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The Truth About ADHD Nobody Talks About w/ Your ADHD Guy · Surviving-ISH Podcast

• 0:14
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to Surviving Ish, the show where we talk about navigating everyday life when we have 10,000 tabs open in our brain.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_02: Three of them are crashing, and we can't remember why we walked into the damn kitchen.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_02: I am so excited to have this conversation today with Ronald.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_02: And how are you, man?
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_01: I'm doing fantastic.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for asking.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: What about you?
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, not too bad.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_02: Like I said, you might hear a little noise in the background just because I have some construction going on in the house, but we'll make it work.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: There's always noise in the background.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_02: There's always something going on.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_02: Well, why don't you do a bit of an introduction for us?
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so yeah, I'm like Ron Sowers, your ADHD guy.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'm a strengths coach.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't always that way.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like, do you want me to just like go into my story and like how?
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, okay, yeah.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it really started like a long time ago in a galaxy farm.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_01: I was just kidding.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I couldn't help that.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: But uh yeah, like literally, I was like I uh it started because like I realized that I was an an addict.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, what what was like the major turning point for me, and I talk about it a lot, is like you know, I ended up homeless uh for the second time and I had a job uh and I was like out on the national mall, like in DC, and that that wasn't fun because it was starting to get cold.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_01: Not that that would be fun, period, but like it I remember specifically like crawling because I I was living in this little house thing that would like they had a whole bunch of people in bunks and it was like a community house, and like it was the only thing I could get at the time, and you know, I I hated going to it, and there was like this altercation, so they you had to type in this code to get in the door, and like when I came home one night, the they had changed the code because you know, even though I paid up, and I was like, so I went around the back and I crawled under this like screen just to sleep that night, and I was like, the thing was like I was like really believing in God at the time, and you know, that this is what I'm supposed to, but it wasn't right, you know.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: So I was like, I didn't want to have to keep crawling under there, so I decided that you know, like I'm not coming back here.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_01: So even when I came back to get my stuff, like they had put it in a trash can, like it was like such a humiliating time in my life, but honestly, like if I didn't follow that path, I wouldn't be here where I am today.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: And like it took a long time to like for me to to understand that it was m about more than the drugs, like that, like I literally had a problem with life and like dealing with stuff in in a way that was functional.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_01: So during that process, like I had had to get to a lot of acceptance of like, yeah, I'm an addict, like this is just gonna be part of who I am for the rest of my life, and along that journey of like bumping my head, like I've discovered that I had ADHD as well.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: Because like people in my my life were continuing to tell me to slow down, you need to slow down, maybe you need to check that out.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, I was like, you guys need to just speed up, like y'all in slow motion, you don't know what you're talking about.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_01: So like I ended up almost losing my job because I kept running into stuff, damaging company property, hurting myself, and like it just got really like the fear got so much of me losing that job and keep keeping like they kept bringing me back into the office and having these conversations.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: And luckily I had someone in my life, you know, my like my sponsor, and he was telling me, Yeah, you probably need to go to see your general practitioner about this and see what you know, maybe it's ADHD.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_01: And so I did, and they were she was like, I was like told her the same thing.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: I'm scared, I'm worried about losing my job, I can't slow down, I don't know what to do.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_01: And like she was kind of like, I don't I don't know what is going on.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't yeah, I really don't have an answer.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, maybe it's ADHD.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: And she was like, didn't seem convinced, but she still gave me a list of therapists and psychologists.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I was like, I went down that list.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_01: I remember I was like, so like I needed the help yesterday.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like I it was there was so much of like freedom, but at the same time, like I want to know what's going on, like they can fix me, or whatever is going on.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like I didn't know what to expect, but I remember when I finally did talk to my to the therapist, which I still have today, like the one of the first things that he said to me was like this can actually be a strength, and I was like, huh?
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like really and once that like started to wear off, I was like, I was I felt because that freedom that that oh this makes sense why why I'm at I was like man, I'm not normal anymore, I'm one of those.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: So there was this whole idea of like the reason why I did the work was because like the work that I did in in Narcotics Anonymous was like what helped me get to where I am.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: So I already had a foundation going in.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_01: Like if if I knew that I just had to be open-minded to the suggestions and at least do them, and then if it didn't work, it wasn't because I didn't try it, it's because it just I need to look for somebody else.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_01: And the thing that really stuck out with that was like I I thought I could fix it.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, I'm gonna do everything that he says to fix this.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the first things that he suggested for me to do was like drive you're going to work the long way.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_01: So I was like, I literally took that to heart and went the long way to work.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_01: So I went like extra early.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_01: It was therapeutic, it really did help things slow down, but it was still like on a mountain that I felt impossible to climb.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: Because I still kept, especially at work, and you know, I had this idea of like I need to, I need to prove myself every day.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: I need to do better than I did yesterday.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_01: And if I forget that's I'm dumb, like how could that happen?
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I've been working on it and focusing on it.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_01: So I never have no real no acceptance of like the ADHD.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: I just was like trying to fix it.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: Well, no, and I think there's such a uh a stigma that comes with it, you know, and and some people don't even take it serious.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, we see these TV shows where it's like the mom's taking the kid's Ritalin, you know, and and that Ritalin was uh for their child's ADHD.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_02: And and there's so there's some kind of like and and of course where we are, especially with men's health and men's mental health, we're supposed to just find out in the front yard and be done with it and not consume any or let anything consume us.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_02: And so so we get, I think we end up, I know when I first heard about uh my me being diagnosed with an ADHD, I didn't take that serious.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_02: I thought, well, this is just something that, but no, I was I was wrong, you know, and and absolutely I was told that it could be a superpower, and that's what I'm trying to do with it.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_02: I know this might be backtracking a little bit, but I want to ask a couple of questions if you don't mind.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: No, no worries.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_02: So when do you mind if I ask?
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_02: Because you seem like a young guy.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_02: So when you were having more addiction problems, like we I'm assuming you were extremely young when you first got active into substance abuse.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_01: So just full disclosure, I'm like 44.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_02: So we're the same age, okay.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so like I'm relatively young, like I feel like I still have a lot of life in in it, and I feel actually feel younger than I've ever felt in my life, which is weird to a degree.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_01: But like, yeah, I it it was uh like on and off.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: I smoked weed most of my life.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_01: That was one of the things when I found it.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: I thought that way it was like because I had such a tough time dealing with the shame and the guilt of who I was, and I didn't really see it as as that at the time.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_01: All I did was I felt depressed and had a lot of anxiety, and there was no real I had the ADHD diagnosis, but I didn't know.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_01: My parents really didn't talk about that, and they kind of like did never talk about it again once it happened, and so I was just like didn't know what was going on.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_01: I thought there was something wrong with me.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_01: I couldn't ever make my dad feel proud of me.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_01: So like I just felt when I found weed, it was like, wow, this is something where I can like it sparked my creativity.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_01: It was something that like really just helped me to feel better.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um so was it like a an upper for you, or did it slow you down and actually allow you to think?
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_02: Because you said it got you into a like a creative mindset.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_02: I know that like I've never been, I think marijuana should be legal.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_02: I don't like the way it makes me feel personally, but yeah, it doesn't bother me if someone else does it.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_02: It slows me down so much that my ADHD wants me to get up and do things, and I just can't, but and it's very uncomfortable.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_02: I almost feel sluggish.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_02: So I've just never liked the way it makes me feel.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it it definitely um you know it slowed me down, you know, and I still feel like it has like a you know, like a uh a tail end of like a long tail effect, because like there's sometimes where I'm I'm really slow, that could just be my ADHD, but I don't think that really helped brain growth like the way that that it could have been without it, you know, and then that turned into like harder drugs, and you know, there was a point where it was like just marijuana, but it was there was always there.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like you're talking to a guy that thought that like not too long ago that like I couldn't get through a day without smoking weed.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it's been like I really just don't even think about it.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it crosses my mind, but I don't even like the smell of it anymore.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_02: I'm I've never dealt with substance abuse and addiction personally, you know, for myself, but I've had we're all affected by it somehow, you know?
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_02: And uh and I definitely have had some people that were extremely close to me.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm a part of a men's sexual assault group therapy here.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_02: And everyone that is involved in that has had an addiction problem.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_02: And we've discussed how you know some of them were sexually assaulted as children, and some of them were even sexually assaulted by women.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, men are told that a woman can't rape a man because you probably liked it, and that's bullshit, you know, and so they they turn to drugs, they turn to alcohol, and and luckily they're all doing great.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_02: And our therapy we do once a week, and and it's amazing, and we're you know, we we're we become a brotherhood, but I I know the battle that they you know that they that they go through with it, and and it it's a real thing, you know, and and I think it's also one of those things, especially with men, where it gets overlooked a lot, and that's where men die pretty young usually, and and and you know, the suicide rates.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_02: You know, even during like COVID, uh, I worked for pilot gas stations, I worked in HR, and the beer and cigarettes went through the roof.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: You know, no, it's it's that isolation, and and like what you're talking about, every pretty much like I would say 99.9% of addicts have dealt with some type of trauma growing up, whether that's physical or mental, because your brain doesn't differentiate either one of them.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_01: And like it's usually the trauma of abandonment be or or like sexual assault.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's an extreme.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: So these people that are walking around homeless uh or or that are you know hopeless addicts are just part of a system that that is just really not built to help them.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's only like the war on drugs is just war on people's children.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: Like the this was somebody that the these are people that just don't feel like they they don't know how to deal with the trauma, they don't even know that it is trauma, um, because of the way that our society has like pushed it out, you know, and it's an opportunity to like reframe.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like I that's why I I don't mind talking about it.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's it's like this needs to be talked about more because this is going on and it it's it's happening on all levels.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't really matter if you're poor or you're rich.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_01: I've seen addicts on all levels because like it's it doesn't discriminate, right?
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's like the those emotional traumas can happen to even like princes and kings.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like you no one's like like this life is traumatic in a way, and if we don't talk about these traumas, like it'll never like they will become worse than they actually need to be.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that's exactly why I, you know, do what I do and and why I want even to do the surviving itch and have a little bit of because I want us to have these conversations, but I also wanted to have a little bit of you know, a fun little twist to it, because I I was telling someone yesterday that you know the holidays are coming up.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, at the time of this recording, it's October 13th.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_02: So we are 10 days away from the anniversary of my hate crime, where you know, someone broke in my house and raped me and beat me until they turned themselves in for murder.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_02: So this time of year gets a little rough for me, right?
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, and then of course we have the holidays where you're seeing people and family members that you know, and and my rape at my attack happened, it'll be 10 years.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_01: So congratulations for being able to start that takes a lot of strength.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely resilience.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and you know, yeah, I appreciate I appreciate that.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_02: And but you know, so the holidays are coming up, and I found that like where I see certain people only at certain times a year, they still look at me as this victim.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_02: And so they they walk on eggshells, yeah, you know, because that's where they don't they haven't seen a lot in the growth, you know.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_02: So they see me just those few times a year, they go back to does David still laugh?
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_02: Does David what kind of jokes can I tell?
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_02: And and so then someone gets uncomfortable.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_02: And and I know that they mean that out of a loving, respected, respectful way, but I'm like, guys, like I need to laugh.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: That's gonna be back to jokes, like it's okay.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm um like that's the way, like, and and and I used to be that way with people that are like different or that I felt like were uh mentally challenged.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's like they don't want to be treated different, they want to be treated the exact same way.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, if they need a little help to get something, be there for them.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_01: But you know, they they want to be part of the program, like and and like also like yeah, I'm sorry that that that had happened to you, but like honestly, like I feel like all my trauma, all the things that I went through, like it may not necessarily equate to what you did, but like it shows it it creates like a person, like like I can talk to people that I never would have been able to if those things didn't happen, and I can help other people and I can show them like you I feel like you're much more resilient with those things happening.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_02: You know, and and it I was a guest on a podcast a couple years ago, and they asked me, and you can see it in real time.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_02: Um but they asked me if I would change what happened to me, and I immediately said no.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, like you could see like the the shock of my face that I said that, you know, and like I had to go outside and ground myself a little bit afterwards because I was like, what the hell?
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_02: But then I realized that the people that are in my life now, and even having this podcast and and having multiple podcasts and growing into this career field was something that I was not gonna be doing without what happened to me.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_02: And the most amazing people I have in my life right now are the people I met because of my recovery and in therapy and and podcasting.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_02: And so I I I would never wish what happened to me to happen, but I don't know that I would change anything.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because it it would change who you are today, and like you know, it's like I know for the longest time my mom like I I caused my mom so much worry and so much hurt, you know, because she cared about me, and and and all I did was push her away and and cause more pain because to not only to her, but to myself, and you know, there it took a long time for me to to get right with that, but it was like she continued to love me, and she's been the only one that supported me through everything, and now she gets to see like the her prayers being answered, and like it is such an amazing thing, you know, and and it took me a long time.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: Like, therapy taught me how to accept compliments and kindness, and like that they're gifts, that people are giving you a gift when they're giving you a compliment.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: You and you don't even like my therapist put it so well, he was like, You don't have to believe what they're saying is true, you just gotta believe that they believe, you know, and like that was like wow, and that started to help my belief in myself, and like you know, now I'm able to see like honestly, right now is is like a crazy time because like I'm on suspension from my regular nine to five job.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_01: I've been on suspension for over two weeks because I posted, you know, and I'm not making light of what I did.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: When I posted a TikTok video on the floor of my company, and they have a no-phone policy, somebody saw it.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: It was like a joke where I was like, This is what this is what it's like when you're trying to sneak the game when you're at work.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: So I was like looking around, like, you know, on the video, and you know, I I did it because I thought I would have views, and you know, I really wasn't it was a lapse of judgment.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: I told them that when they they brought it to my attention, I was honest about it, and I took the video down, you know, but it's been like two weeks because they can't get any everything together, which I'm getting paid for most of that, and like today is another day.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like that I called in, I was like, Yeah, uh what's going on?
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_01: And she's like, I they we don't know.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: I really think that it's God, you know, creating a way for me to get closer to him and to do the things that I need to do for my purpose on this earth.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_02: I love that, and and I respect the you know accountability.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_02: It would be so easy to say it's such a stupid policy, f that job, you know, but it would be so easy to try to pass off the blame or minimize what you did.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_02: But but the truth is whether we like the rule, the rules that are in place or not, they are there.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_02: We signed up for it, we accepted the job, and we broke the rule.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_02: And so now we have to take accountability for that and the repercussions that come with it.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_02: And sometimes they're hard pills to swallow, but when you find those, to me, I always try to find like there's gotta be something good in this, there's got to be something good to get out of this, you know.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_02: And so so I love what what you just said, the same response.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: No, they are honestly are doing me.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_01: I'm getting paid.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, like you guys are paying me to be like I get an extra vacation.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's kind of like I'm and and it goes back to like if you can't follow the rules of man, the who like whether they're right or not, whether you agree with them or not, there's no way you can follow the rules of God.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like, so this has been like a really like honestly, I've been meeting so many people, and if I wasn't, if I didn't have God in my I would go be going up the walls, like trying to sue them, trying to get it to like honestly, like me just sitting here and them doing their thing, like that's not hurting me.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_01: That's like I'm getting paid, like either way.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I miss my co worker.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and that's always going to be the case, but like I don't want to I don't want to go back.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_02: So I mean I think that kind of speaks for itself too, right?
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_02: You know, knowing that you don't want to go back, that there's something different out there that you need to look for.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I believe he closed the door and there's always another door open, and it's always better.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and that's that goes to that mindset of what I coach.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: Is like you've got to mindset is so important if you want to do anything in life, especially if you want to start talking about because a lot of us, you know, and what you're talking about too is like we've lost our voice.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_01: We don't think we have the ability to speak up for what's going on in our life.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_01: The trauma, especially as men, you know, we feel like we've got to hide it, we've got to be tough, we've got to have everything brushed off our shoulders.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_01: And that's not the case.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_01: I've felt more strength and seen more strength in other men and other people when when they've told me, look, I'm I'm feeling depressed, or like I'm scared, like right now.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know what's going gonna happen.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm we're really worried about what's going on.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, and when you start to understand that mindset, and then you start to like go into that direction of like, okay, this is who I am, this is what I need to do, and then having those positive anticipations, it's really like your subconscious is such a powerful tool, and it's not something that's like you get when you sleep, it's there all the time.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_01: Like when you learned to ride a bike, that was all subconscious, like your brain, literally your subconscious had to come out and like figure out how to break, figure out how to balance, figure out how to do all these things at once.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_01: But once it got implanted in there, you no longer need to be have the subconscious come out, so you can literally pre-program your subconscious anytime about it.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's gonna take time, but it's like anytime something comes up, like doubt, like I doubt this is gonna work, or this is just gonna turn bad.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_01: Turn look, like pay attention to that and be like, no, this is gonna be good because like I am doing the right things.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like now, if you're doing the wrong things, I wouldn't suggest that.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_02: And so I'm real big on toxic positivity, you know, because because I I do try to look for the good and everything, but I found that sometimes I was doing it with some toxic positivity, you know, that that was not healthy and was setting me up for failure.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_02: And so I really had to learn how to separate those things and and what was a healthy, positive way to look at things, the realistic truth with things.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_02: And and it it got to where I was almost getting frustrated because I was having to spend a lot of time thinking about something that should be just a quick, simple thought process, but where I was trying to retrain my thinking, it took some time.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_02: But now it's like the back of my hands, right?
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_02: Like I immediately, as soon as I think the negative, I'm I immediately think, okay, but what good can come out of this?
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_02: How can I make this into something better for myself?
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_02: Like, even if it's just a lesson that I learned, there's growth in that.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_01: And it's about recognizing it's like, you know, I feel with toxic positivity that it's more about like ignoring everything that's going on and just just focus on like everything's gonna be great.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_01: We can't talk about these, no, talk about these things.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_01: But like, what is this going, you know, and like you know, especially if you stumble or or you like we're human beings.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_01: We we we make mistakes, that's how we learn.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_01: That's the best process part of the process is the mistakes that I make, and the willingness to make mistakes diminishes when I'm sitting there trying to be perfect and positive, and all these things that don't add up, so like my growth becomes small.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like I've noticed when I do that, and like, okay, I made this mistake, but what can I learn from it?
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_01: What did this teach me?
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and like even if I'm like have this affirmation of like this is gonna work out, and it doesn't, that doesn't mean that like I should adopt that.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_01: It's just not everything works out, but I've gotta have that mindset moving forward, that especially and and uh in business, like if you're starting your own business, which I believe ADHD people with ADHD have the edge on businesses because you literally have the drive, the hyper focus, the creativity, the thinking outside the box.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_01: You you have that innovation that is naturally in you from that creativity that God gave you to do that.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_01: The only thing that holds us back is that follow through because we don't like doing the same, or we just if something's not working, we need to switch to something else immediately.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_01: And sometimes that can work against us.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_02: And this might be backtracking a little bit too, but I'm very curious with this.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_02: You had mentioned, you know, trauma.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_02: Everyone goes through trauma, and and that's the thing with trauma, is we can't compare it, right?
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_02: Like I've had people hear my story and they're like, oh well, yours compared to mine is nothing, and um mine compared to yours is nothing, and we can't do that.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what happened to me is the biggest T that I've gone through, but that's my T.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_02: You know, like like that that's my trauma.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_02: We cannot compare them.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_02: And so you had mentioned how you felt like you were never able to make your father proud.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_02: Do do you consider that traumatic?
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, because like I mean, even my mom like noticed it, you know, and she didn't talk a lot, but that broke her heart.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like seeing seeing me try so hard to make my father proud, and you know, honestly, like I I had to do a lot of exploration, and that came through step work in NA.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_01: So I was like, I didn't even see it as trauma, you know, and and the more that I've done the work, you know, I was like, okay, neglect is actually probably one of the worst traumas like that can happen to anybody because like you know, you liter it literally affects the growth of your brain, you know, in certain areas, and that can lead to addiction.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_01: It's like understanding that, um, understanding my trauma, and I had to and I had to explore that and understand that on a deep level.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't easy, it wasn't something that I wanted to look at, but it like once I understood that like it it opened up so many doors, and the thing about that is is everyone's trauma, like perception of trauma is different.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_01: So two people can go through the same thing and it complet and affect them in a completely different way.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_01: So you can't sit, you can't judge something.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you're soft.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_01: You the I'm a highly sensitive person.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_01: I believe most neurodivergence are highly sensitive, and that is a strength, but I didn't see that most of my life.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_01: So once I explored my trauma and coming circling back, like I understood, like, hey, maybe my dad was going through trauma.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_01: So I had to ask my mom, like, okay, you know, and and this is like a huge thing that really opened up like a lot of mystery, like it put started putting things together.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_01: It was like I had a conversation with my mom about how I grew up, how she grew up, how my dad grew up, how her parents grew up, and like the as much information as she could give me so like I could understand and I could see the patterns, yeah, and like the way that she raised me and the way that my dad was.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: And like I was starting to see him as a human being that like actually did really pretty good with what he had growing up.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, there was trauma there, and it was a little bit different, but like at least he wasn't like his father who'd put his hands on him multiple times and his brothers, you know, and that can have a different type of effect.
• 30:21
  unknown: Yeah.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_02: I love the way that you said all that, especially when you said that you did not consider that uh like not getting certain affection from your parents as trauma.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_02: I've had so many men that I've talked to, and mostly men that I've talked to, that have been like, well, you know, I've not gone through any trauma.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, okay, well, tell me about your childhood.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, well, my parents, you know, my dad was never at any of my football games, my mom addiction problems, my dad had a couple of affairs, that's trauma.
• 30:54
  unknown: Those are trauma.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_02: And so, and and when you think about like your dad's generation, mental health was especially for men.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_02: So when you start following those like breadcrumbs and and you trace it back to like that generational abuse.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_02: And sometimes trauma and abuse can happen with the best of intent, without meaning to like maybe some parents, some parents, some men maybe don't know how to show affection.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_02: They don't know how to love because of the trauma that they've been through, you know, and they don't mean to neglect their child emotionally, and in in a lot of cases, but that doesn't numb the sting, it doesn't lessen the the the the absence of that emotion, you know?
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you gotta really explore that and like you know, understand like and and and it takes like you you've got it if you've like for me, like there would there was still that like forgiveness in my dad, but I still hadn't reacted the way that I like the little boy in me didn't like have the ability or the or the the space to like scream out and say, you know, screw that guy, like he wasn't there, you know, and just really like get everything out, you know, and just like you know, have it at have at it, like here that you deserve this, it's okay.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: Now we can come like once that's out, like I can start to see, oh my dad is like, wow, that was tough for him, you know, and and honestly, like this isn't a bash on parents.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_01: This is just they love you in the best way that they know, they just weren't taught any different.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_01: They you know and and this goes back to the system that is consider like the politics, the way the way that people are taught, you know, growing up, even the school system, like it's all there's all elements of it that like if you added like a couple things in there, like being able to advocate for yourself, self-advocation and emotional intelligence or emotional resilience classes could really like do a lot because a lot of these schools are just like you shouldn't speak up against the teacher because you know you they don't want you to think, yeah, because thinking like is a problem because then you gotta answer questions and then you gotta change systems, and you know it's like ask those questions, like talk about your feelings, yeah, because some people are more sensitive than others, and sensitivity is a strength because you can literally be more empathetic, you can help more people, you can like it, it is such a strength that I have, and I feel like most neurodivergents are highly sensitive individuals, and that means that they are very good at you know, they're very strong towards uh justice and advocating for justice and going up against injustices.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, 100%.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_02: Like I have never been so loud about certain things, especially in the political world today, who people do and don't support and sexual assault, you know, and and I I'm very loud about it.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_02: And I have always not liked sexual assault and rape, but until I became a victim of it, and and I've seen what it my assault happened 10 years ago.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_02: I was an adult, I had a hex a healthy sex life until that point.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_02: But that one time um changed my definition of sex and and it damaged sexual relationships quite a bit going forward.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_02: I had to redefine what sex was.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_02: And so the thought of that happening to a child, and that's their their introduction to sex, you know, they they've never had a healthy sex life.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_02: And and I think sex on that is very, you know, important.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't know what got me on that tangent, but I well actually I do kind of know, you know, you so I'm a gay man in the south, right?
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_02: That's a whole different podcast.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_02: Um but a lot of my friends are straight, and a lot of people that I surround myself with are we're all very d diverse.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_02: And there is this thing, I guess, here I guess probably everywhere, but especially here in the south, where if a man is sensitive or shows emotion, then they're gay or or they're feminine.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, dude, the girls will love it and you're gonna learn a lot from it, and you're gonna be healthier.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_02: And look at all these hot girls that are that love me as their friend.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_02: Imagine if you had a little bit of care, a little bit of emotion, they'd probably like you like that too.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_02: Like, let it be sexy, let it be sexy, it can be sexy.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and and it's like it's good to be able to express that because it's like it shows a vulnerability, yeah.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_01: And that it and people, you know, men that like they hate that V-word because it's like it's it shows that you're weak, it shows that you don't, you know, and and that's okay.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_01: There's strength in that.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, imagine like how hard it is for you know, you it's like me talking about all these issues in my life and these struggles is easy for me now.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_01: But there wasn't a time, there was a time where I wouldn't talk about it.
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like you couldn't get me to open my mouth uh, like, yeah, I I wouldn't talk about being jealous.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_01: I wouldn't, you know, I I wouldn't even admit that to myself.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_01: Because like, how could I feel this?
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_01: It's like these things are going on inside you, and it's starting to drive you crazy because like you have nowhere to to release them.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_01: Once I've you know, I've I've talked to a lot of guys about it, even being sad, like that one was was hard to talk about because it's like, oh, guys aren't supposed to talk about being sad.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what are you gonna cry?
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, if I need to, I wish I could cry more, but like because of like the the events that happened my my in my life, I can't, even though I'm a sensitive guy.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_01: I'm proud of who I am, and I love what you said about like showing those emotions and how you try to how to try to encourage these other guys with other incentives.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that shouldn't it's not really like like it doesn't matter how you get there, right?
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_01: As long as you do.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you know, I I think it's important to read the room, and you know, and so when I'm talking to a bunch of my buddies that are restricted and watching football and drinking beer, I'm there for the beer.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know anything about football, but you know, I'm like, like I find ways to say, like, being sensitive, you know, can be sexy.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_02: Or if they're like, uh, you know, like all my girlfriends are so hot, you know, and they're I'm like, they would like you too if you would just loosen up a little bit, just show a little bit of emotion.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, guys, like I can get in my car and I can cry for the 30-minute drive home or or on my way to work.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_02: But when I walk into work, I have my game face on and I'm good, but I just needed to release.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_02: That is strength.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_02: The fact that I can cry on my way to work, I can pick the time and place to do it, but then I can pull my big shoes, big pants on and get the job done from there.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_02: That is that is also strength.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_02: The weakness is not that I cried, you know, it was very cleansing.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_02: And the fact that I was able to pull my shit together when I needed to and then get the job done, there's some strength in that, there's some empowerment in that.
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like and crying doesn't always have to be from sadness.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like a lot of times, like I cry when I pray, you know, and or or when I I like when God speaks to me, and like I've you know, I feel his love.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like, like it is so it just fills my heart with joy, like so much joy that like that that he like what whatever I did, like he's gonna be there and he's gonna care for me, and and I don't have to worry about anything else.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and sometimes like even at work, like I would get frustrated with something going on, and I I would have to go out and yell in my car, get it out.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_01: Because like what there's when we come into this business or like into a place of work, like there is so much coming in from outside emotional, and it's all mostly repressed because like you can't be emotional at work, they don't accept that.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_01: There's no place for that there, so it's like it's gonna still show up, and it's gonna show up much more aggressively and out of the blue than if we actually started talking about it.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_01: That's why, like, you know, I even had like um I do this mental health committee that I lead, and you know, the last one that I did, they had a whole bunch of upper management there, and we were talking about you know how to talk about difficult emotions, you know, which was you know interesting.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I was kind of a bit intimidated because they didn't have they didn't show up to the other ones before, so I was wondering what what was going on.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: So I was like, you know what, I'm gonna do this.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_01: I I'm I mainly lead, and the the uh uh other girl from HR does the secretary work, so she was doing the presentation.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_01: So I was just like, I'm just gonna sit back, you know, like a leader should and just let it happen because it's their meeting.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_01: I would just facilitate.
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_01: So it was like we we ended up talking about some like relationship issues.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_01: Do you know what your partner's emotional relationship was?
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_01: And like a lot of them didn't know, you know, and so I was like, it came time to me, and I'm not in a relationship, but I was like talking about how I do do it with myself, you know, and how I keep myself motivated, and and uh, you know, especially when I have those difficult emotions, and like I use that as an opportunity to be like, yeah, you see how even the people that you live around and are close, you don't know where they're at emotionally.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_01: Imagine how much more so it is when with the people that you work with.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and you know, like uh what was going through my mind is there's been so many times that I will answer the phone, you know, when someone calls my office and you can tell through uh uh in my tone, or I can tell in their tone.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_02: And then of course I'm gonna mimic that tone, or they're gonna mimic me.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I've gotten really good at not hitting send on the email if I have a bit of frustration.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_02: I need to, I'll, I'll top it out.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_02: I need to step away from it, you know, come back and read it again, and I make sure I don't put anyone, any email address in the send just so it doesn't get sent accidentally, because odds are I'm going to say something in a way.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, we all we know, like reading text messages or emails, that you're kind of creating the tone yourself.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_02: And and then, of course, when you're reading something that could be passive aggressive, and odds are if I'm sending it and you're getting a little bit of passive aggressiveness from it, I intended it for it to be that way.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_02: But it's because the shit I was just feeling, and it's probably being directed to someone that was not a part of the shit.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_01: Like, where's this coming from?
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_02: So so I try to like really like tap my third eye, step away for a minute, get a cup of water, fresh up my coffee, and then come back and read the email again and think, okay, do I really want to send this?
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_02: Have I have I uh am I expressing whatever it is correctly?
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_02: You know, and most of the time I have to do some edits.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, and like I I I totally feel, and we're very intuitive when it comes to like we may not be able to pinpoint it, but we can tell something's off, even in the in the tone of an email.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_01: And like, you know, I had one that was like I felt was very passive aggressive, and I was like, I actually ran it through Chat GPT, and I was like, hey, do you think this is what do you think about this?
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think this and it was like and so because I wanted to respond to it um in a way that wasn't like attacking it, but like standing up for myself, because that's what I represent is fierce kindness, is like not like sitting there and taking things, but like responding where you show your values, but you also talk about like maybe they they misinterpreted it, and so yeah, like chat GPT is great at like being able to be that mediator, and like also like you know, I'll ask somebody how they're and they'll be like, good, and I'm like, that don't sound good, like you know, just being able to like play around with it, so you I feel like that's That really helps out when you're with the emotional like floodgates or or opening up that door to be able to talk about it, especially if you're a manager listening.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_01: Just ask them how they're doing it.
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_01: And if it doesn't sit, just dig a little deeper.
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, yeah, is that are you sure everything's fine?
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_01: Or you know, like play with it, play with it like I did, you know, like saying, Are you yeah, I'm good, like that don't sound good.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like you know, and maybe that might open the door to be able to like and plus it it shows you as being authentic that you could you when pe you care for other people, that goes so much further than a paycheck.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like people will like, especially when you're open and transparent, like things may not be going the way you want to, and and you may not like having that uncomfortable conversation, but it's gonna be a lot more uncomfortable avoiding them, trying to like not address the issue.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_01: Just be transparent.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_01: If if this is coming down from up top and you don't like it, like that will give them much more of like, okay, well, he's with us, you know.
• 45:09
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, this is just something he's being asked to do rather than it looks like you just being a jerk.
• 45:15
  unknown: Yeah.
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_02: I appreciate what you said because when we say how are you, a lot of times it's just a hello, you know, we want to one word influencing kind of thing.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's a yeah, it's like good fine, okay, go get your coffee, whatever.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_02: But when you ask that follow-up question, you know, and if you're like, well, are you sure you're okay?
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_02: You know, whatever.
• 45:33
  SPEAKER_02: Um, what I used to do with some of my employees is we had a walking trail up at the little area away from our office.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_02: And so I would like grab them, I would be like, All right, let's go up here and up here, I'm not your boss.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_02: Like up here, I'm your friend.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_02: I'm I'm your equal.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_02: And you can cuss, you can scream, we can do it together.
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_02: And then I'll let you know when the boss hat has to come back on.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_02: And so we'll go up there and we'll walk and and I'm their friend at that time.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then I'm like, okay, well, this is the friend response.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_02: Now here's the boss hat, and here, here's the boss response.
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_02: And it's really worked for me, you know, and and I learned that from a manager that did that with me, and it was amazing.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_02: And I would say, there were so many times I would say, Kiana, I need you to not be my boss right now.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_02: I need you to just let me be a dick for just a minute.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_02: She's like, All right, you got 30 seconds, you know.
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_02: It worked, you know, and then and then it was like now, Kiana, I need you to be my boss and educate me on how to correct this problem because obviously what I just said is not gonna be the way that fixes it.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_02: And it works, you know, high fibing and laughing about it, and yeah, and that sigh of relief, you know.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, instead of it being like caught up in that, and that's a great technique.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's like being able to have these walks or or these talks or being open, like you know, I do have that type of relationship with one of my managers, and you know, honestly, like this situation with with me um at my job, let's put a lot of stress on him and and the other because he they're not telling him anything, like which is crazy, because like they're not telling me when it's gonna happen.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_01: Most people don't know, but they're not even telling him that.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like, they're just like he may show up, he may not.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_01: We don't know when, whenever.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like, as like as because you're trying to fill a role and they're not giving you anything, like that can be extremely frustrating.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I've been talking to him on the phone, being like, Yeah, you all right?
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure this is stressing you out.
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_01: Here's what I know.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm good on my side because like I'm getting paid.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_01: They could keep doing this for the rest of my life, like, I could care less.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_01: But like, I know that that's not there's there has to be closure here somewhere.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I was gonna say that even though you are getting paid, and but at the same time, there's still that daily, am I employed?
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_02: When does this pay stop?
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_02: You know, and then of course you're gonna get caught into I know that I get caught into routines, right?
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_02: So if I was home for two weeks and they called me and said, Hey, come back to work on Monday, I want to have to prepare for that, you know, mentally.
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_02: And so, so even though there are absolutely perks that are benefiting you right now, but it's still that daily burden of where am I, what's going on, what what what's tomorrow hold?
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_02: What is the when the phone rings, is it gonna be them telling me that I have to come in tomorrow?
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, it's like so it's just this cycle that I know that I would be in, you know, that that could lead to an unhealthy train of thought.
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_01: No, I mean the the thing that with me is the routine, like that I've you know, um it it does get messed up when you don't know like what's gonna happen, and you kind of got a plan for two things, you know, um early in the morning, like do I need to get up early?
• 48:52
  SPEAKER_01: Do I need to get all this done in this time?
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I definitely had that, and especially when it comes to like diet, because like I'm normally like I have a break at a certain time and I eat that.
• 49:03
  SPEAKER_01: Now there's like I don't know when to take a break.
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_01: So I have I have a bunch of breaks throughout the day, but like which break is the one where I need to like eat more vegetables.
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_01: So my my health has be gotten affected to a degree, but um other than that, like it's been amazing, and but like the closure on it is like I want to know which path I'm gonna be taking.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_01: I hope that they the thing is like some backstory on it is like so I was running this line and they asked me to run it, and I didn't feel safe running it because it was like literally duct taped up with these, you know, and I work with dangerous chemicals.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not gonna say the uh organization, but like the zip there was like zip ties and duct tape on a hose that had a history of popping off while in the middle of production.
• 50:04
  SPEAKER_01: So I told them I did not feel safe.
• 50:06
  SPEAKER_01: And every company that has stop work authority.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_01: So I exercised my stop work authority and they didn't they made it like three or four different times.
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like I said, I don't feel comfortable because of that, and they kept trying to backtrack and say, Well, these people told us, and I'm telling you that it's fine, I'm gonna need you to run that line.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_01: So it was implied that if I didn't run that line, something wasn't gonna happen that was agreeable.
• 50:34
  SPEAKER_01: So I felt like I had no other choice.
• 50:37
  SPEAKER_01: So then I ended up calling Osha the next day and filing a complaint and um you know, more of a concern because like I don't want anybody else to get hurt, much less myself.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_01: And that's really what it's coming from.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_01: Is like we can't a lot of times we just do things because we want to keep ourselves safe, but we don't think about other people.
• 50:58
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like if we stood up, how many other people would have been, you know, if I didn't stand up on that and went to OSHA, you know, and I believe that this what's happening now is a retaliation for that, you know, and there's ways to prove that.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_01: So that's going to be another, you know, depending on where they go with it, you know, like I don't know.
• 51:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's up to God.
• 51:22
  SPEAKER_01: And like, you know, and I'll pray to God like to for what what he feels like is should should be the path that I go down.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_01: Because I it's not about me at this point, it's more about is this gonna continue to happen to other people?
• 51:37
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 51:37
  SPEAKER_01: Like they shouldn't feel like they they can be bullied into silence because they need production numbers.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's not about your bottom line.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_01: If you got nobody working there, like there's no bottom line.
• 51:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no company.
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's what happens a lot of times is we get so desperate for a paycheck.
• 52:00
  SPEAKER_02: And in today's America, most of us are living paycheck to paycheck.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_02: People are one to three paychecks away from being homeless, you know, and and you know how that is personally, you know.
• 52:11
  SPEAKER_02: And so we we get very controlled by these organizations.
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_02: They pay us enough, but we can't, you know, they they pay us to keep us there, maybe a a sandwich and a refrigerator, you know, and lights on, but we can't take time off.
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_02: We don't we can't afford to take time off to go find a better paying job.
• 52:29
  SPEAKER_02: And so we just get we get trapped into the cycle.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_02: And so then when they say when when someone notices that there's something that could hurt someone, they can't speak up about it because they don't want to get in trouble and lose their job.
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_02: And so they take that risk of getting hurt, and then odds are someone ends up getting hurt.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's part of what you know, the the major goal, one of the major like um goals or like visions for what I'm doing is to be able to like speak up, as me an example of like, okay, yeah, you know, this happened and it's real, but it's like they'll have less power the more people that speak up for what what they need to do and making things right.
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's not about like saying whatever's on your mind and you know being able to lash out, it's about standing up for what's right and like doing that even when it feels like you know, like you could lose everything.
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_01: Like the more people like I keep trying to tell people, the more people that stand up, the less power they have.
• 53:34
  SPEAKER_01: The less like the reason why they have all that power is because they've got the lawyers, they've got the intimidation, they've got all these strategies.
• 53:46
  SPEAKER_01: So if it's one person going up against them, they'll win.
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_01: But what if it's like 10, 20, 30, 100, 1000, nope, that's too many.
• 53:56
  SPEAKER_01: They can't lawyer that out.
• 53:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 53:59
  SPEAKER_02: We definitely wish you luck, you know, on that.
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_02: And and like you said, I appreciate that.
• 54:04
  SPEAKER_02: You believe that all things are happening for a reason, that God is going to lead you into where you're supposed to be next.
• 54:09
  SPEAKER_02: And and that, and I'm glad that you have that comfort.
• 54:12
  SPEAKER_02: I'm glad that you have that belief, you know.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_02: I think I think that is so important.
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_02: So as we're shifting to toward the end, and even though I could sit and have this conversation all day long, all glory be to God.
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'm just a reflection of it.
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 54:28
  SPEAKER_02: And I will I want to put a pin in the relationship with God because I do have a question, but I'm gonna wait until the end to ask you about your your faith.
• 54:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um but so to kind of shift this to like the fun side of things, when you if I'm understanding your journey correctly, you hated ADHD and thought it was awful and and and didn't care much about yourself, I guess.
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um, not even before you knew you had ADHD.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_02: But at some point there was a transition, right, where you've turned it into a superpower and you realize that you know, I do have this, but I can control it and I can make something beautiful out of it, right?
• 55:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 55:10
  SPEAKER_02: Do you remember like that transition?
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_02: Do you remember that moment when you were like, oh wait, this actually could be a cool thing?
• 55:19
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if it was necessarily a moment, but it was like when I learned mindfulness was the major transition because it was like it was I was able to slow things down enough to give myself space that I've never had before to breathe.
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_01: And like I remember that day, like I went into work, and this girl was like, Wow, you're like smiling, like so you look happy.
• 55:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, my first thought was like, What?
• 55:46
  SPEAKER_01: I don't look happy.
• 55:47
  unknown: Right, right.
• 55:49
  SPEAKER_01: But I didn't say that, like I was like, really?
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_01: And I and because I was like really felt happy because like I found something that like really was starting to work, and like you know, and and it grew and it started to I started to understand, like, and and it really started to take off when I took my um my certification for MBSP training, and that's mindfulness-based strengths practice.
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_01: So that's like takes mindfulness and character strengths and combines them.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like we all have these strengths, like forgiveness, creativity, critical thinking, honesty.
• 56:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's like these things we don't even kindness like is a major strength, but people really don't see it that way.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like being able to understand what your signature strengths are and what strengths you can bring to the table, and like what what strengths you need to work on or need more energy with.
• 56:46
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like looking at and at yourself first in that way, in a mindful way, and understanding like, okay, how can I use this in a better way, and then seeing it in other people, and how that like really recreates your relationships with other people, like on a deep level, and it's just just cultivating so it's it's instead of looking at your faults and trying to get better with them, it's looking at your strengths and leveraging those to get better with everything.
• 57:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I love that because you know, one thing that I've always said is uh and I've always felt like I'm very self-aware.
• 57:29
  SPEAKER_02: And my therapist brought that to my attention, and I was like, oh wow, I never even realized that, but hell yeah, I am, and I've really appreciated that.
• 57:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 57:37
  SPEAKER_02: And and I've always one thing that I've always known, believed, and said is every great leader knows where they're weak.
• 57:45
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, when you when you have a leader that thinks that they know everything, it's gonna fail.
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_02: But I know where I'm I know where I'm strong and I know where I'm weak.
• 57:55
  SPEAKER_02: And so when I'm building some kind of team, like at work or with the podcast network, I know where my strengths are.
• 58:02
  SPEAKER_02: I need people, so I know where my weaknesses are.
• 58:05
  SPEAKER_02: So I need to bring Jenny in, who is strong where I'm weak, and we are going to make an amazing team.
• 58:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm gonna learn from her and she's gonna learn from me and we're gonna grow, right?
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_02: And so when when I think of like a team, I mean that is even with my friendships.
• 58:19
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want to hang out with a hundred Davids.
• 58:21
  SPEAKER_02: I love me, I'm fun, but I don't want a hundred Davids.
• 58:25
  SPEAKER_02: I need I need diversity because I want to learn, you know.
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want to hang out with people that have the same opinion, that that knows the same facts or has the same jokes, or I'm not gonna learn, you know, and so like that's my goal is to surround myself with those people that are strong or stronger where I'm strong and strong where I'm weak, you know, for me to to learn and grow and and advance in life, whatever the job is.
• 58:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, even even they could be weak where you're strong, so you guys support each other.
• 58:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's uh it's about like like God made us the way he made us, he doesn't make mistakes.
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like he made these people, like he didn't make some one person like have everything and everything needs to come under, even him, like he's the only one that's perfect.
• 59:14
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like being able to to mix and match and find, especially you being self-aware, like you understand what you need to do, and those are the best leaders because like they get the people around them that can teach them how to be better.
• 59:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, really leaders are are just facilitators with a vision, right?
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_01: That's it.
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_01: They're not like dictators, they're not like micromanagers, they they trust their employees, they give their employees a lot of autonomy, you know, because they understand that I can learn from them, and if I give them the freedom to do what they are, like this is just gonna get better and better and better, and that's gonna teach them how to be good leaders, and maybe they might do their own thing because like I believe in abundance because there's there's this anything is possible in this world as long as you believe it.
• 1:00:06
  SPEAKER_01: Like the most lucrative things are your creativity, like what you are able to create with what God gave you.
• 1:00:13
  SPEAKER_01: He's like the source of he gave you a little bit of his creativity.
• 1:00:18
  SPEAKER_01: He said, Here, this is gonna and he enjoys seeing you be creative and successful and happy as long as you're doing it in the right way.
• 1:00:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 1:00:30
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so usually I start the show with that petty little grievance of what we're surviving, but you and I just jumped right in to a great conversation.
• 1:00:40
  SPEAKER_02: So uh, so but that's okay.
• 1:00:41
  SPEAKER_02: That that's uh totally fine.
• 1:00:43
  SPEAKER_02: But it's gonna be a fun way to end the show because I have your email open when because you were one of the first people to reach out to me when I first started really putting this the layout of this show together.
• 1:00:54
  SPEAKER_02: So I had never talked with you before, so it was like a nice little way to see how you were gonna respond and your response was beautiful.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you and so supportive.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_00: I appreciate it.
• 1:01:05
  SPEAKER_02: But my surviving ish for the week is actually kind of reminds me of what you put in the email.
• 1:01:11
  SPEAKER_02: So you put a couple of things in the email about like preparing a perfect playlist for a beautiful bike ride, but you can't get your Bluetooth earbuds to work and getting locked out of your computer when you're about to um when you're almost finished with a job.
• 1:01:29
  SPEAKER_02: And it was reminding me of I do, I'm a single guy.
• 1:01:34
  SPEAKER_02: So I do like DoorDash and uh Uber Eats a lot and have anything and everything delivered.
• 1:01:41
  SPEAKER_02: I probably spend more money, I spend money like I have money, you know, which is not gonna be good for long.
• 1:01:46
  SPEAKER_02: But again, I I have like this thing where I cannot stand for something to be left unread on my phone.
• 1:01:54
  SPEAKER_02: I hate the notifications.
• 1:01:56
  SPEAKER_02: And so there's two that I don't mind to leave.
• 1:01:59
  SPEAKER_02: Like if it's an email that I don't want to open yet because I need to remember to look at it later.
• 1:02:04
  SPEAKER_02: Like those don't bother me.
• 1:02:05
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like after Uber, after my food gets here, I got nine, nine messages, nine, nine new notifications.
• 1:02:17
  SPEAKER_02: And then somehow I guess DoorDash knew that I had used Uber Eats instead of them.
• 1:02:24
  SPEAKER_02: So they start emailing me, uh sending me notifications of, well, you know, we've got deals here.
• 1:02:27
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, how does my phone and my apps know how to do all this?
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm spending all this time clearing out all these damn notifications, and I'm over it.
• 1:02:35
  SPEAKER_02: I'm done with it.
• 1:02:39
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 1:02:39
  SPEAKER_01: Well, a lot of things is like I'm really wary of who what I put notifications on, and like, you know, I I've sign up for these free things, and like, you know, I I kind of you know, because you don't want to miss out, you know.
• 1:02:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, okay, that but sometimes it's like, am I even reading this?
• 1:02:58
  SPEAKER_01: So like I'll unsubscribe emails and you know, um, because I'm like, you know what?
• 1:03:04
  SPEAKER_01: Like, really, I can only focus on one or two, maybe three types of things at once.
• 1:03:11
  SPEAKER_01: So even my email, you know, I get it.
• 1:03:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I I you know, I went the whole weekend without answering in the email or or maybe three days.
• 1:03:21
  SPEAKER_01: I don't answer emails on Sunday because that's like my day of rest.
• 1:03:25
  SPEAKER_01: I don't do anything work related, um, you know, uh to the best of my ability, uh, unless it's absolutely urgent.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_01: And like, so yeah, with the emails, like I set aside a time because like, yeah, it used to be like I could answer an email, and but I get so many different emails, like it literally takes me like an hour or more to answer freaking emails.
• 1:03:50
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, what is it?
• 1:03:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I didn't think that was a thing, right?
• 1:03:55
  SPEAKER_01: But I so I have to have like certain days allocated, uh, allocated to those things.
• 1:04:02
  unknown: Yeah.
• 1:04:03
  SPEAKER_02: And I know that people get frustrated.
• 1:04:04
  SPEAKER_02: Like, there's a couple of people that will email me on a regular basis, you know, sending one of their clients to me as a guest.
• 1:04:12
  SPEAKER_02: And if I don't respond within 24 hours, they send another email to follow up to make sure I got it.
• 1:04:17
  SPEAKER_02: But I have to, um, I mean, I still have a day job, even though I have a bunch of podcasts, they're not paying all of my bills yet.
• 1:04:25
  SPEAKER_02: So I have to like figure out what my work schedule is gonna be.
• 1:04:27
  SPEAKER_02: And then I've got to align it with you know their schedule.
• 1:04:30
  SPEAKER_02: I get a lot of people from California, so there's a three-hour time difference.
• 1:04:33
  SPEAKER_02: And then I don't want to work on Sundays and I want them to work on Sundays, and Sundays is like the only day everybody has off, but nobody wants to work, and I don't blame us.
• 1:04:41
  SPEAKER_02: So we're trying to fill in all these, you know, finally saying so.
• 1:04:44
  SPEAKER_02: I'm having my certain times of doing things, and then sure enough, it'll look like I have 87 emails, but 80 of them are from the same person trying to get me to respond to an email that I haven't had time to look at yet or schedule anything for, and then they think I'm neglecting them and seeing it like I'm I'm already in my mind, I'm sweating.
• 1:05:04
  SPEAKER_01: I know, I know a lot of times that's like you know, I go back to God.
• 1:05:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like anytime I feel anxiety, that's like a fear that something's not gonna happen.
• 1:05:14
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that's really basically what it is.
• 1:05:16
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I doubt what I'm doing is gonna work.
• 1:05:20
  SPEAKER_01: So that goes back to God.
• 1:05:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's like if if I'm doing what God asked me to do, as long as I'm doing it to the best of my ability, it's gonna work.
• 1:05:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's just it's gonna work.
• 1:05:31
  SPEAKER_01: It may not work in my time, but it's gonna work.
• 1:05:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like I know it's gonna work.
• 1:05:36
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like I've got to switch off the that anxiety because that anxiety is just gonna stop me from doing what I need to do.
• 1:05:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, do I do I let anxiety come in?
• 1:05:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it everyone does.
• 1:05:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like even Jesus did had doubts.
• 1:05:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like he at the end when he was praying in the garden for four hours, which like Like honestly, like I've I've heard that a few times, but this time really resonated because it's okay.
• 1:06:06
  SPEAKER_01: This guy, you know, he like the context behind him doubting, you know, yeah, he knew that it was gonna be tough.
• 1:06:16
  SPEAKER_01: But I feel like that wasn't the major thing that he doubted.
• 1:06:20
  SPEAKER_01: He was doubting it because he missed he he wanted he was he knew he was gonna miss the people on earth.
• 1:06:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like he didn't want to leave because he loved being around us.
• 1:06:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like that and that attachment is so hard for human beings because like we're doing things for this planet because that's all we can see.
• 1:06:39
  SPEAKER_01: But honestly, for me, it's like and what I'm learning is that this is only a short time, this is only a test for the next level.
• 1:06:51
  SPEAKER_01: So when I see it as only being a test, like it everything starts to make sense.
• 1:06:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like, okay, because there's always a disruption before, like right after you get a creative idea.
• 1:07:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there's always the doubt that follows.
• 1:07:07
  SPEAKER_01: There's it may be in a physical form, or it's it's usually in like a mindset where you're like these things whispering.
• 1:07:14
  SPEAKER_01: That's the devil, like literally doing his job to make it better.
• 1:07:19
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's like diamonds are only created with pressure, like great pressure over time.
• 1:07:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like, we can be diamonds if we allow that, we if we push through that disruption.
• 1:07:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 1:07:35
  SPEAKER_02: You just said something that reminded me of one of my favorite issues that that you sent is um like when you finally get comfortable in bed and then that you really like you remember something, right?
• 1:07:48
  SPEAKER_02: And I think you said you forgot to write down something that could be a vital, life-changing idea.
• 1:07:54
  SPEAKER_02: And and I just really resonated with that because every time I get an idea is when I'm driving, and I can't write anything down.
• 1:08:04
  SPEAKER_02: So I now have my car programmed where I can push a button and it starts recording me and I just start talking out loud.
• 1:08:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 1:08:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but also I keep a notebook and pen by my bed because it never fails.
• 1:08:15
  SPEAKER_02: I wake up at three o'clock in the morning and I'm like, this is a great idea, and I think I'm gonna remember it, and I don't.
• 1:08:21
  SPEAKER_02: So I've started keeping a notebook by my bed, and I have voice memos throughout my phone, like reminding myself uh of things.
• 1:08:28
  SPEAKER_02: And it's funny because once I write it down or leave myself a voice memo, I never have to look at it or write it down or uh read it again or listen to it again because I remember it.
• 1:08:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, it it I definitely had one of those last night.
• 1:08:43
  SPEAKER_01: It was like um it's like how not getting enough sleep is costing you thousands of dollars.
• 1:08:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like literally, and that's I'm gonna do like a TikTok video on that.
• 1:09:01
  SPEAKER_01: I love that because like that that's gonna be the hook of it.
• 1:09:05
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 1:09:06
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I'm gonna put all of your links and everything that you sent me in the show notes.
• 1:09:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I am starting I'm gonna start releasing the uh promos and stuff for the release uh for this podcast, like because I haven't released anything yet.
• 1:09:21
  SPEAKER_02: I've been trying to get like a stockpile of things again.
• 1:09:23
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna edit it and perfect it and figure out a date.
• 1:09:25
  SPEAKER_02: But on Mondays and or Tuesdays, we go live.
• 1:09:30
  SPEAKER_02: I go live with my friend Jenny, who is a co-host of a podcast that we have.
• 1:09:34
  SPEAKER_02: She's the host of it.
• 1:09:35
  SPEAKER_02: I said co-host, she's the host of it, and I do the behind the scenes production with it, but it's called Unholier.
• 1:09:41
  SPEAKER_02: And she was a part of like the IFB, which is this religious cult.
• 1:09:47
  SPEAKER_02: And every week she interviews someone that has gotten out of these cults.
• 1:09:52
  SPEAKER_02: And in most cases, they have deconstructed what they were taught and then rebuilt a relationship with God.
• 1:10:00
  SPEAKER_02: And so I would love for you to check it out and see if you think that it would be something that you'd be interested in speaking about or going live with us sometime.
• 1:10:07
  SPEAKER_02: We're building up a nice audience.
• 1:10:10
  SPEAKER_02: Some people like I I don't know what I identify as right now when it comes to religion.
• 1:10:16
  SPEAKER_02: I I'm sometimes I think I'm agnostic, sometimes I think I'm atheist, but then I always find myself thinking that luckily God is a big enough being that can handle my little temper tantrums where I'm in this phase of trying to figure out what the hell I am.
• 1:10:32
  SPEAKER_02: And so that shows me that there's still something inside me somewhere of a believer, right?
• 1:10:37
  SPEAKER_02: And so um it we're building such a nice community, like everyone has their own beliefs.
• 1:10:43
  SPEAKER_02: We all respect each other.
• 1:10:44
  SPEAKER_02: We talk about uh last week or two weeks ago, we talked about the rapture because it was a big thing on TikTok with the rapture.
• 1:10:51
  SPEAKER_02: Now they keep changing the dates.
• 1:10:52
  SPEAKER_02: And so we had like and we have like these experts that come on, and and it's all respectful, you know, it's all it's all loving, and and so I would love for you to check it out and see if it's something that you would like to be a guest on, either the podcast or a live or both with us sometime.
• 1:11:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, definitely.
• 1:11:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's unholier.
• 1:11:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's unholier underscore pod.
• 1:11:12
  SPEAKER_02: And it's a pretty girl named Jenny that hosted, and I'm in some of the videos with her on TikTok, and she's amazing.
• 1:11:19
  SPEAKER_02: But but yeah, I would love for you to check it out, and maybe we can set up a time for one evening for you to go live with us and uh and get to know our people a little bit and and share your story.
• 1:11:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that sounds amazing.
• 1:11:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely.
• 1:11:30
  SPEAKER_01: And and and talking about that that poll, do you it's like do you have that poll on like Sundays, like maybe you feel like you should be going to church?
• 1:11:40
  SPEAKER_01: Because I know that I felt like that for the longest time, because I'm I haven't always been like I believed in God, but I didn't believe in like Christianity or any specific form of religion.
• 1:11:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like I I you know, and it wasn't like I was a bad person, but it was like there was and in the churches that I did go to, I didn't feel that connection.
• 1:12:00
  SPEAKER_01: So I was like, but there was always this pull of like every Sunday, like I need to go, like I would feel guilty about not going to church.
• 1:12:09
  SPEAKER_01: Is that something that's like resonates with you?
• 1:12:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I ish yeah, because I've never had the I've never been a believer and it's never been put into me.
• 1:12:21
  SPEAKER_02: My my family goes to church every Sunday.
• 1:12:23
  SPEAKER_02: I go see them and have meals with them after they get out of church on Sundays.
• 1:12:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's never been a well, David, you should be in church.
• 1:12:31
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I know that the door is always open.
• 1:12:33
  SPEAKER_02: I haven't found a church that I've enjoyed.
• 1:12:36
  SPEAKER_02: I have a hard time with organized religion.
• 1:12:39
  SPEAKER_02: Again, I'm a gay man in the South, and people think that they need to cleanse the gay away.
• 1:12:43
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, listen, if hell is filled with people like me, it can't be that bad of a place because I'm I even as an atheist, you know, if I identify as as an atheist, the atheists that I know live by Christian values more than the Christians do.
• 1:12:59
  SPEAKER_02: And so I haven't found a church.
• 1:13:02
  SPEAKER_01: No, I'm not saying that if you're if you're a Christian, like you know, like oh, you're saved, you have to live a certain life.
• 1:13:09
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, what 100.
• 1:13:10
  SPEAKER_01: That's more about, you know, and and I do like a TikTok live that you know, I talk, I like I kind of do it's kind of like a a somewhat ministry to like a for ADHD and God, and like, you know, how how it like you know, a lot of the things from the Bible like correlate with what you can do to help.
• 1:13:33
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of the things that I I do with my ADHD has gotten better because of my relationship with God and like my understanding of the Bible and like how to apply that in my life because that book is crazy.
• 1:13:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like I used to just see it in a certain way, but like you have to read books to understand how to read the Bible and interpret it better, right?
• 1:13:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, and and find the right church that's actually teaching you like the pastor is actually teaching you how to apply that in your life.
• 1:14:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and if they're not doing that, then you know, I'm not saying that that can't work, but I feel like in my experience, that you probably should like at least look into other options.
• 1:14:17
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely, absolutely, and yeah, so I know that's was the long way around to answer that question because my answers are never.
• 1:14:24
  SPEAKER_01: But of course, you know, my simple question.
• 1:14:28
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely, but my family has never been the kind, and I've never been when I was a believer that you had to go to church in order to be a Christian and go to heaven, you know.
• 1:14:38
  SPEAKER_02: But but what I can say that resonates with me with what you said is there are a few okay, Ruba McIntyre is my number one.
• 1:14:47
  SPEAKER_02: I own every album, I know every song by heart, and she released a gospel album.
• 1:14:52
  SPEAKER_02: And so on Sundays, I would listen to that album.
• 1:14:55
  SPEAKER_02: She had it's 20 songs, I think, and like the first 10 are old hymns, and then the last 10 are songs that she had written for the album.
• 1:15:05
  SPEAKER_02: And so every Sunday I would listen to all 20 songs, and that was my church.
• 1:15:09
  SPEAKER_02: And and so sometimes I miss that.
• 1:15:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like on Sundays when I'm doing chores on the house, like, oh, I should put in my Reba album.
• 1:15:17
  SPEAKER_02: You know, so that also shows me that there's still something in me, and because but I'm able to easily write it off as well, it's because I love Reba, not because I'm worshiping this God that that some Christians have turned me against, you know.
• 1:15:33
  SPEAKER_02: I used to church.
• 1:15:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, and and like there, like, you know, I love I I only listen to gospel music or like you know, Christian music because like there's a power in words, yeah, especially the words that you say and the words that you listen to.
• 1:15:51
  SPEAKER_01: And a lot of the music that I used to like doesn't have a lot of good messages in the words, and you know, even vulgarity, as like that's that like if you understood the power of that words have, like you can literally speak your existence with positive words, but if you have negative words, you speak that existence.
• 1:16:12
  SPEAKER_01: So it's really like people, you know, and people are like sticking sticks and stones and break break my bones, but words do hurt because we're me and you were proof of that because like uh we're we've built our lives around what we felt other people told us who we are, yeah.
• 1:16:33
  SPEAKER_01: Words.
• 1:16:35
  SPEAKER_02: Well, yeah no, you're 100% correct.
• 1:16:37
  SPEAKER_02: One of the things that I always said was I healed from all the black guys, and I'm meaning this from my attacker, right?
• 1:16:43
  SPEAKER_02: From from that horrific time in my life, I healed from all the black guys, but 10 years later, the things that I remember are the things that people said to me and about me, you know, blaming the victim somehow, blaming my sexuality somehow, you know, because if it was a straight white man that broke in my house and raped me, and and somehow it was my fault, you know, because we blame the victim.
• 1:17:06
  SPEAKER_02: If it was a girl that had said, well, she was out late and her skirt was too short, that does not justify raping someone.
• 1:17:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's it's not uh and so so the parts that stick with me are the words that people used.
• 1:17:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's powerful.
• 1:17:20
  SPEAKER_01: It's it it defines who you are if you allow it.
• 1:17:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, and if you have positive words, positive affirmations, positive influences in your life, it gets hard, you know, you you start to separate yourself from those words.
• 1:17:35
  SPEAKER_01: And and when you do encounter those words, you know better.
• 1:17:39
  SPEAKER_01: You you feel better and you are better.
• 1:17:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 1:17:44
  SPEAKER_02: Man, I've really enjoyed this conversation.
• 1:17:46
  SPEAKER_02: I cannot wait to uh connect again and maybe do some lives and stuff.
• 1:17:50
  SPEAKER_02: Will you tell us where?
• 1:17:53
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, actually, I'm not gonna skip this part.
• 1:17:55
  SPEAKER_02: Rapid fire question.
• 1:17:56
  SPEAKER_02: I always like to end on a fun, random question.
• 1:17:57
  SPEAKER_02: And so I was looking at something like ADHD related because that's what you're passionate about, what your platform is built on.
• 1:18:04
  SPEAKER_02: And as soon as I saw this question, I was like, oh my gosh, this has to be it.
• 1:18:08
  SPEAKER_02: So the question that I have for you is how much money and time do you think that you've spent with this new a new idea that you've come up with that ended up being set aside within a week?
• 1:18:22
  SPEAKER_01: I don't even know.
• 1:18:23
  SPEAKER_01: Probably I would say at least at least$5,000.
• 1:18:29
  SPEAKER_02: When I saw this question, I was like, I don't know that I'll be able to put like a time or a dollar amount on anything, but I'm having some work done in my basement.
• 1:18:38
  SPEAKER_02: And so when I went down to let the workers in my basement today, I was like, ah, here's all those projects I started, and now they're in the basement.
• 1:18:49
  SPEAKER_01: Thousands of dollars, yes.
• 1:18:51
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
• 1:18:51
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
• 1:18:52
  SPEAKER_02: If I could take that money, if I could refund, get a refund for all that stuff and put it into this podcast, I'll be doing great, you know?
• 1:19:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, hey, it's it, it like I look at all those things, and yeah, I could be regret have regret and like, yeah, I shouldn't have done that.
• 1:19:09
  SPEAKER_01: But honestly, without those things, I wouldn't have learned like you got to take what little thing.
• 1:19:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there was like this hundred dollar, two hundred dollar program that I barely used, but I learned how to use Canva in it and like a couple other things that I I I use daily.
• 1:19:29
  SPEAKER_01: So if I didn't use that program, I probably wouldn't have had like that ability to do that.
• 1:19:34
  SPEAKER_01: I know I wouldn't have.
• 1:19:36
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, 100%.
• 1:19:36
  SPEAKER_02: That's what I tell people all the time is I'm like, you know, it's probably the expensive way of the uh elimination process, but I'm finding what I'm good at, what I like to do, and what I don't want to ever touch again.
• 1:19:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, plus like you can't take any of this into heaven with you.
• 1:19:51
  SPEAKER_01: So right.
• 1:19:55
  SPEAKER_01: It's here to be enjoyed and invested while you're here, but like to be passed on and not to be just like, oh well, I shouldn't have spent it on that, or regret, you know, those are things that yeah, I definitely don't regret it because I wouldn't have spent the money on it if I didn't have the money.
• 1:20:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's not like I sacrificed something important to get this thing that I was done with in three days, but it never fails.
• 1:20:20
  SPEAKER_02: I'll be sitting on the porch with a neighbor or someone, and they'll be like, Oh, I'll I'll like to do this, or my hobby is this.
• 1:20:25
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, ah, I tried that, didn't love it.
• 1:20:28
  SPEAKER_02: Come down and take this stuff with you.
• 1:20:30
  SPEAKER_02: Here's my gift.
• 1:20:32
  SPEAKER_01: My gift and contributions to even the drugs that I used, like it it gave me, you know, for the longest time, yeah.
• 1:20:42
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, I need to make up for this lost time.
• 1:20:45
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, that this is something that I'm not gonna talk about again or you know, only in NA meetings or whatever.
• 1:20:52
  SPEAKER_01: But like if I didn't have that experience, I wouldn't have that connection with those other people that are trying, you know, and seeing and being able to encourage them, you know, especially when they stumble in the beginning, because I know how hard it is, and I know what the you know, what I would like, you know, so I'm able to be supportive and see the little little like what other people might overlook and still see like them being whatever.
• 1:21:17
  SPEAKER_01: I see the growth, like I see how big it is, and I'm able to express that to them so that they can at least open their eyes to like the possibilities that they're on the right path.
• 1:21:30
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 1:21:31
  SPEAKER_02: Man, thank you so much for being with me today.
• 1:21:33
  SPEAKER_02: And I and I really enjoyed this conversation.
• 1:21:35
  SPEAKER_02: Please check out Unholier and see if you'd want to join us at any time, and I'm gonna share all the stuff that you've given me.
• 1:21:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, will you tell everybody where we can find you, listen, follow, and all that?
• 1:21:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I appreciate it.
• 1:21:47
  SPEAKER_01: I enjoyed my time here.
• 1:21:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um, if you want to step into my world, you can get on listen to my podcast.
• 1:21:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's called Don't Mind Me.
• 1:21:56
  SPEAKER_01: I just have ADHD.
• 1:21:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'm your ADHD guy.
• 1:22:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you can find that on Apple, Spotify, uh, YouTube, any one of your you know, preferred platforms.
• 1:22:09
  SPEAKER_01: That's really the best way.
• 1:22:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I also have a gift for your audience, and um it's my pro so I mean the my uh self-discovery journal.
• 1:22:20
  SPEAKER_01: So that's basically like it has a lot of prompts, like what we're talking we were talking about, how to explore your emotions on a deeper level.
• 1:22:27
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you can go as deep as you like and take as long as you want.
• 1:22:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's a free resource, it's uh also at your adhdguy.com.
• 1:22:37
  SPEAKER_01: It's right at the top.
• 1:22:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:22:40
  SPEAKER_02: That's amazing.
• 1:22:41
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much for that.
• 1:22:42
  SPEAKER_02: And I I'll make sure I put that link and everything in the show notes and and on the socials.
• 1:22:47
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks so much, man.
• 1:22:48
  SPEAKER_02: I appreciate that.
• 1:22:48
  SPEAKER_02: And I love I utilize stuff like that.
• 1:22:51
  SPEAKER_02: I I think it's great.
• 1:22:52
  SPEAKER_02: I try to have like my coffee in the mornings and I sit down with my journal and I try to just write and start getting things out and set the mood for my day, you know.
• 1:23:02
  SPEAKER_02: So I I can't wait to check this out.
• 1:23:04
  SPEAKER_01: There's a you know, like don't underestimate the power of journaling.
• 1:23:08
  SPEAKER_01: I actually like in my past couple of podcasts, like we've been talking about like journaling and just like the power of it to be able to get to be able to help you process that, you know, especially with something like, yeah, do it on your own, but if you have something that can help you along that way, that's where like I feel like that journal really helps to get to that next get to that to those deeper levels.
• 1:23:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
• 1:23:33
  SPEAKER_02: And I know that like in the mornings when I'm trying to like have my coffee and get my brain flowing, having those prompts has always been so useful because I know that I've sat down and I'm like, how do I have rotter's block with my journal?
• 1:23:45
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I'm writing about me or whatever's on my mind right now, and I'm writing about router's block about myself because I can't think of sometimes I just need that little boost of that prompt, you know, to kind of help the flow of things, and I've always appreciated them.
• 1:24:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I just kind of want to leave you with this is like you have such an amazing personality and and and and resilience and and like you know, humor, like that is such a strength.
• 1:24:14
  SPEAKER_01: You've done that on your own, mostly.
• 1:24:18
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure you've had help with other people, but like imagine how much greater it could be with God backing you up.
• 1:24:26
  SPEAKER_02: I see what you're doing here.
• 1:24:29
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just playing a seed, like oh, oh, absolutely.
• 1:24:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I love you know, it it's funny.
• 1:24:34
  SPEAKER_02: I do think that the universe or someone has told me something because yesterday I received a message from a cousin of mine who I've always been close with that was a lovely message, but it was also what faith-based.
• 1:24:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and then I ran into one of my neighbors, and that conversation came up, and then now I'm having this conversation with you, and it's like, okay, somewhere someone's trying to tell me something.
• 1:24:59
  SPEAKER_01: No coincidences, especially when it comes to God.
• 1:25:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like, and and and I I appreciate that, and I and I want you to know that I'm absolutely open-minded to it.
• 1:25:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'm gonna follow you, I'm gonna listen to your lives, I'm gonna check out your podcast, and let's be in touch because I would love for you to also uh join me one night.
• 1:25:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you can come uh on, you know, I'll I can send you a guest uh link for my podcast as well.
• 1:25:24
  SPEAKER_02: Perfect.
• 1:25:24
  SPEAKER_02: I would love that.
• 1:25:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, awesome.
• 1:25:27
  SPEAKER_01: Love to have you.
• 1:25:28
  SPEAKER_02: Keep us posted with everything.
• 1:25:29
  SPEAKER_02: We're sending you all the love, all the luck.
• 1:25:31
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna let you uh get your we've been on an hour and a half, and I knew we would.
• 1:25:36
  SPEAKER_02: We I I'm the kind of like I say an hour, but if we kept talking, I would just keep talking.
• 1:25:43
  SPEAKER_02: Hey.
• 1:25:46
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, absolutely.
• 1:25:47
  SPEAKER_02: I've enjoyed it, and I have a feeling that I'll I'll be wanting you to come back when this is out and people start asking questions, and so I I I can't wait to stay connected, and I hope that you enjoy today and that you get some closure on on where you're at with your job and everything very soon.
• 1:26:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it will, I I believe.
• 1:26:05
  SPEAKER_01: I thought it was gonna be today, but who knows?
• 1:26:08
  SPEAKER_01: It might be next week, it might be next year.
• 1:26:12
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, if I can keep you pay, like how can I complain about that?
• 1:26:16
  SPEAKER_02: Because I'm sitting here I didn't make any money.
• 1:26:18
  SPEAKER_01: So all right, man.
• 1:26:21
  SPEAKER_02: Enjoy your thank you so much.
• 1:26:22
  SPEAKER_02: I'll keep you posted with everything.
• 1:26:24
  SPEAKER_02: All right, God bless.