Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Cruise ship bliss turns deadly. Murder on the high seas.

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Cruise ship bliss turns deadly. Murder on the high seas. · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

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Speaker 1: Nancy Grace is coming to Fox Nation. I Want Justice.
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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace premieres March ninth, only on
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Speaker 1: Fox Nation. This is about the victims that have lost
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Speaker 1: their lives on cruise ships. She's supposed to be the
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Speaker 1: happiest time of your life with your friends. You're with
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Speaker 1: your family and your children, your spouse, You're on vacation,
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Speaker 1: not working for seven wonderful days. What goes Crime Stories
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Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. I'm Nancy Grace, Welcome to Crime Stories.
0:45
Speaker 1: Thank you from being with us. You know I'm planning
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Speaker 1: a Disney cruise and no that's not a plug. We've
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Speaker 1: been on two Disney cruises with the children, fantastic. I'm
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Speaker 1: planning another one. And you know why because when I
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Speaker 1: think cruise, I don't think murder, even though I think
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Speaker 1: murder all the time, I don't put cruise and murder
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Speaker 1: together in the same sentence. But maybe I should take
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Speaker 1: a listen to our friends Stephen Fabian. The family of
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Speaker 1: five boarded the Emerald Princess in Seattle on Sunday for
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Speaker 1: a seven day cruise. These photos were taken just before
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Speaker 1: boarding the ship. The Emerald Princess with forty five hundred
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Speaker 1: passengers and crew headed up the magnificent Alaskan Coastline for
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Speaker 1: a once in a lifetime cruise on Tuesday night. The
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Speaker 1: passengers were being entertained by, of all things, a murder
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Speaker 1: mystery dinner. Then came the sound of a terrible fight
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Speaker 1: that had broken out in one of the staterooms on
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Speaker 1: Deck nine. Then came the disturbing announcement to the entire ship,
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Speaker 1: calling for medical and security personnel to head straight to
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Speaker 1: the stateroom. I spoke with passenger Vic Simpson on the
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Speaker 1: Emerald Princess because they were doing a murder mystery theater
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Speaker 1: about a death on a cruise ship. I think most
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Speaker 1: of us in there thought it was just part of
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Speaker 1: the dramatic effect of what they were doing. Did the
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Speaker 1: person sound frantic? He did, santaniced my stars. I've seen
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Speaker 1: those murder mystery dinners, and so when the people heard screaming,
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Speaker 1: they thought it was part of their murder mystery dinner.
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Speaker 1: How wrong were they? It was an actual scream from
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Speaker 1: a murder again. I mean, see, Grace, this is climb story.
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Speaker 1: Thanks for being with us with me an all star
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Speaker 1: panel to break it down and put it together again.
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Speaker 1: For you. Kathleen Murphy, we're now North Carolina lawyer. You
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Speaker 1: can find her at NSE Domestic Law dot com. James
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Speaker 1: Shellnutt twenty seven years metro major k SWAT officer, now lawyer,
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Speaker 1: psychoanalyst to the stars. Doctor Bethany Marshall joining us from
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Speaker 1: the course Beverly Hills at doctor Bethany Marshall dot com.
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Speaker 1: And a renowned female medical examiner. You don't find many
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Speaker 1: of those, doctor Michelle Dupree out of Carolina. Not only
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Speaker 1: medical examiner, but she's the author of Homicide Investigation Field Guide,
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Speaker 1: which is a must read if you're a crime sleuth.
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Speaker 1: But right now, to Ray Caputo, lead news anchors for
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Speaker 1: Orlando's Morning News ninety six point five, WDBO, I was
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Speaker 1: just listening to our friend Stephen Fabian at Inside Edition,
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Speaker 1: Ray Kipputo, I don't normally put cruise with murder in
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Speaker 1: the same sentence, but what those people heard were actually
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Speaker 1: the screams of a woman on the cruise, the Emerald
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Speaker 1: Princess with her family. What was her mode of death? Well,
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Speaker 1: Tenneth and Christie mens and ears they were in their
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Speaker 1: cata when their two daughters with an explosive argument break
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Speaker 1: No whoa ray kaputo. The alphabet goes A to Z.
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Speaker 1: I'm asking you a okay, because in all crime investigations
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Speaker 1: you start at the beginning. Ray ka puto. What was
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Speaker 1: the mode of death? It was blunt forced trauma from
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Speaker 1: close fist. Nancy, she was beaten to death. Huh blunt
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Speaker 1: force trauma, closed fist, you know. To doctor Bethany Marshall,
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Speaker 1: psychoanalyst joining me out of Beverly Hills. No offense, doctor Bethany,
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Speaker 1: but I wanted to get your head out of rodeo
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Speaker 1: drive translation rodeo when you go on a cruise ship.
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Speaker 1: And I've done this myself and I actually write about
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Speaker 1: it and the book that I've just written, don't be
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Speaker 1: a victim. You have a false sense of complacency. Now
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Speaker 1: I felt that way. We were out on the main debt. Bethany.
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Speaker 1: Picture this at night after supper and Disney puts up,
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Speaker 1: of course Disney movie, and the children can play in
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Speaker 1: the pool, or we can play in with them. And
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Speaker 1: it's at night out on the you're watching a Disney movie.
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Speaker 1: Of course, the water is only up to here. Nobody's
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Speaker 1: going to drown. And it was just so calming, and relaxing.
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Speaker 1: It's easy to slip into a sense of complacency and
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Speaker 1: thing everything's okay on a cruise ship, Bethany. But Nancy,
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Speaker 1: it's calm and complacent for you because you're in the
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Speaker 1: normal marriage. You don't have a toxic family. I don't know.
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Speaker 1: You may need to ask my husband about that, whether
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Speaker 1: it's normal or not. But go ahead, But think about this.
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Speaker 1: For some families when they go on a cruise, there
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Speaker 1: are idealized expectations. You don't have. Some people even there.
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Speaker 1: They're fifty five years old and it's their birthday and
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Speaker 1: they get their feelings hurt because everybody doesn't, you know,
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Speaker 1: congratulate them on Facebook. No, actually I doubt know that
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Speaker 1: because I don't really recognize my own birthdays. But go ahead,
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Speaker 1: have your way well out there and Beverly Hills. That
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Speaker 1: a grown person gets mad somebody doesn't Facebook, then okay,
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Speaker 1: go ahead and your alternate universe, Bethy A, all right,
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Speaker 1: and my ultimate universe. Some some adults act like babies.
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Speaker 1: They go into the cations, holidays with these idealized expectations
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Speaker 1: that they're going to be special, they're going to be loved, um,
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Speaker 1: they're going to have these wonderful gourmet meals, romantic evenings,
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Speaker 1: great sex, intimacy, and then let the attract sex into
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Speaker 1: everything everything, No matter what I ask you, sex gets
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Speaker 1: in there. Go ahead, Hey, hey, it was a romantic cruise.
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Speaker 1: They did have their family along. Christie had her father,
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Speaker 1: two brothers, they had their two daughters. But somehow the
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Speaker 1: idealized view of what would happen got shattered that faithful night.
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Speaker 1: The couple must have been happened fighting. You mix in
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Speaker 1: alcohol of some you know what you're right. Let me
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Speaker 1: stop you right there about the alcohol. I want you
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Speaker 1: to take a listen now to our friend Dan Raskin
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Speaker 1: at k youth Tay. I heard terrible screaming. I know
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Speaker 1: it was no normal, but now those girls have lost
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Speaker 1: both parents. Their father, Kenneth Massonarius, is in custody, accused
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Speaker 1: of the brutal murder. The family member says she never
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Speaker 1: saw any serious marital problems between the two. I've never
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Speaker 1: seen Kenny an angry person. Ever. The horrific screams could
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Speaker 1: be heard by passengers about nine o'clock on Tuesday night.
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Speaker 1: One passenger says his wife saw Massonarius on the balcony
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Speaker 1: covered in blood as if wanting to jump my wife's
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Speaker 1: registered nurse. She thought he was going to jump over
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Speaker 1: the rail and at one time he put his hand
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Speaker 1: on the rail and says his rear on it. That
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Speaker 1: she started yelling and get back in, and the ship
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Speaker 1: announced give a security team to that area, and another
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Speaker 1: passenger heard screams coming from a daughter of the little
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Speaker 1: girls from that room came running out, calling for help
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Speaker 1: that her parents had been in a fight. She found
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Speaker 1: a pretty death bread. You know, straight out, Kathleen Murphy,
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Speaker 1: North Carolina, family lawyer, no stranger to a courtroom, Kathleen.
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Speaker 1: You know, when you get alcohol, it's like pouring gas
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Speaker 1: on a fire. What normally would have been just an argument.
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Speaker 1: You know, my husband and I never argued. We hardly
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Speaker 1: ever argued until we had children. And when we do argue,
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Speaker 1: it's usually about something to do with the children or
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Speaker 1: my eighty nine year old mother that lives with me,
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Speaker 1: as you and I've discussed. But here we hear that
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Speaker 1: alcohol was involved. Now you're a domestic lawyer. I'd rather
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Speaker 1: try a serial killer, Kathleen, which I have done than
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Speaker 1: that in between two people in a domestic as we
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Speaker 1: call them in cop talk and a domestic they'll shoot you.
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Speaker 1: They don't care because they're so angry and incensed, and
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Speaker 1: then you pour alcohol on it. Now, let me ask you,
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Speaker 1: Kathleen Murphy, what is it with domestics. They're liable to
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Speaker 1: go sideways just like that, Nancy. You know I've I've
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Speaker 1: said to you before or The difficulty is everybody is
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Speaker 1: putting out these appearances on social media that there's wonderful,
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Speaker 1: happy family, but the reality that I see every single
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Speaker 1: day is that there is so many problems. There are
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Speaker 1: so many problems that couples are having and they're not
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Speaker 1: dealing with them appropriately. So when we have alcohol to
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Speaker 1: the mixture, the truth is coming out. It was an
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Speaker 1: abusive relationship and the reality is the children were on
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Speaker 1: the cruise. David and I typically don't even raise there
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Speaker 1: are our exceptions, of course, don't even raise our voices.
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Speaker 1: If we argue, we do not raise our voices. Certainly,
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Speaker 1: don't curse much. Let's pick up a knife or slug
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Speaker 1: each other in front of the children. Absolutely not. I
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Speaker 1: think they should see you disagreeing because you can't live
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Speaker 1: together and agree on everything. But why does it have
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Speaker 1: to go so out of control? Time stories with Nancy Grace.
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Speaker 1: For those of you Jess joining us, we are talking
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Speaker 1: about cruise ship murders, and I want you to take
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Speaker 1: a listen now to our friend Stephen Fabian and Inside Edition.
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Speaker 1: It was supposed to be a romantic wedding anniversary cruised
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Speaker 1: to Alaska, but the FBI says it ended in murder.
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Speaker 1: Thirty nine year old Christie Manzanira As was killed in
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Speaker 1: her cabin on the Emerald Princess and what the FBI
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Speaker 1: says was a domestic dispute. Her husband, Kenneth, is in custody.
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Speaker 1: Christie had a severe head wound and blood was spread
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Speaker 1: throughout the room, says an FBI criminal complaint. Her husband
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Speaker 1: allegedly told the witness she would not stop laughing at me.
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Speaker 1: My life is over. Kenneth Manzonira's reportedly tried to jump overboard,
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Speaker 1: but was restrained by the ship's Christie and Kenneth were
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Speaker 1: celebrating eighteen years of marriage. Their three teenage daughters were
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Speaker 1: whipped them. Passenger Chris Semant, one of the little girls
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Speaker 1: from that room, came running out calling for help that
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Speaker 1: her parents had been in a fight. I spoke with
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Speaker 1: family member Casey Hunt in Utah emotionally, it's just hard
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Speaker 1: to comprehend having someone so sweet and so perfect taken
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Speaker 1: in the primal of their life like that. Over what
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Speaker 1: the husband says, She wouldn't quit laughing at me, so
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Speaker 1: he kills her, and you know, I want to run
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Speaker 1: out to James shell Nutt twenty seven years Metro Major
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Speaker 1: case detective SWAT officer, now lawyer, James shell Nutt, did
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Speaker 1: you hear something very critical? Blood was all over the room?
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Speaker 1: You know what? That tells me that it was a
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Speaker 1: prolonged attack. It wasn't just one blow. She tried to
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Speaker 1: get away from him, hence the blood all over the room.
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Speaker 1: If it had been once sneaking up on her, let's
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Speaker 1: just say, from behind and wham to the back of
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Speaker 1: the head, there would not be all over the room.
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Speaker 1: So that tells me that she was screaming, that she
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Speaker 1: was trying to get away, that she was fighting back,
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Speaker 1: but she could not fight back. She could not win
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Speaker 1: against him. And I wonder what the blunt force trauma object,
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Speaker 1: how it was influtible. What does that tell you the
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Speaker 1: blood pattern? James shell Nutt, Well, I mean exactly what
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Speaker 1: you said. I mean that you know this is a
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Speaker 1: violent attack. It went all and this lady defended herself,
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Speaker 1: I'm sure the best that she could as a victim.
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Speaker 1: She was eventually overpowered. It matches exactly what the daughters
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Speaker 1: said later in the investigation. And this is something that
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Speaker 1: went on for me. Well, speaking of the daughters talking
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Speaker 1: later in the investigation. Back to Ray Kaputo, lead news anchor,
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Speaker 1: Orlando Morning News ninety six point five w DBO. Ray, again,
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Speaker 1: thank you for being with us. What did the daughters say?
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Speaker 1: And all this is unfolding on a family cruise, on
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Speaker 1: this beautiful cruise liner. What the children say, Ray, Well,
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Speaker 1: what of the girls was saying after the attack that
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Speaker 1: I knew that he would do this, and you know,
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Speaker 1: it seemed to be something that the kids were aware
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Speaker 1: of the you know, they knew their parents trouble. But
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Speaker 1: but also I mean that the girls were just hysterical
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Speaker 1: because they saw this going on. They actually witnessed their
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Speaker 1: father just straddling their mom and pumbling her. So the
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Speaker 1: girls were hysterical. But when the girls had said, yeah,
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Speaker 1: that she had saw you thought that her father was
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Speaker 1: going to do something like this, mess says a lot, Nancy,
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Speaker 1: you know, to doctor Michelle du Pree, renowned medical examiner
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Speaker 1: out of South Carolina and author of homicide Investigation Field Guy.
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Speaker 1: Doctor Dupree, you know I could listen to you analyze
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Speaker 1: mortal wounds all day long. You have handled a lot
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Speaker 1: of autopsies that were the result of domestic attacks, and
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Speaker 1: doctor Dupree, I can't tell you how many cases I've handled,
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Speaker 1: all felonies where everybody around them nie something horrible was
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Speaker 1: going to happen. It's like a ticking time bomb waiting
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Speaker 1: to go off, as in this where the little girls
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Speaker 1: knew that one day their dad was going to do
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Speaker 1: something horrible. How can you look at a body and
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Speaker 1: determine what exactly happened. I know you may not be
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Speaker 1: able to determine the order of the blows, which one
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Speaker 1: came first, But as far as a blow to the
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Speaker 1: head being a mortal wound, how does that happen? Why?
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Speaker 1: That's an excellent question. And what we do is we
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Speaker 1: actually look at the area of the body that was struck.
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Speaker 1: We look at the intensity that was struck. So when
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Speaker 1: we look who WHOA You're the MD, I'm just the JD.
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Speaker 1: What do you mean You can look at a body
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Speaker 1: and you can tell the intensity, because we can look
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Speaker 1: at the type of force that it would cause that
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Speaker 1: would be needed to cause that type of an injury.
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Speaker 1: For example, fist are going to cause injury to the
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Speaker 1: soft tissue, but a baseball bat is going to crush
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Speaker 1: the skull. And so looking at the different injuries and
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Speaker 1: knowing what kind of force that would take to make
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Speaker 1: an injury like that, then we can tell what actually happened.
15:05
Speaker 1: You know another thing I'm fascinated by, and this really
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Speaker 1: became evident. You and I discussed this, Doctor Dupree. Do
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Speaker 1: you remember doctor Teresa Sievers who was killed in Benita Springs, Florida.
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Speaker 1: Her husband cooked up some crazy plot with who was
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Speaker 1: one of his buddies and his friend and the beautiful
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Speaker 1: mom of their girls. Doctor brought home all the money
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Speaker 1: to the home. Not judging, but now he wasn't happy.
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Speaker 1: Wasn't happy with the beautiful home and the beautiful wife
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Speaker 1: and the children and the money and the blah, the blah,
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Speaker 1: the blah. She was killed with a claw hammer, and
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Speaker 1: they could actually match up the hammer to the wounds
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Speaker 1: in her head. What I'm trying to say, and not
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Speaker 1: a very good way. You can actually tell the weapon
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Speaker 1: that was used to inflict the blow, like a baseball bat,
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Speaker 1: like a metal rod, like a hammer. How would you
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Speaker 1: tell if it was with a fist as is alleged
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Speaker 1: in this case. Exactly, Nancy. We cause a pattern injuries,
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Speaker 1: and we can look at the pattern of injury on
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Speaker 1: the body and we can tell again what type of
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Speaker 1: weapon caused that. A baseball bat is going to cause
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Speaker 1: a different injury than a fist. A fist is going
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Speaker 1: to be much more blunted. It's not going to be
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Speaker 1: a specific injury like a hammer would leave around defect.
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Speaker 1: So we're going to look at that type of injury,
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Speaker 1: the bruising, the destruction of the tissue, and determine that
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Speaker 1: type of weapon. You know what's interesting about this, James
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Speaker 1: shellnutt is typically at trial you cannot get in autopsy
16:43
Speaker 1: photos due to there typically grizzly nature, unless and until
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Speaker 1: you can convince a judge that this particular photo shows
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Speaker 1: something that only can be shown in an autopsy photo.
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Speaker 1: I learned that lesson James, when I had to show
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Speaker 1: a jury let's oh yes, and an autopsy if there
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Speaker 1: had injuries, the skin is removed or pulled back from
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Speaker 1: the skull, and that was shown to the jury because
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Speaker 1: there were bruises under the skin not apparent on the
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Speaker 1: overlay of the skin. In this case, that may be
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Speaker 1: necessary to show an autopsy photo to show how the
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Speaker 1: medical examiner can tell the jury beyond a reasonable doubt
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Speaker 1: that this was inflicted with a fist. Agree or disagree, Shelnett.
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Speaker 1: And it has the dual benefit for the prosecution and
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Speaker 1: for the victim to get this jury man and to
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Speaker 1: let them see what happened to the victim before I
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Speaker 1: go on to our next story. Cruise, ship and murder
17:45
Speaker 1: just shouldn't go together, but guess what they do. And
17:48
Speaker 1: that's about Lonnie Cocante's I want to go back to
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Speaker 1: doctor Bethany Marshall, Doctor Bethany, please he try try to
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Speaker 1: jump overboard? Really didn't try very hard, did he? Why
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Speaker 1: do killers always say I tried to kill myself, but whoops,
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Speaker 1: I kill my wife? Why and anthy? When they get
18:09
Speaker 1: into trouble, they make up all kinds of things. We
18:12
Speaker 1: call it malingering. Malingering is the make up? Well, I
18:16
Speaker 1: call it something else, but I'm not gonna say that
18:18
Speaker 1: on Fox Nation because I sware I give up cursing
18:21
Speaker 1: when I had the children. The last thing I need
18:24
Speaker 1: is Jesus mad at me. Okay, on top of everything else.
18:26
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna say what I call it. But why
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Speaker 1: do they always say, Oh, I tried to kill him myself,
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Speaker 1: but that didn't work, so I killed my wife. Well,
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Speaker 1: the most common thing that is malingered is Amnetzsche. I
18:37
Speaker 1: don't I blocked out. I don't remember. She was laughing
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Speaker 1: at me, and then I don't know where we just
18:43
Speaker 1: saw that Bethany Molly Tibbitts, the gorgeous jogger. The guy
18:48
Speaker 1: that sounds right killed her allegedly said he forgot he
18:54
Speaker 1: killed her and put her in the trunk, and then
18:57
Speaker 1: he saw her earbuds in his lap, and suddenly he
18:59
Speaker 1: remembered that her body was in his trunk. Guys, that
19:02
Speaker 1: is just one example of murder on a cruise ship.
19:06
Speaker 1: And this is weighing very heavily on my mind as
19:08
Speaker 1: I plan our Alaskan cruise with the children on Disney.
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Speaker 1: Maybe I should plan a backyard camp out. Maybe that
19:15
Speaker 1: would be a safer option. But so far, no murders
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Speaker 1: on Disney that I know of. I want to talk about.
19:21
Speaker 1: Lonnie could contests, Hi, guys, Nancy Grace. Here, I have
19:35
Speaker 1: investigated and prosecuted literally thousands of felony cases. I have
19:42
Speaker 1: covered literally thousands of cases of missing people, adults and children,
19:48
Speaker 1: unsolved homicides, violent crimes. My question is what can we
19:54
Speaker 1: do about it. I don't want to just sit back
19:57
Speaker 1: and report on it. I want to take action, and
20:00
Speaker 1: I know you must feel the same way. And here
20:03
Speaker 1: is the news we have all worked so hard to
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20:57
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. You're listening to crime Stories
21:04
Speaker 1: and I'm Nancy Grace, but this isn't about me. This
21:08
Speaker 1: is about the victims that have lost their lives on
21:13
Speaker 1: cruise ships. She's supposed to be the happiest time of
21:15
Speaker 1: your life with your friends. You're with your family and
21:18
Speaker 1: your children, your spouse. You're on vacation, not working for
21:22
Speaker 1: seven wonderful days. What goes wrong? I want you to
21:25
Speaker 1: take a listen to our friend Anna Garcia of Crime
21:28
Speaker 1: Watch Daily. After three days on board, he and Micky
21:31
Speaker 1: were in their cabin late at night when Micky told
21:34
Speaker 1: him she was going to the ships canteen eleven o'clock
21:37
Speaker 1: toob o'cock at night. Ronnie decides to go to bed
21:39
Speaker 1: and Mickey tells them that she wants to go get
21:42
Speaker 1: a cup of tea and necessarily last he sees of her.
21:45
Speaker 1: Lonnie says he woke up hours later, but she still
21:48
Speaker 1: wasn't back. He says he searched everywhere on board for her,
21:53
Speaker 1: even sexed with other passengers, but there was no sign
21:56
Speaker 1: of Michie. No one on the ship saw her after
22:00
Speaker 1: the two of them went to their room. After being
22:03
Speaker 1: questioned and released, Lonnie is put up at a hotel
22:06
Speaker 1: in Naples while Italian authorities investigating Mickey's disappearance, but does
22:11
Speaker 1: he say the help with a search. The very next day,
22:15
Speaker 1: Lonnie catches a flame back to the States and just
22:17
Speaker 1: listen to where he lands. After one night at the hotel,
22:21
Speaker 1: he ended up flying back to the United States and
22:24
Speaker 1: went directly to the home of wife's number three. Wait
22:27
Speaker 1: a minute, you mean he leaves that very Why does
22:31
Speaker 1: he leave? Straight out to you? Ray Kaput joining me
22:34
Speaker 1: from Orlando. Ray, tell me what happened to Lonnie? Please? Well,
22:38
Speaker 1: well Lonnie, yeah, I mean him and Mickey they were
22:41
Speaker 1: they were married I believe in two thousand or late nineties,
22:44
Speaker 1: and they divorced not long after, about six years and
22:46
Speaker 1: early two thousand one. But they remained in close contact Nancy,
22:49
Speaker 1: and they were having Wait a minute, they're divorced and
22:52
Speaker 1: they go on a cruise together. Yeah, okay, right, right,
22:55
Speaker 1: right right, Bethany Marshall, I gotta go straight out to
22:57
Speaker 1: you everybody again, you're joining our Fox Nation. Nancy graces
23:00
Speaker 1: his crime story. Thank you for being with us. We're
23:02
Speaker 1: talking about cruise ships and murder, doctor, Bethany Marshall. Is
23:06
Speaker 1: that a good idea to be divorced and then you
23:08
Speaker 1: go on a cruise together, a romantic cruise? I mean,
23:10
Speaker 1: as I always say what people ask me love advice,
23:13
Speaker 1: there's a reason they're an X or they call it
23:16
Speaker 1: a break up because it's broken, right, I mean, oh, well,
23:20
Speaker 1: I got I'm stealing it. It's mine. Now, this relationship
23:23
Speaker 1: had gone terribly sour, he had remarried. They go on
23:26
Speaker 1: some kind of a cruise to rekindle their romance. But
23:29
Speaker 1: at the same time they have this property in common
23:33
Speaker 1: that they are in have these she has half, he
23:38
Speaker 1: has half, and he appears to have the kind of personality.
23:41
Speaker 1: And I've seen this in my private practice in Beverly Hills,
23:44
Speaker 1: where one person has the assets and wants them all
23:47
Speaker 1: for themselves. You know, maybe they've built a business together,
23:51
Speaker 1: or they have a home, or they bought all this furniture,
23:53
Speaker 1: but there's one person who keeps holding the money and
23:56
Speaker 1: resenting the other person for sharing in the large So
24:00
Speaker 1: this is sort of boiling in the background for the
24:02
Speaker 1: two of them. Did you say one what did you say?
24:05
Speaker 1: One hordes and the other and then the others. How
24:08
Speaker 1: does that fit with being angry because they share the
24:11
Speaker 1: large ass? How can you be a hoarder? Because all
24:14
Speaker 1: he wanted all the assets for himself and he resented
24:17
Speaker 1: that she might share. What was rightfully heard? Oh I say,
24:20
Speaker 1: I say, I say what she mean, hold on just
24:22
Speaker 1: a second, Ray kimpute, did you tell me that he
24:25
Speaker 1: immediately leaves the ship and goes to the place of
24:28
Speaker 1: wife number three. How many wives did this guy have? Well,
24:31
Speaker 1: he did have three wives. Of them he married Mickey
24:33
Speaker 1: was his second wife, Nancy. But what's really perplexing is
24:37
Speaker 1: he got remarried very quickly after those two had gotten
24:40
Speaker 1: a divorce. So this was his third wife, and you know,
24:44
Speaker 1: for a while she was helping him, you know, kind
24:46
Speaker 1: of being an alibi for him, So she was sticking
24:48
Speaker 1: behind him, and you know, appeared like a valid relationship.
24:51
Speaker 1: But that third wife was eventually the undoing of Lonnie,
24:54
Speaker 1: which is what we later learned. You know, I want
24:56
Speaker 1: to go back to what happened. I want you to
24:58
Speaker 1: take a listen to our friend Anna Garcia. When Lonnie
25:02
Speaker 1: Cacontas met Mickey Kanasaki, he was in a sleete forties,
25:05
Speaker 1: already once divorced, and an attorney at a prominent Los
25:09
Speaker 1: Angeles law firm. She was seven years younger and a
25:12
Speaker 1: paralegal at his firm. When the two decided to marry
25:15
Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety five. Mickey's brother Tosi says things were
25:19
Speaker 1: going well until Mickey got winds of an alleged sexual
25:22
Speaker 1: encounter between Lonnie and a younger woman. It's all She's
25:27
Speaker 1: always thinking about that incident. Not long after that, Tosi says,
25:32
Speaker 1: Lonnie lost his job at that big law firm, and
25:34
Speaker 1: things went from bad to worse for the couple. His marriage,
25:38
Speaker 1: his job, his hand come. They all started going down
25:41
Speaker 1: pretty soon. The marriage breaks down completely, with Lonnie and
25:45
Speaker 1: Mickey filing for divorce. Lonnie moved out of their house
25:48
Speaker 1: in Lavera, rant California, and shortly after that, Mary's wife
25:52
Speaker 1: number three. Wow, he's certainly been busy. We're talking about
25:55
Speaker 1: the death of this beautiful wife. Mickey, Micky, Mary's Lonnie.
26:00
Speaker 1: She had been a paralegal. He was a lawyer. Right there,
26:03
Speaker 1: I see a power dynamic to doctor Bethany, he's a lawyer,
26:08
Speaker 1: she's the paralegal. They get married, and then she finds
26:12
Speaker 1: out he's sleeping around. They hadn't been married that long
26:16
Speaker 1: when it happened either, Doctor Bethany. Nancy. I was just
26:19
Speaker 1: thinking about this and your question about one holding the
26:21
Speaker 1: money and having the large est for themselves. What is
26:24
Speaker 1: usually a part of that picture is a power differential.
26:28
Speaker 1: Maybe somebody marrying somebody from another country where they don't
26:31
Speaker 1: know their rights in this particular country. I see this
26:34
Speaker 1: in my practice all the time. I see the wealthy
26:36
Speaker 1: athlete who gets the fifty million dollar contract he finds.
26:40
Speaker 1: You know what, Bethany, you've got some practice going on
26:43
Speaker 1: out there. You know to wow, Kathleen Murphy, you're the
26:47
Speaker 1: family lawyer. That's certainly a euphemism a family lawyer. It
26:52
Speaker 1: sounds like you're all sitting at the family supper table
26:55
Speaker 1: having a nice meal talking about the law, and that's
26:57
Speaker 1: not what it is at all. Kathy Murphy at nc
27:01
Speaker 1: Domestic law dot com. Kathleen, what concerns me this is
27:05
Speaker 1: now Defense attorneys will tell you all day long until
27:08
Speaker 1: they're blue in the face. It means nothing that he
27:11
Speaker 1: left the cruise ship before his wife's body was found
27:14
Speaker 1: and snugged up with wife number three. But I have
27:17
Speaker 1: a problem with that. You don't even wait to find
27:20
Speaker 1: to find your wife's body, Nancy. The situation on this
27:24
Speaker 1: case is so unbelievable because this cruise was to reconcile
27:30
Speaker 1: their relationships. And one of the things I tell my
27:34
Speaker 1: clients all the time is, if you're married, you go
27:37
Speaker 1: through a divorce. Come see me to do that pre
27:39
Speaker 1: nuptial before you go into your second marriage or before
27:43
Speaker 1: you go into your third marriage to avoid these problems.
27:47
Speaker 1: Oh oh, I'm in trouble. I didn't do a pre nup.
27:51
Speaker 1: Neither did I. I'm not sure who's going to kill
27:53
Speaker 1: who though, you know. So as we see this unfolding,
27:57
Speaker 1: they're going on the cruise to rekindle their relationship. She
28:01
Speaker 1: goes missing, you know, racapeuter. Let me be clear about
28:03
Speaker 1: the facts. How did it all go down? Does she
28:05
Speaker 1: go missing? They find her body in the water? How
28:08
Speaker 1: how was she found? Yeah? Well, Lonnie says that he
28:11
Speaker 1: went to bed one night. It was a couple of
28:12
Speaker 1: days and the cruise and he had, you know, taken
28:15
Speaker 1: an ambient and he said that Mickey wanted to go
28:17
Speaker 1: up for a cup of tea. And that's the last
28:20
Speaker 1: that he says. He oversay the man at whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Again,
28:24
Speaker 1: I've only been on Disney cruises, but they have twenty
28:26
Speaker 1: four hour service room service if you want it, and
28:30
Speaker 1: of course a children order cheese and crackers and pizza
28:32
Speaker 1: at like one o'clock in the morning. Can Harley I know,
28:36
Speaker 1: I smell pizza, and that's how I know they've done it.
28:38
Speaker 1: So why does she have to leave the room to
28:41
Speaker 1: go get a cup of tea? Okay, that's my first question,
28:43
Speaker 1: But go ahead, Raycapeuter, thank you for letting me break
28:46
Speaker 1: in there. Go ahead right. Well, Well, the next morning,
28:48
Speaker 1: Lonnie notices that that she's not even there until he
28:51
Speaker 1: reports her missing. James shell nutt Wait, she leaves the
28:56
Speaker 1: room to go get a cup of tea. That's like
28:58
Speaker 1: being at a hotel in New York City and you
29:02
Speaker 1: go downstairs to get a cup of tea instead of
29:04
Speaker 1: them bringing it up to room service at midnight, and
29:07
Speaker 1: then the husband doesn't notice she's missing till the next morning.
29:11
Speaker 1: That's not ringing a red bell of alarm to you
29:13
Speaker 1: shall not. Oh, the whole situation is ringing a larm.
29:17
Speaker 1: It's thrown up red flex everywhere. I mean, this guy
29:19
Speaker 1: now has just turned into really the number one suspect
29:22
Speaker 1: if you're an investigator. He's drawn a lot of attention
29:25
Speaker 1: to himself. Crime stories with Nancy Grace, we are talking
29:42
Speaker 1: about a beautiful woman, Mickey married to Lannica Contes, and
29:50
Speaker 1: I want to go straight out to Ray Kaputo, joining us,
29:53
Speaker 1: where was her body found? It was really improbable that
29:57
Speaker 1: her body was found in the first place, but it
29:59
Speaker 1: was essentially floating in the middle of the Mediterranean Sea.
30:02
Speaker 1: I mean when somebody falls over. A lot of times
30:04
Speaker 1: they call these searches off because they're feudal, I mean,
30:06
Speaker 1: in such a large area. But it was by chance
30:09
Speaker 1: that less than two days after she went missing, a
30:12
Speaker 1: research vessel finds her body floating and recovers her, which
30:16
Speaker 1: was ultimately critical in the case. But it was just
30:18
Speaker 1: so improbable that she was found floating basically in the
30:20
Speaker 1: middle of the Mediterranean Sea. Her body is found, and
30:24
Speaker 1: the cod as I recall, joining me, as you know
30:28
Speaker 1: we're now medical examiner doctor Michelle Dupree, was strangulation. Yes,
30:32
Speaker 1: after a body has been in the water for that
30:34
Speaker 1: period of time, how can you still determine the cod
30:39
Speaker 1: well again, as you're absolutely riding pins on the condition
30:41
Speaker 1: of the body at the time. But when we look
30:43
Speaker 1: at strangulation, particularly manual strangulation, there is a telltale fon
30:48
Speaker 1: of something called the highoid bone, and it's that high ah,
30:53
Speaker 1: you're making me think of Epstein, that no good piece
30:56
Speaker 1: of you know what go ahead highoid bone, that's right here. Yeah.
31:00
Speaker 1: So if the only way that that high woid bone
31:03
Speaker 1: can get fractured is through manual strangulation, what about ligature, guys.
31:09
Speaker 1: Ligature is when you use a rope, or you use
31:11
Speaker 1: a twine, or you use wire or a stocking. Manual
31:16
Speaker 1: is by hand. There's other asphyxiations as well, like positional
31:20
Speaker 1: with your heads like that you can't breathe. But why
31:23
Speaker 1: do you say that, doctor Dupree, Because a ligature is
31:26
Speaker 1: going to end up in a different place. It doesn't
31:28
Speaker 1: have the same amount of for and it's a difference
31:30
Speaker 1: why it'll go up exactly. And it's a different mechanical
31:34
Speaker 1: mechanism or asphyxiation than asphyxiation by hand. And so again
31:39
Speaker 1: that is a tell pal time that we see that
31:42
Speaker 1: highoid bone fracture. It is the only way you can
31:45
Speaker 1: get fracture. It's through trauma of that nature. That's why
31:48
Speaker 1: you're the MD. And I'm just a JD right there,
31:52
Speaker 1: Rayka Puto, I still say, and of course defense attorneys
31:55
Speaker 1: will tell you all day long into the night that
31:58
Speaker 1: it means absolutely nothing that this guy you can say
32:01
Speaker 1: nothing of him but elbows and tailhole because he's running.
32:05
Speaker 1: He can't wait for them to find his wife's botty.
32:07
Speaker 1: He's got to get snugged up with wife number three.
32:11
Speaker 1: So they find her body. How was she and her
32:15
Speaker 1: death linked back to the husband? Well, Nancy, you've got
32:21
Speaker 1: somebody who's found in the middle of the ocean, and
32:23
Speaker 1: when they figure out that she doesn't have any water
32:25
Speaker 1: in her lungs and that she was strangled, and also
32:28
Speaker 1: Oliver drew jewelry was on until they rule out robbery,
32:31
Speaker 1: they rule out rape. I mean, all fingers are pointing
32:34
Speaker 1: back to Lonnie given that financial motive. Now, if they
32:37
Speaker 1: didn't have her body, this could have been the perfect crime, Nancy,
32:41
Speaker 1: because all of that evidence leads back to Lonnie. But
32:43
Speaker 1: without a body, it's just, you know, somebody on a
32:46
Speaker 1: ship with two thousand people who goes missing, and there's
32:49
Speaker 1: so many different possibilities. So it was critical that they'd
32:51
Speaker 1: found her body and all the evidence that came with it.
32:54
Speaker 1: Did you see that map, Naples? Sicily, The reality is
32:58
Speaker 1: that you're absolutely right, two thousand people on board, it
33:01
Speaker 1: could have been anybody. And with his story that she
33:04
Speaker 1: leaves at midnight to go get a cup of tea
33:06
Speaker 1: fat chance it could have been anyone she encountered en route.
33:11
Speaker 1: Guys were talking about cruise ships and murders on cruise ships. Thankfully,
33:17
Speaker 1: on Disney hasn't been a murder, So I feel good
33:22
Speaker 1: about taking the twins. But when you look at all
33:25
Speaker 1: of this evidence, and these are just a few of
33:28
Speaker 1: the cases that we're aware of, you know, well, let's
33:30
Speaker 1: switch gears and go to Tamara Tucker. Take a listen
33:35
Speaker 1: to our friends at KATEC TV five. This is Betsy Webster.
33:39
Speaker 1: Tucker loved many things, including travel and beaches. She was
33:42
Speaker 1: heading two a beach on the Carnival Elation in January.
33:45
Speaker 1: It left Florida for the Bahamas, but before even making
33:48
Speaker 1: it to the Caribbean island, Tamara Tucker was dead. A
33:51
Speaker 1: Bohemian newspaper reported that she fell to her death two
33:54
Speaker 1: floors below her fourteenth deck stateroom balcony. It was January nineteenth,
33:58
Speaker 1: two days after her fifty's birthday, and she's like, I'm
34:01
Speaker 1: a social worker. Annie Meyer new Tucker only as a neighbor,
34:04
Speaker 1: but for ten plus years she recalled kids, band families.
34:07
Speaker 1: Tucker cared for visiting Tucker's home for cookouts. A different
34:11
Speaker 1: family every time. Tucker taught at Parked You in the
34:14
Speaker 1: Social Work program for the past decade. Before that, she
34:17
Speaker 1: was program director for the Child Abuse Prevention Association. Meyer
34:21
Speaker 1: says Tucker moved away to care for an ailing relative,
34:24
Speaker 1: so she'd lost touch and was understandably shocked by the developments.
34:28
Speaker 1: It's like something you would read in a mystery story.
34:31
Speaker 1: If something happens on a cruise and you don't know.
34:34
Speaker 1: You know, when you're on a cruise and a crime occurs,
34:38
Speaker 1: there are federal laws to protect you, such as the
34:43
Speaker 1: right to have an independent investigator, the right to make
34:46
Speaker 1: a complaint, many many rights now in place, and this
34:51
Speaker 1: is for US citizens. What happened to yet another young woman?
34:57
Speaker 1: Tama Tucker with me an all Star Pa and again
35:00
Speaker 1: I want to thank you for joining us straight out
35:02
Speaker 1: to Ray Caputo, Lead Morning Anchor, News anchor or Landay
35:07
Speaker 1: Morning News ninety six point five w DBO. Ray, this
35:11
Speaker 1: woman is in the prime of her life. Have you
35:13
Speaker 1: seen the photos of her. She's gorgeous, she's healthy, she's
35:16
Speaker 1: got everything to live for. What happened, well, Nancy, this
35:20
Speaker 1: this is absolutely crazy. They had boarded the carnival lation
35:22
Speaker 1: at Jacksonville to traveling for Kansas, and they weren't on
35:26
Speaker 1: this boat more than a matter of hours, and they
35:28
Speaker 1: were in their room and this is violent argument breaks out.
35:31
Speaker 1: So what what we're hearing is is that Eric Dwayne
35:34
Speaker 1: Newman had started choking camera with a boyfriend. The boyfriend
35:39
Speaker 1: the boyfriend with both hands, okay, and he was choking
35:42
Speaker 1: her in such a way on the balcony that he
35:44
Speaker 1: ends up pushing her over the balcony and watches her
35:47
Speaker 1: fall down two stories to her death. Now, she wasn't
35:50
Speaker 1: strangled to death. After they learned it was that fall
35:52
Speaker 1: that ends up killing her. You know, to doctor Bethany Marshall,
35:56
Speaker 1: I'm gonna follow up with you, James shell Nutt strangulation,
36:00
Speaker 1: manual strangulation that doctor g pre just outline for us
36:05
Speaker 1: how you can tell the difference between manual strangulation, ligature strangulation,
36:10
Speaker 1: positional asphyxiation, smothering. I've always referred to it, along with stabbings,
36:17
Speaker 1: as a sweetheart crime. In other words, you have to
36:20
Speaker 1: get really up close and personal to the person, like
36:23
Speaker 1: Jody Arius and Travis Alenxander. She stabbed him twenty eight
36:27
Speaker 1: to twenty nine times before shooting him you're close to
36:31
Speaker 1: your victim as you are in manual strangulation, you are
36:35
Speaker 1: very typically looking your victim in the face as you
36:41
Speaker 1: extinguish their life. That's a whole another mindset, Doctor Bethany Nancy.
36:48
Speaker 1: This was a This was a boyfriend who had ongoing
36:52
Speaker 1: murderous rage towards his girlfriend. He faced her, He put
36:56
Speaker 1: his hands around her neck, all on the balcony, and
37:00
Speaker 1: he enjoyed seeing the fear in her eyes. When you
37:05
Speaker 1: try to strangle somebody, it is so intimate, so rageful,
37:09
Speaker 1: so powerful. You are taking delight in causing them fear
37:14
Speaker 1: and threatening them. And he was backing her out over
37:17
Speaker 1: the railing. Anthy. She didn't just fall to her death.
37:21
Speaker 1: He was torturing and terrifying her during this prolonged assault.
37:25
Speaker 1: He was pushing her out over the railing. He was
37:28
Speaker 1: watching her kind of dangle. Can you imagine her back worth?
37:32
Speaker 1: It is evil, that's just pure evil, looking into her
37:36
Speaker 1: eyes as she died. Just for your knowledge, Eric Dwayne
37:40
Speaker 1: Newman played guilty to second degree murder and the death
37:43
Speaker 1: of his long time girlfriend Tama Tucker. Murders on cruise ships.
37:48
Speaker 1: We've outlined three of them for you. We wait as
37:53
Speaker 1: Justice unfoals Nancy Grace crime story, signing off boyfriend