPEAKER_03]: Like he could, I mean, he could have those thoughts all the time or he could have not had those thoughts.
42:19
[SPEAKER_03]: Sally, he could have, when that first kiss happens,
42:23
[SPEAKER_03]: He could be turned on, I don't think he is, but he could be like, he could see it as like, okay, this is my chance to finally sleep with Sally.
42:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Sally, when she kisses him, they could, you know, it's like, the way I've always seen the scene is that it just happens and suddenly they're in the middle of it.
42:40
[SPEAKER_03]: They're both emotional, they care a lot about each other, they're there, but how much intention is behind each of these things, how much of each of them thought of this
42:52
[SPEAKER_13]: You know, I don't think he's right what he says later, which we'll get to when he says when I went over there that night I didn't go there sleep with him.
43:00
[SPEAKER_12]: I think so.
43:00
[SPEAKER_13]: I agree with him.
43:01
[SPEAKER_13]: And so I think the kiss is coming from a repressed sense of comfort for And I think he's kissing her as a person who doesn't know he's in love with her.
43:08
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, that's how I feel too.
43:10
[SPEAKER_13]: Right.
43:10
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, and but he's doing it for a place of comfort not from a place to instigate a sexual encounter But that's what ends up happening right because she has feelings for him and
43:21
[SPEAKER_13]: She is the, he is the first person that she will sleep with since Joe, you know, and so so you don't think she slept with Julian, hell no, fuck no.
43:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Even after he took him to the baseball game?
43:34
[SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, yeah, even after he took another baseball game.
43:37
[SPEAKER_12]: Yes.
43:37
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think so either.
43:38
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's why I think she dated, I think the dating truly and it was like six dates, you know?
43:45
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, I think for her, she makes love.
43:49
[SPEAKER_13]: She doesn't have sense.
43:50
[SPEAKER_13]: She makes love.
43:51
[SPEAKER_13]: Harry has sex.
43:52
[SPEAKER_13]: And well, maybe find love, which he does with sale, of course.
43:55
[SPEAKER_13]: And make a bet, but I don't think he's ever made love.
43:59
[SPEAKER_13]: I don't think he's ever made love.
44:00
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I think Helen was in control the whole time.
44:03
[SPEAKER_03]: I think so too.
44:04
[SPEAKER_03]: I certainly nothing like this.
44:06
[SPEAKER_03]: He says, well, because he wasn't in love with Helen.
44:09
[SPEAKER_03]: You can't make love really.
44:10
[SPEAKER_03]: If you're not really in love and he is in love with Sally, he loves her on every level.
44:15
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think the next shot is one of the most amazing shots.
44:20
[SPEAKER_03]: It's so perfect.
44:21
[SPEAKER_03]: And again, you know what I think this shot is?
44:24
[SPEAKER_03]: So you know how I said, I'll have what she's having is a great line, but what makes it a great line is that it's built on all this stuff.
44:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Why this is a great shot, is that it combines the two big things, intimate things that we learned about men and women, I believe.
44:42
[SPEAKER_03]: The second part of the shot is guys wanting to get wondering how long do they have to say in snuggle before they can get up and leave.
44:49
[SPEAKER_03]: But the first part of the shot, I believe, in my opinion,
44:53
[SPEAKER_03]: This was not like sex with Sheldon.
44:57
[SPEAKER_03]: And this was not a performance like we saw in Cats' Dally.
45:01
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
45:01
[SPEAKER_03]: I think Sally genuinely enjoyed herself.
45:05
[SPEAKER_03]: And the joy and peacefulness and happiness and contented this that she shows in this shot is perfectly contrasted with the look of stark terror on Harry's face as the camera pans over to him.
45:23
[SPEAKER_13]: I love it.
45:24
[SPEAKER_13]: I think it's great because it's too completely different reactions to that moment.
45:28
[SPEAKER_13]: And she has given herself to him.
45:30
[SPEAKER_13]: So to her, this is love.
45:32
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah.
45:32
[SPEAKER_13]: To Harry, who is emotionally repressed, this is utter fear because he doesn't know what to do now.
45:40
[SPEAKER_13]: And right, he just kind of goes a little bit through the motions until they go to sleep.
45:45
[SPEAKER_13]: Oh, yeah.
45:46
[SPEAKER_13]: He's rattled by it all.
45:47
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think, too, is that, okay, we had the moment of consummation.
45:52
[SPEAKER_03]: We've been waiting this whole movement for these two crazy kids to get together.
45:57
[SPEAKER_03]: And now, in the next moment after going, yes, they did it.
46:01
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we're basically gonna be re-injusted.
46:03
[SPEAKER_03]: Is in that shot we go, oh fuck.
46:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you know, because we realized what's going on.
46:08
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'll say this, too.
46:10
[SPEAKER_03]: I will say, if the sex hadn't been good, if it hadn't been making love, if it just had been sex,
46:17
[SPEAKER_03]: Harry would not be nearly so freaked out as he is.
46:20
[SPEAKER_03]: I think now, you're 100% right, 100% right.
46:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you want something to drink or something?
46:26
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm okay.
46:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I'm going to get up for some water, so it's really no trouble.
46:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
46:34
[SPEAKER_13]: Water.
46:35
[SPEAKER_03]: He's so terrified.
46:37
[SPEAKER_13]: Sure is the death of any relationship.
46:40
[SPEAKER_13]: God.
46:42
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
46:42
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, it's like, and she's just, she's just glowing with happiness.
46:46
[SPEAKER_03]: She really is, and that's what makes, it's not just his behavior that's shitty.
46:53
[SPEAKER_03]: It's the contrast with how she's feeling and then how he behaves.
46:56
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, I'm going to say.
46:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
46:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
46:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
46:59
[SPEAKER_03]: She goes into the kitchen and she bounces around just smiling at everything.
47:02
[SPEAKER_03]: It's great product placement for the avion water.
47:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
47:06
[SPEAKER_13]: And then...
47:08
[SPEAKER_13]: him got so funny that he would forage around to see what's there, it's an interesting decision to do that, uh, while she's out of the room.
47:18
[SPEAKER_13]: I think that's what is it about seeing how anorettentive she is.
47:22
[SPEAKER_03]: I think, well, hey, because we get a little, uh, anorettentive joke, but I what I really think it is is if he didn't do that, he wouldn't be able to stop himself from getting out.
47:30
[SPEAKER_03]: of the whole great post that he's like going, I got to do something because he knows how shitty this is what it's about and he knows he can't just walk out.
47:39
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
47:40
[SPEAKER_03]: He I mean, well, has he slept at all since we woke up in the middle of the night?
47:45
[SPEAKER_03]: No, I don't think so.
47:46
[SPEAKER_03]: He is all.
47:47
[SPEAKER_03]: The thing he's about to say, he has been composing in his head.
47:49
[SPEAKER_03]: How do I get the fuck out of here?
47:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but not act like I'm but be nice about it.
47:54
[SPEAKER_03]: Like that's what he's been trying to figure out.
47:56
[SPEAKER_03]: She wakes up and, of course, he's out of the bed and she looks up and sees him getting dressed.
48:01
[SPEAKER_03]: And just in that moment, she knows, you know, and I think she's expected.
48:06
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, if we watch, if you watch that scene before they turn off the, like before they go to bed, but he is not like rolling over to snugg her or to cuddle her.
48:17
[SPEAKER_13]: he is kind of staying in his area the bed and then she after she's turned off the lights notices that he's not doing that and so but she's just going to stay where she's at right because i think there's a thing of like well i'm not going to unset out of the apple cart i'm here i'm just going to see how this plays out but when she wakes up he is he's getting dressed and that is like a shocking thing
48:41
[SPEAKER_13]: I'm of the other side with you, Steve, and I didn't know what was gonna happen in the scene.
48:45
[SPEAKER_13]: And I never thought, I didn't think they were gonna hook up in this scene.
48:49
[SPEAKER_13]: So when it happens, it's a shock to me.
48:51
[SPEAKER_13]: I remember watching it the first time I was like, oh shit, cause I didn't suspect they were going to end up together or start the process quite this way.
48:59
[SPEAKER_13]: So it was all a shock to me.
49:01
[SPEAKER_13]: And then to see him getting up, putting on his clothes, I was like, oh man, this is bad news.
49:06
[SPEAKER_13]: This is terrible news.
49:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
49:08
[SPEAKER_10]: What are you going?
49:12
[SPEAKER_10]: Gotta go home, gotta change my clothes, and then I have to go to work, and so do you.
49:16
[SPEAKER_10]: But after work, I'd like to take you out to dinner if you're free.
49:18
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I could hear how in his head this sounded like this was gonna sound okay.
49:23
[SPEAKER_13]: This is an AI chat pod after you snack it.
49:26
[SPEAKER_13]: This is what it sounds like.
49:28
[SPEAKER_13]: And I love what Salad, a megrine does here and acting.
49:30
[SPEAKER_13]: Like she yanks up the covers to cover herself because Harry in a way is violating what they've just gone through.
49:38
[SPEAKER_13]: And now he doesn't get access to her body.
49:40
[SPEAKER_13]: Like it's a way of protecting herself.
49:42
[SPEAKER_13]: It's an instinctual thing, but it's a brilliant micro move to convey what's going on between them.
49:47
[SPEAKER_03]: And the just coldness of the fine at the end of the scene, as they says goodbye, and she watches him go.
49:55
[SPEAKER_03]: And you just, oh, Harry.
49:59
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's, dude.
50:01
[SPEAKER_03]: Kisses are on the top of the head, no less.
50:03
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
50:03
[SPEAKER_03]: So the next scene, we talked about in Annie Hall, the scene with the therapist and what Woody Allen had thought that we were going to have these combined scenes and that we would shoot them with split screen and it was the DP Gordon Willis who said, no, no, no, let's shoot this on a live set and actually shoot it all at the same time.
50:25
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, that's what they did here is that in the next scene where we're going to have Jess and Marie and Harry and Sally all on the phone having this conversation is they shot this all at the same time they're on four different kind of mini sets.
50:41
[SPEAKER_03]: or three different minisets, so you have the Jesen Marie set and you have Harry on a set.
50:45
[SPEAKER_03]: They're on live telephones and the sound people are pumping all the dialogue into each of the phones, so they can hear each other.
50:54
[SPEAKER_03]: So they're doing this all in real time.
50:56
[SPEAKER_03]: And just, I mean, you know, I'm sure you've done scenes kind of like this, the degree of difficulty of this to get the rhythm exactly super crisp, no pauses right on the money, yeah, I think they did 60 takes of this Wow, wow, because all one shot and you get to the end in one person hesitates a little bit or comes in a little bit to early and this doesn't where you got to start over.
51:21
[SPEAKER_06]: Hello, I'm sorry to call so early.
51:24
[SPEAKER_06]: Are you all right?
51:25
[SPEAKER_06]: No, and I know we'd call it this hour.
51:26
[SPEAKER_06]: I did something terrible.
51:28
[SPEAKER_06]: What do you do?
51:29
[SPEAKER_09]: No one I know would call it this hour.
51:30
[SPEAKER_09]: That's so awful.
51:31
[SPEAKER_09]: I need to talk.
51:31
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we're going to hear again.
51:33
[SPEAKER_03]: This is that great Nora front dialogue.
51:34
[SPEAKER_03]: We're going to hear the story.
51:36
[SPEAKER_03]: But told from both Harriet Sally separately in slightly different ways.
51:40
[SPEAKER_07]: What happened?
51:41
[SPEAKER_07]: What's the matter?
51:42
[SPEAKER_07]: Harry came over last night.
51:43
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, no, but a salad last night.
51:44
[SPEAKER_07]: Because I was upset that Joe was getting married.
51:46
[SPEAKER_07]: I'm before I knew it.
51:47
[SPEAKER_07]: We were kissing.
51:48
[SPEAKER_10]: Like long story short.
51:49
[SPEAKER_07]: We did it.
51:50
[SPEAKER_07]: They did it.
51:51
[SPEAKER_03]: They did it.
51:52
[SPEAKER_03]: And what we hear now in the next part of the scene is that, of course, this is all Jess and Marie have been talking about forever.
52:00
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
52:00
[SPEAKER_08]: It's great, Sally.
52:01
[SPEAKER_08]: We've been praying for her.
52:02
[SPEAKER_08]: I should have done it in the first place.
52:03
[SPEAKER_08]: For months, we've been saying you should do it.
52:05
[SPEAKER_08]: You guys belong together.
52:06
[SPEAKER_08]: It's like killing two birds with one stone.
52:08
[SPEAKER_08]: It's like two rocks make a rise.
52:09
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not the best bet for us.
52:11
[SPEAKER_03]: And so that's the next beat.
52:13
[SPEAKER_03]: It's first, we did it.
52:14
[SPEAKER_03]: It's second great, we're really happy for you.
52:17
[SPEAKER_03]: Third, how was it?
52:18
[SPEAKER_03]: The during part was good.
52:19
[SPEAKER_07]: I sure it was good.
52:20
[SPEAKER_07]: But then I felt suffocated.
52:21
[SPEAKER_07]: I guess it wasn't.
52:21
[SPEAKER_07]: She's just I'm shy.
52:23
[SPEAKER_07]: I wore a hat again and then.
52:24
[SPEAKER_07]: He just disappeared.
52:24
[SPEAKER_13]: I feel so bad.
52:25
[SPEAKER_07]: I'm so embarrassed.
52:26
[SPEAKER_13]: This is a great window into a scene and the interpretation of an interaction with a man and a woman in this moment, right?
52:36
[SPEAKER_13]: Like, we were just saying, oh, Harry, why would you make these mistakes, right?
52:39
[SPEAKER_13]: But Harry is giving us a window to what he felt, which he felt suffocated by the situation.
52:44
[SPEAKER_13]: he had to get out of there because that was his own way of saving himself from the situation.
52:49
[SPEAKER_13]: And he didn't think about how it might look to Sally, although he tried to do his best, I think, the others, respectively, as possible.
52:57
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think inviting her to dinner was his way of trying to be like,
53:00
[SPEAKER_13]: But I still want to see, for dinner, even those may be offending you what I'm doing to try to smooth things over, but he clearly felt suffocated.
53:07
[SPEAKER_13]: And so you have to honor people's feelings in a moment.
53:10
[SPEAKER_13]: Whether he did the right thing or not is up for debate, but he did the right thing for himself, which was to get out there because he was suffocating.
53:16
[SPEAKER_13]: But she, of course, has a different point of view that he just left and left her that way.
53:20
[SPEAKER_13]: So it's a fascinating window into seeing how two people could see this same interactions in two completely different ways.
53:27
[SPEAKER_03]: So part of why I really do think why the feeling of suffocation was so strong was that and this is actually your true love who you're going to marry and be with for the rest of your life.
53:36
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, that suffocating.
53:38
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like this isn't just someone, this is a big deal.
53:41
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you know, you sleep with your best friend.
53:44
[SPEAKER_03]: That's either going to change your friendship or you know, it's something's going to change.
53:48
[SPEAKER_03]: This is not, this is not nothing.
53:50
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think there's that.
53:50
[SPEAKER_03]: I also, I want to go back and go over these lines again, because I think it's so, it expresses what you're talking about, which is they ask how it was, and they actually both agree on how the sex was.
54:03
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, the during part was good.
54:05
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought it was good.
54:07
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
54:07
[SPEAKER_03]: And then,
54:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Harry goes to his emotional place by saying, then I felt suffocated.
54:13
[SPEAKER_03]: That's not actually about the sex.
54:15
[SPEAKER_03]: That's about how he felt after.
54:16
[SPEAKER_03]: No, of course, the emotion.
54:17
[SPEAKER_03]: And Sally felt Harry pull away.
54:21
[SPEAKER_03]: And she goes, but then I guess it wasn't.
54:24
[SPEAKER_03]: and what she's now done because what she had said about the sex was, I thought it was good.
54:29
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
54:30
[SPEAKER_03]: And now she's retroactively based on what she saw in Harris reaction, gone, oh, maybe I was wrong.
54:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Like maybe the sex wasn't good.
54:40
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe I wasn't experienced because then what she's later is going to say is how embarrassed she feels.
54:44
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, like there's a hole, it's just all so well written, it comes down so fast.
54:49
[SPEAKER_08]: But what do you mean great if it worked out, but it didn't.
54:51
[SPEAKER_08]: I should never go to bed with anyone when you found out your last boyfriend is getting married.
54:54
[SPEAKER_08]: Who's that talking?
54:55
[SPEAKER_08]: Who?
54:56
[SPEAKER_07]: Is that Jess on the phone?
54:57
[SPEAKER_08]: It's James Bond on the VCR.
54:58
[SPEAKER_08]: It's Brian Campbell.
54:59
[SPEAKER_03]: And then they hang out there.
55:01
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I loved.
55:02
[SPEAKER_03]: As much as I think Marie was not always so nice about Jess's wagon wheel, this moment is so lovely and why you feel so good about this couple.
55:11
[SPEAKER_06]: Tell me, I'll never have to be out there again.
55:14
[SPEAKER_06]: You will never have to be out there again.
55:16
[SPEAKER_13]: That is a great feeling.
55:19
[SPEAKER_13]: As someone who endeavors to never be out there again, that is a great feeling.
55:25
[SPEAKER_03]: Somebody got them a problem with this in.
55:26
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I said, there go.
55:28
[SPEAKER_03]: Promise me I'll never have to be in there again.
55:30
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll just say we made a mistake.
55:37
[SPEAKER_07]: Sally, it was a mistake.
55:45
[SPEAKER_10]: I hope she says it before I do.
55:48
[SPEAKER_13]: That's a window into Sally a little bit that she's, although she's been finding her voice and growing stronger, the fact that she says that she wants to say it first, like she wants to reject him first before he rejects her, that's a little bit of pride and ego, right?
56:01
[SPEAKER_13]: So she's not, she's not quite fully grown just yet.
56:05
[SPEAKER_13]: But, you know, clearly there's still some stuff to work out there, and him too, like I hope she's the one that said then that way I'm not the bad guy.
56:14
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, I hope she says it.
56:15
[SPEAKER_13]: So there is a little bit both of them, a little bit of emotional slight emotional immaturity in how they're dealing, how they're preparing to deal with this conversation.
56:34
[SPEAKER_03]: if somehow Harry had been able to handle that moment of feeling suffocated and getting up differently.
56:40
[SPEAKER_03]: If Sally didn't say it was a mistake right away, if there's so many ifs of like, but also, you know, if you can't actually rise above something until you hit the bottom, you know?
56:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, they have to go on this painful journey.
56:55
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I have to go on this painful journey with them.
56:57
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
56:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Their city of dinner and Sally does what she wanted to do.
57:01
[SPEAKER_06]: It was a mistake.
57:02
[SPEAKER_03]: And then, Harry is just too eager.
57:07
[SPEAKER_03]: If he hadn't come in quite so strong, this might not be good, might have gone a little better.
57:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Which you could see on her face.
57:13
[SPEAKER_10]: I am so relieved that you think so too.
57:16
[SPEAKER_10]: I'm not saying last night wasn't great.
57:18
[SPEAKER_01]: It was.
57:20
[SPEAKER_10]: Yes, it was.
57:23
[SPEAKER_01]: We just never should have done it.
57:24
[SPEAKER_03]: couldn't agree more.
57:25
[SPEAKER_03]: They're both too enthusiastic, you know?
57:29
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, she's almost offended like she's thinking about you could see her face, right?
57:33
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, her face is not happy with how enthusiastic air is about it.
57:37
[SPEAKER_13]: She wants him to fight for her, she can't say that, she can't say that because that kind of ruins the organic nature of someone fighting for you, but she wants him to fight for her, and he every opportunity that she kind of lays out for him to possibly fight for her, he doesn't take advantage of.
57:53
[SPEAKER_13]: Which, of course, is what leads us to the great monologue at the end, wants her to fight for.
57:58
[SPEAKER_13]: He wants him, he wants, she wants him to fight for her.
58:01
[SPEAKER_03]: What was the scene?
58:02
[SPEAKER_03]: What was Sally crying about?
58:04
[SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't really about Joe, it was about why doesn't you want to marry me?
58:09
[SPEAKER_03]: What's wrong with me?
58:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Why does no one want me?
58:12
[SPEAKER_03]: Why does no one want to fight for me?
58:14
[SPEAKER_03]: Right exactly exactly.
58:16
[SPEAKER_03]: And so she puts this out right away that it was a mistake because what she doesn't she wants to take control of yeah, I'm not going to reject you.
58:23
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I'm going to reject you before you can reject me because right now she's feeling totally unlovable and he doesn't do anything to help her to feel lovable even though he's in love with her, you know, right.
58:34
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm so relieved.
58:36
[SPEAKER_03]: There's just that little waver in a voice and then the waiter delivers a salad, which I believe can frequently be the most awkward thing to eat on a date.
58:45
[SPEAKER_10]: Oh, that's it.
58:46
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
58:47
[SPEAKER_03]: And they just sit there and eat in silence, and then Harry says, I just show nice when you can sit with someone and not have to talk.
58:54
[SPEAKER_12]: Sometimes that's nice.
58:55
[SPEAKER_13]: I know.
58:57
[SPEAKER_13]: He's almost like, well, fair, or an anchorman.
58:59
[SPEAKER_13]: We are laughing.
59:01
[SPEAKER_13]: We are sitting here eating salad and not talking.
59:03
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, it's all that stuff.
59:05
[SPEAKER_03]: Speedwalking.
59:07
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, God.
59:08
[SPEAKER_03]: This is, oh, my God.
59:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
59:10
[SPEAKER_03]: Some things were just like, really, we did that.
59:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's like the stretch pants that they're wearing.
59:15
[SPEAKER_03]: That's really key to the whole thing.
59:16
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, God.
59:17
[SPEAKER_03]: It's so mitigating, that's it.
59:19
[SPEAKER_10]: It's just like, most of the time you go to bed with someone, then she tells you all the husbands, you tell all your stories.
59:26
[SPEAKER_10]: Oh, it's salient, me.
59:27
[SPEAKER_10]: We didn't really run into the stories.
59:30
[SPEAKER_10]: So once you went to bed, we didn't know what we were supposed to do, you know?
59:37
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we cut to Marie getting fitted for her bridal, for a bridal gown.
59:42
[SPEAKER_03]: It's beautiful.
59:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Is Harry bringing anyone to the wedding?
59:45
[SPEAKER_03]: You have to ask that question.
59:47
[SPEAKER_03]: That means they're really haven't been talking.
59:50
[SPEAKER_03]: Like they barely spoken since the salad incident.
59:53
[SPEAKER_11]: He was seeing this anthropologist, but what does she look like?
59:59
[SPEAKER_11]: Finn, pretty, big tits.
1:00:01
[SPEAKER_11]: Your basic nightmare.
1:00:03
[SPEAKER_03]: Just Carrie Fisher, Carrie Fisherine, that is so great.
1:00:07
[SPEAKER_03]: And we cut to the wedding, and of course, as we're listening to the vows about love and marriage and exchanging rings, Harry and Sally are either looking or not looking at each other in incredibly strong ways.
1:00:19
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think it's fascinating too that, and this is going to be this time watching.
1:00:23
[SPEAKER_13]: And sometimes she don't, my brain goes a little farther on these things as some of you have pointed out who listen to us, but like, she's wearing green.
1:00:30
[SPEAKER_13]: And green is the color of envy.
1:00:32
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think she envies what Marie and Jess have.
1:00:36
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think when she looks at Jess' dress, part of that great reaction, which you talked about, which is a fantastic reaction, there's almost a sense of her, like, she loves the idea of love.
1:00:48
[SPEAKER_13]: She loves the idea of getting married, of being a bride.
1:00:51
[SPEAKER_13]: Some people are genuine love with getting married.
1:00:56
[SPEAKER_13]: You know?
1:00:56
[SPEAKER_13]: And so her reaction to it is more than just Jess' dress, it's the idea of it all,
1:01:04
[SPEAKER_13]: You know, she's looking at Harry for something.
1:01:06
[SPEAKER_13]: And Harry won't give her anything, and then she feels awkward and kind of looks away, but she's wearing green.
1:01:11
[SPEAKER_13]: So in my mind, it's a little bit of a slight subconscious indicator that she envies with Chessenbury.
1:01:15
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah.
1:01:16
[SPEAKER_10]: Nice ceremony.
1:01:19
[SPEAKER_13]: Beautiful.
1:01:19
[SPEAKER_13]: And then he goes into some stick.
1:01:21
[SPEAKER_13]: Trying to, trying to, like, you know, release the tension there.
1:01:24
[SPEAKER_10]: Boy, the holidays are rough.
1:01:26
[SPEAKER_10]: Every year, I just try to get from the day before Thanksgiving to the day of the New Year's.
1:01:30
[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of suicides.
1:01:32
[SPEAKER_03]: I wrote that here.
1:01:33
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like, now she's the dark one, man.
1:01:36
[SPEAKER_10]: Are you seeing anybody?
1:01:37
[SPEAKER_01]: Harry.
1:01:38
[SPEAKER_10]: What?
1:01:39
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want you to talk about this.
1:01:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Why not?
1:01:40
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to talk about it.
1:01:44
[SPEAKER_10]: Why can't we get past this?
1:01:46
[SPEAKER_10]: I mean, are we going to carry this thing around forever?
1:01:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Forever.
1:01:49
[SPEAKER_10]: It just happened.
1:01:50
[SPEAKER_10]: It happened three weeks ago.
1:01:52
[SPEAKER_03]: So, that's not that long.
1:01:54
[SPEAKER_03]: No, it isn't.
1:01:54
[SPEAKER_03]: For air it is, because he sleeps with, you know, we're in it all the time.
1:01:57
[SPEAKER_03]: It is mine, yeah.
1:01:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Has Harry slept with any women since that night.
1:02:01
[SPEAKER_03]: I think you slept with that skinny, we have to follow him.
1:02:03
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah, you're probably right.
1:02:04
[SPEAKER_03]: You're 100%.
1:02:05
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:02:06
[SPEAKER_10]: You know how you do a person as like seven years to a dog?
1:02:10
[SPEAKER_03]: How did I snarfe you?
1:02:10
[SPEAKER_03]: You know the line was coming.
1:02:12
[SPEAKER_03]: These two, that's what great comedy is.
1:02:14
[SPEAKER_01]: He's one of us supposed to be a dog in this scenario.
1:02:18
[SPEAKER_10]: Yes.
1:02:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Who is the dog?
1:02:21
[SPEAKER_10]: You are.
1:02:22
[SPEAKER_01]: I am.
1:02:23
[SPEAKER_01]: I am the dog.
1:02:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I am the dog.
1:02:25
[SPEAKER_13]: Oh, this is how you write.
1:02:28
[SPEAKER_13]: This is great writing, you know, her restressing it three times.
1:02:33
[SPEAKER_13]: I am.
1:02:33
[SPEAKER_13]: I am the dog and it's so great, you know, because she's pushing back and it's just fighting back, which I think is great.
1:02:40
[SPEAKER_13]: And here's Harry again, as I said earlier, here's Harry trying to get closure so they can move past it, trying to force it, but she's not ready to move past it until they actually talk about it.
1:02:52
[SPEAKER_13]: And Harry is not used to that.
1:02:54
[SPEAKER_03]: First of all, Karen and I would say I am the dog or someone's supposed to be the dog in the scenario.
1:02:59
[SPEAKER_03]: All the time to each other, that was a very common line to be quoted.
1:03:02
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think what you just totally spot on about and just to add to it is that
1:03:08
[SPEAKER_03]: Harry is coming, wants to deal with the thing sideways.
1:03:13
[SPEAKER_03]: He wants to joke his way into it.
1:03:15
[SPEAKER_03]: He wants to slightly deal with it, so they can just go back to the way things were.
1:03:19
[SPEAKER_03]: He doesn't actually want to deal with the real emotions.
1:03:23
[SPEAKER_03]: It's only when we deal with those real emotions in the final monologue that we finally, that he can guess, you know, right, exactly.
1:03:29
[SPEAKER_03]: What's funny about this to be is there's a misunderstanding of the meaning of the metaphor of a dog.
1:03:36
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:03:36
[SPEAKER_03]: What Harry was actually trying to say is that time has seemed longer for Sally or shorter because she's the dog and dog see time in a different way.
1:03:46
[SPEAKER_03]: He's making a thing about time.
1:03:47
[SPEAKER_03]: But when she hears the word dog, I think she focuses on a dog as in someone who's having a lot of sex or going, you know.
1:03:54
[SPEAKER_03]: And so she feels that he's calling her something terrible.
1:03:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't see that, Harry, if anybody is the dog, you are the dog.
1:04:00
[SPEAKER_01]: You want to act like what happened didn't mean anything.
1:04:02
[SPEAKER_10]: I'm not saying it didn't mean anything.
1:04:04
[SPEAKER_10]: I am saying, why does it have to mean everything?
1:04:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Because it does!
1:04:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And you should know that better than anybody, because the minute that it happened, you walk right out the door.
1:04:11
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's funny, we had a fight with them before, where they said some really honest things to each other.
1:04:16
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:04:17
[SPEAKER_03]: And this one is going to not go the way that one went.
1:04:23
[SPEAKER_03]: and she storms off into the kitchen.
1:04:25
[SPEAKER_03]: It's funny, I have always watched this on Team Harry.
1:04:29
[SPEAKER_03]: I think in this, you know, I'm a guy and just this scene because I'm always like, look, he's trying his best.
1:04:36
[SPEAKER_03]: He's trying, he's not trying his best.
1:04:39
[SPEAKER_03]: He's trying.
1:04:39
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think I'm much more in seeing it's so much more from Sally's perspective and how she's feeling through all this.
1:04:46
[SPEAKER_03]: And why Harry has to jump through a lot of hoops to get there.
1:04:51
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, yeah, because he's the one that messed the way he left was all raw and she's right to fight for equality in the situation.
1:05:03
[SPEAKER_13]: He's got to a tone for what he did and so she's trying to call him out for it for the approach he's taking.
1:05:10
[SPEAKER_03]: It's funny.
1:05:11
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's interesting.
1:05:12
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know
1:05:14
[SPEAKER_03]: I think in the end, it's not him atoning.
1:05:16
[SPEAKER_03]: It's him being honest.
1:05:18
[SPEAKER_03]: That is finally what does it.
1:05:20
[SPEAKER_03]: He, at the end, at the end, yeah, right, it's, yeah.
1:05:23
[SPEAKER_13]: But and she is gonna make him suffer until he realizes
1:05:29
[SPEAKER_13]: that she's no longer going to be, and she's gonna say that in a couple of seconds as we get to it, she is no longer on the phone, a little bit later, she's not going to be his fallback anymore.
1:05:40
[SPEAKER_13]: After they've had sex, after they've had the consummation of the relationship, she is much more clearer on what is going on here.
1:05:47
[SPEAKER_13]: She's no longer afraid of what she feels for Harry.
1:05:50
[SPEAKER_13]: She is now willing to stand for it, and if he's not gonna meet her at that level, she is going to leave him behind.
1:05:56
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think this is what the process is that we're going to get into once we get out of the scene and she slaps it, you know.
1:06:02
[SPEAKER_03]: So I want to hold that thought.
1:06:04
[SPEAKER_03]: I want to get through the rest of the lines and I have a slightly different take on it.
1:06:07
[SPEAKER_03]: I think, but he says, What do you want?
1:06:09
[SPEAKER_10]: I don't want anything from you.
1:06:10
[SPEAKER_10]: Fine.
1:06:11
[SPEAKER_10]: Fine.
1:06:11
[SPEAKER_10]: Let's just get one thing straight.
1:06:13
[SPEAKER_10]: I did not go over that night to make love to.
1:06:15
[SPEAKER_10]: That is not why I went there.
1:06:16
[SPEAKER_10]: But you looked up at me with these big weepy eyes.
1:06:18
[SPEAKER_10]: Don't go home tonight, Harry.
1:06:19
[SPEAKER_10]: Hold me a little longer, Harry.
1:06:20
[SPEAKER_10]: What was I supposed to do?
1:06:22
[SPEAKER_03]: What are you supposed to do, Harry, is not say that shit.
1:06:25
[SPEAKER_03]: That shit.
1:06:26
[SPEAKER_03]: That is terrible.
1:06:27
[SPEAKER_03]: Everything you just said there.
1:06:29
[SPEAKER_01]: What are you saying?
1:06:30
[SPEAKER_01]: You took pity on me?
1:06:32
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I was... Fuck you.
1:06:34
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's good slap, too.
1:06:35
[SPEAKER_03]: It is a good slap.
1:06:36
[SPEAKER_03]: What I think is going on with Sally, is that I think this is so much about self-protection and who she is.
1:06:43
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not so much I'm trying to get something from you.
1:06:46
[SPEAKER_03]: It is, this is who I am and how I expect to be treated.
1:06:51
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think it's that Harry has to atone.
1:06:54
[SPEAKER_03]: It's I'm not going to let you treat me that way.
1:06:57
[SPEAKER_03]: I am not going to be the person
1:06:59
[SPEAKER_03]: what he does is immaterial.
1:07:01
[SPEAKER_03]: I think in what she is saying, you know.
1:07:03
[SPEAKER_13]: Yes, standing her ground, but she is not going to low longer except him.
1:07:10
[SPEAKER_13]: Like, she should not get away with just trying to walk past this.
1:07:13
[SPEAKER_13]: Right.
1:07:13
[SPEAKER_13]: And so until and I think if she wasn't about that, she wouldn't have been ignoring his calls for so long.
1:07:21
[SPEAKER_13]: She ignores those calls because she wants her as a suffer a little bit and earn her back.
1:07:28
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think there's nothing wrong with that.
1:07:29
[SPEAKER_03]: See, that's where I don't.
1:07:31
[SPEAKER_13]: Then you actually, I can't watch you.
1:07:33
[SPEAKER_13]: Then explain, well, we'll get to that.
1:07:34
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, let's get to that.
1:07:35
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's because I like this as a debate about what you do.
1:07:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, because to me, it's about like if you're in a toxic situation, leaving the toxic situation, not about getting the toxic person to do something you want them to do.
1:07:49
[SPEAKER_03]: It's, I can't be in this situation anymore.
1:07:51
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, but I don't think this is a toxic situation.
1:07:53
[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, I don't think so either.
1:07:54
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think so either, I'm just using that as an analogy.
1:07:57
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
1:07:58
[SPEAKER_03]: So, and then in the moment after this slap, but I love the slap, by the way.
1:08:00
[SPEAKER_03]: The slap was great.
1:08:01
[SPEAKER_03]: It's right?
1:08:02
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:08:03
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we go immediately back out in the reception where Jess and Maria are giving their toes just as Sally and Harry walk back in from the kitchen.
1:08:13
[SPEAKER_03]: You can feel in the not only the aftermath of the slap, but you can see in the red on Harry's face where he just got slapped.
1:08:19
[SPEAKER_09]: Yes.
1:08:26
[SPEAKER_09]: We would not be here today.
1:08:31
[SPEAKER_03]: It's exactly the kind of joke you would get at a wedding and it is perfectly painful considering what just happened with them.
1:08:37
[SPEAKER_13]: I think of the scene in the heartbreak kit.
1:08:40
[SPEAKER_13]: For those of you who haven't seen it, I don't mean the original, because that's a great one, but the terrible remake, which is a guilty pleasure of mine.
1:08:47
[SPEAKER_13]: The same thing happens at the end, oh, the same thing happens in the beginning of the movie where the woman getting married is Ben Stiller's ex-girlfriend.
1:08:56
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think she says that if I had found him attractive, I wouldn't have gotten married to this man.
1:09:03
[SPEAKER_13]: Rob Cordier, who was playing Ben Stiller's best friend, stands up at the front.
1:09:07
[SPEAKER_13]: of the ceremony turns around and goes, oh man, and stairs back it.
1:09:13
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think that's another great way to play a moment like this.
1:09:16
[SPEAKER_13]: It's really funny.
1:09:17
[SPEAKER_13]: So yeah.
1:09:19
[SPEAKER_03]: Wedding stuff, humor and wedding stuff.
1:09:22
[SPEAKER_03]: But humor and pain frequently go together with white hunters.
1:09:25
[SPEAKER_03]: All sorts of weird stuff going on.
1:09:27
[SPEAKER_03]: We go into a montage of all of what their life is like, go building up to the holiday season without each other, Sally getting a treat by herself.
1:09:38
[SPEAKER_03]: We have Harry, Colin, and leaving messages.
1:09:42
[SPEAKER_10]: Hi, it's me.
1:09:43
[SPEAKER_10]: It's the holiday season.
1:09:44
[SPEAKER_10]: I thought I remind you that this is the season.
1:09:49
[SPEAKER_10]: and no, it is also the season of grappling.
1:09:53
[SPEAKER_10]: So, if you felt like calling me back, I'd be more than happy to do the traditional Christmas groundwork.
1:09:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Here's trying to apologize.
1:10:01
[SPEAKER_13]: He knows he fucked up.
1:10:02
[SPEAKER_13]: Oh, yeah.
1:10:03
[SPEAKER_13]: Yep.
1:10:03
[SPEAKER_13]: And so he isn't, but she's not going to give that to him yet.
1:10:08
[SPEAKER_13]: She is going to make him earn her back.
1:10:12
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, well, this is where I don't agree.
1:10:14
[SPEAKER_03]: I think she's done with this relationship.
1:10:16
[SPEAKER_03]: I think she is decided.
1:10:20
[SPEAKER_03]: not trying to get him to do something to come back.
1:10:23
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's what she thinks.
1:10:24
[SPEAKER_13]: I'm not saying that's the reality obviously.
1:10:26
[SPEAKER_13]: Oh, yeah.
1:10:27
[SPEAKER_13]: Well, I, yeah, I, I, yeah, okay.
1:10:29
[SPEAKER_13]: I would just have to disagree in there because I, I think, I think she's absolutely doing it intentionally.
1:10:33
[SPEAKER_13]: Not not because
1:10:35
[SPEAKER_13]: uh... how can i say it's not because you want to control harry it's not from that point it's a point of it's still it's still ties into what you're saying and what you know we've been saying is that she respects herself now yeah and because harry has twice fuck this up
1:10:50
[SPEAKER_13]: uh... she is not going to allow him to get away with it and she is not going to allow herself to give him the easy route out because i think she's done this with every man i think with every man she's been with she has given them the out and she has suffered for it
1:11:08
[SPEAKER_13]: But this time, she's not going to do it any more.
1:11:11
[SPEAKER_13]: It's a defiant stance.
1:11:13
[SPEAKER_13]: She's not going to pick up the phone and make him feel better.
1:11:16
[SPEAKER_13]: She's not going to give him what he wants.
1:11:18
[SPEAKER_13]: She is going to stay away from this situation until she feels she is ready to have the conversation and accept his apology.
1:11:27
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think that's a strong stance of self-love that we haven't seen from her throughout the whole movie.
1:11:34
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a we basically agree on 90% and it's this sliver at the end and it's funny where that sliver is of what does she want from Harry.
1:11:42
[SPEAKER_03]: It's kind of what I was saying before of we know these characters so well, but I actually don't know what they're thinking.
1:11:48
[SPEAKER_03]: You know like like if Sally is Sally in her mind envisioning a future friendship with Harry or even a future romantic relationship with Harry or is she not thinking about that?
1:11:59
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
1:12:00
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know how much he's thinking about those things.
1:12:02
[SPEAKER_03]: So in my mind, I'm more on the side of this isn't healthy for me.
1:12:06
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm taking care of myself and I'm moving on from this relationship.
1:12:10
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we're both getting your mind.
1:12:12
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and in your mind it's more, I want something from him.
1:12:15
[SPEAKER_13]: You know, we're both in the camp.
1:12:17
[SPEAKER_13]: Same camp.
1:12:17
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, exactly.
1:12:18
[SPEAKER_13]: In that self, but like, you're saying she's done with the relationship, and I don't think she is.
1:12:22
[SPEAKER_13]: I think she's saying she's done with that version of the relationship.
1:12:27
[SPEAKER_13]: And she wants a relationship with Harry Meetsor and treats her as an equal, right?
1:12:31
[SPEAKER_13]: She's not going to do it until he does.
1:12:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Which is, which is of course what's happened.
1:12:34
[SPEAKER_03]: Because of course, I'm not, I, I think she thinks she's done with the relationship.
1:12:38
[SPEAKER_03]: I know the movie, you're in a movie.
1:12:40
[SPEAKER_03]: You're not done with this relationship.
1:12:42
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, right.
1:12:43
[SPEAKER_10]: Obviously, she doesn't want to talk to me.
1:12:45
[SPEAKER_10]: Why don't I have to do it, be it over the head?
1:12:47
[SPEAKER_10]: She wants to call me, she'll call me.
1:12:49
[SPEAKER_10]: If you make a mistake, she might kind of myself.
1:12:51
[SPEAKER_03]: Cut to him, go ahead.
1:12:53
[SPEAKER_10]: This is calling her singing with the karaoke machine.
1:12:56
[SPEAKER_10]: Call me.
1:12:57
[SPEAKER_10]: It don't be afraid to just phone.
1:13:04
[SPEAKER_13]: But I think this is also important for Harry.
1:13:06
[SPEAKER_13]: Harry has always found a way to do everything on his terms.
1:13:10
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think with every girl he's been with, it's been his terms.
1:13:14
[SPEAKER_13]: Even when he's fucked up, he's tried that jokie apology and it's worked.
1:13:18
[SPEAKER_13]: But she is like, she's not giving in to all the stuff that he's doing.
1:13:23
[SPEAKER_13]: So he has to learn, he has to grow.
1:13:27
[SPEAKER_13]: And in, you know, in essence, a toning for the things that he's done before, uh, I'm not saying she, and maybe you're right.
1:13:33
[SPEAKER_13]: Well, I'm not saying that she's making him a tone.
1:13:36
[SPEAKER_13]: I'm saying he, us, we were, we were agreed.
1:13:39
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, that's what he's talking about.
1:13:41
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:13:41
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, and I'm not saying, like, I think, because part of me looking at it is like, you know what?
1:13:45
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'll say it about myself.
1:13:47
[SPEAKER_03]: Sometimes the joke you approach isn't appropriate because you're actually protecting yourself from feeling the real feelings.
1:13:53
[SPEAKER_03]: Exactly.
1:13:53
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's what they're talking about.
1:13:55
[SPEAKER_03]: Of course, like you're mocking their feelings by joking about it.
1:13:57
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
1:13:58
[SPEAKER_03]: It can come across that way.
1:14:00
[SPEAKER_03]: The only place where different is on intent is that what has to happen for each of these characters, we're 100% agreed on.
1:14:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:14:07
[SPEAKER_03]: And so he's leaving this cute singing message and you see her listening to it.
1:14:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm sure you've done this
1:14:18
[SPEAKER_10]: Hello, hi, hi.
1:14:19
[SPEAKER_10]: I did not, did you, did you were there?
1:14:22
[SPEAKER_10]: What are you doing?
1:14:23
[SPEAKER_03]: What are you doing?
1:14:24
[SPEAKER_03]: Such a, it's an intimate question for people that doesn't work so well for people that aren't really being friendly at the moment.
1:14:30
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I agree with you.
1:14:31
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought it was a weird question to what I would say again.
1:14:33
[SPEAKER_06]: What do you want, Harry?
1:14:35
[SPEAKER_10]: Nothing, nothing.
1:14:36
[SPEAKER_10]: I, I just call to say, I'm sorry.
1:14:38
[SPEAKER_03]: you can see so many emotions playing with both of them.
1:14:42
[SPEAKER_13]: I think she's genuinely, like, I think she's genuinely finally heard as a politician.
1:14:47
[SPEAKER_13]: Like she's legitimate, you can see in her face that she's like registering the honesty in that, in his voice.
1:14:54
[SPEAKER_13]: Which is great.
1:14:55
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, you're right.
1:14:56
[SPEAKER_13]: You see the emotions going through both.
1:14:58
[SPEAKER_13]: And I love that she cuts him off.
1:14:59
[SPEAKER_13]: It's what do you want, Harry?
1:15:01
[SPEAKER_13]: Boom!
1:15:02
[SPEAKER_13]: It's very strong.
1:15:03
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's funny I want to go back to like this idea we talked about a foreclosure you know what I'd actually say maybe more accurately to reflect my feelings is that To some degree you got to know you're not going to get everything you want and you got to take what you can what what they can give to some degree you know is that
1:15:21
[SPEAKER_03]: The odds of someone giving you the perfect apology that gives you everything you need to hear our slam.
1:15:28
[SPEAKER_03]: Harry's been trying to apologize.
1:15:30
[SPEAKER_03]: Has it been the perfect apology?
1:15:31
[SPEAKER_03]: No, it isn't.
1:15:32
[SPEAKER_03]: And he's going to make the perfect speech in a couple of scenes.
1:15:35
[SPEAKER_03]: But he has been trying.
1:15:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:15:38
[SPEAKER_03]: And then, and then it's so sad because I know why he goes to this as the next thing.
1:15:44
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's exactly, you know, you know, if Sally is filling all this insecurity and feeling unlovable and not understanding why nobody wants to marry her, this is exactly what you shouldn't say.
1:15:55
[SPEAKER_10]: What are you doing for New Year's?
1:15:56
[SPEAKER_10]: Are you going to the Tyler's party?
1:15:57
[SPEAKER_10]: Because I don't have a date.
1:15:59
[SPEAKER_10]: And if you don't have a date, we always said that if neither one of us had a date, we could be together for New Year's and it did, you know, what do I want?
1:16:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't do this anymore.
1:16:07
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not your constellation prize.
1:16:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Goodbye.
1:16:10
[SPEAKER_03]: That consolation prize, man.
1:16:12
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's been echoing around in her brain ever since he got up and walked out on her.
1:16:17
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, she feels like just another, she hurt, she's heard him talk about all the horrible women he slept with and walked out on it.
1:16:25
[SPEAKER_03]: And she feels like I'm just one of them.
1:16:27
[SPEAKER_13]: Yep.
1:16:28
[SPEAKER_13]: And she's worth more than that.
1:16:30
[SPEAKER_13]: And she is not going to open the door to a possibility of them being together again if he doesn't understand that.
1:16:37
[SPEAKER_03]: And now it's New Year's Eve because this is about holidays, and Harry is just watching TV, you know, at home alone.
1:16:47
[SPEAKER_03]: What's so bad about this?
1:16:49
[SPEAKER_10]: Good, Dick Clark, that's tradition, good, Malamaz, the greatest cookie of all time.
1:16:53
[SPEAKER_03]: Man, those New Yorkers, they love their Malamaz, man.
1:16:56
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's a good, it's a good, it's a good, it's a good, it's a good, it's a good, it's a good, it's a good, I think it's just like chocolate and marshmallow and is it a Tim Tam?
1:17:02
[SPEAKER_13]: Is it a new version of a Tim Tam or no?
1:17:04
[SPEAKER_13]: What is what is a Malamaz?
1:17:05
[SPEAKER_03]: But let's hold on.
1:17:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, let me, we need to be accurate.
1:17:08
[SPEAKER_03]: This is the cinephiles.
1:17:09
[SPEAKER_03]: I believe I know what it is.
1:17:10
[SPEAKER_03]: And with the foodie, yes, of course.
1:17:12
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
1:17:13
[SPEAKER_03]: It is a gram cracker-based top with marshmallow and coated in dark chocolate.
1:17:18
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
1:17:19
[SPEAKER_03]: Sounds great.
1:17:20
[SPEAKER_03]: They aren't.
1:17:21
[SPEAKER_03]: I've had them.
1:17:21
[SPEAKER_03]: They're good.
1:17:22
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
1:17:23
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:17:23
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if they're the greatest cookie in the world.
1:17:27
[SPEAKER_03]: then we cut to I'm assuming Tyler's party.
1:17:30
[SPEAKER_03]: I love I love the way Rob, you know, Rob's not like the great Rob Reiner's not the greatest guy director with a camera, but I love what he does with the camera here, which is Sally is with some guy telling him the punchline of a joke.
1:17:41
[SPEAKER_10]: So the guy says read the card.
1:17:44
[SPEAKER_03]: She clearly doesn't get it and then laughs.
1:17:49
[SPEAKER_03]: And then she leans away and the camera goes with her to Marie.
1:17:53
[SPEAKER_11]: I'm going home and she'll never get a taxi.
1:17:55
[SPEAKER_03]: And then back to the garden.
1:17:57
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a perfect shot for that moment.
1:17:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Her fake laugh, too, throughout the whole thing is good.
1:18:02
[SPEAKER_03]: It is terrible stories, it's great.
1:18:04
[SPEAKER_03]: And then Harry is walking.
1:18:06
[SPEAKER_03]: And we start to hear and see moments of their relationship in particular the beginning.
1:18:13
[SPEAKER_10]: You realize, of course, that we can never be friends.
1:18:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Why not?
1:18:17
[SPEAKER_10]: what I'm saying is that men and women can't be friends because the sex part always gets in the way.
1:18:21
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we see them on the plane and then we'll see them walking together.
1:18:25
[SPEAKER_01]: And we hear... What if they don't want to have sex with you?
1:18:28
[SPEAKER_10]: Doesn't matter because the sex thing is already out there so the friendship is ultimately doomed and that is the end of the story.
1:18:33
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we see them when they've made love and I love the contrast between the image of them at the most intimate, which is when they made love, right?
1:18:41
[SPEAKER_03]: And the moment of their first saying goodbye to each other.
1:18:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I guess we're not gonna be friends then.
1:18:47
[SPEAKER_01]: It's too bad, it's really only person that I knew in New York.
1:18:51
[SPEAKER_03]: When does Harry acknowledge that he is in love with Sally?
1:18:55
[SPEAKER_13]: I think when he realizes the idea that he might lose her, which is her saying, that's it's why I think that moment is the final moment of the memories, is her saying, well, I guess we're never gonna be friends again.
1:19:05
[SPEAKER_13]: With each other because, and it's a shame because you're the only person I knew in New York.
1:19:10
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think he realizes, in listen, this is all of for perceptions of some of you listening to this might agree with me disagree with me.
1:19:16
[SPEAKER_13]: But I think there's a reason you can, you know, you're there as a director Steve, you know, you create a montage to lead to a realization at the final moment before in the montage is the one that's supposed to spark the realization.
1:19:29
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think because they have that last moment of her saying, well, it's a shame.
1:19:34
[SPEAKER_13]: I think Harry realizes, like, he doesn't want to live his life without her, and her re-remembering that she's the one that he was like, it's a shame that you don't want to be friends.
1:19:44
[SPEAKER_13]: She's always been fighting for the relationship more than he.
1:19:48
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think in this moment, he realizes like how much of an incredible woman she is and how much of a loss he would experience in his life to lose her and I think what you've been saying throughout this whole episode how much he does lover and didn't realize how much he loved and it's this moment the fear of losing her forever.
1:20:09
[SPEAKER_13]: that sparks this moment where I'm to finally fight for her and run across New York and dive into that party to deliver his honest truth about.
1:20:20
[SPEAKER_03]: I think you're a hundred percent right, I totally agree and I think just in terms of the way I'm framing it in my head, Canon, is that
1:20:28
[SPEAKER_03]: for her like what she needs to do for him to what she needs to do to protect herself.
1:20:35
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, after this incident is go, I have to be, I have to take care of me.
1:20:40
[SPEAKER_03]: I cannot put myself in a position where this person can hurt me anymore, right?
1:20:44
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I am looking at me.
1:20:46
[SPEAKER_03]: That's the evolution, you know, she always put herself in positions with Joe and with other people that weren't all about her.
1:20:53
[SPEAKER_03]: And now she's like, no, no, no, I have to take care of myself.
1:20:55
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think for Harry, he has to expose himself.
1:20:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, her, hers is this protective thing that she's going, like, I have to not put myself out there.
1:21:05
[SPEAKER_03]: And Harry has never really put himself out there.
1:21:08
[SPEAKER_03]: And he has to put himself out there.
1:21:10
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, they both have.
1:21:11
[SPEAKER_03]: And once they do that, and man else, Harry's run across New York.
1:21:17
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, among the most romantic things in any film ever.
1:21:21
[SPEAKER_13]: And again, and I want to make this really, really clear.
1:21:25
[SPEAKER_13]: This song is not on the soundtrack, but the slow version of the older Frank Sinatra, singing it had to be you.
1:21:33
[SPEAKER_12]: It had to be you.
1:21:38
[SPEAKER_13]: Is one of the greatest interpretations of that song ever?
1:21:42
[SPEAKER_13]: It is slow-paced, it is honest, it is truthful, and it is a reflection of this timeless love.
1:21:51
[SPEAKER_13]: And I love that it's an older Sinatra, that delivers this particular version of it had to go, because if it's here, the younger Sinatra is singing it, it's much more happy and jovial and caught in the love of things.
1:22:02
[SPEAKER_13]: But this older Sinatra is the man who has been through the wars of love and is still in love with the woman that he committed to.
1:22:11
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think that's was so great about his interpretation because it mirrors what Harry is about to do, which is about to commit the rest of his life, for this woman and have that kind of love that Sinatra is singing about in this version of it had to be you.
1:22:25
[SPEAKER_03]: It's great.
1:22:25
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a great point and I think part of it is that one of the things about when Harry Mincelli, it's not young love, it's not first love, it's not sweet romantic naïve love.
1:22:36
[SPEAKER_03]: This is mature love and having that mature Sinatra,
1:22:40
[SPEAKER_03]: is what's right for this true love yeah yeah and what's weird it's there's even a ticking clock because we see Sally at the party and she's getting ready to go and she's trying to leave and Harry is walking and then he's walking fast and then he starts running trying to catch a cab he can't find a cab and now he's sprinting which by the way he would be exhausted this is a long run because we've all done but that's all movies go um and it's getting it's right before midnight which is what i mean by the ticking clock i'm going
1:23:10
[SPEAKER_01]: It's all this good money.
1:23:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I thought I'm not kissing somebody.
1:23:14
[SPEAKER_09]: It's just our kissers.
1:23:15
[SPEAKER_03]: Dude, you're a good guy and I know this was well-meaning, but this is not what Sally needed to hear right now.
1:23:22
[SPEAKER_03]: She is one or way out and she sees him.
1:23:26
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think you can look at just a look on Meg Ryan's face and know that she loves him, you know?
1:23:30
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, it mirrors the moment.
1:23:33
[SPEAKER_13]: And I would imagine Cameron Crow stole this moment for Jerry McGuire.
1:23:36
[SPEAKER_13]: Oh, sure.
1:23:37
[SPEAKER_13]: Right.
1:23:38
[SPEAKER_13]: When McGuire comes through that door and Brineza, we're the women are talking and complaining about men, and Zellwager looks up and sees him.
1:23:47
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, he's already won the day, right?
1:23:49
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think in this moment, the fact that Harry showed up and he's not even dressed up for the party, so I think reflects subconsciously she knows that he has just had this realization and is run up to teller.
1:24:00
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, at this moment, you know the way you know about a good melancholy.
1:24:04
[SPEAKER_12]: Yeah, that's exactly.
1:24:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, it's funny, too, because what is that story, the good melanchory, I think, is he crossed the room at the party to talk to me?
1:24:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Great point.
1:24:13
[SPEAKER_03]: That's what's happening right now.
1:24:15
[SPEAKER_03]: What's interesting with Meg Ryan is that the first moment you see, oh, she's in love with Harry.
1:24:19
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
1:24:19
[SPEAKER_03]: And then you see her put on the face.
1:24:21
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
1:24:22
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I can't protect herself.
1:24:24
[SPEAKER_03]: To protect herself.
1:24:24
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:24:26
[SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
1:24:27
[SPEAKER_03]: This is what I mean by this is it's not that I don't feel that she needed him to a tone.
1:24:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Although she obviously did he had fucked up and she needed to apologize.
1:24:36
[SPEAKER_03]: But this is the thing.
1:24:37
[SPEAKER_03]: He needs to expose himself.
1:24:39
[SPEAKER_03]: He needs to say his truth.
1:24:40
[SPEAKER_10]: I've been doing a lot of things.
1:24:42
[SPEAKER_10]: I love you.
1:24:44
[SPEAKER_06]: What?
1:24:45
[SPEAKER_10]: I love you.
1:24:46
[SPEAKER_13]: This is not a hair issue.
1:24:47
[SPEAKER_13]: No, she's putting it on the tape.
1:24:49
[SPEAKER_01]: How do you expect me to respond to this?
1:24:52
[SPEAKER_03]: How bad you love me, too.
1:24:53
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I think he is convinced that she loves him.
1:24:56
[SPEAKER_13]: Yes, I think he is going to fight for them.
1:24:59
[SPEAKER_03]: He is going to fight for them, which is great.
1:25:02
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, and I think that's why he felt suffocated because they made love.
1:25:07
[SPEAKER_03]: He felt love, you know?
1:25:08
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
1:25:09
[SPEAKER_03]: So that's what he's been walking around with for the last month trying to figure out, you know?
1:25:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:25:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that, I'm really big.
1:25:16
[SPEAKER_10]: Doesn't what I said mean anything to you?
1:25:18
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm sorry, Harry.
1:25:20
[SPEAKER_01]: I know it's new, you're new.
1:25:21
[SPEAKER_01]: I know you're feeling lonely, but you just can't show up here.
1:25:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Tell me you love me and expect that to make everything all right.
1:25:27
[SPEAKER_13]: This is not intentional.
1:25:29
[SPEAKER_13]: But I love that it's even harder for him to cross that finish line.
1:25:34
[SPEAKER_13]: This is the last few reps before you fully like the chief muscle failure.
1:25:39
[SPEAKER_13]: And you gotta get there.
1:25:40
[SPEAKER_13]: And so she is not going to make an easy for him.
1:25:43
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think she's fair to say, you might be doing this because you're caught up in the emotional holidays because we've seen the film.
1:25:48
[SPEAKER_13]: Show us that New Year's Eve is a thing they've talked about and had plans for in case they weren't with each other.
1:25:55
[SPEAKER_13]: So she needs to see how authentic he is and she's not going to give in quite easily, quite as easily yet.
1:26:01
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't work this way.
1:26:03
[SPEAKER_10]: Well, how does it work?
1:26:05
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, but not this way.
1:26:07
[SPEAKER_03]: Couple things about the end of this movie.
1:26:10
[SPEAKER_03]: There are, you saw a bunch of them when Rob Riner passed away that people said, oh, he originally intended for this to be a sad ending until he met Michelle and that he turned it into a happy ending that Harry and Sally weren't gonna get together until he met Michelle.
1:26:25
[SPEAKER_03]: That's not true.
1:26:27
[SPEAKER_03]: What is true is that
1:26:29
[SPEAKER_03]: the first couple of drafts did not have Harry and Sally get together.
1:26:33
[SPEAKER_03]: This is months, months and months, years probably before they actually went into production.
1:26:38
[SPEAKER_03]: But there were early drafts because Rob was very cynical and said, I don't believe that I don't think that this can work, so they're not going to get together.
1:26:44
[SPEAKER_03]: But he knew
1:26:46
[SPEAKER_03]: three drafts in that that was the wrong choice and they have to get together.
1:26:50
[SPEAKER_03]: That because that's what the movie demands.
1:26:52
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, this is the kind of movie you're in.
1:26:54
[SPEAKER_03]: But what he says and what I do believe a little bit more was that he never felt great about the ending because he was more cynical and he was depressed and he was, you know, trying out dating that wasn't really working and it wasn't until meeting Michelle on the set that he started to get a lot more romantic and felt better about the ending.
1:27:11
[SPEAKER_03]: He didn't change the ending because he met Michelle.
1:27:14
[SPEAKER_13]: I think the universe, and however you want to do this, God, the universe, universal energy waves, whatever it is you believe in, I think there are special movies.
1:27:25
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think this is why movies are important.
1:27:27
[SPEAKER_13]: There are special movies that come along and certain things happen to make sure those movies happen because the movies are meant for a bigger purpose.
1:27:37
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think this movie, here we are in 2020, 16th,
1:27:44
[SPEAKER_13]: and the movie still delivers.
1:27:46
[SPEAKER_13]: And the movie, with you and I as older people now having been through the wars of our relationships, we can like, savor this movie all over again because the movie is meant to be something bigger and to display and explain something to us.
1:28:02
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think the fact that Rob was having trouble with this ending,
1:28:06
[SPEAKER_13]: and it wasn't till he met Michelle that he was able to give into the ending which is what we see through his direction.
1:28:13
[SPEAKER_13]: This is being beautifully directed final, I think 10 minutes of the movie or eight minutes of the movie.
1:28:19
[SPEAKER_13]: And it's amazing, it's amazing.
1:28:22
[SPEAKER_13]: And I wonder if the Rob who had not met Michelle could have directed these final moments as powerfully and as movingly as he directed them
1:28:35
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's certainly in there and let me tell you a little bit more about how this came about.
1:28:39
[SPEAKER_03]: So they did their rehearsals and all of them, it sounds like kind of felt like the scene was good, but it wasn't quite delivering.
1:28:48
[SPEAKER_03]: And then they went to shoot it.
1:28:50
[SPEAKER_03]: And they're like, okay, we'll figure it out on the day.
1:28:52
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm sure, you know, we'll do the camera and other stuff.
1:28:55
[SPEAKER_03]: And they shot it and it was good.
1:28:57
[SPEAKER_03]: but it wasn't what they wanted.
1:28:59
[SPEAKER_03]: And so they all went back and started talking about it.
1:29:02
[SPEAKER_03]: And when I say they all, I'm assuming that Meg, Billy, Nora, Rob, and Andy are all hanging out.
1:29:08
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know who else is there.
1:29:10
[SPEAKER_03]: And what they start talking about and they shot some stuff.
1:29:13
[SPEAKER_03]: But they're like, well,
1:29:14
[SPEAKER_03]: What is it that Harry really needs to say and what the Sally really need to hear?
1:29:20
[SPEAKER_03]: And so Nora is talking about what Sally needs to hear because she needs to feel loved in a way that she hasn't felt love before.
1:29:28
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like what's gonna be, and what it ended up with, which is that Harry had to show that he saw Sally and that he loved what he saw because only and that he'd been paying attention.
1:29:43
[SPEAKER_10]: How about this way?
1:29:44
[SPEAKER_10]: I love that you get cold when it's 71 degrees out.
1:29:47
[SPEAKER_10]: I love that it takes you an hour and a half to order a sandwich.
1:29:50
[SPEAKER_10]: I love that you get a little sprinkle above your nose when you're looking at me like I'm nuts.
1:29:53
[SPEAKER_03]: Which is great because they cut to Meg Ryan and he has the perfect crinkle or nose.
1:29:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:29:59
[SPEAKER_03]: And then if that wasn't, those were like the little things, right?
1:30:02
[SPEAKER_03]: And then these are, it's big stuff that he says now.
1:30:06
[SPEAKER_10]: I love that after I spend the day with you, I can still smoke your perfume on my clothes, and I love that you are the last person I want to talk to before I go to sleep at night.
1:30:15
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, it's the truth.
1:30:16
[SPEAKER_13]: As someone who is in this kind of love now, I love waking up to
1:30:25
[SPEAKER_13]: by lady and I love going bed.
1:30:27
[SPEAKER_13]: Well, I don't want to talk to anybody else when I wake up and I don't want to talk to anybody else before I go to bed.
1:30:32
[SPEAKER_13]: It's truly a gift.
1:30:33
[SPEAKER_13]: It's truly a blessing and a gift.
1:30:35
[SPEAKER_03]: It's amazing.
1:30:35
[SPEAKER_03]: See, and I just don't want to talk to anybody.
1:30:39
[SPEAKER_12]: He talked to yourself.
1:30:41
[SPEAKER_03]: That's just awesome.
1:30:42
[SPEAKER_12]: A lot's for sure.
1:30:42
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:30:44
[SPEAKER_03]: And he says, and I love rhythmically, by the way, just in terms of the music of the language, this works so well.
1:30:50
[SPEAKER_10]: and it's not because I'm lonely and it's not because it's New Year's Eve.
1:30:54
[SPEAKER_10]: I came here tonight because when you realize you want to spend the rest of your life for somebody, you want the rest of your life to start as soon as possible.
1:31:01
[SPEAKER_13]: That's amazing and Billy delivers it so well, I mean the acting here is so good and this is a Harry we've never seen by the way.
1:31:09
[SPEAKER_13]: We have spent an hour and 30 minutes or 35 minutes with Harry by this point so we have to see something new, we have to see a Harry we've never seen before and he delivers it and the way he, even the pacing of the way he's delivering the lines is a way we've never seen Harry deliver lines throughout the whole movie.
1:31:26
[SPEAKER_13]: It's so authentic and real and she's exactly responding to all of it so well.
1:31:31
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, and what did we say about Sally?
1:31:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Is why doesn't he love me?
1:31:35
[SPEAKER_03]: Why doesn't some of them want to be me, you know?
1:31:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, here's someone who said it.
1:31:41
[SPEAKER_13]: Yes, who sees you, as you said, Nora said, just to see Sarah, he's Sally, he sees Sally, that's what she's been waiting to hear from somebody.
1:31:50
[SPEAKER_13]: I love that when he's done with the speech, we cut to her and she is in love with it.
1:31:57
[SPEAKER_13]: For a second,
1:31:58
[SPEAKER_13]: And then she immediately goes back to the protective thing.
1:32:02
[SPEAKER_13]: And then she can't hold.
1:32:03
[SPEAKER_13]: She can't deny it in a longer and because it's great act.
1:32:07
[SPEAKER_01]: You see, that is just like you, Harry.
1:32:12
[SPEAKER_01]: You say things like that and you make it impossible for me to hate you.
1:32:16
[SPEAKER_01]: I hate you, Harry.
1:32:23
[SPEAKER_03]: and then we get the case.
1:32:25
[SPEAKER_03]: It's funny, too, because we were just a year ago at the New Year's, we're there at the countdown.
1:32:29
[SPEAKER_03]: And we got to the kiss moment and it was awkward and uncomfortable.
1:32:33
[SPEAKER_03]: And now here we are again, except it's not awkward and uncomfortable.
1:32:36
[SPEAKER_03]: It's incredibly romantic.
1:32:37
[SPEAKER_03]: And then, again, I get so relate to Terry because he's got a long time without making a joke.
1:32:45
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I mean, how long do you expect us to go without making a joke?
1:32:48
[SPEAKER_10]: What does this song mean?
1:32:50
[SPEAKER_10]: My whole life, I don't know what this song means.
1:32:52
[SPEAKER_10]: I mean, should all the acquaintance be forgotten?
1:32:54
[SPEAKER_10]: Does that mean that we should forget all the acquaintance?
1:32:55
[SPEAKER_10]: Does it doesn't mean that if we happen to forget them, we should remember them, which is not possible, because we already forgot them.
1:33:00
[SPEAKER_13]: And she's looking at him lovingly.
1:33:03
[SPEAKER_13]: Now, as he says this stuff.
1:33:05
[SPEAKER_13]: because they've now really accepted what they feel for each other, and accept that each other.
1:33:09
[SPEAKER_13]: Yep, he has to see her, but she also has to see him.
1:33:14
[SPEAKER_13]: And so in this moment, she is just rolling with what he says instead of judging him for what he's saying.
1:33:20
[SPEAKER_13]: I think it's great.
1:33:21
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, and what was his whole speech about?
1:33:23
[SPEAKER_03]: His speech was, I see all the crazy things about you.
1:33:28
[SPEAKER_03]: And I love them.
1:33:29
[SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
1:33:30
[SPEAKER_03]: Like I really think a key to relationships are you have to love each other's bullshit?
1:33:35
[SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
1:33:36
[SPEAKER_03]: Is that if you're not with a, if you don't like someone making jokes in awkward or really terrible situations, you shouldn't be in a relationship with me.
1:33:45
[SPEAKER_03]: That would be a bad choice on your part.
1:33:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, maybe it just means that we should remember that we forgot that we were something.
1:33:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, it's a battle, friends.
1:33:56
[SPEAKER_03]: And then what's so great is we hear Vio.
1:33:59
[SPEAKER_03]: And this is the thing where I go like, didn't expect this to be where the movie was going to end.
1:34:03
[SPEAKER_03]: It is so obvious that this is where it has to end.
1:34:07
[SPEAKER_10]: The first time we met, we hated each other.
1:34:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, you didn't hate me.
1:34:10
[SPEAKER_01]: I hated you.
1:34:12
[SPEAKER_01]: The second time we met, you didn't even remember me.
1:34:14
[SPEAKER_10]: I did too.
1:34:15
[SPEAKER_10]: How do you remember you?
1:34:17
[SPEAKER_10]: The third time we met, we became friends.
1:34:20
[SPEAKER_01]: We were friends for a long time.
1:34:22
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we weren't.
1:34:23
[SPEAKER_03]: And you cut to them, and they're on the couch.
1:34:25
[SPEAKER_03]: By the way, apparently, unlike the other ones which are very tightly written by Nora Efron, this was a lot of improv.
1:34:34
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, wow.
1:34:35
[SPEAKER_03]: So they did a bunch of improv because they've obviously really built this relationship.
1:34:38
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
1:34:39
[SPEAKER_03]: I think they did shoot this at the very end of the movie, and so a lot of this was stuff that they improved.
1:34:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Three months later, we got married.
1:34:45
[SPEAKER_10]: Yeah, it only took three months.
1:34:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Twelve years and three months.
1:34:50
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we get it to the wedding, the description of the coconut cake.
1:34:54
[SPEAKER_03]: It was beautiful.
1:34:54
[SPEAKER_10]: We had this enormous coconut cake.
1:34:57
[SPEAKER_01]: A huge coconut cake with it with the tears and there was this very rich chocolate sauce on the side.
1:35:02
[SPEAKER_10]: Right.
1:35:03
[SPEAKER_10]: because not everybody likes it on the cake because it makes it very soggy.
1:35:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Particularly the coconut soaks up a lot of that stuff so you really, it's important to keep it on the side.
1:35:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
1:35:11
[SPEAKER_03]: I love that we end on this very, very Sally kind of moment.
1:35:16
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and that he loves the Sally moment.
1:35:20
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, and of course we're back with it had to be with you and the credits roll because this is the end of one harem in Sally.
1:35:27
[SPEAKER_03]: And you know, we've been talking about this era, you know, just over the summer we talked about Jaws, which was the first movie to have one of these really, really big, wide releases.
1:35:36
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's how these blockbusters were happening.
1:35:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, that's not how they released one, Harry, when that's how they, they did a narrow release.
1:35:43
[SPEAKER_03]: So they only put it in 41 theaters and it grossed over a million dollars just in 41 theaters, which is the second highest opening weekend for a small release like that.
1:35:54
[SPEAKER_03]: since Star Wars, which also opened up small.
1:35:58
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, that's how big a hit this ends up becoming it.
1:36:01
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's funny, because, you know, this is coming out.
1:36:04
[SPEAKER_03]: It's coming out right around the time of Indiana Jones in the last crusade of the Tim Burton Batman movie and Billy Crystals, like we're gonna get killed.
1:36:13
[SPEAKER_13]: Right.
1:36:14
[SPEAKER_03]: And needless to say, did not get killed, ended up making $193 million world card.
1:36:20
[SPEAKER_13]: What an amazing success for a film like this, right?
1:36:22
[SPEAKER_13]: And clearly, you know, people talk about counter programming all the time.
1:36:26
[SPEAKER_13]: Oh, we're going to put this film up against this kind of stuff.
1:36:28
[SPEAKER_13]: And, you know, there is a value in that.
1:36:29
[SPEAKER_13]: If you create a really good film, and it happens to catch fire and is a counter programming to all this other blockbuster stuff as you laid out that's going on there.
1:36:38
[SPEAKER_13]: There, then you really can achieve an incredible amount of success.
1:36:42
[SPEAKER_13]: You know, a looking house made that just came out with Sidney Sweeney and Amanda Seafreed, a lot of people were thinking to be a modest hit $300 million.
1:36:52
[SPEAKER_13]: And that's at a time when blockbusters are coming out usually in December.
1:36:56
[SPEAKER_13]: So, you know, if you hit that thing right, you can actually come out on top and certainly when Harry Metzalli did, and still still coming out.
1:37:04
[SPEAKER_03]: One of the crazy things, as I was doing research was, at least in its initial release, it got kind of a mixed critical response.
1:37:12
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, there are people who founded hollow, there are people that found it shallow, there are people.
1:37:17
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm just like, I don't know what, it's always interesting, like, there are certain movies where maybe you needed this a little time to realize just how damn good this movie is.
1:37:25
[SPEAKER_03]: It only got one Oscar nomination, which was for Screenplay, which it lost to Dead Poets Society, and this is a weird, this is 1990, so this is the year of Do The Right Thing and Driving Miss Daisy.
1:37:38
[SPEAKER_03]: And so it's actually, to me, there's no question the greatest film and most important film that year is without question Do The Right Thing.
1:37:46
[SPEAKER_03]: Agreed.
1:37:47
[SPEAKER_03]: But I actually think when I was looking at some of these other nominations, and I wish that when Harry Metzalli was in this mix a little more.
1:37:54
[SPEAKER_03]: So, best actor was Tom Cruise.
1:37:58
[SPEAKER_03]: It was Kenneth Browna, Morgan Freeman for driving Miss Dave Z, Rom Williams for Dead Poets Society, and Daniel Day Lewis is the winner for my left foot, which is obviously a great performance, and I'm not saying that Billy Crystal should take that away.
1:38:11
[SPEAKER_03]: Best actress goes to Jessica Tandy, and she was up against Isabelle Iendi, Camille Claudel, Pauline Collins and Shirley Valentine and Jessica Lang, and I think Meg Ryan should 100% have been nominated for Best Actors.
1:38:27
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, I think I agree with you.
1:38:29
[SPEAKER_13]: I think you can move Pauline Collins out from Shirley Valentine.
1:38:32
[SPEAKER_13]: I don't even remember a music box with Jessica Lang.
1:38:35
[SPEAKER_13]: I mean, Michelle Flyford being in there for Fabulous Baker Boys.
1:38:37
[SPEAKER_02]: She's creating it.
1:38:38
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, she's creating it.
1:38:39
[SPEAKER_13]: So yeah, I would have absolutely, I'm the hell.
1:38:40
[SPEAKER_13]: I'd have put her over Jessica Tandy.
1:38:42
[SPEAKER_13]: No offense.
1:38:43
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:38:43
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought it was good, but not the winner.
1:38:46
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:38:46
[SPEAKER_03]: That grind is so, so good in this movie, directing went to Oliver Stone for Born on the Fourth of July, which
1:38:55
[SPEAKER_03]: is a movie that has a powerful film.
1:38:58
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, you know, when Harry Metzallie is beloved, and this was up against William for crime semistaminer's Peter Weirford Ed Poets Society, Brana for Henry V and Jim Sheridan, directed my left foot.
1:39:11
[SPEAKER_03]: And again, I put Rob Riner on that list.
1:39:13
[SPEAKER_03]: Who would you take off, maybe Jim Sheridan?
1:39:17
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, or I'm a Peter weir for dead poets.
1:39:20
[SPEAKER_13]: I mean, I think dead poets is a good movie, but I think it rolled the wave of the Robert Williams popularity and the way it affected people because of that powerful ending.
1:39:29
[SPEAKER_13]: But I don't, I would definitely put one hermit Sally over dead poets over my left foot.
1:39:34
[SPEAKER_13]: even possibly overborn on the fold of July.
1:39:36
[SPEAKER_13]: I notice that people might be yelling right now, but I don't think that's Oliver Stone's best film.
1:39:41
[SPEAKER_13]: Nor do I think that's Tom Cruise's best performance.
1:39:44
[SPEAKER_13]: That is Tom Cruise just walking out there into the drama world, but he's not 100% there.
1:39:49
[SPEAKER_13]: He's not there until Magnolia.
1:39:50
[SPEAKER_13]: He's not there to collateral.
1:39:52
[SPEAKER_13]: This is kind of his first foray.
1:39:53
[SPEAKER_13]: This is done to Capri on Avator.
1:39:55
[SPEAKER_13]: He's still figuring out how to be this massive dramatic star.
1:39:59
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think born on the full July is certainly a good film, but I don't think it's a great one.
1:40:02
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think when Harry Mitchell met Sally, resonates much more than born on the fourth of July, in my opinion, and is consistently still better.
1:40:10
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, we've talked a lot about the movies that didn't quite hit when they initially came out.
1:40:15
[SPEAKER_03]: That's not really true when Harry Mincelli.
1:40:17
[SPEAKER_03]: It is certainly true of things like the Princess Bride or Spinal Tap.
1:40:20
[SPEAKER_03]: It's certainly true of Citizen Kane and whole bunch of other movies we talked about.
1:40:23
[SPEAKER_03]: I think there's another category that we haven't really talked about, which is the movie that feels really powerful when it comes out, but doesn't actually have the hold on you over the decades.
1:40:34
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah.
1:40:35
[SPEAKER_03]: Not really talking about Born on the Fourth of July.
1:40:40
[SPEAKER_03]: It really, really racked me.
1:40:41
[SPEAKER_03]: But we're not really talking about it now.
1:40:44
[SPEAKER_03]: And when Hangman Sally, we're going to be talking about forever.
1:40:47
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
1:40:47
[SPEAKER_13]: And of course, this is all factored in.
1:40:50
[SPEAKER_13]: Well, it's all with the understanding that do the right thing arguably belongs in the best picture, best director, probably best supporting actor role there, you could argue with maybe then anybody want to pick out of there for sure.
1:41:05
[SPEAKER_13]: But yeah, I mean, that's the understand there, of course, the screenplay as well.
1:41:08
[SPEAKER_13]: But yeah, I mean, this is the thing when you look at.
1:41:11
[SPEAKER_13]: when Harry Metzalli, it's funny, you're right Steve, there are just films that resonate, and you don't know they're gonna resonate all these years later, and their films that initially are bangers, and then you get a little bit of time pass to me, like, yeah, they're not as strong as I remember than being.
1:41:26
[SPEAKER_13]: I mean, we're not even mentioning cinema parody, so, which is arguably one of the greatest films ever made and certainly belongs in the best director, Best Picture category, it only was nominated for Best One Language Film, which is a fucking crime, in my opinion.
1:41:38
[SPEAKER_13]: I mean, totally redo this Oscars.
1:41:40
[SPEAKER_13]: If we did a whole live show redo in these Oscars, I would redo 1989 in a heartbeat in a heart.
1:41:46
[SPEAKER_03]: It's actually, well, you know, as I think we mentioned, if not, we should mention right here.
1:41:51
[SPEAKER_03]: We are having our second annual cinephiles awards on March 14th, the day before this year's Oscars.
1:41:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Just when, you know, there's nothing saying we actually can't do this.
1:42:02
[SPEAKER_03]: that we can't pick a year and redo the Academy Awards with all of our cinephiles voting and see what the right and one thing I would definitely say is that we can use, because we use wherever fucking rules we want, is that we use today's rules where you're not limited to five best picture nominees that we connect, because
1:42:20
[SPEAKER_03]: If there had been nine or ten best picture options, but with very much Sally and do the right thing would be on this list.
1:42:26
[SPEAKER_13]: There's just no question about it, you know, maybe even sent him a parody, so for sure.
1:42:30
[SPEAKER_03]: And absolutely sent him a parody, so 100%.
1:42:33
[SPEAKER_03]: We have another question from our patrons.
1:42:35
[SPEAKER_03]: This comes from Matt Correa.
1:42:37
[SPEAKER_03]: Who asks?
1:42:38
[SPEAKER_03]: And this is what we've been waiting for this whole time.
1:42:40
[SPEAKER_03]: What is your take on the central question at the beginning of the film?
1:42:44
[SPEAKER_03]: Can many women be friends without the sex part getting in the way?
1:42:48
[SPEAKER_03]: And then he asks does the film answer the question?
1:42:50
[SPEAKER_03]: The final act shows sex complicating their friendship and then ultimately falling in love, which seems to answer no.
1:42:58
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you think the film ultimately undermines the idea of men and women being platonic friends in real life and what impact do you think this had on the culture of the late 80s and early 90s?
1:43:09
[SPEAKER_03]: Wow, big question, right?
1:43:11
[SPEAKER_13]: Massive question.
1:43:12
[SPEAKER_13]: So I would say this for my own personal experience.
1:43:15
[SPEAKER_13]: Yes, I think men and women can be friends.
1:43:16
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think it's an essential part of life.
1:43:19
[SPEAKER_13]: If you're a man to have a female friend and fear of female to have a woman friend, or however you identify to have friends who identify in different ways, because it gives you different perspective in life.
1:43:29
[SPEAKER_13]: And different perspective on how things are going about in life.
1:43:32
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think it's always important to hear from a number of perspectives.
1:43:36
[SPEAKER_13]: So I do think it's essential.
1:43:37
[SPEAKER_13]: I do think it is possible, even with people you're attracted to, you know, you can have friendship there and respect the boundaries of that friendship.
1:43:45
[SPEAKER_13]: Now, when it comes to this particular thing, I think what's amazing about the film is that it turns the question on its head and doesn't answer it one way or another because what it essentially tells you is the greatest relationships are built from friendship.
1:43:59
[SPEAKER_13]: and a genuine friendship, a genuine like and understanding and seeing each other as you put up pointed out so well Steve about Sally, she was desperate so for someone to see her for who she is and by seeing her accepting her loving her and loving those things about her.
1:44:15
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think Billy Chris, are they carry becoming the friend to her first?
1:44:19
[SPEAKER_13]: and then be getting into the relationship, because the attraction has always been there since the beginning, even their first car ride, certainly Harry had a bit more of a traction for Sally, and then later it was reciprocated, but certainly I think the greatest relationships to me come from the greatest friendships.
1:44:37
[SPEAKER_13]: So to me, that seems to be the answer to that question.
1:44:41
[SPEAKER_13]: They're answering it by not answering it, which I think is smart.
1:44:44
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's so right and you made help me clarify my ideas about this, which is that I think what people talk about this question, they're focusing a lot on the sex part and they're not focusing on the friend part, is that I think that because that's what this movie is actually about a friendship.
1:45:01
[SPEAKER_03]: It is so much more edited about a friendship that exists at the heart of a romantic relationship.
1:45:08
[SPEAKER_03]: It is not a romantic relationship that builds a friendship.
1:45:11
[SPEAKER_03]: you know what I mean right like and so and I think that the place because when I first saw this and frankly I think it had to do with my youth and testosterone level what Harry said at the beginning the movie of the sex parts always getting getting away I was like yeah you know and and a I'm older and I think it's it's the in the way part which is the where the movie where Harry is incorrect at the beginning I think
1:45:36
[SPEAKER_03]: In general, particularly when you're younger, if you are heterosexual and with the person of the opposite sex, I think thoughts are going to come into people's minds.
1:45:46
[SPEAKER_03]: There could be stuff.
1:45:48
[SPEAKER_03]: but it's the determination that that will get in the way that it will ruin the friendship.
1:45:52
[SPEAKER_03]: That's where I reject the premise is like, and I agree with you, I think your point and one of the things that I think really does happen so much more after this movie, I have all sorts of women friends, and you have women friends.
1:46:03
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's made you not only just a better, more understanding person, I don't mean you, I'm gonna be all of us.
1:46:09
[SPEAKER_03]: you know, more understanding people, but also more capable of having a healthy relationship because of these friendships.
1:46:17
[SPEAKER_03]: And the other thing I think about this is like, it's like my feelings about the best episodes of Star Trek.
1:46:23
[SPEAKER_03]: Is the best episodes of Star Trek do pose moral questions, but they don't actually always answer them because there isn't an answer.
1:46:31
[SPEAKER_03]: The point is that we should be thinking about this.
1:46:33
[SPEAKER_03]: This is a, this is, we, this movie is a deliberation on this idea of male female friendship and sexual attraction.
1:46:41
[SPEAKER_03]: And we've been all over the place.
1:46:42
[SPEAKER_03]: And I don't think the movie has to make a conclusion because these two people end up in love.
1:46:47
[SPEAKER_03]: That's just what happens to Harry and Sal.
1:46:50
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
1:46:51
[SPEAKER_03]: You know.
1:46:52
[SPEAKER_03]: So, we've reached the time where we have to give our final thoughts.
1:46:56
[SPEAKER_03]: Now, there's more to say, okay, well, that's funny, because that's kind of what I was going to say.
1:47:01
[SPEAKER_03]: I feel like I've given my thoughts for the most part.
1:47:04
[SPEAKER_03]: I think this is damn close to a perfect movie as you can possibly get.
1:47:07
[SPEAKER_03]: The script is amazing.
1:47:09
[SPEAKER_03]: The way it came about,
1:47:10
[SPEAKER_03]: directly affects the collaboration, the exploration, the ideas between Rob and Nora and everybody else on the set.
1:47:16
[SPEAKER_03]: That's where the movie comes from.
1:47:18
[SPEAKER_03]: It is so much fun.
1:47:19
[SPEAKER_03]: It's every shot, every moment, every bit of performance, every music choice is contributing to the whole.
1:47:26
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's one of those movies that I could even after spending all this time with you researching it, studying it, I can still go watch it today and have a great time.
1:47:35
[SPEAKER_13]: I agree with you 100% and you know this is one of those films that you I think you mentioned earlier it's one of those films that for
1:47:44
[SPEAKER_13]: It has its own magic.
1:47:46
[SPEAKER_13]: And the magic is what keeps us coming back.
1:47:49
[SPEAKER_13]: And to me, I look at the film the way Harry looks at Sally.
1:47:53
[SPEAKER_13]: I look at the film as I like the one I watched this film, I can still smell this film on my clothes.
1:47:59
[SPEAKER_13]: I can still, you know, this film is like, what are those films that when I remember it, it's a film I want to talk about when I wake up at the morning and when I go to bed at night.
1:48:06
[SPEAKER_13]: It's just incredible in the way it holds on still all these years later.
1:48:10
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think what this film gets inside, if it works for you,
1:48:13
[SPEAKER_13]: you'll never like all of this film because there's just so much joy and so much knowledge to be acquired from this movie delivered in a humorous package delivered in honest package in a real package and it can go along with you.
1:48:27
[SPEAKER_13]: If you watch it at a young enough age, you can go along with this film and as you age and get older, you revisit this film and you start to see completely different perspectives from Harry's point of view from Sally's point of view and understand them even better as you get
1:48:42
[SPEAKER_13]: on them.
1:48:43
[SPEAKER_13]: And I think that's one of the gifts of this movie for real.
1:48:46
[SPEAKER_13]: And the soundtrack, I think is just incredible to go back to, such a comfort food.
1:48:50
[SPEAKER_13]: This is one of those ones that wraps around you like a blanket.
1:48:52
[SPEAKER_13]: If it works for you, it just brings you comfort.
1:48:54
[SPEAKER_13]: When you're down, when you're sad, when you're happy, you can watch it anytime, and you're just kind of disappear into the world of the film.
1:49:01
[SPEAKER_13]: And of course, that I'm one reason is Rob Reiner and Nora Fron script.
1:49:04
[SPEAKER_13]: So as you highlight it, Steve, they're just so perfectly in tandem together and catching two of these actors perfectly in their prime delivering two of the greatest performances of their careers.
1:49:14
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, that's what we think of when Harry Metzalli, of course we'd love to hear your thoughts.
1:49:18
[SPEAKER_03]: We'd love to hear your response to the final question of can men and women still be friends or does the sex part get in the way?
1:49:24
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1:49:31
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1:49:35
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1:49:40
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1:49:44
[SPEAKER_03]: We love seeing them there and interacting with you.
1:49:46
[SPEAKER_03]: If you want to support the show or ask a question like we've heard in the course of these episodes, you can do it on patreon.com slash the cinephiles as well as Apple podcasts.
1:49:55
[SPEAKER_03]: And if you want to reach me, it's SR Morris on Twitter and SR Morris one on Instagram.
1:49:58
[SPEAKER_03]: John, how about you?
1:49:59
[SPEAKER_13]: Oh, you can always reach me at the Rooka says on all social media.
1:50:02
[SPEAKER_13]: I would appreciate your hanging out there and subscribing to all my social media.
1:50:06
[SPEAKER_13]: And also subscribing to my YouTube channel, YouTube.com slash John Rooka says, we're all my reactions, reviews, shows like the hot mic, the cinema, I was starting the hot mic, the geek buddies and the Jedi way, and now spill the tequila are all there on my channel.
1:50:21
[SPEAKER_13]: And the truth, of course, whenever I get in the mood to do it.
1:50:24
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's it for this week.
1:50:25
[SPEAKER_03]: We're going to continue our season of Rob Reiner with a few good men.
1:50:29
[SPEAKER_03]: And of course, as we mentioned earlier on March 14th, the Saturday day before the Oscars.
1:50:35
[SPEAKER_03]: We are having the second annual.
1:50:37
[SPEAKER_03]: Senifile Academy Award where you get to vote for the winners.