Latest / Gil I Am / Muhammad Ali Interview (1968)

Transcript

Muhammad Ali Interview (1968) · Gil I Am

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Net presents a conversation with Muhammad Ali with Bud Collins,
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: columnist with the Boston Globe.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: Quite an athlete across from me. He used to be
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: named Cassius Marcellus Clay Jr.
• 0:26
  Speaker 3: And his business was price fighting.
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: As a fighter, he became, in my opinion and certainly
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: in his own, the greatest at the age of twenty five.
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: Now he calls himself Muhammad Ali, and he's unemployed as
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: a fighter. His title is gone, ripped away by various
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: boxing commissions. In the name of patriotism, He's been sentenced
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: to five years in prison for refusing induction into the
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: United States Army.
• 0:50
  Speaker 3: Eight years ago, he stood on a podium.
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: In Rome, an American flag blowing in the breeze, the
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: Star Spangled banner being played.
• 0:56
  Speaker 3: He was given a gold medal as an Olympic champion.
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: Thought, here's a kid with a bright future, and he
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: was known as the so called credit to his race.
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: He had talent in the ring, and he had maybe
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: more talent outside of it. He loved Bally, who he
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: loved putting on the nation with a great put on
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: that he was the greatest. He maybe was the greatest
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: poet since Robert Frost. At least he had more of
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: his poetry published, saying Archie Moore must go in for
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: things like that. But then the day after he became champion,
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: he turned off a lot of the country by revealing
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: that he was a convert to a religious sect known
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: popularly as the Black Muslims and formerly as the Nation
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: of Islam, and that antagonized a lot of the American people.
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: So now his principal role is as a Muslim minister.
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: He's had a varied career, an exciting, bizarre, celebrated career,
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: and now perhaps a discouraging career. Or is it discouraging
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: right now with this five year sentence.
• 1:53
  Speaker 4: What I'm doing now is more encouraging and I get
• 1:55
  Speaker 4: more out of it than box And boxing was only
• 1:58
  Speaker 4: for self. Uh, just beating up or one of my
• 2:03
  Speaker 4: brothers or somebody else's brother for money, possibly hurting 'em
• 2:07
  Speaker 4: for life, Uh, which I didn't intend to do, and
• 2:10
  Speaker 4: I'm lucky I never really did. But uh, I would say,
• 2:14
  Speaker 4: I'm having get more pleasure out of lecturing at the
• 2:17
  Speaker 4: various Muslim moss converting so called negroes.
• 2:21
  Speaker 3: You're a minister of the Muslim faith.
• 2:23
  Speaker 4: Yes, though honorably like your Muhammed, we preachers or his
• 2:27
  Speaker 4: teachings to aut American to our people.
• 2:29
  Speaker 5: And I enjoy this much better than boxing. Uh a far.
• 2:32
  Speaker 4: If I didn't, I would still be boxing. I chose
• 2:35
  Speaker 4: this over boxing.
• 2:36
  Speaker 3: What about jail? Uh your appealing is that correct?
• 2:39
  Speaker 5: Oh? Yes, uh jail that could come up.
• 2:42
  Speaker 4: And if I should lose appeal, then I'll uh have
• 2:45
  Speaker 4: to go to jail and uh I'll be out of
• 2:47
  Speaker 4: there in a few years.
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: Have you thought about jail what it might mean. Have
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: you talked about people who've been in jail five years?
• 2:53
  Speaker 4: Well, well, uh, we'll talk about the honorably like your
• 2:57
  Speaker 4: Muhammad that black people actually been in jail for four
• 3:00
  Speaker 4: hundred years we've been here in America. But uh, uh
• 3:03
  Speaker 4: I don't worry about jail. If uh I believe in
• 3:06
  Speaker 4: all law or believe in Elijah. Muhammad is the message
• 3:08
  Speaker 4: of God and and uh many uh great men have
• 3:12
  Speaker 4: to go to jail, and so uh I don't pay
• 3:16
  Speaker 4: no attention to it. The time comes, I'll just have
• 3:18
  Speaker 4: to go boys in Vietnam or.
• 3:20
  Speaker 5: Dying for what they believe.
• 3:22
  Speaker 4: And I can't get on them for dying for what
• 3:26
  Speaker 4: they believe. So I'll just have to and they dying
• 3:28
  Speaker 4: to free uh foreign people ten thousand miles away, So
• 3:32
  Speaker 4: I'll just have to suffer so that the so called
• 3:34
  Speaker 4: negroes uh could be free, so they could have idol
• 3:38
  Speaker 4: and the image they can look up too.
• 3:40
  Speaker 5: They didn't sell 'em out. They did.
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: You think you can do more for your people by
• 3:43
  Speaker 3: going to jail?
• 3:44
  Speaker 5: Oh, yes, sir.
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a report that your manager, Herbert Muhammad, advised
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: you to enter the army.
• 3:49
  Speaker 5: Is that true?
• 3:49
  Speaker 6: No?
• 3:50
  Speaker 4: No, no, sir, No, sir. He couldn't do nothing like that. No,
• 3:53
  Speaker 4: m Everything I'd do is of my own. He couldn't
• 3:56
  Speaker 4: advise me to go to the army. When did that
• 3:58
  Speaker 4: report come out?
• 3:58
  Speaker 3: That report was in a New York paper, but two
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: weeks ago.
• 4:00
  Speaker 4: No, I didn't. This is just rumors. They uh can't
• 4:03
  Speaker 4: believe that I'm this strong. They thought they would weaken
• 4:06
  Speaker 4: me and put fear in men by threatening to go
• 4:07
  Speaker 4: to jail and take.
• 4:08
  Speaker 5: Him earning power.
• 4:10
  Speaker 4: And uh, they won't let me work in America. The
• 4:12
  Speaker 4: government won't let me leave America where I can work.
• 4:15
  Speaker 4: And I'm getting strong on this shakes up a lot
• 4:17
  Speaker 4: of people to see them they're strong. It also makes
• 4:19
  Speaker 4: other so called negroes strong who uh facing the same problems.
• 4:23
  Speaker 4: And in this way, I think I can do for
• 4:26
  Speaker 4: more for my people. They've never had a big black
• 4:28
  Speaker 4: man that just stood up and identified with the struggle
• 4:31
  Speaker 4: of his people a thousand percent.
• 4:33
  Speaker 5: Once they can.
• 4:34
  Speaker 4: Get him a white girl, a blond, a bruin at
• 4:36
  Speaker 4: a a hundred thousand dollars home a show on Broadway.
• 4:39
  Speaker 4: Usually every Negro watching that show now will tell you
• 4:42
  Speaker 4: that you can't talk to 'em. They're too big to
• 4:44
  Speaker 4: be with their own people. They go marry other than
• 4:46
  Speaker 4: their own kind. And I'm so happy and proud to
• 4:48
  Speaker 4: become great in boxing, to become the greatest one that
• 4:52
  Speaker 4: ever lived, the great yes, sir, the greatest box that
• 4:55
  Speaker 4: ever lived. I'm the first one that they had to
• 4:57
  Speaker 4: take a title from. And the history of all the red,
• 4:59
  Speaker 4: wa white, and blue American title, I'm the first one
• 5:03
  Speaker 4: that they tried to make the world believe that wasn't
• 5:06
  Speaker 4: the champion and uh never uh, that never has been beaten.
• 5:11
  Speaker 5: They have.
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: What about this title now, Ali, can you if you're
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: in jail five years, can you come back and.
• 5:16
  Speaker 3: Be the champion?
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: Well, I don't know, I'm not really worrying about boxing.
• 5:20
  Speaker 4: The more I'm in sp the spiritual works that Elijah
• 5:23
  Speaker 4: Mohammad preachers preaching the word of all Ah God, I
• 5:26
  Speaker 4: forget about sports.
• 5:27
  Speaker 5: It's not in my blood. I don't eat ride steaks
• 5:29
  Speaker 5: no more. They make it vicious.
• 5:31
  Speaker 4: I just eat lamb now and fish or holy foods,
• 5:34
  Speaker 4: and uh this keeps me from being vicious feeling, and
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: I really don't miss it. I have nothing else to gain.
• 5:40
  Speaker 4: I beat the best German they had to offer, the
• 5:42
  Speaker 4: best that Canada, they had to offer England, the best
• 5:45
  Speaker 4: of the America had to offer. Two time United State
• 5:47
  Speaker 4: Golden Glove champion, AAU champion, twice Olympic gold medal winner,
• 5:51
  Speaker 4: defending the title nine times. Predicted the rounds all my opponents,
• 5:56
  Speaker 4: Uh wrote poems in poetic fashion, how they would fall
• 5:58
  Speaker 4: and n theres n I cannot go no farther in
• 6:02
  Speaker 4: sports and the first and another thing, I'd like to say,
• 6:05
  Speaker 4: I'm the onliest black man that black people can now
• 6:09
  Speaker 4: say have so champion, Uh like uh I would say Marsana,
• 6:13
  Speaker 4: that's undefeated and retired, or it's true ya. So Joe
• 6:17
  Speaker 4: Louis came back. He uh let the people down. He
• 6:20
  Speaker 4: got beaten and Sugar Ray was a Black pride and
• 6:23
  Speaker 4: they got him beat up.
• 6:25
  Speaker 5: But I'm the first one to think, yes.
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: Is there a conflict now?
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: You say, and but I certainly believe you won't have
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: been with you for long enough to know that you're
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: very sincere in your beliefs that you're a man of
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: God now a minister.
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: Is there a conflict between that and being.
• 6:40
  Speaker 5: A price fighting?
• 6:40
  Speaker 4: Well, yes, we uh don't believe in that sea. We
• 6:43
  Speaker 4: don't believe in sports, and uh, we're right. We don't
• 6:47
  Speaker 4: consider boxing then violent. It's just a sport. It's nothing
• 6:50
  Speaker 4: we not intention it's not to kill or we use
• 6:53
  Speaker 4: is a fist and they're paddy. We have referees, doctors
• 6:55
  Speaker 4: and judges the ringside. The intention is to beat the
• 6:58
  Speaker 4: man out on him. And I've been criticized for not
• 7:00
  Speaker 4: hurting me in and being criticized for carrying 'em because
• 7:03
  Speaker 4: I don't like to hurt nobody.
• 7:04
  Speaker 5: I showed all this in my fights.
• 7:06
  Speaker 4: But if I did fight again, the only reason would
• 7:08
  Speaker 4: be was to get out of debt. This is the
• 7:10
  Speaker 4: onliest way that I have to make the necessary money
• 7:12
  Speaker 4: to pay my draft lawyers, which I t two hundred
• 7:15
  Speaker 4: eighty thousand dollars. That Uh, spending.
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: Two hundred eighty thousand dollars for your appeals and your
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: trials and fighting.
• 7:21
  Speaker 4: For justice cost me that much and then other things
• 7:24
  Speaker 4: back all the morning to the wife. And I can't
• 7:26
  Speaker 4: pay nobody now because I'm not allowed to work and
• 7:29
  Speaker 4: out of the country. So if I did fight, it'll
• 7:31
  Speaker 4: be for those reasons. But just boxing itself, I could
• 7:34
  Speaker 4: box tomorrow if I wanted to. I could just go
• 7:36
  Speaker 4: to the gymnasium and box. But it's the money.
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: Three years ago, when we were coming on the way
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: from Boston and Big Red, your great bus with Bludini
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: Brown Well Otis five X was driving.
• 7:46
  Speaker 3: We had quite a gang.
• 7:47
  Speaker 2: You said, that's why he's getting the back of the bus,
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: which we did.
• 7:49
  Speaker 3: If you did, and uh, we had a lot of fun.
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: And the last fight, just even though you had all
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: this on your mind and all the pressure you were
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: with Boudini and you put on the Dracula masks with Soria,
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: one of your trainers.
• 8:02
  Speaker 3: And uh we we had a great time up there.
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: And and people who knew you, and you've had a
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: lot of criticism in the Prenceville people who lived with
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: you and knew you, uh knew what kind of person
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: you were, and you enjoyed being champion, the the people
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: being around you, and the notoriety and the celebrity.
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: You enjoyed that. Do you miss that now?
• 8:18
  Speaker 5: N Noh No.
• 8:20
  Speaker 4: As I said, I can't go to I can't go
• 8:22
  Speaker 4: no higher in boxing. There's no one I could beat
• 8:25
  Speaker 4: who could get me more praise and been a boxer.
• 8:29
  Speaker 4: I'm always around people. I'm still around people every day.
• 8:32
  Speaker 4: I'm around six of 'em traveling with me today. Every
• 8:36
  Speaker 4: city I go to, the people are waiting for me.
• 8:38
  Speaker 4: I just left the UH college here Mit Mit University.
• 8:44
  Speaker 3: They were well received. We have a b heredominantly white audience.
• 8:46
  Speaker 5: Yes, everywhere I go.
• 8:48
  Speaker 4: We was up at Farleigh Dickinson in New York c
• 8:50
  Speaker 4: W Post. I own a university, Conesius University and UH
• 8:55
  Speaker 4: Penn State and UH Margant State College.
• 8:59
  Speaker 5: And you like to be with people?
• 9:01
  Speaker 4: Oh yes, so, but me not boxing didn't take nothing
• 9:05
  Speaker 4: away from me as far as famous concern our people.
• 9:08
  Speaker 4: I can always hold my head, how I could always
• 9:10
  Speaker 4: put on a necktie, and I can talk most boxers, Uh,
• 9:13
  Speaker 4: you bring 'em on this show now, even the ones
• 9:15
  Speaker 4: fighting they couldn't talk like I'm talking.
• 9:17
  Speaker 5: Now, always talk like you. Yeah. So, uh, I have
• 9:19
  Speaker 5: s lot lots to fall back on.
• 9:21
  Speaker 4: So I can't just ask you a question and Loan,
• 9:24
  Speaker 4: I just can't miss boxing.
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: Do you remember Ali? That night when we were on
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: the bus, we were in you leave, Florida. We stopped
• 9:30
  Speaker 3: to get some food. It was a Jim Crow diner.
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: They threw boudini out and you didn't go in.
• 9:34
  Speaker 4: You s I told him not to go at first.
• 9:36
  Speaker 4: I told him not to go because U I can tell.
• 9:39
  Speaker 4: I went in first and the man said something, but
• 9:41
  Speaker 4: we don't serve negroes. I said, yes, sir, I'm sorry,
• 9:43
  Speaker 4: and I wanted cause we who are Muslims don't believe
• 9:45
  Speaker 4: in forcing our places.
• 9:47
  Speaker 5: Uh of self?
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: And you said to Padi that night you said you
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: were following Martin Luther King and people like that, and
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: you're wrong, did you not?
• 9:54
  Speaker 4: No, I don't remember saying that. And I did mention him.
• 9:57
  Speaker 4: I'm sure I didn't. Uh.
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: I said, I think you said something about that wasn't
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: the way to go about it?
• 10:03
  Speaker 5: Well, I said, if.
• 10:03
  Speaker 4: The man don't want you there and this is his restaurant,
• 10:06
  Speaker 4: and if he hates you that much to put you out,
• 10:09
  Speaker 4: to shoot his own white brother, to keep you out
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: as a possibility. That vanilla milkshake, You won't when he
• 10:14
  Speaker 4: go back to fix it, he could, you know, spit
• 10:16
  Speaker 4: in it. And I'm sure if somebody spitting the milkshake
• 10:18
  Speaker 4: and makes it up, you couldn't see it. And I
• 10:20
  Speaker 4: don't see why you. You have to be sick mentally
• 10:22
  Speaker 4: to want to force yourself into places where you're not wanting.
• 10:25
  Speaker 4: You see, the man hate you. You see they don't
• 10:26
  Speaker 4: want you down here. I want you to leave him alone.
• 10:29
  Speaker 4: We're going somewhere else. He said, No, I'm going in.
• 10:31
  Speaker 4: I'm American. I'm American. Are you going right to go?
• 10:35
  Speaker 6: I said, well, come on out, god bitch, I'll come
• 10:37
  Speaker 6: over with I'll won't. Five minutes later he came out
• 10:40
  Speaker 6: with nothing.
• 10:41
  Speaker 5: Your treat be like that, oh a man, I said,
• 10:44
  Speaker 5: I told you to lead the people alone.
• 10:45
  Speaker 4: They didn't, won't you? You just make yourself look like
• 10:47
  Speaker 4: a food. So we went on down the street and
• 10:48
  Speaker 4: another white man.
• 10:50
  Speaker 5: We could eat it, Georgia, right, you could eat it, yeah.
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: But tell us about the muslims now, as I said
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: today after you and you remember that very well, Sonny
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: listening the big old Bears you call him, sat in
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: his corner. Quick to you. You became champion of the world.
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: Everybody thought this was a refreshing young man.
• 11:05
  Speaker 5: I always wondered, what was his trainer talking about?
• 11:07
  Speaker 3: Ill?
• 11:07
  Speaker 4: Did you finish round this? You know what his training
• 11:09
  Speaker 4: was talking about? When this and southern stude, No, he said,
• 11:11
  Speaker 4: son and son and get up the bellroom. Sony said,
• 11:13
  Speaker 4: my mama didn't raise no food. I'm staying right here
• 11:15
  Speaker 4: on my stool.
• 11:16
  Speaker 3: You got that poetry still going.
• 11:19
  Speaker 5: What was she gonna say? O?
• 11:20
  Speaker 3: I was gonna say that the next day, Ali, when
• 11:22
  Speaker 3: everybody was saying the the stereotype.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: Thing, here's a refreshing young man. We found out you
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: were a Muslim, and people got scared.
• 11:29
  Speaker 5: I got bad, Alisa, people.
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: Got scared and you got bad all of a sudden,
• 11:33
  Speaker 3: right over.
• 11:34
  Speaker 4: And I was a good boy when I was hollering
• 11:35
  Speaker 4: I am the greatest, I cannot be beat. I am pretty,
• 11:40
  Speaker 4: I'm the king. He was a good boy. But when
• 11:44
  Speaker 4: I said I'm a Muslim, my relations Islam? What's wrong
• 11:47
  Speaker 4: with that?
• 11:48
  Speaker 6: You have six hundred million Muslims on earth and Muslim
• 11:51
  Speaker 6: only me one who submits in.
• 11:52
  Speaker 5: Talent to the will of God Allah.
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: And Islam only means peace entire submission to God. And
• 12:00
  Speaker 4: we don't believe in forcing ourselves on You know, we
• 12:03
  Speaker 4: don't hate.
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: Why why is that grown up you supposed.
• 12:05
  Speaker 4: To propaganda to scare Negroes, to keep them from coming.
• 12:10
  Speaker 4: Because Negroes, by nature love their enemy. They pray for
• 12:12
  Speaker 4: those who use some. Negroes by nature don't hate nobody.
• 12:15
  Speaker 4: And so if they can make people think that we
• 12:17
  Speaker 4: a hate group, that are frightening them. But we don't
• 12:19
  Speaker 4: hate white people. We know white people, We know the
• 12:21
  Speaker 4: history of white people. For an example, if a tiger
• 12:23
  Speaker 4: broke in this room, now, I would beat you getting out.
• 12:26
  Speaker 4: If a rattlesnake broke in and I beat you getting
• 12:29
  Speaker 4: off of this stage.
• 12:30
  Speaker 6: I don't hate rattlesnakes. I don't hate tigers. I just
• 12:33
  Speaker 6: know I can't get along with them. After learning nature
• 12:36
  Speaker 6: the snake and the tiger, I don't want to try
• 12:38
  Speaker 6: to eat with him or sleep with him because I
• 12:40
  Speaker 6: know that he might bite me.
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: So now that you don't think along, I think that
• 12:44
  Speaker 3: was your point.
• 12:45
  Speaker 5: I know whites and blacks cannot get along.
• 12:49
  Speaker 4: This is nature. That's It's getting worse every day though.
• 12:51
  Speaker 4: The latest government fact finding committed just said that things
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: are becoming to be separate, just two societies black and white.
• 12:58
  Speaker 4: That's what we've been telling your separation, and now the
• 13:00
  Speaker 4: government amitst that that's coming. White women are got gun
• 13:03
  Speaker 4: clubs all over the countries, learn how to shoot the
• 13:05
  Speaker 4: black targets. Understand the making guns that are shoot through
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: brick walls just to get negroes.
• 13:10
  Speaker 5: And and and and the Do you believe that.
• 13:12
  Speaker 4: I know what I said Mayor Daily on Chicago. I
• 13:15
  Speaker 4: think somebody ordered the helicopters or something just with these
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: riots and rotating machine guns on 'em and all they
• 13:22
  Speaker 4: breeding dogs that just attack black people, all kind of
• 13:25
  Speaker 4: spray and missing banana slicking.
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: Well, what are you going to do now?
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: As one of the prominent black persons.
• 13:33
  Speaker 3: I can't civil wars people.
• 13:37
  Speaker 4: C can't be a leader, but I can tell 'em
• 13:39
  Speaker 4: about the leader. All I can tell them is to
• 13:41
  Speaker 4: drawing on to their own kind, except their own kind,
• 13:43
  Speaker 4: going on to the true religion, which is Islam, drawing
• 13:46
  Speaker 4: on to the Muslim teachings which is taught to us
• 13:49
  Speaker 4: a boy, the NABYLI like Obama on this black man
• 13:51
  Speaker 4: preaching the truth to black people. Clean up your own neighborhoods,
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: do something for yourself, quit begg beg to separate. Oh
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: you well, if number one UH, the Army Elijah Muhammad
• 14:01
  Speaker 4: and the religion of Islam has given me a beautiful name,
• 14:03
  Speaker 4: Muhammad Ali, which is connected me with UH.
• 14:06
  Speaker 6: Some UH fifty six moves some countries. I have fifty
• 14:08
  Speaker 6: six government invitations.
• 14:10
  Speaker 4: This is why Washington won't let me go to Japan
• 14:12
  Speaker 4: to fight, because they, the prostituting eternity s, came to
• 14:16
  Speaker 4: Houston and told the judge that if we let this
• 14:18
  Speaker 4: man leave, he might not come back because he had
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: six hundred million miles them brothers that were gladly making
• 14:24
  Speaker 4: him a mill, making him a millionaire fugitive. So this
• 14:27
  Speaker 4: is what it's done to me. Well, I used to
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: try to get love of whites and begged to be
• 14:32
  Speaker 4: with whites. Now I can go set with kings in Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, Pakistan, Indonesia,
• 14:37
  Speaker 4: Saudi Arabia. This has taught me a knowledge of myself.
• 14:41
  Speaker 4: UH taught me to love and respect my own people,
• 14:44
  Speaker 4: taught me to marry and my own women.
• 14:46
  Speaker 5: All great Negroes.
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: But you're obviously not uncomfortable with whites.
• 14:49
  Speaker 5: I don't know.
• 14:50
  Speaker 6: Oh, I'm no, I'm uncomfortable. Uh No, I'm comfortable. I'm
• 14:55
  Speaker 6: real comfortable with you. Of course, I know how far
• 14:58
  Speaker 6: to go with you. I'm not gonna go home with
• 15:00
  Speaker 6: you now. Don't flirt with your daughter. I'm not gonna
• 15:02
  Speaker 6: try to push you out of your suburb. I integrate
• 15:04
  Speaker 6: so far, see, we don't. That's why I like Governor Wallace.
• 15:07
  Speaker 6: He tells the truth about the Waller. Yes, sir, w
• 15:10
  Speaker 6: that truth he tells. We like he tells the truth.
• 15:13
  Speaker 5: You believe that I see him telling the truth.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: You don't believe he's been a tough influence in this country,
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: and a bad influence.
• 15:19
  Speaker 5: Well, I don't believe it everything nobody say.
• 15:21
  Speaker 4: But I like what he say when he says that
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: negroes shouldn't force to force hisself in the white neighborhoods,
• 15:26
  Speaker 4: and white people shouldn't have to uh move out of
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: the neighborhoods just because one Negro comes, they don't wanna
• 15:31
  Speaker 4: sell the house to him.
• 15:31
  Speaker 5: He shouldn't.
• 15:32
  Speaker 4: And that makes sense if a person UH don't want
• 15:34
  Speaker 4: you not even gonna push yourself on him, and Wallace
• 15:37
  Speaker 4: is omitting that this ain't right, and let the people
• 15:39
  Speaker 4: do what they wanna do. They need local government where
• 15:41
  Speaker 4: they can decide what they wanna do in their own community.
• 15:43
  Speaker 4: They just don't make some northern so called liberal come
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: in and bust the neighborhood up and they all have
• 15:49
  Speaker 4: to pack up and go somewhere else and always be.
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: What would you say for your people? They're living in
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: deplorable conditions in Chicago. Now they're living in terrible conditions.
• 15:56
  Speaker 4: Oh, this is all over the world, living in terrible conditions.
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: This is why eleies you mohamma teachers, is that they
• 16:00
  Speaker 4: need some land of their own where they can produce
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: and build their own homes, schools, factories in hospitals. Since
• 16:04
  Speaker 4: they're suffering and been turned away from many whites, and
• 16:07
  Speaker 4: get some land. Since we help build America to be
• 16:09
  Speaker 4: fit to their rich estates on the planet f out
• 16:12
  Speaker 4: in all American waters, to help maintain an uphold of government,
• 16:14
  Speaker 4: why not should we have some of the land where
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: we can build and construct negroes or doctors. Negroes are lawyers, physicians, mechanics, plumbers, electricians.
• 16:23
  Speaker 4: Why not can we go somewhere now and build a
• 16:26
  Speaker 4: future for our children such as other people. Why should
• 16:28
  Speaker 4: we just remain beggars and employees? Why not can we go.
• 16:33
  Speaker 5: In a job.
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: But do you think that other words, you want some
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: land here in the United States down?
• 16:38
  Speaker 4: Elijah Muhammad teaches us that God taught him, not me,
• 16:41
  Speaker 4: that this land should be here or elsewhere, just like
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: all people. No people can be free and independent without land.
• 16:48
  Speaker 4: No people can be free if they can't feed themselves.
• 16:51
  Speaker 4: No people can be free if they don't clothe themselves.
• 16:54
  Speaker 4: Negroes are twenty two million people. Elijah Mohama teaches us,
• 16:57
  Speaker 4: we don't make shoe strings twenty two million people, and
• 16:59
  Speaker 4: don't have two factory twenty two million people. If you
• 17:02
  Speaker 4: white people close the grocery stores tomorrow, we would starve
• 17:04
  Speaker 4: to death.
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: But you have your own stares us.
• 17:07
  Speaker 5: Oh, he's the elies.
• 17:08
  Speaker 4: Your Mohammed's buying hundreds of thousands of acres of farm
• 17:11
  Speaker 4: land throughout the country, canning up and food and taking
• 17:14
  Speaker 4: it to supermarkets and his restaurants. He's building all over
• 17:17
  Speaker 4: the country. He's got his own college, his universities. He's
• 17:20
  Speaker 4: on radio worldwide, now national in America's on TV in Washington.
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: He spends two million newspapers a week called Mohammed spits.
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: And he's got mosque and temples all over the country.
• 17:30
  Speaker 4: And he is the black man for black people to follow.
• 17:33
  Speaker 4: He's not just asking for job. He's not dressing for
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: house in a white neighborhood.
• 17:36
  Speaker 5: This is nothing.
• 17:37
  Speaker 4: See negroes actually fighting for the quality with the white
• 17:39
  Speaker 4: men's dog. You might say, why, well, when they say
• 17:42
  Speaker 4: we won't open housing, they still not getting nothing.
• 17:44
  Speaker 6: The dog and got the dogs sleeps in the house
• 17:46
  Speaker 6: with white people and the bed many of 'em.
• 17:48
  Speaker 4: And negroes gonna ride on the best transportation up front
• 17:50
  Speaker 4: with the white people. The dogs do bedding net he
• 17:52
  Speaker 4: ride right in the front seat. I see 'em when
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: sunshine and dogs ride right in front seats car and
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: negroes they won't eat the white men restaurant and this
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: and that's still the dog eat at the same plate.
• 18:01
  Speaker 5: I see this.
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: So in reality, the negro's not fighting to be quality
• 18:04
  Speaker 4: with the white man. He's fighting to the quality of
• 18:06
  Speaker 4: the white man's dog. To be equal with the man.
• 18:08
  Speaker 4: He needs some airports, he needs some train stations, some
• 18:11
  Speaker 4: television company, some water plants. He need some farm and
• 18:15
  Speaker 4: not if he had some land of his own. Yes,
• 18:17
  Speaker 4: and if the white man gave him justice and repaid
• 18:20
  Speaker 4: him for building up this country and working three hundred years.
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: Camichael Ralph Brown say that the white man will not
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: do this, though if.
• 18:29
  Speaker 5: They have, I think I know, I'm good.
• 18:33
  Speaker 4: We would look like foods trying to be violent against
• 18:36
  Speaker 4: the most powerless military country on Earth. We would look
• 18:38
  Speaker 4: like bulls running down a railroad track head on into
• 18:40
  Speaker 4: a more locomotive train.
• 18:42
  Speaker 5: You might say, look at that brave bull.
• 18:43
  Speaker 4: But when that bull come head on with that train,
• 18:46
  Speaker 4: all he will have left as his monument is.
• 18:48
  Speaker 5: His blood and his flush on the track.
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: See, we can't be powerful against the man who makes
• 18:52
  Speaker 4: the bullets, who makes the guns. We look like fools
• 18:54
  Speaker 4: with a pop gun hiding on a roof, shooting the arm.
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: And if every Negro had a machine gun or tink
• 18:59
  Speaker 4: a bazooka years round, if ammunition and a good hideout,
• 19:02
  Speaker 4: we wouldn't have a chance because we don't control no food.
• 19:05
  Speaker 5: After two or three days, we would be hungry. For
• 19:09
  Speaker 5: us to be.
• 19:10
  Speaker 4: Violent against America, we would have to have superior weapons
• 19:12
  Speaker 4: than America, and we don't have the factories in all
• 19:15
  Speaker 4: the earth to dig the material to manufacture the weapons.
• 19:18
  Speaker 4: And if we would get the weapons, we would have
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: to get them from you. And I'm sure you are
• 19:21
  Speaker 4: not going to give negroes weaps to.
• 19:24
  Speaker 5: Shoot you with.
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: So I'm not here to talk. So I don't agree
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: with Stokey. I don't agree with rap Brown. I don't
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: agreeve with Martin the late Martin Luther King. We're all
• 19:30
  Speaker 4: black people who are fighting for freedom, just in quality.
• 19:33
  Speaker 4: Everybody have their approach. There's a war going on in Vietnam.
• 19:36
  Speaker 4: One man fights from the air, one man fights from
• 19:38
  Speaker 4: the land. One man fights from on top of the water.
• 19:40
  Speaker 4: One man fights in the submarine under the water. One
• 19:43
  Speaker 4: man comes from he's a secret serviceman our spot. They're
• 19:46
  Speaker 4: all fighting the same common in him as they say,
• 19:48
  Speaker 4: the North Vietnase and people, but they have different approaches.
• 19:52
  Speaker 4: Negroes have different approaches for that freedom. One man believe
• 19:55
  Speaker 4: in integrate and one day we'll all be white, he say,
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: look like white people that have two hundred years believe
• 20:00
  Speaker 4: the education and politics will solve it. One believes shooting
• 20:03
  Speaker 4: and looting and burning up the country of SOLVIEGT. One
• 20:05
  Speaker 4: man believe integration of sovereign and we believe separation somewhere
• 20:08
  Speaker 4: to ourselves are solvegn So we're not here to talk
• 20:10
  Speaker 4: about these fellas. The same dog that bit them bit
• 20:13
  Speaker 4: me and biting me. But we just don't agree with
• 20:15
  Speaker 4: that approach to the freedom. But we all are for
• 20:18
  Speaker 4: them if they are sincere in their way, and one
• 20:21
  Speaker 4: day we hope that they will all soon recognize the
• 20:23
  Speaker 4: true leady Elijah Muhammad and will all soon be moving.
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: What do you think will happen he Elijah Muhammad is
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: a very old man.
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: One day he must die.
• 20:32
  Speaker 5: He will die one day.
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: What do you think will happen to your group?
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: Well, when he died, we will be in We will
• 20:38
  Speaker 4: be in in heaven, we'll be in the here after
• 20:40
  Speaker 4: on earth, America will be destroyed and this will all
• 20:45
  Speaker 4: be over. The negroes with America will go down with
• 20:47
  Speaker 4: America and all our gods.
• 20:50
  Speaker 6: Uh.
• 20:50
  Speaker 4: When he dies, we will be free. We His work
• 20:53
  Speaker 4: will be over, and we have a fierce just around
• 20:56
  Speaker 4: the corner. We don't have a lot of more years
• 20:58
  Speaker 4: in America.
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: Tell us about and.
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: Uh, I was like to say that Moses died to
• 21:03
  Speaker 4: nor die. A lot died, all of God's prophets died,
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: but they accomplish their missions. And Mohammed a prophet, he's
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: a messenger. I s he's not here to tell us
• 21:13
  Speaker 4: what's gonna happen. He's tell us what's happening. He's a messenger.
• 21:16
  Speaker 4: He's a messenger of Allah to the so called negroes.
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: What about your own life now you're married, you have
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: a young.
• 21:23
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I got a little baby on the way in
• 21:25
  Speaker 6: about uh on my half, I'll have another little boy, hope,
• 21:28
  Speaker 6: and I'm young enough to hold the crown until he's around.
• 21:30
  Speaker 3: Do you think he'll be the champion?
• 21:32
  Speaker 4: Well, uh, I don't think I want him to box.
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: I'm gonna send him to school and I'm gonna make
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: him study and work, and he's gonna be a wise man.
• 21:40
  Speaker 5: He'pon box.
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: You're living in Chicago now right.
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: Bought me a nice little home, lin fix it up
• 21:46
  Speaker 4: nice and still that beautiful eighteen year old Mooselom girl.
• 21:51
  Speaker 4: Oh yes, I got a couple of them old Cadillacs.
• 21:53
  Speaker 4: But I'm trying to get my airplane cause are too
• 21:56
  Speaker 4: slow 'em. I travel so much every day, I'm in
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: certain cities and I'm always moving. I always have calls
• 22:03
  Speaker 4: and driving or killing me and so, and I would
• 22:06
  Speaker 4: like to have my own private playing.
• 22:08
  Speaker 5: And or now pricing a lyric.
• 22:09
  Speaker 4: Yet and I have a cousin like an artist in
• 22:12
  Speaker 4: Kansas City where they make those things with gitar. Uh
• 22:16
  Speaker 4: they are working now with giving me a good deal
• 22:19
  Speaker 4: on one where I maybe probably colease it cause it.
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: T I guess saw pride into your personal affairs. Have
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: been so many stories that you've been like Joe Lewis,
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: that you're broken.
• 22:27
  Speaker 5: Yeah, so you're large.
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: You have eighty thousand dollars on one hand. Now you
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: talk about buying the lyric.
• 22:31
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm about gone.
• 22:32
  Speaker 4: I said least see least he say leasey then yeah,
• 22:35
  Speaker 4: but uh, TAXI pay for it anyway. But uh, And
• 22:37
  Speaker 4: what I'm trying to say is that, uh, yeah, I'm
• 22:40
  Speaker 4: just about broke. I'm not allowed to work here now
• 22:43
  Speaker 4: in America. I'm not allowed to leave America. I'm not
• 22:46
  Speaker 4: al like Joe Lowis. I didn't fight thirteen years.
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: See, I was twenty nine fights and one of them all.
• 22:52
  Speaker 5: Yeah, but I was. I only had nine title fights.
• 22:55
  Speaker 4: And out of those nine big title fights, and my
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: cut was two million dollars and my cut after every after.
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: Everything that was your cut two million dollar.
• 23:02
  Speaker 5: No, not after everything. This is before taxes, before taxes.
• 23:05
  Speaker 6: Uh yeah, after the my manager was paid, after my
• 23:07
  Speaker 6: opponent was paid, the peanut man, the popcorn man, and everybody.
• 23:11
  Speaker 6: My cup was two million, and out of two million,
• 23:13
  Speaker 6: the ten white men, the black men in Louisville, they
• 23:16
  Speaker 6: made a deal with the government behind my back.
• 23:18
  Speaker 5: I knew nothing about it.
• 23:19
  Speaker 4: Real quick they made a deal with the government or
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: they would give the government ninety percent of all my
• 23:24
  Speaker 4: earnings before I got 'em. This was called a Joe
• 23:27
  Speaker 4: Lois law to keep me from uh being broke, they say.
• 23:30
  Speaker 4: But uh, ninety percent of my two million dollars went
• 23:34
  Speaker 4: to the American government, So that only left me uh
• 23:37
  Speaker 4: ten percent out of two million to live on. And
• 23:40
  Speaker 4: out of that I had to pay a hundred fifty
• 23:41
  Speaker 4: thousand to get rid of my first wife cause she
• 23:43
  Speaker 4: was enjoined my faith. And then uh naturally it cost
• 23:47
  Speaker 4: me money to live. So the money's about going and
• 23:50
  Speaker 4: not only me or I don't know why people are
• 23:52
  Speaker 4: so confused over one negro boxer, uh getting low in
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: funds or depleted in funds. When America broke, AMERICAUS now
• 24:02
  Speaker 4: counseling trips and things to save money. So if you know,
• 24:04
  Speaker 4: if big powerful America can get broke, you know a
• 24:07
  Speaker 4: little negro boxer can get broke.
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: Well, that's true, you can.
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: You've severed all connections now with your management group and
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: lo At though, which is the group that brought you on.
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: Did you leave them in a friendly manner?
• 24:19
  Speaker 5: Oh? Yeah, contract ran out now.
• 24:21
  Speaker 4: They wanted to renew it, but they didn't wanna give
• 24:23
  Speaker 4: me the price for it, so we just had to
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: find another manager.
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: You go back to Louisville often to see your mother
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: and oh.
• 24:30
  Speaker 4: Oh yes, I was there two days ago. I was
• 24:32
  Speaker 4: in Louisville. But I don't have time to stay there
• 24:34
  Speaker 4: too much. The town looks so small, and the people
• 24:36
  Speaker 4: move so slow. The friends are raised up. We'll still
• 24:39
  Speaker 4: stand on the same corner. Ain't doing nothing hanging around
• 24:42
  Speaker 4: the same places. And when you get out and travel
• 24:45
  Speaker 4: and knowledge and get when you get knowledge of wisdom, understanding,
• 24:48
  Speaker 4: and when they've been around the world a couple of times,
• 24:50
  Speaker 4: like me and uh, talking to wise men like you,
• 24:53
  Speaker 4: newspaper men and on all these TV shows and and
• 24:57
  Speaker 4: this makes you wise and intelligent. When you go back
• 24:59
  Speaker 4: to these little one, harsh towns. You just can't stay
• 25:01
  Speaker 4: the two hours just after day, I'm ready to get out.
• 25:04
  Speaker 3: Well, you gotta move, I've noticed that about you.
• 25:07
  Speaker 5: Or you gotta wrestle this person even in jail. I'm
• 25:10
  Speaker 5: gonna have a moving plan.
• 25:12
  Speaker 3: Movie from Sala salad. I don't know have you. Have
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: you gotten any specific word about when they will act
• 25:22
  Speaker 3: on your appeal?
• 25:23
  Speaker 5: I got a letter though, they said get ready be costs.
• 25:27
  Speaker 4: They're cleaning out your sale to take you on the
• 25:31
  Speaker 4: trail to the jail sale without bail.
• 25:35
  Speaker 3: Without a bail. How are you getting ready?
• 25:38
  Speaker 5: Yeah, if I have to.
• 25:39
  Speaker 4: I told my wife she's packing up a few things
• 25:42
  Speaker 4: and I left, uh certain money.
• 25:44
  Speaker 5: I bury it for her to go back.
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: To you married. You better watch the irs probably watching
• 25:48
  Speaker 3: this show.
• 25:49
  Speaker 5: Uh, that's alright.
• 25:50
  Speaker 4: I bury a lot of money that I make after taxes.
• 25:54
  Speaker 4: I make a little money, like if I make a
• 25:57
  Speaker 4: S fifteen hundred dollars speaking engagement, like give the government
• 26:00
  Speaker 4: that thirty percent.
• 26:02
  Speaker 5: Then I take what's left of mind. I don't put into.
• 26:04
  Speaker 4: Banks cause s banks might go broke or they might
• 26:07
  Speaker 4: get robbed or uh. Just take my money and I
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: hide it here and hide it there and tell her
• 26:12
  Speaker 4: where the hide uts are.
• 26:14
  Speaker 3: Well, you're not too worright now.
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: Bill Russell, whom you know, of course, the coaches, the
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: Boston Selling's here. I said to him two years ago.
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: I said, it's it's a shame that this boy, who's
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: such an attractive boy and such a fine guy and
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: a good fighter, is may wind up pro like Joe Louis.
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: And he said, well, that just shows that you don't understand.
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: And he said, uh, you just don't understand that. That's
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: why we admire him.
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: So is it because he's he's ready to give up
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: everything for as well?
• 26:37
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I haven't.
• 26:38
  Speaker 4: I haven't.
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: I held around to do this and they they don't
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: see he quit Jos.
• 26:41
  Speaker 4: So these people you talking about, they spent money on
• 26:44
  Speaker 4: white women. They set up bars, and they went playing
• 26:47
  Speaker 4: pool and golf a thousand dollars a hole, and they
• 26:50
  Speaker 4: were known to make millions and millions when it wasn't
• 26:53
  Speaker 4: no high taxes, and they were not hindered by a
• 26:55
  Speaker 4: white America.
• 26:56
  Speaker 5: They were allowed to see. The white America is completely
• 27:00
  Speaker 5: close all the doors on me. I'm not allowed to
• 27:02
  Speaker 5: work in America.
• 27:02
  Speaker 4: Out of America, I will stop writing my prime just
• 27:05
  Speaker 4: when I started making money, So it can't compare me
• 27:07
  Speaker 4: with nobody like Joe Louis or nobody and I have
• 27:11
  Speaker 4: I can yes, and tomorrow I can go back to
• 27:14
  Speaker 4: get the money. If I would only deny my faith,
• 27:16
  Speaker 4: if I would only join up against my religion, I
• 27:19
  Speaker 4: could easily go back to make a million.
• 27:21
  Speaker 5: So I can always say that I turned this down.
• 27:23
  Speaker 5: I didn't. I didn't lose. I didn't lose it. I
• 27:26
  Speaker 5: turned it down. And I'd go out still with my
• 27:29
  Speaker 5: head high.
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: You've always had your head high, man.
• 27:32
  Speaker 5: Yes, and thank you. I'm not uh what they call
• 27:34
  Speaker 5: Uncle Tom.
• 27:35
  Speaker 4: And money of a flushing, the blood of my freedom
• 27:39
  Speaker 4: of the flushing, the blood and the freedom of my
• 27:41
  Speaker 4: people comes before money. And this is why black people
• 27:45
  Speaker 4: don't know where today. A white man such as you
• 27:47
  Speaker 4: are saying now, They always talking about money. You're broke?
• 27:51
  Speaker 4: Are you losing money? They threaten out people with money
• 27:53
  Speaker 4: where you won't eat? How you gonna live? Well, this
• 27:56
  Speaker 4: is why we'll know where today, because every time a
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: black man get in a position wor all the babies
• 28:00
  Speaker 4: are following him, where all the youth is following him,
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: then he's looking.
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: When you're moving around, I.
• 28:05
  Speaker 5: Think, Yeah, he's who's looking.
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: Everybody's looking when you're there. They like to see you coming.
• 28:09
  Speaker 4: Oh yeah, So I feel proud. I can tell him
• 28:13
  Speaker 4: he's the greatest. I can tell him to be somebody.
• 28:15
  Speaker 4: I can tell him to fair or not or what
• 28:17
  Speaker 4: are you losing? Look what I did now, I can preach.
• 28:20
  Speaker 4: This all helps what I'm standing for, and I'm just
• 28:23
  Speaker 4: happy everything I'm doing all like. People see me and say,
• 28:25
  Speaker 4: why are You're not tired of old looking up gray,
• 28:27
  Speaker 4: You're so happy?
• 28:28
  Speaker 5: Where are your bodyguards? You don't have no bodyguards? That's
• 28:31
  Speaker 5: what I've done. Nothing.
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: Well, it's great to have you with us.
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: Muhammad Ali, price fighting champion, minister to his people.
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: Now, Muhammad Ali, and.
• 28:39
  Speaker 5: I want Joe phrase as soon as you get it wrong, okay.
• 28:41
  Speaker 5: Joe Fraser for the
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: Type conversation with Muhammad Ali