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Are the Cardinals officially a good baseball team? · Cardinal Territory: A St. Louis Cardinals Podcast

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Winners of sixteen of their last twenty. They just swept
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: the Arizona Diamondbacks at home for their fourth sweep of
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: the season. They are a season high seven games over
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: five hundred. They are the Saint Louis Cardinals, and this
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: is Cardinal territory. Welcome back, Bernie. I gotta say, it's
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: the night before Memorial Day, and I did not necessarily
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: think that I would ever say at this time that
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: the Cardinals would be seven games over five hundred. I
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: know we've talked about it. I know I said I
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: wanted to wait till the end of May. I'm going
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: to call it, though, I'm gonna call it a little early.
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: I think the Same Luis Cardinals are a good baseball team.
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: I agree with you, because listen, even if we include
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: that that opening stretch, the opening what twenty five games,
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: they were ten and fifteen, Even if we include sort
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: of the numbers that weren't all that hot obviously during
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: that time, they're still pretty much a top ten team.
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: And everything you want to look at, runs per game
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: and starting pitching, ra bullpen era, bullpen era might be
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: more like eleven or twelve, and so what still still
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: upper half top ten and also some of the hitting categories.
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: So I think if you even with all of your
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: bad stretch of Baseball twenty five games man first twenty five,
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: even with all of that baked in, and you're still
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: you still rate very well among the thirty teams in
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: most of the categories that matter, I would say you're yeah,
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: you're a good team.
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: Here's why. I think when we looked at what they've
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: done over over May, we've had like incremental checkpoints through
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: each week. Right, it was, okay, well, can they figure
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: out how to play on the road, or okay, well
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: they swept the Pirates of the Nationals. Can they play
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: against better teams? Well, then they go and they take
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: two or three from Philly, and they hold their own
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: against Kansas City and Detroit, and now they sweep the Diamondbacks.
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: And now it's like they keep putting up, we keep
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: putting up little tests for them, and they keep acing them.
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: Good teams win in the ways that the Cardinals have
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: done in the month of May. They have a good defense,
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: they have a pitching staff. Coming into games today, the
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: Cardinals had allowed The Cardinals rotation had allowed two runs
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: or fewer in twelve or thirteen. I'm sorry of their
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: last sixteen games, now thirteen of their last seventeen because
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: Sunny Gray gave up three oohs. Right, But it's been great.
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: You have an offense where it's a different person every night.
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: And that's the thing that Olie Marbles talked about over
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: the weekend. He said, it's hard for me to just
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: pick one person because every night we're talking about a
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: different guy. And they win games the same way they
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: lose them in a way where it's tight, it's quick.
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: I don't know. They just do all these things that
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: makes me feel like I'm watching a good baseball team.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: And they sold me. They sold me this weekend. I
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: think they are a good team.
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: And yeah, because one of the things they couldn't win
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: the one run games early and one of the main
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: reasons the Cardinals were were.
• 2:54
  Speaker 3: Good last year as far as.
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: Getting into a winning column for the season, they were
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: really they were real good at one run decisions, and
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: as you know, it didn't start off that well this year.
• 3:05
  Speaker 3: It was all they were zero and five.
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: Now since then they're ten and three in one run games,
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: which including every game in this Arizona series. So when
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: you know you're playing a good team, and they are
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: a good team. Their record doesn't show it because they've
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: had to play the Dodgers so much and things like that.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: Arizona's a good club when.
• 3:25
  Speaker 3: You can.
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: You have like basically three games that were up for grabs,
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: like in the late innings, and you come out of
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: there with with a win in all three and you're
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: not even using your designated closer Sunday because you couldn't
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: and you know, Philed Mayton got into some trouble but
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: worked out of it. I mean, yeah, I when you
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: win the close games, listen, the Cardinals can bomb you
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: and win that way. They can. They can beat you
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: with just with really good pitching. And then when maybe
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: the offense has to really grind it together. I think
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: I think that was the case in all three of
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: these games.
• 3:59
  Speaker 3: It wasn't easy.
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: They had grind and grind and grind and grind right,
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: and then your bullpen, which has had a couple of
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: shaky moments, but they lock it up and you win
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: these one run games the way they have. I mean
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: ten out of the last thirteen one run games. That's
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: the sign of a really good baseball team. I know
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: some people that are friends of mine, even who are
• 4:16
  Speaker 2: analysts that say, well, one run games tend to be random,
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: not with this team, because they because they couldn't win
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: one run games early because the bullpen was terrible. There
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: was a direct root cause of it. And once they
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: hit their stride in all these other areas, now they're
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: exceptional at one run games. So I think that's a
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: good test too. And they're clearly they know what they're
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: doing against good teams. You know, I don't know whether
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: this is the up to date record, but they're like
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: fourteen and eleven against teams over five hundred. But let's
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: do this real quick and then I'll shut out. They
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: have series wins over Arizona, over Kansas City, over Houston,
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: over Milwaukee, which was a winning team at the time, Minnesota.
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: They have a series win over the Mets. They have
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: two series wins wins over Philadelphia.
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: I mean, I think that I think that is pretty good.
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: I don't think they need there's nothing there that says,
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: oh no, they can't beat good teams.
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: Of course they can.
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: It doesn't mean that, you know, when they play the Dodgers,
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: they won't lose a series. This is a loss of
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: well well played series to Detroit. I mean, no one's
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: saying they're invincible, obviously, but yeah, this stuff that just
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: blows me away. How good they are, that's what blows
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: me away. It isn't just that they're good, but they're
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: this good, and the way it's happening, I am pleasantly stunned,
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: I guess is the way to put it.
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: Yes, I'm not even surprised. I am sitting there and
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: I don't and kind of disbelief. And I think you
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: made a great point about the offense. That's a well
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: pitched series from Arizona. On the other side, I mean
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: that three starters are bullpen is good, and the offense
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: was so great and so versatile and took some great
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: quality of bats and manufactured offense when they needed to.
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: And winning teams do that. Winning teams are versatile. Winning
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: teams find different ways to win games, and we've seen
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: that all throughout May the Cardinals have played. The only
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: thing consistent about how they won is that it's their tenacity.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: But they can bang it out, they can play really
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: tight defense, they can win the one old ball game,
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: they can win the ten to five routes like they
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: It's May for a very very fun May, and again
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: I mean just going through it and being patient, and
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: you don't want to jump the gun. You don't want
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: to overreact, you know, especially in my position as a
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: beat writer, you have to be objective and kind of
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: take it these large sample sizes. I think the month
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: of May has been enough, and health matters, of course,
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: and you can still question the sustainability of a couple
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: of things, like the rotation. They haven't really had to
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: get their depth tested. This is something that I'm going
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: to be watching in June. The Cardinals were aided a
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: little bit by their schedule, you know, having an off
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: day every Thursday, you didn't really need to take any
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: days off or your regulars. You could put your best
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: line up out there every single day. Well, they have
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: two whole off days in June, one of them being
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: June second, So from June second to the end of
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: the month there is one off day, so the Cardinals
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: will have to wrest some of their regulars. Their bench
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: deff will be tested there. We'll get to that in June.
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: Right now, what the Cardinals have done is they've given
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: themselves a cushion. The Cubs are playing great baseball too,
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: so it's you know, they're staying right there at the
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: top of the division. It's been super fun to watch.
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: I've enjoyed it. We'll get into this later in the show.
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: The atmosphere bus shading this weekend was so much fun. Again,
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: before we get into our next segment, Bernie, I just
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: I think that the summer is going to go a
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: lot differently than many of us might have planned. And
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: a big name behind that is that we're gonna be
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: watching is Jordan Walker. So let's start this new segment
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: spoiler alert. I might not be great at it, but
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: let's hear from Arena Club our player to watch. So
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: Jordan Walker on Saturday, great game Offensively, he's been working
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: lessly on just pretty much everything on all sides of
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: the ball, right, and he's been very candid about his struggles.
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: Alie Marml's been very candid about what Jordan's been going
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: through with Brent Brown, the same thing. It's just trying
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: to get everyone convicted on the same page. And he
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: comes through on Saturday, big hits, big swings. The defense
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: was a little weird and very unorthodox defensive ending for
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: the Cardinals across the board for Jordan Walker. Walker to
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: be able to come through not once but twice in
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: that game. The quality of bats are getting better. He's
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: hitting the heck out of the baseball. The exit below
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: is almost always in the triple digits. What are you
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: seeing from from Jordan, Bernie, because he looks like he's
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: getting a little better.
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: Well, he started to get some starting to get some
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: subtraction offensively.
• 8:44
  Speaker 3: You know, a couple of huge hits.
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: You going going all the way back to that Saturday
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: night in Kansas City, and then this weekend, you know,
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: he came he came up big Saturday and Sunday. So, uh,
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: that's what you wanted from him. You just wanted to
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: see him to get at something going, get some confidence,
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: get some traction.
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: And I think he's starting to show that.
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: And listen, I know he's had a couple of shaky
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: moments recently in right field, but he is one of
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: the reasons why they have by easily the best defense
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: in the majors, which is another thing. As you know,
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: the Cardinals do exceptionally well. It's amazing and he's been
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: part of that defensive improvement. So it's a real small sample,
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: but I'm really happy by what we've seen from him
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: in the last you know, six or seven games or so,
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: it might be five. I didn't work up any stats
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: for that, but look, we just know he's getting big
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: hits and he's getting hits bear, so that's that's really
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: good stuff. And you can tell he's like he's exailing
• 9:46
  Speaker 2: a little bit too.
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: So of course, and when you look at Jordan Walker,
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: let's go through his splits right now. Over his last
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: fifteen games, two fifty but the slugginess three seventy five,
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: he has driven an eleven runs, so that's pretty good.
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: You look at the last seven games though, hitting four
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: to twelve, slug is up to seven oh six. And
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: it's gonna be like this with Jordan. We've talked about it.
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: It's gonna be some up and down, some gradual progression,
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: some decline. That's the whole point of the season. But
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: what is different about Jordan this year is how much
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: he's buying into the messaging, where in years prior. I'm
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: not at all suggesting that he was defiant by any
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: means that that's not the case, but you can understand
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: how a twenty two year old at the time, twenty
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: one year old, and the years prior would have some
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: sort of I think it would be natural to have
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: a little bit of reservations about the organization given how
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: things had gone for him in his development, and having
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: new voices come in like Brent Brown, like John Jay
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: and give everyone a clean slate, and Ali Marmal's done
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: a heck of a job with his young roster as well,
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: and just allow Jordan to have the opportunity to trust
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: in the organization. Again, they don't if they don't see
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: this buying from Jordan, they're not committing to him. They're
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: not plain and simple, especially with so many other younger
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: players taking steps forward. But because they see the buying
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: from Jordan, because they see the commitment, because he's putting
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: in the work, they're going to continue to reward him
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: with this opportunity. That's the whole point of the season.
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: And I think we get so caught up in the
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: transition year of a players seizing their opportunity, whether that's
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: Ivon Herrera or Matthew libertorea Brendan Donovan. Just because Jordan
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: Walker isn't seizing the opportunity in the box score right
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: now necessarily doesn't mean that their plan for him won't
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: be successful. I actually think this is just as important
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: in the long term view than the short term view. No,
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: he's had a really bad May. The end of April
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: was really bad as well, but he's continuing to develop
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: from a mental standpoint. He's bought back into the organization.
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: They've done a great job keeping him focused. That's why
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: I'm looking at for Jordan Walker, and maybe this week
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: was a sign that these both things are finally clicking
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: into one.
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm glad you had those stats from the last
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: seven days because I didn't see you're trying to steal
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: my job, Katie, I resented. I'm supposed to be the
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: stat nerd.
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: No, thank you for that.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: But as you were talking and I was agreeing with
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: everything you said, but I was thinking of those numbers
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: over the last seven games four twelve average six LUG.
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: When's the last time he had a seven game stretch
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: like that. I mean, it's only seven, but but that
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: also says like, how and how big of a hole
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: he has been in. He couldn't he couldn't climb out
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: of it. Uh, you know, he had like what two
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: good games, two or three good games at this at
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: the very top of the season last year he put
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: a few good games together late, but that's a really
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: good seven game stretch because he's been everything but that
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: over many, many seven game stretches, So it's a good
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: But I see see this is where Ali gets a
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: lot of credit, not just for his role in what
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: he does as a manager, but as a leader. But
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: I think you and I touched on this recently. Look
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: at the coaching staff he put together, and these are
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: people he wanted. These are people he recruited, These are
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: people he sought recommendations about. Who who should I hire?
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: You know, Brent Brown, Skip Schumacher, who we all trust,
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: said oh, you got to hire this guy.
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: He's great. He was my guy in Miami when I
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: won Manager of the Year. He's great. John Jay great.
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: Daniel de Scalzo already shown he knows what he's doing. Yeah,
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: Brent Brown. And you know, I think Dusty Blakett I
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: used to.
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: Make fun of him.
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: And you know, I've apologized for this because I told
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: you this before. You know, I just did see him
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: in the dugout with the iPad and I'm like, well,
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: what is he He's always looking at the iPad. You know,
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: I called him coach iPad totally totally no. It was
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: like totally wrong, me being a smart alec. You know,
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: he's really good. He's really good. They there's a I taught.
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: I did a video this past week and I explain
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: why they are pitching so well despite not striking a
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: lot of people out.
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: And it's not an accident.
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: They're doing everything you need to do to offset a
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: lack of strikeouts. You know, according to that Itosaris and
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: some others came up with that that thing called you know,
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: it's like pitching plus stuff plus location plus location plus
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: the Cardinals pitchers location plus. It's basically as it sounds,
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: do you do you have the control to get the
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: ball where you want it to go, right, If you
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: have a spot, you hit that spot. They were as
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: of midweek, they there are only three pitching staffs in
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: baseball that had a better location rating. So you say, well,
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: how can they pitch so well? You know, they don't
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: strike people out because they get a lot of gum
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: balls and you know where the highest percentage of the
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: ground balls go, left side of the infield. Uh, oh,
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: bad hitters, you don't want to go there. They don't
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: walk anybody they walk. They have one of the lowest
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: walk rates in Major League Baseball and they have one
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: of the lowest home run rates allowed in Major League Baseball.
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: So they're doing like if you would put a list
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: of things together you have to do even though you're
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: only striking out nineteen percent, which is just so bad.
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: But if you put a list, well, it's gonna you
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: got to thread the needle. But here's how you do it.
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: They have done every single one of those things. Now
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: they're going to have to do it through the end
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: of the season, but it's really impressive. And Dusty Blake's
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: got a lot, a lot, a lot to do with that.
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: I agree. I've always really enjoyed my conversations with Dusty
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: Blake because I find him to be so intelligent and
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: there are so many behind the scenes metrics and analytics
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: and tools to look at pitching and what makes a
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: picture good on paper versus on the mound, and Dusty
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: can explain things where a simple mind person like myself
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: can really understand it. And I understand why fans weren't
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: buying in because you're only going to buy into the
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: results that you see. And in twenty three, especially and
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: in twenty four, there weren't a ton of results to
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: go from this year though, and this is a credit
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: to Dusty and his pictures, who have been so candid
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: in their explanations on why this is important, why location
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: in pitching to contact works, how they're going to get
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: more swing and miss. You're able to one understand because
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: you have some background information and two you see it
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: on the field, and it's so much easier to buy
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: in now. So I'm glad the pitching staff looks way
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: that it does. I mean they fixed Jojo Romero in
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: a matter of you know, ten days. Matthew Liberto. I mean,
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: he's arguably the best picture in the rotation are Polante.
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: I know the ERI doesn't jump off the page, but
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: there's a ton of growth being there. Made are being
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: made there as well. It's a lot of things going
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: right with this coaching staff, and honestly, I think we
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: should dive a little bit more into that. But first
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: let's hear from cash app crats.
• 16:17
  Speaker 4: I'm gonna let everyone in on a little secret. I
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• 17:13
  Speaker 3: Terms apply.
• 17:14
  Speaker 4: That's money, that's Cash App.
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: So I'll have be candid here. After the game today
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: recording this Sunday night, and went into Ali Marble's office
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: and I said, I have a compliment for you, And
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: I'm not one that's I'm not great with compliments. I'm
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: kind of a smart ass. I said, I think that
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: you and your staff have done a commendable job, a
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: really good job getting this team on track. And let's
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: think about what Ali Marmel and his staff had to
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: deal with coming into the season minimal roster upgrades. An
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: organization went out there and saying, our priority is the
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: long term, not the short term. And hey, by the way,
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: Ali in company, you need to play all of these
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: players and figure out a way to get every single
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: person consistent playing time so that we know how to
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: move forward them them in the future or without them
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: in the future. And you also, we're we're not like
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: tanking because we don't do that with the Cardinals. You
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: also have to figure out a way to be relevant
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: and you know, hopefully win games. So we're not gonna
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: help you in any regards. Go get them. And it
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: was rough in April, and he was putting, you know,
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: a really tough spot playing some guys like Gorman Walker
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: every day and though they were struggling, sitting a hotter
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: Bat and Burlison. You know, you go down the list
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: and something clicked, and a lot of it is the
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: credit to the players. But players don't have that buy
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: in unless they believe in their coaching staff and the
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: work that these guys do behind the scenes, whether that's Allie,
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: whether it's Scouse j Study Clap Dusty pop Warner go
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: down the list has allowed the team to buy in
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: to themselves and the coaching staff. And now you're seeing
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: what happens when there's a collective buy in across the board.
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: That doesn't happen by accident. That's an intentional effort by
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: the coaching staff that said, hey, yeah, all the like
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: exterior things happening right now that are not going to
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: work with us, screw that, we don't care. We can
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: build our own culture here. And that's what they did.
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: And I think the coaching staff deserves a ton of
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: credit for turning it around in May.
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: They absolutely do, because the players, you know, coaches tend
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: to come and go.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: And you know, frankly, I don't think the Cardinals have
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: had the best coaching staff that they could put together
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: at times twenty three, even to an extent twenty four,
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: although you know, again, Desgasso was really was a big
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: help to Ali in twenty four and.
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: It also helped lead him to some other guys. But anyway,
• 19:31
  Speaker 3: I'm getting off track.
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: But you can tell even Nolan Gorman, all right, he
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: hasn't gotten the payoff yet, and partially because it's like
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: they're investing more in burleson as they should. But you know,
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: Gorman has actually made progress in a way that doesn't
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: show up in batting average and slugging percentage. I mean
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: he chases less, he strikes out less, he.
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: Walks more. I mean his plate discipline's really good.
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: And so even though there's not a finished product where
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: you say, oh wow, he's hitting two eighty with a
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: you know, four eighty eight sluck. Even though that's not
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: there yet, some of his bad habits have been smoothed out.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: And that's a big step which you think would lead
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: to the actual box score results.
• 20:16
  Speaker 3: So we'll see.
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: But Walker has been really really tough to try to
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: get him settled in.
• 20:21
  Speaker 3: But I think he's figuring it out.
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: But I just you know, I know Miles Michaels, for example,
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: kind of self diagnosed in a lot of weights.
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he's self diagnosed. But he also did.
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: It with help from Dusty Baker and Olie Marvel. I
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: mean they Dusty laid out well this listen, Look, this
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: is where you're.
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: Get in trouble, and this is what you're gonna have
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: to do.
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: And Miles Michaels, who's a prideful guy, you know, he
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: doesn't want to be a guy with a five plus era.
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: He made the changes he needed to me. They made
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: recommendations deliveratore about you know, you have to what's he
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: throwing more? I always get those things confused. Is he
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: throwing the cutter more or the for the slider more?
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: One of the two?
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: His pittricks hasn't totally changed, right, but it ultimately depends
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: on the outing, so it's more of an even mix.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: But there is sometimes an emphasis on the cutter, sometimes
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: an emphasis on the sticker.
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: So they've made recommendations to players that you can see
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: the results, the positive results, and that's really something that's
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: you got to give them credit to. This team's got
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: a shared mindset, they got a shared philosophy, they have
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: a shared personality. Everybody's on the same page and it's
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: really really cool to see. And the other thing I
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: like about this team, if I could just throw this
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: out here, is that when you have an underdog team
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: that no one thinks is going to do anything right,
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: a lot of doom and gloom Saint Louis and elsewhere.
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: You know, national writers, and I don't blame them, they
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: just weren't expecting the Cardinals to be anything really well,
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: you need some surprises, you need some people like all right,
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: if I would have told you at the end of
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: last season, mss Katie Wu, if I would have told
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: you said, well, you know, with all due respect to
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: Sonny Gray, in terms of the two best, the two
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: most important things that have happened with this rotation, what
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: if I told you, Katie, by Memorial Day, Miles Michaelis
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: would have like a like a two O five e
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: R since that start in Boston or whatever it is.
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: And Matthew Liberator, who has never been given a full
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: time opportunity to start that he would have a better
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: fielding independity R than Paul Skene's uh Max Free, Chris Sales,
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: Zach Wheeler, on and on and on.
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: He's he's he's a top ten.
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: Major league starter. So I don't know who played that ticket.
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: Like basically, in a way, they're two best starters. Especially
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: what I'm not doing a good job explaining this, they're
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: two best starters in terms of wildly exceeding expectations.
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: Are Liberator and Michaelis to.
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: Use a horse racing term, like who had that exact ticket?
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: I wouldn't have that.
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: It's not that I thought Limit Tour would stake.
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: It's just we had to see it. We didn't know
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: right well, I never going to.
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: Give him the opportunity in the first place. That was
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: already where I was having some doubts and yeah, in
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: not two years where it doesn't look good. And you know,
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: I've people on the show know this. I really like
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: and enjoy covering Miles michael As. I find it to
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: be very refreshing, very honest, prideful, but understanding of what
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: the expectations are and to be able to see two
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: different guys, right like Miles Michaelis go out there and
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: have a turning point in the season and say like,
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: this is not working. I don't want to I want
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: to help win games. I don't want to be a
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: reason we're not. And turning that around after over a
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: decade of service time making a career out of something
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: he was good at, now at thirty six years old,
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: saying it's either adapt or get out. He adapted, then
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: you have a whole on the whole other side, Liberatore
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: just starting his career as a starting pitcher. They given
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: this opportunity, We've talked about this. They allow him to
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: go out there and fail if he has to. When
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: he rewards them by seizing the opportunity and running with it.
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's two completely different ends at the spectrum.
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: The result is these guys took this challenge to heart,
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: they had a staff that was willing to back them up,
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: and now you're reaping the rewards. I mean, Miles Michaelis.
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: People are gonna hate this one. He's a formidable middle
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: of the rotation army. From almost every single stat that
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: you used to evaluate success. Sure, the analytics or the
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: expected stats suggest that a drop off is coming, but
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: it hasn't so far. So I would never have guessed this.
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: In fact, if you would have told me what you
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: just said, Bernie, I would have asked you, like, what
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: kind of drugs are you on?
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: I would love exactly exactly. You know, Nicholas has been really,
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: really good.
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: I mean I was looking up symmetrics.
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to read them to you, but you
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: know he's those pitches he used to leave off the plate. No,
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry that he would get too much of the plate.
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: He's now he's now doing very well that on those
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: pitches they're shadow pitches just off the plate. He's done
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: very well with him, and he's he realizes now what
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: the deal is, and he's savvy enough to set the
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: hitters up, but he's not going to feed them strikes
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: when they're expecting strikes to come.
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: He's just not going to do it.
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: And I just think he deserves a lot of credit.
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: So you you mentioned the buy in, Miles Michaelis totally
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: has bought in. And the one thing that's the one
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: thing that surprised me in a way is like, I'll
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: just reference cam Wax because I'm on there a lot.
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: And uh, this past week, we we we must have
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: got two or three comments from from listeners, which is fine,
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: but they said he can't understand why, you know, hey,
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: Miles Michaelis is pitching great, why does Olly take him
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: out after sixty sixty.
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: Five pitches and fast the narrative? Fast?
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: Oh my goodness.
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: And it's just I just said, I said, if Olly
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: wasn't doing that, it would actually be managerial malpractice. And
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: you know what, you know who agrees with that, Miles
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: Michaelas see, Miles michaels like he's got he's got a
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: lot of prime and he doesn't if he's pitching a
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: good game and he's gone five or even if he's
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: gone five and two thirds or he's going Any pitcher
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: who believes in himself is not going to like being
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: taken out. But Miles completely understands why, and he can
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: look at the numbers as well, and you don't want
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: him in their third time through the lineup. That's his
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: disaster zone. So why would I I don't understand why
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: people want to space more out of Michaelis when Ali
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: and Dusty Blake and Miles himself they're getting the maximum
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: out of him. So why in the world would you
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: want to change the formula?
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: Well, why do you think Miles Michaelis is doing so well?
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: Right?
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: Because they're managing the workload, the execution, the game plan,
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: and yes, he is producing and performing. Of course, I'm not,
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: obviously not going to suggest otherwise. But part of the
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: reason why his era is lowered now to three five
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: two one five cents that start against Boston is because
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: they're taking him out of the right spots and they've
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: extended some sort of a longer lea in situations where
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: he's mourned it. You think about that game in Kansas City,
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: he goes third time through the order. That's not something
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: that he had it done in years or in weeks prior.
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: But he pitched so well and had been so effective
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: that all he and Dusta said, let's reward him. Let's
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: give give him an opportunity he gets through the inning.
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: It's not going to happen like that every single time,
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: but Miles has such a he's so efficient, right, so
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: he has a low pitch count. That's all you see
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: if you see, why is your manager taking out the
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: starting pitchers at seventy five pitches after six innings. It's
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: bigger than that, though, and how they've been managing Miles
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: is exactly why he's had a good portion of success
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: that he has had so far. And we'll see him,
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: we'll see how this rotation looks. They'll have a weird
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: matchup in Baltimore and then Texas as well coming up
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: on the six game road trip. We'll break that down
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: for you. After another quick message from our pals at
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: Arena Club.
• 27:41
  Speaker 4: I just want to say before Arena Club, if you
• 27:44
  Speaker 4: were trying to very actively buy sell trade, it was
• 27:48
  Speaker 4: very complicated and used a lot of mail that was unnecessary.
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: I don't know I even know how to do it.
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: But I'm glad we have Arena Club now because it's
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: a one stop shop for everything card related.
• 27:56
  Speaker 4: It is, and right now you can get twenty percent
• 27:59
  Speaker 4: off your first lab pack or your first card purchase
• 28:01
  Speaker 4: by going to Arena club dot com. Slash foul, use
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: code foul. If you're a collector, you've got to check
• 28:09
  Speaker 4: out Arena Club. Go get after it.
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: All Right, So some programming notes. I will not be
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: with the team in Baltimore. I will take enough series off.
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: I get one a month, and it was this one.
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: And I'll meet the team in Doubt Arlington before Friday's game.
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: But things that I'm looking at right now, it's not
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: great in Baltimore. That Baltimore team reminds me a lot
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: of the twenty twenty three Cardinals, and just no pitching,
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: things off the rails, no direction. They already fired their manager.
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: Think about how about this, Bernie. Not that I would
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: ever suggest this, I would never want this for anybody,
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: But what did you have the guess that Allie Marmle
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: would have had a job over Derek Shelton, Bud Black
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: and Brandon Hyde.
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: Probably not, probably not, but here probably not, you know,
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: especially Brandon Hyde and It's not like Bud Black or
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: Derek Shelton.
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: Had a chance either.
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: And with Brandon Hyde, I can kind of understand it. It
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: was a there was a weird team. They just that's
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: a team that whatever the things that we attribute to
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: the Cardinals having his collective mindset, they're they're they're great competitors,
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: they grind, they're intense.
• 29:11
  Speaker 3: Uh you get them down in the game.
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: They're they're gonna they're gonna rise up and try to
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: at least try to fight back, you know, and and
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: all you know that the connection between the coaches, the
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: manager and the players is really really strong. I mean,
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: you can see that alignment. That's a that's a word.
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: It became a buzzword. Like in college football. Well, they
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: have the alignment from the university president all the way
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: down to the you know, the position coaches. We have
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: an alignment. The Cardinals have an alignment. They really do.
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: The Orioles from what I can tell. And I follow
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: them sort sort of closely because it's team I grew
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: up with my brother who will be there tomorrow. By
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: the way, they're they're big fans, and he just said, like,
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: I don't know what they're I don't know what their
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: philosophy is. I don't know what they stand for, what's
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: their identity. They're just like, Okay, let's go play. You know,
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: it's like there's nothing. The Cardinals have these qualities you
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: can point to. So yeah, but the only the only
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: thing is that you know the and they've been awful,
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: but they have they have one two in a row.
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: So hope they're not getting it for the Cardinals saying
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: not getting not not starting to fill.
• 30:13
  Speaker 3: Their roads a little bit. But that's baseball, right, that's baseball.
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: Who in the world thought the Cardinals would be sitting
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: here on Memorial Day Eve not only a better record
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: than an than the Ools, but a much better record
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: than the Ools?
• 30:27
  Speaker 3: Right?
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: Who would have thought that? Who would have thought, I'm
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: gonna throw this one out again? Who would have thought that?
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: As we sit here at a Memorial Day twenty twenty five,
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: then since since Craig Council became the Cubs manager at
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: the start of twenty twenty four, who.
• 30:40
  Speaker 3: Would have thought?
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: Who would have bet that Ali Marmel would only have
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: two fewer wins in Craig Council, right, and Craig Council
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: with every advantage that the manager could ask for, right,
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: every advantage a manager can ask for.
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: But yet Ali's only won two fewer games, so.
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: You know, it's a out time that he gets and
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: the coaches they get credit. If we are going to
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: rip them collectively, fans, media, whomever, if we're going to
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: point fingers and rip them when things are going wrong,
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: I do not understand, nor do I respect the people
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: that hold praise when he deserves praise.
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: You can't have it both ways.
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: You can't blame him when something When they're going bad,
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: it's the manager, he's terrible. But when they're playing great, great,
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: great baseball, and the team's fired up and they have
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: a great personality, they have an identity, they have a
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: great coaching staff, everyone's on the same page. The energy
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: level is fantastic. So what they're doing this in spite
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: of the manager? Is anyone who's got a reasonably sane
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: person Is anyone trying to do that they're doing.
• 31:49
  Speaker 3: It in spite of the manager. I don't think so.
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: And as you know, I haven't held back when I
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: think Ali's messing up some stuff, but that that.
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: That has nothing to do with like these sweeping judgment.
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: Oh he's terrible. No, I just thought he made a
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: mistake there. There's a difference, right, So anyway, I had
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: to get on my soapbox there because I it just
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: I think, I think fans are coming around on this
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: team and on him.
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: I do.
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: Well, that's a perfect segue into what it will be
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: our last segment. Okay, Bush Stadium. I did a piece
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: of The Athletic over the weekend about the improving the
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: end game experience because there are several investments being made.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: And before we get into that, yes, I know the
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: best way to get fans back at the ballpark is
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: by winning ball games. I know that, but as someone
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: who you know is in still in her twenties, if
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: I go to a baseball game, I want an entertainment
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: product too. And for the last couple of years, respectfully
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: to everyone working there, have a ton of friends that
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: work there, the experience felt very stale and it just
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: felt like it was it could have been so much
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: better because I think Bushadium is one of the most
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: beautiful stadiums in baseball. I don't think there's a bad seat.
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: I love that you're there for a baseball game, and
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: I love the fans in bus Shadium. They are fantastic,
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: but man, I just felt like they hadn't upgraded anything
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: in years, and they're really trying to appeal to a
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: younger generation, the younger demographic in their twenties and thirties.
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: So this is somewhere that my friends and I've been
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: into and while also in you know, instilling the same
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: kind of tradition and modern baseball game that their longtime
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: fans have been accustomed to. So it's a tough line
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: to draw, but I think they're doing a nice job
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: and trying to figure out what works there. But what
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: I really saw of what works there is winning baseball.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: Because the atmosphere at Bushadium this weekend was electric. I
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: was locked in on every pitch and I'd players telling
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: me after the game, setting me text after the game,
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: Like the atmosphere at bush was great Friday, Saturday, even
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: today with some rainy weather. I feel like the city
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: of Saint Louis is buying back into their Cardinals team,
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: and I hope they are because it just makes things
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: so much more fun when you have, you know, you
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: have a come from behind victory in the eighth inning
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: where you have your closer blowing doors to save the game,
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: and then in the ninth you have your third baseman
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: diving into the stands to make a play to save
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: the game. Like just hearing the fan reaction from that,
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: it just solidifies the experience so much better. So while
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: I commend the Cardinals for the changes of making to
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: the in game experience, go check that out on the
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: Athletic if you choose, I also commend the fans for
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: coming back to the ballpark and making bushad him feel
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: like Bushadium again.
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: No, because it's a special place when it's right. And
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: it's been really depressing to see the empty sea a
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: red and it really is. It's frustrating. It's depressing. I
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: don't people have the right to spend their money as
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: they want, and there are some reasons for people to
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: be frustrated and disillusioned. But then when the team that's
• 34:42
  Speaker 2: actually in the field is this exciting, is this charming?
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: Is this likable?
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: And they play the style of baseball that Saint Louis's
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: of a certain age love and always harken back to,
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: you know, when you know Tony's teams did this, White
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: these teams did this, and I get it, I get it.
• 35:01
  Speaker 3: That's okay.
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: These teams are showing, like we're talking about characteristics. They
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: haven't accomplished anything yet, but they're showing those kind of
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: style points and characteristics that we as Saint Louis and
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: baseball fans going way back, claim that's the thing. Those
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: are the things we love about a team, and this
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: team has a lot of those factors. So yeah, I
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: was going to tell you I read the story and
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: I liked it, and I thought you did a great job.
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: And I also appreciated their candor in talking about basically
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: like what we don't have an answer yet, We're going
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: to be trying different things. We're going to be experimenting, right,
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: and that's the.
• 35:41
  Speaker 3: Way to do it. That's the way to do it.
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: So I was I always read the comments section under
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: your pieces because I think I think you have a
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: very loyal readership, which doesn't surprise me. But man, Katie,
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: your people's they were going nuts over that.
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: They were just blasts than everybody.
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: I've got that one, Yeah, but I don't.
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: I mean again, I get I get a lot of
• 36:09
  Speaker 2: why people are fed up, but if they're if they're
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: making an effort to get young fans in and the
• 36:16
  Speaker 2: baseball experience is actually separate about whether the team that's
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: seven games above five hundred or five hundred or a
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: few games below, you still you still want to have
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: a great ballpark experience. So my thing is, well, let
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: them try this there. Look, did it take them too
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: long to kind of realize well, wait a minute, we're
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: a little outdated here. Okay, uh, they're there. They were
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: like they were like somebody walking around using a BlackBerry.
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: It's like, yo, nobody uses blackberries really, right. So I
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: am not gonna like, I will foam at the mouth
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: about a lot of stuff. I will not foam at
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: the mouth of an organization's trying to do something and
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: they're even being straightforward and say, well, we're not sure.
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: You know what that magic spot is. You're like, what
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: that magic touch is, but we're not sure. But we're
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: gonna try a lot of things. We're gonna see what,
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: you know, the response to this or that. I commend
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: them for that. I don't shred them for that. You know, well,
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: we'll see if it improves over time. But I thought
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: it was a great story. It was very enlightening, and
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: it's I'm always disappointed as a journalist or as a
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: commentator whatever the heck you want to call me. I'm
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: always disappointed when in effect somebody likes you. It takes
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: the time to do all that talk and to do
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: to talk to all them and get all this feedback,
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: and they're very, very candid with you, and they're like
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: laying it on the line, and they're telling you exactly
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: where they went wrong. They're owning up to it. Okay,
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: we got to do this, We got to do that.
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: This is the base, this is the age groups we
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: have to be more appealing to. But and in effect,
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: for being honest, it got them a lot of scorn
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: and ridicule. I've never understood that do you want these
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: people that we cover to be honest with us or
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: or you know, or do you want us you want
• 37:59
  Speaker 2: to you want want them to feed us a bunch
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: of bs?
• 38:02
  Speaker 3: You know?
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So that's what we sign up for, right Bernie,
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: And like fans right to feel the way that they do.
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: And I do think once the overall frustration with ownership settled,
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: if it settles down, fans will be able to look
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: at that information in a new light. But right now,
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: I mean, this is this is a show me state.
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: For a reason, they're as fans in baseball for a reason,
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: they have high standards. So for an organization to go
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: out and be like, oh, yeah, you know, we're we're
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: trying to improve the stadium in the experience. Here's what
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: we're doing. Of course, the response is gonna be like,
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: well about you win games and then we'll come, of course.
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: But what I would encourage fans to do who are
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: skeptical about coming back to the stadium, whatever reasons may be,
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: is just read it and hear what Cardinals brass is saying,
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: what builds what the third is saying on Hey, you know,
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: we need to do better for our fan base. Yeah,
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: they need to do better across the board baseball and business.
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: But these things are like they're intertwined, They're they absolutely
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: are part of the cycle together. So if you want
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: the Cardinals to have a better game to experience, yes,
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: the club needs to be better on the field, But
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: if you want fans to come to the ballpark just
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: for a casual day, you need to give them a
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: reason to And what we're seeing over the last homestand
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: was that fans are having good time coming back.
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: To And just so just so fans watching this don't
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: misunderstand because I talk a lout and sometimes it's easy
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: to uh, maybe I meant I fail to make my
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: own point very well. But no, they have every right
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: to expect better and to demand better. My point is,
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: I don't care what anybody that's running a business. It's
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: like there's an obligation to the customers, and customers can
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: feel however they want to feel about something. My point is,
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: just like before condemning them, just wait, just just wait
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: and see if it's working, if the stuff at the
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: ballpark gets better.
• 39:51
  Speaker 3: I just don't.
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: I've never been the type to just condemn something before
• 39:56
  Speaker 2: anyone's even had a chance to roll out what they're doing.
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: So that's all.
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: That's that's the only point I'm made. But if people
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: if people want to make fun of the Cardinals, make
• 40:03
  Speaker 2: fun of the Cardinals, I mean, it's okay.
• 40:05
  Speaker 3: I don't work. I don't work for the Cardinals, so yeah,
• 40:07
  Speaker 3: you're not hurt my feelings.
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: Well, we'll see what this looks like when they come
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: back from the road again, a six game, seven day trip,
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: all interleague games three against the Baltimore Orioles. I don't
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: know why, I'll just call them the Baltimore Ravens. I'm tired.
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: An off day in Arlington on Thursday, and then three
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: against the Rangers before coming back for a ten game
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: homestand at Bush Stadium. Let's see these birds can keep
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: it rolling finish out the month of May. Strong. As always,
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: Katie Bernie here to break things down for you. Will
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: be back with you next week. Thanks as always. Oh
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: my gosh, I almost forgot this fifth episode of Cardinal Territory,
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: which is crazy. I cannot believe anyone who's given me
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: a platform for this long. I mean, I still don't
• 40:44
  Speaker 1: know how the athletic has kept me hired. But before
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: we sign off, thank you Cardinal Territory subscribers, fans, supporters,
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: whether you're on YouTube, Spotify, Apple, even if you just
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: follow along on Twitter. We can't do this without you.
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: I don't have a job without you, and I really
• 40:58
  Speaker 1: appreciate the support. So here's another fifty more with better
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: ad reads.
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: At least that's part of the entertainment, is it, Yeah,
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: it is?
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: Oh well, I'll try to about You.
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: Know, nobody wants to see you be perfect. You know
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: you need to have that what's the word, what's the phrase?
• 41:16
  Speaker 3: I want to use.
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: I was going to say the common man touch, it
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: wouldn't be that the common person, the common person touch,
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: Like yeah, Katy, Katie, I'm yeah, Like all this stuff's
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: new to Katie. Let's see what Let's see how she
• 41:30
  Speaker 2: does this week and say it's it's it's all right
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: because listen, if somebody be asking me to push buttons
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: and get the right graphics on the screen, oh my goodness,
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: are you kidding me?
• 41:41
  Speaker 3: You're doing fine?
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: So if I am anything you guys, it is entertaining.
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: So hopefully you find this podcast the same way. For Bernie,
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: I'm Katie. We're back with you next week. Thanks, as
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: always for watching.